November 1, 2024 • 46 mins
Turning around the voices in our head is a tough task to face.
Just ask today’s guest, mental health and suicide prevention activist, Kevin Hines, who attempted to take his own life and is now helping save others from doing the same.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is the most traumatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast.
Hello everybody, Chris Harrison coming to you from the home
office in Austin, Texas. Today's show is I'm just letting
you know off the bat, it's going to be emotional, meaningful,
and powerful. If you don't know who Kevin Hines is,
(00:22):
he's my guest today. And if you don't know, it's okay,
because honestly, I had no idea I was out in California.
I love to host events. I'm hosting one this weekend
for Sergio Garcia, the golfer, and his wife Angela, for
four kids. It's one of the things I feel like
I can do with my time and my talent. I
can't sing, I can't dance, but I love to host events.
(00:46):
I do auctions. I do it all because I feel
like that's one way that Elz and I can really
give back. And so I host a lot of events
throughout the year. And there's one that I have hosted
for several years now out in Monterey, California. It's for
the AIM. It's the AIM Gal. It's for the AIM Foundation,
which is for youth mental health suicide prevention. Something that's
(01:08):
kind of near and dear to Elsie and I's heart.
There's another big foundation that we always support, the Grant
Haliburton Foundation out of Dallas, Texas, which was started by
a family that was really close to my family. But
the am Gala I met through friends, and I really
love what they do, and so I started supporting them
and hosting their galap So this year, Elsie and I
(01:31):
went up to host and I was going through the
run of show and I noticed I was introducing the
keynote speaker and it was Kevin Hines. And I'll be honest,
I was completely ignorant. I did not know Kevin. I
didn't know his story, and I started googling and doing
some research because I wanted to be a little educated
on who I was introducing, and my jaw dropped. I
(01:54):
sat there for an hour reading Kevin's story and the
nuts and bolts of it is this. Kevin Hines attempted
to take his life back in nineteen ninety four by
jumping off the Golden Gate Bridge, but he lived, and
he lived to tell the story, and that is the
(02:17):
impetus for everything that has happened since. He is now
an award winning author, speaker. He speaks around the world
on suicide, suicide prevention, on hope, on the ripple effect
of suicide, and just mental health in general. Guys, when
(02:37):
I heard Kevin talk, first of all, you could have
heard a pen drop in the room. He had everybody
spellbound and tears are in her eyes. He is the
most wonderful human being. To say nothing of what a
great speaker he is, just what an amazing human I
was so moved when he walked off the stage. I
(02:58):
have to ask him about this because I felt well. Later,
I thought, did I just hug him? I didn't know
what to say, and I literally just grabbed him and
I gave him a hug, and we just hugged each
other for like ten or fifteen seconds, and I just said,
I love you, I support you, I'm your friend. I've
never met you, but I am now one of those
(03:18):
people that are in your corner and will always be
there for you. Kevin still battles with so much, including depression,
including suicidal thoughts, how he lives with it on the daily,
how he's recovered, and how he speaks about this event
in his life. It just moved me so much that
(03:38):
the first thing I said Kevin, you have to come
on this podcast. We have to have this discussion. It's
an important topic for me and I don't know if
there is a human being in the world that is
more equipped to talk about today's subject. And I just
wanted to give you a heads up of what we're
going to talk about. We're going to talk about his
suicide attempt. We're going to talk talk about living through it,
(04:01):
the pain, all these thoughts. So I just wanted to
give you, you know, if that is activating for you,
I just want to give you fair warning. But I
do think this is going to be positive. I want
you to know and we're what we can learn from this.
And so I hope that if you know someone who's
having these thoughts or struggling with this, I hope this
(04:21):
is good for them. I hope it's cathartic and it's helpful.
So today's guest, maybe the most important guest we have
ever had on this podcast, my now very good friend
Kevin Hines.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Hello, how are you, Chris.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
As I just said to all the listeners, my now
very good friend Kevin Hines, Yes, very good friend.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Absolutely you bet.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Kevin. Do you remember so the night you spoke in California.
You walked off the stage. I didn't know you. We
had never met, and I'll be honest, I was ignorant.
I didn't know your story and you just I'm sure
like most people, my jaw hit the floor. There were
tears in my eyes, if you remember. But you walked
off the stage and I just gave you a hug.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
I just remember. It was bess hugs I've ever had
all year.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
I know it lasted awkwardly, a little too long, but
I was just like, oh, I said, Chris.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Chris, wait a minute, because twenty three second hugs release
oxytocin in the brain that make it feel better.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
I think we hit twenty three seconds.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I think we did it.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
I think we did. I just said, I just said, hey, man,
I love you, I am your friend. I got your back,
and you said the same thing to me, and I
so I love you for it. And I thought, man,
if you would just please come on this podcast and
let's talk about your message and what you have been through,
because as I just spoke to the listeners, I said,
you know, there was nobody more equipped on the face
(05:43):
of the earth than you to talk about depression, suicide, prevention,
how we can survive each day and get through these moments.
So thank you for being here, my friend, Chris.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
The thanks is all mine. You're giving me a wonderful
opportunity to share a message that means the world to
me that we hope helps a lot of people. So
what a gift.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
And we will talk about the documentary suicide the Ripple
Effect that is out and I will we'll get to that,
but let's go back. And I know this is a
story you've told many times. And by the way, for
everyone listening, I've talked to Kevin. It's okay. He will
talk about this. You know, I'm not prying when we
talk about this event. Nothing is off limits with Kevin.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Now.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
That's one thing I love about you is you are
an open book, which is so hard to find in
this area because usually in these situations, we want to
shy away from it, right, we want to hide these stories.
But I love you for being so open for us.
So you jumped off the Golden Gate bridge. Take me
to that day. What I was also curious about something
(06:50):
you didn't talk about that day was driving there, going
to the bridge.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah. Well, you know, first of all, I don't drive.
I have epilepsy, so I can't. I'm not legally allowed
to drive, not to mention, I'm horrible at it, so it's.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Probably good self awareness.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
It's self awareness. I took a bus first, I take
the first. I took a Munie train to the bus,
and on that Uni train, I'll never forget it. I
was dealing with such depths of self loathly and self
hatred that came from severe paranoia, major forms of depression,
(07:35):
alongside bipolar disorder. On the low side, paranoid delusions where
I would believe that people are out to get me,
trying to hurt me, trying to kill me. And I
was in such a dark place, hearing voices in my head,
auditory hallucinations, having visual hallucinations, seeing and hearing things nobody
else can see here, believing them to be as real
(07:58):
as the hands in front of my face. And those
voices were telling me I had to take my life
and that I had no choice, that it was in
fact inevitable. Those are the words the voices used. And
if you've never Chris, if you've never heard auditory hallucinations,
imagine your headphones are on, your earbuds are in and
instead of that podcast that like this or that music
(08:20):
or that or that book. You're hearing a person or
people's voices in your head screaming at you things you
don't want to do, and they're telling you you have
no other choice.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
And it's that clear, and it's that real in your head,
because I'll be honest, I have never felt that or
heard something like that, and so it's that real and
you're in your head.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people around the
world live with auditory hallucinations something both autit turned visual
like me, and you know, Chris, they can be nice.
I've met people that say their their voices tell them
wake up, brush your teeth, take your hour, you know,
stuff like that. But mine were very vicious, very mean,
(09:04):
and hated me and and they told me how to die.
So I get on that medi train, the mini train
gets to the next bus stop, and I vividly remember going,
I need I need a last meal. I need a
last meal, because why not? And so I walked into
a Walgreens, the Walgreens I frequented many many years where
I got my medications that I wasn't taking at the
(09:28):
time properly, right of course, uh and and and I
and I walk in there and I five finger discounted
a starbus and the skittles I stole it. I don't worry,
don't report me to the police. I since returned the
money and paid them, so we don't need to do that.
But but I did. This was my favorite two candies,
and I and I took them and I went. I
(09:49):
got on the next bus. I sat in the very
back row, in the middle seat, looking out upon everybody
who board it. And basically, over the course of the
time from that bus stop to the Golden gate Bridge
parking lot, about one hundred and so people boarded the bus.
And I'm the very last person in the middle, looking
at everybody, and I begin to cry softly, moderately, waterfalls
(10:15):
then flowing from my eyes. And then Chris, I began
screaming aloud at the voices I was hearing in my head.
Leave me alone. I don't want to die. Why do
you hate me so much? What did I ever do
to you? I'm a good person. And now, Chris, when
one hundred and so people are looking down the barrel
(10:36):
of the bus at me but saying absolutely nothing, except
for one man, the man to my left says to
the fella next to him, while pointing at me with
his thumb while smiling and laughing at my pain, what
the hell's wrong with that kid? And in that moment, Chris,
(10:59):
I think, what was the most alone I've ever felt
in my life?
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (11:04):
The problem, Chris is that I was surrounded at home
by a sea of people who love me dearly, and
in that moment of Sue's settle crisis, I could not
recognize that I could only see, feel, here, touch and
know immeasurable pain. And at this point in the conversation,
I always ask people, and I'll ask you, Chris. I
(11:26):
know it's your podcast and you're supposed to ask the questions,
but I want to ask you one question. Yeah, and
this is important for the audience to understand. Who don't
get suicidal ideation? Chris, what is the one thing you
want to happen when you find yourself an excruciating physical pain?
What do you want that pain to do?
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Go away? Go away as fast as possible.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Stop, go away, and or leave. That's physical pain.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
My argument over the last twenty three twenty four years
of doing this work in brain and mental health and
suicide prevention is that brain pain. Mental pain is three
hundred thousand times worse than any physical pain we could
ever experience. Because the people around us tend to invalidate
it because they cannot see it, it must not be real,
(12:11):
and that needs to change. Now back to the story hand.
There I was on the bridge, devastated beyond measure and
hearing the voices while looking at the people ignoring me,
while in the greatest, single, greatest painful moment in my life,
believing I had to take my life and believing I
(12:32):
had no other option. And the bus, of course, gets
to the Golden Gate Bridge parking lot, and one hundred
people deboard right there with their Fannie packs and their
foreign accents and their cameras that weren't yet phones.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Right a bunch of tourists, people going to see the bridge.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
And literally, Chris, there was nobody left on the bus
but me and the driver, and I am just hoping
beyond all hope and wishing beyond wishes and praying beyond
all prayers that this bus driver will see me and
see my pain. Not that it's his responsibility, but when
(13:09):
you think about the larger issue of suicide and suitsaid preension.
It's all of our responsibilities look out for our fellow
human being and those that may be in danger, even
of themselves. I think, because you know, we live in
a tough world, especially these days, and people are hurting
(13:31):
and in deep pain that they're not talking about it.
And there's a reason they're not talking about it. They're
not talking about it because they don't feel safe talking
about it. They don't feel sane talking about it, and
they feel like when they talk about it, they're gonna
be locked up in a white wall, padded room and
throat and the key is gonna be thrown away. That's
how I felt.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
Yes, I was on that bus.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
The bus gets there, everybody need boards and the bus
driver eyes me, looks right at me and goes, come on, kid,
get off the bus. I gotta go. You couldn't even
see it. So I walk up to him, look him
right in his eyes. Waterfalls are now flowing from mine,
and he just motions me to get off the bus.
And I walked down those two short steps and they
(14:11):
felt like a million my heart heavy, my body weighing down,
the pains so great, and I walked onto the span
on the Golden gate bridge, and I paced back and
forth for nearly forty minutes, crying like a baby.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
How old are you at this time? I was nineteen
nineteen years old.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
Yeah, And bikers and joggers and runners and tourists and
patrol officers searching for suicidal people went by me twice. Now,
I always make it clear those officers at the time,
in the year two thousand, they they did not have
the training they have today. I've trained many of them.
They did not at the training they have today to
(14:50):
search for people who are in that place. And over
the last ten years, those officers have, in their valiant
effort saying between fifty and one hundred and twenty lives
from going over those rails every That's incredible, and that's
more power to them. But they didn't have that protocol
(15:10):
for me. They had that protocol because of me. And
so I found myself at a very particular light rail,
which I'll never forget, and I never name it because
I never want anybody to copy what I did. But
I know the exact light rail, and I leaned over
that four foot nothing rail that ease of access to
(15:32):
lethal means, and I cried profusely. My tears to the
water blow. And I really was having this innern dialogue
battle with the voices and then with my I guess
you would call it my conscience saying Kevin, don't do this.
This is wrong. You can't do this. Find a phone,
(15:54):
call anybody. I didn't have a cell phone. Call anybody,
Call anyone. You loves you now, And then the voices
would go, you must die jump now. A woman from
my left approached me and she was smiling, and I thought,
(16:18):
oh my gosh, this is my lady, this.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Is the she sees my pain, an angel.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
She's gonna ask me if I'm okay, I don't have
to do this. I don't have to die today. I
left the fate of my life in a complete stranger's hand,
and it wasn't fair to her. Yeah, And she walks up,
big sunglasses on, and she goes, will you take my picture?
(16:46):
And hands me a digital camera.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Oh my gosh, And.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
I took her camera and she posed five.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Times and there's tears strolling just streaming down your face.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Where I was gonna leave the world forever. Yeah, maybe
the sun was in her eyes, Chris. Maybe she was
trying to reach me in her own way, and there
was a language bearer who knows, who knows, But she
takes her camera back and she walks away, not twenty
yards off the bridge, back across the whole span to
re experience it all over again where I was there
(17:20):
to destroy myself.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
And as you saw her walk away, that was like
your life preserver. Yeah, floating away that that was your hope.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I mean, the bus driver, the people on the bus,
that was enough. But this one, this woman, you know,
you know, even if she was trying to reach me,
I couldn't catch it. And that was like my life preserver.
I was hoping, beyond a hope that she was going
to say something. And when she walked away, this message
flooded into me. It wasn't so much a voice that
(17:48):
I was hearing at this point, it was how I felt.
And at this moment I said to myself, absolutely no
one cares. And that is the single greatest lie any
of us have ever told. When I go and speak
around the world, I don't remember if I did it
(18:08):
there at Pebble Beach, but when I go and speak
around the world, every time I tell that part of
the story, I say, by an honest raise of hands,
if any of you had been there on that day,
seeing nineteen year old me leaning over that four foot
nothing rail, that ease of access to lethal means ready
to leave my family and this world forever, how many
of you would have cared.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
You did, and we all raised our hands, every one
of us.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Everybody raises their hand every time, no matter what country,
no matter what life it's everyone raises their hand. People care.
But there is a blockage on both sides. There's a
blockage in your mind for the people that are suicidal
to say the truth, and there's a blockage on the
(18:53):
other side for the people who love them who don't
know how to ask the question, are you thinking of
killing yourself having made plans to take your life? And
do you have the means? Because the crisis text lines
original AI algorithm, which predates this all this AI craze,
hyper Intelligent has determined those three questions get a more
honest answer than are you thinking of suicide or are
(19:15):
you thinking of self harm? Because of the taboo on
the word suicide and the fact that self harm is
by definition not suicide, it's self harm. And so if
we can understand how to ask these questions to people,
in desperate pain, who we love or who we care about,
who we know, or who are our clients for the
people that are clinicians, if we can understand that and
not be afraid to say, Hey, I'm worried about you.
(19:37):
I'm wondering how you're doing. I know you haven't been
doing well. I can tell. And I'm going to ask
you three questions. But before I ask you those three questions,
before you answer them, I want you to be honest,
and I want you to know I'm lacking in any judgment,
no judgment at all from me, and I am here
for you to listen, to understand, not to respond. Then
(19:58):
you ask the questions, are you thinking of killing yourself,
having made plans to take your life? Do you have
the means? And you have a chance to save a
life in that moment? And it works often, it works often,
really most of the time. And so none of my
family knew that. So it's not their fault what happened.
They weren't They weren't too blamed for what I did,
and and and and one of the things your listeners
(20:21):
and your viewers will know is that all around the world,
there are millions upon millions of people and families that
have lost loved ones to suicide that inherently and innately
blame themselves. And it's not your fault. They didn't die
because of your inspited you. They died because of a
lethal emotional pain that had nothing to do with you.
(20:42):
Take that guilt off of your shoulders. That's too much
weight for anyone to bear.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Yeah, and it is very common. It's very common. I've
lost people to suicide, and I know a lot of
people listening have as well. And that is one of
the first things. If I had only talked to them,
if I had reached out one more time, if I
had not been on that business trip, or whatever the excuse,
you know that we have made up to carry that burden.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Yeah. Yeah, my sister I found out years later. I
found out fifteen years later. My sister blamed herself for
the last fifteen years after it happened.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Really I had.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
I would call her every morning we both went we
both went to City College at the same time, and
I would, I would were adopted. She's only nine months
older than me, and I would, I would. I would
call her every day before her class, And on this
day I called her from home I didn't get to
(21:38):
school yet, and she didn't pick up her phone. She
had a phone, she didn't pay her phone, she was
already in class, she couldn't pick it up. So she
blamed herself for fifteen years.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Well, and then she finally had that conversation with you
fifteen years later.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Teen years later, and she struggles today with severe clinical depression.
She wouldn't be shy of me telling you this. Right now,
she is in a psychiatric hospital as we speak. She
is really struggling.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
Is it because of that moment, because of that day,
or is it just this was.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
She's lived with clinical depressions since she can remember remembering. Yeah,
And she deals with chronic thoughts of suicide, which nobody
really talks about, the plague of chronic thoughts of suicide,
which I dealt with for a very long time. Now
they're seldom and few and far between, but they still occur.
She deals with that, and we're doing our best to
(22:31):
navigate through it and to get her help every day.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
So well, maybe you are the angel she needs, because
if anybody has, you know, equipped to be a good
brother in that sense, it would be someone who's been
in the trench hasn't been there. I mean, I'm sure
you can empathize with everything she's going through.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Absolutely, And I give her as many tools and techniques
as I can that she can utilize in the psych
word and do things a little differently and shift the pair.
I'm that's in our mind.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
So you make the decision to jump, you have that access,
and you take that leap off the Golden Gate Bridge
certain death. Your first thought was was what really shook
the room? When when you tell your first thought as
(23:35):
soon as you let go of that that handle the
guardrail to leap to you certain death? What was your thought?
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Instantaneous regret from my actions and this one recognition that
I just made the greatest mistake in my life. It
was likely too late. And Chris, for ninety nine point
nine percent of the people and they've jumped off the
bridges behind me, it's been too late. They're all gone.
(24:04):
Of the four or five thousand people that have died
off the Golden Gate Bridge, and look, the bridge Directorate
would like to tell the bridge authority who own and
run the bridge, would like to tell you that eighteen
hundred people have jumped off the bridge and died. That
number is ridiculous that was recorded at least twenty years ago.
(24:24):
They are not counting anymore. They haven't been counting for
a long time. They don't count the people that wash
away to see, never to be found. They don't count
the people that are eating by fish to the bone.
They don't count the people they find less than sixty
percent of the body, because when you hit those waters,
your limbs could be severed. The water is so sharp.
They don't count the people that wash away to see.
They don't count so many people. And when the bridge
(24:47):
directorate came out and said it was eighteen hundred people,
the marine corner who saw the bodies, a good friend
of mine, Ken Holmes, and the bridge patrol officers would
say when the Golden Gate Bridge District authority would tell
us that thirty forty people go off the Golden Gate Bridge,
it was more like sixty year higher. Count that for
(25:10):
ninety years.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Yeah, right, So.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
In any event, back to the story at hand.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
That you were saying, your first thought was immediate regret.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I regret. I coined that phrase in an Examiner article
when I first started talking about it, and after that,
nineteen of the twenty six remaining Golden gate Bridge jump
survivors the majority everyone else just didn't talk about it.
But nineteen forward to all say they had the same
exact instant regret that I had the moment their hands
(25:42):
left the rail, and that tells us a great deal
about it.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
I was just say, what is our takeaway from that?
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Yeah, think about it, Chris, Like, what about every other
mean of suicide? What about the people that had moments
before they actually passed away? What were they thinking? And
I have met thousands of suicide attempt survivors that have
attempted in all kinds of means that had the exact
(26:09):
same instint regret at the moment they thought they were
going to die. It's undeniable and it's tragic because if
we could just get to them in time, and I
don't mean the people who love them, I mean like society,
If society could change the narrative on suicide, if society
(26:29):
at large could say, you're not crazy, you're not a
psycho like they used to call me. You've got issues
you need to deal with, that you need to treat,
and that you need to heal from and find recovery,
and we're going to help you do it. At large,
but we you know, Chris, we spend this country I
(26:51):
think spends fifty times the amount of money on smallpox
a year then it on suicidevention and mental health. I'm
part Black. More seven to ten year old Black children
are dying by suicide than every before in the history
of the world. How does this seven year old child
how to take their life? Its my mind, It wrecks
(27:15):
my soul every day. I've been screaming from the mountaintops
for twenty three years, but sometimes I feel it. Not
here on your platform, but sometimes I feel like nobody's listening,
you know. And that's coming from a guy whose videos
have reached three billion people and over two hundred thousand
and counting have said this story saved their life. And
(27:36):
that's a gift and I'm grateful for it. But when
are we going to reduce the numbers of the human
race of suicide as a whole? And I'm not the
only one doing this. There's now thousands of mental advocates,
self proclaimed mental advocates across social media across the globe
doing the work trying to help make it change. And
let's make no mistake about it, They're making a difference.
(27:59):
A person to person changing and helping to save lives.
But we're not mental health experts. If we had mentalth experts,
there would be no mental health problems. If we had
suicide prevention experts, there would be no suicide. So I'm
never gonna label myself that I am on a journey
trying to help as many people as humanly possible, find
a way to be here tomorrow every day after that,
(28:21):
and talk about their immense, immeasurable pain and stop silencing it.
That's the biggest problem I think people have. Yeah, I
think that's the biggest issue is we get into this,
We get stuck into this recidivistic cycle of suiciddle thinking,
and then we decide to shut ourselves off and to
(28:41):
silence ourselves and to not tell anyone for fear of
how they will judge us. But if we are going
to go forward and be vulnerable and talk truth about
our suiticidil ideations, we can't be met with aggression. We
can't be met with anger, we can't be.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
Met with judgment, skepticism.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Yeah, no, yeah, you know you don't feel that way.
It's all in your head. No, we need to be
met with love, compassion, care, empathy and a total lack
of judgment and then steps to get better. And that's
that's what I've developed over the years, is that I
created a ten step plan that thousands of people utilize
(29:24):
called the Art of Wellness two point zero. It's ten
steps that I didn't invent. I didn't tell a novel idea,
and it make them up. They are science packed, evidence informed,
proven ways to benefit brain health, to change your life.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
And I'll say it again but just if you're listening
right now and you're like, oh my god, I need this,
go to at Kevin Hines story. That's at Kevin Hines
Story and you can find all this information. I'll say
it again later, but if I just for people listening,
if you're like, I need this now, I wanted to
get that out there. So Kevin, you you you do
(30:01):
make that jump, and ninety nine point nine that is
the real number. Ninety nine point nine percent of the
people who jump off that bridge. You reach terminal velocity
and you hit that water. And for those people that
don't know, hitting water is not like hitting a pillow.
You're it's you might as well hit a brick wall.
(30:22):
Water is very hard. I know that sounds weird, but
that's the physics of it. Did you just freakishly hit
at the perfect angle of somehow? I know you still
suffered massive internal damage, but you somehow survive this.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
So I'm very careful when I answer that question because
I want to I don't want once again, I don't
want to encourage people. Right, I will say, is this
you hit it fifteen thousand pounds of pressure. That's a
giant African elephant standing on your chest. The people who
have survived fell in the exact same way.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
Okay, I won't say, hey, yeah, yeah, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Yeah, it doesn't matter. But what people don't understand. And
I was written to by a good friend of mine
who's in my film sus Said the Ripple Effect. Marcus
Butler shared with me a spoken word poem he wrote
years after he had seen fifty seven dead bodies under
the Golden Gate Bridge. He saw the worst of the worst.
(31:23):
He saw all kinds of stuff, and it gave him severe,
severe PTSD and he is finally finding himself and finding
hope again. But he wrote it. He wrote a letter
to me, and he was worried about sending it to me,
but he wrote it to me, and he said, Kevin,
I help you understand. I want to share this with
people somehow. This is what happens when you jump off
(31:44):
the Golden gate Bridge. And I won't go into it,
but there are tens of ways to die off of
the Golden gate Bridge and they're all slow and violent, very.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Violent, but you survive. And look, if you are a
if you would believe in any higher being, you got
to hear this miracle story of Kevin's because you're there,
you're probably if you're not unconscious, you're somewhat unconscious from
the blow. There is no way you are swimming or
(32:14):
staying afloat. How did you stay afloat? That is the
most incredible miracle story of God just deciding it is
not your time yet.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Yeah, you know, like you, Chris, I have a firm
belief and faith in God. I always have, always will
to each their own. That said in the water, I
was going down. I couldn't get back to the surface.
I had surfaced and I was going down, couldn't get
back the surface, And I thought, this is it. I'm
gonna drown. It's over. What have I done? I don't
(32:48):
want to die. God, please save me, and at that moment,
at that moment, I said that something began circling beneath me.
It was very large, very slimy, and very alive, and
I panicked. I thought it was a shark, and those
are great white breeding grounds. So I'm punching my one
good arm, like this guy's skin's gonna eat me, and
I'm done. I didn't dive, jump it off the gold
and get bridge shark, It's gonna eat me perfect And
(33:10):
so it turns out it was no shark. I was
on a television program on ABC News with John Kinyonez,
who doesn't show what you do. It was on Primetime
Live when he did that, and he asked me the question,
you know what happened in the water? I said, I
thought them was a shark beneath me in the water. Well.
(33:30):
The show went viral online when they put it out
to the world, and one man wrote back. Morgan I
won't say his last name wrote back and said, Kevin,
I'm so very glad you're alive. I was standing less
than two feet away from me when you jumped. Until
this day watching this show, no one would tell me
whether you lived or died. It's hanted me until right now.
By the way, Kevin, there was no shark like you mentioned.
(33:51):
You thought there was on the show, but there absolutely was.
And I'll show you here a sea lion. And that's
Herbert the sea lion on my shirt, who's my spirit
animal and and uh and who saved my life that
day and did not leave from beneath me until the
Coastguard boat pulled up behind me.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
And he lifted you, literally lifted you at the surface,
swam under you, and pushed you up.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
I was deep in the water, and he butted me,
butt me, butt me, butt me up. He was circling
beneath my shoulders, my elbows and my knees, and eventually
I was just lying on the water, immobile basically, with
this thing just nudging me.
Speaker 1 (34:31):
Come on and.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
Call that what you want. That is very, very personal miracle.
And I was always in forever believe that God saved
my life that day.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
Well if if, if you don't call it divine intervention,
I'm not sure what else you would call that. I
could go on for hours with you, but I want,
I want to, because there's more to this story and
(35:03):
your background and all that. But what I really want
to do too is move forward for people that are
out there, and I want to go back over the
two sides of this. Number One, if you are listening
and you are struggling, if you are where Kevin was,
If you have suicidal thoughts, and I know you still
have suicidal thoughts, what is your advice? What steps immediately
(35:30):
should we be taking.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Okay, so you're in that position, you're in that mindset,
you're thinking of suicide, you're maybe making plans. Stop, take
a breath, Do four to forty resonance breadths into your
nose four seconds, hold four seconds, release eight seconds, like
ap purse lips, like a whistle of no sound. Do
(35:51):
that up to forty times if you can. It lowers panic, stress,
adrenaline and shock and anxiety. Bring your body to a
comp right now, give yourself time and hear me. Number one,
there's a two pronged technique I use every time suicidal
that I teach to everyone I know that is suicidal,
that works around the world and is now right now
(36:11):
working for my sister who's struggling. Two pronged technique. Find
a mirror, any mirror, anywhere, Look into that mirror and
repeat this. My thoughts do not have to become my actions.
They can simply be my thoughts. If they're dangerous to
myself or others. My thoughts do not have to become
my actions. They can simply be my thoughts. They don't
(36:34):
have to own, rule or define what I do next.
And the second thing you must do, and the most
important thing, is turn to anyone in front of you,
whether you know them from Adam or not, and say
four simple but very effective words with the right person,
I need help now. The difference between me and people
(36:57):
who die by suicide and attempt and I have an
attempt to in twenty four years is because I do
not stop saying I need help now until one person
is willing to answer the call. I have been at
the Atlanta Airport. I have stopped a TSA agent. I
have said I need help now. He was like, what
do you mean, buddy, I said suicidal. He took me
(37:17):
to a locked room, brought three police officers, two security guards.
I was almost on the no fly list, but he
got me to my wife. My cell phone had dad,
and he got me to safety. I need help now,
is the answer. Ask it every time, and you know, look,
we're not just talking the talk. We're walking the walk.
(37:38):
My family and I started the Bridge Rail Foundation, and
my wife and I were founding board members. My dad
was the founding board member along with Paul Muller and
Dave Hall. Dave Haull lost his thirteen year old daughter
of the bridge. We fought for the better part of
twenty years to raise the nets at the Golden Gate Bridge.
They are in place now across three hundred and sixty
thousand square feet of the bridge, and there's been a
(38:01):
three month period at the bridge where there were zero
suicides for the first time in almost ninety years. Wow.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
Wow, that's incredible.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Regular new film about it called The Net. It's the
harrowing journey of all of the people involved to make
this happen, and it is harrowing. The Bridge dractorate fought
us at every turn.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
Do you've Yeah, that makes you sick, by the way,
But when you have you found obviously people have jumped,
people have hit the net.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Yeah, people have.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
And have you found that those people have hit the
net had that regret and that has stopped them and
it then stopped them from continuing.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
I can tell you that the people that were saved
from the net attempted again, but I don't know the
specific details of that.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Asking for help, that is, I need
help now, are the most powerful words in the world.
And it's okay to talk about this, and that is
if you are ruggling. Now. For those of us that
are wanting to make a difference, whether we've lost someone
or not, I'm sure we all know somebody answering. I
(39:08):
assume number one, answer the call. You know, if someone
says I need help now, be that person, Be there
for them, be the support.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
And whether you don't know them or you know them,
just remember you could be the catalystic saving a life.
And understand that if it doesn't go that way and
they end up taking their life, that's not your fault.
We're not saying that, but but you could. We all
we all we are saying is that as a human condition,
we could be a little more loving, a little more kind,
(39:38):
a little more compassionate, and a little less judgmental of
those around us.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
There are disease. I lost my anti Crohn's disease many
years ago and it was very difficult. You know, doctors
and even family. You get frustrated at times because you
can't see it. You can't see their pain. And with
crones there's real, I mean actual pain, and same thing
with mental illness. It's so hard when you can't see
what someone's going through. It's you know, it's obvious when
(40:05):
you have this big gash and a cast on your
arm or your bandages. You're like, Okay, I get it.
There's cause and effect there, and I know that's our
own mental issues that we can't get the big picture
of that. But just because you can't see something doesn't
mean it's not excruciating. And like yourself, it was excruciating
what you were going.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Through, really was? It really was?
Speaker 1 (40:27):
Yeah, And I say this at every event I talked
to about mental health. About suicide, it's okay, And I
back me up on this because this is one of
the biggest misnomers. It's one of the biggest, you know,
pieces of misinformation. If you ask someone about suicide, if
you mentioned suicide, you increase the risk. That is false.
(40:49):
That is a lie. You do not increase the risk.
In fact, you help them by asking.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
A pain shared is a pain had when? But when
you ask someone if they're thinking about killing themselves specifically,
those words they made plans to take their life? Do
they have the means? You have the power to save
a life.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
And if you ask that and the answer is no, great,
then there you go. No harm, no foul, best case scenario, yeah,
who cares. But asking those three specific questions, and I'm
glad you said it again because I wanted to get
back to it is you know, are you thinking about
taking your own life? Do you have the means? And
(41:34):
ask those questions. Don't be afraid to ask those questions.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
Don't be afraid.
Speaker 1 (41:39):
Where can we find the documentary that's out, Not obviously
the new one Net I'm very interested to see, but
Suicide the Ripple Effect. Where can we find that?
Speaker 2 (41:50):
You can find that currently on Vimeo, on demand vi
Imeo and then just on demand plus Suicide the Ripple
Effect on Google, or you can just go to Vimeo
and search for it. Suicide the Ripple Effect E F
F E C T. And the new film The Net
is in pre production. We are we are raising funds
(42:10):
for a nap out and if you, if anyone, would
be so gracious as to help us support this film.
It's just the netmovie dot com.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
The neetmovie dot Com. I will be going there very quickly,
and and if you need to find Kevin, follow him
on social media. As I do, I continue to learn.
I mean, I've I'm pretty well versed in all this
as I've been speaking about it for years, but when
you meet someone the likes of you, all the different
(42:39):
podcasts you go on, all the times you speak around
the world, I learn more and more as I dive in.
So you can follow Kevin at Kevin Hines Story obviously
all together at Kevin Hines Story, and it really is revelatory.
It's just it's it's I know it sounds weird, but
it's actually positive. I know it's such a negative subject,
(43:02):
but it's so positive. When I watch your stories and
I listen to people speaking about suicide, I'm like, Okay,
there's hope. People are talking about this, and I will say,
the lights are coming on. We're finally speaking about this
more and more, and I'm very excited about the progress
that we are making.
Speaker 2 (43:18):
I totally agree with that. I think that I think
the people that are sane and well out there in
the world to the best of their ability, right, Yeah,
they're they're engaging, they're acting on things, they're fighting, they're
fighting for causes. They're getting behind people's causes. They're working
to amplify people's causes like you are right now. This
kind of interactivity is incredible and it's going to change
(43:40):
the shape of people's lives. And positive, powerful, hopeful, meaningful
media can save lives. We do it every day, and
we need more people. We need more soldiers in the
fight to produce positive, powerful, meaningful, kind, compassionate media as
opposed to the opposite.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
I love that great message to end on, my friend.
I was looking forward to this for a long time
and I will. I will end this as I began it.
I love you, my friend. I'm always there for you.
If you ever need anything, make me one of those
first calls. I appreciate you so much. I think that.
And again, I know we're both faith based people. I
(44:21):
believe that the Good Lord brings people into your lives
for a reason. Sometimes it's only for a season, but
also for a reason. I feel like you came into
my life for a reason, and vice versa. And I'm
so glad that you were able to come on and
talk about this message today, and it won't be the
last time I have you on.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
I hope, oh brother, that means the world to you.
Have no idea. I'm so grateful.
Speaker 1 (44:42):
And and one last thing, Yes, sir, my.
Speaker 2 (44:45):
Wife and I have got to take you and your
lovely wife out to.
Speaker 1 (44:47):
Dinner anytime you name it. I would love that so much. Yeah,
we need to we'll take this off air. All my
best to you and I will talk to you soon.
And by the way, when the net comes back on,
when when you release it in production, that we definitely will.
We'll have you back on to talk about that. That
impactful film as well. Thank you, brother, my thanks to
(45:09):
Kevin Hines. And again I can't urge you to follow
him enough at Kevin Hines's story. It's so important. I
hope you found that as impactful and meaningful as I
did when I heard it the first time, and I
wanted to bring it to you for those of you
that haven't heard his story. There are so many that
(45:30):
go to that bridge, or go to a number of
places that are kind of well known to try to
take their life, and for some reason, he was spared.
For some reason. Now he's decided to tell that story
and I God bless him for it. And again for
any of you that are struggling out there. You're not alone,
(45:50):
you are loved, and reach out. Ask that question, say
those four important words, I need help now. Please please
reach out. You're not alone out there, and you are loved.
There are people that care for you, no matter what
the voices are saying inside your head. So I wish
you all the best, and I appreciate Kevin coming on,
(46:11):
and I thank you for listening, and I hope you
love this show as much as I did today. God
bless and I'll talk to you soon because we have
a lot more to talk about. Thanks for listening. Follow
us on Instagram at the most dramatic pod ever and
make sure to write us a review and leave us
five stars. I'll talk to you next time.
This is the most traumatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast.
Hello everybody, Chris Harrison coming to you from the home
office in Austin, Texas. Today's show is I'm just letting
you know off the bat, it's going to be emotional, meaningful,
and powerful. If you don't know who Kevin Hines is,
(00:22):
he's my guest today. And if you don't know, it's okay,
because honestly, I had no idea I was out in California.
I love to host events. I'm hosting one this weekend
for Sergio Garcia, the golfer, and his wife Angela, for
four kids. It's one of the things I feel like
I can do with my time and my talent. I
can't sing, I can't dance, but I love to host events.
(00:46):
I do auctions. I do it all because I feel
like that's one way that Elz and I can really
give back. And so I host a lot of events
throughout the year. And there's one that I have hosted
for several years now out in Monterey, California. It's for
the AIM. It's the AIM Gal. It's for the AIM Foundation,
which is for youth mental health suicide prevention. Something that's
(01:08):
kind of near and dear to Elsie and I's heart.
There's another big foundation that we always support, the Grant
Haliburton Foundation out of Dallas, Texas, which was started by
a family that was really close to my family. But
the am Gala I met through friends, and I really
love what they do, and so I started supporting them
and hosting their galap So this year, Elsie and I
(01:31):
went up to host and I was going through the
run of show and I noticed I was introducing the
keynote speaker and it was Kevin Hines. And I'll be honest,
I was completely ignorant. I did not know Kevin. I
didn't know his story, and I started googling and doing
some research because I wanted to be a little educated
on who I was introducing, and my jaw dropped. I
(01:54):
sat there for an hour reading Kevin's story and the
nuts and bolts of it is this. Kevin Hines attempted
to take his life back in nineteen ninety four by
jumping off the Golden Gate Bridge, but he lived, and
he lived to tell the story, and that is the
(02:17):
impetus for everything that has happened since. He is now
an award winning author, speaker. He speaks around the world
on suicide, suicide prevention, on hope, on the ripple effect
of suicide, and just mental health in general. Guys, when
(02:37):
I heard Kevin talk, first of all, you could have
heard a pen drop in the room. He had everybody
spellbound and tears are in her eyes. He is the
most wonderful human being. To say nothing of what a
great speaker he is, just what an amazing human I
was so moved when he walked off the stage. I
(02:58):
have to ask him about this because I felt well. Later,
I thought, did I just hug him? I didn't know
what to say, and I literally just grabbed him and
I gave him a hug, and we just hugged each
other for like ten or fifteen seconds, and I just said,
I love you, I support you, I'm your friend. I've
never met you, but I am now one of those
(03:18):
people that are in your corner and will always be
there for you. Kevin still battles with so much, including depression,
including suicidal thoughts, how he lives with it on the daily,
how he's recovered, and how he speaks about this event
in his life. It just moved me so much that
(03:38):
the first thing I said Kevin, you have to come
on this podcast. We have to have this discussion. It's
an important topic for me and I don't know if
there is a human being in the world that is
more equipped to talk about today's subject. And I just
wanted to give you a heads up of what we're
going to talk about. We're going to talk about his
suicide attempt. We're going to talk talk about living through it,
(04:01):
the pain, all these thoughts. So I just wanted to
give you, you know, if that is activating for you,
I just want to give you fair warning. But I
do think this is going to be positive. I want
you to know and we're what we can learn from this.
And so I hope that if you know someone who's
having these thoughts or struggling with this, I hope this
(04:21):
is good for them. I hope it's cathartic and it's helpful.
So today's guest, maybe the most important guest we have
ever had on this podcast, my now very good friend
Kevin Hines.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
Hello, how are you, Chris.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
As I just said to all the listeners, my now
very good friend Kevin Hines, Yes, very good friend.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
Absolutely you bet.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Kevin. Do you remember so the night you spoke in California.
You walked off the stage. I didn't know you. We
had never met, and I'll be honest, I was ignorant.
I didn't know your story and you just I'm sure
like most people, my jaw hit the floor. There were
tears in my eyes, if you remember. But you walked
off the stage and I just gave you a hug.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
I just remember. It was bess hugs I've ever had
all year.
Speaker 1 (05:07):
I know it lasted awkwardly, a little too long, but
I was just like, oh, I said, Chris.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Chris, wait a minute, because twenty three second hugs release
oxytocin in the brain that make it feel better.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
I think we hit twenty three seconds.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I think we did it.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
I think we did. I just said, I just said, hey, man,
I love you, I am your friend. I got your back,
and you said the same thing to me, and I
so I love you for it. And I thought, man,
if you would just please come on this podcast and
let's talk about your message and what you have been through,
because as I just spoke to the listeners, I said,
you know, there was nobody more equipped on the face
(05:43):
of the earth than you to talk about depression, suicide, prevention,
how we can survive each day and get through these moments.
So thank you for being here, my friend, Chris.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
The thanks is all mine. You're giving me a wonderful
opportunity to share a message that means the world to
me that we hope helps a lot of people. So
what a gift.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
And we will talk about the documentary suicide the Ripple
Effect that is out and I will we'll get to that,
but let's go back. And I know this is a
story you've told many times. And by the way, for
everyone listening, I've talked to Kevin. It's okay. He will
talk about this. You know, I'm not prying when we
talk about this event. Nothing is off limits with Kevin.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Now.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
That's one thing I love about you is you are
an open book, which is so hard to find in
this area because usually in these situations, we want to
shy away from it, right, we want to hide these stories.
But I love you for being so open for us.
So you jumped off the Golden Gate bridge. Take me
to that day. What I was also curious about something
(06:50):
you didn't talk about that day was driving there, going
to the bridge.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah. Well, you know, first of all, I don't drive.
I have epilepsy, so I can't. I'm not legally allowed
to drive, not to mention, I'm horrible at it, so it's.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Probably good self awareness.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
It's self awareness. I took a bus first, I take
the first. I took a Munie train to the bus,
and on that Uni train, I'll never forget it. I
was dealing with such depths of self loathly and self
hatred that came from severe paranoia, major forms of depression,
(07:35):
alongside bipolar disorder. On the low side, paranoid delusions where
I would believe that people are out to get me,
trying to hurt me, trying to kill me. And I
was in such a dark place, hearing voices in my head,
auditory hallucinations, having visual hallucinations, seeing and hearing things nobody
else can see here, believing them to be as real
(07:58):
as the hands in front of my face. And those
voices were telling me I had to take my life
and that I had no choice, that it was in
fact inevitable. Those are the words the voices used. And
if you've never Chris, if you've never heard auditory hallucinations,
imagine your headphones are on, your earbuds are in and
instead of that podcast that like this or that music
(08:20):
or that or that book. You're hearing a person or
people's voices in your head screaming at you things you
don't want to do, and they're telling you you have
no other choice.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
And it's that clear, and it's that real in your head,
because I'll be honest, I have never felt that or
heard something like that, and so it's that real and
you're in your head.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people around the
world live with auditory hallucinations something both autit turned visual
like me, and you know, Chris, they can be nice.
I've met people that say their their voices tell them
wake up, brush your teeth, take your hour, you know,
stuff like that. But mine were very vicious, very mean,
(09:04):
and hated me and and they told me how to die.
So I get on that medi train, the mini train
gets to the next bus stop, and I vividly remember going,
I need I need a last meal. I need a
last meal, because why not? And so I walked into
a Walgreens, the Walgreens I frequented many many years where
I got my medications that I wasn't taking at the
(09:28):
time properly, right of course, uh and and and I
and I walk in there and I five finger discounted
a starbus and the skittles I stole it. I don't worry,
don't report me to the police. I since returned the
money and paid them, so we don't need to do that.
But but I did. This was my favorite two candies,
and I and I took them and I went. I
(09:49):
got on the next bus. I sat in the very
back row, in the middle seat, looking out upon everybody
who board it. And basically, over the course of the
time from that bus stop to the Golden gate Bridge
parking lot, about one hundred and so people boarded the bus.
And I'm the very last person in the middle, looking
at everybody, and I begin to cry softly, moderately, waterfalls
(10:15):
then flowing from my eyes. And then Chris, I began
screaming aloud at the voices I was hearing in my head.
Leave me alone. I don't want to die. Why do
you hate me so much? What did I ever do
to you? I'm a good person. And now, Chris, when
one hundred and so people are looking down the barrel
(10:36):
of the bus at me but saying absolutely nothing, except
for one man, the man to my left says to
the fella next to him, while pointing at me with
his thumb while smiling and laughing at my pain, what
the hell's wrong with that kid? And in that moment, Chris,
(10:59):
I think, what was the most alone I've ever felt
in my life?
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (11:04):
The problem, Chris is that I was surrounded at home
by a sea of people who love me dearly, and
in that moment of Sue's settle crisis, I could not
recognize that I could only see, feel, here, touch and
know immeasurable pain. And at this point in the conversation,
I always ask people, and I'll ask you, Chris. I
(11:26):
know it's your podcast and you're supposed to ask the questions,
but I want to ask you one question. Yeah, and
this is important for the audience to understand. Who don't
get suicidal ideation? Chris, what is the one thing you
want to happen when you find yourself an excruciating physical pain?
What do you want that pain to do?
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Go away? Go away as fast as possible.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Stop, go away, and or leave. That's physical pain.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
My argument over the last twenty three twenty four years
of doing this work in brain and mental health and
suicide prevention is that brain pain. Mental pain is three
hundred thousand times worse than any physical pain we could
ever experience. Because the people around us tend to invalidate
it because they cannot see it, it must not be real,
(12:11):
and that needs to change. Now back to the story hand.
There I was on the bridge, devastated beyond measure and
hearing the voices while looking at the people ignoring me,
while in the greatest, single, greatest painful moment in my life,
believing I had to take my life and believing I
(12:32):
had no other option. And the bus, of course, gets
to the Golden Gate Bridge parking lot, and one hundred
people deboard right there with their Fannie packs and their
foreign accents and their cameras that weren't yet phones.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
Right a bunch of tourists, people going to see the bridge.
Speaker 2 (12:49):
And literally, Chris, there was nobody left on the bus
but me and the driver, and I am just hoping
beyond all hope and wishing beyond wishes and praying beyond
all prayers that this bus driver will see me and
see my pain. Not that it's his responsibility, but when
(13:09):
you think about the larger issue of suicide and suitsaid preension.
It's all of our responsibilities look out for our fellow
human being and those that may be in danger, even
of themselves. I think, because you know, we live in
a tough world, especially these days, and people are hurting
(13:31):
and in deep pain that they're not talking about it.
And there's a reason they're not talking about it. They're
not talking about it because they don't feel safe talking
about it. They don't feel sane talking about it, and
they feel like when they talk about it, they're gonna
be locked up in a white wall, padded room and
throat and the key is gonna be thrown away. That's
how I felt.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
Yes, I was on that bus.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
The bus gets there, everybody need boards and the bus
driver eyes me, looks right at me and goes, come on, kid,
get off the bus. I gotta go. You couldn't even
see it. So I walk up to him, look him
right in his eyes. Waterfalls are now flowing from mine,
and he just motions me to get off the bus.
And I walked down those two short steps and they
(14:11):
felt like a million my heart heavy, my body weighing down,
the pains so great, and I walked onto the span
on the Golden gate bridge, and I paced back and
forth for nearly forty minutes, crying like a baby.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
How old are you at this time? I was nineteen
nineteen years old.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
Yeah, And bikers and joggers and runners and tourists and
patrol officers searching for suicidal people went by me twice. Now,
I always make it clear those officers at the time,
in the year two thousand, they they did not have
the training they have today. I've trained many of them.
They did not at the training they have today to
(14:50):
search for people who are in that place. And over
the last ten years, those officers have, in their valiant
effort saying between fifty and one hundred and twenty lives
from going over those rails every That's incredible, and that's
more power to them. But they didn't have that protocol
(15:10):
for me. They had that protocol because of me. And
so I found myself at a very particular light rail,
which I'll never forget, and I never name it because
I never want anybody to copy what I did. But
I know the exact light rail, and I leaned over
that four foot nothing rail that ease of access to
(15:32):
lethal means, and I cried profusely. My tears to the
water blow. And I really was having this innern dialogue
battle with the voices and then with my I guess
you would call it my conscience saying Kevin, don't do this.
This is wrong. You can't do this. Find a phone,
(15:54):
call anybody. I didn't have a cell phone. Call anybody,
Call anyone. You loves you now, And then the voices
would go, you must die jump now. A woman from
my left approached me and she was smiling, and I thought,
(16:18):
oh my gosh, this is my lady, this.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Is the she sees my pain, an angel.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
She's gonna ask me if I'm okay, I don't have
to do this. I don't have to die today. I
left the fate of my life in a complete stranger's hand,
and it wasn't fair to her. Yeah, And she walks up,
big sunglasses on, and she goes, will you take my picture?
(16:46):
And hands me a digital camera.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Oh my gosh, And.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
I took her camera and she posed five.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Times and there's tears strolling just streaming down your face.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Where I was gonna leave the world forever. Yeah, maybe
the sun was in her eyes, Chris. Maybe she was
trying to reach me in her own way, and there
was a language bearer who knows, who knows, But she
takes her camera back and she walks away, not twenty
yards off the bridge, back across the whole span to
re experience it all over again where I was there
(17:20):
to destroy myself.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
And as you saw her walk away, that was like
your life preserver. Yeah, floating away that that was your hope.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I mean, the bus driver, the people on the bus,
that was enough. But this one, this woman, you know,
you know, even if she was trying to reach me,
I couldn't catch it. And that was like my life preserver.
I was hoping, beyond a hope that she was going
to say something. And when she walked away, this message
flooded into me. It wasn't so much a voice that
(17:48):
I was hearing at this point, it was how I felt.
And at this moment I said to myself, absolutely no
one cares. And that is the single greatest lie any
of us have ever told. When I go and speak
around the world, I don't remember if I did it
(18:08):
there at Pebble Beach, but when I go and speak
around the world, every time I tell that part of
the story, I say, by an honest raise of hands,
if any of you had been there on that day,
seeing nineteen year old me leaning over that four foot
nothing rail, that ease of access to lethal means ready
to leave my family and this world forever, how many
of you would have cared.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
You did, and we all raised our hands, every one
of us.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Everybody raises their hand every time, no matter what country,
no matter what life it's everyone raises their hand. People care.
But there is a blockage on both sides. There's a
blockage in your mind for the people that are suicidal
to say the truth, and there's a blockage on the
(18:53):
other side for the people who love them who don't
know how to ask the question, are you thinking of
killing yourself having made plans to take your life? And
do you have the means? Because the crisis text lines
original AI algorithm, which predates this all this AI craze,
hyper Intelligent has determined those three questions get a more
honest answer than are you thinking of suicide or are
(19:15):
you thinking of self harm? Because of the taboo on
the word suicide and the fact that self harm is
by definition not suicide, it's self harm. And so if
we can understand how to ask these questions to people,
in desperate pain, who we love or who we care about,
who we know, or who are our clients for the
people that are clinicians, if we can understand that and
not be afraid to say, Hey, I'm worried about you.
(19:37):
I'm wondering how you're doing. I know you haven't been
doing well. I can tell. And I'm going to ask
you three questions. But before I ask you those three questions,
before you answer them, I want you to be honest,
and I want you to know I'm lacking in any judgment,
no judgment at all from me, and I am here
for you to listen, to understand, not to respond. Then
(19:58):
you ask the questions, are you thinking of killing yourself,
having made plans to take your life? Do you have
the means? And you have a chance to save a
life in that moment? And it works often, it works often,
really most of the time. And so none of my
family knew that. So it's not their fault what happened.
They weren't They weren't too blamed for what I did,
and and and and one of the things your listeners
(20:21):
and your viewers will know is that all around the world,
there are millions upon millions of people and families that
have lost loved ones to suicide that inherently and innately
blame themselves. And it's not your fault. They didn't die
because of your inspited you. They died because of a
lethal emotional pain that had nothing to do with you.
(20:42):
Take that guilt off of your shoulders. That's too much
weight for anyone to bear.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Yeah, and it is very common. It's very common. I've
lost people to suicide, and I know a lot of
people listening have as well. And that is one of
the first things. If I had only talked to them,
if I had reached out one more time, if I
had not been on that business trip, or whatever the excuse,
you know that we have made up to carry that burden.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Yeah. Yeah, my sister I found out years later. I
found out fifteen years later. My sister blamed herself for
the last fifteen years after it happened.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
Really I had.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
I would call her every morning we both went we
both went to City College at the same time, and
I would, I would were adopted. She's only nine months
older than me, and I would, I would. I would
call her every day before her class, And on this
day I called her from home I didn't get to
(21:38):
school yet, and she didn't pick up her phone. She
had a phone, she didn't pay her phone, she was
already in class, she couldn't pick it up. So she
blamed herself for fifteen years.
Speaker 1 (21:49):
Well, and then she finally had that conversation with you
fifteen years later.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Teen years later, and she struggles today with severe clinical depression.
She wouldn't be shy of me telling you this. Right now,
she is in a psychiatric hospital as we speak. She
is really struggling.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
Is it because of that moment, because of that day,
or is it just this was.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
She's lived with clinical depressions since she can remember remembering. Yeah,
And she deals with chronic thoughts of suicide, which nobody
really talks about, the plague of chronic thoughts of suicide,
which I dealt with for a very long time. Now
they're seldom and few and far between, but they still occur.
She deals with that, and we're doing our best to
(22:31):
navigate through it and to get her help every day.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
So well, maybe you are the angel she needs, because
if anybody has, you know, equipped to be a good
brother in that sense, it would be someone who's been
in the trench hasn't been there. I mean, I'm sure
you can empathize with everything she's going through.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Absolutely, And I give her as many tools and techniques
as I can that she can utilize in the psych
word and do things a little differently and shift the pair.
I'm that's in our mind.
Speaker 1 (23:12):
So you make the decision to jump, you have that access,
and you take that leap off the Golden Gate Bridge
certain death. Your first thought was was what really shook
the room? When when you tell your first thought as
(23:35):
soon as you let go of that that handle the
guardrail to leap to you certain death? What was your thought?
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Instantaneous regret from my actions and this one recognition that
I just made the greatest mistake in my life. It
was likely too late. And Chris, for ninety nine point
nine percent of the people and they've jumped off the
bridges behind me, it's been too late. They're all gone.
(24:04):
Of the four or five thousand people that have died
off the Golden Gate Bridge, and look, the bridge Directorate
would like to tell the bridge authority who own and
run the bridge, would like to tell you that eighteen
hundred people have jumped off the bridge and died. That
number is ridiculous that was recorded at least twenty years ago.
(24:24):
They are not counting anymore. They haven't been counting for
a long time. They don't count the people that wash
away to see, never to be found. They don't count
the people that are eating by fish to the bone.
They don't count the people they find less than sixty
percent of the body, because when you hit those waters,
your limbs could be severed. The water is so sharp.
They don't count the people that wash away to see.
They don't count so many people. And when the bridge
(24:47):
directorate came out and said it was eighteen hundred people,
the marine corner who saw the bodies, a good friend
of mine, Ken Holmes, and the bridge patrol officers would
say when the Golden Gate Bridge District authority would tell
us that thirty forty people go off the Golden Gate Bridge,
it was more like sixty year higher. Count that for
(25:10):
ninety years.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
Yeah, right, So.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
In any event, back to the story at hand.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
That you were saying, your first thought was immediate regret.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I regret. I coined that phrase in an Examiner article
when I first started talking about it, and after that,
nineteen of the twenty six remaining Golden gate Bridge jump
survivors the majority everyone else just didn't talk about it.
But nineteen forward to all say they had the same
exact instant regret that I had the moment their hands
(25:42):
left the rail, and that tells us a great deal
about it.
Speaker 1 (25:45):
I was just say, what is our takeaway from that?
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Yeah, think about it, Chris, Like, what about every other
mean of suicide? What about the people that had moments
before they actually passed away? What were they thinking? And
I have met thousands of suicide attempt survivors that have
attempted in all kinds of means that had the exact
(26:09):
same instint regret at the moment they thought they were
going to die. It's undeniable and it's tragic because if
we could just get to them in time, and I
don't mean the people who love them, I mean like society,
If society could change the narrative on suicide, if society
(26:29):
at large could say, you're not crazy, you're not a
psycho like they used to call me. You've got issues
you need to deal with, that you need to treat,
and that you need to heal from and find recovery,
and we're going to help you do it. At large,
but we you know, Chris, we spend this country I
(26:51):
think spends fifty times the amount of money on smallpox
a year then it on suicidevention and mental health. I'm
part Black. More seven to ten year old Black children
are dying by suicide than every before in the history
of the world. How does this seven year old child
how to take their life? Its my mind, It wrecks
(27:15):
my soul every day. I've been screaming from the mountaintops
for twenty three years, but sometimes I feel it. Not
here on your platform, but sometimes I feel like nobody's listening,
you know. And that's coming from a guy whose videos
have reached three billion people and over two hundred thousand
and counting have said this story saved their life. And
(27:36):
that's a gift and I'm grateful for it. But when
are we going to reduce the numbers of the human
race of suicide as a whole? And I'm not the
only one doing this. There's now thousands of mental advocates,
self proclaimed mental advocates across social media across the globe
doing the work trying to help make it change. And
let's make no mistake about it, They're making a difference.
(27:59):
A person to person changing and helping to save lives.
But we're not mental health experts. If we had mentalth experts,
there would be no mental health problems. If we had
suicide prevention experts, there would be no suicide. So I'm
never gonna label myself that I am on a journey
trying to help as many people as humanly possible, find
a way to be here tomorrow every day after that,
(28:21):
and talk about their immense, immeasurable pain and stop silencing it.
That's the biggest problem I think people have. Yeah, I
think that's the biggest issue is we get into this,
We get stuck into this recidivistic cycle of suiciddle thinking,
and then we decide to shut ourselves off and to
(28:41):
silence ourselves and to not tell anyone for fear of
how they will judge us. But if we are going
to go forward and be vulnerable and talk truth about
our suiticidil ideations, we can't be met with aggression. We
can't be met with anger, we can't be.
Speaker 1 (29:01):
Met with judgment, skepticism.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Yeah, no, yeah, you know you don't feel that way.
It's all in your head. No, we need to be
met with love, compassion, care, empathy and a total lack
of judgment and then steps to get better. And that's
that's what I've developed over the years, is that I
created a ten step plan that thousands of people utilize
(29:24):
called the Art of Wellness two point zero. It's ten
steps that I didn't invent. I didn't tell a novel idea,
and it make them up. They are science packed, evidence informed,
proven ways to benefit brain health, to change your life.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
And I'll say it again but just if you're listening
right now and you're like, oh my god, I need this,
go to at Kevin Hines story. That's at Kevin Hines
Story and you can find all this information. I'll say
it again later, but if I just for people listening,
if you're like, I need this now, I wanted to
get that out there. So Kevin, you you you do
(30:01):
make that jump, and ninety nine point nine that is
the real number. Ninety nine point nine percent of the
people who jump off that bridge. You reach terminal velocity
and you hit that water. And for those people that
don't know, hitting water is not like hitting a pillow.
You're it's you might as well hit a brick wall.
(30:22):
Water is very hard. I know that sounds weird, but
that's the physics of it. Did you just freakishly hit
at the perfect angle of somehow? I know you still
suffered massive internal damage, but you somehow survive this.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
So I'm very careful when I answer that question because
I want to I don't want once again, I don't
want to encourage people. Right, I will say, is this
you hit it fifteen thousand pounds of pressure. That's a
giant African elephant standing on your chest. The people who
have survived fell in the exact same way.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
Okay, I won't say, hey, yeah, yeah, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Yeah, it doesn't matter. But what people don't understand. And
I was written to by a good friend of mine
who's in my film sus Said the Ripple Effect. Marcus
Butler shared with me a spoken word poem he wrote
years after he had seen fifty seven dead bodies under
the Golden Gate Bridge. He saw the worst of the worst.
(31:23):
He saw all kinds of stuff, and it gave him severe,
severe PTSD and he is finally finding himself and finding
hope again. But he wrote it. He wrote a letter
to me, and he was worried about sending it to me,
but he wrote it to me, and he said, Kevin,
I help you understand. I want to share this with
people somehow. This is what happens when you jump off
(31:44):
the Golden gate Bridge. And I won't go into it,
but there are tens of ways to die off of
the Golden gate Bridge and they're all slow and violent, very.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
Violent, but you survive. And look, if you are a
if you would believe in any higher being, you got
to hear this miracle story of Kevin's because you're there,
you're probably if you're not unconscious, you're somewhat unconscious from
the blow. There is no way you are swimming or
(32:14):
staying afloat. How did you stay afloat? That is the
most incredible miracle story of God just deciding it is
not your time yet.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
Yeah, you know, like you, Chris, I have a firm
belief and faith in God. I always have, always will
to each their own. That said in the water, I
was going down. I couldn't get back to the surface.
I had surfaced and I was going down, couldn't get
back the surface, And I thought, this is it. I'm
gonna drown. It's over. What have I done? I don't
(32:48):
want to die. God, please save me, and at that moment,
at that moment, I said that something began circling beneath me.
It was very large, very slimy, and very alive, and
I panicked. I thought it was a shark, and those
are great white breeding grounds. So I'm punching my one
good arm, like this guy's skin's gonna eat me, and
I'm done. I didn't dive, jump it off the gold
and get bridge shark, It's gonna eat me perfect And
(33:10):
so it turns out it was no shark. I was
on a television program on ABC News with John Kinyonez,
who doesn't show what you do. It was on Primetime
Live when he did that, and he asked me the question,
you know what happened in the water? I said, I
thought them was a shark beneath me in the water. Well.
(33:30):
The show went viral online when they put it out
to the world, and one man wrote back. Morgan I
won't say his last name wrote back and said, Kevin,
I'm so very glad you're alive. I was standing less
than two feet away from me when you jumped. Until
this day watching this show, no one would tell me
whether you lived or died. It's hanted me until right now.
By the way, Kevin, there was no shark like you mentioned.
(33:51):
You thought there was on the show, but there absolutely was.
And I'll show you here a sea lion. And that's
Herbert the sea lion on my shirt, who's my spirit
animal and and uh and who saved my life that
day and did not leave from beneath me until the
Coastguard boat pulled up behind me.
Speaker 1 (34:09):
And he lifted you, literally lifted you at the surface,
swam under you, and pushed you up.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
I was deep in the water, and he butted me,
butt me, butt me, butt me up. He was circling
beneath my shoulders, my elbows and my knees, and eventually
I was just lying on the water, immobile basically, with
this thing just nudging me.
Speaker 1 (34:31):
Come on and.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
Call that what you want. That is very, very personal miracle.
And I was always in forever believe that God saved
my life that day.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
Well if if, if you don't call it divine intervention,
I'm not sure what else you would call that. I
could go on for hours with you, but I want,
I want to, because there's more to this story and
(35:03):
your background and all that. But what I really want
to do too is move forward for people that are
out there, and I want to go back over the
two sides of this. Number One, if you are listening
and you are struggling, if you are where Kevin was,
If you have suicidal thoughts, and I know you still
have suicidal thoughts, what is your advice? What steps immediately
(35:30):
should we be taking.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Okay, so you're in that position, you're in that mindset,
you're thinking of suicide, you're maybe making plans. Stop, take
a breath, Do four to forty resonance breadths into your
nose four seconds, hold four seconds, release eight seconds, like
ap purse lips, like a whistle of no sound. Do
(35:51):
that up to forty times if you can. It lowers panic, stress,
adrenaline and shock and anxiety. Bring your body to a
comp right now, give yourself time and hear me. Number one,
there's a two pronged technique I use every time suicidal
that I teach to everyone I know that is suicidal,
that works around the world and is now right now
(36:11):
working for my sister who's struggling. Two pronged technique. Find
a mirror, any mirror, anywhere, Look into that mirror and
repeat this. My thoughts do not have to become my actions.
They can simply be my thoughts. If they're dangerous to
myself or others. My thoughts do not have to become
my actions. They can simply be my thoughts. They don't
(36:34):
have to own, rule or define what I do next.
And the second thing you must do, and the most
important thing, is turn to anyone in front of you,
whether you know them from Adam or not, and say
four simple but very effective words with the right person,
I need help now. The difference between me and people
(36:57):
who die by suicide and attempt and I have an
attempt to in twenty four years is because I do
not stop saying I need help now until one person
is willing to answer the call. I have been at
the Atlanta Airport. I have stopped a TSA agent. I
have said I need help now. He was like, what
do you mean, buddy, I said suicidal. He took me
(37:17):
to a locked room, brought three police officers, two security guards.
I was almost on the no fly list, but he
got me to my wife. My cell phone had dad,
and he got me to safety. I need help now,
is the answer. Ask it every time, and you know, look,
we're not just talking the talk. We're walking the walk.
(37:38):
My family and I started the Bridge Rail Foundation, and
my wife and I were founding board members. My dad
was the founding board member along with Paul Muller and
Dave Hall. Dave Haull lost his thirteen year old daughter
of the bridge. We fought for the better part of
twenty years to raise the nets at the Golden Gate Bridge.
They are in place now across three hundred and sixty
thousand square feet of the bridge, and there's been a
(38:01):
three month period at the bridge where there were zero
suicides for the first time in almost ninety years. Wow.
Speaker 1 (38:07):
Wow, that's incredible.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Regular new film about it called The Net. It's the
harrowing journey of all of the people involved to make
this happen, and it is harrowing. The Bridge dractorate fought
us at every turn.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
Do you've Yeah, that makes you sick, by the way,
But when you have you found obviously people have jumped,
people have hit the net.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Yeah, people have.
Speaker 1 (38:30):
And have you found that those people have hit the
net had that regret and that has stopped them and
it then stopped them from continuing.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
I can tell you that the people that were saved
from the net attempted again, but I don't know the
specific details of that.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Asking for help, that is, I need
help now, are the most powerful words in the world.
And it's okay to talk about this, and that is
if you are ruggling. Now. For those of us that
are wanting to make a difference, whether we've lost someone
or not, I'm sure we all know somebody answering. I
(39:08):
assume number one, answer the call. You know, if someone
says I need help now, be that person, Be there
for them, be the support.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
And whether you don't know them or you know them,
just remember you could be the catalystic saving a life.
And understand that if it doesn't go that way and
they end up taking their life, that's not your fault.
We're not saying that, but but you could. We all
we all we are saying is that as a human condition,
we could be a little more loving, a little more kind,
(39:38):
a little more compassionate, and a little less judgmental of
those around us.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
There are disease. I lost my anti Crohn's disease many
years ago and it was very difficult. You know, doctors
and even family. You get frustrated at times because you
can't see it. You can't see their pain. And with
crones there's real, I mean actual pain, and same thing
with mental illness. It's so hard when you can't see
what someone's going through. It's you know, it's obvious when
(40:05):
you have this big gash and a cast on your
arm or your bandages. You're like, Okay, I get it.
There's cause and effect there, and I know that's our
own mental issues that we can't get the big picture
of that. But just because you can't see something doesn't
mean it's not excruciating. And like yourself, it was excruciating
what you were going.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Through, really was? It really was?
Speaker 1 (40:27):
Yeah, And I say this at every event I talked
to about mental health. About suicide, it's okay, And I
back me up on this because this is one of
the biggest misnomers. It's one of the biggest, you know,
pieces of misinformation. If you ask someone about suicide, if
you mentioned suicide, you increase the risk. That is false.
(40:49):
That is a lie. You do not increase the risk.
In fact, you help them by asking.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
A pain shared is a pain had when? But when
you ask someone if they're thinking about killing themselves specifically,
those words they made plans to take their life? Do
they have the means? You have the power to save
a life.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
And if you ask that and the answer is no, great,
then there you go. No harm, no foul, best case scenario, yeah,
who cares. But asking those three specific questions, and I'm
glad you said it again because I wanted to get
back to it is you know, are you thinking about
taking your own life? Do you have the means? And
(41:34):
ask those questions. Don't be afraid to ask those questions.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
Don't be afraid.
Speaker 1 (41:39):
Where can we find the documentary that's out, Not obviously
the new one Net I'm very interested to see, but
Suicide the Ripple Effect. Where can we find that?
Speaker 2 (41:50):
You can find that currently on Vimeo, on demand vi
Imeo and then just on demand plus Suicide the Ripple
Effect on Google, or you can just go to Vimeo
and search for it. Suicide the Ripple Effect E F
F E C T. And the new film The Net
is in pre production. We are we are raising funds
(42:10):
for a nap out and if you, if anyone, would
be so gracious as to help us support this film.
It's just the netmovie dot com.
Speaker 1 (42:18):
The neetmovie dot Com. I will be going there very quickly,
and and if you need to find Kevin, follow him
on social media. As I do, I continue to learn.
I mean, I've I'm pretty well versed in all this
as I've been speaking about it for years, but when
you meet someone the likes of you, all the different
(42:39):
podcasts you go on, all the times you speak around
the world, I learn more and more as I dive in.
So you can follow Kevin at Kevin Hines Story obviously
all together at Kevin Hines Story, and it really is revelatory.
It's just it's it's I know it sounds weird, but
it's actually positive. I know it's such a negative subject,
(43:02):
but it's so positive. When I watch your stories and
I listen to people speaking about suicide, I'm like, Okay,
there's hope. People are talking about this, and I will say,
the lights are coming on. We're finally speaking about this
more and more, and I'm very excited about the progress
that we are making.
Speaker 2 (43:18):
I totally agree with that. I think that I think
the people that are sane and well out there in
the world to the best of their ability, right, Yeah,
they're they're engaging, they're acting on things, they're fighting, they're
fighting for causes. They're getting behind people's causes. They're working
to amplify people's causes like you are right now. This
kind of interactivity is incredible and it's going to change
(43:40):
the shape of people's lives. And positive, powerful, hopeful, meaningful
media can save lives. We do it every day, and
we need more people. We need more soldiers in the
fight to produce positive, powerful, meaningful, kind, compassionate media as
opposed to the opposite.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
I love that great message to end on, my friend.
I was looking forward to this for a long time
and I will. I will end this as I began it.
I love you, my friend. I'm always there for you.
If you ever need anything, make me one of those
first calls. I appreciate you so much. I think that.
And again, I know we're both faith based people. I
(44:21):
believe that the Good Lord brings people into your lives
for a reason. Sometimes it's only for a season, but
also for a reason. I feel like you came into
my life for a reason, and vice versa. And I'm
so glad that you were able to come on and
talk about this message today, and it won't be the
last time I have you on.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
I hope, oh brother, that means the world to you.
Have no idea. I'm so grateful.
Speaker 1 (44:42):
And and one last thing, Yes, sir, my.
Speaker 2 (44:45):
Wife and I have got to take you and your
lovely wife out to.
Speaker 1 (44:47):
Dinner anytime you name it. I would love that so much. Yeah,
we need to we'll take this off air. All my
best to you and I will talk to you soon.
And by the way, when the net comes back on,
when when you release it in production, that we definitely will.
We'll have you back on to talk about that. That
impactful film as well. Thank you, brother, my thanks to
(45:09):
Kevin Hines. And again I can't urge you to follow
him enough at Kevin Hines's story. It's so important. I
hope you found that as impactful and meaningful as I
did when I heard it the first time, and I
wanted to bring it to you for those of you
that haven't heard his story. There are so many that
(45:30):
go to that bridge, or go to a number of
places that are kind of well known to try to
take their life, and for some reason, he was spared.
For some reason. Now he's decided to tell that story
and I God bless him for it. And again for
any of you that are struggling out there. You're not alone,
(45:50):
you are loved, and reach out. Ask that question, say
those four important words, I need help now. Please please
reach out. You're not alone out there, and you are loved.
There are people that care for you, no matter what
the voices are saying inside your head. So I wish
you all the best, and I appreciate Kevin coming on,
(46:11):
and I thank you for listening, and I hope you
love this show as much as I did today. God
bless and I'll talk to you soon because we have
a lot more to talk about. Thanks for listening. Follow
us on Instagram at the most dramatic pod ever and
make sure to write us a review and leave us
five stars. I'll talk to you next time.
Hosts And Creators
Lauren Zima
Chris Harrison
Popular Podcasts
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.