Steven Rinella talks with the two American hunters, Ryan Watson and Bryan Hagerich, currently detained on the Caribbean island nation of the Turks and Caicos. They face potential 12-year prison sentences for having accidentally left hunting ammunition rounds in the tourist luggage they brought with them on vacation to the island.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,
bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listeningcast.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
You can't predict anything.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
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dot com. F I R S T L I T
E dot com. Okay, I'm on with Ryan Watson and
(00:42):
Brian Hagrich who are in the Caribbean island nation of
Turks and Caicos, which is a British territory. You guys
are currently out on bail and facing with the potential
of a twelve year prison sentence for having been found
(01:10):
to have some hunting ammunition in your respective duffel bags
with no gun with them while on vacation with your families.
And prior to this you two did not know each other.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
No, no, not until what nine days ago? Around?
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Yeah, nine days ago?
Speaker 1 (01:33):
How in the you guys can decide however you want
to start? Who wants to start? I guess whoever had
this happen to him first? Like, how in the hell
does this happen?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Well, that that would be me. So my family and
I we came on vacation here February eighth. My wife,
two kids, they were ages three and five at the time,
came down here. It's a place we've traveled to for years.
This was our fourth trip and we had a great time.
(02:05):
I mean, this was a great time for our kids.
A lot of great stuff, great memories, and then it
all kind of went to hell when we came home.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I'll saying, and this is this is on the way home, the.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Way home, not on the way here, on the way home.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
So you left, you depart when you can't left for
your vacation. Where did you leave from?
Speaker 3 (02:29):
We flew up Pittsburgh.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
And uh obviously went through the TSA process in Pittsburgh.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Y Yeah, yeah, yes he did. I did. Yes.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Okay, So you checked a bag, you checked a Duffel
bag from home, correct, not carried down but checked correct,
got into the country, went through customs on the way in.
Just Turks and Caicos.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
That's the interesting part. That's yeah, they need not scan
your bags upon entry into this country. Okay, the only
country I've ever personally traveled to you that does not do.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
That, but they scanned your bags on exit. Correct, So
what happens then? Like you your vacation wraps up and
you go to the airport and everything seems to be
going fine. Then all of a sudden, it's not like
how does this play out?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Yeah, we're about to hop on a flight, probably I
don't know, half hour from boarding, and I hear my
name paged overhead to come to the ticket counter and
my wife stayed with our two kids. I walk up
to the ticket counter and at first they weren't sure
if you know what it was about or anything. This
is just hang tight for a minute, and then they said, oh,
(03:48):
you've been selected for a random bag check, which, okay,
that's fine, we've all been there at some point. Sent
me over to a different area of the airport and
walk in. There are two individuals there and this they
had been selected for in a bag check. Do you
consent to this? Is this your bag? And I said,
yes it is, and absolutely I consent. So I don't
(04:12):
know exactly how long it was that went by, but
it seemed like a very long time. And their search
and they're pulling out my kid's puddle jumper, their floating sunscreen,
just everything imaginable and they're looking and they're looking. And
then after I would have to guess it was probably
eight nine minutes, they pull up ammunition and the guy
(04:38):
had the biggest smile on his face. It was like
he just won the lottery and just looked at it
and he said, is this yours? And it did a
double take and it quickly became recognizable to me that, yeah,
this is my ammunition I had back home, purchased legally
in the US.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
What was the animal six or five PRC.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
And from there then it just seemed like there was
a whole swarm of people that kind of ensued. People
were on the phone, and I was just lost. I said,
you know, I figured, okay, you know that's you can
take the ammunition. You know, deal with what we need
to deal with. And I fully expected at that point
to still board the flight with my family. And as
(05:26):
time went on it went on, it became more and
more apparent that that probably wasn't going to happen. And
then two police officers arrived and they were all but
ready to take me off too, I presume the police
station or investigation And I said, wait, guys like I have.
(05:51):
You know, my wife and my two kids are about
to hop on a plane. You know, they need to
know what's going on here, and they did not in
the worst kind of way. Even when to let them
know what was happening anything, I had to literally plead
with them to Finally where they went and got my wife.
(06:12):
They brought her and my children over, brought us into
a small room, wouldn't let the kids in, made them
stand outside, and gave us, I don't know, a minute
or two together where I gave her the key to
the car, a few other things, and off they went.
(06:33):
At that point, I still, you know, said hey, you know,
I'll hop on the next flight. I'll see you at
home tomorrow and we'll be in touch. And as things
progressed over, you know, they escorted me to the police car,
different things that became apparent that I was not seeing
them tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Man, I got I got a million questions. Well, let's
let's hear the other story from up top, and then
we'll come back in with a couple follow up questions.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
I'm Rian Watson from Oklahoma. Two buddies of mine, we
were all turning forty within a few weeks of each other.
Our wives had gotten together and thought, man, let's plan
a fortieth birthday forum. We started kicking around a bunch
of different destinations, and the other two couples wanted to
come to Turks and Caicos. My wife and I did not,
(07:27):
which is kind of the salt in this whole thing.
But yeah, so we we agreed. We're like, all right,
let's go, we'll go. We come here April seventh and
with two other couples, have a great time, are leaving
to go home in April twelfth. I have a rolling
(07:48):
Duffel bag that I use, like on the weekends and such.
We grabbed it the very last second when we left
for the airport from Oklahoma City, just because my wife's
bag felt a little heavy and she was like, we
might need a place to throw extra stuff. It's like,
all right, cool, I'll grab that bag, opened it up,
looked inside, gave a little shake. Nothing, So we started
(08:09):
loading it up. Off we go. But anyways, we're on
our way home. We are. It's a madhouse at the
airport because a flight had been canceled. We had hired
this skypass company that basically like fast traction through security,
so we were cutting through. Some families are pissed that
(08:31):
we're cutting through this security line, and so there's like
a whole game of like where there's shuffling bins and such.
And you know, I'm a pretty passive guy at first glance,
and so I'm like, all right, whatever, like with my
wife and I get separated. I ended up going through first.
I walked through nothing and like, no issue. I walk
(08:53):
into the duty free shop and there's a glass wall
and I looked through and I see my wife standing
there waiting on the bag. And so I walked back
and I'm like, what do you wait on? Babcon cheese? Like, oh,
your duffel bag still, like it's getting inspected, okay. So
we had on the way back, we had taken her
makeup bag and such out of her out of her
luggage to make room for a bottle of wine, and
(09:16):
so I threw that in my duffel bag. They are
starting to rip through all that stuff, and I'm thinking, oh,
it's she's got liquid in there, Like that's not a
big deal. Like, and you know, my buddy's are ribbing me.
They're like, oh what you got in there? And we're
all laughing. I'm sure at some point. I don't know
if the security camera would be like it is, like
we're laughing and ribbing and still having a good time,
(09:39):
and they're I mean, they're searching like crazy through this bag,
really looking for They take everything out, run everything through it,
and then they run the bag through another time or two,
and I mean they're searching like crazy, and damn near
just assemble the bag. Next thing, you know, the customs
agent like pulls out like a bag they head. My
(10:02):
wife initially thought it was like the little locks that
they sometimes conclude whenever you buy luggage, and she was like,
was that the little locks? I was like, I don't know,
and then she turned back around. She held it up
after they'd like gone and like taken photos with it,
which was kind of strange because it seemed like they
were like taking selfies with it. But they turn around
they show it to me and I was like, shit,
(10:23):
like I realize exactly what that is, you know, like
that's the Ammo that I buy reloaded Ammo this place
in Oklahoma City, and I was like, that's a little
baggie of sixty five preed more than I buy, like
when I go hunting and like I'm like, oh shit.
The lady walks over and I'm like, hey, I'm so sorry,
Like I don't need it. It's only like a couple
(10:44):
of rounds. It looks like in there. I was like,
you can just toss it. We'll be on our way.
She's like no, she said, well here, you got to
talk to the police officer before you go. And I'm like,
all right, cool guy. The customs guy walks by and
he's like it happens all the time. Are our laws
just say that you have to talk to a police
officer And he's like, you American hunters do this all
the time. I'm all right, whatever, Like nothing seems like.
(11:09):
I'm thinking I'm gonna get like a verbal reprimand we
wait there forever. Twenty minutes pass by. Finally guy walks
over and playing clothes and he's like, hey, let me
like he starts shuffling through my bag. He said, let
me see your passport. He looks at it and he's like, hey,
I just want you to know you're not going to
make that flight, and he like hands it back to
me like the way he did it. I was like,
(11:29):
this guy's trying to be tough, you know, he's trying
to be intimidating, and I was like okay. So I
was like, hey, I'm sorry, we'll probably gonna have to
catch the next flight. We walk outside because both my
wife and I. Next thing, you know, unmarked carr walks
like pulls up. They jump out, They put us in
the car. We don't fully understand what's going on. They
(11:52):
take us to a kind of an unmarked building where
they take us in a room and tearorgate us and
and I'm you know, I'm still not like fully comprehending.
I'm like, all right, I'm about to pay a fine,
you know, Like this is.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
You know, when they're interrogating you, what is the line
of questioning.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Do you are you licensed to carry such AMMO? And
I'm like where I'm from, you don't have to have
a license to have AMMO. Like I was like, I
don't understand what you're talking about, Like there's not a
firearm associated with that AMMO. And they're like are you
a hunter? And I'm like yes, and can you prove it?
And I'm like, I guess I got a bunch of
gripping grins that I can show you. Like and so
(12:34):
I'm like pulling out my phone and they're i mean
asking a litany of questions. It was a you know,
and I was like, hey, I was like, can we
call my parents to let them know that we're going
to be late because they're watching our kids. And they
were like, you don't get it, like you're both going
to be arrested and you're both going to jail or
(12:56):
going to prison for twelve years. And at which point
my wife was like, I mean pleaded, like we have children,
and she broke down, and I mean I quickly broke
down as well, because I was like, it was very
apparent at that point that they weren't joking anymore. At first,
I thought it was an intimidation tactic.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Yeah yeah, and they're.
Speaker 3 (13:18):
Like, no, you're gonna be taken to jail tonight. And
the thing that got me I never said this yet,
but my wife asked, am I going to be cold?
And as a husband who's always considered myself a protector,
(13:39):
I was like, I'm not letting this happen. Like I
was like, she's not going in that damn jail. And
so I started pushing back. I'm like, look, there's got
to be another way, Like like what like, you're not
serious that you're gonna take us both to jail with
kids at home. Finally they came back there like we're
going to offer you a police bail, but you need
to find a surety. And I'm like, I've never been
(14:01):
I've never been arrested in my life. I don't know
what that is. Like. You need to find a Turk Islander,
like a local native that's willing to put up an
asset equivalent to your bail.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
I'm like, I don't want to bail.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Is and he's like, it'll be about ten thousand bucks.
And I'm like, so I need to find a local
that'll put up ten thousand bucks for me. And I
was like, I've been here on a five day vacation
and I'm like texting my friend. I stuck my phone
in and so I was texting my buddies that we
were traveling with, and they're like, oh, we're going to
text Reuben, our driver. So the guy that had we'd
(14:35):
hired to drive us around the whole week, bless his
little heart, man, he shows up. He puts the title
to his car up as sure A kidding me no,
And so that my wife and I can be out
on bail throughout the weekend and kind of get our
feet underneath us and figure out what we had to
rental hotel room last second, call my parents. I'm like,
(14:59):
this is like serious. So they fly down that sun
That was Friday. They fly down that Sunday. That Monday,
we're supposed to go back in give a recorded interview
where I say, my bag, it's the bag that I
travel with. Those are the bullets that I use for hunting.
No idea how they ended up there, but so we
do that mm hmm, and they come out they're not
(15:24):
they're just not decided on whether whether or not they're
going to charge both my wife Valerie or not. And
so they tell my attorney they're like, proba, we just
don't know. We haven't made up her mind yet. We're
going to keep them remanded to the Islands on bail.
They have to post it again. So we had the
driver come back put the title of his car up again,
and they kept us there for another for another week. Essentially,
(15:48):
I went back this past Monday. They charged me. They
dropped the charges of my wife. She got her passport
and I told her it's like immediately go get on
a plane and get off this island. I went to jail.
I had kind of no idea what was going on
in the outside world. I was so here, you have
(16:12):
to go to Supreme Court in order to get bail
under the ammunitions or fire firearms charge. So it took
us a while to get the Supreme Court. So I
was there on Wednesday where they late Wednesday afternoon they
finally approved my bail. Sure how to get surity again,
which we knew our attorney kind of warned us. We
(16:34):
put the feelers out and a guy put up the
title of his restaurant. God I had never met before.
I went and met him, had a beer with him,
and I was like, I'm in a bad situation, dude,
and he was like, I've heard you're a good person
with a really good heart. Like I'm willing to, you know,
take a chance and just you know, put this up
(16:54):
for you. And I was like, man, I don't know
how to thank you, like and so he put his
already for me. And I got out on bail on Wednesday,
and you know, here we are. It's been wild.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
What is their attitude about the fact that you're trying,
that you're on your way out. So presumably if you
were importing ammunition, you'd be looking for it on the
way in, but you're you're leaving with it. Does that
enter the conversation at all? Or is that for a
later date when you have a trial.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I mean, it's our conversation here, we we.
Speaker 3 (17:42):
I mean, you can't not but just sit there and
rack your brain. I mean I've had I had had
conversations with police officers while I was being transported, you know,
in the back of the car, shackled, and they're like,
you know, we don't agree with this, right, And I'm like,
hard to see it from my end, you know, And
they're like and I'm like, look, I was like, charge
me the like set a record for the fine that
(18:04):
you charge somebody. I was like, I'll pay for the
X rays sat on the way in so that you
can actually thwart the gun crime that you're trying to
like get rid of, Like I'll pay for it, like
trust me, Like I'm good for it. But doing this
like arresting two dads that hunt on the weekends, like
(18:25):
it does nothing for your crime. And so yeah, I
mean and they, you know, the police officers, you know,
off the record, and are like, yeah, we can agree more, but.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
And what is this have you heard from the State Department,
the US State Department about like, uh, are they taking
a position on this or are they are they trying
to negotiate on your behalf or making any demands that
that these two people who are obviously innocent of any
kind of attempted gun crime are being harassed with this
(19:01):
potential twelve year prison sentence. This isn't on their radar
in some ways.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
There's actually a third noil too, so we're just we're
not too I heard about that potentially a fourth we're
not sure of yet.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
When I was being interrogated, they brought in a mid
to late twenties presumably. I thought she was an American girl.
I've since reached out to the embassy a number of
times because I'm concerned about her, because this is hell right,
and I mean, the fact that we've been able to
link up and kind of support each other is great,
(19:37):
and I'm like, I want to help the girl out
if I can. I don't know where she is. I
pressed the State Press the embassy. I got a call
back that they're doing an investigation. They do admit that
they took a young female into custody, but they think
(19:58):
that she might not be of American descent.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
Well, an article just came out about another I just
remember it was a male who also had learning ammunition.
So so the state So the State Department is not
making you any they're not making you any promises. I mean,
it just seems to me that it just seems ridiculous
that this could be going on for this long.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
I've been here for almost eighty days. I mean, if
that's any indication.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
And what what are your conversations with the with the
US government.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
So the State Department, We've not engaged directly with them.
It's been predominantly through Senator Wayne Line for well, Mark
Wayne Mark, Mark Wayne mall and I'm sorry. And the
US Embassy in Nassau.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
Yeah, Mark wwyn Willins from from Oklahoma has been on it.
Literally he was informed while my wife and I were
still being interrogated because his his niece and nephew go
to the school. My wife teaches a little Christian school there.
I say, his niece and nephew go to that school,
(21:04):
and my wife had texted her principal and so Mark
Wayne Mullins was already in touch with the embassy before
we were ever out of the investigation. So he's been
on it from the jump and has been just an
absolute bulldog about it. I've got all the faith in
the world and him, I just think that you know,
(21:28):
he's you know, these things take time, and so hit
him and Governor Stead, Senator Langford as well from Oklahoma.
You know, they've both absolutely taken Brian under their wing
and just given him, I mean, Mark Waynemullins.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
Text he called me, texted me. I mean, I can't
tell you how many times at this point and what state?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
What state are you from, Brian, Pennsylvania? Okay? And you've
been in church with elected officials in Pennsylvania.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
I have for quite some time. Yes, nothing Unfortunately, nothing
has happened until Ryde here was arrested as well. And
still from from my perspective, at a senator, at a
governor level, there's been no contact whatsoever. But you're getting it.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
You're getting you're getting it from Oklahoma now, though.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
I certainly am. It's been phenomenal.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Man. I That's what blows my mind here, man is uh.
I mean, I have like an automatic sympathy for you
as just like a couple of hunters, and and I
go hunting, I travel with my family. I'm always hounding
on my thirteen year old, fourteen year old boy to
you know, be careful about straight twenty two shells. When
(22:44):
this first came out, my first caught wind of this
before I even knew how he's speaking to you. I
sent him an article about this, saying, this is why
I'm always on your case about having a twenty two
shell in your pocket. Right, but to me, to have
it be that you have no way to fire these rounds.
(23:05):
This is not ammunition for a gun that would be
even remotely available.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
You are.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Leaving with it, not bringing it in. You are dealing
in like these are very small quantities of ammo. You're
not a drug runner, You're headed home. It's ridiculous, yeah,
that you could be going through this, And it also
seems to me a little bit ridiculous that we're not
(23:35):
able to exert more that are, you know, not that
they're not doing it, but I would just imagine that
there would be a full court press on the on
behalf of the US government about having a couple of
our citizens wrongfully detained over something that's just so obviously ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Yeah. I think it's interesting too, because the charge is
actually possession of ammunition and had nothing to do with
the fact that we were in here. It's just possession.
And so in the United States, possessing ammunition is all right, right,
and so it is. It's just strange, you know, there's
(24:19):
it just seems like there's such a more sensible way
to deal with this, you know, any other country. It's
a fine, any other sovereign country to our knowledge, and all.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
These these islands, all these scribbing islands that it's dealt
with in a much different way.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
Well, listen, man, intent matters. I mean, of course, of course,
I'm sure you learned your lesson. Of course it shouldn't
have happened. Of course, there's there's some blame that you
got to feel on your own end for I mean,
you screwed up. But like intent matters, there's there's clearly
obviously no intent. There's no intent to like be importing,
distributing anything ammunition. I understand the charge is possession, but
(24:58):
but it's uh, you know, like I said, man, I'll
say it for the fourth time. Intent matters, and there's
no intent to do anything wrong here. It just it
really feels to me like a I mean one, it's
a real warning to other hunters and listen, man, I'll
come out and say, this could happen to anybody. It
(25:20):
happened to me. It happened to me in the Anchorage
airport where I was walking on and we had been
Ptarmigan hunting and I had a couple game twelve gauge
game loads in a backpack. Right, it can happen to anyone.
It's happened to many, and many of my friends. With
the fact that it could land you in a situation
like this, with the with the stress of this potential
(25:42):
long term prison sentence, I mean, I feel horrible for
you guys.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
Man, it's I mean for me, it's not a nightmare
that is just you don't wake up from it's every
single day you think, Okay, I'll wake up and I'll
be at home.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
And here I am so far as you guys know,
what what is the next step you have a you
have a A is it does it go to a
jury trial? Like like when when do you next interact
with the authorities?
Speaker 2 (26:09):
So I'm I'm next up to bats. I have my
hearing on Friday, May of the third. So we're only
a few days away from that. And essentially, you know,
my hearing paves the way for for Ryan, for Tyler,
and anybody else that's you know, either here now that
we don't know about or others in the future. There
(26:33):
was a Supreme Court ruling that came out in February
this year that I won't say it didn't change the laws,
but it did clarified in their mind what, you know,
how this can be dealt with, And essentially it's it's
a mine and it's a mandatory jail sentence.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
Mandatory mandatory.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yes, now they can handle that in a number of
different ways. The first key component is they have to
find what they consider exceptional circumstances, and that entails three
different factors. One, it's your prior history. Two was their intent,
and then the third factor is, you know, does the
(27:19):
whatever the repercussions are, does it deter others from committing
a similar same crime. So that's the first hurdle. Then
the second hurdle is the jail time, and that's the
I'll say, essentially the wild card. Because in the past,
I think there were five last year, five cases last year.
There are now four this year that, you know, the
(27:43):
five from last year, they did find exceptional circumstances. But
the last individual, unfortunately, he was sentenced eight months in.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Prison here and what had that the person that did
eight months in prison? What had he done?
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Again? Similar but you know, slightly different. His was I
believe nine millimeter ammunition. I'm not sure what type of
bag it was. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
I think it was a magazine. I think it was
a loaded magazine.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Yeah, but no, but no pistol.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
No, no firearm.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Now, there have been two other cases where there were
firearms prior to him, and essentially the individuals, I appears
they were misled by either the airlines whomever they spoke
with that they were allowed to bring them here, but
upon exiting again were found with handguns and ammunition and
(28:38):
they both were able to They stayed here for quite
a while again, but they paid a fine and went home.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
And I understand you guys have I don't know if
it's one or two. You guys have a GoFundMe site
set up for for folks who feel inclined to help
you out. Is that true?
Speaker 3 (28:56):
Yeah, my sister set one up for us. That was
done while I was in jail, and so I have
no idea, to be honest with you, I've I've never
even clicked on the link. I've some people have shared
it with me, like somebody saying, oh my gosh, Donald
Trump Junior shared your I'm uncomfortable with it. Man, as
somebody that's a provider for you're you know, that's always
(29:20):
considered myself as a provider for my family, and I
wanted to help take care of others. To be in
a situation where you feel like you may need help,
is it's emasculating in a way, like it's just it's
hard to it's hard. It's something that's hard to wear.
I don't know how. I don't know how to explain it.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
I'm understood, understood.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
And completely grateful for everybody. And don't get me wrong,
this is this to very easily financially, like just ankrupt anybody.
And we were, you know, high on the hog. I mean,
we we work hard and you know we do you know, okay,
but like we're not. We weren't equipped to handle this,
(30:03):
you know. I mean, it's damn expensive. And so my
sister she put that together. You know, my wife and
I are both huge in our faith, and we want
to be servants of the Lord, and so we've committed that, like, hey,
we're going to use this to help our situation, but
we want to help others as well. And so you know,
(30:25):
we're going to see what we can do to help
Tyler get bail. He's the one that's still in Grand
Turk prison. We want to help Brian and his family
as best we can. I mean, I don't want to
dissuade anybody from doing their own or whatever, and fully
encourage people to go do that, but I also want
people to know that we're not I mean, I just
(30:48):
want to be home, like with your kids, Like I don't.
I'd give it all right now, I promise. I don't
know what's in there, but I checked to whoever for
it so that we all three can go home. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
Man, I'd like to see you guys come home, Like
I said, it just it really, uh man. I got
empathy for you, but also just an awareness of how
something like this could happen to anyone. And uh Ryan Watson,
Brian Hagrich. I'm gonna let you guys go, but man,
we're all gonna be watching.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Uh A promise on air. I will be recorded.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
This goes for both of us.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
By the way, if we get locked up for twelve years,
you have to take our boys hunting.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
On promise right now.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
I'm gonna send you a picture of my boy from
this this past winter, the first time shooting just be
begun the weekend before.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I saw I saw one of you guys had I
saw one of you guys had a boy that got
a couple of turkeys this spring.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Certain that was the weekend before we came here.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Yeah, well, if it comes down to that, don't worry.
I'll uh, I will personally take them all out hunting.
I'll find some people to take them out hunting as well.
And let's hope it doesn't come to that. And also,
listeners out there, man, this could happen to anybody. If
you guys live in Pennsylvania or Oklahoma, you want to
call your elected officials and try to lean on them
(32:10):
a little bit to help get these guys back home
for something that you know, it's just not something that
someone should be suffering through, for a case of just
an honest mistake made in the wrong place. All right, guys,
best of luck. We're gonna keep following up. Jordan Sillers
has a piece up on the meeater dot com about
you guys. I'm sure he'll continue to track the story.
(32:33):
And man, I just want to wish you guys the
best best of luck. There's anything we can do, let
us know. And uh, like I said, the minute I
saw that story, I just got a sink and feeling
because how like I said, it could happen to anybody.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
Yes, sir, Yeah, appreciate the time you guys.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Take care you tooks, best luck,
This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,
bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listeningcast.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
You can't predict anything.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
The Meat Eater Podcast is brought to you by First Light.
Whether you're checking trail cams, hanging deer stands, or scouting
for el, First Light has performance apparel to support every
hunter in every environment. Check it out at first light
dot com. F I R S T L I T
E dot com. Okay, I'm on with Ryan Watson and
(00:42):
Brian Hagrich who are in the Caribbean island nation of
Turks and Caicos, which is a British territory. You guys
are currently out on bail and facing with the potential
of a twelve year prison sentence for having been found
(01:10):
to have some hunting ammunition in your respective duffel bags
with no gun with them while on vacation with your families.
And prior to this you two did not know each other.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
No, no, not until what nine days ago? Around?
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Yeah, nine days ago?
Speaker 1 (01:33):
How in the you guys can decide however you want
to start? Who wants to start? I guess whoever had
this happen to him first? Like, how in the hell
does this happen?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Well, that that would be me. So my family and
I we came on vacation here February eighth. My wife,
two kids, they were ages three and five at the time,
came down here. It's a place we've traveled to for years.
This was our fourth trip and we had a great time.
(02:05):
I mean, this was a great time for our kids.
A lot of great stuff, great memories, and then it
all kind of went to hell when we came home.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I'll saying, and this is this is on the way home, the.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Way home, not on the way here, on the way home.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
So you left, you depart when you can't left for
your vacation. Where did you leave from?
Speaker 3 (02:29):
We flew up Pittsburgh.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
And uh obviously went through the TSA process in Pittsburgh.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Y Yeah, yeah, yes he did. I did. Yes.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Okay, So you checked a bag, you checked a Duffel
bag from home, correct, not carried down but checked correct,
got into the country, went through customs on the way in.
Just Turks and Caicos.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
That's the interesting part. That's yeah, they need not scan
your bags upon entry into this country. Okay, the only
country I've ever personally traveled to you that does not do.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
That, but they scanned your bags on exit. Correct, So
what happens then? Like you your vacation wraps up and
you go to the airport and everything seems to be
going fine. Then all of a sudden, it's not like
how does this play out?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Yeah, we're about to hop on a flight, probably I
don't know, half hour from boarding, and I hear my
name paged overhead to come to the ticket counter and
my wife stayed with our two kids. I walk up
to the ticket counter and at first they weren't sure
if you know what it was about or anything. This
is just hang tight for a minute, and then they said, oh,
(03:48):
you've been selected for a random bag check, which, okay,
that's fine, we've all been there at some point. Sent
me over to a different area of the airport and
walk in. There are two individuals there and this they
had been selected for in a bag check. Do you
consent to this? Is this your bag? And I said,
yes it is, and absolutely I consent. So I don't
(04:12):
know exactly how long it was that went by, but
it seemed like a very long time. And their search
and they're pulling out my kid's puddle jumper, their floating sunscreen,
just everything imaginable and they're looking and they're looking. And
then after I would have to guess it was probably
eight nine minutes, they pull up ammunition and the guy
(04:38):
had the biggest smile on his face. It was like
he just won the lottery and just looked at it
and he said, is this yours? And it did a
double take and it quickly became recognizable to me that, yeah,
this is my ammunition I had back home, purchased legally
in the US.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
What was the animal six or five PRC.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
And from there then it just seemed like there was
a whole swarm of people that kind of ensued. People
were on the phone, and I was just lost. I said,
you know, I figured, okay, you know that's you can
take the ammunition. You know, deal with what we need
to deal with. And I fully expected at that point
to still board the flight with my family. And as
(05:26):
time went on it went on, it became more and
more apparent that that probably wasn't going to happen. And
then two police officers arrived and they were all but
ready to take me off too, I presume the police
station or investigation And I said, wait, guys like I have.
(05:51):
You know, my wife and my two kids are about
to hop on a plane. You know, they need to
know what's going on here, and they did not in
the worst kind of way. Even when to let them
know what was happening anything, I had to literally plead
with them to Finally where they went and got my wife.
(06:12):
They brought her and my children over, brought us into
a small room, wouldn't let the kids in, made them
stand outside, and gave us, I don't know, a minute
or two together where I gave her the key to
the car, a few other things, and off they went.
(06:33):
At that point, I still, you know, said hey, you know,
I'll hop on the next flight. I'll see you at
home tomorrow and we'll be in touch. And as things
progressed over, you know, they escorted me to the police car,
different things that became apparent that I was not seeing
them tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Man, I got I got a million questions. Well, let's
let's hear the other story from up top, and then
we'll come back in with a couple follow up questions.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
I'm Rian Watson from Oklahoma. Two buddies of mine, we
were all turning forty within a few weeks of each other.
Our wives had gotten together and thought, man, let's plan
a fortieth birthday forum. We started kicking around a bunch
of different destinations, and the other two couples wanted to
come to Turks and Caicos. My wife and I did not,
(07:27):
which is kind of the salt in this whole thing.
But yeah, so we we agreed. We're like, all right,
let's go, we'll go. We come here April seventh and
with two other couples, have a great time, are leaving
to go home in April twelfth. I have a rolling
(07:48):
Duffel bag that I use, like on the weekends and such.
We grabbed it the very last second when we left
for the airport from Oklahoma City, just because my wife's
bag felt a little heavy and she was like, we
might need a place to throw extra stuff. It's like,
all right, cool, I'll grab that bag, opened it up,
looked inside, gave a little shake. Nothing, So we started
(08:09):
loading it up. Off we go. But anyways, we're on
our way home. We are. It's a madhouse at the
airport because a flight had been canceled. We had hired
this skypass company that basically like fast traction through security,
so we were cutting through. Some families are pissed that
(08:31):
we're cutting through this security line, and so there's like
a whole game of like where there's shuffling bins and such.
And you know, I'm a pretty passive guy at first glance,
and so I'm like, all right, whatever, like with my
wife and I get separated. I ended up going through first.
I walked through nothing and like, no issue. I walk
(08:53):
into the duty free shop and there's a glass wall
and I looked through and I see my wife standing
there waiting on the bag. And so I walked back
and I'm like, what do you wait on? Babcon cheese? Like, oh,
your duffel bag still, like it's getting inspected, okay. So
we had on the way back, we had taken her
makeup bag and such out of her out of her
luggage to make room for a bottle of wine, and
(09:16):
so I threw that in my duffel bag. They are
starting to rip through all that stuff, and I'm thinking, oh,
it's she's got liquid in there, Like that's not a
big deal. Like, and you know, my buddy's are ribbing me.
They're like, oh what you got in there? And we're
all laughing. I'm sure at some point. I don't know
if the security camera would be like it is, like
we're laughing and ribbing and still having a good time,
(09:39):
and they're I mean, they're searching like crazy through this bag,
really looking for They take everything out, run everything through it,
and then they run the bag through another time or two,
and I mean they're searching like crazy, and damn near
just assemble the bag. Next thing, you know, the customs
agent like pulls out like a bag they head. My
(10:02):
wife initially thought it was like the little locks that
they sometimes conclude whenever you buy luggage, and she was like,
was that the little locks? I was like, I don't know,
and then she turned back around. She held it up
after they'd like gone and like taken photos with it,
which was kind of strange because it seemed like they
were like taking selfies with it. But they turn around
they show it to me and I was like, shit,
(10:23):
like I realize exactly what that is, you know, like
that's the Ammo that I buy reloaded Ammo this place
in Oklahoma City, and I was like, that's a little
baggie of sixty five preed more than I buy, like
when I go hunting and like I'm like, oh shit.
The lady walks over and I'm like, hey, I'm so sorry,
Like I don't need it. It's only like a couple
(10:44):
of rounds. It looks like in there. I was like,
you can just toss it. We'll be on our way.
She's like no, she said, well here, you got to
talk to the police officer before you go. And I'm like,
all right, cool guy. The customs guy walks by and
he's like it happens all the time. Are our laws
just say that you have to talk to a police
officer And he's like, you American hunters do this all
the time. I'm all right, whatever, Like nothing seems like.
(11:09):
I'm thinking I'm gonna get like a verbal reprimand we
wait there forever. Twenty minutes pass by. Finally guy walks
over and playing clothes and he's like, hey, let me
like he starts shuffling through my bag. He said, let
me see your passport. He looks at it and he's like, hey,
I just want you to know you're not going to
make that flight, and he like hands it back to
me like the way he did it. I was like,
(11:29):
this guy's trying to be tough, you know, he's trying
to be intimidating, and I was like okay. So I
was like, hey, I'm sorry, we'll probably gonna have to
catch the next flight. We walk outside because both my
wife and I. Next thing, you know, unmarked carr walks
like pulls up. They jump out, They put us in
the car. We don't fully understand what's going on. They
(11:52):
take us to a kind of an unmarked building where
they take us in a room and tearorgate us and
and I'm you know, I'm still not like fully comprehending.
I'm like, all right, I'm about to pay a fine,
you know, Like this is.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
You know, when they're interrogating you, what is the line
of questioning.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Do you are you licensed to carry such AMMO? And
I'm like where I'm from, you don't have to have
a license to have AMMO. Like I was like, I
don't understand what you're talking about, Like there's not a
firearm associated with that AMMO. And they're like are you
a hunter? And I'm like yes, and can you prove it?
And I'm like, I guess I got a bunch of
gripping grins that I can show you. Like and so
(12:34):
I'm like pulling out my phone and they're i mean
asking a litany of questions. It was a you know,
and I was like, hey, I was like, can we
call my parents to let them know that we're going
to be late because they're watching our kids. And they
were like, you don't get it, like you're both going
to be arrested and you're both going to jail or
(12:56):
going to prison for twelve years. And at which point
my wife was like, I mean pleaded, like we have children,
and she broke down, and I mean I quickly broke
down as well, because I was like, it was very
apparent at that point that they weren't joking anymore. At first,
I thought it was an intimidation tactic.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
Yeah yeah, and they're.
Speaker 3 (13:18):
Like, no, you're gonna be taken to jail tonight. And
the thing that got me I never said this yet,
but my wife asked, am I going to be cold?
And as a husband who's always considered myself a protector,
(13:39):
I was like, I'm not letting this happen. Like I
was like, she's not going in that damn jail. And
so I started pushing back. I'm like, look, there's got
to be another way, Like like what like, you're not
serious that you're gonna take us both to jail with
kids at home. Finally they came back there like we're
going to offer you a police bail, but you need
to find a surety. And I'm like, I've never been
(14:01):
I've never been arrested in my life. I don't know
what that is. Like. You need to find a Turk Islander,
like a local native that's willing to put up an
asset equivalent to your bail.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
I'm like, I don't want to bail.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Is and he's like, it'll be about ten thousand bucks.
And I'm like, so I need to find a local
that'll put up ten thousand bucks for me. And I
was like, I've been here on a five day vacation
and I'm like texting my friend. I stuck my phone
in and so I was texting my buddies that we
were traveling with, and they're like, oh, we're going to
text Reuben, our driver. So the guy that had we'd
(14:35):
hired to drive us around the whole week, bless his
little heart, man, he shows up. He puts the title
to his car up as sure A kidding me no,
And so that my wife and I can be out
on bail throughout the weekend and kind of get our
feet underneath us and figure out what we had to
rental hotel room last second, call my parents. I'm like,
(14:59):
this is like serious. So they fly down that sun
That was Friday. They fly down that Sunday. That Monday,
we're supposed to go back in give a recorded interview
where I say, my bag, it's the bag that I
travel with. Those are the bullets that I use for hunting.
No idea how they ended up there, but so we
do that mm hmm, and they come out they're not
(15:24):
they're just not decided on whether whether or not they're
going to charge both my wife Valerie or not. And
so they tell my attorney they're like, proba, we just
don't know. We haven't made up her mind yet. We're
going to keep them remanded to the Islands on bail.
They have to post it again. So we had the
driver come back put the title of his car up again,
and they kept us there for another for another week. Essentially,
(15:48):
I went back this past Monday. They charged me. They
dropped the charges of my wife. She got her passport
and I told her it's like immediately go get on
a plane and get off this island. I went to jail.
I had kind of no idea what was going on
in the outside world. I was so here, you have
(16:12):
to go to Supreme Court in order to get bail
under the ammunitions or fire firearms charge. So it took
us a while to get the Supreme Court. So I
was there on Wednesday where they late Wednesday afternoon they
finally approved my bail. Sure how to get surity again,
which we knew our attorney kind of warned us. We
(16:34):
put the feelers out and a guy put up the
title of his restaurant. God I had never met before.
I went and met him, had a beer with him,
and I was like, I'm in a bad situation, dude,
and he was like, I've heard you're a good person
with a really good heart. Like I'm willing to, you know,
take a chance and just you know, put this up
(16:54):
for you. And I was like, man, I don't know
how to thank you, like and so he put his
already for me. And I got out on bail on Wednesday,
and you know, here we are. It's been wild.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
What is their attitude about the fact that you're trying,
that you're on your way out. So presumably if you
were importing ammunition, you'd be looking for it on the
way in, but you're you're leaving with it. Does that
enter the conversation at all? Or is that for a
later date when you have a trial.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I mean, it's our conversation here, we we.
Speaker 3 (17:42):
I mean, you can't not but just sit there and
rack your brain. I mean I've had I had had
conversations with police officers while I was being transported, you know,
in the back of the car, shackled, and they're like,
you know, we don't agree with this, right, And I'm like,
hard to see it from my end, you know, And
they're like and I'm like, look, I was like, charge
me the like set a record for the fine that
(18:04):
you charge somebody. I was like, I'll pay for the
X rays sat on the way in so that you
can actually thwart the gun crime that you're trying to
like get rid of, Like I'll pay for it, like
trust me, Like I'm good for it. But doing this
like arresting two dads that hunt on the weekends, like
(18:25):
it does nothing for your crime. And so yeah, I
mean and they, you know, the police officers, you know,
off the record, and are like, yeah, we can agree more, but.
Speaker 1 (18:37):
And what is this have you heard from the State Department,
the US State Department about like, uh, are they taking
a position on this or are they are they trying
to negotiate on your behalf or making any demands that
that these two people who are obviously innocent of any
kind of attempted gun crime are being harassed with this
(19:01):
potential twelve year prison sentence. This isn't on their radar
in some ways.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
There's actually a third noil too, so we're just we're
not too I heard about that potentially a fourth we're
not sure of yet.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
When I was being interrogated, they brought in a mid
to late twenties presumably. I thought she was an American girl.
I've since reached out to the embassy a number of
times because I'm concerned about her, because this is hell right,
and I mean, the fact that we've been able to
link up and kind of support each other is great,
(19:37):
and I'm like, I want to help the girl out
if I can. I don't know where she is. I
pressed the State Press the embassy. I got a call
back that they're doing an investigation. They do admit that
they took a young female into custody, but they think
(19:58):
that she might not be of American descent.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
Well, an article just came out about another I just
remember it was a male who also had learning ammunition.
So so the state So the State Department is not
making you any they're not making you any promises. I mean,
it just seems to me that it just seems ridiculous
that this could be going on for this long.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
I've been here for almost eighty days. I mean, if
that's any indication.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
And what what are your conversations with the with the
US government.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
So the State Department, We've not engaged directly with them.
It's been predominantly through Senator Wayne Line for well, Mark
Wayne Mark, Mark Wayne mall and I'm sorry. And the
US Embassy in Nassau.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
Yeah, Mark wwyn Willins from from Oklahoma has been on it.
Literally he was informed while my wife and I were
still being interrogated because his his niece and nephew go
to the school. My wife teaches a little Christian school there.
I say, his niece and nephew go to that school,
(21:04):
and my wife had texted her principal and so Mark
Wayne Mullins was already in touch with the embassy before
we were ever out of the investigation. So he's been
on it from the jump and has been just an
absolute bulldog about it. I've got all the faith in
the world and him, I just think that you know,
(21:28):
he's you know, these things take time, and so hit
him and Governor Stead, Senator Langford as well from Oklahoma.
You know, they've both absolutely taken Brian under their wing
and just given him, I mean, Mark Waynemullins.
Speaker 2 (21:44):
Text he called me, texted me. I mean, I can't
tell you how many times at this point and what state?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
What state are you from, Brian, Pennsylvania? Okay? And you've
been in church with elected officials in Pennsylvania.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
I have for quite some time. Yes, nothing Unfortunately, nothing
has happened until Ryde here was arrested as well. And
still from from my perspective, at a senator, at a
governor level, there's been no contact whatsoever. But you're getting it.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
You're getting you're getting it from Oklahoma now, though.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
I certainly am. It's been phenomenal.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Man. I That's what blows my mind here, man is uh.
I mean, I have like an automatic sympathy for you
as just like a couple of hunters, and and I
go hunting, I travel with my family. I'm always hounding
on my thirteen year old, fourteen year old boy to
you know, be careful about straight twenty two shells. When
(22:44):
this first came out, my first caught wind of this
before I even knew how he's speaking to you. I
sent him an article about this, saying, this is why
I'm always on your case about having a twenty two
shell in your pocket. Right, but to me, to have
it be that you have no way to fire these rounds.
(23:05):
This is not ammunition for a gun that would be
even remotely available.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
You are.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Leaving with it, not bringing it in. You are dealing
in like these are very small quantities of ammo. You're
not a drug runner, You're headed home. It's ridiculous, yeah,
that you could be going through this, And it also
seems to me a little bit ridiculous that we're not
(23:35):
able to exert more that are, you know, not that
they're not doing it, but I would just imagine that
there would be a full court press on the on
behalf of the US government about having a couple of
our citizens wrongfully detained over something that's just so obviously ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Yeah. I think it's interesting too, because the charge is
actually possession of ammunition and had nothing to do with
the fact that we were in here. It's just possession.
And so in the United States, possessing ammunition is all right, right,
and so it is. It's just strange, you know, there's
(24:19):
it just seems like there's such a more sensible way
to deal with this, you know, any other country. It's
a fine, any other sovereign country to our knowledge, and all.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
These these islands, all these scribbing islands that it's dealt
with in a much different way.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
Well, listen, man, intent matters. I mean, of course, of course,
I'm sure you learned your lesson. Of course it shouldn't
have happened. Of course, there's there's some blame that you
got to feel on your own end for I mean,
you screwed up. But like intent matters, there's there's clearly
obviously no intent. There's no intent to like be importing,
distributing anything ammunition. I understand the charge is possession, but
(24:58):
but it's uh, you know, like I said, man, I'll
say it for the fourth time. Intent matters, and there's
no intent to do anything wrong here. It just it
really feels to me like a I mean one, it's
a real warning to other hunters and listen, man, I'll
come out and say, this could happen to anybody. It
(25:20):
happened to me. It happened to me in the Anchorage
airport where I was walking on and we had been
Ptarmigan hunting and I had a couple game twelve gauge
game loads in a backpack. Right, it can happen to anyone.
It's happened to many, and many of my friends. With
the fact that it could land you in a situation
like this, with the with the stress of this potential
(25:42):
long term prison sentence, I mean, I feel horrible for
you guys.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
Man, it's I mean for me, it's not a nightmare
that is just you don't wake up from it's every
single day you think, Okay, I'll wake up and I'll
be at home.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
And here I am so far as you guys know,
what what is the next step you have a you
have a A is it does it go to a
jury trial? Like like when when do you next interact
with the authorities?
Speaker 2 (26:09):
So I'm I'm next up to bats. I have my
hearing on Friday, May of the third. So we're only
a few days away from that. And essentially, you know,
my hearing paves the way for for Ryan, for Tyler,
and anybody else that's you know, either here now that
we don't know about or others in the future. There
(26:33):
was a Supreme Court ruling that came out in February
this year that I won't say it didn't change the laws,
but it did clarified in their mind what, you know,
how this can be dealt with, And essentially it's it's
a mine and it's a mandatory jail sentence.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
Mandatory mandatory.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
Yes, now they can handle that in a number of
different ways. The first key component is they have to
find what they consider exceptional circumstances, and that entails three
different factors. One, it's your prior history. Two was their intent,
and then the third factor is, you know, does the
(27:19):
whatever the repercussions are, does it deter others from committing
a similar same crime. So that's the first hurdle. Then
the second hurdle is the jail time, and that's the
I'll say, essentially the wild card. Because in the past,
I think there were five last year, five cases last year.
There are now four this year that, you know, the
(27:43):
five from last year, they did find exceptional circumstances. But
the last individual, unfortunately, he was sentenced eight months in.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
Prison here and what had that the person that did
eight months in prison? What had he done?
Speaker 2 (27:58):
Again? Similar but you know, slightly different. His was I
believe nine millimeter ammunition. I'm not sure what type of
bag it was. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (28:09):
I think it was a magazine. I think it was
a loaded magazine.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Yeah, but no, but no pistol.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
No, no firearm.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Now, there have been two other cases where there were
firearms prior to him, and essentially the individuals, I appears
they were misled by either the airlines whomever they spoke
with that they were allowed to bring them here, but
upon exiting again were found with handguns and ammunition and
(28:38):
they both were able to They stayed here for quite
a while again, but they paid a fine and went home.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
And I understand you guys have I don't know if
it's one or two. You guys have a GoFundMe site
set up for for folks who feel inclined to help
you out. Is that true?
Speaker 3 (28:56):
Yeah, my sister set one up for us. That was
done while I was in jail, and so I have
no idea, to be honest with you, I've I've never
even clicked on the link. I've some people have shared
it with me, like somebody saying, oh my gosh, Donald
Trump Junior shared your I'm uncomfortable with it. Man, as
somebody that's a provider for you're you know, that's always
(29:20):
considered myself as a provider for my family, and I
wanted to help take care of others. To be in
a situation where you feel like you may need help,
is it's emasculating in a way, like it's just it's
hard to it's hard. It's something that's hard to wear.
I don't know how. I don't know how to explain it.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
I'm understood, understood.
Speaker 3 (29:40):
And completely grateful for everybody. And don't get me wrong,
this is this to very easily financially, like just ankrupt anybody.
And we were, you know, high on the hog. I mean,
we we work hard and you know we do you know, okay,
but like we're not. We weren't equipped to handle this,
(30:03):
you know. I mean, it's damn expensive. And so my
sister she put that together. You know, my wife and
I are both huge in our faith, and we want
to be servants of the Lord, and so we've committed that, like, hey,
we're going to use this to help our situation, but
we want to help others as well. And so you know,
(30:25):
we're going to see what we can do to help
Tyler get bail. He's the one that's still in Grand
Turk prison. We want to help Brian and his family
as best we can. I mean, I don't want to
dissuade anybody from doing their own or whatever, and fully
encourage people to go do that, but I also want
people to know that we're not I mean, I just
(30:48):
want to be home, like with your kids, Like I don't.
I'd give it all right now, I promise. I don't
know what's in there, but I checked to whoever for
it so that we all three can go home. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
Man, I'd like to see you guys come home, Like
I said, it just it really, uh man. I got
empathy for you, but also just an awareness of how
something like this could happen to anyone. And uh Ryan Watson,
Brian Hagrich. I'm gonna let you guys go, but man,
we're all gonna be watching.
Speaker 3 (31:18):
Uh A promise on air. I will be recorded.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
This goes for both of us.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
By the way, if we get locked up for twelve years,
you have to take our boys hunting.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
On promise right now.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
I'm gonna send you a picture of my boy from
this this past winter, the first time shooting just be
begun the weekend before.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
I saw I saw one of you guys had I
saw one of you guys had a boy that got
a couple of turkeys this spring.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Certain that was the weekend before we came here.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Yeah, well, if it comes down to that, don't worry.
I'll uh, I will personally take them all out hunting.
I'll find some people to take them out hunting as well.
And let's hope it doesn't come to that. And also,
listeners out there, man, this could happen to anybody. If
you guys live in Pennsylvania or Oklahoma, you want to
call your elected officials and try to lean on them
(32:10):
a little bit to help get these guys back home
for something that you know, it's just not something that
someone should be suffering through, for a case of just
an honest mistake made in the wrong place. All right, guys,
best of luck. We're gonna keep following up. Jordan Sillers
has a piece up on the meeater dot com about
you guys. I'm sure he'll continue to track the story.
(32:33):
And man, I just want to wish you guys the
best best of luck. There's anything we can do, let
us know. And uh, like I said, the minute I
saw that story, I just got a sink and feeling
because how like I said, it could happen to anybody.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
Yes, sir, Yeah, appreciate the time you guys.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Take care you tooks, best luck,
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