#71 Green Jello w/ Zach Sherwin

Between you and Nikki, she and her dog Luigi can't deal with a third party messing up their off leash energy. While Andrew left to a baseball game his girlfriend could have seen and heard too much in the apartment. Nikki welcomes her ex Zach Sherwin to the show and they have a lot of come to Jesus moments for the first time after a decade of not speaking with each other, including the song he wrote that broke them up. In the Final Thought, Nikki reminds people to throw some appreciation to vets...veterinarians that is, for the thankless job they do.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
The nick Yes Nis Nikky, Hello here I am Hello.
Happy Wednesday to you all out there. NICKI Gleanser Podcast.
Thank you for listening. So excited about today's show. Special

(00:22):
guest today Andrew Colin. While he'll be here, he's always here. Um.
But also, if you've been listening to the show for
a few weeks at least you heard me talk about
reconnecting with an old X who I didn't who I
um who I pulled the old out of my phone
out of my life. Uh, stint with it. If someone
crosses me, an ex lover crosses me and does something

(00:45):
to hurt me. I used to do out of my phone,
out of my life, double o L wait, double op
double o l ouple. Um. Sometimes that's necessary to do.
It was for me at the time. We Uh we
reconnected though, and he's coming back on He's coming on
the show for our first time uh talking. I mean
we sent voice memos, but that doesn't equal like talking.

(01:06):
You know, our first time talking in um since two thousand.
It was the weekend after I quit drinking. So I'm
coming up on ten years in December, so almost ten
years of not speaking to this person that I had
a relationship with Zack Sherwin is his name. He is
someone that I was initially attracted to because he was

(01:26):
a tall uh uh uh Jewish looking party. I just
saw that a party was like that guy's hot and um,
I just like I. I don't know if it's um.
I don't know if it's racist to say that I
like the way Jewish men look, but I do. It
has nothing to do with it. Just I like dark features.

(01:46):
I like ums, bespeckled like Jewish fro tall uh strong chin.
He was a handsome man across the room. People told
me he was a UM rapper. I was like dazzled
by that. I watched his stuff. I was so impressed
by his rapping that I was just like good, good
and it's so funny. I was just listening to John

(02:08):
Mayer's song New Light, which is one of my favorite songs.
Um you know it's from I think it's on his
new album sab Rock, but it's been That song has
been around since like maybe two eighteen. And Anya, who
does our theme song, my best friend, she did a
cover of it or she does one in concert. That's
so good. We were obsessed with that song. But that
song is about being in the friend zone, and I

(02:28):
was in the friend zone with him for a while,
and um, and we'll talk about that, we'll talk about
all of that. I'm excited to reconnect with him. Not
nervous at all. I was nervous last night and now
I'm feeling like so excited. So um that's coming up.
I just so my Starbucks around the corner. I don't
know if anyone knows this, but if you're a Starbucks
head like I am, the nation, Um, the nation, Starbucks

(02:48):
are running low on everything. There is a back order,
you know, much like a car dealerships because of the
pandemic or whatever it is. Uh, they're just not they
don't have there's right now. I realized there's not a
lot of new cars, so uh, pre owned used cars
are like flying off the lot and they're going for
way more because there's not enough new supply. So UM,

(03:12):
I've been using I've been buying us Starbucks from people
who don't finish their drinks and it's been a great experience. No. Um.
I every if you order on the mobile app, it
will tell you if they're out of the thing that
you like. And every day I get a little red
red alert for the for the Starbucks around the block
for me, which I have a morning ritual. I put

(03:32):
in my AirPods. I listened to my ex boyfriend's morning
radio show, Uh the Arch, which is my favorite morning
radio show to listen to. I just love. That's what
I wanted this show to be, was not the art,
but like a morning something you rely on every morning
as you walk your dog, get your coffee, whatever it is.
Jerk off and so I popped them in and I'm like,
oh my god, they're out of everything at the Starbucks.

(03:54):
And I feel bad for them because they're probably like
just dealing with a lot of customers. They're like, I
don't understand, and while you're out, and it's like it's
not their fault. But I did find a Starbucks um
about a mile or two away that has everything, and
I've been driving there every morning getting two of them
because I usually have two Starbucks. Today. Anyway, today I
was walking back. I took Luigi with me. He's getting

(04:15):
new story, new little routine of getting in the car.
He goes to p but he takes too long to poop,
which I know he needs to do, so I go listen.
I gotta go get my Starbucks, work on this poop
on the way there. So then we get to Starbucks,
he gets out, he pee's again, not ready to poop
in a new location. Come back, I'm carrying I slammed
that Starbucks on the way home, the first one. The
second one I'm saving for later. So I'm carrying it in.

(04:38):
And you know, I got a novelish dog. You guys,
you guys know right, He just trust me. He walks
next to me like the dog in that the zach
Evron movie where he uh no one even saw this
fucking movie, but it's the hottest thing is where zach
Efron turned from like, you know, high school musical into
a fucking man. The Lucky One. Oh my god. I

(04:58):
saw the trailer for The Lucky One, and I was
I have been a chart to zac Efron since high
school musical, and I always suppressed it because it felt wrong.
And then I was like, oh, I was right. I
was right. Look at go watch these shower scene in
The Lucky One. That's all you need to do. That
movie is good. Actually, Taylor, I'm chilling from Orange a
New Black, isn't it? And she's great. And I have

(05:18):
a friend whose friends with her, and I was like,
can you just ask her what it was like to
kiss sack a front kind of over him, but he
was my celeb crush for a while. Um anyway, how
did I get onto the Lucky One? Oh? Yeah? My
dog just follows me like the dog in that film,
because he has a dog that like stops when he stops,
walks when he walks in it's amazing, And it's just
it's because I walk like Cleopatra with my dog. The

(05:40):
second Luigi senses that I'm scared because sometimes there's homeless
people around here, and I have him off leash the
second there's like a weird person coming, and Luigi will
only see me out of my perifer like he'll you know,
I let him do his own thing. Sometimes he wants
to walk right next to me if I want that.
If there's a lot of people around and I want
to make them feel at ease that I have an
awfuleash dog, I like him like, come here, and he
walks next to me. But some most of the time,

(06:01):
I let him just do his thing and he keeps
me in his vision. But if they're come, if I
he reads my body language, it's wild. No, it's so cute.
I told Andrew about it yesterday because Andrew walked with
us both off leash. I let Andrew be off leash,
and um, it's a little trickier with Andrew. I gotta
I gotta check it on him because he likes to
run out on the road because he sees, um, you know,
a sail at Lulu Lemon or a Celsius can in

(06:23):
the in the street, and he likes to run out
and go. Um. But Andrew was like changing the dynamic
that Luigi was picking up on because Andrew was very
worried about him being off leash and Luigi because Andrew
sensed his scaredness, was being a little skittish and like
just not doing it was not good for awfully show.

(06:44):
I was like, Andrew, will you just I'm sorry, will
you stop doing that? And just like trust him because
if you trust him, he doesn't misbehave. But the second
you go, he wants to misbehave. He doesn't know how
to read it. And I go, it's really funny because
I go, when there's like a homeless person or someone
i'm a little bit scared of in the shadows, Luigi
senses my tension and will come to me immediately and

(07:07):
be a good dog and not like put me in
a place where I have to like walk over to
him and be around this homeless person a little bit more.
It's so sweet. You're such a good boy. Um. And
it's funny because last night I was with uh, my
ex boyfriend and we're friends again and hanging out, and
he was around when I got Luigi and lived with Luigi,
so Luigi like knows him as an owner, and even

(07:30):
he was a little bit skittish like about worrying about
Luigi being off leash, just because that's a natural thing.
And I haven't really told him about my whole, um,
my whole thing of like I read a third of
Caesar Malan's book when I first got Luigi, and I
always remembered that if you walk like Cleopatra, your dog
will treat you like Cleopatra, like if you walk like

(07:52):
you're a princess, and I really do. I walk with
my both my hands behind my back like I'm Klisi.
Andrew said I was walking like Clisie, and I go,
that's funny because I try to harness Cleopatra even though
I don't know anything. I just trying to harness Liz
Taylor and scenes that I've seen so last night though,
uh or yesterday, my ex boyfriend I were just like walking,

(08:13):
I should just call it my friend now. My friend
Chris and I were walking and um, Luigi ran out
in traffic almost and it was so terrifying. There was
a car coming and it's like, and I don't want
to blaming no one, but it was because Chris wasn't
chill about him being awfully like he was being a
good dog dad and being like concerned, and Luigi just

(08:37):
got kind of scared and like ran in the street
and it's just so interesting that our energy. And I
would have never blamed him. If Luigi died, I would
have never been like, it's because, like I would have said,
it's because of that, but it's not because you wanted that.
It was just because I didn't. It was my fault.
I didn't explain my theory of walking him. And when
I walk with other people, I'm just gonna have to
now be on leash because Luigi starts to pick up

(08:58):
on their energy and it's and it really is hard
to get to a place with your animal where you
trust them. I'm just gonna share this one story for
dog owners because it changed my life or just like
pet owners or children owners, what do we call them owners?
A parents? I think they're called This was invaluable to
me in getting both my dogs, Luigi and Marian. Prior

(09:20):
to getting my two dogs, Marianella's with my parents, but
prior to these two dogs, I had grown up with
dogs that run away always. You can't have them off leash.
The second they get off leash, they run away and
they don't come back, and you beg for them to
come back. They ignore you. It causes so much anger.
You guys know the type of dog I'm talking about.
You probably grew up with them. And um, it's like

(09:41):
there's some comedy bit about like some guy was like,
you don't think your dog, you think your dog loves you.
Open the door and it's like, oh yeah, your dog
is like a Some people argue, some animal rights advocates
argue that pet ownership is slavery because you're just like,
I want this thing all around me, and it one
it clearly. Any time it gets a chance, it wants

(10:02):
to fucking run, and we keep it on a leash
like there's a little there's a little truth to that, um.
But this is what changed for me. I was traveling
with both my dogs because I never had dogs that
would behave I just thought dogs don't do that. I
thought that, you know, they had to go through intensive
police training to be a dog that's off leash. But
really what it's about, and I know there's exceptions because

(10:23):
dogs have behavior, behavioral issues that you know they come
with before they get to you and uh, but really
they read your energy. That's like whatever your dogs doing,
it's it's being facilitated by you. So this blew my mind.
And I think I've shared this with you Noah, but
and listen up, because I'm serious, Like this is the thing.
This changed everything with me and my dog. I was

(10:45):
traveling with Luigi for the first time, and I was
so worried about it because we were you know, the
rules of the plane is and if you I didn't
want to say he was a service dog because he wasn't.
I'm going to speak through this because we got it
and Andrew in here, so maybe slow it down. I
couldn't say it was a service dog because it was.
And I don't like to lie, so I paid the
extra hundred fifty dollars for him each way. That means
he has to stay in the bag the entire time.

(11:06):
I was worried because he's never been in a bag
for a two and a half hour flight. What's gonna happen.
I'm so worried. I gave him ben a drill. I
gave him like a like a like kind of a
some kind of like a dog sleepy thing. I like
read all these books about how to do it. The
whole flight, I'm like checking in on him. He was like,
looks scared. He's trying to dig out of the bag.
I'm like, oh, it's so stressful. I get to the

(11:28):
airport and I'm at baggage claim and I'm just like
he's out of the bag at that point, and I'm
just like, oh my god, we made it, but that
was so hard. And this gay couple, these two gay
guys walk up to me and they go, oh, your
dogs so cute, and I go, thank you. I was like,
I just it's been a rough day. It's his first
day um traveling, and it was rough. And they go,
we have a little dog too, we travel with. Can
we give you a tip? And I was like, yes,

(11:48):
anything please, I think I asked him, I go, do
you have any tips? And they go, you're in charge.
Do not worry about what they're gonna do, because that
makes them do that. You have have confidence in your dog.
Believe in your dog because they want you to believe
in them and trust them. Trust that your dog when
you put him in the bag, that's where he belongs.
You know that. Let him know that you're okay with that.

(12:11):
Now this postpect to stand up comedy. You guys, you're
a comedian comedy fans. When you're in the audience, all
you want. I discovered this late in the game. All
an audience wants is to for that person on stage
to not be nervous, to be confident, to know what
they're doing. I'm in good hands. That's all your dog
wants is someone who is in the driver's seat who
knows exactly when they ask for something from them, they

(12:32):
know it's for the best and that's the final answer.
So when you go when you put your dog in
a bag and you kept checking him and go is
he okay? And then you go, oh, he can get
him like worrying it's it causes stress for the dog
because he can pick up on your stress. So I
swear to God. The next flight I got on with
this dog, I put him in the bag and I
was like, you belong there. I put a little sheet
over it. He was still the entire time. Yeah, I

(12:54):
did sedate him with me. No, I didn't sate him
at all. I've never had a sedate him because when
my dogs go in the bag, when they go off leash,
if I don't take them off leash or put him
in a bag or put him in a situation unless
I'm sure and I meditate on it a little bit,
I like take a breath and I go, that's what
I want. I'm in charge, and they pick up on that.
And it was, honestly, it was like the switch that

(13:15):
I didn't know that I had, I was able to possess.
So if you're having struggled with your dog, really work
on knowing what you ask for from them and not
being unsure. And it's really hard to do, and I'm
not perfect at it at all, but that really those
two gay guys telling me that, like when you put
him in the bag, he belongs in the bag. There's
no checking in on him to see if he's okay,
he's okay. You wouldn't put him in the bag unless

(13:36):
he's okay, sweetie. You know you're you're the parent, so no,
And I think that would probably work for kids to
like your sounding. You're going to your room and I'm
not going to check on your That's where you belong
and you're gonna be safe there, and that's where That's
what's gonna happen when you lock them in a cage
and don't feed him for a couple days, you tell
them that, Um, we gotta get Andrew in here. Let's
let's bring up in Oh. I want to break through.

(14:00):
I wanted something too. I want to know the real
thing about you, Andrew. Um it isn't yes, it is okay, okay,
Hi Andrew. Oh, I want to break through. I wanted
something too. I want to know the real thing about
you so you can see me in a new We've

(14:25):
been listening to the new John Mayer album, which has
the old song New Light on it, and we both
love it and uh we were just jamming to it hardcore.
It's about being in the front zone and it's uh, yeah,
I told you about that. It reminds me of my
relationship with extra when, which we'll get to very very soon. Andrew,
did you sleep last night? Um? I slept, okay, you

(14:45):
know my uh my girlfriend slept over. She's not feeling well.
She hasn't felt well for five days. She has a
bad stomach issues. Oh yeah, I mean she was here
last night and I didn't know. I you have texted
me when I was at dinner that and I was
going to be here, and then you texted a bunch
of stuff after that, and then I hadn't seen my
phone and I looked down at it and I just
read the last thing you texted, not the Brenda part. So, um,

(15:09):
she heard some things? Maybe, No, I hope not. We
I was here with a a lover of sorts and
we're pretty loud, and I because we thought we had
the place to ourselves. But I'm really glad she didn't
hear anything. We actually weren't that loud because I realized

(15:32):
my screen door was my I had opened my um
in my room. I'd been smoking pot in my room
and I didn't want it to reek, so I left
the door open before and then when we came back,
we just started like hooking up, and it was opened
the whole time, so I kind of kept it hush hush.
You were no thing odd, but I mean we could

(15:52):
have been. Brenda didn't come. My partner left, and then
I went out, and like I was making food and
watching TV and being out. I was probably like saying
weird things. And she was there the whole time in
your bedroom right off the living room, and I didn't know.
And then you got home and you go not a
ripe this, And you walked in and I saw her shoes,
So I thought she went to the baseball game with
you and just changed shoes here. Yeah. No, I wrote
you saying she doesn't feel well. She also her apartment,

(16:14):
you know, she's moving a bed on the floor. I'm
so glad she was here. Then. Yeah, I thought you'd
be cool with it. But then not hearing back from me,
I'm like, does she have a problem with it? Like that?
My head never? I mean, I'm not though. You have
a right to wonder. So you stay the night here? Yeah?
Last night and I was watching us like some show,

(16:34):
oh the Naomi Osaka documentary on Netflix that you had recommended,
and you were like, oh, Brenna's here, and you went
and checked in on her in the bedroom and then
you came back out and then you were like, I
got I gotta, We're gonna go in there because I gotta.
She's like not feeling I'm like, yeah, I would never
expect you to stay out here if your girlfriends And
first of all, you shouldn't have even gone to the
baseball game. You should have tended to dear. You know what.

(16:57):
She was really happy about that. MR. For the last
three day as I've been very tending. I went on,
I did all her things, did yesterday, I did all
her errands for her. I was there for her just
because I wanted to get healthy so I could suck
her again, you know, yeah, I mean when you have
stomach issues. I mean how much of it though? Is
like when you're like, I'm there for my partner and

(17:17):
it's like, can you speed it up so we can
start having sex again? Like can you get healthy? Well
a little bit, a little bit in you Yeah, of
course you want to have sex, but it's like that
is one of the most beautiful things about a relationship
is that when you are sick, there's someone who cares
about you enough to do those things, and you don't
feel bad asking them and like, it's just they want

(17:38):
to do it because they love you and they care
about you. So I was grateful that she had that
in you, and then you got to be that for someone. Well,
it was interesting. Yesterday she texted me, She's like, hey,
can you help me carry some stuff? I'm not feeling well.
And I didn't write it back right away. I was
doing my podcast and then I just wrote sure, how
about four pm? She read sure as like sure, like whatever,

(17:58):
Like she was like when I annoying me? Yea yeah,
And I was like, no, that's not I was like sure,
right of course. Of course. Of course, tone and texts
is not great. It really sucks and it really causes
a lot of complications. Um, but we worked it out
and we ended up, you know, hanging out this morning
a little bit. You had some sexual actions this morning

(18:20):
just we I tried out that vibrator hand thing that
you gave me. It's like, uh, I don't know. It's like, um,
I can't even describe what it is. It's like a
clamp for your cock and you could hold it on
their vibrates. Why you get a blow job? Oh okay,
so clamp for your I don't even know. What this is.
Maybe I'll get it at halftime, Yeah, and clean it

(18:42):
off a little bit. It's not dirty, it's my skin.
Oh my god. We're supposed to get a really big
batch of toys from love Honey that I'm so excited about.
I can't even like I've been checking my packages every day. Um.
Love Honey is one of our sponsors that I am
so excited about because I went buck wild on their
website like book wild, dude, Like I am going to

(19:04):
be set up for success. I'm very excited. I'm still
dating around, I'm entertaining many gentlemen. I'm having a great
sexual partner that I'm not having vaginal sex with. But
like everything else, I'm feeling like protected in terms of
like not putting my heart on the line, but also
very like invested in this, like feeling this person out.
And also like I'm talking to a guy on Bumble

(19:27):
that I met on Bumble, that the one I showed
you the other day. We've just exchanged Um. We were
talking about life stages, like we're like, oh, oh, I
talked about my trip that I'm going on. Noah's going
on it. We're going to Mexico on Saturday. And I
told him, Um, I'm bringing friends. I'm doing a friend's trip.
I'm like sponsoring a friend's trip, and I'm bringing all
my friends from all walks, all stages of my life.

(19:48):
And he was like, that's so cool. What are the
stages of your life? And I was like, oh, that's interesting,
and I said, you know, one one to eight, age
zero to eighteen, childhood, Cincinnati and St. Louis eighteen two
twenty seven was being finding my way in comedy and
also college, and then seven to thirty four was establishing

(20:10):
myself in comedy, getting sober, first real relationship. Then thirty
four two now is like being uh already proving myself
to myself and like trying to be happy and being
single and liking myself. And it was interesting to break
that down. I recommend everything. He sent me his today
and they were just like really beautiful stage Caterpillar like yeah, yeah,

(20:34):
but no one's going on. So I'm bringing my best
friends Kirsten and Taylor from my childhood. Then I'm bringing
um Carlyle, who's comedy. Um, I'm bringing Noah, who is
comedy radio New York. Um? And then who else am
I bringing? Fuck Sarahlena, who is New York and from

(20:56):
my ex boyfriend I met her, and then there's one more.
I thought, shit, I'm so sorry to the girl that
I am forgetting right now. Carlisle no uh oh, and
Robin from Cayman Islands and someone I was got offered
to do a TV show that would take me out
of uh that would make me leave Mexico early and

(21:16):
I and it's so funny because they're like working it out,
like oh, yes, she'll come back girl, and I go, no,
I'm not. I literally and it's a great TV show
and I go, no, I'm not doing that. This is
so important to me, and like this means more to
me than doing that show that I hope I can
be on another time or if they know it's um,
I already forgot it because it's I put it out
of my mind. But it was a show that I

(21:38):
really really wanted to do and was like so excited
I got I asked to do and I swear to God,
you guys, I already forgot what it is. By the way,
I cut off my work last night on my on
my leg Come on, Nick, come on, thinking it's gone.
I don't know man, that's not healthy. Dude, that's not healthy.
That's not that's not right. Okay, well you know what

(21:58):
is right? Bringing my ex boyfriend, my the person I
even talked to years. This is about to get deep
to Uh. This is hilarious. So talented, um rapper, comedian, please, artist, vegan,
animal rights advocate. I'm gonna keep saying things until he

(22:21):
can get in the room. Um uh tall, uh kind, intelligent,
massively intelligent, gifted, uh spiritual, uh brave. I'm just listening
adjectives about us extra when before we could get you up.
Uh please, welcome to the show. What are you doing, Andrew? Oh? Yeah,

(22:43):
pin Zach right now? Pin him? We're pining u Zach.
Oh there you are show Zack shar when everyone Hi
Zack Andrew, Dude, you know what the way you just
said Hi Nick, which for some of all, I haven't
heard that in a really one time. I think you
were the only uh past lover I had that helped

(23:05):
me and I really did like it. Do you mind
if I call you lover? I think it's a fun
I know it's such a ridiculous word. Taylor Swift got
me into it, but you, uh, what was I just
get us. Oh the way you go Hi, Nick. It
reminded me of when Jennif Franston and Brad Pitt had
to do a zoom over U COVID. They were like
doing some kind of reunion and she goes Hi high

(23:27):
Pit and he goes hey, hey Anniston. No, he goes
hey Anniston, she goes hi Pit And then that was
like it and it was like, oh, it was just
such like so ever winded me of that. But I
think we're on better terms now. Although this is the
first time we will be talking in not voice memo
in almost ten years. Totally. There were the texts, there
were the voice messages, yeah, the memos. But this is wild.

(23:50):
It is Nikki. This is like a historic reunion. To me,
this is a big deal. I know. I don't want
to I don't want to reiterate everything that we talked
about that I already set up, like the whole thing
that happened, But just to give a just for checking
people up, Zack and I dated from God. I want

(24:11):
to say how long were we think it was like
back half five months? Yeah, about five months. We started
out as friends. I met him at the what was
that festival? The bridge Town in Portland's right. We met
that No, I saw you at the backyard party. Yeah,
I saw you at that backyard party. That's when I

(24:33):
was first like a clock it and go after that one.
And then I remember meeting you at that party and
being like that person is interesting, you know, like you
just meet people and you're like, there is my path
goes towards that person. Thank you, I felt the last

(24:55):
you would have been happy. Yes, your mother is a rabbi.
How is your mother by the way, good? Good? Um
uh that my mother's are good. They're both great. Uh.
My dad has transition. So you you did the right
thing by saying that. Um uh. Yeah. So that party,
but then we went to so then we started hanging
out because we had mutual friends Shawn Pearlman and Mike Caplin.

(25:17):
Shawn Pearlman was in l A at the time, so
we would all hang out. I remember one time I
liked you so much and like I didn't I hadn't
told you yet. This was maybe after I had told
you and we were just friends or something. I think
this is okay. So we went to Bridgetown Festival. You
were there too. We hung out the whole time. It
was like definitely flirty and fun or like, at least

(25:38):
from my perspective, he was keeping it so professional, like no,
I couldn't get a read. But this was the time
in my life where I just told guys I liked them.
Eventually I would just like go, like, I like you,
what's going on? You walked to me in my hotel room,
like maybe the last night of Bridgetown, and I was like,
I think I said, can we like kiss or something
like I think I said that line, and you were like,

(25:58):
I have a girl friend, and I'm like what? And
then I was like who that you said? Jennifer? You
said Jennifer Anderson. Now you said you said your girlfriend
at the time, who I knew? And I go, oh, well,
at least I have we have good I knew I
have good taste because that's someone who I respect comedically

(26:19):
and as a friend. And I was like, I had
no idea. I'm so embarrassed, and you were so lovely
to be like, don't be embarrassed, like obviously we get
along and like this wasn't something to like that. There's
no indication that you should have not done that, And
I feel that's so nice, like you were. You handled
it the way that your girlfriend would have wanted you
too at the time, and the way that I I
felt just like very taken care of. Do you have

(26:41):
any memories of that? You yes, And actually my memory
of it is that it wasn't the last night of
the comedy festival and you said it, and I was like,
I'm dating someone, and then we were like, oh okay,
and then there was like a really good recovery and
we were just cool the rest of the time. And
I thought, I too, thought like what a cool thing
to do to just bravely tell someone I'm into you

(27:03):
and then just let it happen. Uh, And I was
I remember thinking it was cool that we sort of
like stuck the landing of that and powered through any
awkwardness and it was fine. We did because it was
like it it actually brought us like closer and gave
us the ability to become better friends, which then led
to us being set up to be together when your
relationship ended, not by any doing of mine, because I

(27:26):
I completely p no. I mean, I've done that in
the past to her just because she's too funny, and
I've done like witchcraft that she gets loses her voice
or something. I've tried to ursula her but and not.
I really actually was like, oh, that's cool, you're dating
someone I like, And it just made me feel like, Okay,
I was right, but I did wish that you guys

(27:48):
ended How long after did you break up with her?
And then how did you read bridge? Was probably in
the spring and then I think we probably got together.
I think that ended pretty quickly after. And I think
that why we were already connecting is because that relationship
was maybe on its way out like something like not
not because we were having a floortation, but like maybe
I don't know Zach that I'm not telling we clear

(28:10):
on the timeline of But what I do specifically remember
is that right after we broke up, you and I
were both at Chicago, JFL. And we like ran into
each other. It's right like that where we first hooked up,
Like how are things going in your relationship? And I
was like, we broke up and I remember we were
having God we both looked at each other like you know,

(28:30):
there was like, yes, did we did we first like
get intimate there in CHICAO. I think we sort of
knew it happen and then yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, And
I was still drinking then, so this is all like
fuzzy and I could only kiss boys and like have
sex or do anything if I was fucked up, not

(28:51):
because I didn't like the person I was doing it with.
It was just so nervous. So my my memory is
hazy of this time. We had a very PG smooth sash.
It was oh good, yeah, now you were it was you.
I have to say, Um, I've dated like a lot
of bad people and a lot of good people, and

(29:12):
you are on the good list with um a few
others where I was like, oh okay, like this pattern
of dating unavailable people that aren't right for me. I
do have it in me to be attracted to people
who would like treat me well and and Zach, you
are one of those. And I've had I've had several
of those that give me hope that when I'm when

(29:33):
I go for someone who's an F boy, F boy
island coming to uh that that I thank you so much.
So then I invited him to Lollapalooza because we were
I was living in St. Louis at the time. No,
I wasn't even your cares. Yes, invited to Lolla Palooza.

(29:53):
How did Chicago in there? Just for the kiss that
one za. There's there's so much nick we need likes
to unpack everything. Yeah, yeah, um Chicago. We we made
out the last night. Uh, it was very PG I did.
I was like crashing on some You had like higher

(30:14):
JFL status than I did, and I was crashing on
some dide shitty couch like way out in the middle
of nowhere. I had to take a train into the
festival and stuff, and you were like, I'm leaving at
four o'clock in the morning. Just stay over in my
hotel room. And I made out. We passed out. You
woke up. I like, I don't remember you leaving, but
I remember I woke up in your nice hotel room

(30:34):
and I was like, this is so much better than
staying on that guy. Oh my god, I love that.
That's so I love that. Uh yeah, that's that's that's
that's why I stand by that move. I would do
that again for you. Um. And then and then we
went to Lollapalooza, which is a big deal. I would
always it was with my best friends from college. It
was like my biggest event, like the most fun thing

(30:55):
I do all year. We go to Chicago, we run
a room, a couple of rooms, and we all get
wasted and go to shows and stuff and um, and
I invited Zach. My friends were obsessed with you, like
a little too much. I mean, we're not going to
talk about the thing that made it was just it
was one of the I will say, yes, I will

(31:20):
not say, but there was a um, there was a
friend in our group that was a straight man who
loved Zach, like loved Zack so much and was like,
he's the coolest guy. One night, we we were in
two queen beds that were in the same room as
this guy and one night, um, he tried to get
in bed and cuddle with Zack. Is that right, Zack.

(31:41):
I only have the haziest memory of this, but I
definitely remember that it was a thing that weekend that
you were like, that guy is really really hanging out. Look,
when you listen to Gin Blossoms all day, it's gonna
do it to you. And I think back then I
was like, he's probably gay. But the truth is I
think that he be a little bit on this. Like

(32:03):
everyone's sexuality is fluid, and I wouldn't I'm never gonna
That guy is now married to a woman, and like
that doesn't make me question his relationship at all. That
he was maybe attracted to Zach who I you know,
I don't blame him. He was again good taste. But
that was like a thing that really like no one's
talked about since. And I'm like, there's no shame in it.
It was cute. He was wasted, and he just wanted

(32:24):
affection from a guy that like he felt really close to.
He just wanted to be loved. I think that guy
was in a band. He climbed in on the other side,
I think with Zack while I was and we were
all really drunk. I mean, like in this guy really drinks,
probably because he's you know, suppressing these things that he
has for men. Sometimes that has nothing to be ashamed of.
And like, I think something I've been told by people

(32:48):
that I sometimes give off, like a camp counselor friendly
camp counselor vibe the one the molested you. You climb
into the bunction, you know, like he needed a little
camp counseling. No, you um do all your chores and
saying this, but you have the did you go to
Jewish camp? Oh? Yeah, never mind. Sorry, I don't want to.

(33:09):
I'm sorry, I don't want that. I think you'll be
comfortable with me saying this. But I've read all these
books about how to trick men into loving you because
I was just interested in this psychology of like attraction
and like what men like. And I learned about like
female and male energy, like the yin and yang, which
people men hate to be like I have a feminine
energy that means I'm gay, but you are a for all,

(33:30):
I know a very straight man who has I think
you have feminine energy, and I think that's why when
I was like, I like you, I like I was
the one that was like pushing it forward, like I
made the booze. But then you also are extremely masculine
in ways and we would like. I think that he
sensed that an energy, the feminine energy of you that
isn't meaning that you are like a woman, but that

(33:51):
is like nurturing and that's what he needed so bad,
and that's what I need. I mean, that's why I
was attracted to you. So do you do you think
that in relationships, are you um usually the one that
makes the first move, because that's usually indicating what you
are like, what's your do you do? You subscribe to
the feminine masculine energy. I'm very comfortable being described as
having feminine energy, and I thought I'd have to think

(34:15):
more about that. Am I usually the one who makes
the first move thing? I want you to think about
it because I think that's you know I I'm trying
to tend to I want to be more in a
feminine energy, and it's against my nature as a stand
up comic, as a female stand up. Male stand up
comics are male performers are generally female energy, even though

(34:35):
and female stand ups are generally masculine energy because we're
like loud and on stage and like requiring attention and masculine.
It takes like a lot of emotion and vulnerability to
get up there as a man and share your feelings
in even comedic or or musical ways. So I was
told by the woman that wrote the book Getting Too
I Do, which is all about this, that male comics

(34:58):
or male performers are generally feminine energy, and that it
wasn't a bad choice for me, as a masculine energy
woman to always be attracted to them, because I felt
like some kind of fault in that moving forward. Can
I say a couple of things at this point. One
is my natural impulses to thank people when they compliment me.
And you've said like ten nice things about me, and
your friends thinking I was cool and me being like
the kind of guy who gave you hope about your

(35:19):
dating instincts. So let me just issue because the conversation
is flying fast and furious. Uh So, you know, thank
you for all this stuff. I really appreciate it. Also,
I just want to report you I was a little
nervous coming on, not because I was like afraid that
something bad was I guess I was afraid that something
bad was going to happen, but not any specific thing,
just like it's been so long, and it's hilarious to

(35:42):
me that like instantly it's like my old bud and
it's it's an amens relief and I'm having I can
wait to see you again and be friends with you
again because and like go to lunch like I was
just in l A and I go fun. I didn't
reach up to Zach. I don't really have time, but
you really are someone that now when I'm thinking about

(36:03):
moving to l A and trying to figure out like
who are my friends gonna be? Who will I hang
out with? I really hope that you're someone on that
list that we can be like regular friends. Lizzie Cooperman,
who's one of my best friends, has over the years
that I haven't talked to Zach because long story short,
Zach went to a little Blues with me. We had
the best time. We went back, he met my family.
They loved him so much. We hung out in St.
Louis a bit. Then I was in New York. I

(36:24):
got this pilot for the MTV show. I was just
feeling distance between us. It just like wasn't gonna sustain
itself and it was losing steam. We called it off.
Then he opened for me on a show a month
later because I was like, we should stay friends. Were
good at being friends. He opened for me on a
show a month later, and you went on the road
with me a little bit. I went on the road
with you. It was like I was a huge fan

(36:45):
of yours, you are a fan of mine. It was
like fun to watch each other's shows. And you had
written a song about me. I think, uh, prior to
the one that I'm going to talk about that was
about like how cute I was when I slept like
about like looking like a roly poly buck, like I
just cut in on the internet. I'll send it to you.
I'll send it to you that I didn't know. I know,

(37:07):
I didn't let you talk to me, so that it's
so nice. So he had written me this, I've never
had a song written about me like touches me in
a way that I almost I'm getting Verklempt talking about
it because it was so sweet. And so then we
met up about a month or so after we had
decided to break up, and he was opening for me
on a show, and I had quit drinking a week before.

(37:29):
I didn't really know how to handle my anger or feelings, uh,
and was kind of like in this new space of
like what do I do with my feelings and life?
And I was also like maybe we'll hook up again,
like I still like one last you know, Yeah, And
then Zach decided to a be a song that he

(37:50):
had worked on in the time between we broke up
and um the performance, and this would be to sit
through if you and I hadn't had the exchange that
we've already had, I'm like forcing myself to power through
hearing this, but please go. I know, and that's why
I'm just like, because people have already heard it, it
doesn't matter, and it's water under the bridge. And I
have done similar things even in recent time that have

(38:13):
reminded me of the choice that you made there that
we've all done, which is like, we're hurt, we decided
to write a joke or a thing. We put it
into our act and we do that thing in front
of a person to let them know how we really
feel because we weren't able to say it that And
so Zach decided to write a song that was about
one time and I remember this, I was like such
a drunk. We were back at your place. I ate

(38:34):
a disgusting salad that I remember, it's awful onions and
stuff on it. And then we kissed afterwards, which is
something I do a lot of times with guys. I'll
kiss them and be like, dude, it's kicking like this,
my breath is terrible like and I remember even saying
that at the time, and you took that moment and
wrote it into a song that was like about a
girl with bad breath, which is really it was actually
beautifully written from what I remember and like very good,

(38:55):
which almost hurt more because I was like the effort
that went into it. So after he got off stage,
you know the whole story. You can go back and
listen to it on the past podcast because I don't
want to go into detail because we're moving on and
I'm not saying the past of the past. But he's
been accountable for it. I have been accountable for my
behavior in it. But he got off stage and I
did the thing that I did depeately, and then I've
done to a couple of guys that have like crossed

(39:16):
me in the past, and I said, never speak to
me again. And I think you thought it was just
like something I was saying, but I really was like, literally,
I never want to talk to you again. It's over.
And I never talked again. When you were doing this song,
did you have any like feeling that, Okay, maybe this
is over, like while you're we're performing it, or like before,

(39:36):
were you just like, no, this is a silly song.
Did you have any inclination that she could take it?
I feel I have to, like I'm so like I'm
overcoming like just bad feelings about that night and the
subsequent like immediate aftermath, just to be in this conversation
right now. But I thank you so much for having

(39:57):
this conversation. So it's so cathartic to have it. It's
such a pleasure, and honestly having it was ten years
ago weird and yet said in those first text to you,
because it got like preserved in Amber all those years.
It still feels like in some ways, it still feels
like it just happened. But I honestly want to nod
to Andrew for being here. It's so uh pleasant to

(40:21):
have this like benevolent presence around to sort of like
I feel like you're the couple's therapist for this interaction
because you're this like nice third party adjudicator. You've got
some skin in the game that it was. It didn't
happen to you, So I'm glad you're here. Um. But
but I read the lyrics and I'm not actually pleased
with you. I think no I wrote them. I wrote

(40:42):
a version of myself. Me and Zach worked on the
song behind your Back. You're no and Andrew and Zack.
I'm sorry I didn't introduce you to each other. You're
going to be best friends. We're both Jews. We went
to Jewish Summer Camp, like they're going to be on
the show again and we're gonna explore anything other than
this story. But what happened was I and then Zach

(41:03):
reached out to me. Zach, I'm sorry, I'm started to interrupt,
but I know you're not allowed to never talk to
me again. This is what I was afraid. Wow, yeah,
tell the answer answer Andrew's question, because I think I
know my recollection is that. Okay, So I wrote Pillbugs,
the song about how you slept curled up like a
rolly Polly, which was such a nice thing. Because also,

(41:26):
do you remember that I had written a song for
about another woman I dated, and you were like, I
really liked that song, but it was not it was
not super kind to her, Like maybe that's why I
like everything. I'm sure. I was like, no, I think
it's sweet. I'm sure I gave you like a green

(41:47):
light to maybe get a little bit christ. So then
I remember standing in the basement of that club and
you and I had seen each other. It was the
first time we saw each other. We had we've gone
out to dinner, but we hadn't like really like been alone.
And we've had this long since the breakup, and it
just was like kind of cordial, but like was weird
and stiff, and I was like part of it. One

(42:10):
piece of the puzzle is that I was obsessed with
doing new material. I was so insecure about what I
was doing on stage that I was like, well, I'll
make up for it with prolific nous for not knowing
what the funk I'm doing. And so I had written
this new song and it was the most recent substantive
thing I'd written. And also Boston was where I started,
and so being back in Boston and not doing anything

(42:32):
new to me was like, uh, it was like an
admission of defeat. Like I'd gone to l A and
wasn't doing it. I didn't even think about that. Oh, Zack,
that makes so much sense. And so I remember coming
up to you and being like Nikki. Mike and I
talked about it, and I was like, should I even
think about doing it? And he was like, it's your
new thing. You could talk about it with her. We

(42:53):
kind of tried to gain So I went up to
a l I went up to you and the up
and I was like, Nikki, I wrote a song and
I'm not I just want to and you were like,
just go for it, don't worry about it. And I
remember being like, I'm just I'm gonna do it, even

(43:13):
though some warning bells are going off. Well, I remember
you having that kind of like face with it, which
it wasn't like there was something that you were worried about.
And I didn't know if it was because it was
like something that I would be offended by, or because
it wasn't ready or something like you had a hesitation
of like should I do this new song. I didn't
know if the worry was it was new, or that

(43:34):
it was about you and might hurt your feelings. And
I just was like, just do And I remember saying
to you, you know me, you know what I'd get
offended by, just like and then I remember Zach so
clearly turning to Mike, who was standing there. Knew the song,
my capa and our friend who had facilitated us kind
of being together was someone that I was like, Oh
my god, Zax friends with Mike. I love Mike. Anyone

(43:55):
who Mike is close to is like, I'm ready to
marry them because Mike is just a good person and
I just trusted him, and so I go to Mike
and I go, you've heard the song, I go, do
you think i'd care or something? And and Mike. I
remember Mike going like kind of hesitating and be like,
I think you should do it. But I remember the
hesitation and being like I should have heeded that and

(44:17):
said no or asked what it was about, because I
gave you the green light, so I I told you
to do it, and then you did it, and my
soul left my body during the performance, and I cried.
I went in the green room and cried during Mike
set because I was just like so I was just
embarrassed because it was like my biggest fears, like having
bad breath, and like all I do was like and

(44:39):
I was just getting out of drinking, which I told
Zack and Um in our voice memos, like so much
of my shame about that song was not about that
this person who it was about a person who I
thought cared about me, like I thought bad things about
me and like spent time writing the song, But it
was more about the fact that the song was about
me being gross and it was just one time, like

(45:01):
Zach even told me later, it was just one time,
and maybe it was more than that I have bad breath.
I'm human, but back then, just like you were insecure
about new material, which I totally understand. I was two
back then, especially in your home club and Boston. I
know how you feel about Boston and how you feel
about new material, and your new material is like a
three and a half minute chunk or sometimes that takes

(45:22):
so much longer than me writing a couple of lines.
So I get all of that, and and I also
appreciate that you were able to channel your feelings about
me in that moment into a song, Like you worked
through some stuff with that song, some anger, which I
think is kind of cool and should you have done
in front of me? No, But we were young and dumb.
But it made me feel like I was gross, which

(45:44):
was already my biggest deep down secret is like I
keep my drinking and and and the reason I was
gross that night because I was drinking and I ate
something late at night. It was attached to my eating disorder.
It was attached to my messy room that I have
been because of my a d h D that I
wasn't diagnosed with, and thought it was just my fault
because I'm gross, um just being just always feeling gross

(46:07):
my whole life and being and not even talking about
that fear because I was so scared that I put
in someone's mind and then they would be like, yeah,
that's true about you. And that's why I just quit
drinking to kind of get away from the grossness. And
then this was validation that yes, you are gross. And
it wasn't those Zach if I would have been listening,
it was it was a scapegoat for me to put
all of my like self hatred into and go. He

(46:30):
made me feel that way, and that's what when people go.
He made me feel that way. I chose that thing
was an excuse for me to go. That's that's why
I hate myself as because someone actually told me in
a song that it's not me just hating myself. It's
like that was validated, and that's what it was all
wrapped around, was my drinking. Because you do have a

(46:52):
cam counselor vibe and I would say, you are actually
like a good like he's extreme, yes he person when
someone is good, and then they do like one thing
that's not great, whatever however you want to view it,
it like sticks out and I feel like sometimes it's
like the Trump is m of like he's always an asshole.
So when he's an asshole, everyone's like, that's who he is,

(47:15):
So you're going to getst the grain. So sometimes I
feel like you get you get more ship for doing
like one bad thing when you're too nice. I always
said that it was totally out of character for him
to be to be um confrontational or to be critical. Um.

(47:37):
We both talked about people, and we both had the
character defect of like not being authentic with our word
that we're probably better at now. But um, yeah, it
was a departure from how it was. It was such
a wild year for me and I had like I
was so confused about comedy. I was like, I've had
two major long distance breakups in the year. Um. I

(47:59):
was really confused about my feelings about you specifically. UM
I wrote that song. I was just grasping for stuff
to write about. UM. So it just was a ship
storm and I I love you saying that you left
your body. When I was writing that song, it's so
or when I was performing it, it's so relatable and
I'm thinking it was kind of over a fast beat

(48:20):
and the lyrics were like rapid fire, so I'm thinking
about me and how much I mean, I'm laughing, but
it's also like I just couldn't believe it, Like to
do a song that like I remember not fucking the
lyrics up because it's like a thing to you know,
I have to like practice and practice, so not only
write it, but like driving around l A practicing it
and then being on stage like vigorously sticking the performance

(48:44):
of this song that would like funk up a really
important part of my life for a decade and me
just like blithely up there like rocking the mic for
this crowd of people being like you know, not that
they were like going out of their minds for the song,
but they were like a there was vineral action to remember,
like it was watching myself in my memory. Performance is

(49:07):
like when you're watching a horror movie and the person
like puts their foot in the swimming pool, where like
the bloodthirsty alligator is You're like stop, do not, but
your powerless to do anything about it. I feel like
everyone at someday, I actually, I bet, I think you
should bring it back, And I think there's a way

(49:27):
that we can, like and I can write a verse
two in response that you can help me. Oh ship,
but you know what about his bad asshole or something. No,
he has a great asshole. I have a shot, but
that was going to happen. Um, but Zack, I just
want to say, because we got to get to the news.
I remember, and I just want validation of this. I

(49:48):
remember you getting off stage and I saw your eyes
and like your expression and you kind of walked into me.
Maybe this is something I've painted in my mind because
I've told the story so many times on so many podcasts.
I'm sure you've heard them where you just walked at
me and you just you after you got a stage
and you looked like you look you just go like
it was like this, like I fucked up. Like you

(50:09):
knew you might have sensed like my energy in the
room the second you looked at me. You knew it
was thinking even though the performance was great, the song
was great, and everyone loved you. I mean, then you
closed with be it brought down the house. It's like hard.
I had to put Mike up to like bring them
back down. No offense to Mike, but like get them
sit because he's so good, and I think I m before,

(50:32):
oh yeah, he that's why I was attracted to do.
Mostly it's like how fucking talented you were, and it
was an honor to even be a subject of your song,
even if it was this one. But I just remember
seeing you and knowing that you knew you sucked up?
Did you feel that walking off stages? Let me say
a few things beginning with answering this question, and I
know I need to move on, so I'll make it snappy.

(50:52):
I I think I was checking in with you, like
flicking my eyes towards you throughout the performance to see
what was happening. So I'm sure I knew midway through
that like basically this part of my life was over.
And then there's definitely no way that I would have
approached you and like gone through the state of the
crowd at Motley's to like back in the at the
back wall where you were standing and not been able

(51:13):
to pick up from your body language that something was
seriously wrong. So yes, I ravivate that memory for sure.
And I remember you standing back against that one back
wall and just being like, oh boy, this is going
to be wild. Were you in the back slowly going
like smelling your own breath? Next? Because I knew I
knew the time he was talking about, and I really

(51:34):
did know that I wasn't like a stinky person and
like or you know something, No, I am a stinky
person because I'm sucking human. But and I wasn't taking
care of myself then because I was drinking too much.
So it makes sense like I was stinkier than I
am now. Also, let me say I chew gum compulsively
and I'm super always self aware about my breath. It's
it came from my security inside me as well. Yes,
I had to quit gum actually because I was so

(51:56):
obsessed with gum. It was more related to like eating disorder.
But I'm coming up on a year of no and
I literally used to do like three packs a day,
like cigarettes. It was disgusting. So August I was a
tried on haead. I spent more money on tried to
than like people do on car insurance and like they're
and you had a certain kind of Yet it was
light blue that no one sold. It's winter winter Fresh

(52:18):
if you want to winter green, I think is the
nut name, but it's light blue. It's the best tried
and gum. If you're if you're someone who's not a
gum addict. You should try it, um, But I remember um.
I was next to Emmy blot Nick, who I had
told Zach wrote a song about me. I wonder what
it was, and she remember her, but it was so
nice to have her there because she was just like,
it's okay, like and then we went back in the
green room. I think during Mike set, after I had

(52:40):
told you never talked to me again, how dare you
do that? I went back in the green room, shed
a little tears, and then went out and I had
a great set because I was so angry, and you
know what this story has brought me before in my life.
It's like, actually that implies that, like I have the
ability to throw you, a consummate professional, off your game.

(53:01):
I'm sure it happens. Good stuff happens before Zack you did,
but it's like it was. I'm grateful for this because
obviously it's given me so much fodder because it is
such a good story and now it's brought I'm always
glad when we have I have conflicts with friends, even
if it's ten years of not talking. Because Pete Lee

(53:22):
and I after eleven years of not talking because of
a similar ish thing because I said a boundary that
he was not allowed to cross by any means. We
are now like so freaking close that we wouldn't have
been that way if we would have just been friends anyway.
And Zach, I feel like our future as friends is
going to be, like, will be at each other's weddings,
will be at each other's funerals, like I know now

(53:43):
like that we each other. Yeah, like one of us
will be at each other's. I always say that to
new friends. I go, You're either gonna be a mine
or I'm gonna be at yours. It's a true thing
that's going to happen, so um, you can actually blow
off mine if you have something else. I always give
extend that my funeral if I die, my friends can
all blow it off because it's the only thing that
you actually don't have to show up for for me

(54:04):
because I'm dead and I honestly don't care. So process
it anyway you want, and please perform that song amos
at all um the roly poly one, because roly polies
are gonna be eating my flesh soon in about twenty
years the wold. But Zach, I do want to say
that I'm grateful for it, and you did try to
reach out to me over the years, and you made

(54:24):
amazing amends and apologies that I wasn't able to accept.
Uh in the days following, the weeks following, the months following,
in the years following, extended apologies took accountability was no
no part of your apologies were ever but this it
was always like I did wrong. Here's what I did.
I would really like to be friends again, and I

(54:44):
was not ready to let that go because it felt
it was still an excuse for me to be like,
that's why I feel like I'm gross because he wrote
that song and if I, if I let him off
the hook, then I have to just feel gross because
of something. And I wasn't ready to unless you're you
and to accept apology in which you're really ready. I
will say though, that on Yam Kapor and like two
thousand maybe fifteen, you wrote to me said it was

(55:09):
Yam Kapoor asked for forgiveness, beautiful email. I was with
my parents and I was like, and I'm not kidding music.
I couldn't listen to rap music after that that the
song that you performed, because I just associated it all
with like I felt like how like Kim felt from
eminem Like, I was like, I never I didn't enjoy
by the way I was thinking about that that we did.

(55:30):
It was so good. Really no, maybe did he wear
an orange jump? Sorry? No, that's so funny though, but
I really couldn't enjoy. It was the same time, the
same thing that happened with Taylor Swift. When I thought
I had defended Taylor Swift and had like a bad
thing with her, I couldn't listen to her music anymore
until I apologize. And as soon as I accepted your apology,

(55:53):
it had been a couple of years since I really
enjoyed rap. I was like, all of a sudden, I
was like drawn to rap again. I was like, oh
my god, I go. I don't want to be but
I forgive you, and I really did. And then you
brought it up on um. You made it weird, the
story up on You made it weird the Pete Holmes
Show because Mike Kaplan had given Pete Holmes that little
nugget to bring up with you. You were so good
in that interview, being like I don't want to talk

(56:13):
about I don't want to talk about it, like knowing
that it was a bad place to go. Pete kept prying,
and I think you also, Pete was in a position
of like you're on the show, Pete is like super
famous at the time, You're like even feeling like why
amn't even on the show? Like you just want to
give him what he wants? And you probably he brought
it along and you handled it. You talked about it
as delicately as you could. But it's still brought up

(56:34):
stuff for me where I go, Okay, forgiveness revoked, I'm
I'm gonna hate my only word. Can I ask questions
that after this whole ordeal went down, did it make
you gun shy on like writing stuff about other people?
Like do you think it might have hindered you creatively
because of a reaction that might have not have necessarily
been about what you did verse how it was received,

(56:57):
and like with like future relationships or future things wrote about,
like family members or anything like that. Such a good question,
um and uh and and a generous one to like
invite me to think about that. I guess I'll say.
You know, we're sensitive artists like h and every experience
like you ricochet off of it, and it like affects
your forward trajectory, and I guess I would say I

(57:19):
feel the most myself creatively at this point, like you
know today that i'd like ever have, and I'm able
to speak about the creative confusion I was feeling at
the time with lots of remove because I feel like, oh,
I'm really doing my ship now. And if it is
the case that I was hindered from writing more songs
about people that I was dating, like, I'm glad that
I had this experience because perhaps it is a path

(57:41):
that would have brought me a lot of joy. I'm
happy with my trajectory now. Maybe another good path would
have been like writing more very personal songs about people
with their names thinly veiled, but like, I'm totally fine
to have not gone farther down that path. And this
was like the huge learning experience for me and Nikki.
Can I say like two things. One is I have
never listened to you talk about this on podcasts, and

(58:02):
actually the episode of your podcast where you two talked
about it was the first time I've ever been able
to like, like, I it would make me perspire to
think about hearing you talk about it, and so hearing
you laid out there. I was like, you just have
to like power through and listen to this, and it
was a really good experience. And I'm really glad I did.
And I'm glad I didn't get any earlier versions. I'll
never seek them out. I've never even re listened to

(58:24):
myself on PETE because I just remember how excruciating. Yes,
and you're right, I'm so glad you haven't done that.
Thank you. And I and I also want to say,
I am just so the fact that you're I'm like,
I told you this when we started trading voice memos
like a couple of weeks ago, but you have become
this incredible You're like a beacon of self awareness and

(58:46):
like calling it like it is and being upfront about
who you are, even saying stuff like I am a
stinky person because I'm a person who exists in a
physical body. Like I'm just I always was like so
impressed with how I mean, you might remember this time
as more dark than you were, but like I was
into you because you were so smart and funny and gorgeous,

(59:07):
but you had this like being around you was just
like it was exhilarating because you you had a unique Uh,
aspects to your character that like weren't like almost anyone
or anyone that I've ever met, and I think you've
only amplified those things. And sometimes, like the way our
relationship worked for me once we stopped talking was that,
like every couple of years, i'd get a text from

(59:28):
someone and they'd be like, hey, man, I just want
you to know. I was listening to a podcast and
Nikki Glazer is talking about you, and eventually I was like, yeah,
that's just part of things now. And even when those
things would happen, I would think, I'm very clear about this.
I would think this is not the way it's supposed
to go, and it's not like I knew, and I

(59:49):
was like, oh, Nicky is gonna come around. But I thought,
I just have this feeling that one day it's not
going to be like this, And like it helped make
that stuff more. It still hurt my feelings, but I
was able to roll with it more and I'm so
happy to be here now. I feel like I time
warped from all those past texts or you know, phone
calls or whatever, and now I'm like, Okay, this is
how it's supposed to be. Thank you, for saying all that.

(01:00:11):
And and I do think that I the person I
am now was there then. And I don't uh when
people are like, wait, you before you quit drinking, you
were like a different person that you don't stand by,
and it's like, no, it was all there. It was
being clouded by that stuff. And so it's really nice
to hear that. And I knew you saw that in me,
And that's why I like that you were It's obvious

(01:00:32):
to me that I was on the way to being
a better person because I was attracted to something. I mean,
all these things, me quitting drinking and you being the
relationship I head right before. That was not because I
was like hit a bottom. It was because I saw
better for myself and I was already on that trajectory.
So and I just want to say that in I understood, uh,

(01:00:53):
I was able to have. I did the same thing
to people, uh, to people I cared about, where I
talked bad about them on something that I just didn't
even think about them hearing. Didn't do it because I
didn't think they would hear about because I was just like, whatever,
those are my feelings. It really hurt them. I apologized
for it. I got their forgiveness, and then I brought
it up again on something and the person that I

(01:01:15):
had upset got mad again and was like, you brought
it up again, like you're bringing it up on a
podcast as like entertainment. And even though you have this
perspective of being being sorry about what you did, it
just open it like picked at the scab and it's
bleeding again. And I was like, oh my god, I
know that feeling. I felt that on the you made
it weird thing like even though he was remorseful and
like the fact that he brought it up again like

(01:01:36):
re triggered it all and and so I was able
to understand. Um it helped me in and like being
able to see myself and people I've heard so I've
done the same thing. I'm so glad we're friends now. Um.
And I said over the voice where I was like,
I love I don't even think. I don't even way too,

(01:01:59):
I and so, UM, I do love. It's like it's
really I love you too, Andrew Nicky. I really did
love you back then, like you're just I feel like
we're like I don't know, it's like one of those Okay,
this is my last question. About this in My friend
Larry was in town and we went out to eat
by the Improv and he was like, Hey, are we

(01:02:21):
can we go see a comedy show? And I was
like sure. And we went to the Improv and we
slid into that like circular booth and like the back
right of the room, and you were on stage and
you came and sat down in the booth and we
hadn't talked, and I was like, oh my god, does
Nikki know that we're sitting like one person apart from
each other. It was dark. You weren't expecting to see
me there. So a thing I've wondered about for I

(01:02:42):
guess like four years, is did that Did you know
that this happened? I don't. When you're bringing this up,
I did not remember it, but A dent knew because
like I, that's a move I would have made, is
like I'm just gonna act totally fine about him being here.
I actually love that he's here, because I'm gonna go
and try to kill and like be impressive make him.

(01:03:04):
You probably did, and I probably knew that he didn't
know I had seen him, So I was going to
make him uncomfortable by like being in the being in
front of him on the booth, being like, whence she
turns around and sees it me, it's going to be
a thing. But I knew, so it was all calculated.
I saw you went. I mean, I really went out
of my way to like make you a pariah. And
that is what I'm most disgusted by, is like when
boys have hurt me, I've gone out of my way

(01:03:24):
to like to have everyone hate them too, And it's
such a disgusting move and I'm really embarrassed that. And
I do think that some of my ship talking about
you and behavior towards you at comedy events made you
feel alienated as I was trying to do and possibly
hurt you, not only in your career or like personal relationships.

(01:03:46):
And I really apologize, and I want to make it
up to you by like bringing you in and lifting
you up and like showing you off because you're so
insanely talented and you're I love to hear that back
then the tour. Absolutely do spots on the tour pick
out dats. It is going to come out of your time.
But I'm grateful for you. But anyway, I I really

(01:04:09):
I apologize for being a bully to you. It's like
my worst character defect, I believe, and um and I
really was and I tried to and um and I
and I will try to do everything I can to
make up for that in a sincere way, which is like,
not because I want to make up for it, but because, um,
you deserve to have all the success, because you're one
of the most talented people I've ever known, and you

(01:04:30):
know that, and that's why I was attracted to you
and felt so like one of the many reasons I
was attracted to you. And uh so I plan on
making it up to you, not because I have to,
but because I want to. And also, um, I loved
that you said when I go I'm a vegan now,
I was really catching up on voice. Someone was I
was like, I'm a vegan now, and he said, when
I heard you were vegan, I had a feeling we

(01:04:50):
would be able to because if you're a vegan, you
have enough empathy for like if you kept empathy for
like snails and bees, I don't know that you are.
There's that animal rights lawyer who wanted to kill her
girlfriends a balance. Oh, that's interesting to have a cow
kill a cowboy really being vegan. You were the first

(01:05:14):
vegan I ever got close to, and I used to
like roll my eyes at it and even used it
against you to make fun of you in later years.
And um, that's that's been really fun to talk about
as a vegan now because there's so many vegan stand
up jokes. Were we where do we do our protein?
And it's just the hackiest ship. And I'm on a
crusade to make vegan material. That is making fun of that,

(01:05:38):
uh looking at us like that, But I used to
do it. I was. I was a person that made
fun of vegans and you were. It was all because
I was hurt. Let's get to the news. I don't
know if we're doing the news. Were skipping the news? Yeah,
let's skip the news and thank you, well we did
the news. You heard it here first Shewn and Andrew

(01:05:59):
And now this is this is a segment I'm very
excited about. It's where we're playing. Um, Wednesday is a
wild card. We just do different segments on Wednesday. This
today's segment is going to be the blankest thing you've
ever done. And today's blank is the bravest thing. The
word has already come up a bunch of times which
we didn't even plan for. Um, and I want to
know what what the bravest thing is you've ever done? Andrew,

(01:06:20):
have you had time to think about this? Yeah, I
would say it would have to be to think, well,
giving them drinking and going to therapy. Okay, telling kind
of a selfish thing though, Like I was thinking about, like,
what have I done brave for someone else? And which
is sad? Uh? Maybe I'll sign up for a big

(01:06:41):
brother going to therapy when you talk about that, Yeah,
so going to therapy. I just, um, you know, I
was told to go to therapy by my family for
many years, and I just you know, when you're told
to do something, you want to rebel against it and eventually, um,
I don't Were we friends before I even went to
first time? I don't know, I think so, but yeah,

(01:07:04):
so I don't know, Like I always I also assumed,
because I never looked into it, that it was so
fucking expensive that I can come bepoor comedian dogwalker, I
can next excuses putting it on a pedestal, being like
I kind of understand what I'm going through because my
little brother went to therapy. So the correlation like through him,
I understand where I'm at, Like, why don't you ask

(01:07:26):
her this? Sam? Uh so? Yeah, so like going to
that and how did you do it? To be honest,
there's a lot of people listening that the same way,
and they're they're talking their head like, well, I they're
making excuses, So how did you do it? It's so
hard to do to find the right one, because it
is hard. I always say it's like dating, like you
can you cannot go off one to three, even five.

(01:07:47):
It took me I finally found a good therapist and
it's taken me eighteen years ago. Therapy. I've had good
ones here and there, but like a really good one.
It's like a relationship. It's hard. Well, part of you
you learn along the way. I just thought maybe it
would make me weak or like weaker, like like I
looked at it as a weakness to go get help.
So I actually went to a social worker years ago,

(01:08:09):
and I was like, well, that's not like a therapist.
That's like a that that's a social that's a tough
social worker, you know, like you convince. Yeah. We used
to build construction and break down my relationship with the Yeah,
one hammer at a time. Yeah, yeah, I've never used
a hammer, so anyways, so yeah, so no, I went

(01:08:31):
another comedian this uh that all the comedians went through
this guy. I went to his wife because she was
had more availability, and someone said I could pay for
on a sliding scale, and I was like, what the
hell is a sliding scale? I didn't even know what
that was. Uh, and um it was like sixty bucks
to see her. And I was like, I could afford

(01:08:53):
sixty dollars a month or every two weeks to kind
of get an understanding of like what the hell is
going away? Get out of it? Could always stop unless
you Nicky Glazer for a couple of years with an
abuse of therapist. But like if you encounter one of
those talk to I went to another therapist to break
up with a therapist one time because it was just
such so there's people out there just like relationships. It

(01:09:13):
really like in like three things like like there were
things that I was putting off, like I had financial
uh like ruined him a debt that I would just
avoid because it was too scary to focus on and
I was too afraid of finding out if I was
sick or not, whether I had like aids or like
whether I had cancer, I was a complete hypochondriac, and

(01:09:37):
those two things within the first five sessions. I went
to a doctor and I went to an accountant, and
I gotta tell you, I was even sadder when I
found off. Now it's very close. Yeah, And and I
just think that that I love that you. I'm tying.
So that's good because it's like, I just feel like

(01:09:58):
so many men are just out getting into therapy and
self help because it's become this like almost I think
it's the I think it's the hottest thing a guy
can do. And I don't just say that too, just
because I want more people to get help, and I'm
think it will incentivize it. It is really like it's
such a turn on that someone's like it's brave. It
honestly is brave. It's like as brave as rock climbing

(01:10:20):
or doing something like masks. It's very masculine to admit
what to ask for help and to talk to someone
who admit you're not as smart as you think you
are and that you don't have it figured all out,
and that you want to get better. There's nothing hotter.
So I always say, like, if people, if you're in
a relationship with a man who or a woman who
is refusing to do therapy or like things they haven't

(01:10:42):
figured out. You're with someone who thinks they're done you.
The idea that someone is done that you're just like,
I'm good this time is so it's just so unattractive
and it's so it's it's it's indicative of someone who
if you're not happy with them right now and they
feel like they're on do you think it's going to
get better? Ever unless they take the step to get better, No,

(01:11:04):
it's gonna get worse. So, um, I always tell my friends,
make an ultimatum, say leave him if if he if
he doesn't get help, and they go. But then he's
just gonna do it because he doesn't want to leave me.
Yeah he is. You need to give people it's like intervention.
And then and then he'll learn in therapy that it's
not even about her, it's about him the whole time,
and that his ship that he had to figure out.

(01:11:25):
It might be a bad therapist and you don't like her.
And then they goes it was a bad therapist. I
don't want to go again, And you go, okay, well, um,
you keep going did did you stop out of the
first girlfriend who wasn't or the first bumble date you
went on? Did you just stop maybe because bumble is
not that great? But like you just keep going. So
I really appreciate you saying that that was the bravest thing.
And I do believe you're You've done a lot of

(01:11:47):
masculinely brave things. But I'm glad you chose that one
because I think it is you really didn't want to go, Zach,
what's the bravest thing you've ever done? Well? Uh, Andrew,
that was great, Thank you. It's making me feel good
about being in therapy. I think my therapist is good,
not great, but he's good. That's good enough. Um. The
sort of boring answer that I chose when thinking about
this prompt was moving to l A when I did,

(01:12:09):
like eleven years ago, because I just didn't know what
was going on and it was kind of a dumb
move that has turned out to have worked out. But yeah,
I really was like, did you ever read the book
The Phantom Tollbooth. It's like a children's book. There's a
part where I saw the booth with Colin Farrell. There's
a part where this like this guy says to this

(01:12:31):
boy who's going to go on a quest, He's like,
I have to tell you something about this, but I
can't tell you till you're back. And then the kid
goes and does it, and then he comes back and
the king is like, Okay, the thing I can only
tell you when you're back is this is impossible. It
can't be achieved. And the kids like, but I did it,
And the King's like, well, if I told you that before,
you would not have been able to do it. And
so sometimes I look back at myself and I'm like,

(01:12:52):
you don't want to know how much you're going to
have to deal with, man, just go move to l
A and don't worry about it and let some time pass.
So yeah, I think, yeah, that blind and that blind
being naive is a good thing. Yeah, because you look
back and you go, I didn't really have to steal
myself before that move, Like maybe a little bit. You
were nervous, and like I definitely went before I moved

(01:13:12):
to l A the first time, I had gotten explosive
fights out of nowhere because I was so nervous to
take this leap, and I was like acting out in
all these ways. But I didn't. It was just the
thing you had to do. I didn't think of it
as like this. When I think of bravery, I think
of like running into a burning building, right like and
and that is what l A is now is a
burning burning burning tents on the street. Yeah, no going.

(01:13:37):
I actually know your bravest thing back that I would say,
do you know what I'm gonna say? I want to
talk about it? You confronted a dog and like saved
my life. It was the hottest thing ever. I've never
been so horned up for someone. First of all, I
get horned up when guys are like vulnerable and go
to therapy. I literally get like one time I've got
so horny on a dime was when my ex boyfriend

(01:13:59):
started saw being out of nowhere. Is the first time
I saw him like break down, crying and I literally
had to blow him in a conference room because I
was at his emotions. So I stand by this like
getting help and accessing feelings. But the time that we
were about to go to launch or dinner something walking
out of your apartment, a pit bull growled at us
and was about like, Zach, it was your neighbors that

(01:14:20):
were okay, I used to live next to the band
Green Jello. Do you remember them. They had the song
three Little No No like okay. So they lived in
this house in Hollywood that I lived in the apartment
next to, and they would have these wild parties and
they got evicted because someone died at one of their parties.
And they just had these two pit bulls named Jihad

(01:14:43):
and Lucy, and Lucy was short for Lucifer, and they
were just unrestrained and when you walk by, they would
scream it you ferociously while you walked past this like
met this concrete yard full of like piles of dogshit.
And so one night Nicki and I were coming back
late from a show and we were walking into my
terrible apartment and all of a sudden it wasn't terrible.

(01:15:05):
I like, like, I like remember that Brauner's show. It
was the time I saw Brauner's that stuff that has
like all the scripture, what the fund is this? And
I smelled like peppermints for like thirteen years. I think
you were like, go you didn't want to do a
little bit more stuff? Can you wash your mouth? Go
on peppermint Like it's almost like mouthwash. You had his body,

(01:15:27):
and I think it was for me. You were sending
and looked like a face when you looked at it
from overhead, and you were always like I like that guy.
You'd say hi when you would come back to visit
for it was really Nikki is like what the fund
is that? And I look up and the pit bull
is just charging us. Why do I feel like it
was a jihad? Yeah, if I had to put my

(01:15:48):
money on, But this was ten years ago, so thank
god they're both Probably it was no, it was their
puppy Sharia law, and it was like what it was
that was so scary. I member, Zack, I went like
this around my neck because I knew that I was
about to be attacked, and like my neck is the
only thing in my face, my money maker. I went
into I'm being attacked, like not fight mode, it's already gone. Yeah.

(01:16:13):
I was like, let me go for it. Maybe I'll
come during this. So then uh but you didn't you? Sorry?
Who are you? Moses? My dog just got so mad
or so scared. That's what it does. It does a
dog when you do that at it, and the dog

(01:16:34):
was just like what the it stopped and and then
we just kind of ran around, stopped in its tracks,
and you were just like you were not someone that
I had seen in that mode before, of like like
you're you're vegan, like you're kind to people like That's
why I was attracted to you as well. It was
and you just protected my life and I was like, oh,

(01:16:55):
let's go. I went in and was like yeah, like
let's I was so horn up because you saved my life.
That was very brave. I want to say my bravest
thing real quick was doing was accepting Dancing with the
Stars when I had no dancing ability and agreeing to
dance and not knowing that it was a live show.
But then the day I found out it was live
and I didn't pull out of it was the bravest

(01:17:17):
moment of going like, Okay, I'm going to dance live
on TV and I don't know if I can dance.
I literally have never learned a dance before. That was
the bravest moment of my life. No, what was your
bravest moment trying to text me to hurry this up
and seeing my response. I think the bravest moment for
me was having to put my dog down, like dealing
with with his death because I usually try to avoid

(01:17:39):
stuff like that, And what what um, I mean I
guess you didn't have a choice a little bit, or
I mean I guess you did have a choice, Like
what was that choice? Like, well, I could so he
had um a cancer that had me tasks mathask aside
um and he would need assistance going to the bathroom,
he would need assistance using the bathrooms. I would have

(01:18:01):
to take him to get his bladder drained for the
rest of his life. And I was like, I'm not
I'm not going to keep him alive for that, like
it would be for me, would be so selfish, just
like having to go through it and be like being
there as he's euthanized. It was just like a life
changing moment that I could have like ignored or had
someone else deal with it, which is something like I

(01:18:25):
don't I don't um confront like death feelings like like
straightforward and like send people my regards, like I just
kind of like avoid it. I do too. I like
when when I have a friend whose parent dies, I
can't call them. It's just too I don't know what
to do either. And it's like I'm really grateful, Like

(01:18:45):
you said that because I feel alone. I feel like
a really that's when I feel I'm a really good friend.
But when my friends have a death in their life,
I go, I go silent, and I don't know what
to do. The dog things weird because I see all
these tiktoks like last Day with you know, Loose or
Lucy Jehad and uh yeah and uh and and the

(01:19:05):
dog is like eating and looks like that's the thing
that's hard with the dogs, Like you could euthanize it.
It almost looks like it could live another couple of years,
you know what I mean, Like, but it has like
cancer and it's gonna die in a month anyways. But
you just you don't. It's not showing you that because
it's not a dog. It's not like the dog can't
be like, hey, yeah, this is pretty bad. Terminal five

(01:19:26):
or whatever the hell it is. You know what a
great Terminal five? I think that's like a music venue
in New York where I saw green Land and uh yeah,
no that's a really really good one, and um and
then you turned it into something awesome. Yeah, I turned
into something very positive where I was able to raise
money for um, a charity that a dot like a

(01:19:49):
a veterinarian who helped me through it. Um was was
a director of that helped people get medical assistance for
their pets and helped um stray animals as well get
medical service. So I just, yeah, that was to something
really touched. Uh did not die in vain. Final thought,
I want to move into This brings us perfectly to

(01:20:10):
a place that I just I don't know if people
know this. I've been giving out dog in the In
the solo part of the show, I talked about how
I get my dog to be an awfulish dog, and
this has all been like dog themed and brave themed,
but um, being with your dog when it's youth and
I I haven't had to go through that before, but
if you can, I hope everyone makes the choice to

(01:20:32):
like be in the room, because I've just read on
Reddit enough times that like from veterinarians writing in like
that is a time that you just you need to
be I know you don't want to see it and
it's gonna be hard, but like you need to be
there for your dog to like hold his paw or
do have whatever to like, you know, bring them to
the next stage of their life. So if you can
do it. It's like so many veterinarians share on Reddit

(01:20:54):
where I read stuff that, um, the saddest moments are
when the owner can't be in and if you're someone
something that you were, like I was one person who
wasn't in there. That's that's what you had to do
to get through it. And maybe next time you won't
and your dog. You only did because you love your
dog so much, So don't feel bad. It's just like
maybe next time, try to be there and you just

(01:21:14):
couldn't do it then, and that's okay. And I share
one thing, yeah, please, that I regret and I wish
someone would have advised me. So when it was happening, Bruno,
like I was like on the side of him and
I was holding him, like I had my hand around
his neck or whatever, just like holding him calmly. And
my biggest regret is that I wasn't the last person
that he saw right before he passed. So sit in

(01:21:38):
front of your pet. Okay, I like that too, but
I will say that, Yeah, I forgive yourself for that,
and because you were the last person he felt you
touching him and dogs he was probably blind anyway, like
he's so old like they don't even see the way
that we see or like think about the I think
dogs are less image focus. You were probably the last

(01:21:59):
person he smelled and felt and which is much more
important to a dog than seeing, But we look at
it through a human lens of like seeing, and it's
just it's not the same. So I think that you're
okay that you weren't the last thing. You probably heard too. Yeah,
and also yeah, her walkman um, Yeah, And I just

(01:22:25):
think that uh oh. And I also want to say
that some veterinarians wrote to me about um because I
was talking about taking care of Marian who was attacked
by a dog and how she almost died and was
very recently and all the things we went through. And
I just want to say that you may not know this,
but veterinarians are Everyone always says like dentists are the
number one like suicidal or like they have the most

(01:22:46):
suicide of any profession. But it's actually veterinarians because they
get into being a vet because they love animals and
they have like extreme empathy. And it was like a shot.
It's like it's almost like a childhood. That's always the
job you pick as a child. So these people still
retain that childhood love of animals that most of us
abandoned along the way, and they get into this profession

(01:23:07):
to save animals, and most of their job is not
it's it's actually treating animals that have been abused, seeing
terrible things, putting down animals, just seeing you can't save
as much as you think. And they do save a lot.
So they suffer immense grief, immense um just emotional turmoil
and uh. And because there's they feel so much more

(01:23:29):
because they were drawn to that profession in the first place,
they feel the negative so much more so. Actually, veterinarians vets,
both veterans and vets, VET technicians and veterinarians have higher
suicide than any other profession. Veterinarians. So I want to
give a shout out to veterinarians. And I want everyone
who might be like annoyed with other vet or like,

(01:23:50):
just know that those people when my parents were kind
of like annoyed at how much they were getting charged
for the marrying stuff, and they had brought a dog
to this place before, and they the dog they paid
all this money because they were like, we could save
him this way. It's most likely he's going to be
saved if we do this. He wasn't saved. And they
were always like and because they tried their best, and
they always think like they didn't even try because they
knew they we didn't pay enough, or they knew our

(01:24:12):
credit score. They want to like make it someone else's
fault other than like it just as bad luck. And
my parents have a lot of Like when they brought
Mary into the hospital, I go, why would you bring
her there again? If you truly thought these people weren't
giving her They didn't give Django who died the best care,
why would you bring him back? You know that's not
the case. They're gonna do their best. Oh, your your
mom gave the credit card. I bet they're gonna see

(01:24:34):
her credit and they're gonna not even save Mary because
they know that they can't get a buck from us.
And I'm like, if they wanted to make money, they
would have been a human doctor. These people are not drying.
I know there's money and being a vet, but there's
not they're smart enough to be any kind of doctor.
They chose one that is uh more thankless and uh
as ill you know then than the one they if

(01:24:56):
they were motivated by money, which I'm sure some are.
Uh they would have done that. Have faith in your
vets that they're really good people and they're drawn to
it for a good reason and have a lot of
empathy and uh gratitude for what they do as you
have any pets growing up, Zack where you had to
didn't write, I feel like you're a hardcore cat family.
But then when I went to college to fill the void, Yes,

(01:25:20):
and now she a dog. Parson know that dog died
and she's back to cats. Nikki Jan is like an
iconic Glazer pet right like before me. I would have
heard about him when we were dating. I think he
was around when you were thinking Django was around. You
met Django and Django died tragically, but um we you know,

(01:25:41):
Django was the second Jango in our lives. We had
a bird named Django initially that was bought to replace Kiwi,
who was the best part we ever had that died
because of my mom cleaned his cage was something and
then she blamed it on a friend, Cindy, but it
was actually her and um years later I found out
the Kiwi died. We ki We was a parakeet, just
a shitty pair keep that talked No, it's fine. She

(01:26:02):
didn't mean to. No one means to. But she just
didn't want to take accountability because she thought I would
be mad at her because I was a kid and
I probably would have it was easier for me to
be mad at her friend. So Kiwi died. He was
just a shitty pair keet that like, isn't supposed to
talk and do tricks, but he was insanely intelligent and
could do all these things. And we were like, we
don't want to gamble with another pair of keet who
might not be as special at Kibi. Let's get a
parrot that we know we'll talk, no does tricks. We

(01:26:24):
got it um Senegalese parrot. It was. We named a Django.
It uh never talked bid us all the time. Was
not fun. Eventually flew out of the house one My
dad was bringing in a Christmas tree one year um
and gone never came back. We looked for it forever
and it was winter outside so it didn't last long.

(01:26:46):
So he never came back. And then my parents got
a dog and they were like, we're gonna name this
dog Django, and I go, how dare you? We had
a burnt like, you can't do that, and they did it.
And so when my my parents got another pet, I
was like, what a good name of ja go And
they're like, no, that was dog and I was like,
now there's been a bird so um And so they
named it uh much like uh Lucifer and Gad. They

(01:27:09):
named it um uh child rape. Yeah, think of the
worst child before. It's like a like a very like
dark thing. And that that was one of the bravest things, honestly,
because that there's a big risk factor. And thank you
guys for laughing because you have to because I'm the host. Um,

(01:27:30):
thank you so much, actor when you will be back,
Thank you for doing the show. Thank you to the listener.
We skipped the news today, but I think this was
one of my favorite episodes ever. Zach, you are delight.
I'm so excited for you and Andrew to be friends.
I'm so excited for us to be friends again. UM
and Zach, who what song right now? Are you most
proud of that people can go and check out and
get a really good taste of who you are and

(01:27:51):
just be sold instantly. I I want to know, Um,
I wish I had bad it's about your girlfriend now
as great breath. She's got too good at breath. I
can't believe it. She smells like a mint tree. Zach
is so fucking good. And I haven't listened to your

(01:28:12):
stuff for I mean, I still over the years would
play people your stuff too. She would. I remember, like
one of the first times we ever hung out, she
played your stuff. Yeah, so yeah, thank you. I'm well,
let me say, I'm definitely gonna send you the pillbugs
a link to the pillbugs thing once we get out. Great.
It's it's not how I would write it today. I
listened to it when we became friends again. But you

(01:28:34):
know whatever, you'll take it with a grain of song.
It was. It was ten years the first lyric is
I had this girl and when she spent the night,
and I listened to it, and I was like, oh,
not how I would phrase it. No, that's cool. I
feel cool. I like that I had this girl when
she's for the night. Hello, Yes, I was a girl
that you had. I think, what's the song we can
look at now? Damn. Everything that I want to point

(01:28:56):
people too is from the cross Word show, My magnum
Opus and the thing that I'm doing now days, so
I'll send you a link to that too. But it's
a song of mine called Red Thread that's going to
be part of an upcoming show and it's like a
rapt retelling of the myth of um theseus, the mythical
hero like escaping from the labyrinth by following a red
Thread out. It's it's dope, red Threat and it's out now.
People can find it YouTube whatever. We'll follow up YouTube.

(01:29:21):
Zach Sherwin not m C. Mr Napkin anymore, Okay, Zach Sherwin, Rwyn.
If you're listening to this podcast, you should just listen
to Pillbugs. It's gonna be much you don't listen to
be I know that you're like overb probably, but it's
called aggressive. That's a goodsive. It is so fucking good.
It's so fucking good and it just is uh like

(01:29:42):
it's yeah, I love it. I still I still love it.
And I'm excited to listen to your new work and
to be thank you. I'm so glad to be here.
This was I just like, thank you the best. It
was literally the best you're going to be in Let's
cuddle going out or I love you, I love you
also Sweet Noah's on the Fence. So much for listening

(01:30:07):
today to this different kind of episode, but we had
so much fun. We love you guys, Thank you Busties,
don't be and