August 10, 2021 • 43 mins
Tom stops by Liberation Radio to make the case for gentrification in Oakland and Elaine Brown discusses affordable housing. Beulah, Rebecca and Owen take a ride to an abandoned train station where the truth about Savannah comes out.
Starring:
Ryan Destiny as Rebecca
Kelsey Grammer as Narrator
Theo Rossi as Lenny
Annie Ilonzeh as Beulah
Omar Dorsey as Pastor Green
Teresa "TopNotch" Celeste as Shant'e
Dru Down as Devon
Robbie Jarvis as Owen
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
In America today, the dream of a home of your
own to when you go looking for can turn into
a nightmare. A social blight called slum slum, a health
problem called overcrowding, an economic deadlock called housing. It's an
age of unrest and change, an age of confused personal values,
(00:31):
of widespread domestic difficulties culminating in a fabulous number of
broken homes. Fabulous the young men and women's day. Where
can they find the courage and hope to take the
responsibility of making what should be the most secure of
all wills a home In a world where the tight
reigns of dollars and cents must ever govern the individual's
(00:52):
creative instincts, where ambitions can find at a chasm between
inflation and deflation. We're rising, living costs seem always to
our distance like a earning power. It's a tough world,
miss worldly young people are supposed to inherit. Sure, we're
usually on the right side of things. But as Oakland
(01:14):
grows and new faces arrived, that growth adds different perspectives
to the conversation, perspectives which could be problematic, limited, privileged, racist, classist.
You know that stuff, yes, and they should be heard. Nonetheless,
even if I loathe everything they believe in, even if
they're wrong. Now, I know a lot of our listeners
(01:34):
are going to be mad if we give a platform
to people who are dead set on being capitalist pieces
of ship. But ignoring them doesn't make them go away, right,
It does not remove their ability to influence, and it
certainly doesn't change minds. It just makes us uninformed and
confused when one of them rolls up to the protests
for the tiki tool exactly. It's almost like people think
(01:57):
if we ignore them long enough, they'll magically vanish. Anyway,
today we're going to have a local business owner who
wanted to come here and give us his take on
the changing neighborhood and where he fits into it all.
By the way, it's definitely not Lenny this time. Let's
bring him in one yo. Do I just put on
(02:17):
these headphones or nice chair? What is it? Vegan leather?
Very classy, thanks for joining us, so tell our listeners
who you are, what you do, and while you're in well,
thank you both for having me. Who am I? Well,
(02:39):
my name is Tom and I'm the owner of Cafe
Meta here in West Oakland. It's a little coffee shop,
mom and pop style of the place. We've been open
for sixteen months now and we're really, really thriving. For
the most part, the neighborhood has been very welcoming until recently.
Two nights ago, someone threw a brick through the front
(03:02):
window with a note that said, fuck off, die yuppies Now.
The first thing I thought to myself was yuppies? But
what is this the eighties? The second thing I thought
was who are these cowards? No doubt they are the
same losers who have been trying to scare people like
me out of this area, and I mean it is
(03:23):
It's scary. You know. I have a question for you.
What did you think was gonna happen when you opened
a cafe in the hood? What do you mean? I
guess I'm trying to understand why you chose the Lower
Bottoms as a home for met a cafe. I mean,
why not? I'm a Bay Area native. It's not like
I'm an outsider. This is my community too. Where are
(03:45):
you from? My family is from Walnut Creek, where I
grew up. Wow, classy, Tom even on, I will not
creak in Unkland, don't you exactly? Sister cities. That's an understatement.
Aren't there like twelve black people in Walnut Creek? You know?
It just bums me out when people have to make
things racial. Coffee is not about race, black, white, orange.
(04:07):
Everyone likes coffee. It's universal, it's accessible, and it brings
people together. That's really why open meta. Okay, here's a
real question, serious question. I have a copy of your
menu right here. Um, can you define gourmet toast at
twelve dollars? What makes a peanut butter and apple toast
(04:29):
accessible to people in the area. I hope you're not
suggesting that people who live in this neighborhood deserve any
less than the best, freshest organic ingredients. Off an apple,
two spoonfuls of peanut butter, and a slice of bread.
That can't be more than about fifty worth of ingredients,
even if the peanut butter is free range or whatever.
(04:51):
Are you trying to make the totals in the area
go broke. We're swamp business and we're passionate about the
food we put out. Our gourmet toast don't just taste good,
they make you feel good. What nose? But that kind
of sounds like bullshit, I assure you, it's not. Do
you understand where we're coming from. That West Oakland's blue collar,
(05:13):
many live in poverty, so it almost feels like you're
intentionally catering to a different class of people. Yeah. I
sort of feel like I'm being attacked here. When it
comes down to it, I'm the victim of what I
would possibly characterize as I hate crime. I've been trying
not to take it personally, but you know, I'm sure
whoever broke my window felt that they were justified. Because
(05:36):
there's a white guy in town running a successful business.
Obviously someone felt threatened. I'm saying, did you did you
say hate crime? Can you explain that a little more? Yeah,
clearly my being white played a part in this. Yuppi
almost comes across as an ethnic slurn because yuppie's gonnaly
(05:56):
be white pretty much. I'm still trying to process how
on one hand you can say you're the victim of
a race based crime, and on the other hand you
say people shouldn't make things about race. No, that's not
what I meant. No, yeah it is. But anyway, let
me just say point blank, I think your business model
(06:17):
is harmful to the community and also elitist. Well, it's
unfortunate you feel that way. I feel we've created a
space where all are welcome. On Tuesday nights we have
for yoga, there's great art, open mic nights, and even
trivia nights. Resist Refuse Cafe has had free events and
open mic nights for years though, so come on, nobody
takes that place seriously. It's one health inspection away from
(06:39):
shutting down anyway. Don't you think it's wrong that, at worst,
businesses like yours contribute to the displacement of longtime residents.
What you've described would be great if it were actual
locals who've benefited. At best, you represent the changing demographics.
I'm sorry, but displacement is a natural occurrence, and in
nature there are always winners and losers. The fact is
(07:01):
that many residents I've spoken to love the changes that
upscale revitalization brings, less crime, better schools, actual grocery stores.
So you're a philanthropist, really, I guess you could make
the case that business owners contribute to the betterment of society.
I think a lot of the credit goes to Mayor
Denise Dane, though I'm a big fan of hers. She's
(07:23):
been so supportive of small businesses in Oakland. And it's
because of her shout out on Twitter that Meta has
a constant line out the door and down the block.
These last two days, business has more than tripled. It's amazing.
Denise Dane. If you're listening, thank you. Oh, I assure you.
Denise Dane is not one of our listeners. We know
exactly facts of this around you. Why not? She's the
(07:47):
best Oakland mayor since Jerry Brown. He did not just
say that. Yeah, what's the big deal? I mean, look,
don't tell me you're supporting Lenny whoa what what's his face? No,
we don't believe in government. Actually, oh my god, you
guys like Antifa or something. Oh, and I think it's
safe to say that this experiment has been a fail. Tom.
(08:08):
It's been a pleasure getting to know you. I'm sure
you will continue being toned deaf for the rest of
your days. Must have luck to you. Oh that's it, okay,
Uh see you around, amigo. Honestly, I knew it would
(08:34):
be a file please, oh and stop it. This was
your idea, But we learned a lot right Personally, I'm
glad to know that someone like him exists in the neighborhood.
I feel like I can make an informed decision and
not patronises establishment, not that I could afford it anyway.
Don't you think he kind of looks like Mark Zuckerberg?
They both had that ancient Greek statue look so creepy.
(08:56):
I don't think I'd go to Cafe Menta based on
that alone. I don't unders stand your brain. Sometimes. I
think that conversation fried my brain really makes you appreciate
Lenny Huh, No, not at all. These men are both
living on a different planet, oblivious to the fact that
everyone hates them. I can't wait till we bring back
the guillotine. Oh dear a. The guillotine not a real guillotine,
(09:19):
just a figurative one, was it not? The Occupied movement
seems like that with society's last attempt to address inequality,
and we all know how that ended. Sadly, it appears
that the powers that be will not let it happen.
Occupy was just a single battle, true, thanks to the
Federal Bureau of Investigation, we lost that one, but the
war rages on. People are organizing, radicals are infiltrating spaces
(09:41):
in the high places. Rebecca, you are a revolutionary and
I'm just getting started, and that seems like the perfect
transition for us to bring on our next guest. Yes,
I'm very excited to have Elain Brown join us. In
just a moment, Liberation Radio presents a conversation with former
Black Panther leader, divist and author of The Condemnation of
(10:02):
Little By Elaine Brown. Elene is a regular guest here
on our show, but we learned something new every time
she comes on. Hello, Elaine rebeccan Owen here at Liberation Radio,
and we are so grateful to have you come on
our show and talk with this. We have so much
respect for you the work you've done and continue to
do for the community. Um. I'm just gonna start it
(10:24):
right out. It's no secret that the Bay Area gets
more and more expensive every year. I know so many
people who have had to move to places like Stockton
or Lajo because they've been priced out of the city.
So my first question is about affordable housing in Oakland.
Where is it and how can we create more of it? Well? Um,
(10:46):
of course, affordable is a subjective term at all. It
all depends on what you mean by affordable. UM. And
in the lexicon, of the development housing development, Uh, affordable
me anything they feel like it, meaning so they can
pretend that they have affordable housing when they don't in
fact have affordable housing, meaning that's not affordable for the
(11:07):
average person. Black people particularly have been um a gentrified
out of Oakland. West Oakland was at one point when
the Black Panther Party was in existence and thriving, we
had probably around black in West Oakland. Um. We are
still the majority in West Oakland, but it's a very
slim majority, could be thirty percent something like this. And
(11:30):
in the overall city, I think black people represent something
like the city. So there is a race question as
well as a class question, as is true in all
cases with black people, because the convergence of racing class
exists in Black people and when it doesn't exist in
any other group. Um. So there is the question of
(11:51):
all of the bank foulldral, the Wells fargoes of racism
and banking, and you know in all of these things
that Obama bailed these banks out for having exploited poor
Black people and giving us these fake loans and then
we would have to pay them, and then we didn't
have we didn't have the ability to pay because we
never did, and so that happened and the houses were
taken over. So then that allowed for a whole new
(12:13):
mix of people to come in to Oakland, and particularly
in West Oakland. Um. And then there is just the
fact that the Bay Area is the most expensive place
to live in San Francisco, as I understand, it is
more expensive to live in than New York. Now the
idea is that, uh. And in the capitalist society that
we live in, it's all about what the market will bear.
(12:35):
In other words, if you can raise the prices you do,
you have no there's no fundamental moral principle driving any
marketplace in America as far as the Black Panther Party
was concerned. UM, housing should be free for everybody, or
available as free in case you can't pay. In other words,
your ability to be sheltered shouldn't depend on what do
(12:55):
you have any money, Just like food, if I can't eat,
I will die. Now, if I don't have money, I
can't get food in America. So that tells you that
my life is on the line every day. If I
can't don't have money, I can't get medical care. If
I don't have money, I can't get housing, so forth,
and so and so. These things are a reflection of
the whole situation. So what the market will bear is
(13:16):
what we're talking about. And the market has gotten because
of the tech workers that have come here, because of
a variety of changes, and because of racism, because the
tech workers aren't word at all about black people and
prout a matter of fact, they think they're doing us
a favor by living in our neighborhoods, uh and elevating
the neighborhoods. I've actually had people say that, well, you know,
we brought a kind of middle class, as if anybody
(13:39):
cared values, as if middle class people have a value,
like a moral value. So the bottom line is it's
extremely uh difficult to find affordable housing in Oakland. So
you can say it's afford You can call a housing
unit affordable at eight percent of media income. Matter of fact,
you can really call it affordable a per cent. And
(14:01):
why is it important to call it affordable Because you
can get money from the government, from cities and states
and the federal government hud to build affordable housing at
eight income. So what does that mean. It means that
if you're making a hundred thousand a year, so would
be counting you as eighty thousand, and then uh thirty
percent of your income would go for uh your rent,
(14:24):
So I can raise the rents to that and still
actually call it affordable. Now, what I'm doing in West Oakland,
it's seventh in Campbell, uh in Lower Bottoms, is that
I'm building um amazingly housing that will be actually actually affordable.
I will be for low and very low income people.
(14:44):
Some people probably end up paying something like two or
three hundred a month, and most of it will be
subsidized from HUD From this, from from that. We've hustled
for this stuff. I've hustled. This is however, to build
the seventy nine affordable units. Affordability doesn't mean you're building
cheap units. It's just you build the exact same thing.
You have the same requirements, the same environmental requirements, same
(15:07):
building requirements, but you're gonna build. I'm building very beautiful
place that will be energy efficient. Now that price right
now and here in one the project budget is seventy
million dollars for seventy nine units. Can you believe that? Now?
I basically I got that land by pushing, cajoling, intimidating,
(15:27):
screaming and acting a fool with the City of Ocean
and after a while it just they just said, okay,
you can have this. It was a vacant property, have
been left vacant and blighted for thirty some years that
we have to argue about it. There's a lot of
vacant property. Now people had iota of will. I'm talking
about so called radical, so called activists. They're going and
(15:47):
do what the occupied people did. And some of them
are still living in West Oakland because they just took
over a vacant house. Just go on and say, we're
going to fix up this vacant lot. Now, the problem
is not getting the land. Even though people are not
bold enough to go ahead and seize the land, they
just want to say that free to land, Okay, free
(16:08):
to let go and do it. Not doing anything, just
sitting around whining. But if you were to get a property,
then the question becomes, how do you build on it?
How do you get the money? Now you've got black
people who have a lot of money. Yeah, and nobody's
asking them to give up their multimillion dollar houses or
their multimillion dollar lifestyles. But you would think that, you know,
(16:34):
you would say, all right, let's pull our money together
and begin to build housing, because they have the money
to do it, and all they have, they can get
a lot of government money because there's a lot of
government money out there to give for for development. So
we we have to find a way to have the will.
But if we don't have the will, don't ask me
how you can fix something in a system that has
(16:54):
bent on keeping black people oppressed. Yeah, well, what are
the other ways that you think that we can off
sent the effects of gentrification? Until you get to nineteen
sixty four, nineteen sixty four, the Civil Rights Act. The
people have led from eighteen sixty nineteen sixty four to
(17:14):
get the vote, to get to sit at a lunch counter,
whatever little stuff we want, We did a little stuff. Now,
little teeny stuff we didn't shape. Let's just burn down America.
We could have said it, but we didn't. We fought
just to get by, just to get by, and we're
list and beaten down just for little things like oh,
(17:35):
can I vote? No, you can't vote. Eighteen nineteen sixty four.
You have the Civil Rights to Act allowing us to
use public facilities. Ain't that deep? I can now pee
in the same public toilet as a white person. One
hundred years to get there, one hundred years to get
the nineteen sixty five Civil Rights Voting Rights Act. After
(17:56):
bloody Sunday on Selma in some Alabama on the been
Fedis Bridge forced Lyndon Johnson as he was invading Vietnam
and killing the Vietnamese people, to go ahead and give
these negroes something. Let's give him the vote, as if
it really would matter what else changed, I don't know.
(18:18):
That's all We've had legislatively, legally any other way, black
people getting beaten up by the police. Long before we
heard about George Floyd and all these people that think they,
oh my god, I can't believe George Floyd. It was
so so here we are. So if we want to
talk about housing or anything else, really, then we have
(18:42):
to talk about either what I'm doing, something practical where
you can figure it out, sees the land, do some
day to day stuff, or understand there's a long struggle.
Two dismantle this capitalist racist system that is in place.
This system is a exactly so when we say systomach,
(19:02):
I'm not talking about some little thing. This is inculpated
into America and then there's a cultural norm that black
people are inferior. There's no undoing some little teenage like
this is some small thing and all we gotta do
is fix it. This is a reformist minded thinking, Well,
if I just keep the police uh a camera, video
(19:24):
camera on their shoulder, they won't kill us. Well, there's
a joke. I'll film it and kill you. Now, what's
your next point. Who's gonna stop me? You ain't. You
ain't gonna shoot nobody. You're gonna cry, You're gonna walk
around with your little picket signs Black Lives Matter? Whose
treets are streets? I saw them in Rochester the other
(19:44):
day and they actually use that Ferguson slogan, Who streets
are streets? Who are you kidding? These are not your streets.
You don't own anything. They let you bar strow and
have your little exercise, and it goes on and on
and on. But the real problem is we don't really
want this stuff, because if we did, we would do
(20:04):
what the Black Panther Party did, and that is dedicate
twenty four hours a day to this struggle. M I'm
glad you mentioned the Panthers. You you see something about
guns just now, and I think it's uh testament interesting.
I suppose that the Panthers affected gun reform in California
(20:26):
regarding I believe regarding shotguns. Is that correct? That was
not our at the time in California. In California, you
could carry a shotgun openly, in llegally, legally and openly.
So we protested the as soon as they saw some
black people with now all along you can see some
white people walking around with uh, you know, automatic weapons,
(20:48):
you know, so on and so on. Nobody was said
a word. But as soon as some black people got
ahold of some guns and simply said, we are going
to patrol our streets and we're going to make sure
that the law is fi If you arrest this man,
We're gonna be standing there and make sure. I got
a gun on one hand, and I got a law book.
Now tell us what he what code he's arrested under.
(21:09):
So that kind of changed the dynamic. Not in a
big way, I mean what we were going to fight
the whole Oakland Street Police Department, but it gave it
emboldened the people to see that you can't resist. So
the gun is necessary, not necessarily revolutionary, because the police
have guns, and they're not our friends, and they're not
(21:30):
trying to have a revolutionary and revoluntary change. So with
the gun, the question of the gun, we believe in
the right we believed and I believe in the right
to self defense. Um, if you try to come into
my home, I don't care who you are and kill me.
Brianna Taylor gets shot in her home in her bed. Now,
(21:54):
I'll give her her her fiancee credit for getting one
round off because at least he wasn't just sitting there
waiting for everybody to die. But I don't think you
know the city, We don't know what all the rest
of it was. But the bottom line is we're not
willing to stand up to that. So what the Black
Panthers guns were about was the show two things. One
that the gun can be revolutionarybody quoting Mao, as we did, uh,
(22:20):
it may be necessary to take up the gun in
order to get rid of the gun. Our goal would
have been to get rid of the gun. We're not
trying to have guns in the society. Who the health cares.
So when we marched in May of nineteen sixty seven
up to Sacramento with our guns, which were loaded, unlike
other people who displayed unloaded guns. Uh. It was called
the mall for that. And some guys said, look, we
(22:40):
just can't have uh these black people run around here
these shotguns. So let's have a law to uh say
that it's illegal to carry shotgun or any gun openly.
And this is the first and only time the n
r A supported gun before gun control. It's like it
was a gun control bill, remember that, and gun reformers
(23:00):
gun control bill that they specifically wrote to get rid
of us. So they said we couldn't carry a shotguns openly.
So we said, okay, so now we don't carry everything,
uh carry everything under the coat and where of element,
and we're not gonna stop using guns, but we use
those guns. Wanted to literally protect ourselves, but also to
(23:23):
show the people that, as Hughie Newton said, uh, you
know the pigs bleed to you know, say, hey, if
you get shot with a shotgun, you will have the
same reaction with your policeman or a personal you know,
a civilian. So we wanted to embold in the people
instead of doing what is happening now, all this whining
(23:44):
and crying, and that's what's happening right now. Oh black
Lives Man, and we don't paint Washington d C. Those
people trampled all over that and invaded the capital. Not
that I care. That's like, you know, the enemy fighting
the enemy, so whatever. Uh. That was the point. It
was educational point because we as a vanguard party thought
of ourselves as organizing and readying the people for revolution.
(24:10):
But the people would tell you were violent, so because
they believed it. That's what they do with anarchists groups.
They tell the public that they're violent, and then they
take away their power because people ostracizing. Well violent non
violent is you know, is irrelevant. I mean, the violence
of the founding of America can't be compared to anything
(24:30):
that we might do. We you know, these things are violent.
There are things being done to take your life. They're
done to take your life. Now. We used to quote
h the Great Russian anarchists by kun In, and our
quote wash that the revolutionary is a dumed man. So
(24:52):
the question of anarchism versus non anarchism, I don't have
any issue with that because I'm not looking for this
system to stay in place under any circumstances. I don't
really care how it gets taken down because it enemy
of my enemy is my friend. And that's the end
of that comment part. Well, Elaine, thank you so so much.
We appreciate every time you are with us, and this
(25:16):
was an amazing conversation. We learned a lot. Thank you
for sharing your wisdom. Yes, we appreciate you. Thank you
for inviting me. It's ten pm, another late evening on
the streets of West Oakland. Like so much of the area,
(25:37):
it's deceptive, appearing safe and deserted. The four of us,
Rebecca Owen, Poppins, and myself ride our bikes through a
maze of brand new modern condominiens bizarrely generic and soulness.
They're the apparent result of massive foreign investment. We could
have driven my car, since it's been repaired and repaint it,
(25:58):
but we be consisted we go on bikes. Perhaps I
should be more apprehensive. It's clear this group is a
lot more cunning and observant than they let on, Especially
this Poppin's character. I mean he literally orchestrated our entire
first encounter. What else is he capable of? Let's go
(26:18):
right on frontage, Watch over that poth hold up ahead.
Rebecca is a natural leader. Can't deny her that it's
obvious she's in her element in this role she's playing.
As I said, I learned a lot during my short
time with the FBI, But the fact that I've already
successfully penetrated this rag tag group of activists, arsonists, whatever
(26:41):
is pretty remarkable. Never mind the fact that it's because
Rebecca is convinced I'm some kind of double agent. I
understand her way of thinking. On the surface, my story
looks pretty shady to someone with her history. Truthfully, I
don't understand my own intention, Jans. Since I've been back
(27:02):
in Oakland, everything feels like a fog. Perhaps subconsciously, I've
been feeling like I need to be a part of
a group again, and then there's only one. I don't
even know what to make at him. He's slippery, imperceptible,
impossible to profile. How does it feel? How does what feel?
(27:29):
How does it feel to be on the other side
of the law. I don't know what you mean? You will?
We're here. This place is creepy, like horror film set creepy,
But I wouldn't expect an abandoned train station to be
any less dark, dank, and dirty. It's a very tall
(27:51):
barbed wire fence surrounding the perimeter, and I have a
feeling we won't be going through the front entrance. You'll
bring your back over here. I'll lock it up with
the others. Do you think they're safe? I mean I
don't see anyone else around you. We both know how
quickly that can change. I'll be fine. You can hardly
(28:12):
see them from the street, whatever you say, So how
do we get in here with these You're not serious
a wire cutter. If you know a better way, now,
I would be the time this year. I don't see
how you can snip a hole in a fence and
expect to get away with it. Look, I'll show you up.
(28:33):
Let me see those things. She's helpless. You know this
is just a teaching moment. MS you follow me. It's
actually very easy. We'll find a discreet spot like this
and sniff it just so. Then we remove this pio. Next,
(28:54):
open the edges so they hook back on the fence
and cover the hole. See good as new, and no
one will be able to tell, at least not tonight.
That's very clever. I didn't know you were such a
seasoned criminal. So are you're going to tell me what
we're doing here? An initiation assaults. But why this location?
(29:18):
I suppose it's because Rebecca has it in our mind
that you're still left b I personally, I don't think
that's true. There's no way you're still have fed or
wherever want to begin with? Oh really? And why is that?
For one, you're very reckless, and two I think you
seem maybe I shouldn't say tell me. I'm pretty sure
I can handle it. I mean, we've worked together for
(29:40):
over a week now, so I see things. You know,
you seem broken. Not that you're acting weird or crazy.
It's as if you're going through the motions of existing,
as if doing the bare minimum is exhausting, so you
just kind of tune out a ghost. Wow, you've really
(30:01):
given this some thought. Huh. Well, don't get me wrong.
You've gone through a lot recently, more than most. But
when I think it fits, they're like robots, stoic on emotion.
I think, then you don't know Beulah because she has
always been an icy bitch. It's what I like about
her and what makes me want to wring her neck.
(30:23):
There she goes read me like a book, I swear
Rebecca and I have more of a psychic connection than
me and my own twin sister. It's becoming very fucking annoying.
Maybe you'll get your chance. Judging by the looks of
this place, would be a great place to leave a body. Guys,
can we just do this already? Damn owen? Could you
have made the whole any smaller? Discretion is the key, Darling.
(30:45):
Upon closer inspection, the train station is even more ominous.
It's drenched in graffiti and surrounded by dead plants, clandestine
club meetings in a rickety old building. It's almost cliche
this way. Make sure you're turn your flashlights one. This
(31:08):
is insane. It's almost worth risking jail to see over
Here is where we have everything set up. Play it
turns pillows. You thought of everything? What are you doing?
Is this some kind of trade course not? It's your initiation.
I don't understand. You can drop the act now, sweetheart,
owing some help? Please? Hello, You can't just stand there
(31:31):
on a little point of gun at me. And now
you didn't think we were coming here to play monopoly.
You made your point. You want to protect your little
secret society. Go ahead. You're the one who invited me
because it was just a matter of time before you
weaseled your way in because that's what you do. But first,
for the last time, I'm not FBI. I am not
(31:53):
an informant, I am not investigating you, and I am
not trying to sabotage whatever you're involved in. If you're
not an agent, then why are you here. If your
intent isn't to infiltrate and stir up ship and report
back to your master's, then why did your type a
ass agree to come here tonight. We're supposed to believe
that you're compelled to be a social justice warrior after
years of apathy. It's a fair question. Just be honest, Savannah.
(32:19):
Is why I'm here. The fact that this part of
her life meant so much to her and I had
no idea. It makes me feel like I never really
knew her at all, and that's my fault. I should
have been there for her before she went looking for
family or acceptance or whatever it is you guys offered her.
(32:40):
So you asked me, what do I want? I want answers.
I want to know why my sister is lying in
a bed comatose. You still don't get it. There's nothing
to tell what happened to Savannah is on Savannah, Rebecca,
hold on, she should not. The whole truth won't make
a difference. She should still not. This is stupid. Don't
over her bullshit. She's not even a good liar. Check
(33:01):
out dude. All right, sit down, I guess his story. Time.
You remember Terence Peters. It doesn't ring a bell. Yeah,
it probably wouldn't. He was only fifteen when he was
murdered by a cop six months ago. That's terrible. And
(33:22):
what did he do? See? That's the problem. You automatically
assume he was doing something that justified on the spot execution.
I was just asking for context. He was homeless and
he's been stealing ship from the local stores, food mostly.
The cops stopped him with bags of chips under his jacket.
I'm sure you can guess how the story ends. They
(33:44):
assumed he was armed and acted in self defense. This
was right across the street from Resist. Savannah and I
were there when it happened, hearing the shots and going
outside seeing his body sprawled out on the seamen m.
The memory is ' grained in my mind even more
(34:08):
than the blood. I remember clearly. All of those chips
blown the bits and scattered everywhere. Holy shit, Savannah never
told me about that. It affected all of us deeply,
(34:29):
a kind of um collective PTSD. But Savannah took it
the hardest anyway. The asshole who killed Terence got away
with it, of course, but that was the final strong
for us. What did you do? I'm getting there? Are
(34:54):
you where? The double a CP stage several incidents and
confrontations during the Civil rights movement. The idea was to
bring injustices to light by having upstanding citizens engaged and
planned acts of defiance. That way, the public wouldn't be
able to simply look the other way and dismiss the
horror of Jim curl Loss. So we came up with
the plan of our own. Savannah was supposed to be
(35:16):
the perfect victim, an attractive black woman with a clean record,
good family and a twin sister and the motherfucking FBI.
Why Savannah, why not you? You openly advocate for destruction
of government. Do you really think there's any love loss
for anarchist in this country? Anyway? Savannah insisted that it'd
be heard. It was a long shot, but we came
up with a pretty good plan for her to encounter
(35:37):
the same officer who shot Terence. I think we decided
on her car breakdown or something. Didn't we on thanks,
I can't remember. We had quite a lot of brands
to him in that week. The trickiest part was ensuring
the same court will be the one to respond to
the emergency calls. You made my sister into a martyr,
and for what we didn't do anything. At the last minute,
(36:00):
it owen and I realized that we could actually end
up undermining the cause we were championing. We didn't need
a lie because cops commit enough crimes on their own,
particularly the cop we were targeting, So we called it off,
but Savannah still wanted to do it. She went rogue
and tried to go through with confronting him on her own.
So it's true, Savannah is practically dead because of you.
(36:22):
Hey wait, wait, wait wait, what was that something? Do
you guys here that we're over here? What are you doing?
Didn't I say this was an initiation? That's what's happening.
Whoever you are, you're trespassing. Backup is on the way.
I suggest you stay right where you are. Great, we're
waiting shape the gun hold them to dispute up. No, wait,
(36:47):
hurry and take it. It's a call that's coming. What
just put it in your back pocket. If you don't,
I'll point it and we know how that will turn out.
Fuck you Owen, you're just the baddest Rebecca. If to me,
this thing really is loaded. I want all of your
(37:08):
hands up right now. So you got my text message
that's afraid you aren't coming. I don't know you. I said,
hands up, they're up. Aren't you gonna ask why I
told you to meet me here tonight? Now? I want
all of you to slowly pull out your identification cards. Hello,
you're not even gonna guess? Stop talking now, Okay? Office?
(37:35):
Just Scott Corey, who lives at one Hastings I have
and Alameda? How the fund do you know that? Chees man?
Do you listen? I'm the one who texted you. You
were summoned by me. This is all by my design.
I don't understand what you're not kidder. My friend is
having a hard time with her personal life. I know
we shouldn't be here, but we're we're just messing around.
(37:59):
I was a train any at Quantico and my father
was good friends with Chief man in at the O
p D for many years. I'm sure he can vouch
for us. You're really like that boolean. Yeah, I asked
you a question, and come on, let's cooperate and let
this end peaceful, peaceful. He killed Terence. Here's the reason
(38:21):
your sister is in a coma. Unfortunately, that's all been
dean legalized murder. But you've been up to no good
on the downlow, haven't you, Scott Bulah. This guy is
a literal white supremacist. We put it all together. Not
only is he a murder of black people, he's been
bringing little black girls to a cat house. Officer Scott
Corey is scum and he's here so he can be
(38:42):
held accountable enough. You're all under arrest. If you use
the thing in your pocket, we can end this tonight.
Justice can be served. The law dictates justice. So decide
right now if you are on the side of the
law or on the side of justice. I'm not her,
I'm not like Savannah. Come in you first, turn around,
get offer you greasy piece of ship, do something you
(39:06):
actually gone It will be Hollwood against taste. What about
a camera? It's not on because he's a bad guy.
You all are fucking nuts all of you. I am
not part of this, and I don't want to be. Well,
it's too late, baby, because you're in it. Knee deep officer, Officer.
I have a gun. It's in my back pocket. I'll
keep my hands up and you can take it. Hands up.
(39:29):
Don't you move. Don't you fucking move. My hands are up,
My hands are up. I'm being completely compliant. Your compliance
is the problem. If you won't do it, then I will. Hey, Handsome,
put it down. No, I don't think I will yet.
(39:58):
Episode gourmette TOAs and The Intimate Evening. H Yeah, uh
Will Packer, I was gonna Producer James Lopez, I was
that count a producer behind Look here, Jack Leavy, executive
producer and director, Let's Go Deminique, New Time Yeah Now,
(40:24):
creator and writer, producer, Leave your baby, you need Hello? Hello,
Whitney Fuller, Creative executive Michael keith Berg, co producer, Drell
Alexis recording mixer, Sounds Ros Davis, Audio Consultan, Music supervisor
(40:47):
Jeff Forston, music by Jeff Jeff what Up Boy, Joe Wolf,
Tony Homer, score mangers, Paye Ramsay Production assistant Junior Rohne
Production System. You didn't main cats, Now you did? I Yeah,
(41:11):
and the Alonza plays Blue Lave, Elaine Brown playing as
Elaine Brown, Jordan Dick playing his poets. Miguel Perez offered
the Scott Card, Paul Butcher as time come on, Robbie Jarvis,
(41:34):
Owen at Wards, Ran Destiny plays Rebecca. You didn't, Yeah,
seek Olton additional voices. You didn't shuts out, So it's
mission Tom Venez baby and I for Real sound by
(42:00):
podcast Stage. Yeah, this has been a world pack of
media production. I heart production and I am that boys
you down. The one is only no phoney, am back
without the Roman. Let's go. That's an additional voice. Yeah,
(42:22):
one and only. Let's go. Lord,
In America today, the dream of a home of your
own to when you go looking for can turn into
a nightmare. A social blight called slum slum, a health
problem called overcrowding, an economic deadlock called housing. It's an
age of unrest and change, an age of confused personal values,
(00:31):
of widespread domestic difficulties culminating in a fabulous number of
broken homes. Fabulous the young men and women's day. Where
can they find the courage and hope to take the
responsibility of making what should be the most secure of
all wills a home In a world where the tight
reigns of dollars and cents must ever govern the individual's
(00:52):
creative instincts, where ambitions can find at a chasm between
inflation and deflation. We're rising, living costs seem always to
our distance like a earning power. It's a tough world,
miss worldly young people are supposed to inherit. Sure, we're
usually on the right side of things. But as Oakland
(01:14):
grows and new faces arrived, that growth adds different perspectives
to the conversation, perspectives which could be problematic, limited, privileged, racist, classist.
You know that stuff, yes, and they should be heard. Nonetheless,
even if I loathe everything they believe in, even if
they're wrong. Now, I know a lot of our listeners
(01:34):
are going to be mad if we give a platform
to people who are dead set on being capitalist pieces
of ship. But ignoring them doesn't make them go away, right,
It does not remove their ability to influence, and it
certainly doesn't change minds. It just makes us uninformed and
confused when one of them rolls up to the protests
for the tiki tool exactly. It's almost like people think
(01:57):
if we ignore them long enough, they'll magically vanish. Anyway,
today we're going to have a local business owner who
wanted to come here and give us his take on
the changing neighborhood and where he fits into it all.
By the way, it's definitely not Lenny this time. Let's
bring him in one yo. Do I just put on
(02:17):
these headphones or nice chair? What is it? Vegan leather?
Very classy, thanks for joining us, so tell our listeners
who you are, what you do, and while you're in well,
thank you both for having me. Who am I? Well,
(02:39):
my name is Tom and I'm the owner of Cafe
Meta here in West Oakland. It's a little coffee shop,
mom and pop style of the place. We've been open
for sixteen months now and we're really, really thriving. For
the most part, the neighborhood has been very welcoming until recently.
Two nights ago, someone threw a brick through the front
(03:02):
window with a note that said, fuck off, die yuppies Now.
The first thing I thought to myself was yuppies? But
what is this the eighties? The second thing I thought
was who are these cowards? No doubt they are the
same losers who have been trying to scare people like
me out of this area, and I mean it is
(03:23):
It's scary. You know. I have a question for you.
What did you think was gonna happen when you opened
a cafe in the hood? What do you mean? I
guess I'm trying to understand why you chose the Lower
Bottoms as a home for met a cafe. I mean,
why not? I'm a Bay Area native. It's not like
I'm an outsider. This is my community too. Where are
(03:45):
you from? My family is from Walnut Creek, where I
grew up. Wow, classy, Tom even on, I will not
creak in Unkland, don't you exactly? Sister cities. That's an understatement.
Aren't there like twelve black people in Walnut Creek? You know?
It just bums me out when people have to make
things racial. Coffee is not about race, black, white, orange.
(04:07):
Everyone likes coffee. It's universal, it's accessible, and it brings
people together. That's really why open meta. Okay, here's a
real question, serious question. I have a copy of your
menu right here. Um, can you define gourmet toast at
twelve dollars? What makes a peanut butter and apple toast
(04:29):
accessible to people in the area. I hope you're not
suggesting that people who live in this neighborhood deserve any
less than the best, freshest organic ingredients. Off an apple,
two spoonfuls of peanut butter, and a slice of bread.
That can't be more than about fifty worth of ingredients,
even if the peanut butter is free range or whatever.
(04:51):
Are you trying to make the totals in the area
go broke. We're swamp business and we're passionate about the
food we put out. Our gourmet toast don't just taste good,
they make you feel good. What nose? But that kind
of sounds like bullshit, I assure you, it's not. Do
you understand where we're coming from. That West Oakland's blue collar,
(05:13):
many live in poverty, so it almost feels like you're
intentionally catering to a different class of people. Yeah. I
sort of feel like I'm being attacked here. When it
comes down to it, I'm the victim of what I
would possibly characterize as I hate crime. I've been trying
not to take it personally, but you know, I'm sure
whoever broke my window felt that they were justified. Because
(05:36):
there's a white guy in town running a successful business.
Obviously someone felt threatened. I'm saying, did you did you
say hate crime? Can you explain that a little more? Yeah,
clearly my being white played a part in this. Yuppi
almost comes across as an ethnic slurn because yuppie's gonnaly
(05:56):
be white pretty much. I'm still trying to process how
on one hand you can say you're the victim of
a race based crime, and on the other hand you
say people shouldn't make things about race. No, that's not
what I meant. No, yeah it is. But anyway, let
me just say point blank, I think your business model
(06:17):
is harmful to the community and also elitist. Well, it's
unfortunate you feel that way. I feel we've created a
space where all are welcome. On Tuesday nights we have
for yoga, there's great art, open mic nights, and even
trivia nights. Resist Refuse Cafe has had free events and
open mic nights for years though, so come on, nobody
takes that place seriously. It's one health inspection away from
(06:39):
shutting down anyway. Don't you think it's wrong that, at worst,
businesses like yours contribute to the displacement of longtime residents.
What you've described would be great if it were actual
locals who've benefited. At best, you represent the changing demographics.
I'm sorry, but displacement is a natural occurrence, and in
nature there are always winners and losers. The fact is
(07:01):
that many residents I've spoken to love the changes that
upscale revitalization brings, less crime, better schools, actual grocery stores.
So you're a philanthropist, really, I guess you could make
the case that business owners contribute to the betterment of society.
I think a lot of the credit goes to Mayor
Denise Dane, though I'm a big fan of hers. She's
(07:23):
been so supportive of small businesses in Oakland. And it's
because of her shout out on Twitter that Meta has
a constant line out the door and down the block.
These last two days, business has more than tripled. It's amazing.
Denise Dane. If you're listening, thank you. Oh, I assure you.
Denise Dane is not one of our listeners. We know
exactly facts of this around you. Why not? She's the
(07:47):
best Oakland mayor since Jerry Brown. He did not just
say that. Yeah, what's the big deal? I mean, look,
don't tell me you're supporting Lenny whoa what what's his face? No,
we don't believe in government. Actually, oh my god, you
guys like Antifa or something. Oh, and I think it's
safe to say that this experiment has been a fail. Tom.
(08:08):
It's been a pleasure getting to know you. I'm sure
you will continue being toned deaf for the rest of
your days. Must have luck to you. Oh that's it, okay,
Uh see you around, amigo. Honestly, I knew it would
(08:34):
be a file please, oh and stop it. This was
your idea, But we learned a lot right Personally, I'm
glad to know that someone like him exists in the neighborhood.
I feel like I can make an informed decision and
not patronises establishment, not that I could afford it anyway.
Don't you think he kind of looks like Mark Zuckerberg?
They both had that ancient Greek statue look so creepy.
(08:56):
I don't think I'd go to Cafe Menta based on
that alone. I don't unders stand your brain. Sometimes. I
think that conversation fried my brain really makes you appreciate
Lenny Huh, No, not at all. These men are both
living on a different planet, oblivious to the fact that
everyone hates them. I can't wait till we bring back
the guillotine. Oh dear a. The guillotine not a real guillotine,
(09:19):
just a figurative one, was it not? The Occupied movement
seems like that with society's last attempt to address inequality,
and we all know how that ended. Sadly, it appears
that the powers that be will not let it happen.
Occupy was just a single battle, true, thanks to the
Federal Bureau of Investigation, we lost that one, but the
war rages on. People are organizing, radicals are infiltrating spaces
(09:41):
in the high places. Rebecca, you are a revolutionary and
I'm just getting started, and that seems like the perfect
transition for us to bring on our next guest. Yes,
I'm very excited to have Elain Brown join us. In
just a moment, Liberation Radio presents a conversation with former
Black Panther leader, divist and author of The Condemnation of
(10:02):
Little By Elaine Brown. Elene is a regular guest here
on our show, but we learned something new every time
she comes on. Hello, Elaine rebeccan Owen here at Liberation Radio,
and we are so grateful to have you come on
our show and talk with this. We have so much
respect for you the work you've done and continue to
do for the community. Um. I'm just gonna start it
(10:24):
right out. It's no secret that the Bay Area gets
more and more expensive every year. I know so many
people who have had to move to places like Stockton
or Lajo because they've been priced out of the city.
So my first question is about affordable housing in Oakland.
Where is it and how can we create more of it? Well? Um,
(10:46):
of course, affordable is a subjective term at all. It
all depends on what you mean by affordable. UM. And
in the lexicon, of the development housing development, Uh, affordable
me anything they feel like it, meaning so they can
pretend that they have affordable housing when they don't in
fact have affordable housing, meaning that's not affordable for the
(11:07):
average person. Black people particularly have been um a gentrified
out of Oakland. West Oakland was at one point when
the Black Panther Party was in existence and thriving, we
had probably around black in West Oakland. Um. We are
still the majority in West Oakland, but it's a very
slim majority, could be thirty percent something like this. And
(11:30):
in the overall city, I think black people represent something
like the city. So there is a race question as
well as a class question, as is true in all
cases with black people, because the convergence of racing class
exists in Black people and when it doesn't exist in
any other group. Um. So there is the question of
(11:51):
all of the bank foulldral, the Wells fargoes of racism
and banking, and you know in all of these things
that Obama bailed these banks out for having exploited poor
Black people and giving us these fake loans and then
we would have to pay them, and then we didn't
have we didn't have the ability to pay because we
never did, and so that happened and the houses were
taken over. So then that allowed for a whole new
(12:13):
mix of people to come in to Oakland, and particularly
in West Oakland. Um. And then there is just the
fact that the Bay Area is the most expensive place
to live in San Francisco, as I understand, it is
more expensive to live in than New York. Now the
idea is that, uh. And in the capitalist society that
we live in, it's all about what the market will bear.
(12:35):
In other words, if you can raise the prices you do,
you have no there's no fundamental moral principle driving any
marketplace in America as far as the Black Panther Party
was concerned. UM, housing should be free for everybody, or
available as free in case you can't pay. In other words,
your ability to be sheltered shouldn't depend on what do
(12:55):
you have any money, Just like food, if I can't eat,
I will die. Now, if I don't have money, I
can't get food in America. So that tells you that
my life is on the line every day. If I
can't don't have money, I can't get medical care. If
I don't have money, I can't get housing, so forth,
and so and so. These things are a reflection of
the whole situation. So what the market will bear is
(13:16):
what we're talking about. And the market has gotten because
of the tech workers that have come here, because of
a variety of changes, and because of racism, because the
tech workers aren't word at all about black people and
prout a matter of fact, they think they're doing us
a favor by living in our neighborhoods, uh and elevating
the neighborhoods. I've actually had people say that, well, you know,
we brought a kind of middle class, as if anybody
(13:39):
cared values, as if middle class people have a value,
like a moral value. So the bottom line is it's
extremely uh difficult to find affordable housing in Oakland. So
you can say it's afford You can call a housing
unit affordable at eight percent of media income. Matter of fact,
you can really call it affordable a per cent. And
(14:01):
why is it important to call it affordable Because you
can get money from the government, from cities and states
and the federal government hud to build affordable housing at
eight income. So what does that mean. It means that
if you're making a hundred thousand a year, so would
be counting you as eighty thousand, and then uh thirty
percent of your income would go for uh your rent,
(14:24):
So I can raise the rents to that and still
actually call it affordable. Now, what I'm doing in West Oakland,
it's seventh in Campbell, uh in Lower Bottoms, is that
I'm building um amazingly housing that will be actually actually affordable.
I will be for low and very low income people.
(14:44):
Some people probably end up paying something like two or
three hundred a month, and most of it will be
subsidized from HUD From this, from from that. We've hustled
for this stuff. I've hustled. This is however, to build
the seventy nine affordable units. Affordability doesn't mean you're building
cheap units. It's just you build the exact same thing.
You have the same requirements, the same environmental requirements, same
(15:07):
building requirements, but you're gonna build. I'm building very beautiful
place that will be energy efficient. Now that price right
now and here in one the project budget is seventy
million dollars for seventy nine units. Can you believe that? Now?
I basically I got that land by pushing, cajoling, intimidating,
(15:27):
screaming and acting a fool with the City of Ocean
and after a while it just they just said, okay,
you can have this. It was a vacant property, have
been left vacant and blighted for thirty some years that
we have to argue about it. There's a lot of
vacant property. Now people had iota of will. I'm talking
about so called radical, so called activists. They're going and
(15:47):
do what the occupied people did. And some of them
are still living in West Oakland because they just took
over a vacant house. Just go on and say, we're
going to fix up this vacant lot. Now, the problem
is not getting the land. Even though people are not
bold enough to go ahead and seize the land, they
just want to say that free to land, Okay, free
(16:08):
to let go and do it. Not doing anything, just
sitting around whining. But if you were to get a property,
then the question becomes, how do you build on it?
How do you get the money? Now you've got black
people who have a lot of money. Yeah, and nobody's
asking them to give up their multimillion dollar houses or
their multimillion dollar lifestyles. But you would think that, you know,
(16:34):
you would say, all right, let's pull our money together
and begin to build housing, because they have the money
to do it, and all they have, they can get
a lot of government money because there's a lot of
government money out there to give for for development. So
we we have to find a way to have the will.
But if we don't have the will, don't ask me
how you can fix something in a system that has
(16:54):
bent on keeping black people oppressed. Yeah, well, what are
the other ways that you think that we can off
sent the effects of gentrification? Until you get to nineteen
sixty four, nineteen sixty four, the Civil Rights Act. The
people have led from eighteen sixty nineteen sixty four to
(17:14):
get the vote, to get to sit at a lunch counter,
whatever little stuff we want, We did a little stuff. Now,
little teeny stuff we didn't shape. Let's just burn down America.
We could have said it, but we didn't. We fought
just to get by, just to get by, and we're
list and beaten down just for little things like oh,
(17:35):
can I vote? No, you can't vote. Eighteen nineteen sixty four.
You have the Civil Rights to Act allowing us to
use public facilities. Ain't that deep? I can now pee
in the same public toilet as a white person. One
hundred years to get there, one hundred years to get
the nineteen sixty five Civil Rights Voting Rights Act. After
(17:56):
bloody Sunday on Selma in some Alabama on the been
Fedis Bridge forced Lyndon Johnson as he was invading Vietnam
and killing the Vietnamese people, to go ahead and give
these negroes something. Let's give him the vote, as if
it really would matter what else changed, I don't know.
(18:18):
That's all We've had legislatively, legally any other way, black
people getting beaten up by the police. Long before we
heard about George Floyd and all these people that think they,
oh my god, I can't believe George Floyd. It was
so so here we are. So if we want to
talk about housing or anything else, really, then we have
(18:42):
to talk about either what I'm doing, something practical where
you can figure it out, sees the land, do some
day to day stuff, or understand there's a long struggle.
Two dismantle this capitalist racist system that is in place.
This system is a exactly so when we say systomach,
(19:02):
I'm not talking about some little thing. This is inculpated
into America and then there's a cultural norm that black
people are inferior. There's no undoing some little teenage like
this is some small thing and all we gotta do
is fix it. This is a reformist minded thinking, Well,
if I just keep the police uh a camera, video
(19:24):
camera on their shoulder, they won't kill us. Well, there's
a joke. I'll film it and kill you. Now, what's
your next point. Who's gonna stop me? You ain't. You
ain't gonna shoot nobody. You're gonna cry, You're gonna walk
around with your little picket signs Black Lives Matter? Whose
treets are streets? I saw them in Rochester the other
(19:44):
day and they actually use that Ferguson slogan, Who streets
are streets? Who are you kidding? These are not your streets.
You don't own anything. They let you bar strow and
have your little exercise, and it goes on and on
and on. But the real problem is we don't really
want this stuff, because if we did, we would do
(20:04):
what the Black Panther Party did, and that is dedicate
twenty four hours a day to this struggle. M I'm
glad you mentioned the Panthers. You you see something about
guns just now, and I think it's uh testament interesting.
I suppose that the Panthers affected gun reform in California
(20:26):
regarding I believe regarding shotguns. Is that correct? That was
not our at the time in California. In California, you
could carry a shotgun openly, in llegally, legally and openly.
So we protested the as soon as they saw some
black people with now all along you can see some
white people walking around with uh, you know, automatic weapons,
(20:48):
you know, so on and so on. Nobody was said
a word. But as soon as some black people got
ahold of some guns and simply said, we are going
to patrol our streets and we're going to make sure
that the law is fi If you arrest this man,
We're gonna be standing there and make sure. I got
a gun on one hand, and I got a law book.
Now tell us what he what code he's arrested under.
(21:09):
So that kind of changed the dynamic. Not in a
big way, I mean what we were going to fight
the whole Oakland Street Police Department, but it gave it
emboldened the people to see that you can't resist. So
the gun is necessary, not necessarily revolutionary, because the police
have guns, and they're not our friends, and they're not
(21:30):
trying to have a revolutionary and revoluntary change. So with
the gun, the question of the gun, we believe in
the right we believed and I believe in the right
to self defense. Um, if you try to come into
my home, I don't care who you are and kill me.
Brianna Taylor gets shot in her home in her bed. Now,
(21:54):
I'll give her her her fiancee credit for getting one
round off because at least he wasn't just sitting there
waiting for everybody to die. But I don't think you
know the city, We don't know what all the rest
of it was. But the bottom line is we're not
willing to stand up to that. So what the Black
Panthers guns were about was the show two things. One
that the gun can be revolutionarybody quoting Mao, as we did, uh,
(22:20):
it may be necessary to take up the gun in
order to get rid of the gun. Our goal would
have been to get rid of the gun. We're not
trying to have guns in the society. Who the health cares.
So when we marched in May of nineteen sixty seven
up to Sacramento with our guns, which were loaded, unlike
other people who displayed unloaded guns. Uh. It was called
the mall for that. And some guys said, look, we
(22:40):
just can't have uh these black people run around here
these shotguns. So let's have a law to uh say
that it's illegal to carry shotgun or any gun openly.
And this is the first and only time the n
r A supported gun before gun control. It's like it
was a gun control bill, remember that, and gun reformers
(23:00):
gun control bill that they specifically wrote to get rid
of us. So they said we couldn't carry a shotguns openly.
So we said, okay, so now we don't carry everything,
uh carry everything under the coat and where of element,
and we're not gonna stop using guns, but we use
those guns. Wanted to literally protect ourselves, but also to
(23:23):
show the people that, as Hughie Newton said, uh, you
know the pigs bleed to you know, say, hey, if
you get shot with a shotgun, you will have the
same reaction with your policeman or a personal you know,
a civilian. So we wanted to embold in the people
instead of doing what is happening now, all this whining
(23:44):
and crying, and that's what's happening right now. Oh black
Lives Man, and we don't paint Washington d C. Those
people trampled all over that and invaded the capital. Not
that I care. That's like, you know, the enemy fighting
the enemy, so whatever. Uh. That was the point. It
was educational point because we as a vanguard party thought
of ourselves as organizing and readying the people for revolution.
(24:10):
But the people would tell you were violent, so because
they believed it. That's what they do with anarchists groups.
They tell the public that they're violent, and then they
take away their power because people ostracizing. Well violent non
violent is you know, is irrelevant. I mean, the violence
of the founding of America can't be compared to anything
(24:30):
that we might do. We you know, these things are violent.
There are things being done to take your life. They're
done to take your life. Now. We used to quote
h the Great Russian anarchists by kun In, and our
quote wash that the revolutionary is a dumed man. So
(24:52):
the question of anarchism versus non anarchism, I don't have
any issue with that because I'm not looking for this
system to stay in place under any circumstances. I don't
really care how it gets taken down because it enemy
of my enemy is my friend. And that's the end
of that comment part. Well, Elaine, thank you so so much.
We appreciate every time you are with us, and this
(25:16):
was an amazing conversation. We learned a lot. Thank you
for sharing your wisdom. Yes, we appreciate you. Thank you
for inviting me. It's ten pm, another late evening on
the streets of West Oakland. Like so much of the area,
(25:37):
it's deceptive, appearing safe and deserted. The four of us,
Rebecca Owen, Poppins, and myself ride our bikes through a
maze of brand new modern condominiens bizarrely generic and soulness.
They're the apparent result of massive foreign investment. We could
have driven my car, since it's been repaired and repaint it,
(25:58):
but we be consisted we go on bikes. Perhaps I
should be more apprehensive. It's clear this group is a
lot more cunning and observant than they let on, Especially
this Poppin's character. I mean he literally orchestrated our entire
first encounter. What else is he capable of? Let's go
(26:18):
right on frontage, Watch over that poth hold up ahead.
Rebecca is a natural leader. Can't deny her that it's
obvious she's in her element in this role she's playing.
As I said, I learned a lot during my short
time with the FBI, But the fact that I've already
successfully penetrated this rag tag group of activists, arsonists, whatever
(26:41):
is pretty remarkable. Never mind the fact that it's because
Rebecca is convinced I'm some kind of double agent. I
understand her way of thinking. On the surface, my story
looks pretty shady to someone with her history. Truthfully, I
don't understand my own intention, Jans. Since I've been back
(27:02):
in Oakland, everything feels like a fog. Perhaps subconsciously, I've
been feeling like I need to be a part of
a group again, and then there's only one. I don't
even know what to make at him. He's slippery, imperceptible,
impossible to profile. How does it feel? How does what feel?
(27:29):
How does it feel to be on the other side
of the law. I don't know what you mean? You will?
We're here. This place is creepy, like horror film set creepy,
But I wouldn't expect an abandoned train station to be
any less dark, dank, and dirty. It's a very tall
(27:51):
barbed wire fence surrounding the perimeter, and I have a
feeling we won't be going through the front entrance. You'll
bring your back over here. I'll lock it up with
the others. Do you think they're safe? I mean I
don't see anyone else around you. We both know how
quickly that can change. I'll be fine. You can hardly
(28:12):
see them from the street, whatever you say, So how
do we get in here with these You're not serious
a wire cutter. If you know a better way, now,
I would be the time this year. I don't see
how you can snip a hole in a fence and
expect to get away with it. Look, I'll show you up.
(28:33):
Let me see those things. She's helpless. You know this
is just a teaching moment. MS you follow me. It's
actually very easy. We'll find a discreet spot like this
and sniff it just so. Then we remove this pio. Next,
(28:54):
open the edges so they hook back on the fence
and cover the hole. See good as new, and no
one will be able to tell, at least not tonight.
That's very clever. I didn't know you were such a
seasoned criminal. So are you're going to tell me what
we're doing here? An initiation assaults. But why this location?
(29:18):
I suppose it's because Rebecca has it in our mind
that you're still left b I personally, I don't think
that's true. There's no way you're still have fed or
wherever want to begin with? Oh really? And why is that?
For one, you're very reckless, and two I think you
seem maybe I shouldn't say tell me. I'm pretty sure
I can handle it. I mean, we've worked together for
(29:40):
over a week now, so I see things. You know,
you seem broken. Not that you're acting weird or crazy.
It's as if you're going through the motions of existing,
as if doing the bare minimum is exhausting, so you
just kind of tune out a ghost. Wow, you've really
(30:01):
given this some thought. Huh. Well, don't get me wrong.
You've gone through a lot recently, more than most. But
when I think it fits, they're like robots, stoic on emotion.
I think, then you don't know Beulah because she has
always been an icy bitch. It's what I like about
her and what makes me want to wring her neck.
(30:23):
There she goes read me like a book, I swear
Rebecca and I have more of a psychic connection than
me and my own twin sister. It's becoming very fucking annoying.
Maybe you'll get your chance. Judging by the looks of
this place, would be a great place to leave a body. Guys,
can we just do this already? Damn owen? Could you
have made the whole any smaller? Discretion is the key, Darling.
(30:45):
Upon closer inspection, the train station is even more ominous.
It's drenched in graffiti and surrounded by dead plants, clandestine
club meetings in a rickety old building. It's almost cliche
this way. Make sure you're turn your flashlights one. This
(31:08):
is insane. It's almost worth risking jail to see over
Here is where we have everything set up. Play it
turns pillows. You thought of everything? What are you doing?
Is this some kind of trade course not? It's your initiation.
I don't understand. You can drop the act now, sweetheart,
owing some help? Please? Hello, You can't just stand there
(31:31):
on a little point of gun at me. And now
you didn't think we were coming here to play monopoly.
You made your point. You want to protect your little
secret society. Go ahead. You're the one who invited me
because it was just a matter of time before you
weaseled your way in because that's what you do. But first,
for the last time, I'm not FBI. I am not
(31:53):
an informant, I am not investigating you, and I am
not trying to sabotage whatever you're involved in. If you're
not an agent, then why are you here. If your
intent isn't to infiltrate and stir up ship and report
back to your master's, then why did your type a
ass agree to come here tonight. We're supposed to believe
that you're compelled to be a social justice warrior after
years of apathy. It's a fair question. Just be honest, Savannah.
(32:19):
Is why I'm here. The fact that this part of
her life meant so much to her and I had
no idea. It makes me feel like I never really
knew her at all, and that's my fault. I should
have been there for her before she went looking for
family or acceptance or whatever it is you guys offered her.
(32:40):
So you asked me, what do I want? I want answers.
I want to know why my sister is lying in
a bed comatose. You still don't get it. There's nothing
to tell what happened to Savannah is on Savannah, Rebecca,
hold on, she should not. The whole truth won't make
a difference. She should still not. This is stupid. Don't
over her bullshit. She's not even a good liar. Check
(33:01):
out dude. All right, sit down, I guess his story. Time.
You remember Terence Peters. It doesn't ring a bell. Yeah,
it probably wouldn't. He was only fifteen when he was
murdered by a cop six months ago. That's terrible. And
(33:22):
what did he do? See? That's the problem. You automatically
assume he was doing something that justified on the spot execution.
I was just asking for context. He was homeless and
he's been stealing ship from the local stores, food mostly.
The cops stopped him with bags of chips under his jacket.
I'm sure you can guess how the story ends. They
(33:44):
assumed he was armed and acted in self defense. This
was right across the street from Resist. Savannah and I
were there when it happened, hearing the shots and going
outside seeing his body sprawled out on the seamen m.
The memory is ' grained in my mind even more
(34:08):
than the blood. I remember clearly. All of those chips
blown the bits and scattered everywhere. Holy shit, Savannah never
told me about that. It affected all of us deeply,
(34:29):
a kind of um collective PTSD. But Savannah took it
the hardest anyway. The asshole who killed Terence got away
with it, of course, but that was the final strong
for us. What did you do? I'm getting there? Are
(34:54):
you where? The double a CP stage several incidents and
confrontations during the Civil rights movement. The idea was to
bring injustices to light by having upstanding citizens engaged and
planned acts of defiance. That way, the public wouldn't be
able to simply look the other way and dismiss the
horror of Jim curl Loss. So we came up with
the plan of our own. Savannah was supposed to be
(35:16):
the perfect victim, an attractive black woman with a clean record,
good family and a twin sister and the motherfucking FBI.
Why Savannah, why not you? You openly advocate for destruction
of government. Do you really think there's any love loss
for anarchist in this country? Anyway? Savannah insisted that it'd
be heard. It was a long shot, but we came
up with a pretty good plan for her to encounter
(35:37):
the same officer who shot Terence. I think we decided
on her car breakdown or something. Didn't we on thanks,
I can't remember. We had quite a lot of brands
to him in that week. The trickiest part was ensuring
the same court will be the one to respond to
the emergency calls. You made my sister into a martyr,
and for what we didn't do anything. At the last minute,
(36:00):
it owen and I realized that we could actually end
up undermining the cause we were championing. We didn't need
a lie because cops commit enough crimes on their own,
particularly the cop we were targeting, So we called it off,
but Savannah still wanted to do it. She went rogue
and tried to go through with confronting him on her own.
So it's true, Savannah is practically dead because of you.
(36:22):
Hey wait, wait, wait wait, what was that something? Do
you guys here that we're over here? What are you doing?
Didn't I say this was an initiation? That's what's happening.
Whoever you are, you're trespassing. Backup is on the way.
I suggest you stay right where you are. Great, we're
waiting shape the gun hold them to dispute up. No, wait,
(36:47):
hurry and take it. It's a call that's coming. What
just put it in your back pocket. If you don't,
I'll point it and we know how that will turn out.
Fuck you Owen, you're just the baddest Rebecca. If to me,
this thing really is loaded. I want all of your
(37:08):
hands up right now. So you got my text message
that's afraid you aren't coming. I don't know you. I said,
hands up, they're up. Aren't you gonna ask why I
told you to meet me here tonight? Now? I want
all of you to slowly pull out your identification cards. Hello,
you're not even gonna guess? Stop talking now, Okay? Office?
(37:35):
Just Scott Corey, who lives at one Hastings I have
and Alameda? How the fund do you know that? Chees man?
Do you listen? I'm the one who texted you. You
were summoned by me. This is all by my design.
I don't understand what you're not kidder. My friend is
having a hard time with her personal life. I know
we shouldn't be here, but we're we're just messing around.
(37:59):
I was a train any at Quantico and my father
was good friends with Chief man in at the O
p D for many years. I'm sure he can vouch
for us. You're really like that boolean. Yeah, I asked
you a question, and come on, let's cooperate and let
this end peaceful, peaceful. He killed Terence. Here's the reason
(38:21):
your sister is in a coma. Unfortunately, that's all been
dean legalized murder. But you've been up to no good
on the downlow, haven't you, Scott Bulah. This guy is
a literal white supremacist. We put it all together. Not
only is he a murder of black people, he's been
bringing little black girls to a cat house. Officer Scott
Corey is scum and he's here so he can be
(38:42):
held accountable enough. You're all under arrest. If you use
the thing in your pocket, we can end this tonight.
Justice can be served. The law dictates justice. So decide
right now if you are on the side of the
law or on the side of justice. I'm not her,
I'm not like Savannah. Come in you first, turn around,
get offer you greasy piece of ship, do something you
(39:06):
actually gone It will be Hollwood against taste. What about
a camera? It's not on because he's a bad guy.
You all are fucking nuts all of you. I am
not part of this, and I don't want to be. Well,
it's too late, baby, because you're in it. Knee deep officer, Officer.
I have a gun. It's in my back pocket. I'll
keep my hands up and you can take it. Hands up.
(39:29):
Don't you move. Don't you fucking move. My hands are up,
My hands are up. I'm being completely compliant. Your compliance
is the problem. If you won't do it, then I will. Hey, Handsome,
put it down. No, I don't think I will yet.
(39:58):
Episode gourmette TOAs and The Intimate Evening. H Yeah, uh
Will Packer, I was gonna Producer James Lopez, I was
that count a producer behind Look here, Jack Leavy, executive
producer and director, Let's Go Deminique, New Time Yeah Now,
(40:24):
creator and writer, producer, Leave your baby, you need Hello? Hello,
Whitney Fuller, Creative executive Michael keith Berg, co producer, Drell
Alexis recording mixer, Sounds Ros Davis, Audio Consultan, Music supervisor
(40:47):
Jeff Forston, music by Jeff Jeff what Up Boy, Joe Wolf,
Tony Homer, score mangers, Paye Ramsay Production assistant Junior Rohne
Production System. You didn't main cats, Now you did? I Yeah,
(41:11):
and the Alonza plays Blue Lave, Elaine Brown playing as
Elaine Brown, Jordan Dick playing his poets. Miguel Perez offered
the Scott Card, Paul Butcher as time come on, Robbie Jarvis,
(41:34):
Owen at Wards, Ran Destiny plays Rebecca. You didn't, Yeah,
seek Olton additional voices. You didn't shuts out, So it's
mission Tom Venez baby and I for Real sound by
(42:00):
podcast Stage. Yeah, this has been a world pack of
media production. I heart production and I am that boys
you down. The one is only no phoney, am back
without the Roman. Let's go. That's an additional voice. Yeah,
(42:22):
one and only. Let's go. Lord,
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