May 1, 2025 • 34 mins
In this episode of The Deal, Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly talk about the new Washington Commanders stadium deal and the upcoming Miami Grand Prix. Then, they speak with Jennifer Epstein about what it’s like to build a team from scratch with the NWSL’s latest expansion team: Boston Legacy FC. Epstein tells the hosts what she learned from her family’s ownership of the Boston Celtics, how she’s inspired by the passion of Boston sports fans, and why it’s too early to take a victory lap celebrating her investment in the NWSL.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Welcome back to the Deal.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I'm your host, Jason Kelly alongside my partner Alex Rodriguez.
All right, Alex, you are in Los Angeles. We're recording
this on Tuesday. You've got a massive game coming up,
so by the time people hear this, you will either
be onto the next round or you're gonna have another
big game coming up. But I have to do a
beat with you about this game. Over the weekend, I
(00:36):
watched every minute of it on TV. You were obviously
there in Minnesota. I gotta say I was watching a
lot of basketball this weekend. I don't think there was
an arena that had anything like the.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Energy that the Target Center did.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
It was a wild weekend in Minnesota, I gotta tell you.
And our fan base just showed up in the biggest
way for the biggest games. I mean, back to back.
It was so fun Friday and Sunday. And I'm not
saying that just because we won. I mean both games
honestly could have gone either way. We could be down
three to one, just like we're up three to one.
So exciting and a lot of interests in Minnesota.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Yeah, and so tell me about that interest, because obviously,
you know, a lot of it is about the matchups.
People are tuning in in a really meaningful way.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
It sounds like they are.
Speaker 4 (01:24):
And Jason, the thing that jumped off the page for
me is I had a friend who flew in from
New York and he needed tickets and there was no
floor tickets available. He ended up buying one ticket for
seventeen thousand, five hundred, and then he cut a deal
with a broker and he got thirty thousand for two games,
so he paid fifteen for each. And I said, my goodness,
(01:45):
that's insane.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
In Minneapolis, Minnesota.
Speaker 4 (01:48):
In Minneapolis, yes, they love their basketball and they're hungry.
And we have a team that's now been together. You know,
the thing that I've learned in sports is one of
the most powerful arbitrages is youth and experience with talent.
And we have three guys that were drafted five years
ago together in nas reed Jada McDaniels and Anthony Edwards.
(02:10):
And Anthony Edwards is growing up right in front of America.
I mean, we've known this in Minneapolis. I think the
world is getting to see how special this young man is.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Yeah, it's a big moment for the NBA. I feel
like these playoffs are just electric if you look across everything.
I know, we talk about it every week on the show,
but it continues to be true. All right, So you're
going to be there. Then you and I are going
to link up in Miami. We've got a huge week
coming up for the deal. We are tying it very
directly to I mean, you live there. I mean you're
there some of the time. I feel like you're everywhere
(02:40):
these days. But I spent a lot of time in
Miami too. But I'm coming down F one weekend. This
has become something that people just pin on their calendars.
We're going to catch up with Susie Wolf. She is
the managing director of F one Academy. She's a force
to be reckoned with. This is the all female racing
circuit within F one. Miami is one of the places
(03:04):
where they run the F one Academy races. There's a
lot of excitement around that they're premiering a new Netflix
series all about F one Academy. So I'm just I'm
so psyched to talk to her.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
And she's really exciting.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
I mean, she's got an incredible story her father was
in the auto business as well. She recently told me,
and I know you spent some time with her as well,
that the first time she got behind the wheel, she
was two years old.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
Yeah, and at ten she was starting to.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
Kind of drive the gold carts around and she was
always the only female. And I think you'll hear from
her like, what are those numbers back then when she
was ten versus now when she's forty two.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Yeah, So really excited for that conversation that'll come up
in a few weeks on your feed, So stay tuned
for that. The other person we're catching up with down
to Miami, he lives down there now, Josh Harris.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
What a time to catch up with this.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Guy, because probably one of the biggest single deals in
the sports world that's happened in a long time, a
much anticipated deal for a new stadium in Washington, DC
announced this week. Josh Harris. I read someone said, Josh
Harris got done in a very short amount of time.
What it took in twenty four months, basically what in
(04:13):
Snyder couldn't get done in twenty four years, which is
a new stadium for the Washington Commanders.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
This is a massive deal it's a massive deal.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
And that's why these owners are so important, right because
Josh Harris, who has over three and a half decades
in private equity with Apollo. You know, the way he
bought the Sixers deal was a corporate carve out, just
like his LBO days, and he bought it from Comcast
at Snyder, who's you know, the legendary at Snyder. And
you've seen what he's done, such a great job with
the Sixers and how he's transformed that you know, trust
(04:40):
the process or it has worked. And now with the Commanders.
I mean you know this, you went to school right
down the street, and the political landscape that you have
to navigate, it takes someone like Josh Harris and his
ownership group to do such great work in such a
short period of time.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Yeah, it's amazing too, and we're going to talk to
him about this again. That's an episode that'll come up
in the next few weeks, talk about the fact that
DC has done two massive deals for stadiums, one with
Josh Harrison, one with a previous guest on the show,
Ted Leonsis. So that's what we've got going on this week.
Coming out today, another really interesting deal maker a new
team and altogether new team coming onto the scene, Boston Legacy,
(05:17):
that of course is one of the newest teams coming
onto the pitch next year for the National Women Soccer League.
We catch up with the controlling owner there, Jennifer Epstein,
her family, of course, part of the group that just
sold the Boston Celtics for a record six point one
billion dollars. We talked to her about that and about
what the Legacy is going to mean for one of
(05:38):
the biggest sports cities in the world.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
That's coming up.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Hi, everyone, welcome back to the Deal. I'm your host,
Jason Kelly, alongside my co host and partner Alex Rodriguez.
So excited to be here today with Jennifer Epstein, the
controlling owner of the Boston Legacy football Club. She's got
a long history in sports and we're so excited to
get into all of it.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Jennifer, great to be with you.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Thanks so much for having me. Jason, great to be here,
Thank you, Alex.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
So we have a lot to talk about.
Speaker 3 (06:19):
We want to talk a little lot about soccer, but
let's first talk about that banner that is right behind you.
Twenty twenty four World champion Boston Celtics. It's a moment
we all remember. Your family was part of the ownership
group of the Boston Celtics, going back to that two
thousand and two purchase for what seemed like a crazy
amount of money at the time three hundred and sixty
(06:40):
million dollars and obviously the more recent transaction sold for
six point one billion dollars, a record across the board.
Tell us about that journey, like what was it like
to be sort of in it two championships over the
course of ownership, Like what do you take away from
that experience.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I just feel like it was such an honor and
privilege to be involved with that organization.
Speaker 5 (07:04):
I mean, it starts out.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
I'm a diehard Boston sports fan, grew up in Boston,
had a real intergenerational connection with my father around sports.
Speaker 5 (07:12):
He's a huge.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
Lover of the game, but is only five foot eight,
so a career as a player.
Speaker 5 (07:17):
Was not going to happen.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
But in two thousand and two he filled a lifelong
dream and became a managing partner of the Celtics. And
Wick Grossbeck, who has led that team, has really just
built an extraordinary organization.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
You mentioned two championships.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
They've made an incredible impact on and off the court
and as you said, driven the valuation of that team
over the past twenty three years, you know, seventeen X
to you know, an upcoming biggest sports team sale in
North American history. So there's lots to be inspired by
in that model. From my vantage point, i'd say, you know,
(07:54):
it's an organization where from the players and everyone evolved.
They have bought into this idea that it's team before
self and you're not always going to win championships, but
you're going to compete for championships always. And you know,
it's a team that has always recognized the responsibility to
have impact both on and off the court. And so
you know, that's what we're trying to do at Boston Legacy.
(08:17):
You know, we realize that we have to be fielding
a team that is competing for championships all the time,
and you know, we are really also, i think, setting
a new standard for how sports franchises can connect to
their community by redefining what a team's commitment to social
impact really can be. And that's through our public private
(08:37):
partnership with the City of Boston and the Boston Public
schools as we renovate a stadium.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
To be our home pitch.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
I guess my question goes back to the Boston Celtics.
You guys have been part of his ownership now for
over two decades. When you can receive that call, is
is there a little bittersweetness? Is it like, eya, we're
going to make a great return, or is it like, oh,
we really enjoyed this investment and to be here.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
How do you feel about it?
Speaker 5 (09:03):
So bittersweet?
Speaker 1 (09:04):
At my heart, I'm a fan and I still will
always be a fan, and I will look forward to,
you know, going to games for the rest of my life.
I may not have quite as good seats, but there'll
be an adjustment just because you.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
Know, I'm a fan.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
But it's also I have relationships with a lot of
people within that organization and a real respect for them,
and you know, it will change and I won't have
that same window to kind of the inner workings of
that organization.
Speaker 5 (09:38):
So yes, it'll be bittersweet.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
But it's been a phenomenal twenty three years and it's
taking me to places that I didn't anticipate. I would,
you know, necessarily go riding the duck boats down Boyleston
Street with two million fans cheering for the Celtics, I mean,
you know, and and really helped position me to now
launch this Club Boston legacy that I hope I will
also be writing down the Duck Boats celebrating a championship
(10:03):
with two million fans, where you know there are female
athletes who are the focus of the celebration.
Speaker 4 (10:10):
So, Jennifer, you mentioned Vick, who's a controlling partner of
the Boston Celtics and has really done a phenomenal job.
If you go just fifty thousand feet, what he's done
with that franchise for over twenty years, two tighters, all
of that is pretty incredible. But I guess he's also
one of the most respected governors and revered governors in
the NBA board, which tells you a lot about who
(10:31):
he is a character. What lessons can you take for
him as you embark in your controlling governor in the
world of soccer.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
I mean, I think he's always had a real respect
for his partners and a real respect for his players,
and you know, a real respect for the community and
his fans, and just you know, everything that he's done
has really honored that respect. And commitment to the city
of Boston. In Boston, you know there's a lot of
(11:03):
pressure here too. We have such a legacy of championships.
Speaker 5 (11:07):
Here in our city.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
How do we show that respect where the stewards really
have a public asset right as owners of a sports team.
If we do this correctly, you know, we don't know
the team. The whole city owns the team, right. And
these are some of the lessons that I've I take,
by example, from from Wick.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
You led me exactly where I was hoping we would go, Jennifer,
which is the Boston of it all. You know, I'm
here in New York, and you know, I'm sitting virtually
alongside a New York Yankee, former New York Yankee, who
may have his own feelings about your sports teams and
sort of what they've done to other teams over the
course of the last twenty five years. Especially, you know,
(11:48):
I mean, I'm watching this, you know, great documentary about
the Celtics, this great docuseries that Bill Simmons produced.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
It's unbelievable, you know, the history.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
I mean, every time you turn around, there's like this
other name where you think, even beyond the people that
we obviously associate with the Celtics. You know, they're more
who are just so tied to that franchise then, you know,
than the Patriots, than the Bruins, than the Red Sox.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
Sorry Alex, but like, what is it about the fans?
Speaker 3 (12:14):
What is it about the city that is unique when
it comes to sports.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
I mean, I love Boston sports fans. I really feel
like we have the best fans in the country, the
most passionate. You know, we are we are die hard.
But what that means is, you know, we are loyal
I think above all else. So we criticize. I mean,
we are not always nice. We are not happy when
the team's not playing well. I mean, you know, but
(12:40):
but we show up. You know, we show up when
we're winning, we show up when we're losing, and we
show up when we're rebuilding.
Speaker 5 (12:46):
You know, it's just you know, for me, you know,
the joy.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Of sports is this way that sports can connect communities.
And that's you know, the athletes on the court, are
on the field, and it's the fans in the stands.
Speaker 5 (12:58):
You know, you all come from where you come from.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
But you show up and you live and share this
experience together and then it doesn't really matter so much
from where you came from. You can just connect and
you know, I think there's a real appreciation for that
here in Boston. But there's a real appreciation for winning.
So pressure's on.
Speaker 4 (13:18):
You are Massachusetts, Boston is basically championship town. I mean,
you look at the Bruins of Celtics, the Red Sox
and Patriots. My question, Jennifer is I count around fifty
five titles somewhere around there, plus or minus. How do
you cut through that noise now with Boston legacy, Like,
how do you jump out.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Of the page.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
So you know, I think our name honors and recognizes
that legacy that's here in Boston. It's the DNA of
our club, and we aspire to the standard that other
Boston teams have set. But we start out, and we've
talked about some of this already, but we start out
gathering a lot of information about our fan base. So
you know, we do have to make our mark, and
(14:01):
so we do have to have an extremely compelling, exciting
fan experience. But I think we have the opportunity to capture,
you know, some fans that haven't necessarily felt included in
all of our spaces right now in.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
In sports here in Boston.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
So we have the opportunity to get the fans that
are already going and then some and I really look
forward to sort of expanding that fan base. But you know,
Boston fans, they do have a high performance standard and
we're going to have to meet it from our very
first kick. Bostonians appreciate great sports, and so we're going
(14:38):
to have to be relentless competitors in every aspect of
how we build the club. And I think you know,
you can see that in our first hire and the
sporting side of our GM Domeguash from FC Barcelona, one
of the best women's clubs you know in the world,
that we are ensuring that we can recruit a highly
competitive roster. And it's pressure, but we're ready to try
(15:00):
and meet those expectations and actually maybe turn that pressure
into really a privilege, right, It's a privilege that we
can be here in Boston and use the performance of
our other teams here as an inspiration.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
So, Jennifer, you have a law degree.
Speaker 4 (15:16):
I think that's always a great competitive advantage for someone
in the position that you're going to embark as controlling
partner governor. But when it comes to Boston, you also
have to think about there's a different element, and it's
harder in Boston.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
It's harder in New York.
Speaker 4 (15:29):
I do believe it's harder in LA in these primary
markets where the media has such a loud voice and
such a rabbit fan base. How do you think about
your role and responsibilities dealing with the media from your position.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Now, Well, I didn't have a lot of experience, honestly,
dealing with the media prior to this role. So it's
new and I'm learning, getting more comfortable appreciating it more.
When we are launching and announcing the club. In September
twenty two, twenty three, I had the good fortune to
sit down with the Boston Globe, you know, a bunch
(16:05):
of reporters from there, and they asked me, you know,
we're we want to support women's sports.
Speaker 5 (16:08):
You know what can we do?
Speaker 1 (16:09):
And you know, one of the things I said is, well,
once we start to play, you're going to have a
beat reporter at our games, just in the same ways
that you have one at you know, at the Celtics,
at the Red Sox, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
So I think it's building.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
Relationships with the media and you know, making sure that
they cover the women's teams and the way they cover
the men's teams. Right, you're seeing such tremendous growth in
women's sports, and that's partly because of this increase in
visibility the leagues. In year two of a new media deal,
we're on four different networks. You know, the value is
forty x higher. People are starting to actually see the games.
(16:43):
You know, the product has always been exceptional, but it
was just hard to find. So I guess it's you know,
it's our responsibility to make sure that the.
Speaker 5 (16:52):
Media recognizes fans are interested.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
This is world class sports that you're seeing out there,
and please make sure and cover it.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
And you I don't need to cover it with.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
With kid gloves or like be gentle, you know, cover
it in the same way, which means critique and promote
do it all right?
Speaker 3 (17:21):
Well, speaking of critique, there was a lot of criticism
when you first came out with the original name bost
Nation and a marketing campaign that many people reacted negatively to.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
To be fair, there were a lot of people who
liked it.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
As well and loved the cheekiness of saying too many
balls you ultimately decide to change the name. Take us
into that process, because that's a deal in its own
right of making a decision, you know, admitting that, you know,
maybe you misstep originally, like take us inside those conversations
with you and your partners.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
So you know, certainly there was a lot of work
and a lot of excitement before we launched the original name,
and it was incredibly disappointing because we realized we had
missed the mark and our biggest error was that in
our effort to sort of think about the broader Boston ecosystem,
we had alienated, you know, some of our core fan base.
(18:17):
That's one of the worst things you could do, right,
And you know, that process, we had done some testing.
Speaker 5 (18:23):
But we had kept it tighter.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
We were probably overly concerned with confidentiality and trademark issues.
And so with that hiccup, I will say, well, the
positive part of that, of course, is that we learned
how much passion people have for this club.
Speaker 5 (18:37):
Okay, so there was a positive.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
It was a lot of criticism, but there was a
lot of passion and support. Really, there was support that
you know, you got to get this right and we're
going to be there for you. And so we went
back and we enlarged our testing to encompass you know,
a much broader base, and you know, we really gathered
a lot of information about our existing very invested women's
(19:01):
soccer fan base, the potential fans that will come from
all over Boston. You know, people knew to women's sports,
LGBTQ community, Hispanic audiences, and we had all those perspectives
that we brought together in both you know, with a
brand advisory group, and we went out and did more
market research and we tested names and you know, really
(19:21):
it was the same vision, this vision of championships and
impact and innovation through soccer through this club in the
heart of Boston. It was the same vision, but it
ultimately led to a much better execution and we learned
a lot.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
Yeah, how did it feel in that moment?
Speaker 3 (19:38):
I mean, were you because as you said, you know,
you're a person who's been highly successful behind the scenes.
You're a successful investor, you're a successful entrepreneur. And Alex
and I were actually talking about this offline that you know,
being a sports team owner is a different level of scrutiny,
in a different level of sort of being a public figure.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
So I wonder how you sort of go about adjusting
to that.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
It's a new experience for me. It is different running
a sports organization. You know, you said it, there's a
much higher level of public scrutiny because sports teams at
their core are community assets, right, so to have people
criticize it, it means that they're invested in what you
were doing right And you know, we really truly do
(20:24):
want to build this club within the fabric of our community,
but that's hard, and we need to think really hard
about what makes up our community and be appreciative and
realize when we make mistakes. So it was incredibly disappointing.
But you know, you mentioned also that I'm an investor,
which I am, and one of the things that I
look for in a founder because you know, I haven't
(20:46):
done very precede you know, early stage investing, and it's
hard to really make some of those decisions based on
a lot of metrics, a lot of data, because it's
not really there yet. But what I really love to
see and invest is an investor who's nimble because you're
going to.
Speaker 5 (21:03):
Face obstacles and you're going to make mistakes.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
And that's what happened to us, and as long as
you're able to react and pivot, that's when you really learn,
and that's when you are on the path to greater success.
Speaker 5 (21:16):
You know.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
It's interesting, Jennifer.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
You know I got a chance to meet to you
when you guys are first launching this and alongside your
partner Stephanie Conneton, Amy Danoff and Anna Palmer. It's such
a fascinating group of people who sort of came together
from different parts of the business and investing world. I
want you to talk a little bit about them and
sort of how you guys came together, and then I
would love to talk a little bit about even what's
(21:39):
happened in those intervening couple of years when it comes
to the business of soccer. But tell us a little
bit about how the four of you came together.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
I'm glad you mentioned my co founders because this is
a collective vision. It's certainly not a vision of just
my own, and I would not be here speaking to
you without the support of all of my partners behind
I mean, but particularly my three co founders. We didn't
all know each other really well before we came together
for this project, but we were all investing. We had
(22:11):
a connection around investing in female founders and diverse founding teams,
sort of recognizing that, you know, a plurality of voices
around the table is really what leads to long term ROI.
Speaker 5 (22:27):
You know, it's not just the right.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
Way to do business, it leads to better business. And
you know, we were all sports fans. My partner and
I was a diehard soccer fan. She's a venture capitalist,
but she's from the supporter culture. And my partner, Amy,
who runs the Women's Foundation of Boston, has been you know,
thinking about women and girls in the city of Boston
(22:49):
and how to you know, how ventures can really impact
and promote growth there. And my partner Stephanie is a marketer,
so she was at Gillette, one of the real brains
behind the venus or so it was thinking about how
you can take a product and market you know, it's
really pretty much the same product, right, but to a
corror demographic. So we all brought experience in different relevant sectors.
(23:13):
We see this as not just an opportunity to have
generational impact in the city of Boston, but we see
this as a good investment.
Speaker 5 (23:19):
You know, we're pursuing this for both reasons.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
I think we all learned of the opportunity and barely
skipped to Pete before we just jumped in, you know,
recognizing this was this was the moment to enter women's sports.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
I mean, Jennifer, one of the most interesting things when
you think about your founding team as investors is how
good an investment this already is when you look at
where valuations have gone. So walk us through where soccer was,
where women's soccer was, where it was when you came in,
and now where it is today.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
You know, when we were pitching this to our partners
into the league, it was twenty twenty two, so the
league was looking ahead towards their next media deal, which
you know now is forty x higher and you know,
on four different networks. But there was a lot of
optimism around that. Angel City and San Diego Wave had
(24:12):
just begun play. San Diego Wave brought in thirty two
thousand people to their home opener, and Angel City was
consistently selling out Bemost Stadium at nineteen thousand fans, and
CPKC had just announced they were going to build the
first purpose built stadium for a pro women's team in
the world. So you know what you were seeing is
that fans were showing up, and there was optimism around
(24:35):
potential for new media deal to broad invisibility, and owners
were investing in their clubs. These metrics were giving them
confidence to do so, and when we jumped in, it
was I mean, what a time to jump in. Expansion
fees prior to us were two to five million dollars.
We got in at the same time as the Bay
We paid fifty three and now Denver has just entered
(24:59):
the league and they paid one hundred and ten. So
I think we were correct in assessing the opportunity.
Speaker 5 (25:05):
I mean, it's a long game.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
We're in it for the long game, but it's an
upward trajectory on the rise.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
We're excited.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
So, Jennifer, that is tremendous growth in a very short
period of time, within five years, to go from two
to five to fifty three to now Denver.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
One to ten.
Speaker 4 (25:21):
I'm just curious because when you talk to some of
your limited partners and you say the number is going
to be fifty three, I'm sure there's a few that go, oh,
that's so expensive, Jennifer, is not two to five a
win a bubble? And then my question is that that happened,
and the follow up is when Denver happens at one ten,
do you pick up the phone and say, I told
(25:42):
you we bought a good price. How does that go?
It certainly has to make you feel good. That is
two x in less than two years.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
It feels good, But it's really premature to take a
victory lap.
Speaker 5 (25:52):
I think, you know, it certainly was what we hope
to see.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
But you know, we got a lot to do before
we get out for our first game. So you know,
we have to finish the rejuvenation of White Stadium. We're
building a elite performance facility for our club with the
hope that in a second phase it'll grow to be
a sports hub for youth sports. We got to build
a roster. We have a lot to do. We got
(26:18):
to finish rounding out the brand. We're launching our Crests
in early summer. So it's too early for a victory lap,
but we were certainly excited to see that growth in
that short of a period of time, and we expected
to continue as the league continues to expand.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Yeah, I think that's a little bit of an untold
tale on you know, once you get the keys handed
to you, how much work there is under that hood
and its three sixty five twenty four seven, and the
busiest time is probably your off season.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
I'm sure you've seen that.
Speaker 4 (26:47):
But when you say there's a lot of work to do,
what are maybe one or two things you can share
with us that keep you up at night.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
I don't sleep really well these days. There's there's a
lot that keeps me up at night that makes me excited. Yeah,
I am really excited, But there is you know, there's
stressing the amount that we have to accomplish to do
this really well and have a really successful launch. And
I believe we have you know, all the reasons that
we can do that, and you know, all the ingredients
(27:16):
are there, but we still have some key senior hires
to make We have some phenomenal people. We've recently, in
the past couple of months, hired our Chief revenue Officer,
Amina Bowman. She came from the Commanders, it was in
the NFL, and she's recently hired our VP of Ticketing,
who also comes from the NFL. My chief of staff,
(27:39):
my chief legal counselor. She's been with me since virtually
day one. Kim Minor, she came from Baseball, actually worked
for the Red Sox and then helped launch the Woo
Socks and build Polar Park in Worcester.
Speaker 5 (27:51):
We've just hired ahead of people. We've just hired a
creative director.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
You know, every day there's a new hire because you know,
we're going to require exceptional talent to launch this club
in the way that we want to do that. And then,
of course it'll be the really exciting part when we
actually get to announce players and they're interviewing final rounds
for head coach and have a lot of interest with
respect to players, and I expect some announcements there really
soon as well.
Speaker 5 (28:15):
So these are the things that keep me up at night.
But these are the.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Things that are you know, all really exciting, and just
the to do list is long.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
One thing that I did want to ask you, Jennifer
before we got to that is, you know, we've had
Jessica Berman, the and WSL commissioner on this show.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Just recently. Brandy Chastain has been on the show.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
We've got an upcoming episode with Melody Hobson. Jess Gelman
has been on this program. Carolyn Tish Blodgett was also
in the show. So We've talked to a lot of
folks who've been involved in this sport. One of the
things that strikes me is is, you know, without guessing
everybody up too much, it's really interesting to see the
level of expertise and the level candidly of intensity that's
(29:11):
happening on this board of governors.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
So what is that board like and how would you
characterize it?
Speaker 3 (29:16):
Again as someone who you know, you've been on investment committees,
you've been an investor, You've been involved in you know,
philanthropic work and entrepreneurial work, Like, what's the tone right
now among the governors?
Speaker 5 (29:27):
You know, there are a lot of new owners.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
There's a lot of savvy investors who've recognized that the NWSL,
should we be strategic, you know, has every ability to
be the best league in the world in the sport.
We have owners that have come from Major League Baseball,
from the NFL, will Obey and Bob Iger from Disney
(29:49):
just you know, in the past year or so acquired
the controller stake in Angel City. We have the Bethal
family who comes, you know, also from the NBA and
not only purchase the Thorns, but recently expanded into the
WNBA as well. So we have a lot of investors
that recognize the potential for growth in the NWSL specifically,
(30:11):
And I mean, this is what it's exciting to be
on that board right now, because we are building the
plane as we fly it in many respects, and it
is still a relatively young league. We have a strong
commissioner in Jessica Berman, but it's going to require, you know,
the right decisions to retain and attract the world's best
(30:33):
players here in our country and to keep having the
fans show up. I mean, there are some stadiums that
are selling out and there's some stadiums that aren't doing
as well. So, you know, how do we make sure
that fans understand the exceptional product that is out in
the field. How do we market the brand, how do
we you know, get the media properties to continue to
(30:56):
be alongside us and in the next two years, actually
grow that media deal to take us to the next chapter.
I mean, it's one of the you know, exciting things
I think about Boston joining the league. You know, we
are also a top ten media market. We're a city
of champions, and you know, I like to say there's
no league complete without Boston, and I think, and I
hope that's what they recognize when they decided to believe
(31:19):
in our vision.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
I do think to editorialize.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
I mean, this is one of the most interesting spaces
in sports right now because of all the things we've
been talking about, all the new entrants, all the investment.
The growth rate that we're seeing, I think is really
interesting general. So let's go to the lightning round really quick.
(31:50):
I'm going to start.
Speaker 5 (31:51):
You know, I don't know if I'm good at a
lightning round.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
You're gonna do great, You're gonna do great. All right,
here we go.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
What's the best piece of advice you been given on
deal making your business?
Speaker 5 (32:03):
Don't be afraid to go after opportunity.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Who's your dream deal making partner?
Speaker 1 (32:09):
I mean, how can I not say my three co founders,
Amy Kwan, dan Off, Stephanie Connatton, and Anna Palmer.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
All right, what's the most nervous you've ever been?
Speaker 4 (32:20):
Now?
Speaker 5 (32:20):
Going there?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
I'm right, I mean, now when I'm in a lightning
rod with Jason and Alex Rodriguez, and I don't have
the right answer to the question. No, I'd probably say,
you know, when we traveled to New York and we
went in front of of the League and the expansion
committee to show them what.
Speaker 5 (32:39):
Our vision was in Boston and pitch our bid.
Speaker 4 (32:45):
What's your hype song before a big meeting or negotiation?
Speaker 5 (32:50):
Beyonce, who Run the World?
Speaker 2 (32:53):
I love it all right?
Speaker 3 (32:54):
What's your advice for someone listening who what's a career
like yours?
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Recognize that it's often a long game, and that there
are different chapters to a career, and they all lead
to something, and each chapter may not be as fulfilling
as the one that comes after it. But if you
work really hard and you recognize and take advantage of
every opportunity that comes your way, you know you're gonna
(33:18):
achieve what you want to achieve.
Speaker 5 (33:19):
I mean, honestly, I actually.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
If you had asked me when I was in my
twenties if I was going to be where I am
right now, I would never have been able to tell
you that. I have had different chapters of my career.
I was a lawyer, I launched a hospitality business and
open restaurants in the Boston area. I'm an investor, and
now I'm doing something that I think I have never
been more passionate about. So stay the course. They'll get there.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
All right, Well, that was great. Thank you so much,
Jennifer Epstein.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
She is the controlling manager of the Boston Legacy Football
Club and WSL team taking the pitch next season. A
lot of work to do, as she said, doing now
and then. Really fun to spend some time with you.
Thank you so much, Thank you, Jennifer, Thank you.
Speaker 1 (34:01):
So much for having me. It was lots of fun.
Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Good luck.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and me Jason Kelly.
This episode was made by Anamazarakus, Stacey Wong, and Lizzie Phillip.
Amy Keen is our editor and Will Connelly is our
video editor. Our theme music is made by Blake Maples.
Our executive producers are Kelly Leferrier, Ashley Hoenig, and Brendan
neonham Sage Bauman is the head of Bloomberg Podcast. Additional
(34:36):
support from Rachel Carnivale and Elena Los Angeles. Thanks so
much for listening to the Deal. If you have a minute, subscribe,
rate and review our show. It'll help other listeners find us.
I'm Jason Kelly.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
See you next week.
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Welcome back to the Deal.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I'm your host, Jason Kelly alongside my partner Alex Rodriguez.
All right, Alex, you are in Los Angeles. We're recording
this on Tuesday. You've got a massive game coming up,
so by the time people hear this, you will either
be onto the next round or you're gonna have another
big game coming up. But I have to do a
beat with you about this game. Over the weekend, I
(00:36):
watched every minute of it on TV. You were obviously
there in Minnesota. I gotta say I was watching a
lot of basketball this weekend. I don't think there was
an arena that had anything like the.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Energy that the Target Center did.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
It was a wild weekend in Minnesota, I gotta tell you.
And our fan base just showed up in the biggest
way for the biggest games. I mean, back to back.
It was so fun Friday and Sunday. And I'm not
saying that just because we won. I mean both games
honestly could have gone either way. We could be down
three to one, just like we're up three to one.
So exciting and a lot of interests in Minnesota.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Yeah, and so tell me about that interest, because obviously,
you know, a lot of it is about the matchups.
People are tuning in in a really meaningful way.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
It sounds like they are.
Speaker 4 (01:24):
And Jason, the thing that jumped off the page for
me is I had a friend who flew in from
New York and he needed tickets and there was no
floor tickets available. He ended up buying one ticket for
seventeen thousand, five hundred, and then he cut a deal
with a broker and he got thirty thousand for two games,
so he paid fifteen for each. And I said, my goodness,
(01:45):
that's insane.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
In Minneapolis, Minnesota.
Speaker 4 (01:48):
In Minneapolis, yes, they love their basketball and they're hungry.
And we have a team that's now been together. You know,
the thing that I've learned in sports is one of
the most powerful arbitrages is youth and experience with talent.
And we have three guys that were drafted five years
ago together in nas reed Jada McDaniels and Anthony Edwards.
(02:10):
And Anthony Edwards is growing up right in front of America.
I mean, we've known this in Minneapolis. I think the
world is getting to see how special this young man is.
Speaker 3 (02:18):
Yeah, it's a big moment for the NBA. I feel
like these playoffs are just electric if you look across everything.
I know, we talk about it every week on the show,
but it continues to be true. All right, So you're
going to be there. Then you and I are going
to link up in Miami. We've got a huge week
coming up for the deal. We are tying it very
directly to I mean, you live there. I mean you're
there some of the time. I feel like you're everywhere
(02:40):
these days. But I spent a lot of time in
Miami too. But I'm coming down F one weekend. This
has become something that people just pin on their calendars.
We're going to catch up with Susie Wolf. She is
the managing director of F one Academy. She's a force
to be reckoned with. This is the all female racing
circuit within F one. Miami is one of the places
(03:04):
where they run the F one Academy races. There's a
lot of excitement around that they're premiering a new Netflix
series all about F one Academy. So I'm just I'm
so psyched to talk to her.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
And she's really exciting.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
I mean, she's got an incredible story her father was
in the auto business as well. She recently told me,
and I know you spent some time with her as well,
that the first time she got behind the wheel, she
was two years old.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
Yeah, and at ten she was starting to.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
Kind of drive the gold carts around and she was
always the only female. And I think you'll hear from
her like, what are those numbers back then when she
was ten versus now when she's forty two.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Yeah, So really excited for that conversation that'll come up
in a few weeks on your feed, So stay tuned
for that. The other person we're catching up with down
to Miami, he lives down there now, Josh Harris.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
What a time to catch up with this.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Guy, because probably one of the biggest single deals in
the sports world that's happened in a long time, a
much anticipated deal for a new stadium in Washington, DC
announced this week. Josh Harris. I read someone said, Josh
Harris got done in a very short amount of time.
What it took in twenty four months, basically what in
(04:13):
Snyder couldn't get done in twenty four years, which is
a new stadium for the Washington Commanders.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
This is a massive deal it's a massive deal.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
And that's why these owners are so important, right because
Josh Harris, who has over three and a half decades
in private equity with Apollo. You know, the way he
bought the Sixers deal was a corporate carve out, just
like his LBO days, and he bought it from Comcast
at Snyder, who's you know, the legendary at Snyder. And
you've seen what he's done, such a great job with
the Sixers and how he's transformed that you know, trust
(04:40):
the process or it has worked. And now with the Commanders.
I mean you know this, you went to school right
down the street, and the political landscape that you have
to navigate, it takes someone like Josh Harris and his
ownership group to do such great work in such a
short period of time.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Yeah, it's amazing too, and we're going to talk to
him about this again. That's an episode that'll come up
in the next few weeks, talk about the fact that
DC has done two massive deals for stadiums, one with
Josh Harrison, one with a previous guest on the show,
Ted Leonsis. So that's what we've got going on this week.
Coming out today, another really interesting deal maker a new
team and altogether new team coming onto the scene, Boston Legacy,
(05:17):
that of course is one of the newest teams coming
onto the pitch next year for the National Women Soccer League.
We catch up with the controlling owner there, Jennifer Epstein,
her family, of course, part of the group that just
sold the Boston Celtics for a record six point one
billion dollars. We talked to her about that and about
what the Legacy is going to mean for one of
(05:38):
the biggest sports cities in the world.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
That's coming up.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Hi, everyone, welcome back to the Deal. I'm your host,
Jason Kelly, alongside my co host and partner Alex Rodriguez.
So excited to be here today with Jennifer Epstein, the
controlling owner of the Boston Legacy football Club. She's got
a long history in sports and we're so excited to
get into all of it.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Jennifer, great to be with you.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Thanks so much for having me. Jason, great to be here,
Thank you, Alex.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
So we have a lot to talk about.
Speaker 3 (06:19):
We want to talk a little lot about soccer, but
let's first talk about that banner that is right behind you.
Twenty twenty four World champion Boston Celtics. It's a moment
we all remember. Your family was part of the ownership
group of the Boston Celtics, going back to that two
thousand and two purchase for what seemed like a crazy
amount of money at the time three hundred and sixty
(06:40):
million dollars and obviously the more recent transaction sold for
six point one billion dollars, a record across the board.
Tell us about that journey, like what was it like
to be sort of in it two championships over the
course of ownership, Like what do you take away from
that experience.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I just feel like it was such an honor and
privilege to be involved with that organization.
Speaker 5 (07:04):
I mean, it starts out.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
I'm a diehard Boston sports fan, grew up in Boston,
had a real intergenerational connection with my father around sports.
Speaker 5 (07:12):
He's a huge.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
Lover of the game, but is only five foot eight,
so a career as a player.
Speaker 5 (07:17):
Was not going to happen.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
But in two thousand and two he filled a lifelong
dream and became a managing partner of the Celtics. And
Wick Grossbeck, who has led that team, has really just
built an extraordinary organization.
Speaker 5 (07:31):
You mentioned two championships.
Speaker 1 (07:32):
They've made an incredible impact on and off the court
and as you said, driven the valuation of that team
over the past twenty three years, you know, seventeen X
to you know, an upcoming biggest sports team sale in
North American history. So there's lots to be inspired by
in that model. From my vantage point, i'd say, you know,
(07:54):
it's an organization where from the players and everyone evolved.
They have bought into this idea that it's team before
self and you're not always going to win championships, but
you're going to compete for championships always. And you know,
it's a team that has always recognized the responsibility to
have impact both on and off the court. And so
you know, that's what we're trying to do at Boston Legacy.
(08:17):
You know, we realize that we have to be fielding
a team that is competing for championships all the time,
and you know, we are really also, i think, setting
a new standard for how sports franchises can connect to
their community by redefining what a team's commitment to social
impact really can be. And that's through our public private
(08:37):
partnership with the City of Boston and the Boston Public
schools as we renovate a stadium.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
To be our home pitch.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
I guess my question goes back to the Boston Celtics.
You guys have been part of his ownership now for
over two decades. When you can receive that call, is
is there a little bittersweetness? Is it like, eya, we're
going to make a great return, or is it like, oh,
we really enjoyed this investment and to be here.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
How do you feel about it?
Speaker 5 (09:03):
So bittersweet?
Speaker 1 (09:04):
At my heart, I'm a fan and I still will
always be a fan, and I will look forward to,
you know, going to games for the rest of my life.
I may not have quite as good seats, but there'll
be an adjustment just because you.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
Know, I'm a fan.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
But it's also I have relationships with a lot of
people within that organization and a real respect for them,
and you know, it will change and I won't have
that same window to kind of the inner workings of
that organization.
Speaker 5 (09:38):
So yes, it'll be bittersweet.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
But it's been a phenomenal twenty three years and it's
taking me to places that I didn't anticipate. I would,
you know, necessarily go riding the duck boats down Boyleston
Street with two million fans cheering for the Celtics, I mean,
you know, and and really helped position me to now
launch this Club Boston legacy that I hope I will
also be writing down the Duck Boats celebrating a championship
(10:03):
with two million fans, where you know there are female
athletes who are the focus of the celebration.
Speaker 4 (10:10):
So, Jennifer, you mentioned Vick, who's a controlling partner of
the Boston Celtics and has really done a phenomenal job.
If you go just fifty thousand feet, what he's done
with that franchise for over twenty years, two tighters, all
of that is pretty incredible. But I guess he's also
one of the most respected governors and revered governors in
the NBA board, which tells you a lot about who
(10:31):
he is a character. What lessons can you take for
him as you embark in your controlling governor in the
world of soccer.
Speaker 1 (10:41):
I mean, I think he's always had a real respect
for his partners and a real respect for his players,
and you know, a real respect for the community and
his fans, and just you know, everything that he's done
has really honored that respect. And commitment to the city
of Boston. In Boston, you know there's a lot of
(11:03):
pressure here too. We have such a legacy of championships.
Speaker 5 (11:07):
Here in our city.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
How do we show that respect where the stewards really
have a public asset right as owners of a sports team.
If we do this correctly, you know, we don't know
the team. The whole city owns the team, right. And
these are some of the lessons that I've I take,
by example, from from Wick.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
You led me exactly where I was hoping we would go, Jennifer,
which is the Boston of it all. You know, I'm
here in New York, and you know, I'm sitting virtually
alongside a New York Yankee, former New York Yankee, who
may have his own feelings about your sports teams and
sort of what they've done to other teams over the
course of the last twenty five years. Especially, you know,
(11:48):
I mean, I'm watching this, you know, great documentary about
the Celtics, this great docuseries that Bill Simmons produced.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
It's unbelievable, you know, the history.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
I mean, every time you turn around, there's like this
other name where you think, even beyond the people that
we obviously associate with the Celtics. You know, they're more
who are just so tied to that franchise then, you know,
than the Patriots, than the Bruins, than the Red Sox.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
Sorry Alex, but like, what is it about the fans?
Speaker 3 (12:14):
What is it about the city that is unique when
it comes to sports.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
I mean, I love Boston sports fans. I really feel
like we have the best fans in the country, the
most passionate. You know, we are we are die hard.
But what that means is, you know, we are loyal
I think above all else. So we criticize. I mean,
we are not always nice. We are not happy when
the team's not playing well. I mean, you know, but
(12:40):
but we show up. You know, we show up when
we're winning, we show up when we're losing, and we
show up when we're rebuilding.
Speaker 5 (12:46):
You know, it's just you know, for me, you know,
the joy.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Of sports is this way that sports can connect communities.
And that's you know, the athletes on the court, are
on the field, and it's the fans in the stands.
Speaker 5 (12:58):
You know, you all come from where you come from.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
But you show up and you live and share this
experience together and then it doesn't really matter so much
from where you came from. You can just connect and
you know, I think there's a real appreciation for that
here in Boston. But there's a real appreciation for winning.
So pressure's on.
Speaker 4 (13:18):
You are Massachusetts, Boston is basically championship town. I mean,
you look at the Bruins of Celtics, the Red Sox
and Patriots. My question, Jennifer is I count around fifty
five titles somewhere around there, plus or minus. How do
you cut through that noise now with Boston legacy, Like,
how do you jump out.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Of the page.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
So you know, I think our name honors and recognizes
that legacy that's here in Boston. It's the DNA of
our club, and we aspire to the standard that other
Boston teams have set. But we start out, and we've
talked about some of this already, but we start out
gathering a lot of information about our fan base. So
you know, we do have to make our mark, and
(14:01):
so we do have to have an extremely compelling, exciting
fan experience. But I think we have the opportunity to capture,
you know, some fans that haven't necessarily felt included in
all of our spaces right now in.
Speaker 5 (14:15):
In sports here in Boston.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
So we have the opportunity to get the fans that
are already going and then some and I really look
forward to sort of expanding that fan base. But you know,
Boston fans, they do have a high performance standard and
we're going to have to meet it from our very
first kick. Bostonians appreciate great sports, and so we're going
(14:38):
to have to be relentless competitors in every aspect of
how we build the club. And I think you know,
you can see that in our first hire and the
sporting side of our GM Domeguash from FC Barcelona, one
of the best women's clubs you know in the world,
that we are ensuring that we can recruit a highly
competitive roster. And it's pressure, but we're ready to try
(15:00):
and meet those expectations and actually maybe turn that pressure
into really a privilege, right, It's a privilege that we
can be here in Boston and use the performance of
our other teams here as an inspiration.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
So, Jennifer, you have a law degree.
Speaker 4 (15:16):
I think that's always a great competitive advantage for someone
in the position that you're going to embark as controlling
partner governor. But when it comes to Boston, you also
have to think about there's a different element, and it's
harder in Boston.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
It's harder in New York.
Speaker 4 (15:29):
I do believe it's harder in LA in these primary
markets where the media has such a loud voice and
such a rabbit fan base. How do you think about
your role and responsibilities dealing with the media from your position.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Now, Well, I didn't have a lot of experience, honestly,
dealing with the media prior to this role. So it's
new and I'm learning, getting more comfortable appreciating it more.
When we are launching and announcing the club. In September
twenty two, twenty three, I had the good fortune to
sit down with the Boston Globe, you know, a bunch
(16:05):
of reporters from there, and they asked me, you know,
we're we want to support women's sports.
Speaker 5 (16:08):
You know what can we do?
Speaker 1 (16:09):
And you know, one of the things I said is, well,
once we start to play, you're going to have a
beat reporter at our games, just in the same ways
that you have one at you know, at the Celtics,
at the Red Sox, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
So I think it's building.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
Relationships with the media and you know, making sure that
they cover the women's teams and the way they cover
the men's teams. Right, you're seeing such tremendous growth in
women's sports, and that's partly because of this increase in
visibility the leagues. In year two of a new media deal,
we're on four different networks. You know, the value is
forty x higher. People are starting to actually see the games.
(16:43):
You know, the product has always been exceptional, but it
was just hard to find. So I guess it's you know,
it's our responsibility to make sure that the.
Speaker 5 (16:52):
Media recognizes fans are interested.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
This is world class sports that you're seeing out there,
and please make sure and cover it.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
And you I don't need to cover it with.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
With kid gloves or like be gentle, you know, cover
it in the same way, which means critique and promote
do it all right?
Speaker 3 (17:21):
Well, speaking of critique, there was a lot of criticism
when you first came out with the original name bost
Nation and a marketing campaign that many people reacted negatively to.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
To be fair, there were a lot of people who
liked it.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
As well and loved the cheekiness of saying too many
balls you ultimately decide to change the name. Take us
into that process, because that's a deal in its own
right of making a decision, you know, admitting that, you know,
maybe you misstep originally, like take us inside those conversations
with you and your partners.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
So you know, certainly there was a lot of work
and a lot of excitement before we launched the original name,
and it was incredibly disappointing because we realized we had
missed the mark and our biggest error was that in
our effort to sort of think about the broader Boston ecosystem,
we had alienated, you know, some of our core fan base.
(18:17):
That's one of the worst things you could do, right,
And you know, that process, we had done some testing.
Speaker 5 (18:23):
But we had kept it tighter.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
We were probably overly concerned with confidentiality and trademark issues.
And so with that hiccup, I will say, well, the
positive part of that, of course, is that we learned
how much passion people have for this club.
Speaker 5 (18:37):
Okay, so there was a positive.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
It was a lot of criticism, but there was a
lot of passion and support. Really, there was support that
you know, you got to get this right and we're
going to be there for you. And so we went
back and we enlarged our testing to encompass you know,
a much broader base, and you know, we really gathered
a lot of information about our existing very invested women's
(19:01):
soccer fan base, the potential fans that will come from
all over Boston. You know, people knew to women's sports,
LGBTQ community, Hispanic audiences, and we had all those perspectives
that we brought together in both you know, with a
brand advisory group, and we went out and did more
market research and we tested names and you know, really
(19:21):
it was the same vision, this vision of championships and
impact and innovation through soccer through this club in the
heart of Boston. It was the same vision, but it
ultimately led to a much better execution and we learned
a lot.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
Yeah, how did it feel in that moment?
Speaker 3 (19:38):
I mean, were you because as you said, you know,
you're a person who's been highly successful behind the scenes.
You're a successful investor, you're a successful entrepreneur. And Alex
and I were actually talking about this offline that you know,
being a sports team owner is a different level of scrutiny,
in a different level of sort of being a public figure.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
So I wonder how you sort of go about adjusting
to that.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
It's a new experience for me. It is different running
a sports organization. You know, you said it, there's a
much higher level of public scrutiny because sports teams at
their core are community assets, right, so to have people
criticize it, it means that they're invested in what you
were doing right And you know, we really truly do
(20:24):
want to build this club within the fabric of our community,
but that's hard, and we need to think really hard
about what makes up our community and be appreciative and
realize when we make mistakes. So it was incredibly disappointing.
But you know, you mentioned also that I'm an investor,
which I am, and one of the things that I
look for in a founder because you know, I haven't
(20:46):
done very precede you know, early stage investing, and it's
hard to really make some of those decisions based on
a lot of metrics, a lot of data, because it's
not really there yet. But what I really love to
see and invest is an investor who's nimble because you're
going to.
Speaker 5 (21:03):
Face obstacles and you're going to make mistakes.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
And that's what happened to us, and as long as
you're able to react and pivot, that's when you really learn,
and that's when you are on the path to greater success.
Speaker 5 (21:16):
You know.
Speaker 2 (21:16):
It's interesting, Jennifer.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
You know I got a chance to meet to you
when you guys are first launching this and alongside your
partner Stephanie Conneton, Amy Danoff and Anna Palmer. It's such
a fascinating group of people who sort of came together
from different parts of the business and investing world. I
want you to talk a little bit about them and
sort of how you guys came together, and then I
would love to talk a little bit about even what's
(21:39):
happened in those intervening couple of years when it comes
to the business of soccer. But tell us a little
bit about how the four of you came together.
Speaker 1 (21:47):
I'm glad you mentioned my co founders because this is
a collective vision. It's certainly not a vision of just
my own, and I would not be here speaking to
you without the support of all of my partners behind
I mean, but particularly my three co founders. We didn't
all know each other really well before we came together
for this project, but we were all investing. We had
(22:11):
a connection around investing in female founders and diverse founding teams,
sort of recognizing that, you know, a plurality of voices
around the table is really what leads to long term ROI.
Speaker 5 (22:27):
You know, it's not just the right.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
Way to do business, it leads to better business. And
you know, we were all sports fans. My partner and
I was a diehard soccer fan. She's a venture capitalist,
but she's from the supporter culture. And my partner, Amy,
who runs the Women's Foundation of Boston, has been you know,
thinking about women and girls in the city of Boston
(22:49):
and how to you know, how ventures can really impact
and promote growth there. And my partner Stephanie is a marketer,
so she was at Gillette, one of the real brains
behind the venus or so it was thinking about how
you can take a product and market you know, it's
really pretty much the same product, right, but to a
corror demographic. So we all brought experience in different relevant sectors.
(23:13):
We see this as not just an opportunity to have
generational impact in the city of Boston, but we see
this as a good investment.
Speaker 5 (23:19):
You know, we're pursuing this for both reasons.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
I think we all learned of the opportunity and barely
skipped to Pete before we just jumped in, you know,
recognizing this was this was the moment to enter women's sports.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
I mean, Jennifer, one of the most interesting things when
you think about your founding team as investors is how
good an investment this already is when you look at
where valuations have gone. So walk us through where soccer was,
where women's soccer was, where it was when you came in,
and now where it is today.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
You know, when we were pitching this to our partners
into the league, it was twenty twenty two, so the
league was looking ahead towards their next media deal, which
you know now is forty x higher and you know,
on four different networks. But there was a lot of
optimism around that. Angel City and San Diego Wave had
(24:12):
just begun play. San Diego Wave brought in thirty two
thousand people to their home opener, and Angel City was
consistently selling out Bemost Stadium at nineteen thousand fans, and
CPKC had just announced they were going to build the
first purpose built stadium for a pro women's team in
the world. So you know what you were seeing is
that fans were showing up, and there was optimism around
(24:35):
potential for new media deal to broad invisibility, and owners
were investing in their clubs. These metrics were giving them
confidence to do so, and when we jumped in, it
was I mean, what a time to jump in. Expansion
fees prior to us were two to five million dollars.
We got in at the same time as the Bay
We paid fifty three and now Denver has just entered
(24:59):
the league and they paid one hundred and ten. So
I think we were correct in assessing the opportunity.
Speaker 5 (25:05):
I mean, it's a long game.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
We're in it for the long game, but it's an
upward trajectory on the rise.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
We're excited.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
So, Jennifer, that is tremendous growth in a very short
period of time, within five years, to go from two
to five to fifty three to now Denver.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
One to ten.
Speaker 4 (25:21):
I'm just curious because when you talk to some of
your limited partners and you say the number is going
to be fifty three, I'm sure there's a few that go, oh,
that's so expensive, Jennifer, is not two to five a
win a bubble? And then my question is that that happened,
and the follow up is when Denver happens at one ten,
do you pick up the phone and say, I told
(25:42):
you we bought a good price. How does that go?
It certainly has to make you feel good. That is
two x in less than two years.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
It feels good, But it's really premature to take a
victory lap.
Speaker 5 (25:52):
I think, you know, it certainly was what we hope
to see.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
But you know, we got a lot to do before
we get out for our first game. So you know,
we have to finish the rejuvenation of White Stadium. We're
building a elite performance facility for our club with the
hope that in a second phase it'll grow to be
a sports hub for youth sports. We got to build
a roster. We have a lot to do. We got
(26:18):
to finish rounding out the brand. We're launching our Crests
in early summer. So it's too early for a victory lap,
but we were certainly excited to see that growth in
that short of a period of time, and we expected
to continue as the league continues to expand.
Speaker 4 (26:33):
Yeah, I think that's a little bit of an untold
tale on you know, once you get the keys handed
to you, how much work there is under that hood
and its three sixty five twenty four seven, and the
busiest time is probably your off season.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
I'm sure you've seen that.
Speaker 4 (26:47):
But when you say there's a lot of work to do,
what are maybe one or two things you can share
with us that keep you up at night.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
I don't sleep really well these days. There's there's a
lot that keeps me up at night that makes me excited. Yeah,
I am really excited, But there is you know, there's
stressing the amount that we have to accomplish to do
this really well and have a really successful launch. And
I believe we have you know, all the reasons that
we can do that, and you know, all the ingredients
(27:16):
are there, but we still have some key senior hires
to make We have some phenomenal people. We've recently, in
the past couple of months, hired our Chief revenue Officer,
Amina Bowman. She came from the Commanders, it was in
the NFL, and she's recently hired our VP of Ticketing,
who also comes from the NFL. My chief of staff,
(27:39):
my chief legal counselor. She's been with me since virtually
day one. Kim Minor, she came from Baseball, actually worked
for the Red Sox and then helped launch the Woo
Socks and build Polar Park in Worcester.
Speaker 5 (27:51):
We've just hired ahead of people. We've just hired a
creative director.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
You know, every day there's a new hire because you know,
we're going to require exceptional talent to launch this club
in the way that we want to do that. And then,
of course it'll be the really exciting part when we
actually get to announce players and they're interviewing final rounds
for head coach and have a lot of interest with
respect to players, and I expect some announcements there really
soon as well.
Speaker 5 (28:15):
So these are the things that keep me up at night.
But these are the.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
Things that are you know, all really exciting, and just
the to do list is long.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
One thing that I did want to ask you, Jennifer
before we got to that is, you know, we've had
Jessica Berman, the and WSL commissioner on this show.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Just recently. Brandy Chastain has been on the show.
Speaker 3 (28:46):
We've got an upcoming episode with Melody Hobson. Jess Gelman
has been on this program. Carolyn Tish Blodgett was also
in the show. So We've talked to a lot of
folks who've been involved in this sport. One of the
things that strikes me is is, you know, without guessing
everybody up too much, it's really interesting to see the
level of expertise and the level candidly of intensity that's
(29:11):
happening on this board of governors.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
So what is that board like and how would you
characterize it?
Speaker 3 (29:16):
Again as someone who you know, you've been on investment committees,
you've been an investor, You've been involved in you know,
philanthropic work and entrepreneurial work, Like, what's the tone right
now among the governors?
Speaker 5 (29:27):
You know, there are a lot of new owners.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
There's a lot of savvy investors who've recognized that the NWSL,
should we be strategic, you know, has every ability to
be the best league in the world in the sport.
We have owners that have come from Major League Baseball,
from the NFL, will Obey and Bob Iger from Disney
(29:49):
just you know, in the past year or so acquired
the controller stake in Angel City. We have the Bethal
family who comes, you know, also from the NBA and
not only purchase the Thorns, but recently expanded into the
WNBA as well. So we have a lot of investors
that recognize the potential for growth in the NWSL specifically,
(30:11):
And I mean, this is what it's exciting to be
on that board right now, because we are building the
plane as we fly it in many respects, and it
is still a relatively young league. We have a strong
commissioner in Jessica Berman, but it's going to require, you know,
the right decisions to retain and attract the world's best
(30:33):
players here in our country and to keep having the
fans show up. I mean, there are some stadiums that
are selling out and there's some stadiums that aren't doing
as well. So, you know, how do we make sure
that fans understand the exceptional product that is out in
the field. How do we market the brand, how do
we you know, get the media properties to continue to
(30:56):
be alongside us and in the next two years, actually
grow that media deal to take us to the next chapter.
I mean, it's one of the you know, exciting things
I think about Boston joining the league. You know, we
are also a top ten media market. We're a city
of champions, and you know, I like to say there's
no league complete without Boston, and I think, and I
hope that's what they recognize when they decided to believe
(31:19):
in our vision.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
I do think to editorialize.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
I mean, this is one of the most interesting spaces
in sports right now because of all the things we've
been talking about, all the new entrants, all the investment.
The growth rate that we're seeing, I think is really
interesting general. So let's go to the lightning round really quick.
(31:50):
I'm going to start.
Speaker 5 (31:51):
You know, I don't know if I'm good at a
lightning round.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
You're gonna do great, You're gonna do great. All right,
here we go.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
What's the best piece of advice you been given on
deal making your business?
Speaker 5 (32:03):
Don't be afraid to go after opportunity.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
Who's your dream deal making partner?
Speaker 1 (32:09):
I mean, how can I not say my three co founders,
Amy Kwan, dan Off, Stephanie Connatton, and Anna Palmer.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
All right, what's the most nervous you've ever been?
Speaker 4 (32:20):
Now?
Speaker 5 (32:20):
Going there?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
I'm right, I mean, now when I'm in a lightning
rod with Jason and Alex Rodriguez, and I don't have
the right answer to the question. No, I'd probably say,
you know, when we traveled to New York and we
went in front of of the League and the expansion
committee to show them what.
Speaker 5 (32:39):
Our vision was in Boston and pitch our bid.
Speaker 4 (32:45):
What's your hype song before a big meeting or negotiation?
Speaker 5 (32:50):
Beyonce, who Run the World?
Speaker 2 (32:53):
I love it all right?
Speaker 3 (32:54):
What's your advice for someone listening who what's a career
like yours?
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Recognize that it's often a long game, and that there
are different chapters to a career, and they all lead
to something, and each chapter may not be as fulfilling
as the one that comes after it. But if you
work really hard and you recognize and take advantage of
every opportunity that comes your way, you know you're gonna
(33:18):
achieve what you want to achieve.
Speaker 5 (33:19):
I mean, honestly, I actually.
Speaker 1 (33:21):
If you had asked me when I was in my
twenties if I was going to be where I am
right now, I would never have been able to tell
you that. I have had different chapters of my career.
I was a lawyer, I launched a hospitality business and
open restaurants in the Boston area. I'm an investor, and
now I'm doing something that I think I have never
been more passionate about. So stay the course. They'll get there.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
All right, Well, that was great. Thank you so much,
Jennifer Epstein.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
She is the controlling manager of the Boston Legacy Football
Club and WSL team taking the pitch next season. A
lot of work to do, as she said, doing now
and then. Really fun to spend some time with you.
Thank you so much, Thank you, Jennifer, Thank you.
Speaker 1 (34:01):
So much for having me. It was lots of fun.
Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Good luck.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and me Jason Kelly.
This episode was made by Anamazarakus, Stacey Wong, and Lizzie Phillip.
Amy Keen is our editor and Will Connelly is our
video editor. Our theme music is made by Blake Maples.
Our executive producers are Kelly Leferrier, Ashley Hoenig, and Brendan
neonham Sage Bauman is the head of Bloomberg Podcast. Additional
(34:36):
support from Rachel Carnivale and Elena Los Angeles. Thanks so
much for listening to the Deal. If you have a minute, subscribe,
rate and review our show. It'll help other listeners find us.
I'm Jason Kelly.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
See you next week.
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