October 5, 2022 • 41 mins
Bobbi sits with Tan France to find out what’s important to him.
Tan’s things include his new hosting gig and the inclusive changes he wants to create with it, the changes he’s discovered in himself since becoming a dad and his new gender-neutral fashion line.
There’s a lot of exciting things happening for Tan and it’s all being revealed right here on this episode of The Important Things…
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
I first met Tan France behind the scenes. I think
I was on a TV show. He was a guest
on another show, and I literally just turned around. I
had watched him on TV for years, and I just
turned around to this beautiful man with his beautiful hair,
introduced myself and asked for photos. And he could not
have been any nicer. And for some reason, there's been
(00:26):
some weird connection between us. But we don't get to
talk a lot. But I'm really excited that he said
yes to be on this podcast because I have so
many questions. He's so interesting and such a wonderful man.
So here's my conversation with Tan. Friends. Hello, Oh my god,
you're such a beautiful man. That is very kind of you.
(00:48):
I don't know if I can accept that compliment, but
I appreciate you very much. And is this your bedroom?
Mom saying this is my bedroom in my Salt Lake house. Yeah.
First of all, let's just start. Why are you in
Salt Lake? Why? Um? You know, for so many reasons.
Have you ever First off, have you ever been Salt Lake? Um?
(01:10):
I don't think so. I've gone. I've followed my husband's
skiing in Utah, but that's not where is that. That
was probaly Park City, which is about I've been to
Park City, so Utah. In my opinion, it's the most
beautiful landscape. And I've visited here seventeen years ago. I
was in m I was in New York living for
(01:31):
a short time. My housemate was from Utah asked me
if I wanted to come here. I'd never heard of it,
quite frankly, Utah or Salt Lake is definitely not one
of the places that people get excited about in England,
and so I've never heard about it, and so I
was open to experiencing something new. So I came here,
fell in love with the place, and I just kept
returning and the finally I moved here. Wow, that's it's
(01:56):
just it's it's you know, I just fegued you'd be
in the Hollywood Hills. Yeah, that or something that is that.
It's very part time, but every time I have time off, Honestly, Bobby,
all I want to do is come home to Salt Lake.
My favorite people could not be kinder. And I don't
know how deep you want to go, but I'm just
(02:17):
going to give you the real real. You have a
brown daughter in law, daughter in law South I do.
And now I have a brown granddaughter who she's a Gendiangendian.
Yeah one week one week ago. Oh my gosh, congratulation.
That's amazing. Things, that's amazing. I've got a half South Asian,
half white sun also or child also. Anyway, So I
(02:42):
when I got here, there was something about being South
Asian in Utah compared to England. In England, South Asians
were treated like second citizens and probably still are actually
still off and we were kind of the undateable, so
you wouldn't really take us home to see the family
and so um. And so then I came to Utah
(03:04):
and weirdly, the first night I was here, I was
asked out twice, and I thought, well, I'm desirable here.
They don't know where I'm from and therefore they don't
know what to apply to me, and so they don't
have to be racist and they just he is being
exotic and so yeah, that's There's so much. There's so
many reasons why ale of Utah, but that's one of
(03:24):
them is I was treated as an equal here, which
was really beautiful. Well, and it's and you know, being
uh a gay British Pakistanian in Utah. You would think
you would just be like stand out and people say,
who are you? Yes? Have you ever seen anyone else
like you? Very few no, No South Asian gay men
(03:46):
they probably are, but that one, um and very few
brown gay men Mocy white. However, when I moved here,
when I first started coming here seventeen years ago, there
was no diversity. It definitely has gotten better over the
last for decades UM. But with the gay community, I
think this is the case in general. I don't think
(04:07):
I would have done well twenty years ago. Seventeen years ago,
it was definitely on the gay websites it was no Asians,
no whatever, no one or whatever. And I was definitely
one of those no thank you, And so yeah, it was.
It was interesting dating here, really interesting. Wow. Wow. And
and your son, I mean, I've not seen what he
(04:28):
looks like because you always put those like like those
faces on. I'm going to show you a lady, not
for camera. Oh my god, he looks so beautiful. He
looks like you. That's very kind. I see everybody else
thinks he looks likely. I don't see it myself, but
(04:49):
I do think he's beautiful, absolutely beautiful. He is beautiful.
But he looks he's a brown boy. Yeah, he looks
like you. He definitely looks more brown than he does.
Why I thought, you know, you never known with a
mixed rays child what would be I assumed he would
it was quite white or just Mediterranean. He definitely looks
(05:11):
wow wow. So how how has fatherhood changed you? You know,
you know this. It's gonna sound strange considering this Sherman,
But anyone who's listening, who has ever seen Queer Eye,
they will know. Up to a year and a half ago,
I only ever cried twice. We there were five seasons out,
technically six we did a special season in Japan, so
(05:34):
technically six seasons. I only ever cried twice. And I
got it together real quick. I am very typically British,
which means I don't emote much. And then it wasn't
even when we heard my son, but we were just
expecting my son. I became such an emotional person. I
will cry at the drop of a hat if something
(05:56):
emotional has happened, especially if it comes to children. I
am just so it's become a much more empathetic, compassionate,
emotional person um and it has dictated how I lived
my life a lot more clauses. Um, I say no
to a lot more than I ever did before, so
I could be at home little more often. So yeah,
it has really changed me in so many ways. Well,
(06:19):
it's funny that you say that you say no to
a lot, because you say yes to a lot too.
You're doing so many amazing things and your career has,
like you know, has just like exploded. I'll never forget
when I ran into in the UK. You were doing
the show with my Brain and what's her name? The
beautiful Girl? Was it not your co host Alexi Chuan
(06:41):
Alexa Alexa Chun? Yes, yes, so that was Now what
show was that? That wasn't show called Next in Fashion? Right? Okay,
so but your first show was Queer. I was that
she was queer? Is that what put you on the map? Yeah.
So I had never auditioned for anything I was. I
had no just an entertainment I got. So I had
(07:04):
my own businesses. I was thankfully quite successful at that
and I retired, um quite young age. I was thirty two,
and somebody at Netflix found out through well somebody who
was looking to cast for this show at Netflix found
out and said, well, you must be free and available
then um and so they did all they could to
(07:26):
make me audition for this show. UM and so I
never planned on being an entertainer. That was not what
I thought was going to be my life. UM and
I had not audition over over what was Skype at
the time, and it went incredibly well. I thought, Okay,
that's it. That was my taste of what it must
be like to audition for something. UM and I never
(07:46):
thought in a million years that I would then go
out for a physical chemistry test, which was an audition,
and then I got the job. So within three weeks
I had gone from living a very regular a life
um to being an entertain Wow, but the fashion has
been your life, Like, that's what you did before? And
(08:10):
is that what you studied in college and university? Yes? Yeah,
I studied in college and I was very excited to
be a designer. It was it was what I thought
was going to be the rest of my life. UM.
I come from a really strict Asian family, which means
that you are a doctor or a lawyer. That are
usually the only two options. I knew that that was
(08:34):
definitely not for me. I was not I was academic,
well naturally academic. I always did well in school, but
I didn't care to try because I just didn't enjoy academia.
Because I always knew what I wanted from such a
young age, tobab Me, I was that kid who I
think some people are just destined to be who they become.
And as a kid, I from the age of seven
(08:55):
or eight, I remember so distinctly wanting to choose what
my mom will wanted to choose what my sister's well,
and they had sories in the house and I would
use those stories on them to create something that wasn't
a sorry, like create a skirt and a top just
I wanted. I wanted to make them feel beautiful. My
family is very Muslim, which we usually wear modest clothing,
(09:19):
especially around others. They would wear clothes that would cover
up their more fashionable close than me, and so I
really wanted them to feel beautiful always and so well.
As I got older, I learned how to set my
my granddad's factory. I became a very very very proficient
so a um and so by the time I hit
(09:40):
college age, I actually could create something very skillfully as
if it was going to be sold in a retail store.
And so my passion for wanting to just make my
mom feel beautiful and my sisters feel beautiful. I never
realized was going to turn into what I now do.
And I also thought if I do that, it was
just going to be as a designer. I will create
a brand, I will design clothes for somebody and hope
(10:03):
that my audience will like it. I never realized that
it would. I would do it familiar And how supportive
was your very strict family when they found out your
choices in your life style? Um? Not super supportive. Not surprisingly,
(10:23):
I think everyone just thought it was a joke in
a phase like oh ha ha, yeah, you'll do it
for a year at college when you're realizing I'm not
going to make any money, And that was always the dig,
like you're gonna be broke. They saw it as a
starving artist. Basically, yes, you make really passionate about it,
but will it pay for a family? And back in
(10:43):
the day, I wasn't out, and so my family just
assumed I would have a wife and children and how
could I possibly support them when I'm an artist? And
so I think for the majority of my early twenties,
late teen, daily twenties, it was convincing my family that
I can I will find a way to make money
from this. I can build a living out of this,
(11:05):
and so I will never forget the conversation I have
with my mom. So, my my dad passed away when
I was thirteen, and my mom was the one who
was trying to make sure that her final child and
the youngest you lived up to what my father wanted. Um.
And so she was so incredibly disappointed when I told
her that I wanted to make clothes for a living.
I design clothes for a living, and I was an
(11:28):
interesting sixteen seventeen year old. I told my mom very confidently.
I said, look, I know that your other children, my siblings,
if I love very much academic and have good jobs,
like conservatively good jobs. Um, but I promise you, if
you give me the freedom to do this, I swear
(11:49):
I will work so hard that I will become your
most successful child. And I won't I won't sponder this opportunity.
I won't behave like an idiot. I will work to
create something incredible so that I'm not the punchline for
you family affairs. Because we are we're a really tight
knit community, theation community I've got over a hundred family
(12:09):
members within a couple of miles um to my mom,
and so I know how important it is to not
feel shame and to make sure that you don't embarrass
the community. And so my point to my mom was
always just I've always been reliable. As you know, son,
I's always a good boy. I will be a good boy.
I will be responsible. Just give me the freedom to
(12:31):
do it my way. And I promised, how I will
make you proud, um. And so it took a few years,
but finally she could see that I wasn't just selling
printed T shirts out the back of my car. She
finally when I purchased my first home, I think she
finally realized, Oh, you're not just doing something that I
(12:54):
consider a joke. You're doing something she's respectable. And how
was she when you told her that you are getting
you know, actually weirdly, Okay, the first few minutes, we're
really shocking to her. So I came out to my
sister and my brother before I came out to her mom, um,
(13:14):
and so they helped me get through this um. And
so I told her, actually she found out she found
a picture that she was not going to find and
thankissing my boyfriend UM, and so under my bed on
my bed at her house. I had long since moved
out of her home, but I had a bunch of
botombs under my bed that were all locked, and she
decided to break them up and because just wanted to
(13:36):
see what her Asian kids are doing. That's what Asian
parents do. This is no such thing as privacy. You
can have whatever you want. That's your child. And so
she broke in and she's so just one picture was
so innocent, was giving my boyfriend a peck on my lips. Um,
And she was mortified. And she spoke to my brother
and sister saying, that's it. He can't ever come home.
(13:57):
We are done. He can't. He can't be a part
of the family. So I called her, UM, and I said,
I heard what you saw, and I hear what you said, Um,
And that's fine. However, you're about to lose, so do
she You're about to lose the best memory. I'm the
glue that holds your family together every time the fight.
(14:20):
I'm the one who steps in. I don't let your
your children fight. I don't know you fight with your siblings.
And I've always been a grandma like I've ever since
I was a team I've always been incredibly mature at
that age for such a young person. If there was
a fight in the family, I would always go on
media and make sure that there was no drama between them,
(14:40):
between family, especially grandma. Why do you say grandma not grandpa? Oh,
Because in my culture is always a grandma that solves
the drama between their family. Always the grandpa's just kind
of stared at it and pretend it's not it. Just
so yeah, I was. I was always that person. And
so I said, look what you're about to lose, in
(15:03):
my opinion, the best member who will make sure that
you still have a family in fifty years. If you
want to let that go, fine, what I just want
you to understand you will you will actually lose me
if you if you decide to do this. And she
was like, okay, you're You're right, I don't want to
lose you. You will always my son. And I said,
other than that, other than me being gay, I've never
(15:23):
ever do anything that should make you feel negatively towards me.
I've been a good son. I've taken care of you
at every turn. I've taken care of you, even though
at times others didn't. Do you really want me, of
all your kids to leave? Um? And so we had
a really honest conversation, probably the first virtually honest conversation
I had, saying, what do you want for your life? Mom?
(15:47):
And Aunt? I are part of that? Haven't I joined
everything you've asked for, even though yes, I didn't have
the career that you expected. Yes, I moved to America,
which is not what an Asian will ever wants, is
to put a son to remove away on the child
my way. Other than that, I've been a good son
to you. Do you really want to disown me? Um?
And she was really good about it. She was like, no,
(16:08):
I was shocked and not to set. Of course, I
could never live my life without your youngest. It was beautiful,
it was peutful, and so since then that I mean,
it was literally an hour of weirdness. And we went
right back. And she must be so thrilled to be
a grandma to your son. She's obsessed. Um. So I
(16:29):
brought my family out from England, all nineteen and my
immediate to uh l a place and none of them
have ever been to America. Um. So this was the
first time in the United States. UM. And they all
stayed for twelve days. UM. And it was a lot,
but it's very Asian to have that roof, so it
(16:52):
wasn't bizarre to us. UM. And so they all got
to spend time with my son. At that point, he
was just over six months old, UM, sorry, just under
six months old, UM, And they had the most amazing
time with him. It was weird having a child with
them not being with him regularly because ordinarily, when one
of us has a kid, our families in and out
of our homes multiple times a days. We'll all used
(17:15):
to live so close to each other. So I was
the only one of the extended family who's ever had
a child, and you've for meet that child for once,
and so they made up for last time. Yeah, my
mother loves him. Yeah, it must be hard that she's
so far away, but it's you probably do these facetimes
with her right a lot. Yeah. I mean she just
drive me in saying the last couple of weeks. My
mom has a wildly active social life, which drives the nuts. Um.
(17:39):
She hangs out with it. She's got two older sisters
and she's always out of the house. I've become her
times I've had to say you need to be in
at a certain time, don't be out all day? Why
you were more again? Um? And so finally I had
it out with a few days ago, saying I've tried
to call you three times this week and you've not
answer my call once. I just need you to answer. Uh.
(18:00):
Beat that. So I want to just dive a little
bit into your career because that's a white how people
know you, and you know, I know you thought you
were going to retire at one point. I saw that
(18:22):
on the notes, but clear clearly that didn't happen. So
Queer I now is in their fifth season? Is that no? Actually,
so now we are. We just wrapped us seventh season,
but we've technically got eight, so there's a mini season
on on Netflix, which is in Japan, so technically we
shot Okay, wow, that's incredible. So you're you're right now
(18:43):
you're done with this? Because didn't you just sign on
to a new show that's going to be filmed out
of the UK? I did, so, Actually I have not
done quere I couere I still definitely a thing. Um.
And also this is a total brag. Pubby but I'm
gonna do it. We made history at the end is
three weeks ago we have won more more awards at
(19:05):
the Emmys for unscripted than any show in history and consecuted.
So we were now a history, which is wonderful. So yes,
we're not getting anywhere anytime soon. Um. And then I
and then I have another show which you've seen with
the like to Jump or you know of with the
like what. I just finished season two of that in
(19:30):
the spring and my co host is now Gigi Headid,
who I love very was one of my closest friends. Um.
So that was magical. And then um, then very soon
I leave for the UK to shoot say yes to
the dress? Um, so say yes to the dress. It's
been Can I tell you a bit about so they
(19:51):
asked if I would join, and that was very particular
about a group, particular about what I will say yes
to on TV in particular, I want to cultivate a
and kind of brand. Um. And I'm still one of
the very few South Asians in entertainment and definitely one
of the very very few queer South Asians and queer
(20:12):
South Asian Muslims, and so I feel real responsibility to
make sure that I'm not just making white tv UM
and I make sure and I keep that at the
forefront of my mind every time I decide whether I
want to do a show or not. Thankly, I'm in
a very problem position where we get offered a fair
amount and the majority of the stuff I say no to.
UM And this one excited me because they said, what
(20:34):
would you do if you if you were to bring
back say yes to the dress? And I've always thought
says was wonderful. It's been going on for years. It's
a very very successful show for TLC and now Discovery
plus UM it's one of the biggest shows that they've
never done, but they haven't shot it for a few years. UM.
And so my concern all my request was this, you
(20:55):
when you book me, are you hiring me for something?
There's a reason why your booking meat. If you want
to hire anybody else, they will do it their way.
With me. I'm very particular about how I shoot and
very particular about what I want to put out there
in the world. And I know that that sounds sorry.
And after four or five years, I've only been in
this five years, but I've hit a point point in
my life where I get to dictate this is what
I will do and this is what I want to
(21:17):
And so with this it's a case of I won't
just dress white women in white wedding a dresses. That's
not my brand at all. You can hire anyone out
of the UK who's Caucasian and would possibly be fine
with that. They're they're representing their people. I don't want that.
If I do this, I want it to be incredibly diverse.
I want to not do it out of a bridal story.
(21:39):
I want to do it at a place where we
can decide if you've got an Indian bribery of Indian
dresses and we've got tired, We've got tired dress, We've
got a Nigerian I've got Nigerian dresses. I want to
what I've watched, um say you to the dress and
thought this is a beautiful show. But I'm sure if
I still watching should be thinking, yes, it's will lovely
that all these white women dressing these white I want
(22:01):
the fantasy too, um. And so I think I'm one
of the very few people who get to demand that
when you offered me a show, saying I'll do on
these conditions and so I'm really excited about it. I'm
really really to make my version of say yes, that's
so cool. Well as as someone who has gotten to
wear Indian dresses to my daughter in law's wedding and
(22:23):
her baby shower. Like I just I love all the
different cultures. I just did so much fun to be
part of it. So yeah, and I was sure that.
I mean again, it did soone, it was off for
so many years, it did so many episodes. But I
just think after a certain while, I've been thinking, Okay,
it's a little white dress, give me the story. And
(22:46):
when you travel to do this, does your husband and
son come with you? Yeah. We just got back from
New Orleans where we shot a lat season of where
I we all traveled as a family. We were there
for three months, um, and we all go to the
UK together if I do more than a week or
two maximum than the family troubles. And I noticed your
husband took your last name. Is that or is that correct?
(23:09):
Actually we both took each other's. So my husband is
Rob Softer France and I'm Tanca. Okay, okay, yeah, no
I like that because you don't usually see that. Yeah,
in my opinion, it made it seemed like one of
us was more important than the other, and we just
feel like it was in the relationship, and with it
(23:30):
being a gay marriage, we get to create our own rules.
And so yeah, I love having able at all study
And so what else haven't you done that you want
to do besides your men's grooming line that I'm still
you know, I'm ready for you when you decide you're
coming out with the men's Come on, you don't have
to do anything except hold a jar and everyone would
buy it. I'm ready, but we believe me. I'm ready.
(23:54):
I've been talking about doing it for a long time.
We just never found So you and I start talking
abou up. Yes, you mentioned it years ago, probably two years,
and we never found that. We were going to do
it at one point and it just didn't feel like
the right thing at the time. Hopefully one day soon
we'll find the right way to do it. I have
(24:15):
my own brand of our tour, which I love, so yes,
tell me about that, because I remember when it launched.
There's so many beautiful pieces. Thank you. So it's seasonal.
We only do it um well, we only really pushed
it between November and February it's just two dns we
do each year now, so yes, last year was our
first year and this year we got dropped three and four.
(24:38):
I think it's gorgeous this year actually, well the whole time.
It's inspired by being British and being American and being
South Asian and so the coast themselves are very tailored
but ties into being British. UM, and we add embroidery
which is very very complete Asian. This year we're adding
do you know what couch babriack has many chance, Bobby,
(24:59):
have you been seen that? Probably with little mirrors on
the usually lots and embroidered around it. That's called clutch fabric.
It's it's salvation very differently and at that way, I'm
positive you saw a bunch of it but probably hadn't noticed.
But it's very traditional for us UM and so on
finding ways to add that to my brand also so
people feel like they're getting a version of about where
(25:21):
that is quite unique. UM. I work with my husband
done creating the embroidery, so he will create the artwork
that will then be embroidered onto the coats. UM. So
it's called was him. My middle name is the scene.
But it's spelled W A S H I M. And
so we just broke up the middle name and called it.
But it's a neutral. It's for men and women. We
(25:42):
have men and women modeling the brand. I think it's gorgeous.
I'm really I'm really proud of it, and it's the
only way I'm wanting to design these days because having
run there's a lot and I've got four shows that
I work on so acutely busy all year, and the
last thing I can handle it is a full brand
(26:03):
or running a full brand right now. I understand that
and think about sizes because I am a five foot tall,
petite woman who it's really hard to find clothes you
know that fit me. And I have friends that are
large sized women and they have trouble, so you know,
people don't think about body shape. Yeah with our brand, okay,
(26:28):
we don have a petite maage. I will be honest. However,
we when it comes to the actual sizing and the brand,
the people that we have model models, well, the people
that we have model is relatively diverse, um, which I
was really proud of the amount of ethnicities represented. And
(26:48):
body shapes is something we will continue to do always okay,
well that I used. I used to own brands and
one of them was to swim my brand and we
never I don't remember every using any under a size mm.
Really they're not the ones who have But then I
mean that the supermodels, the ones who are TV TV,
(27:11):
they're not buying the product. The design is gifting into them.
We would we were designing for real of it. And
tell me about the shirt you're wearing, because you know
you have a very cool style and I've never seen Oh. Thanks,
So this is a brand that no longer is this
from the UK? I love an article stripe. It's a classic.
I will also describe it. We are on a podcast,
(27:32):
describe it. Oh you know, also showing this. Sorry, I'm
wearing a nautical stripe. T is maybe in blue. It's
got a beautiful vintage rose patch from a brand that
used to exist called Canton co In, which was a
heritage British brand. Yeah, because I love classic things that
have a twist. Yeah yeah, yeah. And what I will
(27:52):
say it got more difficult for me because of the
job that I hold. I can't do classic as much.
People expect you to push more. I think if I
was dressed classic all the time, and I was guilty
of this at the start. I really wanted to continue
how I dressed, continue on with how AD dress, which
was very classic, with the amount of people who said, oh,
(28:13):
he plays it safe all the time, how is he
the style guy? So you feel pressured to the anti
what's your favorite men's sock? Yeah, I mean people don't.
I mean I'm someone that believes you should have really
good underwear and really good socks. Socks, Okay, I love.
I hate to say this because it's a celebrity brand,
(28:36):
but I think it's called Arthur Arthur George. Yeah, it
is South the George. Rob Kardashian's brand is actually very good,
very good. And then I if it's not that, I
really love the J Crew suck always always um. And
then when it comes to under one, very particular for men,
there's a brand c d LP. I'm not affiliated with
(28:57):
them in any way, but there are European brand I
think from Scandinavia somewhere. In my opinion, c d LP
has the best quality of ever ever had. Boxers are brief,
both both and pajamas and ropes. They just all feel gorgeous.
I don't want they're doing how they're doing it, but
it's beautiful. Did you write that down? What's the name
(29:20):
of it? Because I want to order the pajamas c
D L P D LP Okay, I love them? How
about that is very specific, but I mean I do
love that pajamas to my favorite pajama place. Yeah, Bobby
is called Sleepy Jokes pleepy jamas. Yes, I have a pair.
They're very comfortable. I love that pajamas. So yeah. And
(29:40):
I and I wear the Brooks Brothers men's pajamas. They're
like the best. I almost look like your sheets and
oh yeah those are really good. So what are what
are some of your other brands? Like what do you
have a gene brand that you love? I really like
a brand called Closed, which I think you're yeah, um
(30:02):
they're great. Um. And then T shirts there's a brand
called Evelyne of Yeah yeah, um they're quality T shirts
is great um and I love what they stand for. Um.
So yeah, that's a brand I love very much. And
then when it comes to what's the T shirt that
I wear? The one from the UK I discovered to you,
okay t shirt that I'm in love with is it
(30:25):
called arkad No Son what is it called sun Spell.
It's a very old brand, you know, sun Spell the
best of T shirts. I now buy them in bulk.
They're amazing. Okay, then I'm gonna be one more if
you like. I don't know, but I'm going to give
you a counter, a brand from the UK called Arquette.
(30:45):
It's spelled like market but without the Okay, arkhead. Tell
me a bit about your health and wellness, because you
look incredibly healthy. Do you have a certain way that
you eat? Oh gosh, Bobby, I wish I could say
(31:09):
another thing what I was about to lie and say.
I wish I could do better. I could, Everyone can
do better. However, I here's my here's my balance. I
eat well Monday to Friday. Mostly I don't have much
fried food. Every now and then I'll have fries, but
I will have just a few. But most people can.
(31:31):
Monday and Friday a pretty down well nothing only Friday,
nothing really processed um. And I cook a lot for
myself on the weekend, and I think this is why
my balance works and has been sustainable. On the weekends,
I will enjoy what I want to enjoy. I don't
go crazy crazy, but I will if I want something
like pizza, I'll have pizza if I whatever I want,
(31:52):
I will mostly have. Um. My only major weakness. I
don't have any vices. I don't drink alcohol, I don't smoke.
I don't do much that could hurt my body. However, Um,
I've got a terrible sweet tooth, shocking like shockingly bad
sweet tooth. Um. And so if my metabolism metabolism wasn't
(32:14):
so intensely high, I probably would uh not be the
way I am now because it doesn't My my physical
appearance doesn't show you how badly I eat sweets. Wow.
And you don't drink cartails at all? No, every now
and then, Like many years ago, I would have a
(32:36):
glass of champagne if I was off going at a party.
But it's been many, many many, but at least fifteen years.
My husband doesn't drink either. Um, So it's much easier
to not drink in your partner doesn't drink um. Yeah.
I don't have many actual vices other than actual sugar. Yeah.
And I do work out. To be fair, I do
work out a lot. I really like to keep in shape,
(32:57):
and it's for my husband, really is, and if he
feels the same way about me. We work out regularly,
and it's not because I want to look a certain well.
I don't want to look like in a Jonnis. I
don't ever expect look like a muscle man. I just
want to stay fit and healthy and active because we're
very keen hikers. Um, we love to boulder like we're
(33:19):
we're we have. We live a very active lifestyle here
in Utah, and so I just want to be able
to keep it as long as I can. And I
want my husband to look at me and think yeah
and yeah, and you want to feel good in your
body too. I mean it's it's definitely. So I have
another Utah question just because I read it on on
the on the notes that you are the first person
(33:40):
to design close for Mormons. Is that no, okay, no,
Like I will, I was explained this, I think somebody
else and I think that that information is sowhere but
slight slightly accurate. So I did design clothing for woman women.
(34:01):
They were my first three brands. However, I think well, no,
I think I am. I was the first non woman
to make clothing form woman women. So I started out
in Utah working for a company about twelve thirteen years ago,
and when I worked with this company, it was a
modest clothing company UM and I didn't know what that
(34:22):
was before I started working there. But in Utah, they
weren't clothing brands. But I was I wanted to live
here and be with my husband, so the only job
I could find was working for this company. So I
was a sales director of the company UM and I
loved what they stood for. I loved what they did,
but I didn't know of it beforehand. However, I worked
in a fashion for a while. I understood many facets
(34:43):
of the business, but I didn't know how to start
a new business, a small business and build it from
the ground up. And that's what they had achieved here.
And they were selling the company. This was wonderful woman
who was the owner. She was selling the company to
a much much larger American business called jumpany UM and
so that business was no longer. And so I asked,
I was like, to you mind if I create my
(35:04):
own version of a modest clothing company. I respect what
you guys have done, but I really want to create
a modest clothing where nobody would know it's modest clothing.
Because this is absolutely going to create the work she did,
and I'm not trying to be mean. However, her brand
and her competitors brand, they just looked very homely, like
(35:25):
the clothes look like almost as if somebody were living
in amish Land. Like it was very say, when there's
people walk down the streets, there they're wearing modest clothes,
and I just thought, yes, I understand what you need
to cover, but why can't it be beautiful, Like, why
can't it just look stylish? And so I set out
to create a modest brand for moment women that looked
(35:50):
good enough to be worn around London and nobody would
ever know that they were trying to cut their bodies.
And so we did. And so I think that's why
we saw such great success, don't in among The first
two years were halacious, absolutely helicious. I started the business
with my own money. I started the next to no
money whatsoever. Well, then after a couple of years the
business started to do really well, and I think it's
(36:11):
because we were finally offering something that I just wasn't
there for anybody out of that anybody else was doing.
It was just nice clothes that just so happened to
cover part of the body, and we had such a
massive Jewish customer base who assumed we were a Jewish company.
We had a massive Mustland custom base, but were a
Mustland company. All these people that had been neglected by
(36:34):
the fashion industry finally felt like and And the strange
thing was, so I didn't what we call wholesale. For
anyone listening who don't know what wholesale is, it's were
we designed the product, We put the company's label in
that product, and they sent us down and we did
it for like some mud cloth, which was a mative
retail online retail at the time. We did a Nordstrum project.
(36:56):
And none of these people knew that we were catering
to religious people. They just saw it as nice clothing.
And so once we started the wholesale, we had all
these businesses in New York and wherever who were a
Jewish moment pop shop, I don't know, an Indian moment
pop shop, a Hindu whatever. None of them realized that
(37:18):
we weren't catering to them. We were catering for body studience.
But they didn't just covered what that's that's really very cool. Yeah,
I I just I couldn't even imagine. But there are
so many similarities and all the different cultures that it
really makes sense. And quite honestly, just to put that
slightly more, if we knew that somebody really wanted something
(37:42):
from us, Let's say an example, there was a Jewish
store that would have purchased a lot if they loved
one of the styles we had, and they knew that
I just needed to raise the next cline slightly, so
I'd covered the colophone. We did it. If they were
ordering enough, we didn't. And so I think that's what
made a successful Like what do you need? What does
your girl all need to feel beautiful? And we'll get there.
(38:02):
M m no. For um, you know, first of all,
you're the most upp positive person. And before I ask
you the last, before I feel, are you ever in
a bad mood? Yes? So really so yeah I am, uh,
but one would probably know that my version of bad
(38:23):
mood is using not anyone's versional. I just go a
little lighter than usual. But I'm you know, anyone who's
listening will know who this is. My my Custmas, Anthony
and Jonathan. I would watch their interviews. We all did
separate interviews. We all continue to separate interviews. From different publications,
and inevitably the interview always asked about the other co
(38:46):
host on this show, and the one thing I hit
them say a thousand times over is what you see
with Tan is not an act. He's weirdly the peppiest
person you'll ever meet. First in the morning, I just
I don't know what. I'm so great for life in general.
I just the luckiest boy in the world, and I
just think, what am I going to moan about? Yeah? No,
it's it's very evident you're one of those people that
(39:08):
brings the energy into the room instead of sucks it out.
So um. But so the last the last question that
I asked everyone since this podcast is called The Important
Things because I don't know, I couldn't think of anything else,
but it's called the Important Things. If you could tell
people listening one thing that they're going to remember out
of your mouth, it's going to help them change their life,
(39:31):
what would it be go into everything with intention when
you are I've mentioned something of the spot on the show,
but it's usually about clothes, but it's not just about clothes.
What you put on your body, the way you treat
a person, the way you are with your family, the
way you are with your friends, the way you are
at work really does dictate how you're perceived and how
(39:55):
you will live out the rest of your life. Whether
you're in my wild or a regular corporate world or
your family. Go into it with the intention of just
trying to be good and do good, and that will
serve you well. But never a time in your life
where you would have come across some major adiversity and
you had to be the bigger person and you'd be
good and be kind and you will regret it. Yes,
(40:17):
you may think, gosh, I wish I had stood up
myself and I wish I had told this person, Yeah,
you can't treat me that way. However, long term, you
look back thinking, I'm really glad I chose to be good.
I'm really glad I chose to be kind. Um, So yeah,
choose being decent at every turn in every situation. I
love this and I hope that we cut that up
and post that all over because that is an incredible advice.
(40:40):
So thank you so much. Thank you so much for
talking to me, Thank you for showing me your son,
your bedroom, your teacher, your underwear, everything. So thanks, Yeah, Bobby,
I was just gonna say this, you're an angel. I'd
be following you for a while. You are, actually, I
don't know if you realize it's the inspirational you've always
(41:01):
see buddy, peppy and positive on your instead, you are
a very inspirational lady. Thank you. When you're ready for
the beauty talk, I'm telling you I I know exactly
what you should, what you should do, and how you
should do it. So call me anytime. Okay. I love that.
I'm actually going to figure something out with you. I
love that big hit. Thanks for listening. Follow us on
(41:22):
social at The Important Things podcast on Instagram, and just
Bobby Brown on TikTok. See you guys next time.
I first met Tan France behind the scenes. I think
I was on a TV show. He was a guest
on another show, and I literally just turned around. I
had watched him on TV for years, and I just
turned around to this beautiful man with his beautiful hair,
introduced myself and asked for photos. And he could not
have been any nicer. And for some reason, there's been
(00:26):
some weird connection between us. But we don't get to
talk a lot. But I'm really excited that he said
yes to be on this podcast because I have so
many questions. He's so interesting and such a wonderful man.
So here's my conversation with Tan. Friends. Hello, Oh my god,
you're such a beautiful man. That is very kind of you.
(00:48):
I don't know if I can accept that compliment, but
I appreciate you very much. And is this your bedroom?
Mom saying this is my bedroom in my Salt Lake house. Yeah.
First of all, let's just start. Why are you in
Salt Lake? Why? Um? You know, for so many reasons.
Have you ever First off, have you ever been Salt Lake? Um?
(01:10):
I don't think so. I've gone. I've followed my husband's
skiing in Utah, but that's not where is that. That
was probaly Park City, which is about I've been to
Park City, so Utah. In my opinion, it's the most
beautiful landscape. And I've visited here seventeen years ago. I
was in m I was in New York living for
(01:31):
a short time. My housemate was from Utah asked me
if I wanted to come here. I'd never heard of it,
quite frankly, Utah or Salt Lake is definitely not one
of the places that people get excited about in England,
and so I've never heard about it, and so I
was open to experiencing something new. So I came here,
fell in love with the place, and I just kept
returning and the finally I moved here. Wow, that's it's
(01:56):
just it's it's you know, I just fegued you'd be
in the Hollywood Hills. Yeah, that or something that is that.
It's very part time, but every time I have time off, Honestly, Bobby,
all I want to do is come home to Salt Lake.
My favorite people could not be kinder. And I don't
know how deep you want to go, but I'm just
(02:17):
going to give you the real real. You have a
brown daughter in law, daughter in law South I do.
And now I have a brown granddaughter who she's a Gendiangendian.
Yeah one week one week ago. Oh my gosh, congratulation.
That's amazing. Things, that's amazing. I've got a half South Asian,
half white sun also or child also. Anyway, So I
(02:42):
when I got here, there was something about being South
Asian in Utah compared to England. In England, South Asians
were treated like second citizens and probably still are actually
still off and we were kind of the undateable, so
you wouldn't really take us home to see the family
and so um. And so then I came to Utah
(03:04):
and weirdly, the first night I was here, I was
asked out twice, and I thought, well, I'm desirable here.
They don't know where I'm from and therefore they don't
know what to apply to me, and so they don't
have to be racist and they just he is being
exotic and so yeah, that's There's so much. There's so
many reasons why ale of Utah, but that's one of
(03:24):
them is I was treated as an equal here, which
was really beautiful. Well, and it's and you know, being
uh a gay British Pakistanian in Utah. You would think
you would just be like stand out and people say,
who are you? Yes? Have you ever seen anyone else
like you? Very few no, No South Asian gay men
(03:46):
they probably are, but that one, um and very few
brown gay men Mocy white. However, when I moved here,
when I first started coming here seventeen years ago, there
was no diversity. It definitely has gotten better over the
last for decades UM. But with the gay community, I
think this is the case in general. I don't think
(04:07):
I would have done well twenty years ago. Seventeen years ago,
it was definitely on the gay websites it was no Asians,
no whatever, no one or whatever. And I was definitely
one of those no thank you, And so yeah, it was.
It was interesting dating here, really interesting. Wow. Wow. And
and your son, I mean, I've not seen what he
(04:28):
looks like because you always put those like like those
faces on. I'm going to show you a lady, not
for camera. Oh my god, he looks so beautiful. He
looks like you. That's very kind. I see everybody else
thinks he looks likely. I don't see it myself, but
(04:49):
I do think he's beautiful, absolutely beautiful. He is beautiful.
But he looks he's a brown boy. Yeah, he looks
like you. He definitely looks more brown than he does.
Why I thought, you know, you never known with a
mixed rays child what would be I assumed he would
it was quite white or just Mediterranean. He definitely looks
(05:11):
wow wow. So how how has fatherhood changed you? You know,
you know this. It's gonna sound strange considering this Sherman,
But anyone who's listening, who has ever seen Queer Eye,
they will know. Up to a year and a half ago,
I only ever cried twice. We there were five seasons out,
technically six we did a special season in Japan, so
(05:34):
technically six seasons. I only ever cried twice. And I
got it together real quick. I am very typically British,
which means I don't emote much. And then it wasn't
even when we heard my son, but we were just
expecting my son. I became such an emotional person. I
will cry at the drop of a hat if something
(05:56):
emotional has happened, especially if it comes to children. I
am just so it's become a much more empathetic, compassionate,
emotional person um and it has dictated how I lived
my life a lot more clauses. Um, I say no
to a lot more than I ever did before, so
I could be at home little more often. So yeah,
it has really changed me in so many ways. Well,
(06:19):
it's funny that you say that you say no to
a lot, because you say yes to a lot too.
You're doing so many amazing things and your career has,
like you know, has just like exploded. I'll never forget
when I ran into in the UK. You were doing
the show with my Brain and what's her name? The
beautiful Girl? Was it not your co host Alexi Chuan
(06:41):
Alexa Alexa Chun? Yes, yes, so that was Now what
show was that? That wasn't show called Next in Fashion? Right? Okay,
so but your first show was Queer. I was that
she was queer? Is that what put you on the map? Yeah.
So I had never auditioned for anything I was. I
had no just an entertainment I got. So I had
(07:04):
my own businesses. I was thankfully quite successful at that
and I retired, um quite young age. I was thirty two,
and somebody at Netflix found out through well somebody who
was looking to cast for this show at Netflix found
out and said, well, you must be free and available
then um and so they did all they could to
(07:26):
make me audition for this show. UM and so I
never planned on being an entertainer. That was not what
I thought was going to be my life. UM and
I had not audition over over what was Skype at
the time, and it went incredibly well. I thought, Okay,
that's it. That was my taste of what it must
be like to audition for something. UM and I never
(07:46):
thought in a million years that I would then go
out for a physical chemistry test, which was an audition,
and then I got the job. So within three weeks
I had gone from living a very regular a life
um to being an entertain Wow, but the fashion has
been your life, Like, that's what you did before? And
(08:10):
is that what you studied in college and university? Yes? Yeah,
I studied in college and I was very excited to
be a designer. It was it was what I thought
was going to be the rest of my life. UM.
I come from a really strict Asian family, which means
that you are a doctor or a lawyer. That are
usually the only two options. I knew that that was
(08:34):
definitely not for me. I was not I was academic,
well naturally academic. I always did well in school, but
I didn't care to try because I just didn't enjoy academia.
Because I always knew what I wanted from such a
young age, tobab Me, I was that kid who I
think some people are just destined to be who they become.
And as a kid, I from the age of seven
(08:55):
or eight, I remember so distinctly wanting to choose what
my mom will wanted to choose what my sister's well,
and they had sories in the house and I would
use those stories on them to create something that wasn't
a sorry, like create a skirt and a top just
I wanted. I wanted to make them feel beautiful. My
family is very Muslim, which we usually wear modest clothing,
(09:19):
especially around others. They would wear clothes that would cover
up their more fashionable close than me, and so I
really wanted them to feel beautiful always and so well.
As I got older, I learned how to set my
my granddad's factory. I became a very very very proficient
so a um and so by the time I hit
(09:40):
college age, I actually could create something very skillfully as
if it was going to be sold in a retail store.
And so my passion for wanting to just make my
mom feel beautiful and my sisters feel beautiful. I never
realized was going to turn into what I now do.
And I also thought if I do that, it was
just going to be as a designer. I will create
a brand, I will design clothes for somebody and hope
(10:03):
that my audience will like it. I never realized that
it would. I would do it familiar And how supportive
was your very strict family when they found out your
choices in your life style? Um? Not super supportive. Not surprisingly,
(10:23):
I think everyone just thought it was a joke in
a phase like oh ha ha, yeah, you'll do it
for a year at college when you're realizing I'm not
going to make any money, And that was always the dig,
like you're gonna be broke. They saw it as a
starving artist. Basically, yes, you make really passionate about it,
but will it pay for a family? And back in
(10:43):
the day, I wasn't out, and so my family just
assumed I would have a wife and children and how
could I possibly support them when I'm an artist? And
so I think for the majority of my early twenties,
late teen, daily twenties, it was convincing my family that
I can I will find a way to make money
from this. I can build a living out of this,
(11:05):
and so I will never forget the conversation I have
with my mom. So, my my dad passed away when
I was thirteen, and my mom was the one who
was trying to make sure that her final child and
the youngest you lived up to what my father wanted. Um.
And so she was so incredibly disappointed when I told
her that I wanted to make clothes for a living.
I design clothes for a living, and I was an
(11:28):
interesting sixteen seventeen year old. I told my mom very confidently.
I said, look, I know that your other children, my siblings,
if I love very much academic and have good jobs,
like conservatively good jobs. Um, but I promise you, if
you give me the freedom to do this, I swear
(11:49):
I will work so hard that I will become your
most successful child. And I won't I won't sponder this opportunity.
I won't behave like an idiot. I will work to
create something incredible so that I'm not the punchline for
you family affairs. Because we are we're a really tight
knit community, theation community I've got over a hundred family
(12:09):
members within a couple of miles um to my mom,
and so I know how important it is to not
feel shame and to make sure that you don't embarrass
the community. And so my point to my mom was
always just I've always been reliable. As you know, son,
I's always a good boy. I will be a good boy.
I will be responsible. Just give me the freedom to
(12:31):
do it my way. And I promised, how I will
make you proud, um. And so it took a few years,
but finally she could see that I wasn't just selling
printed T shirts out the back of my car. She
finally when I purchased my first home, I think she
finally realized, Oh, you're not just doing something that I
(12:54):
consider a joke. You're doing something she's respectable. And how
was she when you told her that you are getting
you know, actually weirdly, Okay, the first few minutes, we're
really shocking to her. So I came out to my
sister and my brother before I came out to her mom, um,
(13:14):
and so they helped me get through this um. And
so I told her, actually she found out she found
a picture that she was not going to find and
thankissing my boyfriend UM, and so under my bed on
my bed at her house. I had long since moved
out of her home, but I had a bunch of
botombs under my bed that were all locked, and she
decided to break them up and because just wanted to
(13:36):
see what her Asian kids are doing. That's what Asian
parents do. This is no such thing as privacy. You
can have whatever you want. That's your child. And so
she broke in and she's so just one picture was
so innocent, was giving my boyfriend a peck on my lips. Um,
And she was mortified. And she spoke to my brother
and sister saying, that's it. He can't ever come home.
(13:57):
We are done. He can't. He can't be a part
of the family. So I called her, UM, and I said,
I heard what you saw, and I hear what you said, Um,
And that's fine. However, you're about to lose, so do
she You're about to lose the best memory. I'm the
glue that holds your family together every time the fight.
(14:20):
I'm the one who steps in. I don't let your
your children fight. I don't know you fight with your siblings.
And I've always been a grandma like I've ever since
I was a team I've always been incredibly mature at
that age for such a young person. If there was
a fight in the family, I would always go on
media and make sure that there was no drama between them,
(14:40):
between family, especially grandma. Why do you say grandma not grandpa? Oh,
Because in my culture is always a grandma that solves
the drama between their family. Always the grandpa's just kind
of stared at it and pretend it's not it. Just
so yeah, I was. I was always that person. And
so I said, look what you're about to lose, in
(15:03):
my opinion, the best member who will make sure that
you still have a family in fifty years. If you
want to let that go, fine, what I just want
you to understand you will you will actually lose me
if you if you decide to do this. And she
was like, okay, you're You're right, I don't want to
lose you. You will always my son. And I said,
other than that, other than me being gay, I've never
(15:23):
ever do anything that should make you feel negatively towards me.
I've been a good son. I've taken care of you
at every turn. I've taken care of you, even though
at times others didn't. Do you really want me, of
all your kids to leave? Um? And so we had
a really honest conversation, probably the first virtually honest conversation
I had, saying, what do you want for your life? Mom?
(15:47):
And Aunt? I are part of that? Haven't I joined
everything you've asked for, even though yes, I didn't have
the career that you expected. Yes, I moved to America,
which is not what an Asian will ever wants, is
to put a son to remove away on the child
my way. Other than that, I've been a good son
to you. Do you really want to disown me? Um?
And she was really good about it. She was like, no,
(16:08):
I was shocked and not to set. Of course, I
could never live my life without your youngest. It was beautiful,
it was peutful, and so since then that I mean,
it was literally an hour of weirdness. And we went
right back. And she must be so thrilled to be
a grandma to your son. She's obsessed. Um. So I
(16:29):
brought my family out from England, all nineteen and my
immediate to uh l a place and none of them
have ever been to America. Um. So this was the
first time in the United States. UM. And they all
stayed for twelve days. UM. And it was a lot,
but it's very Asian to have that roof, so it
(16:52):
wasn't bizarre to us. UM. And so they all got
to spend time with my son. At that point, he
was just over six months old, UM, sorry, just under
six months old, UM, And they had the most amazing
time with him. It was weird having a child with
them not being with him regularly because ordinarily, when one
of us has a kid, our families in and out
of our homes multiple times a days. We'll all used
(17:15):
to live so close to each other. So I was
the only one of the extended family who's ever had
a child, and you've for meet that child for once,
and so they made up for last time. Yeah, my
mother loves him. Yeah, it must be hard that she's
so far away, but it's you probably do these facetimes
with her right a lot. Yeah. I mean she just
drive me in saying the last couple of weeks. My
mom has a wildly active social life, which drives the nuts. Um.
(17:39):
She hangs out with it. She's got two older sisters
and she's always out of the house. I've become her
times I've had to say you need to be in
at a certain time, don't be out all day? Why
you were more again? Um? And so finally I had
it out with a few days ago, saying I've tried
to call you three times this week and you've not
answer my call once. I just need you to answer. Uh.
(18:00):
Beat that. So I want to just dive a little
bit into your career because that's a white how people
know you, and you know, I know you thought you
were going to retire at one point. I saw that
(18:22):
on the notes, but clear clearly that didn't happen. So
Queer I now is in their fifth season? Is that no? Actually,
so now we are. We just wrapped us seventh season,
but we've technically got eight, so there's a mini season
on on Netflix, which is in Japan, so technically we
shot Okay, wow, that's incredible. So you're you're right now
(18:43):
you're done with this? Because didn't you just sign on
to a new show that's going to be filmed out
of the UK? I did, so, Actually I have not
done quere I couere I still definitely a thing. Um.
And also this is a total brag. Pubby but I'm
gonna do it. We made history at the end is
three weeks ago we have won more more awards at
(19:05):
the Emmys for unscripted than any show in history and consecuted.
So we were now a history, which is wonderful. So yes,
we're not getting anywhere anytime soon. Um. And then I
and then I have another show which you've seen with
the like to Jump or you know of with the
like what. I just finished season two of that in
(19:30):
the spring and my co host is now Gigi Headid,
who I love very was one of my closest friends. Um.
So that was magical. And then um, then very soon
I leave for the UK to shoot say yes to
the dress? Um, so say yes to the dress. It's
been Can I tell you a bit about so they
(19:51):
asked if I would join, and that was very particular
about a group, particular about what I will say yes
to on TV in particular, I want to cultivate a
and kind of brand. Um. And I'm still one of
the very few South Asians in entertainment and definitely one
of the very very few queer South Asians and queer
(20:12):
South Asian Muslims, and so I feel real responsibility to
make sure that I'm not just making white tv UM
and I make sure and I keep that at the
forefront of my mind every time I decide whether I
want to do a show or not. Thankly, I'm in
a very problem position where we get offered a fair
amount and the majority of the stuff I say no to.
UM And this one excited me because they said, what
(20:34):
would you do if you if you were to bring
back say yes to the dress? And I've always thought
says was wonderful. It's been going on for years. It's
a very very successful show for TLC and now Discovery
plus UM it's one of the biggest shows that they've
never done, but they haven't shot it for a few years. UM.
And so my concern all my request was this, you
(20:55):
when you book me, are you hiring me for something?
There's a reason why your booking meat. If you want
to hire anybody else, they will do it their way.
With me. I'm very particular about how I shoot and
very particular about what I want to put out there
in the world. And I know that that sounds sorry.
And after four or five years, I've only been in
this five years, but I've hit a point point in
my life where I get to dictate this is what
I will do and this is what I want to
(21:17):
And so with this it's a case of I won't
just dress white women in white wedding a dresses. That's
not my brand at all. You can hire anyone out
of the UK who's Caucasian and would possibly be fine
with that. They're they're representing their people. I don't want that.
If I do this, I want it to be incredibly diverse.
I want to not do it out of a bridal story.
(21:39):
I want to do it at a place where we
can decide if you've got an Indian bribery of Indian
dresses and we've got tired, We've got tired dress, We've
got a Nigerian I've got Nigerian dresses. I want to
what I've watched, um say you to the dress and
thought this is a beautiful show. But I'm sure if
I still watching should be thinking, yes, it's will lovely
that all these white women dressing these white I want
(22:01):
the fantasy too, um. And so I think I'm one
of the very few people who get to demand that
when you offered me a show, saying I'll do on
these conditions and so I'm really excited about it. I'm
really really to make my version of say yes, that's
so cool. Well as as someone who has gotten to
wear Indian dresses to my daughter in law's wedding and
(22:23):
her baby shower. Like I just I love all the
different cultures. I just did so much fun to be
part of it. So yeah, and I was sure that.
I mean again, it did soone, it was off for
so many years, it did so many episodes. But I
just think after a certain while, I've been thinking, Okay,
it's a little white dress, give me the story. And
(22:46):
when you travel to do this, does your husband and
son come with you? Yeah. We just got back from
New Orleans where we shot a lat season of where
I we all traveled as a family. We were there
for three months, um, and we all go to the
UK together if I do more than a week or
two maximum than the family troubles. And I noticed your
husband took your last name. Is that or is that correct?
(23:09):
Actually we both took each other's. So my husband is
Rob Softer France and I'm Tanca. Okay, okay, yeah, no
I like that because you don't usually see that. Yeah,
in my opinion, it made it seemed like one of
us was more important than the other, and we just
feel like it was in the relationship, and with it
(23:30):
being a gay marriage, we get to create our own rules.
And so yeah, I love having able at all study
And so what else haven't you done that you want
to do besides your men's grooming line that I'm still
you know, I'm ready for you when you decide you're
coming out with the men's Come on, you don't have
to do anything except hold a jar and everyone would
buy it. I'm ready, but we believe me. I'm ready.
(23:54):
I've been talking about doing it for a long time.
We just never found So you and I start talking
abou up. Yes, you mentioned it years ago, probably two years,
and we never found that. We were going to do
it at one point and it just didn't feel like
the right thing at the time. Hopefully one day soon
we'll find the right way to do it. I have
(24:15):
my own brand of our tour, which I love, so yes,
tell me about that, because I remember when it launched.
There's so many beautiful pieces. Thank you. So it's seasonal.
We only do it um well, we only really pushed
it between November and February it's just two dns we
do each year now, so yes, last year was our
first year and this year we got dropped three and four.
(24:38):
I think it's gorgeous this year actually, well the whole time.
It's inspired by being British and being American and being
South Asian and so the coast themselves are very tailored
but ties into being British. UM, and we add embroidery
which is very very complete Asian. This year we're adding
do you know what couch babriack has many chance, Bobby,
(24:59):
have you been seen that? Probably with little mirrors on
the usually lots and embroidered around it. That's called clutch fabric.
It's it's salvation very differently and at that way, I'm
positive you saw a bunch of it but probably hadn't noticed.
But it's very traditional for us UM and so on
finding ways to add that to my brand also so
people feel like they're getting a version of about where
(25:21):
that is quite unique. UM. I work with my husband
done creating the embroidery, so he will create the artwork
that will then be embroidered onto the coats. UM. So
it's called was him. My middle name is the scene.
But it's spelled W A S H I M. And
so we just broke up the middle name and called it.
But it's a neutral. It's for men and women. We
(25:42):
have men and women modeling the brand. I think it's gorgeous.
I'm really I'm really proud of it, and it's the
only way I'm wanting to design these days because having
run there's a lot and I've got four shows that
I work on so acutely busy all year, and the
last thing I can handle it is a full brand
(26:03):
or running a full brand right now. I understand that
and think about sizes because I am a five foot tall,
petite woman who it's really hard to find clothes you
know that fit me. And I have friends that are
large sized women and they have trouble, so you know,
people don't think about body shape. Yeah with our brand, okay,
(26:28):
we don have a petite maage. I will be honest. However,
we when it comes to the actual sizing and the brand,
the people that we have model models, well, the people
that we have model is relatively diverse, um, which I
was really proud of the amount of ethnicities represented. And
(26:48):
body shapes is something we will continue to do always okay,
well that I used. I used to own brands and
one of them was to swim my brand and we
never I don't remember every using any under a size mm.
Really they're not the ones who have But then I
mean that the supermodels, the ones who are TV TV,
(27:11):
they're not buying the product. The design is gifting into them.
We would we were designing for real of it. And
tell me about the shirt you're wearing, because you know
you have a very cool style and I've never seen Oh. Thanks,
So this is a brand that no longer is this
from the UK? I love an article stripe. It's a classic.
I will also describe it. We are on a podcast,
(27:32):
describe it. Oh you know, also showing this. Sorry, I'm
wearing a nautical stripe. T is maybe in blue. It's
got a beautiful vintage rose patch from a brand that
used to exist called Canton co In, which was a
heritage British brand. Yeah, because I love classic things that
have a twist. Yeah yeah, yeah. And what I will
(27:52):
say it got more difficult for me because of the
job that I hold. I can't do classic as much.
People expect you to push more. I think if I
was dressed classic all the time, and I was guilty
of this at the start. I really wanted to continue
how I dressed, continue on with how AD dress, which
was very classic, with the amount of people who said, oh,
(28:13):
he plays it safe all the time, how is he
the style guy? So you feel pressured to the anti
what's your favorite men's sock? Yeah, I mean people don't.
I mean I'm someone that believes you should have really
good underwear and really good socks. Socks, Okay, I love.
I hate to say this because it's a celebrity brand,
(28:36):
but I think it's called Arthur Arthur George. Yeah, it
is South the George. Rob Kardashian's brand is actually very good,
very good. And then I if it's not that, I
really love the J Crew suck always always um. And
then when it comes to under one, very particular for men,
there's a brand c d LP. I'm not affiliated with
(28:57):
them in any way, but there are European brand I
think from Scandinavia somewhere. In my opinion, c d LP
has the best quality of ever ever had. Boxers are brief,
both both and pajamas and ropes. They just all feel gorgeous.
I don't want they're doing how they're doing it, but
it's beautiful. Did you write that down? What's the name
(29:20):
of it? Because I want to order the pajamas c
D L P D LP Okay, I love them? How
about that is very specific, but I mean I do
love that pajamas to my favorite pajama place. Yeah, Bobby
is called Sleepy Jokes pleepy jamas. Yes, I have a pair.
They're very comfortable. I love that pajamas. So yeah. And
(29:40):
I and I wear the Brooks Brothers men's pajamas. They're
like the best. I almost look like your sheets and
oh yeah those are really good. So what are what
are some of your other brands? Like what do you
have a gene brand that you love? I really like
a brand called Closed, which I think you're yeah, um
(30:02):
they're great. Um. And then T shirts there's a brand
called Evelyne of Yeah yeah, um they're quality T shirts
is great um and I love what they stand for. Um.
So yeah, that's a brand I love very much. And
then when it comes to what's the T shirt that
I wear? The one from the UK I discovered to you,
okay t shirt that I'm in love with is it
(30:25):
called arkad No Son what is it called sun Spell.
It's a very old brand, you know, sun Spell the
best of T shirts. I now buy them in bulk.
They're amazing. Okay, then I'm gonna be one more if
you like. I don't know, but I'm going to give
you a counter, a brand from the UK called Arquette.
(30:45):
It's spelled like market but without the Okay, arkhead. Tell
me a bit about your health and wellness, because you
look incredibly healthy. Do you have a certain way that
you eat? Oh gosh, Bobby, I wish I could say
(31:09):
another thing what I was about to lie and say.
I wish I could do better. I could, Everyone can
do better. However, I here's my here's my balance. I
eat well Monday to Friday. Mostly I don't have much
fried food. Every now and then I'll have fries, but
I will have just a few. But most people can.
(31:31):
Monday and Friday a pretty down well nothing only Friday,
nothing really processed um. And I cook a lot for
myself on the weekend, and I think this is why
my balance works and has been sustainable. On the weekends,
I will enjoy what I want to enjoy. I don't
go crazy crazy, but I will if I want something
like pizza, I'll have pizza if I whatever I want,
(31:52):
I will mostly have. Um. My only major weakness. I
don't have any vices. I don't drink alcohol, I don't smoke.
I don't do much that could hurt my body. However, Um,
I've got a terrible sweet tooth, shocking like shockingly bad
sweet tooth. Um. And so if my metabolism metabolism wasn't
(32:14):
so intensely high, I probably would uh not be the
way I am now because it doesn't My my physical
appearance doesn't show you how badly I eat sweets. Wow.
And you don't drink cartails at all? No, every now
and then, Like many years ago, I would have a
(32:36):
glass of champagne if I was off going at a party.
But it's been many, many many, but at least fifteen years.
My husband doesn't drink either. Um, So it's much easier
to not drink in your partner doesn't drink um. Yeah.
I don't have many actual vices other than actual sugar. Yeah.
And I do work out. To be fair, I do
work out a lot. I really like to keep in shape,
(32:57):
and it's for my husband, really is, and if he
feels the same way about me. We work out regularly,
and it's not because I want to look a certain well.
I don't want to look like in a Jonnis. I
don't ever expect look like a muscle man. I just
want to stay fit and healthy and active because we're
very keen hikers. Um, we love to boulder like we're
(33:19):
we're we have. We live a very active lifestyle here
in Utah, and so I just want to be able
to keep it as long as I can. And I
want my husband to look at me and think yeah
and yeah, and you want to feel good in your
body too. I mean it's it's definitely. So I have
another Utah question just because I read it on on
the on the notes that you are the first person
(33:40):
to design close for Mormons. Is that no, okay, no,
Like I will, I was explained this, I think somebody
else and I think that that information is sowhere but
slight slightly accurate. So I did design clothing for woman women.
(34:01):
They were my first three brands. However, I think well, no,
I think I am. I was the first non woman
to make clothing form woman women. So I started out
in Utah working for a company about twelve thirteen years ago,
and when I worked with this company, it was a
modest clothing company UM and I didn't know what that
(34:22):
was before I started working there. But in Utah, they
weren't clothing brands. But I was I wanted to live
here and be with my husband, so the only job
I could find was working for this company. So I
was a sales director of the company UM and I
loved what they stood for. I loved what they did,
but I didn't know of it beforehand. However, I worked
in a fashion for a while. I understood many facets
(34:43):
of the business, but I didn't know how to start
a new business, a small business and build it from
the ground up. And that's what they had achieved here.
And they were selling the company. This was wonderful woman
who was the owner. She was selling the company to
a much much larger American business called jumpany UM and
so that business was no longer. And so I asked,
I was like, to you mind if I create my
(35:04):
own version of a modest clothing company. I respect what
you guys have done, but I really want to create
a modest clothing where nobody would know it's modest clothing.
Because this is absolutely going to create the work she did,
and I'm not trying to be mean. However, her brand
and her competitors brand, they just looked very homely, like
(35:25):
the clothes look like almost as if somebody were living
in amish Land. Like it was very say, when there's
people walk down the streets, there they're wearing modest clothes,
and I just thought, yes, I understand what you need
to cover, but why can't it be beautiful, Like, why
can't it just look stylish? And so I set out
to create a modest brand for moment women that looked
(35:50):
good enough to be worn around London and nobody would
ever know that they were trying to cut their bodies.
And so we did. And so I think that's why
we saw such great success, don't in among The first
two years were halacious, absolutely helicious. I started the business
with my own money. I started the next to no
money whatsoever. Well, then after a couple of years the
business started to do really well, and I think it's
(36:11):
because we were finally offering something that I just wasn't
there for anybody out of that anybody else was doing.
It was just nice clothes that just so happened to
cover part of the body, and we had such a
massive Jewish customer base who assumed we were a Jewish company.
We had a massive Mustland custom base, but were a
Mustland company. All these people that had been neglected by
(36:34):
the fashion industry finally felt like and And the strange
thing was, so I didn't what we call wholesale. For
anyone listening who don't know what wholesale is, it's were
we designed the product, We put the company's label in
that product, and they sent us down and we did
it for like some mud cloth, which was a mative
retail online retail at the time. We did a Nordstrum project.
(36:56):
And none of these people knew that we were catering
to religious people. They just saw it as nice clothing.
And so once we started the wholesale, we had all
these businesses in New York and wherever who were a
Jewish moment pop shop, I don't know, an Indian moment
pop shop, a Hindu whatever. None of them realized that
(37:18):
we weren't catering to them. We were catering for body studience.
But they didn't just covered what that's that's really very cool. Yeah,
I I just I couldn't even imagine. But there are
so many similarities and all the different cultures that it
really makes sense. And quite honestly, just to put that
slightly more, if we knew that somebody really wanted something
(37:42):
from us, Let's say an example, there was a Jewish
store that would have purchased a lot if they loved
one of the styles we had, and they knew that
I just needed to raise the next cline slightly, so
I'd covered the colophone. We did it. If they were
ordering enough, we didn't. And so I think that's what
made a successful Like what do you need? What does
your girl all need to feel beautiful? And we'll get there.
(38:02):
M m no. For um, you know, first of all,
you're the most upp positive person. And before I ask
you the last, before I feel, are you ever in
a bad mood? Yes? So really so yeah I am, uh,
but one would probably know that my version of bad
(38:23):
mood is using not anyone's versional. I just go a
little lighter than usual. But I'm you know, anyone who's
listening will know who this is. My my Custmas, Anthony
and Jonathan. I would watch their interviews. We all did
separate interviews. We all continue to separate interviews. From different publications,
and inevitably the interview always asked about the other co
(38:46):
host on this show, and the one thing I hit
them say a thousand times over is what you see
with Tan is not an act. He's weirdly the peppiest
person you'll ever meet. First in the morning, I just
I don't know what. I'm so great for life in general.
I just the luckiest boy in the world, and I
just think, what am I going to moan about? Yeah? No,
it's it's very evident you're one of those people that
(39:08):
brings the energy into the room instead of sucks it out.
So um. But so the last the last question that
I asked everyone since this podcast is called The Important
Things because I don't know, I couldn't think of anything else,
but it's called the Important Things. If you could tell
people listening one thing that they're going to remember out
of your mouth, it's going to help them change their life,
(39:31):
what would it be go into everything with intention when
you are I've mentioned something of the spot on the show,
but it's usually about clothes, but it's not just about clothes.
What you put on your body, the way you treat
a person, the way you are with your family, the
way you are with your friends, the way you are
at work really does dictate how you're perceived and how
(39:55):
you will live out the rest of your life. Whether
you're in my wild or a regular corporate world or
your family. Go into it with the intention of just
trying to be good and do good, and that will
serve you well. But never a time in your life
where you would have come across some major adiversity and
you had to be the bigger person and you'd be
good and be kind and you will regret it. Yes,
(40:17):
you may think, gosh, I wish I had stood up
myself and I wish I had told this person, Yeah,
you can't treat me that way. However, long term, you
look back thinking, I'm really glad I chose to be good.
I'm really glad I chose to be kind. Um, So yeah,
choose being decent at every turn in every situation. I
love this and I hope that we cut that up
and post that all over because that is an incredible advice.
(40:40):
So thank you so much. Thank you so much for
talking to me, Thank you for showing me your son,
your bedroom, your teacher, your underwear, everything. So thanks, Yeah, Bobby,
I was just gonna say this, you're an angel. I'd
be following you for a while. You are, actually, I
don't know if you realize it's the inspirational you've always
(41:01):
see buddy, peppy and positive on your instead, you are
a very inspirational lady. Thank you. When you're ready for
the beauty talk, I'm telling you I I know exactly
what you should, what you should do, and how you
should do it. So call me anytime. Okay. I love that.
I'm actually going to figure something out with you. I
love that big hit. Thanks for listening. Follow us on
(41:22):
social at The Important Things podcast on Instagram, and just
Bobby Brown on TikTok. See you guys next time.
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