October 24, 2024 • 43 mins
Hannah sits down with costume designer Debra McGuire for the first time since New Girl went off the air to discuss her epic career. Debra breaks down the art of crafting costumes for an ensemble cast. Plus, she tells us how Crayola Crayons impacted the Jessica Day wardrobe.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Yeah, no mess Welcome to the Mess around. It is
our New Girl Recap, a recap podcast that I do
with Lemourn and we bring in all the New Girl
(00:26):
fan favorites that made the show the show, and I
would say, without exaggeration, maybe fifty percent of our questions
are about what we're wearing. How it all came to
be where people can get a bird shirt, we're zolways,
clothes made or bought, I mean on and the wedding dresses,
(00:48):
the amazing weddings, and I'm like, this was Debra's world.
We somehow And I remember this when I got a
New Girl and they said that Deborah maguire was doing costumes.
It was really my first job in the industry. So
I was like, Okay, I can't wait to meet Deborah
and they're like, no, like they got Deborah and I
(01:11):
was like, Okay, what does that mean? And they're like,
she's the greatest in the entire business. Nobody can understand
how they got her. And then I got to learn
over like almost a decade of how and why you
are the best in every single aspect of what you do.
So what is your New Girl origin story? How did
(01:34):
you get connected to the show, and why did you
agree to do it?
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Truthfully, it must have had to do with Jake Castin, right,
mm hmm. Yeah. So you know, I started working with
Jake on Freaks and Geeks, and then I started doing
all of his shows, and you know, we had the
three shows going for a long time, and I'm sure
(02:01):
that's how I got there.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Jake was just like, you're you're part of this world.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Right, I've done At that point, I'd worked with him
since he was twenty two years old, I think get out.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yeah, so he was like, you have to be part
of this. How did you approach creating the looks for
the central cast of New Girl.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Well, I had this idea that was about color and
with you know, Zoe being the teacher and sort of
the center of the cyclone. I thought of it like
a box of Crayola krans and that She was like, like,
(02:43):
I have a real connection to Crayola Kranz from the
time I'm a child. I can like smell, I know
what it smells like. Like I every time the boxes
got bigger and there were more crans in there, it
was the most exciting thing in the world. So I
sort of dealt with it like that, and she was
a Creola cran And then I designed everybody else around them,
(03:04):
around her, and that's why she had all those primary
colors and and everybody else, you know, because it's an
ensemble and you guys are together so much, much the
same as I had when I did Friends. It was
the same thing. When you have an ensemble cast and
they're together a lot, it's more about the way it
(03:26):
looks together than it is about the individual fashion because subliminally,
you know, we're looking at the screen as a painting,
so it needs to look beautiful. So that's my main
concern always, that's the first concern. And then you know,
sometimes you know, I have to have some disappointment about,
(03:48):
you know, things that work and things that don't, and
having to adjust that palette. But for the most part,
you know, I designed by palette, and this show fit
in pretty well. I mean, you know, your character added
a lot of different silhouettes from Zoe's silhouettes, and also
some patterns that we didn't really see that often in
(04:11):
her clothes.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, with Zoe's clothes, I feel like I remember conversations
about you made right.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Quite a few. We made a lot of her looks
most of them actually, because she had that you know,
that fifties silhouette, so if it wasn't vintage, and sometimes
we had a vintage style that worked perfectly, so I
would knock off a pattern from that and then do
a series of dresses off of that. But her figure
(04:41):
was such that that shirt waist showing her waist was
really the best look for her. So we made that,
and we also made all those jammies she wore. She
wear a lot of pajamas.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
You know what's really funny, I have a very clear
memory of my first fitting with you.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
So do I at night downtown at that down Yeah,
me too.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
Oh my gosh, okay, I took a screen grab of this. Well,
we'll play. We'll put the picture up properly when we
put it in the show. It's so funny because again
it was my first show. I have to show you.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
It was this.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yes, it's like going to focus.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Yes, there the feathers, that's right.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
And so I remember, so I've again never done a
big show. This was my first big thing I'd ever booked,
and they were like, well, never wants to meet you downtown.
I was like downtown, and so I was not the
most confident driver. I only learned to drive in La,
So I'm like trying to like navigate my way, hoping
I don't die on the way to the fitting. And
it was a beautiful day, and I think you were
finishing up something else. I don't even know if it
(05:49):
was for a new girl, maybe for something else, because
you were in this fabulous, fabulous like warehouse and and
so I was waiting on the roof. And I remember
waiting on the roof and it was this beautiful day
and blue skies, and I was I just couldn't believe
it was real. I had then been educated on your
career and who you were, and I was like, I
(06:11):
guess I'm going to figure out who this character was
not understanding like there's going to be multiple looks. There's
going to be your core look. This is going to
be like a joke photoshoot that you're going for a
fitting for. I didn't understand all those things yet, and
so I think someone came I don't know who came
up and like tap me on the shoulder and they
were like, Debraa's ready, And I came in and they're
(06:32):
on this rack. Were some of to this day, the
most wild outfits with shoes and like hats that I
had ever seen in my entire life, and it was
one of the most fun things I've ever done. So
what was that space? Where did that conversation come about
to like go that far with it?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Truthfully, I have a real recollection of it. But I
don't remember what that company was. I don't know that
they exist anymore. But I did know that they had
inherited like tons of old McQueen and lots of amazing
(07:11):
dresses and things that I just wouldn't be able to
access in other places, and I thought that would be
like a perfect place to try stuck on it. I
remember we tried on some McQueen shoes, really weird shoes,
and it was really fun.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, I have pictures of it. I have to find them.
I think it's on my other computer. I have pictures
from the fitting. You sent me the fitting pictures. I'll
text them to you too. And their outfits are fabulous,
I mean they're beyond fabulous. And then I remember that
that was the outfit that they chose for a scene
that never made it into the pilot on the cutting
room floor, I know, but it was so and I
(07:49):
remember the hair. We just like went for it with
this incredible look and I was like, this is going
to be so fun. And I was so nervous, and
they put me on the stage and then a security
safety guy came out and was like, nobody speak, nobody move,
and they brought in a vulture, like a bird of prey,
(08:11):
and I was dressed like a bird, and they were like,
nobody speak because these are like predatory animals and we
don't want it to get scared. And then I remember
Aaron O'Malley coming over to whisper to me. She's like, okay,
so then we're just gonna give you a hand signal
for action. And then in the scene I was screaming
(08:31):
into the phone dressed as a bird. Well this bird
was next to me. I was like, this was the
most surreal experience of my life and that outfit was
the most incredible thing I'd worn. And then instantly in
that moment became so terrifying because I felt like I
was a bird.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
It was and it never made it right into it. Yeah,
welcome to my world. Like the most fabulous things I
think I have ever done in my life. I didn't
make it in the movie because.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
No one ever saw. I also have to share another
memory with you because it was also in that first
year we got nominated for a Golden Globe. I don't
know if you remember this conversation, and I was like,
the only person I need to talk to is Deborah.
And I had found a dress and I loved it
so much, and it was green, and I remember having
(09:25):
you come to my trailer and I was like, I
want to talk to you in confidence about something. I
really like this dress. It's great and my first time
I ever gonna wear like a fancy designer on a
red carpet, like and I was so worried that Zoe
would be wearing the same color and that I would
in any way distract from her by wearing the same color.
(09:47):
It was like old school, like high school thinking, like
I was just so worried that, you know, like I
don't know the rules of the red carpet. And I
remember you gently sitting down with me and explaining of
all these people's like dresses that you'd had made and
had done for every like award show, and you were like,
it doesn't matter. Wear the dress that you want to wear,
(10:11):
whatever it is. Everybody's gonna be wearing every color. And
it was the kindest moment of education and sudden that
I had nothing to do with our show, but just
in terms of my own confidence of being able to
stand in what felt good to me, not in a
character to be able to go to this honoring and
I had no one else to kind of turn to
(10:31):
that I would have believed. And I think about that
all the time, even now when I'd choose an outfit,
I'm always like, oh, it doesn't matter when anybody else
is wearing or doing or the palette. In those moments,
you can just express yourself and what feels good. And
that was you. That was you teaching me that in
taking the time, and I think it was pretty you know,
(10:54):
crazy as always on that show, but you found like,
I don't know, fifteen minutes and sat down and just
walk me through it in those moments.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
I don't know you realize that that's so sweet.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Yeah, it was a really powerful one for me. I
just have the fondest memories of us being in that
trailer and we would do these huge fittings and we
would talk about our lives and our families and our
pain always always and it was you just always had
that time to share and it was really like you
(11:26):
and your department was really I think Laura and I
talk about all the time like that was like family,
Like it's what made it feel like we were so
cared for because it was really And you've been on
a lot of those shows where it's people's first experience
being kind of thrust out there and they're looking at
our bodies and then how you guys outfit us, you know,
(11:46):
gives us the confidence or makes us self conscious and
out of our body.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Well, we had Kathy and Megan, who are like my daughters.
So Kathy just became a grandmother. If you can believe it, No.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
I can not.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
Yes, what yes?
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Wow? Oh but that's so sea.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
So I know I feel like she just had, you know,
her baby, not that long ago. But it's crazy.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Wow. Yeah, how did you? Okay? So the big question
is I have been put in charge of this because
we put a like a call to action out to
the fans about this, and I would say about fifty
percent of those questions coming in were about Lamarne, about
Lomarn and the bird shirt. And so I'm going to
read you this from a fan her name is Amy Caruso.
(12:33):
She wrote, I love listening to the show every week.
Hearing the Debora will be on got me so excited
because I have a question that's been haunting me for years.
I think this is a big fan theory that we
all want to know. So, season four, episode twenty one,
Jess and Nick talk about who they are growing old with.
After Nick says he just sees himself next to Winston,
just says, yeahmy too. I just see an ancient Winston
(12:53):
eating handfuls of bird seed right out of the bag.
He just really gets in to birds. Could you please
confirm if this was foreshadowing of or the triggering idea
to Winston's obsessions with bird shirts for the very next season.
What's the background on the birds?
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Interesting questions? So I don't think that's the case. However,
I do believe in all of these things that we do,
that there is a level of synchronicity that exists with everything.
And you know, what happens in a television show sort
of mirrors real life. You know that when people ask me,
(13:35):
you know about the characters, and from season to season,
it's like everybody evolves in the same way that we
evolve as human beings because we're going through these periods
of time. So I don't think there's a direct correlation
between the bird seed and the bird And I think
also what the fans should know is that the biggest
(13:57):
evolution was schmidt evolution in terms of him as a
person and his personal style. I mean, if you remember
he was in polo shirts for you know a few seasons,
I think, I mean, and you know a lot of
that doesn't necessarily have to do with me and my ideas,
(14:20):
but has to do with sort of the next level
of writers and people who are giving us the information
about the characters so we can best satisfy. Sometimes we're
at odds, but I am a servant to them. They
do not serve me. That being said, a lot of
(14:43):
decisions don't necessarily come from me directly. They come from above,
from the writing. You know a lot of it and
a lot of the ideas that get generated are things
that we have to process from information that we get
from the be And in doing that and evolving his
(15:04):
character to those great shirts, and that became sort of
an obsession with us because it was a really good
place for us to be creative, which we're always looking
for and you know, sometimes you know, once we get
into who these characters are, there's only so much creativity
that we can insert, unless, of course, we have a
(15:26):
fabulous wedding or we have a reason to create something.
The day to day is pretty much within its little bubble.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
So yeah, I knew Girl had a lot of those
fun episodes. It seems like with like Halloween episodes.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Halloween episodes definitely, and hello we had Prince I mean yeah, hello,
probably only the greatest experiences ever.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Why, I mean still to this day it feels really surreal.
We're recapping season three right now, which comes off the
heels of Taylor Swift being in the season two finale.
Did you pick that Elaine dress? Was that provided by wardrobe?
Was that hers?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
No? We those are our dresses?
Speaker 1 (16:18):
How did you decide on that iconical? So many people
said that they went to the Taylor Swift concert dressed
as a lane, so like they remade the dress. They
have like altered dresses to beat the Elaine dress.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Okay, so just so you know, you know, I'm old,
What can I say? You know, like she falls within
a category that like I didn't really know, you know,
it didn't have any more importance than you know, anybody
else being on the show. The ideation, don't. I didn't
equate her with Prince. Let's put it that way. Okay, okay,
(16:55):
Prince is my wheelhouse. So for me, Taylor Swift was
like dealing with any other actor that comes in, you know.
And so the dress, you know, we had picked up
dresses and she was very agreeable. You know, she was
lovely to work with. Easy, So you know, I don't
(17:16):
remember that much except looking at pictures on her phone
of her cats. You know. That's so.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
That's so It's funny, right, those moments where you're just
like another day, another you know, a guest star, so cool,
no big deals on you, Hannah, because.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
Your outfit, you were like, that's what I cared about,
you know what I mean, Oh.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
My gosh, that outfit. That was my first time ever
going to Artesia ever well going there and I was like,
and you were like, I've been here many times. Let
me take you to the best stores. And I was like,
what you opened up that whole part of LA to me.
I had no idea the best and was so overwhelmed,
like anybody who's gone like Indian wedding dress shopping. I
(18:04):
had never done that before. It's not like even going
just for like your white wedding dress, like time's it
by a million in terms of options. So how did
how did? I can't even I can't remember, like how
we landed on what we chose for the wedding dress.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Oh. When I took you there and we tried stuff on,
it was like, hands down, it was the most magnificently embellished, gorgeous.
Sorry ever, it was like, oh my god. So it
was there was no competition. You put it on and
it was like whoa, that's the one. Yeah, that was amazing.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
It was incredible. I just remember being like, what's little India?
Like I truly had no idea because I was still
so new to La and being like wow, okay, so
you mentioned Prince, so we've got to talk about it,
like how did he was that? Also, Ward, you're bringing
close to him. I know he does a whole dress
up sequence with Zoe in phenomenal clothes. What was that?
Speaker 2 (19:06):
So he we were in touch with his people and
they were going to bring sort of we gave them
sort of things we were looking for and they were
like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and he's so tiny
and his feet were so tiny. So they were going
to bring the shoes and dah da da da dah.
Oh my god, I'm just thinking about those shoes. Oh
my god. They were like a wedge and it was
(19:29):
a clear heel that you could see through, and they
were just outrageous. Yeah, everything he brought was outrageous. But
we also had really taken it very seriously and had
gotten some of the most amazing things from Palace Costume
in different places, and so we just had an assortment
of stuff. So he wore his stuff, and he wore
(19:50):
a little bit of our stuff, and then Zoe wore
some stuff as well, Right, she puts stuff on. Yeah,
but it was like it was really like an out
of body experience because it was so normal that it
was weird. Like it was so weird, it was so normal,
and like, yeah, my conversation with him, sitting in the
(20:11):
director's chair next to him, we talked about the weather
in Minneapolis, like we had like the most normal conversation
that you'd have when you meet your cousins in the
Midwest and you have a little conversation. That's what it
was like. And I remember the end of the day
just thinking, oh my god. And I don't know. I'm
(20:34):
sure you remember, Hannah, when he like in between he
just was sitting on the couch and then he started
playing the guitar. But we were just all trying to
be so cool and it was so not cool. It
was like, oh my god, Prince is sitting five feet
away from me and he's playing the guitar and singing,
Oh my God. Like it was and nobody could emote
(20:57):
or express themselves really until after because we all had
to be so cool. You know, we were so cool,
and it.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
Was so everybody trying to hold it together was the
greatest thing in the world because everyone's just like trying
to just be like casual and then you would watch
people like step out for you know, craftier to get
a snack or something and then just being like, oh
my god, oh my god, like these like mini heart
attack moments.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Of like and then Hannah, it's true, right, Like the
reason he wanted to do it is because he had
a crush.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
On our little Hannah. Yeah a Christian you Yeah, it
was yeah. Yeah. He tried for a very long time.
He tried for a very long time. To find a
way to be in the same room together. Yep, And
I uh, I was not interested in that way. Love
(21:53):
a Prince song, Happy to a Prince record, I was
not interested in anything else. So I was never in
the same room with Prince. And then yeah, he uh
it was like a teenage boy showed up at my job,
which was really funny. And then that's apparently with people
that he really likes that to have that time, quality
time with he likes to he liked to play ping pong,
(22:14):
and so that's why they I don't know if you
were still there at that point, but at the night
it was like five in the morning, they had to
write in the tag because how were they going to
incorporate ping pong into the show? And they had to
write this tag where Prince would get his request, which
was he wanted to play ping pong with me, And
(22:36):
they saved it as the last thing that we shot
because they were low key scared that if we shot
that early, he would be east Prince so he could
be like, Okay, I'm gonna go now, and so we
saved it for the end. And the thing that I'll
never ever I don't play ping pong I'm not a
good ping pong player. I was so tired. It had
been a you know, twenty something our day, and I
(22:59):
just slammed the shot and he had it because I
was just so tired. My body just went like we're
doing it, and then he was like he genuinely did
walk off, which was really funny. But you guys had
put me in that gold like bandage dress, and to
this day, I don't think I've ever looked as good
(23:19):
as I did on the day that I met Prince
because that dress. I mean, it didn't seem like on
the hangar you're like, oh, it's nice, but somehow it
was like made for my body. I don't know. You
guys had the most amazing way of just like pulling
it in here, pulling this part up here, sensing this
thing in here, we're gonna take it up an inch,
and then it was like it was like Cinderella every time,
like it was made to hide the things you don't
(23:42):
want to see and to compliment the things, and to
give you body parts you didn't even have, and it
was like you guys were magicians that way. It was
wild to me. And I watched that episode and I
was like that dress gave me the confidence to be
like that was a real high pressure episode. That was
like their biggest one, right, and he was there, And
(24:04):
I feel like somebody told me too about like the
Zoe like the outfit changes. It was all with like
a Stevie Nicks like yeah, right, like that was her
thing she was going for at the time. How fun
it was. What's the most I guess aside from Prince,
because how can we compare anything to that day that
(24:25):
was crazy? Aside from Prince, what was your favorite episode
or moment or fashion moment in the show that you
You're like, that was a good time.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Well, the Indian wedding and the dancing and that whole
thing was just amazing. And yeah, and that was sort
of the prequel to the movie when I did Murder
Mystery Too. I don't know if you.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Saw, but I saw it.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Yeah, Indian and I had everything made in India for
like three hundred dancers. But I got a taste of
that from having done New Girl, and I met this
woman in Artesia who had a factory in Mumbai and
she ended up doing all the manufacturing for me. So yeah,
(25:15):
it was really really special, and yeah, I just love that,
and I loved you know, Schmidt and his funny outfit.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Or the suit. Were you guys part of that, the
development of the suit?
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Yeah? That was crazy. Did you guys have to make that?
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Yeah, people love that.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
People talk about that all the time. Especially when the
pandemic hit. It had like a resurgence. People were like,
where can we get it? It's got to be real
so funny.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
No, I should probably watch it the whole thing again
because I have to tell you it's hysterical. So I
had Kathy and Megan with me, of course, and we'd
read the script and then I'd go, Okay, you guys,
you have to tell me, like what.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Does it mean?
Speaker 2 (26:11):
Like? Am I that old that I don't get the jokes?
They got the biggest kick out of it. And we'd
go through the script together and they'd be like yeah,
and then they'd have to explain it to me. I
was like, oh my god, not another generation. It was
(26:32):
like humor had gotten to another level. I was like,
oh my god, I don't even understand it.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Oh the other question I had to ask you Another
person asked me this, and I was like, I'll ask
ever we get on the show. It was about the
raining cats and dogs Halloween cape right that was on.
It was that something you guys had to make too
with the cats and dogs.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Whatsh Yeah, but that's like we love doing it, like
that's what we donna right right, that's like what I do,
you know what I mean? Like so when we have
the ability to do anything like that, we're down on it,
you know.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
Yeah, like it's a fun episode too exactly.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
I mean anybody can like go shopping or do It's like,
that's not really what we do. I'm a costume designer
and you know Kathy's gone on to become a big designer.
You know, she's Post Malone's designer and all these rock
stars heard that yeah for years and it's done like
the most amazing things. So yeah, we're always looking for
(27:40):
like the creative moment.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
Yeah, of something that you can kind of inject your
your creativity into. And what's do you remember the biggest
like challenge you had a new girl where you fought
for something and you're like, this is this needs to happen.
Trust me on this one.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
You can't really go there without getting myself in trouble. Fair, Okay, Fair,
So you know we had some powers that be that
it's a little arm wrestling going on at times, but
uh yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
You know what's funny is I remember there were very
few moments where I, you know, because we worked together
so long and so there's always going to be a
moment I guess right where you're just like, well, I
don't understand or whatever it is. We all have good days,
bad days. We were again, we're family at that point,
(28:36):
so we just had to have a lot of grace
for each other going through the things when it happened,
and know that, you know, we loved each other and
we're all good people. But I remember I feel like
it was for the Ferguson funeral, and you know, like
they did that dramatic open like they were at a
funeral and to look like a cast member died or something.
(28:57):
And I don't remember. I can't remember because it was
so long ago. If it was me, and it was
like either I wanted to wear a coat or I
didn't want to wear a coat. Either was cold and
I wanted a coat, or it was sweltering. Maybe it
was sweltering, but we had to wear coats. I don't
know what it was. And I just remember I don't know,
and I was like, I really don't want and I
(29:17):
don't know why that was like this little hill I
wanted to die on that day or something. And I
don't know what those moments were sometimes and then now,
of course with time and you pull back from it
and you just go like girls sometimes you know, yeah,
you gotta wear things you don't want to wear, even
if it's uncomfortable. You're selling a story and it's a
(29:37):
cohesive look. And as I've moved now into producing and
executive producing, I have such a deeper understanding of those moments.
And I'll tell you, like, you had some really great
like mom energy sometimes where you're just sort of like, well,
I know you feel that way, we're gonna put the
coat on. And it was sort of like and then
(29:59):
that's what we had to do. And I was grateful
for that because otherwise it starts to for me at
least I think, you know, it's like you get an insue,
maybe start to push a mile a little. But I remember,
I feel like it was around that Fergusing thing, and
I feel like that was those moments of somebody being like, no,
that's what's happening. This is what we're doing, so be
(30:21):
uncomfortable on a hot day. That's we're all a little
uncomfortable sometimes in this business. But I appreciated it.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
I have a visceral reaction to what you're saying, so
inside of me I remember, but in my brain I
don't exactly remember, but the emotion came up of remembering that.
And that's how it is with a lot of what happens,
you know, like how far do you push and how
(30:47):
important is it? And you know, for the most part,
I for me to care has to mean something, because
really I don't really give a shit about a lot
of stuff that has to do with things that aren't important,
especially for things on the screen. You know, it's really
(31:09):
important for me of what we see, but there's a
lot of stuff that we don't see that there's a
lot of energy put into unnecessarily, and I think sometimes
that happens on shows like this, where a lot of
energy gets spent on things that are not that important,
and then sometimes when something is important, it's only obvious
(31:34):
to very few people. So it's the nature of the
beast of working on a collaborative show, which I love.
But yeah, it's and you know, I'm so used to
being in charge and being in charge of my life
and my family and the things that I'm involved in
(31:57):
that you know, in this work, I'm just a messenger.
So I have to really use a lot of self
control to kind of, you know, keep myself in a
place where it's not it's not about my ideas, it's
not not even you know, doesn't matter what it is,
you know, whether it's a two hundred million dollar movie
(32:17):
that I'm designing or not. You know, it's you present
what you have and then you deal with what the
feedback is and you make it work. So you know,
it's definitely a collaborative thing. Nobody is really in charge.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
Yeah, yeah, I feel that deeply. I feel like that.
And again, as I've stayed longer in the industry, I
understand that more and more. I love how you keep
learning how important and unimportant it all is, and that
hopefully you're all on the same team, right and we're
all here for the win. Because as soon as one
(32:57):
person starts to make it fully just about them and
their experience, that's what starts to feel bumpy, because then
it starts to have this weird domino effect on everything
and So those moments, those little teaching moments that I
had on New Girl. I always feel like New Girl
prepared me for going out into the world to be
on other shows, because it was very loving, but there
was there was boundaries of things where like, well, this
(33:18):
is kind of where that moment is, and this is
kind of like where we're drawing the line, and sometimes
we'd push, but then I feel like we'd all find
a way to come back together. And I think that's
the when people talk about the chemistry of this show,
Lamarne and I always say, like it goes well beyond
what you guys saw on screen, like every department. Really,
(33:39):
that was the thing that always blew my mind as
you would hear like you've worked with every movie star
in the world, on every huge TV show, You've worked
with the greatest directors in the world, and there isn't
a single drop of apathy that has ever felt when
you walked into our trailer, like five times a week,
(34:00):
coming in cared about like every you know, pair of
jeans that I put on, or this T shirt or
here's options for your accessories, but wear one. Trust me,
you want to start wearing these accessories. Anna. I remember
those conversations like how do you not yeah, how do
you not get jaded? How do you just keep that
passion alive no matter what because you had it every
(34:21):
time you walked in the room.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
Well I couldn't. You know, I'm doing this. This is
my third career and I'm thirty four years into this career,
so you know, I mean, but I'm at a different
place in my career even now than I was then.
It's not that I don't care, because I cared, maybe
even more now, but I have a really different approach
(34:48):
to how I work and I only work for people
that I love. I don't My agent calls me and
she'll go, I know you like this person, but do
you love them? And I'm like, no, I just like them.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
Pass Wow. Yeah, and that's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
Well, it makes every project or gasmic literally like amazing
because it's not just creative and interesting but fun and
there's a different flow that happens. It really is collaborative.
(35:28):
It's not just pretending to be where someone is really
in charge and then pretends that we're being collaborative. The
things I work in are very collaborative. And you know,
I met just at this point in my career that
I can't do it any other way, And I feel
like I have learned a lot to be where I
(35:48):
am and make the decisions that I make.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
I was saying that to someone the other day of
a sense maybe of what you're saying, which is the
greatest part is like when you in this industry, is
when you get your career to the point where you
can really embrace the power of no. You can say no,
and so you're only doing the work you want to
do with the people you want to do it. And then,
of course, and it becomes highly enjoyable because they fully
(36:11):
trust you and you fully trust them, and you don't
have to deal with any of that stuff, right, so
all of a sudden, the battles are less and the
excitement is higher. And it's because you have the privilege
and luxury. It's a certain point from working for it
where you can say yeah, pass.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
Yeah, no, it's it took a long time, you know,
it's it's took a long time to get to this place.
It didn't just happen.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
You've worked on everything with everyone truly, like truly, I mean,
your career is so aspirational, is there, Like what's left
on like they're your bucket list of things you want
to do or types of stories you'd like to be
part of telling.
Speaker 2 (36:52):
You know, Hannah, I never I didn't take the route
of doing those interesting projects of those working with the
Michael Man's of the world. And I had the option
to do all of that, but I was raising children,
and I had a husband, and I was in LA
and I needed to create a career trajectory that was
(37:17):
going to work for them. And I'm a workaholic, so
I mean, there were those years when I had to
do five and six projects at the same time in
order to make enough money to support my family, and
I worked my ass off. I just you know, for
(37:37):
almost thirty years, I worked my ass off, and I
had a goal, which was to take care of my
family and make sure that we could live the way
we needed to live. And my husband's a therapist and
work in school with kids with learning disabilities, so our
income wasn't going to come from there, and I had
(37:58):
to make those decisions early on, which I did, so
I never took those interesting projects that I was offered
because I couldn't leave the country and I couldn't leave
my family, so I did a lot, you know, friends,
was ten years, you guys was seven years. Like a
lot of the projects I did in LA I did
(38:18):
because I could be here and I could be with
my family. Now I'm in a place where my kids
are grown, where I travel all the time. I was
gone all year last year doing a movie all over
the world, and I travel a lot, and I work
for people who do movies out of the country a lot,
and I just want to keep working for people that
(38:39):
I adore, you know, where it's like this last project,
you know, I've known them, Oh my god. Well, I
work for John Daily and Jonathan Goldstein, who are partners
writing and directing partners. And John Daly was my little
boy on Prigs and Geeks, you know, came up to
(38:59):
my chin and now I was six foot four, gorgeous, fabulous,
brilliant director, writer. And Jonathan Goldstein, who's his partner, grew
up in Beechwood, Ohio, which is where I'm from. So
working for these boys and their families and their children,
it's like, I don't know, it's not like working. It's
like going off with your family, you know, and being
(39:23):
together and having fun. And yeah, it's pretty amazing, you know,
I still manage to do Shabbat every Friday night, no
matter where I am in the world, and with crews
of thirty five people, some of whom are no One's Jewish,
and everybody is just loving the idea of coming together
(39:46):
once a week to have a moment, you know, And
so that's kind of my priority. And in terms of
stories that I want to tell, you know, I'd love
to do an opera. I'd love to do a Broadway show,
but it's probably not going to happen at this point
in my life. And I think that's okay. I am
(40:06):
going to write a book, which I've started, just about
the creative aspect of my careers, all three of them,
and you know, sort of what it takes to sort
of move through the creative process and all of these
things and making these life changes that you have to
make in order to sort of get where you need
(40:28):
to be. So, but you know, New Girl was it
was a very special time. And I had a really
wonderful relationship with Zoe as well. And she's another person
I haven't seen since then, which is crazy. And yeah,
(40:49):
and there was a time, you know, when we would
go to synagogue together, all right, Remember yeah, kids, when
the kids were little. Yeah, so yeah, so life. You know,
everybody has their own own journey, and I just hope
that everybody is, you know, happy and healthy and has
nice long futures and careers to look forward to.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
You always were the wisest woman. I feel like walking
around our set and I remember our fittings always gave
me such a sense. I always said, you remind me
like a lot of my dad in the sense my
dad's Buddhist and he has such a sage and a teacher,
and it's the way he talks about what's important, what's success,
(41:35):
what truly faills our cup. And you know, my dad
was living in another country and I was, you know,
by myself. I had no family here in La I remember,
and I really just would treasure those conversations we would
have because those weren't all the conversations that were being
had about what was important or energy was being given
on what's important. And even now talking about like what
(41:57):
your you know, your career going forward, what the priority
is of what's filling your cup, takes me back to
those days in the trailer of like what we would
really talk about and what was really important, which made
then everything else we were doing, which was like trying
on nine pairs of jeans feel fun.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
I know, we had very deep conversations while you were
like putting shirts on and off, and Kathy was taking
pictures and you and I were just like really into it. Yeah,
we had some yea, we got into it. And I
cherish those times together too, because for me, that's really important.
And if you can have those kind of conversations in
(42:36):
the middle of a day of doing a sitcom, it's
pretty fabulous.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Debra. I loved you then, I love you now. I
am so grateful that this magical show somehow has kept
us connected and brought us together to talk. I can't
wait for your book. When your book comes out, please
come and talk on this show and Lamour and we'll
be here, probably knowing Lamour in a full bird shirt,
sunglasses and trying to make everybody laugh. I love you,
(43:04):
Thank you for your time, and thank you for everything
you did on this show. We appreciate you so deeply.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
You're welcome. Love you, Hannah
Yeah, no mess Welcome to the Mess around. It is
our New Girl Recap, a recap podcast that I do
with Lemourn and we bring in all the New Girl
(00:26):
fan favorites that made the show the show, and I
would say, without exaggeration, maybe fifty percent of our questions
are about what we're wearing. How it all came to
be where people can get a bird shirt, we're zolways,
clothes made or bought, I mean on and the wedding dresses,
(00:48):
the amazing weddings, and I'm like, this was Debra's world.
We somehow And I remember this when I got a
New Girl and they said that Deborah maguire was doing costumes.
It was really my first job in the industry. So
I was like, Okay, I can't wait to meet Deborah
and they're like, no, like they got Deborah and I
(01:11):
was like, Okay, what does that mean? And they're like,
she's the greatest in the entire business. Nobody can understand
how they got her. And then I got to learn
over like almost a decade of how and why you
are the best in every single aspect of what you do.
So what is your New Girl origin story? How did
(01:34):
you get connected to the show, and why did you
agree to do it?
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Truthfully, it must have had to do with Jake Castin, right,
mm hmm. Yeah. So you know, I started working with
Jake on Freaks and Geeks, and then I started doing
all of his shows, and you know, we had the
three shows going for a long time, and I'm sure
(02:01):
that's how I got there.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Jake was just like, you're you're part of this world.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Right, I've done At that point, I'd worked with him
since he was twenty two years old, I think get out.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yeah, so he was like, you have to be part
of this. How did you approach creating the looks for
the central cast of New Girl.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Well, I had this idea that was about color and
with you know, Zoe being the teacher and sort of
the center of the cyclone. I thought of it like
a box of Crayola krans and that She was like, like,
(02:43):
I have a real connection to Crayola Kranz from the
time I'm a child. I can like smell, I know
what it smells like. Like I every time the boxes
got bigger and there were more crans in there, it
was the most exciting thing in the world. So I
sort of dealt with it like that, and she was
a Creola cran And then I designed everybody else around them,
(03:04):
around her, and that's why she had all those primary
colors and and everybody else, you know, because it's an
ensemble and you guys are together so much, much the
same as I had when I did Friends. It was
the same thing. When you have an ensemble cast and
they're together a lot, it's more about the way it
(03:26):
looks together than it is about the individual fashion because subliminally,
you know, we're looking at the screen as a painting,
so it needs to look beautiful. So that's my main
concern always, that's the first concern. And then you know,
sometimes you know, I have to have some disappointment about,
(03:48):
you know, things that work and things that don't, and
having to adjust that palette. But for the most part,
you know, I designed by palette, and this show fit
in pretty well. I mean, you know, your character added
a lot of different silhouettes from Zoe's silhouettes, and also
some patterns that we didn't really see that often in
(04:11):
her clothes.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, with Zoe's clothes, I feel like I remember conversations
about you made right.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Quite a few. We made a lot of her looks
most of them actually, because she had that you know,
that fifties silhouette, so if it wasn't vintage, and sometimes
we had a vintage style that worked perfectly, so I
would knock off a pattern from that and then do
a series of dresses off of that. But her figure
(04:41):
was such that that shirt waist showing her waist was
really the best look for her. So we made that,
and we also made all those jammies she wore. She
wear a lot of pajamas.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
You know what's really funny, I have a very clear
memory of my first fitting with you.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
So do I at night downtown at that down Yeah,
me too.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
Oh my gosh, okay, I took a screen grab of this. Well,
we'll play. We'll put the picture up properly when we
put it in the show. It's so funny because again
it was my first show. I have to show you.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
It was this.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yes, it's like going to focus.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Yes, there the feathers, that's right.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
And so I remember, so I've again never done a
big show. This was my first big thing I'd ever booked,
and they were like, well, never wants to meet you downtown.
I was like downtown, and so I was not the
most confident driver. I only learned to drive in La,
So I'm like trying to like navigate my way, hoping
I don't die on the way to the fitting. And
it was a beautiful day, and I think you were
finishing up something else. I don't even know if it
(05:49):
was for a new girl, maybe for something else, because
you were in this fabulous, fabulous like warehouse and and
so I was waiting on the roof. And I remember
waiting on the roof and it was this beautiful day
and blue skies, and I was I just couldn't believe
it was real. I had then been educated on your
career and who you were, and I was like, I
(06:11):
guess I'm going to figure out who this character was
not understanding like there's going to be multiple looks. There's
going to be your core look. This is going to
be like a joke photoshoot that you're going for a
fitting for. I didn't understand all those things yet, and
so I think someone came I don't know who came
up and like tap me on the shoulder and they
were like, Debraa's ready, And I came in and they're
(06:32):
on this rack. Were some of to this day, the
most wild outfits with shoes and like hats that I
had ever seen in my entire life, and it was
one of the most fun things I've ever done. So
what was that space? Where did that conversation come about
to like go that far with it?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Truthfully, I have a real recollection of it. But I
don't remember what that company was. I don't know that
they exist anymore. But I did know that they had
inherited like tons of old McQueen and lots of amazing
(07:11):
dresses and things that I just wouldn't be able to
access in other places, and I thought that would be
like a perfect place to try stuck on it. I
remember we tried on some McQueen shoes, really weird shoes,
and it was really fun.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, I have pictures of it. I have to find them.
I think it's on my other computer. I have pictures
from the fitting. You sent me the fitting pictures. I'll
text them to you too. And their outfits are fabulous,
I mean they're beyond fabulous. And then I remember that
that was the outfit that they chose for a scene
that never made it into the pilot on the cutting
room floor, I know, but it was so and I
(07:49):
remember the hair. We just like went for it with
this incredible look and I was like, this is going
to be so fun. And I was so nervous, and
they put me on the stage and then a security
safety guy came out and was like, nobody speak, nobody move,
and they brought in a vulture, like a bird of prey,
(08:11):
and I was dressed like a bird, and they were like,
nobody speak because these are like predatory animals and we
don't want it to get scared. And then I remember
Aaron O'Malley coming over to whisper to me. She's like, okay,
so then we're just gonna give you a hand signal
for action. And then in the scene I was screaming
(08:31):
into the phone dressed as a bird. Well this bird
was next to me. I was like, this was the
most surreal experience of my life and that outfit was
the most incredible thing I'd worn. And then instantly in
that moment became so terrifying because I felt like I
was a bird.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
It was and it never made it right into it. Yeah,
welcome to my world. Like the most fabulous things I
think I have ever done in my life. I didn't
make it in the movie because.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
No one ever saw. I also have to share another
memory with you because it was also in that first
year we got nominated for a Golden Globe. I don't
know if you remember this conversation, and I was like,
the only person I need to talk to is Deborah.
And I had found a dress and I loved it
so much, and it was green, and I remember having
(09:25):
you come to my trailer and I was like, I
want to talk to you in confidence about something. I
really like this dress. It's great and my first time
I ever gonna wear like a fancy designer on a
red carpet, like and I was so worried that Zoe
would be wearing the same color and that I would
in any way distract from her by wearing the same color.
(09:47):
It was like old school, like high school thinking, like
I was just so worried that, you know, like I
don't know the rules of the red carpet. And I
remember you gently sitting down with me and explaining of
all these people's like dresses that you'd had made and
had done for every like award show, and you were like,
it doesn't matter. Wear the dress that you want to wear,
(10:11):
whatever it is. Everybody's gonna be wearing every color. And
it was the kindest moment of education and sudden that
I had nothing to do with our show, but just
in terms of my own confidence of being able to
stand in what felt good to me, not in a
character to be able to go to this honoring and
I had no one else to kind of turn to
(10:31):
that I would have believed. And I think about that
all the time, even now when I'd choose an outfit,
I'm always like, oh, it doesn't matter when anybody else
is wearing or doing or the palette. In those moments,
you can just express yourself and what feels good. And
that was you. That was you teaching me that in
taking the time, and I think it was pretty you know,
(10:54):
crazy as always on that show, but you found like,
I don't know, fifteen minutes and sat down and just
walk me through it in those moments.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
I don't know you realize that that's so sweet.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Yeah, it was a really powerful one for me. I
just have the fondest memories of us being in that
trailer and we would do these huge fittings and we
would talk about our lives and our families and our
pain always always and it was you just always had
that time to share and it was really like you
(11:26):
and your department was really I think Laura and I
talk about all the time like that was like family,
Like it's what made it feel like we were so
cared for because it was really And you've been on
a lot of those shows where it's people's first experience
being kind of thrust out there and they're looking at
our bodies and then how you guys outfit us, you know,
(11:46):
gives us the confidence or makes us self conscious and
out of our body.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Well, we had Kathy and Megan, who are like my daughters.
So Kathy just became a grandmother. If you can believe it, No.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
I can not.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
Yes, what yes?
Speaker 1 (12:02):
Wow? Oh but that's so sea.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
So I know I feel like she just had, you know,
her baby, not that long ago. But it's crazy.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Wow. Yeah, how did you? Okay? So the big question
is I have been put in charge of this because
we put a like a call to action out to
the fans about this, and I would say about fifty
percent of those questions coming in were about Lamarne, about
Lomarn and the bird shirt. And so I'm going to
read you this from a fan her name is Amy Caruso.
(12:33):
She wrote, I love listening to the show every week.
Hearing the Debora will be on got me so excited
because I have a question that's been haunting me for years.
I think this is a big fan theory that we
all want to know. So, season four, episode twenty one,
Jess and Nick talk about who they are growing old with.
After Nick says he just sees himself next to Winston,
just says, yeahmy too. I just see an ancient Winston
(12:53):
eating handfuls of bird seed right out of the bag.
He just really gets in to birds. Could you please
confirm if this was foreshadowing of or the triggering idea
to Winston's obsessions with bird shirts for the very next season.
What's the background on the birds?
Speaker 2 (13:11):
Interesting questions? So I don't think that's the case. However,
I do believe in all of these things that we do,
that there is a level of synchronicity that exists with everything.
And you know, what happens in a television show sort
of mirrors real life. You know that when people ask me,
(13:35):
you know about the characters, and from season to season,
it's like everybody evolves in the same way that we
evolve as human beings because we're going through these periods
of time. So I don't think there's a direct correlation
between the bird seed and the bird And I think
also what the fans should know is that the biggest
(13:57):
evolution was schmidt evolution in terms of him as a
person and his personal style. I mean, if you remember
he was in polo shirts for you know a few seasons,
I think, I mean, and you know a lot of
that doesn't necessarily have to do with me and my ideas,
(14:20):
but has to do with sort of the next level
of writers and people who are giving us the information
about the characters so we can best satisfy. Sometimes we're
at odds, but I am a servant to them. They
do not serve me. That being said, a lot of
(14:43):
decisions don't necessarily come from me directly. They come from above,
from the writing. You know a lot of it and
a lot of the ideas that get generated are things
that we have to process from information that we get
from the be And in doing that and evolving his
(15:04):
character to those great shirts, and that became sort of
an obsession with us because it was a really good
place for us to be creative, which we're always looking
for and you know, sometimes you know, once we get
into who these characters are, there's only so much creativity
that we can insert, unless, of course, we have a
(15:26):
fabulous wedding or we have a reason to create something.
The day to day is pretty much within its little bubble.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
So yeah, I knew Girl had a lot of those
fun episodes. It seems like with like Halloween episodes.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Halloween episodes definitely, and hello we had Prince I mean yeah, hello,
probably only the greatest experiences ever.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Why, I mean still to this day it feels really surreal.
We're recapping season three right now, which comes off the
heels of Taylor Swift being in the season two finale.
Did you pick that Elaine dress? Was that provided by wardrobe?
Was that hers?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
No? We those are our dresses?
Speaker 1 (16:18):
How did you decide on that iconical? So many people
said that they went to the Taylor Swift concert dressed
as a lane, so like they remade the dress. They
have like altered dresses to beat the Elaine dress.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Okay, so just so you know, you know, I'm old,
What can I say? You know, like she falls within
a category that like I didn't really know, you know,
it didn't have any more importance than you know, anybody
else being on the show. The ideation, don't. I didn't
equate her with Prince. Let's put it that way. Okay, okay,
(16:55):
Prince is my wheelhouse. So for me, Taylor Swift was
like dealing with any other actor that comes in, you know.
And so the dress, you know, we had picked up
dresses and she was very agreeable. You know, she was
lovely to work with. Easy, So you know, I don't
(17:16):
remember that much except looking at pictures on her phone
of her cats. You know. That's so.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
That's so It's funny, right, those moments where you're just
like another day, another you know, a guest star, so cool,
no big deals on you, Hannah, because.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
Your outfit, you were like, that's what I cared about,
you know what I mean, Oh.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
My gosh, that outfit. That was my first time ever
going to Artesia ever well going there and I was like,
and you were like, I've been here many times. Let
me take you to the best stores. And I was like,
what you opened up that whole part of LA to me.
I had no idea the best and was so overwhelmed,
like anybody who's gone like Indian wedding dress shopping. I
(18:04):
had never done that before. It's not like even going
just for like your white wedding dress, like time's it
by a million in terms of options. So how did
how did? I can't even I can't remember, like how
we landed on what we chose for the wedding dress.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Oh. When I took you there and we tried stuff on,
it was like, hands down, it was the most magnificently embellished, gorgeous.
Sorry ever, it was like, oh my god. So it
was there was no competition. You put it on and
it was like whoa, that's the one. Yeah, that was amazing.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
It was incredible. I just remember being like, what's little India?
Like I truly had no idea because I was still
so new to La and being like wow, okay, so
you mentioned Prince, so we've got to talk about it,
like how did he was that? Also, Ward, you're bringing
close to him. I know he does a whole dress
up sequence with Zoe in phenomenal clothes. What was that?
Speaker 2 (19:06):
So he we were in touch with his people and
they were going to bring sort of we gave them
sort of things we were looking for and they were
like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and he's so tiny
and his feet were so tiny. So they were going
to bring the shoes and dah da da da dah.
Oh my god, I'm just thinking about those shoes. Oh
my god. They were like a wedge and it was
(19:29):
a clear heel that you could see through, and they
were just outrageous. Yeah, everything he brought was outrageous. But
we also had really taken it very seriously and had
gotten some of the most amazing things from Palace Costume
in different places, and so we just had an assortment
of stuff. So he wore his stuff, and he wore
(19:50):
a little bit of our stuff, and then Zoe wore
some stuff as well, Right, she puts stuff on. Yeah,
but it was like it was really like an out
of body experience because it was so normal that it
was weird. Like it was so weird, it was so normal,
and like, yeah, my conversation with him, sitting in the
(20:11):
director's chair next to him, we talked about the weather
in Minneapolis, like we had like the most normal conversation
that you'd have when you meet your cousins in the
Midwest and you have a little conversation. That's what it
was like. And I remember the end of the day
just thinking, oh my god. And I don't know. I'm
(20:34):
sure you remember, Hannah, when he like in between he
just was sitting on the couch and then he started
playing the guitar. But we were just all trying to
be so cool and it was so not cool. It
was like, oh my god, Prince is sitting five feet
away from me and he's playing the guitar and singing,
Oh my God. Like it was and nobody could emote
(20:57):
or express themselves really until after because we all had
to be so cool. You know, we were so cool,
and it.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
Was so everybody trying to hold it together was the
greatest thing in the world because everyone's just like trying
to just be like casual and then you would watch
people like step out for you know, craftier to get
a snack or something and then just being like, oh
my god, oh my god, like these like mini heart
attack moments.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Of like and then Hannah, it's true, right, Like the
reason he wanted to do it is because he had
a crush.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
On our little Hannah. Yeah a Christian you Yeah, it
was yeah. Yeah. He tried for a very long time.
He tried for a very long time. To find a
way to be in the same room together. Yep, And
I uh, I was not interested in that way. Love
(21:53):
a Prince song, Happy to a Prince record, I was
not interested in anything else. So I was never in
the same room with Prince. And then yeah, he uh
it was like a teenage boy showed up at my job,
which was really funny. And then that's apparently with people
that he really likes that to have that time, quality
time with he likes to he liked to play ping pong,
(22:14):
and so that's why they I don't know if you
were still there at that point, but at the night
it was like five in the morning, they had to
write in the tag because how were they going to
incorporate ping pong into the show? And they had to
write this tag where Prince would get his request, which
was he wanted to play ping pong with me, And
(22:36):
they saved it as the last thing that we shot
because they were low key scared that if we shot
that early, he would be east Prince so he could
be like, Okay, I'm gonna go now, and so we
saved it for the end. And the thing that I'll
never ever I don't play ping pong I'm not a
good ping pong player. I was so tired. It had
been a you know, twenty something our day, and I
(22:59):
just slammed the shot and he had it because I
was just so tired. My body just went like we're
doing it, and then he was like he genuinely did
walk off, which was really funny. But you guys had
put me in that gold like bandage dress, and to
this day, I don't think I've ever looked as good
(23:19):
as I did on the day that I met Prince
because that dress. I mean, it didn't seem like on
the hangar you're like, oh, it's nice, but somehow it
was like made for my body. I don't know. You
guys had the most amazing way of just like pulling
it in here, pulling this part up here, sensing this
thing in here, we're gonna take it up an inch,
and then it was like it was like Cinderella every time,
like it was made to hide the things you don't
(23:42):
want to see and to compliment the things, and to
give you body parts you didn't even have, and it
was like you guys were magicians that way. It was
wild to me. And I watched that episode and I
was like that dress gave me the confidence to be
like that was a real high pressure episode. That was
like their biggest one, right, and he was there, And
(24:04):
I feel like somebody told me too about like the
Zoe like the outfit changes. It was all with like
a Stevie Nicks like yeah, right, like that was her
thing she was going for at the time. How fun
it was. What's the most I guess aside from Prince,
because how can we compare anything to that day that
(24:25):
was crazy? Aside from Prince, what was your favorite episode
or moment or fashion moment in the show that you
You're like, that was a good time.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Well, the Indian wedding and the dancing and that whole
thing was just amazing. And yeah, and that was sort
of the prequel to the movie when I did Murder
Mystery Too. I don't know if you.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Saw, but I saw it.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Yeah, Indian and I had everything made in India for
like three hundred dancers. But I got a taste of
that from having done New Girl, and I met this
woman in Artesia who had a factory in Mumbai and
she ended up doing all the manufacturing for me. So yeah,
(25:15):
it was really really special, and yeah, I just love that,
and I loved you know, Schmidt and his funny outfit.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Or the suit. Were you guys part of that, the
development of the suit?
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Yeah? That was crazy. Did you guys have to make that?
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Yeah, people love that.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
People talk about that all the time. Especially when the
pandemic hit. It had like a resurgence. People were like,
where can we get it? It's got to be real
so funny.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
No, I should probably watch it the whole thing again
because I have to tell you it's hysterical. So I
had Kathy and Megan with me, of course, and we'd
read the script and then I'd go, Okay, you guys,
you have to tell me, like what.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Does it mean?
Speaker 2 (26:11):
Like? Am I that old that I don't get the jokes?
They got the biggest kick out of it. And we'd
go through the script together and they'd be like yeah,
and then they'd have to explain it to me. I
was like, oh my god, not another generation. It was
(26:32):
like humor had gotten to another level. I was like,
oh my god, I don't even understand it.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
Oh the other question I had to ask you Another
person asked me this, and I was like, I'll ask
ever we get on the show. It was about the
raining cats and dogs Halloween cape right that was on.
It was that something you guys had to make too
with the cats and dogs.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Whatsh Yeah, but that's like we love doing it, like
that's what we donna right right, that's like what I do,
you know what I mean? Like so when we have
the ability to do anything like that, we're down on it,
you know.
Speaker 1 (27:15):
Yeah, like it's a fun episode too exactly.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
I mean anybody can like go shopping or do It's like,
that's not really what we do. I'm a costume designer
and you know Kathy's gone on to become a big designer.
You know, she's Post Malone's designer and all these rock
stars heard that yeah for years and it's done like
the most amazing things. So yeah, we're always looking for
(27:40):
like the creative moment.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
Yeah, of something that you can kind of inject your
your creativity into. And what's do you remember the biggest
like challenge you had a new girl where you fought
for something and you're like, this is this needs to happen.
Trust me on this one.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
You can't really go there without getting myself in trouble. Fair, Okay, Fair,
So you know we had some powers that be that
it's a little arm wrestling going on at times, but
uh yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
You know what's funny is I remember there were very
few moments where I, you know, because we worked together
so long and so there's always going to be a
moment I guess right where you're just like, well, I
don't understand or whatever it is. We all have good days,
bad days. We were again, we're family at that point,
(28:36):
so we just had to have a lot of grace
for each other going through the things when it happened,
and know that, you know, we loved each other and
we're all good people. But I remember I feel like
it was for the Ferguson funeral, and you know, like
they did that dramatic open like they were at a
funeral and to look like a cast member died or something.
(28:57):
And I don't remember. I can't remember because it was
so long ago. If it was me, and it was
like either I wanted to wear a coat or I
didn't want to wear a coat. Either was cold and
I wanted a coat, or it was sweltering. Maybe it
was sweltering, but we had to wear coats. I don't
know what it was. And I just remember I don't know,
and I was like, I really don't want and I
(29:17):
don't know why that was like this little hill I
wanted to die on that day or something. And I
don't know what those moments were sometimes and then now,
of course with time and you pull back from it
and you just go like girls sometimes you know, yeah,
you gotta wear things you don't want to wear, even
if it's uncomfortable. You're selling a story and it's a
(29:37):
cohesive look. And as I've moved now into producing and
executive producing, I have such a deeper understanding of those moments.
And I'll tell you, like, you had some really great
like mom energy sometimes where you're just sort of like, well,
I know you feel that way, we're gonna put the
coat on. And it was sort of like and then
(29:59):
that's what we had to do. And I was grateful
for that because otherwise it starts to for me at
least I think, you know, it's like you get an insue,
maybe start to push a mile a little. But I remember,
I feel like it was around that Fergusing thing, and
I feel like that was those moments of somebody being like, no,
that's what's happening. This is what we're doing, so be
(30:21):
uncomfortable on a hot day. That's we're all a little
uncomfortable sometimes in this business. But I appreciated it.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
I have a visceral reaction to what you're saying, so
inside of me I remember, but in my brain I
don't exactly remember, but the emotion came up of remembering that.
And that's how it is with a lot of what happens,
you know, like how far do you push and how
(30:47):
important is it? And you know, for the most part,
I for me to care has to mean something, because
really I don't really give a shit about a lot
of stuff that has to do with things that aren't important,
especially for things on the screen. You know, it's really
(31:09):
important for me of what we see, but there's a
lot of stuff that we don't see that there's a
lot of energy put into unnecessarily, and I think sometimes
that happens on shows like this, where a lot of
energy gets spent on things that are not that important,
and then sometimes when something is important, it's only obvious
(31:34):
to very few people. So it's the nature of the
beast of working on a collaborative show, which I love.
But yeah, it's and you know, I'm so used to
being in charge and being in charge of my life
and my family and the things that I'm involved in
(31:57):
that you know, in this work, I'm just a messenger.
So I have to really use a lot of self
control to kind of, you know, keep myself in a
place where it's not it's not about my ideas, it's
not not even you know, doesn't matter what it is,
you know, whether it's a two hundred million dollar movie
(32:17):
that I'm designing or not. You know, it's you present
what you have and then you deal with what the
feedback is and you make it work. So you know,
it's definitely a collaborative thing. Nobody is really in charge.
Speaker 1 (32:35):
Yeah, yeah, I feel that deeply. I feel like that.
And again, as I've stayed longer in the industry, I
understand that more and more. I love how you keep
learning how important and unimportant it all is, and that
hopefully you're all on the same team, right and we're
all here for the win. Because as soon as one
(32:57):
person starts to make it fully just about them and
their experience, that's what starts to feel bumpy, because then
it starts to have this weird domino effect on everything
and So those moments, those little teaching moments that I
had on New Girl. I always feel like New Girl
prepared me for going out into the world to be
on other shows, because it was very loving, but there
was there was boundaries of things where like, well, this
(33:18):
is kind of where that moment is, and this is
kind of like where we're drawing the line, and sometimes
we'd push, but then I feel like we'd all find
a way to come back together. And I think that's
the when people talk about the chemistry of this show,
Lamarne and I always say, like it goes well beyond
what you guys saw on screen, like every department. Really,
(33:39):
that was the thing that always blew my mind as
you would hear like you've worked with every movie star
in the world, on every huge TV show, You've worked
with the greatest directors in the world, and there isn't
a single drop of apathy that has ever felt when
you walked into our trailer, like five times a week,
(34:00):
coming in cared about like every you know, pair of
jeans that I put on, or this T shirt or
here's options for your accessories, but wear one. Trust me,
you want to start wearing these accessories. Anna. I remember
those conversations like how do you not yeah, how do
you not get jaded? How do you just keep that
passion alive no matter what because you had it every
(34:21):
time you walked in the room.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
Well I couldn't. You know, I'm doing this. This is
my third career and I'm thirty four years into this career,
so you know, I mean, but I'm at a different
place in my career even now than I was then.
It's not that I don't care, because I cared, maybe
even more now, but I have a really different approach
(34:48):
to how I work and I only work for people
that I love. I don't My agent calls me and
she'll go, I know you like this person, but do
you love them? And I'm like, no, I just like them.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
Pass Wow. Yeah, and that's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
Well, it makes every project or gasmic literally like amazing
because it's not just creative and interesting but fun and
there's a different flow that happens. It really is collaborative.
(35:28):
It's not just pretending to be where someone is really
in charge and then pretends that we're being collaborative. The
things I work in are very collaborative. And you know,
I met just at this point in my career that
I can't do it any other way, And I feel
like I have learned a lot to be where I
(35:48):
am and make the decisions that I make.
Speaker 1 (35:50):
I was saying that to someone the other day of
a sense maybe of what you're saying, which is the
greatest part is like when you in this industry, is
when you get your career to the point where you
can really embrace the power of no. You can say no,
and so you're only doing the work you want to
do with the people you want to do it. And then,
of course, and it becomes highly enjoyable because they fully
(36:11):
trust you and you fully trust them, and you don't
have to deal with any of that stuff, right, so
all of a sudden, the battles are less and the
excitement is higher. And it's because you have the privilege
and luxury. It's a certain point from working for it
where you can say yeah, pass.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
Yeah, no, it's it took a long time, you know,
it's it's took a long time to get to this place.
It didn't just happen.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
You've worked on everything with everyone truly, like truly, I mean,
your career is so aspirational, is there, Like what's left
on like they're your bucket list of things you want
to do or types of stories you'd like to be
part of telling.
Speaker 2 (36:52):
You know, Hannah, I never I didn't take the route
of doing those interesting projects of those working with the
Michael Man's of the world. And I had the option
to do all of that, but I was raising children,
and I had a husband, and I was in LA
and I needed to create a career trajectory that was
(37:17):
going to work for them. And I'm a workaholic, so
I mean, there were those years when I had to
do five and six projects at the same time in
order to make enough money to support my family, and
I worked my ass off. I just you know, for
(37:37):
almost thirty years, I worked my ass off, and I
had a goal, which was to take care of my
family and make sure that we could live the way
we needed to live. And my husband's a therapist and
work in school with kids with learning disabilities, so our
income wasn't going to come from there, and I had
(37:58):
to make those decisions early on, which I did, so
I never took those interesting projects that I was offered
because I couldn't leave the country and I couldn't leave
my family, so I did a lot, you know, friends,
was ten years, you guys was seven years. Like a
lot of the projects I did in LA I did
(38:18):
because I could be here and I could be with
my family. Now I'm in a place where my kids
are grown, where I travel all the time. I was
gone all year last year doing a movie all over
the world, and I travel a lot, and I work
for people who do movies out of the country a lot,
and I just want to keep working for people that
(38:39):
I adore, you know, where it's like this last project,
you know, I've known them, Oh my god. Well, I
work for John Daily and Jonathan Goldstein, who are partners
writing and directing partners. And John Daly was my little
boy on Prigs and Geeks, you know, came up to
(38:59):
my chin and now I was six foot four, gorgeous, fabulous,
brilliant director, writer. And Jonathan Goldstein, who's his partner, grew
up in Beechwood, Ohio, which is where I'm from. So
working for these boys and their families and their children,
it's like, I don't know, it's not like working. It's
like going off with your family, you know, and being
(39:23):
together and having fun. And yeah, it's pretty amazing, you know,
I still manage to do Shabbat every Friday night, no
matter where I am in the world, and with crews
of thirty five people, some of whom are no One's Jewish,
and everybody is just loving the idea of coming together
(39:46):
once a week to have a moment, you know, And
so that's kind of my priority. And in terms of
stories that I want to tell, you know, I'd love
to do an opera. I'd love to do a Broadway show,
but it's probably not going to happen at this point
in my life. And I think that's okay. I am
(40:06):
going to write a book, which I've started, just about
the creative aspect of my careers, all three of them,
and you know, sort of what it takes to sort
of move through the creative process and all of these
things and making these life changes that you have to
make in order to sort of get where you need
(40:28):
to be. So, but you know, New Girl was it
was a very special time. And I had a really
wonderful relationship with Zoe as well. And she's another person
I haven't seen since then, which is crazy. And yeah,
(40:49):
and there was a time, you know, when we would
go to synagogue together, all right, Remember yeah, kids, when
the kids were little. Yeah, so yeah, so life. You know,
everybody has their own own journey, and I just hope
that everybody is, you know, happy and healthy and has
nice long futures and careers to look forward to.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
You always were the wisest woman. I feel like walking
around our set and I remember our fittings always gave
me such a sense. I always said, you remind me
like a lot of my dad in the sense my
dad's Buddhist and he has such a sage and a teacher,
and it's the way he talks about what's important, what's success,
(41:35):
what truly faills our cup. And you know, my dad
was living in another country and I was, you know,
by myself. I had no family here in La I remember,
and I really just would treasure those conversations we would
have because those weren't all the conversations that were being
had about what was important or energy was being given
on what's important. And even now talking about like what
(41:57):
your you know, your career going forward, what the priority
is of what's filling your cup, takes me back to
those days in the trailer of like what we would
really talk about and what was really important, which made
then everything else we were doing, which was like trying
on nine pairs of jeans feel fun.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
I know, we had very deep conversations while you were
like putting shirts on and off, and Kathy was taking
pictures and you and I were just like really into it. Yeah,
we had some yea, we got into it. And I
cherish those times together too, because for me, that's really important.
And if you can have those kind of conversations in
(42:36):
the middle of a day of doing a sitcom, it's
pretty fabulous.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Debra. I loved you then, I love you now. I
am so grateful that this magical show somehow has kept
us connected and brought us together to talk. I can't
wait for your book. When your book comes out, please
come and talk on this show and Lamour and we'll
be here, probably knowing Lamour in a full bird shirt,
sunglasses and trying to make everybody laugh. I love you,
(43:04):
Thank you for your time, and thank you for everything
you did on this show. We appreciate you so deeply.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
You're welcome. Love you, Hannah
Hosts And Creators
Lamorne Morris
Hannah Simone
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