November 13, 2023 • 24 mins
In this episode, Karol discusses a study on why many people in Western societies are single and the impact of screen time on social skills. She suggests that fear of commitment, lack of flirting skills, and excessive screen time are contributing factors. Brian Kilmeade joins Karol and discusses his new book "Teddy and Booker T: How Two American Icons Blazed a Path for Racial Equality," highlighting the controversial relationship between Teddy Roosevelt and Booker T. Washington. He also reflects on his career, the importance of setting personal and professional goals. The Karol Markowicz Show is part of the Clay Travis & Buck Sexton Podcast Network - new episodes debut every Monday & Thursday.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio.
I'm into studies about relationships. I know they don't give
the whole picture, but they so often give interesting insight
into what's really going on between people. Somebody posted a
Frontiers in Psychology study. It was looking at why large
(00:23):
numbers of people in Western societies are single, and they
had some interesting notes like women are a little more
likely to say that they're too picky eighty two percent
of women versus sixty eight percent of men. Both men
and women say they're afraid of commitment at about fifty
five percent. Both are in the high eighties in the
(00:44):
want to be free to do whatever they want. Men
want to be free to quote flirt around slightly more
than women twenty seven percent versus eighteen percent. But then
what was really interesting to me is that both sexes
overwhelmingly say that they're not good at flirting. Ninety one
percent of women and eighty six percent of men said that.
(01:05):
And again, I think it's interesting that more women ninety
one percent of women versus eighty six percent of men
say that. I thought that was kind of funny, But they're,
you know, both pretty high up there, and I think
it's a real problem. Flirting is signaling interest, and one
of the best ways to signal interest is to ask
people questions about themselves and then listen for the answer.
(01:28):
There's more to flirting, of course, but you know, there's banter,
and there's making people feel good about themselves. But I
think the overall issue is that a lot of people
just don't know how to have conversations anymore at all.
It's hard to ignore that the generations that are struggling
with things like flirting, the ones who are perpetually single,
the ones who aren't getting married, the ones who aren't
(01:50):
having kids, are the same generations that have had the
Internet their entire lives. I talk a lot about living
your life offline, and I admit that I do a
lot of my socializing online. I've made close friends online.
I really do get the concept that the Internet can
be used for good and social media can actually be social.
(02:10):
But I'm Generation X and I had to learn to
talk to people before there was an internet. I really
do think that too much screen time makes people boring
in real life. It starts so absurdly young. Now I've
written about this before, but I've watched families get to
the beach, lotion up their kids and then tuck them
under umbrellas with their phones for the day, or arrive
(02:33):
at restaurants and hand out iPads for the children with
no expectations of any interaction throughout the meal. A playdate
at a park is two kids staring at iPads side
by side. I'm not perfect. I've definitely given my kids
a phone and a restaurant if it ran too late
or if they were melting down. Nobody's perfect, But the
idea of just getting there and handing out devices and
(02:57):
not even trying to have them, you know, have conversations
or interact at all. It's bad. Kids need boredom. They
cannot be entertained every minute of every day. Kids who
can't be bored end up being boring. You see their
dull faces, incapable of maintaining a conversation with anyone. Eye
(03:18):
contact is impossible. They can't function, they're on a drug,
and everyone seems like they're okay with it. That's the
worst part of too much screen time. It leads to
people who can't meaningfully participate in society. They don't know
how to have relationships. The phone literally stands between them
and real life, and that real life it's awkward, it's tedious,
(03:39):
it's monotonous. It just can't compete with the constant dopamine
hits and filters that fix every flaw on the phone.
When you're always perfecting your angles or dropping just exactly
the right words online, it gets very tough to function
in real life. And I think studies like this prove
that out there are no easy answers. But if I
were single right now and I didn't want to be,
(04:01):
I would cut way back on my Internet usage. I
know it sounds kind of counterintuitive since so much of
the dating world originates online. Now, look, continue swiping if
that's how you meet people, but really limit how much
more time you spend beyond that scrolling. And if you
have kids, I understand the impulse to let them use
screens just like their friends do. Again, we let our
(04:24):
kids use screens. I'm not going to lie to you
and say we don't. But not at restaurants, not at
the beach, not in places where they should be talking
to other people and learning how to have conversations. Teach
them how to have conversations where they ask questions, listen
for the response add something to what everyone else is saying,
and hope that they grow up to be part of
that ten percent of the population that apparently knows how
(04:47):
to flirt. Coming up next and interview with Brian Kilmead.
Join us after the break.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
My next guest is Fox News host and New York
Times best selling author Brian kill Mead. He's written a
new book out now, Teddy and Booker, t how two
American icons blazed a path for racial equality. Thanks so
much for coming on my show, Brian.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Usually i'm interviewing you.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
You know, it's so exciting your column or your kids.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Yes, this is great.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
I am extremely excited to read your book, and I
have loved your previous history books.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I think you're just fantastic, So thank you so much.
Tell us about your new book.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Well, I mean.
Speaker 4 (05:29):
I wanted to move up through time, and I started
with George Washington's Spy Ring and then what after that
was something unplowed, which was Thomas Jefferson took on the
Islamic extremists to TRIPLEI Pirates.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
I loved that one.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
The Triple One was amazing.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Yeah, yeah, I mean we were on track to get
it was supposed to be on an e They scripted
it out to be a three part series, and the pandemic hit.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
You heard about the pandemic.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
I have heard about the pandemic. Yeah, I mean I'm
in Florida now. They don't really know about it down
here either.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
The crazy thing that they allowed people to walk on
the beach and they got criticized for that, you remember, right,
So then we got to the War of eighteen twelve,
and then I got to the Texas how it came
to be with Sam Houston and the Alamo Avengers, And
I thought, how do I take on the Civil War?
Its almost written about war outside World War Two for
American audience. I said, what if I just talked about
(06:18):
how Lincoln and Frederick Douglas worked together, which brings me
to what's next? And I just said, well, who picked
up where they left off that had some time interaction
with them. And even before I read Frederick Douglas, I
read up from slavery booker T. Washington's autobiography that was
the best African American bestseller until Malcolm XU released is,
(06:41):
and it was just so motivating, inspirational, an Teddy Roosevelt's sender.
And then talking to his I went to a descendants
meeting of presidents and there was Tweed Roosevelt and he
runs the lu Roosevelt Center now. And I got to
know motive by I said, Tweet, well could you tell
me about your great grand father and Booker t And
(07:02):
he went off and he said, oh, what a great relationship.
It's unexplored and this is what goes. He knew everything cold.
And I said, okay, not, you know, not well worn out.
What if I talk about how they looked at America.
That was Jim Crow, poll taxes, stepper body, equal.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
The whole.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
You know what the South was like in some in
many Southern states back then.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
You know what the Democrats were like.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
And that's I said, Well, let me tell here's a
guy that actually lived it, went back to it and
spend the rest of his life trying to make it
better through education, which is right up your alley. And
he did it through which was I just did an
interview with micro and I bounced it off him two
years ago because he was build up your mind, spoke
it to Washington. But everybody's going to learn a trade.
(07:50):
And he's also, by the way, you're going to learn
that trade. Here are you going to Are you going
to be a cabinet maker great? Are you going to
be a construction gun fantastic? Going to be into agriculture,
a blacksmith, whatever it is.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
You will learn to trade.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Why because white people aren't ready to hire you yet,
so you have to be invaluable. They got to realize
sooner or later, if people are blocking you in life,
you got to be so good they can't deny you.
And instead of just making Booker T. Washington great, which
he was, he decided to make a generation great. Thousands
of kids would go through Tuskegee and then they were
(08:24):
with the Rosenwald Schools, learning of trade, building up the mind,
overcoming any racist racial barriers that were in our country
at the time. I thought that would be a pretty
cool story to bring forward because Teddy Roosevelt was another guy. Okay,
he was born into wealth, but he almost died. He
wasn't supposed to survive child and he had a huge
site problem. Thought he was going blind, he had asthma.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Couldn't go to regular school.
Speaker 4 (08:46):
First time he went to formal school was he when
he went to Yale. So he goes over there and
he ends up becoming this robust individual who decided to
overcome his feeble youth.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
And build up a body the rest of his life.
Speaker 4 (09:01):
And when he looked back and his mom was born
in the South, is our brother's part for the Confederacy.
So he had a knowledge of the South. It wasn't
another planet to him right then. He had a knowledge
of the Midwest, and those are like working in your hands,
being a rancher and a tough guy, legitimate cowboy.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
But he wanted to understand the South.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
And he said, I re read up from Slavery too,
and him and Edith said, we got to get a
hold of this guy, Booker T. Washington, and then we
watched their relationship take root. And that's what I thought
i'd bring forward.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Yeah, I really love that.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
I think that both of them, I mean Teddy Roosevelt obviously,
you know, we do learn about him in history class
Booker T. Washington less, but I think that, you know,
just they're both kind of unexplored figures for I mean,
I think most kids going through a history education right now,
which you.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Know is a problem to me that we don't learn history.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
But and obviously Teddy Roosevelt went through a moment where
his statue was torn down in New York City because
it was, you know, inappropriate in front of the Natural
History Museum the right, and I believe that statue was
actually I don't remember what the situation was, but it
was like, because Native Americans were in the statue, that
(10:10):
was somehow inappropriate. So I think the fact that we
spent all this time tearing down history instead of building
it up. I love that you're telling the story of
these two men. So what was their you know relationship ultimately?
Like were they friends?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Carol? A couple of things.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
Number one is the people that Teddy Roosevelt Museum, which
is now going to be in North Dakota where he
spent all this time ranching. It's such an impact on him,
they're going to they ship it out. They're going to
ship it out that direction. And the reason why they
box it up is because Teddy was on a horse
and an African American standing behind him along with thee
which is not offensive, was unbelievable. They box it up
(10:45):
and split out. That's when we were drunk with anger
and it's embarrassing. I was doing the history of the
police in New York City for Fox Nation, and I
wanted to do a thing right by the statue, and
I walk out there with Ray Kelly, and it's boxed up.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
It's crazy boxed up.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
So listen, you'll see some quotes from day Roosevelt and
you go, oh my goodness. You know, obviously racially he
was a person of his times.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
But you see a lot of his actions and the
way he interact with Burgert Washington. You know, he treated
everyone equal.
Speaker 4 (11:18):
But at the same time he was at Victimus times
the same thing you would look at Abraham Lincoln said
some things where you go, oh my goodness, I can't
believe this is the great emancipator.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
But he would change over time like we all do hopefully. Right.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
No, I think, you know, maybe we shouldn't hold historical
figures to modern standards. I think even things that we said,
you know, ten, fifteen, twenty years ago and you know
now no longer allowed. So as we change our standards
and get rid of anybody who ever spoke in a
way that we don't speak today, I think that maybe
that's a foolish thing to do.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
Yeah, I'll give you a great quote.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
So he obviously is living in the South, where if
you were caught dating a white woman or a black man,
you get hanged.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
And he saw lynchings all around him.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
He saw some inequities he couldn't tolerate, but he looked
at the big picture. This is the America I'm in.
How do I make it better? And how do I
educate people rather than agitate people? And he writes this,
with a few exceptions, the negro youth must work harder
and perform his task even better than a white youth
in order to secure recognition. He also saw silver lining it,
(12:19):
he said, quote out of the hard and unusual struggle
through which he is compelled to pass, he gets to
strengthen confidence that one misses whose pathway is comparatively smooth
by reason of birth and race.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Yeah, it's unequal.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
But if you understand that and you overcome that, think
about where you'll be as a person.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
And dare I say, in a career?
Speaker 4 (12:41):
Right?
Speaker 1 (12:42):
So I usually end with this question, but I think
you know, asking it sort of at the top. I
think probably your book and actually all your history work
might inform your answer. But what do you think is
our largest cultural or societal problem in America? And do
you think it's solvable?
Speaker 4 (12:57):
I just think fundamentally, we don't appreciate where we're at,
and it's hard to appreciate something you've always had a
couple of two, three generations. People look around and go, well,
I see imperfections. I think we have lost patriotism in
a sense of exceptionalism. But it's easy to get back.
All you have to do is realize it's the problem.
So putting it into our schools. Don't indoctrinate me. Tell me,
(13:20):
tell me the story. I'm not telling you that there
was no racism. I'm not telling you that there wasn't
any slavery. But I'm watching these figures emerge, and also
know that there's more African Americans today coming to America
than any of the country in the world. So if
it's that bad and the most successful, I believe this
was the case two years ago.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
Probably today the most successful new immigrant immigrant.
Speaker 4 (13:42):
Group coming here are Nigerians. Their education and their culture.
They come over with the kind of a sophisticated they
had the easiest time blending in, as opposed to somebody
from Somalia through a culture that's so dramatically different. So
we know race doesn't matter, and we also know that
no matter how smart you are, naturally, it's how hard
(14:03):
you're gonna work for what you have. So I think
the biggest problem is we're not grounded in the same
thing we used to say.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
We love this country. I have a different vision to
make it better.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
There's a lot of people protesting today anti Semitism, anti
American pro hamas.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
They clearly don't.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
Like the country and clearly are embarrassed by the country.
And if you could just start getting a generation understanding
how specially we are compared elsewhere, for those who can't
travel and see for yourself, I think that would iron
out a lot of things. Also, competition, and I know
you write a book about this competition and education. The
minute you get competition in education, I think things will
(14:41):
straighten out because parents like you and me will go,
excuse me, this my school. I'm going somewhere else. Give
me my eight thousand dollars.
Speaker 3 (14:50):
I'm gonna go down.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
I'm going to the Catholic school down the block, the
charter school in the city.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
I'm gonna leave.
Speaker 4 (14:55):
And when you get enough leaving, all of a sudden,
those jobs will leave less. The public schools straightens out
his act.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
That's right, and how do we get your book in
the public schools?
Speaker 3 (15:06):
You know?
Speaker 4 (15:07):
Oh yeah, I mean I have a lot of people
take it for homeschool, and yeah, that's it.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
And that's another thing. And they'll say something, would you
be able to call in? And best? I can I
call in?
Speaker 4 (15:17):
So you have a group of like a pod of
eight to twelve kids, and I'll call in and I'll
talk to them.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
And I find that very interesting.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Were there any surprises while you were writing Teddy and
Booker T?
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (15:32):
How much criticism he got in his real life. Both
like Mark Twain never liked Teddy Roosevelt. I thought he
was a big showman full of hot air, and it
bothered him. Mark Twain loved Booker T. Washington And how
many people in Booker T. Washington's life were critical of
him while he was alive. Like WB the Boys was
founded the NAACP. Who was never a slave, was born,
(15:57):
was highly educated, did a lot of great things, great minds,
great education. Never you couldn't say that he had a
fraction of the impact.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
That Booker D. Washington net. But he was very critical.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
And to see other African Americans critical of this black superstar,
why because they said he was too compliant. He wasn't
standing up more for the injustices that we all saw,
you know, from the water fountains to the bathrooms, to
the no longer allout in schools, to not being able
to play sports, all that stuff. WB du bois an example.
(16:30):
Somebody wanted to fight all that and he said, I
can't fight, and book it to you.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
I said, I can't fight all that, but I could
fight a lot.
Speaker 4 (16:36):
And if you're gonna be if the Johnson family is
unbelievably racist, I don't hate them.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
But I'm gonna deal with the other two families that aren't.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
And maybe the Johnson family by watching the way the
others treat me and I treat them, will change. And
w B du boys like Al Sharpton was just how
dare you not confront that racism you just saw? And
he said, I'm living in the South and I'm trying
to change generations in my time. And he died at
(17:08):
fifty nine. And you're talking about in the perfect world,
this is what the perfect way to live would be.
And that's fine, but we could both coexist. He didn't
see it that way because Boogety Watching was so big,
so famous, white people were very comfortable with him.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
It bothered him.
Speaker 4 (17:26):
Andrew Carnegie called him one of his best friends. JP
Morgan the same thing. Rosenwold, the founder of Sears, the
same thing. These guys were tight, and to see him
with these powerful people, many people thought, well, he had
to have sold his soul for that.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
He goes.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
No. They would turn around and donate to his school
another hb as a historical Black colleges, and they were
both winning. They felt bad about the inequities in society.
They wanted to help any where they can. They had
a ton of money, they wanted to help. And yet
people view Booker T. Washington doing that while not calling
(18:02):
out any racious brasal practices that might have existed in
their finances and their businesses. He thought that was too
willing to comply. And that was the biggest surprise. I'm like,
wait a second, you can't see that. The fact that
he's lauded in England and in France and in Spain
and Germany and right, and he's looked up this way,
(18:24):
isn't an inspiration the generations of black youth that you
can do this too, And he did. He was very
critical in fact, I think in his eulogy he started
three or four lines WB to boys and compliment him
and then says, here's how we set the mission back.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
We're going to take a quick break and be right
back on the Carol Markowitz Show. So you know, a
question that I ask all of my guests is do
you feel like you've made it? And so I want
to ask you, Brian about that, But I also want
to know do you think Booker and Roosevelt felt like
they made it in their lives?
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yes, to which one, well, don't think you've made it
and started there?
Speaker 3 (19:05):
No? No, I feel very fortunate to be here.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
And I also think that in our business, you see
so many talented people and it stops on a dime,
whether it's something they did or something that changes about
the business. And I don't think I give myself credit
for is realizing. When I started filling in in nineteen
ninety six, I had already been on the air in
some way for thirteen years, and I realized how great
(19:32):
this place was. Even though nobody was watching it. Couldn't
get it in your cable system, there was no streaming.
I just walked in and I said, man, this is
this is unbelievable, and I give myself credit for realizing
that and never thinking the grass was greener because I
knew so many people, and I know so many talented people,
and they always even the people here that left, I'm like,
(19:54):
you are.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Crazy, and I was right. That's awesome.
Speaker 4 (19:57):
So I'll give myself credit for that. But not in
our business, it changes so much. I mean, you probably
thought you were going to be a writer, and if
you just wanted to be a newspaper writer and not
not adjust to the mediums when you'll probably be in trouble.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
You have to do more than one.
Speaker 4 (20:13):
That's why I'm saying to myself, Okay, I want to
do radio. I want to be able to write books.
Speaker 3 (20:17):
I want to be able to talk about them. I
want to be able to go on stage.
Speaker 4 (20:21):
In the back of my mind, I got this sports foundation,
so my goal.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
Was what was to do it?
Speaker 4 (20:26):
But I don't think I made it because I think
I see how things change so much. We all know
people that were at the top of the game a
short time ago and they're now out.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
Their talent didn't change.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Things changed, and then so the minute I feel like
I made it, I think that it's probably over the
next day. For those guys, what's so interesting is I
think they did realize, but they also were in the
prime of their life and they already had seen their
high by maybe fifty six. That's why Teddy Roosevelt goes
to with the Amazon. He loses that election after they
(21:03):
split the vote with the Bull Moose Party and him
and taff split the Republican vote, and Woodrow Wilson becomes president.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
And he thinks, what am I going to do?
Speaker 4 (21:11):
I gotta go, you know, I'm going to go down
of the Amazon. He almost dies and it would eventually
kill him. Compromise the system, which you never fully recovered
from Booker T. Washington kind of hid his high and
he was on the down side for a couple of
years before he got sick and ended up getting His
last wish was to die at Tuskegee, and he did.
Speaker 3 (21:28):
Teddy Roosevelt was one of the speakers at his funeral.
So I think they did reach.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
I think they realized they were impact, but they were
never satisfied, right, So it sounds everything You got to
be grateful, You got to be grateful, But I think
if you're ever satisfied, you.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
Know, such a range of answers to this.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
I just I love asking this question because I always
get like, you know, just people who you think would
say no, say yes. But people who you think would
say yes, wo'd say no.
Speaker 3 (21:55):
It's just it's.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Really interesting to see where people think that they are
in their lives. And it's interesting to imagine where Teddy
Roosevelt and Booker T. Washington might have imagined if they know,
if they felt that they had made it.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
So I would think that the one thing about Teddy
Roosevelt is underappreciate I told you about Booker T.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
Is his family.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
His family is all over his biographies, for autobiographies, his biographies,
you research him, he would just when he was with
his kids. Obviously there's no phones, so it's a big advantage. Well,
he would be all in. There'll be one adventure after another.
And his dad was the same way. When his dad
as busy as he was successful, as he was no communication,
(22:32):
no cars, he still was always there for him, especially
when they were so worried about his respiration and we
got to help this kid. So he always felt really
close to his family. So it does go to show
you you can have.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
This historically successful career yeah, and still have the other
if you choose with a little luck. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Absolutely, Brian, I've loved having you on. I can't wait
to read Teddy and Booker t how two American icons
blazed a path for racial equality. My last question that
I also ask all of my guests is to end
with your best tip for my listeners on how they
can improve their lives. And it could be obviously what
you've learned from Teddy and Booker.
Speaker 4 (23:16):
I'll do it, and it's not earth shattering or cutting edge,
but I just think you got to take some time
to figure out your personal goals and your professional goals,
separate them and ask yourself why, and if your wise
or strong enough o happen. You write them down two
sides of the same page, keep it to yourself, in
(23:37):
your pocket, or share with your family.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Whatever you're more comfortable with. Might be too personal and
it'll happen.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
You take some time to look at that every day
and it'll manifest itself in some way, shape or form.
If your why is strong enough. If you just want
to be famous to prove to your parents that I'm
not the loser you thought I was, it's not going
to work, or when you get there, you're never going
to be satisfied if your why is strong enough. I
(24:03):
want to be famous and successful in order it's this
former foundation that maybe they help the most matter of
people possible. I want to prove to somebody in my
neighborhood that somebody like me could emerge.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
That's fine. I want to be the best basketball coach
in high school history, that's great.
Speaker 4 (24:20):
I want to affect five thousand kids, thirty kids at
a time in football, that's great.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
So whatever it is, the more detailed, the better chance
it has of coming through.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Thank you so much, Brian, thanks for coming on.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
Thank you, Carolyn. Just if anyone wants to seen me
on the road, I'm Aliva Florida. Brian kill me dot com.
I got a whole list there.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah, I'm gonna definitely go. I'm going to surprise you
at one of the events.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
I'm going to give you twenty percent off the admission.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Oh nice, it's big you guys, go get it.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
Carol, thank you, thanks.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
So much for joining us on the Carol Marcowitz Show.
Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio.
I'm into studies about relationships. I know they don't give
the whole picture, but they so often give interesting insight
into what's really going on between people. Somebody posted a
Frontiers in Psychology study. It was looking at why large
(00:23):
numbers of people in Western societies are single, and they
had some interesting notes like women are a little more
likely to say that they're too picky eighty two percent
of women versus sixty eight percent of men. Both men
and women say they're afraid of commitment at about fifty
five percent. Both are in the high eighties in the
(00:44):
want to be free to do whatever they want. Men
want to be free to quote flirt around slightly more
than women twenty seven percent versus eighteen percent. But then
what was really interesting to me is that both sexes
overwhelmingly say that they're not good at flirting. Ninety one
percent of women and eighty six percent of men said that.
(01:05):
And again, I think it's interesting that more women ninety
one percent of women versus eighty six percent of men
say that. I thought that was kind of funny, But they're,
you know, both pretty high up there, and I think
it's a real problem. Flirting is signaling interest, and one
of the best ways to signal interest is to ask
people questions about themselves and then listen for the answer.
(01:28):
There's more to flirting, of course, but you know, there's banter,
and there's making people feel good about themselves. But I
think the overall issue is that a lot of people
just don't know how to have conversations anymore at all.
It's hard to ignore that the generations that are struggling
with things like flirting, the ones who are perpetually single,
the ones who aren't getting married, the ones who aren't
(01:50):
having kids, are the same generations that have had the
Internet their entire lives. I talk a lot about living
your life offline, and I admit that I do a
lot of my socializing online. I've made close friends online.
I really do get the concept that the Internet can
be used for good and social media can actually be social.
(02:10):
But I'm Generation X and I had to learn to
talk to people before there was an internet. I really
do think that too much screen time makes people boring
in real life. It starts so absurdly young. Now I've
written about this before, but I've watched families get to
the beach, lotion up their kids and then tuck them
under umbrellas with their phones for the day, or arrive
(02:33):
at restaurants and hand out iPads for the children with
no expectations of any interaction throughout the meal. A playdate
at a park is two kids staring at iPads side
by side. I'm not perfect. I've definitely given my kids
a phone and a restaurant if it ran too late
or if they were melting down. Nobody's perfect, But the
idea of just getting there and handing out devices and
(02:57):
not even trying to have them, you know, have conversations
or interact at all. It's bad. Kids need boredom. They
cannot be entertained every minute of every day. Kids who
can't be bored end up being boring. You see their
dull faces, incapable of maintaining a conversation with anyone. Eye
(03:18):
contact is impossible. They can't function, they're on a drug,
and everyone seems like they're okay with it. That's the
worst part of too much screen time. It leads to
people who can't meaningfully participate in society. They don't know
how to have relationships. The phone literally stands between them
and real life, and that real life it's awkward, it's tedious,
(03:39):
it's monotonous. It just can't compete with the constant dopamine
hits and filters that fix every flaw on the phone.
When you're always perfecting your angles or dropping just exactly
the right words online, it gets very tough to function
in real life. And I think studies like this prove
that out there are no easy answers. But if I
were single right now and I didn't want to be,
(04:01):
I would cut way back on my Internet usage. I
know it sounds kind of counterintuitive since so much of
the dating world originates online. Now, look, continue swiping if
that's how you meet people, but really limit how much
more time you spend beyond that scrolling. And if you
have kids, I understand the impulse to let them use
screens just like their friends do. Again, we let our
(04:24):
kids use screens. I'm not going to lie to you
and say we don't. But not at restaurants, not at
the beach, not in places where they should be talking
to other people and learning how to have conversations. Teach
them how to have conversations where they ask questions, listen
for the response add something to what everyone else is saying,
and hope that they grow up to be part of
that ten percent of the population that apparently knows how
(04:47):
to flirt. Coming up next and interview with Brian Kilmead.
Join us after the break.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
My next guest is Fox News host and New York
Times best selling author Brian kill Mead. He's written a
new book out now, Teddy and Booker, t how two
American icons blazed a path for racial equality. Thanks so
much for coming on my show, Brian.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Usually i'm interviewing you.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
You know, it's so exciting your column or your kids.
Speaker 2 (05:15):
Yes, this is great.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
I am extremely excited to read your book, and I
have loved your previous history books.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I think you're just fantastic, So thank you so much.
Tell us about your new book.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Well, I mean.
Speaker 4 (05:29):
I wanted to move up through time, and I started
with George Washington's Spy Ring and then what after that
was something unplowed, which was Thomas Jefferson took on the
Islamic extremists to TRIPLEI Pirates.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
I loved that one.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
The Triple One was amazing.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Yeah, yeah, I mean we were on track to get
it was supposed to be on an e They scripted
it out to be a three part series, and the pandemic hit.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
You heard about the pandemic.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
I have heard about the pandemic. Yeah, I mean I'm
in Florida now. They don't really know about it down
here either.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
The crazy thing that they allowed people to walk on
the beach and they got criticized for that, you remember, right,
So then we got to the War of eighteen twelve,
and then I got to the Texas how it came
to be with Sam Houston and the Alamo Avengers, And
I thought, how do I take on the Civil War?
Its almost written about war outside World War Two for
American audience. I said, what if I just talked about
(06:18):
how Lincoln and Frederick Douglas worked together, which brings me
to what's next? And I just said, well, who picked
up where they left off that had some time interaction
with them. And even before I read Frederick Douglas, I
read up from slavery booker T. Washington's autobiography that was
the best African American bestseller until Malcolm XU released is,
(06:41):
and it was just so motivating, inspirational, an Teddy Roosevelt's sender.
And then talking to his I went to a descendants
meeting of presidents and there was Tweed Roosevelt and he
runs the lu Roosevelt Center now. And I got to
know motive by I said, Tweet, well could you tell
me about your great grand father and Booker t And
(07:02):
he went off and he said, oh, what a great relationship.
It's unexplored and this is what goes. He knew everything cold.
And I said, okay, not, you know, not well worn out.
What if I talk about how they looked at America.
That was Jim Crow, poll taxes, stepper body, equal.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
The whole.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
You know what the South was like in some in
many Southern states back then.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
You know what the Democrats were like.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
And that's I said, Well, let me tell here's a
guy that actually lived it, went back to it and
spend the rest of his life trying to make it
better through education, which is right up your alley. And
he did it through which was I just did an
interview with micro and I bounced it off him two
years ago because he was build up your mind, spoke
it to Washington. But everybody's going to learn a trade.
(07:50):
And he's also, by the way, you're going to learn
that trade. Here are you going to Are you going
to be a cabinet maker great? Are you going to
be a construction gun fantastic? Going to be into agriculture,
a blacksmith, whatever it is.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
You will learn to trade.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Why because white people aren't ready to hire you yet,
so you have to be invaluable. They got to realize
sooner or later, if people are blocking you in life,
you got to be so good they can't deny you.
And instead of just making Booker T. Washington great, which
he was, he decided to make a generation great. Thousands
of kids would go through Tuskegee and then they were
(08:24):
with the Rosenwald Schools, learning of trade, building up the mind,
overcoming any racist racial barriers that were in our country
at the time. I thought that would be a pretty
cool story to bring forward because Teddy Roosevelt was another guy. Okay,
he was born into wealth, but he almost died. He
wasn't supposed to survive child and he had a huge
site problem. Thought he was going blind, he had asthma.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Couldn't go to regular school.
Speaker 4 (08:46):
First time he went to formal school was he when
he went to Yale. So he goes over there and
he ends up becoming this robust individual who decided to
overcome his feeble youth.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
And build up a body the rest of his life.
Speaker 4 (09:01):
And when he looked back and his mom was born
in the South, is our brother's part for the Confederacy.
So he had a knowledge of the South. It wasn't
another planet to him right then. He had a knowledge
of the Midwest, and those are like working in your hands,
being a rancher and a tough guy, legitimate cowboy.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
But he wanted to understand the South.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
And he said, I re read up from Slavery too,
and him and Edith said, we got to get a
hold of this guy, Booker T. Washington, and then we
watched their relationship take root. And that's what I thought
i'd bring forward.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Yeah, I really love that.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
I think that both of them, I mean Teddy Roosevelt obviously,
you know, we do learn about him in history class
Booker T. Washington less, but I think that, you know,
just they're both kind of unexplored figures for I mean,
I think most kids going through a history education right now,
which you.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Know is a problem to me that we don't learn history.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
But and obviously Teddy Roosevelt went through a moment where
his statue was torn down in New York City because
it was, you know, inappropriate in front of the Natural
History Museum the right, and I believe that statue was
actually I don't remember what the situation was, but it
was like, because Native Americans were in the statue, that
(10:10):
was somehow inappropriate. So I think the fact that we
spent all this time tearing down history instead of building
it up. I love that you're telling the story of
these two men. So what was their you know relationship ultimately?
Like were they friends?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Carol? A couple of things.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
Number one is the people that Teddy Roosevelt Museum, which
is now going to be in North Dakota where he
spent all this time ranching. It's such an impact on him,
they're going to they ship it out. They're going to
ship it out that direction. And the reason why they
box it up is because Teddy was on a horse
and an African American standing behind him along with thee
which is not offensive, was unbelievable. They box it up
(10:45):
and split out. That's when we were drunk with anger
and it's embarrassing. I was doing the history of the
police in New York City for Fox Nation, and I
wanted to do a thing right by the statue, and
I walk out there with Ray Kelly, and it's boxed up.
Speaker 3 (11:02):
It's crazy boxed up.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
So listen, you'll see some quotes from day Roosevelt and
you go, oh my goodness. You know, obviously racially he
was a person of his times.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
But you see a lot of his actions and the
way he interact with Burgert Washington. You know, he treated
everyone equal.
Speaker 4 (11:18):
But at the same time he was at Victimus times
the same thing you would look at Abraham Lincoln said
some things where you go, oh my goodness, I can't
believe this is the great emancipator.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
But he would change over time like we all do hopefully. Right.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
No, I think, you know, maybe we shouldn't hold historical
figures to modern standards. I think even things that we said,
you know, ten, fifteen, twenty years ago and you know
now no longer allowed. So as we change our standards
and get rid of anybody who ever spoke in a
way that we don't speak today, I think that maybe
that's a foolish thing to do.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
Yeah, I'll give you a great quote.
Speaker 4 (11:51):
So he obviously is living in the South, where if
you were caught dating a white woman or a black man,
you get hanged.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
And he saw lynchings all around him.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
He saw some inequities he couldn't tolerate, but he looked
at the big picture. This is the America I'm in.
How do I make it better? And how do I
educate people rather than agitate people? And he writes this,
with a few exceptions, the negro youth must work harder
and perform his task even better than a white youth
in order to secure recognition. He also saw silver lining it,
(12:19):
he said, quote out of the hard and unusual struggle
through which he is compelled to pass, he gets to
strengthen confidence that one misses whose pathway is comparatively smooth
by reason of birth and race.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Yeah, it's unequal.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
But if you understand that and you overcome that, think
about where you'll be as a person.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
And dare I say, in a career?
Speaker 4 (12:41):
Right?
Speaker 1 (12:42):
So I usually end with this question, but I think
you know, asking it sort of at the top. I
think probably your book and actually all your history work
might inform your answer. But what do you think is
our largest cultural or societal problem in America? And do
you think it's solvable?
Speaker 4 (12:57):
I just think fundamentally, we don't appreciate where we're at,
and it's hard to appreciate something you've always had a
couple of two, three generations. People look around and go, well,
I see imperfections. I think we have lost patriotism in
a sense of exceptionalism. But it's easy to get back.
All you have to do is realize it's the problem.
So putting it into our schools. Don't indoctrinate me. Tell me,
(13:20):
tell me the story. I'm not telling you that there
was no racism. I'm not telling you that there wasn't
any slavery. But I'm watching these figures emerge, and also
know that there's more African Americans today coming to America
than any of the country in the world. So if
it's that bad and the most successful, I believe this
was the case two years ago.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
Probably today the most successful new immigrant immigrant.
Speaker 4 (13:42):
Group coming here are Nigerians. Their education and their culture.
They come over with the kind of a sophisticated they
had the easiest time blending in, as opposed to somebody
from Somalia through a culture that's so dramatically different. So
we know race doesn't matter, and we also know that
no matter how smart you are, naturally, it's how hard
(14:03):
you're gonna work for what you have. So I think
the biggest problem is we're not grounded in the same
thing we used to say.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
We love this country. I have a different vision to
make it better.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
There's a lot of people protesting today anti Semitism, anti
American pro hamas.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
They clearly don't.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
Like the country and clearly are embarrassed by the country.
And if you could just start getting a generation understanding
how specially we are compared elsewhere, for those who can't
travel and see for yourself, I think that would iron
out a lot of things. Also, competition, and I know
you write a book about this competition and education. The
minute you get competition in education, I think things will
(14:41):
straighten out because parents like you and me will go,
excuse me, this my school. I'm going somewhere else. Give
me my eight thousand dollars.
Speaker 3 (14:50):
I'm gonna go down.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
I'm going to the Catholic school down the block, the
charter school in the city.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
I'm gonna leave.
Speaker 4 (14:55):
And when you get enough leaving, all of a sudden,
those jobs will leave less. The public schools straightens out
his act.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
That's right, and how do we get your book in
the public schools?
Speaker 3 (15:06):
You know?
Speaker 4 (15:07):
Oh yeah, I mean I have a lot of people
take it for homeschool, and yeah, that's it.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
And that's another thing. And they'll say something, would you
be able to call in? And best? I can I
call in?
Speaker 4 (15:17):
So you have a group of like a pod of
eight to twelve kids, and I'll call in and I'll
talk to them.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
And I find that very interesting.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Were there any surprises while you were writing Teddy and
Booker T?
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Yes?
Speaker 4 (15:32):
How much criticism he got in his real life. Both
like Mark Twain never liked Teddy Roosevelt. I thought he
was a big showman full of hot air, and it
bothered him. Mark Twain loved Booker T. Washington And how
many people in Booker T. Washington's life were critical of
him while he was alive. Like WB the Boys was
founded the NAACP. Who was never a slave, was born,
(15:57):
was highly educated, did a lot of great things, great minds,
great education. Never you couldn't say that he had a
fraction of the impact.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
That Booker D. Washington net. But he was very critical.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
And to see other African Americans critical of this black superstar,
why because they said he was too compliant. He wasn't
standing up more for the injustices that we all saw,
you know, from the water fountains to the bathrooms, to
the no longer allout in schools, to not being able
to play sports, all that stuff. WB du bois an example.
(16:30):
Somebody wanted to fight all that and he said, I
can't fight, and book it to you.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
I said, I can't fight all that, but I could
fight a lot.
Speaker 4 (16:36):
And if you're gonna be if the Johnson family is
unbelievably racist, I don't hate them.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
But I'm gonna deal with the other two families that aren't.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
And maybe the Johnson family by watching the way the
others treat me and I treat them, will change. And
w B du boys like Al Sharpton was just how
dare you not confront that racism you just saw? And
he said, I'm living in the South and I'm trying
to change generations in my time. And he died at
(17:08):
fifty nine. And you're talking about in the perfect world,
this is what the perfect way to live would be.
And that's fine, but we could both coexist. He didn't
see it that way because Boogety Watching was so big,
so famous, white people were very comfortable with him.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
It bothered him.
Speaker 4 (17:26):
Andrew Carnegie called him one of his best friends. JP
Morgan the same thing. Rosenwold, the founder of Sears, the
same thing. These guys were tight, and to see him
with these powerful people, many people thought, well, he had
to have sold his soul for that.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
He goes.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
No. They would turn around and donate to his school
another hb as a historical Black colleges, and they were
both winning. They felt bad about the inequities in society.
They wanted to help any where they can. They had
a ton of money, they wanted to help. And yet
people view Booker T. Washington doing that while not calling
(18:02):
out any racious brasal practices that might have existed in
their finances and their businesses. He thought that was too
willing to comply. And that was the biggest surprise. I'm like,
wait a second, you can't see that. The fact that
he's lauded in England and in France and in Spain
and Germany and right, and he's looked up this way,
(18:24):
isn't an inspiration the generations of black youth that you
can do this too, And he did. He was very
critical in fact, I think in his eulogy he started
three or four lines WB to boys and compliment him
and then says, here's how we set the mission back.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
We're going to take a quick break and be right
back on the Carol Markowitz Show. So you know, a
question that I ask all of my guests is do
you feel like you've made it? And so I want
to ask you, Brian about that, But I also want
to know do you think Booker and Roosevelt felt like
they made it in their lives?
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Yes?
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yes, to which one, well, don't think you've made it
and started there?
Speaker 3 (19:05):
No? No, I feel very fortunate to be here.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
And I also think that in our business, you see
so many talented people and it stops on a dime,
whether it's something they did or something that changes about
the business. And I don't think I give myself credit
for is realizing. When I started filling in in nineteen
ninety six, I had already been on the air in
some way for thirteen years, and I realized how great
(19:32):
this place was. Even though nobody was watching it. Couldn't
get it in your cable system, there was no streaming.
I just walked in and I said, man, this is
this is unbelievable, and I give myself credit for realizing
that and never thinking the grass was greener because I
knew so many people, and I know so many talented people,
and they always even the people here that left, I'm like,
(19:54):
you are.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Crazy, and I was right. That's awesome.
Speaker 4 (19:57):
So I'll give myself credit for that. But not in
our business, it changes so much. I mean, you probably
thought you were going to be a writer, and if
you just wanted to be a newspaper writer and not
not adjust to the mediums when you'll probably be in trouble.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
You have to do more than one.
Speaker 4 (20:13):
That's why I'm saying to myself, Okay, I want to
do radio. I want to be able to write books.
Speaker 3 (20:17):
I want to be able to talk about them. I
want to be able to go on stage.
Speaker 4 (20:21):
In the back of my mind, I got this sports foundation,
so my goal.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
Was what was to do it?
Speaker 4 (20:26):
But I don't think I made it because I think
I see how things change so much. We all know
people that were at the top of the game a
short time ago and they're now out.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
Their talent didn't change.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
Things changed, and then so the minute I feel like
I made it, I think that it's probably over the
next day. For those guys, what's so interesting is I
think they did realize, but they also were in the
prime of their life and they already had seen their
high by maybe fifty six. That's why Teddy Roosevelt goes
to with the Amazon. He loses that election after they
(21:03):
split the vote with the Bull Moose Party and him
and taff split the Republican vote, and Woodrow Wilson becomes president.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
And he thinks, what am I going to do?
Speaker 4 (21:11):
I gotta go, you know, I'm going to go down
of the Amazon. He almost dies and it would eventually
kill him. Compromise the system, which you never fully recovered
from Booker T. Washington kind of hid his high and
he was on the down side for a couple of
years before he got sick and ended up getting His
last wish was to die at Tuskegee, and he did.
Speaker 3 (21:28):
Teddy Roosevelt was one of the speakers at his funeral.
So I think they did reach.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
I think they realized they were impact, but they were
never satisfied, right, So it sounds everything You got to
be grateful, You got to be grateful, But I think
if you're ever satisfied, you.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
Know, such a range of answers to this.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
I just I love asking this question because I always
get like, you know, just people who you think would
say no, say yes. But people who you think would
say yes, wo'd say no.
Speaker 3 (21:55):
It's just it's.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Really interesting to see where people think that they are
in their lives. And it's interesting to imagine where Teddy
Roosevelt and Booker T. Washington might have imagined if they know,
if they felt that they had made it.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
So I would think that the one thing about Teddy
Roosevelt is underappreciate I told you about Booker T.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
Is his family.
Speaker 4 (22:11):
His family is all over his biographies, for autobiographies, his biographies,
you research him, he would just when he was with
his kids. Obviously there's no phones, so it's a big advantage. Well,
he would be all in. There'll be one adventure after another.
And his dad was the same way. When his dad
as busy as he was successful, as he was no communication,
(22:32):
no cars, he still was always there for him, especially
when they were so worried about his respiration and we
got to help this kid. So he always felt really
close to his family. So it does go to show
you you can have.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
This historically successful career yeah, and still have the other
if you choose with a little luck. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Absolutely, Brian, I've loved having you on. I can't wait
to read Teddy and Booker t how two American icons
blazed a path for racial equality. My last question that
I also ask all of my guests is to end
with your best tip for my listeners on how they
can improve their lives. And it could be obviously what
you've learned from Teddy and Booker.
Speaker 4 (23:16):
I'll do it, and it's not earth shattering or cutting edge,
but I just think you got to take some time
to figure out your personal goals and your professional goals,
separate them and ask yourself why, and if your wise
or strong enough o happen. You write them down two
sides of the same page, keep it to yourself, in
(23:37):
your pocket, or share with your family.
Speaker 3 (23:39):
Whatever you're more comfortable with. Might be too personal and
it'll happen.
Speaker 4 (23:43):
You take some time to look at that every day
and it'll manifest itself in some way, shape or form.
If your why is strong enough. If you just want
to be famous to prove to your parents that I'm
not the loser you thought I was, it's not going
to work, or when you get there, you're never going
to be satisfied if your why is strong enough. I
(24:03):
want to be famous and successful in order it's this
former foundation that maybe they help the most matter of
people possible. I want to prove to somebody in my
neighborhood that somebody like me could emerge.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
That's fine. I want to be the best basketball coach
in high school history, that's great.
Speaker 4 (24:20):
I want to affect five thousand kids, thirty kids at
a time in football, that's great.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
So whatever it is, the more detailed, the better chance
it has of coming through.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Thank you so much, Brian, thanks for coming on.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
Thank you, Carolyn. Just if anyone wants to seen me
on the road, I'm Aliva Florida. Brian kill me dot com.
I got a whole list there.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah, I'm gonna definitely go. I'm going to surprise you
at one of the events.
Speaker 3 (24:44):
I'm going to give you twenty percent off the admission.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Oh nice, it's big you guys, go get it.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
Carol, thank you, thanks.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
So much for joining us on the Carol Marcowitz Show.
Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
Host
Karol Markowicz
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