July 10, 2025 • 18 mins
Steven Rinella talks with Apprentice Professional Hunter George Dodds.
Topics Discussed: Ginormous termite mounds; growing up on a ranch in Kenya; how elephants hate bees; the resident lions and leopards; Kenya's 1977 ban on hunting; 250-pound Nile Perch; the misery that tsetse flies unleash; the fashion combo of shorts and cute gaiters; what it takes to become a Professional Hunter in Tanzania; harvesting honey on the Luganzo Tongwe Game Reserve; eating Steve's Cape Buffalo; and more.
Connect with Steve and The MeatEater Podcast Network
Steve on Instagram and Twitter
MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and Youtube
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Welcome to Africa Dispatch flop three. And first, before we
even introduce who we're talking right now, we got to
address the elephant in the room, which is this.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Tell my mound.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Yeah, this is for you people watching not listening. This
is one of the most This is like a major
feature of the landscape. Is this is a termite hill.
They're everywhere.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, and they go a little bit of an iceberg
kind of thing, goang on. What you see above ground
is much less than what's underground, So that's maybe a
third of what's actually going on.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah, and this thing is it's a mound, looks like
a mount of dirt probably nine maybe nine feet high,
eight or nine feet high, riddled with holes. But they're
all over out here. And there's even a fancy term
for this. Because we're in a big we're near a
big lake shore and so we're in a big like
big open grass flat. It's kind of reminiscent of it
(01:30):
would be reminiscent of like oak savannah in the US
or in Florida. You get that grass lane with the
I'm not trying to think of seth the Yeah, the
grassland with the oak hammocks. But these hammocks are often
based around these giant termite mounds, which have a name.
It's a Morgan, the little territory made by the turmite mound, Turmitalia.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
And then all these trees have what's called termitalia association,
so they like the.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Kind a bit of a symbolt relationship that's.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Created by the kind of moistured humidity that's going on
inside that termite mountain.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yeah. So if you were here scanning around, it's all grass.
If it's standing up, it's like six foot grass with
all these little clusters of trees here and there, and
they're built around these giant termite mountains. With dad, said
George Dodds, George Dodds, who we're going to talk to
him today because he is doing his second year apprenticeship
(02:38):
to become a professional hunter. Right, and you are what's
known as you have to explain as the people you're
a white Kenyon.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
I'm a white Kenyon.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, explain explain that everybody.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Yeah, fifth generation Kenyon. My great grandfather came to Kenya
in the early nineteen hundreds and yeah, we've we've born
and bred every generations. Yeah, out of small small farming
area in Kenya called like Keipia, yeah, which is sort
of slightly north of central central Kenya.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
And you guys farm and ranch there, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Yeah, I correct, terminalogy would be a ranch. Yeah, so
an indigenous cattlegory called the barn cattle and it's just
a just a bit of a ranch and a small
bit of crop farming. But yeah, full of full of game. Yeah,
much like much like what we got going on here,
just wilderness really top people.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
White. Elephants hate drones.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Sound like bees. Elephants hate bees.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
I know elephants hated bees.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Yeah, a lot of a lot of small scale farmers
actually put put beehives up around their crops because their
elephants just hate that noise and it really helps them
keep them away from their crops. Yeah, it's incredible.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
So when you guys, what is the number one things
that do crop damage in Kenya? The number one like
farm and ranch.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Hassles, Elephant would probably have the biggest impact just because
of shifts eyes. So you know, they they get into
a small small piece of land, they do a huge
amount of damage. They can they can you know, a
group of elephant can clean out acres in a matter
of hours of a maze crop. So yeah, they they
probably do the biggest damage. And then we've got the
bird species, the colia, which also do a massive amount
(04:19):
of damage, but sort of large large mammals would definitely
be would be elephant, and they're also so clever. They're
how to break electric fences. Yeah, they can think about
how to get into it and what kind of stuff
kills your cable. Lions mostly lions and leopard leopard. Leopard
will take out our calves, but lions take out our big,
(04:40):
our big, fully grown animals.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
It doesn't on your like on your ranch at any
given time, there could be African lions, elephants and leopards
could be like on in among your live style. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
We we've usually got about four resident lions on the
on the farm, on the ranch, and anywhere up to
sixty elephant at one time. They move a lot depending
on season and water availability as well as you know
the cropping season for small scale farmers around us. So
they'll move into an area when they when the crops
are nearly ripening and they'll come in and eat it. Yeah,
(05:19):
and then a lot of leopard it's quite thick bush
where we are. And then yeah, we've got the buffalo
eland and all the all the antelope species as well.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
You know, a peculiarity of Kenya, or maybe it's not
so peculiar in terms of all African countries, but I
think that always has surprised me as I've tried learning
a little bit about Africa, reading books about Africa. Is
that Kenya years ago in the seventies, I believe banned honting. Yeah,
I mean just like banned hunting across the across the board.
(05:52):
What was that conversation? Like why did that occur?
Speaker 2 (05:56):
And I can't speak much to why. You know, I
wasn't I wasn't around then, but yeah, they banned all
large game hunting. They kept bird hunting for a long time.
I think that was banned in the sort of mid
two thousands. But yeah, they banned all sort of planes
game dangerous game hunting, and I think seventy six, seventy seven,
(06:18):
and yeah, no chance of it opening anytime soon.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Again, was it like when it happened? Was it a
regarded as a conservation move or does a cultural move?
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I think a conservation move. I think there was a
lot of pressure to sort of move with the times.
I think that was sort of the driving force and yeah,
so definitely a big conservation move.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Really. Yeah, so even though you grew so growing up
in Kenya, you've come to like you would go elsewhere
in Africa and do big game hunting. Yeah. Yeah, like
like I imagine would it feel You're probably out from the States,
But I mean, is it fairly easy and fluid to
bounce around and hunt?
Speaker 3 (06:58):
It is?
Speaker 2 (06:59):
It is, it's it's definitely we can. We can access areas.
I mean, Southern Africa is probably the most popular and
most accessible, but definitely Tanzania, Uganda, Central and Central Africa,
Cameroon's we can. You know, you can get to these places.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
But you're prior to the band you were from, you
were you guys were a hunting family. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Yeah, we my sort of great grandparents and great great
grandparents were all we're all hunters and yeah, I've been
doing it, doing it for a long time and still shooting.
We do a lot of sort of sports shooting. A
lot of sports shooting is big in Kenya and that's yeah,
so it's there's no hunting, but there's still a lot
(07:42):
of a lot of sports shooting, fish, a lot of fishing.
Great fishing some really interesting species as well.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
Describe the fishing to me, like, what what kind of
fishing as a person doing Kenya.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Sort of recreational fishing. Probably some of the most popular
benal perch, which is a really big I mean they
used to get up to sort of two hundred, two
hundred and fifty pounds freshwater fish.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Oh, I thought nile perch is a tilapia.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
No, no, so noile perch eat lapia. That's that's a
really good bait that we use live bait. That's not
the same thing, totally different, much bigger. Yeah, I mean
when we're fishing for big, big noil perch, we'll use
up to a two pounds size to lapia to catch
a now perch.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Yeah, they they're big, and they're they're a bit like
bass in the way they sort of ambush and love structure.
So it's really fun fishing.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Yeah, and you you we we do.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
We keep the little ones. I mean, they're they're they're
getting a bit rare now, the numbers. There's a lot
of pressure on them, fishing pressure, so we release a
lot of the big ones. But they're they're very good
eating and where we catch them is a place of
absolute beauty. Most guys fishing in a place called Lake Takana,
which is I think the one of, if not the
(09:00):
longest desert lake in the world, which is northern Kenya.
And it's what we would call a safari, not a
hunting safari, but a safari just getting there, take you
two or three days, all offer a driving, no access
to sort of shops or anything like that. So yeah,
it's it's a bit of an adventure just getting there,
which makes it really special.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
Yeah. Yeah, I want to refer real quick to the
to the very familiar uniform that people might see with
with people from Africa, the hunt. Yeah, you guys were
on the shorts. Yeah, you know you're getting malled all
day by tetsi flies.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Yeah. I hate hunting in all sort of cruising around
in trousers. I just get too hot. I run hot.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Oh yeah. But then the flip side is you get
marled by fly.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
More by flies. I kind of look at it that,
you know, you kind of just let them eat you
for two weeks and then your body gets used to it,
does it.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Yeah, Because I'm kind of like a few of us,
a few of US Americans are having some mic and
some body feelings.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, I know, we all, we all get those.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
I first week is always tough.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Like a tingly poison ivy kind of feel from too
many TESTSI fly some welts. Yeah, but that fades away.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Yeah, yeah, after one of two weeks it goes.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
Yeah, and you run those cute little gators.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, run the gators. Keep the birds and everything out
of the socks.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
Yeah. Let's keep your socks clean.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
Yeah, keep the socks clean. Nothing worse than it she socks. Yeah,
and then just some good quiet leather boots.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Yeah. You want to like, I understand, you get your
ranch responsibilities, but you're doing an apprenticeship to become a
professional hunter, indeed, to work to hunt in Tanzani and
be a hunting what would professional hunt being like what
we would recall, you know, a hunting guide in Tanzania. Yeah. Uh,
does that mean you're gonna walk away from ranching?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
No, I'll do it part time. You know, hunting is
very seasonal and also depends on how many trips you
can do, So I'll definitely sort of stay on the farm,
run the farm, and then when I get a when
I get a trip, I'll come down and do the work.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Yeah, what draws you to do in the professional hunting?
Speaker 2 (11:13):
I just I'm I grew up a bush kid on
the farm, you know, just being outdoors. Both my parents
were photographic guides as well. My mum was a botanist,
so yeah, she described some species of pint, Yeah, described
a few. She specialized in aloes, so you know, aloverra
sort of African species, So she's described a couple of
couple of aloes. So my childhood was sort of spent
(11:37):
traveling across Kenya and into Ethiopia searching for different species
of plants, which took us to some incredible places, far
out places that most people don't go to, off the
beaten track, and just fell in love with being in
the bush and just yeah, it just gelled with me.
And this is this is as close as I can
get to.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
That is the process formal meaning you have to do
two years of apprenticeship. Is that because of who you want,
because you want to work for Robin Hurt Safaris? Or
is that a government thing?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
It's it's a government thing. I think that's a standard
standard for all all want to be professional hunters. You've
got to do an apprenticeship with one of the recognized
hunting outfitters or hunting companies like Robin Hurtsafaris. And then
once you finished that, then you've got a theoretical exam
which is pretty heavy, and you've got to get all
(12:31):
the law and everything. It's quite it's quite extensive. Yeah,
So you finish your two years of apprenticeship, I think obviously,
you know you have to be recommended to actually sit
the exam. So if you if you've done your apprenticeship
and the outfitter thinks, oh, he's not up to the task,
you just won't be recommended to sit the exam, and
then you can't sit the exam without a recommendation, got it.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
Yeah. Morgan mentioned to me, like I was kind of
marveling how he was one in Australia, came here and
learned the Swahili language Qui Swahili as says, and he said,
you can kid yourself and think you can do it
without but you gotta have Yeah. Absolutely, But Keny in Kenya,
(13:14):
the national language is English.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
It's it's it's also ki okay. Kiswahili is very it's
very different to Tanzanian Kiswahili. So the first couple of
months for me. Every time I get back down here
is quite a challenge. I would describe Tanzani and Swahelia
as sort of a very very correct, very polite language,
whereas sorry, which one is Tanzanian, whereas kenyansweely is quite colloquial,
(13:42):
a lot of other languages thrown in there.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
So I can.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
I can converse with anyone back home in Kenya and
they'll understand me. But I need to think a bit
and and sort of use the correct words and not
sort of use all these colloquialisms that we use in Kenya. Yeah,
so it's it's tricky, and yeah, I think if you
don't speak Swahili, yeah, I mean most of our most
of our guys don't speak English language. Barrier is a
(14:07):
big thing.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
So did you grow up you grew up bilingual? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Yeah, I actually I actually spoke to Heli before I
spoke English. My My mom and dad said, well, he's
obviously gonna speak English. You know, I went to an
English English boarding school. So they just said, okay, everyone
don't speak to these kids in English speak, and they
spoke to us in Swahili until we were fluent in
Swahili and then once we were fluent, then they spoke
spoke to us in English. Yeah, which has been a godsend.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
So you'll you'll finish a prenticing this year, yeah, and
then next season and we should clarify a season is
what do you guys think about as the season the
hunting season.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
So typically in western Tanzania where we are now, it'll
be from from July up to October. So yeah, so
hopefully by by next next July, I'll be I'll be
fully qualified before it goes well and.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
You might come here and hunt.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
That would be that's to go. Yeah, this is this, Yeah,
this is the standard for me. This this loupganz or
tonge gamers of his. Yeah, it's unbelievable. It's as you've seen. Yeah,
that's the thing that you know. Prior to coming here,
I went out to Massi Land. Yeah, you know, and
(15:19):
that was so cool in its own right where you're
you know, you're out in that like very desert like
open grassland and you know, every couple of hours or
whatever you see, you're seeing.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
I mean, well, one, you can never look around and
not find in the open you can never look around
and not find animals. Absolutely, there's always something there. But
every couple hours or whatever, there's like a group of
Massi kids with like yeah, their parents. You know, they
make water runs with donkeys loaded with jugs of water.
(15:58):
So you'll see a string of you know, women with
you know, a dozen donkeys lower water going across and
it's like a working landscape and mixed within this is
all this wildlife and it's it's stunning, it's like amazing.
But here you are in like one of the pure, pure,
more vast chunks of wilderness I've ever been in. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Absolutely, I think we've got different sort of classes of
land use in these in these wildlife areas in Tanzania,
and this this area is a game reserve, so there's
no there's no permanent settlement, there's no semi permanent settlement.
The only access guys will have is permitted honey harvesting,
which is you'll see you've seen all those bee hives.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
It's incredible.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
So we get guys coming in about twice a year
to come and check on their hives, harvest their honey.
But other than that, it's it's pristine wilderness. Yeah, there's
no one here. There's nothing here yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
And then when you start, you'll you'll engage with clients. Yeah.
Now do you imagine, like, do you imagine that you
are probably have clients from off the continent.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Right, Yeah, absolutely. I think the majority is is is
American clients or European clients. So yeah, that's the that's
the next trick is to get your name out there
and and start getting some trips.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Yeah, I'll hopefully get some get some trips for the
company if I if I make the cut.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
So it's it's a long it's a long, slow process,
but it's I think that's what it's all about. That's
you know, at the end of the day, when you
do come out here, you you're you're hunting with someone
who who knows what they're doing.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Oh yeah, yeah, Well I don't want to interfere in it,
but good luck on getting the okay. Thank you. I
feel like you might be gonna Yeah, I feel like
you're maybe going to get the okay. I haven't. I
feel like somehow if you weren't, we wouldn't be talking
to you. I just feel like it'd be awkward, but
fresh as on. I feel like you might get the
okay to do some studying. Last note, when we ended
(18:00):
the Last the Last Flop edition, we're heading out back
on the trail of some buffalo and that night we
got one. I'm i gonna give you any more detail
in that, but we got one. We've been eating them, yep.
And he's a beauty of three times yesterday and two
times today.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's what we're doing, all right.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Thanks man, Cool
Welcome to Africa Dispatch flop three. And first, before we
even introduce who we're talking right now, we got to
address the elephant in the room, which is this.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Tell my mound.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Yeah, this is for you people watching not listening. This
is one of the most This is like a major
feature of the landscape. Is this is a termite hill.
They're everywhere.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, and they go a little bit of an iceberg
kind of thing, goang on. What you see above ground
is much less than what's underground, So that's maybe a
third of what's actually going on.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah, and this thing is it's a mound, looks like
a mount of dirt probably nine maybe nine feet high,
eight or nine feet high, riddled with holes. But they're
all over out here. And there's even a fancy term
for this. Because we're in a big we're near a
big lake shore and so we're in a big like
big open grass flat. It's kind of reminiscent of it
(01:30):
would be reminiscent of like oak savannah in the US
or in Florida. You get that grass lane with the
I'm not trying to think of seth the Yeah, the
grassland with the oak hammocks. But these hammocks are often
based around these giant termite mounds, which have a name.
It's a Morgan, the little territory made by the turmite mound, Turmitalia.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
And then all these trees have what's called termitalia association,
so they like the.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Kind a bit of a symbolt relationship that's.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Created by the kind of moistured humidity that's going on
inside that termite mountain.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yeah. So if you were here scanning around, it's all grass.
If it's standing up, it's like six foot grass with
all these little clusters of trees here and there, and
they're built around these giant termite mountains. With dad, said
George Dodds, George Dodds, who we're going to talk to
him today because he is doing his second year apprenticeship
(02:38):
to become a professional hunter. Right, and you are what's
known as you have to explain as the people you're
a white Kenyon.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
I'm a white Kenyon.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Yeah, explain explain that everybody.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Yeah, fifth generation Kenyon. My great grandfather came to Kenya
in the early nineteen hundreds and yeah, we've we've born
and bred every generations. Yeah, out of small small farming
area in Kenya called like Keipia, yeah, which is sort
of slightly north of central central Kenya.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
And you guys farm and ranch there, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Yeah, I correct, terminalogy would be a ranch. Yeah, so
an indigenous cattlegory called the barn cattle and it's just
a just a bit of a ranch and a small
bit of crop farming. But yeah, full of full of game. Yeah,
much like much like what we got going on here,
just wilderness really top people.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
White. Elephants hate drones.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Sound like bees. Elephants hate bees.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
I know elephants hated bees.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Yeah, a lot of a lot of small scale farmers
actually put put beehives up around their crops because their
elephants just hate that noise and it really helps them
keep them away from their crops. Yeah, it's incredible.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
So when you guys, what is the number one things
that do crop damage in Kenya? The number one like
farm and ranch.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Hassles, Elephant would probably have the biggest impact just because
of shifts eyes. So you know, they they get into
a small small piece of land, they do a huge
amount of damage. They can they can you know, a
group of elephant can clean out acres in a matter
of hours of a maze crop. So yeah, they they
probably do the biggest damage. And then we've got the
bird species, the colia, which also do a massive amount
(04:19):
of damage, but sort of large large mammals would definitely
be would be elephant, and they're also so clever. They're
how to break electric fences. Yeah, they can think about
how to get into it and what kind of stuff
kills your cable. Lions mostly lions and leopard leopard. Leopard
will take out our calves, but lions take out our big,
(04:40):
our big, fully grown animals.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
It doesn't on your like on your ranch at any
given time, there could be African lions, elephants and leopards
could be like on in among your live style. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
We we've usually got about four resident lions on the
on the farm, on the ranch, and anywhere up to
sixty elephant at one time. They move a lot depending
on season and water availability as well as you know
the cropping season for small scale farmers around us. So
they'll move into an area when they when the crops
are nearly ripening and they'll come in and eat it. Yeah,
(05:19):
and then a lot of leopard it's quite thick bush
where we are. And then yeah, we've got the buffalo
eland and all the all the antelope species as well.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
You know, a peculiarity of Kenya, or maybe it's not
so peculiar in terms of all African countries, but I
think that always has surprised me as I've tried learning
a little bit about Africa, reading books about Africa. Is
that Kenya years ago in the seventies, I believe banned honting. Yeah,
I mean just like banned hunting across the across the board.
(05:52):
What was that conversation? Like why did that occur?
Speaker 2 (05:56):
And I can't speak much to why. You know, I
wasn't I wasn't around then, but yeah, they banned all
large game hunting. They kept bird hunting for a long time.
I think that was banned in the sort of mid
two thousands. But yeah, they banned all sort of planes
game dangerous game hunting, and I think seventy six, seventy seven,
(06:18):
and yeah, no chance of it opening anytime soon.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Again, was it like when it happened? Was it a
regarded as a conservation move or does a cultural move?
Speaker 2 (06:27):
I think a conservation move. I think there was a
lot of pressure to sort of move with the times.
I think that was sort of the driving force and yeah,
so definitely a big conservation move.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
Really. Yeah, so even though you grew so growing up
in Kenya, you've come to like you would go elsewhere
in Africa and do big game hunting. Yeah. Yeah, like
like I imagine would it feel You're probably out from the States,
But I mean, is it fairly easy and fluid to
bounce around and hunt?
Speaker 3 (06:58):
It is?
Speaker 2 (06:59):
It is, it's it's definitely we can. We can access areas.
I mean, Southern Africa is probably the most popular and
most accessible, but definitely Tanzania, Uganda, Central and Central Africa,
Cameroon's we can. You know, you can get to these places.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
But you're prior to the band you were from, you
were you guys were a hunting family. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Yeah, we my sort of great grandparents and great great
grandparents were all we're all hunters and yeah, I've been
doing it, doing it for a long time and still shooting.
We do a lot of sort of sports shooting. A
lot of sports shooting is big in Kenya and that's yeah,
so it's there's no hunting, but there's still a lot
(07:42):
of a lot of sports shooting, fish, a lot of fishing.
Great fishing some really interesting species as well.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
Describe the fishing to me, like, what what kind of
fishing as a person doing Kenya.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Sort of recreational fishing. Probably some of the most popular
benal perch, which is a really big I mean they
used to get up to sort of two hundred, two
hundred and fifty pounds freshwater fish.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Oh, I thought nile perch is a tilapia.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
No, no, so noile perch eat lapia. That's that's a
really good bait that we use live bait. That's not
the same thing, totally different, much bigger. Yeah, I mean
when we're fishing for big, big noil perch, we'll use
up to a two pounds size to lapia to catch
a now perch.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Yeah, they they're big, and they're they're a bit like
bass in the way they sort of ambush and love structure.
So it's really fun fishing.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Yeah, and you you we we do.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
We keep the little ones. I mean, they're they're they're
getting a bit rare now, the numbers. There's a lot
of pressure on them, fishing pressure, so we release a
lot of the big ones. But they're they're very good
eating and where we catch them is a place of
absolute beauty. Most guys fishing in a place called Lake Takana,
which is I think the one of, if not the
(09:00):
longest desert lake in the world, which is northern Kenya.
And it's what we would call a safari, not a
hunting safari, but a safari just getting there, take you
two or three days, all offer a driving, no access
to sort of shops or anything like that. So yeah,
it's it's a bit of an adventure just getting there,
which makes it really special.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
Yeah. Yeah, I want to refer real quick to the
to the very familiar uniform that people might see with
with people from Africa, the hunt. Yeah, you guys were
on the shorts. Yeah, you know you're getting malled all
day by tetsi flies.
Speaker 2 (09:39):
Yeah. I hate hunting in all sort of cruising around
in trousers. I just get too hot. I run hot.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Oh yeah. But then the flip side is you get
marled by fly.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
More by flies. I kind of look at it that,
you know, you kind of just let them eat you
for two weeks and then your body gets used to it,
does it.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Yeah, Because I'm kind of like a few of us,
a few of US Americans are having some mic and
some body feelings.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, I know, we all, we all get those.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
I first week is always tough.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Like a tingly poison ivy kind of feel from too
many TESTSI fly some welts. Yeah, but that fades away.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Yeah, yeah, after one of two weeks it goes.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
Yeah, and you run those cute little gators.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, run the gators. Keep the birds and everything out
of the socks.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
Yeah. Let's keep your socks clean.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
Yeah, keep the socks clean. Nothing worse than it she socks. Yeah,
and then just some good quiet leather boots.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Yeah. You want to like, I understand, you get your
ranch responsibilities, but you're doing an apprenticeship to become a
professional hunter, indeed, to work to hunt in Tanzani and
be a hunting what would professional hunt being like what
we would recall, you know, a hunting guide in Tanzania. Yeah. Uh,
does that mean you're gonna walk away from ranching?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
No, I'll do it part time. You know, hunting is
very seasonal and also depends on how many trips you
can do, So I'll definitely sort of stay on the farm,
run the farm, and then when I get a when
I get a trip, I'll come down and do the work.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Yeah, what draws you to do in the professional hunting?
Speaker 2 (11:13):
I just I'm I grew up a bush kid on
the farm, you know, just being outdoors. Both my parents
were photographic guides as well. My mum was a botanist,
so yeah, she described some species of pint, Yeah, described
a few. She specialized in aloes, so you know, aloverra
sort of African species, So she's described a couple of
couple of aloes. So my childhood was sort of spent
(11:37):
traveling across Kenya and into Ethiopia searching for different species
of plants, which took us to some incredible places, far
out places that most people don't go to, off the
beaten track, and just fell in love with being in
the bush and just yeah, it just gelled with me.
And this is this is as close as I can
get to.
Speaker 1 (11:57):
That is the process formal meaning you have to do
two years of apprenticeship. Is that because of who you want,
because you want to work for Robin Hurt Safaris? Or
is that a government thing?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
It's it's a government thing. I think that's a standard
standard for all all want to be professional hunters. You've
got to do an apprenticeship with one of the recognized
hunting outfitters or hunting companies like Robin Hurtsafaris. And then
once you finished that, then you've got a theoretical exam
which is pretty heavy, and you've got to get all
(12:31):
the law and everything. It's quite it's quite extensive. Yeah,
So you finish your two years of apprenticeship, I think obviously,
you know you have to be recommended to actually sit
the exam. So if you if you've done your apprenticeship
and the outfitter thinks, oh, he's not up to the task,
you just won't be recommended to sit the exam, and
then you can't sit the exam without a recommendation, got it.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
Yeah. Morgan mentioned to me, like I was kind of
marveling how he was one in Australia, came here and
learned the Swahili language Qui Swahili as says, and he said,
you can kid yourself and think you can do it
without but you gotta have Yeah. Absolutely, But Keny in Kenya,
(13:14):
the national language is English.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
It's it's it's also ki okay. Kiswahili is very it's
very different to Tanzanian Kiswahili. So the first couple of
months for me. Every time I get back down here
is quite a challenge. I would describe Tanzani and Swahelia
as sort of a very very correct, very polite language,
whereas sorry, which one is Tanzanian, whereas kenyansweely is quite colloquial,
(13:42):
a lot of other languages thrown in there.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
So I can.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
I can converse with anyone back home in Kenya and
they'll understand me. But I need to think a bit
and and sort of use the correct words and not
sort of use all these colloquialisms that we use in Kenya. Yeah,
so it's it's tricky, and yeah, I think if you
don't speak Swahili, yeah, I mean most of our most
of our guys don't speak English language. Barrier is a
(14:07):
big thing.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
So did you grow up you grew up bilingual? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Yeah, I actually I actually spoke to Heli before I
spoke English. My My mom and dad said, well, he's
obviously gonna speak English. You know, I went to an
English English boarding school. So they just said, okay, everyone
don't speak to these kids in English speak, and they
spoke to us in Swahili until we were fluent in
Swahili and then once we were fluent, then they spoke
spoke to us in English. Yeah, which has been a godsend.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
So you'll you'll finish a prenticing this year, yeah, and
then next season and we should clarify a season is
what do you guys think about as the season the
hunting season.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
So typically in western Tanzania where we are now, it'll
be from from July up to October. So yeah, so
hopefully by by next next July, I'll be I'll be
fully qualified before it goes well and.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
You might come here and hunt.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
That would be that's to go. Yeah, this is this, Yeah,
this is the standard for me. This this loupganz or
tonge gamers of his. Yeah, it's unbelievable. It's as you've seen. Yeah,
that's the thing that you know. Prior to coming here,
I went out to Massi Land. Yeah, you know, and
(15:19):
that was so cool in its own right where you're
you know, you're out in that like very desert like
open grassland and you know, every couple of hours or
whatever you see, you're seeing.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
I mean, well, one, you can never look around and
not find in the open you can never look around
and not find animals. Absolutely, there's always something there. But
every couple hours or whatever, there's like a group of
Massi kids with like yeah, their parents. You know, they
make water runs with donkeys loaded with jugs of water.
(15:58):
So you'll see a string of you know, women with
you know, a dozen donkeys lower water going across and
it's like a working landscape and mixed within this is
all this wildlife and it's it's stunning, it's like amazing.
But here you are in like one of the pure, pure,
more vast chunks of wilderness I've ever been in. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Absolutely, I think we've got different sort of classes of
land use in these in these wildlife areas in Tanzania,
and this this area is a game reserve, so there's
no there's no permanent settlement, there's no semi permanent settlement.
The only access guys will have is permitted honey harvesting,
which is you'll see you've seen all those bee hives.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
It's incredible.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
So we get guys coming in about twice a year
to come and check on their hives, harvest their honey.
But other than that, it's it's pristine wilderness. Yeah, there's
no one here. There's nothing here yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
And then when you start, you'll you'll engage with clients. Yeah.
Now do you imagine, like, do you imagine that you
are probably have clients from off the continent.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
Right, Yeah, absolutely. I think the majority is is is
American clients or European clients. So yeah, that's the that's
the next trick is to get your name out there
and and start getting some trips.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Yeah, I'll hopefully get some get some trips for the
company if I if I make the cut.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
So it's it's a long it's a long, slow process,
but it's I think that's what it's all about. That's
you know, at the end of the day, when you
do come out here, you you're you're hunting with someone
who who knows what they're doing.
Speaker 1 (17:37):
Oh yeah, yeah, Well I don't want to interfere in it,
but good luck on getting the okay. Thank you. I
feel like you might be gonna Yeah, I feel like
you're maybe going to get the okay. I haven't. I
feel like somehow if you weren't, we wouldn't be talking
to you. I just feel like it'd be awkward, but
fresh as on. I feel like you might get the
okay to do some studying. Last note, when we ended
(18:00):
the Last the Last Flop edition, we're heading out back
on the trail of some buffalo and that night we
got one. I'm i gonna give you any more detail
in that, but we got one. We've been eating them, yep.
And he's a beauty of three times yesterday and two
times today.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's what we're doing, all right.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
Thanks man, Cool
Host
Steven Rinella
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.