Jon Stewart is joined by co-founder and co-chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates, Frank J. Fahrenkopf Jr., to learn what it means for President Biden and Donald Trump to break tradition and debate outside of the Commission’s rules and regulations. And Kamala Harris’s holistic thought advisor, Dahlia Rose Hibiscus (Desi Lydic), takes us behind the scenes of how VP Harris’s words become idea voyages.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
You're listening to Comedy Central. Hey, it's Michael Consta.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
The Daily Shows taking a break this week, but we
put together some special highlight episodes just for you. We'll
be back with brand new episodes of The Daily Show
next week. In the meantime, enjoy this episode, hell love
about it in The.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Daily Show my gost tonight. He is the co founder
and co chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates. Please
talking to the program, Frank Farnkoff, Let me first of all,
(00:44):
welcome you to the show and explain very quickly the
reason on the Commission for Presidential Debates kind of got
blown out of the water. You guys would run the debates.
The two candidates, Trump and Biden, the two main candidates,
made their own agreement and kind of cut you guys
(01:04):
out of the process. Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Well, they're trying.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
To I see. Why would they do that.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Because we're not nice people, I guess.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
And they seemed so nice. But why what was the
reasoning behind not having it in the way that it's
been since eighty seven?
Speaker 3 (01:19):
You know, it started in eighty seven for a reason.
We were created after two studies, one at Harvard, one
at the Georgetown not familiarly for the center, and because
there was so many problems with the candidates on both
sides over the years, we went sixteen years without any
presidential debates because they wouldn't participate. No one can be
forced to debate.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
They thought it was troo partisan when it was the
legal women.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Vite that's right, And so we were created. Paul Kirk
was then the chairman of the Democratic National Committee. I
was President Reagan's chairman of the RNC, and we created
the Commission and have done them now for well, we've
done thirty three over the last thirty six years. And
we were created for one purpose, to be in the
middle of the candidates, representing the people. Commission not non
(02:05):
part non part of IC. And so at this point
in time, with this particular UH battle, there's a lot
of things unexpected happening, and I don't know what the
hell is going to happen. Is we go forward? Agreed,
so we have to wait and see. Now they agreed,
supposedly they've agreed, but now the question is.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
You know, there's gonna be one debate on Sanna apparently,
and then one other debate. I'm not exactly ABC.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
UH. Now the questions that aren't been settled because I
hear that the former president today said he won't appear
unless a drug test is taken by Biden to show
he wasn't hopped up like he allegedly was when he
made his speech, you know, the State of the Union speech.
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
I don't think that the prey they want Biden drug
tested because they think he's trans what what? What do
they think is out of it?
Speaker 3 (02:50):
What?
Speaker 1 (02:52):
What do they believe?
Speaker 3 (02:53):
We believe? I guess that that he was hyped up
there at when.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I say speech, and would Trump then also drug test?
Speaker 3 (03:00):
I don't think so?
Speaker 1 (03:01):
All right?
Speaker 3 (03:03):
And the other thing is what's undecided, John, is how
did they walk out on the stage or they see.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
These things they decide where to sit?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Oh yeah, a lot of things.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Uh huh.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
The mute button. I put a mute button in four
years ago because they weren't obeying the rules that they
weren't supposed to talk for two minutes when the others.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
I put one of those in my TV and I
used it as soon as they started. Let me ask
you a question, and perhaps this may not what are
we missing? Like? So let's say they don't go with
the Presidential Commission, and they don't go with what are
(03:41):
we really losing? I mean, to be perfectly frank, I
don't get much substantive out of these debates anyway, the
idea that their answers have to be a minute and
a half and there's a buzzer, there's a meat.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
So that's all been changed. We changed that some time ago.
What happens is the debates ninety minutes or divided in
the six fifteen minute pods that each answer a question
from the moderator for two minutes without interruption, and then
the moderator can drill down. It's no of these two minutes,
one minute and all the rest like existed a long
long time ago. Those are the things we changed, and
(04:16):
so you know what they're going to do here. They
haven't answered those questions.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
But do you believe that those debates were fruitful? Like
when I think of the debates between Trump and Hillary,
or Trump and Biden or Trump, and let's say, Adore,
I didn't necessarily, I didn't find much.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
What we do, what we do after each cycle is
we go out and ask the public did the debates
have an effect with any good for you? In making
this decision, and about sixty five to seventy percent say
it's not the only and the most significant factor, But yes,
it does play a part. And you know, we look
at it in two ways. John. Not only are they
answering the questions about issues that are important to the
(04:55):
people they want to hear, but you'll learn an awful
lot about the personality, the attitude of a person, how
they conduct themselves in the debates. For example, I think
for former President Trump, really hurt himself in the first
debate last time. I think al Gore back in nineteen
or in two thousand walking across the stage in front
of door, So they learned that.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Isn't that? I think that's kind of my point, which is,
if what we take away from it is al Gore
side and war rouge, so he shouldn't so he shouldn't
be president. That strikes me as a methodology that is
terribly flawed.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
Well, you tie that with what the answers to the
questions were also on.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
It, but no one remembers those, and isn't because I
think the point is you have this sort of system
set up for tradition, but the media has changed so drastically.
It's so polarized, it's so sensationalized. They're not looking to accomplish.
What maybe the Commission even is looking to accomplish is
(05:54):
that now at.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
Odds, what we lose is this number one, We lose
the town hall meeting in this situation where there are
private citizens who are on the stage and get to
ask the president, former president whatever questions. That's a real
big part of this. Plus we go to campuses we've got.
I mean, there are four schools right now, Texas State,
Virginia State, Lafayette College in Pennsylvania, the University of Utah
(06:19):
and Salt Lake. They're cramped, they're they're they're working up
right now to put on what they do. They teach civics,
special civics courses. I mean, there's an awful lot that's done.
Those schools really deserve a hand because they're whole.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
They just.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
I'm pretty sure those schools are supposed to be teaching civics.
Whether there's a debate or not. I do think we
should give them applause. Like you know, Mention in Utah
is teaching physics and civics. Uh. I guess my worry
is we have this. Are we clinging to an institution
that nobody is particularly satisfied with, whether they think the
(06:58):
moderators are too part in, whether they think the rules
are too archaic or too steeped in Robert's rules of order,
and we're not working hard enough to design a system
that will help our democracy flourish rather than just become sensationalistic.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Fact, I think that that is a criticism that's been there,
But we have changed what we do now. Wasn't what
happened when we how we did it back when it started,
or how it was done before us. Just dividing in
fact the ninety minutes in the six minutes.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Monitoring an audience seems to me a way of dispelling
a little bit of the theatrical nature.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
But you know that was both parties, both candidates. He said, Well,
at our debates there were people are booing, and those
are the primary debates. We have nothing to do with
the primary debates. In our debates. You can go back
and look at all thirty three of them. Very few
times do you even hear that there's an audience. They
may laugh if something funny you said. The ticket said
you're not allowed to make a noise. If so, the
(07:58):
Secret Service is going to come and r give up.
So they've been pretty good. They've been pretty good.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
The Silver Service really drag people out for making noise. Yes, yes,
I don't think you're making the case for democracy connecting.
I think I think you're finding yourself in all.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Right, Well, John, we're not perfect understood.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
I'm starting to get that sense. How does the the
Commission regain its footing or is it out of the barn?
Speaker 3 (08:32):
And that's the end you say this, as I said,
we were. We were started so that we could provide
the middle down the middle for the public. If these
two candidates.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Clowns, no, well you know I started with that and switched.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
But if they're successful, if they do this and it
works out, and so that people sitting at home and
watching on television have have learned something, we'll salute them.
We'll salute them now. Whether that doesn't mean we're not
ever going to come back. But if they crash, which
they may still, because a lot of things have to
be figure, we're going to be there. We're going to
(09:09):
be there until we know for sure.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
What be there to pick up the pieces. This is
one of the situations where you say to the debate,
people will be there when you fall, and I.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Remember that, yes, you will fall.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
All right, frank fur cop, ladies and gentlemen, we're gonna
take this for a break.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
So Vice President Kamala Harris has been out on the
campaign trail, which is very refreshing. For a long time,
it felt like the White House was hiding her, possibly
because whenever she speaks, it's mostly an unintelligible word salad.
But it turns out that's all on purpose.
Speaker 5 (09:53):
Talking about the significance of the passage of time, right,
the significance of the passage of time. So when you
think about it, there is great significance to the passage
of time. It seems like maybe it's a small issue.
Speaker 6 (10:08):
It's a big issue. You need to get to go
and need to be able to get where you need
to go to do the work and get home. And
it is time for us to do what we have
been doing in that time is every day.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Every day.
Speaker 6 (10:23):
It is time for us to agree that.
Speaker 7 (10:27):
She's come so far since our first session. My name
is Dahlia Rose Hibiscus and I am Vice President Kamala
Harris's holistic thought advisor. What is a holistic thought advisor.
It's holistic, yes, and I am advising. And what do
(10:49):
we mean when we say that? It means that I
am the one by whom the thoughts are being advised
from a place of advisement and then, once advised, communicated holistically.
What mm hmm you get up? I lead the Vice
President on not so much sentences as idea voyages.
Speaker 5 (11:13):
You think you just fell out of a coconut tree.
You exist in the context of all in which you
live and what came before you.
Speaker 7 (11:25):
It's a process I call speaking without thinking. It's not
about the destination of the thought. It's about the journey
and how many words you use to describe the journey.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
That's on top of everything else that we know and
don't know yet based on what we've just been able
to see. And because we've seen it or not doesn't
mean it hasn't happened.
Speaker 7 (11:46):
Whenever the Vice President gets a speech from her staff,
the first thing I do is cut out all the
words individually, and then I take those words to my
word cave. That's where I wait to learn what order
the universe wants them to be in. Words have vibrations,
(12:15):
the feeling they give you is so much more powerful
than what they need.
Speaker 5 (12:20):
We have the ability to see what can be unburdened
by what has been, and then to make the possible
actually happen.
Speaker 7 (12:33):
I hear the counter arguments all the time. People should
be able to understand what their leaders are saying when
they talk. But I prefer to leave Kamalist thoughts open
to interpretation, like a work of modern art that you
look at and go, I wonder what that was all about.
Speaker 5 (12:50):
See the moment in time in which we exist and
are present, and to be able to contextualize it, to
understand where we exist in the history and in the
moment as it relates not only to the past but
the future.
Speaker 7 (13:08):
It really is such a career highlight to be working
with someone with such an advanced mind space as the
Vice President. I also sell Essential Oils on Facebook Marketplace.
Speaker 8 (13:20):
Explore more shows from The Daily Show podcast universe by
searching The Daily Show wherever you get your podcasts. Watch
The Daily Show week nights at eleven ten Central on
Comedy Central and stream full episodes anytime on Paramount Plus.
This has been a Comedy Central podcastow
You're listening to Comedy Central. Hey, it's Michael Consta.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
The Daily Shows taking a break this week, but we
put together some special highlight episodes just for you. We'll
be back with brand new episodes of The Daily Show
next week. In the meantime, enjoy this episode, hell love
about it in The.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Daily Show my gost tonight. He is the co founder
and co chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates. Please
talking to the program, Frank Farnkoff, Let me first of all,
(00:44):
welcome you to the show and explain very quickly the
reason on the Commission for Presidential Debates kind of got
blown out of the water. You guys would run the debates.
The two candidates, Trump and Biden, the two main candidates,
made their own agreement and kind of cut you guys
(01:04):
out of the process. Is that correct?
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Well, they're trying.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
To I see. Why would they do that.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Because we're not nice people, I guess.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
And they seemed so nice. But why what was the
reasoning behind not having it in the way that it's
been since eighty seven?
Speaker 3 (01:19):
You know, it started in eighty seven for a reason.
We were created after two studies, one at Harvard, one
at the Georgetown not familiarly for the center, and because
there was so many problems with the candidates on both
sides over the years, we went sixteen years without any
presidential debates because they wouldn't participate. No one can be
forced to debate.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
They thought it was troo partisan when it was the
legal women.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Vite that's right, And so we were created. Paul Kirk
was then the chairman of the Democratic National Committee. I
was President Reagan's chairman of the RNC, and we created
the Commission and have done them now for well, we've
done thirty three over the last thirty six years. And
we were created for one purpose, to be in the
middle of the candidates, representing the people. Commission not non
(02:05):
part non part of IC. And so at this point
in time, with this particular UH battle, there's a lot
of things unexpected happening, and I don't know what the
hell is going to happen. Is we go forward? Agreed,
so we have to wait and see. Now they agreed,
supposedly they've agreed, but now the question is.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
You know, there's gonna be one debate on Sanna apparently,
and then one other debate. I'm not exactly ABC.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
UH. Now the questions that aren't been settled because I
hear that the former president today said he won't appear
unless a drug test is taken by Biden to show
he wasn't hopped up like he allegedly was when he
made his speech, you know, the State of the Union speech.
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
I don't think that the prey they want Biden drug
tested because they think he's trans what what? What do
they think is out of it?
Speaker 3 (02:50):
What?
Speaker 1 (02:52):
What do they believe?
Speaker 3 (02:53):
We believe? I guess that that he was hyped up
there at when.
Speaker 1 (02:57):
I say speech, and would Trump then also drug test?
Speaker 3 (03:00):
I don't think so?
Speaker 1 (03:01):
All right?
Speaker 3 (03:03):
And the other thing is what's undecided, John, is how
did they walk out on the stage or they see.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
These things they decide where to sit?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Oh yeah, a lot of things.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Uh huh.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
The mute button. I put a mute button in four
years ago because they weren't obeying the rules that they
weren't supposed to talk for two minutes when the others.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
I put one of those in my TV and I
used it as soon as they started. Let me ask
you a question, and perhaps this may not what are
we missing? Like? So let's say they don't go with
the Presidential Commission, and they don't go with what are
(03:41):
we really losing? I mean, to be perfectly frank, I
don't get much substantive out of these debates anyway, the
idea that their answers have to be a minute and
a half and there's a buzzer, there's a meat.
Speaker 3 (03:54):
So that's all been changed. We changed that some time ago.
What happens is the debates ninety minutes or divided in
the six fifteen minute pods that each answer a question
from the moderator for two minutes without interruption, and then
the moderator can drill down. It's no of these two minutes,
one minute and all the rest like existed a long
long time ago. Those are the things we changed, and
(04:16):
so you know what they're going to do here. They
haven't answered those questions.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
But do you believe that those debates were fruitful? Like
when I think of the debates between Trump and Hillary,
or Trump and Biden or Trump, and let's say, Adore,
I didn't necessarily, I didn't find much.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
What we do, what we do after each cycle is
we go out and ask the public did the debates
have an effect with any good for you? In making
this decision, and about sixty five to seventy percent say
it's not the only and the most significant factor, But yes,
it does play a part. And you know, we look
at it in two ways. John. Not only are they
answering the questions about issues that are important to the
(04:55):
people they want to hear, but you'll learn an awful
lot about the personality, the attitude of a person, how
they conduct themselves in the debates. For example, I think
for former President Trump, really hurt himself in the first
debate last time. I think al Gore back in nineteen
or in two thousand walking across the stage in front
of door, So they learned that.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Isn't that? I think that's kind of my point, which is,
if what we take away from it is al Gore
side and war rouge, so he shouldn't so he shouldn't
be president. That strikes me as a methodology that is
terribly flawed.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
Well, you tie that with what the answers to the
questions were also on.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
It, but no one remembers those, and isn't because I
think the point is you have this sort of system
set up for tradition, but the media has changed so drastically.
It's so polarized, it's so sensationalized. They're not looking to accomplish.
What maybe the Commission even is looking to accomplish is
(05:54):
that now at.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
Odds, what we lose is this number one, We lose
the town hall meeting in this situation where there are
private citizens who are on the stage and get to
ask the president, former president whatever questions. That's a real
big part of this. Plus we go to campuses we've got.
I mean, there are four schools right now, Texas State,
Virginia State, Lafayette College in Pennsylvania, the University of Utah
(06:19):
and Salt Lake. They're cramped, they're they're they're working up
right now to put on what they do. They teach civics,
special civics courses. I mean, there's an awful lot that's done.
Those schools really deserve a hand because they're whole.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
They just.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
I'm pretty sure those schools are supposed to be teaching civics.
Whether there's a debate or not. I do think we
should give them applause. Like you know, Mention in Utah
is teaching physics and civics. Uh. I guess my worry
is we have this. Are we clinging to an institution
that nobody is particularly satisfied with, whether they think the
(06:58):
moderators are too part in, whether they think the rules
are too archaic or too steeped in Robert's rules of order,
and we're not working hard enough to design a system
that will help our democracy flourish rather than just become sensationalistic.
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Fact, I think that that is a criticism that's been there,
But we have changed what we do now. Wasn't what
happened when we how we did it back when it started,
or how it was done before us. Just dividing in
fact the ninety minutes in the six minutes.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Monitoring an audience seems to me a way of dispelling
a little bit of the theatrical nature.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
But you know that was both parties, both candidates. He said, Well,
at our debates there were people are booing, and those
are the primary debates. We have nothing to do with
the primary debates. In our debates. You can go back
and look at all thirty three of them. Very few
times do you even hear that there's an audience. They
may laugh if something funny you said. The ticket said
you're not allowed to make a noise. If so, the
(07:58):
Secret Service is going to come and r give up.
So they've been pretty good. They've been pretty good.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
The Silver Service really drag people out for making noise. Yes, yes,
I don't think you're making the case for democracy connecting.
I think I think you're finding yourself in all.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
Right, Well, John, we're not perfect understood.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
I'm starting to get that sense. How does the the
Commission regain its footing or is it out of the barn?
Speaker 3 (08:32):
And that's the end you say this, as I said,
we were. We were started so that we could provide
the middle down the middle for the public. If these
two candidates.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Clowns, no, well you know I started with that and switched.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
But if they're successful, if they do this and it
works out, and so that people sitting at home and
watching on television have have learned something, we'll salute them.
We'll salute them now. Whether that doesn't mean we're not
ever going to come back. But if they crash, which
they may still, because a lot of things have to
be figure, we're going to be there. We're going to
(09:09):
be there until we know for sure.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
What be there to pick up the pieces. This is
one of the situations where you say to the debate,
people will be there when you fall, and I.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Remember that, yes, you will fall.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
All right, frank fur cop, ladies and gentlemen, we're gonna
take this for a break.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
So Vice President Kamala Harris has been out on the
campaign trail, which is very refreshing. For a long time,
it felt like the White House was hiding her, possibly
because whenever she speaks, it's mostly an unintelligible word salad.
But it turns out that's all on purpose.
Speaker 5 (09:53):
Talking about the significance of the passage of time, right,
the significance of the passage of time. So when you
think about it, there is great significance to the passage
of time. It seems like maybe it's a small issue.
Speaker 6 (10:08):
It's a big issue. You need to get to go
and need to be able to get where you need
to go to do the work and get home. And
it is time for us to do what we have
been doing in that time is every day.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Every day.
Speaker 6 (10:23):
It is time for us to agree that.
Speaker 7 (10:27):
She's come so far since our first session. My name
is Dahlia Rose Hibiscus and I am Vice President Kamala
Harris's holistic thought advisor. What is a holistic thought advisor.
It's holistic, yes, and I am advising. And what do
(10:49):
we mean when we say that? It means that I
am the one by whom the thoughts are being advised
from a place of advisement and then, once advised, communicated holistically.
What mm hmm you get up? I lead the Vice
President on not so much sentences as idea voyages.
Speaker 5 (11:13):
You think you just fell out of a coconut tree.
You exist in the context of all in which you
live and what came before you.
Speaker 7 (11:25):
It's a process I call speaking without thinking. It's not
about the destination of the thought. It's about the journey
and how many words you use to describe the journey.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
That's on top of everything else that we know and
don't know yet based on what we've just been able
to see. And because we've seen it or not doesn't
mean it hasn't happened.
Speaker 7 (11:46):
Whenever the Vice President gets a speech from her staff,
the first thing I do is cut out all the
words individually, and then I take those words to my
word cave. That's where I wait to learn what order
the universe wants them to be in. Words have vibrations,
(12:15):
the feeling they give you is so much more powerful
than what they need.
Speaker 5 (12:20):
We have the ability to see what can be unburdened
by what has been, and then to make the possible
actually happen.
Speaker 7 (12:33):
I hear the counter arguments all the time. People should
be able to understand what their leaders are saying when
they talk. But I prefer to leave Kamalist thoughts open
to interpretation, like a work of modern art that you
look at and go, I wonder what that was all about.
Speaker 5 (12:50):
See the moment in time in which we exist and
are present, and to be able to contextualize it, to
understand where we exist in the history and in the
moment as it relates not only to the past but
the future.
Speaker 7 (13:08):
It really is such a career highlight to be working
with someone with such an advanced mind space as the
Vice President. I also sell Essential Oils on Facebook Marketplace.
Speaker 8 (13:20):
Explore more shows from The Daily Show podcast universe by
searching The Daily Show wherever you get your podcasts. Watch
The Daily Show week nights at eleven ten Central on
Comedy Central and stream full episodes anytime on Paramount Plus.
This has been a Comedy Central podcastow
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Intentionally Disturbing
Join me on this podcast as I navigate the murky waters of human behavior, current events, and personal anecdotes through in-depth interviews with incredible people—all served with a generous helping of sarcasm and satire. After years as a forensic and clinical psychologist, I offer a unique interview style and a low tolerance for bullshit, quickly steering conversations toward depth and darkness. I honor the seriousness while also appreciating wit. I’m your guide through the twisted labyrinth of the human psyche, armed with dark humor and biting wit.