March 22, 2023 • 58 mins
One caller is left wondering whether or not he should leave his marriage in order to gain a clear peace of mind. He feels selfish for wanting to separate from his partner that he currently has four children with. Another caller wants her partner to value and appreciate her. But should she keep her family together, or leave the rocky and abusive relationship, knowing that he has cheated on her? Iyanla offers insight to them both: be willing to forgive oneself, and be careful not to be lured back in by urges, desires, and the good ol’ “Hoo-Haa”! Do you want to be on the podcast? Follow Iyanla on social media for the latest call-in information! instagram & twitter: @IyanlaVanzant facebook: @DrIyanlaVanzant
Executive Producers: Sandie Bailey, Alex Alcheh, Lauren Hohman, Tyler Klang & Gabrielle Collins
Producer & Editor: Vince Dajani
Associate Producer: Akiya McKnight
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
I am, I Amla. I had a baby daddy relationship,
I spend time in a relationship with a married man.
I had to learn the skills and tools required to
make my relationships healthy, fulfilling and loving. Welcome to the
Our Spot, a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio.
(00:38):
Sometimes the question in a relationship is not how do
I leave? The question is how do I stay? How
do I stay where I'm unhappy? How do I stay
where I'm not being fulfilled? How do I stay where
(00:59):
I know I don't want to be? How do I stay? Well?
Sometimes you can't stay. Sometimes you have left even before
you turn your key over, And that's probably more difficult
to be in than if you just gather up whatever nerve, courage,
(01:26):
strength you need to say this just isn't working for me.
Sometime the work to make it work is harder than
the work you'll have to do to just step out
of it. How do you stay? How do you stay
(01:47):
if you can't tell the truth? How do you stay
if you can't find a compromise? How do you stay? Well?
You can't stay? But then the real question becomes, well,
how do I leave? How do I leave with my
self intact? How do I leave the other person intact?
How do I leave and handle my responsibilities? How do
(02:09):
I leave? And what I always tell people is you
really can't leave or won't leave until you can stay,
until you can be in the same place with the
person being honest and forthright, without being cruel and abusive
(02:31):
or abrasive. You can't leave because if you leave in
the middle of a fight, that fight will follow you.
So how do you stay with the clear vision that
you're done? How do you stay with compassion for yourself
first and for what the other person is going through?
(02:54):
How do you stay? You stay with your heart and
your mind to open that your best interests and the
person's best interests will be best served when you go.
You stay and you create an exit plan. Stay and
(03:16):
you pray, You pray that you get your lessons and
that you understand what you've done. Can't leave until you
can stay. That's what I want my first caller to
hear today, because the truth is they're already gone. Now
(03:38):
the question becomes how do you get out? Greetings beloved,
and welcome to the our spot. I'm so glad that
you could join me today and tell me what is
your relationship challenge, issue dilemma that we are going to
be working on. My own challenge today is with my wife.
(04:01):
We've been together six years. I don't know if I
should start from the beginning or tell you how I'm
feeling now. Well, tell me now, because I can't do
nothing about the beginning. If I need to know, we'll
go back there okay, which she probably will, but I
don't feel it now. It's I feel like it's time
(04:22):
for me to go. I love her, but I'm not
in love anymore. I lost attraction and the energy to
keep making trying to make the relationship work like I
lost myself. Trying to satisfy her and make her happy.
Attention that she requires it drains me. I've even broken
(04:45):
relationships with family and friends to try to satisfy her.
She's in one room, I have to be another. I
get more of a peace of mind enjoyed when I'm alone.
I feel like I would have left by now. But
we do have four kids together, so I want to
(05:07):
make sure that I really hold on to a thought
of and raising my kids in the same household. But
I don't want to be unhappy and regret and later
on in life. I want the best for her, and
I want her to be happy as well, But I'm
(05:28):
not I'm not feeling like that. Maybe me, I want
her to be mentally saber as well, so she could
raise my kids the right way. If that's the way
it's going to go, it's a big challenge for me
right now. Yeah, can I ask how old you are?
Twenty three? You are twenty three? And did I hear
(05:50):
you say you have four children? Yes? Now? Four children
at twenty three and you've only been married nine months? Yes? Now,
oh my goodness? How old are your children? I owe
these three? I have twins, that's two, and I have
a two month old. So let me ask you this first.
(06:14):
What is your question to me? God? Because I'm not
hearing the question here, I don't know. I don't know
if I'm making Would I be making the right decision
to leave? So let me ask you something. Yes, are
you making the right decision for you to leave this marriage?
(06:38):
I don't know? Yes, you do. There's a distinction between
not knowing if you should leave and not knowing how
to leave. Right I think you've already left. If you're
telling me you've got to be in another room to
be happy, because you don't leave a marriage when you
(06:59):
walk out the door. You leave the marriage first in
your heart and then in your mind. Yeah, so where
is your mind? Now? Where's your mind? Because it's not there.
It's to the point to now that I may be
interested in other women. Now I don't want to see
(07:20):
her anything. I'd rather, you know, let her know and
what's going on and try to have that conversation with her.
There was a movie, if I'm not mistaken, Tyler Perry
did the movie called Why did I Get Married? Why
Did You get married? I really didn't want to. Yeah,
(07:44):
that's obvious. I was pressed in through it. I was
instead of being alone a couple months before, she was
actually trying to leave me at one point because situation
with her and my mother and and she felt like
I didn't support her and she was going to leave
in hours and fearl being alone. I bet that mistake.
(08:08):
Were you in fear of being alone or were you
in fear of losing her? Because there's a distinction there,
Probably losing her at the time. Sometimes we love somebody,
we love them and we want them in our life.
We don't want to be joined at the hip, but
(08:30):
we want them in our life, and we're afraid that
if we don't do what they want the way they
want it, that will lose them totally, which couldn't have
been your case because you had two children at the time.
All right, So you want her in your life, but
you don't want to be joined to her in this
way anymore? Is that right? Yes, maw Yeah, So what
(08:54):
is your fear? What is your fear that she wouldn't
be messing able to raise kids the right way? Maybe
she may be more focused on somebody trying to love
her and not raising the kids the right way and
trying to get back at me instead of moving forward
and trying to hear that's what I'm trying to do.
(09:17):
You probably have some experiences with her that tell you that, right,
that she's going to be focused on herself and not
on your children. Right. I gotta ask you two questions
that may seem totally unrelated. Okay, were you raised with
your dad? Yeah? Do you want to be to your
(09:39):
children who he wasn't to you? Now, I have a
grandson your age, a grandson on your age, and I've
got a grandson that's seven years older than you. So
I want to talk to you like a grandma. Okay,
I don't don't. I don't want to be your coach.
(10:02):
I don't want to be your therapist. I want to
talk to you like a grandmother. That means I'm gonna
give you some cold water in your face. Okay, now
that's what I need. Okay, let me let me ask
you this before I start. What is your mother saying
about all of this? I finally had that conversation with
her because I had stopped talking to her for about
a year because of her and my wife. But he
(10:26):
feel like that they bombed heads because my mother would
point out things that my wife did and my wife
didn't like that. Or my wife would go to her
about things about our relationship and she would how to
make I take accountability. Basically, my wife didn't like that.
So that's why they started bumping heads. So this is
(10:49):
Grandma talking to you. Now. This is not Missy on
Love from fixing my life. This is Grandma. But you
need some cold water in your face? Okay, And I'm
doing it out of an old rusty pot, not doing
it with a nice, a nice glass picture. Okay, First
(11:09):
of all, my love, what in the blazing But Jesus
are you doing with four children at twenty three years old?
If you can't take care of your penis, how are
you going to take care of four kids and a
woman that's grandma? Okay? What in the world? What is
that about? Irresponse? Yes, good for you, good for you?
(11:37):
And see, as an old lady, I really have challenge
and issue with young women having children with men who
don't have their stuff together right, And you don't have
your stuff together? Where are you with your education? I
just went to a technical college and got him well
(12:00):
in diploma and I got my speedos? Okay? And what
kind of work do you do? Oh? Drive truck? So
you ain't home half the time? Well? I do be home.
I come home every day. Okay, you don't. You're not
a long distance driver. And what do you want to do?
What is your vision for yourself at twenty three? What's
(12:20):
your vision beyond your penis or kids? Good for you? Good, good, good?
But you can't do that if your heart in your
mind or not at peace? Right? So you let this
young woman and her who haa, you know what the
(12:41):
whoha is right, drag you around by the nose and
didn't even have enough sense to protect yourself. So now
you got four mouths to feed, and as a man,
you have to be at your best. You have to
be at your best in order to create that legacy
(13:04):
in a way that will benefit your children. And you've
created these four lives with a woman who obviously doesn't
respect herself, because if she respected herself, you would not
be in fear of her denying you your children. So
we've got to kind of backtrack this now. And like
(13:26):
I said, the issue here is not are you leaving.
You're gonna leave you out, You're done, And what you've
done in the process is that these four young lives
are going to be collateral damage of your irresponsibility, and
you just got to suck that up. Tell me what
(13:48):
you hear me saying, tell me what you're thinking, tell
me what you're feeling, and then we can go from there.
It doesn't matter. You don't have to repeat my words.
I want to know what you are hearing and thinking
and feeling. It's over here. The relationship between me and
her basically over. I'm just trying to hold onto it.
(14:10):
Why the kids. That's never a good excuse, because you
can't be any better to them than you are to yourself.
I have noticed that, Like sometimes I get real impatient
with them and I catch it. I've spanked them, and
(14:30):
I could have just talked to him instead of spanking them.
Read in that moment. And I heard you say earlier
that you might be interested in other woman. That's first
of all, that ain't true. You are interested in other woman.
You're talking to grandma. Grandma got eyes in the back
(14:52):
of her head. Okay, But the last thing you need
is a woman, right right, that's the last thing you need.
What do you need a woman for what you're gonna
do with I don't. I don't. It's just you know, man,
got need so sometimes I might need to get my rock.
So that's all I'm saying. I don't need a woman
(15:12):
to just be in my life. But you need to
take a cold shower, take a cold shower, eat some grapes.
You're getting your rocks off. Got you four kids that
you now can't be with. Stop it. But that's because
that's because you're twenty three. You've put the cart before
the horse. You've created responsibilities for yourself that even in
(15:37):
your normal development as a man, you know, it's just
it's a lot. It's a lot. It's not too much
because it's been done. So what you need, my beloved.
I could be very wrong here, and I'm not advocating
the end of your marriage, but from what you've shared
with me, it sounds to me like you're already gone
(16:01):
and that's not fair to her, to you, or to
the children. So what you need is an exit plan,
which is going to be challenging because you've got a wife,
you've got four children. You already said you didn't want
to get married, so you've probably never really been there.
And I bet y'all had a big wedding complete with
(16:22):
chicken and people and bridesmaids and all of that. Didn't shit.
Oh no, we didn't go through all that. Nah. It's
a good thing because the money y'all would have spent
on the wedding you could have used to buy a house, right,
which we did. We did buy a house instead. Oh
you do have a house. Okay, so you can leave
her in a house. That's so good. Now where are
you going? Probably getting apartment? I could take the one
(16:46):
dead own apartment and found with me. Let's start with
the studio. It's cheaper, you'll need no bedroom because if
you have a bedroom, you might want to have company
that I'm going to say this to you and then
I want us to work through it. Okay, you cannot
(17:07):
leave until you can stay. What I mean by that
that as long as you're angry, as long as you're frustrated,
as long as you are upset with her, you can't
leave because what's going to happen is guilt and manipulation
and fighting is going to bring you back. So you've
(17:30):
got to be able to be in that house with her,
be in that place with her, and grow the muscle
within yourself to say I love her, I don't want
to be with her. I wish the best for her,
and I'm not the best for her. I want her
to be a good mother to my children, and I
(17:51):
want to support her in that. You've got to get
to that place within yourself while you are in the
house with her, Otherwise you're gonna leave. She's gonna use
the kids as a tool. Y'all be fighting and it'll
be a mass. So you've got lots of planning to do.
You need a place to live. You need to look
(18:14):
at your money and see what are you going to
be able to provide for her so that when you leave,
you understand this is what I'm giving, this is what
I have, this is what I need. How you want
to see your children? When you want to see your children,
So that when you talk to her you don't get
beat up and talked out of your plan. You've got
(18:38):
to have a plan because what you're doing right now
is brutal. You can't do that to her, to you,
to the children. Right. I do want what's best for her.
I want her to be happy still, but this with
me or not? But I don't have a plan yet.
I'm right. I actually wrote everything said down. So are
(19:00):
come my plan to get them? How far are you
going to live away from the children? Will you be
able to get them to school? How often do you
want to see them? How much money are you going
to have to give her? When are you going to
give it to her? You're going to leave her in
the house for now. But you know, even if you
went to court to get a separation agreement, which is
(19:23):
what you're going to do, when you get ready, you
don't just tell her that you're leaving. You take your
happy butt down to the courthouse and you file a
separation agreement, so that you're legally separated, not that you're out,
you know, benagling around in the street. What you've just done, baby,
(19:44):
is because you probably didn't have a model and an example,
you've just taken on more than you can possibly manage
at your age and your level of development. We'll talk
about that right at this break. Welcome back to the
(20:09):
art spot. Let's get back to the conversation. So let's
walk this back and then we'll walk it for for
whatever reason, you allowed yourself to do something you didn't
want to do. You didn't want to get married, but
you were afraid of losing her and your children. Can
you own that? Can you sit in that? Yeah? And
(20:33):
how does that make you feel? To know that you
did something you didn't want to do because you were afraid?
Kind of we as a man? Oh no, wrong? How
about sad? Do you feel sad about that? Yes? Well? Yeah,
(20:58):
maybe a little angry at yourself? Right? Yes? Now? Okay,
so you feel sad and angry about what you did,
but you understand in that moment you were afraid, not weak,
but afraid. There's a distinction. What you're doing now is weak,
(21:18):
not being able to say look, I'm out. This is
not good for me. It's not good for me. It's
not good. I don't want my children to grow up
with an angry father. I don't want my children to
grow up with an unhappy father. I don't want them
to see that. I don't want them to see the
tension between their father and their mother. That's not what
(21:40):
I want for my children. Would that be accurate? Yes? Now.
I try to communicate that too one time before, but
it didn't work out too good trying to communicate that
tool and I will trying to communicate that. I wasn't
happy as well, but I'm trying to work it out.
How old is she? Twenty three as well? So let
(22:03):
me just tell you a little bit about her as
a woman. She is scared to death that at twenty
three with four children, if you're gone, nobody's gonna want her.
She just scared to death. I was thinking that as well,
(22:25):
and I was scared for like, I still want her
to be loved. Still, won't her to be able to
find someone easiness? It ain't me. Well, she's got to
love herself first. Once she learns to love herself, Once
you learn to love yourself, both of you will be
able to be in a healthy relationship, because even if
(22:46):
you didn't protect yourself from creating life that you couldn't
provide for, she does a woman didn't protect herself. No way.
Are you to have three kids? Four kids? That twenty
three when she had them twins, she was supposed to
shut that thing down. You'all was just out there hopscotching
(23:07):
on each other and not paying attention. Happens all the time,
and it's not fatal. You'll be okay. I want the
children to be okay. I want them to have a strong,
healthy father and a strong healthy mother. Okay, So you
did something you didn't want to do because you're afraid.
Are you clear that you're repeating the same pattern. You're
(23:30):
doing something staying in the marriage that you don't want
to be in because you're afraid of what will happen
if you leave. You're doing the same thing. Yes, now,
right now? How's that going to turn out for you?
It'll be it'll be a repeated cycle. Yah, yeah, I
(23:54):
think Wow. Let's just get clear at first. Are you
done with this marriage? Yes? Man? Are you willing to
be a responsible co parent with your children's mother? Yes? Man?
In order to do that, you're gonna have to be
her friend. Can you be her friend? I didn't ask
(24:19):
you if she could be your friend? Can you be
her friend? Yes? How can you be a good friend
to her? I could be a good friend her as
far as importing her, I know, financially, which that's not
a friend, but just in support of her. I would
(24:39):
say support of her emotionally, but she probably would block
me out knowing her, he probably would block me out emotionally.
So I really don't know how I could be a
friend too. I would want to be, but I don't
know how I would be. Well. You being her friend
is not contingent upon it how she reacts to you.
(25:02):
So the first thing a good friend does it's always
tell the truth. Always tell the truth. So if you're
done with this marriage, but the marriage not with co parenting,
because I heard you say you're willing to be a
good co parent, right, hear me what I'm saying to you,
(25:25):
Then you have to stop expecting the benefits of a husband.
You have to stop sleeping with her. You have to
stop expecting how to do your launtry. You have to
stop expecting how to beat you and do your clothes.
You have to stop that because sleeping with her, having
(25:46):
sex with her, doing those kinds of things, you're sending
a mixed message. Either you're done or you're not done.
I try to cut it off. That's what aspect of
our relationship with see you against es sexually first graded in. Well,
that's her problem. She has to figure out how to
handle that. You gotta put a little more base in
(26:09):
your voice and tighten up your bottom pieces because for
whatever reason, you're letting her drag you around to what
she wants and you're not getting what you want, and
what you're doing is not good. No sex. Stop being
a husband, Start being a co parent. Work with the kids,
(26:29):
provide the provision, you know, the resources for them. I'm
taking the kids out, you know, if you got to
go over to your mom's, go to the park, do whatever.
Start co parenting. How do I communicate this to her?
With your behavior, I'm duting. You have to tell her
(26:51):
a good friend. My best friend tells me the truth
all the time. Sometimes I don't want to hear it right,
and she don't argue with me. She don't explain stuff,
you know, unless I ask her, But she tells me
the truth. That's how you be a good friend. Number two.
A good friend handles their responsibilities. They don't make you
(27:14):
responsible for what they need to do for themselves. Now,
they may ask for your support, they may ask for
your input, But a good friend that handles their part
of the relationship. So if you're there and you're paying
the bills and you're giving her money or whatever you're doing,
(27:35):
you continue to do that, Okay. If you can't sleep
on the sofa or sleep in the kid's room, you
get into beds, you say good night, you say your prayers,
and you turn over, and you let her know I'm
I'm not engaging in sex with you anymore because I'm
done here. What do you mean? I mean, I'm done.
(27:56):
I'm not going to expect you to be my wife
when I can't no longer be your husband, all right,
and one statement at a time, I'm done. And if
she tells you to get out, you don't have to
be there, say well, that's not good for the children.
If you want me to leave, i'll leave, but we
(28:18):
need to figure this out for the children and me.
Just leaving in the middle of the night because you're mad,
that's not good for the kids. All right, Now, I'll
sleep on the couch or I'll sleep in the basement
or whatever. But we need to we need to have
a plan. And that's what you say to her because
that's what you want. Your vision is for you to
(28:39):
be healthy, her to be healthy, You to be happy,
her to be happy, and that you'll create a new relationship,
which is that your cold parents. So tell me, tell
me where you are now, tell me what you're hearing,
tell me what you know, tell me what you're ready
to do. Okay, So what I'm hearing is all I
(29:00):
need to be truthful with her, hand to my own responsibilities,
starf respecting the benefits of her husband, and putting actually
playing together. Good for you, Good for you. And let
me just say this, I'm talking to you again as grandma. Okay, okay,
(29:23):
you are not responsible for how she's going to react
because she's gonna make you wrong and just gonna make
you wrong. Yeah, that's not your responsibility. The wrong that
you did you did a long time ago by not
being mindful in creating children with the woman you didn't
(29:46):
want to be with. All right, The wrong you did
was getting married when you didn't want to get married.
The wrong you did was allowing fear to rule your
choices and decisions. Okay, that's out of the way, all right,
But she is going to make you responsible. Be compassionate. Understand,
this is a twenty three year old woman who's been
(30:07):
with one man for six years and now she's got
four kids and he's talking about leaving her. What you've
got to be out your mind. I'll stay with you
and be miserable. I'll stay with you and let the
kids see us deteriorate. But you ain't leaving me, right,
you are going. As a matter of fact, you're gone.
(30:27):
But now you're gonna begin to engage in behaviors that
starts to educate her that you're serious about this right,
And the first thing you have to know is she's
going to blame you. You are not responsible for that.
You're responsible for the mistakes that you made. We're going
to forgive you and move on. But she's gonna make
(30:49):
you wrong. But your behavior, this is how you straighten
your spine. You're gonna have to deal with it. You
don't have to react to it, but you have to
deal with it. And all you can do is saye
forgive me, not I'm sorry, because you are not sorry.
You are a proud, strong black man. You are not sorry,
and you are willing to take responsibility and you're not
(31:14):
going to be beaten down and beat up. And as
long as you can stay there and come to peace
with her, I want you to be happy, and I
want to be happy. I want us to compare in
our kids. But I'm no longer willing to do this
as mom. What's your greatest fear about moving in this direction?
(31:37):
I would say maybe I was making the wrong decision
by leaving. She might have been the right woman, because
see a good person. But it drains me and it
stills my joy and happiness. Trying to make it work.
The work to make it work maybe too much for you.
(31:58):
Right now, you're twelve three years old. You really haven't
solidified your vision. I heard you say you want to
create a legacy for your children. So you need to
be able to run and move and do that, make
some power moves and some choices. You're gonna fail a
couple of times. You're gonna have to fall down and
(32:20):
get up, because that's just the age that you're at
and that's just what happens. That was another thing that
kind of deterred in my mind like she may not
be the one because I try to entrepreneur endeavor and
I feeled at it and when I failed at it,
not only did she not support it, he bashed me
(32:42):
for it and was telling me all you could have
did this and that I forgive her for everything, and
I'm I'm I'm free at hard about it, but that
once you said that, that that brong it back to
my memory. Well, this is what Grandma wants you to know.
And this is a tip for you and all young men.
(33:03):
You want a woman with a vision, a vision for herself,
and you want a woman who can support your vision. Right,
nothing will tear a relationship down faster than two people
with no vision. Does y'all are just flopping around like
fish out of water. What is her vision for herself?
(33:24):
Because if she had a clear vision for herself, chances
are she wouldn't have four kids at twenty three. Unless
her vision is to be a stay at home mom,
which is great. I don't have no issue with that,
but it just seems to me like carelessness and recklessness
and the glact is why we're in this position when
(33:46):
we're not gonna beat that dead horse. The kids are here,
we love them and we want to be the best
for them. You've got to give yourself space to grow.
Start thinking of her as your children's mother and become
her friend. You know, I know you've got a two
month old, but start talking. Hell, what do you want
to do with your life? What do you want to be?
(34:07):
Do you want to go to school, do you want
to do hair? Do you want to make club? What
do you want to do with your life? And how
can I support you in that? Right? That's the kind
of conversation you need to be having with her, and
stay away from little petty arguments. You know you did this,
why don't you do that? Just take a breath and
walk away and get your exit plan together. You don't
(34:31):
have to do it today or tomorrow. What do you
have to do? Really? How many of your children are boys,
so you have to be a demonstration for them to
be the best man you can be, so you can
be the best father that you can be. And your
(34:53):
greatest ally, let me tell you something. Your greatest ally
here is your mom. Was that because she's a woman
with experience and you have to let her know. You know,
I'm I'm really thinking about leaving this marriage, and I
(35:13):
want to do it the right way. I was going
to do that, but being that they was bumping heads,
I didn't want to kind of involve her in it
because I was thinking maybe she might have a buy
as a pain man that they both gotta stout to
taste somebody. To never never, ever, ever, ever, ever put
(35:34):
yourself between your mother and a woman. You have to
let your mother know what your clear boundaries are, and
you have to let your the woman in your life
know what your clear boundaries are. But here's a little
tip from Grandma. If your mother don't like her, you're
dead in the water. And your mother doesn't have to
(35:57):
like her. But there are some case in situations where
mama really does know best. I'm telling you your mother
is an ally. If you have a good relationship with
your mom, you must just create clear boundaries. Mama, that's
my children's mother. I need you to be kind and compassionate.
(36:22):
You can't talk to me about my children's mother now.
If you think the children are in danger or can
be harmed, that I want you to know. But how
she walks and talks, and how she colors her hair
and choose her. Gum, I don't want to hear that.
I don't want to hear that. You are their grandmother
and I need you to be their grandmother, not a
(36:44):
critic of their mother. Tell me what you know now
that you didn't know when you're called I need to
be more responsible. I need to stop making decisions out
of spear. Yes, that's what I want you to get.
When I'm afraid, I make poor decisions. So if I
(37:06):
feel afraid, let me stop and get myself together so
I can make a decision based on what's good for
me and what's good for everybody involved, so that it's
a win win. Right. Do you know that you're not weak?
You're not weak. You've made some poor decisions, but you're
not weak, not at all. If you were weak, you
(37:27):
wouldn't be on this phone. You're looking for some guidance
and some support that I can offer you. Issue is
not what is she going to do? The issue is
how are you going to be? And you're going to
be kind, you're going to be compassionate, you're going to
be clear, you're going to be honest, you're going to
(37:49):
be firm, and you're going to be a good father.
As now. I'm gonna wish you the best, and I
want to know how you how this turns out. Move slow,
but stop stop saying should I leave? You've already left.
Now make the plan and do it. Okay, You're self full.
(38:15):
Self full means that you make put yourself first in
your life so that you can be the best for
everybody else. Thou full, it's not selfish. Don't you dare
don't you dare go? Get no other woman? Okay, my love,
(38:37):
thank you for calling. Thank you, Okay, bye bye. The
waw Hohohi and the untrained penis it's a it's a
dangerous mix because our mind is telling us one thing,
our heart is telling us one thing, and miss the
Man and Miss Hohoha are having a whole, whole another conversation.
(39:01):
And as long as we put those sensory stimulations into
the process, we can't think clearly, and our feelings become
very confused, and it just makes the inevitable more difficult
and more challenging. After the break, we'll come back with
my second caller, who has a similar issue, but for
(39:25):
a very different reason. Welcome back, I Amy, y' len.
This is the our spot, you know, that it's time
to go. You know that you don't want to stay.
(39:46):
You may not want to leave, but you don't know
how to stay, or you know how you want to leave,
but you think you're supposed all of that. Don't invite
the untrained penis and the wild who had into that conversation. Breathe,
get clear and vote for you. Just listen. Greetings beloved,
(40:14):
welcome to the our spot, and thank you for your patience.
Now what is your relationship challenge, issue, dilemma, problem question
that we are going to work through today. Yeah, I'm
just think I'm out of a relationship and it's of
my son's father on an offing end for about eight years.
(40:35):
I'm just really at a place where the breakup was
it was mutual, but a lot of my bad behavior
has like let up to the dissolution of their relationship.
I'm just really trying to get into a decent head
space so that I can continue to cope here from
a healthy space. I'm so caught up in like shame
(40:57):
and guilt, or I'm on the other end of the
spectrum where when I have peace about the end of
the relationship, I'm feeling guilty because i feel that peace.
You feel guilty because you're at peace that the relationship
is over. M So you'all have already separated. Is this
(41:17):
a marriage, is it a living or what kind of
relationship are we talking about? Um? We were living together. Yeah,
he moved out about a week ago. Okay, oh just
a week? Oh you still on it? You right at
the beginning of this thing? Yeah? So do you want out? Um?
(41:38):
I think I do. I've been praying about it for
a while. We were planning to kind of get our
own spaces because it's been so rocky, and we were thinking, like,
you know, maybe moving out will allow us to clear
our heads and get some space and try again. I
felt like I've kind of got an answer my prayers.
(42:00):
And so there's always a point where I feel like
I want out, and then we break up and then
I'm like, Okay, maybe I really don't, and so we
start this whole life begging process with him again, and
I just know I really don't want to go back
into that headspace. So here's what I want you to do.
I want you to just close your eyelets for a
moment and allow your mind to waffle or wave or
(42:24):
float through your body and let me ask you this question.
Is there any part of you that still wants him?
It could be a toe, it could be an armpit, hair,
it could be you know, a pimple on your but
it could be anything. Find it. Is there a place
in your body where you still want him? Yes, ma'am? Okay?
(42:49):
So where is she at? Where she located in my heart?
My head? Both, probably your heart? Okay? And she wants him? Why?
Why does she want on him? We would get me
in and he was trying to make a word, and
we've invested a lot of time. We have a son.
Now does she want him for who he is? Or
(43:13):
does she want him for what he does for her?
I'm playing more about what he does for me and
how he makes me feel. Okay, Well, then we need
to shut her down because as long as she's active
and alive, you'll be in that back and forth thing.
I don't want you, you know, because she may want
(43:34):
him for how he makes her feel, but she doesn't
want the responsibilities or the restrictions or the limitations of
the relationship. Does that make sense to you? I think so? Okay,
Because she if she wants him for how she makes
(43:56):
him feel, how he makes her feel, which is why
how does she How does he make her feel? He
makes her feel what wanted, appreciate it, value that time.
So he's giving her things that she needs to give
(44:17):
to herself. Does she want herself just as she is
as a woman? Does she want herself? Does she love herself?
Does she appreciate herself? Does she value herself? She's making
him responsible for things that she has to give to
herself and bring that into the relationship. She's got to
(44:40):
get that together because that's not his responsibility. His responsibility
is to better her, not to complete her. So if
she's looking to him to feel some sense of completion
or value or worth, you know, M, let's aim her.
What's her name? I don't know. I just know he's
(45:04):
really young. Okay, let's name her M Patsy. Yeah, so
we gotta we gotta get Patsy in check so that you,
the grown woman, can make a clear, conscious choice about
(45:25):
whether or not this is the man that you want
to spend your life with, that you want to raise
your child with. Is he the man? But that's a
grown woman decision. Tell me what you're thinking, because I
hear you thinking. Um, I'm thinking I can do that.
(45:45):
I just I just get caught up in like the
guilt of everything that I've kind of that I've done
this let up until this point, and so what did
you do? Oh do? Tell? What did you do? Um? Well,
I've been like physically harmful at times, kind of respond
to something that's happened. Still not acceptable obviously, and so
(46:08):
I always kind of get caught up. He does something
to upset me, I do something totally inappropriate, and then
like we focus more on my bad behavior, and I'm
like making them pleading for us to get back to
a good space. We've taken five stiff backwards. I just yeah,
he's cheated on you. Yeah before, yes, mail, Okay, if
(46:30):
Patsy understood that she has to want herself before somebody
else can want her. If Patsy understood that and that
wasn't present in your consciousness, then you wouldn't attract a
man who would cheat. But since you want him to
prove that he wants you, that she didn't just send
(46:53):
you right down the rabbit hole of See, he doesn't
want me, he doesn't want me. But I'm telling you
there's a part of you that doesn't want you. We'll
call it, Patsy. And if he really wanted you and
he valued you, and if he appreciated you, he wouldn't
do that. He wouldn't call your names, or stay out
late or whatever went on. Now, Patsy's beating you up
(47:18):
for the things that you did when he disappointed her
or hurt her or whatever. So there's a lot of
forgiveness that needs to go on here, and that's you
forgiving yourself, You forgiving Patsy. It isn't even about him,
because you can't stay in a relationship that's abusive. You
can't stay in a relationship where you feel guilty. You
(47:41):
can't stay in a relationship where you feel ashamed. You
can't stay in a relationship where you feel unwanted or disappointed.
You can't stay in that. But you have to make
the clear decision to leave or to clean this stuff up,
and you have to clean it up. He can't clean
(48:02):
it up. I don't know what his behavior is that
he needs to clean up, because I'm talking to you.
So what do you need to forgive yourself for all
of the harmful things that I said? All the harmful
things happened. Okay, that's too broad, that's too broad. You
can't experience forgiveness like that. So take a breath, and
(48:27):
when you think back to your worst day, because we
all have bad days, do your worst day with you
with your boot. I forgive myself for I'm forging myself
for allowing um out of his name, for using things. Okay,
(48:49):
wait a minute, Wait a minute, Wait a minute. I
forgive myself for calling him out of mind his name.
Take a breath there. What about foul language. Let's let's
do that one. I forgive myself for you say that
whole stamp. I forgive myself for the fouling which I use. Yeah,
(49:12):
how about this one? I forgive myself for disrespecting him
as a man. Let me hear that one. I forgive
myself for disrespecting him as a man. And I forgive
myself for disrespecting myself as a woman. Forgive myself for
distance respecting myself as a woman. What else I forgive
(49:34):
myself for? I forgive myself for not controlling my anger.
How about I forgive myself for believing he was the
source of my anger. Let me hear that one. I
forget myself for believing that he was the source of
my anger. Yeah, what else. Forgive myself for not feeling
(50:01):
like I'm good enough, not feeling like I'm worthy. Let's
relanguage that so that we can get to the root.
I forgive myself or making him responsible for making to
make me feel worthy. Forget myself for making him responsible
to make me feel worthy. Yeah, take a breath, Take
(50:25):
a breath, Come on, breathe, but just sitting on just
a pool of regretting and hurt, and some of it
doesn't have anything to do with him. Here's one. I
forgive myself for believing that I can't be loved the
(50:48):
way I want to be. I forget myself for believing
that I can't be loved the way I want to be. Yeah,
let's just dig around there for a moment. Why can't
you be loved the way you want to be? Um? Like,
I ruined relationships as everybody that me. I push them away,
(51:12):
and I push them away because they're gonna leave me anyway. Yeah, say,
I push them away because I believe they're gonna leave
me anyway. Let me hear the whole step. Oh wait,
because I believe they're gonna leave me in any way. Yeah,
take a breath, and they're gonna leave me because they're
(51:33):
gonna leave me because something's wrong with me. So let's
let's work in there for a little bit. Okay, I
forgive myself for believing there's something wrong with me. I
forget my for believing something wrong with me. I forgive
myself for believing that I don't deserve love, myself for
(51:57):
believing that I don't deservele them. Yeah, okay, So who
left you, Mommy or daddy or both? Who left both? Okay? Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay,
so that's Patsy's heartbreak. Let me just say this, your mom, Now,
(52:17):
you've got to be as healthy as you can be
for that little one. Consciously or unconsciously. You've created for
your little one, your experience. You know, now Dad is
gone and mom is someplace else mentally and emotionally. So
(52:39):
that's what you've got to pull together and be able
to compare. If you and him never get back together,
you've got to be able to compare. And all of
that behavior, the guilty behavior, the abusive behavior, shameful behavior,
that was Patsy just acting out her heartbreak about being
(53:01):
abandoned or rejected or however that happened for her. She
just brought it into your relationship, so she needs a
little help. How old is she? How old is Patsy?
I really like twelve? I would think, Yeah, they're they're
rough them twelve and thirteen year olds. Maybe talk to
(53:24):
your therapists about doing some work with Patsy and getting
her to a voice her hurt and heartbreak and disappointment,
but also bum growing her up so that she catches
up with where you are. But she's running a muck
right now. I could tell you a million things that
(53:48):
you could do, but I think the best thing for
you to do right now is to know that where
you are is exactly where you need to be, and
when you feel better and when you are better, maybe
y'all get back together. Maybe not, but he's still your
child's father, so visiting and questions about decisions and those
(54:12):
kinds of things. You just need to stay focused right there.
Take a sabbatical. Don't even think about trying to get
back with him. Right now, you and Patsy have some
work to Patsy is a Messingham. If I were going
to give you a book to read, I would tell
you to get forgiveness. Okay, I have it forty days? Yeah,
(54:37):
have you done the work. I started it a couple
of years ago and I never finished on me, So
that would be a no. That would be a no.
But you know what, it's so amazing. So very often
we have the very thing that we need right in
the palm of our hand and we don't put it
(54:58):
to good use. That a lot, So don't beat yourself
up about it. The good news is maybe you're ready now.
Put you first right now, you and mothering and don't
withhold a baby and don't fight with him and that
kind of stuff. No, Patsy, no, no, sit down, we'll
(55:19):
sit down over there. What do you know now that
you didn't know when you call me? But my heartwired
belief push people there do the very thing I don't
want them to do. Yeah, but I'm glad that you
owned it. My hardwired belief pushes people because you hold
(55:46):
the belief and you want to be right about what
you believe, so you will engage in behavior and she
naigations to prove yourself right. We all do it. Baby.
There's nothing wrong with you. You're human and that means
that you're craziest hell, just like the rest of us.
(56:09):
I want to hear from you in about three months.
I want to know how you're doing, how your sabbatical
is going okay, And no matter what, no matter what,
when he comes over and Patsy and you were feeling
hot and bothered, don't give him none. Yes, thank you
(56:34):
for calling. Thank you, beloved, have a good dade. Bye.
The wild who she will get you into trouble every time.
The wild who ha. You gotta give her name, and
(56:54):
you gotta train her, making the shift, changing the nature,
creating a new normal. All of that goes into the
process of a relationship breakdown. And then when you put
the untrained penis in the wild, who are in the
midst real bets. So here's what I want to say.
(57:19):
If you're in break down in your relationship, if you're
breaking up a relationship, if you don't know how to
stay and you don't know how to leave, and it's
just all over the place, come above the waist and
make choices and decisions that honor you and honor the
other person. You may not know how to stay, you
(57:42):
may not know how to lead, and in either case
you must learn how to take care of yourself in
a way that honors you and honors the other person.
I hope this has been helpful to someone, and if
you have a question about this or any other relationship issue,
(58:03):
you can call me live at seven seven five three
zero seven seven seven sixty eight. Now be sure to
follow me on social media for all of the calling times,
and until then, stay in peace. Nine Piece The R
Spot is a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio.
(58:27):
For more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
I am, I Amla. I had a baby daddy relationship,
I spend time in a relationship with a married man.
I had to learn the skills and tools required to
make my relationships healthy, fulfilling and loving. Welcome to the
Our Spot, a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio.
(00:38):
Sometimes the question in a relationship is not how do
I leave? The question is how do I stay? How
do I stay where I'm unhappy? How do I stay
where I'm not being fulfilled? How do I stay where
(00:59):
I know I don't want to be? How do I stay? Well?
Sometimes you can't stay. Sometimes you have left even before
you turn your key over, And that's probably more difficult
to be in than if you just gather up whatever nerve, courage,
(01:26):
strength you need to say this just isn't working for me.
Sometime the work to make it work is harder than
the work you'll have to do to just step out
of it. How do you stay? How do you stay
(01:47):
if you can't tell the truth? How do you stay
if you can't find a compromise? How do you stay? Well?
You can't stay? But then the real question becomes, well,
how do I leave? How do I leave with my
self intact? How do I leave the other person intact?
How do I leave and handle my responsibilities? How do
(02:09):
I leave? And what I always tell people is you
really can't leave or won't leave until you can stay,
until you can be in the same place with the
person being honest and forthright, without being cruel and abusive
(02:31):
or abrasive. You can't leave because if you leave in
the middle of a fight, that fight will follow you.
So how do you stay with the clear vision that
you're done? How do you stay with compassion for yourself
first and for what the other person is going through?
(02:54):
How do you stay? You stay with your heart and
your mind to open that your best interests and the
person's best interests will be best served when you go.
You stay and you create an exit plan. Stay and
(03:16):
you pray, You pray that you get your lessons and
that you understand what you've done. Can't leave until you
can stay. That's what I want my first caller to
hear today, because the truth is they're already gone. Now
(03:38):
the question becomes how do you get out? Greetings beloved,
and welcome to the our spot. I'm so glad that
you could join me today and tell me what is
your relationship challenge, issue dilemma that we are going to
be working on. My own challenge today is with my wife.
(04:01):
We've been together six years. I don't know if I
should start from the beginning or tell you how I'm
feeling now. Well, tell me now, because I can't do
nothing about the beginning. If I need to know, we'll
go back there okay, which she probably will, but I
don't feel it now. It's I feel like it's time
(04:22):
for me to go. I love her, but I'm not
in love anymore. I lost attraction and the energy to
keep making trying to make the relationship work like I
lost myself. Trying to satisfy her and make her happy.
Attention that she requires it drains me. I've even broken
(04:45):
relationships with family and friends to try to satisfy her.
She's in one room, I have to be another. I
get more of a peace of mind enjoyed when I'm alone.
I feel like I would have left by now. But
we do have four kids together, so I want to
(05:07):
make sure that I really hold on to a thought
of and raising my kids in the same household. But
I don't want to be unhappy and regret and later
on in life. I want the best for her, and
I want her to be happy as well, But I'm
(05:28):
not I'm not feeling like that. Maybe me, I want
her to be mentally saber as well, so she could
raise my kids the right way. If that's the way
it's going to go, it's a big challenge for me
right now. Yeah, can I ask how old you are?
Twenty three? You are twenty three? And did I hear
(05:50):
you say you have four children? Yes? Now? Four children
at twenty three and you've only been married nine months? Yes? Now,
oh my goodness? How old are your children? I owe
these three? I have twins, that's two, and I have
a two month old. So let me ask you this first.
(06:14):
What is your question to me? God? Because I'm not
hearing the question here, I don't know. I don't know
if I'm making Would I be making the right decision
to leave? So let me ask you something. Yes, are
you making the right decision for you to leave this marriage?
(06:38):
I don't know? Yes, you do. There's a distinction between
not knowing if you should leave and not knowing how
to leave. Right I think you've already left. If you're
telling me you've got to be in another room to
be happy, because you don't leave a marriage when you
(06:59):
walk out the door. You leave the marriage first in
your heart and then in your mind. Yeah, so where
is your mind? Now? Where's your mind? Because it's not there.
It's to the point to now that I may be
interested in other women. Now I don't want to see
(07:20):
her anything. I'd rather, you know, let her know and
what's going on and try to have that conversation with her.
There was a movie, if I'm not mistaken, Tyler Perry
did the movie called Why did I Get Married? Why
Did You get married? I really didn't want to. Yeah,
(07:44):
that's obvious. I was pressed in through it. I was
instead of being alone a couple months before, she was
actually trying to leave me at one point because situation
with her and my mother and and she felt like
I didn't support her and she was going to leave
in hours and fearl being alone. I bet that mistake.
(08:08):
Were you in fear of being alone or were you
in fear of losing her? Because there's a distinction there,
Probably losing her at the time. Sometimes we love somebody,
we love them and we want them in our life.
We don't want to be joined at the hip, but
(08:30):
we want them in our life, and we're afraid that
if we don't do what they want the way they
want it, that will lose them totally, which couldn't have
been your case because you had two children at the time.
All right, So you want her in your life, but
you don't want to be joined to her in this
way anymore? Is that right? Yes, maw Yeah, So what
(08:54):
is your fear? What is your fear that she wouldn't
be messing able to raise kids the right way? Maybe
she may be more focused on somebody trying to love
her and not raising the kids the right way and
trying to get back at me instead of moving forward
and trying to hear that's what I'm trying to do.
(09:17):
You probably have some experiences with her that tell you that, right,
that she's going to be focused on herself and not
on your children. Right. I gotta ask you two questions
that may seem totally unrelated. Okay, were you raised with
your dad? Yeah? Do you want to be to your
(09:39):
children who he wasn't to you? Now, I have a
grandson your age, a grandson on your age, and I've
got a grandson that's seven years older than you. So
I want to talk to you like a grandma. Okay,
I don't don't. I don't want to be your coach.
(10:02):
I don't want to be your therapist. I want to
talk to you like a grandmother. That means I'm gonna
give you some cold water in your face. Okay, now
that's what I need. Okay, let me let me ask
you this before I start. What is your mother saying
about all of this? I finally had that conversation with
her because I had stopped talking to her for about
a year because of her and my wife. But he
(10:26):
feel like that they bombed heads because my mother would
point out things that my wife did and my wife
didn't like that. Or my wife would go to her
about things about our relationship and she would how to
make I take accountability. Basically, my wife didn't like that.
So that's why they started bumping heads. So this is
(10:49):
Grandma talking to you. Now. This is not Missy on
Love from fixing my life. This is Grandma. But you
need some cold water in your face? Okay, And I'm
doing it out of an old rusty pot, not doing
it with a nice, a nice glass picture. Okay, First
(11:09):
of all, my love, what in the blazing But Jesus
are you doing with four children at twenty three years old?
If you can't take care of your penis, how are
you going to take care of four kids and a
woman that's grandma? Okay? What in the world? What is
that about? Irresponse? Yes, good for you, good for you?
(11:37):
And see, as an old lady, I really have challenge
and issue with young women having children with men who
don't have their stuff together right, And you don't have
your stuff together? Where are you with your education? I
just went to a technical college and got him well
(12:00):
in diploma and I got my speedos? Okay? And what
kind of work do you do? Oh? Drive truck? So
you ain't home half the time? Well? I do be home.
I come home every day. Okay, you don't. You're not
a long distance driver. And what do you want to do?
What is your vision for yourself at twenty three? What's
(12:20):
your vision beyond your penis or kids? Good for you? Good, good, good?
But you can't do that if your heart in your
mind or not at peace? Right? So you let this
young woman and her who haa, you know what the
(12:41):
whoha is right, drag you around by the nose and
didn't even have enough sense to protect yourself. So now
you got four mouths to feed, and as a man,
you have to be at your best. You have to
be at your best in order to create that legacy
(13:04):
in a way that will benefit your children. And you've
created these four lives with a woman who obviously doesn't
respect herself, because if she respected herself, you would not
be in fear of her denying you your children. So
we've got to kind of backtrack this now. And like
(13:26):
I said, the issue here is not are you leaving.
You're gonna leave you out, You're done, And what you've
done in the process is that these four young lives
are going to be collateral damage of your irresponsibility, and
you just got to suck that up. Tell me what
(13:48):
you hear me saying, tell me what you're thinking, tell
me what you're feeling, and then we can go from there.
It doesn't matter. You don't have to repeat my words.
I want to know what you are hearing and thinking
and feeling. It's over here. The relationship between me and
her basically over. I'm just trying to hold onto it.
(14:10):
Why the kids. That's never a good excuse, because you
can't be any better to them than you are to yourself.
I have noticed that, Like sometimes I get real impatient
with them and I catch it. I've spanked them, and
(14:30):
I could have just talked to him instead of spanking them.
Read in that moment. And I heard you say earlier
that you might be interested in other woman. That's first
of all, that ain't true. You are interested in other woman.
You're talking to grandma. Grandma got eyes in the back
(14:52):
of her head. Okay, But the last thing you need
is a woman, right right, that's the last thing you need.
What do you need a woman for what you're gonna
do with I don't. I don't. It's just you know, man,
got need so sometimes I might need to get my rock.
So that's all I'm saying. I don't need a woman
(15:12):
to just be in my life. But you need to
take a cold shower, take a cold shower, eat some grapes.
You're getting your rocks off. Got you four kids that
you now can't be with. Stop it. But that's because
that's because you're twenty three. You've put the cart before
the horse. You've created responsibilities for yourself that even in
(15:37):
your normal development as a man, you know, it's just
it's a lot. It's a lot. It's not too much
because it's been done. So what you need, my beloved.
I could be very wrong here, and I'm not advocating
the end of your marriage, but from what you've shared
with me, it sounds to me like you're already gone
(16:01):
and that's not fair to her, to you, or to
the children. So what you need is an exit plan,
which is going to be challenging because you've got a wife,
you've got four children. You already said you didn't want
to get married, so you've probably never really been there.
And I bet y'all had a big wedding complete with
(16:22):
chicken and people and bridesmaids and all of that. Didn't shit.
Oh no, we didn't go through all that. Nah. It's
a good thing because the money y'all would have spent
on the wedding you could have used to buy a house, right,
which we did. We did buy a house instead. Oh
you do have a house. Okay, so you can leave
her in a house. That's so good. Now where are
you going? Probably getting apartment? I could take the one
(16:46):
dead own apartment and found with me. Let's start with
the studio. It's cheaper, you'll need no bedroom because if
you have a bedroom, you might want to have company
that I'm going to say this to you and then
I want us to work through it. Okay, you cannot
(17:07):
leave until you can stay. What I mean by that
that as long as you're angry, as long as you're frustrated,
as long as you are upset with her, you can't
leave because what's going to happen is guilt and manipulation
and fighting is going to bring you back. So you've
(17:30):
got to be able to be in that house with her,
be in that place with her, and grow the muscle
within yourself to say I love her, I don't want
to be with her. I wish the best for her,
and I'm not the best for her. I want her
to be a good mother to my children, and I
(17:51):
want to support her in that. You've got to get
to that place within yourself while you are in the
house with her, Otherwise you're gonna leave. She's gonna use
the kids as a tool. Y'all be fighting and it'll
be a mass. So you've got lots of planning to do.
You need a place to live. You need to look
(18:14):
at your money and see what are you going to
be able to provide for her so that when you leave,
you understand this is what I'm giving, this is what
I have, this is what I need. How you want
to see your children? When you want to see your children,
So that when you talk to her you don't get
beat up and talked out of your plan. You've got
(18:38):
to have a plan because what you're doing right now
is brutal. You can't do that to her, to you,
to the children. Right. I do want what's best for her.
I want her to be happy still, but this with
me or not? But I don't have a plan yet.
I'm right. I actually wrote everything said down. So are
(19:00):
come my plan to get them? How far are you
going to live away from the children? Will you be
able to get them to school? How often do you
want to see them? How much money are you going
to have to give her? When are you going to
give it to her? You're going to leave her in
the house for now. But you know, even if you
went to court to get a separation agreement, which is
(19:23):
what you're going to do, when you get ready, you
don't just tell her that you're leaving. You take your
happy butt down to the courthouse and you file a
separation agreement, so that you're legally separated, not that you're out,
you know, benagling around in the street. What you've just done, baby,
(19:44):
is because you probably didn't have a model and an example,
you've just taken on more than you can possibly manage
at your age and your level of development. We'll talk
about that right at this break. Welcome back to the
(20:09):
art spot. Let's get back to the conversation. So let's
walk this back and then we'll walk it for for
whatever reason, you allowed yourself to do something you didn't
want to do. You didn't want to get married, but
you were afraid of losing her and your children. Can
you own that? Can you sit in that? Yeah? And
(20:33):
how does that make you feel? To know that you
did something you didn't want to do because you were afraid?
Kind of we as a man? Oh no, wrong? How
about sad? Do you feel sad about that? Yes? Well? Yeah,
(20:58):
maybe a little angry at yourself? Right? Yes? Now? Okay,
so you feel sad and angry about what you did,
but you understand in that moment you were afraid, not weak,
but afraid. There's a distinction. What you're doing now is weak,
(21:18):
not being able to say look, I'm out. This is
not good for me. It's not good for me. It's
not good. I don't want my children to grow up
with an angry father. I don't want my children to
grow up with an unhappy father. I don't want them
to see that. I don't want them to see the
tension between their father and their mother. That's not what
(21:40):
I want for my children. Would that be accurate? Yes? Now.
I try to communicate that too one time before, but
it didn't work out too good trying to communicate that
tool and I will trying to communicate that. I wasn't
happy as well, but I'm trying to work it out.
How old is she? Twenty three as well? So let
(22:03):
me just tell you a little bit about her as
a woman. She is scared to death that at twenty
three with four children, if you're gone, nobody's gonna want her.
She just scared to death. I was thinking that as well,
(22:25):
and I was scared for like, I still want her
to be loved. Still, won't her to be able to
find someone easiness? It ain't me. Well, she's got to
love herself first. Once she learns to love herself, Once
you learn to love yourself, both of you will be
able to be in a healthy relationship, because even if
(22:46):
you didn't protect yourself from creating life that you couldn't
provide for, she does a woman didn't protect herself. No way.
Are you to have three kids? Four kids? That twenty
three when she had them twins, she was supposed to
shut that thing down. You'all was just out there hopscotching
(23:07):
on each other and not paying attention. Happens all the time,
and it's not fatal. You'll be okay. I want the
children to be okay. I want them to have a strong,
healthy father and a strong healthy mother. Okay, So you
did something you didn't want to do because you're afraid.
Are you clear that you're repeating the same pattern. You're
(23:30):
doing something staying in the marriage that you don't want
to be in because you're afraid of what will happen
if you leave. You're doing the same thing. Yes, now,
right now? How's that going to turn out for you?
It'll be it'll be a repeated cycle. Yah, yeah, I
(23:54):
think Wow. Let's just get clear at first. Are you
done with this marriage? Yes? Man? Are you willing to
be a responsible co parent with your children's mother? Yes? Man?
In order to do that, you're gonna have to be
her friend. Can you be her friend? I didn't ask
(24:19):
you if she could be your friend? Can you be
her friend? Yes? How can you be a good friend
to her? I could be a good friend her as
far as importing her, I know, financially, which that's not
a friend, but just in support of her. I would
(24:39):
say support of her emotionally, but she probably would block
me out knowing her, he probably would block me out emotionally.
So I really don't know how I could be a
friend too. I would want to be, but I don't
know how I would be. Well. You being her friend
is not contingent upon it how she reacts to you.
(25:02):
So the first thing a good friend does it's always
tell the truth. Always tell the truth. So if you're
done with this marriage, but the marriage not with co parenting,
because I heard you say you're willing to be a
good co parent, right, hear me what I'm saying to you,
(25:25):
Then you have to stop expecting the benefits of a husband.
You have to stop sleeping with her. You have to
stop expecting how to do your launtry. You have to
stop expecting how to beat you and do your clothes.
You have to stop that because sleeping with her, having
(25:46):
sex with her, doing those kinds of things, you're sending
a mixed message. Either you're done or you're not done.
I try to cut it off. That's what aspect of
our relationship with see you against es sexually first graded in. Well,
that's her problem. She has to figure out how to
handle that. You gotta put a little more base in
(26:09):
your voice and tighten up your bottom pieces because for
whatever reason, you're letting her drag you around to what
she wants and you're not getting what you want, and
what you're doing is not good. No sex. Stop being
a husband, Start being a co parent. Work with the kids,
(26:29):
provide the provision, you know, the resources for them. I'm
taking the kids out, you know, if you got to
go over to your mom's, go to the park, do whatever.
Start co parenting. How do I communicate this to her?
With your behavior, I'm duting. You have to tell her
(26:51):
a good friend. My best friend tells me the truth
all the time. Sometimes I don't want to hear it right,
and she don't argue with me. She don't explain stuff,
you know, unless I ask her, But she tells me
the truth. That's how you be a good friend. Number two.
A good friend handles their responsibilities. They don't make you
(27:14):
responsible for what they need to do for themselves. Now,
they may ask for your support, they may ask for
your input, But a good friend that handles their part
of the relationship. So if you're there and you're paying
the bills and you're giving her money or whatever you're doing,
(27:35):
you continue to do that, Okay. If you can't sleep
on the sofa or sleep in the kid's room, you
get into beds, you say good night, you say your prayers,
and you turn over, and you let her know I'm
I'm not engaging in sex with you anymore because I'm
done here. What do you mean? I mean, I'm done.
(27:56):
I'm not going to expect you to be my wife
when I can't no longer be your husband, all right,
and one statement at a time, I'm done. And if
she tells you to get out, you don't have to
be there, say well, that's not good for the children.
If you want me to leave, i'll leave, but we
(28:18):
need to figure this out for the children and me.
Just leaving in the middle of the night because you're mad,
that's not good for the kids. All right, Now, I'll
sleep on the couch or I'll sleep in the basement
or whatever. But we need to we need to have
a plan. And that's what you say to her because
that's what you want. Your vision is for you to
(28:39):
be healthy, her to be healthy, You to be happy,
her to be happy, and that you'll create a new relationship,
which is that your cold parents. So tell me, tell
me where you are now, tell me what you're hearing,
tell me what you know, tell me what you're ready
to do. Okay, So what I'm hearing is all I
(29:00):
need to be truthful with her, hand to my own responsibilities,
starf respecting the benefits of her husband, and putting actually
playing together. Good for you, Good for you. And let
me just say this, I'm talking to you again as grandma. Okay, okay,
(29:23):
you are not responsible for how she's going to react
because she's gonna make you wrong and just gonna make
you wrong. Yeah, that's not your responsibility. The wrong that
you did you did a long time ago by not
being mindful in creating children with the woman you didn't
(29:46):
want to be with. All right, The wrong you did
was getting married when you didn't want to get married.
The wrong you did was allowing fear to rule your
choices and decisions. Okay, that's out of the way, all right,
But she is going to make you responsible. Be compassionate. Understand,
this is a twenty three year old woman who's been
(30:07):
with one man for six years and now she's got
four kids and he's talking about leaving her. What you've
got to be out your mind. I'll stay with you
and be miserable. I'll stay with you and let the
kids see us deteriorate. But you ain't leaving me, right,
you are going. As a matter of fact, you're gone.
(30:27):
But now you're gonna begin to engage in behaviors that
starts to educate her that you're serious about this right,
And the first thing you have to know is she's
going to blame you. You are not responsible for that.
You're responsible for the mistakes that you made. We're going
to forgive you and move on. But she's gonna make
(30:49):
you wrong. But your behavior, this is how you straighten
your spine. You're gonna have to deal with it. You
don't have to react to it, but you have to
deal with it. And all you can do is saye
forgive me, not I'm sorry, because you are not sorry.
You are a proud, strong black man. You are not sorry,
and you are willing to take responsibility and you're not
(31:14):
going to be beaten down and beat up. And as
long as you can stay there and come to peace
with her, I want you to be happy, and I
want to be happy. I want us to compare in
our kids. But I'm no longer willing to do this
as mom. What's your greatest fear about moving in this direction?
(31:37):
I would say maybe I was making the wrong decision
by leaving. She might have been the right woman, because
see a good person. But it drains me and it
stills my joy and happiness. Trying to make it work.
The work to make it work maybe too much for you.
(31:58):
Right now, you're twelve three years old. You really haven't
solidified your vision. I heard you say you want to
create a legacy for your children. So you need to
be able to run and move and do that, make
some power moves and some choices. You're gonna fail a
couple of times. You're gonna have to fall down and
(32:20):
get up, because that's just the age that you're at
and that's just what happens. That was another thing that
kind of deterred in my mind like she may not
be the one because I try to entrepreneur endeavor and
I feeled at it and when I failed at it,
not only did she not support it, he bashed me
(32:42):
for it and was telling me all you could have
did this and that I forgive her for everything, and
I'm I'm I'm free at hard about it, but that
once you said that, that that brong it back to
my memory. Well, this is what Grandma wants you to know.
And this is a tip for you and all young men.
(33:03):
You want a woman with a vision, a vision for herself,
and you want a woman who can support your vision. Right,
nothing will tear a relationship down faster than two people
with no vision. Does y'all are just flopping around like
fish out of water. What is her vision for herself?
(33:24):
Because if she had a clear vision for herself, chances
are she wouldn't have four kids at twenty three. Unless
her vision is to be a stay at home mom,
which is great. I don't have no issue with that,
but it just seems to me like carelessness and recklessness
and the glact is why we're in this position when
(33:46):
we're not gonna beat that dead horse. The kids are here,
we love them and we want to be the best
for them. You've got to give yourself space to grow.
Start thinking of her as your children's mother and become
her friend. You know, I know you've got a two
month old, but start talking. Hell, what do you want
to do with your life? What do you want to be?
(34:07):
Do you want to go to school, do you want
to do hair? Do you want to make club? What
do you want to do with your life? And how
can I support you in that? Right? That's the kind
of conversation you need to be having with her, and
stay away from little petty arguments. You know you did this,
why don't you do that? Just take a breath and
walk away and get your exit plan together. You don't
(34:31):
have to do it today or tomorrow. What do you
have to do? Really? How many of your children are boys,
so you have to be a demonstration for them to
be the best man you can be, so you can
be the best father that you can be. And your
(34:53):
greatest ally, let me tell you something. Your greatest ally
here is your mom. Was that because she's a woman
with experience and you have to let her know. You know,
I'm I'm really thinking about leaving this marriage, and I
(35:13):
want to do it the right way. I was going
to do that, but being that they was bumping heads,
I didn't want to kind of involve her in it
because I was thinking maybe she might have a buy
as a pain man that they both gotta stout to
taste somebody. To never never, ever, ever, ever, ever put
(35:34):
yourself between your mother and a woman. You have to
let your mother know what your clear boundaries are, and
you have to let your the woman in your life
know what your clear boundaries are. But here's a little
tip from Grandma. If your mother don't like her, you're
dead in the water. And your mother doesn't have to
(35:57):
like her. But there are some case in situations where
mama really does know best. I'm telling you your mother
is an ally. If you have a good relationship with
your mom, you must just create clear boundaries. Mama, that's
my children's mother. I need you to be kind and compassionate.
(36:22):
You can't talk to me about my children's mother now.
If you think the children are in danger or can
be harmed, that I want you to know. But how
she walks and talks, and how she colors her hair
and choose her. Gum, I don't want to hear that.
I don't want to hear that. You are their grandmother
and I need you to be their grandmother, not a
(36:44):
critic of their mother. Tell me what you know now
that you didn't know when you're called I need to
be more responsible. I need to stop making decisions out
of spear. Yes, that's what I want you to get.
When I'm afraid, I make poor decisions. So if I
(37:06):
feel afraid, let me stop and get myself together so
I can make a decision based on what's good for
me and what's good for everybody involved, so that it's
a win win. Right. Do you know that you're not weak?
You're not weak. You've made some poor decisions, but you're
not weak, not at all. If you were weak, you
(37:27):
wouldn't be on this phone. You're looking for some guidance
and some support that I can offer you. Issue is
not what is she going to do? The issue is
how are you going to be? And you're going to
be kind, you're going to be compassionate, you're going to
be clear, you're going to be honest, you're going to
(37:49):
be firm, and you're going to be a good father.
As now. I'm gonna wish you the best, and I
want to know how you how this turns out. Move slow,
but stop stop saying should I leave? You've already left.
Now make the plan and do it. Okay, You're self full.
(38:15):
Self full means that you make put yourself first in
your life so that you can be the best for
everybody else. Thou full, it's not selfish. Don't you dare
don't you dare go? Get no other woman? Okay, my love,
(38:37):
thank you for calling. Thank you, Okay, bye bye. The
waw Hohohi and the untrained penis it's a it's a
dangerous mix because our mind is telling us one thing,
our heart is telling us one thing, and miss the
Man and Miss Hohoha are having a whole, whole another conversation.
(39:01):
And as long as we put those sensory stimulations into
the process, we can't think clearly, and our feelings become
very confused, and it just makes the inevitable more difficult
and more challenging. After the break, we'll come back with
my second caller, who has a similar issue, but for
(39:25):
a very different reason. Welcome back, I Amy, y' len.
This is the our spot, you know, that it's time
to go. You know that you don't want to stay.
(39:46):
You may not want to leave, but you don't know
how to stay, or you know how you want to leave,
but you think you're supposed all of that. Don't invite
the untrained penis and the wild who had into that conversation. Breathe,
get clear and vote for you. Just listen. Greetings beloved,
(40:14):
welcome to the our spot, and thank you for your patience.
Now what is your relationship challenge, issue, dilemma, problem question
that we are going to work through today. Yeah, I'm
just think I'm out of a relationship and it's of
my son's father on an offing end for about eight years.
(40:35):
I'm just really at a place where the breakup was
it was mutual, but a lot of my bad behavior
has like let up to the dissolution of their relationship.
I'm just really trying to get into a decent head
space so that I can continue to cope here from
a healthy space. I'm so caught up in like shame
(40:57):
and guilt, or I'm on the other end of the
spectrum where when I have peace about the end of
the relationship, I'm feeling guilty because i feel that peace.
You feel guilty because you're at peace that the relationship
is over. M So you'all have already separated. Is this
(41:17):
a marriage, is it a living or what kind of
relationship are we talking about? Um? We were living together. Yeah,
he moved out about a week ago. Okay, oh just
a week? Oh you still on it? You right at
the beginning of this thing? Yeah? So do you want out? Um?
(41:38):
I think I do. I've been praying about it for
a while. We were planning to kind of get our
own spaces because it's been so rocky, and we were thinking, like,
you know, maybe moving out will allow us to clear
our heads and get some space and try again. I
felt like I've kind of got an answer my prayers.
(42:00):
And so there's always a point where I feel like
I want out, and then we break up and then
I'm like, Okay, maybe I really don't, and so we
start this whole life begging process with him again, and
I just know I really don't want to go back
into that headspace. So here's what I want you to do.
I want you to just close your eyelets for a
moment and allow your mind to waffle or wave or
(42:24):
float through your body and let me ask you this question.
Is there any part of you that still wants him?
It could be a toe, it could be an armpit, hair,
it could be you know, a pimple on your but
it could be anything. Find it. Is there a place
in your body where you still want him? Yes, ma'am? Okay?
(42:49):
So where is she at? Where she located in my heart?
My head? Both, probably your heart? Okay? And she wants him? Why?
Why does she want on him? We would get me
in and he was trying to make a word, and
we've invested a lot of time. We have a son.
Now does she want him for who he is? Or
(43:13):
does she want him for what he does for her?
I'm playing more about what he does for me and
how he makes me feel. Okay, Well, then we need
to shut her down because as long as she's active
and alive, you'll be in that back and forth thing.
I don't want you, you know, because she may want
(43:34):
him for how he makes her feel, but she doesn't
want the responsibilities or the restrictions or the limitations of
the relationship. Does that make sense to you? I think so? Okay,
Because she if she wants him for how she makes
(43:56):
him feel, how he makes her feel, which is why
how does she How does he make her feel? He
makes her feel what wanted, appreciate it, value that time.
So he's giving her things that she needs to give
(44:17):
to herself. Does she want herself just as she is
as a woman? Does she want herself? Does she love herself?
Does she appreciate herself? Does she value herself? She's making
him responsible for things that she has to give to
herself and bring that into the relationship. She's got to
(44:40):
get that together because that's not his responsibility. His responsibility
is to better her, not to complete her. So if
she's looking to him to feel some sense of completion
or value or worth, you know, M, let's aim her.
What's her name? I don't know. I just know he's
(45:04):
really young. Okay, let's name her M Patsy. Yeah, so
we gotta we gotta get Patsy in check so that you,
the grown woman, can make a clear, conscious choice about
(45:25):
whether or not this is the man that you want
to spend your life with, that you want to raise
your child with. Is he the man? But that's a
grown woman decision. Tell me what you're thinking, because I
hear you thinking. Um, I'm thinking I can do that.
(45:45):
I just I just get caught up in like the
guilt of everything that I've kind of that I've done
this let up until this point, and so what did
you do? Oh do? Tell? What did you do? Um? Well,
I've been like physically harmful at times, kind of respond
to something that's happened. Still not acceptable obviously, and so
(46:08):
I always kind of get caught up. He does something
to upset me, I do something totally inappropriate, and then
like we focus more on my bad behavior, and I'm
like making them pleading for us to get back to
a good space. We've taken five stiff backwards. I just yeah,
he's cheated on you. Yeah before, yes, mail, Okay, if
(46:30):
Patsy understood that she has to want herself before somebody
else can want her. If Patsy understood that and that
wasn't present in your consciousness, then you wouldn't attract a
man who would cheat. But since you want him to
prove that he wants you, that she didn't just send
(46:53):
you right down the rabbit hole of See, he doesn't
want me, he doesn't want me. But I'm telling you
there's a part of you that doesn't want you. We'll
call it, Patsy. And if he really wanted you and
he valued you, and if he appreciated you, he wouldn't
do that. He wouldn't call your names, or stay out
late or whatever went on. Now, Patsy's beating you up
(47:18):
for the things that you did when he disappointed her
or hurt her or whatever. So there's a lot of
forgiveness that needs to go on here, and that's you
forgiving yourself, You forgiving Patsy. It isn't even about him,
because you can't stay in a relationship that's abusive. You
can't stay in a relationship where you feel guilty. You
(47:41):
can't stay in a relationship where you feel ashamed. You
can't stay in a relationship where you feel unwanted or disappointed.
You can't stay in that. But you have to make
the clear decision to leave or to clean this stuff up,
and you have to clean it up. He can't clean
(48:02):
it up. I don't know what his behavior is that
he needs to clean up, because I'm talking to you.
So what do you need to forgive yourself for all
of the harmful things that I said? All the harmful
things happened. Okay, that's too broad, that's too broad. You
can't experience forgiveness like that. So take a breath, and
(48:27):
when you think back to your worst day, because we
all have bad days, do your worst day with you
with your boot. I forgive myself for I'm forging myself
for allowing um out of his name, for using things. Okay,
(48:49):
wait a minute, Wait a minute, Wait a minute. I
forgive myself for calling him out of mind his name.
Take a breath there. What about foul language. Let's let's
do that one. I forgive myself for you say that
whole stamp. I forgive myself for the fouling which I use. Yeah,
(49:12):
how about this one? I forgive myself for disrespecting him
as a man. Let me hear that one. I forgive
myself for disrespecting him as a man. And I forgive
myself for disrespecting myself as a woman. Forgive myself for
distance respecting myself as a woman. What else I forgive
(49:34):
myself for? I forgive myself for not controlling my anger.
How about I forgive myself for believing he was the
source of my anger. Let me hear that one. I
forget myself for believing that he was the source of
my anger. Yeah, what else. Forgive myself for not feeling
(50:01):
like I'm good enough, not feeling like I'm worthy. Let's
relanguage that so that we can get to the root.
I forgive myself or making him responsible for making to
make me feel worthy. Forget myself for making him responsible
to make me feel worthy. Yeah, take a breath, Take
(50:25):
a breath, Come on, breathe, but just sitting on just
a pool of regretting and hurt, and some of it
doesn't have anything to do with him. Here's one. I
forgive myself for believing that I can't be loved the
(50:48):
way I want to be. I forget myself for believing
that I can't be loved the way I want to be. Yeah,
let's just dig around there for a moment. Why can't
you be loved the way you want to be? Um? Like,
I ruined relationships as everybody that me. I push them away,
(51:12):
and I push them away because they're gonna leave me anyway. Yeah, say,
I push them away because I believe they're gonna leave
me anyway. Let me hear the whole step. Oh wait,
because I believe they're gonna leave me in any way. Yeah,
take a breath, and they're gonna leave me because they're
(51:33):
gonna leave me because something's wrong with me. So let's
let's work in there for a little bit. Okay, I
forgive myself for believing there's something wrong with me. I
forget my for believing something wrong with me. I forgive
myself for believing that I don't deserve love, myself for
(51:57):
believing that I don't deservele them. Yeah, okay, So who
left you, Mommy or daddy or both? Who left both? Okay? Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay,
so that's Patsy's heartbreak. Let me just say this, your mom, Now,
(52:17):
you've got to be as healthy as you can be
for that little one. Consciously or unconsciously. You've created for
your little one, your experience. You know, now Dad is
gone and mom is someplace else mentally and emotionally. So
(52:39):
that's what you've got to pull together and be able
to compare. If you and him never get back together,
you've got to be able to compare. And all of
that behavior, the guilty behavior, the abusive behavior, shameful behavior,
that was Patsy just acting out her heartbreak about being
(53:01):
abandoned or rejected or however that happened for her. She
just brought it into your relationship, so she needs a
little help. How old is she? How old is Patsy?
I really like twelve? I would think, Yeah, they're they're
rough them twelve and thirteen year olds. Maybe talk to
(53:24):
your therapists about doing some work with Patsy and getting
her to a voice her hurt and heartbreak and disappointment,
but also bum growing her up so that she catches
up with where you are. But she's running a muck
right now. I could tell you a million things that
(53:48):
you could do, but I think the best thing for
you to do right now is to know that where
you are is exactly where you need to be, and
when you feel better and when you are better, maybe
y'all get back together. Maybe not, but he's still your
child's father, so visiting and questions about decisions and those
(54:12):
kinds of things. You just need to stay focused right there.
Take a sabbatical. Don't even think about trying to get
back with him. Right now, you and Patsy have some
work to Patsy is a Messingham. If I were going
to give you a book to read, I would tell
you to get forgiveness. Okay, I have it forty days? Yeah,
(54:37):
have you done the work. I started it a couple
of years ago and I never finished on me, So
that would be a no. That would be a no.
But you know what, it's so amazing. So very often
we have the very thing that we need right in
the palm of our hand and we don't put it
(54:58):
to good use. That a lot, So don't beat yourself
up about it. The good news is maybe you're ready now.
Put you first right now, you and mothering and don't
withhold a baby and don't fight with him and that
kind of stuff. No, Patsy, no, no, sit down, we'll
(55:19):
sit down over there. What do you know now that
you didn't know when you call me? But my heartwired
belief push people there do the very thing I don't
want them to do. Yeah, but I'm glad that you
owned it. My hardwired belief pushes people because you hold
(55:46):
the belief and you want to be right about what
you believe, so you will engage in behavior and she
naigations to prove yourself right. We all do it. Baby.
There's nothing wrong with you. You're human and that means
that you're craziest hell, just like the rest of us.
(56:09):
I want to hear from you in about three months.
I want to know how you're doing, how your sabbatical
is going okay, And no matter what, no matter what,
when he comes over and Patsy and you were feeling
hot and bothered, don't give him none. Yes, thank you
(56:34):
for calling. Thank you, beloved, have a good dade. Bye.
The wild who she will get you into trouble every time.
The wild who ha. You gotta give her name, and
(56:54):
you gotta train her, making the shift, changing the nature,
creating a new normal. All of that goes into the
process of a relationship breakdown. And then when you put
the untrained penis in the wild, who are in the
midst real bets. So here's what I want to say.
(57:19):
If you're in break down in your relationship, if you're
breaking up a relationship, if you don't know how to
stay and you don't know how to leave, and it's
just all over the place, come above the waist and
make choices and decisions that honor you and honor the
other person. You may not know how to stay, you
(57:42):
may not know how to lead, and in either case
you must learn how to take care of yourself in
a way that honors you and honors the other person.
I hope this has been helpful to someone, and if
you have a question about this or any other relationship issue,
(58:03):
you can call me live at seven seven five three
zero seven seven seven sixty eight. Now be sure to
follow me on social media for all of the calling times,
and until then, stay in peace. Nine Piece The R
Spot is a production of Shondaland Audio in partnership with iHeartRadio.
(58:27):
For more podcasts from Shondaland Audio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Host
Iyanla Vanzant
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