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November 23, 2022 35 mins

Iyanla believes that a betrayal of trust by a family member can be one of the most difficult relationships to heal from, but also one of the most beneficial. And two callers this week have detailed stories of betrayal to share on their paths toward healing. One caller had the police called on her after she exposed her sister’s cheating husband. And a second caller has always had contention with her three sisters, whom she now hasn’t talked to for years after a very minor disagreement.

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Executive Producers: Sandie Bailey, Alex Alcheh, Lauren Hohman, Tyler Klang & Gabrielle Collins

Producer & Editor: Vince Dajani

Associate Producer: Akiya McKnight

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
I am a Yamlah, and the reason I'm your guide
is because I've probably experienced everything you could possibly imagine
as a result of a relationship. Betrayal, abandonment, rejection, sheer, joy, sheer, utter, heartbreak,
and most of all, healing, growth and evolution. Welcome to

(00:23):
the Our Spot, a production of shondaland Audio in partnership
with I Heart Radio. Relationships are life's classroom. That's where

(00:45):
we go to learn to heal, to stretch, to grow,
to work through problems, to work out problems. We go
into relationships to learn how to communicate. We go into
relationships to learn where we're broken and wounded so that
we can have an opportunity to heal. And no place

(01:06):
do I find opportunities for healing more present than in
our relationships with our family. Family relationships, whether it's mother, child,
or sibling, and family relationships are lifetime relationships. If you
share blood with someone, that person is going to be
in your life forever. Now you get to choose how.

(01:28):
You get to choose if you see them or communicate
with them. You get to choose how you interact with them.
But you cannot throw a loved one out of your
heart and out of your mind. So today we are
going to journey into the breakdowns and betrayals that occur

(01:50):
in family relationships. And for some reason, we think that
because they are mother or father, or sister or brother,
they're not human, and because we're in relationship with someone
we're related to by blood, we may think that they
should behave other than human. Your mother shouldn't make any mistakes,

(02:10):
your father shouldn't have any deficiencies, your sister should behave
like you think she should, your brother shouldn't borrow money
the humans. But it's those blood ties and those expectations
and that closeness that we have experience that make family
betrayals all the more difficult to live through and sometimes

(02:36):
to heal. But family relationships there your foundation. That's where
you learned everything about relationship. So when there's a breakdown
in a family relationship, trust me when I tell you
it's gonna stir up all of your stuff. And if
you don't address it as if you're human are in

(02:57):
relationship with another human, if you don't surrender your expectations
of the other person, it's going to be really, really
hard to heal. But we're going to talk about that
and so much more today here on the Our Spot
as we take a deep, hard look at family betrayals.

(03:18):
Welcome to the Our Spot where we discuss all things
about all kinds of relationships. So glad you're here with us.
So tell me what is the challenge issue problem that
you're having and in what relationship that we can talk
about today that's been betrayed by a husband? Um? Friends, Um,

(03:41):
I got over them, but betrayed by family members, especially
your sisters and mothers and father. We cool up in
the same house, so I really, UM didn't expect that
at all from her. So your sister betrayed you, Yes,
my sister, Okay, tell me what happened. So happen is? Um?

(04:01):
I was at the time, I was young and I
was married, my first husband, and we had three little kids,
there were three, four and five, and I was going
through so much. I was losing apartment and she said,
Florida has had too bad. At least it's not cold.
Because I was in Connecticut. She said, why don't you
move to Florida and you can stay with me, and
you know from there you can get a job, and

(04:22):
you know you can get back on your feet and
you know, stuff like that, and it sounded good. So
I moved. I left her husband behind, and I told him,
you know, I was gonna move to Florida and get
a better job. When I get an apartment, and I
would call for him, you know, things like that. Um.
So when I came to Florida just two weeks later,
it was her boyfriend at the time, but they were
living in together, and this man started asking me out.

(04:44):
I wish I had met you first. Um. Every time
she goes to work, he will try to talk to me. Um,
let's go out. She want to know, And I didn't
feel right, just keep saying no to him and her
not knowing. So I just thought that was a bad man.
I'm gonna tell her, you know, don't marry someone like that,
you know, just take him to the curve. And so
I told her. Um. But I called her from work

(05:07):
and I told her, I said, I over her him
talking to all the women too, and not just me.
She said, oh my god, you're right, because the name
you told me, it's true. She said, when I come home,
it's gonna kick him out. So when she came home,
she had a night job, evening jobs, so she came
over on eleven thirty. I was sleeping by then with
the kids. Um, and next ting I know the police
were there. So the police said, she wants me to

(05:28):
get out right now, and AS thought she was kidding.
So I went back in my in the room where
I was staying, and I with the kids. The kids
were sleeping and we continued to sleep and next time
I know the police that I gotta get out or
they will already me. So I saw that she was
really um. She wasn't joking. So I was crying and crying.
So I got out. I didn't even have a car,

(05:49):
so I managed to call her best friend, and her
best friend came. She she came got me. I mean
think that was after that, but that's all. Bottom line
is I just couldn't believe that she would do that. Wow,
So that's the story. Yeah, So how long ago did
that happen? It happened so long ago, And that's what
I would think by now, she would, you know, be better.

(06:12):
My son was five and he's six now. Wow, So
twenty one years ago, your sister chose a man over you. Yes,
and it didn't last for her, It didn't even last.
That doesn't matter what we're looking at is what happened
and how you healed it, because the truth is it's
still not healed. Yes, if she still isn't speaking to you,

(06:36):
or if you'll still don't have a relationship, but it's
not me, it is you. It's always you. Yeah, it's
always you. And so the question becomes in your mind,
in your quiet times, in the darkness, when nobody else

(06:56):
is around, what are the doubts that you have or
the questions you have about whether or not you did
the right thing by telling her. Well, I still feel
that I did the right thing, because if I didn't
do that and she married him for all the things
that I've heard that she went through with him, then

(07:18):
I would feel guilty. I would have felt like, like
what now, I don't feel guilty because I don't feel
like I did anything wrong. But if I did tell
her and she married him and then they got a
divorce because she was cheating doing all these bad things,
then I would have thought that if because I didn't
tell her, to see, you did tell her, she married
him anyway and it ruined your relationship. So here's the question,

(07:41):
because we're just looking for the place that we can
go in and clean up any residue, and it's her choice.
She may maybe she don't like you. She she's got
that right. Her job is not to like you. She's
still your sister. She don't have to like you. The
question is we are in your mind and heart and

(08:02):
the secret places. Do you question or doubt? Maybe I
shouldn't have told her. Maybe if I hadn't told her,
maybe it wasn't my place to tell her. Do you
have any of those thoughts, feelings, you know in your
quiet time? Um? Yes, sometimes I do feel maybe I
should because, like her friend told me, she knew already.

(08:24):
She said, if you had told me first, I would
have told you. She already knew. So it would have
been a better just not to tell her because she
would have taken that path of marrying him. Anyway, What
was your intention for telling her? What did you want
to happen when you told her that? Yes, because she
had already married um from high school and that didn't

(08:45):
go well. That was the main reason she moved to
Florida and right away she met this guy and then
he was doing that again. So on my mind, like, well,
let me prevent her from making another mistake. That was
the main reason. Did she excuse to help her, No,
mm hmmm. And did she ask you to protect her

(09:08):
from her mistakes? No? No, no, mm hmm. So you
took it upon yourself to do that. And I'm not
saying it was wrong, because that is a challenge I
learned very young in my life with my best friend.
We're still friends to this very day. But I learned

(09:29):
very young in life the last thing you want to
do is tell a woman something about her. Man. Yeah,
I'm learned that now, but I wouldn't think that. Yes,
but I want to help you understand that's the last
thing you want to do. And I faced that situation twice.

(09:50):
I must have been about seventeen. It happened with my
best friend and I said something to her about him,
and she cut me off and it took us a
number of years to repair that relationship. But it was
when she got clear that, oh my god, you know
you were just trying to help me and I was
stupid and blah blah blah. The second time it happened,

(10:14):
because I learned from the first time, I didn't say
anything to her. I said it to him. I said,
if you ever open your mouth and say that to
me again. I'm gonna tell her, and I'm gonna tell
her in your face, because I learned it's very hard
to tell a woman something about her. Man. I get

(10:38):
that you were trying to protect your sister, but in
that moment, she was not your sister. She was just
another woman, and you were a threat to her. You
get that. I didn't see it like that at all.
I'm glad I called. The other thing is, can you
imagine how guilty, not guilty, but how embarrassed she is

(11:03):
that you were right? Mm hm, you know that's all
key tent right there. You're very right about that. I've
been thinking about that, lady, I said, she wants to
be embarrassed because she probably cannot believe that I'm willy
forgiving her also for taking me out. Maybe it has
nothing to do with her forgiving you, and everything to
do with her forgiving herself. Yeah, she cannot forgive you

(11:27):
until she forgives herself. And there's probably a laundry list
of things that she needs to forgive herself for. First
of all, she knew if you knew, and her best
friend knew she knew, and she hoped he would be different. Mhm.
That you saw it and knew that's embarrassing. Yes, that

(11:48):
this is her second failed relationship or just another failed relationship.
The shame in that, so her not wanting to you
this amend this even after twenty one years, doesn't have
anything to do with you and the betrayal there. While

(12:08):
she violated your trust, she invited you to Florida, told
you to come and live with her. When this situation
came up, she abandoned you. That is a form of betrayal.
But what you're really dealing with is watching her betray herself. Yeah,
I didn't see it like that. Wow. Then we'll talk
more about that right after this. Welcome back to the

(12:37):
art spot. I am yam La. Let's get back to
the conversation. So why can't I say what can I
do in order for her to know that I really considar.
So I went to see my father and my mom,
but my thought was sick and I that's when I
talked to her night. That's when I really wanted her
to see that I'm her friend, said, I didn't tell

(13:00):
about her past. I gave her money, I gave her
children money, and she's still not trying to get close
to me. Leave her alone, Okay, love her from a distance.
Stop trying to prove because every time now the fact
that you have elevated and grown and your life is
shifted and she may still be struggling, that's even more

(13:22):
embarrassing because that says that you're right and she was wrong,
and she will do everything in her power for you
not to see her wrongness. So every attempt that you
make to repair this deepens her. Probably I don't know

(13:43):
it to be true, but I'm just looking at it.
Probably deepens her shame, her embarrassment. But you know, because
trust me and her mind, you destroyed her life. Wow.
So that's why I say it is you. Wow. You
know cent her birthday card, a Christmas card? Leave her alone.

(14:06):
I never understood it before, but you just said something.
You said, um like, you just said that. It didn't
ask me. I have lost friends over my opinion. I'm
working on that. But I always felt like it's my
job to tell people what I think, because I always
thought that it was being honest. But I'm not so
many people. Sometimes people with ages, sometimes we're not want

(14:28):
to come close because they feel like, oh, she's gonna
tell me what I should do. Well, a good practice
that you can employ, or you could engage. Let's ask
them so you know, I have something on my heart
about you. For you, it's kind of personal, and i'd
like to know if you want to hear it. And

(14:48):
if they say, what's it about, Well, it's about your husband,
or it's about your son, or it's about money, or
it's about whatever. Give them the opportunity to make the choice.
That way, if you give them the information what they
they may still get mad at you, but at least
you're sharing with them with their permission. Your sister didn't

(15:10):
ask you to protect her. She didn't ask you to
stop anything because her her life is her lessons and
she's got to learn that. And that's the same is
true for everybody. And here you have, like I said,
in that moment, you were not her sister. You were
a threat to her relationship. But she was in love. Right.

(15:32):
Have you ever been in love with Boo Boo the Fool?
Me too? Every woman has loved Boo Boo the Fool
at some point or another. And and when we're in it,
you can't tell us he's a fool. I don't want
to hear that, and I probably don't need to hear

(15:52):
it because there's something Boo Boo has come to teach me.
Now I may have to marry six boo boos before
I the lesson. And if you are blind, deaf, dumb
to the fact that the person that you're with is dishonoring,
you're disrespecting you, betraying you, and somebody tried to tell you,
you probably wouldn't fall to your knees and say, oh,

(16:14):
thank you, thank you for saving me from this. You'd
probably have a little bit of response. Okay. So that's
when I say it to you. You show the compassion
um and protect yourself because it's painful to have your
sister reject you. One day, she's gonna come to you
and say, you know, I should have listened to you.

(16:36):
I should have listened to you. I promise you when
she gets clear, she's going to say that to you.
And once she does that, then you know that the
healing will happen because she has to forgive herself before
she can forgive you. Okay, thank you for calling, Thank
you for calling, and keep praying for her. Okay, Okay,

(16:58):
I will light and thank you light and love, thank you.
Ben betrayal, it's a really challenging topic. And while my
caller felt she was betrayed, the truth is she was

(17:18):
the witness to her sister betraying herself and she just
happened to be collateral damage. She was collateral damage because
she to call the police and put your sister and
three children out of your house in the midnight hour.
That goes beyond betrayal. That's bordering on insanity. And yes,

(17:42):
that was a betrayal of trust. However, my caller spoke
to something that is very very important for us to
understand when it comes to family breakdown. If you're looking
at your sister, you're younger sister, and you're trying to
take care of her or your younger brother, and you're

(18:03):
trying to guide him or your older sister, shouldn't be
telling you this or that. We've got to understand that
these are humans. So before they respond like a sister
or a brother, they're going to respond like a human
and we don't expect that, and then we take it
on that because this is my sister, she shouldn't do
that to me. Well, as I said to the caller,

(18:26):
you became another woman who was a threat in her relationship.
She didn't see you as a sister in that moment,
and she certainly didn't ask for your advice. And that's hard.
I get it. That's hard when you know something is
gonna hurt someone you love, you want to try to
prevent them from being hurt. But that's when I fall

(18:51):
into or recall something that one of my teachers told
me a long time ago. She said, it is hard
to why watch a loved one hit rock bottom, but
you must remember that God made the rock. Maybe they
need to fall there so that divine intervention can lift

(19:12):
them up. Oh, this thing with sisters, I've got another
caller who's got a problem with another set of sisters,
and we're gonna get to that call right after this
Welcome back to the art spot. I've got another caller

(19:33):
who has a challenge with her sister. Let's dive into that.
Welcome to the art spot. I am so glad to
have you here today. And what is the relationship challenge
your issue you're dealing with. Well, first of all, good morning,
thank you so much for taking my call. On The
relationship effect I'm having is directly with my knee that

(19:57):
it has always been with my sisters for two of
my sister put it that way. Tell me more. Mmr
A is the oldest Mster. B and C are twins,
and so you know you had that twin type of
relationship love hate, but they will always stick together no

(20:17):
matter what. And then my niece, I would say, it
will be me and she is the daughter of who
she's a daughter of one of the twins or the
older sister, the older sister. Okay, she's a daughter of
your niece. Is the daughter of your older sister. Okay, great.
My niece wanted to do a production, was doing Thanksgiving

(20:38):
three years ago, and it was okay that she did so.
And I was in charge of getting the bed and
breakfast of everything for Thanksgiving and everybody together. And when
she called me, she says she wanted to do it
six in the morning, and I said, oh, I don't
think that's a good idea because we had to get

(20:59):
a smaller place and people would have been sleeping out
over the place and bringing in cameras and you know,
people from the outside at that time. But for sure,
exactly how everybody will be situated in the in the
bed and breakfast that we rent it. She's got a
little hop and the phone hung up. Initially because I

(21:21):
thought we had this great relationship. I'm thinking something happened
because I think she was in a car accident the
way she found it, and I'm like, oh my god,
this happened to her, you know. So I tried calling
her back several times and kept going to voicemail, and meanwhile,
I'm turning to frantic because I'm thinking something that's happened
to my knees. About forty minutes later, sister and the

(21:44):
oldest sister called me and said, well, this is what
we're going to do, and proceeded to say what was
going to happen at the bed and breakfast? I said once,
And I said to my niece, I said, did you
paint that phone up for me? Because I'm trying to
call you back? And she said, I would never do that.
I said, but I kept trying to call you back,

(22:04):
so obviously you were getting the call. And from that
point on, everything just went downhill. What does that mean?
Went downhill? She stopped speaking to me. I said, okay,
And we were supposed to all go to Ghana together
and I decided not to go because I'm not gonna
spend this kind of money, had people not talk to me.

(22:27):
And of course sisters, the twin sisters B and C.
They just rallied around her, because that's just they were
rally around anybody. And when it comes to me, I know,
whatever I do something, if somebody doesn't like it, it
becomes just big fiasco. You did something she didn't like.

(22:47):
You offered her some unsolicited information and it became a
big fiasco, a three year fiasco. So you got exactly
what you expect it. Look at you, and I thought
myself with that, I just told you do that. And see,
here's the piece. When we go into anything, you may

(23:10):
not get what you ask for in life, you may not,
but you always get what you expect. And if you
expect it consciously or unconsciously, sometimes you know you're doing it,
sometimes you don't know you're doing it. You'll set it up.
So here you made a very innocent statement, I don't

(23:32):
think that's gonna work because we got the kids. Yes,
but that wasn't your job to tell her what was
gonna work and what wasn't gonna work. Because here's another possibility.
Oh okay, if you're all going to do this in
six o'clock in the morning. Then I don't think the
children and I are going to make that because that's
kind of early. But I get why you want to

(23:55):
do that, But that's really kind of early. But when
you said to her what she wanted to do wasn't
a good idea, do you get that you were out
of your lane? Yeah? I agree. What she did was
then she went to her mother, your older sister, knowing
that she could whip you into shape. Absolutely. And you

(24:20):
said another interesting thing. You said, the twins will rally
around anyone when it comes to me. What does that mean?
I'm involved and anything becomes contentuous. It's always which would
be her phone, no metal. But because it's just me,
We've always had this relationship like that. I'm not sure why,

(24:43):
but it's always been like that. Okay, so there's the
older sister, then there's you, then there's the twins. So
you're the middle child. That's why it happens. That's why
it happens because you're the middle child. And it ain't personal.
It's what they call the middle child syndrome. I can't

(25:04):
help being the middle child. Well no you can't. But
here's what the middle child is. Clutch your pearls the
middle child is a pain in the butt. Okay, the
middle child is a pain in the butt. And the
older one is always saying who side you on? And

(25:26):
the younger ones are saying whose side is she on?
The older one will say, you better be on my side,
and the younger ones will say, she ain't on my side.
It ain't personal, it's it's just how it happens with siblings.
And then if you happen, by some slight freaking nature,

(25:47):
you know, to be an opinionated middle child, well then
you just you just you jacked up. They you jacked
up you if you got an opinion, because the big
one thinks you need to follow me, and the little
one thinks if I follow her, the big one's gonna

(26:09):
get me, So I'm usually gonna do what the what
the older one is saying, that's just it's just sibling rivalry.
It's just how it happens. But if you hold it
in consciousness that the two of them, because they're twins
and they have that bond, are against you, and that
the older one thinks she's the boss of you, and

(26:32):
you're gonna do everything in your power to prove to
her she ain't the boss of you. If you hold
that in consciousness, yeah, it's always gonna be your fault
because you are going to get what you expect, and
that's to be who's faulted it. Now, if your son's
back up or withdraw, that creates an issue between them

(26:55):
and their aunt's, between them and their cousins. So how
one slight misunderstanding, how one misstep could create a total
breakdown in the family is very, very intriguing and exciting
to me. Well, it's not just one misstep. It's been

(27:18):
many over the forty something years. Yes, but but but
putting to that, there was always tension with the person
that I married. I found out after I was married
to him that she had went to bed with him us.
But I think that really masticized it. Hold up one second,
you found out that your sister slept with your husband.

(27:42):
Was he your husband when she slept with him? No,
he was not. No, Okay, So prior to prior to that, yeah, okay,
And she didn't she didn't tell you that. He didn't
tell me that, and he, of course he didn't tell
me that. And how I found out it was like
she was always calling me having something negative to say

(28:04):
about him. Do you have a pencil and a piece
of paper near you? I want you to write this down. Okay,
jay E A l you as why what what did

(28:25):
you just write? Now? Are you gonna act like you
don't know that exists? Because it's your sister. You're trying
to make sense out of it. But you're talking about
siblings and the natural things that happened amongst siblings. Oh,
she's doing it better, or she they like her more,

(28:49):
or she does it faster. You know, it's just jealousy
simply means it's an unpleasant suspicion or a perceived sense
of rivalry, which happens among siblings. Among sisters, then you're

(29:09):
talking about four girls. And then you know, if jealousy
doesn't get addressed or handled, it can elevate into envy,
which simply means I want what you have and I'm
mad because you have it. Remember that when it comes
to a breakdown in a family, one of the hardest

(29:32):
things to do, and one of the most important things
to do, is to get on the other person's side
of the table, look back at the experience and say,
what must they have been thinking or feeling to behave
like that? What must they have not what I did
and didn't do, and what I said and what they said.

(29:54):
Look back, get on the other side and look back,
because that's really the only way you can heal it.
The only way you can heal it is to see
my I must have hurt my niece or she she
misunderstood what I said or my tone of voice was
off that she could have perceived it. You have to

(30:16):
look back if you want to clean this up. What
I would offer is if your sister is the oldest,
write or a letter and I start right, you know,
wham bam, right between the eyes, I would ask her
sometimes I feel like, no matter what happens, I'm the blame.

(30:36):
I'm asking you to help me understand why I feel
like that. Do you have any idea why? And as
the middle child, I know that I can be annoying
or whatever, and it really makes me sad because see,
you're talking about all these problems. You're not talking about
your sadness. There's a sadness there that this is going

(30:59):
on with you and your sister's Okay, okay, this is good.
So there's a lot of healing that can be done here.
But I would encourage you to consider making your older
sister your ally. Does that sound like something you might
want to consider? Mm hmm. I want you to give

(31:20):
me a call in about three months and let me
know how this thing turned out. Okay, I will, and
I think I'm gonna have the conversation with Okay, well,
prepare yourself, get ready, pray about it, and move forward
so much okay, love, bye bye. When it comes to
any kind of breakdown, but specifically a breakdown among siblings

(31:44):
where they are more than one sibling involved, your birth
order plays a very important role because your birth order
has determined your bonding patterns, and those bonding patterns come
into play. So, as my caller said, it seems to
her that the two younger sisters bond together and the
fact that they're twins doesn't help, and that they bond

(32:07):
to the older sister, and then because she's the middle child,
she feels out of place. But it's really some of
the breakdowns that we experience among siblings or as siblings,
really have to do with our birth order and our
bonding pattern and how we see ourselves in that family.

(32:27):
But when you add to that the fact that because
of our birth water and because of our family dynamics.
We don't always speak the truth. We don't truth speak
to one another. That's what creates the dust bunnies under
the bed. And then there's a big blow up and
the whole bed is on fire and we can't figure

(32:48):
out why. It's because of those dust bunnies. The things
you haven't said, the things you have let go, the
things you've been holding in your mind, in your heart,
that become the filter and become your expectations. Mind this,
mind this. You may never get what you ask for,

(33:08):
you will always get what you expect, because an expectation
is a belief on steroids, and a belief is a
thought fueled by emotion, and emotion is what determines the
tides of our life. I really hope that my caller
and her sisters can start cleaning up some of those

(33:30):
dust bunnies. There's a lot of them. There are a
lot of them. It's doable. Just hold the vision. Hold
the vision. I don't care how deep the breakdown is.
Hold the vision that the relationship can be healed, and
then take appropriate steps and start with telling the truth,
not accusation. Tell the truth. This is how I feel,

(33:53):
This is what I'm thinking, this is what I thought?
What did you feel? What did you think? In other words,
get on the other side of the table, Get on
the other person side of the table, and look back
and be willing to hear what they say. Not try
to fix it or change it. Just be willing to
hear what they say. And sometimes for siblings, particularly because

(34:17):
of the birth order and the bonding pattern, that can
be difficult, but it can be healed. I hope this
has been helpful to someone, and if you have a
question about this or any other relationship issue, you can
call me live at seven seven five three zero seven
seven seven six eight. Now be sure to follow me

(34:40):
on social media for all of the calling times, and
until then, stay in peace and not pieces. The R
Spot is a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with
I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from s on the

(35:00):
Land Audio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. H
Advertise With Us

Host

Iyanla Vanzant

Iyanla Vanzant

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