October 2, 2025 • 40 mins
Dan discusses the playoff baseball and goes through history on MLB rosters and MVPs. Peter King talks about trying to make the comp between Shohei Ohtani and someone comparable in football, why he’s fine with ties in the NFL, and argues with Dan about what defines a Hall of Fame quarterback. Notre Dame is a draw regardless of their record and Dan thinks they’ll be a regular participant in the College Football Playoff for the foreseeable future.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Starting lineup's been altered today. Dilan in for Fritzie, Seaton's here, Marv, Paul,
Yours truly and the BRGS. We'll have a poll question
for you. We'll clean up the one we had from
our one. Peter King will join us. Hall of Fame
football writer who actually is He's okay with a tie
in overtime, and he'll explain that to you. Coming up,
(00:26):
Al Michaels will be on the call. Tonight we have
Thursday Night football and it'll be the Rams and the Niners.
The Niners getting eight and a half. No Brock party
in this game. Al Michaels will be on the call.
Al will join us. Coming up. All right, here's a
couple of things on the Dodgers, so I'm watching, okay,
everybody expected them to blow by the Reds. Yamamoto allowed
(00:50):
two unearned runs and six and two thirds over his
last six starts. So this is since August thirty first,
Yamamoto has allowed three earned runs forty innings, three earned
in forty innings, striking out fifty three. The opposition is
batting one ten against him over that spans. The stat
(01:25):
of today brought to you by Panini America. Now, it's
good that he's pitching that well, because in two postseason games,
the Dodgers bullpen has thrown four and a third. That's
fewest of any team in the playoffs. That's really good
news because over that time period four in a third
they've allowed twelve base runners, five hits, seven walks, and
the era is a ten ooh.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Now stead of a day, stall of a day, stead
of a day, scout out a day.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
This is the study and that's why he probably came
back in for an extra inning. There is take away
some of the stress or the risk with that bullpen.
In the three previous season since the current format was introduced,
only two of the twelve wild card series had gone
three games. This season, today you're gonna have three of
(02:20):
the four series go the distance. It's fun. It's a
game seven field, it's a winner go home, and it's
game three. I was looking at the Dodger lineup and
you start to look at Mookie Betts won an MVP,
Freddie Freeman and MVP. Otani's got three MVPs. Clayton Kershaw
has an MVP. So that's four players, six MVP totals.
(02:43):
And I started to think, let's look at other lineups
here of how many MVPs have been in a lineup
in baseball history. Now the Yankees, this year's Yankees have
four players who have won MVPs, four MVPs total. Now,
gold Schmidt didn't win his MVP with the Yankees, and
Cody Bellinger didn't win his MVP with them. Jim Carlos
(03:07):
Stanton didn't win his MVP. So it's Aaron Judge the
Dodgers in twenty twenty four, Kershaw, Otani, Freddie Freeman, and
Mooki the Dodgers in twenty twenty two, Betts, Freeman, Kershaw, Bellinger.
Nineteen ninety six, Red Sox, Knseko, Clemens, Mo Vaughn, and
(03:29):
Andre Dawson. But how many? How many MVPs? Kenseko didn't
win his MVP there, Dawson didn't win his MVP there,
Clemens won his MVP there? Did Mo Vaughn win his
MVP there? I believe? Okay, the Angels in nineteen eighty two,
(03:51):
Rod carw Don Baylor, Fred Lynn, and Reggie Jackson. But
Freddie won it with the Red Sox carew. Did Rod
win it with the Angels or the Twins? Did Reggie
win the MVP with the Angels or the A's as as? Okay,
see that's the difference here. I'm looking at a team
(04:12):
that won the MVP. On those teams, the Reds. Johnny Bench,
Joe Morgan, Joe George Foster, Pete Rose, they won their
MVPs with the Reds.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
Yes, Marvin, So, I don't think you can count they
shares Dodgers because Mookie won in Boston.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Yeah. Yeah, Still impressive though, to have MVPs in the lineup.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
Oh, it's incredible.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Yeah. I still look at that seventy eight Reds team,
you know, Bench, Morgan, Foster, and Rose, and all four
of those won MVPs with the Reds. Greatest National League
lineup in history in my opinion, Yes, Martin.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
I'm asking, I'm legit asking for the fans of Cincinnati
that watched that team. Do you think they should have won?
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (04:56):
More?
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Yes? Yeah. You know they faced Brooks Robinson the Oriols
in nineteen seventy, but that seventy Orioles team had four
twenty game winners. Oakland was just better. When they faced Oakland,
they were better. They beat the Red Sox one of
the great World Series of all time. Then they beat
they swept the Yankees. They embarrassed the Yankees. They probably
(05:18):
should have won two more out of that. But I'm
gonna be fair to Baltimore. It was a great lineup pitching, hitting, defense,
and Oakland just had They had the Reds numbers. Even
the Mets when they'd play in the playoffs, seem to
have the Reds numbers. But those that lineup, I put
that nationally against anybody that lineup against any National league lineup.
(05:42):
Pitching staff wasn't great. Had a Hall of Fame manager
in Sparky Anderson. But when you talk about you know,
you had bench. You had Perez Morgan concepcion to me
as a Hall of Famer, Pete Rose, George Foster, Sasar Geronimo,
one of the best defensive players in the game, Ken
Griffy Junior. Then you had George Foster came in and
he had fifty home runs back when people weren't hitting
(06:04):
fifty home runs. That was a power power, powerful UNI team.
Danny Dreesen was on the bench. I mean they had
a really good, good team.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
Yeah, PAULI I'm looking at a couple other lineups in
somewhat recent history that had three killers that were back
to back to back. The nineteen ninety six Mariners Ken Griffy, Junior,
Jay Buner and a Rod Forty nine homers, forty four
homers and thirty six homers in the ninety six season.
That's a nice lineup.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
And the Dodgers have one, one, two three r That's
what's so impressive is you got MVPMVPMVP and the fact
that you got Otani leading off. See, that's what makes
it so difficult for a pitching staff or a pitcher.
Your first batter is Otani. You don't get to ease
into the lineup. You know, you might have a guy
who's a leadoff guy who gets on base and maybe steals.
(06:53):
I mean, that's the way it used to be. Now
it's he's here. And can you imagine you faring up
for your start. You're spending four days to get ready,
You're doing everything, you're checking out scouting report, you're down
there long throw, and then then you got your bullpen session.
Then you're ready to go, and all of a sudden,
your teammates come on, let's go where it's going and
(07:15):
Otani gets to the plate and it's just like that
high pressure right out of the game. Ah, you know,
and pictures have to kind of that. The mound is
always different than the mound in the bullpen, and it's
it's just a different feel and all of that and
you're trying to settle in and all of a sudden,
(07:35):
that's why Ricky Henderson, Oh, I think he let off
seventy nine games with home runs something incredible. Just imagine
you start the game and it's like, damn it, he
did it the best. And you go in there saying,
I'm not going to give him something to hit. You know,
I'd rather walk him than have him, you know, take
(07:57):
me deep.
Speaker 4 (07:58):
Yeah, Marvin, Sorry, I don't want to get on the
Ricky topic, but I can't help it. Shouldn't shouldn't he
be considered maybe the greatest player ever?
Speaker 2 (08:06):
No, thank you, thank you, Marvin. Yes, no, no, no, no,
what I mean he said, no a little bit too
quil Well. He didn't have the batting average and he
was in a great fielder. What he was a disruptor
as good, if not better than anybody in modern baseball history.
When he got on people they got out of their
(08:30):
comfort zone to be like, I'm gonna throw over, throw over, hey,
throw fastballs because I want to make sure I throw
him out. He was the great disruptor.
Speaker 5 (08:39):
Yeah, Pauling, I'm looking at the first decade of Ricky
Henderson's career and it's almost like Lawrence Taylor. He was
impossible to deal with. A base hit became a double
automatically his first few years. I mean he was stealing
one hundred bases repeatedly and he was hitting three, ten, three,
twenty three, fifteen the first ten years or something.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah, well, maybe I'm not being fair. What was his
lifetime average?
Speaker 5 (09:02):
Lifetime average, Remember he played a lot of later years
where it went down, but lifetime two seventy nine, that's
what I thought.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Yeah, but he got on base. He had power, Yes, Marph.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
But when we talk about the greatest players like Bonds
and Babe Ruth, we don't ever bring up how great
of a defensive player they were.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
If you are a great defensive player, it should be
brought up, but we don't. Well, no, I do. Like
Mike Schmidt was an all timer at third base. George
Brett was an unbelievable feeler Joe Morgan was a great
Davey concepcion. Part of the reason why he should be
on the Hall of Fame is he revolutionized the position
on aster turf Johnny Bench. That's why he's the greatest
(09:45):
catcher in history in my opinion. Offensively great, but defensively.
You know, he was able to handle a pitching staff
and he didn't run on him. So I think, I
think if you're really good, then it should be part
of your resume. I guarant Judge to me not a
good fielder. He's just not. I mean, he's serviceable out there.
(10:05):
It's better than Jen Carlos Stanton. But then I am yeah,
And I think that's sort of like the defensive part
for Barry Bond splits into Young Bonds Old Bonds too.
That Young Bonds had a run of like how many
golden gloves in a row. You know, he just didn't
have a golden arm because he couldn't throw out Sid
Bream from left field short left field in the playoffs
(10:28):
and he couldn't throw him out. Yeah, Bonds had range,
but he didn't have an arm. His dad had a
better arm than him. Yeah, Paul, I think two.
Speaker 5 (10:35):
Things hurt Ricky Henderson, he's clearly an all time great,
but the.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Second half a lot of teams though, yes, the second half.
Speaker 5 (10:41):
Of a career, he was a mercenary. He went from team
to team. And also he's almost like a character of
the game. And the character of Ricky Henderson is bigger
than the player Ricky Nelson. And I don't know if
you compare it, but like I think Charles Barkley's underrated
because he's such a character and a personality and his
career doesn't get the do and Ricky Henderson's first Yeah,
(11:02):
from from twenty to thirty three, he was lights out, you.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Know, great player. You whenever he got up or got on,
then he made it interesting. But that's when the stolen
base meant something. You know that teams really cared about it.
Now it's coming back a little bit, but there's nobody
that you go, oh boy, he's on, because Ricky, if
he was on first, he was going to end up
(11:26):
on third. You could have a sack fly and he's
going to score. Yes, Martin, it's crazy because guess who's next.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Maguire and Conseko like that lineup is is that lineup underrated?
Speaker 2 (11:37):
That was a great lineup, great great lineup. But you
know that's part of the problem of being artificially inflated,
where you might not give them credit, but then do
they deserve credit?
Speaker 6 (11:49):
You know.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
I saw a picture of McGuire when he was he
had to be a rookie and he was so lean,
but he did hit like forty nine home runs back
then when he looked like that. Chris and Syracuse, Hi, Chris,
what's on your mind today?
Speaker 7 (12:10):
Hey Danny, I got a couple things for you. You
guys were talking Chris Carter the Bike's got him for
one hundred bucks off waivers from the Eagles. And I
think another reason the Reds didn't win World Series. Every
year they had to win the Division to get in,
and the Dodgers were so good the Reds would win
close to one hundred games and they wouldn't make it.
And off of Fritzie being off for the Jewish Holiday.
It got me thinking about Sandy Kofax, who missed a
(12:31):
World Series start, I think because of the same holiday.
And I think it was Don Drysdale was a rookie
and he got the start for that game, and he
was interviewed. He said he went like two and a
third and he got shelled and as the manager took
the ball from him, as he was walking back to
the dugout, he turned and said, Hey, Skip, I bet
you wished I were Jewish.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Thank you, Chris. So, Fritzie is Sandy Kofax and Dylan
is Don Dry. I'm fine with being Drysdale Hall of Famer. Yeah, yeah,
I'm not fine with Fritzy being Sandy Kofax though it
seems extreme, but they are left handed and Jewish and
that's where the similarities at. Sam and Saint Louis. Hi, Sam,
(13:18):
what's on your mind?
Speaker 8 (13:21):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (13:22):
Dan, I was calling about a lineup from three years
ago that potentially has four Hall of Famers on it.
Between them, they have thirty six All Star appearances, twenty
five Gold Gloves, and four MVP Awards. And that lineup
would be the Saint Louis Cardinals with Malina, Poohols, Arnado
and gold Smith.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
Yeah, that's a really good lineup. Looks like Pools is
going to get the Angels. Managerial John how about that?
He's done some managing. I think I don't know if
he's done it in winter Ball, but he's done some
managing and looks like Ardie Moreno, who is gonna bring
him in?
Speaker 5 (14:03):
Yeah, Paul Foolhols is still gonna get paid by the Angels.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Yeah, you're getting paid by them for a long time.
Now keep it going. Jeez. I don't know if he's
he's been getting paid by them, but yeah, he's gonna
make more money. Let's see uh and Twine in Fort Lauderdale.
Hey and Twine, what's on your mind? Hey?
Speaker 10 (14:23):
What's up?
Speaker 9 (14:24):
DP five six?
Speaker 11 (14:27):
First time?
Speaker 2 (14:28):
Long time?
Speaker 4 (14:29):
Just a quick clarification being a big hurricane saying cam
Ward actually holds the record for the most touchdowns in
college football one fifty eight and how.
Speaker 10 (14:39):
You got am going to sleep on your boy? Steve Young.
He was also in the eighty four supplemental Draft.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
All right, well thank you. Yeah, but he went to
the USFL and then he was in the supplemental Draft.
I believe that's why.
Speaker 5 (14:52):
Yes, Paul, the NSA does not give cam Ward credit
for the year he was at Incarnate Word, so he
is not in there. I think he doesn't get it
officially with the NCAA. Dylan Gabriel and case Keenum both
have one hundred and fifty five touchdown in college.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Let's take a break. Peter King, Hall of Famer, he'll
join us. We'll talk to him. He sent me a
text yesterday out of nowhere saying, why am I the
only person who is fine with a tie in overtime?
I said, all right, Pete, how about joining us on Thursday?
He'll join us next year on The Dan Patrick Show.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Hey, this is Jason McIntyre. Join me every weekday morning
on my podcast, Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. This isn't
your typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down your.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Throat every day.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
Straight Fire gives you honest opinions on all the biggest
sports headlines, accurate stats to help you win big at
the sports book, and all the best guests. Do yourself
a favor and listen to Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
We were talking about great lineups in baseball history and
how many teams have MVPs in their lineup. You of
course have show a tany Freddie Freeman and Mookie Betts
with the Dodgers. We talked about the Big Red Machine
because those guys won their MVPs with the Reds when
you had Rose and Morgan and Bench and Foster Peter
(16:28):
King who covered the Reds, I believe for a little
while in Cincinnati, longtime NFL writer, Where do you rank
the Big Red Machine as far as lineups of all time?
Speaker 6 (16:39):
Dan, It's got to be in the top five, clearly.
I think it's hard because you have to rank lineups
as you know, in their era. So I don't know
how a lineup could be much better, any better than
what the Yankees put on the field with Gary and Ruth.
(17:01):
But the difference with this Reds lineup is that, you know,
look a lot of times, obviously the pitcher's still hit.
You have Davy Concepcion batting eighth. You know, sometimes maybe
Caesar Geronimo, But I mean, you know, they they had
an all star batting eighth a lot of times, and
(17:22):
I don't know. To me, I thought it was so
dangerous and that was such a potent group. And you're right.
I covered him on and off for four years in
the late seventies and early eighties as an intern. And
then I mean I actually went on the road with
the Reds three times in eighty eighty one and eighty two,
(17:46):
and so I got to know those guys. I got
to know Johnny Bench, got to know Tom Seavers some
and they were they were totally fearless. That's the thing
I loved about him. You know, I just love the
fact that Tony Perez conceptsi on. Hey, bring it on,
we love it.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
You know, We've been talking about Shoho Tani that he
has this added advantage that he's able to pitch, so
no matter what you do hitting, he's going to be
a great hitter. But he always has that. And I'm
wondering if that translates to the NFL that Josh Allen
and Lamar Jackson have the added element of running as
(18:26):
well as being really good passers, and how that gives them.
Does that give them a little bit more of a
head start when it comes to MVPs.
Speaker 6 (18:36):
Yeah, I mean, shoe Otani to me, is the guy
in the NFL who'd be like him. Maybe is Travis
Hunter at some point, because you've always had mobile quarterbacks.
I mean, you know, he had Michael Vick running for
in Colin Kaepernick running for one hundred yards in playoff games.
(18:56):
I was at lambeau Field in I think O two
when Michael Vick came in and be far of twenty
seven to seven in the snow, and he did it
with his legs just as much as his arm. So
that has existed. Otani is so special because he's not
just a pitcher. I mean he might be at his
(19:19):
p I mean, he might be Garrett Crochet. I mean, hey,
Garrett Crochet, might be show Hey. I mean because I
don't want I don't want to demean show Hey Otani,
because man, he's great. When I'm really looking forward next year,
I hope that we could see him pitch seven or
(19:40):
eight innings every fifth day. I hope. I have no
idea what his body can take, but man, what a
treat it is to watch him play.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
All Right, So I get a random text from you
yesterday saying, basically, am I the only guy who is
affiliated with football who is okay with a tie in?
Over time?
Speaker 6 (20:01):
I actually liked ties. I mean the biggest reason, Dan,
I'll take you back to twenty twenty one. There was
one tie in the NFL that season, Pittsburgh tied Detroit sixteen.
All okay, that was you know, that was I mean
Detroit either was winless at the time or whatever. They
(20:22):
were a bad team at that time, but there was
a tie sixteen sixteen. At the end of the year,
the Steelers record was nine seven and one, okay, And
that season there were three teams in the AFC that
were nine and eight, the Chargers, the Colts, and the Dolphins.
(20:45):
So just imagine. And the Lions had a field goal
in overtime that they missed, So imagine if the Steelers,
if that field goal had been good, and the Steelers
would have lost. I don't know who would have won
the tiebreaker, but it would have been a fourteen tiebreaker.
A tie basically eliminates a tie. At the end of
(21:06):
the seats, you know, you're either north of the Mason
Dixon line or south of it, but it eliminates it.
And plus here's the other thing, Dan, that game the
other night was incredibly fun and at the end of it, Now,
if you're if you're a fan of one of the
two teams, you know, Green Bay or Dallas, maybe you're
(21:29):
ticked off that you and if you're a player, you're
ticked off that you got a tie. I mean, how
can a fan just watching at home you see the
bizarre end the clock stop with one second left and
they're able to kick a field goal. How can you
be upset at that? I mean, it was fun. It
(21:49):
was scintillating the whole time. So I don't know. I mean,
I bet that was a lot more fun than the
sixteen sixteen tie between Pittsburgh and Detroit. That was a
fantastic football game.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Yeah, it was a great meal. But I got to
have dessert in coffee, and when we didn't get that,
I want to have I'd like to have, you know,
a winner and a loser. That's why we play these games,
to win or lose.
Speaker 6 (22:18):
But but but it's so unique. It's so I mean,
you know, there's they don't There isn't even on average
one tie per season. I think it's kind of cool.
My grandson, Freddy, who's a huge football fan, he's seven
years old, about to turn eight, and he watches all
(22:39):
the games. And he got up Monday morning to get
ready for school, and you know, my daughter said, hey,
there was a tie last night Green Bay in Dallas.
A tie how does that happen? I can't believe it
a tie, so I don't know. I think once in
a while, different is fun.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
If I task you with make overtime, how you would
want to make it. Let's say it's different than what
it is now, is how would you improve overtime?
Speaker 6 (23:07):
Well, you know, the selfish person in me would want
them to just play sudden death, don't have a clock
in overtime. The problem with that is, and I very
much empathize with the players. I was dead set against
a seventeenth game. I am deador set against an eighteenth game.
It's just not fair to these players. It isn't. You're
(23:30):
adding on six percent more snaps for a starting player
and saying, ah, there's not any more injury risk. Of
course there is, so I understand why you don't want
to add more snaps to overtime. Selfishly, I would like
to see it go until it ends. But I don't
think right now, in my opinion anyway, that there's a
(23:52):
better system than this system that there is. The only
way you could do it differently is to have first
score wins, which I think is eminently unfair.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
I'm wondering if the tush push is esthetically not pleasing.
Seeing kickers kick all these field goals is not esthetically
pleasing either. In my opinion, does the NFL how much
of it? Should they be worried about the glut of
kickers being so great at what they do.
Speaker 6 (24:24):
I would be because they didn't create this game to.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Have.
Speaker 6 (24:30):
I mean, let's just say Dan, that the that you're
playing the Dallas Cowboys and your kicker skitter's one out
of bounds and you get the ball. You know, the
Cowboys get the ball at their own forty yard line.
Think about it. They need ten yards to get Brandon
Aubrey and field goal it's and again, let's say they
(24:52):
get it at the run it back to the twenty eight.
You know, they only need twenty two to twenty three
yards to get him in field goal range, and not
just a maybe field goal. He is likely to make
a sixty six sixty seven yard field goal, you know,
in weatherless conditions. I think the one thing the NFL
(25:13):
has to look at. And you know, and I don't
really cover this obviously now I'm retired, but I've been
reading about how, you know, some of the balls that
get broken in the kicking the k balls they get
broken in better than they did before, and they're going
to have to look at that to see if that
(25:36):
is a big factor, because kicking a well worn football
is much better for a kicker than kicking a football
right out of the box.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
I know you voted for the Hall of Fame. For decades,
there's been a lot of conversation about Russell Wilson. Can
you play your way out of the Hall of Fame?
Speaker 6 (25:55):
Now?
Speaker 2 (25:55):
I don't know if you had Russ in the Hall
of Fame in your opinion, but have player played their
way out of the Hall of Fame?
Speaker 6 (26:02):
I think so, and I think coaches can coach their
way out of the Hall of Fame. You've got to
consider a guy's entire career. I think Russell Wilson was
a borderline quarterback for the Hall of Fame. We have
to remember a few things right now about the quarterback position.
Look at the incredible glut of strong quarterback candidates for
(26:26):
the Hall of Fame. I mean, I think Eli Manning
is a strong candidate. Matthew Stafford is going to be
a strong candidate. Matt Ryan is a candidate. You've got
a lot of people who are candidates who've put up really,
really good numbers. What differentiates you? And now we have
seen Russell Wilson be disappointing in Denver, kind of get
(26:49):
run out of Pittsburgh when they needed a veteran, they
didn't choose to resign him. And he has two out
of three ignominious weeks the Giants and loses his job.
It all has to factor in, Dan, it would you know?
I think he and again we'll see. I think he's
(27:10):
got an uphill fight, but then again, his career is
not over.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Yeah. I think Russ was far more consistent than Eli.
You got ten Pro Bowls back when it did mean
something to be a Pro Bowl player.
Speaker 6 (27:21):
I'm not sure it did mean something in twenty ten
years ago. Dan, I don't think the Pro Bowl has
meant anything in twenty five years.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
Okay, but he did. He was a better He's a
better regular season quarterback. His stats aren't. It's not even close.
Eli is an inch away from having one Super Bowl
with David Tyree's catch, and Russell is an inch away
with Malcolm Butler from having two Super Bowls.
Speaker 6 (27:49):
Blah blah blah. You know so what, I don't care.
Could we go back to the championship game in nineteen
fifty eight and say, well, what if Johnny Unitas hadn't
made such and such a pass, a miracle catch by whoever?
Speaker 2 (28:08):
Raymond Berry?
Speaker 6 (28:09):
Yeah, you can't. You can't act that way. In my opinion,
I don't think.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
We're holding it against him because he lost that Super Bowl.
If you win two Super Bowls and you have his resume,
he's a Hall of Famer.
Speaker 6 (28:21):
Okay, but Dan Eli Manning beat the best quarterback head
to head in the Super Bowl, best quarterback of all
time twice, head to head. He beat the best coach
of this era head to head in the Super Bowl twice.
I don't care what his stats were. I don't care numbers,
(28:42):
and I understand I'm not saying he's a walk in
Hall of Famer. But what I'm saying is, at the
biggest moments, how about Eli Manning going into Green Bay
when it's nine hundred below zero and beating a team
that is used to playing like that in that a lot,
beating Brett Farve in overtime, and you know, look, I
(29:06):
think Eli Manning. I in my opinion, I'd vote for
Eli Manning. And I'll tell you why because at the
biggest moments of his career he produced, and you're right,
his regular season record, a lot of it is mediocre,
even though he put up huge numbers. But I am
(29:28):
more of a fan of let's not get totally hung
up on the numbers, especially because the numbers for quarterbacks
now don't mean is don't mean the same thing as
they used to.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
But I can argue that the defensive line won that
Super Bowl, that first one against Brady. They beat the
hell out of him. They dominated that game.
Speaker 6 (29:48):
How about the Joe Namath Super Bowl. Did Matt Snell
have a much better game that day than Joe Namath?
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Yes?
Speaker 6 (29:56):
Yeah, and did? And did the Jets defense totally snuff
out the vaunted Colts offense?
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yes? Yes, But Joe.
Speaker 6 (30:08):
Namath was drafted by the New York Jets, was you know,
chose the AFL over the NFL. And he had the
signature one of the great wins in history, and he
predicted it was going to happen. And so I understand
what you're saying, but.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
That's not enough to put him in the Hall of Fame.
I don't think Namath had Hall of Fame numbers. He didn't.
Speaker 6 (30:33):
That doesn't matter he had Hall of Fame impact in
a Hall of Fame impact, huge, huge impact. Oh, I
understand the era, and I think it's it's more I'm
not one of these guys. I just of course you
look at his numbers. You look at Ken Stabler's numbers.
You know you're gonna say, geez, that's fairly mediocre. You're
(30:56):
judging it in a different thing. How about Joe Namath
thrown for four thousand yards the fourteen game season. That
is incredible in those days. So I'm only saying I'm not.
I don't think you can say that, well, Joe Namath
didn't have Hall of Fame numbers, no crap. Sure, lock,
I see the numbers too, but he had Hall of
(31:19):
Fame impact.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Lenny Dawson was a better quarterback.
Speaker 6 (31:23):
Okay, don't I don't.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Did he have did he?
Speaker 6 (31:26):
Did he do what Joe Namath did?
Speaker 11 (31:28):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Yeah, he beat he won the Super Bowl. He didn't
do no guarantee in the sixties, he didn't know one.
Speaker 6 (31:36):
No one in the sixties did what Joe Namath did
for the sport of pro football. No one, no one.
And so in my opinion, he absolutely belongs to the
Hall of Fame. Was Joe was Len Dawson? A better
quarterback was Daryl Lamonica was you know, I'm not I
don't really care. I mean, I just don't care.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
I like you fired up? Do you want to get right?
Speaker 6 (32:02):
Dan? Who you Dan?
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Who do you like tonight with the Red Sox and
the Yank Games?
Speaker 6 (32:07):
Red Sox y Eggs?
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Well here, since I'm talking to you, I'll take the
Red Sox.
Speaker 6 (32:14):
Now. I mean, hey, look, they're relying on a kid
who started the year at a ball right.
Speaker 2 (32:19):
Both of these starters, I don't think they shave. They're
they're like twenty four years Whatever happened to deep pitching staffs?
Speaker 6 (32:27):
Yeah, well starters, the whole thing has changed. It's a
bullpen game. I know it's a bullpen game. And I'll
tell you what these two games, I don't know. I
got to tell you something. Both these teams, I don't
know how they get to the park and don't just
pour themselves into their chair and say, geez, I need
a nap. I mean, these games just to watch them
(32:51):
have taken a ton out. I mean they've they've really
been fun. This has been good for baseball.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
What were you doing forty seven years ago?
Speaker 6 (33:00):
Forty seven years ago today. Yes, I was with my
good friend Tony Grossi of the Post, the student newspaper
at Ohio University. We skipped class that day and at
two o'clock in the afternoon, we walked into the Union,
the nice little bar on campus, and we asked the
(33:22):
guy to put it on I think ABC, right, put
the TV on ABC, and we watched the Yankees and
Bucky Bleeping Dent win that game, and the class we
skipped newswriting and editing. We were seniors. The professor of
the class came in midway through the game at the
(33:46):
end of the class and he just said, yeah, you
guys are in trouble, but he knew that we were
going to be there, and we watched the game. It
was a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Don't be a stranger, Pete. You know something that bothers
you get you fire, you let me know.
Speaker 6 (34:01):
Thank you, Dan, really appreciate your reaching out.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
That's Peter King, Hall of Fame NFL writer. Yeah, Pete
said to me yesterday, I'm fine with a tie in
overtime and ask me what I was doing forty seven
years ago. I said, all right, I can do that.
Always great to hear from him, We'll take a break.
More phone calls coming up. Al Michaels will join us
next hour back after this.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to listen.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
Live the great Al Michaels in a half hour from now.
He's got the game tonight, the Niners against the Rams.
The Niners getting eight and a half for entertainment purposes only.
Gambling Podcast after the show available at Danpatrick dot com.
We have Dylan in for Fritzie today and he'll be
on the Gambling Podcast with Shan Irving and of course
Bad Larry. Still driving that trusty old ride. Keep it
(34:56):
looking sharp with Mako. From dentse to dings to faded paint,
They've literally got you covered. Get a free estimate today.
Uh oh, Vetter, get Mako, Michael and Syracuse. Hey Mike,
thanks for holding what's on your mind today?
Speaker 10 (35:10):
Hey Dan?
Speaker 11 (35:11):
Two thirty nine point nine, How are you good?
Speaker 6 (35:16):
Hey?
Speaker 11 (35:16):
Listen. Earlier you guys were talking about Ricky Henderson, about
the best of all time. So my question to you is,
as a player strictly as a player. My all time
favorite players Pete Rose. I don't think there's no question
that Pete Rose is better than Ricky Hunderson's.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Your comments uh different, But I can't argue with Pete
won more games than anybody in history of the game.
I think he was an All Star at five different positions.
I don't think anybody in baseball history has been. You'd
have to check that, but I think Pete was an
All Star at five different positions. Let here's how I
(35:54):
would settle this. You take Pete, I'll take Ricky. If
you took Ricky, I'd take Pete. Then I'd be fine
with that. Larry, and I don't know where that exact
that location is. Can you help me with that, Larry?
Speaker 10 (36:11):
Yeah, I'm in I'm telling you Turkey.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Oh you're in Turkey.
Speaker 10 (36:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Oh okay, big over here. Oh okay. I can't walk
the streets of Turkey. But I'm glad to have you
join us.
Speaker 9 (36:24):
Larry.
Speaker 10 (36:26):
Hey, top eleven, one seventy five. Thanks for taking my call. Yeah, question, Dan,
how long do you think that this money can last?
In pro sports and amateur sports? For that another n
I owe money WNBA contracts NBA guys getting thirty forty
fifty million dollars a year. Where's the money in? Where
does it dry up?
Speaker 2 (36:46):
Well, I don't know if there is a breaking point.
It feels like and thank you Larry, it feels like
there should be. But I remember when athletes were making
a million dollars and then it was Ricky Henderson and
I think Nolan Ryan they're making three million dollars. Like
there were certain times when you would hear the amount
(37:06):
and now I'm just numb to it. Nil what they get. Well,
I think there's always going to be a lot of
influx of money that you have in college football until
they get it professionalized. I think you're still going to
have that. There's going to be a few people making
a lot of money there. But the NBA is crazy.
(37:28):
In five years, you're probably going to have somebody making
one hundred million dollars this season because it has to
go to somebody because of the new TV deals, there's
a financial pie you split up and they can only
go to the players. Somebody's going to make a hundred
million dollars. It'll either be Shay Gilgis or Luka Doncic.
(37:49):
They're going to make a hundred million dollars maybe when
Ben Yama.
Speaker 4 (37:52):
Yes, Marv Trey Henderson makes about eleven million dollars a
year less than Isaiah Hartenstein. M h to set picks
in rebound and play hard?
Speaker 2 (38:03):
All right? Better defensive end or gratty more gutty? Uh
Dave in New York, Hi Dave, what's on your mind?
Hey Dave? Guess nothing's on your mind? Uh? John Fox
(38:25):
in Atlanta?
Speaker 6 (38:26):
Hi?
Speaker 8 (38:27):
John, Hey, about a six three one ninety quick question?
Notre Dame. When is the madness going to end?
Speaker 11 (38:34):
That?
Speaker 8 (38:35):
They don't get to play a conference championship? Last year
they got to sit back. They watched my quarterback Carson
get hurt and his SEC championship. He sat on the couch,
had an easy playoff game. How does this keep happening?
I mean ACC is getting stronger. They eat like in
Miami and then they can watch Miami lose in a
(38:57):
championship and then jump them and get in the playoff.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Hey, Notre Dame's good TV. Never lose sight of that
NBC partnership they're in. You know, this is the entertainment business.
Having Notre Dame there is good for ratings. Whether you're
rooting for them or against them. That's just the fact,
you know, whether you like it or not, they have
positioned themselves in a unbelievable way that if they go
(39:24):
ten and two, they're going to make the playoffs. And
now we've expanded the playoffs. Now it's almost like we're
going to take conference winners, and of course we're going
to take Notre Dame.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Yes, morph doesn't Notre Dame joining a conference take away
the mistique of being Notre Dame.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
Well, if I'm Notre Dame, I don't join a conference.
Speaker 4 (39:44):
You know, you're just by brand alone. Yeah, like we're
not at any conference. We're Notre Dame.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
I don't have to share anything. If I go to
a conference, I got to share. You know, Clemson one's
out of the ACC. If I'm Notre Dame, Why do
I want in the ACC unless you go, Well, we
get an auto birth. If we make we win the
playoffs or conference championship, Notre Dame is going to be in.
It would be really, really really rare. I'd be really
(40:11):
really surprised in the next ten years if Notre Dame
is not in the playoffs ten years, because I think
they want Notre Dame in the playoffs. Notre Dame is
a sure thing of tune in factor, great atmosphere, great history,
and you either love them or you hate them. Yes, Marv,
they were ranked at owing two. I know, yeah, nobody else.
(40:34):
Oh and two was ranked when don't we out at
Notre Dame? Is that in three weeks? Spots today? Two
weeks today? Is that right, Marvin? We leave on the fourteenth,
so two weeks from today we're in sol the yes?
Speaker 6 (40:50):
Is that right?
Speaker 2 (40:51):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (40:51):
Accurate.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Al Michaels set to join his final hour, Dan and
the Dana at Stan Patrick Show
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Starting lineup's been altered today. Dilan in for Fritzie, Seaton's here, Marv, Paul,
Yours truly and the BRGS. We'll have a poll question
for you. We'll clean up the one we had from
our one. Peter King will join us. Hall of Fame
football writer who actually is He's okay with a tie
in overtime, and he'll explain that to you. Coming up,
(00:26):
Al Michaels will be on the call. Tonight we have
Thursday Night football and it'll be the Rams and the Niners.
The Niners getting eight and a half. No Brock party
in this game. Al Michaels will be on the call.
Al will join us. Coming up. All right, here's a
couple of things on the Dodgers, so I'm watching, okay,
everybody expected them to blow by the Reds. Yamamoto allowed
(00:50):
two unearned runs and six and two thirds over his
last six starts. So this is since August thirty first,
Yamamoto has allowed three earned runs forty innings, three earned
in forty innings, striking out fifty three. The opposition is
batting one ten against him over that spans. The stat
(01:25):
of today brought to you by Panini America. Now, it's
good that he's pitching that well, because in two postseason games,
the Dodgers bullpen has thrown four and a third. That's
fewest of any team in the playoffs. That's really good
news because over that time period four in a third
they've allowed twelve base runners, five hits, seven walks, and
the era is a ten ooh.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Now stead of a day, stall of a day, stead
of a day, scout out a day.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
This is the study and that's why he probably came
back in for an extra inning. There is take away
some of the stress or the risk with that bullpen.
In the three previous season since the current format was introduced,
only two of the twelve wild card series had gone
three games. This season, today you're gonna have three of
(02:20):
the four series go the distance. It's fun. It's a
game seven field, it's a winner go home, and it's
game three. I was looking at the Dodger lineup and
you start to look at Mookie Betts won an MVP,
Freddie Freeman and MVP. Otani's got three MVPs. Clayton Kershaw
has an MVP. So that's four players, six MVP totals.
(02:43):
And I started to think, let's look at other lineups
here of how many MVPs have been in a lineup
in baseball history. Now the Yankees, this year's Yankees have
four players who have won MVPs, four MVPs total. Now,
gold Schmidt didn't win his MVP with the Yankees, and
Cody Bellinger didn't win his MVP with them. Jim Carlos
(03:07):
Stanton didn't win his MVP. So it's Aaron Judge the
Dodgers in twenty twenty four, Kershaw, Otani, Freddie Freeman, and
Mooki the Dodgers in twenty twenty two, Betts, Freeman, Kershaw, Bellinger.
Nineteen ninety six, Red Sox, Knseko, Clemens, Mo Vaughn, and
(03:29):
Andre Dawson. But how many? How many MVPs? Kenseko didn't
win his MVP there, Dawson didn't win his MVP there,
Clemens won his MVP there? Did Mo Vaughn win his
MVP there? I believe? Okay, the Angels in nineteen eighty two,
(03:51):
Rod carw Don Baylor, Fred Lynn, and Reggie Jackson. But
Freddie won it with the Red Sox carew. Did Rod
win it with the Angels or the Twins? Did Reggie
win the MVP with the Angels or the A's as as? Okay,
see that's the difference here. I'm looking at a team
(04:12):
that won the MVP. On those teams, the Reds. Johnny Bench,
Joe Morgan, Joe George Foster, Pete Rose, they won their
MVPs with the Reds.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
Yes, Marvin, So, I don't think you can count they
shares Dodgers because Mookie won in Boston.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Yeah. Yeah, Still impressive though, to have MVPs in the lineup.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
Oh, it's incredible.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Yeah. I still look at that seventy eight Reds team,
you know, Bench, Morgan, Foster, and Rose, and all four
of those won MVPs with the Reds. Greatest National League
lineup in history in my opinion, Yes, Martin.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
I'm asking, I'm legit asking for the fans of Cincinnati
that watched that team. Do you think they should have won?
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (04:56):
More?
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Yes? Yeah. You know they faced Brooks Robinson the Oriols
in nineteen seventy, but that seventy Orioles team had four
twenty game winners. Oakland was just better. When they faced Oakland,
they were better. They beat the Red Sox one of
the great World Series of all time. Then they beat
they swept the Yankees. They embarrassed the Yankees. They probably
(05:18):
should have won two more out of that. But I'm
gonna be fair to Baltimore. It was a great lineup pitching, hitting, defense,
and Oakland just had They had the Reds numbers. Even
the Mets when they'd play in the playoffs, seem to
have the Reds numbers. But those that lineup, I put
that nationally against anybody that lineup against any National league lineup.
(05:42):
Pitching staff wasn't great. Had a Hall of Fame manager
in Sparky Anderson. But when you talk about you know,
you had bench. You had Perez Morgan concepcion to me
as a Hall of Famer, Pete Rose, George Foster, Sasar Geronimo,
one of the best defensive players in the game, Ken
Griffy Junior. Then you had George Foster came in and
he had fifty home runs back when people weren't hitting
(06:04):
fifty home runs. That was a power power, powerful UNI team.
Danny Dreesen was on the bench. I mean they had
a really good, good team.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
Yeah, PAULI I'm looking at a couple other lineups in
somewhat recent history that had three killers that were back
to back to back. The nineteen ninety six Mariners Ken Griffy, Junior,
Jay Buner and a Rod Forty nine homers, forty four
homers and thirty six homers in the ninety six season.
That's a nice lineup.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
And the Dodgers have one, one, two three r That's
what's so impressive is you got MVPMVPMVP and the fact
that you got Otani leading off. See, that's what makes
it so difficult for a pitching staff or a pitcher.
Your first batter is Otani. You don't get to ease
into the lineup. You know, you might have a guy
who's a leadoff guy who gets on base and maybe steals.
(06:53):
I mean, that's the way it used to be. Now
it's he's here. And can you imagine you faring up
for your start. You're spending four days to get ready,
You're doing everything, you're checking out scouting report, you're down
there long throw, and then then you got your bullpen session.
Then you're ready to go, and all of a sudden,
your teammates come on, let's go where it's going and
(07:15):
Otani gets to the plate and it's just like that
high pressure right out of the game. Ah, you know,
and pictures have to kind of that. The mound is
always different than the mound in the bullpen, and it's
it's just a different feel and all of that and
you're trying to settle in and all of a sudden,
(07:35):
that's why Ricky Henderson, Oh, I think he let off
seventy nine games with home runs something incredible. Just imagine
you start the game and it's like, damn it, he
did it the best. And you go in there saying,
I'm not going to give him something to hit. You know,
I'd rather walk him than have him, you know, take
(07:57):
me deep.
Speaker 4 (07:58):
Yeah, Marvin, Sorry, I don't want to get on the
Ricky topic, but I can't help it. Shouldn't shouldn't he
be considered maybe the greatest player ever?
Speaker 2 (08:06):
No, thank you, thank you, Marvin. Yes, no, no, no, no,
what I mean he said, no a little bit too
quil Well. He didn't have the batting average and he
was in a great fielder. What he was a disruptor
as good, if not better than anybody in modern baseball history.
When he got on people they got out of their
(08:30):
comfort zone to be like, I'm gonna throw over, throw over, hey,
throw fastballs because I want to make sure I throw
him out. He was the great disruptor.
Speaker 5 (08:39):
Yeah, Pauling, I'm looking at the first decade of Ricky
Henderson's career and it's almost like Lawrence Taylor. He was
impossible to deal with. A base hit became a double
automatically his first few years. I mean he was stealing
one hundred bases repeatedly and he was hitting three, ten, three,
twenty three, fifteen the first ten years or something.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah, well, maybe I'm not being fair. What was his
lifetime average?
Speaker 5 (09:02):
Lifetime average, Remember he played a lot of later years
where it went down, but lifetime two seventy nine, that's
what I thought.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Yeah, but he got on base. He had power, Yes, Marph.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
But when we talk about the greatest players like Bonds
and Babe Ruth, we don't ever bring up how great
of a defensive player they were.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
If you are a great defensive player, it should be
brought up, but we don't. Well, no, I do. Like
Mike Schmidt was an all timer at third base. George
Brett was an unbelievable feeler Joe Morgan was a great
Davey concepcion. Part of the reason why he should be
on the Hall of Fame is he revolutionized the position
on aster turf Johnny Bench. That's why he's the greatest
(09:45):
catcher in history in my opinion. Offensively great, but defensively.
You know, he was able to handle a pitching staff
and he didn't run on him. So I think, I
think if you're really good, then it should be part
of your resume. I guarant Judge to me not a
good fielder. He's just not. I mean, he's serviceable out there.
(10:05):
It's better than Jen Carlos Stanton. But then I am yeah,
And I think that's sort of like the defensive part
for Barry Bond splits into Young Bonds Old Bonds too.
That Young Bonds had a run of like how many
golden gloves in a row. You know, he just didn't
have a golden arm because he couldn't throw out Sid
Bream from left field short left field in the playoffs
(10:28):
and he couldn't throw him out. Yeah, Bonds had range,
but he didn't have an arm. His dad had a
better arm than him. Yeah, Paul, I think two.
Speaker 5 (10:35):
Things hurt Ricky Henderson, he's clearly an all time great,
but the.
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Second half a lot of teams though, yes, the second half.
Speaker 5 (10:41):
Of a career, he was a mercenary. He went from team
to team. And also he's almost like a character of
the game. And the character of Ricky Henderson is bigger
than the player Ricky Nelson. And I don't know if
you compare it, but like I think Charles Barkley's underrated
because he's such a character and a personality and his
career doesn't get the do and Ricky Henderson's first Yeah,
(11:02):
from from twenty to thirty three, he was lights out, you.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Know, great player. You whenever he got up or got on,
then he made it interesting. But that's when the stolen
base meant something. You know that teams really cared about it.
Now it's coming back a little bit, but there's nobody
that you go, oh boy, he's on, because Ricky, if
he was on first, he was going to end up
(11:26):
on third. You could have a sack fly and he's
going to score. Yes, Martin, it's crazy because guess who's next.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
Maguire and Conseko like that lineup is is that lineup underrated?
Speaker 2 (11:37):
That was a great lineup, great great lineup. But you
know that's part of the problem of being artificially inflated,
where you might not give them credit, but then do
they deserve credit?
Speaker 6 (11:49):
You know.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
I saw a picture of McGuire when he was he
had to be a rookie and he was so lean,
but he did hit like forty nine home runs back
then when he looked like that. Chris and Syracuse, Hi, Chris,
what's on your mind today?
Speaker 7 (12:10):
Hey Danny, I got a couple things for you. You
guys were talking Chris Carter the Bike's got him for
one hundred bucks off waivers from the Eagles. And I
think another reason the Reds didn't win World Series. Every
year they had to win the Division to get in,
and the Dodgers were so good the Reds would win
close to one hundred games and they wouldn't make it.
And off of Fritzie being off for the Jewish Holiday.
It got me thinking about Sandy Kofax, who missed a
(12:31):
World Series start, I think because of the same holiday.
And I think it was Don Drysdale was a rookie
and he got the start for that game, and he
was interviewed. He said he went like two and a
third and he got shelled and as the manager took
the ball from him, as he was walking back to
the dugout, he turned and said, Hey, Skip, I bet
you wished I were Jewish.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
Thank you, Chris. So, Fritzie is Sandy Kofax and Dylan
is Don Dry. I'm fine with being Drysdale Hall of Famer. Yeah, yeah,
I'm not fine with Fritzy being Sandy Kofax though it
seems extreme, but they are left handed and Jewish and
that's where the similarities at. Sam and Saint Louis. Hi, Sam,
(13:18):
what's on your mind?
Speaker 8 (13:21):
Yeah?
Speaker 9 (13:22):
Dan, I was calling about a lineup from three years
ago that potentially has four Hall of Famers on it.
Between them, they have thirty six All Star appearances, twenty
five Gold Gloves, and four MVP Awards. And that lineup
would be the Saint Louis Cardinals with Malina, Poohols, Arnado
and gold Smith.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
Yeah, that's a really good lineup. Looks like Pools is
going to get the Angels. Managerial John how about that?
He's done some managing. I think I don't know if
he's done it in winter Ball, but he's done some
managing and looks like Ardie Moreno, who is gonna bring
him in?
Speaker 5 (14:03):
Yeah, Paul Foolhols is still gonna get paid by the Angels.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Yeah, you're getting paid by them for a long time.
Now keep it going. Jeez. I don't know if he's
he's been getting paid by them, but yeah, he's gonna
make more money. Let's see uh and Twine in Fort Lauderdale.
Hey and Twine, what's on your mind? Hey?
Speaker 10 (14:23):
What's up?
Speaker 9 (14:24):
DP five six?
Speaker 11 (14:27):
First time?
Speaker 2 (14:28):
Long time?
Speaker 4 (14:29):
Just a quick clarification being a big hurricane saying cam
Ward actually holds the record for the most touchdowns in
college football one fifty eight and how.
Speaker 10 (14:39):
You got am going to sleep on your boy? Steve Young.
He was also in the eighty four supplemental Draft.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
All right, well thank you. Yeah, but he went to
the USFL and then he was in the supplemental Draft.
I believe that's why.
Speaker 5 (14:52):
Yes, Paul, the NSA does not give cam Ward credit
for the year he was at Incarnate Word, so he
is not in there. I think he doesn't get it
officially with the NCAA. Dylan Gabriel and case Keenum both
have one hundred and fifty five touchdown in college.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Let's take a break. Peter King, Hall of Famer, he'll
join us. We'll talk to him. He sent me a
text yesterday out of nowhere saying, why am I the
only person who is fine with a tie in overtime?
I said, all right, Pete, how about joining us on Thursday?
He'll join us next year on The Dan Patrick Show.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Hey, this is Jason McIntyre. Join me every weekday morning
on my podcast, Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. This isn't
your typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down your.
Speaker 1 (15:44):
Throat every day.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
Straight Fire gives you honest opinions on all the biggest
sports headlines, accurate stats to help you win big at
the sports book, and all the best guests. Do yourself
a favor and listen to Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre
on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
We were talking about great lineups in baseball history and
how many teams have MVPs in their lineup. You of
course have show a tany Freddie Freeman and Mookie Betts
with the Dodgers. We talked about the Big Red Machine
because those guys won their MVPs with the Reds when
you had Rose and Morgan and Bench and Foster Peter
(16:28):
King who covered the Reds, I believe for a little
while in Cincinnati, longtime NFL writer, Where do you rank
the Big Red Machine as far as lineups of all time?
Speaker 6 (16:39):
Dan, It's got to be in the top five, clearly.
I think it's hard because you have to rank lineups
as you know, in their era. So I don't know
how a lineup could be much better, any better than
what the Yankees put on the field with Gary and Ruth.
(17:01):
But the difference with this Reds lineup is that, you know,
look a lot of times, obviously the pitcher's still hit.
You have Davy Concepcion batting eighth. You know, sometimes maybe
Caesar Geronimo, But I mean, you know, they they had
an all star batting eighth a lot of times, and
(17:22):
I don't know. To me, I thought it was so
dangerous and that was such a potent group. And you're right.
I covered him on and off for four years in
the late seventies and early eighties as an intern. And
then I mean I actually went on the road with
the Reds three times in eighty eighty one and eighty two,
(17:46):
and so I got to know those guys. I got
to know Johnny Bench, got to know Tom Seavers some
and they were they were totally fearless. That's the thing
I loved about him. You know, I just love the
fact that Tony Perez conceptsi on. Hey, bring it on,
we love it.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
You know, We've been talking about Shoho Tani that he
has this added advantage that he's able to pitch, so
no matter what you do hitting, he's going to be
a great hitter. But he always has that. And I'm
wondering if that translates to the NFL that Josh Allen
and Lamar Jackson have the added element of running as
(18:26):
well as being really good passers, and how that gives them.
Does that give them a little bit more of a
head start when it comes to MVPs.
Speaker 6 (18:36):
Yeah, I mean, shoe Otani to me, is the guy
in the NFL who'd be like him. Maybe is Travis
Hunter at some point, because you've always had mobile quarterbacks.
I mean, you know, he had Michael Vick running for
in Colin Kaepernick running for one hundred yards in playoff games.
(18:56):
I was at lambeau Field in I think O two
when Michael Vick came in and be far of twenty
seven to seven in the snow, and he did it
with his legs just as much as his arm. So
that has existed. Otani is so special because he's not
just a pitcher. I mean he might be at his
(19:19):
p I mean, he might be Garrett Crochet. I mean, hey,
Garrett Crochet, might be show Hey. I mean because I
don't want I don't want to demean show Hey Otani,
because man, he's great. When I'm really looking forward next year,
I hope that we could see him pitch seven or
(19:40):
eight innings every fifth day. I hope. I have no
idea what his body can take, but man, what a
treat it is to watch him play.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
All Right, So I get a random text from you
yesterday saying, basically, am I the only guy who is
affiliated with football who is okay with a tie in?
Over time?
Speaker 6 (20:01):
I actually liked ties. I mean the biggest reason, Dan,
I'll take you back to twenty twenty one. There was
one tie in the NFL that season, Pittsburgh tied Detroit sixteen.
All okay, that was you know, that was I mean
Detroit either was winless at the time or whatever. They
(20:22):
were a bad team at that time, but there was
a tie sixteen sixteen. At the end of the year,
the Steelers record was nine seven and one, okay, And
that season there were three teams in the AFC that
were nine and eight, the Chargers, the Colts, and the Dolphins.
(20:45):
So just imagine. And the Lions had a field goal
in overtime that they missed, So imagine if the Steelers,
if that field goal had been good, and the Steelers
would have lost. I don't know who would have won
the tiebreaker, but it would have been a fourteen tiebreaker.
A tie basically eliminates a tie. At the end of
(21:06):
the seats, you know, you're either north of the Mason
Dixon line or south of it, but it eliminates it.
And plus here's the other thing, Dan, that game the
other night was incredibly fun and at the end of it, Now,
if you're if you're a fan of one of the
two teams, you know, Green Bay or Dallas, maybe you're
(21:29):
ticked off that you and if you're a player, you're
ticked off that you got a tie. I mean, how
can a fan just watching at home you see the
bizarre end the clock stop with one second left and
they're able to kick a field goal. How can you
be upset at that? I mean, it was fun. It
(21:49):
was scintillating the whole time. So I don't know. I mean,
I bet that was a lot more fun than the
sixteen sixteen tie between Pittsburgh and Detroit. That was a
fantastic football game.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Yeah, it was a great meal. But I got to
have dessert in coffee, and when we didn't get that,
I want to have I'd like to have, you know,
a winner and a loser. That's why we play these games,
to win or lose.
Speaker 6 (22:18):
But but but it's so unique. It's so I mean,
you know, there's they don't There isn't even on average
one tie per season. I think it's kind of cool.
My grandson, Freddy, who's a huge football fan, he's seven
years old, about to turn eight, and he watches all
(22:39):
the games. And he got up Monday morning to get
ready for school, and you know, my daughter said, hey,
there was a tie last night Green Bay in Dallas.
A tie how does that happen? I can't believe it
a tie, so I don't know. I think once in
a while, different is fun.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
If I task you with make overtime, how you would
want to make it. Let's say it's different than what
it is now, is how would you improve overtime?
Speaker 6 (23:07):
Well, you know, the selfish person in me would want
them to just play sudden death, don't have a clock
in overtime. The problem with that is, and I very
much empathize with the players. I was dead set against
a seventeenth game. I am deador set against an eighteenth game.
It's just not fair to these players. It isn't. You're
(23:30):
adding on six percent more snaps for a starting player
and saying, ah, there's not any more injury risk. Of
course there is, so I understand why you don't want
to add more snaps to overtime. Selfishly, I would like
to see it go until it ends. But I don't
think right now, in my opinion anyway, that there's a
(23:52):
better system than this system that there is. The only
way you could do it differently is to have first
score wins, which I think is eminently unfair.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
I'm wondering if the tush push is esthetically not pleasing.
Seeing kickers kick all these field goals is not esthetically
pleasing either. In my opinion, does the NFL how much
of it? Should they be worried about the glut of
kickers being so great at what they do.
Speaker 6 (24:24):
I would be because they didn't create this game to.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Have.
Speaker 6 (24:30):
I mean, let's just say Dan, that the that you're
playing the Dallas Cowboys and your kicker skitter's one out
of bounds and you get the ball. You know, the
Cowboys get the ball at their own forty yard line.
Think about it. They need ten yards to get Brandon
Aubrey and field goal it's and again, let's say they
(24:52):
get it at the run it back to the twenty eight.
You know, they only need twenty two to twenty three
yards to get him in field goal range, and not
just a maybe field goal. He is likely to make
a sixty six sixty seven yard field goal, you know,
in weatherless conditions. I think the one thing the NFL
(25:13):
has to look at. And you know, and I don't
really cover this obviously now I'm retired, but I've been
reading about how, you know, some of the balls that
get broken in the kicking the k balls they get
broken in better than they did before, and they're going
to have to look at that to see if that
(25:36):
is a big factor, because kicking a well worn football
is much better for a kicker than kicking a football
right out of the box.
Speaker 2 (25:46):
I know you voted for the Hall of Fame. For decades,
there's been a lot of conversation about Russell Wilson. Can
you play your way out of the Hall of Fame?
Speaker 6 (25:55):
Now?
Speaker 2 (25:55):
I don't know if you had Russ in the Hall
of Fame in your opinion, but have player played their
way out of the Hall of Fame?
Speaker 6 (26:02):
I think so, and I think coaches can coach their
way out of the Hall of Fame. You've got to
consider a guy's entire career. I think Russell Wilson was
a borderline quarterback for the Hall of Fame. We have
to remember a few things right now about the quarterback position.
Look at the incredible glut of strong quarterback candidates for
(26:26):
the Hall of Fame. I mean, I think Eli Manning
is a strong candidate. Matthew Stafford is going to be
a strong candidate. Matt Ryan is a candidate. You've got
a lot of people who are candidates who've put up really,
really good numbers. What differentiates you? And now we have
seen Russell Wilson be disappointing in Denver, kind of get
(26:49):
run out of Pittsburgh when they needed a veteran, they
didn't choose to resign him. And he has two out
of three ignominious weeks the Giants and loses his job.
It all has to factor in, Dan, it would you know?
I think he and again we'll see. I think he's
(27:10):
got an uphill fight, but then again, his career is
not over.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Yeah. I think Russ was far more consistent than Eli.
You got ten Pro Bowls back when it did mean
something to be a Pro Bowl player.
Speaker 6 (27:21):
I'm not sure it did mean something in twenty ten
years ago. Dan, I don't think the Pro Bowl has
meant anything in twenty five years.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
Okay, but he did. He was a better He's a
better regular season quarterback. His stats aren't. It's not even close.
Eli is an inch away from having one Super Bowl
with David Tyree's catch, and Russell is an inch away
with Malcolm Butler from having two Super Bowls.
Speaker 6 (27:49):
Blah blah blah. You know so what, I don't care.
Could we go back to the championship game in nineteen
fifty eight and say, well, what if Johnny Unitas hadn't
made such and such a pass, a miracle catch by whoever?
Speaker 2 (28:08):
Raymond Berry?
Speaker 6 (28:09):
Yeah, you can't. You can't act that way. In my opinion,
I don't think.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
We're holding it against him because he lost that Super Bowl.
If you win two Super Bowls and you have his resume,
he's a Hall of Famer.
Speaker 6 (28:21):
Okay, but Dan Eli Manning beat the best quarterback head
to head in the Super Bowl, best quarterback of all
time twice, head to head. He beat the best coach
of this era head to head in the Super Bowl twice.
I don't care what his stats were. I don't care numbers,
(28:42):
and I understand I'm not saying he's a walk in
Hall of Famer. But what I'm saying is, at the
biggest moments, how about Eli Manning going into Green Bay
when it's nine hundred below zero and beating a team
that is used to playing like that in that a lot,
beating Brett Farve in overtime, and you know, look, I
(29:06):
think Eli Manning. I in my opinion, I'd vote for
Eli Manning. And I'll tell you why because at the
biggest moments of his career he produced, and you're right,
his regular season record, a lot of it is mediocre,
even though he put up huge numbers. But I am
(29:28):
more of a fan of let's not get totally hung
up on the numbers, especially because the numbers for quarterbacks
now don't mean is don't mean the same thing as
they used to.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
But I can argue that the defensive line won that
Super Bowl, that first one against Brady. They beat the
hell out of him. They dominated that game.
Speaker 6 (29:48):
How about the Joe Namath Super Bowl. Did Matt Snell
have a much better game that day than Joe Namath?
Speaker 2 (29:55):
Yes?
Speaker 6 (29:56):
Yeah, and did? And did the Jets defense totally snuff
out the vaunted Colts offense?
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yes? Yes, But Joe.
Speaker 6 (30:08):
Namath was drafted by the New York Jets, was you know,
chose the AFL over the NFL. And he had the
signature one of the great wins in history, and he
predicted it was going to happen. And so I understand
what you're saying, but.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
That's not enough to put him in the Hall of Fame.
I don't think Namath had Hall of Fame numbers. He didn't.
Speaker 6 (30:33):
That doesn't matter he had Hall of Fame impact in
a Hall of Fame impact, huge, huge impact. Oh, I
understand the era, and I think it's it's more I'm
not one of these guys. I just of course you
look at his numbers. You look at Ken Stabler's numbers.
You know you're gonna say, geez, that's fairly mediocre. You're
(30:56):
judging it in a different thing. How about Joe Namath
thrown for four thousand yards the fourteen game season. That
is incredible in those days. So I'm only saying I'm not.
I don't think you can say that, well, Joe Namath
didn't have Hall of Fame numbers, no crap. Sure, lock,
I see the numbers too, but he had Hall of
(31:19):
Fame impact.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Lenny Dawson was a better quarterback.
Speaker 6 (31:23):
Okay, don't I don't.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Did he have did he?
Speaker 6 (31:26):
Did he do what Joe Namath did?
Speaker 11 (31:28):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Yeah, he beat he won the Super Bowl. He didn't
do no guarantee in the sixties, he didn't know one.
Speaker 6 (31:36):
No one in the sixties did what Joe Namath did
for the sport of pro football. No one, no one.
And so in my opinion, he absolutely belongs to the
Hall of Fame. Was Joe was Len Dawson? A better
quarterback was Daryl Lamonica was you know, I'm not I
don't really care. I mean, I just don't care.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
I like you fired up? Do you want to get right?
Speaker 6 (32:02):
Dan? Who you Dan?
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Who do you like tonight with the Red Sox and
the Yank Games?
Speaker 6 (32:07):
Red Sox y Eggs?
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Well here, since I'm talking to you, I'll take the
Red Sox.
Speaker 6 (32:14):
Now. I mean, hey, look, they're relying on a kid
who started the year at a ball right.
Speaker 2 (32:19):
Both of these starters, I don't think they shave. They're
they're like twenty four years Whatever happened to deep pitching staffs?
Speaker 6 (32:27):
Yeah, well starters, the whole thing has changed. It's a
bullpen game. I know it's a bullpen game. And I'll
tell you what these two games, I don't know. I
got to tell you something. Both these teams, I don't
know how they get to the park and don't just
pour themselves into their chair and say, geez, I need
a nap. I mean, these games just to watch them
(32:51):
have taken a ton out. I mean they've they've really
been fun. This has been good for baseball.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
What were you doing forty seven years ago?
Speaker 6 (33:00):
Forty seven years ago today. Yes, I was with my
good friend Tony Grossi of the Post, the student newspaper
at Ohio University. We skipped class that day and at
two o'clock in the afternoon, we walked into the Union,
the nice little bar on campus, and we asked the
(33:22):
guy to put it on I think ABC, right, put
the TV on ABC, and we watched the Yankees and
Bucky Bleeping Dent win that game, and the class we
skipped newswriting and editing. We were seniors. The professor of
the class came in midway through the game at the
(33:46):
end of the class and he just said, yeah, you
guys are in trouble, but he knew that we were
going to be there, and we watched the game. It
was a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Don't be a stranger, Pete. You know something that bothers
you get you fire, you let me know.
Speaker 6 (34:01):
Thank you, Dan, really appreciate your reaching out.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
That's Peter King, Hall of Fame NFL writer. Yeah, Pete
said to me yesterday, I'm fine with a tie in
overtime and ask me what I was doing forty seven
years ago. I said, all right, I can do that.
Always great to hear from him, We'll take a break.
More phone calls coming up. Al Michaels will join us
next hour back after this.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to listen.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
Live the great Al Michaels in a half hour from now.
He's got the game tonight, the Niners against the Rams.
The Niners getting eight and a half for entertainment purposes only.
Gambling Podcast after the show available at Danpatrick dot com.
We have Dylan in for Fritzie today and he'll be
on the Gambling Podcast with Shan Irving and of course
Bad Larry. Still driving that trusty old ride. Keep it
(34:56):
looking sharp with Mako. From dentse to dings to faded paint,
They've literally got you covered. Get a free estimate today.
Uh oh, Vetter, get Mako, Michael and Syracuse. Hey Mike,
thanks for holding what's on your mind today?
Speaker 10 (35:10):
Hey Dan?
Speaker 11 (35:11):
Two thirty nine point nine, How are you good?
Speaker 6 (35:16):
Hey?
Speaker 11 (35:16):
Listen. Earlier you guys were talking about Ricky Henderson, about
the best of all time. So my question to you is,
as a player strictly as a player. My all time
favorite players Pete Rose. I don't think there's no question
that Pete Rose is better than Ricky Hunderson's.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Your comments uh different, But I can't argue with Pete
won more games than anybody in history of the game.
I think he was an All Star at five different positions.
I don't think anybody in baseball history has been. You'd
have to check that, but I think Pete was an
All Star at five different positions. Let here's how I
(35:54):
would settle this. You take Pete, I'll take Ricky. If
you took Ricky, I'd take Pete. Then I'd be fine
with that. Larry, and I don't know where that exact
that location is. Can you help me with that, Larry?
Speaker 10 (36:11):
Yeah, I'm in I'm telling you Turkey.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Oh you're in Turkey.
Speaker 10 (36:15):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Oh okay, big over here. Oh okay. I can't walk
the streets of Turkey. But I'm glad to have you
join us.
Speaker 9 (36:24):
Larry.
Speaker 10 (36:26):
Hey, top eleven, one seventy five. Thanks for taking my call. Yeah, question, Dan,
how long do you think that this money can last?
In pro sports and amateur sports? For that another n
I owe money WNBA contracts NBA guys getting thirty forty
fifty million dollars a year. Where's the money in? Where
does it dry up?
Speaker 2 (36:46):
Well, I don't know if there is a breaking point.
It feels like and thank you Larry, it feels like
there should be. But I remember when athletes were making
a million dollars and then it was Ricky Henderson and
I think Nolan Ryan they're making three million dollars. Like
there were certain times when you would hear the amount
(37:06):
and now I'm just numb to it. Nil what they get. Well,
I think there's always going to be a lot of
influx of money that you have in college football until
they get it professionalized. I think you're still going to
have that. There's going to be a few people making
a lot of money there. But the NBA is crazy.
(37:28):
In five years, you're probably going to have somebody making
one hundred million dollars this season because it has to
go to somebody because of the new TV deals, there's
a financial pie you split up and they can only
go to the players. Somebody's going to make a hundred
million dollars. It'll either be Shay Gilgis or Luka Doncic.
(37:49):
They're going to make a hundred million dollars maybe when
Ben Yama.
Speaker 4 (37:52):
Yes, Marv Trey Henderson makes about eleven million dollars a
year less than Isaiah Hartenstein. M h to set picks
in rebound and play hard?
Speaker 2 (38:03):
All right? Better defensive end or gratty more gutty? Uh
Dave in New York, Hi Dave, what's on your mind?
Hey Dave? Guess nothing's on your mind? Uh? John Fox
(38:25):
in Atlanta?
Speaker 6 (38:26):
Hi?
Speaker 8 (38:27):
John, Hey, about a six three one ninety quick question?
Notre Dame. When is the madness going to end?
Speaker 11 (38:34):
That?
Speaker 8 (38:35):
They don't get to play a conference championship? Last year
they got to sit back. They watched my quarterback Carson
get hurt and his SEC championship. He sat on the couch,
had an easy playoff game. How does this keep happening?
I mean ACC is getting stronger. They eat like in
Miami and then they can watch Miami lose in a
(38:57):
championship and then jump them and get in the playoff.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Hey, Notre Dame's good TV. Never lose sight of that
NBC partnership they're in. You know, this is the entertainment business.
Having Notre Dame there is good for ratings. Whether you're
rooting for them or against them. That's just the fact,
you know, whether you like it or not, they have
positioned themselves in a unbelievable way that if they go
(39:24):
ten and two, they're going to make the playoffs. And
now we've expanded the playoffs. Now it's almost like we're
going to take conference winners, and of course we're going
to take Notre Dame.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Yes, morph doesn't Notre Dame joining a conference take away
the mistique of being Notre Dame.
Speaker 2 (39:41):
Well, if I'm Notre Dame, I don't join a conference.
Speaker 4 (39:44):
You know, you're just by brand alone. Yeah, like we're
not at any conference. We're Notre Dame.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
I don't have to share anything. If I go to
a conference, I got to share. You know, Clemson one's
out of the ACC. If I'm Notre Dame, Why do
I want in the ACC unless you go, Well, we
get an auto birth. If we make we win the
playoffs or conference championship, Notre Dame is going to be in.
It would be really, really really rare. I'd be really
(40:11):
really surprised in the next ten years if Notre Dame
is not in the playoffs ten years, because I think
they want Notre Dame in the playoffs. Notre Dame is
a sure thing of tune in factor, great atmosphere, great history,
and you either love them or you hate them. Yes, Marv,
they were ranked at owing two. I know, yeah, nobody else.
(40:34):
Oh and two was ranked when don't we out at
Notre Dame? Is that in three weeks? Spots today? Two
weeks today? Is that right, Marvin? We leave on the fourteenth,
so two weeks from today we're in sol the yes?
Speaker 6 (40:50):
Is that right?
Speaker 2 (40:51):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (40:51):
Accurate.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Al Michaels set to join his final hour, Dan and
the Dana at Stan Patrick Show
Hosts And Creators
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Dan Patrick
Patrick "Seton" O'Connor
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