August 29, 2023 • 44 mins
Host Bryan Ford is joined by street artist and muralist Brandan ‘BMike’ Odums. Brandan became known for his murals after painting a series of Black revolutionaries in the Florida Housing Development in New Orleans’ Ninth Ward. Other artists began to flock to the location and this underground, guerilla art hub became #ProjectBe. In 2016, Odums established Studio Be, a 36,000- square foot gallery that includes over a dozen original murals, room-sized installations, and reconstructed murals salvaged from #ProjectBe before the Florida Housing Development’s demolition. Brandon and Bryan share a favorite meal from BMike’s time in Japan, Taco Rice.
Watch Bryan make his version and Subscribe: Youtube
Recipe from today's episode can be found at Shondaland.com
Join The Flaky Biscuit Community: Discord
BMike IG: @bmike2c
Bryan Ford IG: @artisanbryan
Help BMike empower young artists, donate your money or time to Eternal Seeds at EternalSeeds.com.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Flaky Biscuit is a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership
with iHeartRadio. Hi, fam, Welcome to the Flaky Biscuit. You
already know what it is. Each episode we are cooking
up delicious morsels of nostalgia, meals and recipes that have
comforted and guided our guests to success. I can't stress
(00:22):
this enough. Food plays such an important role in people's lives.
I guarantee you, as a listener, you have a meal
that just means a lot to you, whether it was
your mama's gravy or a vending machine pop tart or
whatever it is. I'm Brian Ford to tune it in, cookbook, author,
TV show hosts, but most importantly, I love to cook
(00:44):
and bake for people. And today I got someone so special.
He's borderline elusive. My guest today is a visual artist
and activist that sees beauty and neglected spaces. If you've
ever visited New Orleans, you probably definitely want past his work.
You've got a mural of, for example, Paul Pogba near
(01:04):
laf Lafitte Greenway, and that's that's one of my favorite
soccer players. So that was really cool to see I'm
pretty sure I saw you when we were living in
New Orleans last summer. Saw you on some kind of
big machine pain in something, and I was like, I
think that's the that's Brandon's being my Perhaps you've bought
Will Smith's book and admire that beautiful artwork, or maybe
(01:24):
you visited his studio studio Bee name one of the
fifty best things to do in the world. This dude's
so humble.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Dude chillin.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
I am so thrilled to have today with me, legend inspiration,
Brandon Odoms, Thank you so much for being here today.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Yeah, I mean I bet you were excited when we
change locations from the west Bank to three blocks from
your studio.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Yeah, definitely, I mean west Bank is home. But yeah,
literally walk here.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Yeah, we are in the bywater right now. Talk to
me a little bit about your studio. I mean about
this neighbor. I mean notes, it's changed a lot. You know,
you got Alma Restaurant here on the corner.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Me. I really enjoy that spo.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Yeah. Yeah, it's good to see hundred and food elevator.
But what does it mean to you to see kind
of the progression or the direction that this block, this
neighborhood's going.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
And my experience with this space goes way back. I
went to high school at NOKA, which is the beginning
of the Bywater NOCA, New Orleans Center of Creative Arts.
So and then serendipitously, eight plus years later, I ended
up with this studio space in this warehouse, and it's
just been a blessing to be in this more artistic
you know, New Orleans in general is just a very
(02:35):
culturally rich, artistic city, but the Bywater has it has
its own version of that, I guess you will. It's
a blend of local and traveler in a way that's
really beautiful. So here, it's been dope to be there.
The studio is this huge warehouse, thirty five thousand square feet.
We're grateful to open up our doors for people to
experience not only my work, but other artists from the
city and around that have work displayed there. So yeah,
(02:58):
I'm grateful to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
That's amazing. I'm very thrilled to be here with you
so that I can kind of continue my education. I mean,
you know, I'm from New Orleans, but being with someone
like yourself that is so ingrained in the community through
the ups and downs, right, I mean, the city seems
to be going through a lot of ups and downs,
and I don't know, how does that impact your work?
I mean, how does that impact your day to day?
Speaker 2 (03:20):
You know, I live here. I love this space. I
love the people in this city, and with love comes
a lot of things. It comes critique, it comes with hope,
you know what I mean. And so I think I
have all of those things for the city. You know,
I can be critical of certain aspects of it, critical
of certain decisions made, but ultimately I have a lot
of hope for what this city represents and the people
(03:42):
who make it what it is. You know, this is
a one of the oldest cities in this country. It's
actually older than the country itself. So it's like when
you think about how much time and how much people,
how much energy, how many stories are part of this space,
you can see that we've been through it all and
we're still here. We're still resilient, We're still like this
beak of what's possible when you have this interesting blend
(04:03):
of past president future. It's here in a very very
visibly beautiful way. Those are the things that make me
love this space. When I travel to other cities, that's
what I'm looking for. I'm looking for, like, what is
the oldest part of this city. I want to see that.
I want to experience that, because in New Orleans, if
you're in the city of New Orleans, if you're in
the French quart if you're anywhere in the surrounding areas,
you're in old ground, you know, sacred ground, and there's
(04:25):
a lot of stories there. So I love this space.
I could talk on and on about New Orleans.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
Some might say hunted ground. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I think with time and history comes a lot of things.
There's a lot of things we love, a lot of
things we might be collectively ashamed of. You know. I
think it's always interesting when I travel the world and
I tell people from New Orleans. I know you probably
get this too. You say New Orleans, and there's always
a response, Yeah, something they heard or something they've seen,
and it ranges. It's not just one thing. It might
be oh the maighti ground, old food, Yeah, yeah, some
(04:55):
people might be voodoo, it might be you know, it's
like all these things that get this direct response from
people people, And I think what's beautiful about what happens
when you say New Orleans that typically what pops up
in their head is the imagination or creativity of the
everyday person. You know what I mean myself, We can
be flowers of this soil, but the best of this
(05:18):
land is the soil, you know what I mean. It's
not depending upon the flowers to make it beautiful. People
come here before the soil, you know what I mean.
They come here because they know that what makes it
beautiful is the every day. It's the mundane, you know.
It's the fact that you can get probably the best
male at the corner store here, then the top of
the line restaurant, or you can hear the best music
(05:38):
from someone playing on the corner, then you will if
you were to go to Lincoln Center. And you know so,
I think that level of proximity here is is so beautiful.
I said, I could talk about New Orleans. No, No,
and we will.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
And that kind of brings me back to why we're
here on this podcast. You mentioned to our team, you
mentioned to me that you spend some time in Japan. Yeah,
and why don't you tell it a listeners what it
is that you had me prepare for you, like literally,
what is it? How did you encounter this for the
first time, and what was your experience with it?
Speaker 2 (06:09):
You know, you asked that question. I was. I went
a few directions, but I landed here because it was
such a bookmark of my life, this meal and this space.
I lived in Okinawa, Japan. My father was in the Marines,
so I was in military brad up until seventh grade.
I believe we traveled a lot as a result. My
mom and all her families from New Orleans, so this
was always home. But I was born in California, Ocean side, California.
(06:33):
I lived there up to like six months we moved
back to New Orleans, and then from that point, like
every two every three years, we would move to a
different city, different state, different countries, sometimes on military basis.
But when you go to these spaces, when you live
in the military base, the assumption is you're not from there.
So everyone always asked where you're from, and our answer
was always New Orleans, even though we had not spent
(06:56):
a lot of time. We would come here for summers.
Every other year we would come and go to schoo here.
So there's like dotted throughout my elementary school. Around the
time of middle school, we were living in Okinawa, Japan,
and the experience that was exciting. It was interesting. This
is before internet, so being able to see the world
outside of what I thought the world was in terms
(07:18):
of what I saw every day on TV, etc. So
it was just an amazing experience. I wish in hindsight,
we did more to fully immerse ourselves in the culture.
But living in a military basis like being in an
American town. But what happened is from my understanding of
this dish, it's called taco rice. The history of it,
from what I understand, is that a lot of Japanese
(07:38):
chefs were trying to cater to the American soldiers and
trying to figure out this fusion of sorts. How it
came to be tacos, I don't know, but I do
know that they were like, Okay, what is something we
can create that these soldiers would like. Okinawa is like
a sixty mile long island, and any restaurant you go
to when we were there, it was a dish on
the menu like taco rice. And so there was a
(08:01):
spot we would go to after church every Sunday. It
was called the tea house. I believe we probably ordered
that every single time we went there, and it remind us,
I guess, I'm back home. Whatever that meant for each
of us. But it also had all these like Japanese
sensibilities to it because it was it was a rice dish.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Yeah, they don't play with their rice exactly. They don't
play with their.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Rice exactly, And so it ended up happening. After our
years there were there for like two and a half
three years, my mother started to cook this as a
dish that she would have as a part of her rotation.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
So your mom had it in her rotation, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Too, because it's an easy dish to make it quick
and it fills you up. And so I'm one of three.
My mom has three sons, and so for us in
the home, you know, she knew she could feed all
of us quickly with that meal. And so yeah, it's
real nostalgic. Yeah, for the.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Listeners, what exactly is taco rice?
Speaker 2 (08:52):
So it's basically it's like layers, right, So the first
layer would typically be rice, white white rice. Definitely. I
still memories of like the rice cooker, the steam rice
cooker just filled with rice and just scoop that in
the second layer would be lettuce or some sort of meat,
so it would be like ground beef. And then on
(09:12):
top of that was dependent upon the person, like in
a lot of ways, if you imagine Chipotle, but not
as many options. You had lettuce, tomatoes, cheese, salsa, and
maybe if you were in a fancy spot, some like
sour cream and soy sauce and things like that.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
So like blending kind of a more Japanese flavor with
the text mechs.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
America, that tacos became like the representation of what the
American soldiers wanted. So it was like like a text
Mex style. And depending on the person, you'll see some
people the bowl will be as large as as power,
and some folk it will be just like a lot
of rice, a little bit of meat, a lot of lettuce,
a little you know. So it was a cool meal
(09:58):
that everybody was able to create the her own right version.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Of it with fresh ingredients, with fresh ingredients.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I just remember at a young
age it was something that we did collectively as a family,
Like I remember I would chop the tomatoes, my brother
would chop up the lettuce, and it was just like
this quick thing that we can do straight home from school.
We're helping prepare. Those are some of the memories I have,
and I do have memories coming back to the States
and trying to introduce it to friends, Like my mom
(10:26):
would cook it. We would try to and you know,
people have their thoughts about what they want their taco
to be, so they're like, all right, put Rice in there, man. Rice.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Look, I'm Hispanic and I'm from New Orleans, so Rice
goes with everything. We play with Rice. But yeah, it's interesting.
The idea of what Mexican food has become in this
country almost like a representation of what American food is.
And I think if you drive drive through the South,
you know, you can stop in Virginia at the most
(10:55):
like crazy looking sketchy town with Confederate flags and all
this thing. But all m dudes is in the taco joint.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
That's such an interesting thing. That's true.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
They got they're rocking the Confederate flag and they're looking
at you a certain way. But then they meeting at
the taco joint. So you better believe that this kind
of text mex you know, taco bell and all this
sudden thing. It's kind of permeates what the perception of
an American would want, like nachos, yeah, or something like that.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Right, And that's what's interesting about the taco rice dishes.
The things that aren't there that friends of mine who
as I think about like preparing it, like the things
that they would include when I make versions of it,
I would include like quacamola or like avocados. I would
include like fatilla chips, these types of things, but these
were never part of the table spread. So that's the
(11:41):
part that's interesting too. It's like how ultimately that decision
was made to make the traditional taco rice dish what
it is. And I wish I knew more about it.
I was too young to ask questions. I was just
happy to be eating something that I really enjoyed.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
So yeah, I mean I never knew about it. I
had nothing. I had no knowledge of taco rice. I
thought that was super dope. I mean, my brother's in
the Navy, so I do have knowledge of the culture
of being on a base. Yeah, he doesn't have kids
or anything like that, but you know he's been in Bahrain,
Kuwait and all this kind of thing, and he's like, yeah,
like they'll have burgers and yeah, pull pork, you know,
(12:13):
you know, they don't eat pork there. But because of
the military, I don't know, I don't want to call
it occupation, but because of the military presence, the certain
countries cater to the American needs, even with alcohol, Like
there's countries that they don't drink alcohol, but the soldiers
get it.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Yeah. Yeah. It was interesting as a child. I was eleven, twelve,
thirteen and not really understanding that aspect of our presence there.
And I remember there were times where we had that
it was like one channel on the news that was
it was like one channel on TV that they would
try to get as much American stuff on as possible.
So in the mornings it'll be cartoons and it'll be
(12:48):
the stories, soap operas, then it'll be the news. It
was like the one channel for everybody because you know,
there's no streaming anything. Yeah, but I remember there'll be
times that it'll be like, oh, don't go out in
town today because they're protesting.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Oh snap, know what it meant.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
I'm like, oh they you yes. And as an adult,
and I've explored that in my art too, in terms
of those moments as well, but I think the beautiful
thing about this dish is that I've seen moments where
they were Japanese folks American folks sitting together like eating
this meal. So if it started that way, if it
was like this beautiful blend of cultures intentionally, then I
(13:22):
think that's an amazing thing that food allows us to
do that, to kind of break bread and sit together.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
I mean, that's why me and you are here, right. So,
speaking of eating, so I've got as usually on the
flaky bit. Maybe it's called flaky biscuit because something flaky
always happens. So, you know, we do our ricon. We
exchange emails, you know, Brandon's on board shows up. I've
got this, I've got this really beautiful okay, so let
(13:48):
me tell you what I did before we talk about
on the fly maneuvers here. I got some ground beef
eighty twenty chuck, you know, try to keep it a
little fatty. And I got some dried chittaki mushrooms. Actually
soak those to kind of rehydrate them, slice them up,
incorporate them with the beef and the taco seasoning, some schalllette,
some garlic. He said, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I
(14:10):
threw it down a little bit of sesame oil, like
you know, I got down with that me and I
was like, let me, I don't know much about taco rice,
but I know that a Japanese chef will probably maybe
be using some ingredients like sesame oil. So I do
all that boom had a little bit of a little
bit of like salsa in it, just to give it
creaminess and that kind of salsa type. Damn it. So
(14:34):
Brandon walks in and he's like, oh, shoot, I don't
eat beef, and I was like, oh, by the way,
I forgot to tell you. I don't know but that
this is what makes this so fun because there's no script, like,
there's no things happen across. So I had to pivot.
(14:54):
I was gonna actually do like a four minute egg
on top of that and let the yolk run on it.
What I didn't said is I hard boil them a
little bit more. And I quickly whipped up a new
taco seasoning here with the seasonings they had in the cabinet.
So I'm gonna present to you your taco rice. Yeah,
basically it's just eggs, rice, tomato, but some soy sauce.
(15:17):
But but we'll see where it brings you. So I'm
gonna just step up and grab for you real quick.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
That's amazing what you did with the beef too, and
you got me second guessing.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
What I'm gonna eat it for you.
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Thank you, sir, thank you, thank you. All right, this
looks beautiful.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
Though, man, I appreciate that. Let me get a little
soy sauce on mine. Don't go anywhere.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
We'll be right back after this.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Hey, Brian again, let's get back into it. So I
didn't have any cheese. Current approach of getting those like
chittaki mushrooms in there and kind of creating that umami
that way. I was like, well, we don't really need
you know what, adding cheese like a shredded chaddar it's
like to add oumammy right at richness. So I thought
I had fulfilled that. But anyway, let me know your thoughts. Okay,
(16:15):
give it a taste.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
It is really good. I'm also really hungry, so to
be good, I can imagine all that description.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
When did you stop eating beef and pork if that's
something you're comfortable with talking about.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Yeah, no, it's been about seven eight years now I
was in a relationship with someone who was vegan. It
was the first time I thought about what I ate,
and I was more impressed by the discipline of it.
It wasn't like the what are you putting body? It
wasn't that. It was just when I was like, man,
everywhere we go, we have to like make this announcement
and how to be Like I never thought about discipline
(16:51):
as it relates to food, So I was like, let
me see if I can not do I think it
was pork at first, right, and then time passed and
it was like, okay, I feel different. I don't know
if I feel better, but I feel different.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
You could feel the pork leaving your body.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
And I think the main thing that kind of made
me stick to it and continue to think about what
else to add was one time I made a mistake
in eight Port and I didn't feel well, and so
from that point I was like, okay, this is just
out my system now now I can't go back. So
I do a lot of like Turkey based things, So
like I would have did this this way like Turkey
ground me. I'm not like the type of person is
(17:26):
think I'm better off because I don't it's just I
think my stomach or whatever has adjusted to not having
these things. So when my doctor told me I was tripping,
he was like, you eat steak tomorrow. N it's gonna happen.
And I was like, who knows, a year from now,
I might be like, yeah, that was then and now.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Just like, so you're eight years strong in beef and pork, eat.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Chicken, definitely, chicken, turkey, all seafood. You know, I can
do that easily. Here. Traveling is where I guess the hardest.
And actually, the last time I ate beef, I was
in Korea. It was like a career barbecue spot that
was super authentic. I couldn't read them menu. I was
with some friends. They interpreted things for me and it
was like, if you don't eat the beef here, something
(18:08):
is wrong with you. And I did it and it
was amazing.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Felt fine.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I felt fine, Yeah, but this was early into it. It
was like a year in so if I'm in the
space and they're like, yo, this is the best version
of this that you will ever have, and I'm like, Okay,
I'm gonna do it, you know what I mean? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:23):
No, I mean, what are you gonna do? Say?
Speaker 2 (18:25):
No, right exactly. I do feel like as for my
own personal self, there's more discipline I want to impose
upon myself in terms of what I consume. I tried
to stop doing dairy for a while, but I.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Just yea cheese and yo cheese bro jesus esus so good.
But if Darry be messing my sinuses up, like, I.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Found alternatives and milk that I really love. I love
oak milk, I love all my milk. Yeah. I found
alternatives of ice cream, all these things, but cheese. I
could just not find an alternative.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
There is nothing.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
There is nothing.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
It's just an alternative to cheese.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
And I know my non dairy folk and vegan folks like, yo,
you need to try this version. This version. I've tried
it all, and none of it compares to like real cheese.
One of those things where I'm like, yo, this is amazing.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
Yeah for sure. So to the listeners out there, the
recipe for Brandon's taco rice will be on shandaland dot com.
This is really good, but I bet we're all curious.
I do appreciate you saying that it's really good. How
are we feeling about the nostalgia of the taco rice
I presented to you today. Where does this rank? Did
(19:26):
I bring you back? Are you having a moment, are
you having a flashback? Or are you just eating eggs
and rice?
Speaker 2 (19:33):
This is really different from the way for me, at
least the way I would have prepared it when I
was making my own servant. There's always a lot of dairy,
a lot of cheese.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
So the answer is no, no, no, But I think I
don't eat on a white rice.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
So just eating his rice alone is bringing me back.
The texture of the rice, lettuce and a tomato, bringing
me back to like sitting at that table with my family.
And this is something because I remember, I'm starting to
have memories of like negotiating with myself because I always
wanted more negotiating with myself about how much my portions
was going to be. And I don't know how many
(20:07):
siblings you have or don't have, how large the household
you grew up in, yeah, but for me, it was
always like looking at my brothers seeing how much they
ate and how much is left, and trying to hurry
up before they finished to get more. So these are
just typing memories that's coming back to me, that competitive
spirit of life. Yo, they only have so much left,
and I'm trying to have him finished so I can
go get the rest of it before you do.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Well, we got a whole pot of rice here. I
ain't got no more eggs though, So you could take
your time.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
With my brothers and probably here this and be like
I knew it.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
I used to have a race with my brother on Thanksgiving.
We'd each take a turkey leg and we'd each pile
or plate high, and this dude would clean me out
every year. He would be relaxed, he would just be
kind of, how you're eating right now, chilling, and I
would be like taking bites. Then I look over he'd done.
You ain't never gonna beat me. That's what my brother saying.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
We should do everything like my mother would get like
pastries or whatever. We would count them out and see
how many people. Okay, there's six in here total. That
means you get to you get to, you get too.
Everything is so competitive about like you can't eat three
if I can only eat one, Like if you eat two,
I have to eat two, et cetera. Yeah, all right,
that's what this is bringing me back to.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
I'll take that you've been brought back somewhere relevant, somewhere special.
I'm glad I can give you those moments once again.
You're continuing to eat, you know, I gotta keepad myself
on the bat. I'm waiting on the episode where someone
takes one bite and just doesn't touch it again, and
I'm be like, oh shit, But I appreciate your honesty
and transparency here. Man.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
You know, I have a question of when that happens.
Do you take that personal? If you prepare something for
someone and they don't like it, don't enjoy it, or
don't finish it.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
No, I don't take it personal as long as they
don't make it personal. Like, you know, if someone comes
to me and insults me or something or whatever, then
I'd be like, yeah, what's up. But if someone just
doesn't like something I made, then that's life. I mean,
not everyone's gonna like everything I do. There's stuff I
don't like to eat. Yeah, I've gone to Michelin rests
and then completely like disappointed. I'll be at the table
(22:03):
to be like, man, this ain't good, this ain't right.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
I mean, that's interesting because that's an art form. There
are many art forms that people will tolerate if they
don't enjoy it, Like you just sit through a bad
performance or sit through a bad film, someone can watch it,
look at a painting and be like, yeah, I don't
like this, but I'll give it some time. It's hard
to food is like it's not passing the test for you, Like, nah,
I gotta go.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
That's an interesting point. And I love how you mentioned
food as an art form. If you don't like food,
you're not going to put it into your body. You know,
if you go over to like you know, you got
a new wife or something and her mama took something,
you better clean that plate. You better clean that plate quick,
all the tricks. Yeah, she's gonna be talking about my
(22:43):
mom makes the best and this and now you take
one by snap. But for me, it's very hard to
find a meal that I don't want it at all
that I'm just like this is gross, like it's I'll
usually play ball a little bit, But you are right.
I mean I've been to a music show or like,
looked at a pain and and be like I don't
really lie with that, and then I just turn around.
I mean like I don't have to engage with it anything.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah. Yeah, And that's interesting. I always wondered that because
comedians talk about what happens if no one laughs, and
I always wondered for chefs.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Yeah, comedians, if no one laughs, it's glaringly obvious if
someone looks at your murals, if you were on the corner,
then you saw someone like they didn't know you were around,
and they were like standing in front of your mural
and they just stood there and then they walked away.
What would go through your mind?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
I think I bacon the idea, but I bacon the
idea when I create that. It's not for everyone, and
people are only going to give you so much time,
Like with murals and etcetera. There's an eight second billboard
rule where like people would give you eight seconds, you
have that much time to try to communicate with them
before they keep moving. They're processing so much information in
(23:51):
their day, especially with phones and just a general stimulation
of what's around them. So I always challenge myself to say, Okay,
what can I commune within eight seconds? How can I
not make this so complicated and so nuanced and so
visually complicated that it requires them thirty minutes just to
get something?
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Do you feel like within that eight seconds if someone
takes their phone out and takes a picture of your art?
Is that is that something that makes you feel good?
Do you not care? Is it something you look for,
like if you know people are in the studio, I
don't even know if you allow photos in there? No,
definitely do Is that like what you would be looking for? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (24:29):
I mean to me, I've been playing with this juxtaposition
of the ephemeral with the eternal as a relations to
the work I create. And this is also an interesting
point for you as an artist as a chef in
terms of like how long does something last? Like are
you upset when someone eats the food in like five seconds?
It's like I've worked on that this long and you
just But with the mural, it's like the idea that
(24:51):
I know it has a short time frame. It's not
going to last forever, whether it's the conditions of the
elements of the environment that's going to beat up on it,
or the building itself might crumble.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Like at the hurricane. Yeah, exactly, I got a story
about that. I watched it happen. Wow, and continue on it.
I do want to. I do want to jump back
to that, but continue on to what No, it's.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Just the idea that I know that this is not
up for everything. So when someone takes as a photo,
it does sort of impose an extended lifespan because now
they can look back at it on their photo or
if we sell it as a print, they can put
it up on their wall. But I think ultimately, for
me personally, like my experience is the production is the process.
(25:30):
Once that performance is done, then I'm kind of.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Like, Okay, interesting, what else can you do? You've presented yourself,
You've created right, you step back, and.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
To me, that part of it feels like a performance,
like a choreographed dance in a way I remember hearing
friends talk about like the beauty of stage plays. Once
it's over, it's over. You can't record it because it's
not the same, Like what you get from a recorded
version of it isn't the same thing you got from
being there. And so for me, as a person who's
in the process of creating it, when it's done, it's over,
(25:59):
Like I can't recreate what I fell in love about it.
You know, I can look at it and fall in
love with the impact it has on other people, But
for me, the process is done, Like the story is done.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
There's a struggle involved with creation, right. Everything you're saying
is pointing to the fact that there's a slight struggle
involved when you're in the weeds of it, trying to
figure out what it is you're putting out. And I
read somewhere that you wrestle with concepts like black power,
the definition of blackness, and what is the responsibility that
you have to your community to portray these things. I mean,
(26:30):
when I look at your artwork, I see black excellence.
So no, I do, I mean, I truly do so.
I mean, like, how has that molded your path forward?
Speaker 2 (26:40):
I mean, on one extent, I benefited from this collective
moment that we've been in around investigating the value of
black lives. Just this new sort of black arts movement
where you see a lot of creatives, whether it be
in music and cinema and literature or all these things,
where they're like investigating their responsibility. In the moment we're in,
you see the general disregard of black life, and it's like, well,
(27:02):
I'm a black person that's creating communication to the public.
How can I communicate the way I love myself, the
way I love my community? And how does that translate
in the moment, So I understand that I've benefited. My
work has benefited from this current that has pushed it forward.
Other people who said, you know what your work, like
you just said in Black excellence, like seeing your work
makes me love myself, makes me understand why I'm powerful,
(27:26):
why I'm beautiful, And I've benefited from that. But also
I think there's another conversation that a lot of black
artists are having around Is it just that you know,
I have friends who struggle with calling themselves a black artist.
They say, no, I'm just an artist. I listen to that.
I'm so tricky that, yeah, because I can understand, even
as a chef and thinking about when people label you
at that, you know, it opens up a door of
(27:49):
opportunity as well as the type of exceptionality. But you
also know what the door is limiting to.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Right pretty much, anyone that's black or brown that I
talk to that is creating something. It's just something that
we have to deal with because at least, you know,
I can speak for myself growing up in Louisiana going
to high school and slide, Oh, you already know what
it was calling me. I don't have to get into it.
So I'm always having to validate my existence to myself,
(28:14):
like I am good enough, I'm not those things they
call me. So then when you become successful, like I'm
an afrohunderan or a black baker who's wrote a baking
cookbook like you said, I've benefited from this realization of like, oh,
the media wants to now accept us as worthy. So
we're obviously going to take the opportunities that we can
(28:34):
get because you know, we're trying to get it in.
But then it does make you step back and say, like, oh, man,
like am I am I a good baker? Or am
I a good baker because I'm black? I don't know
the answer.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
No. I think it's definitely a question that a lot
of us explore, and I think for me, the exploration
led me to just focusing on what's most important. When
I did that, I realized what's most important to me
is the fact that I can inspire in life to
fire in folks. Because when I was younger, when I
was in high school, I didn't see examples of what
a black artist look like. Right, there were many examples,
(29:07):
but I didn't have social media. I couldn't look it up.
I couldn't go follow people on Instagram that I felt
model a certain creativity that I had. So I'm excited
by the fact that I can be one of those
examples for these artists that we encounter all the time,
these younger artists that say, Okay, I want to do
it like you. I want to do it better than you.
You've showed me how this way looks, so I want
(29:28):
to do it that way. And I think those things
are exciting to me. How people define you. You would
never like fully satisfy yourself with that answer, because they're
gonna people gonna do it regardless. They're they're gonna dice
you up in some category that makes them feel comfortable. Right.
And you know, there's a quote by Audrey Lord who said,
if I didn't define myself for myself, I would be
shrunk into other people's imaginations and eating alive. You can
(29:51):
vicariously live to other people's imagination, or you could be
like noth but define myself for myself. And I think
for a lot of us, oh, for a lot of
us as creatives, that's why we spent a lot of
our time I'm doing trying to define ourselves for us,
and then you know, some of us but up against
those definitions and say no that I'm absolutely not that,
And I'm gonna show you why some of us embrace
it and say okay that plus more right, and I
(30:12):
think I'm into that plus more cat.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
I mean, you're you're obviously very self aware of where
you're at right now as an artist having a good time.
Stay flaky, We'll be right back. Enough of that, Enough
(30:40):
of that, back to the interview. Tell me quickly, how
did you get from eating taco rice, moving around the
globe to having this world renowned studio. I mean, like,
you know what, when was the moment you were like,
oh shoot, I'm really good at this.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
I mean, the short end of the story is that
I went to Nooka for visual arts. I didn't see
myself reflected in the space, not the physical Nooka space,
but just like the general space of fine arts. And
so I went to school for filmmaking because I was
also in love with filmmaking as well. So I went
to Uno for filmmaking because I did see myself reflected
in those spaces. I saw Spike Lee, John Singleton, and
(31:23):
I'm like, okay, I'm gonna be a movie director. So
I did that, and somewhere in that process of exploring filmmaking,
I got stuck in the purgatory space of music videos,
which any filmmaker student would laugh at that, because there
is a space where you can get stuck in, where
all you do is music videos. I was doing that
in New Orleans, post Katrina, New Orleans, and it was
(31:44):
a beautiful creative space because I'm a super fan of music, right,
Musicians are my favorite people, just seeing their processes so beautiful.
So I was privileged to be able to create music
videos for so many amazing artists and be able to
interpret their music into visuals. But what that afforded me
as well well was this opportunity to explore New Orleans
in a different way post Katrina, New Orleans, where space
(32:05):
was political, where you would see neighborhoods completely still destroyed,
and like on pause, you.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
See the water line exactly, you could still see a
water line.
Speaker 2 (32:13):
And for years, exactly, I'm deep in these spaces looking
for locations for music videos because the rappers they wanted
that look at edge, and so I'm back there location scouting,
and I would see all this amazing graffiti and street art.
Remember my roommate at the time, as well as other friends,
we would just go urban exploring all the time, looking
for locations. But also I fell in love with this,
this process of finding graffiti and just like, all, look
(32:35):
at this beautiful thing, and look at this, So who
did this? Why? And so you know, imitation is the
highest form of flattery. So I'm like going back there
with spray paint now because I'm like, well, I know
how to paint a little bit, so let me try.
So I'm deep into these spaces, trying my own hand
at graffiti, and I fell in love graffiti, or I
should say spray paint, reigniting my love for visual art.
(32:57):
And so I start going back there all the time.
Because at first, so I was just trying to duplicate
what I saw people doing. I was doing a lettering,
and I was like, well, I'm not really that interested
in that. So I started to find my own voice
creating portraits of specifically people in black history. I was
just a super fan of history, so I'm like painting
these portraits of people. And then the media got into
it because the images started to circulate. It was like
(33:19):
this idea that if I'm painting Doctor King in an
abandoned housing project, then there must be a political message.
So it started the Snowball as this political thing. It's
like art. And this is around the time that Banksy
is blowing up. Shepherd Ferry did the Obama poster. So
there's this idea that street artists are political. Yeah, so
it's all just started the Snowball. This first base became
(33:41):
Project B. It got shut down, and then we started
to Exhibit B on the West Bank. Once that ended,
then it was blessed to be able to walk into
what's now Studio B and through that almost ten year journey.
Yeah ten years now, Wow, it's crazy it twenty thirteen
is when it all started. But through that tenure journey,
(34:02):
so much growth, so much understanding of the medium, of
the responsibility. It's been a blessing.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
You're a master man, Like don't even don't even play
no games man. Before we wrap up, we like to
usually play a little flaky game. Got a game for you.
But before we get into the game, I wanted to
circle back to what we talked about during IDA. I'll
give you my experience. You know we're sitting you know,
I've been through Katrina. I've been through I've been through
them all. I'm sure you have been through quite a
few of them as well. And I was in this
(34:31):
apartment and it seemed pretty safe. And I was actually
moving to New York three days after the landfall was expected,
so I was like, I'm not going to evacuate then
be stuck somewhere and can't get my stuff and move
blah blah blah.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
So I stayed.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
And it wasn't supposed to be that bad. Yeah, it
just was not supposed to be bad. And I was like,
it'll be fine. And as the storm progressed, started noticing
it turned into like a wind tunnel or like turn
into like a tornado type vibe, and it just started.
The wind was spinding. Then the power went out, and
the rain was battering, and the wind kept intensifying, and
(35:05):
all of a sudden, right before our eyes, it was
my sister Bridgett and myself. This building just cold, I
mean it just cold. It just fell. And I didn't
realize it was the building that you had that was it,
the buddy Bowlder. Yeah, I didn't realize that until the
next day and the storm came down. You know, we
did a little walk, you know, the walk around the
(35:27):
post storm. And we walked around. I was like, oh shit,
you know, the news was everywhere and the bricks were everywhere,
and I was like, those bricks have something.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
And I was like, oh no, so you.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Know, enough of me talking about my experience with this.
I'd love to know what happened, you know.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
No, I was that was wild. That was an interesting
take because I wasn't there, like last minute we decided
to leave because I lived not too far from that that.
I was living at the Pithyan at the time, right there,
a couple of blocks away. But I do remember when
we came back, I was like, Okay, this mural is done.
Cool part of it. It's unfortunate, but I remember I
tried to go get some of the bricks to like
(36:05):
preserve them. I'm like, okay, this is an interesting moment.
They shut that down. They started to call the police
on me. It was like a big old at that point.
They had the whole space like fenced up. Yeah, and
I was just like, yo, I'm about to go try
to get some bricks. So we walked in. I was
documenting the whole thing, so we tried to have a
conversation with the crew. It was like, yo, we just
wanted to talk and and then one of my homies
(36:26):
took a brick, so we're leaving. They didn't want to
let me film inside. I think that's what I was
trying to do. So we're leaving, I don't know where.
Somebody pops up, like one of my workers just said,
you took a brick? Where is it? And we're like, yo,
what's going on? Like yeah, it got tense. We filmed
the whole thing. But then a couple months later, the
company that owns the space reached out and we're like, yo,
(36:46):
how can we make this work right? And so ended
up getting recommissioned to paint the spat over. So it's
back up, new and improved.
Speaker 1 (36:55):
Amazing. Well, congrats on the new and improved. You know,
I can't imagine what it must have felt like to
know that that crumbled down. But you know, in life,
sometimes you just got to move forward, maybe do something again.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
Yeah, no, definitely, I learned those lessons many times with
painting in public space. Yeah, so it's part of it.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
So I want to pivot into what we call our
flaky game. I got something kind of fun lined up
over for your particular game. First of all, I have
a question. Have you ever made paint with fruits or vegetables?
Speaker 2 (37:29):
No, I haven't. My niece. I have your niece. He's
two almost three, and I did purchase some vegetable based
paint for her and we did like a little finger
paint project. That cool. Well.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
In order to win my game, okay, you need to
get twenty points, okay, and to get a point, you
just have to name an ingredient that can create the
color of paint that I'm going to ask you for.
So yeah, we're gonna have three rounds of this. Okay,
Each rounds ten seconds, So you've got ten seconds and
we will start right now. So you've got to be ready.
You had ten seconds. Tell me as many food ingredients
(38:02):
as you can that can make green paint. Starting out green?
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Uh uh, ginger, avocado, avocado. I don't know why I'm
blanking out celery.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
And that's time. You got two points, alright, So you
getting a little warm, get a little the little spinach
juice or some care or something like that.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
Okay, all the green, yeah exactly, And I'm drinking something
green right now. Just a macha.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
Hey, you can do this.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Okay, I got it.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
So you got two points. We got to get to twenty.
You got two rounds left, you know, alright ready.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
Red red beets, strawberry berries like regular berries. That's five
A bunch of berries, six, seven meat. I don't know,
like the blood from me.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
I'll tell you.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
We're ten.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Okay, at ten points, Okay, there we go. Okay, all right,
round three, round, last round. See if you can get
ten points. Let's see orange.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
Okay, we can do oranges. You could do Uh no,
that's not orange.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
You mean pumpkin? Is that?
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:24):
Did you mean six different types of squads?
Speaker 2 (39:26):
Yes, chloral fum, squash, squashes, squash, squash, orange. And if
I would have read those ingredients on my niece's coloring thing,
I probably would have got all those. It was like
a vegan some organic.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
When you walk in drinking the green smoothie. I was like, Oh,
he's definitely gonna get this.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
No, this is people to think I'm man.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
And you know, the last thing we definitely want to
talk about is eternal seeds. You're doing so many things
for so many parts of the community, but you mentioned
to us you wanted to talk about eternal seeds. So
let our listeners know what what is eternal seeds and
why is it so important to you?
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Yeah, internal seeds is like where we've been focusing all
our efforts into investing in the creative community of New Orleans,
especially young and emerging artists of color. This idea that
for so many people in New Orleans is is that
thing like that creative space, that imagination incubator, whatever you
want to call it. But there are people who extract
that and say, Okay, I like these things, I like
(40:24):
these elements, I'm going to extract it. But we realize
we have a responsibility to toil in the ground to
make sure the ground is fertile for flowers to grow.
Like I use that analogy earlier, but as a rapper
who said, what's more important the flower or the soil
that grew it? And what are we doing? What is
the work that we're doing to make sure that the
soil there's fertile grounds from new talent, new creativity to
(40:44):
grow and thrive, be sustainable, to be successful. So what
does that look like practically? That's workshops at summer camps,
that's creating opportunities, grants for artists, for creatives and just
making it so that a story like myself, which was
wild and meandering and confusing and organic, how do we
make sure that it doesn't have to be that way
for the next person? Right? How do we make sure
(41:05):
that we pave that ground that the mud that we
got it out of, and we say, oh, I got
it out the mud. How do we make sure it
doesn't have to be that way for the next person? Yeah,
And that's what Eternal Seas is about. Look us up
eternal seeds dot com. If you love anything about New Orleans' creativity,
invest in the future, you know, I.
Speaker 1 (41:20):
Mean, donate, contribute, volunteer, definitely volunteer all the things. All Right, Well,
y'all are ever in New Orleans, I know a lot
of y'all. Wherever y'all live in this country, y'all gonna
be visiting and partying and doing all that. Yeah, But
if you're gonna come and party and stuff, go to
Eternal Seeds dot com and spend a couple hours somewhere
to do something nice for the community here. We really
always need that kind of support, especially the youth that
(41:42):
are growing up here.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
So appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
This has been an absolute honor. I cannot stress enough
how excited this I got goosebumps. I mean we even
waiting for this for a while. Thank you for taking
time to be on Flaky biscuits.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Now, thank you for inviting me. This is fun. I
appreciate you making this meal bringing me back.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
I appreciate that, all right, all right, the appreciate thank you,
thank you, Thank y'all so so so much for listening
once again. Man, I love y'all support. If you want
the recipe for my version of taco rice, find that
(42:18):
recipe on shondaland dot com. This recipe was new to me.
It's in fact, this dish was new to me. I
never knew about it. So I'm really curious as to
how y'all are gonna do. Tag me at artists and Brian,
tag B Mike at B Mike two C and of course,
please don't forget to tag shondaland post those photos videos
(42:38):
you already know, send us messages, leave some comments, get
into that discord and chat with everyone else, Chat with
our other listeners about how y'all are doing with this recipe.
And I think the best advice I can give make
that protein nice in season whatever it is that you
choose get a nice I'm not always a fan of
this package taco seasoning, but you can make your own
(42:58):
by using like cayam pepper, pepper, white pepper, black pepper, salt.
And you know what I'm saying. So just get creative,
make sure you season it up nice and make a
nice comfaning bowl. Don't forget to look up Eternal Seeds
at eternalseeds dot com. You can find their website and
all the handles I've mentioned in the show notes for
this episode. If you like Flaky Biscuit all right, if
(43:22):
you like flaky layers and delicious morsels of nostalgia, then
you know what to do. Leave us a beautiful rating, review, Share, subscribe,
tell the whole world, scream it from the rooftops. If
you're driving to work and you want to hear something delicious,
put on Flaky Biscuit. Thank you so much for joining guys.
(43:42):
Flaky Biscuit is executive produced by Sandy Bailey, alex Alja,
Lauren Homan, Tyler Klang, and Gabrielle Collins. Our creative producer
is Bridget Kenna, and our editor and producer is Nicholas
Harder with music by Crucial. Recipes from Flaky Biscuit can
be found each week on Shondaland. Subscribe to the Shondaland
YouTube channel for more Flaky Biscuit content. Flaky Biscuit is
(44:09):
a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Flaky Biscuit is a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership
with iHeartRadio. Hi, fam, Welcome to the Flaky Biscuit. You
already know what it is. Each episode we are cooking
up delicious morsels of nostalgia, meals and recipes that have
comforted and guided our guests to success. I can't stress
(00:22):
this enough. Food plays such an important role in people's lives.
I guarantee you, as a listener, you have a meal
that just means a lot to you, whether it was
your mama's gravy or a vending machine pop tart or
whatever it is. I'm Brian Ford to tune it in, cookbook, author,
TV show hosts, but most importantly, I love to cook
(00:44):
and bake for people. And today I got someone so special.
He's borderline elusive. My guest today is a visual artist
and activist that sees beauty and neglected spaces. If you've
ever visited New Orleans, you probably definitely want past his work.
You've got a mural of, for example, Paul Pogba near
(01:04):
laf Lafitte Greenway, and that's that's one of my favorite
soccer players. So that was really cool to see I'm
pretty sure I saw you when we were living in
New Orleans last summer. Saw you on some kind of
big machine pain in something, and I was like, I
think that's the that's Brandon's being my Perhaps you've bought
Will Smith's book and admire that beautiful artwork, or maybe
(01:24):
you visited his studio studio Bee name one of the
fifty best things to do in the world. This dude's
so humble.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Dude chillin.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
I am so thrilled to have today with me, legend inspiration,
Brandon Odoms, Thank you so much for being here today.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Yeah, I mean I bet you were excited when we
change locations from the west Bank to three blocks from
your studio.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Yeah, definitely, I mean west Bank is home. But yeah,
literally walk here.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Yeah, we are in the bywater right now. Talk to
me a little bit about your studio. I mean about
this neighbor. I mean notes, it's changed a lot. You know,
you got Alma Restaurant here on the corner.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Me. I really enjoy that spo.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Yeah. Yeah, it's good to see hundred and food elevator.
But what does it mean to you to see kind
of the progression or the direction that this block, this
neighborhood's going.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
And my experience with this space goes way back. I
went to high school at NOKA, which is the beginning
of the Bywater NOCA, New Orleans Center of Creative Arts.
So and then serendipitously, eight plus years later, I ended
up with this studio space in this warehouse, and it's
just been a blessing to be in this more artistic
you know, New Orleans in general is just a very
(02:35):
culturally rich, artistic city, but the Bywater has it has
its own version of that, I guess you will. It's
a blend of local and traveler in a way that's
really beautiful. So here, it's been dope to be there.
The studio is this huge warehouse, thirty five thousand square feet.
We're grateful to open up our doors for people to
experience not only my work, but other artists from the
city and around that have work displayed there. So yeah,
(02:58):
I'm grateful to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
That's amazing. I'm very thrilled to be here with you
so that I can kind of continue my education. I mean,
you know, I'm from New Orleans, but being with someone
like yourself that is so ingrained in the community through
the ups and downs, right, I mean, the city seems
to be going through a lot of ups and downs,
and I don't know, how does that impact your work?
I mean, how does that impact your day to day?
Speaker 2 (03:20):
You know, I live here. I love this space. I
love the people in this city, and with love comes
a lot of things. It comes critique, it comes with hope,
you know what I mean. And so I think I
have all of those things for the city. You know,
I can be critical of certain aspects of it, critical
of certain decisions made, but ultimately I have a lot
of hope for what this city represents and the people
(03:42):
who make it what it is. You know, this is
a one of the oldest cities in this country. It's
actually older than the country itself. So it's like when
you think about how much time and how much people,
how much energy, how many stories are part of this space,
you can see that we've been through it all and
we're still here. We're still resilient, We're still like this
beak of what's possible when you have this interesting blend
(04:03):
of past president future. It's here in a very very
visibly beautiful way. Those are the things that make me
love this space. When I travel to other cities, that's
what I'm looking for. I'm looking for, like, what is
the oldest part of this city. I want to see that.
I want to experience that, because in New Orleans, if
you're in the city of New Orleans, if you're in
the French quart if you're anywhere in the surrounding areas,
you're in old ground, you know, sacred ground, and there's
(04:25):
a lot of stories there. So I love this space.
I could talk on and on about New Orleans.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
Some might say hunted ground. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I think with time and history comes a lot of things.
There's a lot of things we love, a lot of
things we might be collectively ashamed of. You know. I
think it's always interesting when I travel the world and
I tell people from New Orleans. I know you probably
get this too. You say New Orleans, and there's always
a response, Yeah, something they heard or something they've seen,
and it ranges. It's not just one thing. It might
be oh the maighti ground, old food, Yeah, yeah, some
(04:55):
people might be voodoo, it might be you know, it's
like all these things that get this direct response from
people people, And I think what's beautiful about what happens
when you say New Orleans that typically what pops up
in their head is the imagination or creativity of the
everyday person. You know what I mean myself, We can
be flowers of this soil, but the best of this
(05:18):
land is the soil, you know what I mean. It's
not depending upon the flowers to make it beautiful. People
come here before the soil, you know what I mean.
They come here because they know that what makes it
beautiful is the every day. It's the mundane, you know.
It's the fact that you can get probably the best
male at the corner store here, then the top of
the line restaurant, or you can hear the best music
(05:38):
from someone playing on the corner, then you will if
you were to go to Lincoln Center. And you know so,
I think that level of proximity here is is so beautiful.
I said, I could talk about New Orleans. No, No,
and we will.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
And that kind of brings me back to why we're
here on this podcast. You mentioned to our team, you
mentioned to me that you spend some time in Japan. Yeah,
and why don't you tell it a listeners what it
is that you had me prepare for you, like literally,
what is it? How did you encounter this for the
first time, and what was your experience with it?
Speaker 2 (06:09):
You know, you asked that question. I was. I went
a few directions, but I landed here because it was
such a bookmark of my life, this meal and this space.
I lived in Okinawa, Japan. My father was in the Marines,
so I was in military brad up until seventh grade.
I believe we traveled a lot as a result. My
mom and all her families from New Orleans, so this
was always home. But I was born in California, Ocean side, California.
(06:33):
I lived there up to like six months we moved
back to New Orleans, and then from that point, like
every two every three years, we would move to a
different city, different state, different countries, sometimes on military basis.
But when you go to these spaces, when you live
in the military base, the assumption is you're not from there.
So everyone always asked where you're from, and our answer
was always New Orleans, even though we had not spent
(06:56):
a lot of time. We would come here for summers.
Every other year we would come and go to schoo here.
So there's like dotted throughout my elementary school. Around the
time of middle school, we were living in Okinawa, Japan,
and the experience that was exciting. It was interesting. This
is before internet, so being able to see the world
outside of what I thought the world was in terms
(07:18):
of what I saw every day on TV, etc. So
it was just an amazing experience. I wish in hindsight,
we did more to fully immerse ourselves in the culture.
But living in a military basis like being in an
American town. But what happened is from my understanding of
this dish, it's called taco rice. The history of it,
from what I understand, is that a lot of Japanese
(07:38):
chefs were trying to cater to the American soldiers and
trying to figure out this fusion of sorts. How it
came to be tacos, I don't know, but I do
know that they were like, Okay, what is something we
can create that these soldiers would like. Okinawa is like
a sixty mile long island, and any restaurant you go
to when we were there, it was a dish on
the menu like taco rice. And so there was a
(08:01):
spot we would go to after church every Sunday. It
was called the tea house. I believe we probably ordered
that every single time we went there, and it remind us,
I guess, I'm back home. Whatever that meant for each
of us. But it also had all these like Japanese
sensibilities to it because it was it was a rice dish.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
Yeah, they don't play with their rice exactly. They don't
play with their.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Rice exactly, And so it ended up happening. After our
years there were there for like two and a half
three years, my mother started to cook this as a
dish that she would have as a part of her rotation.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
So your mom had it in her rotation, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Too, because it's an easy dish to make it quick
and it fills you up. And so I'm one of three.
My mom has three sons, and so for us in
the home, you know, she knew she could feed all
of us quickly with that meal. And so yeah, it's
real nostalgic. Yeah, for the.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Listeners, what exactly is taco rice?
Speaker 2 (08:52):
So it's basically it's like layers, right, So the first
layer would typically be rice, white white rice. Definitely. I
still memories of like the rice cooker, the steam rice
cooker just filled with rice and just scoop that in
the second layer would be lettuce or some sort of meat,
so it would be like ground beef. And then on
(09:12):
top of that was dependent upon the person, like in
a lot of ways, if you imagine Chipotle, but not
as many options. You had lettuce, tomatoes, cheese, salsa, and
maybe if you were in a fancy spot, some like
sour cream and soy sauce and things like that.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
So like blending kind of a more Japanese flavor with
the text mechs.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
America, that tacos became like the representation of what the
American soldiers wanted. So it was like like a text
Mex style. And depending on the person, you'll see some
people the bowl will be as large as as power,
and some folk it will be just like a lot
of rice, a little bit of meat, a lot of lettuce,
a little you know. So it was a cool meal
(09:58):
that everybody was able to create the her own right version.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
Of it with fresh ingredients, with fresh ingredients.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I just remember at a young
age it was something that we did collectively as a family,
Like I remember I would chop the tomatoes, my brother
would chop up the lettuce, and it was just like
this quick thing that we can do straight home from school.
We're helping prepare. Those are some of the memories I have,
and I do have memories coming back to the States
and trying to introduce it to friends, Like my mom
(10:26):
would cook it. We would try to and you know,
people have their thoughts about what they want their taco
to be, so they're like, all right, put Rice in there, man. Rice.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Look, I'm Hispanic and I'm from New Orleans, so Rice
goes with everything. We play with Rice. But yeah, it's interesting.
The idea of what Mexican food has become in this
country almost like a representation of what American food is.
And I think if you drive drive through the South,
you know, you can stop in Virginia at the most
(10:55):
like crazy looking sketchy town with Confederate flags and all
this thing. But all m dudes is in the taco joint.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
That's such an interesting thing. That's true.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
They got they're rocking the Confederate flag and they're looking
at you a certain way. But then they meeting at
the taco joint. So you better believe that this kind
of text mex you know, taco bell and all this
sudden thing. It's kind of permeates what the perception of
an American would want, like nachos, yeah, or something like that.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Right, And that's what's interesting about the taco rice dishes.
The things that aren't there that friends of mine who
as I think about like preparing it, like the things
that they would include when I make versions of it,
I would include like quacamola or like avocados. I would
include like fatilla chips, these types of things, but these
were never part of the table spread. So that's the
(11:41):
part that's interesting too. It's like how ultimately that decision
was made to make the traditional taco rice dish what
it is. And I wish I knew more about it.
I was too young to ask questions. I was just
happy to be eating something that I really enjoyed.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
So yeah, I mean I never knew about it. I
had nothing. I had no knowledge of taco rice. I
thought that was super dope. I mean, my brother's in
the Navy, so I do have knowledge of the culture
of being on a base. Yeah, he doesn't have kids
or anything like that, but you know he's been in Bahrain,
Kuwait and all this kind of thing, and he's like, yeah,
like they'll have burgers and yeah, pull pork, you know,
(12:13):
you know, they don't eat pork there. But because of
the military, I don't know, I don't want to call
it occupation, but because of the military presence, the certain
countries cater to the American needs, even with alcohol, Like
there's countries that they don't drink alcohol, but the soldiers
get it.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Yeah. Yeah. It was interesting as a child. I was eleven, twelve,
thirteen and not really understanding that aspect of our presence there.
And I remember there were times where we had that
it was like one channel on the news that was
it was like one channel on TV that they would
try to get as much American stuff on as possible.
So in the mornings it'll be cartoons and it'll be
(12:48):
the stories, soap operas, then it'll be the news. It
was like the one channel for everybody because you know,
there's no streaming anything. Yeah, but I remember there'll be
times that it'll be like, oh, don't go out in
town today because they're protesting.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Oh snap, know what it meant.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
I'm like, oh they you yes. And as an adult,
and I've explored that in my art too, in terms
of those moments as well, but I think the beautiful
thing about this dish is that I've seen moments where
they were Japanese folks American folks sitting together like eating
this meal. So if it started that way, if it
was like this beautiful blend of cultures intentionally, then I
(13:22):
think that's an amazing thing that food allows us to
do that, to kind of break bread and sit together.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
I mean, that's why me and you are here, right. So,
speaking of eating, so I've got as usually on the
flaky bit. Maybe it's called flaky biscuit because something flaky
always happens. So, you know, we do our ricon. We
exchange emails, you know, Brandon's on board shows up. I've
got this, I've got this really beautiful okay, so let
(13:48):
me tell you what I did before we talk about
on the fly maneuvers here. I got some ground beef
eighty twenty chuck, you know, try to keep it a
little fatty. And I got some dried chittaki mushrooms. Actually
soak those to kind of rehydrate them, slice them up,
incorporate them with the beef and the taco seasoning, some schalllette,
some garlic. He said, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I
(14:10):
threw it down a little bit of sesame oil, like
you know, I got down with that me and I
was like, let me, I don't know much about taco rice,
but I know that a Japanese chef will probably maybe
be using some ingredients like sesame oil. So I do
all that boom had a little bit of a little
bit of like salsa in it, just to give it
creaminess and that kind of salsa type. Damn it. So
(14:34):
Brandon walks in and he's like, oh, shoot, I don't
eat beef, and I was like, oh, by the way,
I forgot to tell you. I don't know but that
this is what makes this so fun because there's no script, like,
there's no things happen across. So I had to pivot.
(14:54):
I was gonna actually do like a four minute egg
on top of that and let the yolk run on it.
What I didn't said is I hard boil them a
little bit more. And I quickly whipped up a new
taco seasoning here with the seasonings they had in the cabinet.
So I'm gonna present to you your taco rice. Yeah,
basically it's just eggs, rice, tomato, but some soy sauce.
(15:17):
But but we'll see where it brings you. So I'm
gonna just step up and grab for you real quick.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
That's amazing what you did with the beef too, and
you got me second guessing.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
What I'm gonna eat it for you.
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Thank you, sir, thank you, thank you. All right, this
looks beautiful.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
Though, man, I appreciate that. Let me get a little
soy sauce on mine. Don't go anywhere.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
We'll be right back after this.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Hey, Brian again, let's get back into it. So I
didn't have any cheese. Current approach of getting those like
chittaki mushrooms in there and kind of creating that umami
that way. I was like, well, we don't really need
you know what, adding cheese like a shredded chaddar it's
like to add oumammy right at richness. So I thought
I had fulfilled that. But anyway, let me know your thoughts. Okay,
(16:15):
give it a taste.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
It is really good. I'm also really hungry, so to
be good, I can imagine all that description.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
When did you stop eating beef and pork if that's
something you're comfortable with talking about.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Yeah, no, it's been about seven eight years now I
was in a relationship with someone who was vegan. It
was the first time I thought about what I ate,
and I was more impressed by the discipline of it.
It wasn't like the what are you putting body? It
wasn't that. It was just when I was like, man,
everywhere we go, we have to like make this announcement
and how to be Like I never thought about discipline
(16:51):
as it relates to food, So I was like, let
me see if I can not do I think it
was pork at first, right, and then time passed and
it was like, okay, I feel different. I don't know
if I feel better, but I feel different.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
You could feel the pork leaving your body.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
And I think the main thing that kind of made
me stick to it and continue to think about what
else to add was one time I made a mistake
in eight Port and I didn't feel well, and so
from that point I was like, okay, this is just
out my system now now I can't go back. So
I do a lot of like Turkey based things, So
like I would have did this this way like Turkey
ground me. I'm not like the type of person is
(17:26):
think I'm better off because I don't it's just I
think my stomach or whatever has adjusted to not having
these things. So when my doctor told me I was tripping,
he was like, you eat steak tomorrow. N it's gonna happen.
And I was like, who knows, a year from now,
I might be like, yeah, that was then and now.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Just like, so you're eight years strong in beef and pork, eat.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Chicken, definitely, chicken, turkey, all seafood. You know, I can
do that easily. Here. Traveling is where I guess the hardest.
And actually, the last time I ate beef, I was
in Korea. It was like a career barbecue spot that
was super authentic. I couldn't read them menu. I was
with some friends. They interpreted things for me and it
was like, if you don't eat the beef here, something
(18:08):
is wrong with you. And I did it and it
was amazing.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Felt fine.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I felt fine, Yeah, but this was early into it. It
was like a year in so if I'm in the
space and they're like, yo, this is the best version
of this that you will ever have, and I'm like, Okay,
I'm gonna do it, you know what I mean? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:23):
No, I mean, what are you gonna do? Say?
Speaker 2 (18:25):
No, right exactly. I do feel like as for my
own personal self, there's more discipline I want to impose
upon myself in terms of what I consume. I tried
to stop doing dairy for a while, but I.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Just yea cheese and yo cheese bro jesus esus so good.
But if Darry be messing my sinuses up, like, I.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Found alternatives and milk that I really love. I love
oak milk, I love all my milk. Yeah. I found
alternatives of ice cream, all these things, but cheese. I
could just not find an alternative.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
There is nothing.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
There is nothing.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
It's just an alternative to cheese.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
And I know my non dairy folk and vegan folks like, yo,
you need to try this version. This version. I've tried
it all, and none of it compares to like real cheese.
One of those things where I'm like, yo, this is amazing.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
Yeah for sure. So to the listeners out there, the
recipe for Brandon's taco rice will be on shandaland dot com.
This is really good, but I bet we're all curious.
I do appreciate you saying that it's really good. How
are we feeling about the nostalgia of the taco rice
I presented to you today. Where does this rank? Did
(19:26):
I bring you back? Are you having a moment, are
you having a flashback? Or are you just eating eggs
and rice?
Speaker 2 (19:33):
This is really different from the way for me, at
least the way I would have prepared it when I
was making my own servant. There's always a lot of dairy,
a lot of cheese.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
So the answer is no, no, no, But I think I
don't eat on a white rice.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
So just eating his rice alone is bringing me back.
The texture of the rice, lettuce and a tomato, bringing
me back to like sitting at that table with my family.
And this is something because I remember, I'm starting to
have memories of like negotiating with myself because I always
wanted more negotiating with myself about how much my portions
was going to be. And I don't know how many
(20:07):
siblings you have or don't have, how large the household
you grew up in, yeah, but for me, it was
always like looking at my brothers seeing how much they
ate and how much is left, and trying to hurry
up before they finished to get more. So these are
just typing memories that's coming back to me, that competitive
spirit of life. Yo, they only have so much left,
and I'm trying to have him finished so I can
go get the rest of it before you do.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
Well, we got a whole pot of rice here. I
ain't got no more eggs though, So you could take
your time.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
With my brothers and probably here this and be like
I knew it.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
I used to have a race with my brother on Thanksgiving.
We'd each take a turkey leg and we'd each pile
or plate high, and this dude would clean me out
every year. He would be relaxed, he would just be
kind of, how you're eating right now, chilling, and I
would be like taking bites. Then I look over he'd done.
You ain't never gonna beat me. That's what my brother saying.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
We should do everything like my mother would get like
pastries or whatever. We would count them out and see
how many people. Okay, there's six in here total. That
means you get to you get to, you get too.
Everything is so competitive about like you can't eat three
if I can only eat one, Like if you eat two,
I have to eat two, et cetera. Yeah, all right,
that's what this is bringing me back to.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
I'll take that you've been brought back somewhere relevant, somewhere special.
I'm glad I can give you those moments once again.
You're continuing to eat, you know, I gotta keepad myself
on the bat. I'm waiting on the episode where someone
takes one bite and just doesn't touch it again, and
I'm be like, oh shit, But I appreciate your honesty
and transparency here. Man.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
You know, I have a question of when that happens.
Do you take that personal? If you prepare something for
someone and they don't like it, don't enjoy it, or
don't finish it.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
No, I don't take it personal as long as they
don't make it personal. Like, you know, if someone comes
to me and insults me or something or whatever, then
I'd be like, yeah, what's up. But if someone just
doesn't like something I made, then that's life. I mean,
not everyone's gonna like everything I do. There's stuff I
don't like to eat. Yeah, I've gone to Michelin rests
and then completely like disappointed. I'll be at the table
(22:03):
to be like, man, this ain't good, this ain't right.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
I mean, that's interesting because that's an art form. There
are many art forms that people will tolerate if they
don't enjoy it, Like you just sit through a bad
performance or sit through a bad film, someone can watch it,
look at a painting and be like, yeah, I don't
like this, but I'll give it some time. It's hard
to food is like it's not passing the test for you, Like, nah,
I gotta go.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
That's an interesting point. And I love how you mentioned
food as an art form. If you don't like food,
you're not going to put it into your body. You know,
if you go over to like you know, you got
a new wife or something and her mama took something,
you better clean that plate. You better clean that plate quick,
all the tricks. Yeah, she's gonna be talking about my
(22:43):
mom makes the best and this and now you take
one by snap. But for me, it's very hard to
find a meal that I don't want it at all
that I'm just like this is gross, like it's I'll
usually play ball a little bit, But you are right.
I mean I've been to a music show or like,
looked at a pain and and be like I don't
really lie with that, and then I just turn around.
I mean like I don't have to engage with it anything.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah. Yeah, And that's interesting. I always wondered that because
comedians talk about what happens if no one laughs, and
I always wondered for chefs.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Yeah, comedians, if no one laughs, it's glaringly obvious if
someone looks at your murals, if you were on the corner,
then you saw someone like they didn't know you were around,
and they were like standing in front of your mural
and they just stood there and then they walked away.
What would go through your mind?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
I think I bacon the idea, but I bacon the
idea when I create that. It's not for everyone, and
people are only going to give you so much time,
Like with murals and etcetera. There's an eight second billboard
rule where like people would give you eight seconds, you
have that much time to try to communicate with them
before they keep moving. They're processing so much information in
(23:51):
their day, especially with phones and just a general stimulation
of what's around them. So I always challenge myself to say, Okay,
what can I commune within eight seconds? How can I
not make this so complicated and so nuanced and so
visually complicated that it requires them thirty minutes just to
get something?
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Do you feel like within that eight seconds if someone
takes their phone out and takes a picture of your art?
Is that is that something that makes you feel good?
Do you not care? Is it something you look for,
like if you know people are in the studio, I
don't even know if you allow photos in there? No,
definitely do Is that like what you would be looking for? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (24:29):
I mean to me, I've been playing with this juxtaposition
of the ephemeral with the eternal as a relations to
the work I create. And this is also an interesting
point for you as an artist as a chef in
terms of like how long does something last? Like are
you upset when someone eats the food in like five seconds?
It's like I've worked on that this long and you
just But with the mural, it's like the idea that
(24:51):
I know it has a short time frame. It's not
going to last forever, whether it's the conditions of the
elements of the environment that's going to beat up on it,
or the building itself might crumble.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
Like at the hurricane. Yeah, exactly, I got a story
about that. I watched it happen. Wow, and continue on it.
I do want to. I do want to jump back
to that, but continue on to what No, it's.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Just the idea that I know that this is not
up for everything. So when someone takes as a photo,
it does sort of impose an extended lifespan because now
they can look back at it on their photo or
if we sell it as a print, they can put
it up on their wall. But I think ultimately, for
me personally, like my experience is the production is the process.
(25:30):
Once that performance is done, then I'm kind of.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Like, Okay, interesting, what else can you do? You've presented yourself,
You've created right, you step back, and.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
To me, that part of it feels like a performance,
like a choreographed dance in a way I remember hearing
friends talk about like the beauty of stage plays. Once
it's over, it's over. You can't record it because it's
not the same, Like what you get from a recorded
version of it isn't the same thing you got from
being there. And so for me, as a person who's
in the process of creating it, when it's done, it's over,
(25:59):
Like I can't recreate what I fell in love about it.
You know, I can look at it and fall in
love with the impact it has on other people, But
for me, the process is done, Like the story is done.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
There's a struggle involved with creation, right. Everything you're saying
is pointing to the fact that there's a slight struggle
involved when you're in the weeds of it, trying to
figure out what it is you're putting out. And I
read somewhere that you wrestle with concepts like black power,
the definition of blackness, and what is the responsibility that
you have to your community to portray these things. I mean,
(26:30):
when I look at your artwork, I see black excellence.
So no, I do, I mean, I truly do so.
I mean, like, how has that molded your path forward?
Speaker 2 (26:40):
I mean, on one extent, I benefited from this collective
moment that we've been in around investigating the value of
black lives. Just this new sort of black arts movement
where you see a lot of creatives, whether it be
in music and cinema and literature or all these things,
where they're like investigating their responsibility. In the moment we're in,
you see the general disregard of black life, and it's like, well,
(27:02):
I'm a black person that's creating communication to the public.
How can I communicate the way I love myself, the
way I love my community? And how does that translate
in the moment, So I understand that I've benefited. My
work has benefited from this current that has pushed it forward.
Other people who said, you know what your work, like
you just said in Black excellence, like seeing your work
makes me love myself, makes me understand why I'm powerful,
(27:26):
why I'm beautiful, And I've benefited from that. But also
I think there's another conversation that a lot of black
artists are having around Is it just that you know,
I have friends who struggle with calling themselves a black artist.
They say, no, I'm just an artist. I listen to that.
I'm so tricky that, yeah, because I can understand, even
as a chef and thinking about when people label you
at that, you know, it opens up a door of
(27:49):
opportunity as well as the type of exceptionality. But you
also know what the door is limiting to.
Speaker 1 (27:54):
Right pretty much, anyone that's black or brown that I
talk to that is creating something. It's just something that
we have to deal with because at least, you know,
I can speak for myself growing up in Louisiana going
to high school and slide, Oh, you already know what
it was calling me. I don't have to get into it.
So I'm always having to validate my existence to myself,
(28:14):
like I am good enough, I'm not those things they
call me. So then when you become successful, like I'm
an afrohunderan or a black baker who's wrote a baking
cookbook like you said, I've benefited from this realization of like, oh,
the media wants to now accept us as worthy. So
we're obviously going to take the opportunities that we can
(28:34):
get because you know, we're trying to get it in.
But then it does make you step back and say, like, oh, man,
like am I am I a good baker? Or am
I a good baker because I'm black? I don't know
the answer.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
No. I think it's definitely a question that a lot
of us explore, and I think for me, the exploration
led me to just focusing on what's most important. When
I did that, I realized what's most important to me
is the fact that I can inspire in life to
fire in folks. Because when I was younger, when I
was in high school, I didn't see examples of what
a black artist look like. Right, there were many examples,
(29:07):
but I didn't have social media. I couldn't look it up.
I couldn't go follow people on Instagram that I felt
model a certain creativity that I had. So I'm excited
by the fact that I can be one of those
examples for these artists that we encounter all the time,
these younger artists that say, Okay, I want to do
it like you. I want to do it better than you.
You've showed me how this way looks, so I want
(29:28):
to do it that way. And I think those things
are exciting to me. How people define you. You would
never like fully satisfy yourself with that answer, because they're
gonna people gonna do it regardless. They're they're gonna dice
you up in some category that makes them feel comfortable. Right.
And you know, there's a quote by Audrey Lord who said,
if I didn't define myself for myself, I would be
shrunk into other people's imaginations and eating alive. You can
(29:51):
vicariously live to other people's imagination, or you could be
like noth but define myself for myself. And I think
for a lot of us, oh, for a lot of
us as creatives, that's why we spent a lot of
our time I'm doing trying to define ourselves for us,
and then you know, some of us but up against
those definitions and say no that I'm absolutely not that,
And I'm gonna show you why some of us embrace
it and say okay that plus more right, and I
(30:12):
think I'm into that plus more cat.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
I mean, you're you're obviously very self aware of where
you're at right now as an artist having a good time.
Stay flaky, We'll be right back. Enough of that, Enough
(30:40):
of that, back to the interview. Tell me quickly, how
did you get from eating taco rice, moving around the
globe to having this world renowned studio. I mean, like,
you know what, when was the moment you were like,
oh shoot, I'm really good at this.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
I mean, the short end of the story is that
I went to Nooka for visual arts. I didn't see
myself reflected in the space, not the physical Nooka space,
but just like the general space of fine arts. And
so I went to school for filmmaking because I was
also in love with filmmaking as well. So I went
to Uno for filmmaking because I did see myself reflected
in those spaces. I saw Spike Lee, John Singleton, and
(31:23):
I'm like, okay, I'm gonna be a movie director. So
I did that, and somewhere in that process of exploring filmmaking,
I got stuck in the purgatory space of music videos,
which any filmmaker student would laugh at that, because there
is a space where you can get stuck in, where
all you do is music videos. I was doing that
in New Orleans, post Katrina, New Orleans, and it was
(31:44):
a beautiful creative space because I'm a super fan of music, right,
Musicians are my favorite people, just seeing their processes so beautiful.
So I was privileged to be able to create music
videos for so many amazing artists and be able to
interpret their music into visuals. But what that afforded me
as well well was this opportunity to explore New Orleans
in a different way post Katrina, New Orleans, where space
(32:05):
was political, where you would see neighborhoods completely still destroyed,
and like on pause, you.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
See the water line exactly, you could still see a
water line.
Speaker 2 (32:13):
And for years, exactly, I'm deep in these spaces looking
for locations for music videos because the rappers they wanted
that look at edge, and so I'm back there location scouting,
and I would see all this amazing graffiti and street art.
Remember my roommate at the time, as well as other friends,
we would just go urban exploring all the time, looking
for locations. But also I fell in love with this,
this process of finding graffiti and just like, all, look
(32:35):
at this beautiful thing, and look at this, So who
did this? Why? And so you know, imitation is the
highest form of flattery. So I'm like going back there
with spray paint now because I'm like, well, I know
how to paint a little bit, so let me try.
So I'm deep into these spaces, trying my own hand
at graffiti, and I fell in love graffiti, or I
should say spray paint, reigniting my love for visual art.
(32:57):
And so I start going back there all the time.
Because at first, so I was just trying to duplicate
what I saw people doing. I was doing a lettering,
and I was like, well, I'm not really that interested
in that. So I started to find my own voice
creating portraits of specifically people in black history. I was
just a super fan of history, so I'm like painting
these portraits of people. And then the media got into
it because the images started to circulate. It was like
(33:19):
this idea that if I'm painting Doctor King in an
abandoned housing project, then there must be a political message.
So it started the Snowball as this political thing. It's
like art. And this is around the time that Banksy
is blowing up. Shepherd Ferry did the Obama poster. So
there's this idea that street artists are political. Yeah, so
it's all just started the Snowball. This first base became
(33:41):
Project B. It got shut down, and then we started
to Exhibit B on the West Bank. Once that ended,
then it was blessed to be able to walk into
what's now Studio B and through that almost ten year journey.
Yeah ten years now, Wow, it's crazy it twenty thirteen
is when it all started. But through that tenure journey,
(34:02):
so much growth, so much understanding of the medium, of
the responsibility. It's been a blessing.
Speaker 1 (34:08):
You're a master man, Like don't even don't even play
no games man. Before we wrap up, we like to
usually play a little flaky game. Got a game for you.
But before we get into the game, I wanted to
circle back to what we talked about during IDA. I'll
give you my experience. You know we're sitting you know,
I've been through Katrina. I've been through I've been through
them all. I'm sure you have been through quite a
few of them as well. And I was in this
(34:31):
apartment and it seemed pretty safe. And I was actually
moving to New York three days after the landfall was expected,
so I was like, I'm not going to evacuate then
be stuck somewhere and can't get my stuff and move
blah blah blah.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
So I stayed.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
And it wasn't supposed to be that bad. Yeah, it
just was not supposed to be bad. And I was like,
it'll be fine. And as the storm progressed, started noticing
it turned into like a wind tunnel or like turn
into like a tornado type vibe, and it just started.
The wind was spinding. Then the power went out, and
the rain was battering, and the wind kept intensifying, and
(35:05):
all of a sudden, right before our eyes, it was
my sister Bridgett and myself. This building just cold, I
mean it just cold. It just fell. And I didn't
realize it was the building that you had that was it,
the buddy Bowlder. Yeah, I didn't realize that until the
next day and the storm came down. You know, we
did a little walk, you know, the walk around the
(35:27):
post storm. And we walked around. I was like, oh shit,
you know, the news was everywhere and the bricks were everywhere,
and I was like, those bricks have something.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
And I was like, oh no, so you.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Know, enough of me talking about my experience with this.
I'd love to know what happened, you know.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
No, I was that was wild. That was an interesting
take because I wasn't there, like last minute we decided
to leave because I lived not too far from that that.
I was living at the Pithyan at the time, right there,
a couple of blocks away. But I do remember when
we came back, I was like, Okay, this mural is done.
Cool part of it. It's unfortunate, but I remember I
tried to go get some of the bricks to like
(36:05):
preserve them. I'm like, okay, this is an interesting moment.
They shut that down. They started to call the police
on me. It was like a big old at that point.
They had the whole space like fenced up. Yeah, and
I was just like, yo, I'm about to go try
to get some bricks. So we walked in. I was
documenting the whole thing, so we tried to have a
conversation with the crew. It was like, yo, we just
wanted to talk and and then one of my homies
(36:26):
took a brick, so we're leaving. They didn't want to
let me film inside. I think that's what I was
trying to do. So we're leaving, I don't know where.
Somebody pops up, like one of my workers just said,
you took a brick? Where is it? And we're like, yo,
what's going on? Like yeah, it got tense. We filmed
the whole thing. But then a couple months later, the
company that owns the space reached out and we're like, yo,
(36:46):
how can we make this work right? And so ended
up getting recommissioned to paint the spat over. So it's
back up, new and improved.
Speaker 1 (36:55):
Amazing. Well, congrats on the new and improved. You know,
I can't imagine what it must have felt like to
know that that crumbled down. But you know, in life,
sometimes you just got to move forward, maybe do something again.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
Yeah, no, definitely, I learned those lessons many times with
painting in public space. Yeah, so it's part of it.
Speaker 1 (37:14):
So I want to pivot into what we call our
flaky game. I got something kind of fun lined up
over for your particular game. First of all, I have
a question. Have you ever made paint with fruits or vegetables?
Speaker 2 (37:29):
No, I haven't. My niece. I have your niece. He's
two almost three, and I did purchase some vegetable based
paint for her and we did like a little finger
paint project. That cool. Well.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
In order to win my game, okay, you need to
get twenty points, okay, and to get a point, you
just have to name an ingredient that can create the
color of paint that I'm going to ask you for.
So yeah, we're gonna have three rounds of this. Okay,
Each rounds ten seconds, So you've got ten seconds and
we will start right now. So you've got to be ready.
You had ten seconds. Tell me as many food ingredients
(38:02):
as you can that can make green paint. Starting out green?
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Uh uh, ginger, avocado, avocado. I don't know why I'm
blanking out celery.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
And that's time. You got two points, alright, So you
getting a little warm, get a little the little spinach
juice or some care or something like that.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
Okay, all the green, yeah exactly, And I'm drinking something
green right now. Just a macha.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
Hey, you can do this.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
Okay, I got it.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
So you got two points. We got to get to twenty.
You got two rounds left, you know, alright ready.
Speaker 2 (38:42):
Red red beets, strawberry berries like regular berries. That's five
A bunch of berries, six, seven meat. I don't know,
like the blood from me.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
I'll tell you.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
We're ten.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Okay, at ten points, Okay, there we go. Okay, all right,
round three, round, last round. See if you can get
ten points. Let's see orange.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
Okay, we can do oranges. You could do Uh no,
that's not orange.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
You mean pumpkin? Is that?
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:24):
Did you mean six different types of squads?
Speaker 2 (39:26):
Yes, chloral fum, squash, squashes, squash, squash, orange. And if
I would have read those ingredients on my niece's coloring thing,
I probably would have got all those. It was like
a vegan some organic.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
When you walk in drinking the green smoothie. I was like, Oh,
he's definitely gonna get this.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
No, this is people to think I'm man.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
And you know, the last thing we definitely want to
talk about is eternal seeds. You're doing so many things
for so many parts of the community, but you mentioned
to us you wanted to talk about eternal seeds. So
let our listeners know what what is eternal seeds and
why is it so important to you?
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Yeah, internal seeds is like where we've been focusing all
our efforts into investing in the creative community of New Orleans,
especially young and emerging artists of color. This idea that
for so many people in New Orleans is is that
thing like that creative space, that imagination incubator, whatever you
want to call it. But there are people who extract
that and say, Okay, I like these things, I like
(40:24):
these elements, I'm going to extract it. But we realize
we have a responsibility to toil in the ground to
make sure the ground is fertile for flowers to grow.
Like I use that analogy earlier, but as a rapper
who said, what's more important the flower or the soil
that grew it? And what are we doing? What is
the work that we're doing to make sure that the
soil there's fertile grounds from new talent, new creativity to
(40:44):
grow and thrive, be sustainable, to be successful. So what
does that look like practically? That's workshops at summer camps,
that's creating opportunities, grants for artists, for creatives and just
making it so that a story like myself, which was
wild and meandering and confusing and organic, how do we
make sure that it doesn't have to be that way
for the next person? Right? How do we make sure
(41:05):
that we pave that ground that the mud that we
got it out of, and we say, oh, I got
it out the mud. How do we make sure it
doesn't have to be that way for the next person? Yeah,
And that's what Eternal Seas is about. Look us up
eternal seeds dot com. If you love anything about New Orleans' creativity,
invest in the future, you know, I.
Speaker 1 (41:20):
Mean, donate, contribute, volunteer, definitely volunteer all the things. All Right, Well,
y'all are ever in New Orleans, I know a lot
of y'all. Wherever y'all live in this country, y'all gonna
be visiting and partying and doing all that. Yeah, But
if you're gonna come and party and stuff, go to
Eternal Seeds dot com and spend a couple hours somewhere
to do something nice for the community here. We really
always need that kind of support, especially the youth that
(41:42):
are growing up here.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
So appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
This has been an absolute honor. I cannot stress enough
how excited this I got goosebumps. I mean we even
waiting for this for a while. Thank you for taking
time to be on Flaky biscuits.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Now, thank you for inviting me. This is fun. I
appreciate you making this meal bringing me back.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
I appreciate that, all right, all right, the appreciate thank you,
thank you, Thank y'all so so so much for listening
once again. Man, I love y'all support. If you want
the recipe for my version of taco rice, find that
(42:18):
recipe on shondaland dot com. This recipe was new to me.
It's in fact, this dish was new to me. I
never knew about it. So I'm really curious as to
how y'all are gonna do. Tag me at artists and Brian,
tag B Mike at B Mike two C and of course,
please don't forget to tag shondaland post those photos videos
(42:38):
you already know, send us messages, leave some comments, get
into that discord and chat with everyone else, Chat with
our other listeners about how y'all are doing with this recipe.
And I think the best advice I can give make
that protein nice in season whatever it is that you
choose get a nice I'm not always a fan of
this package taco seasoning, but you can make your own
(42:58):
by using like cayam pepper, pepper, white pepper, black pepper, salt.
And you know what I'm saying. So just get creative,
make sure you season it up nice and make a
nice comfaning bowl. Don't forget to look up Eternal Seeds
at eternalseeds dot com. You can find their website and
all the handles I've mentioned in the show notes for
this episode. If you like Flaky Biscuit all right, if
(43:22):
you like flaky layers and delicious morsels of nostalgia, then
you know what to do. Leave us a beautiful rating, review, Share, subscribe,
tell the whole world, scream it from the rooftops. If
you're driving to work and you want to hear something delicious,
put on Flaky Biscuit. Thank you so much for joining guys.
(43:42):
Flaky Biscuit is executive produced by Sandy Bailey, alex Alja,
Lauren Homan, Tyler Klang, and Gabrielle Collins. Our creative producer
is Bridget Kenna, and our editor and producer is Nicholas
Harder with music by Crucial. Recipes from Flaky Biscuit can
be found each week on Shondaland. Subscribe to the Shondaland
YouTube channel for more Flaky Biscuit content. Flaky Biscuit is
(44:09):
a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
Ridiculous History
History is beautiful, brutal and, often, ridiculous. Join Ben Bowlin and Noel Brown as they dive into some of the weirdest stories from across the span of human civilization in Ridiculous History, a podcast by iHeartRadio.