May 7, 2025 • 45 mins
Steelers reporter Gerry Dulac discusses the Steelers trading WR George Pickens to the Cowboys and breaks down how Pittsburgh may be heading into the 2025 season without a clear plan. NBA Hall of Famer Ray Allen talks about the Celtics' strategy against the Knicks and shares a story about borrowing shoes from Michael Jordan in a freezing United Center. And NHL analyst PK Subban discusses playoff chaos and breaks down the unwritten rules of fighting in hockey.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
The Steelers dump wide receiver George Pickens to the Cowboys
for draft picks. And I'm not surprised. I think that
there was a lot of chatter leading up to the
draft that they were trying to do this, or they
might do this, and then I thought, are they going
to draft a wide receiver? Which they didn't, and then
George Pickens goes to the Cowboys. You look at the
(00:26):
Pittsburgh side of this, and you go, what's this meme
for Aaron Rodgers? If anything, He's going to say, Well,
they got DK Metcalf and a couple of guys that
I'm not familiar with, got a pretty good tight end,
got rid of Nog Harris. Maybe it's Mason Rudolph's team,
but this guy would know better than I. It's Jerry
Dulac joining us again. Steeler's coverage with the Pittsburgh Post
(00:50):
Gazette and the Steelers radio network. How surprised were you
that this move took place?
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Well?
Speaker 4 (00:58):
I was, obviously I was, and shocked because I knew
they were going to move on him at some point. Dan.
They were never going to give George Pickens a second
contract that was never going to happen. And I never
thought they would just let him walk when they didn't
take a receiver. I thought they were content to go
into the season with a you know, a double barreled
(01:20):
receiving room with DK Metcalf and George Pickens. But you know,
a coach told me this a long time ago, Dan,
and it's still true. When the production outweighs the aggravation,
you keep them. When the aggravation out weighs the production,
you get rid of them. And that's what happens with
George Pickens. They just thought that, you know, his teammates.
It was a problem in the locker room. It became
(01:42):
a problem with Mike Tomlin. It wasn't just his on
field temperament and behavior, you know, repeated violations off the field,
late for meetings, skipping meetings, late to games. It was
just on and on, and it just got to the
point where they weren't especially after they traded for d Metcalf,
they just weren't going to tolerated anymore.
Speaker 5 (02:02):
Dan, what are the Cowboys getting?
Speaker 4 (02:05):
They're getting, you know, both a problem and problematic receiver.
There's no question he is a big play guy. But
you know, I severely doubt that his on the field
temperament is going to change. You know, they're going to
deal with a guy who's you know, is he all
of a sudden be going to become a mister discipline?
(02:26):
I doubt it. I don't mean to pick on the guy.
I only know what they saw and what we saw
for three years with the Steelers, so there's no question
about his talent level. But you know, sometimes it's it's
about more than just talent level in the NFL.
Speaker 5 (02:42):
This move impact Aaron Rodgers' decision, you.
Speaker 6 (02:46):
Know, I don't think so. They don't think so.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
You know, from their end, it doesn't have any impact
at all on whether he signs with the team. I
will say this, Dan, And of course this was certainly
no motivation for making the deal. But Aaron Rodgers didn't
get to where he is as a future Hall of
Famer by being an undisciplined, fly by the seat of
pans quarterback, which is kind of the description you can
(03:10):
apply to George Pickens. You know, I think Aaron Rodgers
is a very detailed quarterback, and I don't think he
is on the field. Relationship with George Pickens, who is anything,
but that would mesh very well. So you know, I
don't want to say it might be a blessing an
(03:31):
enticement for Aaron Rodgers to come. I don't think that
at all. But I don't know that it would have
been a good mix here anyhow.
Speaker 5 (03:38):
Any news on the Aaron Rodgers front.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
I wish I could tell you some, Dan, I mean
I check all the time, and you know they you know,
as I've told you before, he told them up front
he's going to take his time. They are willing to
do that. They are still willing to do that. You know,
Mini camp is in excuse me, OTAs the rookies are
in this weekend and OTAs to start two weeks after that.
(04:02):
There's still time and then of course, you know, you
get into the mini camp, which is I gauge everything
about the US Open coming to Oakmont at the twelve
through to fifteenth, which is where Mini camp is. So
you know there's still time for him to come.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
Is there a plan B.
Speaker 4 (04:21):
Yeah, you touched on it, Mason Rodgers. But I think
even if that is the case, Dan, they will go
out and sign some other veteran quarterback.
Speaker 6 (04:29):
I really don't think they.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
Are going to rely on a sixth round pick, even
though I like Will Howard in that spot. I don't
think they're really going to rely on a rookie being
a backup. Their history has always been to have two
quarterbacks with NFL starting experience on their roster, and even
though some of those have been picked over, that's one
of the downsides of this Aaron Rodgers delay. I still
(04:51):
believe they will try to sign some veteran quarterback to
come in and be the number two behind Mason Rudolph
if Aaron Rodgers falls through, but they firmly bel leave
Dan that he is coming.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
But if you look at where they are talent level,
you know, are they the third best team in their division?
Would you put obviously Baltimore? Would you put Cincinnati above them?
Speaker 4 (05:11):
Well, you know, Dan, last year, after acquiring Russell Wilson
and Patrick Queen and Deshaun Elliott and the moves they made,
they were nine win team. The year before, I automatically
thought they were a better team based on their offseason,
I thought they were a ten win team. I don't
right now think they are a better team than last year,
So I don't know if that means it's ten wins,
(05:34):
eleven wins, nine wins, or eight wins. I don't think
they're an eight win team, you know, Mike Tomlins. History
has shown that they are just not that a sub
five hundred team. But you know, the Bengals, as long
as they have that quarterback and their receivers, their defense
is very suspect.
Speaker 6 (05:51):
You know.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
You know they finished Steelers finished second last year. I
don't think they're the best in the division by any stretch.
So it might be a coin for how it goes
with the Bengals. Depending on Joe Burrow's health. If he
stays healthy, they're gonna be tough.
Speaker 6 (06:05):
We saw that at the end of the year.
Speaker 5 (06:07):
Steelers gonna pony up for TJ. Watt.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Yeah, I think so, Dan. You know, you go back
in their history, I can't think of one player, one
of their star players, basically in their prime, that they
have ever let walk. I can't think of one. I
go back to frank O Harris, which was toward the
end of his career, and Dan Rooney admitted quietly admitted
after that it was the biggest professional mistake he ever made.
(06:32):
He should have just signed Franco for everything he meant
to the franchise. I can't TJ. Watt doesn't want to leave,
and they don't want him to leave, so I expect
that to happen.
Speaker 5 (06:41):
I'll leave you with this.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
With Pittsburgh, Mike Tomlin's not afraid to bring in guys
who are suspect the headaches. You know, if you look
at Antonio Brown, Le'Veon Bell, Chase Claypool, you got I mean,
They've gone.
Speaker 5 (06:57):
Through a lot of wide receivers.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
It feels like, uh, they can't and then they don't
draft one when they need to draft one. Do they
get enough criticis Do the Steelers get criticized locally for
the kind of the randomness of some of these players
that they bring in.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
I don't think there's any question they get criticized locally
for it. Dan, I mean, and that is one of uh,
you know, to me, I don't want to see her
and call it a Mike Tomlin fault. But Mike Tomlin
believes that he can, you know, work through these guys
and and kind of you know, get them onto the
Steeler way and you roll the dice with some of
(07:36):
those guys and you know, you look back, you know
even you know you look at Juju Smith Schuster when
he came in, and he's not nearly the problem that
some of the other guys were. But you mentioned Chase Claypool,
Antonio Brown, and they're still sensitive to everything that happened
with Antonio Brown. And that's why they knew they weren't
going to give George Pickens a second contract, because if
he was acting this way without the big money, what
(07:59):
do you think he is going to do once he
got the big money. So yeah, I think it's I
think that people here are very much aware of it,
and I think you pointing it up shows that maybe
nationally some people becoming a little bit more aware of
it as well.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
I don't know why I always go back to this
play when Antonio Brown got concussed by Vontez Burfekt, it
felt like his personality changed. Now you being around the
team on a daily basis, but he went from being
this great story. He was on the path to be
a Hall of Famer. And I don't know if you
can pinpoint that concussion that changed Antonio Brown.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
You know then that that kind of theory has been advanced.
I have been told, you know, medically that that wasn't
the case. The Steelers believe that the money changed Antonio Brown,
but whatever it was, that sense of entitlement reached a point.
You know, they traded him for a fifth round pick,
(08:59):
So people think like they're getting short change for a
third round pick for George Pickens. They are not. I
think they're a little spoiled by the fact that they
got a second round pick from for Chase claypol from
the desperate Chicago Bears.
Speaker 6 (09:14):
But you know, I don't know if you know this
from not Dan.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
For five years I did a weekly radio show with
Antonio Brown, and I did. I liked the kid, I did,
but you saw him later the last couple years. Change
and his insubordination that last year with the Steelers, from
from his teammates to his coaches, to the general manager
to the team owner was unlike anything I've ever seen
(09:39):
happen in the Steeler family. And so that's why they
had to move on from him.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
Great stuff. We'll be in touch this summer. Thank you, Jerry.
Speaker 6 (09:47):
All right, Dan, you got it, man.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
Government Steelers for decades. Jerry Doula for the Pittsburgh Post Gazette.
Steelers radio network.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
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Speaker 2 (11:04):
Ray Allen, Hall of Famer and two time NBA champ
joining us on the program. You put up all those
numbers in Seattle. You spent five years in Seattle?
Speaker 5 (11:13):
Correct?
Speaker 6 (11:14):
Yep?
Speaker 5 (11:14):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Are those numbers now attached to the Oklahoma City Thunder
since the SuperSonics went to OKAC?
Speaker 6 (11:21):
Like?
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Could your jersey number be retired by OKAC based off
what you did in Seattle?
Speaker 6 (11:29):
Technically I think it could be, but I think for
tradition speaking, you know, typically you raise a banner or
jersey in a place that is kind of familiar to
that city. And nobody in Oklahoma City really had ever
watched me play in that city, so I don't think.
(11:50):
And it's a ownership mandate as well, so I don't
think that would ever happen.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Is there a building where your jersey is up in
the rafters in Seattle?
Speaker 6 (12:03):
Yeah? In Ky Arena, Okay, it would, I would say, possibly,
but it's Key Arena. I don't think. I don't even
know they use it for.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Anymore Okay, here's a couple of things I'm going to
talk to you about. The Celtics keep shooting threes the
other night. Yeah, now you had a game. I think
you went over thirteen from three point range. But as
a great shooter, you're told to keep shooting. But at
what point do you stop shooting threes if you're the
(12:30):
Celtics the other night? Or do you stop shooting threes?
Speaker 6 (12:36):
Well, the other night, I think the Celtics shot sixty
threes and they were shooting them at points when the
Knicks kept kind of plugging them away. And they're plugging
away and they're playing, they're playing tougher, they're getting tougher buckets.
The next word, obviously Brussel's getting so many mid range shots,
(12:58):
so he had a great offensive rhythm. Don't think the
Celtics ever built their rhythm offensively. Now they take a
lot of threes early and they take them throughout the
game and when they're going because you got multiple guys
that shoot threes and shoot them well. But if you
never build a rhythm, you know, get into the basket,
getting to the free throw line, to the mid range game.
That's kind of where there was a hole in that
(13:19):
game for the Celtics other night. So to answer your question,
they got to figure out getting some easy buckets, you know,
just kind of establishing rhythm as opposed to just kind
of let the fly consistently. Because it's the playoffs, it
changes a lot because now those shots become smaller opportunities
and they're shooting quicker, and it's important for them to
(13:42):
try to figure out a way to get some rhythm
stuff start in the game. Early.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Yeah, I just.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Thought, you know, go inside, get found, go to the
free throw line, get like, let's break up all this
and just get something there. That's what was surprising. But
the analytics say, I think to keep shooting the three?
Speaker 5 (14:00):
Are you still't think?
Speaker 6 (14:01):
Well, obviously, because threes are more than two's, and that's
what everybody says. You keep shooting them, and they've been
highly successful at it. So it's hard to stop what
you've been doing and what's made you successful this whole year.
But you have to take into account that the game
does slow down a little bit more in the playoffs,
and you're you're putting so much pressure on Tatum. He
(14:23):
makes a lot of tough threes. Jalen went to the
basket and got a layup at one point during that
fourth quarter, and I was like, okay, that steady the
offense a little bit. And you see them and you
want them to drive because you look at the Knicks defense.
You know there's a lot of holes in their defense
if you just drive. There's a couple of times where
even Derek White had the ball in the paint and
(14:44):
he the basket was behind them and he's looking out
towards the Berman as supposed to just turn around and
get something easy, and it is hopefully you know, they'll
look at the film and you know, I'm sure Missoula
will say, these are just shots that we missed. You know,
we're all capable of making any shots, but make it
easier on yourself. You know, it's hard in a playoff
situation because you know you could make those shots. So
(15:07):
I just think to start the game tonight, they had
to make sure that they get to the free throw
line early and establish something in the paint from the
standpoint of driving and getting some easy stuff because as
a shooter, I'll tell you I did not want to
start a game shooting the three because if you miss,
then you start pressing and then you start pressing. I
(15:28):
didn't want to have to feel like I was pressing.
In Boston, we had so many good players that score,
so I want to make sure I got to the
basket early if I could.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Talking to Ray Allen, former three point shooting Contest winner
back in two thousand and one, do you practice missing
free throws? We saw that with Tyrese Haliburton, because you
know he's got to miss the free throw, but you
got to miss it correctly to get a chance.
Speaker 5 (15:53):
Do you practice missing free throws?
Speaker 6 (15:56):
Well, I mean it sounds funny, but you know how
to miss, and it's just kind of being off and
obviously you're looking to who your best rebounder is on
what side. So yeah, there is some precision to being
able to miss a free throw. I can't say that
I practiced it, but I definitely know how to aim
(16:16):
up there and get it to bounce on one side
or the other.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Well, you did practice making them, though, you did a
really good job at that.
Speaker 6 (16:22):
I did.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
I did.
Speaker 6 (16:24):
I was pretty good at it.
Speaker 5 (16:25):
Yeah, but I never understood that.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Explain to me what happens when guys go to the
free throw line and all of a sudden they they
free you know, they're it's not fluid. They like everything slows,
you know, it stops. Maybe that's what it is. Guys
you used to moving, all of a sudden it stops.
But the mind games that go on with these guys
who can't shoot free throws.
Speaker 6 (16:47):
Well, it's simpler when you think about golf. When you
stand to the tea box and they call your name
and they say where you're from, exactoly, and all of
a sudden they everybody's quiet. I was like, oh, keep
making noise. Uncomfortable in noise, you know, don't be quiet.
I think what people and I say this a lot
with free throws. People don't understand how emotional a free
(17:08):
throw is. You know, when you think about a guy
going to the free throw line, and emotions don't always
mean anger, but your your adrenaline is pumping. You just
got knocked on your butt. You know you're either down
to or you're up to. You just dunked on somebody.
All these emotions are inside of you, and for most players,
(17:29):
imagine a situation in practice where you practice those emotions.
It's hard to practice feeling competitive, to practice feeling angry,
to practice feeling anxious, practice feeling desperate. How do you
do that in the gym by yourself? And so you
have to figure out a way when you practice to
take that that quiet gym and make yourself tired, make
(17:53):
yourself mad, make yourself excited, because that feeling you have
to get used to in a game and a lot
of times then when they get into a game situation,
it's a foreign situation for them when they go to
that free to line. Because think about you take somebody
life like Prichard. You know, Gray Shooter had a great year,
but how often is he at the free throw line
(18:15):
in the fourth quarter if it's not Tatum or Brown?
So now he goes to free throw line because it
gets fout. Is Sometimes it's a foreign circumstance or situation
for a lot of players, and that's why you do
get nervous because it's like, I'm not used to this,
and I gotta get used to I gotta be better
at figuring out the situation.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
One thing that drives me crazy, and I'm sure I
drive my audience crazy because I bring it up all
the time. I never want the best player to beat me. Never,
I'm always going to send another guy. I got to
get the ball out of your hands. I want somebody
who's not used to taking that shot. And if that
guy beats me, I live with that. It's like, you know,
when Jordan beats Brian Russell, they don't send another guy,
(18:58):
and I got to get the ball out of his hands, right, Like,
I don't help me understand that. If Jalen Brunson has
the ball, I'm gonna double I'm gonna get the ball
out of his hands.
Speaker 5 (19:08):
I have to do that. But why don't more coaches
do that?
Speaker 6 (19:13):
Well? I think it's a double ast sword because when
you want you don't want the best player to beat you.
There's some scenarios, some playoff situations you kind of walk
into and you say, he's gonna get his forty, but
we can't let these other guys get off, you know.
So it is each situation from from series the series,
(19:36):
you know, what do you deal with? Like if you
look at Indiana, you got Nessmith that had twenty three,
and Turner had twenty three and nim Hard had thirteen.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
And this is the last shot. Though, this is the
last shot, that's all I'm talking about. Even Halliburton has
the ball, that's the guy I know who wants the ball.
I have to send another guy his way. I'm not
gonna let him beat me. And they gave him. You know,
he created space. It was a tough shot though, but
he know, but he's only he's got single coverage on it.
Speaker 6 (20:07):
Yeah. I mean it's always we can be perfect defensively
as a as a scheme, you know, going to the game,
but we always say good offense, better defense, or good
defense better offense. I'm sorry, We're playing a scheme a
certain way and then a guy makes a tough shot
over the top of us. We have to shake their
(20:28):
head because this league is fulled filled with great offensive players,
so they can, like I said, it can go either way.
You know, we'll run to at a guy because he
got hot. Saif a guy has forty plus, you know,
I don't know. Halliburton only had nineteen points last night,
so it wasn't like he was cooking.
Speaker 5 (20:45):
But he's a closer.
Speaker 6 (20:47):
Yeah, But you just kind of you live with those
odds because if you look at defenses and you look
at all these playoff games, the one thing that you
find fascinating is there's there's no paint presence. Last night.
I don't know who I don't remember. It was Draymond Green.
He came straight down the lane and dunked it, and
(21:07):
there was no awareness from Minnesota whatsoever. And that's the
one thing in playoff basketball that you kind of you know,
you fortify your defense with a paint presence and you
work from inside out. And you see that consistently because
you know so many teams are shooting threes. And then
you look at the ball, the way the ball bounced,
(21:28):
you know, against against with the Golden State, and you
see how many rebounds they got in Minnesota's the bigger team,
you know, you think about how many rebounds they didn't get.
Go Beart had eleven and I think Anthony had fourteen
or somewhere around there. But those balls are bounds a
so long, so spreading the defense out and then you're
trying to figure out what we tried to do. On
(21:50):
most teams I played on, we tried to keep our
big guy in the paint. You know, we rotated. We're
playing man the man, so it was myself and KG.
I tried to stay up time and he stayed low
so if somebody did drive, they had to see him.
And right now, you just don't see that that fortification
of the paint, and there's so many holes right now
in their defense. So that's ultimately a system where it's
(22:12):
built around team shooting threes.
Speaker 5 (22:14):
What's your favorite pair of shoes behind you?
Speaker 6 (22:17):
My favorite pair, I would have to go up. I'd
have to go up, one, two, three, four. If I
can show.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
You, Oh my goodness, you got a whole wall, this
one right here, okay, number four. So those are how
many of those are air Jordan's.
Speaker 6 (22:39):
They're one through thirty, one through thirty.
Speaker 5 (22:44):
You might sign any shoes that you have.
Speaker 6 (22:47):
No, you wouldn't ask him. I haven't, Like I have
a jersey and his hang on my wall and I
played golf with him regularly. I wouldn't ask them. But
I think at some point I should here in the future,
just just for keepsake, just having momentum. And I know
he would if I asked him. But but I thought
(23:10):
about it, but I haven't done it yet.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Okay, But if you have them in the back of
the golf cart and then you know Mike probably sees them,
and then you go, oh god, yeah, sorry, I thought
I was going to leave these in the car. Uh.
Speaker 5 (23:26):
And then you have a sharpie attached to it.
Speaker 6 (23:29):
Then all of a sudden, see that I'm a vet
right here.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
DP.
Speaker 6 (23:34):
That's like the rookie move to do that. If somebody
did that to me, I'd be looking. I'm like, really
really do Oh? You really left it with the sharpie
on the on taped up to it.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Okay, what if you send somebody that you guys, guys
used to do this where you'd send the clubhouse guy
over to get something signed by somebody in the other
locker room.
Speaker 5 (23:56):
Right, okay, did that?
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Did it?
Speaker 6 (23:58):
I'll tell you a story. One time when I was
playing in Milwaukee. I was always early and the bus
wasn't there yet, so I took the cab over and
I'm sitting in the locker room. So our equipment manager
didn't get our gear out yet. So I'm sitting in
the locker room and I'm antsy trying to get on
the court. And you know, the United senter was always freezing,
so you wanted to come like bundled. So I'm sitting
(24:20):
there and the equipment guy from the Bulls comes to
the locker room. He goes, you guys didn't get here yet.
I said, no, they're not here. I'm just waiting on him.
He goes, Mike's on the other side. You know, he
has some stuff. Maybe you want to ask him. And
I was like really, and He's like, yeah, but you
got to ask him. You got to go in there
and ask him. And you know, this was I'm probably
like three years in the league, and I'm like, I asked,
go over there and ask I was like, can you
(24:41):
ask for me? He goes, no, you got to ask me.
And so I went in there and I was like, Mike,
you think I could borrow a pair of shoes And
I'm already wearing the shoes anyway, I'm under contract. And
He's like, sure, kid, you know. And in the hall,
I walked in the cabinet full of Jordan's just like
all the way down.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
There, all this.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
That was where are those shoes?
Speaker 6 (25:05):
I don't know, there's somewhere floating. I got so many
shoes like tucked everywhere.
Speaker 5 (25:09):
We brought this up yesterday.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
The Hall of very Good, like the guys that you
played against or with, like Jamal Crawford in the Hall
of very Good. Not a Hall of Famer, but you know,
a Hall of very good. Who would you put in there?
Maybe you played against you know contemporaries where you go,
that guy should be in the Hall of very Good.
Not a Hall of Famer, but Hall of very good.
Speaker 6 (25:31):
Did I played with. I would definitely say two players
that just you know, one in particular that would kill
the game today is Then Baker. Okay, he just he
was around the basket. I didn't think anybody could stop him,
and he still could shoot, you know, in the primer.
He would be really good in today's game. And obviously,
(25:55):
you know, these are two guys that I played with
my rookie year in Glenn Robinson and you know, arguably
one of the greatest college players of all time. And
I think they don't get their their uh their credit,
but they were incredible scores and and when I watched
then nobody could stop them, you know. So they were good.
And they just ended up not being on teams once
(26:16):
they left Milwaukeeople but they had any any symbolus of success.
But I thought they're incredible and and so you look
at the game today, we don't have those. You know,
you talk about those mid range players, those pick great
pick and role players. Uh think about Terrell Brandon. He
was dubbed best point guard in the World Sports illustrated
(26:37):
like this. He was he was split a pick and roll.
His mid range game, he was automatic, and I learned
a lot from him. You know, just playing with those
three guys helped my game tremendously. Uh. And we don't
have that that skill level right now in the NBA
because of the overuse of the three ball.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Yeah, I still keep I can't get it out of
my mind. You're wearing Michael Jordan's shoes playing against Michael Jordan.
Speaker 6 (27:05):
Well, just remember my second game in the NBA. My
first game was Minnesota Timberwolves a preseason and the second
one and I seen the schedule. So I was still
in my college apartment when I got the schedule in
October fifteenth, nineteen ninety three, Chicago Bulls United Center, and
(27:25):
I'm sitting there. I still got poster him on my
wall right here in my room, and I'm like, I'm
about to play against Michael Jordan. So I'm wearing his
shoes on October fifteen. I'm stretching and then I hear
the whole introduction, and you know, I'm used to being
on the other side looking at the TV watching all
this stuff happen, and now I'm like, Wow, this is
(27:47):
so crazy. I'm inside the TV right now, and then
I'm sitting here on the ground stretching and I'm doing
this and I'm just kind of and I see the
bulls run out and he's the last one, and I said,
I couldn't believe it, you know, just as much as
I've watched him and kind of like study his game
and he was kind of he was such a big
(28:08):
role model. Then being on the same floor with him,
it was just unbelievable.
Speaker 5 (28:11):
Did he talk trash dude?
Speaker 6 (28:14):
No, But at jump Bald he walks over to me
and he said, welcome to the NBA. Ray, like, you
just don't understand, like this man he's you know, to
be great, you also have to be intelligent. You know,
you can't walk around and be oblivious to the things
around you. So he knows everybody who's playing against you,
(28:37):
study your opponents, you watch the draft. You know who's
young and come into the league. And so as us
young players, we're so naive to that idea. You start
to realize how much you have to immerse yourself in
this game and you have to know every player in
the league. You can't just think that Oh, I'm the
best player. I don't care about anybody. You really have
to study this game and who's in it. What's on
(28:58):
your shirt? Jesus shooting a jumper up side? That's not Jesus,
shuttles Worth, that's Jesus. But the play.
Speaker 5 (29:12):
I don't know about Jesus form though.
Speaker 6 (29:14):
Ray, Yeah, this one a we got. We'll work with him.
We'll give him a pass. We definitely will give him
a pass.
Speaker 5 (29:22):
Thank you, Ray, Good to talk to you again. That's right, Dylan.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app PK subin.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
He's a ESPN analyst and former defenseman played thirteen years
in the NHL.
Speaker 5 (29:41):
Great to have you on PK.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
What kind of uh mood do you think Toronto is
going to be in tonight when they face Florida.
Speaker 3 (29:51):
Well, they have to be in a pretty good mood.
Speaker 9 (29:54):
You know, you're up one nothing at home, still in
the home, playing in your building again, and you know
all that. You maybe didn't play your best game in
Game one. I think they had a great start, but
maybe not the best finish. So coming into game too,
they should feel pretty good about where they're at and
plan them full sixty minutes.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
But you had an incident where you know, your goalie
takes an elbow to the head, he's throwing up. They
take him on like you guys, you know, police your
own sport. Here, How does Toronto stay in the game
an important game while you still send the message to
maybe the most physical team in the NHL.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 9 (30:35):
And I think that the best way to send that
message is in between the whistles and shift by shift.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
This is gonna be a long series. He's gonna be
up and downs.
Speaker 9 (30:46):
As a player for the most part, leave the media
and all the quotes and all that stuff to the fans.
As a player, you got to stay focused on what
you need to do on the ice. And let's be
honest here, nobody knows that the symptoms that you know,
Anthony Stolar's was that we all witnessed on the bench,
we're from that hit.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
I think a lot of.
Speaker 9 (31:05):
People believe that maybe it was from something else, maybe
a sickness or from the prior shot do But that
all being said, no one should be speculating on what
the injury injury statuses of Anthony Stollars and Meg No
doubt about it based on the incident outside decreased or
just inside decrease. Rather, this was not a significant enough
(31:25):
play for this to be anything. This is just playoff
hockey and both coaches are doing what they need to
do to maintain the edge.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Explain to me we talk about goalies standing on their
heads like they're going to stop everything, but why is
it in that moment we have at least one goalie
every every playoff, a Stanley Cup final where you go,
I'll be damned like he's winning a series, winning a
Stanley Cup championship.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 9 (31:53):
And I feel like it's goaltending has become more and
more important every year.
Speaker 3 (31:57):
It's always been important, you know, playing hockey.
Speaker 9 (31:59):
It's the ultimate team sport, but we have an individual
position that can really dictate whether you are a competitive team,
a contending team, or you're not even calls. And without
a good goaltender, you're probably not getting too far in
the regular season, let alone the playoffs. So when it
comes to playoff times, we're seeing the best goaltenders you know,
on the most competitive teams going at it and you know,
(32:21):
we're seeing that every night. Now, what we're also seeing
is a lot of contact in decrease. A lot of
that is due because players are doing whatever they can
to disrupt any you know, any groove that the goaltender
might be in, any rhythm that he might be in.
You want to disrupt that by flash screens and getting
physical in the crease. Well, sometimes that boils over. You know,
(32:44):
Sam Bennett's going into the crease. Yeah, I know, he
says Anthony Stolars's buddy, but he's going in there.
Speaker 3 (32:50):
You know, if he makes contact. I mean, no one's
upset about that.
Speaker 9 (32:53):
And let's be real, if you hurt the number one goaltender,
you know, if a third or fourth line guy runs
And this is something that we got to talk about
it hockey, because all it takes is one player to say,
you know what, I'm going to go in there, and
you know, whatever happens happens. But you know, you lose
that player for a couple of games, that's one thing,
But losing a number one goaltender for the playoffs is another.
(33:13):
And you know I've been on that side. Right when
we lost Kerry Price against the Rangers in the Conference final,
that was the end of our run. So they're trying
to protect the goaltenders the best that they can. But
that play on the crease wasn't wasn't anything, The got gap,
wasn't anything too crazy.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
What's it like to fight somebody and then he turns
out to be your teammate at some point in your career.
Speaker 3 (33:36):
There's a lot in hockey. This is what makes our
sports so special.
Speaker 9 (33:39):
And you know, Brian Birch says the hockey fraternity is
the best fraternity in all of sports, and I believe him,
but it starts for that simple reason. We're the only
sport where you can fight a guy and the next
day literally be sitting at the bar having a beer
with them after playing a full sixty minutes and fighting
next to him. Right, So we're the only sport that
does that. It's about honor, It's all about your teammates
(34:04):
and team first and the willingness to do anything for
the team.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
That's that's what fighting really is in hockey.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
When do you start fighting in hockey? At what age
are is it acceptable?
Speaker 3 (34:16):
Well?
Speaker 9 (34:17):
I mean oftentimes now, because we're in the world of
social media, I get all these reels and these tweets
at me every day of like these little nine year
old kids having brawls on the ice some different parts,
and like, you know, this just happens in hockey. It
happens all the times, happens in all sports. But it's
funny to me when I see the little kids doing
it in hockey, you know, because they're watching everything on TV.
Speaker 3 (34:38):
But you know, I'll keep it real.
Speaker 9 (34:40):
People talk about our sport the.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Time, they don't talk about the respect in it. There's
a lot of respect in it.
Speaker 9 (34:47):
They talk about it a little bit, but you know,
not to the degree that they probably should. And the
level of respect in the game of hockey is I
think it's unmatched in any other sport because of the
physicality and the in our sport. And when you talk
about fighting, there's such a respect in regards to fighting
that if you do it the wrong way, you know
(35:08):
you're gonna have everybody, including your teammates, not happy with you.
So you know, that's the respect that fighting sort of garners.
When you drop the gloves, we all know it's something
that you have to be willing to do, and not
everybody's willing to do it. So I think for kids
it's not in the forefront for them. You know, we
stress skill and allent because you got to entertain at
(35:28):
the end of the day. This is sports entertainment. So
the fighting part, you know, is a part of the game,
but the entertainment goes way up right. The entertainment though,
has to meet the skill as well. So we got
to have a balance of both, and I think we
have that in the league. But fighting for me doesn't
really start. Doesn't really start until the kids are about
fourteen or fifteen, usually once you get to junior. And
(35:49):
even then it's like a choice. If you don't want
to fight, you don't have to.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
PK subin of the Mothership ESPN Analyst and second round
playoff action coming up tonight, doubleheader. It's the Maple Leafs
Panthers and then it'll be the Down the Stars Winnipeg Jets.
Playoff scoring is up again. I think this is I
think this might be the fifth consecutive year playoff scoring
is going up.
Speaker 5 (36:13):
Why is that?
Speaker 9 (36:16):
I think it's the style, style of play, the way
teams are built. Obviously, it's the way the game is
policed as well with officiating.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
You can't hook in a hold anymore.
Speaker 9 (36:25):
You can't clutch and grab, you can't cross check, you
can't do all those things as a defenseman, you know,
to impede players. You know, guys are also coming into
the league way more skilled. When I came into the league,
you knew that their third and fourth line probably weren't
scoring any goals. They could run around and hit. But
now you've got goal scorers and multi point guys on
(36:48):
the third and fourth line.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
I was just talking about this last night about Edmonton with.
Speaker 9 (36:52):
You know, Corey Perry scoring that beautiful goal in that
passing play with McDavid. But Corey Perry was a fifty
goal scorer in in the OHL like Cory Perry was
one hundred point guy. And uh, Cory Perry is a
former ending p a Stanley Cup Chiven playing on the
fourth line and up and down their lineup.
Speaker 3 (37:11):
You know.
Speaker 9 (37:11):
And when you look at the Detroit Red Wings back
in the day, Kirk Molty, you know, Darren McCarty party, uh,
you know, excuse me I'm missing another name here, but
you know they had Danny Cleary. They had a bunch
of guys that played those roles of third and fourth
line roles. When they got to the NHL, but we're
skill players in junior hockey. So I think there's a
(37:35):
lot of more talent in the league, a lot more skill.
You know, there's way more parody in the game, which
challenges teams. I think the star players have to do
a lot more every night, which is more difficult to
do so, and there's more teams now, so you have
more skill players.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
So I think there's no off nights now.
Speaker 9 (37:54):
You could circle your you know, calendar, and for the
games that were point nights, even in the playoffs, you
knew you're playing against teams that we're going to give
up a lot.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
Now, it's just difficult to do that.
Speaker 9 (38:04):
You got to play discipline game and you got to
have skilled players that can check both sides of the pupkin.
I think we're seeing the game and probably a ties
point in a long time.
Speaker 2 (38:13):
I'll let you start your team with Sid Crosby or
Alex Ovechkin.
Speaker 3 (38:19):
Sidney Crosby.
Speaker 9 (38:20):
First of all, I'll always take a Canadian player over
any Cutchy Canadian.
Speaker 3 (38:25):
This is our sport, folks.
Speaker 9 (38:27):
I know I worked for ESPN in America, but hockey
is our sport.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
So I'm always going to go with the Canadian.
Speaker 9 (38:33):
But you know, I'll say this about both Sydney Crosby
and Alex Novechkin. I mean, how lucky was the NHL
to have two ambassadors like that over the past two decades,
you know, And we're.
Speaker 3 (38:46):
Hoping to have them around a lot longer too. Neither
of them is slowing down and you.
Speaker 9 (38:51):
Can see the age, but the performance hasn't really dropped
that much, and there's such they're premier athletes, premiere professional
and most of all premier people the way they've represented
the games. So to have either or of those guys
would be a huge win. They're both champions, like I said,
great ambassadors, great teammates, But I'm going with Sydney Cosby.
(39:14):
To me, he's the best all around player in my generation.
He's a winner, he's a champion and once again, he's
got that Canadian maple syrup running through his fase.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
That's the X factor.
Speaker 5 (39:23):
Dan Utah has their nickname.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Is it the Mammoth?
Speaker 5 (39:29):
Did I see that? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (39:30):
The Mammoth?
Speaker 6 (39:31):
Yah?
Speaker 3 (39:31):
Okay, what do you think of that?
Speaker 5 (39:35):
I kind of like the Utah Hockey Club.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
You like the Utah Hockey Club? You don't? Me too?
Speaker 9 (39:41):
I did like it. I did like it just playing.
It was starting to grow on me, especially towards the end.
But you know, I will say to this Dan as
a fan, because I still consider myself a big sportsman.
That's why I do this now, is that I'm a
fan of sports. Is that the fan does love those logos.
They like having that logo, like the Chicago Black Box logo.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
To have that, that's the best logo.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
That's the best logo in sports.
Speaker 9 (40:09):
It is, it is, And I think for Utah, they
want the opportunity to create something, to create something iconic.
So I understand having a proper name and a proper logo.
I get that, but I share that with you, dude.
I'm the same way I loved Utah Hockey Club. I
love the simplicity of it.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
I did.
Speaker 2 (40:28):
In basketball, you guard guys, you know, guys with Guarden,
Michael or Larry or Kobe, And in hockey we don't
really kind of single out. It's a one on one
match up there. It's it's like us against them. But
how often do you have those one on one mode
like you know with Ovechkin, how often did you have
a one on one where it's like, uh, you know,
(40:51):
this might not end well.
Speaker 9 (40:53):
Oh my god, it's such a great question. Hockey is
a sport of one on one battles. It's all about
one on one battle. If you watch the game of hockey,
it's one on one battles all over the ice.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
It's a one it's it's.
Speaker 9 (41:09):
A team sport, but you have to beat the guy
across the line from you.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
So when we line up for that base off, there's
the sentiment he's got to be better than the sentiment.
Speaker 9 (41:19):
The wingers got to be better than the wingers, and
the D got to be better than the D.
Speaker 3 (41:22):
And I know who's on the other side.
Speaker 9 (41:24):
I know when I'm playing Eric Carlton, Drew Dowdy, Cale mccarr,
Victory Headmand.
Speaker 3 (41:29):
My job is to do those guys. So it's individual.
Speaker 9 (41:32):
This is competition, it's pro sports, so it's very.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
Much one on one and that's what we want. We
want our athletes to take it on.
Speaker 9 (41:41):
And part of my responsibility as the next player now
being on the broadcast, is to bring those battles to
the forefront for the audience and people watching to see
and participate in, because you don't have an opportunity to
hear what the players are saying on the ice all
the time, or on.
Speaker 3 (41:56):
The court or on the field.
Speaker 9 (41:57):
You don't always have the opportunity to know that there's
bad blood or that these players have a history. So
it's our job as the analyst and the talent on
air to paint that picture of the story. And last
night we got a good glimpse of Big David and
Jack Piper going back and forth. But in my time,
it was you know, even when I came into the league,
(42:17):
it was more rich than that. And I think that
hockey is now starting to take ownership of those one
on one battles. We saw it at the Four Nations between
Brendan Hagel and Matthew Kachuk, and we want to continue
to build on those storylines and I think the players
are buying into it and it's really helping our game.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
Is there anybody you could see that you might still
want a piece of, like just in regular life.
Speaker 9 (42:43):
That's a great, great question. Let me see which guy
would I want a piece of? You know, And I
don't hate It's not that I hate them at all.
I love them, But I'm going to tell you why
I would want a piece of them. And I don't
even know if I'd do anything if I had a chance.
But let's just say I had a chance, it probably
be Chris Proudle, because you know, my best chance to
win the Stanley Cup with Montreal was a conference final
(43:07):
when he collided with Carriy Price. So you know, I
mean every Montreal Canadians man and every player on that
team shares that same view with me. You know, Chrystal
maintains that it was an accident, and I believe him.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
You're at Starbucks and he's in line at Starbucks and
you see him, would.
Speaker 5 (43:26):
You you wouldn't cross, You would not.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
No, I wouldn't cross second.
Speaker 9 (43:30):
No, no, And I I feel even that throwing them
into the mix like that, But no, I wouldn't because
you know, it's no one's bigger than the game, even me.
And even though that may have been my best chance
to win a Stanley Cup. Uh, there's a lot of
guys out there who dream about winning the Stanley Cup.
And there's a lot of guys who have before me
(43:52):
and didn't get a chance to win one. So you know,
I would never take I never take myself too seriously
when it comes to other people. It's out the game,
So maybe I'd throw a little loumbow, like a Messia
elbow to the ribs and something like that.
Speaker 3 (44:05):
Maybe I hit him with one of.
Speaker 5 (44:06):
Those Messier looks like he could still play.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
Oh, I mean, uh, don't take this the wrong way.
Speaker 9 (44:15):
I mean, he is my teammate and I work with him,
so I'm gonna pump his tires on air. But he
could probably be on the front cover of GQ as well.
He's a good looking guy. I haven't met a woman
yet who hasn't asked me about Mark Messier and what
his whole what his whole treatment regime is, and how
he keeps his skin so nice and all that time.
I'm like, guys, I'm thirty five, what about me? Like,
you know, black, don't crack, Come on, give me a break.
(44:38):
Mess has taken all my shine. But no, he he
takes He takes really really good care of himself.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
And you know, he's a happy guy.
Speaker 9 (44:46):
You know, I also believe this as time goes on,
if you're a happy person, it shows in your energy.
And you know, I love There's nothing better than I
love to do at work. It's a super Bowl if
I get a laugh out of mess because he's got
that big grin and that big laugh. It's just fun
to see him laugh. So no, he takes good care
of him.
Speaker 3 (45:04):
Somebody. He does look like he can play.
Speaker 9 (45:05):
I went on the ice with him in La for
that charity to raise money for the fires, and I
told him right a wait, like his presence on the
ice now, I know why they call him moose. I
know why they call him the moose now because he's
just so big and he could just feel his presence
and it was pretty cool to touch the ice with
him in La.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
Great to talk to you. I hope you're doing well.
Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 3 (45:28):
Thanks Dan, hope to come back on soon. Man, Thank you,
thanks for having me.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
PK Subin
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
The Steelers dump wide receiver George Pickens to the Cowboys
for draft picks. And I'm not surprised. I think that
there was a lot of chatter leading up to the
draft that they were trying to do this, or they
might do this, and then I thought, are they going
to draft a wide receiver? Which they didn't, and then
George Pickens goes to the Cowboys. You look at the
(00:26):
Pittsburgh side of this, and you go, what's this meme
for Aaron Rodgers? If anything, He's going to say, Well,
they got DK Metcalf and a couple of guys that
I'm not familiar with, got a pretty good tight end,
got rid of Nog Harris. Maybe it's Mason Rudolph's team,
but this guy would know better than I. It's Jerry
Dulac joining us again. Steeler's coverage with the Pittsburgh Post
(00:50):
Gazette and the Steelers radio network. How surprised were you
that this move took place?
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Well?
Speaker 4 (00:58):
I was, obviously I was, and shocked because I knew
they were going to move on him at some point. Dan.
They were never going to give George Pickens a second
contract that was never going to happen. And I never
thought they would just let him walk when they didn't
take a receiver. I thought they were content to go
into the season with a you know, a double barreled
(01:20):
receiving room with DK Metcalf and George Pickens. But you know,
a coach told me this a long time ago, Dan,
and it's still true. When the production outweighs the aggravation,
you keep them. When the aggravation out weighs the production,
you get rid of them. And that's what happens with
George Pickens. They just thought that, you know, his teammates.
It was a problem in the locker room. It became
(01:42):
a problem with Mike Tomlin. It wasn't just his on
field temperament and behavior, you know, repeated violations off the field,
late for meetings, skipping meetings, late to games. It was
just on and on, and it just got to the
point where they weren't especially after they traded for d Metcalf,
they just weren't going to tolerated anymore.
Speaker 5 (02:02):
Dan, what are the Cowboys getting?
Speaker 4 (02:05):
They're getting, you know, both a problem and problematic receiver.
There's no question he is a big play guy. But
you know, I severely doubt that his on the field
temperament is going to change. You know, they're going to
deal with a guy who's you know, is he all
of a sudden be going to become a mister discipline?
(02:26):
I doubt it. I don't mean to pick on the guy.
I only know what they saw and what we saw
for three years with the Steelers, so there's no question
about his talent level. But you know, sometimes it's it's
about more than just talent level in the NFL.
Speaker 5 (02:42):
This move impact Aaron Rodgers' decision, you.
Speaker 6 (02:46):
Know, I don't think so. They don't think so.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
You know, from their end, it doesn't have any impact
at all on whether he signs with the team. I
will say this, Dan, And of course this was certainly
no motivation for making the deal. But Aaron Rodgers didn't
get to where he is as a future Hall of
Famer by being an undisciplined, fly by the seat of
pans quarterback, which is kind of the description you can
(03:10):
apply to George Pickens. You know, I think Aaron Rodgers
is a very detailed quarterback, and I don't think he
is on the field. Relationship with George Pickens, who is anything,
but that would mesh very well. So you know, I
don't want to say it might be a blessing an
(03:31):
enticement for Aaron Rodgers to come. I don't think that
at all. But I don't know that it would have
been a good mix here anyhow.
Speaker 5 (03:38):
Any news on the Aaron Rodgers front.
Speaker 4 (03:41):
I wish I could tell you some, Dan, I mean
I check all the time, and you know they you know,
as I've told you before, he told them up front
he's going to take his time. They are willing to
do that. They are still willing to do that. You know,
Mini camp is in excuse me, OTAs the rookies are
in this weekend and OTAs to start two weeks after that.
(04:02):
There's still time and then of course, you know, you
get into the mini camp, which is I gauge everything
about the US Open coming to Oakmont at the twelve
through to fifteenth, which is where Mini camp is. So
you know there's still time for him to come.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
Is there a plan B.
Speaker 4 (04:21):
Yeah, you touched on it, Mason Rodgers. But I think
even if that is the case, Dan, they will go
out and sign some other veteran quarterback.
Speaker 6 (04:29):
I really don't think they.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
Are going to rely on a sixth round pick, even
though I like Will Howard in that spot. I don't
think they're really going to rely on a rookie being
a backup. Their history has always been to have two
quarterbacks with NFL starting experience on their roster, and even
though some of those have been picked over, that's one
of the downsides of this Aaron Rodgers delay. I still
(04:51):
believe they will try to sign some veteran quarterback to
come in and be the number two behind Mason Rudolph
if Aaron Rodgers falls through, but they firmly bel leave
Dan that he is coming.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
But if you look at where they are talent level,
you know, are they the third best team in their division?
Would you put obviously Baltimore? Would you put Cincinnati above them?
Speaker 4 (05:11):
Well, you know, Dan, last year, after acquiring Russell Wilson
and Patrick Queen and Deshaun Elliott and the moves they made,
they were nine win team. The year before, I automatically
thought they were a better team based on their offseason,
I thought they were a ten win team. I don't
right now think they are a better team than last year,
So I don't know if that means it's ten wins,
(05:34):
eleven wins, nine wins, or eight wins. I don't think
they're an eight win team, you know, Mike Tomlins. History
has shown that they are just not that a sub
five hundred team. But you know, the Bengals, as long
as they have that quarterback and their receivers, their defense
is very suspect.
Speaker 6 (05:51):
You know.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
You know they finished Steelers finished second last year. I
don't think they're the best in the division by any stretch.
So it might be a coin for how it goes
with the Bengals. Depending on Joe Burrow's health. If he
stays healthy, they're gonna be tough.
Speaker 6 (06:05):
We saw that at the end of the year.
Speaker 5 (06:07):
Steelers gonna pony up for TJ. Watt.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Yeah, I think so, Dan. You know, you go back
in their history, I can't think of one player, one
of their star players, basically in their prime, that they
have ever let walk. I can't think of one. I
go back to frank O Harris, which was toward the
end of his career, and Dan Rooney admitted quietly admitted
after that it was the biggest professional mistake he ever made.
(06:32):
He should have just signed Franco for everything he meant
to the franchise. I can't TJ. Watt doesn't want to leave,
and they don't want him to leave, so I expect
that to happen.
Speaker 5 (06:41):
I'll leave you with this.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
With Pittsburgh, Mike Tomlin's not afraid to bring in guys
who are suspect the headaches. You know, if you look
at Antonio Brown, Le'Veon Bell, Chase Claypool, you got I mean,
They've gone.
Speaker 5 (06:57):
Through a lot of wide receivers.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
It feels like, uh, they can't and then they don't
draft one when they need to draft one. Do they
get enough criticis Do the Steelers get criticized locally for
the kind of the randomness of some of these players
that they bring in.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
I don't think there's any question they get criticized locally
for it. Dan, I mean, and that is one of uh,
you know, to me, I don't want to see her
and call it a Mike Tomlin fault. But Mike Tomlin
believes that he can, you know, work through these guys
and and kind of you know, get them onto the
Steeler way and you roll the dice with some of
(07:36):
those guys and you know, you look back, you know
even you know you look at Juju Smith Schuster when
he came in, and he's not nearly the problem that
some of the other guys were. But you mentioned Chase Claypool,
Antonio Brown, and they're still sensitive to everything that happened
with Antonio Brown. And that's why they knew they weren't
going to give George Pickens a second contract, because if
he was acting this way without the big money, what
(07:59):
do you think he is going to do once he
got the big money. So yeah, I think it's I
think that people here are very much aware of it,
and I think you pointing it up shows that maybe
nationally some people becoming a little bit more aware of
it as well.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
I don't know why I always go back to this
play when Antonio Brown got concussed by Vontez Burfekt, it
felt like his personality changed. Now you being around the
team on a daily basis, but he went from being
this great story. He was on the path to be
a Hall of Famer. And I don't know if you
can pinpoint that concussion that changed Antonio Brown.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
You know then that that kind of theory has been advanced.
I have been told, you know, medically that that wasn't
the case. The Steelers believe that the money changed Antonio Brown,
but whatever it was, that sense of entitlement reached a point.
You know, they traded him for a fifth round pick,
(08:59):
So people think like they're getting short change for a
third round pick for George Pickens. They are not. I
think they're a little spoiled by the fact that they
got a second round pick from for Chase claypol from
the desperate Chicago Bears.
Speaker 6 (09:14):
But you know, I don't know if you know this
from not Dan.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
For five years I did a weekly radio show with
Antonio Brown, and I did. I liked the kid, I did,
but you saw him later the last couple years. Change
and his insubordination that last year with the Steelers, from
from his teammates to his coaches, to the general manager
to the team owner was unlike anything I've ever seen
(09:39):
happen in the Steeler family. And so that's why they
had to move on from him.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
Great stuff. We'll be in touch this summer. Thank you, Jerry.
Speaker 6 (09:47):
All right, Dan, you got it, man.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
Government Steelers for decades. Jerry Doula for the Pittsburgh Post Gazette.
Steelers radio network.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
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Speaker 2 (11:04):
Ray Allen, Hall of Famer and two time NBA champ
joining us on the program. You put up all those
numbers in Seattle. You spent five years in Seattle?
Speaker 5 (11:13):
Correct?
Speaker 6 (11:14):
Yep?
Speaker 5 (11:14):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Are those numbers now attached to the Oklahoma City Thunder
since the SuperSonics went to OKAC?
Speaker 6 (11:21):
Like?
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Could your jersey number be retired by OKAC based off
what you did in Seattle?
Speaker 6 (11:29):
Technically I think it could be, but I think for
tradition speaking, you know, typically you raise a banner or
jersey in a place that is kind of familiar to
that city. And nobody in Oklahoma City really had ever
watched me play in that city, so I don't think.
(11:50):
And it's a ownership mandate as well, so I don't
think that would ever happen.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Is there a building where your jersey is up in
the rafters in Seattle?
Speaker 6 (12:03):
Yeah? In Ky Arena, Okay, it would, I would say, possibly,
but it's Key Arena. I don't think. I don't even
know they use it for.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
Anymore Okay, here's a couple of things I'm going to
talk to you about. The Celtics keep shooting threes the
other night. Yeah, now you had a game. I think
you went over thirteen from three point range. But as
a great shooter, you're told to keep shooting. But at
what point do you stop shooting threes if you're the
(12:30):
Celtics the other night? Or do you stop shooting threes?
Speaker 6 (12:36):
Well, the other night, I think the Celtics shot sixty
threes and they were shooting them at points when the
Knicks kept kind of plugging them away. And they're plugging
away and they're playing, they're playing tougher, they're getting tougher buckets.
The next word, obviously Brussel's getting so many mid range shots,
(12:58):
so he had a great offensive rhythm. Don't think the
Celtics ever built their rhythm offensively. Now they take a
lot of threes early and they take them throughout the
game and when they're going because you got multiple guys
that shoot threes and shoot them well. But if you
never build a rhythm, you know, get into the basket,
getting to the free throw line, to the mid range game.
That's kind of where there was a hole in that
(13:19):
game for the Celtics other night. So to answer your question,
they got to figure out getting some easy buckets, you know,
just kind of establishing rhythm as opposed to just kind
of let the fly consistently. Because it's the playoffs, it
changes a lot because now those shots become smaller opportunities
and they're shooting quicker, and it's important for them to
(13:42):
try to figure out a way to get some rhythm
stuff start in the game. Early.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
Yeah, I just.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Thought, you know, go inside, get found, go to the
free throw line, get like, let's break up all this
and just get something there. That's what was surprising. But
the analytics say, I think to keep shooting the three?
Speaker 5 (14:00):
Are you still't think?
Speaker 6 (14:01):
Well, obviously, because threes are more than two's, and that's
what everybody says. You keep shooting them, and they've been
highly successful at it. So it's hard to stop what
you've been doing and what's made you successful this whole year.
But you have to take into account that the game
does slow down a little bit more in the playoffs,
and you're you're putting so much pressure on Tatum. He
(14:23):
makes a lot of tough threes. Jalen went to the
basket and got a layup at one point during that
fourth quarter, and I was like, okay, that steady the
offense a little bit. And you see them and you
want them to drive because you look at the Knicks defense.
You know there's a lot of holes in their defense
if you just drive. There's a couple of times where
even Derek White had the ball in the paint and
(14:44):
he the basket was behind them and he's looking out
towards the Berman as supposed to just turn around and
get something easy, and it is hopefully you know, they'll
look at the film and you know, I'm sure Missoula
will say, these are just shots that we missed. You know,
we're all capable of making any shots, but make it
easier on yourself. You know, it's hard in a playoff
situation because you know you could make those shots. So
(15:07):
I just think to start the game tonight, they had
to make sure that they get to the free throw
line early and establish something in the paint from the
standpoint of driving and getting some easy stuff because as
a shooter, I'll tell you I did not want to
start a game shooting the three because if you miss,
then you start pressing and then you start pressing. I
(15:28):
didn't want to have to feel like I was pressing.
In Boston, we had so many good players that score,
so I want to make sure I got to the
basket early if I could.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Talking to Ray Allen, former three point shooting Contest winner
back in two thousand and one, do you practice missing
free throws? We saw that with Tyrese Haliburton, because you
know he's got to miss the free throw, but you
got to miss it correctly to get a chance.
Speaker 5 (15:53):
Do you practice missing free throws?
Speaker 6 (15:56):
Well, I mean it sounds funny, but you know how
to miss, and it's just kind of being off and
obviously you're looking to who your best rebounder is on
what side. So yeah, there is some precision to being
able to miss a free throw. I can't say that
I practiced it, but I definitely know how to aim
(16:16):
up there and get it to bounce on one side
or the other.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
Well, you did practice making them, though, you did a
really good job at that.
Speaker 6 (16:22):
I did.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
I did.
Speaker 6 (16:24):
I was pretty good at it.
Speaker 5 (16:25):
Yeah, but I never understood that.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
Explain to me what happens when guys go to the
free throw line and all of a sudden they they
free you know, they're it's not fluid. They like everything slows,
you know, it stops. Maybe that's what it is. Guys
you used to moving, all of a sudden it stops.
But the mind games that go on with these guys
who can't shoot free throws.
Speaker 6 (16:47):
Well, it's simpler when you think about golf. When you
stand to the tea box and they call your name
and they say where you're from, exactoly, and all of
a sudden they everybody's quiet. I was like, oh, keep
making noise. Uncomfortable in noise, you know, don't be quiet.
I think what people and I say this a lot
with free throws. People don't understand how emotional a free
(17:08):
throw is. You know, when you think about a guy
going to the free throw line, and emotions don't always
mean anger, but your your adrenaline is pumping. You just
got knocked on your butt. You know you're either down
to or you're up to. You just dunked on somebody.
All these emotions are inside of you, and for most players,
(17:29):
imagine a situation in practice where you practice those emotions.
It's hard to practice feeling competitive, to practice feeling angry,
to practice feeling anxious, practice feeling desperate. How do you
do that in the gym by yourself? And so you
have to figure out a way when you practice to
take that that quiet gym and make yourself tired, make
(17:53):
yourself mad, make yourself excited, because that feeling you have
to get used to in a game and a lot
of times then when they get into a game situation,
it's a foreign situation for them when they go to
that free to line. Because think about you take somebody
life like Prichard. You know, Gray Shooter had a great year,
but how often is he at the free throw line
(18:15):
in the fourth quarter if it's not Tatum or Brown?
So now he goes to free throw line because it
gets fout. Is Sometimes it's a foreign circumstance or situation
for a lot of players, and that's why you do
get nervous because it's like, I'm not used to this,
and I gotta get used to I gotta be better
at figuring out the situation.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
One thing that drives me crazy, and I'm sure I
drive my audience crazy because I bring it up all
the time. I never want the best player to beat me. Never,
I'm always going to send another guy. I got to
get the ball out of your hands. I want somebody
who's not used to taking that shot. And if that
guy beats me, I live with that. It's like, you know,
when Jordan beats Brian Russell, they don't send another guy,
(18:58):
and I got to get the ball out of his hands, right, Like,
I don't help me understand that. If Jalen Brunson has
the ball, I'm gonna double I'm gonna get the ball
out of his hands.
Speaker 5 (19:08):
I have to do that. But why don't more coaches
do that?
Speaker 6 (19:13):
Well? I think it's a double ast sword because when
you want you don't want the best player to beat you.
There's some scenarios, some playoff situations you kind of walk
into and you say, he's gonna get his forty, but
we can't let these other guys get off, you know.
So it is each situation from from series the series,
(19:36):
you know, what do you deal with? Like if you
look at Indiana, you got Nessmith that had twenty three,
and Turner had twenty three and nim Hard had thirteen.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
And this is the last shot. Though, this is the
last shot, that's all I'm talking about. Even Halliburton has
the ball, that's the guy I know who wants the ball.
I have to send another guy his way. I'm not
gonna let him beat me. And they gave him. You know,
he created space. It was a tough shot though, but
he know, but he's only he's got single coverage on it.
Speaker 6 (20:07):
Yeah. I mean it's always we can be perfect defensively
as a as a scheme, you know, going to the game,
but we always say good offense, better defense, or good
defense better offense. I'm sorry, We're playing a scheme a
certain way and then a guy makes a tough shot
over the top of us. We have to shake their
(20:28):
head because this league is fulled filled with great offensive players,
so they can, like I said, it can go either way.
You know, we'll run to at a guy because he
got hot. Saif a guy has forty plus, you know,
I don't know. Halliburton only had nineteen points last night,
so it wasn't like he was cooking.
Speaker 5 (20:45):
But he's a closer.
Speaker 6 (20:47):
Yeah, But you just kind of you live with those
odds because if you look at defenses and you look
at all these playoff games, the one thing that you
find fascinating is there's there's no paint presence. Last night.
I don't know who I don't remember. It was Draymond Green.
He came straight down the lane and dunked it, and
(21:07):
there was no awareness from Minnesota whatsoever. And that's the
one thing in playoff basketball that you kind of you know,
you fortify your defense with a paint presence and you
work from inside out. And you see that consistently because
you know so many teams are shooting threes. And then
you look at the ball, the way the ball bounced,
(21:28):
you know, against against with the Golden State, and you
see how many rebounds they got in Minnesota's the bigger team,
you know, you think about how many rebounds they didn't get.
Go Beart had eleven and I think Anthony had fourteen
or somewhere around there. But those balls are bounds a
so long, so spreading the defense out and then you're
trying to figure out what we tried to do. On
(21:50):
most teams I played on, we tried to keep our
big guy in the paint. You know, we rotated. We're
playing man the man, so it was myself and KG.
I tried to stay up time and he stayed low
so if somebody did drive, they had to see him.
And right now, you just don't see that that fortification
of the paint, and there's so many holes right now
in their defense. So that's ultimately a system where it's
(22:12):
built around team shooting threes.
Speaker 5 (22:14):
What's your favorite pair of shoes behind you?
Speaker 6 (22:17):
My favorite pair, I would have to go up. I'd
have to go up, one, two, three, four. If I
can show.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
You, Oh my goodness, you got a whole wall, this
one right here, okay, number four. So those are how
many of those are air Jordan's.
Speaker 6 (22:39):
They're one through thirty, one through thirty.
Speaker 5 (22:44):
You might sign any shoes that you have.
Speaker 6 (22:47):
No, you wouldn't ask him. I haven't, Like I have
a jersey and his hang on my wall and I
played golf with him regularly. I wouldn't ask them. But
I think at some point I should here in the future,
just just for keepsake, just having momentum. And I know
he would if I asked him. But but I thought
(23:10):
about it, but I haven't done it yet.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Okay, But if you have them in the back of
the golf cart and then you know Mike probably sees them,
and then you go, oh god, yeah, sorry, I thought
I was going to leave these in the car. Uh.
Speaker 5 (23:26):
And then you have a sharpie attached to it.
Speaker 6 (23:29):
Then all of a sudden, see that I'm a vet
right here.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
DP.
Speaker 6 (23:34):
That's like the rookie move to do that. If somebody
did that to me, I'd be looking. I'm like, really
really do Oh? You really left it with the sharpie
on the on taped up to it.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
Okay, what if you send somebody that you guys, guys
used to do this where you'd send the clubhouse guy
over to get something signed by somebody in the other
locker room.
Speaker 5 (23:56):
Right, okay, did that?
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Did it?
Speaker 6 (23:58):
I'll tell you a story. One time when I was
playing in Milwaukee. I was always early and the bus
wasn't there yet, so I took the cab over and
I'm sitting in the locker room. So our equipment manager
didn't get our gear out yet. So I'm sitting in
the locker room and I'm antsy trying to get on
the court. And you know, the United senter was always freezing,
so you wanted to come like bundled. So I'm sitting
(24:20):
there and the equipment guy from the Bulls comes to
the locker room. He goes, you guys didn't get here yet.
I said, no, they're not here. I'm just waiting on him.
He goes, Mike's on the other side. You know, he
has some stuff. Maybe you want to ask him. And
I was like really, and He's like, yeah, but you
got to ask him. You got to go in there
and ask him. And you know, this was I'm probably
like three years in the league, and I'm like, I asked,
go over there and ask I was like, can you
(24:41):
ask for me? He goes, no, you got to ask me.
And so I went in there and I was like, Mike,
you think I could borrow a pair of shoes And
I'm already wearing the shoes anyway, I'm under contract. And
He's like, sure, kid, you know. And in the hall,
I walked in the cabinet full of Jordan's just like
all the way down.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
There, all this.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
That was where are those shoes?
Speaker 6 (25:05):
I don't know, there's somewhere floating. I got so many
shoes like tucked everywhere.
Speaker 5 (25:09):
We brought this up yesterday.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
The Hall of very Good, like the guys that you
played against or with, like Jamal Crawford in the Hall
of very Good. Not a Hall of Famer, but you know,
a Hall of very good. Who would you put in there?
Maybe you played against you know contemporaries where you go,
that guy should be in the Hall of very Good.
Not a Hall of Famer, but Hall of very good.
Speaker 6 (25:31):
Did I played with. I would definitely say two players
that just you know, one in particular that would kill
the game today is Then Baker. Okay, he just he
was around the basket. I didn't think anybody could stop him,
and he still could shoot, you know, in the primer.
He would be really good in today's game. And obviously,
(25:55):
you know, these are two guys that I played with
my rookie year in Glenn Robinson and you know, arguably
one of the greatest college players of all time. And
I think they don't get their their uh their credit,
but they were incredible scores and and when I watched
then nobody could stop them, you know. So they were good.
And they just ended up not being on teams once
(26:16):
they left Milwaukeeople but they had any any symbolus of success.
But I thought they're incredible and and so you look
at the game today, we don't have those. You know,
you talk about those mid range players, those pick great
pick and role players. Uh think about Terrell Brandon. He
was dubbed best point guard in the World Sports illustrated
(26:37):
like this. He was he was split a pick and roll.
His mid range game, he was automatic, and I learned
a lot from him. You know, just playing with those
three guys helped my game tremendously. Uh. And we don't
have that that skill level right now in the NBA
because of the overuse of the three ball.
Speaker 2 (26:57):
Yeah, I still keep I can't get it out of
my mind. You're wearing Michael Jordan's shoes playing against Michael Jordan.
Speaker 6 (27:05):
Well, just remember my second game in the NBA. My
first game was Minnesota Timberwolves a preseason and the second
one and I seen the schedule. So I was still
in my college apartment when I got the schedule in
October fifteenth, nineteen ninety three, Chicago Bulls United Center, and
(27:25):
I'm sitting there. I still got poster him on my
wall right here in my room, and I'm like, I'm
about to play against Michael Jordan. So I'm wearing his
shoes on October fifteen. I'm stretching and then I hear
the whole introduction, and you know, I'm used to being
on the other side looking at the TV watching all
this stuff happen, and now I'm like, Wow, this is
(27:47):
so crazy. I'm inside the TV right now, and then
I'm sitting here on the ground stretching and I'm doing
this and I'm just kind of and I see the
bulls run out and he's the last one, and I said,
I couldn't believe it, you know, just as much as
I've watched him and kind of like study his game
and he was kind of he was such a big
(28:08):
role model. Then being on the same floor with him,
it was just unbelievable.
Speaker 5 (28:11):
Did he talk trash dude?
Speaker 6 (28:14):
No, But at jump Bald he walks over to me
and he said, welcome to the NBA. Ray, like, you
just don't understand, like this man he's you know, to
be great, you also have to be intelligent. You know,
you can't walk around and be oblivious to the things
around you. So he knows everybody who's playing against you,
(28:37):
study your opponents, you watch the draft. You know who's
young and come into the league. And so as us
young players, we're so naive to that idea. You start
to realize how much you have to immerse yourself in
this game and you have to know every player in
the league. You can't just think that Oh, I'm the
best player. I don't care about anybody. You really have
to study this game and who's in it. What's on
(28:58):
your shirt? Jesus shooting a jumper up side? That's not Jesus,
shuttles Worth, that's Jesus. But the play.
Speaker 5 (29:12):
I don't know about Jesus form though.
Speaker 6 (29:14):
Ray, Yeah, this one a we got. We'll work with him.
We'll give him a pass. We definitely will give him
a pass.
Speaker 5 (29:22):
Thank you, Ray, Good to talk to you again. That's right, Dylan.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app PK subin.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
He's a ESPN analyst and former defenseman played thirteen years
in the NHL.
Speaker 5 (29:41):
Great to have you on PK.
Speaker 2 (29:43):
What kind of uh mood do you think Toronto is
going to be in tonight when they face Florida.
Speaker 3 (29:51):
Well, they have to be in a pretty good mood.
Speaker 9 (29:54):
You know, you're up one nothing at home, still in
the home, playing in your building again, and you know
all that. You maybe didn't play your best game in
Game one. I think they had a great start, but
maybe not the best finish. So coming into game too,
they should feel pretty good about where they're at and
plan them full sixty minutes.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
But you had an incident where you know, your goalie
takes an elbow to the head, he's throwing up. They
take him on like you guys, you know, police your
own sport. Here, How does Toronto stay in the game
an important game while you still send the message to
maybe the most physical team in the NHL.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 9 (30:35):
And I think that the best way to send that
message is in between the whistles and shift by shift.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
This is gonna be a long series. He's gonna be
up and downs.
Speaker 9 (30:46):
As a player for the most part, leave the media
and all the quotes and all that stuff to the fans.
As a player, you got to stay focused on what
you need to do on the ice. And let's be
honest here, nobody knows that the symptoms that you know,
Anthony Stolar's was that we all witnessed on the bench,
we're from that hit.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
I think a lot of.
Speaker 9 (31:05):
People believe that maybe it was from something else, maybe
a sickness or from the prior shot do But that
all being said, no one should be speculating on what
the injury injury statuses of Anthony Stollars and Meg No
doubt about it based on the incident outside decreased or
just inside decrease. Rather, this was not a significant enough
(31:25):
play for this to be anything. This is just playoff
hockey and both coaches are doing what they need to
do to maintain the edge.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Explain to me we talk about goalies standing on their
heads like they're going to stop everything, but why is
it in that moment we have at least one goalie
every every playoff, a Stanley Cup final where you go,
I'll be damned like he's winning a series, winning a
Stanley Cup championship.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 9 (31:53):
And I feel like it's goaltending has become more and
more important every year.
Speaker 3 (31:57):
It's always been important, you know, playing hockey.
Speaker 9 (31:59):
It's the ultimate team sport, but we have an individual
position that can really dictate whether you are a competitive team,
a contending team, or you're not even calls. And without
a good goaltender, you're probably not getting too far in
the regular season, let alone the playoffs. So when it
comes to playoff times, we're seeing the best goaltenders you know,
on the most competitive teams going at it and you know,
(32:21):
we're seeing that every night. Now, what we're also seeing
is a lot of contact in decrease. A lot of
that is due because players are doing whatever they can
to disrupt any you know, any groove that the goaltender
might be in, any rhythm that he might be in.
You want to disrupt that by flash screens and getting
physical in the crease. Well, sometimes that boils over. You know,
(32:44):
Sam Bennett's going into the crease. Yeah, I know, he
says Anthony Stolars's buddy, but he's going in there.
Speaker 3 (32:50):
You know, if he makes contact. I mean, no one's
upset about that.
Speaker 9 (32:53):
And let's be real, if you hurt the number one goaltender,
you know, if a third or fourth line guy runs
And this is something that we got to talk about
it hockey, because all it takes is one player to say,
you know what, I'm going to go in there, and
you know, whatever happens happens. But you know, you lose
that player for a couple of games, that's one thing,
But losing a number one goaltender for the playoffs is another.
(33:13):
And you know I've been on that side. Right when
we lost Kerry Price against the Rangers in the Conference final,
that was the end of our run. So they're trying
to protect the goaltenders the best that they can. But
that play on the crease wasn't wasn't anything, The got gap,
wasn't anything too crazy.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
What's it like to fight somebody and then he turns
out to be your teammate at some point in your career.
Speaker 3 (33:36):
There's a lot in hockey. This is what makes our
sports so special.
Speaker 9 (33:39):
And you know, Brian Birch says the hockey fraternity is
the best fraternity in all of sports, and I believe him,
but it starts for that simple reason. We're the only
sport where you can fight a guy and the next
day literally be sitting at the bar having a beer
with them after playing a full sixty minutes and fighting
next to him. Right, So we're the only sport that
does that. It's about honor, It's all about your teammates
(34:04):
and team first and the willingness to do anything for
the team.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
That's that's what fighting really is in hockey.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
When do you start fighting in hockey? At what age
are is it acceptable?
Speaker 3 (34:16):
Well?
Speaker 9 (34:17):
I mean oftentimes now, because we're in the world of
social media, I get all these reels and these tweets
at me every day of like these little nine year
old kids having brawls on the ice some different parts,
and like, you know, this just happens in hockey. It
happens all the times, happens in all sports. But it's
funny to me when I see the little kids doing
it in hockey, you know, because they're watching everything on TV.
Speaker 3 (34:38):
But you know, I'll keep it real.
Speaker 9 (34:40):
People talk about our sport the.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Time, they don't talk about the respect in it. There's
a lot of respect in it.
Speaker 9 (34:47):
They talk about it a little bit, but you know,
not to the degree that they probably should. And the
level of respect in the game of hockey is I
think it's unmatched in any other sport because of the
physicality and the in our sport. And when you talk
about fighting, there's such a respect in regards to fighting
that if you do it the wrong way, you know
(35:08):
you're gonna have everybody, including your teammates, not happy with you.
So you know, that's the respect that fighting sort of garners.
When you drop the gloves, we all know it's something
that you have to be willing to do, and not
everybody's willing to do it. So I think for kids
it's not in the forefront for them. You know, we
stress skill and allent because you got to entertain at
(35:28):
the end of the day. This is sports entertainment. So
the fighting part, you know, is a part of the game,
but the entertainment goes way up right. The entertainment though,
has to meet the skill as well. So we got
to have a balance of both, and I think we
have that in the league. But fighting for me doesn't
really start. Doesn't really start until the kids are about
fourteen or fifteen, usually once you get to junior. And
(35:49):
even then it's like a choice. If you don't want
to fight, you don't have to.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
PK subin of the Mothership ESPN Analyst and second round
playoff action coming up tonight, doubleheader. It's the Maple Leafs
Panthers and then it'll be the Down the Stars Winnipeg Jets.
Playoff scoring is up again. I think this is I
think this might be the fifth consecutive year playoff scoring
is going up.
Speaker 5 (36:13):
Why is that?
Speaker 9 (36:16):
I think it's the style, style of play, the way
teams are built. Obviously, it's the way the game is
policed as well with officiating.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
You can't hook in a hold anymore.
Speaker 9 (36:25):
You can't clutch and grab, you can't cross check, you
can't do all those things as a defenseman, you know,
to impede players. You know, guys are also coming into
the league way more skilled. When I came into the league,
you knew that their third and fourth line probably weren't
scoring any goals. They could run around and hit. But
now you've got goal scorers and multi point guys on
(36:48):
the third and fourth line.
Speaker 3 (36:49):
I was just talking about this last night about Edmonton with.
Speaker 9 (36:52):
You know, Corey Perry scoring that beautiful goal in that
passing play with McDavid. But Corey Perry was a fifty
goal scorer in in the OHL like Cory Perry was
one hundred point guy. And uh, Cory Perry is a
former ending p a Stanley Cup Chiven playing on the
fourth line and up and down their lineup.
Speaker 3 (37:11):
You know.
Speaker 9 (37:11):
And when you look at the Detroit Red Wings back
in the day, Kirk Molty, you know, Darren McCarty party, uh,
you know, excuse me I'm missing another name here, but
you know they had Danny Cleary. They had a bunch
of guys that played those roles of third and fourth
line roles. When they got to the NHL, but we're
skill players in junior hockey. So I think there's a
(37:35):
lot of more talent in the league, a lot more skill.
You know, there's way more parody in the game, which
challenges teams. I think the star players have to do
a lot more every night, which is more difficult to
do so, and there's more teams now, so you have
more skill players.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
So I think there's no off nights now.
Speaker 9 (37:54):
You could circle your you know, calendar, and for the
games that were point nights, even in the playoffs, you
knew you're playing against teams that we're going to give
up a lot.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
Now, it's just difficult to do that.
Speaker 9 (38:04):
You got to play discipline game and you got to
have skilled players that can check both sides of the pupkin.
I think we're seeing the game and probably a ties
point in a long time.
Speaker 2 (38:13):
I'll let you start your team with Sid Crosby or
Alex Ovechkin.
Speaker 3 (38:19):
Sidney Crosby.
Speaker 9 (38:20):
First of all, I'll always take a Canadian player over
any Cutchy Canadian.
Speaker 3 (38:25):
This is our sport, folks.
Speaker 9 (38:27):
I know I worked for ESPN in America, but hockey
is our sport.
Speaker 3 (38:32):
So I'm always going to go with the Canadian.
Speaker 9 (38:33):
But you know, I'll say this about both Sydney Crosby
and Alex Novechkin. I mean, how lucky was the NHL
to have two ambassadors like that over the past two decades,
you know, And we're.
Speaker 3 (38:46):
Hoping to have them around a lot longer too. Neither
of them is slowing down and you.
Speaker 9 (38:51):
Can see the age, but the performance hasn't really dropped
that much, and there's such they're premier athletes, premiere professional
and most of all premier people the way they've represented
the games. So to have either or of those guys
would be a huge win. They're both champions, like I said,
great ambassadors, great teammates, But I'm going with Sydney Cosby.
(39:14):
To me, he's the best all around player in my generation.
He's a winner, he's a champion and once again, he's
got that Canadian maple syrup running through his fase.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
That's the X factor.
Speaker 5 (39:23):
Dan Utah has their nickname.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Is it the Mammoth?
Speaker 5 (39:29):
Did I see that? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (39:30):
The Mammoth?
Speaker 6 (39:31):
Yah?
Speaker 3 (39:31):
Okay, what do you think of that?
Speaker 5 (39:35):
I kind of like the Utah Hockey Club.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
You like the Utah Hockey Club? You don't? Me too?
Speaker 9 (39:41):
I did like it. I did like it just playing.
It was starting to grow on me, especially towards the end.
But you know, I will say to this Dan as
a fan, because I still consider myself a big sportsman.
That's why I do this now, is that I'm a
fan of sports. Is that the fan does love those logos.
They like having that logo, like the Chicago Black Box logo.
Speaker 5 (40:04):
To have that, that's the best logo.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
That's the best logo in sports.
Speaker 9 (40:09):
It is, it is, And I think for Utah, they
want the opportunity to create something, to create something iconic.
So I understand having a proper name and a proper logo.
I get that, but I share that with you, dude.
I'm the same way I loved Utah Hockey Club. I
love the simplicity of it.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
I did.
Speaker 2 (40:28):
In basketball, you guard guys, you know, guys with Guarden,
Michael or Larry or Kobe, And in hockey we don't
really kind of single out. It's a one on one
match up there. It's it's like us against them. But
how often do you have those one on one mode
like you know with Ovechkin, how often did you have
a one on one where it's like, uh, you know,
(40:51):
this might not end well.
Speaker 9 (40:53):
Oh my god, it's such a great question. Hockey is
a sport of one on one battles. It's all about
one on one battle. If you watch the game of hockey,
it's one on one battles all over the ice.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
It's a one it's it's.
Speaker 9 (41:09):
A team sport, but you have to beat the guy
across the line from you.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
So when we line up for that base off, there's
the sentiment he's got to be better than the sentiment.
Speaker 9 (41:19):
The wingers got to be better than the wingers, and
the D got to be better than the D.
Speaker 3 (41:22):
And I know who's on the other side.
Speaker 9 (41:24):
I know when I'm playing Eric Carlton, Drew Dowdy, Cale mccarr,
Victory Headmand.
Speaker 3 (41:29):
My job is to do those guys. So it's individual.
Speaker 9 (41:32):
This is competition, it's pro sports, so it's very.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
Much one on one and that's what we want. We
want our athletes to take it on.
Speaker 9 (41:41):
And part of my responsibility as the next player now
being on the broadcast, is to bring those battles to
the forefront for the audience and people watching to see
and participate in, because you don't have an opportunity to
hear what the players are saying on the ice all
the time, or on.
Speaker 3 (41:56):
The court or on the field.
Speaker 9 (41:57):
You don't always have the opportunity to know that there's
bad blood or that these players have a history. So
it's our job as the analyst and the talent on
air to paint that picture of the story. And last
night we got a good glimpse of Big David and
Jack Piper going back and forth. But in my time,
it was you know, even when I came into the league,
(42:17):
it was more rich than that. And I think that
hockey is now starting to take ownership of those one
on one battles. We saw it at the Four Nations between
Brendan Hagel and Matthew Kachuk, and we want to continue
to build on those storylines and I think the players
are buying into it and it's really helping our game.
Speaker 2 (42:34):
Is there anybody you could see that you might still
want a piece of, like just in regular life.
Speaker 9 (42:43):
That's a great, great question. Let me see which guy
would I want a piece of? You know, And I
don't hate It's not that I hate them at all.
I love them, But I'm going to tell you why
I would want a piece of them. And I don't
even know if I'd do anything if I had a chance.
But let's just say I had a chance, it probably
be Chris Proudle, because you know, my best chance to
win the Stanley Cup with Montreal was a conference final
(43:07):
when he collided with Carriy Price. So you know, I
mean every Montreal Canadians man and every player on that
team shares that same view with me. You know, Chrystal
maintains that it was an accident, and I believe him.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
You're at Starbucks and he's in line at Starbucks and
you see him, would.
Speaker 5 (43:26):
You you wouldn't cross, You would not.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
No, I wouldn't cross second.
Speaker 9 (43:30):
No, no, And I I feel even that throwing them
into the mix like that, But no, I wouldn't because
you know, it's no one's bigger than the game, even me.
And even though that may have been my best chance
to win a Stanley Cup. Uh, there's a lot of
guys out there who dream about winning the Stanley Cup.
And there's a lot of guys who have before me
(43:52):
and didn't get a chance to win one. So you know,
I would never take I never take myself too seriously
when it comes to other people. It's out the game,
So maybe I'd throw a little loumbow, like a Messia
elbow to the ribs and something like that.
Speaker 3 (44:05):
Maybe I hit him with one of.
Speaker 5 (44:06):
Those Messier looks like he could still play.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
Oh, I mean, uh, don't take this the wrong way.
Speaker 9 (44:15):
I mean, he is my teammate and I work with him,
so I'm gonna pump his tires on air. But he
could probably be on the front cover of GQ as well.
He's a good looking guy. I haven't met a woman
yet who hasn't asked me about Mark Messier and what
his whole what his whole treatment regime is, and how
he keeps his skin so nice and all that time.
I'm like, guys, I'm thirty five, what about me? Like,
you know, black, don't crack, Come on, give me a break.
(44:38):
Mess has taken all my shine. But no, he he
takes He takes really really good care of himself.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
And you know, he's a happy guy.
Speaker 9 (44:46):
You know, I also believe this as time goes on,
if you're a happy person, it shows in your energy.
And you know, I love There's nothing better than I
love to do at work. It's a super Bowl if
I get a laugh out of mess because he's got
that big grin and that big laugh. It's just fun
to see him laugh. So no, he takes good care
of him.
Speaker 3 (45:04):
Somebody. He does look like he can play.
Speaker 9 (45:05):
I went on the ice with him in La for
that charity to raise money for the fires, and I
told him right a wait, like his presence on the
ice now, I know why they call him moose. I
know why they call him the moose now because he's
just so big and he could just feel his presence
and it was pretty cool to touch the ice with
him in La.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
Great to talk to you. I hope you're doing well.
Thanks for joining us.
Speaker 3 (45:28):
Thanks Dan, hope to come back on soon. Man, Thank you,
thanks for having me.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
PK Subin
Hosts And Creators
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Dan Patrick
Patrick "Seton" O'Connor
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