June 1, 2021 • 20 mins
Is it illegal for businesses to require proof of vaccination? Short answer is no. In some states such as Texas, Florida, Utah and others, they have banned vaccine passports, but that does not apply to private businesses. Misinformation is floating around on the internet citing protection from Fourth Amendment, but the reality is, a business can ask you to voluntarily disclose your vaccination status and you can refuse, but that business also has the right to refuse you entry. Sasha Hupka, reporter at CapRadio.org, joins us for some fact checking.
Next, it was August 1, 1981 when MTV was launched playing the first ever music video on television. That video was “Video Killed the Radio Star” by the Buggles. To celebrate the importance of MTV as a cultural and musical force, there is a new exhibit at the Grammy Museum in Mississippi. The exhibit is called MTV Turns 40: I Still Want My MTV and is open to the public now. It spotlights pivotal moments in their history… everything from its inception to Yo! MTV Raps!, MTV Unplugged, Beavis and Butthead, and even the Jersey Shore. Bob Santelli, founding Executive Director of the Grammy Museum and curator of the MTV exhibit, joins us for what MTV meant for music and popular culture.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's Tuesday, June one. I'm Oscar Ramirez in Los Angeles
and this is the Daily Dive. Is it illegal for
businesses to require proof of vaccination? Short answer is no.
In some states such as Texas, Florida, Utah, and others,
they have banned vaccine passports, but that does not apply
(00:22):
to private businesses. Misinformation is floating around on the Internet
citing protection from the Fourth Amendment. But the reality is
a business can ask you to voluntarily disclose your vaccination
status and you can refuse, but that business also has
the right to refuse entry. Sasha Hopka, reporter at cap
radio dot org, joins us for some fact checking. Next.
(00:44):
It was August first when MTV was launched, playing the
first ever music video on television. That video was video
Killed the Radio Star by the Buggles. To celebrate the
importance of MTV as a cultural and musical force. There's
a new exhibit at the Grammy Museum Insissippi. The exhibit
is called MTV Turnsporty, I Still Want My MTV and
(01:05):
it's open to the public now. Its spotlights pivotal moments
in their history, everything from its inception to yo MTV
raps MTV Unplugged, Vivis and butt Head and even the
Jersey Shore. Bob Santelli, founding executive director of the Grammy Museum,
curator of the MTV Exhibit, joins us for what MTV
meant for music and popular culture. It's news without the noise.
(01:28):
Let's dive in. It's business employee or a business owner
asked somebody for proof of vaccination or says, hey, you
can't provide proof of vaccination. I'm afraid that I'm gonna
have to ask you to wear a mask to come inside,
or I'm afraid I can't let you in. That person
is most certainly not going to be put to death
because of that or thrown in jail for a very
long period of time. Joining us now with Sasha Hopka,
(01:51):
reporter at cap radio dot org and contributor to PolitiFact California.
Thanks for joining us, Sasha, thanks for having me. You know,
there's a lot of talk about vaccine passports and can
of business require you to get a vaccination before you
use their services, things like that. There's a lot of
misinformation that is rolling around and one that you wrote
(02:12):
about recently. There's an image being shared on Instagram and Twitter,
claiming that businesses can't legally require customers to provide proof
of vaccination or deny them entry based on their vaccination status.
But it goes on to say that those people, if
they're trying to stop you, those businesses or individuals can
be put in jail, even given the death penalty. These
things get passed around. I think this one in particular
(02:35):
has been shared thousands of time on Instagram and Twitter
and people start believing it. The quick answer of it
is that that's not true. So Sasha, help us walk
through some of this. What can businesses do when it
comes to proof of vaccination? According to legal experts, businesses
have a number of rights when it comes to letting
(02:57):
people onto their private property. So this this is can
ask you, hey, can I see proof of vaccination? An
employee might ask you that they have the right to
ask you that you don't have to answer them, but
if you don't, they also have the right to say,
you know, we really can't let you onto the property
without your vaccination status. There might be certain instances in
(03:18):
which somebody have a disability, they are not able to
get a vaccination for a medical reason, and so therefore
in that case, you know, the business will likely try
to provide a reasonable accommodation. So a grocery store might say,
if you aren't vaccinated and can't proove to us that
you're vaccinated, in order to enter the grocery store, you
need to be wearing a mask, and unvaccinated people have
(03:38):
to wear a mask, but people who are vaccinated and
can sure a proof of that don't have to. There
might be other instances, like a movie theater where you
would have to wear a mask in order to watch
the movie, or where it's a large scale event where
only vaccinated people can really be in that space, in
which case they might try to provide some sort of
a virtual option for people who are unvaccinated or who
(04:00):
cannot be vaccinated but until we reach her immunity. This
is likely what it's going to look like in California
and also possibly in a number of other states, because
we have seen the other states have rolled out vaccine
passports and similar reopening framework. There's a several states who
have voiced their opposition to vaccine passports, things like that
Texas Florida are two big ones, but also Idaho, Montana, Arizona, Utah.
(04:24):
They all have some type of executive order or law
on the books that say, you know, places can't require
proof of vaccination, but that largely is limited to government
offices or places that receive government funding. Privately owned businesses
don't fall under that. And as you mentioned, there are
other states like New York that have rolled out their
systems of vaccine passports. So as these states keep reopening,
(04:47):
we're going to be seeing a lot of this and
it's going to cause a lot of confusion. Yes, absolutely,
and it really already has. I mean, we've already seen
numerous kind of versions of this claim around the internet
that businesses can't ask you for proof of vaccination or
can't deny entry based on vaccination status. And there's been
a number of kinds of different reasons that have been
given in some of this false information as to why
(05:09):
that is. My story and the fact check that I
did on this issue specifically pertained to the Fourth Amendment
and the US Civil Rights Act. But I've also seen
claims that have been checked by national fact checking organizations
regarding hippa and that asking for proof of vaccination or
denying entry based on that violence hippa, which is also
(05:32):
completely false. So there's kind of numerous versions of this
claim that are floating around out there, and I think
that it's important as we move into this next stage
of reopening, that people understand what is true and what
isn't true. Yeah, I mean, for the most part, businesses
that have a lot of leeway on how they want
to operate and this falls under their purview. If they
want to ask for it and you don't want to cooperate,
(05:54):
they can't ask you to leave at that point, right.
I feel like a lot of businesses aren't going to
be asking. They're gonna be more on the side willing
to get people in there. But if some unruly customer
comes in or something like that, that's all the more
reason to push people out and say, hey, we're not
going to be able to do this. Going back to
that example that we use of that graphic that's been
floating around on the internet right now, it says the
(06:15):
penalty of this that the business or the individual telling
you you need to show us your vaccine passport or
that you've been vaccinated could be go to jail or
be punishable by death. That's also not true too, That
is not true the image specifically sites title eighteen the
USC Section two forty two, and that's a part of
the Federal Criminal Codes that specifically addresses the deprivation of rights.
(06:36):
And the law states that those who are acting quote
under the color of law, who willfully depress a person
in the US of their constitutional rights can go to
prison or in really extreme cases, if the guys because
of that or there's serious injury, they could receive capital punishment.
But it's important to note that that law specifically says
(06:57):
under the color of law. Those are the exact words,
and that part of law specifically means that it pertains
to official government officials who violate a person's rights. And
I actually had a legal expert tell me that this
really does not at all apply to private businesses or individuals.
It's completely not relevant. So it's completely not true if
business employee or a business owner asked somebody for proof
(07:20):
of vaccination or says, hey, you can't provide proof of vaccination,
I'm afraid that I'm gonna have to ask you to
wear a mask to come inside, or I'm afraid I
can't let you in. That person is most certainly not
going to be put to death because of that or
grown in jail for a very long period of time.
That's completely untrue. Sasha Popka, reporter at Cape Radio dot
org and contributor to PolitiFact California. Thank you very much
(07:43):
for joining us. Thank you so much for having me,
Ladies and gentlemen rock and roll. Joining me now is
(08:06):
Bob Sanelli, founding executive director of the Grammy Museum and
curator of the MTV at forty exhibit. Bob, thank you
very much for joining us. It's a pleasure something that
was very influential in my life and a lot of
people's lives. We're gonna talk about m t V. It's
turning forty years old. It's amazing to think that there's
a new exhibit at the Grammy Museum in Mississippi. It's
(08:30):
called MTV Turns forty. I still want my m t V.
It's open to the public now, and I mean it
just has a lot of the history that goes on there.
It's really the first exhibit ever kind of that shows
the importance of MTV as a cultural and a musical force. Bob,
tell me a little bit about the exhibit and then
we'll get into some of the fun stuff that MTV play.
(08:51):
You know, the big role that it played in music.
The exhibit, as you said, basically tarts the importance of MTV,
you music, television, especially in the nineteen eighties when the
first surfaces, and how it impacts both popular culture and
popular music, and it had profound implications for both of those.
(09:12):
So the goal of the exhibit was essentially to educate people,
especially young people who weren't even born when the MTV
first started in August of nineteen eighty and so one
I should say the key here is that this is
an exhibit that had the cooperation of MTV. We pulled
artifacts from DJ's original DJs, we pulled artifacts and did
(09:35):
interviews with some of the earliest founders of MTV. All
in all, it was a very big cooperative exhibit that
we hope tells that story and shows the impact and
enlightens people today who watched MTV, because back then it
was a very very different channel. Yeah, and that's the
important thing. You know, music has changed over the course
of these forty years that specifically that we're talking about,
(09:58):
and MTV itself has changed so much. You know, people
look at music videos and all that you know on YouTube,
mostly now on their phones. It's we're not turning the
TV in the same fashion for it. But MTV itself started,
as you mentioned, August first one, the co creator of MTV,
started off by saying, ladies and gentlemen rock and roll,
and then the first ever music video to air was
(10:20):
Video Killed the Radio start by the Buggles. Tell me
about those early days and the big launch, because it
was a new concept at that time, twenty four hour
music videos, and I think they only started with about
two and fifty videos, so there was a lot of replay.
At one point. The idea of having a music channel
that broadcasts seven and had videos and tastes were much
(10:44):
like DJ's disc jockeys, because basically the idea was MTV
would be like a radio station, except you could see
the music now. And the concept wasn't just hatched in
nine eight. The idea of music, as were saying the exhibit,
go all the way back to the nineteen when the
(11:06):
great blue singer Bessie Smith actually did a short promotional
kind of film called St. Louis Blues. And then as
we go through the decades, there were things called sound
Ease in which R and B artists and jazz artists
at the time, Duke Gellington, Count Basie, Cap Callaway and
some of these great names in American music. They would
do promotional videos and they would be mostly shown on
(11:28):
something called Sounds, which is basically a small video machine
where if you put ten cents in or five cents,
you actually get to see these videos. And then of
course move into the nineteen sixties and the Reil if
you will, Modern Fathers if you will, the music video
that you would eventually see on MTV, where the Beatles,
you know, still stop touring in August of nineteen sixty six,
(11:52):
and you have a tremendous demand that they perform on
TV shows or whatever, and so they come up with
the idea of, well, let's just make a big deo
and you can show the video of us on these
television programs both in the UK, Europe and then also
in the United States. And so that's really the start
of the videos. It really goes back to the Beatles.
(12:12):
And then by the time one rolls around the idea
of turning a potential radio show into a TV show
and instead of just playing music spinning disks, actually see
videos that just totally gave pop music a brand new
dimension and then we were off to the racist at
that point. I mean definitely. Uh. You know, I can
(12:34):
remember as a kid, MTV was kind of already in
full force by the time I was coming around to it,
and I would just sit there for hours into the
night looking at videos and I loved it. It was
something you couldn't really turn yourself away from. Why is
this exhibit in Mississippi? What's the touching point there? Most
people don't realize this, but one of the prime movers
(12:55):
behind MTV is a man by the name of Bob Pittman.
And Bob Pittman had to be from Mississippi. So when
we thought about doing the exhibit, why not open it
in Mississippi. This is where the idea hatched. This is
the person who basically gave MTV its form. His vision
came from Mississippi, and he always attributed his roots in
(13:17):
Mississippi to a lot of his success. Later on, Today
popped him and runs I Heart Radio, So he's still
in the business. He's still very much involved in music.
And we had an exclusive interview with him about those
early days that secluded in the exhibit, and it was
really great because for the opening of the exhibit, a
couple of weeks ago, he actually flew down from New
York and it was a participant. We actually did some
(13:39):
public programs with him and some of the original d
j's Martha Quinn and Alan Hunter, and it's been really
terrific because his insight and his funny stories are just
quite amazing. Like for instance, for instance, New York is
where MTV really launched us, and yet in August of
Manhattan did not have cable television, which of courses where
(14:00):
MTV was on. So they had to take a bus
across to my homes, New Jersey and watch it in
the bar in New Jersey. All of people about the
MTV they had to sit there in the bar and
watch it to see what it would actually look like.
Those little kinds of great stories like that about those
early days. That's part of the exhibit. And as you mentioned,
just full disclosure, Bob Pittman is the CEO of I
(14:21):
Heart Media. That's uh the parent company that I worked
for here, So you know, it's just great to see
him kind of involved. As you mentioned in music all
this time. Okay, let's talk a little bit about the
evolution of MTV, because at first it was definitely all
about the music videos, but the programming had to change
with the times. They I mean, they blew up so
many artists they had, uh you know yo, MTV raps,
(14:43):
MTV Unplugged, which I loved, you know, stripping them down
to acoustic sets into animation, Beavis and butt Head, Jersey Shore,
which was kind of controversial at first, but people grew
to love that group of people so much they're still
making programming about them. Tell me a little bit of
about sure. Well, early those earliest videos were mostly British
(15:05):
because it was the British rock bands and British music
scene in particular in the seventies that really embraced the
idea of music videos. And so early on the first weeks,
months or so of MTV you saw a preponderance of
British videos. And later then, of course, when MTV is
(15:26):
skyrocketing and popularity, kids like yourself are watching this, and
myself as well looking at this and can't take our
eyes off it. All of a sudden, American electric companies
get very much involved and they start turning out videos.
Of course, I think, you know, one of the interesting
things about it is that the great thing about music
pop music is that it's always changing and if you
(15:46):
don't change with the music, you run the risk are
becoming obsolete. And MTV did not want that to happen.
So as pop music and pop culture evolved, so MTV
so before you know it, by the eight eighties and
now you're getting into the nine nineties, they had these
incredible special programs, things like you know, MTV Raps, which
(16:07):
I have to say played a big part in in
breaking rap hip hop music back then called rap to
white audiences, and that was here for hip hop. Same
thing which grunts, I mean, the pop was at the
forefront of bands like Nirvana and Pearl Jam getting those
videos out to help break that Seattle sound, which was
maybe one of the last grade if not the last,
(16:29):
great rock and roll sound to evolve in this country.
So MTV plays a big role in that. But then
they also played a big role in video Music awards,
you know, and one of the Grammys. And yet the
Video Music Awards were basically an attempt to compete with us,
going after a younger audience. Being not so because they're
on cable TV and not on standard networks, they had
(16:50):
a little bit more freedom to be a little bit crazier.
So the v n as become really popular, and then
of course the reality TV shows, whether it's US and
Butt It or like as you mentioned the Jersey Shore,
you know, right, it was very controversial being Italian American
and from the Jersey Shore of hard time working that.
I'm sure if my mom was still alive, she would say,
(17:13):
do not put that in the exhibit. But I did
because you can't not. I mean, it was so popular, snooky,
oh my goodness. And so we have some really cool
artifacts that we got from the show and they're all
in as well. But you know, the fact of the matter,
as MTV continues to evolve, I mean, I got to
give it credit. It just moves with the times and
size to stay as relevant as possible to youth culture
(17:36):
and biologus. It succeeds. There's a lot of cool stuff
as you mentioned, memorabilia, artifacts, all of these interviews with
some of these original VJs and everything. There's such just
such a rich history with MTV, and as I mentioned,
you know, people growing up during this era looked to
it for that music news, for new artists, breaking artists,
the whole nine, and you know, maybe kids these days
(17:57):
don't really experience it the same way, but it's no,
they don't. Yeah, and it's something that just that was
so important to music and music culture, and that's why
this exhibit looks so exciting, that's right, you know. I
mean this this is ment basically to show the way
it was back in the game. It's a historical exhibit
(18:18):
in in the way it charts the importance of MTV,
but also you know, MTV still has a place in
American row international pop culture, and they did so many
things that you know, part of the exhibit was to
make young people aware of Live Aid. For instance, it's
a big part in one of the biggest, most successful
benefit series of concerts where it was basically shown from
(18:42):
London and Philadelphia, and what the role that MTV played
and all that. But you talked about TRL totally Request
Live with Carson Dally and what the Midtown Manhattan crazy stuff.
Now it does not have that kind of impact today,
as you said, and as I said, thanks, move on
and YouTube forints. TikTok a new vers if you will.
(19:05):
They're not affiliated with it, but they do the same
job that MTV was doing in the nineteen eighties. So
you know, The idea is to stay a little bit
as long as you can, and MTP advantaged to do that.
Bob sent Kelly, founding executive director of the Grammy Museum
and curator of MTV turns forty. I still want my MTV.
You can get that at the Grammy Museum in Mississippi.
(19:27):
Thank you very much for joining us. Oh, it's my
pleasure of that's it for today. Join us on social
media at Daily Dive Pod on both Twitter and Instagram.
Leave us a comment, give us a rating, and tell
us the stories that you're interested in. Follow us and
(19:49):
I heart radio or subscribe wherever you get your podcast.
This episode of the Daily Divers produced by vicer Wright
and engineered by Tony Sarrantina him Oscar Ramirez, and this
was her Daily dit
It's Tuesday, June one. I'm Oscar Ramirez in Los Angeles
and this is the Daily Dive. Is it illegal for
businesses to require proof of vaccination? Short answer is no.
In some states such as Texas, Florida, Utah, and others,
they have banned vaccine passports, but that does not apply
(00:22):
to private businesses. Misinformation is floating around on the Internet
citing protection from the Fourth Amendment. But the reality is
a business can ask you to voluntarily disclose your vaccination
status and you can refuse, but that business also has
the right to refuse entry. Sasha Hopka, reporter at cap
radio dot org, joins us for some fact checking. Next.
(00:44):
It was August first when MTV was launched, playing the
first ever music video on television. That video was video
Killed the Radio Star by the Buggles. To celebrate the
importance of MTV as a cultural and musical force. There's
a new exhibit at the Grammy Museum Insissippi. The exhibit
is called MTV Turnsporty, I Still Want My MTV and
(01:05):
it's open to the public now. Its spotlights pivotal moments
in their history, everything from its inception to yo MTV
raps MTV Unplugged, Vivis and butt Head and even the
Jersey Shore. Bob Santelli, founding executive director of the Grammy Museum,
curator of the MTV Exhibit, joins us for what MTV
meant for music and popular culture. It's news without the noise.
(01:28):
Let's dive in. It's business employee or a business owner
asked somebody for proof of vaccination or says, hey, you
can't provide proof of vaccination. I'm afraid that I'm gonna
have to ask you to wear a mask to come inside,
or I'm afraid I can't let you in. That person
is most certainly not going to be put to death
because of that or thrown in jail for a very
long period of time. Joining us now with Sasha Hopka,
(01:51):
reporter at cap radio dot org and contributor to PolitiFact California.
Thanks for joining us, Sasha, thanks for having me. You know,
there's a lot of talk about vaccine passports and can
of business require you to get a vaccination before you
use their services, things like that. There's a lot of
misinformation that is rolling around and one that you wrote
(02:12):
about recently. There's an image being shared on Instagram and Twitter,
claiming that businesses can't legally require customers to provide proof
of vaccination or deny them entry based on their vaccination status.
But it goes on to say that those people, if
they're trying to stop you, those businesses or individuals can
be put in jail, even given the death penalty. These
things get passed around. I think this one in particular
(02:35):
has been shared thousands of time on Instagram and Twitter
and people start believing it. The quick answer of it
is that that's not true. So Sasha, help us walk
through some of this. What can businesses do when it
comes to proof of vaccination? According to legal experts, businesses
have a number of rights when it comes to letting
(02:57):
people onto their private property. So this this is can
ask you, hey, can I see proof of vaccination? An
employee might ask you that they have the right to
ask you that you don't have to answer them, but
if you don't, they also have the right to say,
you know, we really can't let you onto the property
without your vaccination status. There might be certain instances in
(03:18):
which somebody have a disability, they are not able to
get a vaccination for a medical reason, and so therefore
in that case, you know, the business will likely try
to provide a reasonable accommodation. So a grocery store might say,
if you aren't vaccinated and can't proove to us that
you're vaccinated, in order to enter the grocery store, you
need to be wearing a mask, and unvaccinated people have
(03:38):
to wear a mask, but people who are vaccinated and
can sure a proof of that don't have to. There
might be other instances, like a movie theater where you
would have to wear a mask in order to watch
the movie, or where it's a large scale event where
only vaccinated people can really be in that space, in
which case they might try to provide some sort of
a virtual option for people who are unvaccinated or who
(04:00):
cannot be vaccinated but until we reach her immunity. This
is likely what it's going to look like in California
and also possibly in a number of other states, because
we have seen the other states have rolled out vaccine
passports and similar reopening framework. There's a several states who
have voiced their opposition to vaccine passports, things like that
Texas Florida are two big ones, but also Idaho, Montana, Arizona, Utah.
(04:24):
They all have some type of executive order or law
on the books that say, you know, places can't require
proof of vaccination, but that largely is limited to government
offices or places that receive government funding. Privately owned businesses
don't fall under that. And as you mentioned, there are
other states like New York that have rolled out their
systems of vaccine passports. So as these states keep reopening,
(04:47):
we're going to be seeing a lot of this and
it's going to cause a lot of confusion. Yes, absolutely,
and it really already has. I mean, we've already seen
numerous kind of versions of this claim around the internet
that businesses can't ask you for proof of vaccination or
can't deny entry based on vaccination status. And there's been
a number of kinds of different reasons that have been
given in some of this false information as to why
(05:09):
that is. My story and the fact check that I
did on this issue specifically pertained to the Fourth Amendment
and the US Civil Rights Act. But I've also seen
claims that have been checked by national fact checking organizations
regarding hippa and that asking for proof of vaccination or
denying entry based on that violence hippa, which is also
(05:32):
completely false. So there's kind of numerous versions of this
claim that are floating around out there, and I think
that it's important as we move into this next stage
of reopening, that people understand what is true and what
isn't true. Yeah, I mean, for the most part, businesses
that have a lot of leeway on how they want
to operate and this falls under their purview. If they
want to ask for it and you don't want to cooperate,
(05:54):
they can't ask you to leave at that point, right.
I feel like a lot of businesses aren't going to
be asking. They're gonna be more on the side willing
to get people in there. But if some unruly customer
comes in or something like that, that's all the more
reason to push people out and say, hey, we're not
going to be able to do this. Going back to
that example that we use of that graphic that's been
floating around on the internet right now, it says the
(06:15):
penalty of this that the business or the individual telling
you you need to show us your vaccine passport or
that you've been vaccinated could be go to jail or
be punishable by death. That's also not true too, That
is not true the image specifically sites title eighteen the
USC Section two forty two, and that's a part of
the Federal Criminal Codes that specifically addresses the deprivation of rights.
(06:36):
And the law states that those who are acting quote
under the color of law, who willfully depress a person
in the US of their constitutional rights can go to
prison or in really extreme cases, if the guys because
of that or there's serious injury, they could receive capital punishment.
But it's important to note that that law specifically says
(06:57):
under the color of law. Those are the exact words,
and that part of law specifically means that it pertains
to official government officials who violate a person's rights. And
I actually had a legal expert tell me that this
really does not at all apply to private businesses or individuals.
It's completely not relevant. So it's completely not true if
business employee or a business owner asked somebody for proof
(07:20):
of vaccination or says, hey, you can't provide proof of vaccination,
I'm afraid that I'm gonna have to ask you to
wear a mask to come inside, or I'm afraid I
can't let you in. That person is most certainly not
going to be put to death because of that or
grown in jail for a very long period of time.
That's completely untrue. Sasha Popka, reporter at Cape Radio dot
org and contributor to PolitiFact California. Thank you very much
(07:43):
for joining us. Thank you so much for having me,
Ladies and gentlemen rock and roll. Joining me now is
(08:06):
Bob Sanelli, founding executive director of the Grammy Museum and
curator of the MTV at forty exhibit. Bob, thank you
very much for joining us. It's a pleasure something that
was very influential in my life and a lot of
people's lives. We're gonna talk about m t V. It's
turning forty years old. It's amazing to think that there's
a new exhibit at the Grammy Museum in Mississippi. It's
(08:30):
called MTV Turns forty. I still want my m t V.
It's open to the public now, and I mean it
just has a lot of the history that goes on there.
It's really the first exhibit ever kind of that shows
the importance of MTV as a cultural and a musical force. Bob,
tell me a little bit about the exhibit and then
we'll get into some of the fun stuff that MTV play.
(08:51):
You know, the big role that it played in music.
The exhibit, as you said, basically tarts the importance of MTV,
you music, television, especially in the nineteen eighties when the
first surfaces, and how it impacts both popular culture and
popular music, and it had profound implications for both of those.
(09:12):
So the goal of the exhibit was essentially to educate people,
especially young people who weren't even born when the MTV
first started in August of nineteen eighty and so one
I should say the key here is that this is
an exhibit that had the cooperation of MTV. We pulled
artifacts from DJ's original DJs, we pulled artifacts and did
(09:35):
interviews with some of the earliest founders of MTV. All
in all, it was a very big cooperative exhibit that
we hope tells that story and shows the impact and
enlightens people today who watched MTV, because back then it
was a very very different channel. Yeah, and that's the
important thing. You know, music has changed over the course
of these forty years that specifically that we're talking about,
(09:58):
and MTV itself has changed so much. You know, people
look at music videos and all that you know on YouTube,
mostly now on their phones. It's we're not turning the
TV in the same fashion for it. But MTV itself started,
as you mentioned, August first one, the co creator of MTV,
started off by saying, ladies and gentlemen rock and roll,
and then the first ever music video to air was
(10:20):
Video Killed the Radio start by the Buggles. Tell me
about those early days and the big launch, because it
was a new concept at that time, twenty four hour
music videos, and I think they only started with about
two and fifty videos, so there was a lot of replay.
At one point. The idea of having a music channel
that broadcasts seven and had videos and tastes were much
(10:44):
like DJ's disc jockeys, because basically the idea was MTV
would be like a radio station, except you could see
the music now. And the concept wasn't just hatched in
nine eight. The idea of music, as were saying the exhibit,
go all the way back to the nineteen when the
(11:06):
great blue singer Bessie Smith actually did a short promotional
kind of film called St. Louis Blues. And then as
we go through the decades, there were things called sound
Ease in which R and B artists and jazz artists
at the time, Duke Gellington, Count Basie, Cap Callaway and
some of these great names in American music. They would
do promotional videos and they would be mostly shown on
(11:28):
something called Sounds, which is basically a small video machine
where if you put ten cents in or five cents,
you actually get to see these videos. And then of
course move into the nineteen sixties and the Reil if
you will, Modern Fathers if you will, the music video
that you would eventually see on MTV, where the Beatles,
you know, still stop touring in August of nineteen sixty six,
(11:52):
and you have a tremendous demand that they perform on
TV shows or whatever, and so they come up with
the idea of, well, let's just make a big deo
and you can show the video of us on these
television programs both in the UK, Europe and then also
in the United States. And so that's really the start
of the videos. It really goes back to the Beatles.
(12:12):
And then by the time one rolls around the idea
of turning a potential radio show into a TV show
and instead of just playing music spinning disks, actually see
videos that just totally gave pop music a brand new
dimension and then we were off to the racist at
that point. I mean definitely. Uh. You know, I can
(12:34):
remember as a kid, MTV was kind of already in
full force by the time I was coming around to it,
and I would just sit there for hours into the
night looking at videos and I loved it. It was
something you couldn't really turn yourself away from. Why is
this exhibit in Mississippi? What's the touching point there? Most
people don't realize this, but one of the prime movers
(12:55):
behind MTV is a man by the name of Bob Pittman.
And Bob Pittman had to be from Mississippi. So when
we thought about doing the exhibit, why not open it
in Mississippi. This is where the idea hatched. This is
the person who basically gave MTV its form. His vision
came from Mississippi, and he always attributed his roots in
(13:17):
Mississippi to a lot of his success. Later on, Today
popped him and runs I Heart Radio, So he's still
in the business. He's still very much involved in music.
And we had an exclusive interview with him about those
early days that secluded in the exhibit, and it was
really great because for the opening of the exhibit, a
couple of weeks ago, he actually flew down from New
York and it was a participant. We actually did some
(13:39):
public programs with him and some of the original d
j's Martha Quinn and Alan Hunter, and it's been really
terrific because his insight and his funny stories are just
quite amazing. Like for instance, for instance, New York is
where MTV really launched us, and yet in August of
Manhattan did not have cable television, which of courses where
(14:00):
MTV was on. So they had to take a bus
across to my homes, New Jersey and watch it in
the bar in New Jersey. All of people about the
MTV they had to sit there in the bar and
watch it to see what it would actually look like.
Those little kinds of great stories like that about those
early days. That's part of the exhibit. And as you mentioned,
just full disclosure, Bob Pittman is the CEO of I
(14:21):
Heart Media. That's uh the parent company that I worked
for here, So you know, it's just great to see
him kind of involved. As you mentioned in music all
this time. Okay, let's talk a little bit about the
evolution of MTV, because at first it was definitely all
about the music videos, but the programming had to change
with the times. They I mean, they blew up so
many artists they had, uh you know yo, MTV raps,
(14:43):
MTV Unplugged, which I loved, you know, stripping them down
to acoustic sets into animation, Beavis and butt Head, Jersey Shore,
which was kind of controversial at first, but people grew
to love that group of people so much they're still
making programming about them. Tell me a little bit of
about sure. Well, early those earliest videos were mostly British
(15:05):
because it was the British rock bands and British music
scene in particular in the seventies that really embraced the
idea of music videos. And so early on the first weeks,
months or so of MTV you saw a preponderance of
British videos. And later then, of course, when MTV is
(15:26):
skyrocketing and popularity, kids like yourself are watching this, and
myself as well looking at this and can't take our
eyes off it. All of a sudden, American electric companies
get very much involved and they start turning out videos.
Of course, I think, you know, one of the interesting
things about it is that the great thing about music
pop music is that it's always changing and if you
(15:46):
don't change with the music, you run the risk are
becoming obsolete. And MTV did not want that to happen.
So as pop music and pop culture evolved, so MTV
so before you know it, by the eight eighties and
now you're getting into the nine nineties, they had these
incredible special programs, things like you know, MTV Raps, which
(16:07):
I have to say played a big part in in
breaking rap hip hop music back then called rap to
white audiences, and that was here for hip hop. Same
thing which grunts, I mean, the pop was at the
forefront of bands like Nirvana and Pearl Jam getting those
videos out to help break that Seattle sound, which was
maybe one of the last grade if not the last,
(16:29):
great rock and roll sound to evolve in this country.
So MTV plays a big role in that. But then
they also played a big role in video Music awards,
you know, and one of the Grammys. And yet the
Video Music Awards were basically an attempt to compete with us,
going after a younger audience. Being not so because they're
on cable TV and not on standard networks, they had
(16:50):
a little bit more freedom to be a little bit crazier.
So the v n as become really popular, and then
of course the reality TV shows, whether it's US and
Butt It or like as you mentioned the Jersey Shore,
you know, right, it was very controversial being Italian American
and from the Jersey Shore of hard time working that.
I'm sure if my mom was still alive, she would say,
(17:13):
do not put that in the exhibit. But I did
because you can't not. I mean, it was so popular, snooky,
oh my goodness. And so we have some really cool
artifacts that we got from the show and they're all
in as well. But you know, the fact of the matter,
as MTV continues to evolve, I mean, I got to
give it credit. It just moves with the times and
size to stay as relevant as possible to youth culture
(17:36):
and biologus. It succeeds. There's a lot of cool stuff
as you mentioned, memorabilia, artifacts, all of these interviews with
some of these original VJs and everything. There's such just
such a rich history with MTV, and as I mentioned,
you know, people growing up during this era looked to
it for that music news, for new artists, breaking artists,
the whole nine, and you know, maybe kids these days
(17:57):
don't really experience it the same way, but it's no,
they don't. Yeah, and it's something that just that was
so important to music and music culture, and that's why
this exhibit looks so exciting, that's right, you know. I
mean this this is ment basically to show the way
it was back in the game. It's a historical exhibit
(18:18):
in in the way it charts the importance of MTV,
but also you know, MTV still has a place in
American row international pop culture, and they did so many
things that you know, part of the exhibit was to
make young people aware of Live Aid. For instance, it's
a big part in one of the biggest, most successful
benefit series of concerts where it was basically shown from
(18:42):
London and Philadelphia, and what the role that MTV played
and all that. But you talked about TRL totally Request
Live with Carson Dally and what the Midtown Manhattan crazy stuff.
Now it does not have that kind of impact today,
as you said, and as I said, thanks, move on
and YouTube forints. TikTok a new vers if you will.
(19:05):
They're not affiliated with it, but they do the same
job that MTV was doing in the nineteen eighties. So
you know, The idea is to stay a little bit
as long as you can, and MTP advantaged to do that.
Bob sent Kelly, founding executive director of the Grammy Museum
and curator of MTV turns forty. I still want my MTV.
You can get that at the Grammy Museum in Mississippi.
(19:27):
Thank you very much for joining us. Oh, it's my
pleasure of that's it for today. Join us on social
media at Daily Dive Pod on both Twitter and Instagram.
Leave us a comment, give us a rating, and tell
us the stories that you're interested in. Follow us and
(19:49):
I heart radio or subscribe wherever you get your podcast.
This episode of the Daily Divers produced by vicer Wright
and engineered by Tony Sarrantina him Oscar Ramirez, and this
was her Daily dit
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