September 19, 2025 • 24 mins
Want to see The Puzzler LIVE in NYC on Oct 7? Limited tickets available now! https://bit.ly/cheerfulpuzzler
Hello, Puzzlers! Today, A.J. and Greg give you a little peek behind the curtain and take you on a tour of the Puzzle Lab.
Join host A.J. Jacobs and his guests as they puzzle–and laugh–their way through new spins on old favorites, like anagrams and palindromes, as well as quirky originals such as “Ask AI” and audio rebuses.
Subscribe to The Puzzler podcast wherever you get your podcasts!
"The Puzzler with A.J. Jacobs" is distributed by iHeartPodcasts and is a co-production with Neuhaus Ideas.
Our executive producers are Neely Lohmann and Adam Neuhaus of Neuhaus Ideas, and Lindsay Hoffman of iHeart Podcasts.
The show is produced by Jody Avirgan and Brittani Brown of Roulette Productions.
Our Chief Puzzle Officer is Greg Pliska. Our associate producer is Andrea Schoenberg.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello Puzzlers. A quick announcement, The Puzzler is doing a
live show in New York City and we'd love for
you to come. It's October seventh at six thirty pm
and an awesome venue called Caveat. There will be stories, puzzles, prizes.
It's part of the Cheerful Earful Podcast Festival. We love
(00:23):
a good rhyming title here at the Puzzler. Please check
the show notes for a link to tickets. Now on
with the show, Hello Puzzlers, I think it would be
nice to start with a quick quiz. So, in honor
of the current month of September, can you come up
with any other words that begin with the letters sept
(00:46):
I'm looking for other words that begin with sept. One
of them is right in front of your nose or
actually inside your nose. To be more clear, it can
be straight or deviated. The answer to this question and
others after the break, Hello Puzzlers, Welcome back to The
(01:12):
Puzzler podcast. My kid is an honor student sticker on
your puzzle car bumper, so uh wow.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
We asked before the break if you could come up
with some words that begin with the letters sept sept
As in the current month, September, and I clude that
one of them is right inside your nose.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Greg, Yes, that is well. I came up with a couple.
That one is septum, right.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yes, septum exactly.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
And I don't know if that you know sept In
September is the group of mean seven, right, yes, Septus.
September used to be the seventh month. I also thought
of septic absolutely, and then the others are all seven words,
septuplet septet exactly, the less interesting.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Right, those are the two that that Andrea and I
came up with, and neither of them are related to seven.
You do not have seven nostrils in your nose.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Oh you don't.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
That's true. I don't want I don't want to assume.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Come on, but you.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Did bring up that sept is the Latin prefix for seven,
as opposed to hept which is the Greek prefix for
seven as a heptathlon. But because we have a crazy language,
September is not actually the seventh month. It's the ninth month.
You can blame Julius Caesar who inserted two months between
(02:49):
June and September, but I did.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
One of them, both of them named for him.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Yes, although I did read that that was later someone else.
He had other names else is like, well, let's give
him credit for messing up our calendar. But I do
think they could have been more logical, because you could stick.
Here's my proposal. See if it catches on and puzzlers,
I'm counting on you just to make this happen. You
(03:16):
change July's name to September, because now that's the real
seventh month. August becomes October, eighth month. September becomes November.
October becomes December. Now here's where it gets good. November
becomes on December.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yeah, that's eleventh.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
That's un is the eleventh, and December becomes duo December,
so that I feel is ready to catch on.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
It sounds like we get three months of winter break
because of all the Decembers set December on December and
duo December, and you just you're off school for the
whole time.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
And on December kind of sounds like, you know, it
doesn't exist, like.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Right, enjoy December and then everything disappears. Right.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, anyway, I'm hoping for an on December, Thanksgiving on December,
and New Year's in dua December, but we'll see.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Congress is going to get on this right away.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Yes, I feel that that is top priority. Well, today,
in September or whatever we're going to call it, we
are going inside the puzzle Lab. We're going to talk
about puzzle news. Greg has been monitoring the puzzle.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Puzzle ticker, the tickers ticker.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
And also we have reader mail, and let's start with
some reader mail, because we have gotten some delightful letters.
One of my favorite genres of reader mail is when
the puzzlers at home write their own puzzles for So
we have Steve Baggish and his son, Eli Sheer Baggish,
(04:57):
who are delightful listeners as they've emailed before, and this
time they they caught the puzzle making bug and submitted
their own puzzle about city names. So their puzzle is
very clever and it's all about wordplay, puns, homophones, hominem's
(05:18):
homographs about city names. So I'll give you an example,
and then I'll give you a couple of their other clues.
So the example would be, this is a clue to
a state capital in the United States, and the clue
is genetic testing of this rabbit showed no DNA from
(05:39):
any other animals. You might say it is completely rabbit.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Or all hair, no money, Oh monny.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Honey, which is all been a New York the state
capital in New York. You made Greg laugh, that's about.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Laughed, Eli, And always make me laugh or at least
make me smile.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Uh all right, Well we'll see if this does smile
or laugh. This is I actually am going to start
with an island. It's a European island, not a city.
And it's what you might say to indicate that you
own the killer whale. It belongs to you. You might say,
that's blank blank.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Yes, this is a place I have been fortunate enough
to vacation with my family. Oh fantasy. It is the
island of Majorca. That's right, My Orca.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
My Orca, like the killer whale and my and I
I saw there are like a bunch of different spellings
of my Orca.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
With J or with two l's Majorca either.
Speaker 1 (06:44):
Something like that, but equally it's lovely either way you
spell it.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Beautiful place really, and there's going to be a total
solar eclipse there next year, no way.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Okay, good to know. Puzzled, there's a puzzle field trip
for us. Yeah, all right, uh, a couple more than
This is a city on the west coast of the
United States. It's two words. If you eat round waffles
on the beach, you might end up with this city.
(07:12):
So it's think of a round frozen waffle. Yeah, if
you eat it at the beach, it might get this.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
This was the first two words city I thought of
on the west coast, so that's interesting that that worked
out that way. It would be a sand Diego Sandy
Ego exactly, San Diego.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
You are good at this, no sprice. I guess you
are the puzzler.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
It's very well clued. It's a very good clue.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Yes, it's credit the clue.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
They done they they done good.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
They've done good the father son team. All right, how
about this is a capital city in Asia, Southeast Asia.
Imagine there's an entirely naked staff at a shop that
sells sandwich, meats and bagels. You might say, this is
a blank blank.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
I thought of Bangkok, which has nothing to do with this,
so just leave that there. And I also, when you
said Asia, you said south South Asia, Yes, South Asia,
right right, I went to I went to Southeast Asia
and then I thought of, of course, Taipei, which is
(08:23):
the capital of Taiwan and is also like a Taipei personality,
which also has nothing to do with this. They're looking
for New Delhi. That's nude Nude.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
Deli, Nude Delhi as in delicatessen, and New Delhi as
in uh, the city in India. Well done, well done.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Those are good.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Now there are more. There are more that the Bangish
family wrote. Then we're gonna put them all on Instagram,
so yeah, very good. Check that out at Hello puzzlers,
and thank you Steve and Ela. You guys are heroes,
all right. I have one last one from okay, the
Baggish boys. This is a city in the midwest of
(09:04):
the United States, and it sounds like small red fruits,
small red fruits.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Small red fruits. It's not Indianapoli, oh right, the right
suffix right, which is just what the Greek word for
city polus Indianapolis, Minneapolis, Minneapolis. They are Minneapolis, Minneapolis, Minneapolis.
(09:32):
That's actually when you when you don't have any small
red fruit, you are minnieapple Less.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Nicely done, all right, so you can use that clue instead.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Baggish to the Baggishes.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Uh well, thank you again. The bagishes, but that's just
part one. As I said, Greg has been monitoring the
puzzle news feed.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
What do you got, Greg, Well, it's big news actually,
and big news in the world of ciphers, and it's
all about cryptos, which, well, you should talk about it
a little bit because it's in the book.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
You wrote about it extensively, and you interviewed folks associated
with I think you went there and saw it, so
would you that's right, Explain what cryptos is and then
I'll talk about.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
The news so littly. Yes, we wrote about it in
the Puzzler, which Greg and I collaborated on, and it
is one of the great unsolved puzzles of the world.
It's an obsession of thousands of puzzle fanatics. And it
is a sculpture that was commissioned by the CIA in
nineteen ninety so thirty five years ago, and it's on
(10:44):
the grounds of the CIA headquarters in Virginia, and it's
this big metal sculpture sort of like a wall, and
it has hundreds of letters and symbols carved into the wall.
And it was created by sculptor named Jim Samborn along
with a retired cryptographer from the CIA. Now they thought like,
(11:09):
this will be fun. We'll put a code in and
the cia'll solve it in like two days. That was
thirty five years ago. People have solved parts of it.
There are four parts, and they've solved the three of
the four parts, and those solutions they're kind of mysterious.
Their sentences about it seem like directions. Actually one of
(11:31):
them seems like directions longitude and latitude. But the fourth part,
called K four, has never been solved, and people have
been going at it. I am actually on a message
board where people every day have different theory.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
I think it's about the Navajo language. That's the secret
to the code. Oh no, it's Moby Dick. If you
read Moby Dick. And I actually got permission after months
of trying to go to the CIA headquarters and see
it in person. I thought this will give me a
leg up. Didn't. I didn't help it, but I did
(12:09):
get advice from all of these fanatics about what I
should look for, and I gave them all the information.
So maybe that'll help. But as you mentioned, this is
just a couple of weeks ago we had breaking news
about cryptos.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Exactly exactly well. Jim Sanborn, the artist, is celebrating his
eightieth birthday in a few months, and he's going to
celebrate it by auctioning off the answer to the final passage. Yes,
because I could keel over it any minute, and I'd
rest easier if I knew that things were in control
somehow right.
Speaker 1 (12:47):
And this has been all the talk, of course, of
the cryptos message board. I've probably gotten like ten messages
while we've been recording this. People. Most people are happy.
Some people are in they see it as a money grab,
but most people are happy that it'll be out there.
I am actually part of a group bid Oh right,
(13:10):
I'm guessing will be outfit by a billionaire, like a
Silicon Valley billionaire who wants to plunk down three million.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
But I am.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
I am in the mix.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
So yeah, well, good good. And I should point out
Jim is not saying I'm about to keel over. He's
basically he says, I'm gonna be eighty. I don't have
the physical, mental, or financial resources to sort of maintain
this last piece and continue with other projects he wants
to do. So he's he he wants to pass on
the secret, but he doesn't want whoever gets it to
(13:43):
give it away. He's hoping that the buyer keeps the
code of secret. Drops a few hints where necessary, but
you know he has He says, power resides with having
the secret, not without it. So billionaire, whoever you are,
don't just give it away. Keep everyone guessing.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
There you go. I love it. I think it is.
It's a fun little uh. It made for a great chapter.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Of our Oh yeah, well, because people will periodically say
I figured it out, and they'll say, here's what it is,
and then the several thousand of the cryptos community will
descend on this person's theory and basically debunk it completely.
They no, you're completely wrong. But I wanted to do
a little quiz because cryptos is not the only unsolved
(14:29):
cipher in the world. Great, and I thought i'd do
a little true false quiz about some of the others.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
All right, I'm ready, I'm ready.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
All right, So, so true or false? We'll start with
I think there's a pretty well known one, the Voinage Manuscript.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Right, I remember reading about that.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yep. The question is the Voyage Manuscript a over two
hundred pages of undecipherable scribbles and drawings of unidentifiable plants.
Or is it be a medieval code created by Hildegard
von Bingen, the composer and abbess, and she created it
to communicate with other nuns.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Interesting, Well, I actually researched this, so I'm going to
turn this over to Andrea.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
I I enjoyed the idea more that it is undecipherable scribbles.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
So well, you would be correct, you would enjoy it correctly.
It's it's been studied deeply. It's got these weird drawings
of plants that nobody can tell what they are. And
there's a lot of debate. Is it just a piece
of science fiction? Is it total you know, the ravings
of a lunatic? Is it some secret code? Who knows?
Who knows? But I will say Hildegard von Bingen did
(15:41):
create a coded language that she did use to communicate
with other nuns. It was called something ignota I forget. Now,
I'll tell you.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
What I'm going to be researching this lady right after up.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Now.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
She is a great composer from the Middle Age. In fact,
I think more of her works are preserved today than
any other music creator from the Middle Ages. That's awesome. Yeah,
she is awesome. All right, here's your next one, The
Fen Treasure FNN. This was a cache of gold and
(16:18):
jewels buried in the Rocky Mountains by an art dealer
named Forest Fenn, and one of the Too East two
things is true. A Fenn was diagnosed with terminal cancer
and planned to bury himself along with the cash. When
he recovered, he published a book of short stories instead.
(16:39):
Or Fifteen people have died while searching for the treasure,
and the chief of the New Mexico State Police has
actually ordered Fenn to stop, to stop the treasure hunt.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Those are both good and disturbing. I would say, I actually,
I think I know this one because I also considered
writing about it. But Andrea, you look like it.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
I have not.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
I have no familiarity with this. Fifteen dead people, fifteen
people dead seems hot.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
It seems high.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
That seems that seems high. I would believe maybe less
than ten people. So I'm gonna go with a.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Well, Andrea, you are too good at this, because in
fact it was five people who have but people have died,
stretching them out that somebody I can't remember if I
think somebody found this one but has been kept secret
about where it is, so people are no longer dying. Yeah,
somebody found it and auctioned off a bunch of the things,
(17:39):
but kept secret where it was found, so people still
look to try to find the site exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
And there's a book about it. I think of the
person who found it either wrote or collaborated on a book.
But yeah, but it took many years, wasn't it all
twenty years.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Something like that? Yeah? Yeah, all right, last one, last one.
The Shugburrow in inscription.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
All right, I don't think I.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
Know that on Shugburrow or maybe it's pronounced Sugbro. It's
a British location Cheguar inscription. It's a sequence of letters
O UO, s V A VV inscribed on a monument,
and it's it's on an eighteenth century shepherd's monument in
(18:23):
the grounds of Shugborough Hall in Staffordshire, England. And it's
below a mirror image of a painting of the Shepherds
of Arcadia. Which of the following is not a theory
used to explain the inscription. So I'm gonna give you
three theories that explain it. Nobody knows for sure. One
of these is not real okay, god, hey, the letters.
(18:45):
The letters stand for a new Latin translation of the
phrase vanity of vanities saith the preacher all is vanity,
which is a passage from the Bible, and in Latin
that would be orator ut omnia suntivaniitas all aitavani tas
ivani tatum. Wow, so that would be those are the initials.
(19:05):
That's one theory. The next theory is the memorial commemorates
the anatomous John Houston, who first described a series of
rectal folds known as Houston's valves, and the letters are
taken from that phrase, but not all of the letters,
just some of the letters in Houston's valves O UoS
(19:26):
V A v V. All Right, one more theory. It
was a memorial to a man's wife who was portrayed
metaphorically as the Shepherdess on that artwork, and the letters
stand for out your own sweet veil, Alicia vanishes vanity
TwixT Deity and man thou shepherdess. The way.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
I'm gonna say, I mean, if you did come up
with the Latin phrase, I'm very impressed, because you know
that is that is harder than an English phrase. So
I'm going to take that off, fair, fair, and then
I am going to I also think that the rectal
folds is bizarre enough that it would uh, you're very creative.
(20:13):
I'm not saying you're not, but it is. It is
so bizarre that maybe it would be something that someone
else came up with. So I'm going to go with
the third as the false one.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
I'm sorry to say I came up with the ass joke.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Nice, all right?
Speaker 2 (20:32):
The third one is yes all the other most of
the theories are all about what the initials stand for.
And I did a little search for words that have
those letters in them and discovered Houston's valves, which are
an actual thing, actually discovered by or described by John Houston.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
Excellent, all right, well done. So you're blaming Google for
coming up with the mast joke.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
It might be true. Nobody knows. It's nothing.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
If it wasn't a theory before, it's a theory, Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
I'm adding it to Wikipedia. That's a bit right now.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
Excellent. Well, that was fascinating and crazy and educational. So
feel free to bid on cryptos now that you know
that it's out there, and if you do win, just
tell us. We won't tell anyone, but I would like
to know and thank you Greg, thank you Andrea, thank
you listeners, and of course we'll see you here on
(21:25):
Monday for more puzzling puzzles that will puzzle you puzzlingly.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Hey puzzlers, it's Greg Pliska, You're chief puzzle Officer here
one more time with the extra credit answer from our
previous episode. AJ and I celebrated Paw Paw Day with
a game of reduplicated words, words that have the same
letters twice, like pawpaw. Your extra credit clue was this,
This is a Hawaiian term for quickly, and it's where
(21:58):
we get the name of a commonly used reference work
that of course is wiki wiki, which is where we
get the name Wikipedia. I also did another puzzle with
AJ called Alphabetical Order, in which every answer is two words,
each of which start with two letters that are in
alphabetical order. Your extra credit clue was viewpoints about La
(22:22):
Bom and the Magic Flute. And as I said, these
are viewpoints that might have been uttered by my friend
and colleague Joshua Cosmon, former music critic for the San
Francisco Chronicle and co author of The Awesome Out of
left Field cryptics. Go find them on Patreon or Patreon,
as you might say, and check them out anyway. Joshua
(22:42):
Cosmon would be someone who has opera opinions op op.
We like hear all your opinions about opera, puzzles and
anything else, So drop us a line and we look
forward to catching your hair next time. Thanks for playing
along with the team Here at The Puzzler with Aj Jacobs.
(23:04):
I'm Greg Pliska, your chief puzzle Officer. Our executive producers
are Neelie Lohman and Adam Neuhouse of New House Ideas
and Jonathan Strickland of iHeart Podcasts. The show is produced
by Jody Afrigan and Britney Brown of Roulette Productions, with
production support from Claire Bitegar Curtis. Our senior puzzler is
Andrea Schoenberg. The Puzzler with Aj Jacobs is a co
(23:27):
production with New House Ideas and is distributed by Asteroids
Patch or is it patch Asteroids or no, no, no no,
I've got it all, mix it up. It's distributed by
iHeart Podcasts. If you want to know more about puzzling puzzles,
please check out the book The Puzzler by aj Jacobs
a history of puzzles that The New York Times called
(23:49):
fun and funny. It features an original puzzle hunt by
yours truly, and is available wherever you get your books
and puzzlers. For all all your puzzling needs, go visit
the puzzler dot Com. See you there,
Hello Puzzlers. A quick announcement, The Puzzler is doing a
live show in New York City and we'd love for
you to come. It's October seventh at six thirty pm
and an awesome venue called Caveat. There will be stories, puzzles, prizes.
It's part of the Cheerful Earful Podcast Festival. We love
(00:23):
a good rhyming title here at the Puzzler. Please check
the show notes for a link to tickets. Now on
with the show, Hello Puzzlers, I think it would be
nice to start with a quick quiz. So, in honor
of the current month of September, can you come up
with any other words that begin with the letters sept
(00:46):
I'm looking for other words that begin with sept. One
of them is right in front of your nose or
actually inside your nose. To be more clear, it can
be straight or deviated. The answer to this question and
others after the break, Hello Puzzlers, Welcome back to The
(01:12):
Puzzler podcast. My kid is an honor student sticker on
your puzzle car bumper, so uh wow.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
We asked before the break if you could come up
with some words that begin with the letters sept sept
As in the current month, September, and I clude that
one of them is right inside your nose.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Greg, Yes, that is well. I came up with a couple.
That one is septum, right.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yes, septum exactly.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
And I don't know if that you know sept In
September is the group of mean seven, right, yes, Septus.
September used to be the seventh month. I also thought
of septic absolutely, and then the others are all seven words,
septuplet septet exactly, the less interesting.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Right, those are the two that that Andrea and I
came up with, and neither of them are related to seven.
You do not have seven nostrils in your nose.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Oh you don't.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
That's true. I don't want I don't want to assume.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Come on, but you.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Did bring up that sept is the Latin prefix for seven,
as opposed to hept which is the Greek prefix for
seven as a heptathlon. But because we have a crazy language,
September is not actually the seventh month. It's the ninth month.
You can blame Julius Caesar who inserted two months between
(02:49):
June and September, but I did.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
One of them, both of them named for him.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Yes, although I did read that that was later someone else.
He had other names else is like, well, let's give
him credit for messing up our calendar. But I do
think they could have been more logical, because you could stick.
Here's my proposal. See if it catches on and puzzlers,
I'm counting on you just to make this happen. You
(03:16):
change July's name to September, because now that's the real
seventh month. August becomes October, eighth month. September becomes November.
October becomes December. Now here's where it gets good. November
becomes on December.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yeah, that's eleventh.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
That's un is the eleventh, and December becomes duo December,
so that I feel is ready to catch on.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
It sounds like we get three months of winter break
because of all the Decembers set December on December and
duo December, and you just you're off school for the
whole time.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
And on December kind of sounds like, you know, it
doesn't exist, like.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Right, enjoy December and then everything disappears. Right.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
Well, anyway, I'm hoping for an on December, Thanksgiving on December,
and New Year's in dua December, but we'll see.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Congress is going to get on this right away.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Yes, I feel that that is top priority. Well, today,
in September or whatever we're going to call it, we
are going inside the puzzle Lab. We're going to talk
about puzzle news. Greg has been monitoring the puzzle.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Puzzle ticker, the tickers ticker.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
And also we have reader mail, and let's start with
some reader mail, because we have gotten some delightful letters.
One of my favorite genres of reader mail is when
the puzzlers at home write their own puzzles for So
we have Steve Baggish and his son, Eli Sheer Baggish,
(04:57):
who are delightful listeners as they've emailed before, and this
time they they caught the puzzle making bug and submitted
their own puzzle about city names. So their puzzle is
very clever and it's all about wordplay, puns, homophones, hominem's
(05:18):
homographs about city names. So I'll give you an example,
and then I'll give you a couple of their other clues.
So the example would be, this is a clue to
a state capital in the United States, and the clue
is genetic testing of this rabbit showed no DNA from
(05:39):
any other animals. You might say it is completely rabbit.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Or all hair, no money, Oh monny.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Honey, which is all been a New York the state
capital in New York. You made Greg laugh, that's about.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Laughed, Eli, And always make me laugh or at least
make me smile.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
Uh all right, Well we'll see if this does smile
or laugh. This is I actually am going to start
with an island. It's a European island, not a city.
And it's what you might say to indicate that you
own the killer whale. It belongs to you. You might say,
that's blank blank.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
Yes, this is a place I have been fortunate enough
to vacation with my family. Oh fantasy. It is the
island of Majorca. That's right, My Orca.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
My Orca, like the killer whale and my and I
I saw there are like a bunch of different spellings
of my Orca.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
With J or with two l's Majorca either.
Speaker 1 (06:44):
Something like that, but equally it's lovely either way you
spell it.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
Beautiful place really, and there's going to be a total
solar eclipse there next year, no way.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Okay, good to know. Puzzled, there's a puzzle field trip
for us. Yeah, all right, uh, a couple more than
This is a city on the west coast of the
United States. It's two words. If you eat round waffles
on the beach, you might end up with this city.
(07:12):
So it's think of a round frozen waffle. Yeah, if
you eat it at the beach, it might get this.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
This was the first two words city I thought of
on the west coast, so that's interesting that that worked
out that way. It would be a sand Diego Sandy
Ego exactly, San Diego.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
You are good at this, no sprice. I guess you
are the puzzler.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
It's very well clued. It's a very good clue.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Yes, it's credit the clue.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
They done they they done good.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
They've done good the father son team. All right, how
about this is a capital city in Asia, Southeast Asia.
Imagine there's an entirely naked staff at a shop that
sells sandwich, meats and bagels. You might say, this is
a blank blank.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
I thought of Bangkok, which has nothing to do with this,
so just leave that there. And I also, when you
said Asia, you said south South Asia, Yes, South Asia,
right right, I went to I went to Southeast Asia
and then I thought of, of course, Taipei, which is
(08:23):
the capital of Taiwan and is also like a Taipei personality,
which also has nothing to do with this. They're looking
for New Delhi. That's nude Nude.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
Deli, Nude Delhi as in delicatessen, and New Delhi as
in uh, the city in India. Well done, well done.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Those are good.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Now there are more. There are more that the Bangish
family wrote. Then we're gonna put them all on Instagram,
so yeah, very good. Check that out at Hello puzzlers,
and thank you Steve and Ela. You guys are heroes,
all right. I have one last one from okay, the
Baggish boys. This is a city in the midwest of
(09:04):
the United States, and it sounds like small red fruits,
small red fruits.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Small red fruits. It's not Indianapoli, oh right, the right
suffix right, which is just what the Greek word for
city polus Indianapolis, Minneapolis, Minneapolis. They are Minneapolis, Minneapolis, Minneapolis.
(09:32):
That's actually when you when you don't have any small
red fruit, you are minnieapple Less.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Nicely done, all right, so you can use that clue instead.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Baggish to the Baggishes.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Uh well, thank you again. The bagishes, but that's just
part one. As I said, Greg has been monitoring the
puzzle news feed.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
What do you got, Greg, Well, it's big news actually,
and big news in the world of ciphers, and it's
all about cryptos, which, well, you should talk about it
a little bit because it's in the book.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
You wrote about it extensively, and you interviewed folks associated
with I think you went there and saw it, so
would you that's right, Explain what cryptos is and then
I'll talk about.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
The news so littly. Yes, we wrote about it in
the Puzzler, which Greg and I collaborated on, and it
is one of the great unsolved puzzles of the world.
It's an obsession of thousands of puzzle fanatics. And it
is a sculpture that was commissioned by the CIA in
nineteen ninety so thirty five years ago, and it's on
(10:44):
the grounds of the CIA headquarters in Virginia, and it's
this big metal sculpture sort of like a wall, and
it has hundreds of letters and symbols carved into the wall.
And it was created by sculptor named Jim Samborn along
with a retired cryptographer from the CIA. Now they thought like,
(11:09):
this will be fun. We'll put a code in and
the cia'll solve it in like two days. That was
thirty five years ago. People have solved parts of it.
There are four parts, and they've solved the three of
the four parts, and those solutions they're kind of mysterious.
Their sentences about it seem like directions. Actually one of
(11:31):
them seems like directions longitude and latitude. But the fourth part,
called K four, has never been solved, and people have
been going at it. I am actually on a message
board where people every day have different theory.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
I think it's about the Navajo language. That's the secret
to the code. Oh no, it's Moby Dick. If you
read Moby Dick. And I actually got permission after months
of trying to go to the CIA headquarters and see
it in person. I thought this will give me a
leg up. Didn't. I didn't help it, but I did
(12:09):
get advice from all of these fanatics about what I
should look for, and I gave them all the information.
So maybe that'll help. But as you mentioned, this is
just a couple of weeks ago we had breaking news
about cryptos.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Exactly exactly well. Jim Sanborn, the artist, is celebrating his
eightieth birthday in a few months, and he's going to
celebrate it by auctioning off the answer to the final passage. Yes,
because I could keel over it any minute, and I'd
rest easier if I knew that things were in control
somehow right.
Speaker 1 (12:47):
And this has been all the talk, of course, of
the cryptos message board. I've probably gotten like ten messages
while we've been recording this. People. Most people are happy.
Some people are in they see it as a money grab,
but most people are happy that it'll be out there.
I am actually part of a group bid Oh right,
(13:10):
I'm guessing will be outfit by a billionaire, like a
Silicon Valley billionaire who wants to plunk down three million.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
But I am.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
I am in the mix.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
So yeah, well, good good. And I should point out
Jim is not saying I'm about to keel over. He's
basically he says, I'm gonna be eighty. I don't have
the physical, mental, or financial resources to sort of maintain
this last piece and continue with other projects he wants
to do. So he's he he wants to pass on
the secret, but he doesn't want whoever gets it to
(13:43):
give it away. He's hoping that the buyer keeps the
code of secret. Drops a few hints where necessary, but
you know he has He says, power resides with having
the secret, not without it. So billionaire, whoever you are,
don't just give it away. Keep everyone guessing.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
There you go. I love it. I think it is.
It's a fun little uh. It made for a great chapter.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Of our Oh yeah, well, because people will periodically say
I figured it out, and they'll say, here's what it is,
and then the several thousand of the cryptos community will
descend on this person's theory and basically debunk it completely.
They no, you're completely wrong. But I wanted to do
a little quiz because cryptos is not the only unsolved
(14:29):
cipher in the world. Great, and I thought i'd do
a little true false quiz about some of the others.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
All right, I'm ready, I'm ready.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
All right, So, so true or false? We'll start with
I think there's a pretty well known one, the Voinage Manuscript.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Right, I remember reading about that.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yep. The question is the Voyage Manuscript a over two
hundred pages of undecipherable scribbles and drawings of unidentifiable plants.
Or is it be a medieval code created by Hildegard
von Bingen, the composer and abbess, and she created it
to communicate with other nuns.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Interesting, Well, I actually researched this, so I'm going to
turn this over to Andrea.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
I I enjoyed the idea more that it is undecipherable scribbles.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
So well, you would be correct, you would enjoy it correctly.
It's it's been studied deeply. It's got these weird drawings
of plants that nobody can tell what they are. And
there's a lot of debate. Is it just a piece
of science fiction? Is it total you know, the ravings
of a lunatic? Is it some secret code? Who knows?
Who knows? But I will say Hildegard von Bingen did
(15:41):
create a coded language that she did use to communicate
with other nuns. It was called something ignota I forget. Now,
I'll tell you.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
What I'm going to be researching this lady right after up.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Now.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
She is a great composer from the Middle Age. In fact,
I think more of her works are preserved today than
any other music creator from the Middle Ages. That's awesome. Yeah,
she is awesome. All right, here's your next one, The
Fen Treasure FNN. This was a cache of gold and
(16:18):
jewels buried in the Rocky Mountains by an art dealer
named Forest Fenn, and one of the Too East two
things is true. A Fenn was diagnosed with terminal cancer
and planned to bury himself along with the cash. When
he recovered, he published a book of short stories instead.
(16:39):
Or Fifteen people have died while searching for the treasure,
and the chief of the New Mexico State Police has
actually ordered Fenn to stop, to stop the treasure hunt.
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Those are both good and disturbing. I would say, I actually,
I think I know this one because I also considered
writing about it. But Andrea, you look like it.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
I have not.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
I have no familiarity with this. Fifteen dead people, fifteen
people dead seems hot.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
It seems high.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
That seems that seems high. I would believe maybe less
than ten people. So I'm gonna go with a.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Well, Andrea, you are too good at this, because in
fact it was five people who have but people have died,
stretching them out that somebody I can't remember if I
think somebody found this one but has been kept secret
about where it is, so people are no longer dying. Yeah,
somebody found it and auctioned off a bunch of the things,
(17:39):
but kept secret where it was found, so people still
look to try to find the site exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
And there's a book about it. I think of the
person who found it either wrote or collaborated on a book.
But yeah, but it took many years, wasn't it all
twenty years.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Something like that? Yeah? Yeah, all right, last one, last one.
The Shugburrow in inscription.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
All right, I don't think I.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
Know that on Shugburrow or maybe it's pronounced Sugbro. It's
a British location Cheguar inscription. It's a sequence of letters
O UO, s V A VV inscribed on a monument,
and it's it's on an eighteenth century shepherd's monument in
(18:23):
the grounds of Shugborough Hall in Staffordshire, England. And it's
below a mirror image of a painting of the Shepherds
of Arcadia. Which of the following is not a theory
used to explain the inscription. So I'm gonna give you
three theories that explain it. Nobody knows for sure. One
of these is not real okay, god, hey, the letters.
(18:45):
The letters stand for a new Latin translation of the
phrase vanity of vanities saith the preacher all is vanity,
which is a passage from the Bible, and in Latin
that would be orator ut omnia suntivaniitas all aitavani tas
ivani tatum. Wow, so that would be those are the initials.
(19:05):
That's one theory. The next theory is the memorial commemorates
the anatomous John Houston, who first described a series of
rectal folds known as Houston's valves, and the letters are
taken from that phrase, but not all of the letters,
just some of the letters in Houston's valves O UoS
(19:26):
V A v V. All Right, one more theory. It
was a memorial to a man's wife who was portrayed
metaphorically as the Shepherdess on that artwork, and the letters
stand for out your own sweet veil, Alicia vanishes vanity
TwixT Deity and man thou shepherdess. The way.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
I'm gonna say, I mean, if you did come up
with the Latin phrase, I'm very impressed, because you know
that is that is harder than an English phrase. So
I'm going to take that off, fair, fair, and then
I am going to I also think that the rectal
folds is bizarre enough that it would uh, you're very creative.
(20:13):
I'm not saying you're not, but it is. It is
so bizarre that maybe it would be something that someone
else came up with. So I'm going to go with
the third as the false one.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
I'm sorry to say I came up with the ass joke.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Nice, all right?
Speaker 2 (20:32):
The third one is yes all the other most of
the theories are all about what the initials stand for.
And I did a little search for words that have
those letters in them and discovered Houston's valves, which are
an actual thing, actually discovered by or described by John Houston.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
Excellent, all right, well done. So you're blaming Google for
coming up with the mast joke.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
It might be true. Nobody knows. It's nothing.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
If it wasn't a theory before, it's a theory, Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
I'm adding it to Wikipedia. That's a bit right now.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
Excellent. Well, that was fascinating and crazy and educational. So
feel free to bid on cryptos now that you know
that it's out there, and if you do win, just
tell us. We won't tell anyone, but I would like
to know and thank you Greg, thank you Andrea, thank
you listeners, and of course we'll see you here on
(21:25):
Monday for more puzzling puzzles that will puzzle you puzzlingly.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Hey puzzlers, it's Greg Pliska, You're chief puzzle Officer here
one more time with the extra credit answer from our
previous episode. AJ and I celebrated Paw Paw Day with
a game of reduplicated words, words that have the same
letters twice, like pawpaw. Your extra credit clue was this,
This is a Hawaiian term for quickly, and it's where
(21:58):
we get the name of a commonly used reference work
that of course is wiki wiki, which is where we
get the name Wikipedia. I also did another puzzle with
AJ called Alphabetical Order, in which every answer is two words,
each of which start with two letters that are in
alphabetical order. Your extra credit clue was viewpoints about La
(22:22):
Bom and the Magic Flute. And as I said, these
are viewpoints that might have been uttered by my friend
and colleague Joshua Cosmon, former music critic for the San
Francisco Chronicle and co author of The Awesome Out of
left Field cryptics. Go find them on Patreon or Patreon,
as you might say, and check them out anyway. Joshua
(22:42):
Cosmon would be someone who has opera opinions op op.
We like hear all your opinions about opera, puzzles and
anything else, So drop us a line and we look
forward to catching your hair next time. Thanks for playing
along with the team Here at The Puzzler with Aj Jacobs.
(23:04):
I'm Greg Pliska, your chief puzzle Officer. Our executive producers
are Neelie Lohman and Adam Neuhouse of New House Ideas
and Jonathan Strickland of iHeart Podcasts. The show is produced
by Jody Afrigan and Britney Brown of Roulette Productions, with
production support from Claire Bitegar Curtis. Our senior puzzler is
Andrea Schoenberg. The Puzzler with Aj Jacobs is a co
(23:27):
production with New House Ideas and is distributed by Asteroids
Patch or is it patch Asteroids or no, no, no no,
I've got it all, mix it up. It's distributed by
iHeart Podcasts. If you want to know more about puzzling puzzles,
please check out the book The Puzzler by aj Jacobs
a history of puzzles that The New York Times called
(23:49):
fun and funny. It features an original puzzle hunt by
yours truly, and is available wherever you get your books
and puzzlers. For all all your puzzling needs, go visit
the puzzler dot Com. See you there,
Hosts And Creators
Greg Pliska
A.J. Jacobs
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
What Are We Even Doing? with Kyle MacLachlan
Join award-winning actor and social media madman Kyle MacLachlan on “What Are We Even Doing,” where he sits down with Millennial and Gen Z actors, musicians, artists, and content creators to share stories about the entertainment industry past, present, and future. Kyle and his guests will talk shop, compare notes on life, and generally be weird together. In a good way. Their conversations will resonate with listeners of any age whose interests lie in television & film, music, art, or pop culture.