October 1, 2025 • 39 mins
The Athletic WNBA reporter Ben Pickman unpacks Napheesa Collier's fiery comments about league leadership and sees it as a seminal moment in the league's history. NFL on FOX analyst Mark Schlereth is fired up about ties in football and weighs in on the recent Eagles drama. MLB Network analyst Sean Casey says playoff energy is unlike anything else and reminisces on facing a young Clayton Kershaw's curveball.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio. Let me bring in Ben Pickman.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
He is covering the situation WNBA reporter for The Athletic.
Before I get to you, Ben, I want to play
Nofisia Callier had. Now, this is just a portion of
what she had to say about the WNBA commissioner, Kathy
Engelbert at.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Unrivaled this past February. I sat a across from Kathy
and asked how she planned to address the officiating issues
in our league. Her response was, will only the losers
complain about the refs? I also asked how she planned
to fix the fact that players like Caitlin Angel and Page,
who are clearly driving massive revenue for the league, are
making so little for their first four years. Her response was,
(00:44):
Caitlyn should be grateful she makes sixty million off the court,
because without the platform that the WBA gives her, she
wouldn't make anything. And in that same conversation, she told
me players should be on their knees thanking their lucky
stars for the media.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
Righte steal that I got them?
Speaker 5 (00:59):
Well, well, well, Ben pick it up from there.
Speaker 6 (01:03):
Yeah, you could have picked any number of sound bites
I mean, think about any other player in any other
sport doing what Nefisa Collier did. I mean, this is
a potentially seminal moment in WNBA history. I just want
to know how your production crew Dan decided on those
clips and not the clip of you know, Nafisa Collier's
saying that right now, the WNBA has the worst leadership
(01:24):
in the world. I mean, this was four minutes of
just going scorched earth and frankly telling a lot of
things that seemingly a lot of players, a lot of executives,
a lot of people around the league team wise.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
Tend to agree with. Do you agree with her?
Speaker 6 (01:37):
I mean, I think there's certainly a lot of valid
criticism in what she said. I'm not going to go
so far to say that Kathy Engelbert is part of
the worst leadership in the world, but I think a
lot of what she said is a lot of what
you know, someone like me here is in private. I mean,
my phone was blowing up Tuesday from you know, the
moment that Nafisa Collier's comments finished, with a lot of
people really commending her for saying the quiet part out loud,
(02:01):
and I Fisakllier did say this in her own comments
that you know, I'm not going to keep things private anymore.
She's calling for accountability, transparency, not just on officiating but
on broader league wide matters too.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
But they have added five teams. I mean, you know
that let's look at both sides here, because the commissioner
has done some good things, but this is negotiations and
that's where it's a war, and this is one of
the most This might be the most important moment in
WNBA history as we move forward.
Speaker 6 (02:31):
Yeah, it's important to call that out because since Kathy
Engelbert has been the commissioner, it's around six years now.
At this point, a lot has changed in the WNBA.
I mean, Kathy Engelbert used to say that the WNBA
was in an existential moment.
Speaker 5 (02:44):
That was the word that she used.
Speaker 6 (02:46):
In twenty twenty there was a potential that if they
didn't play a bubble season, would the league even exist?
And so a lot has changed since then. Just look
at recent years. A fifty million dollar expansion fee for
the Golden State Valkyries in Septembumber twenty twenty three, that
was two fifty million this summer. I mean, that is
crazy growth. The New York Liberty a four hundred and
(03:07):
fifty million dollar valuation this summer. That is all under
Kathy Engelbert's watch. But what Nafisa Kalier is also saying
is the players are really driving that. I mean, that
is what we heard or what you can hear when
she retells that story involving Caitlyn Clark, Like that is
a clear story of hitting the players against management. And yes,
(03:27):
this is a really intense negotiation. And you know these
comments are not going to do anything to put less
fuel on the fire of anything. It's going to explode
from here on out.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Caitlin Clark's WNBA salary was seventy eight thousand. Yeah, so
it's slotted that she's going to make seventy eight thousand. Yes,
she makes all that money off the court. But should
Caitlin Clark be grateful that she makes sixteen million dollars
off the court? According to the commissioner through Nafisia Collier, Yeah.
Speaker 6 (03:56):
I mean we should say. The commissioner said she was
disheartened by the characterization of those comments, and this was
an a Fisa Collier relaying them. But I mean, think
about that kind of tactical move or that decision to
include Caitlin Clark in this conversation, and we should say
Nefisa Callier and Kitlin Clark they shared the same agent, right,
So I don't think it's a coincidence that both of
those players, or that Caitlin Clark's name rather was mentioned
(04:19):
in this four and a half minute statement by Nafisa Kalier,
like there is a knowledge know how going on there.
Caitlin Clark obviously super super important to the league. And
one of the questions that you know, I was fielding
yesterday was yes, Kathy Engelbert is you know, has been
the commissioner over this period of growth. But if you
look at the next fifteen years of the league, Dan,
(04:39):
who is more important to the health the growth of
the league? Kathy Engelbert if she's around that long, or
Kitlyn Clark. I think the answer there is is pretty clear.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Well, does Caitlin Clark need the WNBA more than the
WNBA needs Caitlyn Clark.
Speaker 6 (04:52):
I mean that is another big question. I feel like
you could write books and articles and fund articles. Certainly
Caitlin Clark is worth you know, millions, if not. You know,
I did a story earlier this season, she could be
worked up to a billion dollars. Some people told me
two women's sports more generally, and so yeah, I mean,
Caitlin Clark's certainly a big driver in the broader WNBA
(05:14):
revenue conversation, the change of the business right.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
And the commissioner responded, I'm not going to read the
whole statement, but she was complimentary to Nofisia Collier, who's
a very bright woman. You know, started the unrivaled league.
It's a side league, not a competing league. But where
does this go from here?
Speaker 5 (05:32):
Where does it go? That is a great question.
Speaker 6 (05:34):
I mean, as you mentioned, the league and the players
are in this contentious CBA negotiation. The deal currently expires
October thirty. First, we'll see if they reach an extension
or if you know, there is a work stoppage, whether
it is just in the off season or down the line.
May twenty twenty six is when the twenty twenty sixth
season would begin, So we will see where things go.
(05:56):
I think the tensions have only heightened from here on that.
How could they not knowing that a FISA klier said
what she said, knowing that so many players have supported her,
knowing that now there's so many more eyeballs on the
WNBA and what is going on because of her comments
like that is what is so fascinating about this really remarkable,
remarkable for a minute statement than a FISA Collier gave
(06:16):
on Tuesday.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
There's only a certain piece of the pie available here,
Ben that I know. We look at leagues and we
go they should be paid more. Well, this it comes
down to math. It's just it's that amount of money
that's available. We split it up and that's what everybody
is going to share it. Now you're adding five new franchises,
so now that piece of the pie gets carved up
(06:39):
a little bit more. And they did sign what eleven year,
two billion dollar, two point two billion dollar TV deal.
There's a lot of progress here. I'm just I worry.
I thought that they tripped themselves up with the Caitlin
Clark situation. Nobody knew how to deal with her. Officials
didn't be, you know, the opposite position other players.
Speaker 5 (07:01):
They weren't all in on her.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Hey, we've got Diana Tarazzi and all the people who
started the league. I still don't know if they know
how to handle Caitlin Clark moving forward, because she is
different than anybody else in the sport.
Speaker 6 (07:17):
Yeah, I mean, she definitely is. But I want to
go back to your point on splitting the pie because
I think it's really important here because what makes the
WNBA so unique in this context is that also it
is owned by the NBA that Kathy Engelbert reports up
to Adam Silver, Right, So there are other stakeholders here
other than just WNBA owners who are important in this conversation.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
Right.
Speaker 6 (07:40):
So it's not just what do the owners of the
WNBA think, because even that phrase owners of the WNBA
is a really muddled phrase.
Speaker 7 (07:49):
Right.
Speaker 6 (07:49):
You have a number of franchises that are owned by
the same people that also own NBA teams. Forty two
percent of the league is owned by the NBA, for instance,
forty two percent is owned by WNBA owners. But in
that forty two percent, well, there's some people who are
in both pots here, right, and then there is another
pot of sixteen that also includes some people who are
in both of those other pots. That is what makes
(08:10):
the WNBA's situation about how to proceed, whether it relates
to Kathy Engelbert and her job status, whether it relates
to the CBA. That's part of what makes it so tricky,
so unique is there are so many stakeholders in this
conversation that the league is in a really tough spot,
and that's why we're in this very complicated mess that
(08:31):
we are in.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
ESPN reported over the weekend that WNBA data doesn't show
a correlation between recent playoff injuries and missed calls by officials.
Nafisia Collier, one of the great players in the game,
called the claim quote an insult to my intelligence, honestly.
Caller also asked the commissioner about how the league planned
(08:52):
to address officiating, and according to Collier, the commissioner said,
only the losers complain about the reps.
Speaker 7 (09:02):
Also strong, Yeah, that's wrong.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Yes, but not correct because some of the biggest complainers
in the history of the NBA, or Michael Jordan and
Larry Bird and great players complain about officiating as well,
not losers.
Speaker 5 (09:17):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 6 (09:18):
And I think one of the things that is so
interesting or that everyone is tracking is these claims or
these calls about officiating.
Speaker 5 (09:25):
They're not new, right.
Speaker 6 (09:26):
I wrote a story two years ago at the start
of the WNBA Finals all about coaches and executives and
players talking about inconsistent officiating, and going back to that
point that I was just making on NBA and WNBA ownership,
Several people around the league, coaches, executives, they point to
high yearly turnover that multiple WNB officials move out of
the league and into the NBA literally from twenty eighteen
(09:49):
to twenty twenty two. In NBA official press releases, they
would use the word promotes as it relates to people
moving from the WNBA, that is officials, to the NBA. Right,
and so there are questions again systemic questions about how
much are officials paid, how are they trained, how are
they reviewed?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
But is it slanted ben they are they calling different?
Are they seeing something different for certain players and not others?
Are they just not great at their jobs?
Speaker 6 (10:18):
I mean it's hard for me, the layperson to say,
you know, how correct or incorrect is an official's assessment
of it.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
But they do grade them. They get graded, just like
NBA officials. I don't know if they're not calling enough
for Kaitlyn Clark or they're calling too much for it,
does she get preferential? I mean it feels like everything
circles back to Caitlin Clark.
Speaker 6 (10:38):
I mean I think actually on this officiating conversation though, Dan, like,
this is a conversation that has been going on for
a number of years. I think Caitlyn Clark, like so
many other topics, her presence in the league has brought
more eyeballs to the topic of officiating. But you talk
to people like, these frustrations are frustrations that have been
held for a number of years the league. As you're
saying and you're asking, they're saying that, you know, our
(11:01):
officials are excellent, that they gray out incredibly well, that
we don't have the same kind of problem that so
many people say. But what Nafisa Collier and what others
have said is, you know, the first step in what
fixing a problem is acknowledging you have a problem in
the first place. Like that was another, you know, clear
sentiment that she tried to voice throughout her opening statement
at her exit interview.
Speaker 5 (11:22):
Great stuff, Ben, thanks for joining us, we'll be reading.
Speaker 6 (11:25):
Thanks at for having me.
Speaker 5 (11:26):
That's Ben Pickman, wmba reporter for The Athletic.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 8 (11:40):
Hey, this is Jason McIntyre. Join me every weekday morning
on my podcast, Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. This isn't
your typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down
your throat every day. Straight Fire gives you honest opinions
on all the biggest sports headlines, accurate stats to help
you win big at the sportsbook, and all the best guests.
(12:00):
Do yourself a favor and listen to Straight Fire with
Jason McIntyre on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever
you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Mark Schlereth, NFL and Fox analyst. He won three Super
Bowls with the Broncos and he called the Patriots Panthers
game in Week four and guess what as a reward
he gets the Dolphins in the Panthers coming up this
weekend at one o'clock Sunday on Fox.
Speaker 5 (12:30):
Mark joins us on the program.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
You know you've gotten to that grumpy old man age
where you can say what you want to. So here's
your platform. What's the topic today that is really bothering you.
Speaker 7 (12:44):
Overtime? Like listen to fans. You guys did it?
Speaker 9 (12:48):
You guys asked for this, right forty to forty game,
we don't get a winner, we don't get a victory.
Speaker 7 (12:53):
We don't get victory. What was wrong with sudden death?
There was nothing wrong with sudden debts, sudden depth. It's
it's sudden and it's death. You're over.
Speaker 9 (13:02):
Like that makes sense to me. Playing to a forty
to forty tie makes zero sense to me. And by
the way, I've sat in a bunch of meetings twelve
years I played this league.
Speaker 7 (13:11):
I sat in meetings, I heard it every week. Hey,
it's three things of the game.
Speaker 9 (13:14):
It's special teams, it's offense, and it's defense. Your defense
had an opportunity to stop the opponent's quarterback. But no,
you know what happened. Josh Allen didn't get the ball.
And that's not fair and we want to be fair.
And it's not fair. Like did your parenting your parents?
Did they ever parent you? Did they ever say to you, hey, man,
(13:36):
life ain't fair. Did you not get parented?
Speaker 7 (13:39):
And now this is what we have to live with ties.
I hate it, Dan, and I hate it.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Okay, if you're in a game and you get to
overtime and you lose in sudden death, like would you
are you better at accepting a loss in sudden death
overtime than a tie in overtime.
Speaker 9 (13:59):
I'm good with whatever, because we had sixty minutes to
win this football game, and we didn't get it done
in sixty minutes. And I'll deal with the consequences of that.
I just I hate playing an extra ten minutes and
then nothing is sold, nothing is satisfied to me, and
then so I just it just bothers me. The whole
thing bothers me. And the thing that bothers me is
(14:22):
the way the NFL operates. Right, we listen to a
bunch of people whine about things right and so and then,
and most of the people that whind don't even like
the game, Like why do we as a league, why
do we basically cowtow to people who.
Speaker 7 (14:39):
Don't even like our game? Screw them.
Speaker 9 (14:41):
It's the greatest game in the world. If you don't
like it, tough, I don't care. So that part of
that part, to me, I don't understand. I mean, I
guess I understand it. You're trying to get more and
more people involved in the game, and I get that
part of it, but I just I don't like to
make excuses for it. And I don't like people who
don't like our game, who complained about it that we
(15:03):
try to satisfy.
Speaker 7 (15:04):
I like, screw those people.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Are you more bothered by overtime or the Broncos uniforms
that they trotted out on Monday Night?
Speaker 9 (15:13):
I like, hey, man, I'm old school, Like I liked
Pat Patriot, Like did you see the Patriots in the
game against Pittsburgh, you know, with the old pat Patriot
on the helmet and that I think.
Speaker 7 (15:23):
I love that.
Speaker 9 (15:24):
I love the old school. I wish they'd go back
to that Bronco uniform would.
Speaker 7 (15:28):
Be you know, the horse breathing fire out of snows, Like.
Speaker 9 (15:31):
I wish they would go back to all that stuff
because I think those uniforms are just absolutely classic.
Speaker 7 (15:37):
They're awesome. And yeah, they all blues.
Speaker 9 (15:40):
I could do without the all blues, but I hate
it mostly because when we went to all blues when
I played for the Broncos. One, the pants for whatever reason,
the pants were super tight, Like I didn't like that.
And two two you look like a upa lumpa like
you just look like a big, giantly blueberry, and.
Speaker 7 (16:01):
Uh, I was concientious. Hey, I looked at my other
offensive liga. Does this uniform make me look sad?
Speaker 9 (16:07):
You know.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
We're talking to Mark Schlareth. You will find him an
NFL Fox analyst. Panthers Patriots Week four and now you've
got the Dolphins and the Panthers.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
Wow.
Speaker 9 (16:21):
Turns it turns out that I am the official broadcaster
of the NFC South. I don't know who's cheery as
I pissed in to get the Panthers every weekend.
Speaker 5 (16:30):
They are, Uh they are.
Speaker 9 (16:31):
Don't tell anybody I said that they are a bad
football team.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Okay, I saw this headline and I knew you were
going to call the game. H Bryce Young is not
a bust? The Panthers are?
Speaker 5 (16:44):
Is that? Is that a fair headline?
Speaker 7 (16:48):
Well? I think so. You know we put up in
the broadcast end of the day.
Speaker 9 (16:50):
I mean they had both Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold
in their organization and said see you and you know what,
you get some good coaching. Sam Donald actually turns down
this is Sam Donald's a great story, because Sam, they're
both great stories. Sam Donald turns down other opportunities to
potentially go in and be a starter, and he decides,
(17:13):
I'm going to go to San Francisco and get coached
by Kyle Shanahan and.
Speaker 7 (17:17):
Learn how to play NFL football. That's what happened.
Speaker 9 (17:19):
And then he goes to Minnesota and Kyle Shannan told
me he goes. Listen, he gets to the Jets, right,
bad organization gets to the Jets and they try to
put him in the Peyton Manning offense. He goes, there's
one guy they can run the Peyton Manning offense. That's
Peyton Manning, right, So he fails there. Then he goes
to Matt Rule in the Carolina Panthers and they're running
some college So the first time that this guy has
(17:41):
ever gotten into a true progression offense in reality is
in San Francisco, and so he learned basically NFL football.
He's year four in the league and at one point,
Baker Mayfield, we put a picture of a couple of
a different broadcasts at Tampa broadcast I did last year
where he is actually a scout team defensive end for
(18:02):
the Carolina Panthers and they didn't like they cut him.
And then he signs on in with the Rams and
plays there for a few weeks as that. I think
it was a Christmas Day game against the Broncos where
he hangs fifty on them after being in the facility
for three days, and and you know he goes on
to play great football.
Speaker 7 (18:19):
So I don't know what Bryce Young is yet.
Speaker 9 (18:22):
I think he's I mean, he's small, he's diminutive, but
you know he gonna operate an offense. And I've seen
growth because I'm because i'm the official broadcast of the
Carolina Panthers, I've seen some growth.
Speaker 7 (18:34):
But but Dan, like I think.
Speaker 9 (18:37):
The wide receivers, I think wide receivers are a completely
dependent position.
Speaker 7 (18:41):
They're they're like children.
Speaker 9 (18:42):
One they're dependent, right, ten other guys had to do
their job for them to sniff a football, and then
you know they're they're like toddlers. They whine and they
cry and they bitch a lot if they don't get fed.
Speaker 7 (18:53):
Like that's who wide receivers are. They're just like toddlers.
Speaker 9 (18:56):
And so ultimately, ultimately, there is not very much talent
on this football team. And so if you're a great quarterback,
you take you know, fair to midland wide receivers and
you can create a great offense around that.
Speaker 7 (19:13):
If you're a.
Speaker 9 (19:14):
Quarterback trying to figure it out, you've got to surround
that guy with some opportunity, some people who can actually
excel get opening one on one and going into last week,
Tedoro McMillan had two hundred and sixteen yards receiving. All
the other wide receivers combined had a one hundred and
forty one through three games. It's just they just don't
I mean, they're just not very good that way, that
(19:34):
talent wise. So again, I just don't know. Do I
think he's a franchise quarterback. No, But do I think
you can win with Bryce Young if you put enough
people around him, in pieces around him, I think you
probably could help me understand the Eagles situation.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
It feels like every week there's something. Every week there's something.
You know, we started out with spitgate with Jalen Carter
to start the year. Now you know, you got aj
Brown with a cryptic tweet that he puts out and
then I mean, they don't throw the ball a lot,
but if they when they do throw it, I think
he's targeted a little over thirty percent of the time.
(20:10):
So they're good numbers. You're winning, you're undefeated, you won
the Super Bowl. Help me understand the Philadelphia Eagles.
Speaker 7 (20:20):
I can't. I don't understand. I don't come from that world.
Speaker 9 (20:25):
I don't come from that world where I'm not getting
enough shine.
Speaker 7 (20:28):
So I'm upset.
Speaker 9 (20:30):
I come from the offensive line world, the world of
offensive line, and that's a you know, we're a secret
mushroom society.
Speaker 7 (20:36):
Nobody knows what the hell we're doing. And if we
have a great game, we're just to throw away tagline.
Speaker 9 (20:42):
You know, I mean, a guy who rushes for two
hundred yards, you got to think the big fellow's up front.
Now let's talk about me. It was awesome, you know.
I mean, that's that's the way it works, right. You
give up, man, I can whip your ass sixty five
plays in a row. Dan, I give up one sack.
I'm a piece of garbage and you go to the
Pro Bowl. That's the world I come from. And so
I don't underst and this world of we're winning, but
(21:02):
I'm not getting to touch the ball enough. So I'm
going to pout or send cryptic tweets or be upset
that world. I don't understand that world. And I mean, ultimately,
it is about winning. And I know that you want
to compete, and I know that you want you know,
you want to win but you know, it's amazing what
you can do as an organization, whether it's football or
(21:24):
any organization, it's amazing what you can accomplish when no
one cares who gets the credit. And that's the world
I come from. So it's probably why I hate wide
receivers with the white hot intensity of a thousand suns.
Speaker 7 (21:38):
So it's you.
Speaker 9 (21:40):
I'm probably not the right guy to ask because I
just think. I just think it's selfish and it bothers me,
and you know, and I'm.
Speaker 7 (21:48):
Grumpy and I've got on black sox. So that's where
I live right now.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
How frustrating was it or is it for an offensive
lineman to do your job for a couple of seconds
and then all of a sudden you turn around and
your quarterbacks trying to make something happen, and then you
guys are going to get blamed for a sack?
Speaker 7 (22:08):
Yeah, well I will.
Speaker 9 (22:10):
I will tell you that sacks are more of a
quarterback driven and a coaching driven statistic than they are
on offensive line static in today's NFL with all the
I mean, we didn't even have a bubble screen when
I was playing that that didn't even exist. And you know,
and you throw it behind line of scrimmage and out
to the sidelines so much, and there's so much quick game.
(22:31):
You really if you boil it down, Dan, you say,
hey man, we throw it thirty five times. You boil
it down thirty five times, you've got five. Let's call it.
I'm just gonna make the math easy because I'm not
that smart. We're gonna go five quick balls, like five
three step drops, right, So now you're down to thirty. Right,
We're gonna do five kind of bubble screens. So now
(22:51):
I'm down to twenty five. We're gonna do five, you know,
swing passes out to the running backs, all right, So
now I'm down to to twenty. Now we're going to
do a five to five step drop, but five step
drop with no hitch. So it's the ball is out
right now. Now I'm down to fifteen, you know, and
so I look at that. How about the boot keep
(23:11):
play action game. We're gonna do five of those, right,
So now I'm down.
Speaker 7 (23:15):
To let's let's call it. I'll whittle it down, you know,
give or take a few.
Speaker 9 (23:19):
I'll whittle it down to twelve plays where you actually
have to protect twelve plays, and so ultimately you got
to get the ball out of your hand. That's the
way the game is designed. And I was talking to
Byron left which when Tom Brady was playing for the
Dam Bay Buccaneers, and I said, what has been the
most amazing thing about Tom? He said, Hey, listen, if
(23:40):
I call curl flat, which is the first day, like
first day operation curl flat, everybody name league runs curl flat.
And your first read is the flat like it's just
you know, a backron tight end that's in the flat, right,
whatever it is, and that flat is open, and that's
the first read in the progression. Tom will take it
one hundred out of one hundred times, never get taking
(24:00):
the profit, and it'll put us in second down and
six minus and then the entirety of the offense is open.
We're on schedule. You hear people say that all the time.
On schedule, there are some quarterbacks that don't want to
throw it. Let me see what I can get at hey,
let me see if I can get something better. Let
me see if I can get something better. You got
to fall in love with Bory. And that's why guys
who scramble around. Most guys who scramble around don't win.
(24:23):
Championships because you gotta be you can't like ultimately, Like
I look at Kyler Murray and do you want to
win football games? Or do you want to make Sports
Center highlights? Like that was? That was what I would ask, like,
because I want to I want to win football games.
Speaker 7 (24:41):
And the way you win is staying out a third
down and long.
Speaker 9 (24:44):
And the way you stay at a third down long
is you have success on first and second down.
Speaker 7 (24:48):
And so if somebody is going to give me a gift,
somebody's going to give me.
Speaker 9 (24:53):
A five yard quick out and I pass it by
because I want something.
Speaker 7 (24:58):
Better, or I want to make a highlight play. What's
selfish football? Because it's second down and five, I can
do anything. Everything is open to me. Second down and ten.
I'm predictable. Nothing is open to you. I have aired
down my playbook by you know, eighty percent. Whatever it is.
Speaker 5 (25:18):
Stay grumpy, Okay.
Speaker 7 (25:24):
I'm gonna get a T shirt.
Speaker 5 (25:25):
Stay grumpy, stay grumpy. Good to talk to you, buddy,
Thank you.
Speaker 7 (25:28):
Likewise, be good, buddy.
Speaker 5 (25:30):
Mark Slera.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at foxsports radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app search FSR to
listen live.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
We bring in Sean CASEYMLB Network analyst. You can see
him throughout the postseason on MLB Network the studio shows
also MLB Tonight and his Mayor's Office podcast, Great to
See You Again. How much of the game comes down
to a gut feeling as a post to the analytics,
because it feels like you can lean on analytics and
(26:05):
blame analytics, but when it's a gut feeling, it's on you.
Speaker 10 (26:09):
Yeah, what's up, Danny? Yeah, I think there's definitely something
to that, you know. I think we go back to,
you know a few years ago when when Snell was
cruising along for the Rays and then Cash comes and
gets them because that's what the analytics saying.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
I think that was the first time we were all like,
oh man, where's the gut feel here?
Speaker 10 (26:29):
Of kind of watching what you're seeing and going with that.
I think the managers that are that are in these games,
you know, are allowed to go on gut fields. And
you heard Aaron Boone say, I think that was a
gut feel for him. He felt like there was some
traffic on the bases with Freed in four five and six,
and he felt like, you know that that was the
right time he was going to go to the pen
there anyhow, So I feel like that was kind of
(26:51):
a gut feel from Boone as opposed to the analytics.
But you know, Danny being in these meetings, you know,
being back in the clubhouse in twenty twenty three with
the Yankees and seeing these meetings of how hey, if
this matchup comes up, the analytics say here, uh, you
know those are on the table. But I do think
as a manager in the postseason, the gut feel is
part of it, and you know it has.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
To come and play.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Managing differently in the postseason, do you do you manage
differently or is that let's fight the urge to manage differently.
Speaker 10 (27:23):
Well, I think I think there's a little bit of
managing differently in the postseason on a few fronts because
you know there is no tomorrow sometimes, you know, especially
some in these wildcard series too, like what is it
ninety percent of the teams that have won Game one
have gone on to.
Speaker 4 (27:38):
Win the Wildcard series.
Speaker 10 (27:40):
So I think that you know, if a pitcher's in
trouble early, you can't do what you might have done
in the in the regular season to save the bullpen.
You gotta you gotta get them out. You got to
get to the pen sooner. I think you're going to
see more bunts and strategies in the postseason of get
the you know, getting the bunt down, putting pressure on
getting the guy over. Uh So, I think I think
you do have to manage a little differently in the
(28:01):
postseason because the stakes are a lot higher.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
Of the four teams that lost yesterday, which one has
the best chance to win their series?
Speaker 4 (28:12):
I still think the Yankees have a great shot to
win that series.
Speaker 10 (28:14):
I really, I really believe that, you know, I think
they you know, when you run into Crochet and Chapman,
you know, for seven and two thirds and then one
and a third, I mean, that is a that's a
tall order. They hadn't they had Chapman on the ropes
too in the ninth couldn't figure it out with basis loaded,
no outs. But you know, that's a taller in Game one.
I really feel like the Yankees have a really good team.
(28:34):
I think they still have a chance to win that series.
Speaker 5 (28:37):
What do you remember about your first playoff game?
Speaker 10 (28:40):
Wow, you know what's a good This is a great,
This is a great point. I was just I was
just saying this last week on on MLB Network. My
first real kind of playoff game was Game one sixty
three with the Reds and the and the and the Mets.
When we had the playing game the playoff atmosphere. Was
the first time I ever felt that, and I rememberer
(29:01):
Danny like it was an adrenaline and energy I'd never felt.
I'm twenty five year old kid, and I remember thinking,
I'm gonna go win this game tonight. I'm gonna go
I'm gonna really go go take this game. Right, I'm
I'm you know, it's the kind of that football mentality
which doesn't work in baseball. I end up going zero
for four, two punchouts, one of the worst games.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
Of my life.
Speaker 10 (29:19):
Right, And I remember thinking to myself, you know, and
as in the game of baseball and in life, failures, feedback, failures, information,
I was like, man, how do I take the failure
I got here?
Speaker 4 (29:30):
Get me back to the postseason to experience it.
Speaker 10 (29:32):
And when I finally went back to the postseason in
six when I was with the Tigers and I you know,
led the post, led all hitters and hitting and I
hit five hundred in the World Series.
Speaker 4 (29:42):
The only reason I say that is because.
Speaker 10 (29:44):
What I learned when I was twenty five years old
about you know, trying my hardest and really being somebody
different to you know, go get this game with the
adrenaline of the postseason being on another level. It doesn't work.
You got to be able to slow down. You got
to be able to let the game come to you.
And I think that's why you do. Sees maybe a
guy like Hunter Green last night, maybe the adrenaline was
(30:04):
a little too high.
Speaker 4 (30:06):
Maybe that cost his pitches to.
Speaker 10 (30:07):
Be up out over the plate more than they would
be during the regular season.
Speaker 4 (30:10):
But you can't teach experience.
Speaker 5 (30:13):
How do you pitch to o'tani.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
Man?
Speaker 4 (30:17):
I'll tell you what.
Speaker 10 (30:18):
When he's locked in like this, he's very very dangerous.
I mean, you know, for me, you got to be
very careful. I mean, i'd like to say, you know,
I'd like to say, you go upper rail, but he's
proven he can hit that better than anybody in the game.
Now too, you got to really mix and match with him.
I think you got to get him off the plate
a little bit. You got to, you know, get him in,
move his feet and then you try and uh just
(30:39):
try and hit him with the kitchen sink.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
Uh Kershaw is I think Otani's pitching maybe Game three,
but we saw, you know, Kershaw the second half of
the season. Pitch unbelievable. What's it like or was it
like to face a Clayton Kershaw?
Speaker 10 (30:58):
Well, you know, funny looking back at me, you know
in my career because that was my last spring training
in two thousand and eight, was with the Red Sox.
Scott's time Flies met seventeen years ago, and it was
my third bat at the game. We're in Vero Beach.
Joe toy is the manager with Larry Bowa the bench coach.
Tito's my manager with the Red Sox, and it's like
(31:19):
my third bat.
Speaker 4 (31:20):
I'm coming after that out of the game.
Speaker 10 (31:21):
So on the on the mound pops a guy I
believe he was number ninety eight or eighty nine, and
I remember going to Dave Magnant and my hitting coach,
going hey, hey, you got anything on this guy. He's like, nah,
I got me. He goes through his notes, got nothing.
So I go to Tito, Hey you got anything on
this guy? He's like just some rookie off the backfield.
They're trying to get some work, and I'm like, all right,
it should be easy. Let me you know, you know,
so I'm daddy. I'm like, all right, let me take it.
(31:43):
Let me take a look at the first pitch. See
what he's got, you know, maybe set out my eyes.
So I get in there, say how to the catch here?
Look over, Tory gives me a nod.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
I get in there.
Speaker 10 (31:51):
You know this big left he's on the mound, number
ninety eight. So I set up, take a nice I'm
gonna take one.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
Wam hits me with like ninety eight outside black. I'm like,
I am. I'm like, that's this kid from the backfield's
pretty good. This guy's got some pretty good stuff.
Speaker 10 (32:05):
So I look over Joe Tory and Joe Tory and
Larry Bow and now laughing because I obviously they know
they know this kid better than than we know him
on the Red Sox side. So next pitch, Danny, he
hits me with it. This guy hits me with a curveball.
I swear to guy who was behind me, I total
buck Tony's buckle. I just Tony's pizza up whaa and
bam he hits me with strike two and I'm like wow,
(32:26):
I'm like, that's this kid's this kid from the backfield,
something special, so believable. Like so next pitch he hits
me with like about ninety eight outside black.
Speaker 4 (32:35):
It's no doubt strike three.
Speaker 10 (32:36):
Like I just got used and abused by this young
eighteen year old kid ninety eight from the backfield.
Speaker 4 (32:41):
They call it ball. They called a ball just because I.
Speaker 10 (32:43):
Think Gump was like, hey, we can't, we can't ring
up shaw Casey on three pitches from this guy number
ninety eight on the backfields and Danny hits me. Next pitch,
he hits me with that curveball again. I almost I
literally almost blew out my acl. I was like, what
Bamy hits me? And I look over everyone's laugh and
I come back to the dugout and I go to.
Speaker 4 (33:01):
Tito, go, man, you don't know who that guy is.
He goes, no, I'm just glad I'm.
Speaker 9 (33:04):
Not you right now, but yeah, I go, yeah.
Speaker 7 (33:06):
Me too.
Speaker 4 (33:07):
It turns out that was Clayton Kershaw. I think that
was his first big lead year ever. Faced he maybe
looked like a four year old kid.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
So Sean Casey MLB network analysts, you can see him
on MLB's postseason coverage, and also check out his Mayor's
Office podcast. I opened the show talking about it used
to be I had to have a hammer or two
in the postseason. And you know, we've seen teams that
have had those two great starters in a best of five,
(33:33):
best of seven, you're going to see them four times.
Scooba is one of those guys. Croche we saw that
performance there. Schemes isn't going to be in a playoff
anytime soon. Verlander didn't make the playoffs, you know, so
you're starting to look around and go, how many of
these hammers are out there, and just the importance of them,
(33:54):
certainly in a three game series.
Speaker 4 (33:57):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 10 (33:57):
Well, I look at the Dodgers and I go, okay,
you got game one with Snell, you're gonna get Yamamoto
coming back, game two, and you got Otani game three.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
You know that that wasn't that rotation setting up all year.
Speaker 10 (34:08):
Snell was banged up, Yamamoto did well, Otani came back late.
But they they they couldn't have timed Otawni's uh, you know,
his ascending into that starter with his last couple of starts.
I now think that's a that's a real three headed
monster right there. You talk about hammers. These are guys
that can absolutely control the game. Now, the big thing
with the Dodgers is can that you know, can they
(34:29):
can they go pretty long because the bullpen's you know,
been a little banged up. But you're right when you
watch Scoobale pitch yesterday and you watched Crochet even Freed you.
Speaker 4 (34:39):
Know, kept him in the game with the Yankees.
Speaker 10 (34:40):
But these are guys that are, like, you really gotta
be on your A game.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
You gotta find a way to.
Speaker 10 (34:46):
Manufacture against these guys because if they're on, it's it's
a tough go.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
How much should it factor in that cal Rawly was
the catcher on a on a Pennant winning team as
far as the MVP go with Aaron.
Speaker 4 (35:00):
Judge, it should definitely factor in.
Speaker 10 (35:02):
I mean, I think the biggest reason we're talking about
cal Rawley obviously, other than the sixty home runs, which
is incredible, is that he's a catcher. You know, because
at the end of the day, you know, to be
able to catch that many games, to handle the staff,
the preparation, pregame of what goes into that We've never
seen a catcher do it, because you know, the legs
that are under you start to go in the second half.
(35:24):
The fact that he beat Mantles and he's also a
switch hitter. He beat Manos fifty four home runs as
a switch hitter. Really historic stuff. I mean historic stuff.
So you know, I really think that that cal Rawly.
That's why he's in this conversation for MVP. That's why
he might he might win. It is because he's a catcher.
Speaker 5 (35:41):
Sounds like you're leaning towards Aaron Judge.
Speaker 4 (35:46):
You know what.
Speaker 10 (35:46):
I this is the one thing I think about the
MVP race in this generation. Back when I was playing,
guys would have incredible, incredible years, historic seasons. But Barry
Bonds was in the league, and then you know, years
ago guys would have historic seasons and look how amazing
this is. Yeah, but sho heyo, Tawny's in that league,
in the American League. I feel that way with Aaron Judge.
(36:09):
I mean, Aaron Judge won a batting title, hit hit
over fifty home runs. Only Jimmy Fox and Mickey Manle
have ever done that historic stuff. He's one of four
players that ever have four seasons of fifty homers. Historic stuff.
He's hitting three thirty in an age where no one's
hitting three hundred. Is that like three seventy years ago?
Historic stuff? So like I look at Aaron Judge's numbers.
(36:29):
His ops is over, you know, two hundred, greater than
cal Raley's.
Speaker 4 (36:33):
There's just so many things. Is on base percentage what
he does every day?
Speaker 10 (36:36):
And for me, Danny, I don't buy the whole average
doesn't matter. You know what batting average shows me. It
shows me you're showing up every day. It shows me
I can trust you. It shows me you're hitting good pitching.
It shows me you're hitting the closers and the number
one starters. It shows me that you're winning ball games
for my team.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
So I don't know.
Speaker 10 (36:52):
I just look at Aaron Judge. I just feel like
cal Rawly had a historic year. But Aaron Judge exists
in twenty twenty five, and he's a generational player that
we've never seen, one that we've really never seen before.
Speaker 4 (37:03):
And for me, he's the MVP.
Speaker 5 (37:05):
What's the coolest thing in your office?
Speaker 4 (37:08):
Coolest thing in my office?
Speaker 10 (37:10):
I got a lot of cool things here in the office.
I have a picture over there of Marilyn Monroe and
Joe DiMaggio getting off a plane, and there's two signed checks.
One of the Maggio he signed us to a school
in nineteen ninety eight and the Marilyn Monroe check signed
in like nineteen fifty three for a dollar fifty to
(37:32):
a friend of hers.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Are those Sports Emmys? The years that MLB Tonight beat
my show? Did you put those out? Those weren't out there?
Probably twenty minutes ago. They weren't out there.
Speaker 10 (37:45):
Dude, I knew I was coming on. I was like,
I want to be sure Danny knows the Emmys.
Speaker 5 (37:50):
Damn you. That's like a bat flip there. Damn Oh.
Speaker 4 (37:56):
You know.
Speaker 5 (37:56):
One more thing.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
We were talking about great swings, pretty swings. Why is
it a right handed hitters? Never we don't single out
and go, boy, that guy's got one of the prettiest
swings in the game. It's always gonna be Junior Rafael
Paul Merrow. I mean, there's it's always the left handed hitter.
Speaker 4 (38:12):
Why is that always the lefties? I don't know.
Speaker 10 (38:14):
It just looks a lot sweeter left handed the right
he's look like they're always grinding, Like, oh man, that
looks weird, but boy, it's a good swing hundred pens like,
oh what hell, man, he's a really good player, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Once again, this guy got thrown out from left field
on a base hit.
Speaker 4 (38:31):
That's right, that's right.
Speaker 10 (38:32):
And don't forget there's two new members in that Dylan
Moore and uh and uh Tommy Fam.
Speaker 4 (38:36):
Thank you guys for being in that club.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
How many guys have gotten thrown out from left field?
Speaker 5 (38:40):
At first? That's it three us now in the history
of the game.
Speaker 4 (38:43):
It was me forever, that history of the game. And
then Tommy Fam this year and Dylan Moore. I'm keeping tabs.
Speaker 10 (38:49):
I'm keeping receipts on who's getting thrown off and left
because I was.
Speaker 4 (38:52):
I was in the exclusive club.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Dandy, damn them. Keep the energy. Great to talk to you, buddy.
Speaker 4 (38:58):
Great scene, man, I'll talk to you.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Sean Casey, MLB Network analysts. You can see him throughout
the postseason on MLB Network studio shows and his podcast,
The Mayor's Office.
You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox
Sports Radio. Let me bring in Ben Pickman.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
He is covering the situation WNBA reporter for The Athletic.
Before I get to you, Ben, I want to play
Nofisia Callier had. Now, this is just a portion of
what she had to say about the WNBA commissioner, Kathy
Engelbert at.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Unrivaled this past February. I sat a across from Kathy
and asked how she planned to address the officiating issues
in our league. Her response was, will only the losers
complain about the refs? I also asked how she planned
to fix the fact that players like Caitlin Angel and Page,
who are clearly driving massive revenue for the league, are
making so little for their first four years. Her response was,
(00:44):
Caitlyn should be grateful she makes sixty million off the court,
because without the platform that the WBA gives her, she
wouldn't make anything. And in that same conversation, she told
me players should be on their knees thanking their lucky
stars for the media.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
Righte steal that I got them?
Speaker 5 (00:59):
Well, well, well, Ben pick it up from there.
Speaker 6 (01:03):
Yeah, you could have picked any number of sound bites
I mean, think about any other player in any other
sport doing what Nefisa Collier did. I mean, this is
a potentially seminal moment in WNBA history. I just want
to know how your production crew Dan decided on those
clips and not the clip of you know, Nafisa Collier's
saying that right now, the WNBA has the worst leadership
(01:24):
in the world. I mean, this was four minutes of
just going scorched earth and frankly telling a lot of
things that seemingly a lot of players, a lot of executives,
a lot of people around the league team wise.
Speaker 5 (01:34):
Tend to agree with. Do you agree with her?
Speaker 6 (01:37):
I mean, I think there's certainly a lot of valid
criticism in what she said. I'm not going to go
so far to say that Kathy Engelbert is part of
the worst leadership in the world, but I think a
lot of what she said is a lot of what
you know, someone like me here is in private. I mean,
my phone was blowing up Tuesday from you know, the
moment that Nafisa Collier's comments finished, with a lot of
people really commending her for saying the quiet part out loud,
(02:01):
and I Fisakllier did say this in her own comments
that you know, I'm not going to keep things private anymore.
She's calling for accountability, transparency, not just on officiating but
on broader league wide matters too.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
But they have added five teams. I mean, you know
that let's look at both sides here, because the commissioner
has done some good things, but this is negotiations and
that's where it's a war, and this is one of
the most This might be the most important moment in
WNBA history as we move forward.
Speaker 6 (02:31):
Yeah, it's important to call that out because since Kathy
Engelbert has been the commissioner, it's around six years now.
At this point, a lot has changed in the WNBA.
I mean, Kathy Engelbert used to say that the WNBA
was in an existential moment.
Speaker 5 (02:44):
That was the word that she used.
Speaker 6 (02:46):
In twenty twenty there was a potential that if they
didn't play a bubble season, would the league even exist?
And so a lot has changed since then. Just look
at recent years. A fifty million dollar expansion fee for
the Golden State Valkyries in Septembumber twenty twenty three, that
was two fifty million this summer. I mean, that is
crazy growth. The New York Liberty a four hundred and
(03:07):
fifty million dollar valuation this summer. That is all under
Kathy Engelbert's watch. But what Nafisa Kalier is also saying
is the players are really driving that. I mean, that
is what we heard or what you can hear when
she retells that story involving Caitlyn Clark, Like that is
a clear story of hitting the players against management. And yes,
(03:27):
this is a really intense negotiation. And you know these
comments are not going to do anything to put less
fuel on the fire of anything. It's going to explode
from here on out.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Caitlin Clark's WNBA salary was seventy eight thousand. Yeah, so
it's slotted that she's going to make seventy eight thousand. Yes,
she makes all that money off the court. But should
Caitlin Clark be grateful that she makes sixteen million dollars
off the court? According to the commissioner through Nafisia Collier, Yeah.
Speaker 6 (03:56):
I mean we should say. The commissioner said she was
disheartened by the characterization of those comments, and this was
an a Fisa Collier relaying them. But I mean, think
about that kind of tactical move or that decision to
include Caitlin Clark in this conversation, and we should say
Nefisa Callier and Kitlin Clark they shared the same agent, right,
So I don't think it's a coincidence that both of
those players, or that Caitlin Clark's name rather was mentioned
(04:19):
in this four and a half minute statement by Nafisa Kalier,
like there is a knowledge know how going on there.
Caitlin Clark obviously super super important to the league. And
one of the questions that you know, I was fielding
yesterday was yes, Kathy Engelbert is you know, has been
the commissioner over this period of growth. But if you
look at the next fifteen years of the league, Dan,
(04:39):
who is more important to the health the growth of
the league? Kathy Engelbert if she's around that long, or
Kitlyn Clark. I think the answer there is is pretty clear.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Well, does Caitlin Clark need the WNBA more than the
WNBA needs Caitlyn Clark.
Speaker 6 (04:52):
I mean that is another big question. I feel like
you could write books and articles and fund articles. Certainly
Caitlin Clark is worth you know, millions, if not. You know,
I did a story earlier this season, she could be
worked up to a billion dollars. Some people told me
two women's sports more generally, and so yeah, I mean,
Caitlin Clark's certainly a big driver in the broader WNBA
(05:14):
revenue conversation, the change of the business right.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
And the commissioner responded, I'm not going to read the
whole statement, but she was complimentary to Nofisia Collier, who's
a very bright woman. You know, started the unrivaled league.
It's a side league, not a competing league. But where
does this go from here?
Speaker 5 (05:32):
Where does it go? That is a great question.
Speaker 6 (05:34):
I mean, as you mentioned, the league and the players
are in this contentious CBA negotiation. The deal currently expires
October thirty. First, we'll see if they reach an extension
or if you know, there is a work stoppage, whether
it is just in the off season or down the line.
May twenty twenty six is when the twenty twenty sixth
season would begin, So we will see where things go.
(05:56):
I think the tensions have only heightened from here on that.
How could they not knowing that a FISA klier said
what she said, knowing that so many players have supported her,
knowing that now there's so many more eyeballs on the
WNBA and what is going on because of her comments
like that is what is so fascinating about this really remarkable,
remarkable for a minute statement than a FISA Collier gave
(06:16):
on Tuesday.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
There's only a certain piece of the pie available here,
Ben that I know. We look at leagues and we
go they should be paid more. Well, this it comes
down to math. It's just it's that amount of money
that's available. We split it up and that's what everybody
is going to share it. Now you're adding five new franchises,
so now that piece of the pie gets carved up
(06:39):
a little bit more. And they did sign what eleven year,
two billion dollar, two point two billion dollar TV deal.
There's a lot of progress here. I'm just I worry.
I thought that they tripped themselves up with the Caitlin
Clark situation. Nobody knew how to deal with her. Officials
didn't be, you know, the opposite position other players.
Speaker 5 (07:01):
They weren't all in on her.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Hey, we've got Diana Tarazzi and all the people who
started the league. I still don't know if they know
how to handle Caitlin Clark moving forward, because she is
different than anybody else in the sport.
Speaker 6 (07:17):
Yeah, I mean, she definitely is. But I want to
go back to your point on splitting the pie because
I think it's really important here because what makes the
WNBA so unique in this context is that also it
is owned by the NBA that Kathy Engelbert reports up
to Adam Silver, Right, So there are other stakeholders here
other than just WNBA owners who are important in this conversation.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
Right.
Speaker 6 (07:40):
So it's not just what do the owners of the
WNBA think, because even that phrase owners of the WNBA
is a really muddled phrase.
Speaker 7 (07:49):
Right.
Speaker 6 (07:49):
You have a number of franchises that are owned by
the same people that also own NBA teams. Forty two
percent of the league is owned by the NBA, for instance,
forty two percent is owned by WNBA owners. But in
that forty two percent, well, there's some people who are
in both pots here, right, and then there is another
pot of sixteen that also includes some people who are
in both of those other pots. That is what makes
(08:10):
the WNBA's situation about how to proceed, whether it relates
to Kathy Engelbert and her job status, whether it relates
to the CBA. That's part of what makes it so tricky,
so unique is there are so many stakeholders in this
conversation that the league is in a really tough spot,
and that's why we're in this very complicated mess that
(08:31):
we are in.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
ESPN reported over the weekend that WNBA data doesn't show
a correlation between recent playoff injuries and missed calls by officials.
Nafisia Collier, one of the great players in the game,
called the claim quote an insult to my intelligence, honestly.
Caller also asked the commissioner about how the league planned
(08:52):
to address officiating, and according to Collier, the commissioner said,
only the losers complain about the reps.
Speaker 7 (09:02):
Also strong, Yeah, that's wrong.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Yes, but not correct because some of the biggest complainers
in the history of the NBA, or Michael Jordan and
Larry Bird and great players complain about officiating as well,
not losers.
Speaker 5 (09:17):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 6 (09:18):
And I think one of the things that is so
interesting or that everyone is tracking is these claims or
these calls about officiating.
Speaker 5 (09:25):
They're not new, right.
Speaker 6 (09:26):
I wrote a story two years ago at the start
of the WNBA Finals all about coaches and executives and
players talking about inconsistent officiating, and going back to that
point that I was just making on NBA and WNBA ownership,
Several people around the league, coaches, executives, they point to
high yearly turnover that multiple WNB officials move out of
the league and into the NBA literally from twenty eighteen
(09:49):
to twenty twenty two. In NBA official press releases, they
would use the word promotes as it relates to people
moving from the WNBA, that is officials, to the NBA. Right,
and so there are questions again systemic questions about how
much are officials paid, how are they trained, how are
they reviewed?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
But is it slanted ben they are they calling different?
Are they seeing something different for certain players and not others?
Are they just not great at their jobs?
Speaker 6 (10:18):
I mean it's hard for me, the layperson to say,
you know, how correct or incorrect is an official's assessment
of it.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
But they do grade them. They get graded, just like
NBA officials. I don't know if they're not calling enough
for Kaitlyn Clark or they're calling too much for it,
does she get preferential? I mean it feels like everything
circles back to Caitlin Clark.
Speaker 6 (10:38):
I mean I think actually on this officiating conversation though, Dan, like,
this is a conversation that has been going on for
a number of years. I think Caitlyn Clark, like so
many other topics, her presence in the league has brought
more eyeballs to the topic of officiating. But you talk
to people like, these frustrations are frustrations that have been
held for a number of years the league. As you're
saying and you're asking, they're saying that, you know, our
(11:01):
officials are excellent, that they gray out incredibly well, that
we don't have the same kind of problem that so
many people say. But what Nafisa Collier and what others
have said is, you know, the first step in what
fixing a problem is acknowledging you have a problem in
the first place. Like that was another, you know, clear
sentiment that she tried to voice throughout her opening statement
at her exit interview.
Speaker 5 (11:22):
Great stuff, Ben, thanks for joining us, we'll be reading.
Speaker 6 (11:25):
Thanks at for having me.
Speaker 5 (11:26):
That's Ben Pickman, wmba reporter for The Athletic.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan
Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Speaker 8 (11:40):
Hey, this is Jason McIntyre. Join me every weekday morning
on my podcast, Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre. This isn't
your typical sports pod pushing the same tired narratives down
your throat every day. Straight Fire gives you honest opinions
on all the biggest sports headlines, accurate stats to help
you win big at the sportsbook, and all the best guests.
(12:00):
Do yourself a favor and listen to Straight Fire with
Jason McIntyre on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever
you get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Mark Schlereth, NFL and Fox analyst. He won three Super
Bowls with the Broncos and he called the Patriots Panthers
game in Week four and guess what as a reward
he gets the Dolphins in the Panthers coming up this
weekend at one o'clock Sunday on Fox.
Speaker 5 (12:30):
Mark joins us on the program.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
You know you've gotten to that grumpy old man age
where you can say what you want to. So here's
your platform. What's the topic today that is really bothering you.
Speaker 7 (12:44):
Overtime? Like listen to fans. You guys did it?
Speaker 9 (12:48):
You guys asked for this, right forty to forty game,
we don't get a winner, we don't get a victory.
Speaker 7 (12:53):
We don't get victory. What was wrong with sudden death?
There was nothing wrong with sudden debts, sudden depth. It's
it's sudden and it's death. You're over.
Speaker 9 (13:02):
Like that makes sense to me. Playing to a forty
to forty tie makes zero sense to me. And by
the way, I've sat in a bunch of meetings twelve
years I played this league.
Speaker 7 (13:11):
I sat in meetings, I heard it every week. Hey,
it's three things of the game.
Speaker 9 (13:14):
It's special teams, it's offense, and it's defense. Your defense
had an opportunity to stop the opponent's quarterback. But no,
you know what happened. Josh Allen didn't get the ball.
And that's not fair and we want to be fair.
And it's not fair. Like did your parenting your parents?
Did they ever parent you? Did they ever say to you, hey, man,
(13:36):
life ain't fair. Did you not get parented?
Speaker 7 (13:39):
And now this is what we have to live with ties.
I hate it, Dan, and I hate it.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
Okay, if you're in a game and you get to
overtime and you lose in sudden death, like would you
are you better at accepting a loss in sudden death
overtime than a tie in overtime.
Speaker 9 (13:59):
I'm good with whatever, because we had sixty minutes to
win this football game, and we didn't get it done
in sixty minutes. And I'll deal with the consequences of that.
I just I hate playing an extra ten minutes and
then nothing is sold, nothing is satisfied to me, and
then so I just it just bothers me. The whole
thing bothers me. And the thing that bothers me is
(14:22):
the way the NFL operates. Right, we listen to a
bunch of people whine about things right and so and then,
and most of the people that whind don't even like
the game, Like why do we as a league, why
do we basically cowtow to people who.
Speaker 7 (14:39):
Don't even like our game? Screw them.
Speaker 9 (14:41):
It's the greatest game in the world. If you don't
like it, tough, I don't care. So that part of
that part, to me, I don't understand. I mean, I
guess I understand it. You're trying to get more and
more people involved in the game, and I get that
part of it, but I just I don't like to
make excuses for it. And I don't like people who
don't like our game, who complained about it that we
(15:03):
try to satisfy.
Speaker 7 (15:04):
I like, screw those people.
Speaker 2 (15:06):
Are you more bothered by overtime or the Broncos uniforms
that they trotted out on Monday Night?
Speaker 9 (15:13):
I like, hey, man, I'm old school, Like I liked
Pat Patriot, Like did you see the Patriots in the
game against Pittsburgh, you know, with the old pat Patriot
on the helmet and that I think.
Speaker 7 (15:23):
I love that.
Speaker 9 (15:24):
I love the old school. I wish they'd go back
to that Bronco uniform would.
Speaker 7 (15:28):
Be you know, the horse breathing fire out of snows, Like.
Speaker 9 (15:31):
I wish they would go back to all that stuff
because I think those uniforms are just absolutely classic.
Speaker 7 (15:37):
They're awesome. And yeah, they all blues.
Speaker 9 (15:40):
I could do without the all blues, but I hate
it mostly because when we went to all blues when
I played for the Broncos. One, the pants for whatever reason,
the pants were super tight, Like I didn't like that.
And two two you look like a upa lumpa like
you just look like a big, giantly blueberry, and.
Speaker 7 (16:01):
Uh, I was concientious. Hey, I looked at my other
offensive liga. Does this uniform make me look sad?
Speaker 9 (16:07):
You know.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
We're talking to Mark Schlareth. You will find him an
NFL Fox analyst. Panthers Patriots Week four and now you've
got the Dolphins and the Panthers.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
Wow.
Speaker 9 (16:21):
Turns it turns out that I am the official broadcaster
of the NFC South. I don't know who's cheery as
I pissed in to get the Panthers every weekend.
Speaker 5 (16:30):
They are, Uh they are.
Speaker 9 (16:31):
Don't tell anybody I said that they are a bad
football team.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Okay, I saw this headline and I knew you were
going to call the game. H Bryce Young is not
a bust? The Panthers are?
Speaker 5 (16:44):
Is that? Is that a fair headline?
Speaker 7 (16:48):
Well? I think so. You know we put up in
the broadcast end of the day.
Speaker 9 (16:50):
I mean they had both Baker Mayfield and Sam Darnold
in their organization and said see you and you know what,
you get some good coaching. Sam Donald actually turns down
this is Sam Donald's a great story, because Sam, they're
both great stories. Sam Donald turns down other opportunities to
potentially go in and be a starter, and he decides,
(17:13):
I'm going to go to San Francisco and get coached
by Kyle Shanahan and.
Speaker 7 (17:17):
Learn how to play NFL football. That's what happened.
Speaker 9 (17:19):
And then he goes to Minnesota and Kyle Shannan told
me he goes. Listen, he gets to the Jets, right,
bad organization gets to the Jets and they try to
put him in the Peyton Manning offense. He goes, there's
one guy they can run the Peyton Manning offense. That's
Peyton Manning, right, So he fails there. Then he goes
to Matt Rule in the Carolina Panthers and they're running
some college So the first time that this guy has
(17:41):
ever gotten into a true progression offense in reality is
in San Francisco, and so he learned basically NFL football.
He's year four in the league and at one point,
Baker Mayfield, we put a picture of a couple of
a different broadcasts at Tampa broadcast I did last year
where he is actually a scout team defensive end for
(18:02):
the Carolina Panthers and they didn't like they cut him.
And then he signs on in with the Rams and
plays there for a few weeks as that. I think
it was a Christmas Day game against the Broncos where
he hangs fifty on them after being in the facility
for three days, and and you know he goes on
to play great football.
Speaker 7 (18:19):
So I don't know what Bryce Young is yet.
Speaker 9 (18:22):
I think he's I mean, he's small, he's diminutive, but
you know he gonna operate an offense. And I've seen
growth because I'm because i'm the official broadcast of the
Carolina Panthers, I've seen some growth.
Speaker 7 (18:34):
But but Dan, like I think.
Speaker 9 (18:37):
The wide receivers, I think wide receivers are a completely
dependent position.
Speaker 7 (18:41):
They're they're like children.
Speaker 9 (18:42):
One they're dependent, right, ten other guys had to do
their job for them to sniff a football, and then
you know they're they're like toddlers. They whine and they
cry and they bitch a lot if they don't get fed.
Speaker 7 (18:53):
Like that's who wide receivers are. They're just like toddlers.
Speaker 9 (18:56):
And so ultimately, ultimately, there is not very much talent
on this football team. And so if you're a great quarterback,
you take you know, fair to midland wide receivers and
you can create a great offense around that.
Speaker 7 (19:13):
If you're a.
Speaker 9 (19:14):
Quarterback trying to figure it out, you've got to surround
that guy with some opportunity, some people who can actually
excel get opening one on one and going into last week,
Tedoro McMillan had two hundred and sixteen yards receiving. All
the other wide receivers combined had a one hundred and
forty one through three games. It's just they just don't
I mean, they're just not very good that way, that
(19:34):
talent wise. So again, I just don't know. Do I
think he's a franchise quarterback. No, But do I think
you can win with Bryce Young if you put enough
people around him, in pieces around him, I think you
probably could help me understand the Eagles situation.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
It feels like every week there's something. Every week there's something.
You know, we started out with spitgate with Jalen Carter
to start the year. Now you know, you got aj
Brown with a cryptic tweet that he puts out and
then I mean, they don't throw the ball a lot,
but if they when they do throw it, I think
he's targeted a little over thirty percent of the time.
(20:10):
So they're good numbers. You're winning, you're undefeated, you won
the Super Bowl. Help me understand the Philadelphia Eagles.
Speaker 7 (20:20):
I can't. I don't understand. I don't come from that world.
Speaker 9 (20:25):
I don't come from that world where I'm not getting
enough shine.
Speaker 7 (20:28):
So I'm upset.
Speaker 9 (20:30):
I come from the offensive line world, the world of
offensive line, and that's a you know, we're a secret
mushroom society.
Speaker 7 (20:36):
Nobody knows what the hell we're doing. And if we
have a great game, we're just to throw away tagline.
Speaker 9 (20:42):
You know, I mean, a guy who rushes for two
hundred yards, you got to think the big fellow's up front.
Now let's talk about me. It was awesome, you know.
I mean, that's that's the way it works, right. You
give up, man, I can whip your ass sixty five
plays in a row. Dan, I give up one sack.
I'm a piece of garbage and you go to the
Pro Bowl. That's the world I come from. And so
I don't underst and this world of we're winning, but
(21:02):
I'm not getting to touch the ball enough. So I'm
going to pout or send cryptic tweets or be upset
that world. I don't understand that world. And I mean, ultimately,
it is about winning. And I know that you want
to compete, and I know that you want you know,
you want to win but you know, it's amazing what
you can do as an organization, whether it's football or
(21:24):
any organization, it's amazing what you can accomplish when no
one cares who gets the credit. And that's the world
I come from. So it's probably why I hate wide
receivers with the white hot intensity of a thousand suns.
Speaker 7 (21:38):
So it's you.
Speaker 9 (21:40):
I'm probably not the right guy to ask because I
just think. I just think it's selfish and it bothers me,
and you know, and I'm.
Speaker 7 (21:48):
Grumpy and I've got on black sox. So that's where
I live right now.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
How frustrating was it or is it for an offensive
lineman to do your job for a couple of seconds
and then all of a sudden you turn around and
your quarterbacks trying to make something happen, and then you
guys are going to get blamed for a sack?
Speaker 7 (22:08):
Yeah, well I will.
Speaker 9 (22:10):
I will tell you that sacks are more of a
quarterback driven and a coaching driven statistic than they are
on offensive line static in today's NFL with all the
I mean, we didn't even have a bubble screen when
I was playing that that didn't even exist. And you know,
and you throw it behind line of scrimmage and out
to the sidelines so much, and there's so much quick game.
(22:31):
You really if you boil it down, Dan, you say,
hey man, we throw it thirty five times. You boil
it down thirty five times, you've got five. Let's call it.
I'm just gonna make the math easy because I'm not
that smart. We're gonna go five quick balls, like five
three step drops, right, So now you're down to thirty. Right,
We're gonna do five kind of bubble screens. So now
(22:51):
I'm down to twenty five. We're gonna do five, you know,
swing passes out to the running backs, all right, So
now I'm down to to twenty. Now we're going to
do a five to five step drop, but five step
drop with no hitch. So it's the ball is out
right now. Now I'm down to fifteen, you know, and
so I look at that. How about the boot keep
(23:11):
play action game. We're gonna do five of those, right,
So now I'm down.
Speaker 7 (23:15):
To let's let's call it. I'll whittle it down, you know,
give or take a few.
Speaker 9 (23:19):
I'll whittle it down to twelve plays where you actually
have to protect twelve plays, and so ultimately you got
to get the ball out of your hand. That's the
way the game is designed. And I was talking to
Byron left which when Tom Brady was playing for the
Dam Bay Buccaneers, and I said, what has been the
most amazing thing about Tom? He said, Hey, listen, if
(23:40):
I call curl flat, which is the first day, like
first day operation curl flat, everybody name league runs curl flat.
And your first read is the flat like it's just
you know, a backron tight end that's in the flat, right,
whatever it is, and that flat is open, and that's
the first read in the progression. Tom will take it
one hundred out of one hundred times, never get taking
(24:00):
the profit, and it'll put us in second down and
six minus and then the entirety of the offense is open.
We're on schedule. You hear people say that all the time.
On schedule, there are some quarterbacks that don't want to
throw it. Let me see what I can get at hey,
let me see if I can get something better. Let
me see if I can get something better. You got
to fall in love with Bory. And that's why guys
who scramble around. Most guys who scramble around don't win.
(24:23):
Championships because you gotta be you can't like ultimately, Like
I look at Kyler Murray and do you want to
win football games? Or do you want to make Sports
Center highlights? Like that was? That was what I would ask, like,
because I want to I want to win football games.
Speaker 7 (24:41):
And the way you win is staying out a third
down and long.
Speaker 9 (24:44):
And the way you stay at a third down long
is you have success on first and second down.
Speaker 7 (24:48):
And so if somebody is going to give me a gift,
somebody's going to give me.
Speaker 9 (24:53):
A five yard quick out and I pass it by
because I want something.
Speaker 7 (24:58):
Better, or I want to make a highlight play. What's
selfish football? Because it's second down and five, I can
do anything. Everything is open to me. Second down and ten.
I'm predictable. Nothing is open to you. I have aired
down my playbook by you know, eighty percent. Whatever it is.
Speaker 5 (25:18):
Stay grumpy, Okay.
Speaker 7 (25:24):
I'm gonna get a T shirt.
Speaker 5 (25:25):
Stay grumpy, stay grumpy. Good to talk to you, buddy,
Thank you.
Speaker 7 (25:28):
Likewise, be good, buddy.
Speaker 5 (25:30):
Mark Slera.
Speaker 1 (25:31):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at foxsports radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app search FSR to
listen live.
Speaker 2 (25:42):
We bring in Sean CASEYMLB Network analyst. You can see
him throughout the postseason on MLB Network the studio shows
also MLB Tonight and his Mayor's Office podcast, Great to
See You Again. How much of the game comes down
to a gut feeling as a post to the analytics,
because it feels like you can lean on analytics and
(26:05):
blame analytics, but when it's a gut feeling, it's on you.
Speaker 10 (26:09):
Yeah, what's up, Danny? Yeah, I think there's definitely something
to that, you know. I think we go back to,
you know a few years ago when when Snell was
cruising along for the Rays and then Cash comes and
gets them because that's what the analytics saying.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
I think that was the first time we were all like,
oh man, where's the gut feel here?
Speaker 10 (26:29):
Of kind of watching what you're seeing and going with that.
I think the managers that are that are in these games,
you know, are allowed to go on gut fields. And
you heard Aaron Boone say, I think that was a
gut feel for him. He felt like there was some
traffic on the bases with Freed in four five and six,
and he felt like, you know that that was the
right time he was going to go to the pen
there anyhow, So I feel like that was kind of
(26:51):
a gut feel from Boone as opposed to the analytics.
But you know, Danny being in these meetings, you know,
being back in the clubhouse in twenty twenty three with
the Yankees and seeing these meetings of how hey, if
this matchup comes up, the analytics say here, uh, you
know those are on the table. But I do think
as a manager in the postseason, the gut feel is
part of it, and you know it has.
Speaker 4 (27:12):
To come and play.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Managing differently in the postseason, do you do you manage
differently or is that let's fight the urge to manage differently.
Speaker 10 (27:23):
Well, I think I think there's a little bit of
managing differently in the postseason on a few fronts because
you know there is no tomorrow sometimes, you know, especially
some in these wildcard series too, like what is it
ninety percent of the teams that have won Game one
have gone on to.
Speaker 4 (27:38):
Win the Wildcard series.
Speaker 10 (27:40):
So I think that you know, if a pitcher's in
trouble early, you can't do what you might have done
in the in the regular season to save the bullpen.
You gotta you gotta get them out. You got to
get to the pen sooner. I think you're going to
see more bunts and strategies in the postseason of get
the you know, getting the bunt down, putting pressure on
getting the guy over. Uh So, I think I think
you do have to manage a little differently in the
(28:01):
postseason because the stakes are a lot higher.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
Of the four teams that lost yesterday, which one has
the best chance to win their series?
Speaker 4 (28:12):
I still think the Yankees have a great shot to
win that series.
Speaker 10 (28:14):
I really, I really believe that, you know, I think
they you know, when you run into Crochet and Chapman,
you know, for seven and two thirds and then one
and a third, I mean, that is a that's a
tall order. They hadn't they had Chapman on the ropes
too in the ninth couldn't figure it out with basis loaded,
no outs. But you know, that's a taller in Game one.
I really feel like the Yankees have a really good team.
(28:34):
I think they still have a chance to win that series.
Speaker 5 (28:37):
What do you remember about your first playoff game?
Speaker 10 (28:40):
Wow, you know what's a good This is a great,
This is a great point. I was just I was
just saying this last week on on MLB Network. My
first real kind of playoff game was Game one sixty
three with the Reds and the and the and the Mets.
When we had the playing game the playoff atmosphere. Was
the first time I ever felt that, and I rememberer
(29:01):
Danny like it was an adrenaline and energy I'd never felt.
I'm twenty five year old kid, and I remember thinking,
I'm gonna go win this game tonight. I'm gonna go
I'm gonna really go go take this game. Right, I'm
I'm you know, it's the kind of that football mentality
which doesn't work in baseball. I end up going zero
for four, two punchouts, one of the worst games.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
Of my life.
Speaker 10 (29:19):
Right, And I remember thinking to myself, you know, and
as in the game of baseball and in life, failures, feedback, failures, information,
I was like, man, how do I take the failure
I got here?
Speaker 4 (29:30):
Get me back to the postseason to experience it.
Speaker 10 (29:32):
And when I finally went back to the postseason in
six when I was with the Tigers and I you know,
led the post, led all hitters and hitting and I
hit five hundred in the World Series.
Speaker 4 (29:42):
The only reason I say that is because.
Speaker 10 (29:44):
What I learned when I was twenty five years old
about you know, trying my hardest and really being somebody
different to you know, go get this game with the
adrenaline of the postseason being on another level. It doesn't work.
You got to be able to slow down. You got
to be able to let the game come to you.
And I think that's why you do. Sees maybe a
guy like Hunter Green last night, maybe the adrenaline was
(30:04):
a little too high.
Speaker 4 (30:06):
Maybe that cost his pitches to.
Speaker 10 (30:07):
Be up out over the plate more than they would
be during the regular season.
Speaker 4 (30:10):
But you can't teach experience.
Speaker 5 (30:13):
How do you pitch to o'tani.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
Man?
Speaker 4 (30:17):
I'll tell you what.
Speaker 10 (30:18):
When he's locked in like this, he's very very dangerous.
I mean, you know, for me, you got to be
very careful. I mean, i'd like to say, you know,
I'd like to say, you go upper rail, but he's
proven he can hit that better than anybody in the game.
Now too, you got to really mix and match with him.
I think you got to get him off the plate
a little bit. You got to, you know, get him in,
move his feet and then you try and uh just
(30:39):
try and hit him with the kitchen sink.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
Uh Kershaw is I think Otani's pitching maybe Game three,
but we saw, you know, Kershaw the second half of
the season. Pitch unbelievable. What's it like or was it
like to face a Clayton Kershaw?
Speaker 10 (30:58):
Well, you know, funny looking back at me, you know
in my career because that was my last spring training
in two thousand and eight, was with the Red Sox.
Scott's time Flies met seventeen years ago, and it was
my third bat at the game. We're in Vero Beach.
Joe toy is the manager with Larry Bowa the bench coach.
Tito's my manager with the Red Sox, and it's like
(31:19):
my third bat.
Speaker 4 (31:20):
I'm coming after that out of the game.
Speaker 10 (31:21):
So on the on the mound pops a guy I
believe he was number ninety eight or eighty nine, and
I remember going to Dave Magnant and my hitting coach,
going hey, hey, you got anything on this guy. He's like, nah,
I got me. He goes through his notes, got nothing.
So I go to Tito, Hey you got anything on
this guy? He's like just some rookie off the backfield.
They're trying to get some work, and I'm like, all right,
it should be easy. Let me you know, you know,
so I'm daddy. I'm like, all right, let me take it.
(31:43):
Let me take a look at the first pitch. See
what he's got, you know, maybe set out my eyes.
So I get in there, say how to the catch here?
Look over, Tory gives me a nod.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
I get in there.
Speaker 10 (31:51):
You know this big left he's on the mound, number
ninety eight. So I set up, take a nice I'm
gonna take one.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
Wam hits me with like ninety eight outside black. I'm like,
I am. I'm like, that's this kid from the backfield's
pretty good. This guy's got some pretty good stuff.
Speaker 10 (32:05):
So I look over Joe Tory and Joe Tory and
Larry Bow and now laughing because I obviously they know
they know this kid better than than we know him
on the Red Sox side. So next pitch, Danny, he
hits me with it. This guy hits me with a curveball.
I swear to guy who was behind me, I total
buck Tony's buckle. I just Tony's pizza up whaa and
bam he hits me with strike two and I'm like wow,
(32:26):
I'm like, that's this kid's this kid from the backfield,
something special, so believable. Like so next pitch he hits
me with like about ninety eight outside black.
Speaker 4 (32:35):
It's no doubt strike three.
Speaker 10 (32:36):
Like I just got used and abused by this young
eighteen year old kid ninety eight from the backfield.
Speaker 4 (32:41):
They call it ball. They called a ball just because I.
Speaker 10 (32:43):
Think Gump was like, hey, we can't, we can't ring
up shaw Casey on three pitches from this guy number
ninety eight on the backfields and Danny hits me. Next pitch,
he hits me with that curveball again. I almost I
literally almost blew out my acl. I was like, what
Bamy hits me? And I look over everyone's laugh and
I come back to the dugout and I go to.
Speaker 4 (33:01):
Tito, go, man, you don't know who that guy is.
He goes, no, I'm just glad I'm.
Speaker 9 (33:04):
Not you right now, but yeah, I go, yeah.
Speaker 7 (33:06):
Me too.
Speaker 4 (33:07):
It turns out that was Clayton Kershaw. I think that
was his first big lead year ever. Faced he maybe
looked like a four year old kid.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
So Sean Casey MLB network analysts, you can see him
on MLB's postseason coverage, and also check out his Mayor's
Office podcast. I opened the show talking about it used
to be I had to have a hammer or two
in the postseason. And you know, we've seen teams that
have had those two great starters in a best of five,
(33:33):
best of seven, you're going to see them four times.
Scooba is one of those guys. Croche we saw that
performance there. Schemes isn't going to be in a playoff
anytime soon. Verlander didn't make the playoffs, you know, so
you're starting to look around and go, how many of
these hammers are out there, and just the importance of them,
(33:54):
certainly in a three game series.
Speaker 4 (33:57):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 10 (33:57):
Well, I look at the Dodgers and I go, okay,
you got game one with Snell, you're gonna get Yamamoto
coming back, game two, and you got Otani game three.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
You know that that wasn't that rotation setting up all year.
Speaker 10 (34:08):
Snell was banged up, Yamamoto did well, Otani came back late.
But they they they couldn't have timed Otawni's uh, you know,
his ascending into that starter with his last couple of starts.
I now think that's a that's a real three headed
monster right there. You talk about hammers. These are guys
that can absolutely control the game. Now, the big thing
with the Dodgers is can that you know, can they
(34:29):
can they go pretty long because the bullpen's you know,
been a little banged up. But you're right when you
watch Scoobale pitch yesterday and you watched Crochet even Freed you.
Speaker 4 (34:39):
Know, kept him in the game with the Yankees.
Speaker 10 (34:40):
But these are guys that are, like, you really gotta
be on your A game.
Speaker 4 (34:45):
You gotta find a way to.
Speaker 10 (34:46):
Manufacture against these guys because if they're on, it's it's
a tough go.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
How much should it factor in that cal Rawly was
the catcher on a on a Pennant winning team as
far as the MVP go with Aaron.
Speaker 4 (35:00):
Judge, it should definitely factor in.
Speaker 10 (35:02):
I mean, I think the biggest reason we're talking about
cal Rawley obviously, other than the sixty home runs, which
is incredible, is that he's a catcher. You know, because
at the end of the day, you know, to be
able to catch that many games, to handle the staff,
the preparation, pregame of what goes into that We've never
seen a catcher do it, because you know, the legs
that are under you start to go in the second half.
(35:24):
The fact that he beat Mantles and he's also a
switch hitter. He beat Manos fifty four home runs as
a switch hitter. Really historic stuff. I mean historic stuff.
So you know, I really think that that cal Rawly.
That's why he's in this conversation for MVP. That's why
he might he might win. It is because he's a catcher.
Speaker 5 (35:41):
Sounds like you're leaning towards Aaron Judge.
Speaker 4 (35:46):
You know what.
Speaker 10 (35:46):
I this is the one thing I think about the
MVP race in this generation. Back when I was playing,
guys would have incredible, incredible years, historic seasons. But Barry
Bonds was in the league, and then you know, years
ago guys would have historic seasons and look how amazing
this is. Yeah, but sho heyo, Tawny's in that league,
in the American League. I feel that way with Aaron Judge.
(36:09):
I mean, Aaron Judge won a batting title, hit hit
over fifty home runs. Only Jimmy Fox and Mickey Manle
have ever done that historic stuff. He's one of four
players that ever have four seasons of fifty homers. Historic stuff.
He's hitting three thirty in an age where no one's
hitting three hundred. Is that like three seventy years ago?
Historic stuff? So like I look at Aaron Judge's numbers.
(36:29):
His ops is over, you know, two hundred, greater than
cal Raley's.
Speaker 4 (36:33):
There's just so many things. Is on base percentage what
he does every day?
Speaker 10 (36:36):
And for me, Danny, I don't buy the whole average
doesn't matter. You know what batting average shows me. It
shows me you're showing up every day. It shows me
I can trust you. It shows me you're hitting good pitching.
It shows me you're hitting the closers and the number
one starters. It shows me that you're winning ball games
for my team.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
So I don't know.
Speaker 10 (36:52):
I just look at Aaron Judge. I just feel like
cal Rawly had a historic year. But Aaron Judge exists
in twenty twenty five, and he's a generational player that
we've never seen, one that we've really never seen before.
Speaker 4 (37:03):
And for me, he's the MVP.
Speaker 5 (37:05):
What's the coolest thing in your office?
Speaker 4 (37:08):
Coolest thing in my office?
Speaker 10 (37:10):
I got a lot of cool things here in the office.
I have a picture over there of Marilyn Monroe and
Joe DiMaggio getting off a plane, and there's two signed checks.
One of the Maggio he signed us to a school
in nineteen ninety eight and the Marilyn Monroe check signed
in like nineteen fifty three for a dollar fifty to
(37:32):
a friend of hers.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Are those Sports Emmys? The years that MLB Tonight beat
my show? Did you put those out? Those weren't out there?
Probably twenty minutes ago. They weren't out there.
Speaker 10 (37:45):
Dude, I knew I was coming on. I was like,
I want to be sure Danny knows the Emmys.
Speaker 5 (37:50):
Damn you. That's like a bat flip there. Damn Oh.
Speaker 4 (37:56):
You know.
Speaker 5 (37:56):
One more thing.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
We were talking about great swings, pretty swings. Why is
it a right handed hitters? Never we don't single out
and go, boy, that guy's got one of the prettiest
swings in the game. It's always gonna be Junior Rafael
Paul Merrow. I mean, there's it's always the left handed hitter.
Speaker 4 (38:12):
Why is that always the lefties? I don't know.
Speaker 10 (38:14):
It just looks a lot sweeter left handed the right
he's look like they're always grinding, Like, oh man, that
looks weird, but boy, it's a good swing hundred pens like,
oh what hell, man, he's a really good player, you
know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
Once again, this guy got thrown out from left field
on a base hit.
Speaker 4 (38:31):
That's right, that's right.
Speaker 10 (38:32):
And don't forget there's two new members in that Dylan
Moore and uh and uh Tommy Fam.
Speaker 4 (38:36):
Thank you guys for being in that club.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
How many guys have gotten thrown out from left field?
Speaker 5 (38:40):
At first? That's it three us now in the history
of the game.
Speaker 4 (38:43):
It was me forever, that history of the game. And
then Tommy Fam this year and Dylan Moore. I'm keeping tabs.
Speaker 10 (38:49):
I'm keeping receipts on who's getting thrown off and left
because I was.
Speaker 4 (38:52):
I was in the exclusive club.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Dandy, damn them. Keep the energy. Great to talk to you, buddy.
Speaker 4 (38:58):
Great scene, man, I'll talk to you.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Sean Casey, MLB Network analysts. You can see him throughout
the postseason on MLB Network studio shows and his podcast,
The Mayor's Office.
Hosts And Creators
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Dan Patrick
Patrick "Seton" O'Connor
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