Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Broadcasting from the Civic Ciphers Studios. Welcome to the QR Code,
where we share perspective, seek understanding, and shape outcomes. The
man you are about to hear from is a generous man,
one who would give the shirt off of his own back.
He is a kind human being and person I happy
pleasure of sharing today's stage with.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
He has the Q in the QR code. He goes
by the name of q Ward.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
The voice that you just heard was clearly created and
designed to speak into microphones to the masses. He is
the R in the QR code.
Speaker 4 (00:32):
He is my brother. He is the north star of
this program.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
He goes by the name ramses Jah.
Speaker 1 (00:39):
And we need you to stick around because we are
going to be having another interesting show man. We live
in interesting times, so we just keep giving him to
you back to back.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Stay tuned.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
Later in the show, we're going to be talking about
how Trump's DEI hate actually caused a fight in the
DCA control tower in DC. We're also going to be
having a conversation about why one creator left MAGA left
the Maga movement, and you know, his words really give
some insight into what the appeal was like and what
(01:13):
his motivations were for leaving and the strategies that he
used to kind of overcome his biases and not stand
in his own way. She was going to share some
news with us about Target and why they should have
probably just kept their word to black folks. I'm really
excited for that, So stay tuned for the clap back.
(01:34):
We're also going to be talking about how Donald Trump
says no flag burning. He signed an executive order, but
you know the flag code, the United States Flag Code
actually says different. I'm when it takes some time to
actually talk about that. And before we get to all that,
we're gonna talk about how many people actually owned slaves.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
That's been a.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
Hotly debated topic these past few days on soulcial media,
and so we're going to discuss all that more. But
before we get there, at his time, as always for
a feel good feature. In today's feel good feature, we're
shouting out to some folks in Phoenix. Yeah, we know
those folks out there. So this comes from the Phoenix
New Times on the orders of President Donald Trump, and
(02:16):
thanks to an increased budget from Congress to US Immigration
and Customs Enforcement better known as ICE, is ramping up
its mass deportation efforts and Phoenix. An increase in deportations
of long standing law abiding community members has motivated political
organizers in Phoenix electronic music scene heads to team up
in an effort to raise money for families impacted by
(02:38):
the Trump administration's mass deportations. The Spark was a year's
long friendship between Sebastian del Portillo, a political organizer with
organized power and numbers, and Lyle Veggiebing, a city planning
professional who also moonlights as a DJ producer and an
event planner. The two reconnected in June in the wake
of ice raids and made a plan to rally local
(02:59):
businesses and a funding and public awareness effort under the
banner of Voices United Phoenix. At least thirty five organizations
from Phoenix's music, arts, nightlife and bar scenes have joined
on board to host events or help with the fundraiser.
The two week fundraiser and awareness campaign is spearheaded by
del Portillo's OPI in stalwart community organizers Puente and poderen Action.
(03:22):
Shout out to poderen Action and Meltfest funds will be raised.
Sorry Funds raised will benefit the emergency work of Legal
Defense Fund. So far, del Portillo said they have raised
twenty four thousand dollars for the Defense Fund and hoped
to make it to thirty thousand dollars by the end
of the fundraiser, all of which will go to legal
fees and mutual aid. The campaign's final events will be
held on August twenty ninth and thirtieth at Linger Longer Lounge,
(03:45):
followed by a final capstone event on August thirty firth
at Central Records, where the art auction will end In person,
it hits a little different when you kind of know
the orgs and know the people and know the lay
of the land and just kind of feel spe show
that you know some folks are doing that, and we
don't always get to talk about folks that we feel
like we have a connection to. So glad somebody is
(04:07):
doing something there, all right, so.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
Cute.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
I'll admit that.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
I haven't really been tuned in to all of the
back and forth surrounding Jillian Michaels' comments on CNN. I
don't know if you have yourself, have you.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
I've seen the video. I don't.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
I don't know what it would mean to be all
the way tuned in. I mean, it's Jillian Michaels. She's
a reality TV lady, Like I don't you know, I'm
thinking like apparence that she's spewed on television, But it's
not like she's a television regular or an intellectual or
news anchor or a person that we would typically go
to for stuff like this.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Not like a scholar or anything.
Speaker 4 (04:56):
Give what you mean? No, my rule has to say
about this, somebody get job ruled. Yeah, I don't. We
would like to say, where.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Is joh that's funny.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I'm thinking about more like the kind of the back
and forth because people have taken her comments and really
dissected it, and people have had a lot to say
about it on both sides.
Speaker 4 (05:18):
From what I understand.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Again, I haven't been really paying too much attention to it,
but I do know that the chatter exists that people
are taking what she said and then running with it
to try to suggest that and for those that are
not familiar, she said, I believe it was on CNN
at a roundtable that less than two percent of people
own slaves in the United States, and her point in
(05:43):
making that statement was to try to suggest that ninety
eight percent of the people in this country disagreed with
slavery something like that, and or just to try to
reframe slavery so that you know, there's a lot of
I guess, way of manipulating data that takes place across
(06:08):
all politics, but we found it particularly pronounced on the right,
where any way that people can try to remove the
responsibility of the predicament of any marginalized people from the
(06:30):
conservative movement and put that responsibility squarely in the lapse
of those marginalized folks, like this is your own fault
that the world hates you and that everything bad happens
to you.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
That they'll do it.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
They'll kind of play with the numbers, and this is
one such example, right. But for folks that don't do
any digger dot or any deeper digs or deeper dives
into it, they just have a new talking point that
they can use. And I believe that Jillian Michaels indeed
used a talking point that was probably given to her.
She echoed it on a platform very loudly with her
(07:04):
whole chest, and you.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Know, caused the stir that we're talking about today. And
so for.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Folks that again aren't entirely familiar, that's kind of what
has been taking place online and we just haven't got
to it until today. And so what ended up coming
I guess across our table was one creator's response to it.
He's more in the creator. He's an Emmy winning filmmaker,
(07:33):
he's an author, he's a podcaster, he's a creator. And
indeed he's the son of civil rights icon Joan Trumpoor Mulholland.
His name is Loki Muholland, and he has a fantastic response.
So let me share that with you now.
Speaker 5 (07:47):
So there's a video where this lady says a really
crazy thing about slavery, and of course she's wrong, and
she's very wrong and not just something use of the
word only. And I'm going to explain why. But first
here's the video on less than two percent of white
Americans enslaves. Again, the two percent number is wrong. But
where did they come from? Well, most of it comes
from American historian Alan Evans over fifty years ago. He
(08:08):
wrote that base on the eighteen sixty census, there were
three hundred ninety three thousand, nine undred and seventy five
enslavers in the United States out of a population of
thirty one point two million people, and never get you
to one point twenty six percent, which it should be
noted that of that thirty one point two million, roughly
four million were actually enslaved black, So you need to
reduce that number even further. It is one percent correct?
Never suggested? Well no, unless you count the number of
(08:29):
white and southern families that enslaved more than two hundred people,
that was one percent. So why is the one percent
or even two percent that people point too wrong? Well,
because when you're calculating data sets like this, you don't
include those that shouldn't be counted. Beyond just the enslaved people,
need to take out those whites who lived in free
states because they wouldn't have owned anyone. For example, if
you're doing a study on women's health, you don't add
(08:50):
in men. Well, based on research done by US Civil
War expert Al McKee, let me tell you what the
real numbers are. Of the thirty one states in the Union,
fifteen were slave states with a population of twelve point
two million. Again, you can't count anyone living in free states.
Now take that three hundred ninety four thousand white and
slavers and you get three point two two percent. So
is that correct? Not even close. For one, the free
(09:13):
population of those states was eight point three million. Based
on that number, you now have four point seventy five
percent of whites who win slavers. However, there's a problem
with saying what percentage of whites were in slavers because
of how they defined in slavers. You see, there weren't
three hundred ninety four thousand individuals who enslaved people. There
were three hundred ninety four thousand households or families. Let
me explain. Take refrigerators for example, if I said only
(09:36):
thirty nine percent of people in the United States owned
a fridge, you'd be shocked. The real number is ninety
nine point eight percent of households have a fridge. That's
roughly one hundred and twenty eight point seven million refrigerators,
assuming one per household. But if you base it on
a population of three hundred and forty million people, then
only thirty nine percent of people owned a fridge. But
of course that's not how we calculate household property in
(09:58):
our senses, typically calculated based on the households, not local
the population. That's how it was done during slavery as well.
Because enslaved people were seen as property, So the real
number was twenty one percent, not two percent. This doesn't
even count those in the North that also profited from
the enslavement of others. And by the way, in eighteen sixty,
in some places like Mississippi, over fifty percent of the
(10:21):
population was enslaved.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
All right, So twenty one percent from two percent adjusted
for the reality of you know that that period in time.
And I think, you know, we've done an episode before
about how we've seen data get manipulated on the right
(10:47):
to hold up narratives or to establish narratives that really
support a lot of what I think Republicans wish was true,
that the data manipulation and the cooking of the books
in a manner of speaking to prop up a worldview
that is.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
Not real.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
But they wish was real, and it ends up being
essentially propaganda. And I think that this is another one
of those examples, So I don't know for me. One
of the things that I took away from that, of course,
is that how the refrigerators, how you counter refrigerator, Like,
(11:31):
not everybody could own a slave. Typically a household owned
a slave, right, so when you adjust for households, then
you get a lot closer to the actual number of
people that owned slaves, and it's not two percent or
less than two percent. The other part, of course, is
that how they were talking about, how they included the
(11:52):
population of the North and there where it was not
possible to own slaves in the North. So just a
couple of takeaways I got, how about.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
You, Well, there's an intentional lack of comprehensive thinking, right.
The confirmation bias from that stat made her feel good
and less guilty. She knows a lot of white people
would love to have that guilt lifted off of them.
So she rushes to share some data that she probably
got from a TikTok or you know, because that's how
(12:22):
people get information.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
Now.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
There's no scholastic research, there's no follow up, there's no
critical thinking. There's just oh, there's something that supports how
I feel or how I want to feel, So let
me go share that with as many people as I
can in this gotcha moment, because that's what they're trying
to get.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
Right.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Everything goes back to owning the libs. So I'm going
to get this two percent off and have my gotcha moment,
not realizing she's going to make herself look like an idiot,
and then, because people seem incapable of doing so, she
couldn't come back and say my bad when she got
caught out on it. She had to double down because
(12:58):
no one can say my bad these days. No one's
ever wrong, no one makes a mistake, and if they
hurt your feelings, that's just too bad. Stop being a
soft left wing snowflake or whatever they say. So, of course,
the actual data was going to show us that wasn't correct.
You didn't have to be alive back then to know that,
(13:20):
And anybody who heard that should have pumped the brakes,
like even flamboyantly aggressively racist people should have hurt two
percent and say, hey, that don't sound right, because once
upon a time they were our property and we thought
that that was a good thing. We thought that was
the right thing. That's what all decent people did. So
(13:42):
this doesn't surprise me at all.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
Yeah, you know, the the thing is, also slaves are
pretty expensive, so not everybody could afford them, but those
they could bought slaves.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
It seems seems like what was happening. So anyway, all right,
let's move on. This is a big one for me.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
We have talked about the flag of the United States
of America on this show countless times. How the flag
has been used to try to intimidate those of us
who aren't super fans of Donald Trump. How the flag
has been used to suggest that the United States of
(14:25):
America belongs to one group of people and does not
belong to anyone else. How the flag is used as
a sort of dividing line. And you know, it's crazy
because you grow up in the United States and you
(14:46):
pledge allegiance to the flag, and you know, you watch
the war movies and you feel good when the USA wins,
you know, all that.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Sort of stuff.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
And then you get older and you live in Trump's
America and you see the flag and it causes you
to stop and be like, oh am, I going to
get lynched. It's a whole different reality when you see
the flag now, right, So on this show, we've really
talked about that. We've talked to a lot of other
people about our relationship with the flag of the United States. Well,
(15:16):
flags in the news, not because of Kaepernick, not because
of who knows. We've had tons of flag conversations over
the years. But now the flag's in the News because
Donald Trump says that if you signed in an executive
order rather that says that people should be punished for
burning the flag. And one of the things that we've
(15:40):
had to do on this show is become familiar with
US flag code. And because we've had to do it,
now you're going to get to do it too, says,
We're going to share US flag code with you just
so that you understand what we know in case you didn't.
All right, let me start this off by sharing from CNN.
This is from cnn dot com. Specifically, so President Donald
Trump sees an epidil of flag burning and says it
(16:01):
needs attention. Quote all over the country, they're burning flags,
Trump said on Monday in the Oval Office, Declaring it
an important issue, he signed an executive order directing his
Justice Department to investigate incidents of flag burning where laws
are broken. There are few problems with his claim, the
first of which is that it's not at all clear
they're burning flags all over the country. But beyond the
(16:24):
question of whether the flags are indeed being burned all
over the country is the fact that the Supreme Court
back in nineteen eighty nine declared flag burning to be
a protected form of speech under the First Amendment. Trump
acknowledged that decision by a sad Supreme Court, and his
executive Order is seemingly written to address the Supreme Court's
flag burning decisions. The administration will try to prosecute other
(16:48):
crimes like violent crimes, hate crimes, and crimes against property
and the peace as a way to deter flag burning.
According to a White House fact sheet, Trump spoke to
that Preme Court decision when he said, the simple act
of burning the flag is an incitement. Okay, So I
(17:09):
think you are the one Q that sent over something
today that said I'm paraphrasing. But Trump was caught on
a mic saying like, oh, I'm the president, I can
do whatever I want to do, or something like that.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
Right, that came from you?
Speaker 4 (17:22):
Yes, that absolutely did it.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
Okay, all right, well my mind's still there.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
All right.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Well, we're going to talk about something that has existed
before Donald Trump. We're going to talk about something that
has existed for a long time. And for all the people,
the conservative people, the people that like it the way
that it was, this should give you the warm fuzzies. Okay,
for the people that light off fireworks on the fourth
(17:51):
of July.
Speaker 4 (17:53):
This is this is your legacy.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
This is your history. Okay.
Speaker 1 (17:57):
It's funny that you tell us to forget our history
and get over our history. But we know you like history,
or at least your history, the parts of it that
you feel comfortable with. So I'm going to share your
history with you. This comes from American the American Legion
or Legion dot org. This is the Flag Code. We're
only going to take section eight out. It's called respect
(18:17):
for the Flag. But we've gone over this again to
talk about Kaepernick and all that other star stuff.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
But we're going to go through.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
This line by line so that you know exactly how
to respect the flag and what the US Flag Code
says long before Donald Trump was born. This is what
the United States of America does with its flags, or
supposed to do with its flags.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
Okay, I'll start.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Ay, the flag should never be displayed with the Union down,
except as a signal of dire distress and instances of
extreme danger to.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
Life or property. Okay.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
B The flag should never touch anything beneath it, such
as the ground, the floor, water, or merchandise.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
And for those that don't know, when the flag touches
the ground, it is considered soiled.
Speaker 2 (19:10):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
And when it touches the ground, you have to dispose
of that flag. And I'm gonna we're gonna get to it.
But just because I know it by heart, I don't
want to get ahead. But we're gonna talk about how
you dispose of a soiled flag.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Okay, all right?
Speaker 1 (19:25):
Flag should not touch anything, but all right, See the
flag should never be carried flat or horizontally, but always
aloft and free.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
So this is for all those folks that were mad
at Colin Kaepernick kneeling, but are okay with them rolling
the flag out flat on a football field so the
airplanes can fly over it. That violates the United States
Flag Code. Colin Kaepernick never did, okay. And and go
look at number eight Legion dot org United States or sorry,
the American Legion. Okay, says eight respect for the flag.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
For all the folks that said he was disrespecting the flag,
the troops and the no he was not.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
They disrespect it every week on the NFL or whatever,
the Super Bowl or whatever that thing is. All right,
f The flag should never be used as a covering
or a ceiling, okay. G The flag should never have
placed upon it, nor on any part of it, nor
attached to it any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture,
(20:26):
or drawing of any nature. H The flag should never
be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, caring, or
delivering anything. So if you have a what are those
beer holder cup things, there's a flag or a beer
cup that has a flag on any of that sort
of stuff, you're violating US Flag Code and you are
disrespecting the flag.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
All right.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
I The flag should never be used for advertising purposes
in any manner whatsoever. I'm going to read that part
one more time. The flag should never be used for
advertising purposes in any manner whatsoever. It should not be
embroidered on such articles as cushions or handkerchiefs and the like,
(21:09):
printed or otherwise impressed on paper, napkin or boxes, or
anything that is designed for temporary use and discard. Advertising
signs should not be fastened to a staff or halyard
from which the flag is flown.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
All right, Let's go to the next one. This is jay.
Speaker 1 (21:28):
No part of the flag should ever be used as
a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may
be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen,
or members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living
country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the
lapel flag pen, being a replica, should be worn on
(21:50):
the left lapel near the heart k the flag. When
it is in such condition that it is no longer
a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a
dignified way, preferably by burning. All right, and I promise
you flag code is a lot longer than that, But
(22:11):
I just wanted to break out kind of the important
parts for today's conversation. But man, you could break it
all the way down. Whoever decided on flag code really
did care about the flag and you can see that.
And I'm not mad at this. You know, it's okay
to have some pride in your country. And you know whatever.
If I played for a sports team, I'd have pride
in that team. If I lived in a country, I'd
(22:31):
be happy that this is my country. News, my folks,
you take the good with the bad.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
Whatever.
Speaker 1 (22:36):
But there's so many people who have like selective outrage.
And again for people that have that selective outrage that
look at Donald Trump, and say, oh, well, you know,
he's the president, you should be able to do whatever
he wants. They're spitting in the face of tradition. They're
spitting in the face of the flag. This is actually
(22:57):
flag code.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
Are the people that want to kind of split hairs
or you know, kind of walk that weird line saying that, oh,
these are the old rules and they don't reflect modern sensibilities.
You know, just ask yourself if you're in the same
group that says, you know, black people should get over
slavery because slavery was a long time ago as well,
do you select which history is important to you or
do you believe that all history is equally important for
(23:24):
this country that you love, And if so, you should
not be picking and choosing. And if you get to
pick and choose, then you shouldn't tell other people to
pick and choose what history is important to them. So
either way, you're kind of shooting yourself in the foot here.
So I'm interested in hearing what you think about Donald
Trump's current I guess push on getting people to stop
(23:50):
burning the flag or punish punishing people for what is
effectively protected speech.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
What's say ye.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Have an idea of what I think he's trying to do.
But I'll need some help from you or some and
put it from you or some insight from you on
this one, because there's this thing he does.
Speaker 4 (24:10):
Where we.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Where I wish we collectively knew that the intended audience
was just his base. And I think once upon a
time that was the truth. He'd say something ridiculous, Maggie
would share, the rest of the earth would know, Okay,
that's nonsense. Except this time around, since he's been elected,
(24:32):
he's making his outlandish and bogus thoughts and ideas real
in real time, so it's harder to not take him
serious when he speaks now.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
But the reason why I bring that up.
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Is because when he brings up burning the flag as
this extistential threat that he has to make sure he
makes an executive order toward, I think what he's trying
to do once again is i'men dear the symbol of
the United States flag as belonging to him and his cult. Right,
(25:14):
Like I told you about how I feel now, if
I'm on the highway or I'm on the street and
a truck pulls up to me with a giant American
flag flapping in the wind. I don't think American. I
think Maga. Unfortunately, I think Trump. I think what I
think this person intends for me to think and feel
(25:35):
in that moment.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
He's done a very very good job.
Speaker 3 (25:41):
Of reappropriating the American flag as part of his brand,
and I think this is another ploy to do that.
So in the event that someone burned a flag and protest,
they'd come across anti American, not anti Trump. And he
gets the point and say, see told you the left
(26:01):
hates America.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Ah, I see.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
Now.
Speaker 3 (26:05):
Strangely, he's not that intelligent, so I feel bad for
giving him that type of credit. However, I do think
intended or not, that that's that That's one of the
possible outcomes from something like this. Make make me the one,
or I make myself the one protecting the identity and
(26:26):
the symbol of this country and anybody that would do
this thing that's not illegal at all, but would come
across as I hate America. If I framed it that way,
we'll see anti American, not anti MAGA. Therefore, MAGA will
now look like we're pro America and everybody else isn't.
Even though my made in America Trump phones are Samsung
(26:48):
phones that are made in China, which is another two together. God'spired,
my made America and my make America great again. Hats
are not made in America. It's just it's so much
irony and just straight forward idiocy that his base and
sort of the rest of us just ignore on a
daily basis every time he opens his mouth. But so, yeah, man,
(27:11):
it's another made up emergency, another made up crime wave,
another made up thing that deserves the attention of the
whole country because it's such a big deal. I've been
walking down the street during protest, you know, during these
sweeps that he has military and law enforcement doing, and
(27:32):
I've yet to see a single person burning a flag.
So he creates this problem that doesn't exist, and then
presents himself as the solution for that problem. And I think,
without even intending to do so, he creates those who
would protest his voice, his thoughts, and his decisions, and
if they do that in too much haste and in
(27:53):
too much anger because they're too outraged, he gets to
mark himself as the protector of America and its values
and everyone else who's protesting that as anti American.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
Yeah, I could, I could easily see that and I
think there's something else to be said about how you
like kind of clocked his play straight out of his playbook.
Let me create a problem that doesn't really exist, but
let me create the problem in the minds of people
(28:33):
that I am solving. Like, Hey, did you guys know
that fish have poison in them? Well, I'm taking care
of it, so fish are safe because of what I did.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
What fish had poison.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
Well, he's saying, Okay, well cool, I mean I get thanks, man.
You know, so that strategy feels like kind of this
whole thing, like, do you know they're burning flags all
over the country. Well, I'm putting together an executive order
that's going to take these people on. And again, what
threat to democracy is or what threat to the country
(29:12):
is a person exercising what the Supreme Court established as
free speech speech, you know, a person burning a flag
and protester otherwise, you know, the way you're supposed to
dispose of a flag when the time comes is by
burning it. That's the dignified way, according to the Flag Code.
So this idea that I get what he's trying to do.
(29:35):
I think your point is well made that he's trying
to appear as like the strong man and the leader.
But he's this is a non existent problem that doesn't
really pose a threat to anyone, and he's putting himself
as a solution, probably to distract from the Epstein list.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
I had guess my thoughts