February 25, 2025 • 33 mins
The guys talk about a whether or not Stafford gets dealt, as well as other looming moves this offseason!
00:00 - Stafford Permitted to Talk with Teams
12:13 - Will Myles Garrett be Traded Soon?
15:45 - Sam Darnold's Future in Question
20:16 - Other Available Quarterbacks
25:34 - Big Contracts Looming in Cincinnati
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Featuring: Chris Rose and Justin Penik
Edited by: Connor Kurpat
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It is Tuesday, February twenty fifth, twenty twenty five. This
is another off season addition of football today. Justin Pennick
is here, Chris Rose is here, Producer Connor is here
as well. The man who's not here, and he's got
a really good excuse, Bobby Skinner and Pennick. Why isn't
he here today?
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Oh well, he got married on Sunday. Chris Rose and
I am just getting home from the ceremony by the
time that we're recording this. We had a great, great time,
I requested Shania Twain. I was the star of the evening.
Forget Bobby, Forget Bobby Skinner and his lovely wife getting married,
and lots of tears and family and loving and things
(00:39):
on the sides of Bobby Skinner I've never seen. I
was the star of the evening because I danced very well.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
I saw a little bit ad on social media. There's
no question. Yeah, we'll leave it at that. So really,
Bobby got very emotional.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Huh he did, And he's probably gonna hate that I'm
saying it. But it was nice. It really was a
nice day, wholesome day. Bobby's Skinner. Believe you, I believe
it or not. It's always the people that you wouldn't
expect to be loving and deep, to be the deepest,
deepest of people. So I saw a side of Bobby
that I haven't seen, and I've thought of it, so
(01:14):
I have to admit something justin what if they asked you?
Even though none of his family members really know me, well,
some of them do more than you would think I
know me, but like I never really met his mother
or his father or anything like that. But I still
had this dream and fantasy of like, well, what if
they ask you to perform a speech? Because that's how
(01:35):
conceited I am. And I would have been, like, how
have you talked to Bobby Skinner for like twenty thousand hours?
That's the amount of time that I've calculated in our
in our couple of years have known each other between
phone calls, podcasts and everything, twenty thousand hours, And that's
how that's that's how I would have like started off
my speech and I would have went from there.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
But that wouldn't been adorable. Woh, you said they didn't
ask you?
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Okay, no, we seated my conceited mindset, Like if they do,
that's what I would.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Say way to represent the John Boy media family. So
that part is good. Yes, thank you, and congratulations to Bobby.
His bride's name is it? What's her name? I'm sorry, Lisasa? Okay, well,
iet to meet her. So I look forward to that.
Today it's mister and missus Skinner. That'll be nice. So
Bobby will be back somewhere down the road, I'm sure
(02:25):
before the first game of the twenty twenty five season.
At any rate, we're getting ready. I'm heading to the combine.
We'll do that next show. We'll have a little preview
for you. That'll be fun. In the meantime, there's a
bunch of headlines out there, so why don't we just
scour through them before we do it? Though? I want
to ask this. Apparently for the competition committee, there was
one anonymous team that brought up banning the tush push,
(02:49):
and Diana Russini of the Athletic came out and said, yeah,
it's not anonymous anymore. It's the Green Bay Packers. Ooh,
do you respect the Packers for trying to ban the
push push or since they're the only one where you
like God, that's kind of a weasly move. Just learn
how to stop it.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Stop it because it rose if every NFL team did
it and did it successfully, and I would be like,
all right, maybe this is a little bit of a
cheat code. There's one team that does it and does
it better than everybody else. So I respect the Packers
for maybe trying to get something going, but it's we
see other teams try to do it, like didn't the
(03:28):
Bills try to do it against the Chiefs a bunch
of time in the Conference championship, But it's like, what
are we doing? It's not working. There's one team that
does it, one team that does it really well, and
somebody's got to try and find a way to stop it,
and nobody can.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
Well, you know, the quarterback sneak has been a part
of this game ever since I've been watching. Some team's
always ran it a little bit better. The Eagles just
happened to have it. It's an amazing combination of a
wonderful offensive line that knows how to get low, they
have guys behind Hurts that don't mind doing the pushing,
(04:01):
and then Jalen Hurts is probably as strong a quarterback
as we've gotten this league. The Bills, they don't run
a tush push they run Josh Allen and unfortunately for
the biggest play of the year for them, they couldn't
get or some people think they did get the first
down on fourth down. But you know, it's not a
tush push. It is a true quarterback sneak. Even occasionally
when they have guys pushing from behind. They just other
(04:23):
teams don't run it as well, and there's certainly no
way to stop it with the way that the Eagles
run it. They just do a tremendous job. I don't know.
I guess teams will figure it out or until Jalen
Hurts gets injured, which he has yet to do on
that particular play. Anyway, we're gonna do the intrat scale
of one to five, one being passed not even blinking
(04:45):
my eyes at it, and five being all the way
in on this story. Let's start with my colleague Tom
Pelisero over at NFL Network who says that the Rams
have given Matthew Stafford's agent a chance to talk to
other teams, and then there was a follow up report
it said this coming week in Indy, Stafford's agent is
going to talk to the Rams about trying to figure
(05:05):
out how there can be a financial agreement moving forward.
The entire story scale of one to five.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
How interested No, it's a five for me since since
my my team that I'm repping behind me is primarily
involved in that right now, I honestly think there's one
out of four teams there. You know, there's Matthew Stafford's
going to be on one of these four teams coming
this year. It's either going to be the Rams, well,
I think, you know, I think that's likely, the Giants.
(05:32):
I also think that could be likely, And I also
think the Raiders and maybe the Steelers could be players
in this. Do you think your Browns are players in this?
Speaker 1 (05:39):
Or No? No, I wouldn't.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I would say no to but those four would you
agree with those four?
Speaker 1 (05:45):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (05:48):
The Steelers are an interesting one. I think. I think
if you were to ask me to rank the three
other teams, because I think it's the three that you mentioned, Rams, Giants, Raiders,
if you were to have me ranked in order of
where I think he'll end up, I think it's Rams,
then I think it's Raiders, and I think the Giants
are a distant third.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
A distant third. Okay, I think you know I came
on here last week saying oh, I'm pretty I'm pretty
sure and everything like that. I do think I think
he's gonna wind up staying with the Rams. I think
he's gonna wind up staying with the Rams, and especially
doing some reading about this is all money. This is
all Matthew Stafford wants more money, and I do think
he deserves more money. But also, at the same time,
(06:31):
rose that contract extension that he agreed to in twenty
twenty two. You know, we didn't have a football show
at the time, but you know, the NFL, I'm sure
the NFL world really looked at that forty million dollars
average annual value and kind of scratched their head at it.
Because now it's Stafford in his camp that agreed to
that deal that now they want, not necessarily a new deal.
(06:53):
And this is really the funky part about this Matthew
Stafford situation. It's not necessarily like this extension, but he's
kind of looking for more money right now. Now. There's
typically not a big precedence for this, but the Rams
have a precedent for it since they did the same
thing to Aaron Donald just a couple years ago, where
they kind of scrapped his current deal and made him
(07:15):
the highest paid interior defense alignment in the NFL and
didn't really extend him but just gave him more money
in the moment now here Now, Jason Fitzgerald of Over
the Cap kind of kind of broke this down. And
this is what's making me think that it's kind of
a little bit more likely than I did a couple
of days ago. In last week, you know, I'm thinking, oh,
I think Giants, Giants, Giants, And now I'm kind of
(07:35):
I'm walking back a little bit, and I still have
hope as a Giants fan, but I think the money
is just so complicated here, and Stafford and his team
really really did dig themselves a hole here. So there's
players like Kyler Murray and Deshaun Watson that are getting
forty six million dollars average annual value. Stafford's at forty
(07:57):
You know, Peter Schrager comes out and says that Stafford
was looking for fifty million, right, And that makes sense
because you have Jalen Hurts, Lamar Jackson and then Jared Goff,
the player that was involved in that trade, that are
just getting north to fifty million dollars. So you would
have to think that's what Stafford's looking for, and I
think that's fair. Here's the thing. Currently, every player with
a fifty million dollar a year contract has at least
one hundred and sixty million dollars guaranteed. Currently, Stafford has
(08:20):
sixty three million dollars remaining on his contract, So on
a minimum, that means the Rams are committing an extra
forty million dollars, which likely means committing him to be
the QB until he's thirty nine and then possibly being
able to walk until he's forty. So the money on
this rose it's a lot. It is a lot. If
he wants to get up to fifty and you know,
(08:43):
we're talking about kind of throwing out the deal that
we have now, but we're adding more guaranteed years. That's
adding a lot of guaranteed money on. You're probably going
to have to add on those guaranteed years, and that's
not something the Rams really want to do, knowing the
window that they're in right now, and you know, knowing
that Stafford could take it down to kind of at
any moment.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Well, he obviously wants more money. We don't know how
much more. I don't know if Peter's right, or wrong,
I'm sure, but you would think.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Fifty would make sense, right, like Deshn Watson, Like, you know,
if I'm Matthew Stafford, I'm looking at the Rams being like,
if you're not willing to pay me more than what
those like those two guys are getting and not paying
me the literally you traded away Jared Goff for me,
if you don't think that I'm worth that, Yeah, I
would feel very disrespect well, and I'm won a super
(09:31):
Bowl for you.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
I think he probably wants to pay play another couple
of years. If I were to guess he's been healthy.
He missed one game this year, and that's because they
sat him out in a game where Jimmy Garoppolo played
the last week and they didn't care whether they were
the third or the fourth seed didn't matter to them.
I would say this, I wouldn't discount the Raiders from
(09:55):
this equation only because it's a forty minute flight from
Los Angeles. He's got four girls. I can't imagine he
wants to uproot a family, move them all the way
to New York to go play with the Giants who well,
by the way, when three and fourteen last year, he
might want to not like the Raiders were any better,
but I will say this, it's a forty minute flight,
it ain't five hours, it's not in the snow, it's
(10:17):
inside a dome, it's on grass, it's all sorts of
stuff where he's won his ring. Now, I think that
if you hooked him up to a lie detector test,
I think he'd want to say, let's figure this out
with the Rams. I can live in the home that
I've built, one of the many homes that I've built,
and just stay here with a damn good team. And
by the way, the Rams don't have to pay anybody
on defense yet and they're shipping Cooper Cup out of town.
(10:41):
So I don't know. I just I think it's gonna
end up. But for me, the interest is one to
it's a five yeah, because so many teams are affected.
It's a domino effect one percent.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
What could happen with Donald and you know, then then
you get into the other two b's that are gonna
get paid a lot less, like the Rogers. The I
wouldn't really put Russell Wilson in that category, but Rogers
and Kirk Cousins like, there is a domino effect and
it is waiting for Matthew Stafford to fall. Now, I
do think, you know, another team could negotiate a contract
that Matthew Stafford likes and the compensation could be right,
(11:15):
and the Raiders of the Giants could could really pull
that trigger. But it does seem it really does just
seem like the easiest alternative and kind of meeting at
the middle, Right, what's the word I'm looking for when
you meet at the middle with some compromise. The easiest
compromise is the Rams kind of just give Matthew Stafford
(11:36):
a little bit more money. Maybe maybe they maybe they
get close to fifty million or you know, again, it's complicated,
but they would really it's working within year to year
and not if you give them forty million dollars guaranteed more,
then you're you may be adding more years and adding
bad money. And the Rams don't want to do that
if they have to do that, especially when Stafford's camp
(11:57):
kind of made this mistake and they dug their own
grave to begin with in twenty twenty two with this
extension on.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Their own grave, right, Yeah, I mean, it's just this
is the way the system works. It's not always the
best guy that gets paid. It's the next guy up,
and that's what happens. So let's move on to Miles Garrett.
We know this story. He's requested a trade, he did
the rounds at Super Bowl. Do you think things will
move forward with all the teams when they get together
in Indy? How much does this story now up? You're
(12:23):
anti on a scale of one to five.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Rose, I'm down out a two for this because it
seems like the smoke I don't even know if they're
ever the only smoke that we really had. Is it
all Miles Garrett requested a trade. It's really the only
kind of smoke that this story has ever had. The
brown should want to keep Miles Garrett self explanatory. I
think they kind of came out and said that as
soon as this happened. So Rose, let me let me
ask you this, any chance they could just work on
(12:49):
an extension? Yes, more more money, continue to kick money
down the road. Would making Miles Garrett the highest paid
defensive player in the league menfences, Yeah, of course it would.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
And here's the thing. I get it. The Browns totally
screwed up this Deshaun Watson thing. It has set them
back immensely. But let's remember this, who has won more
playoff games over the last five seasons. The Cleveland Browns
are the Pittsburgh Steelers Rounds. So the Browns, although since
ninety nine, have been a total dumpster fire for the
(13:21):
most part, and I believe have only bed the playoffs
three times since then. I want to say, but twice
under this regime. Last year was a huge, huge step
back for them and the Watson stuff. Until they come
out and admit their failures on many fronts here, I
don't know if they can move forward. Now. I get it.
I understand Miles's frustration, and he took a personal shot
(13:43):
at the GM Andrew Berry with the way that he
worded things when he came out with his statement about
I don't want to go directly from Cleveland to Canton.
I want to win multiple Super Bowls. That was a
shot at Andrew Berry's line where he said, Miles Garrett,
we fully expect him to go right from Cleveland to Canton.
That's what he said is his year end presser. So
for me, it's a one because I don't think it's
(14:03):
gonna happen. I don't think they're going to trade him
I get it. It sounds great for this sort of
fodder for all sorts of morning shows and podcasts, and
everybody's trying to figure out, well, should he go to Detroit,
Should he go to Green Bay? Should he go to Buffalo?
Oh shit, why would Cleveland do all that stuff if
they're gonna get a pick in the late twenties. And
by the way, this stuff is if you go figure
(14:23):
out the cap stuff, it can't happen till after June anyway.
So is Miles really gonna sit out a year or two?
I don't see that. I think they're gonna get back together.
I think they'll figure it out. I understand he was
hot at the end of the season. I want guys
that are pissed off that they went three and fourteen. Me,
it's not that big a deal now. At first, when
(14:44):
we did that show and they and you and Bobby
were arm wrestling to see who could break the news
to me, that day was a difficult one. The next
few days for the Super Bowl were really hard. But
after that I haven't really given it much thought. So
very low one or two.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Yeah, So we'll see. I mean, I think this is
the week where if steam starts to pick up and
we hear teams then this person's interested, this team's interested,
blah blah blah. But it's kind of died since it
initially broke that Garrett wants to be traded. And I
really think, like believe it or not, the Cleveland Browns
are actually in a good salary cap scenario. Two years
(15:21):
down the line from now, you can push money down
the road on a Miles Garrett. I really think an
extension will kind of be like the Cleveland Browns as
an organization or you know, putting their arms out and
then Garrett becoming the highest paid defensive player in the
league with the Cleveland Browns. You know, maybe that's the
contract that sends you into your mid thirties. That could
be another word compromise, using it again for both sides.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
All Right, a report out there that Sam Darnold and
the Vikings are talking about an extension. His football future
scale of one to five. How interested, it's a four
for me.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
I am very very fast to see what's happening with
UH with Sam Donald and Albert Brier put out an
article today, Rose and you talked about this on last
week's show. This is from Albert Brier. The Sam donald
situation still merits watching in Minnesota, and in a weird way,
I could see JJ McCarthy's weight being a factor. He
lost a bunch going through the knee surgeries over the
(16:19):
past six months. So returning to his fighting weight, we'll
play in an element in the Vikings confidence and there
is confidence there in parentheses that they could go forward
with him. End quote. So, Rose, you talked about it
last week JJ McCarthy and his weight, and you know
you talked about it last year at the combine. It's
kind of seeing him that, you know, he kind of
looked like kind of put some put some weight on
(16:41):
specifically for the combine, like you could see it in
his face. So certainly his playing weight is a conversation
in the Minnesota building. Now here's my only question. Rose,
you're if you're the Vikings, you're not giving Sam donaldlake
a three or a four year deal, right, but that
I feel like he could get that on the open market.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Right, Well, whatever it is, I would have to frontlad
this thing, and I don't know their cap situation enough.
I'll put it up on over the cap.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
It's decent.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
Fine, here's the point, would I would front load it
because I'm not so sure that you're going to get
a better Sam Darnold than the one we saw in
twenty twenty four. I really mean, he's got a great
receiving corps, he's got an innovative offensive mine. Their offensive
line is good enough, although Darrisaw was missing the back
half of the year and they had to make that
trade for Cam Robinson. So Darrisaw comes back and that'll
(17:35):
help him, you know. I think they're going to add
more weapons. Wouldn't surprise me if in a deep running
back draft class that they add something there in the
backfield to help them out. Like, I think there's gonna
be more playmakers available. So could he play better? He
could do I expect him to than he did in
twenty twenty four. I don't. Yeah. Everybody says, well you
got JJ McCarthy there, Well, hold on, we just saw
(17:56):
in that same division. How long was it before Jordan
Love made his second NFL start? It was until year four,
and he wouldn't have made one if Rogers hadn't gotten
Pop for COVID. Right. Isn't that why he missed the
Kansas City game a few years ago? Or was it
an injury he played. He had one start basically before
his fourth season, so you can put him on layaway.
(18:16):
You run the risk of not knowing what your quarterback
looks like until the time you have to decide whether
or not to extend him. But still you can do it.
So I don't know. I said last week that I
would move on from Sam Donald. There's a big part
of me that still says, yes, that's what I want
to do. But yeah, it's an interesting story because of
all these other teams that need some kind of help.
(18:39):
So I would I would put it at a four
as well.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yeah, now here's here's my here's my thing. If you're
the Vikings and you want to bring in somebody, whether
that's Sam Donald or somebody else, for let's say a
two year deal to give JJ McCarthy more time, wouldn't
it be smarter to just pay a guy like Aaron
(19:03):
Rodgers way less money on a two year deal that
you can probably even get out after one year. So
that timeline makes more sense, because I really think Sam
Donald could go somewhere and get a three year deal
that's maybe two years, or a four year deal that's
maybe actually three years, like he's going to get more
money than what it realistically makes sense for the Minnesota Vikings.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Right right, so it makes sense. Do you think any
part of that equation is Aaron Rodgers sitting there saying, well,
hold on, as compared to Brett Fahr for so long?
Do I really want to go Packers, Jets Vikings?
Speaker 2 (19:41):
It would be very funny.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
It'd be funny for us. I don't know if he
would think it's funny.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
But Rose, we talk about it with any with any
quarterback that has a pulse, whether you're a rookie, a veteran,
or whatever. If you want to if you want to
have a good freaking year, you go to Kevin O'Connell.
All right, go to Justin Jefferson. You've got those tackles. Yeah,
Aaron Rodgers had a good last ten games. We'll talk
(20:06):
about that momentarily. I mean, at least statistically, not when
it comes to wins and losses. But they were a
dumpster fire up there. So yeah, it's an interesting story
for both of us. But let's move on to the
veteran quarterbacks the future, Kirk Cousins, Rogers and Russell Wilson.
Can any of them be the missing piece. They were
expected to be in Atlanta, New York, and Pittsburgh, respectively,
(20:28):
and it didn't really happen for two of them, and
for Uss it kind of crumbled there at the end.
So with that full story scale interest scale of one
to five, Rogers is the only one that really fully
interests me. So I'll put Rogers at like a three.
You know, I still have questions about Rogers's body because
(20:48):
that you know, it took him over half a year
to kind of fully get into it, which he's coming
off the Achilles. I get it, but you're forty two.
There's going to be another reset after playing this year.
I think Kirk is done. What's going to be really
interesting with Kirk and I'm interested to get your thoughts
on this. The Falcons are going to have to release
(21:09):
and cut Kirk Cousins. They're not going to find a
trade partner that's going to want to even take on
part of that contract. And also, why would anybody give
up any kind of draft capital when the Falcons are
in this own mess that they've created themselves. So the
Falcons could release Kirk Cousins and then we have a
Russell Wilson situation. Just like the Steelers had last year,
(21:31):
where you can basically sign him for a veteran minimum deal,
and that's what an NFL team is going to prefer.
And then also, I just don't fully believe in I
don't fully believe in Russ. I think he does the
moonball thing well and throwing the deep ball on the sideline,
and I don't know, like you know, I don't know how,
I don't know if he can fully elevate a team anymore.
So Rogers has me at like a three, and then
(21:51):
Kirk and Russ A Kirk, I'm more interested too, and
then Russ.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
On a one. Yeah. Well, whatever team Russell goes to,
he has to come up with some little cute saying
at the end of interviews. So whether it's the Boks
or let's ride. And I heard him do something with
the Steelers this year. I think that's about the only
interest I've got with that. Rogers, I think is somewhat
fascinating because his last ten games eighteen touchdowns, four picks.
(22:17):
Jets went three and seven in those starts, and there
were times where the game was on the line and
the Jets couldn't get their shit together, but they I'm
really curious to see if he could get with whether
it's a Kevin O'Connell or somebody else that can coach offense,
can get him pointed back in the right direction to
where he can put him the team in a position
(22:37):
to win. I still am fascinated by that, and I
don't think he wants to finish the way that it
literally limped out with not even playing in twenty three
and then in twenty four just it felt so clunky
and awkward, and yeah, I don't know. Now. The Kirk
Cousins is interesting because of the reports that he's saying
(22:58):
now that yeah, you know what, my elbow and my
shoulder were kind of screwed up at the end of
the year and he was only on the injured list
like once in the last six games or whatever. Now
he's saying after saying, well, no, I was fine. No,
I was really a little banged up. I don't know
whether he's trying to save face or that's real. It's
probably some combination of the two.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
It's his legs, though, Rose he he can't generate any
power from his lower body.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Well, he couldn't this year, but that doesn't mean that
a year removed from that surgery that he won't be
able to Cousins was playing the best football of his
career when he got hurt in the middle of the
twenty twenty three season. Are you saying that no team
should take a shot on a what if? What if
the deal is just slightly more in terms of finances
than what the Steelers paid Russell Wilson, which was under
(23:43):
two million I think last year.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Oh yeah, yeah. But regardless that that is what's going
to make Kirk Cousins interesting to a team is that
would you want it going to have to cut him?
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Would you want him quarterbacking your team? No, I would question.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
I would get very frustrated with the limiteds. Like now
I will say, like it was Stafford, old Man Stafford
and Kirk Cousins. I was looking at this the other
day that you know, because PFF does like the the
ship like the QB shares responsibility for the amount of
pressures that he has, and it's those two guys that
are down there, even though they're older and they can't
move per se. But I would just say, Cousins just
(24:20):
got rid of the ball very fast. So I don't know, man,
you know, the pistol and play action you know the
you know the Zach Robinson and the and the McVeigh stuff.
They really utilized the play action stuff. They did not
utilize the bootleg and Atlanta, and that was the issue
for them. But I would just get very frustrated about Cousins' limitations,
especially like that he just can't use it. I'm not
(24:40):
even talking about using his legs mobility, using his legs
to generate power on his arm. That's how a lot
of those interceptions I feel like happened last year.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
Where do you think he ends up?
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Where do I think he ends up? You know there's
this team in Minnesota that may look for a bridge. Now,
did you do you have an idea he might end
up in my city, Cleveland? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (25:05):
I mean I think that the offense that Stefanski's gonna
end up running again could be interesting for him. We'll see.
I mean, he's gonna play and I think he's gonna
start Week one. I really do so that to me,
I do find the whole. I think I find at
least two of the three interesting. I don't know if
I can I don't know with Russ, but I find
(25:29):
two of the three pretty interesting and Rogers and cousins.
I would say at least a three. Last thing here,
will the Bengals franchise t Higgins yet again the second
straight year? Will they get you know, Jamar Chase done?
What's gonna happen with Trey Henderson who's headed the last
year of his deal? Are they going to trade him that?
I've seen some stories that say, well it makes sense
(25:51):
instead of paying a guy who's over thirty despite leading
the league in sacks, trade him now? You could probably, yes, yes,
there are there are reports. I don't understand it, but
there are some people who say, yeah, if we add
draft capital, then you know what, we can get a
few guys that can help us. It just doesn't make
(26:11):
sense on the Bengals offseason situation. How interested are.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
You now the Bengals as a whole, I'm I'm at,
like you know, ranging between three to four, But in
terms of like T Higgins, I'm down at a two.
I just don't think they're gonna franchise tag them. I
think from a from a football standpoint, you trust your
you trust your elite quarterback, you trust your offensive coach,
(26:37):
and you trust in your elite wide receiver and Jamar
Chase that you're going to pay right. You trust that
they can make it work and the front office can
patch that wide receiver to with someone else. You know,
vas is taking a step up. I'm saying I'm wrong
for the wide receiver from Princeton.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
He took.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
He took a step up, especially in the red zone
last year. But I still think you're you're gonna need
another compliment on the outside at wide receiver two. But
I think the Bengals trying to, I guess, make some
sort of EXTENTSI with te Higgins. They already franchised tagged him.
They let talented defensive players walk out the dorm past years.
(27:14):
We gotta add defensive talent, Like enough, t Higgins, go
go and get paid from New England. Go be the
wide receiver one for the Patriots. Go get your bag.
Trust everybody on offense to do what they have to
do to get by and still be really good. We
gotta add defensive talent and extend Trey Hendrickson like this
is ridiculous, Rose, It's a steal. It's criminal. Three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine,
(27:39):
ten eleventh. Trey Hendrickson is eleventh. An average annual value
among all edge rushers in the NFL, just in front
of Joey Bosa and behind Bradley Chubb, Max Crosby, Vershan
Gary and Danelle Hunter Montes what is up there too? So,
I mean, we got to give Trey Hendrickson the bag
that he that he's like deserved throughout all of his career.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
The Bengals really don't have a problem paying good players.
It's the glue guys that they'll let walk out the door.
Ye that's been That's part of the issue with this franchise.
And you can't pay everybody. I would let Higgins walk.
The difference between this past season's franchise tag and this
(28:21):
year's franchise tag for wide receiver is gonna be about
five million. It's gonna go from twenty one to twenty six.
Do you want to tie that up and pay Jamar?
You have to get the Jamar Chase Steel done this offseason.
You can't wait again, because my god, if he has
another season the way he did this year, forget about it,
like you better. This is the mistake that the Cowboys
(28:42):
have made in recent years. That Dak was good. You know,
he finished second in the MVP in twenty twenty three.
You waited, so you probably cost yourself tens of millions
of dollars on that deal to the Bengals want to
do the same. You're gonna pay him, Just pay him now.
He is freaking incredible, and he will end up being
paid as the highest paid non quarterback in the NFL,
(29:04):
is my guess.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
Yeah, that would be thirty six. Right, You don't you
don't want to bid against yourself, and you're right, that's
what the Cowboys have done, you know, to their detriment. Yeah,
so you're paying them more than justin Jefferson, So you're
he's getting thirty six or at least thirty five to five.
So get your more Chase done and you gotta you
gotta add defensive talent. You just you just have to
do that.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
So as far as the interest in the story goes,
it's a two. Unless here's the prediction, Chase gets extended,
even if that's closer to training camp. That's fine because
that's when a lot of that stuff happens. Yeah, uh,
Jamar Chase. I'd extend Trey Hendrickson on a nice, short,
fat deal, and I'd let t Higgins walk, and you
can get a comp pick for him. Oh wait, is
(29:48):
the com pick attached to him once they're franchised.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
That's that's a good question. Don't know that on top
of my head. Even CAP people sometimes don't know how
the cap works because it's very complicated.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
Yeah, that's it's all interesting, all right, but regardless, could
be an interesting off season in Cincinnati. We are back
at it again later this week. We'll have a new
episode out in time for the Combine.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
Yeah, what, I have a very interest you're gonna be
at the combine, Chris Rose. Yes, I have an interesting
last question that I didn't I didn't we didn't prep
on Okay, but I uh, I'm gonna this is a
Chris Rose question that I'm asking Chris Rose. Great, maybe
an unexpected piece of news rumor that we're going to
(30:33):
start to hear at the combine. Do you have any
that's now on the fact that it's unexpected means that
you're not expecting it. So I'm putting you on the
spot to think of one.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
You know. Daniel Jeremiah put out a great tweet on Monday.
He's our lead draft analyst and he and Richisen will
be in the booth on Thursday, calling all this stuff,
and he said, listen, I I've done some homework as
well on the free agent class, and he goes, it's
got me even more excited for the draft. And then
(31:04):
somebody took that and said, this is why you expect
a lot of extensions coming up. So I think that
because of the lack of wow in the free agent
class that you'll see in the middle of March, there
are going to be some extensions that perhaps you don't expect. Okay,
(31:25):
who could that be? I don't know. I mean, is
there a guy that's Is there a pass rusher that's
two years away from free agency that ends up getting
a huge haul? Does that sort of stuff make sense?
Is there another wide receiver like does Puka Nakua get
a deal? He's heading into the third year of a
four year deal. Remember he is a fifth round pick,
(31:47):
so he doesn't have a five year contract. He's got
a four year rookie deal. Does he get one? That
doesn't seem to make sense. But maybe with the lack
of a you know, big name available free agents, go
take care of your own now, get ahead of it.
I don't think a guy like Tyreek Hill's going anywhere.
Stuff like that, So this does Travis Kelsey retire, Like,
(32:10):
that's the sort of stuff that would I think would
be that would be huge, right, Yeah, not sure. I
think he's gotten eleven and a half million dollar roster bonus.
Let's do it the league year. Oh yeah, so that
would be big. I don't know if that was a
good enough answer for you. No.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
I like that. I like that, and I really do
think teams should start As the cap continues to expand,
I think eventually it won't be booming twenty million every year,
but as long as these TV deals keep coming in
and money keeps flowing for the NFL like, it's going
to continue to expand rapidly. So I think teams should
start to normalize, like why why are we going to
(32:47):
wait and bid against ourselves? As these guys and these
players have good years, you can responsibly extend players and
responsibly you know, you know, spread out cap hits if
you extend guys early. And I think that's a good
move and I think NFL teams and good players should
start to do that and reward these.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
Guys absolutely all right, As I mentioned, we are back
at it again later this week with a combined preview
so for our producer who puts it all together, Connor,
for Justin Pennock, for the newly married Bobby Beginner. I
am Chris Rose. We will see you later this week
here on Football Today.
It is Tuesday, February twenty fifth, twenty twenty five. This
is another off season addition of football today. Justin Pennick
is here, Chris Rose is here, Producer Connor is here
as well. The man who's not here, and he's got
a really good excuse, Bobby Skinner and Pennick. Why isn't
he here today?
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Oh well, he got married on Sunday. Chris Rose and
I am just getting home from the ceremony by the
time that we're recording this. We had a great, great time,
I requested Shania Twain. I was the star of the evening.
Forget Bobby, Forget Bobby Skinner and his lovely wife getting married,
and lots of tears and family and loving and things
(00:39):
on the sides of Bobby Skinner I've never seen. I
was the star of the evening because I danced very well.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
I saw a little bit ad on social media. There's
no question. Yeah, we'll leave it at that. So really,
Bobby got very emotional.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Huh he did, And he's probably gonna hate that I'm
saying it. But it was nice. It really was a
nice day, wholesome day. Bobby's Skinner. Believe you, I believe
it or not. It's always the people that you wouldn't
expect to be loving and deep, to be the deepest,
deepest of people. So I saw a side of Bobby
that I haven't seen, and I've thought of it, so
(01:14):
I have to admit something justin what if they asked you?
Even though none of his family members really know me, well,
some of them do more than you would think I
know me, but like I never really met his mother
or his father or anything like that. But I still
had this dream and fantasy of like, well, what if
they ask you to perform a speech? Because that's how
(01:35):
conceited I am. And I would have been, like, how
have you talked to Bobby Skinner for like twenty thousand hours?
That's the amount of time that I've calculated in our
in our couple of years have known each other between
phone calls, podcasts and everything, twenty thousand hours, And that's
how that's that's how I would have like started off
my speech and I would have went from there.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
But that wouldn't been adorable. Woh, you said they didn't
ask you?
Speaker 2 (01:58):
Okay, no, we seated my conceited mindset, Like if they do,
that's what I would.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Say way to represent the John Boy media family. So
that part is good. Yes, thank you, and congratulations to Bobby.
His bride's name is it? What's her name? I'm sorry, Lisasa? Okay, well,
iet to meet her. So I look forward to that.
Today it's mister and missus Skinner. That'll be nice. So
Bobby will be back somewhere down the road, I'm sure
(02:25):
before the first game of the twenty twenty five season.
At any rate, we're getting ready. I'm heading to the combine.
We'll do that next show. We'll have a little preview
for you. That'll be fun. In the meantime, there's a
bunch of headlines out there, so why don't we just
scour through them before we do it? Though? I want
to ask this. Apparently for the competition committee, there was
one anonymous team that brought up banning the tush push,
(02:49):
and Diana Russini of the Athletic came out and said, yeah,
it's not anonymous anymore. It's the Green Bay Packers. Ooh,
do you respect the Packers for trying to ban the
push push or since they're the only one where you
like God, that's kind of a weasly move. Just learn
how to stop it.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Stop it because it rose if every NFL team did
it and did it successfully, and I would be like,
all right, maybe this is a little bit of a
cheat code. There's one team that does it and does
it better than everybody else. So I respect the Packers
for maybe trying to get something going, but it's we
see other teams try to do it, like didn't the
(03:28):
Bills try to do it against the Chiefs a bunch
of time in the Conference championship, But it's like, what
are we doing? It's not working. There's one team that
does it, one team that does it really well, and
somebody's got to try and find a way to stop it,
and nobody can.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
Well, you know, the quarterback sneak has been a part
of this game ever since I've been watching. Some team's
always ran it a little bit better. The Eagles just
happened to have it. It's an amazing combination of a
wonderful offensive line that knows how to get low, they
have guys behind Hurts that don't mind doing the pushing,
(04:01):
and then Jalen Hurts is probably as strong a quarterback
as we've gotten this league. The Bills, they don't run
a tush push they run Josh Allen and unfortunately for
the biggest play of the year for them, they couldn't
get or some people think they did get the first
down on fourth down. But you know, it's not a
tush push. It is a true quarterback sneak. Even occasionally
when they have guys pushing from behind. They just other
(04:23):
teams don't run it as well, and there's certainly no
way to stop it with the way that the Eagles
run it. They just do a tremendous job. I don't know.
I guess teams will figure it out or until Jalen
Hurts gets injured, which he has yet to do on
that particular play. Anyway, we're gonna do the intrat scale
of one to five, one being passed not even blinking
(04:45):
my eyes at it, and five being all the way
in on this story. Let's start with my colleague Tom
Pelisero over at NFL Network who says that the Rams
have given Matthew Stafford's agent a chance to talk to
other teams, and then there was a follow up report
it said this coming week in Indy, Stafford's agent is
going to talk to the Rams about trying to figure
(05:05):
out how there can be a financial agreement moving forward.
The entire story scale of one to five.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
How interested No, it's a five for me since since
my my team that I'm repping behind me is primarily
involved in that right now, I honestly think there's one
out of four teams there. You know, there's Matthew Stafford's
going to be on one of these four teams coming
this year. It's either going to be the Rams, well,
I think, you know, I think that's likely, the Giants.
(05:32):
I also think that could be likely, And I also
think the Raiders and maybe the Steelers could be players
in this. Do you think your Browns are players in this?
Speaker 1 (05:39):
Or No? No, I wouldn't.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
I would say no to but those four would you
agree with those four?
Speaker 1 (05:45):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (05:48):
The Steelers are an interesting one. I think. I think
if you were to ask me to rank the three
other teams, because I think it's the three that you mentioned, Rams, Giants, Raiders,
if you were to have me ranked in order of
where I think he'll end up, I think it's Rams,
then I think it's Raiders, and I think the Giants
are a distant third.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
A distant third. Okay, I think you know I came
on here last week saying oh, I'm pretty I'm pretty
sure and everything like that. I do think I think
he's gonna wind up staying with the Rams. I think
he's gonna wind up staying with the Rams, and especially
doing some reading about this is all money. This is
all Matthew Stafford wants more money, and I do think
he deserves more money. But also, at the same time,
(06:31):
rose that contract extension that he agreed to in twenty
twenty two. You know, we didn't have a football show
at the time, but you know, the NFL, I'm sure
the NFL world really looked at that forty million dollars
average annual value and kind of scratched their head at it.
Because now it's Stafford in his camp that agreed to
that deal that now they want, not necessarily a new deal.
(06:53):
And this is really the funky part about this Matthew
Stafford situation. It's not necessarily like this extension, but he's
kind of looking for more money right now. Now. There's
typically not a big precedence for this, but the Rams
have a precedent for it since they did the same
thing to Aaron Donald just a couple years ago, where
they kind of scrapped his current deal and made him
(07:15):
the highest paid interior defense alignment in the NFL and
didn't really extend him but just gave him more money
in the moment now here Now, Jason Fitzgerald of Over
the Cap kind of kind of broke this down. And
this is what's making me think that it's kind of
a little bit more likely than I did a couple
of days ago. In last week, you know, I'm thinking, oh,
I think Giants, Giants, Giants, And now I'm kind of
(07:35):
I'm walking back a little bit, and I still have
hope as a Giants fan, but I think the money
is just so complicated here, and Stafford and his team
really really did dig themselves a hole here. So there's
players like Kyler Murray and Deshaun Watson that are getting
forty six million dollars average annual value. Stafford's at forty
(07:57):
You know, Peter Schrager comes out and says that Stafford
was looking for fifty million, right, And that makes sense
because you have Jalen Hurts, Lamar Jackson and then Jared Goff,
the player that was involved in that trade, that are
just getting north to fifty million dollars. So you would
have to think that's what Stafford's looking for, and I
think that's fair. Here's the thing. Currently, every player with
a fifty million dollar a year contract has at least
one hundred and sixty million dollars guaranteed. Currently, Stafford has
(08:20):
sixty three million dollars remaining on his contract, So on
a minimum, that means the Rams are committing an extra
forty million dollars, which likely means committing him to be
the QB until he's thirty nine and then possibly being
able to walk until he's forty. So the money on
this rose it's a lot. It is a lot. If
he wants to get up to fifty and you know,
(08:43):
we're talking about kind of throwing out the deal that
we have now, but we're adding more guaranteed years. That's
adding a lot of guaranteed money on. You're probably going
to have to add on those guaranteed years, and that's
not something the Rams really want to do, knowing the
window that they're in right now, and you know, knowing
that Stafford could take it down to kind of at
any moment.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Well, he obviously wants more money. We don't know how
much more. I don't know if Peter's right, or wrong,
I'm sure, but you would think.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Fifty would make sense, right, like Deshn Watson, Like, you know,
if I'm Matthew Stafford, I'm looking at the Rams being like,
if you're not willing to pay me more than what
those like those two guys are getting and not paying
me the literally you traded away Jared Goff for me,
if you don't think that I'm worth that, Yeah, I
would feel very disrespect well, and I'm won a super
(09:31):
Bowl for you.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
I think he probably wants to pay play another couple
of years. If I were to guess he's been healthy.
He missed one game this year, and that's because they
sat him out in a game where Jimmy Garoppolo played
the last week and they didn't care whether they were
the third or the fourth seed didn't matter to them.
I would say this, I wouldn't discount the Raiders from
(09:55):
this equation only because it's a forty minute flight from
Los Angeles. He's got four girls. I can't imagine he
wants to uproot a family, move them all the way
to New York to go play with the Giants who well,
by the way, when three and fourteen last year, he
might want to not like the Raiders were any better,
but I will say this, it's a forty minute flight,
it ain't five hours, it's not in the snow, it's
(10:17):
inside a dome, it's on grass, it's all sorts of
stuff where he's won his ring. Now, I think that
if you hooked him up to a lie detector test,
I think he'd want to say, let's figure this out
with the Rams. I can live in the home that
I've built, one of the many homes that I've built,
and just stay here with a damn good team. And
by the way, the Rams don't have to pay anybody
on defense yet and they're shipping Cooper Cup out of town.
(10:41):
So I don't know. I just I think it's gonna
end up. But for me, the interest is one to
it's a five yeah, because so many teams are affected.
It's a domino effect one percent.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
What could happen with Donald and you know, then then
you get into the other two b's that are gonna
get paid a lot less, like the Rogers. The I
wouldn't really put Russell Wilson in that category, but Rogers
and Kirk Cousins like, there is a domino effect and
it is waiting for Matthew Stafford to fall. Now, I
do think, you know, another team could negotiate a contract
that Matthew Stafford likes and the compensation could be right,
(11:15):
and the Raiders of the Giants could could really pull
that trigger. But it does seem it really does just
seem like the easiest alternative and kind of meeting at
the middle, Right, what's the word I'm looking for when
you meet at the middle with some compromise. The easiest
compromise is the Rams kind of just give Matthew Stafford
(11:36):
a little bit more money. Maybe maybe they maybe they
get close to fifty million or you know, again, it's complicated,
but they would really it's working within year to year
and not if you give them forty million dollars guaranteed more,
then you're you may be adding more years and adding
bad money. And the Rams don't want to do that
if they have to do that, especially when Stafford's camp
(11:57):
kind of made this mistake and they dug their own
grave to begin with in twenty twenty two with this
extension on.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Their own grave, right, Yeah, I mean, it's just this
is the way the system works. It's not always the
best guy that gets paid. It's the next guy up,
and that's what happens. So let's move on to Miles Garrett.
We know this story. He's requested a trade, he did
the rounds at Super Bowl. Do you think things will
move forward with all the teams when they get together
in Indy? How much does this story now up? You're
(12:23):
anti on a scale of one to five.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Rose, I'm down out a two for this because it
seems like the smoke I don't even know if they're
ever the only smoke that we really had. Is it
all Miles Garrett requested a trade. It's really the only
kind of smoke that this story has ever had. The
brown should want to keep Miles Garrett self explanatory. I
think they kind of came out and said that as
soon as this happened. So Rose, let me let me
ask you this, any chance they could just work on
(12:49):
an extension? Yes, more more money, continue to kick money
down the road. Would making Miles Garrett the highest paid
defensive player in the league menfences, Yeah, of course it would.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
And here's the thing. I get it. The Browns totally
screwed up this Deshaun Watson thing. It has set them
back immensely. But let's remember this, who has won more
playoff games over the last five seasons. The Cleveland Browns
are the Pittsburgh Steelers Rounds. So the Browns, although since
ninety nine, have been a total dumpster fire for the
(13:21):
most part, and I believe have only bed the playoffs
three times since then. I want to say, but twice
under this regime. Last year was a huge, huge step
back for them and the Watson stuff. Until they come
out and admit their failures on many fronts here, I
don't know if they can move forward. Now. I get it.
I understand Miles's frustration, and he took a personal shot
(13:43):
at the GM Andrew Berry with the way that he
worded things when he came out with his statement about
I don't want to go directly from Cleveland to Canton.
I want to win multiple Super Bowls. That was a
shot at Andrew Berry's line where he said, Miles Garrett,
we fully expect him to go right from Cleveland to Canton.
That's what he said is his year end presser. So
for me, it's a one because I don't think it's
(14:03):
gonna happen. I don't think they're going to trade him
I get it. It sounds great for this sort of
fodder for all sorts of morning shows and podcasts, and
everybody's trying to figure out, well, should he go to Detroit,
Should he go to Green Bay? Should he go to Buffalo?
Oh shit, why would Cleveland do all that stuff if
they're gonna get a pick in the late twenties. And
by the way, this stuff is if you go figure
(14:23):
out the cap stuff, it can't happen till after June anyway.
So is Miles really gonna sit out a year or two?
I don't see that. I think they're gonna get back together.
I think they'll figure it out. I understand he was
hot at the end of the season. I want guys
that are pissed off that they went three and fourteen. Me,
it's not that big a deal now. At first, when
(14:44):
we did that show and they and you and Bobby
were arm wrestling to see who could break the news
to me, that day was a difficult one. The next
few days for the Super Bowl were really hard. But
after that I haven't really given it much thought. So
very low one or two.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Yeah, So we'll see. I mean, I think this is
the week where if steam starts to pick up and
we hear teams then this person's interested, this team's interested,
blah blah blah. But it's kind of died since it
initially broke that Garrett wants to be traded. And I
really think, like believe it or not, the Cleveland Browns
are actually in a good salary cap scenario. Two years
(15:21):
down the line from now, you can push money down
the road on a Miles Garrett. I really think an
extension will kind of be like the Cleveland Browns as
an organization or you know, putting their arms out and
then Garrett becoming the highest paid defensive player in the
league with the Cleveland Browns. You know, maybe that's the
contract that sends you into your mid thirties. That could
be another word compromise, using it again for both sides.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
All Right, a report out there that Sam Darnold and
the Vikings are talking about an extension. His football future
scale of one to five. How interested, it's a four
for me.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
I am very very fast to see what's happening with
UH with Sam Donald and Albert Brier put out an
article today, Rose and you talked about this on last
week's show. This is from Albert Brier. The Sam donald
situation still merits watching in Minnesota, and in a weird way,
I could see JJ McCarthy's weight being a factor. He
lost a bunch going through the knee surgeries over the
(16:19):
past six months. So returning to his fighting weight, we'll
play in an element in the Vikings confidence and there
is confidence there in parentheses that they could go forward
with him. End quote. So, Rose, you talked about it
last week JJ McCarthy and his weight, and you know
you talked about it last year at the combine. It's
kind of seeing him that, you know, he kind of
looked like kind of put some put some weight on
(16:41):
specifically for the combine, like you could see it in
his face. So certainly his playing weight is a conversation
in the Minnesota building. Now here's my only question. Rose,
you're if you're the Vikings, you're not giving Sam donaldlake
a three or a four year deal, right, but that
I feel like he could get that on the open market.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Right, Well, whatever it is, I would have to frontlad
this thing, and I don't know their cap situation enough.
I'll put it up on over the cap.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
It's decent.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
Fine, here's the point, would I would front load it
because I'm not so sure that you're going to get
a better Sam Darnold than the one we saw in
twenty twenty four. I really mean, he's got a great
receiving corps, he's got an innovative offensive mine. Their offensive
line is good enough, although Darrisaw was missing the back
half of the year and they had to make that
trade for Cam Robinson. So Darrisaw comes back and that'll
(17:35):
help him, you know. I think they're going to add
more weapons. Wouldn't surprise me if in a deep running
back draft class that they add something there in the
backfield to help them out. Like, I think there's gonna
be more playmakers available. So could he play better? He
could do I expect him to than he did in
twenty twenty four. I don't. Yeah. Everybody says, well you
got JJ McCarthy there, Well, hold on, we just saw
(17:56):
in that same division. How long was it before Jordan
Love made his second NFL start? It was until year four,
and he wouldn't have made one if Rogers hadn't gotten
Pop for COVID. Right. Isn't that why he missed the
Kansas City game a few years ago? Or was it
an injury he played. He had one start basically before
his fourth season, so you can put him on layaway.
(18:16):
You run the risk of not knowing what your quarterback
looks like until the time you have to decide whether
or not to extend him. But still you can do it.
So I don't know. I said last week that I
would move on from Sam Donald. There's a big part
of me that still says, yes, that's what I want
to do. But yeah, it's an interesting story because of
all these other teams that need some kind of help.
(18:39):
So I would I would put it at a four
as well.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yeah, now here's here's my here's my thing. If you're
the Vikings and you want to bring in somebody, whether
that's Sam Donald or somebody else, for let's say a
two year deal to give JJ McCarthy more time, wouldn't
it be smarter to just pay a guy like Aaron
(19:03):
Rodgers way less money on a two year deal that
you can probably even get out after one year. So
that timeline makes more sense, because I really think Sam
Donald could go somewhere and get a three year deal
that's maybe two years, or a four year deal that's
maybe actually three years, like he's going to get more
money than what it realistically makes sense for the Minnesota Vikings.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Right right, so it makes sense. Do you think any
part of that equation is Aaron Rodgers sitting there saying, well,
hold on, as compared to Brett Fahr for so long?
Do I really want to go Packers, Jets Vikings?
Speaker 2 (19:41):
It would be very funny.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
It'd be funny for us. I don't know if he
would think it's funny.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
But Rose, we talk about it with any with any
quarterback that has a pulse, whether you're a rookie, a veteran,
or whatever. If you want to if you want to
have a good freaking year, you go to Kevin O'Connell.
All right, go to Justin Jefferson. You've got those tackles. Yeah,
Aaron Rodgers had a good last ten games. We'll talk
(20:06):
about that momentarily. I mean, at least statistically, not when
it comes to wins and losses. But they were a
dumpster fire up there. So yeah, it's an interesting story
for both of us. But let's move on to the
veteran quarterbacks the future, Kirk Cousins, Rogers and Russell Wilson.
Can any of them be the missing piece. They were
expected to be in Atlanta, New York, and Pittsburgh, respectively,
(20:28):
and it didn't really happen for two of them, and
for Uss it kind of crumbled there at the end.
So with that full story scale interest scale of one
to five, Rogers is the only one that really fully
interests me. So I'll put Rogers at like a three.
You know, I still have questions about Rogers's body because
(20:48):
that you know, it took him over half a year
to kind of fully get into it, which he's coming
off the Achilles. I get it, but you're forty two.
There's going to be another reset after playing this year.
I think Kirk is done. What's going to be really
interesting with Kirk and I'm interested to get your thoughts
on this. The Falcons are going to have to release
(21:09):
and cut Kirk Cousins. They're not going to find a
trade partner that's going to want to even take on
part of that contract. And also, why would anybody give
up any kind of draft capital when the Falcons are
in this own mess that they've created themselves. So the
Falcons could release Kirk Cousins and then we have a
Russell Wilson situation. Just like the Steelers had last year,
(21:31):
where you can basically sign him for a veteran minimum deal,
and that's what an NFL team is going to prefer.
And then also, I just don't fully believe in I
don't fully believe in Russ. I think he does the
moonball thing well and throwing the deep ball on the sideline,
and I don't know, like you know, I don't know how,
I don't know if he can fully elevate a team anymore.
So Rogers has me at like a three, and then
(21:51):
Kirk and Russ A Kirk, I'm more interested too, and
then Russ.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
On a one. Yeah. Well, whatever team Russell goes to,
he has to come up with some little cute saying
at the end of interviews. So whether it's the Boks
or let's ride. And I heard him do something with
the Steelers this year. I think that's about the only
interest I've got with that. Rogers, I think is somewhat
fascinating because his last ten games eighteen touchdowns, four picks.
(22:17):
Jets went three and seven in those starts, and there
were times where the game was on the line and
the Jets couldn't get their shit together, but they I'm
really curious to see if he could get with whether
it's a Kevin O'Connell or somebody else that can coach offense,
can get him pointed back in the right direction to
where he can put him the team in a position
(22:37):
to win. I still am fascinated by that, and I
don't think he wants to finish the way that it
literally limped out with not even playing in twenty three
and then in twenty four just it felt so clunky
and awkward, and yeah, I don't know. Now. The Kirk
Cousins is interesting because of the reports that he's saying
(22:58):
now that yeah, you know what, my elbow and my
shoulder were kind of screwed up at the end of
the year and he was only on the injured list
like once in the last six games or whatever. Now
he's saying after saying, well, no, I was fine. No,
I was really a little banged up. I don't know
whether he's trying to save face or that's real. It's
probably some combination of the two.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
It's his legs, though, Rose he he can't generate any
power from his lower body.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Well, he couldn't this year, but that doesn't mean that
a year removed from that surgery that he won't be
able to Cousins was playing the best football of his
career when he got hurt in the middle of the
twenty twenty three season. Are you saying that no team
should take a shot on a what if? What if
the deal is just slightly more in terms of finances
than what the Steelers paid Russell Wilson, which was under
(23:43):
two million I think last year.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Oh yeah, yeah. But regardless that that is what's going
to make Kirk Cousins interesting to a team is that
would you want it going to have to cut him?
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Would you want him quarterbacking your team? No, I would question.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
I would get very frustrated with the limiteds. Like now
I will say, like it was Stafford, old Man Stafford
and Kirk Cousins. I was looking at this the other
day that you know, because PFF does like the the
ship like the QB shares responsibility for the amount of
pressures that he has, and it's those two guys that
are down there, even though they're older and they can't
move per se. But I would just say, Cousins just
(24:20):
got rid of the ball very fast. So I don't know, man,
you know, the pistol and play action you know the
you know the Zach Robinson and the and the McVeigh stuff.
They really utilized the play action stuff. They did not
utilize the bootleg and Atlanta, and that was the issue
for them. But I would just get very frustrated about Cousins' limitations,
especially like that he just can't use it. I'm not
(24:40):
even talking about using his legs mobility, using his legs
to generate power on his arm. That's how a lot
of those interceptions I feel like happened last year.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
Where do you think he ends up?
Speaker 2 (24:51):
Where do I think he ends up? You know there's
this team in Minnesota that may look for a bridge. Now,
did you do you have an idea he might end
up in my city, Cleveland? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (25:05):
I mean I think that the offense that Stefanski's gonna
end up running again could be interesting for him. We'll see.
I mean, he's gonna play and I think he's gonna
start Week one. I really do so that to me,
I do find the whole. I think I find at
least two of the three interesting. I don't know if
I can I don't know with Russ, but I find
(25:29):
two of the three pretty interesting and Rogers and cousins.
I would say at least a three. Last thing here,
will the Bengals franchise t Higgins yet again the second
straight year? Will they get you know, Jamar Chase done?
What's gonna happen with Trey Henderson who's headed the last
year of his deal? Are they going to trade him that?
I've seen some stories that say, well it makes sense
(25:51):
instead of paying a guy who's over thirty despite leading
the league in sacks, trade him now? You could probably, yes, yes,
there are there are reports. I don't understand it, but
there are some people who say, yeah, if we add
draft capital, then you know what, we can get a
few guys that can help us. It just doesn't make
(26:11):
sense on the Bengals offseason situation. How interested are.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
You now the Bengals as a whole, I'm I'm at,
like you know, ranging between three to four, But in
terms of like T Higgins, I'm down at a two.
I just don't think they're gonna franchise tag them. I
think from a from a football standpoint, you trust your
you trust your elite quarterback, you trust your offensive coach,
(26:37):
and you trust in your elite wide receiver and Jamar
Chase that you're going to pay right. You trust that
they can make it work and the front office can
patch that wide receiver to with someone else. You know,
vas is taking a step up. I'm saying I'm wrong
for the wide receiver from Princeton.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
He took.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
He took a step up, especially in the red zone
last year. But I still think you're you're gonna need
another compliment on the outside at wide receiver two. But
I think the Bengals trying to, I guess, make some
sort of EXTENTSI with te Higgins. They already franchised tagged him.
They let talented defensive players walk out the dorm past years.
(27:14):
We gotta add defensive talent, Like enough, t Higgins, go
go and get paid from New England. Go be the
wide receiver one for the Patriots. Go get your bag.
Trust everybody on offense to do what they have to
do to get by and still be really good. We
gotta add defensive talent and extend Trey Hendrickson like this
is ridiculous, Rose, It's a steal. It's criminal. Three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine,
(27:39):
ten eleventh. Trey Hendrickson is eleventh. An average annual value
among all edge rushers in the NFL, just in front
of Joey Bosa and behind Bradley Chubb, Max Crosby, Vershan
Gary and Danelle Hunter Montes what is up there too? So,
I mean, we got to give Trey Hendrickson the bag
that he that he's like deserved throughout all of his career.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
The Bengals really don't have a problem paying good players.
It's the glue guys that they'll let walk out the door.
Ye that's been That's part of the issue with this franchise.
And you can't pay everybody. I would let Higgins walk.
The difference between this past season's franchise tag and this
(28:21):
year's franchise tag for wide receiver is gonna be about
five million. It's gonna go from twenty one to twenty six.
Do you want to tie that up and pay Jamar?
You have to get the Jamar Chase Steel done this offseason.
You can't wait again, because my god, if he has
another season the way he did this year, forget about it,
like you better. This is the mistake that the Cowboys
(28:42):
have made in recent years. That Dak was good. You know,
he finished second in the MVP in twenty twenty three.
You waited, so you probably cost yourself tens of millions
of dollars on that deal to the Bengals want to
do the same. You're gonna pay him, Just pay him now.
He is freaking incredible, and he will end up being
paid as the highest paid non quarterback in the NFL,
(29:04):
is my guess.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
Yeah, that would be thirty six. Right, You don't you
don't want to bid against yourself, and you're right, that's
what the Cowboys have done, you know, to their detriment. Yeah,
so you're paying them more than justin Jefferson, So you're
he's getting thirty six or at least thirty five to five.
So get your more Chase done and you gotta you
gotta add defensive talent. You just you just have to
do that.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
So as far as the interest in the story goes,
it's a two. Unless here's the prediction, Chase gets extended,
even if that's closer to training camp. That's fine because
that's when a lot of that stuff happens. Yeah, uh,
Jamar Chase. I'd extend Trey Hendrickson on a nice, short,
fat deal, and I'd let t Higgins walk, and you
can get a comp pick for him. Oh wait, is
(29:48):
the com pick attached to him once they're franchised.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
That's that's a good question. Don't know that on top
of my head. Even CAP people sometimes don't know how
the cap works because it's very complicated.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
Yeah, that's it's all interesting, all right, but regardless, could
be an interesting off season in Cincinnati. We are back
at it again later this week. We'll have a new
episode out in time for the Combine.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
Yeah, what, I have a very interest you're gonna be
at the combine, Chris Rose. Yes, I have an interesting
last question that I didn't I didn't we didn't prep
on Okay, but I uh, I'm gonna this is a
Chris Rose question that I'm asking Chris Rose. Great, maybe
an unexpected piece of news rumor that we're going to
(30:33):
start to hear at the combine. Do you have any
that's now on the fact that it's unexpected means that
you're not expecting it. So I'm putting you on the
spot to think of one.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
You know. Daniel Jeremiah put out a great tweet on Monday.
He's our lead draft analyst and he and Richisen will
be in the booth on Thursday, calling all this stuff,
and he said, listen, I I've done some homework as
well on the free agent class, and he goes, it's
got me even more excited for the draft. And then
(31:04):
somebody took that and said, this is why you expect
a lot of extensions coming up. So I think that
because of the lack of wow in the free agent
class that you'll see in the middle of March, there
are going to be some extensions that perhaps you don't expect. Okay,
(31:25):
who could that be? I don't know. I mean, is
there a guy that's Is there a pass rusher that's
two years away from free agency that ends up getting
a huge haul? Does that sort of stuff make sense?
Is there another wide receiver like does Puka Nakua get
a deal? He's heading into the third year of a
four year deal. Remember he is a fifth round pick,
(31:47):
so he doesn't have a five year contract. He's got
a four year rookie deal. Does he get one? That
doesn't seem to make sense. But maybe with the lack
of a you know, big name available free agents, go
take care of your own now, get ahead of it.
I don't think a guy like Tyreek Hill's going anywhere.
Stuff like that, So this does Travis Kelsey retire, Like,
(32:10):
that's the sort of stuff that would I think would
be that would be huge, right, Yeah, not sure. I
think he's gotten eleven and a half million dollar roster bonus.
Let's do it the league year. Oh yeah, so that
would be big. I don't know if that was a
good enough answer for you. No.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
I like that. I like that, and I really do
think teams should start As the cap continues to expand,
I think eventually it won't be booming twenty million every year,
but as long as these TV deals keep coming in
and money keeps flowing for the NFL like, it's going
to continue to expand rapidly. So I think teams should
start to normalize, like why why are we going to
(32:47):
wait and bid against ourselves? As these guys and these
players have good years, you can responsibly extend players and
responsibly you know, you know, spread out cap hits if
you extend guys early. And I think that's a good
move and I think NFL teams and good players should
start to do that and reward these.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
Guys absolutely all right, As I mentioned, we are back
at it again later this week with a combined preview
so for our producer who puts it all together, Connor,
for Justin Pennock, for the newly married Bobby Beginner. I
am Chris Rose. We will see you later this week
here on Football Today.
Hosts And Creators
Todd "Fritzy" Fritz
Dan Patrick
Patrick "Seton" O'Connor
Paul Pabst
Marvin Prince
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