February 16, 2023 • 56 mins
Jalen Rose joins ‘The Draymond Green Show’ to discuss his experience being a pioneer of active NBA players doing media, what it’s like to open up a charter school, why finishing his college degree was important, why he and the Fab 5 feel under appreciated by Michigan, who he’s picking for NBA MVP and Finals matchup, and how his lack of a relationship with his father impacted him.
Produced by: Jackson Safon
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
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Last minute tickets Lord's Price guaranteed. What's up, everybody, Welcome
back to the Draymond Green Show. I am excited to
have this next guest. Um, in my opinion, the founding
(01:47):
father of the Five five, the leader, UM, the person
who really embodied that spirit. Now, as you know, I
can't really be too fond of that, being that it's
from the other school. However, you know, you grow up
in the state of Michigan. Really, you grow up anywhere,
and you watch basketball. If you know anything, you knew
something about the Five five, and obviously growing up in
(02:09):
the state of Michigan, it's all right there. From Detroit
Southwestern High schoolte pick in the NBA Draft by the
Denver Nuggets, Jalen Rose my brother more like more like
an uncle of mine. I appreciate you for coming on,
Welcome to the show. Appreciate the love you're killing and
keep doing your thing. Absolutely, I appreciate you, I mean
(02:31):
just getting right into it. Um. I get a lot
of credit for being the first active player. UM doing
TV that's actually you, that's actually you. How how did
you go about way back I think in two thousand
and six you did the playoffs, you were still playing.
(02:52):
How did you go about way back then? And um
saying I'm gonna start doing media right now as an
active player. So the crazy thing is like growing up
in the city, being a fan of the game, looking
up to the bad boys, looking up to Magic Johnson.
But also my favorite athletes had personality. They were flamboyant.
(03:16):
They do only not only dressed loud like Diana Sanders
or Clyde Fraser, but they also talked loud like Mohammad Ali,
and those voices is something that I always appreciated, following
Kareem Abdul Jabbar and Bill Russell and just how they
were athletes, but they were more than jocks. And so
(03:38):
when I got to college when it was trying to
pick a major, I wanted communications to be that. So
Radio TV Film became my major and I took those
classes at Michigan, went there three years, eventually went back
and got my degree. So while I was playing in
the league, and it's crazy how this works. I remember
(04:00):
feeling like like you're a good player, but you ain't magic,
you know what I'm saying. And that happed me one day,
like like, you got a chance to do this for
a while, but you need to find something else to do,
you know what I'm saying. And my first couple of
years starting and coming off the bench and then getting
(04:22):
trade to Indiana with Larry Brown gave me fifteen d
m p s. I was like, I don't know if
I'm gonna have a thirteen year career. So I started
to figure other things that I could do in the
game that I love. And once I got traded from
the Patients to the Bulls, it was February this time
of the year and the team had nine wins and like,
(04:44):
I'm like, we ain't going to the playoffs for Shure.
So this was two thousand and two. I reached out
to a contact and B team, Matt Sports, because I
had just done the show and I just done one
O six in part, and I pitched the idea for
e T to let me cover the finals for them.
At the time, it was New Jersey Nets and the Lakers.
(05:07):
I was like, just sending the camera, I'll get the access,
I'll do all of that. So they trusted me they
did it, so they sent the cameras, we cut it,
we spiced it, we edited, they showed it on TV
and then I pitched that same idea to the Best
Dance Sports Show the next year, and they already had
big Bro John Sally who was doing TV and at
(05:29):
the time, Jason Williams from the Nets. I saw him
doing some stuff with NBC while he was still playing
and the mad Rashot. I saw him kind of more
from doing football to doing basketball. So those are guys.
I was like, you know what, I'm about to try
to do this while I'm playing. So they hired me.
So I was in the league two thousand and three
(05:50):
to two thousand and seven playing while I was still
working for Best Dance Sports Show, MTV Movie Awards. I
was doing halftime with Bill Walton and Snapper. I was
doing boxing for Top Rank. I was doing all of
that stuff. And so when I retired to two thousand
and seven and I was doing sideline for T and T.
(06:10):
I worked with T and T for a couple of years.
The famous video Nick Vanax and my brother throwing the
towel at me when I was standing on the sideline
and I just kept going and so in two thousand
and seven when I retired, that's when I started working
full time for ESPN. That's I actually didn't even know
about all the BT stuff. So I appreciate that. I
(06:33):
think UM did when I started this podcast last year,
and you know, maybe a little different because I was
doing it after game, but I caught a lot of
heat for actively doing a podcast and providing the content
that I was providing during the final, during the playoffs,
during the finals, I caught a lot of heat for
(06:54):
when you first started doing that. Did you catch a
lot of heat? And I know it's different, but it
wasn't social media and all of that stuff, But did
you catch heat for that when you first started doing it? Absolutely, Because,
as you know, in order to be colorful and or
good at this job, that means you gotta say something.
There's a lot of people that's vanilla and don't say nothing.
(07:15):
But you and I are strong will, strong opinion, and
we ain't scared to stand on it. And what ends
on how ends up happening, is why you still playing.
I'm still running into these players, into these coaches, into
the managers, into the agents and the fans also, and
so guys used to sometimes take it personal. Oh man,
(07:37):
how are you gonna call me out like that? Or whatever?
I'm like, dog, you had six points and eight turnovers,
like what you expect me to say? You know what
I'm saying, like And what ends up happening is people
start to earn your You start to earn the respect
of the players and of the coaches and of everybody
(07:58):
when they know when you speak, not only are you knowledgeable,
but it ain't personal, Like I ain't got nothing personal
against you. I'm just saying what I see, giving my opinion.
When you do poor, I'm gonna say it. When you
do great, I'm gonna big you up. And I know
you noticed this quick. You can big up people all
day and they never shout you. They never say thank you,
(08:19):
they never give love. But soon as you criticize them
or call him out for some bs that they did,
then they want to add you. Then they want to
get but hurt. And so that's when I learned at
that time, I'm gonna just stay authentic, be authentic to myself.
And when I started to do that, I started to
see me get results. You know. One of the one
(08:42):
of the things that I wanted to do, especially that
I'm actively playing is. I felt like I needed to
find a balance of like um authenticity and telling the
truth UM and being very critical, but doing it in
a way where like, I still got to play these guys.
I still have to play possibly with some of these guys.
(09:04):
And I felt like that was one of the biggest
things that I adjustments that I had to make and
go on in the TV right now. And I spoke
about this before one one instant that made me really
happy because it was actually my first time doing T
and T UM. I was doing the segment or and
(09:25):
we were doing the Denver Nuggets game they were in
the playoffs, was during the bubble and Joker and I
pointed out his defense that he's the low man, he's
the back, he's the center. He has to be everybody's eyes,
he has to be the communication. He has to cover
up everybody mistakes if somebody breaks down the defense, and
he was missing his rotations, and so I pointed it
(09:46):
out on TV, and I tried to do it in
a way of like not bashing him, but letting the
world know, like this is an issue. And when I
saw him the following year, he said to me said, Hey,
I talked, I saw your comments about my defense. I've
gotten better and I appreciate it. It gave me so
(10:09):
much confidence in TV like and doing TV like, Oh
so I could, I can't do it. It gave me
so much confidence. That was a very huge moment for me.
That is that is huge. But here's what you also know,
and you know this balance. Anytime you see a player
doing this job, we're only really saying like what we
(10:30):
really know facts, you know, like we know everything. So
it's like if I'm on TV and I'm talking about
somebody had a bad game, I know where it was
at last night. I know who they was with. I
know what time they got out. As a matter of fact,
I probably was with him. You see what I'm saying.
So now when I'm on TV, if I'm speaking on
(10:53):
what happened in the game, they know it ain't personal,
but they know I ain't saying everything that I could say.
And that's what the Joker felt about you. He saw
you breaking it down and giving knowledge, but it wasn't
like you was trying to clown him or disrespect him.
And so that to me is when I started to
(11:15):
draw the line because I don't like media members that
name call. And so I remember when I was making
my bones and I was doing first take and I
was doing the show with Kid Bayless. I used to
sit back and take notes and it's a debate show.
So I'm like, wait a minute, he calling Chris bosh
Spice like like like like this is really happening like that.
(11:38):
That bugged me out, you know what I'm saying. And
so I'm like, all right, I'm gonna have to have
some material ready for this dude, because if he come
at me like that, I got the jab, I got
the head shot, I got the body blow, I got
whatever he gonna need. Because I don't like the name calling.
I think that went too far. Like I've seen him
(11:58):
do this recently with Dak Prescott when he had just
lost a family member, I believe, and he was dealing
with some issues, and Homie was like basically saying, I
don't care about this mental wellness. And so those are
the examples for me that give us a different level
of credibility that can never be matched because we could
(12:21):
be authentic and say a portion of what we know
without saying too much, but yet know what not to
say to make it personal. And speaking of that, I
always I always talk about this turn new media and
old media, and quite frankly, people has always assumed that
(12:43):
when I say new media, I'm talking about basketball players,
current players or like, like it's this actual thing of
new media. And reality is when I speak of new media,
I'd be speaking of a way of going about the job,
because I think the way people used to go about
the job, in the way people go about it today,
it's totally different. And and so I speak of new media,
(13:05):
and I always say, like, it's truth telling, it's being
upfront and honest, you know, it's it's it's actually analyzing
the game and not just going with this statue and saying,
oh man, this guy played bad because he missed shots.
Like no, he could have played an incredible game and
missed those shots, you know. And so when I speak
about new media, but there's also this new way of
(13:26):
doing things. And then there are the skip bayliss Is
of the world that are old media, like it's tired,
it's all in it, Uh, what do you make of
new medias? And and and also but player driven media
as opposed to the old fashioned way of media and
kind of how we're seeing the change of the guard.
(13:47):
Not in a sense because there's still a space for that,
but there's a space for both. What do you make
of that whole thing? The thing I make of it,
first off is I love the term and it reminded
me like, this is my twentieth year cover in the finals, right,
And so what ends up happening is when you come
(14:08):
onto the scene and you say the term new media.
It reminded me of like an old school rapper for example,
or somebody that's been out for a while, and then
somebody else coming to the game and people try to
put us against each other. I saw that happen when
Lebron started his school and if I'll be on TV
(14:28):
and I'm like, yo, Lebron did this, they lost the
game or whatever whatever, people like, oh, he just jealous
because Lebron started to school. I'm like like, like, I
want all people to to to give back to their
community and started school. I'm not quote unquote jealous because
his school got more hyped, like he's one of the
(14:50):
most famous people that ever walked to earth. Like I'm
happy that he did it, because now it's how it's
almost like this Michael Jackson wasn't the first person to
do the moonwalk. He popularized it. And that's what Lebron
now can do for people like me when he starts
to school. It's the same thing when you say new media.
(15:10):
People's coming to me like, what trade mind talking about?
You were doing that twenty years ago. I'm like, First off,
that's family, we ain't even doing that. Second off, he's right,
And what you're talking about is the ability aid to
articulate the game and be unapologetic. See, at first, when
we got into this gig kind of had to walk
(15:31):
on eggshells. There was there was times where family. I
stopped wearing ear rings because they was frowned upon. I
always wore long sleeves because tattoos wasn't necessarily welcome. I
wore my hair a certain way. I always wore tying
the blazer because the game was different then. Now, for me,
new media is saying what you feel, dressing how you feel,
(15:55):
driving how you want to whip, and then having a
way to articulate your self that you're speaking the language
other people that you play with. See when you see me,
I'm I'm rocking with y'all, rocking listening to the music
that y'all listening to. And so for me is it's
up to the guys that's been doing it a long
(16:16):
time to stay current, not the other way around. And
so when I saw c J get eliminated with Portland
and he was covering y'all, I pulled a nephew to
the side. We got numbers, we exchange. I remember when
he got drafted. I said that he was gonna be
that same with j J Reddick saying whatever. And so
the more of us they get into it, and the
(16:38):
more we support one another, that now changes the entire
narrative where we're all pulling together and we're all saying
it absolutely I agree on Um, you just spoke about school.
I got a couple of questions about school number one. Um,
the Jalen Rose Charter Academy. Um, how did you get
(17:01):
into starting that? And what do you need to continue
to make that the success has been but also continue
to take it to new heights because you continue to
get it better and better and make it better and
improving it. But what do you need to continue to
take that the new heis to get these kids the
opportunities that you've been affording to them. So you and
(17:22):
I from the hood hood, and like, when you be
out there balling, there's a reason why I be singing
sacking all pride since the day you got drafted, because
I remember you in high school and in college, and
I know where you're from and when you come from
where we come from. You know, the difference is money.
(17:44):
The quality of your education. Unfortunately in the United States
is defined by your zip code. And it ain't just education,
it's the protection from the police if you make a
nine one one call. Is fire, is deserts where you
can't get a quality supermarket when you're in the hood.
Is fast food, funeral homes, flower shops, gas station's, party stores.
(18:10):
That's what we see. We see depression, you see poverty.
And so I was like, how can I give back
to my community? And I'm gonna be frank with you
in a way. We're mass media, and people who don't
look like me can't block me, even if they don't
(18:30):
want me to do what I'm doing when I say
I'm doing it for the sake of education, even if
they're not gonna give me a dime, and even if
they don't want to see me educating the kids that
I'm educating. They can't say it out loud. It's almost
like when white people listen to rap music. At some
point when you're saying the lyrics, you're gonna say all
(18:52):
of the lyrics. That's a fact. You're gonna say all
of the lyrics. You just gotta watch where you're saying them, right.
And so I realized that inner city students in Detroit
we're getting like eight thousand dollars a year, while the
suburban counterparts were getting doubled at and then the families
who are fortunate enough to put their kids in private
(19:15):
school that costs like forty dollars a year, and you
can start doing that K through two or three years,
K through one or two. So now that's like a
five hundred thousand dollar investment in that student, or the
suburban students like a two hundred and fifty thousand dollars investment,
where the students from my community were only getting like
(19:37):
nineties six thousand dollars. So how do I put them
in position to compete for the same jobs, for the
same careers, for the same opportunities, and put themselves in
position to be successful. I'm gonna start a school open enrollment,
tuition free, public charter. I'm not a part of a network.
I don't test students in before ninth grade. I don't
(19:58):
test students in after ninth grade. And here's the kicker.
United States don't look at us like we're cute and
cuddly when we're in high school anymore. A lot of
times when people want to influence us, they want to
do it when we're small, because you still got parental involvement.
If you acting out in class, I could call your parents.
(20:19):
But when you get in ninth grade, these young people
have been exposed to life, sex, drugs, violence, gangs, poverty,
and so these relationships are a lot different. When they're
on social media. Now they know what www is and
they can go anywhere in the world. So we influence
that four hundred high school students, and I'm influencing another
(20:42):
six hundred and what we call secondary education. So I'm
influencing them in a model called nine through sixteen because
after twelfth grade, just think about it, what does your
high school do for you? Nothing? Nothing, but the job
ain't done. If I just came from poverty and I
just graduated from high school, I'm throwing my hat in
(21:03):
the air, but I can't put my resume nowhere and
get it gig. So now I'm helping those students in
community college, trade school, military, four year college, and now
we're helping them be in position to be successful in life.
So the thing that we need is money and awareness,
and I'm continuing to try to do that, and I'm
(21:25):
really proud of what we've accomplished over twelve years. We're
fundraising right now to expand our facility. I took over
a middle school, converted it into a high school, and Sally,
our basketball team is never played the home game because
I took over an elementary school. And when you look
at our budget, I'm the founder, I'm the president of
(21:49):
the board, I'm the chief fundraiser. And shout to my
co founder, Michael Carter, Shout to all of my board members,
the founding team, our students are, staff is amazing, our
our school leader, Principal Lowis, our parents. They all believe
in my vision. And so now for me, it's to
expand the facility so I can get three more classrooms.
(22:09):
I want to create a health and wellness space for
mental health. I want to create a space for yoga
where young people can be stretching and getting exposed to
things while they're in the building. And I want to
have a gym so that now when people come play
college games or high school tournaments or proteins or whatever,
we have the kind of facility that they can come
and enjoy. So you took over in the elementary school.
(22:32):
There's been um thirties high schools in Detroit clothes correct,
are you not able to get access to those buildings
that they've closed down. I'm about to give you some
game that people don't know about education. First off, I
remember trying to open the school, and this was a
(22:53):
political cycle that people were going back and forth about
public school, charter school, magnet school. I'm like, first off,
I don't care what kind of school they go to.
You can home school them. I'm just trying to put
them in position to have a quality school to go to.
And then there were people like, well, charter schools are
(23:15):
still a students from the public schools. News flash, a
charter school is a public school. That's just cap And
why do people say that Because one of the largest
donors of the Democratic Party is the teachers union, and
so why is that so important to both of those
(23:37):
things because if you're part of the union, you get
something called tenure as a teacher. That means you could
go to school for two or three years and basically
never get fired, and that has nothing to do with
your results. But when you go to a charter school,
you give up your tenure opportunity. And so that's what
(24:01):
they're fighting against. And then they're also fighting against the
numbers of students that are in a public school building
that you're talking about. You ready for this, because a
public school building is gifted a charter school building, we
get zero state funding for the facility. Zero, not for improvements,
(24:24):
not for expansion, nothing. If something happens with the boiler
at the school right now, if something happens with a
lightbulb at the school right now, my phone ringing. Wow,
you see what I'm saying. And so that's one of
the dirty secrets about education, is that we get zero
(24:44):
state funding for our facility. And so therefore that's why
writing and raising and me creating awareness for the school
is so very important. That's incredible. I'm gonna I'm gonna
sell checkers the next couple of weeks. I'll give my
financial team and get that out absolutely amazing. Um, like
(25:06):
the amount of like me knowing you personal amount of
time that you give to that. Like I've seen you
at times where your and you hustling like yo, I
need to go raise his money for these kids, Like
you really hustling going to do that. I got so
much respect for you. Appreciate that because I think that's
absolutely amazing. But continuing on along the lines of school,
(25:28):
you said you ended up going back to finish your degree.
Why was this so important for you to go back?
You Jalen Rose, You're going in the TV like why
was this so important for you to go back and
finish your degree? Because school was actually always important to me.
I never wanted to be considered a dumb jock. I
(25:50):
hated that term. I used to see people get called that,
and I was like, I'm gonna make sure nobody ever
called me that. And then you know, the whole stigma like, oh,
you play athlete, you're an athlete, you talented, so now
people hooking you up with your grades or people doing
your work for you and that type of stuff. So
then I was like, you know, I started to take pride.
(26:11):
And one of the funny things that happened in high
school is I got a chance to take some accelerated
classes because I was an honor roll student, and I
heard that if you got a certain g p A
and your attendance was this, that you got a chance
to meet a special guest that was gonna come to
the school at the end of the year for a seminar.
(26:34):
And then I found out that guest was Irvan Magic Johnson.
So I couldn't be on the basketball team all Americans
and Magic come to the school and I can't go
to the gym and see him. You know what I'm saying.
That would not have been a good look. So I
(26:55):
really started to buckle down on my academics. Same when
I was in Michigan. It was a was a Dean's
List student at Michigan, and so at that point, I
don't went to school for three years in the middle
of winter, you know, it's cold outside. I might as
well finished, you know what I'm saying, I might as
well finish. At that point, I'm in the league taking
correspondence courses. I'm like, I'm gonna finish in Michigan at
(27:18):
the time, and this showing my age wasn't even offering
the classes I needed for to allow me to graduate
unless I went on campus. I'm like, I can't, I
can't go on campus. So I eventually took my courses
online at the University of Maryland University College, and that's
actually where I got my degree from. Wait, so your
(27:39):
degree today, it's not from the University of Michigan. Correct.
They didn't even offer the classes that I needed. And
I love Michigan and I hope somebody here this they
should be getting at me to give me some sort
of honorary degree and putting the banners back up, like
I go to games now, I go. All right, I didn't.
(28:06):
They didn't offer the classes that I needed. Just so
you know, just so you know, just so we're clear,
mistake you made in life that would have never happened
that Michigan State. I'm just saying, I never happened that state.
That's ridiculous, you know what I know. And let me
just be real with you. You know, I love is
(28:27):
absolutely and I took a visit to Michigan State. I
looked up to magic, I looked up to Steve Smith's
six eight big guards. No doubt I analized them. But
I couldn't turn down the chance to be the fifth
member of the Fat five. That's why I changed my number.
(28:48):
I didn't wear five in high school. I wore forty two.
I changed my number because I was the fifth member
of the fat file to sign. That's why I changed
my number. That's interesting things. Like I said, I, it's
almost like you took it over though, like like the
five five it became year thing. But it would make
(29:08):
sense because you essentially made at the five five. But
that's why I find that very interesting. So a lot
of laws have changed in the United States of America.
Drug laws have changed. We've seen people that you and
I know that who had life in prison get out
because laws changed and they're no longer subject to that time.
(29:34):
The things that y'all got in trouble for, kids can
now do no problem. They can make money off their likeness.
They they got endorsement deals. There's kids in college making
a million dollars a year, which I'm happy about, Like,
get your money, it's great. I want to talk to
you about the n I L too. But now that
(29:55):
making money is legal in college, why hasn't those batters
gone back up? If you're being punished, as I was thinking,
about this about you guys five. I was thinking about
this about Reggie Bush, like these are y'all. Y'all worked
to become the five five and accomplished with y'all to
accomplished Reggie Bush work, and it got snatched away because
(30:16):
some poor kids needed some money. Now that those laws
have changed, why having all of those banners going back
up so and by the way, that's a Michigan thing
at that point, not an n c A thing, because
they can do it right now, just like you Mass
did it for coach cal Um and Memphis did, just
(30:38):
like Maurice Clarette at Ohio State. They could do it
right now. For whatever reason, it just hasn't happened. And
now that Jawan's leading the program, I have faith that
it will happen. But to be honest, I probably shouldn't
say this, but it's true. Since we didn't win it,
(31:00):
I don't really care about those banners. I feel like
it should be one banner with all of our numbers
on it, or like retire our numbers, or like give
us a statue of something like truly immortalize what we've done.
And when you talk about what we got disciplined for,
(31:21):
let me tell you what's crazy. It was a thing
that's happened in sports because it's a remnant of slavery.
And I know soon as I say this, people that
don't look like us sometimes shoulder shrug and like, oh,
here we go. But here's what happens the black sports,
(31:42):
predominantly football and basketball. You're put in a position as
an athlete where they could profit off of you longer
and you get paid less, if you notice, in tennis
and golf, in NASCAR, in hockey and all gymnastics, whatever, golf,
whatever other sports, it ain't no restrictions after high school.
(32:04):
M hmm, ain't no restrictions. They can have sponsors, they
can go play, they could do what they love, and
they can earn money. And by the way, you've been
on the college campus, just because you wasn't getting paid,
guess what the people from the student council was. They
was getting paid. Other students could have jobs. So the
(32:26):
remnants of those sports make it to where they could
profit off of us as long as possible while paying
us the least. And so when you have a high
profile team like you and l V or John Thompson's
teams at Georgetown, that all of a sudden play with
an attitude. Oh man, we gotta muzzle them, We gotta,
(32:50):
we gotta allowed them to perform. But we all want
our kids dressing and looking like them. Like I remember
being one of the most hated athletes. Now Jalen is
a common name, like literally, and so what happens is
it's one thing for Ray. It's one thing for Jalen,
(33:12):
Chris and Jawan to go on and play long careers
in the NBA and make the kind of coins that
we did. It brings my heart when I look at
you and l V and Anderson Hunt, the Final four
m VP didn't profit off of his likeness or Jimmy
King and Ray Jackson, members of the Fab five. For
(33:33):
rachis were a shoe that we popularized. We popularized black socks.
They didn't even sell black socks at the mall. Imagine
if we had the trademark for long shorts. Imagine if
we had the trademark for Fab five. Then you see
what I'm saying. And so with all of that taking place,
(33:55):
it just hurts me that those gentlemen ain't able to
profit off of what blood, sweat and tears that they've
been able to do. But I know, and it makes
me smile that the young people now can because I
remember being a champion for that for like thirty years
and people looking at me like, oh, you should just
be happy you got a scholarship. If I had a scholarship,
(34:18):
I would know. But you ain't talented and making the
school money, and therefore they're profiting off of you. Was
selling your jersey and selling tickets and doing all of
that and making money off the shoe company. You noticed
you signed a letter of intent. You might as well
sign a shoe deal. You can't go to Michigan State
and whatever, wear whatever shoe you want. You gotta wear
(34:39):
whatever you can't. And here's the here's a dirty secret
about the n I l it ain't true market value.
Here's why none of your sponsors could compete with the
ones that the school already have. And they got the
best ones, correct, correct, So they already getting top dollar
(34:59):
from radio, from TV, from the advertisement from the shoe company.
And so now you can get like, all right, you know,
we'll get you something at the local gym. You know
what I'm saying. We'll get you We're gonna get you
a membership for the next twelve months that type of stuff.
We've seen some quarterbacks you know, get paid and the
(35:20):
young lady um page page buckets from Connecticut get paid.
It's been some individuals, but for the most part, if
you notice in totality, it ain't become the mushroom effect
for players getting paid to then want to go play
in college like the headline is, because you're really getting
(35:41):
the secondary market for the sponsors. Turn every Thursday into
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n b A. I think when I look at the
n I L and like I said, it's great that
these kids are making money, but that, for instance, I
think is a huge thing that will probably have learned
(36:45):
long term effects that guys don't realize or not even gods,
just students in general, guys, girls, And that is this
if and which they are. You're not allowed to partner
with premium brands essentially because they're gonna be in East Lansting.
The top brands are going to be a sponsor of
(37:06):
Michigan State. That's just other school before and after you.
Absolutely so. And most of these college towns, I mean
most of the where most of these colleges are college towns.
So it's in East Lasting, it's in ann Arbor, it's
some blah blah blah blah. You endorse these second tier,
(37:28):
third tier brands for a year or two, three or
four years, your name becomes synonymous with that brand. Say
you then going to the NFL, You're going to the NBA.
Your name is synonymous with second tier brands. If I'm
merced these bands, I'm not coming to give you a deal.
You don't have a premium brand, so why would I
(37:49):
come give you? Why would I come give you a deal?
And you you you haven't been aligned with premium brands.
And I think that's something that that's one of the
effects of of the n I L that we've yet
to really see because it's so fresh. But I'm interested
in seeing if people will find if that will happen.
(38:11):
And that's a great point, and that's why I like
imagine the revenue streams that the coaches get. They get
money from TV, from radio, from the school, from the
shoe company, endorsements and appearances. Just give us that absolutely right.
(38:33):
Imagine if these schools had a shoe brand that was
sponsoring them. It's X amount of football players on the team,
say a hundred this X amount of players on the
basketball team, say fifteen. If the school getting a hundred
and fifty million, two hundred million, why each player can't
(38:54):
get a million? Mm hmm hm. I agree that the
school can do that, they're choosing not to. They're not
sharing their revenue stream from their premium endorser with their
student athletes. And also they can't say it out loud,
(39:16):
but they're still coaches that don't even want the players
to get that. M hmm. It's still coaches in college football, basketball,
all of these sports that still don't want the players
to profit off of their name, image and likeness. And
that's crazy. I think. I think it's absolutely ridiculous. And
like you talk to those coaches, you know, they'll they'll
(39:39):
they'll speak on the challenges that it presents. But a
challenge that's presented if if you don't have that is
how are these kids eat? How are these kids families?
And all of those things? So I think, you know, no,
no matter what, you can look at it from both sides.
But in speaking of you know, these schools or the
(40:02):
n c A in general, I think it's time that
we get rid of this amateurism work. There's no longer amateurism.
These guys are now they're making money off their name,
image and likeness, which is great. Like you're you're you're
getting some money. So and for for majority of these kids,
and like you just talked about Anderson Hunt, like you
(40:23):
just talked about Ray and Jim, for majority of these kids,
they won't be in a position that will be in
that will be the most money they will ever make
from basketball. And now whether you go on and do
something you know, down the road, that's a totally different thing.
But from basketball, that will be the most money that
they'll ever make. And for these schools and the n
(40:45):
c A, not like I felt like the n I
L for the n c A was just a cop
out for everybody to shut up and say just for
everyone to stop saying, let's pay these athletes. And guess what,
I am guilty of this too, because I was very
outspoken about athletes getting paid, and sure enough they did
n I M And I shut up too. M. I
(41:08):
shut up too. I remember being on TV the data
ruling got paid and I literally stood on the table
like I Am not about to bust my arm patting
myself on the back for being a champion of the
n I L happening because of my voice, because all
that is a band aid. Yeah, all that's all that is.
(41:31):
The true money is if I can make money off
my name, image and likeness, or I can make money
with the school that's the school got the money. You
know what I'm saying. You you you I can't. I
can't use their logo at all at all, but the logo.
(41:54):
But but the block m is very synonymous with Jaylen
Rose five correct, no question is synonymous. Yeah you if
you took the block right now, it's so five five years,
it's sell out like that, Yes, absolutely, or they'll sue
me so fast I wouldn't get a chance to do it. Yeah. Yeah.
(42:17):
And that's what the athletes are kind of realizing, which
is why people aren't lining up to necessarily go playing
college no more. They're going to the G League, They're
going overseas. It's players just like I'd rather just work
out for a year into the draft versus going to
college and being part of that system. That's that's what
(42:39):
this has become. Absolutely, Yeah, I know you gotta get
out of here. We haven't spoke NBA at all. Um,
just a couple of NBA questions, Um, number one, who
is your m v P this year? Who will walk
with the m v P? And number two, who do
you think the finals come down to when it's all
set and done this year? So a couple of things.
(43:01):
And I'm really fortunate to be an actual voter and
I vote for all of the NBA awards. I just
recently did an All Star ballot and as somebody who's
biological father played in the league. And you know, being
from Michigan, we played whatever sport it is that season,
we played football, baseball, basketball, ran across country, whatever. Like
(43:24):
I take it serious, like I'm literally trying to make
sure that I'm a student of the game and I'm
rewarding people that deserve it. And as I look at
this year, there's some amazing candidates, but you can't ignore
what the jokers doing, Like like, and I know Bill
(43:46):
Russell and Larry Bird are the only people to win
the m v P three times in a row. And
so what ends up happening is it becomes an award
about storyline. It becomes an award about perception of doing
the most with the least and or having a historic
year to go with your numbers. And so after he's
won it twice, it's like, all right, we should be
(44:09):
trying to give it to somebody else. In theory, that's
what the the the lazy prevailing thinking becomes. And so
I love what lucas doing. He putting up historic numbers,
flirting with leading the league and scoring giving supersize triple doubles, um,
But I just don't know if his team's record is
(44:30):
gonna be, you know, top four in the West. I
love with Jahs doing. He's spectacular. You know how explosive
he is, and he'll eventually win it one day. Um,
you gotta always talk about Steph in the conversation. I
know he's dealt with some injuries and y'all didn't get
off to the start that you wanted to get off too,
(44:51):
But he's still out here, Flames. Lebron is out here
killing this year, like like Lebron is the first time
I've ever watched Lebron be down by twenty and he
mesmerized was the other night against the Clippers, Like I
was watching that game, like, yo, he is really killing
(45:15):
threes off the catch off the trible Duncan spinning like
he gotta be in the conversation, and then Jayson Tatum
how he's elevated and the Celtics are a number one seed.
Janice is gonna make sure that the Bucks are flirting
with a top tier seed in the East and then
(45:37):
then be eat also, So like there's all of these
great candidates, So now what's gonna separate them? Team record?
Right now, Denver's number one in the West historic stats,
This dude about the average a triple double, not just
(45:58):
ma bloin. And so right now, if I had to
select a betting choice, it has to be the joker.
He getting twenty five, twelve and ten assists on the
nightly basis, shooting six and like thirties some from three like,
and they got the number one seed. It's a lot
of ball to be played. But right now we'll have
(46:20):
to say him as it relates to the finals, I
still feel like, y'all gotta run in, y'all. You know,
I just saw coming to float to the left the
other night, like Honnie Hawkins. You know what I'm saying.
I'm like, all right, young fella, that's what I'm talking about.
That's what they need. Um. And the beautiful thing about
(46:42):
the West races in the East, I feel like Boston.
Let me just say that Boston is the best team
in the East. There, the deepest team in the East.
They got two wing scores that could get you twenty
five or thirty. They got great guard, played multiple guards
with White and brogg Den and Marcus Smart like, they
got multiple bigs, and Robert Williams and Horford like they
just they just loaded. So I'll say Boston if healthy
(47:06):
should win. Here's why the West is intriguing. The people
that's been there and done that. Our lower in the
standings today as we speak, the Warriors, as you know, Lebron,
the Clippers, the Sons like these are all people that
have done it recently. So now it's new Jack's at
the top. Denver, Memphis, Sacramento. In the West, Sacramento, shout Brown,
(47:36):
no doubt he ball and he got him, he got
the ball and doing this thing. So but here's the thing.
When the Kings play against one of the teams I
just mentioned in the first round, like the Warriors or
the Lakers, they ain't gonna be favorite. Yeah they're not. Yeah,
they ain't gonna be favorite. And so that's gonna catapult
(47:58):
you veteran latent team teams into position to do it.
So I'm just excited about the West. I'm excited about
um covering the West because we have the West this year,
and I ain't ruling out being in the Golden State
for at least the conference finals. That part. I respect that. Actually,
this is the last question we're gonna get out. Here's
(48:19):
a very personal question. Um, Jimmy Walker, mm hmm. Number
one pick. Yea, your biological father. You never met him,
the number one pick in nineteen sixty seven. What impact
did that have on you growing up as a kid,
(48:41):
growing up as a kid that played basketball to know
my father. It's the number one pick, but I never
had the chance to know him. Yet I'm essentially walking
in these footsteps like it's just in me, Like what impact?
Because that's like having doad issues is one thing. Not
meeting your father this is a totally different thing. We
know the traumas that come with that. But to actually
(49:05):
walk in that light and say, no, I'm a basketball player,
I'm from Detroit. Basketball is a big thing. I'm chasing
the stream. Or by the way, my father was a
number one pick and I don't even have a chance
to talk to him, meet him. What impacted to have him?
A lot of pain, a lot of hurt, a lot
of anger, a lot of disappointment because a lot of
(49:27):
times you start to think he don't want to meet me.
You see what I'm saying. And then it's when I'm
at St. Cecilia and people are referencing him and showing
him love. But I'm standing next to my mother who
just brought me there and we're poor and they're talking
(49:48):
about him. I resented that, you see what I'm saying.
And it became where I never talked about him. What
I was very young, I used to carry his basketball
card and I should take it to the park and
be like, ooh, this is my dad or whatever. And
then as I started to get like in middle school,
(50:10):
and you know, kids say mean things, and so having
his name, the first thing a kid to do when
they try to joke on me was act like JJ
from Good Times was my father. Wow, you know what
I'm saying. To try to disrespect me, you see what
I'm saying, like you don't know your father? That the
he Jimmy Barker, No, No, JJ from good So that
(50:32):
used to that used to be fist fight right off
what I'm saying. And as I started to get older,
I was like he was my inspiration to following his footsteps,
but he was also my motivation and he was gonna
learn my name one day. And when I got to
(50:52):
high school and he wore twenty four when he played
with the Pistons, I purposely picked number four the too,
because I'm like, I'm gonna be the opposite of how
he was with me. Wow, And so that was my
number in high school out of spite, literally, and so
(51:14):
once I got to college, and I'm not mad at
Mitch album now, but as I look back at it,
I'm disappointed. And he literally gave me a letter as
he was writing a five five book the night before
we played the national championship game, and I had never
met my father. He gave me this letter because he
(51:35):
had just talked to him for his book, and so
I remember just sitting there staring at this letter. Ain't
no excuse by the way we got waxed, and you know,
I ain't got no problems talking about bad games or whatever.
But I just remember like thinking about this years later
and understanding that this has such a profound impact on me.
(51:56):
I kept that letter for like seven years with me
and never even opened it, like Linus in the Blanket
on Charlie Brown, Like, I just kept it with me,
just always in my bag, always with me, always with me.
And after we made the finals, when I was in
the league and after I got paid and I was
almost improved, I was like, now I'm ready, And I
(52:20):
remember being at Dale David's crib. They was in the
front playing poker, and I went in the back in
his bathroom and I opened the letter and I read
it and it was a number on there, and I
called him. I'm like, I'm about to call him right now.
And the first number he wasn't there. They gave me
a second number. Second number wasn't there. I ended up
talking to like his sister, and she was giving me
(52:42):
some game about him, some good games, some bad game,
good game. He's a great man. He would love to
meet you. It's all, you know, he whatever. Then there
was some dubious things like he had thirteen kids by
Levin women and died out of that. So it's all
types of like just and so I finally got him
on the phone first day. I told him, as I
loved him, I thank them for the jenes, I thank
(53:05):
them for the inspiration. And I told him I ain't
got no hard feelings. I made it and however the
journey took us, this is how God meant it to be.
And so I want to meet you. I want to
celebrate you. I want us to be able to start
a relationship. And the crazy thing about this day they
(53:26):
a couple of years go by, I'm playing in the
league I'm working in the media. I'm talking to him
on the phone and like twenties to two thousand and seven,
and I'm like, I'm coming to see you this summer.
He died before the playoffs ended and I got a
chance to see him. I believe he died like I
was working on the finals, as you know, and I
(53:47):
was gonna go see him like in July, and I
believe he died before I got a chance to actually
go see him. But I did go to his funeral
with Dave being And for all you youngsters out there
is having a lot of babies and choosing not to
be in their lives, let me tell you something. His
funeral was the coldest thing you ever want to see.
(54:09):
It was like, I'm not making this up. It was
like in a cafeteria and it was like thirty people there.
It was so chilling. I was like, yo, WHOA. I
was like, I'm just dropped to my knees and and
just like ask for forgiveness to any of my sinness,
(54:31):
because whatever this is, I don't want this, you know
what I'm saying, Like you can have an infant have
a funeral and it could be hundreds of people there.
You see what I'm saying. And so that experience did
teach me a lot. But being a part of the
NBA family and Kareem map do a Jabar coming up
(54:53):
to me talking to me about, Hey, I went to
your grandmother's house. She cooked real good, like to hang
out with your dad or whatever. And Clyde Fraser telling
me stories and Jerry West telling me stories and stuff
like that. I appreciated how they still treated me those
O g s like I was in the family then,
even though I wasn't mm hmm because I was. That's deep, man,
(55:18):
That's that's deep. Wow. You know I have I've had
my little fair share of issues. And when you're going
through it, no nobody talks anymore. And so until you
start talking to someone, you realize, yo, it's so many
(55:38):
more people going through the same thing. But when you're
going through it by yourself and feel like you're the
only person got that issue correct. And I applaud you
for you for your approach to have to be mad
enough to call him and say, man, I am mad
at you, I love you like and I appreciate you.
That's so powerful. What I will say that of people
(56:00):
out there is if you're having those issues, talk to somebody.
You'd be very shocked on the guy that you talked
to next year got the same issues. But also, here's
the other thing I want to say. You don't realize
how much anxiety and pain and hurt that you have
from that. So if you can fix it, do it.
(56:22):
That's the other thing. Like there's certain relationships that for
whatever reason that just you can't repair. But if you
can fix it, do it. Mm hmm. J Rose, I
appreciate you, my brother. Thank you for coming on the
show always. I love you, my brother, Wanta call away.
I see you in the playoffs. Yes, sir, I love
(56:42):
you too, Bro. Thank you, Yes, sir,
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Last minute tickets Lord's Price guaranteed. What's up, everybody, Welcome
back to the Draymond Green Show. I am excited to
have this next guest. Um, in my opinion, the founding
(01:47):
father of the Five five, the leader, UM, the person
who really embodied that spirit. Now, as you know, I
can't really be too fond of that, being that it's
from the other school. However, you know, you grow up
in the state of Michigan. Really, you grow up anywhere,
and you watch basketball. If you know anything, you knew
something about the Five five, and obviously growing up in
(02:09):
the state of Michigan, it's all right there. From Detroit
Southwestern High schoolte pick in the NBA Draft by the
Denver Nuggets, Jalen Rose my brother more like more like
an uncle of mine. I appreciate you for coming on,
Welcome to the show. Appreciate the love you're killing and
keep doing your thing. Absolutely, I appreciate you, I mean
(02:31):
just getting right into it. Um. I get a lot
of credit for being the first active player. UM doing
TV that's actually you, that's actually you. How how did
you go about way back I think in two thousand
and six you did the playoffs, you were still playing.
(02:52):
How did you go about way back then? And um
saying I'm gonna start doing media right now as an
active player. So the crazy thing is like growing up
in the city, being a fan of the game, looking
up to the bad boys, looking up to Magic Johnson.
But also my favorite athletes had personality. They were flamboyant.
(03:16):
They do only not only dressed loud like Diana Sanders
or Clyde Fraser, but they also talked loud like Mohammad Ali,
and those voices is something that I always appreciated, following
Kareem Abdul Jabbar and Bill Russell and just how they
were athletes, but they were more than jocks. And so
(03:38):
when I got to college when it was trying to
pick a major, I wanted communications to be that. So
Radio TV Film became my major and I took those
classes at Michigan, went there three years, eventually went back
and got my degree. So while I was playing in
the league, and it's crazy how this works. I remember
(04:00):
feeling like like you're a good player, but you ain't magic,
you know what I'm saying. And that happed me one day,
like like, you got a chance to do this for
a while, but you need to find something else to do,
you know what I'm saying. And my first couple of
years starting and coming off the bench and then getting
(04:22):
trade to Indiana with Larry Brown gave me fifteen d
m p s. I was like, I don't know if
I'm gonna have a thirteen year career. So I started
to figure other things that I could do in the
game that I love. And once I got traded from
the Patients to the Bulls, it was February this time
of the year and the team had nine wins and like,
(04:44):
I'm like, we ain't going to the playoffs for Shure.
So this was two thousand and two. I reached out
to a contact and B team, Matt Sports, because I
had just done the show and I just done one
O six in part, and I pitched the idea for
e T to let me cover the finals for them.
At the time, it was New Jersey Nets and the Lakers.
(05:07):
I was like, just sending the camera, I'll get the access,
I'll do all of that. So they trusted me they
did it, so they sent the cameras, we cut it,
we spiced it, we edited, they showed it on TV
and then I pitched that same idea to the Best
Dance Sports Show the next year, and they already had
big Bro John Sally who was doing TV and at
(05:29):
the time, Jason Williams from the Nets. I saw him
doing some stuff with NBC while he was still playing
and the mad Rashot. I saw him kind of more
from doing football to doing basketball. So those are guys.
I was like, you know what, I'm about to try
to do this while I'm playing. So they hired me.
So I was in the league two thousand and three
(05:50):
to two thousand and seven playing while I was still
working for Best Dance Sports Show, MTV Movie Awards. I
was doing halftime with Bill Walton and Snapper. I was
doing boxing for Top Rank. I was doing all of
that stuff. And so when I retired to two thousand
and seven and I was doing sideline for T and T.
(06:10):
I worked with T and T for a couple of years.
The famous video Nick Vanax and my brother throwing the
towel at me when I was standing on the sideline
and I just kept going and so in two thousand
and seven when I retired, that's when I started working
full time for ESPN. That's I actually didn't even know
about all the BT stuff. So I appreciate that. I
(06:33):
think UM did when I started this podcast last year,
and you know, maybe a little different because I was
doing it after game, but I caught a lot of
heat for actively doing a podcast and providing the content
that I was providing during the final, during the playoffs,
during the finals, I caught a lot of heat for
(06:54):
when you first started doing that. Did you catch a
lot of heat? And I know it's different, but it
wasn't social media and all of that stuff, But did
you catch heat for that when you first started doing it? Absolutely, Because,
as you know, in order to be colorful and or
good at this job, that means you gotta say something.
There's a lot of people that's vanilla and don't say nothing.
(07:15):
But you and I are strong will, strong opinion, and
we ain't scared to stand on it. And what ends
on how ends up happening, is why you still playing.
I'm still running into these players, into these coaches, into
the managers, into the agents and the fans also, and
so guys used to sometimes take it personal. Oh man,
(07:37):
how are you gonna call me out like that? Or whatever?
I'm like, dog, you had six points and eight turnovers,
like what you expect me to say? You know what
I'm saying, like And what ends up happening is people
start to earn your You start to earn the respect
of the players and of the coaches and of everybody
(07:58):
when they know when you speak, not only are you knowledgeable,
but it ain't personal, Like I ain't got nothing personal
against you. I'm just saying what I see, giving my opinion.
When you do poor, I'm gonna say it. When you
do great, I'm gonna big you up. And I know
you noticed this quick. You can big up people all
day and they never shout you. They never say thank you,
(08:19):
they never give love. But soon as you criticize them
or call him out for some bs that they did,
then they want to add you. Then they want to
get but hurt. And so that's when I learned at
that time, I'm gonna just stay authentic, be authentic to myself.
And when I started to do that, I started to
see me get results. You know. One of the one
(08:42):
of the things that I wanted to do, especially that
I'm actively playing is. I felt like I needed to
find a balance of like um authenticity and telling the
truth UM and being very critical, but doing it in
a way where like, I still got to play these guys.
I still have to play possibly with some of these guys.
(09:04):
And I felt like that was one of the biggest
things that I adjustments that I had to make and
go on in the TV right now. And I spoke
about this before one one instant that made me really
happy because it was actually my first time doing T
and T UM. I was doing the segment or and
(09:25):
we were doing the Denver Nuggets game they were in
the playoffs, was during the bubble and Joker and I
pointed out his defense that he's the low man, he's
the back, he's the center. He has to be everybody's eyes,
he has to be the communication. He has to cover
up everybody mistakes if somebody breaks down the defense, and
he was missing his rotations, and so I pointed it
(09:46):
out on TV, and I tried to do it in
a way of like not bashing him, but letting the
world know, like this is an issue. And when I
saw him the following year, he said to me said, Hey,
I talked, I saw your comments about my defense. I've
gotten better and I appreciate it. It gave me so
(10:09):
much confidence in TV like and doing TV like, Oh
so I could, I can't do it. It gave me
so much confidence. That was a very huge moment for me.
That is that is huge. But here's what you also know,
and you know this balance. Anytime you see a player
doing this job, we're only really saying like what we
(10:30):
really know facts, you know, like we know everything. So
it's like if I'm on TV and I'm talking about
somebody had a bad game, I know where it was
at last night. I know who they was with. I
know what time they got out. As a matter of fact,
I probably was with him. You see what I'm saying.
So now when I'm on TV, if I'm speaking on
(10:53):
what happened in the game, they know it ain't personal,
but they know I ain't saying everything that I could say.
And that's what the Joker felt about you. He saw
you breaking it down and giving knowledge, but it wasn't
like you was trying to clown him or disrespect him.
And so that to me is when I started to
(11:15):
draw the line because I don't like media members that
name call. And so I remember when I was making
my bones and I was doing first take and I
was doing the show with Kid Bayless. I used to
sit back and take notes and it's a debate show.
So I'm like, wait a minute, he calling Chris bosh
Spice like like like like this is really happening like that.
(11:38):
That bugged me out, you know what I'm saying. And
so I'm like, all right, I'm gonna have to have
some material ready for this dude, because if he come
at me like that, I got the jab, I got
the head shot, I got the body blow, I got
whatever he gonna need. Because I don't like the name calling.
I think that went too far. Like I've seen him
(11:58):
do this recently with Dak Prescott when he had just
lost a family member, I believe, and he was dealing
with some issues, and Homie was like basically saying, I
don't care about this mental wellness. And so those are
the examples for me that give us a different level
of credibility that can never be matched because we could
(12:21):
be authentic and say a portion of what we know
without saying too much, but yet know what not to
say to make it personal. And speaking of that, I
always I always talk about this turn new media and
old media, and quite frankly, people has always assumed that
(12:43):
when I say new media, I'm talking about basketball players,
current players or like, like it's this actual thing of
new media. And reality is when I speak of new media,
I'd be speaking of a way of going about the job,
because I think the way people used to go about
the job, in the way people go about it today,
it's totally different. And and so I speak of new media,
(13:05):
and I always say, like, it's truth telling, it's being
upfront and honest, you know, it's it's it's actually analyzing
the game and not just going with this statue and saying,
oh man, this guy played bad because he missed shots.
Like no, he could have played an incredible game and
missed those shots, you know. And so when I speak
about new media, but there's also this new way of
(13:26):
doing things. And then there are the skip bayliss Is
of the world that are old media, like it's tired,
it's all in it, Uh, what do you make of
new medias? And and and also but player driven media
as opposed to the old fashioned way of media and
kind of how we're seeing the change of the guard.
(13:47):
Not in a sense because there's still a space for that,
but there's a space for both. What do you make
of that whole thing? The thing I make of it,
first off is I love the term and it reminded
me like, this is my twentieth year cover in the finals, right,
And so what ends up happening is when you come
(14:08):
onto the scene and you say the term new media.
It reminded me of like an old school rapper for example,
or somebody that's been out for a while, and then
somebody else coming to the game and people try to
put us against each other. I saw that happen when
Lebron started his school and if I'll be on TV
(14:28):
and I'm like, yo, Lebron did this, they lost the
game or whatever whatever, people like, oh, he just jealous
because Lebron started to school. I'm like like, like, I
want all people to to to give back to their
community and started school. I'm not quote unquote jealous because
his school got more hyped, like he's one of the
(14:50):
most famous people that ever walked to earth. Like I'm
happy that he did it, because now it's how it's
almost like this Michael Jackson wasn't the first person to
do the moonwalk. He popularized it. And that's what Lebron
now can do for people like me when he starts
to school. It's the same thing when you say new media.
(15:10):
People's coming to me like, what trade mind talking about?
You were doing that twenty years ago. I'm like, First off,
that's family, we ain't even doing that. Second off, he's right,
And what you're talking about is the ability aid to
articulate the game and be unapologetic. See, at first, when
we got into this gig kind of had to walk
(15:31):
on eggshells. There was there was times where family. I
stopped wearing ear rings because they was frowned upon. I
always wore long sleeves because tattoos wasn't necessarily welcome. I
wore my hair a certain way. I always wore tying
the blazer because the game was different then. Now, for me,
new media is saying what you feel, dressing how you feel,
(15:55):
driving how you want to whip, and then having a
way to articulate your self that you're speaking the language
other people that you play with. See when you see me,
I'm I'm rocking with y'all, rocking listening to the music
that y'all listening to. And so for me is it's
up to the guys that's been doing it a long
(16:16):
time to stay current, not the other way around. And
so when I saw c J get eliminated with Portland
and he was covering y'all, I pulled a nephew to
the side. We got numbers, we exchange. I remember when
he got drafted. I said that he was gonna be
that same with j J Reddick saying whatever. And so
the more of us they get into it, and the
(16:38):
more we support one another, that now changes the entire
narrative where we're all pulling together and we're all saying
it absolutely I agree on Um, you just spoke about school.
I got a couple of questions about school number one. Um,
the Jalen Rose Charter Academy. Um, how did you get
(17:01):
into starting that? And what do you need to continue
to make that the success has been but also continue
to take it to new heights because you continue to
get it better and better and make it better and
improving it. But what do you need to continue to
take that the new heis to get these kids the
opportunities that you've been affording to them. So you and
(17:22):
I from the hood hood, and like, when you be
out there balling, there's a reason why I be singing
sacking all pride since the day you got drafted, because
I remember you in high school and in college, and
I know where you're from and when you come from
where we come from. You know, the difference is money.
(17:44):
The quality of your education. Unfortunately in the United States
is defined by your zip code. And it ain't just education,
it's the protection from the police if you make a
nine one one call. Is fire, is deserts where you
can't get a quality supermarket when you're in the hood.
Is fast food, funeral homes, flower shops, gas station's, party stores.
(18:10):
That's what we see. We see depression, you see poverty.
And so I was like, how can I give back
to my community? And I'm gonna be frank with you
in a way. We're mass media, and people who don't
look like me can't block me, even if they don't
(18:30):
want me to do what I'm doing when I say
I'm doing it for the sake of education, even if
they're not gonna give me a dime, and even if
they don't want to see me educating the kids that
I'm educating. They can't say it out loud. It's almost
like when white people listen to rap music. At some
point when you're saying the lyrics, you're gonna say all
(18:52):
of the lyrics. That's a fact. You're gonna say all
of the lyrics. You just gotta watch where you're saying them, right.
And so I realized that inner city students in Detroit
we're getting like eight thousand dollars a year, while the
suburban counterparts were getting doubled at and then the families
who are fortunate enough to put their kids in private
(19:15):
school that costs like forty dollars a year, and you
can start doing that K through two or three years,
K through one or two. So now that's like a
five hundred thousand dollar investment in that student, or the
suburban students like a two hundred and fifty thousand dollars investment,
where the students from my community were only getting like
(19:37):
nineties six thousand dollars. So how do I put them
in position to compete for the same jobs, for the
same careers, for the same opportunities, and put themselves in
position to be successful. I'm gonna start a school open enrollment,
tuition free, public charter. I'm not a part of a network.
I don't test students in before ninth grade. I don't
(19:58):
test students in after ninth grade. And here's the kicker.
United States don't look at us like we're cute and
cuddly when we're in high school anymore. A lot of
times when people want to influence us, they want to
do it when we're small, because you still got parental involvement.
If you acting out in class, I could call your parents.
(20:19):
But when you get in ninth grade, these young people
have been exposed to life, sex, drugs, violence, gangs, poverty,
and so these relationships are a lot different. When they're
on social media. Now they know what www is and
they can go anywhere in the world. So we influence
that four hundred high school students, and I'm influencing another
(20:42):
six hundred and what we call secondary education. So I'm
influencing them in a model called nine through sixteen because
after twelfth grade, just think about it, what does your
high school do for you? Nothing? Nothing, but the job
ain't done. If I just came from poverty and I
just graduated from high school, I'm throwing my hat in
(21:03):
the air, but I can't put my resume nowhere and
get it gig. So now I'm helping those students in
community college, trade school, military, four year college, and now
we're helping them be in position to be successful in life.
So the thing that we need is money and awareness,
and I'm continuing to try to do that, and I'm
(21:25):
really proud of what we've accomplished over twelve years. We're
fundraising right now to expand our facility. I took over
a middle school, converted it into a high school, and Sally,
our basketball team is never played the home game because
I took over an elementary school. And when you look
at our budget, I'm the founder, I'm the president of
(21:49):
the board, I'm the chief fundraiser. And shout to my
co founder, Michael Carter, Shout to all of my board members,
the founding team, our students are, staff is amazing, our
our school leader, Principal Lowis, our parents. They all believe
in my vision. And so now for me, it's to
expand the facility so I can get three more classrooms.
(22:09):
I want to create a health and wellness space for
mental health. I want to create a space for yoga
where young people can be stretching and getting exposed to
things while they're in the building. And I want to
have a gym so that now when people come play
college games or high school tournaments or proteins or whatever,
we have the kind of facility that they can come
and enjoy. So you took over in the elementary school.
(22:32):
There's been um thirties high schools in Detroit clothes correct,
are you not able to get access to those buildings
that they've closed down. I'm about to give you some
game that people don't know about education. First off, I
remember trying to open the school, and this was a
(22:53):
political cycle that people were going back and forth about
public school, charter school, magnet school. I'm like, first off,
I don't care what kind of school they go to.
You can home school them. I'm just trying to put
them in position to have a quality school to go to.
And then there were people like, well, charter schools are
(23:15):
still a students from the public schools. News flash, a
charter school is a public school. That's just cap And
why do people say that Because one of the largest
donors of the Democratic Party is the teachers union, and
so why is that so important to both of those
(23:37):
things because if you're part of the union, you get
something called tenure as a teacher. That means you could
go to school for two or three years and basically
never get fired, and that has nothing to do with
your results. But when you go to a charter school,
you give up your tenure opportunity. And so that's what
(24:01):
they're fighting against. And then they're also fighting against the
numbers of students that are in a public school building
that you're talking about. You ready for this, because a
public school building is gifted a charter school building, we
get zero state funding for the facility. Zero, not for improvements,
(24:24):
not for expansion, nothing. If something happens with the boiler
at the school right now, if something happens with a
lightbulb at the school right now, my phone ringing. Wow,
you see what I'm saying. And so that's one of
the dirty secrets about education, is that we get zero
(24:44):
state funding for our facility. And so therefore that's why
writing and raising and me creating awareness for the school
is so very important. That's incredible. I'm gonna I'm gonna
sell checkers the next couple of weeks. I'll give my
financial team and get that out absolutely amazing. Um, like
(25:06):
the amount of like me knowing you personal amount of
time that you give to that. Like I've seen you
at times where your and you hustling like yo, I
need to go raise his money for these kids, Like
you really hustling going to do that. I got so
much respect for you. Appreciate that because I think that's
absolutely amazing. But continuing on along the lines of school,
(25:28):
you said you ended up going back to finish your degree.
Why was this so important for you to go back?
You Jalen Rose, You're going in the TV like why
was this so important for you to go back and
finish your degree? Because school was actually always important to me.
I never wanted to be considered a dumb jock. I
(25:50):
hated that term. I used to see people get called that,
and I was like, I'm gonna make sure nobody ever
called me that. And then you know, the whole stigma like, oh,
you play athlete, you're an athlete, you talented, so now
people hooking you up with your grades or people doing
your work for you and that type of stuff. So
then I was like, you know, I started to take pride.
(26:11):
And one of the funny things that happened in high
school is I got a chance to take some accelerated
classes because I was an honor roll student, and I
heard that if you got a certain g p A
and your attendance was this, that you got a chance
to meet a special guest that was gonna come to
the school at the end of the year for a seminar.
(26:34):
And then I found out that guest was Irvan Magic Johnson.
So I couldn't be on the basketball team all Americans
and Magic come to the school and I can't go
to the gym and see him. You know what I'm saying.
That would not have been a good look. So I
(26:55):
really started to buckle down on my academics. Same when
I was in Michigan. It was a was a Dean's
List student at Michigan, and so at that point, I
don't went to school for three years in the middle
of winter, you know, it's cold outside. I might as
well finished, you know what I'm saying, I might as
well finish. At that point, I'm in the league taking
correspondence courses. I'm like, I'm gonna finish in Michigan at
(27:18):
the time, and this showing my age wasn't even offering
the classes I needed for to allow me to graduate
unless I went on campus. I'm like, I can't, I
can't go on campus. So I eventually took my courses
online at the University of Maryland University College, and that's
actually where I got my degree from. Wait, so your
(27:39):
degree today, it's not from the University of Michigan. Correct.
They didn't even offer the classes that I needed. And
I love Michigan and I hope somebody here this they
should be getting at me to give me some sort
of honorary degree and putting the banners back up, like
I go to games now, I go. All right, I didn't.
(28:06):
They didn't offer the classes that I needed. Just so
you know, just so you know, just so we're clear,
mistake you made in life that would have never happened
that Michigan State. I'm just saying, I never happened that state.
That's ridiculous, you know what I know. And let me
just be real with you. You know, I love is
(28:27):
absolutely and I took a visit to Michigan State. I
looked up to magic, I looked up to Steve Smith's
six eight big guards. No doubt I analized them. But
I couldn't turn down the chance to be the fifth
member of the Fat five. That's why I changed my number.
(28:48):
I didn't wear five in high school. I wore forty two.
I changed my number because I was the fifth member
of the fat file to sign. That's why I changed
my number. That's interesting things. Like I said, I, it's
almost like you took it over though, like like the
five five it became year thing. But it would make
(29:08):
sense because you essentially made at the five five. But
that's why I find that very interesting. So a lot
of laws have changed in the United States of America.
Drug laws have changed. We've seen people that you and
I know that who had life in prison get out
because laws changed and they're no longer subject to that time.
(29:34):
The things that y'all got in trouble for, kids can
now do no problem. They can make money off their likeness.
They they got endorsement deals. There's kids in college making
a million dollars a year, which I'm happy about, Like,
get your money, it's great. I want to talk to
you about the n I L too. But now that
(29:55):
making money is legal in college, why hasn't those batters
gone back up? If you're being punished, as I was thinking,
about this about you guys five. I was thinking about
this about Reggie Bush, like these are y'all. Y'all worked
to become the five five and accomplished with y'all to
accomplished Reggie Bush work, and it got snatched away because
(30:16):
some poor kids needed some money. Now that those laws
have changed, why having all of those banners going back
up so and by the way, that's a Michigan thing
at that point, not an n c A thing, because
they can do it right now, just like you Mass
did it for coach cal Um and Memphis did, just
(30:38):
like Maurice Clarette at Ohio State. They could do it
right now. For whatever reason, it just hasn't happened. And
now that Jawan's leading the program, I have faith that
it will happen. But to be honest, I probably shouldn't
say this, but it's true. Since we didn't win it,
(31:00):
I don't really care about those banners. I feel like
it should be one banner with all of our numbers
on it, or like retire our numbers, or like give
us a statue of something like truly immortalize what we've done.
And when you talk about what we got disciplined for,
(31:21):
let me tell you what's crazy. It was a thing
that's happened in sports because it's a remnant of slavery.
And I know soon as I say this, people that
don't look like us sometimes shoulder shrug and like, oh,
here we go. But here's what happens the black sports,
(31:42):
predominantly football and basketball. You're put in a position as
an athlete where they could profit off of you longer
and you get paid less, if you notice, in tennis
and golf, in NASCAR, in hockey and all gymnastics, whatever, golf,
whatever other sports, it ain't no restrictions after high school.
(32:04):
M hmm, ain't no restrictions. They can have sponsors, they
can go play, they could do what they love, and
they can earn money. And by the way, you've been
on the college campus, just because you wasn't getting paid,
guess what the people from the student council was. They
was getting paid. Other students could have jobs. So the
(32:26):
remnants of those sports make it to where they could
profit off of us as long as possible while paying
us the least. And so when you have a high
profile team like you and l V or John Thompson's
teams at Georgetown, that all of a sudden play with
an attitude. Oh man, we gotta muzzle them, We gotta,
(32:50):
we gotta allowed them to perform. But we all want
our kids dressing and looking like them. Like I remember
being one of the most hated athletes. Now Jalen is
a common name, like literally, and so what happens is
it's one thing for Ray. It's one thing for Jalen,
(33:12):
Chris and Jawan to go on and play long careers
in the NBA and make the kind of coins that
we did. It brings my heart when I look at
you and l V and Anderson Hunt, the Final four
m VP didn't profit off of his likeness or Jimmy
King and Ray Jackson, members of the Fab five. For
(33:33):
rachis were a shoe that we popularized. We popularized black socks.
They didn't even sell black socks at the mall. Imagine
if we had the trademark for long shorts. Imagine if
we had the trademark for Fab five. Then you see
what I'm saying. And so with all of that taking place,
(33:55):
it just hurts me that those gentlemen ain't able to
profit off of what blood, sweat and tears that they've
been able to do. But I know, and it makes
me smile that the young people now can because I
remember being a champion for that for like thirty years
and people looking at me like, oh, you should just
be happy you got a scholarship. If I had a scholarship,
(34:18):
I would know. But you ain't talented and making the
school money, and therefore they're profiting off of you. Was
selling your jersey and selling tickets and doing all of
that and making money off the shoe company. You noticed
you signed a letter of intent. You might as well
sign a shoe deal. You can't go to Michigan State
and whatever, wear whatever shoe you want. You gotta wear
(34:39):
whatever you can't. And here's the here's a dirty secret
about the n I l it ain't true market value.
Here's why none of your sponsors could compete with the
ones that the school already have. And they got the
best ones, correct, correct, So they already getting top dollar
(34:59):
from radio, from TV, from the advertisement from the shoe company.
And so now you can get like, all right, you know,
we'll get you something at the local gym. You know
what I'm saying. We'll get you We're gonna get you
a membership for the next twelve months that type of stuff.
We've seen some quarterbacks you know, get paid and the
(35:20):
young lady um page page buckets from Connecticut get paid.
It's been some individuals, but for the most part, if
you notice in totality, it ain't become the mushroom effect
for players getting paid to then want to go play
in college like the headline is, because you're really getting
(35:41):
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n b A. I think when I look at the
n I L and like I said, it's great that
these kids are making money, but that, for instance, I
think is a huge thing that will probably have learned
(36:45):
long term effects that guys don't realize or not even gods,
just students in general, guys, girls, And that is this
if and which they are. You're not allowed to partner
with premium brands essentially because they're gonna be in East Lansting.
The top brands are going to be a sponsor of
(37:06):
Michigan State. That's just other school before and after you.
Absolutely so. And most of these college towns, I mean
most of the where most of these colleges are college towns.
So it's in East Lasting, it's in ann Arbor, it's
some blah blah blah blah. You endorse these second tier,
(37:28):
third tier brands for a year or two, three or
four years, your name becomes synonymous with that brand. Say
you then going to the NFL, You're going to the NBA.
Your name is synonymous with second tier brands. If I'm
merced these bands, I'm not coming to give you a deal.
You don't have a premium brand, so why would I
(37:49):
come give you? Why would I come give you a deal?
And you you you haven't been aligned with premium brands.
And I think that's something that that's one of the
effects of of the n I L that we've yet
to really see because it's so fresh. But I'm interested
in seeing if people will find if that will happen.
(38:11):
And that's a great point, and that's why I like
imagine the revenue streams that the coaches get. They get
money from TV, from radio, from the school, from the
shoe company, endorsements and appearances. Just give us that absolutely right.
(38:33):
Imagine if these schools had a shoe brand that was
sponsoring them. It's X amount of football players on the team,
say a hundred this X amount of players on the
basketball team, say fifteen. If the school getting a hundred
and fifty million, two hundred million, why each player can't
(38:54):
get a million? Mm hmm hm. I agree that the
school can do that, they're choosing not to. They're not
sharing their revenue stream from their premium endorser with their
student athletes. And also they can't say it out loud,
(39:16):
but they're still coaches that don't even want the players
to get that. M hmm. It's still coaches in college football, basketball,
all of these sports that still don't want the players
to profit off of their name, image and likeness. And
that's crazy. I think. I think it's absolutely ridiculous. And
like you talk to those coaches, you know, they'll they'll
(39:39):
they'll speak on the challenges that it presents. But a
challenge that's presented if if you don't have that is
how are these kids eat? How are these kids families?
And all of those things? So I think, you know, no,
no matter what, you can look at it from both sides.
But in speaking of you know, these schools or the
(40:02):
n c A in general, I think it's time that
we get rid of this amateurism work. There's no longer amateurism.
These guys are now they're making money off their name,
image and likeness, which is great. Like you're you're you're
getting some money. So and for for majority of these kids,
and like you just talked about Anderson Hunt, like you
(40:23):
just talked about Ray and Jim, for majority of these kids,
they won't be in a position that will be in
that will be the most money they will ever make
from basketball. And now whether you go on and do
something you know, down the road, that's a totally different thing.
But from basketball, that will be the most money that
they'll ever make. And for these schools and the n
(40:45):
c A, not like I felt like the n I
L for the n c A was just a cop
out for everybody to shut up and say just for
everyone to stop saying, let's pay these athletes. And guess what,
I am guilty of this too, because I was very
outspoken about athletes getting paid, and sure enough they did
n I M And I shut up too. M. I
(41:08):
shut up too. I remember being on TV the data
ruling got paid and I literally stood on the table
like I Am not about to bust my arm patting
myself on the back for being a champion of the
n I L happening because of my voice, because all
that is a band aid. Yeah, all that's all that is.
(41:31):
The true money is if I can make money off
my name, image and likeness, or I can make money
with the school that's the school got the money. You
know what I'm saying. You you you I can't. I
can't use their logo at all at all, but the logo.
(41:54):
But but the block m is very synonymous with Jaylen
Rose five correct, no question is synonymous. Yeah you if
you took the block right now, it's so five five years,
it's sell out like that, Yes, absolutely, or they'll sue
me so fast I wouldn't get a chance to do it. Yeah. Yeah.
(42:17):
And that's what the athletes are kind of realizing, which
is why people aren't lining up to necessarily go playing
college no more. They're going to the G League, They're
going overseas. It's players just like I'd rather just work
out for a year into the draft versus going to
college and being part of that system. That's that's what
(42:39):
this has become. Absolutely, Yeah, I know you gotta get
out of here. We haven't spoke NBA at all. Um,
just a couple of NBA questions, Um, number one, who
is your m v P this year? Who will walk
with the m v P? And number two, who do
you think the finals come down to when it's all
set and done this year? So a couple of things.
(43:01):
And I'm really fortunate to be an actual voter and
I vote for all of the NBA awards. I just
recently did an All Star ballot and as somebody who's
biological father played in the league. And you know, being
from Michigan, we played whatever sport it is that season,
we played football, baseball, basketball, ran across country, whatever. Like
(43:24):
I take it serious, like I'm literally trying to make
sure that I'm a student of the game and I'm
rewarding people that deserve it. And as I look at
this year, there's some amazing candidates, but you can't ignore
what the jokers doing, Like like, and I know Bill
(43:46):
Russell and Larry Bird are the only people to win
the m v P three times in a row. And
so what ends up happening is it becomes an award
about storyline. It becomes an award about perception of doing
the most with the least and or having a historic
year to go with your numbers. And so after he's
won it twice, it's like, all right, we should be
(44:09):
trying to give it to somebody else. In theory, that's
what the the the lazy prevailing thinking becomes. And so
I love what lucas doing. He putting up historic numbers,
flirting with leading the league and scoring giving supersize triple doubles, um,
But I just don't know if his team's record is
(44:30):
gonna be, you know, top four in the West. I
love with Jahs doing. He's spectacular. You know how explosive
he is, and he'll eventually win it one day. Um,
you gotta always talk about Steph in the conversation. I
know he's dealt with some injuries and y'all didn't get
off to the start that you wanted to get off too,
(44:51):
But he's still out here, Flames. Lebron is out here
killing this year, like like Lebron is the first time
I've ever watched Lebron be down by twenty and he
mesmerized was the other night against the Clippers, Like I
was watching that game, like, yo, he is really killing
(45:15):
threes off the catch off the trible Duncan spinning like
he gotta be in the conversation, and then Jayson Tatum
how he's elevated and the Celtics are a number one seed.
Janice is gonna make sure that the Bucks are flirting
with a top tier seed in the East and then
(45:37):
then be eat also, So like there's all of these
great candidates, So now what's gonna separate them? Team record?
Right now, Denver's number one in the West historic stats,
This dude about the average a triple double, not just
(45:58):
ma bloin. And so right now, if I had to
select a betting choice, it has to be the joker.
He getting twenty five, twelve and ten assists on the
nightly basis, shooting six and like thirties some from three like,
and they got the number one seed. It's a lot
of ball to be played. But right now we'll have
(46:20):
to say him as it relates to the finals, I
still feel like, y'all gotta run in, y'all. You know,
I just saw coming to float to the left the
other night, like Honnie Hawkins. You know what I'm saying.
I'm like, all right, young fella, that's what I'm talking about.
That's what they need. Um. And the beautiful thing about
(46:42):
the West races in the East, I feel like Boston.
Let me just say that Boston is the best team
in the East. There, the deepest team in the East.
They got two wing scores that could get you twenty
five or thirty. They got great guard, played multiple guards
with White and brogg Den and Marcus Smart like, they
got multiple bigs, and Robert Williams and Horford like they
just they just loaded. So I'll say Boston if healthy
(47:06):
should win. Here's why the West is intriguing. The people
that's been there and done that. Our lower in the
standings today as we speak, the Warriors, as you know, Lebron,
the Clippers, the Sons like these are all people that
have done it recently. So now it's new Jack's at
the top. Denver, Memphis, Sacramento. In the West, Sacramento, shout Brown,
(47:36):
no doubt he ball and he got him, he got
the ball and doing this thing. So but here's the thing.
When the Kings play against one of the teams I
just mentioned in the first round, like the Warriors or
the Lakers, they ain't gonna be favorite. Yeah they're not. Yeah,
they ain't gonna be favorite. And so that's gonna catapult
(47:58):
you veteran latent team teams into position to do it.
So I'm just excited about the West. I'm excited about
um covering the West because we have the West this year,
and I ain't ruling out being in the Golden State
for at least the conference finals. That part. I respect that. Actually,
this is the last question we're gonna get out. Here's
(48:19):
a very personal question. Um, Jimmy Walker, mm hmm. Number
one pick. Yea, your biological father. You never met him,
the number one pick in nineteen sixty seven. What impact
did that have on you growing up as a kid,
(48:41):
growing up as a kid that played basketball to know
my father. It's the number one pick, but I never
had the chance to know him. Yet I'm essentially walking
in these footsteps like it's just in me, Like what impact?
Because that's like having doad issues is one thing. Not
meeting your father this is a totally different thing. We
know the traumas that come with that. But to actually
(49:05):
walk in that light and say, no, I'm a basketball player,
I'm from Detroit. Basketball is a big thing. I'm chasing
the stream. Or by the way, my father was a
number one pick and I don't even have a chance
to talk to him, meet him. What impacted to have him?
A lot of pain, a lot of hurt, a lot
of anger, a lot of disappointment because a lot of
(49:27):
times you start to think he don't want to meet me.
You see what I'm saying. And then it's when I'm
at St. Cecilia and people are referencing him and showing
him love. But I'm standing next to my mother who
just brought me there and we're poor and they're talking
(49:48):
about him. I resented that, you see what I'm saying.
And it became where I never talked about him. What
I was very young, I used to carry his basketball
card and I should take it to the park and
be like, ooh, this is my dad or whatever. And
then as I started to get like in middle school,
(50:10):
and you know, kids say mean things, and so having
his name, the first thing a kid to do when
they try to joke on me was act like JJ
from Good Times was my father. Wow, you know what
I'm saying. To try to disrespect me, you see what
I'm saying, like you don't know your father? That the
he Jimmy Barker, No, No, JJ from good So that
(50:32):
used to that used to be fist fight right off
what I'm saying. And as I started to get older,
I was like he was my inspiration to following his footsteps,
but he was also my motivation and he was gonna
learn my name one day. And when I got to
(50:52):
high school and he wore twenty four when he played
with the Pistons, I purposely picked number four the too,
because I'm like, I'm gonna be the opposite of how
he was with me. Wow, And so that was my
number in high school out of spite, literally, and so
(51:14):
once I got to college, and I'm not mad at
Mitch album now, but as I look back at it,
I'm disappointed. And he literally gave me a letter as
he was writing a five five book the night before
we played the national championship game, and I had never
met my father. He gave me this letter because he
(51:35):
had just talked to him for his book, and so
I remember just sitting there staring at this letter. Ain't
no excuse by the way we got waxed, and you know,
I ain't got no problems talking about bad games or whatever.
But I just remember like thinking about this years later
and understanding that this has such a profound impact on me.
(51:56):
I kept that letter for like seven years with me
and never even opened it, like Linus in the Blanket
on Charlie Brown, Like, I just kept it with me,
just always in my bag, always with me, always with me.
And after we made the finals, when I was in
the league and after I got paid and I was
almost improved, I was like, now I'm ready, And I
(52:20):
remember being at Dale David's crib. They was in the
front playing poker, and I went in the back in
his bathroom and I opened the letter and I read
it and it was a number on there, and I
called him. I'm like, I'm about to call him right now.
And the first number he wasn't there. They gave me
a second number. Second number wasn't there. I ended up
talking to like his sister, and she was giving me
(52:42):
some game about him, some good games, some bad game,
good game. He's a great man. He would love to
meet you. It's all, you know, he whatever. Then there
was some dubious things like he had thirteen kids by
Levin women and died out of that. So it's all
types of like just and so I finally got him
on the phone first day. I told him, as I
loved him, I thank them for the jenes, I thank
(53:05):
them for the inspiration. And I told him I ain't
got no hard feelings. I made it and however the
journey took us, this is how God meant it to be.
And so I want to meet you. I want to
celebrate you. I want us to be able to start
a relationship. And the crazy thing about this day they
(53:26):
a couple of years go by, I'm playing in the
league I'm working in the media. I'm talking to him
on the phone and like twenties to two thousand and seven,
and I'm like, I'm coming to see you this summer.
He died before the playoffs ended and I got a
chance to see him. I believe he died like I
was working on the finals, as you know, and I
(53:47):
was gonna go see him like in July, and I
believe he died before I got a chance to actually
go see him. But I did go to his funeral
with Dave being And for all you youngsters out there
is having a lot of babies and choosing not to
be in their lives, let me tell you something. His
funeral was the coldest thing you ever want to see.
(54:09):
It was like, I'm not making this up. It was
like in a cafeteria and it was like thirty people there.
It was so chilling. I was like, yo, WHOA. I
was like, I'm just dropped to my knees and and
just like ask for forgiveness to any of my sinness,
(54:31):
because whatever this is, I don't want this, you know
what I'm saying, Like you can have an infant have
a funeral and it could be hundreds of people there.
You see what I'm saying. And so that experience did
teach me a lot. But being a part of the
NBA family and Kareem map do a Jabar coming up
(54:53):
to me talking to me about, Hey, I went to
your grandmother's house. She cooked real good, like to hang
out with your dad or whatever. And Clyde Fraser telling
me stories and Jerry West telling me stories and stuff
like that. I appreciated how they still treated me those
O g s like I was in the family then,
even though I wasn't mm hmm because I was. That's deep, man,
(55:18):
That's that's deep. Wow. You know I have I've had
my little fair share of issues. And when you're going
through it, no nobody talks anymore. And so until you
start talking to someone, you realize, yo, it's so many
(55:38):
more people going through the same thing. But when you're
going through it by yourself and feel like you're the
only person got that issue correct. And I applaud you
for you for your approach to have to be mad
enough to call him and say, man, I am mad
at you, I love you like and I appreciate you.
That's so powerful. What I will say that of people
(56:00):
out there is if you're having those issues, talk to somebody.
You'd be very shocked on the guy that you talked
to next year got the same issues. But also, here's
the other thing I want to say. You don't realize
how much anxiety and pain and hurt that you have
from that. So if you can fix it, do it.
(56:22):
That's the other thing. Like there's certain relationships that for
whatever reason that just you can't repair. But if you
can fix it, do it. Mm hmm. J Rose, I
appreciate you, my brother. Thank you for coming on the
show always. I love you, my brother, Wanta call away.
I see you in the playoffs. Yes, sir, I love
(56:42):
you too, Bro. Thank you, Yes, sir,
Host
Draymond Green
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