November 4, 2025 • 53 mins
We love the new Battle of the Sexes! Just kidding, we hate it and its cynical, gross and insultingly crude existence. We talk all things WTA Finals—matchups, blowouts, blowups and more, as well as go in depth about the brilliant critique of the failure of tennis' establishment to offer good digital content. Sorry, but watching players create meme content is an insult to our intelligence. Plus: shoutout to a Mandarin speaking Anna Blinkova. Hen hao!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
One two one two sturdy.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Elms on everybody, Almzon, everybody, Hi, everybody, Welcome to the
Renee Stubs Tennis Podcast. You guys should see what we
go through trying to get this thing going.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
But it sounds so good.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
It does sound good, and uh we're happy to be
here with you. Of course, the WTA finals are going
on and we have lots to comment on before we
get to the WDA finals. Sorry, we want to talk about,
Oh Canada, Victoria Momboco.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
What I delighted it is to have a Canadian young
woman of upstanding baseline skills, a dazzling smile and an
incredibly uh infectious personality joining the top twenty. It was
so exciting to watch her. When Hong Kong I was thrilled.
Victoria Booko. Of course we were talking about love it.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
We need these younger players to come through, We need
them to keep winning. Obviously winning in Canada. What was
that like? Three months ago? Feels like forever.
Speaker 3 (01:08):
However, ago before.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
The US Open and then she had this issue with
her wrist. You know how I feel about it. I
didn't think she should have played the US Open. She
was not ready to play that tournament and she wasn't
one hundred percent fit, and I wish she had just
stepped away and got that better. But after a lot
of time and away from you know, she's been playing
in Asia, but clearly she's one hundred percent now and
wins the tournament in Hong Kong. So a couple of
(01:32):
tournaments this year are ready for the young Canadian.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
What a great path she had.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
Sometimes these smaller tournaments, you know, don't always attract the
top field. But Victoria and Boger went through a pretty
much a gauntlet getting to the finals, which she won
in three sets against Busca from Spain. Before that, she
played Leela Fernandez. They went three sets. That was a
very good match, and she had priorly gone through Colinskaya.
(01:58):
But the alex Yaala match for me was one of
the more exciting ones, even though that happened only in
the round of sixteen. Alex Yala is the first Filipino
player to crack the top what is it fifty, Well.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Yeah, on top fifty for the very first time a Filipino.
That's so awesome.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
It's so awesome, and the fans doing that in Asia, obviously,
she had a good run on the hard courts earlier
in North America this summer and in Miami, but seeing
her back it up in Asia and just the fans
like tennis is the best port in the world. And
one of the reasons is the best part in the
world is because all these different fan groups, backgrounds, stories
get highlighted. Alex Yala is a star. She came to
our bobb a lot event at the Seaport Racket Club
(02:34):
this summer. Yeah, and the amount of press who wanted
to talk to her, people who wanted to talk about her,
who wanted to follow her around. You know, it was
no Carlo's Outkrez, but it was close and it was
really interesting to watch. She's a star, as is Vicki
and Boco. So I'm really feeling very optimistic about the
young women who are about to inherit, you know, sort
of the main spotlight on the women's tour.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Yeah, you think about those two, and then of course
Mira andrev who, as we talked about last week, missed
out on the singles because she didn't have a visa
for Taikyo.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
I just want to point out what an ass eater
it must be, because she's in't Reo out.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Anyway, an ass eater.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Just it bites you in the aps because she's there.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Thank you for clarifay, because I.
Speaker 4 (03:09):
Was playing doubles. She qualified in doubles Ersten, so she's
there anyway, she might as well be playing singles. It's
not like she gets to go to the beach.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Word on the street is that she might be playing
singles because Maddie Keys is not one hundred percent. We
saw her not handshake Amanda Anisamova yesterday and the word
on the street is she's not well. So she walked
to the net and was just like, Nope, do not
hug me, do not touch me, do not shake my hand.
I'm going straight to the bag and I'm straight off
(03:37):
this court.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
I preventive medical.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, Amanda Anisimova was like, got your kid.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
I'm not trying to get barth time, stay away from me.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
And also Jasmine Paulini was also talked about today by
the commentary that she also is not one hundred percent either, So.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
I'm not totally surprised these guys are dead and blooded
and buried along the way kind of thing, because it's
basically season, you know, month number seven of this seemingly
in less twenty twenty five season.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
And I think what happens is when you get into
the WA finals, because you know, you are all together
all the time, so if somebody gets if someone goes
down in the locker room, you attend to a lot
of you go down. So I'm sure there's a lot
of hand washing, there's a lot of mass being worn.
If I was a player, I would be preventatively trying
to stay away from those players that are sick. And
(04:25):
clearly Maddie Keys that was that was a classy thing
for her to do because she doesn't have to care
about how Amanda and Annis I'movie does in the next
three or four days. But I think that was a
really classy thing for her to do. Be like, look,
you beat me. Not happy about it, but I don't
want to give you what I've got.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
While we're on the subject of handshakes, there was a
little bit a little bit made on the internet about
Igish Fiantek not shaking the hand of the umpire immediately.
I do want to say she went back and leader
shook the hand of the but immediately, which is typically customed.
You greet your opponent the net, you both walk together
and you at one after the other handshake turn at
(05:03):
the umpire.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
She didn't do that, and.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
Maybe it was because she was a little salty about
losing six to zero in the last set against Elena Rebacchina,
who appears to be from all I can tell on
fire at these WTO finals.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Yeah, I mean it was a little bit unusual. I'm
not gonna lie, I thought, you know, usually you go
shake the hand immediately of the umpire and then you
sort of go. But I think she was just thinking,
I'm gonna go put my a little bit upset, I'm
going to go put my racket down, and then I'm
going to loose myself. Yeah, she definitely a breath shook
the umpire's hand. Ship So calm the farm, everybody out there.
She did the right thing in the end, and we've
(05:34):
all lost, and it's never fun. You lose.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Doesn't seem very fun, especially.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Getting smoked six and the third. But before we fully
get Caitlin into the WTA finals and some of the
matches that have already been played, I do want to
talk really quickly about the men stand. Babrinka one seven,
five and the third in his first round, and he
will now play MUSSETI so we know that Mussetti joined
the I need to play one more tournament to try
and win. So he has to win this tournament to
(06:01):
make the tour finals on the A top side. And
interestingly enough, you're a guy Felix Asier Ali Siem said,
you know what, good luck. If you win the tournament,
you deserve to be in. I don't want to play
because he could have played. He could have played Mets
and he could have you know, had an issue where
he pretty much won one or one match and he
was good enough, you know what, I mean to be in.
(06:23):
But I think he's smart here because he's like, look,
if Massetti wins the tournament, good for you. If not,
I don't want to be exhausted going into the ATB
finals having to like try and just win a match,
you know, and go and play another tournament.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
And then Alane and turned to compete in the last.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
I will see he's betting on himself and he's not
betting on Mersetti.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
I think that that's actually really wise. And I was
going to make that same point. He's betting on himself
and he's not betting on MUSSETI now keen listeners of
the show will remember that a week ago I was
real team Felix.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yes, you, you were always team four, but I.
Speaker 4 (06:58):
Was optimistic that he would be in content engine and look,
we don't know. Mis said, he's got to win this tournament,
and then Felix gets to begin his preseason.
Speaker 3 (07:06):
Earlier that said, I.
Speaker 4 (07:08):
Think Felix, the way he has comported himself making the
semis of the US Open, I think was a major
breakthrough moment, not only because obviously it was the furthest
he'd gone in quite a long time in a major,
but also he's playing with like, uh positive composure in
a way that I think a lot of times I
was used to seeing a little bit of like timid
anxiety from him, and I like this new Felix was like, yeah,
(07:30):
you want to get into the finals, go ahead and play, play,
play and win, And it was some chilling like a
villain out here, Like I love that from him.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Yeah, I mean, listen, you and I have spoken about
this so much in the last few years about Felix.
I've always said I just if I was coaching him,
I would shake him, like literally like shake him and
be like relax, just relaxx just the chill.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
Doesn't that sound relaxing? The na stubs his relaxation.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
You know when you just like, you know, when singers
got whatever they would their lips and them we can't
do it right now, but you know, you know my point.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
This is a really compelling case for Yeah, I just
I just want a stub spa.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
I just want him to relax. I just want him
to have almost would say to him one match, I'd
be like, listen, here's the deal. Doesn't matter if you win.
I want to see literally how much fun you can have.
I want you to be a little bit like a
Roger Federer type who he's sort of modeled a lot
of his game on. And you know he's born the
same day as Roger, just about twelve years later. Yeah,
they have the same birthday, and just like, just relax,
(08:29):
just almost tank. I just want to see you tanker match,
semi tanker match, and just not give a.
Speaker 4 (08:34):
Fuck I want him to do. I want him to
have like ten percent quarantine mute.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Ten percent that's stampt back some most just.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
A little dog and that little dog is named quarantine.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Mate who lost today?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
I know, I think a really good hit, a good
fall run.
Speaker 4 (08:50):
He made the finals out in one of those step countries,
which I was really in al Madi, I was really
pleased to see. Yeah, I mean quarantine mate. Yeah, you
don't want more than ten percent of him at a
gain of a time, but Felix could certainly use it
and just shake those shoulders up a little bit.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
All right.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
Any other men you want to talk about before we
get to the results from Riad, No.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Not really, but I do want to say this could
be sound baron Rica's last match.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Tim for Rinka's really given us a lot. He's given
us two of the most beautifully horrific outfits Evernis Court.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
With the greatest, most beautiful one handed back and we've
ever seen. The back came down.
Speaker 3 (09:25):
The line he Justine Hannah, but yes a male, no, no, no, no,
just you know it is such very beautiful in stam
for rinkas now for.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
You will not win this battle.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
You know whose last biting is John McEnroe.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Well, listen, you're going to find John McEnroe. I'm telling
you there is no way. Justin Anna her one handed
back and was phenomenal. It was so good, it was
so powerful. But she looked like she was having a
conniption fit every time she hit it. You watch her head, Caitline,
when she hits her back end, it looks like she's
literally like having a mild exorcist moment when she's hitting
(10:03):
her back in. Her head snapped.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
That is getting exercised or she wasn't.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I would say Francesca Scavone, I would say, I would
say Spaniards.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
It was very good.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Concia Martinez and cheat Nou Suarez, Rambo Suarez Navarro.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Suarez. Navarro's backhand was a thing of beauty, okay, whereas
Justin Annan's was powerful and explosive and incredible, but it
was not a.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Beautiful well agreed to disagree.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Stan Vavrinka's gorgeous smooth as butter.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
I don't even think stim Verrinka has the most beautiful
one headed back in on the men's tour people, even
in his era.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Richard Gascay, Hello fans out there, I want you.
Speaker 4 (10:44):
I would like you to say, I will quibble to
me about all the socials and about tennis history, but
I will not allow a quibbling of stylistic analysis.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Here we go, everyone out there, you can all write
to us on the socials and give us your top
ten one handed backhand.
Speaker 3 (10:59):
Tell us where Rene is wrong and Justine and.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Nuns is definitely not the most beautiful one.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
Okay, well be prepared for a lot of Justine Henna fans,
these Belgians once they get their teeth.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Any man, it was not a pretty shot. It was effective, incredible,
but no one near is anyway.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Standy Rinka is going to be missed because he wore
between the hot Raspberry and truly the worst plaid slash
the best plaid shorts ever.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
He won two French opens.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
I know, in those.
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Terrible clothes that were terribly beautiful, and I even carry
around a tiny token of the plaid shorts on my
tennis bag as a commemoration. The team at Yonix gave
them to me because they knew that I was a
massive fan of them.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
So talk about that waffling. I will say you dick
when I give her a shit. I love when she
looks at me like fuck you. The funny thing is,
guys out there, is that you know my rants on
Novak and you hate when I do this. But everyone's
upset that I haven't been asking for stan Vabrinka to
retire for the last two years. It's because he's not
(11:52):
winning more than one match, and frankly.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
He's not trying to win.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
He's not trying to win Grand Slams anymore. The guy's
like a hundred something actually, uh, while we're just trying
to win matches.
Speaker 4 (12:03):
Novak Djokovic, you know, could solve this Lorenzo Mussetti Felix
uge Alesian battle because he could not play. I don't
think Djokovic doesn't play the ATV finals, which I'm not
saying he should or shouldn't, but if he doesn't play,
then Musseti and Felix get in.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Guess what, Caitlin, there's no chance that Novak's not playing.
If he's playing this week. He's not playing this week
in a two fifty. It's a two fifty, right, He's
not playing a two fifty.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
In itf challenger in my back, he's not playing a.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Two fifty for the fun of it. He's playing it
to get matches for the w for the ATP final.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
I'm just saying he could happen. Anything could happen.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Has he played since the years Open so he doesn't
well maybe I don't know.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Played in grees anyway, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
God, we're such great followers of tennis when we don't
even know if if we hadn't produced that.
Speaker 4 (12:52):
Right now, talk about one thing and one thing only,
which is the amusing sub stack. I want to shout
out to about tennis media credentials, problem of tennis content
being under optimized. But I am happy to talk about
the Debuta finals because these are players that carry deeply
about ok So, shall we proceed.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
We shall proceed. Let's uh, do you want to go
on your round about the w T A TP media
stuff or do you want to stick with the women's.
Speaker 4 (13:13):
Let's finish the tennis and then we can, okay, of
the one thing I'm an expert in, which is a media.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Which is see it's going to say complaining about the media. Okay,
So here we go, ladies and gentlemen and tennis fans
and everyone in between. We're going to talk about the
WTF finals. So thus far, thus far. Arena Sabalanca just
got the win over Jessica Baulgoula in three sets. That
was really a determination of who is probably going to
win the Uh.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
That's certainly the Stefanie Graff group.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
The Stephanie Graff group or are they in the Serena
Williams craw.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
She's in the Stepigraph group. Okay, so Stephanie.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Graff, Stephanie Graff, listen, here's the deal. Sabal Anca decided
to give her player's box a bit of a spray
today at one all in the third tow to one
in the third down loss serve to go down to one,
gave it bit of a spray to the player's box
and the player's box said see you later. So Anton
Debrof was like, Okay, you're going to talk to me
(14:08):
like that, out of here, And sometimes when a player
does that. I have never had a coach to leave
the players box, but I would imagine what it would
feel like if I've had players yelling at me As
a coach. I've also yelled at my coaches, and it's
kind of that moment where when you say shit that
you probably go later on, which she did in her
(14:29):
postmatch interview, was like I probably went a little bit
too far. When you know you've gone a little too far,
it sort of like makes you go, oh, oh shit.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
I better just better win now.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
I better knuckle down here and try and win this
match and stop being a little whiny bit c h
because she was bitch in like upper storm, and I
think it gets to you. The point was like, okay,
well I've got no one to bitch out anymore because
my coach has literally left the building. She said he
pissed her off. I don't know what he said or
did that pissed her off, but she was obviously upset.
(15:01):
And then when he left, she was probably like, oh shit,
maybe I went too far. And it certainly refocused her
because down to one, she had Lo's a game after
that and just sort of fell apart. The two to
one game where Jessica was serving was so important and
on a couple of really big points, just did not
get the first serve in, and Sabolenca hit a couple
of huge returns to rebreak and then just ran away
(15:23):
with the match after that. And that's just that's little
tiny things make a difference in these matches.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
It's kind of it.
Speaker 4 (15:28):
It was interesting watching that match, you know, Sabolenka looked
a little sleepy, a little out of sorts, and then
all she needs to do is a couple haymakers and
good night.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Totally, It's kind of it.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
That's exactly what it is. Yeah, fourhand haymaker, boom winner,
boom winner, game over too all, All right, I'm back
in this. My coaches left the building. I need to
get my shit together, I need to behave got no
one yell at And all of a sudden, she wins
four games, five games in a row.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
If only we all had the arena Sablanca arsenal at
her disposal.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
What else some well, earlier on and the day Coco
GoF comfortable win over Jasmine, Paulini, it's interesting that Coco
has gotten the win over Jasmine now the last couple
of times, considering Jasmine had it over cocoed this year.
I think we'll had won three matches against coc this year.
Now Coco's gone. The last two matches have gone in
her favor. Judging by Paulini, she is also not at
(16:20):
one hundred percent, so she's in the Maddie Keys area
of the locker room for sure. So Jasmine not one
hundred percent, And you cannot not be one hundred percent
against Coco because every freaking ball comes back. And I
love that she's using the hide on the forehand, which
is a nightmare for Jasmine because Jasmine's little little things,
(16:41):
and if you get she is weak. If you get
the ball way above her head, she's it's hard for
her to do anything. And she's particularly on the backhand side.
On the forehand, you can still hit a ball above
your shoulders a little bit easier. On the backhand, it's
a lot more difficult to do anything of aggression. And
Coco was just too good. She just outsmarted served a
lot today, a lot less double faults, barely hit any
(17:02):
double faults today, So that is a big improvement for her.
And now it's going to come down to it. It's
going to be a big match tomorrow with Cocoa and Sabolenka.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
Yeah, and I think for me, it's hard to imagine
anybody except Sabolenka kind of lifting the trophy at the
end of this. But if we look at the other
group form it has had this surge. She has not
looked like the Rabacchino we saw for the majority of
this year, but one we got used to seeing year
before last and the year before that. Even just absolute
(17:35):
ice cold, no seeming moments of anxiety or doubt when
she's dealing, and she can do pretty much anything at
any time she's she's unflappable, and so I would love
very much and actually think it would be a very
fun and explosive final to see the two of those
guys together if they were to end up meeting after
the semis in their group finishes.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
But yeah, I think.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
There's there's the thing I like the most is there's
just many good tennis matches at the final. I really
like that they play round robin because you really want
to do see all the different matchups and then you
can't really complain about a bad draw, if you know,
if you get to see everybody, at least the ones
in your group. But Rebeckena for me, is the other
one who's looking absolutely dominant and she has been. She's
up to and Oero in her group as well.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Yeah, I think look going back to the first match
of Rabekina played against Amanda Annasamoa, I would say that
Amanda and I put this out on the socials the
other day. It's hard to explain to people when you
play in your first WTA finals how different the feeling
is walking on the court. It's kind of just feels
a little bit different. You just feel like, ah, this
(18:40):
just feels like a different tournament. It's kind of like
playing the Olympics for the first time or playing for
your country for the first time in Billy Jean King Cup.
It's just a there's a different feeling, and I think
that she looked a lot. She looked lost in the
first match against Rabakiina. She'd never played Rabaccina, which is crazy.
Speaker 4 (18:55):
Yeah, I'm crazy. To play your first match against somebody
at the two Pine, yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
And I mean somebody who hits the ball is hard
as you, so having to adjust to that. And also
her first match, I think she just looked like a
deer in headlights, as Rebuccian has played in the last
whole bunch over the last few years. And then against
Mattie Keys again the same She looked very anxious. She
was not playing well. Maddie was playing pretty well, up
a set and three one, then all of a sudden,
Amanda just sort of found her way. It was a
(19:19):
little bit like how she played against Osakan the Semis
of the US Open, where she was down a set
in six five and all a sudden something just clicked.
She played so much better after that. But I just
feel like once she got back in that match, and
she sort of found her normality, if that makes sense
to me. She's like, oh, this is a tennis match.
That's a tennis court. I'm playing against somebody had never
played to get it against, which is crazy. She never
(19:40):
played Madison Keys either, and sort of like finally sort
of found her rhythm a little bit, and you could
tell that her shoulders just relaxed and she calmed down,
and once it got to three sets, you just had
a feeling it was going to be over. And then
we didn't really know about Madison Keys not being one
hundred percent, but certainly that didn't help her, but Amanda
and usim over winning that match in three is a
huge thing for her going into the next match because
(20:02):
she now has an opportunity to get through to the
Semis if she wins her next match in straight sets.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
And I give her a good chance.
Speaker 4 (20:07):
I mean, I think the thing that I like watching
about an Asimova too much is you can look you
can learn her. You can see her learning curve right
exactly what we were just talking about, where she kind
of gets her sea legs a little bit and then
she settles in. I mean, even just watching the two
matches she played against Serena Sbalanka under the lights this year.
You know, the first match petrified, the second match took
it to her and almost got away with a set,
(20:28):
and you know that third set in a final, who
knows anything happens, right, So for me, watching Anisimova dial
in in real time is really exciting. It's also like
pretty much the only thing that's relatable about her because
she hits the living shit out of the ball and
she's such a tremendous, tremendous player. But for me, it's
the fact that you can kind of see her the
wheels turning in her head a little bit that makes
it really dramatic and exciting because you're like, oh, is
(20:49):
she gonna settle? And if she does, then what kind
of trouble is she gonna throw across the net at
her opponent?
Speaker 2 (20:56):
And she it's so important for Anasimova to like stay calm,
to just not not be demonstrative, because when she's demonstrative
on the court, she's sort of like a little bit
not a little bit petulant. She sort of looks a
little petulant rather than just like refocusing sort of and
I know she's learning. That's it's so hard for her
not to be like that. Some players just they just emote,
(21:16):
and she's that a negative emotor when things are going badly,
but when she sort of settles in good luck. What's
interesting now is that she goes up against eager.
Speaker 5 (21:26):
She on tech is the total question mark to me,
how good is this though that's going to be a match,
How good is this? Like Amandamova in that match, I
have to say. And that's not just because you go
last hear my first, her last match, most recent match
against Rebeccaa. I think for me, the.
Speaker 4 (21:42):
Ego that shows up at these finals is one of
two flavors, and I think we have the flavor of
ego that's not here to win. And that's not to
criticize her prep. It's not right, mind. I just think
she's not she she has She plays well with the
error of invincibility behind her.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
Well.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
She played griding and looked mad Keys was you know,
coming in here not playing? Since the US Open has
this random abbreviation to her serve motion, now, I don't
know what's going on there. She changed the serf at
this strain open and going into this train open, which
was fantastic, bringing the leg up. I love it. It helps
her hip, it helps her her her adductors and where
(22:19):
she has a lot of tend to have a lot
of injuries. And now you just think, what's going on
with this abbreviation with the serve like just taking a
racket head up quickly? Is that because she has a
shoulder issue? Is that something that she's mentally trying to
get I don't know, but I don't you know, there's
been so much iterations to this serve now and changes,
so you just wonder what's going on. Is it mental
(22:41):
or is it now physical? What's going on? Not having
played since the US Open, you just knew that there
was very little chance she was going to beat Eager
in the first round because Eager is like a nightmata
play in the first round because she's like one hundred
miles an hour, like from the get go, and if
you're not feeling good, it's going to be real quick.
And it was fairly comfortable two set match, and then
you know she obviously ran out of steam against Amanda
(23:02):
and a Simova in the third set and wasn't feeling
well because we know that from the handshake or lack thereof.
But now Eager. You know, she won a pretty comfortable
first set, looking really good against Rebeccin, and then Rebekkin
had just turned everything around. She started not missing. She
made so many errors in the first set of rebecu
in it she looked horrible and Eager was serving really well.
And then Eager served went a little bit off, and
then Rebeckan it just stopped missing, just purely, and when
(23:25):
she just hitting winners all over the place. And I
think the biggest issue for Eager when that starts happening,
when she starts getting hit off the court by the
likes of sabal Ankas and Rebeckin, is the ones that
hit the ball real big and amandable. He's got to
use a little bit more variety, like just even a
just a shitty slice or a or a shitty forehands,
(23:46):
a little junker, just a little junk every now and again.
Talking about once a point, I'm talking about once every
two games or something. Throw these players like a rebek
In and like Amanda Nsimova, like a sable Anka. You
have to throw them different spades of ball.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
For sure, and to break it up.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
And you're at the court and Ega has that, and
she's got one of the more sort of thoughtful and
varied toolkits, however, and the reason I don't like her
odds against Anisimova is for two reasons. Number One, Anisimova
has the kind of game that she doesn't like, as
we've established the big hitter paceball that she can just
get out of the point even before she's you know,
can really establish herself. And the second reason is I
(24:25):
think Ega plays she's one of the best front runners.
But I think when she gets anxious, and I think
because she's lost a match, not necessarily because she played
badly or she's not prepared or anything other than just yes,
she got out hit, especially that third set, and she
just couldn't, you know, she couldn't deal with her Rabakkina,
who wasn't donating errors to her. To me, this idea
(24:46):
that she's not fallible helps her. And when she's playing
it the French clay, Yes, of course it's the surface
and it's so of course the speed, but it's also
just the aura. She's a big aura player to me,
and that means that I think Nisimova, hopefully we'll go
in confident and I think for eager to win that
she's really got to figure out how to get a
(25:07):
little bit of that mojo back, because she plays well
when she's confident. But I don't think she has the
tools to solve Anisimova, at least if Anisimova is making
it tough fun her. So anyway, that's my very very
mild prediction is that Anisimova is going to come through
and get to the semis.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I think if Eager wants to win that match, she
has to vary her serve speeds. You cannot hit the
same serve speed sometimes, like I think yesterday Matti Keys
was winning more second serves that were hit than first serves. Well,
and that's because it's getting out of the hitting zone
area of Amanda and Asimova. If you give it to
her shoulder high ish, she's going to crush it every
(25:42):
time if you get it a little bit varied and
she's not quite short because she is such a rhythm
groundstroker right the way she hits her groundstrokes, it's so rhythmic,
so beautiful. You know, some players are a little different.
She is a very rhythmic type of player. So when
it's on, good luck, it's on. But eger is I
feel with eger when she gets pushed really hard with
(26:03):
a big deep ball, she tries to hit it back
as hard and with her grip, it's very difficult to
do that, particularly on the forehand side. So I would
like to see her implement in the off season some
kind of slice forehand, some kind of variation, whether it
be just to jung it back.
Speaker 3 (26:21):
Just to get it in the court, just something else.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Just the longer the point goes. Most of the time,
she's going to win it, right, because she's physically so
much more gift, but not just so gifted, so strong
and so fit. It's like, but if you're not in
the point, you're not going to win. And Coco Gough
is a perfect example of that. Clearly. Coco's forehand is,
you know, her weaker side, but rather than miss.
Speaker 4 (26:44):
She will get it in the court and she throws
up the high loopy, a loopy which is really really effective.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Yeah, And you know, when you throw up the high loopy,
you've got to be willing to play a longer point, right,
And so obviously Coco is one of the most unbelievable
athletes I've ever seen play. So she will run down
the next ball if you smack it. So Eca can
do that too. So it's like, just stay in the point,
throwing a bit of junk every now and again, throwing
a high ball, throw in a sliced forehand, throwing a
(27:12):
chip forehand, get it as long as you get it
below the net. You are making things real uncomfortable for
players like Amanda and a slover barking at Sabalanca, who
are tall, big strikers.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
A bend don't want it to do.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
You necessarily come into the net. So when you throw
a junk ball in there and say okay, come in
and then you pass them, you can sometimes win so
many points by just getting the ball into it a
difficult part of the court that most women don't like,
which is service line area below the net. So I
would imply that, well, it's not about me. I mean,
(27:52):
I'm just like, I'm just giving my free wisdom out
to everybody.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
There you go, wisdom for free shaking massages and free wisdom.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
So it's got to come down really to Amanda, Anisimova
and Eager Shound text match in that group. And of
course now Pagoula is going to have to play against Paulini,
which we imagine she's going to win because Paolini's own
two and Sablenca golf, so Sabalanca is going to have
to It'll be interesting to see how that goes.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
That much.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Onder your hats, Hold on to your hats because we
know it's always an entertaining, fun match when those two play. Yeah, okay,
so one thing we wanted. Do we have any predictions
where you've said that, do you think Sabalanc is going
to win the tournament?
Speaker 4 (28:34):
I have a hard time. I think it's I think
it's going to be sabole Anco Rebeccina.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
I think it might be that too, but it also
depends on who finishes first and second and who plays who.
Speaker 4 (28:44):
Yeah, they may plan even if they play, they might
not play in the finance the semis.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
That's right anyway. So it's all it's a lot of
fun what's happening over in riannd. It's hard for me
to watch it, though, Caitline I will say the crowds
have been pretty they're certainly a little better than they
were last year. But it does bother me in so
many ways when I see the crowds that are not
that big and it's we're not it's not going to
(29:09):
happen where. I mean, you look at Paris indoors, the
men playing that Paris Indoors and it was just the
most amazing stadium. Absolutely chock is full, as we say
in Australia, and to see our best players in the
world battling it out with not a big crowd, it
really bothers me because I know that they're there that.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
I think, Yeah, I mean the WTA has struggled with
this full stop for a decade.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Yeah, because we keep putting in places that are offering
a lot of money.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
I just want to push back, and we've argued about
this before. I truly don't think the main thing is
where it is. I really don't think that's true unless
you want to talk about Guadalajara or someplace where, like
they are starved for more tennis than they need it.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
So how do we get bigger crowds here?
Speaker 4 (29:52):
I think the WTA, and I think it sort of
ties into the thing that I want to talk about,
which is I think the WTA has to productize tennis
in a much much more, much more sophisticated way than
they do. And I think knowing the check sizes that
Saudi in particular is going to write the sport of tennis.
There's going to be more tournaments, more exos, more events.
There we already saw this year obviously the six King
(30:13):
Slam repeat. It's its presence there, as did the WTA finals.
The next gen is there, and now they're getting an
ATP one thousand tournament.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
They're getting a one an AIGHTTP one thousand tournament with
no that no one has to play right, So every
other masta's and WTA one thousand has mandatory that everyone
plays right. It's on the mandatory list, meaning that if
you don't play it, you get a one point and
that counts to your ranking for your twelve month rotation
of points. They don't have any guarantee like this now.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
I mean they have three years before the first ball
is going to be start, but they I would be
surprised if they changed the rules profoundly between now and then.
I wouldn't be surprised if the entirety of tennis has
a new leader by then and it's a joint effort,
or they you know, completely scrap the sort of failing tours.
Like I think, there's so many different things that could happen,
So I don't want to get hung up on the
particularities of this deal, not to say that it's not
(31:01):
stupid or we don't like it, but rather like.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
But how, in my opinion, how does the ATP allow
the Saudis to have a ATP one thousand without mandatory
mandatorily making every play a play? I don't mean every
player will play because again.
Speaker 4 (31:17):
You're asking, you're acting like they otherwise are totally logical.
How does how does anybody in tenors uperate logically? Oh
they don't remember when we talked about like how the
the slams could never be moved, no one could do anything,
and it's like, oh, there's a COVID, we're going to
cancel one, but the French is going to be in October.
It's like nothing matters, there's no rules, And for me,
that's not necessarily a good or bad thing. I think
you could probably make the argument that it's not great,
(31:39):
but the truth of it is, like, I think the
only thing that's useful to talk about is how can
you align to make it create a better sport?
Speaker 3 (31:52):
You know?
Speaker 4 (31:52):
And the thing that we're not going to do probably
on this and this show is solved for the fact
that the Saudis, who you know, regardless what you're feeling
about it is, aren't going to not be at the
table for buying up assets. So how do you make
those assets really valuable? And how do you make sure
that they get the shine that they need or maybe
that you know, distribute some of the play, the prize
(32:16):
and sort of the fan chip across entities because I
can tell you what they don't need to be doing,
which is like dumb meme content where we quiz our
athletes about their favorite emojis.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
And yeah, so let's get into that a little bit.
You wanted to talk about the atp WTA and the
Grand Slams and the majors yea, all the government and
all the tournaments. How they don't allow influencers quote unquote
or tennis you know, riders or fans put up their
own stuff on the internet and because it's protected by
(32:50):
the networks that buy it. Let's say ESPN it you
were so Open or the Friends Federation at the friend
I mean, I remember I posted something I don't know
somebody maybe it was Nadal winning his one hundred French
Open title or whatever, and I put it on my Twitter.
It was a video of him winning, and then within
an hour I was like, you got to take this down.
I was like, what what do you mean? I got
to take it down. I couldn't believe it. And it's
happening all the time, where you know, they want to
(33:12):
protect their own piece of the pie. But it's like,
but you're not helping grow, especially when you have people
that have not me. I don't have millions of followers,
but like, there are players that have almost a million followers,
or their girlfriends have seven hundred followers, seven hundred thousand
followers or whatever. They can't win anything out because it's
like protected quote unquote, and I'm like, I thought the
(33:33):
whole idea was to promote the sport. The more fans
you can bring in, the more money you're gonna make.
Isn't that right.
Speaker 4 (33:40):
It's sort of baffling. And I think there are two
pieces that I want to urge people to read. One
of them is late this summer, Jessica Testa, who's a
New York Times reporter who covers media, wrote a really
interesting piece and we talked about a little bit about
how like the USTA brought served the podcast into the
US Open, they couldn't agree on which ads and advertisements
(34:03):
were going to work with it because the WTA or
the USTA and the podcast had conflicting advertisements, and nobody
could agree on it, and it was a mess, and
nobody anticipated it because the folks at the USTA who
run all this stuff aren't necessarily up, I would argue
on the latest and greatest of what is happening in
the world of media, now, there's this really phenomenal substack
that I urge all of you to subscribe to. It's
(34:23):
called hardcoret and Jessica Schiffler, who's a former Vogue and
New York Times and Business of Fashion correspondent, has been
doing wonderful, wonderful reporting on sort of the culture aspect
of tennis. It's not terribly dissimilar from something you'd read
and racket. It's just a little bit more substacky in
the sense that it's kind of like a fired off blog.
But the reporting in the thought there is really excellent.
Along with a woman named Melissa Kenny who writes hard
hitting and who fun fact, is also our advice columnist.
(34:45):
So anyway, plug for smart women writing on.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Substack and including Andrea Pekovic of course, who's brilliant. Brilliant
on substack.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
I would say what makes Jessica's piece today about the
media really interesting is we're able to see it in
real time. So not only is it the wags or
the content creators as athletes themselves who aren't allowed to post,
or somebody like Renee Stubbs who is there who's just
trying to share and bring behind the scenes, it is
also the fact that media credentials have been disappearing. The
(35:17):
tours themselves want to moderate all access to all of
the athletes, not to mention behind the scenes, but then
what they do, instead of taking something away and then
giving it in a bigger and better way, they give
us hot garbage.
Speaker 3 (35:31):
So they'll while hire TikTok creators.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
They'll hire folks who maybe have a lot of audience
but don't necessarily know anything about tennis to kind of
create a lot of it is through the creative agency
network and overtime, and it's a lot of it's a
lot of like your favorite athletes being interviewed about what
their favorite courses.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Yeah, and I just made that up, but it's dumb
and it insults our intelligence.
Speaker 4 (35:57):
And I would say that as much as you want
to make a play for gen Z, what you're leaving
the door open to is a whole lot of armchair
media content that you have no creation or say in,
which is honestly like what to me has flourished you
around the part of tennis in spite of tennis itself. Obviously,
that's what we've been trying to do a racket for
a really long time. This podcast is about that, as
are a number of really great substacks as we're talking
(36:19):
about and other people's blog. So this is all a
way of saying, the tennis machine has noticed that it's
not doing a very good job of telling its own story,
and now they're hiring well intentioned but strategically insulting content
creators at the expense of having more journalists, media and
people who are great and primed to tell the story.
(36:40):
A lot of times they're athletes and those people in
their countery and they don't know. Should Morgan Riddle get
a media credential, Well, no, she's not media. Should she
get a player credential, Well she better be in a
player's box. However, is she allowed to create content? Well
not unless she has a media credential. And it's just
sort of like, okay, well, yeah, either way, you're missing
out on having somebody bring in fans and do it
in a really sophisticated way.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
And how many followers does she have on Instagram?
Speaker 3 (37:02):
Or a couple hundred k? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (37:05):
I mean so again, did these tournaments themselves have in
some cases ten to twenty thirty thousand?
Speaker 2 (37:10):
And then I read in that artist called it down.
If you have over a million, you're allowed to do it,
but if you have under a million, that's like what
so Taylor Fritz has like seven hundred and fifty thousand
or whatever on Instagram but not enough.
Speaker 3 (37:22):
What I would sort of illustrate the point again is.
Speaker 2 (37:25):
That it's only like seven tennis players I think that
have over.
Speaker 4 (37:28):
And also the seven or ten, by the way, they're
going to retire and leave, and they're not going to
tell the same stories about the tennis world that they
do now, and so you're going to have to regrow
this same garden over and over and over again.
Speaker 2 (37:42):
Yeah, you don't see. Look at a perfect example, our
friend Sophie Goldschmid, who we mentioned quite often on this pod.
It runs usk and snowpo but Mikaela Schiffren is doing
her own pod, is doing her own vlog, is doing
all sorts of things, doing some amazing things behind the scenes,
like who doesn't want to see that from the greatest
skier of all time? And no one's shutting it down
or not, you can't show that. They're like, yeah, we
(38:04):
need to grow the sport. So my whole thing isn't
on this. I would like to see the A T
P WTA majors or all of them, every single one
of them, for one year, just say, you know what,
fuck it. Everyone can post whatever they want, right.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Just free for all three Let's see, let's do one year.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
Okay, so I'm throwing this out to all the tennis establishment.
Let's do one year where anyone can post anything about
any tennis tournament whatever they want, as long as it's positive. Clearly,
we don't want to have you know, No, no, no, I
actually don't.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
I don't necessarily disagree with that. I think I think
any other sport would have embraced.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
The I'm saying is I don't want someone out there
you can sit on death wembledons, right, That's what I'm saying.
What I'm saying, No, no, disgusting stuff.
Speaker 4 (38:49):
I want us have the dialogue around the sport really
improve and increase.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
Yeah, let's just see, let's see what Let's see what happens,
because I guarantee you there'll be some ship that will
go viral and then all of a sudden, I'll give
you an example Wimbledon, and please invite me back to
play the legends because I but I just want to
say this, because they weren't happy. Number of years ago
we had someone from the crowd come on to the
court and play a point. It was a very famous
(39:15):
point with Kim Cleister's and we ended up serving to
a gentleman and we put a white skirt on him
because he was in color and it was funny, and
we put a long sleeve on him and he was
all in white and it's done out. It was so funny.
And he played one point and we put him back
in the crowd, and the club weren't super happy because
they don't want the public on the courts. Totally understandable,
like you can't just have people come and round on
(39:36):
the court. Da da dada. It has I'd say at
this point now in time, probably ten million views it
is I think one of the most viewed videos from
Wimbledon's history, and now they plug it. They plug it
now because they realized, holy shit, it got so many
people looking at it, and so many people probably thought, Oh,
maybe that'll happen to me one day, someone will put
(39:56):
me down in the crowd and I'll get on the
court at Wimbledon. I don't know. But now I promote
that video. But at the time they weren't happy about it.
So that's what I'm saying, like the establishment, like, open
up a little bit, be a little bit of fun,
let the let stuff be seen, and then let's see
how it goes. Now if it's a disaster, we shot
it down again because it's real easy.
Speaker 3 (40:14):
Yeah, but I shot it.
Speaker 4 (40:15):
I would love for people who are smart to be
in charge of this, and people who understood media and
people who understood how to market. And this is why
I started talking about this because at the end of
the day, yes, you could point out the fact that
it's in Saudi Arabia, you can point about that we
have a major time difference. You could point out the
fact that maybe this is in a culture that embraces tennis.
And this is even before you get into the some
of the political situation there, which, by the way, yeah,
there's a couple pretty severe hotspots that are difficult for
(40:38):
the tour for a global sport to reckon with. I
will say, for me, if this were a short or
more optimized season, if the WTA did a great job
of selling the event itself, the tourism destination possibilities that
this has, yeah, and a lot more of the goings
on around it. I liked the photoshoot they did before it.
(40:59):
They used regional talent, they created some narratives around the dresses.
It was certainly better than last year when Jasmine and
Paulini didn't even get a chair to sit on. Are
tough fits. They had to pull in a like a
random thing at the last minute. But you know, I'm
not trying to criticize.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
It's just more bring over that stool.
Speaker 4 (41:13):
You're like, uh, we couldn't get it to match, but
she has to sit So again, I see that they're
making some effort. It's just not enough and it's not
fast enough, and it's not optimized enough. And the voices
that are on the outside trying to get in a
lot of cases applying for these media credentials trying to
help you guys, and then the agencies and the creators
are all going to men also instead of a lot
(41:34):
of really good storytellers. Is again not a new thing,
but it's again a massive opportunity for I was at
an investor.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
I just want to come men.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
It's always the men somehow benefits and these content creators
are They're like, oh, well they're women's so we won't anyway.
That's it's hard not to see this all is extremely gendered.
I was at an investment event last night. A friend
is starting Chrystalis Collective, which is about funding women in
sports startup tech, and I met with a couple of
(42:06):
women Sapna shout out to shop Sapnam Melissa, both investors
who put their money where their mouth is with investments.
And they were telling us that they listened to the
podcast and they like, we disagree, and I said, well,
it's real.
Speaker 2 (42:17):
We did just disagree. You should see the facial expressions.
We're going to start filming this and putting on YouTube.
How does everyone feel about that? Let us know about
that on the socials as well, because then you get
to see Caitlin's facial expressions or mine when we do disagree,
and it is often.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
It's often, but that's I mean, listen to this part
of me.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
I'm an air, she's a cancer.
Speaker 4 (42:35):
It's just no chance that we're not going to disagree
on things inevitable. I just want to say to wrap
this up, you know there we got one more thing
to talk. All these women on the outside and all
these people and all these creators who are brilliant, like
Anastasia for so we did a podcast with Live before
the French shopmen, and I would just love for them
to be have there have there be their work work
(42:55):
embraced by the men mainstream of the sport. And until
they let people in the door, will keep knocking it
down because we're not going away.
Speaker 2 (43:02):
There is nothing better than having behind the scenes look
at stuff from the players and from the people that
are there on that you know all the time. Anyway,
So yes shouted out to all of the parties, all
of them a T P W T A major's a
T P I I I T F strain open. Let's
(43:22):
say strain open should do it first. Because Craig tile
is usually so strong.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Open is usually the the Craig head.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
Of you're listening Craig Craig.
Speaker 3 (43:29):
Well, Craig's not the problem. Craig's like innovating out the ad.
Craig problem should be.
Speaker 2 (43:34):
What I'm saying is he is the usually the start
of everything. Okay, when it comes to the led screens,
Strain Open gets it, USDA gets it. We built the built,
we built the roof before people even thought that there
was rain, and we did it really for heat. But
but yeah, anyway, so listen, we're going to throw it
out there, Strain open. Let creators put out anything they want,
(43:55):
Let the fans put out anything they want. Let's give
it a go. See how how many more tickets you sell.
Last thing we want to talk about before we end this,
because I know Caitlin, you've got to go because you
apparently are busy all the time where you're going to
play paddle? By the way, do we talk about my paddle?
We did a couple weeks ago.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
How much I love it?
Speaker 4 (44:12):
You traded a pegman most of the time I did,
and it worked. Didn't that work? Incorrect?
Speaker 2 (44:16):
I did make a comment today on socials. You know
how much I love that. I'm the about Arena Sablanca
playing Nick kiro and someone said, I'm sure.
Speaker 3 (44:28):
I'm not sure I could sigh any louder than that.
I want to a loud to sigh I have.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
I want to read the actual quote, and it says
from James Hansen, the Battle of the Sexes has a
significant place in tennis history. In Arena Sabalanca Nick Currious's version,
it's unclear what is at stake beyond the comment modification.
Thank you, no comment, I can't read modatization. Yeah, yep, okay,
(44:56):
thanks yep.
Speaker 3 (44:58):
Here we got it, keep it going.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
We got it of the name and an invitation to
criticize women's tennis after either result. Thank you James for
writing that. And he posts The New York Times dot
com has the entire little at the Atlantic written by
(45:19):
I like to give them credit the athletic tennis stuff.
It just says the athletic tenni stuff.
Speaker 3 (45:23):
Yeah. I thought that piece was good and fair.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
Yeah, And I wrote, oh boy, because I had to
make a comment on it, shouldn't And I said, yeah,
the one fifty years ago, not this. Yes, you know,
they're saying it's a significant place in tennis history, and
he's kind of making fun of that, and I said, yeah,
the one fifty years ago was important when it was
(45:48):
women trying to fight for equality and women's rights in
the United States. That's when it was important. When we
had fifty thousand or eighty thousand plus people in the
Metrodiamond Houston watching it, the whole country watching it. No
one gives a fuck about what's happening with Arena Sabalanca
and Nick Curios. I mean, the only reason they're putting
this on is because it is literally their company Evolve,
(46:10):
Who's a sponsor, Who's who's their management company? Is going
We're gonna make a bit of money here. Does it
would be good? Get it on TV, sell a few tickets?
But what is in this for women's tennis? And Nick
curios at? I mean, unless he's hurt, like really hurt
and can't run at all, he is going to win
(46:30):
this match so easily. It's just a fact male tennis players,
especially someone as good as Nick Curios, if he's playing
at fifty percent, he's going to win that match. And
it just it just doesn't make sense to me. Is
it going to be a like? Is is Sabalanca going
to be serious? Is it going to be like a joke?
Is it like?
Speaker 4 (46:49):
I just it's I'm going to say a few things
that are informed by an afternoon. I spent last year
with Billy Jean King. Billy and Alana asked me to
go up to a retirement community where Billy's mother in law,
(47:10):
Alana Claus's mother had spent the last years of her life,
and to speak and to interview her in front of
a group of assembled seniors in their families. So cute,
it was amazing, So obviously I said, yes, what time
should I be there?
Speaker 3 (47:23):
I mean, what should I wear so that we could
be matching if.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
People know Caitlin's love for Billy Jeane as all of us.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
As all of us.
Speaker 4 (47:31):
I've spoken about that before, and I won't bore you
guys with what that means to me to be asked.
But I said, yes, of course, I'll gladly be there.
I got up on stage with her, and before I
could even ask her a question, the amount of women
who stood up and said, you changed my life because
I felt like I could leave an abusive husband. You
changed my life because I could get a credit card.
(47:53):
You changed my life because my daughter could go to college.
You changed my life because X, Y and Z right,
And I'm one of those people, as are you, And
you know the past is not past, it is living
with us every day. And if anybody wants to look
at rights that have been clawed out of selfish hands
(48:16):
and their ability to be rolled back, look no further
than the predicament that women in this country face as
second class citizens, literally not in control of our own bodies.
So I am tempted to make fun of this event
to such an extreme degree. I am tempted to ex
curate the organizers for irresponsibility, for callousness, for cynicism, for
(48:37):
cash grabs. I'm tempted to do all those things because
I know that this, in no way, shape or form
will be helpful to anyone except maybe the bank accounts
of a few cynical people involved. And I'm saddened by
the irresponsibility and callousness in which this is being organized,
and I can only hope it is dismissed as the stupid,
(49:00):
trait and insignificant and meaningless event that it is destined
to be, because giving it any credence whatsoever as saying
anything about politics, gender, the people involved, or what our
society should take away from it, is giving it far
too much credit and I would go on, except I
(49:21):
truly don't believe that anybody involved in it has the
intellectual capacity to understand what it is that they're doing.
Speaker 3 (49:28):
And so all I'll say is this is a fucking shame.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
Wow. That is the most aggressive I've ever heard you,
ladies and gentlemen. Caitlin Thompson, that's all I have has
been put on notice. You've all been put on notice.
This is Caitlin. When her crab the shell comes up,
we've got a long fuse and the crab claws come
out here they are.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
Fuck all y'all. Wow, that's what I'm saying. Let's not
in a positive note because I want to give it
a shout out.
Speaker 2 (49:56):
So basically, you're telling me you're not a fan of it.
I don't love it, Okay, I'm just wanted to play.
I don't know how does everyone else feel about it
out there? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (50:04):
Anyway, I don't love it. I do want to You
drew my attention to.
Speaker 4 (50:09):
A wonderful little moment of cross cultural harmony that I
did not know I missed it. Russian player on a Blankova.
Speaker 2 (50:15):
Yes, what a positive note to end on.
Speaker 3 (50:18):
Thank you for remembering we've been really are the best.
Speaker 2 (50:20):
Usually I write things down so I don't forget them
because you know, memory and all getting a little less.
I mean, I just love her so much. Blinkova is like,
literally one of my favorite what a delete. Everyone out
there who watches tennis would have seen her play one
of the greatest, if not well for sure one of
the greatest. Let's say, Borg McEnroe is probably the greatest
(50:40):
tie break of all time, but the tiebreak of all
tie breaks, which is the tie break that's broken every record.
It was, of course Blinkova playing against Rebarking a couple
of years ago at this Strain Open. I had the
pleasure of coiling that for ESPN with Chris Fowler, and
Chris and I are not shy in the words that
we can use. We like to talk. We were speechless
watching that. It was just like none stopped looking at
(51:00):
each other, like what the fuck are we watching? It
was the most umbelious. So you remember blink over from
that mats for the people that forget who she is.
And then she goes and wins a tournament in China,
and god lover gets up there and starts thanking the
fans and speaking to them in Chinese and.
Speaker 1 (51:15):
She killed it.
Speaker 3 (51:16):
She killed it.
Speaker 2 (51:17):
She's the cutest thing ever. She is Caitlin. When I
tell you, there's not a day that goes by, no
matter what happens. I've told this story on the pod
where she played against Sam Stows and doubles in Cincinnati.
Her and her partner were up like five to one
and the third or whatever it was a five to
one in the second set, a set in five to
one something. They end up losing to Sam and Shwey
(51:38):
and Shwae and Sam then went on to win the
Tournament of Cincinnati and then the US Open. And after
this match, she's on the bike next to Sam cooling down,
and I'm like, oh my god, I would kill myself
if I was this team if I lost that match, Right.
Speaker 3 (51:51):
That's spositive and that's true.
Speaker 2 (51:53):
I'd like, I'm walking back to the hotel. It's going
to take me four hours, but I'm going to get
there anyway. She's on the bike. I walk over, Oh,
I'm so sorry, and she looks at me. She says, oh, no,
it's okay. They played so good.
Speaker 3 (52:03):
They played so good.
Speaker 2 (52:04):
Good luck in the finals, big smile on a face.
I'm like, I would kill myself. And here's this girl,
the smile on a face, you know, saying well done
to everyone, good luck, I hope you win the tournament now,
and sweet as pie, that is Anna Blinkova. She is
never not in a good mood. She is never not
nice to everyone around her. She's never not smiling, she's
never not pleasant. And so when you see her do
(52:25):
something like that, Anna Blinkova, I loved it. Definitely one
of my favorite people.
Speaker 4 (52:28):
Don't want to teach chenellently, but uh tin Chi Lager,
John Grender Neuron, Wow, Gender.
Speaker 2 (52:35):
Would you like to interpret that for everybody else?
Speaker 3 (52:37):
Understand it and explain anyone else?
Speaker 1 (52:38):
What about our listeners, they'll understand it too, No, they won't.
Speaker 4 (52:42):
Thank you guys so much for listening. For the highs
to lows, the woes. We told you to put on
your helmets. I hope you did.
Speaker 2 (52:47):
We hope you did. We hope you enjoyed it. We've
got a lot of tennis still to cover, obviously, with
the WTO Finals, the ATP Finals coming up and next
starting next week. Oh, we needn't even mention the fact
that Sinner one Paris over faa kay Hill there as
the coach again, keep asking the question, what is Darren
k Hill going to do next year? Is he going
(53:09):
to I.
Speaker 4 (53:10):
Know all the audience is on the edge of their
seats about this, so I'm I'm really glad we're bringing
it up yet.
Speaker 2 (53:15):
All Right, everyone, thanks for joining us this week. We
look forward to hearing and we're hearing from us next week.
I hope you enjoy today and we'll see you next week. Everybody,
Bye bye,
One two one two sturdy.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Elms on everybody, Almzon, everybody, Hi, everybody, Welcome to the
Renee Stubs Tennis Podcast. You guys should see what we
go through trying to get this thing going.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
But it sounds so good.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
It does sound good, and uh we're happy to be
here with you. Of course, the WTA finals are going
on and we have lots to comment on before we
get to the WDA finals. Sorry, we want to talk about,
Oh Canada, Victoria Momboco.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
What I delighted it is to have a Canadian young
woman of upstanding baseline skills, a dazzling smile and an
incredibly uh infectious personality joining the top twenty. It was
so exciting to watch her. When Hong Kong I was thrilled.
Victoria Booko. Of course we were talking about love it.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
We need these younger players to come through, We need
them to keep winning. Obviously winning in Canada. What was
that like? Three months ago? Feels like forever.
Speaker 3 (01:08):
However, ago before.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
The US Open and then she had this issue with
her wrist. You know how I feel about it. I
didn't think she should have played the US Open. She
was not ready to play that tournament and she wasn't
one hundred percent fit, and I wish she had just
stepped away and got that better. But after a lot
of time and away from you know, she's been playing
in Asia, but clearly she's one hundred percent now and
wins the tournament in Hong Kong. So a couple of
(01:32):
tournaments this year are ready for the young Canadian.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
What a great path she had.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
Sometimes these smaller tournaments, you know, don't always attract the
top field. But Victoria and Boger went through a pretty
much a gauntlet getting to the finals, which she won
in three sets against Busca from Spain. Before that, she
played Leela Fernandez. They went three sets. That was a
very good match, and she had priorly gone through Colinskaya.
(01:58):
But the alex Yaala match for me was one of
the more exciting ones, even though that happened only in
the round of sixteen. Alex Yala is the first Filipino
player to crack the top what is it fifty, Well.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Yeah, on top fifty for the very first time a Filipino.
That's so awesome.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
It's so awesome, and the fans doing that in Asia, obviously,
she had a good run on the hard courts earlier
in North America this summer and in Miami, but seeing
her back it up in Asia and just the fans
like tennis is the best port in the world. And
one of the reasons is the best part in the
world is because all these different fan groups, backgrounds, stories
get highlighted. Alex Yala is a star. She came to
our bobb a lot event at the Seaport Racket Club
(02:34):
this summer. Yeah, and the amount of press who wanted
to talk to her, people who wanted to talk about her,
who wanted to follow her around. You know, it was
no Carlo's Outkrez, but it was close and it was
really interesting to watch. She's a star, as is Vicki
and Boco. So I'm really feeling very optimistic about the
young women who are about to inherit, you know, sort
of the main spotlight on the women's tour.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Yeah, you think about those two, and then of course
Mira andrev who, as we talked about last week, missed
out on the singles because she didn't have a visa
for Taikyo.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
I just want to point out what an ass eater
it must be, because she's in't Reo out.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
Anyway, an ass eater.
Speaker 3 (03:05):
Just it bites you in the aps because she's there.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Thank you for clarifay, because I.
Speaker 4 (03:09):
Was playing doubles. She qualified in doubles Ersten, so she's
there anyway, she might as well be playing singles. It's
not like she gets to go to the beach.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Word on the street is that she might be playing
singles because Maddie Keys is not one hundred percent. We
saw her not handshake Amanda Anisamova yesterday and the word
on the street is she's not well. So she walked
to the net and was just like, Nope, do not
hug me, do not touch me, do not shake my hand.
I'm going straight to the bag and I'm straight off
(03:37):
this court.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
I preventive medical.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, Amanda Anisimova was like, got your kid.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
I'm not trying to get barth time, stay away from me.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
And also Jasmine Paulini was also talked about today by
the commentary that she also is not one hundred percent either, So.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
I'm not totally surprised these guys are dead and blooded
and buried along the way kind of thing, because it's
basically season, you know, month number seven of this seemingly
in less twenty twenty five season.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
And I think what happens is when you get into
the WA finals, because you know, you are all together
all the time, so if somebody gets if someone goes
down in the locker room, you attend to a lot
of you go down. So I'm sure there's a lot
of hand washing, there's a lot of mass being worn.
If I was a player, I would be preventatively trying
to stay away from those players that are sick. And
(04:25):
clearly Maddie Keys that was that was a classy thing
for her to do because she doesn't have to care
about how Amanda and Annis I'movie does in the next
three or four days. But I think that was a
really classy thing for her to do. Be like, look,
you beat me. Not happy about it, but I don't
want to give you what I've got.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
While we're on the subject of handshakes, there was a
little bit a little bit made on the internet about
Igish Fiantek not shaking the hand of the umpire immediately.
I do want to say she went back and leader
shook the hand of the but immediately, which is typically customed.
You greet your opponent the net, you both walk together
and you at one after the other handshake turn at
(05:03):
the umpire.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
She didn't do that, and.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
Maybe it was because she was a little salty about
losing six to zero in the last set against Elena Rebacchina,
who appears to be from all I can tell on
fire at these WTO finals.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Yeah, I mean it was a little bit unusual. I'm
not gonna lie, I thought, you know, usually you go
shake the hand immediately of the umpire and then you
sort of go. But I think she was just thinking,
I'm gonna go put my a little bit upset, I'm
going to go put my racket down, and then I'm
going to loose myself. Yeah, she definitely a breath shook
the umpire's hand. Ship So calm the farm, everybody out there.
She did the right thing in the end, and we've
(05:34):
all lost, and it's never fun. You lose.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Doesn't seem very fun, especially.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
Getting smoked six and the third. But before we fully
get Caitlin into the WTA finals and some of the
matches that have already been played, I do want to
talk really quickly about the men stand. Babrinka one seven,
five and the third in his first round, and he
will now play MUSSETI so we know that Mussetti joined
the I need to play one more tournament to try
and win. So he has to win this tournament to
(06:01):
make the tour finals on the A top side. And
interestingly enough, you're a guy Felix Asier Ali Siem said,
you know what, good luck. If you win the tournament,
you deserve to be in. I don't want to play
because he could have played. He could have played Mets
and he could have you know, had an issue where
he pretty much won one or one match and he
was good enough, you know what, I mean to be in.
(06:23):
But I think he's smart here because he's like, look,
if Massetti wins the tournament, good for you. If not,
I don't want to be exhausted going into the ATB
finals having to like try and just win a match,
you know, and go and play another tournament.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
And then Alane and turned to compete in the last.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
I will see he's betting on himself and he's not
betting on Mersetti.
Speaker 4 (06:45):
I think that that's actually really wise. And I was
going to make that same point. He's betting on himself
and he's not betting on MUSSETI now keen listeners of
the show will remember that a week ago I was
real team Felix.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yes, you, you were always team four, but I.
Speaker 4 (06:58):
Was optimistic that he would be in content engine and look,
we don't know. Mis said, he's got to win this tournament,
and then Felix gets to begin his preseason.
Speaker 3 (07:06):
Earlier that said, I.
Speaker 4 (07:08):
Think Felix, the way he has comported himself making the
semis of the US Open, I think was a major
breakthrough moment, not only because obviously it was the furthest
he'd gone in quite a long time in a major,
but also he's playing with like, uh positive composure in
a way that I think a lot of times I
was used to seeing a little bit of like timid
anxiety from him, and I like this new Felix was like, yeah,
(07:30):
you want to get into the finals, go ahead and play, play,
play and win, And it was some chilling like a
villain out here, Like I love that from him.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
Yeah, I mean, listen, you and I have spoken about
this so much in the last few years about Felix.
I've always said I just if I was coaching him,
I would shake him, like literally like shake him and
be like relax, just relaxx just the chill.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
Doesn't that sound relaxing? The na stubs his relaxation.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
You know when you just like, you know, when singers
got whatever they would their lips and them we can't
do it right now, but you know, you know my point.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
This is a really compelling case for Yeah, I just
I just want a stub spa.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
I just want him to relax. I just want him
to have almost would say to him one match, I'd
be like, listen, here's the deal. Doesn't matter if you win.
I want to see literally how much fun you can have.
I want you to be a little bit like a
Roger Federer type who he's sort of modeled a lot
of his game on. And you know he's born the
same day as Roger, just about twelve years later. Yeah,
they have the same birthday, and just like, just relax,
(08:29):
just almost tank. I just want to see you tanker match,
semi tanker match, and just not give a.
Speaker 4 (08:34):
Fuck I want him to do. I want him to
have like ten percent quarantine mute.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Ten percent that's stampt back some most just.
Speaker 4 (08:43):
A little dog and that little dog is named quarantine.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Mate who lost today?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
I know, I think a really good hit, a good
fall run.
Speaker 4 (08:50):
He made the finals out in one of those step countries,
which I was really in al Madi, I was really
pleased to see. Yeah, I mean quarantine mate. Yeah, you
don't want more than ten percent of him at a
gain of a time, but Felix could certainly use it
and just shake those shoulders up a little bit.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
All right.
Speaker 4 (09:03):
Any other men you want to talk about before we
get to the results from Riad, No.
Speaker 2 (09:08):
Not really, but I do want to say this could
be sound baron Rica's last match.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
Tim for Rinka's really given us a lot. He's given
us two of the most beautifully horrific outfits Evernis Court.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
With the greatest, most beautiful one handed back and we've
ever seen. The back came down.
Speaker 3 (09:25):
The line he Justine Hannah, but yes a male, no, no, no, no,
just you know it is such very beautiful in stam
for rinkas now for.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
You will not win this battle.
Speaker 4 (09:35):
You know whose last biting is John McEnroe.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Well, listen, you're going to find John McEnroe. I'm telling
you there is no way. Justin Anna her one handed
back and was phenomenal. It was so good, it was
so powerful. But she looked like she was having a
conniption fit every time she hit it. You watch her head, Caitline,
when she hits her back end, it looks like she's
literally like having a mild exorcist moment when she's hitting
(10:03):
her back in. Her head snapped.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
That is getting exercised or she wasn't.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
I would say Francesca Scavone, I would say, I would
say Spaniards.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
It was very good.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Concia Martinez and cheat Nou Suarez, Rambo Suarez Navarro.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Suarez. Navarro's backhand was a thing of beauty, okay, whereas
Justin Annan's was powerful and explosive and incredible, but it
was not a.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
Beautiful well agreed to disagree.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Stan Vavrinka's gorgeous smooth as butter.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
I don't even think stim Verrinka has the most beautiful
one headed back in on the men's tour people, even
in his era.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Richard Gascay, Hello fans out there, I want you.
Speaker 4 (10:44):
I would like you to say, I will quibble to
me about all the socials and about tennis history, but
I will not allow a quibbling of stylistic analysis.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Here we go, everyone out there, you can all write
to us on the socials and give us your top
ten one handed backhand.
Speaker 3 (10:59):
Tell us where Rene is wrong and Justine and.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Nuns is definitely not the most beautiful one.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
Okay, well be prepared for a lot of Justine Henna fans,
these Belgians once they get their teeth.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Any man, it was not a pretty shot. It was effective, incredible,
but no one near is anyway.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Standy Rinka is going to be missed because he wore
between the hot Raspberry and truly the worst plaid slash
the best plaid shorts ever.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
He won two French opens.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
I know, in those.
Speaker 4 (11:21):
Terrible clothes that were terribly beautiful, and I even carry
around a tiny token of the plaid shorts on my
tennis bag as a commemoration. The team at Yonix gave
them to me because they knew that I was a
massive fan of them.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
So talk about that waffling. I will say you dick
when I give her a shit. I love when she
looks at me like fuck you. The funny thing is,
guys out there, is that you know my rants on
Novak and you hate when I do this. But everyone's
upset that I haven't been asking for stan Vabrinka to
retire for the last two years. It's because he's not
(11:52):
winning more than one match, and frankly.
Speaker 3 (11:54):
He's not trying to win.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
He's not trying to win Grand Slams anymore. The guy's
like a hundred something actually, uh, while we're just trying
to win matches.
Speaker 4 (12:03):
Novak Djokovic, you know, could solve this Lorenzo Mussetti Felix
uge Alesian battle because he could not play. I don't
think Djokovic doesn't play the ATV finals, which I'm not
saying he should or shouldn't, but if he doesn't play,
then Musseti and Felix get in.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
Guess what, Caitlin, there's no chance that Novak's not playing.
If he's playing this week. He's not playing this week
in a two fifty. It's a two fifty, right, He's
not playing a two fifty.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
In itf challenger in my back, he's not playing a.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
Two fifty for the fun of it. He's playing it
to get matches for the w for the ATP final.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
I'm just saying he could happen. Anything could happen.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Has he played since the years Open so he doesn't
well maybe I don't know.
Speaker 3 (12:44):
Played in grees anyway, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
God, we're such great followers of tennis when we don't
even know if if we hadn't produced that.
Speaker 4 (12:52):
Right now, talk about one thing and one thing only,
which is the amusing sub stack. I want to shout
out to about tennis media credentials, problem of tennis content
being under optimized. But I am happy to talk about
the Debuta finals because these are players that carry deeply
about ok So, shall we proceed.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
We shall proceed. Let's uh, do you want to go
on your round about the w T A TP media
stuff or do you want to stick with the women's.
Speaker 4 (13:13):
Let's finish the tennis and then we can, okay, of
the one thing I'm an expert in, which is a media.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Which is see it's going to say complaining about the media. Okay,
So here we go, ladies and gentlemen and tennis fans
and everyone in between. We're going to talk about the
WTF finals. So thus far, thus far. Arena Sabalanca just
got the win over Jessica Baulgoula in three sets. That
was really a determination of who is probably going to
win the Uh.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
That's certainly the Stefanie Graff group.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
The Stephanie Graff group or are they in the Serena
Williams craw.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
She's in the Stepigraph group. Okay, so Stephanie.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
Graff, Stephanie Graff, listen, here's the deal. Sabal Anca decided
to give her player's box a bit of a spray
today at one all in the third tow to one
in the third down loss serve to go down to one,
gave it bit of a spray to the player's box
and the player's box said see you later. So Anton
Debrof was like, Okay, you're going to talk to me
(14:08):
like that, out of here, And sometimes when a player
does that. I have never had a coach to leave
the players box, but I would imagine what it would
feel like if I've had players yelling at me As
a coach. I've also yelled at my coaches, and it's
kind of that moment where when you say shit that
you probably go later on, which she did in her
(14:29):
postmatch interview, was like I probably went a little bit
too far. When you know you've gone a little too far,
it sort of like makes you go, oh, oh shit.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
I better just better win now.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
I better knuckle down here and try and win this
match and stop being a little whiny bit c h
because she was bitch in like upper storm, and I
think it gets to you. The point was like, okay,
well I've got no one to bitch out anymore because
my coach has literally left the building. She said he
pissed her off. I don't know what he said or
did that pissed her off, but she was obviously upset.
(15:01):
And then when he left, she was probably like, oh shit,
maybe I went too far. And it certainly refocused her
because down to one, she had Lo's a game after
that and just sort of fell apart. The two to
one game where Jessica was serving was so important and
on a couple of really big points, just did not
get the first serve in, and Sabolenca hit a couple
of huge returns to rebreak and then just ran away
(15:23):
with the match after that. And that's just that's little
tiny things make a difference in these matches.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
It's kind of it.
Speaker 4 (15:28):
It was interesting watching that match, you know, Sabolenka looked
a little sleepy, a little out of sorts, and then
all she needs to do is a couple haymakers and
good night.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Totally, It's kind of it.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
That's exactly what it is. Yeah, fourhand haymaker, boom winner,
boom winner, game over too all, All right, I'm back
in this. My coaches left the building. I need to
get my shit together, I need to behave got no
one yell at And all of a sudden, she wins
four games, five games in a row.
Speaker 4 (15:53):
If only we all had the arena Sablanca arsenal at
her disposal.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
What else some well, earlier on and the day Coco
GoF comfortable win over Jasmine, Paulini, it's interesting that Coco
has gotten the win over Jasmine now the last couple
of times, considering Jasmine had it over cocoed this year.
I think we'll had won three matches against coc this year.
Now Coco's gone. The last two matches have gone in
her favor. Judging by Paulini, she is also not at
(16:20):
one hundred percent, so she's in the Maddie Keys area
of the locker room for sure. So Jasmine not one
hundred percent, And you cannot not be one hundred percent
against Coco because every freaking ball comes back. And I
love that she's using the hide on the forehand, which
is a nightmare for Jasmine because Jasmine's little little things,
(16:41):
and if you get she is weak. If you get
the ball way above her head, she's it's hard for
her to do anything. And she's particularly on the backhand side.
On the forehand, you can still hit a ball above
your shoulders a little bit easier. On the backhand, it's
a lot more difficult to do anything of aggression. And
Coco was just too good. She just outsmarted served a
lot today, a lot less double faults, barely hit any
(17:02):
double faults today, So that is a big improvement for her.
And now it's going to come down to it. It's
going to be a big match tomorrow with Cocoa and Sabolenka.
Speaker 4 (17:12):
Yeah, and I think for me, it's hard to imagine
anybody except Sabolenka kind of lifting the trophy at the
end of this. But if we look at the other
group form it has had this surge. She has not
looked like the Rabacchino we saw for the majority of
this year, but one we got used to seeing year
before last and the year before that. Even just absolute
(17:35):
ice cold, no seeming moments of anxiety or doubt when
she's dealing, and she can do pretty much anything at
any time she's she's unflappable, and so I would love
very much and actually think it would be a very
fun and explosive final to see the two of those
guys together if they were to end up meeting after
the semis in their group finishes.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
But yeah, I think.
Speaker 4 (17:57):
There's there's the thing I like the most is there's
just many good tennis matches at the final. I really
like that they play round robin because you really want
to do see all the different matchups and then you
can't really complain about a bad draw, if you know,
if you get to see everybody, at least the ones
in your group. But Rebeckena for me, is the other
one who's looking absolutely dominant and she has been. She's
up to and Oero in her group as well.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Yeah, I think look going back to the first match
of Rabekina played against Amanda Annasamoa, I would say that
Amanda and I put this out on the socials the
other day. It's hard to explain to people when you
play in your first WTA finals how different the feeling
is walking on the court. It's kind of just feels
a little bit different. You just feel like, ah, this
(18:40):
just feels like a different tournament. It's kind of like
playing the Olympics for the first time or playing for
your country for the first time in Billy Jean King Cup.
It's just a there's a different feeling, and I think
that she looked a lot. She looked lost in the
first match against Rabakiina. She'd never played Rabaccina, which is crazy.
Speaker 4 (18:55):
Yeah, I'm crazy. To play your first match against somebody
at the two Pine, yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
And I mean somebody who hits the ball is hard
as you, so having to adjust to that. And also
her first match, I think she just looked like a
deer in headlights, as Rebuccian has played in the last
whole bunch over the last few years. And then against
Mattie Keys again the same She looked very anxious. She
was not playing well. Maddie was playing pretty well, up
a set and three one, then all of a sudden,
Amanda just sort of found her way. It was a
(19:19):
little bit like how she played against Osakan the Semis
of the US Open, where she was down a set
in six five and all a sudden something just clicked.
She played so much better after that. But I just
feel like once she got back in that match, and
she sort of found her normality, if that makes sense
to me. She's like, oh, this is a tennis match.
That's a tennis court. I'm playing against somebody had never
played to get it against, which is crazy. She never
(19:40):
played Madison Keys either, and sort of like finally sort
of found her rhythm a little bit, and you could
tell that her shoulders just relaxed and she calmed down,
and once it got to three sets, you just had
a feeling it was going to be over. And then
we didn't really know about Madison Keys not being one
hundred percent, but certainly that didn't help her, but Amanda
and usim over winning that match in three is a
huge thing for her going into the next match because
(20:02):
she now has an opportunity to get through to the
Semis if she wins her next match in straight sets.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
And I give her a good chance.
Speaker 4 (20:07):
I mean, I think the thing that I like watching
about an Asimova too much is you can look you
can learn her. You can see her learning curve right
exactly what we were just talking about, where she kind
of gets her sea legs a little bit and then
she settles in. I mean, even just watching the two
matches she played against Serena Sbalanka under the lights this year.
You know, the first match petrified, the second match took
it to her and almost got away with a set,
(20:28):
and you know that third set in a final, who
knows anything happens, right, So for me, watching Anisimova dial
in in real time is really exciting. It's also like
pretty much the only thing that's relatable about her because
she hits the living shit out of the ball and
she's such a tremendous, tremendous player. But for me, it's
the fact that you can kind of see her the
wheels turning in her head a little bit that makes
it really dramatic and exciting because you're like, oh, is
(20:49):
she gonna settle? And if she does, then what kind
of trouble is she gonna throw across the net at
her opponent?
Speaker 2 (20:56):
And she it's so important for Anasimova to like stay calm,
to just not not be demonstrative, because when she's demonstrative
on the court, she's sort of like a little bit
not a little bit petulant. She sort of looks a
little petulant rather than just like refocusing sort of and
I know she's learning. That's it's so hard for her
not to be like that. Some players just they just emote,
(21:16):
and she's that a negative emotor when things are going badly,
but when she sort of settles in good luck. What's
interesting now is that she goes up against eager.
Speaker 5 (21:26):
She on tech is the total question mark to me,
how good is this though that's going to be a match,
How good is this? Like Amandamova in that match, I
have to say. And that's not just because you go
last hear my first, her last match, most recent match
against Rebeccaa. I think for me, the.
Speaker 4 (21:42):
Ego that shows up at these finals is one of
two flavors, and I think we have the flavor of
ego that's not here to win. And that's not to
criticize her prep. It's not right, mind. I just think
she's not she she has She plays well with the
error of invincibility behind her.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
Well.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
She played griding and looked mad Keys was you know,
coming in here not playing? Since the US Open has
this random abbreviation to her serve motion, now, I don't
know what's going on there. She changed the serf at
this strain open and going into this train open, which
was fantastic, bringing the leg up. I love it. It helps
her hip, it helps her her her adductors and where
(22:19):
she has a lot of tend to have a lot
of injuries. And now you just think, what's going on
with this abbreviation with the serve like just taking a
racket head up quickly? Is that because she has a
shoulder issue? Is that something that she's mentally trying to
get I don't know, but I don't you know, there's
been so much iterations to this serve now and changes,
so you just wonder what's going on. Is it mental
(22:41):
or is it now physical? What's going on? Not having
played since the US Open, you just knew that there
was very little chance she was going to beat Eager
in the first round because Eager is like a nightmata
play in the first round because she's like one hundred
miles an hour, like from the get go, and if
you're not feeling good, it's going to be real quick.
And it was fairly comfortable two set match, and then
you know she obviously ran out of steam against Amanda
(23:02):
and a Simova in the third set and wasn't feeling
well because we know that from the handshake or lack thereof.
But now Eager. You know, she won a pretty comfortable
first set, looking really good against Rebeccin, and then Rebekkin
had just turned everything around. She started not missing. She
made so many errors in the first set of rebecu
in it she looked horrible and Eager was serving really well.
And then Eager served went a little bit off, and
then Rebeckan it just stopped missing, just purely, and when
(23:25):
she just hitting winners all over the place. And I
think the biggest issue for Eager when that starts happening,
when she starts getting hit off the court by the
likes of sabal Ankas and Rebeckin, is the ones that
hit the ball real big and amandable. He's got to
use a little bit more variety, like just even a
just a shitty slice or a or a shitty forehands,
(23:46):
a little junker, just a little junk every now and again.
Talking about once a point, I'm talking about once every
two games or something. Throw these players like a rebek
In and like Amanda Nsimova, like a sable Anka. You
have to throw them different spades of ball.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
For sure, and to break it up.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
And you're at the court and Ega has that, and
she's got one of the more sort of thoughtful and
varied toolkits, however, and the reason I don't like her
odds against Anisimova is for two reasons. Number One, Anisimova
has the kind of game that she doesn't like, as
we've established the big hitter paceball that she can just
get out of the point even before she's you know,
can really establish herself. And the second reason is I
(24:25):
think Ega plays she's one of the best front runners.
But I think when she gets anxious, and I think
because she's lost a match, not necessarily because she played
badly or she's not prepared or anything other than just yes,
she got out hit, especially that third set, and she
just couldn't, you know, she couldn't deal with her Rabakkina,
who wasn't donating errors to her. To me, this idea
(24:46):
that she's not fallible helps her. And when she's playing
it the French clay, Yes, of course it's the surface
and it's so of course the speed, but it's also
just the aura. She's a big aura player to me,
and that means that I think Nisimova, hopefully we'll go
in confident and I think for eager to win that
she's really got to figure out how to get a
(25:07):
little bit of that mojo back, because she plays well
when she's confident. But I don't think she has the
tools to solve Anisimova, at least if Anisimova is making
it tough fun her. So anyway, that's my very very
mild prediction is that Anisimova is going to come through
and get to the semis.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
I think if Eager wants to win that match, she
has to vary her serve speeds. You cannot hit the
same serve speed sometimes, like I think yesterday Matti Keys
was winning more second serves that were hit than first serves. Well,
and that's because it's getting out of the hitting zone
area of Amanda and Asimova. If you give it to
her shoulder high ish, she's going to crush it every
(25:42):
time if you get it a little bit varied and
she's not quite short because she is such a rhythm
groundstroker right the way she hits her groundstrokes, it's so rhythmic,
so beautiful. You know, some players are a little different.
She is a very rhythmic type of player. So when
it's on, good luck, it's on. But eger is I
feel with eger when she gets pushed really hard with
(26:03):
a big deep ball, she tries to hit it back
as hard and with her grip, it's very difficult to
do that, particularly on the forehand side. So I would
like to see her implement in the off season some
kind of slice forehand, some kind of variation, whether it
be just to jung it back.
Speaker 3 (26:21):
Just to get it in the court, just something else.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Just the longer the point goes. Most of the time,
she's going to win it, right, because she's physically so
much more gift, but not just so gifted, so strong
and so fit. It's like, but if you're not in
the point, you're not going to win. And Coco Gough
is a perfect example of that. Clearly. Coco's forehand is,
you know, her weaker side, but rather than miss.
Speaker 4 (26:44):
She will get it in the court and she throws
up the high loopy, a loopy which is really really effective.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Yeah, And you know, when you throw up the high loopy,
you've got to be willing to play a longer point, right,
And so obviously Coco is one of the most unbelievable
athletes I've ever seen play. So she will run down
the next ball if you smack it. So Eca can
do that too. So it's like, just stay in the point,
throwing a bit of junk every now and again, throwing
a high ball, throw in a sliced forehand, throwing a
(27:12):
chip forehand, get it as long as you get it
below the net. You are making things real uncomfortable for
players like Amanda and a slover barking at Sabalanca, who
are tall, big strikers.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
A bend don't want it to do.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
You necessarily come into the net. So when you throw
a junk ball in there and say okay, come in
and then you pass them, you can sometimes win so
many points by just getting the ball into it a
difficult part of the court that most women don't like,
which is service line area below the net. So I
would imply that, well, it's not about me. I mean,
(27:52):
I'm just like, I'm just giving my free wisdom out
to everybody.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
There you go, wisdom for free shaking massages and free wisdom.
Speaker 2 (27:59):
So it's got to come down really to Amanda, Anisimova
and Eager Shound text match in that group. And of
course now Pagoula is going to have to play against Paulini,
which we imagine she's going to win because Paolini's own
two and Sablenca golf, so Sabalanca is going to have
to It'll be interesting to see how that goes.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
That much.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Onder your hats, Hold on to your hats because we
know it's always an entertaining, fun match when those two play. Yeah, okay,
so one thing we wanted. Do we have any predictions
where you've said that, do you think Sabalanc is going
to win the tournament?
Speaker 4 (28:34):
I have a hard time. I think it's I think
it's going to be sabole Anco Rebeccina.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
I think it might be that too, but it also
depends on who finishes first and second and who plays who.
Speaker 4 (28:44):
Yeah, they may plan even if they play, they might
not play in the finance the semis.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
That's right anyway. So it's all it's a lot of
fun what's happening over in riannd. It's hard for me
to watch it, though, Caitline I will say the crowds
have been pretty they're certainly a little better than they
were last year. But it does bother me in so
many ways when I see the crowds that are not
that big and it's we're not it's not going to
(29:09):
happen where. I mean, you look at Paris indoors, the
men playing that Paris Indoors and it was just the
most amazing stadium. Absolutely chock is full, as we say
in Australia, and to see our best players in the
world battling it out with not a big crowd, it
really bothers me because I know that they're there that.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
I think, Yeah, I mean the WTA has struggled with
this full stop for a decade.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
Yeah, because we keep putting in places that are offering
a lot of money.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
I just want to push back, and we've argued about
this before. I truly don't think the main thing is
where it is. I really don't think that's true unless
you want to talk about Guadalajara or someplace where, like
they are starved for more tennis than they need it.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
So how do we get bigger crowds here?
Speaker 4 (29:52):
I think the WTA, and I think it sort of
ties into the thing that I want to talk about,
which is I think the WTA has to productize tennis
in a much much more, much more sophisticated way than
they do. And I think knowing the check sizes that
Saudi in particular is going to write the sport of tennis.
There's going to be more tournaments, more exos, more events.
There we already saw this year obviously the six King
(30:13):
Slam repeat. It's its presence there, as did the WTA finals.
The next gen is there, and now they're getting an
ATP one thousand tournament.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
They're getting a one an AIGHTTP one thousand tournament with
no that no one has to play right, So every
other masta's and WTA one thousand has mandatory that everyone
plays right. It's on the mandatory list, meaning that if
you don't play it, you get a one point and
that counts to your ranking for your twelve month rotation
of points. They don't have any guarantee like this now.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
I mean they have three years before the first ball
is going to be start, but they I would be
surprised if they changed the rules profoundly between now and then.
I wouldn't be surprised if the entirety of tennis has
a new leader by then and it's a joint effort,
or they you know, completely scrap the sort of failing tours.
Like I think, there's so many different things that could happen,
So I don't want to get hung up on the
particularities of this deal, not to say that it's not
(31:01):
stupid or we don't like it, but rather like.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
But how, in my opinion, how does the ATP allow
the Saudis to have a ATP one thousand without mandatory
mandatorily making every play a play? I don't mean every
player will play because again.
Speaker 4 (31:17):
You're asking, you're acting like they otherwise are totally logical.
How does how does anybody in tenors uperate logically? Oh
they don't remember when we talked about like how the
the slams could never be moved, no one could do anything,
and it's like, oh, there's a COVID, we're going to
cancel one, but the French is going to be in October.
It's like nothing matters, there's no rules, And for me,
that's not necessarily a good or bad thing. I think
you could probably make the argument that it's not great,
(31:39):
but the truth of it is, like, I think the
only thing that's useful to talk about is how can
you align to make it create a better sport?
Speaker 3 (31:52):
You know?
Speaker 4 (31:52):
And the thing that we're not going to do probably
on this and this show is solved for the fact
that the Saudis, who you know, regardless what you're feeling
about it is, aren't going to not be at the
table for buying up assets. So how do you make
those assets really valuable? And how do you make sure
that they get the shine that they need or maybe
that you know, distribute some of the play, the prize
(32:16):
and sort of the fan chip across entities because I
can tell you what they don't need to be doing,
which is like dumb meme content where we quiz our
athletes about their favorite emojis.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
And yeah, so let's get into that a little bit.
You wanted to talk about the atp WTA and the
Grand Slams and the majors yea, all the government and
all the tournaments. How they don't allow influencers quote unquote
or tennis you know, riders or fans put up their
own stuff on the internet and because it's protected by
(32:50):
the networks that buy it. Let's say ESPN it you
were so Open or the Friends Federation at the friend
I mean, I remember I posted something I don't know
somebody maybe it was Nadal winning his one hundred French
Open title or whatever, and I put it on my Twitter.
It was a video of him winning, and then within
an hour I was like, you got to take this down.
I was like, what what do you mean? I got
to take it down. I couldn't believe it. And it's
happening all the time, where you know, they want to
(33:12):
protect their own piece of the pie. But it's like,
but you're not helping grow, especially when you have people
that have not me. I don't have millions of followers,
but like, there are players that have almost a million followers,
or their girlfriends have seven hundred followers, seven hundred thousand
followers or whatever. They can't win anything out because it's
like protected quote unquote, and I'm like, I thought the
(33:33):
whole idea was to promote the sport. The more fans
you can bring in, the more money you're gonna make.
Isn't that right.
Speaker 4 (33:40):
It's sort of baffling. And I think there are two
pieces that I want to urge people to read. One
of them is late this summer, Jessica Testa, who's a
New York Times reporter who covers media, wrote a really
interesting piece and we talked about a little bit about
how like the USTA brought served the podcast into the
US Open, they couldn't agree on which ads and advertisements
(34:03):
were going to work with it because the WTA or
the USTA and the podcast had conflicting advertisements, and nobody
could agree on it, and it was a mess, and
nobody anticipated it because the folks at the USTA who
run all this stuff aren't necessarily up, I would argue
on the latest and greatest of what is happening in
the world of media, now, there's this really phenomenal substack
that I urge all of you to subscribe to. It's
(34:23):
called hardcoret and Jessica Schiffler, who's a former Vogue and
New York Times and Business of Fashion correspondent, has been
doing wonderful, wonderful reporting on sort of the culture aspect
of tennis. It's not terribly dissimilar from something you'd read
and racket. It's just a little bit more substacky in
the sense that it's kind of like a fired off blog.
But the reporting in the thought there is really excellent.
Along with a woman named Melissa Kenny who writes hard
hitting and who fun fact, is also our advice columnist.
(34:45):
So anyway, plug for smart women writing on.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Substack and including Andrea Pekovic of course, who's brilliant. Brilliant
on substack.
Speaker 4 (34:54):
I would say what makes Jessica's piece today about the
media really interesting is we're able to see it in
real time. So not only is it the wags or
the content creators as athletes themselves who aren't allowed to post,
or somebody like Renee Stubbs who is there who's just
trying to share and bring behind the scenes, it is
also the fact that media credentials have been disappearing. The
(35:17):
tours themselves want to moderate all access to all of
the athletes, not to mention behind the scenes, but then
what they do, instead of taking something away and then
giving it in a bigger and better way, they give
us hot garbage.
Speaker 3 (35:31):
So they'll while hire TikTok creators.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
They'll hire folks who maybe have a lot of audience
but don't necessarily know anything about tennis to kind of
create a lot of it is through the creative agency
network and overtime, and it's a lot of it's a
lot of like your favorite athletes being interviewed about what
their favorite courses.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Yeah, and I just made that up, but it's dumb
and it insults our intelligence.
Speaker 4 (35:57):
And I would say that as much as you want
to make a play for gen Z, what you're leaving
the door open to is a whole lot of armchair
media content that you have no creation or say in,
which is honestly like what to me has flourished you
around the part of tennis in spite of tennis itself. Obviously,
that's what we've been trying to do a racket for
a really long time. This podcast is about that, as
are a number of really great substacks as we're talking
(36:19):
about and other people's blog. So this is all a
way of saying, the tennis machine has noticed that it's
not doing a very good job of telling its own story,
and now they're hiring well intentioned but strategically insulting content
creators at the expense of having more journalists, media and
people who are great and primed to tell the story.
(36:40):
A lot of times they're athletes and those people in
their countery and they don't know. Should Morgan Riddle get
a media credential, Well, no, she's not media. Should she
get a player credential, Well she better be in a
player's box. However, is she allowed to create content? Well
not unless she has a media credential. And it's just
sort of like, okay, well, yeah, either way, you're missing
out on having somebody bring in fans and do it
in a really sophisticated way.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
And how many followers does she have on Instagram?
Speaker 3 (37:02):
Or a couple hundred k? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (37:05):
I mean so again, did these tournaments themselves have in
some cases ten to twenty thirty thousand?
Speaker 2 (37:10):
And then I read in that artist called it down.
If you have over a million, you're allowed to do it,
but if you have under a million, that's like what
so Taylor Fritz has like seven hundred and fifty thousand
or whatever on Instagram but not enough.
Speaker 3 (37:22):
What I would sort of illustrate the point again is.
Speaker 2 (37:25):
That it's only like seven tennis players I think that
have over.
Speaker 4 (37:28):
And also the seven or ten, by the way, they're
going to retire and leave, and they're not going to
tell the same stories about the tennis world that they
do now, and so you're going to have to regrow
this same garden over and over and over again.
Speaker 2 (37:42):
Yeah, you don't see. Look at a perfect example, our
friend Sophie Goldschmid, who we mentioned quite often on this pod.
It runs usk and snowpo but Mikaela Schiffren is doing
her own pod, is doing her own vlog, is doing
all sorts of things, doing some amazing things behind the scenes,
like who doesn't want to see that from the greatest
skier of all time? And no one's shutting it down
or not, you can't show that. They're like, yeah, we
(38:04):
need to grow the sport. So my whole thing isn't
on this. I would like to see the A T
P WTA majors or all of them, every single one
of them, for one year, just say, you know what,
fuck it. Everyone can post whatever they want, right.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Just free for all three Let's see, let's do one year.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
Okay, so I'm throwing this out to all the tennis establishment.
Let's do one year where anyone can post anything about
any tennis tournament whatever they want, as long as it's positive. Clearly,
we don't want to have you know, No, no, no, I
actually don't.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
I don't necessarily disagree with that. I think I think
any other sport would have embraced.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
The I'm saying is I don't want someone out there
you can sit on death wembledons, right, That's what I'm saying.
What I'm saying, No, no, disgusting stuff.
Speaker 4 (38:49):
I want us have the dialogue around the sport really
improve and increase.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
Yeah, let's just see, let's see what Let's see what happens,
because I guarantee you there'll be some ship that will
go viral and then all of a sudden, I'll give
you an example Wimbledon, and please invite me back to
play the legends because I but I just want to
say this, because they weren't happy. Number of years ago
we had someone from the crowd come on to the
court and play a point. It was a very famous
(39:15):
point with Kim Cleister's and we ended up serving to
a gentleman and we put a white skirt on him
because he was in color and it was funny, and
we put a long sleeve on him and he was
all in white and it's done out. It was so funny.
And he played one point and we put him back
in the crowd, and the club weren't super happy because
they don't want the public on the courts. Totally understandable,
like you can't just have people come and round on
(39:36):
the court. Da da dada. It has I'd say at
this point now in time, probably ten million views it
is I think one of the most viewed videos from
Wimbledon's history, and now they plug it. They plug it
now because they realized, holy shit, it got so many
people looking at it, and so many people probably thought, Oh,
maybe that'll happen to me one day, someone will put
(39:56):
me down in the crowd and I'll get on the
court at Wimbledon. I don't know. But now I promote
that video. But at the time they weren't happy about it.
So that's what I'm saying, like the establishment, like, open
up a little bit, be a little bit of fun,
let the let stuff be seen, and then let's see
how it goes. Now if it's a disaster, we shot
it down again because it's real easy.
Speaker 3 (40:14):
Yeah, but I shot it.
Speaker 4 (40:15):
I would love for people who are smart to be
in charge of this, and people who understood media and
people who understood how to market. And this is why
I started talking about this because at the end of
the day, yes, you could point out the fact that
it's in Saudi Arabia, you can point about that we
have a major time difference. You could point out the
fact that maybe this is in a culture that embraces tennis.
And this is even before you get into the some
of the political situation there, which, by the way, yeah,
there's a couple pretty severe hotspots that are difficult for
(40:38):
the tour for a global sport to reckon with. I
will say, for me, if this were a short or
more optimized season, if the WTA did a great job
of selling the event itself, the tourism destination possibilities that
this has, yeah, and a lot more of the goings
on around it. I liked the photoshoot they did before it.
(40:59):
They used regional talent, they created some narratives around the dresses.
It was certainly better than last year when Jasmine and
Paulini didn't even get a chair to sit on. Are
tough fits. They had to pull in a like a
random thing at the last minute. But you know, I'm
not trying to criticize.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
It's just more bring over that stool.
Speaker 4 (41:13):
You're like, uh, we couldn't get it to match, but
she has to sit So again, I see that they're
making some effort. It's just not enough and it's not
fast enough, and it's not optimized enough. And the voices
that are on the outside trying to get in a
lot of cases applying for these media credentials trying to
help you guys, and then the agencies and the creators
are all going to men also instead of a lot
(41:34):
of really good storytellers. Is again not a new thing,
but it's again a massive opportunity for I was at
an investor.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
I just want to come men.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
It's always the men somehow benefits and these content creators
are They're like, oh, well they're women's so we won't anyway.
That's it's hard not to see this all is extremely gendered.
I was at an investment event last night. A friend
is starting Chrystalis Collective, which is about funding women in
sports startup tech, and I met with a couple of
(42:06):
women Sapna shout out to shop Sapnam Melissa, both investors
who put their money where their mouth is with investments.
And they were telling us that they listened to the
podcast and they like, we disagree, and I said, well,
it's real.
Speaker 2 (42:17):
We did just disagree. You should see the facial expressions.
We're going to start filming this and putting on YouTube.
How does everyone feel about that? Let us know about
that on the socials as well, because then you get
to see Caitlin's facial expressions or mine when we do disagree,
and it is often.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
It's often, but that's I mean, listen to this part
of me.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
I'm an air, she's a cancer.
Speaker 4 (42:35):
It's just no chance that we're not going to disagree
on things inevitable. I just want to say to wrap
this up, you know there we got one more thing
to talk. All these women on the outside and all
these people and all these creators who are brilliant, like
Anastasia for so we did a podcast with Live before
the French shopmen, and I would just love for them
to be have there have there be their work work
(42:55):
embraced by the men mainstream of the sport. And until
they let people in the door, will keep knocking it
down because we're not going away.
Speaker 2 (43:02):
There is nothing better than having behind the scenes look
at stuff from the players and from the people that
are there on that you know all the time. Anyway,
So yes shouted out to all of the parties, all
of them a T P W T A major's a
T P I I I T F strain open. Let's
(43:22):
say strain open should do it first. Because Craig tile
is usually so strong.
Speaker 3 (43:25):
Open is usually the the Craig head.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
Of you're listening Craig Craig.
Speaker 3 (43:29):
Well, Craig's not the problem. Craig's like innovating out the ad.
Craig problem should be.
Speaker 2 (43:34):
What I'm saying is he is the usually the start
of everything. Okay, when it comes to the led screens,
Strain Open gets it, USDA gets it. We built the built,
we built the roof before people even thought that there
was rain, and we did it really for heat. But
but yeah, anyway, so listen, we're going to throw it
out there, Strain open. Let creators put out anything they want,
(43:55):
Let the fans put out anything they want. Let's give
it a go. See how how many more tickets you sell.
Last thing we want to talk about before we end this,
because I know Caitlin, you've got to go because you
apparently are busy all the time where you're going to
play paddle? By the way, do we talk about my paddle?
We did a couple weeks ago.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
How much I love it?
Speaker 4 (44:12):
You traded a pegman most of the time I did,
and it worked. Didn't that work? Incorrect?
Speaker 2 (44:16):
I did make a comment today on socials. You know
how much I love that. I'm the about Arena Sablanca
playing Nick kiro and someone said, I'm sure.
Speaker 3 (44:28):
I'm not sure I could sigh any louder than that.
I want to a loud to sigh I have.
Speaker 2 (44:32):
I want to read the actual quote, and it says
from James Hansen, the Battle of the Sexes has a
significant place in tennis history. In Arena Sabalanca Nick Currious's version,
it's unclear what is at stake beyond the comment modification.
Thank you, no comment, I can't read modatization. Yeah, yep, okay,
(44:56):
thanks yep.
Speaker 3 (44:58):
Here we got it, keep it going.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
We got it of the name and an invitation to
criticize women's tennis after either result. Thank you James for
writing that. And he posts The New York Times dot
com has the entire little at the Atlantic written by
(45:19):
I like to give them credit the athletic tennis stuff.
It just says the athletic tenni stuff.
Speaker 3 (45:23):
Yeah. I thought that piece was good and fair.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
Yeah, And I wrote, oh boy, because I had to
make a comment on it, shouldn't And I said, yeah,
the one fifty years ago, not this. Yes, you know,
they're saying it's a significant place in tennis history, and
he's kind of making fun of that, and I said, yeah,
the one fifty years ago was important when it was
(45:48):
women trying to fight for equality and women's rights in
the United States. That's when it was important. When we
had fifty thousand or eighty thousand plus people in the
Metrodiamond Houston watching it, the whole country watching it. No
one gives a fuck about what's happening with Arena Sabalanca
and Nick Curios. I mean, the only reason they're putting
this on is because it is literally their company Evolve,
(46:10):
Who's a sponsor, Who's who's their management company? Is going
We're gonna make a bit of money here. Does it
would be good? Get it on TV, sell a few tickets?
But what is in this for women's tennis? And Nick
curios at? I mean, unless he's hurt, like really hurt
and can't run at all, he is going to win
(46:30):
this match so easily. It's just a fact male tennis players,
especially someone as good as Nick Curios, if he's playing
at fifty percent, he's going to win that match. And
it just it just doesn't make sense to me. Is
it going to be a like? Is is Sabalanca going
to be serious? Is it going to be like a joke?
Is it like?
Speaker 4 (46:49):
I just it's I'm going to say a few things
that are informed by an afternoon. I spent last year
with Billy Jean King. Billy and Alana asked me to
go up to a retirement community where Billy's mother in law,
(47:10):
Alana Claus's mother had spent the last years of her life,
and to speak and to interview her in front of
a group of assembled seniors in their families. So cute,
it was amazing, So obviously I said, yes, what time
should I be there?
Speaker 3 (47:23):
I mean, what should I wear so that we could
be matching if.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
People know Caitlin's love for Billy Jeane as all of us.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
As all of us.
Speaker 4 (47:31):
I've spoken about that before, and I won't bore you
guys with what that means to me to be asked.
But I said, yes, of course, I'll gladly be there.
I got up on stage with her, and before I
could even ask her a question, the amount of women
who stood up and said, you changed my life because
I felt like I could leave an abusive husband. You
changed my life because I could get a credit card.
(47:53):
You changed my life because my daughter could go to college.
You changed my life because X, Y and Z right,
And I'm one of those people, as are you, And
you know the past is not past, it is living
with us every day. And if anybody wants to look
at rights that have been clawed out of selfish hands
(48:16):
and their ability to be rolled back, look no further
than the predicament that women in this country face as
second class citizens, literally not in control of our own bodies.
So I am tempted to make fun of this event
to such an extreme degree. I am tempted to ex
curate the organizers for irresponsibility, for callousness, for cynicism, for
(48:37):
cash grabs. I'm tempted to do all those things because
I know that this, in no way, shape or form
will be helpful to anyone except maybe the bank accounts
of a few cynical people involved. And I'm saddened by
the irresponsibility and callousness in which this is being organized,
and I can only hope it is dismissed as the stupid,
(49:00):
trait and insignificant and meaningless event that it is destined
to be, because giving it any credence whatsoever as saying
anything about politics, gender, the people involved, or what our
society should take away from it, is giving it far
too much credit and I would go on, except I
(49:21):
truly don't believe that anybody involved in it has the
intellectual capacity to understand what it is that they're doing.
Speaker 3 (49:28):
And so all I'll say is this is a fucking shame.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
Wow. That is the most aggressive I've ever heard you,
ladies and gentlemen. Caitlin Thompson, that's all I have has
been put on notice. You've all been put on notice.
This is Caitlin. When her crab the shell comes up,
we've got a long fuse and the crab claws come
out here they are.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
Fuck all y'all. Wow, that's what I'm saying. Let's not
in a positive note because I want to give it
a shout out.
Speaker 2 (49:56):
So basically, you're telling me you're not a fan of it.
I don't love it, Okay, I'm just wanted to play.
I don't know how does everyone else feel about it
out there? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (50:04):
Anyway, I don't love it. I do want to You
drew my attention to.
Speaker 4 (50:09):
A wonderful little moment of cross cultural harmony that I
did not know I missed it. Russian player on a Blankova.
Speaker 2 (50:15):
Yes, what a positive note to end on.
Speaker 3 (50:18):
Thank you for remembering we've been really are the best.
Speaker 2 (50:20):
Usually I write things down so I don't forget them
because you know, memory and all getting a little less.
I mean, I just love her so much. Blinkova is like,
literally one of my favorite what a delete. Everyone out
there who watches tennis would have seen her play one
of the greatest, if not well for sure one of
the greatest. Let's say, Borg McEnroe is probably the greatest
(50:40):
tie break of all time, but the tiebreak of all
tie breaks, which is the tie break that's broken every record.
It was, of course Blinkova playing against Rebarking a couple
of years ago at this Strain Open. I had the
pleasure of coiling that for ESPN with Chris Fowler, and
Chris and I are not shy in the words that
we can use. We like to talk. We were speechless
watching that. It was just like none stopped looking at
(51:00):
each other, like what the fuck are we watching? It
was the most umbelious. So you remember blink over from
that mats for the people that forget who she is.
And then she goes and wins a tournament in China,
and god lover gets up there and starts thanking the
fans and speaking to them in Chinese and.
Speaker 1 (51:15):
She killed it.
Speaker 3 (51:16):
She killed it.
Speaker 2 (51:17):
She's the cutest thing ever. She is Caitlin. When I
tell you, there's not a day that goes by, no
matter what happens. I've told this story on the pod
where she played against Sam Stows and doubles in Cincinnati.
Her and her partner were up like five to one
and the third or whatever it was a five to
one in the second set, a set in five to
one something. They end up losing to Sam and Shwey
(51:38):
and Shwae and Sam then went on to win the
Tournament of Cincinnati and then the US Open. And after
this match, she's on the bike next to Sam cooling down,
and I'm like, oh my god, I would kill myself
if I was this team if I lost that match, Right.
Speaker 3 (51:51):
That's spositive and that's true.
Speaker 2 (51:53):
I'd like, I'm walking back to the hotel. It's going
to take me four hours, but I'm going to get
there anyway. She's on the bike. I walk over, Oh,
I'm so sorry, and she looks at me. She says, oh, no,
it's okay. They played so good.
Speaker 3 (52:03):
They played so good.
Speaker 2 (52:04):
Good luck in the finals, big smile on a face.
I'm like, I would kill myself. And here's this girl,
the smile on a face, you know, saying well done
to everyone, good luck, I hope you win the tournament now,
and sweet as pie, that is Anna Blinkova. She is
never not in a good mood. She is never not
nice to everyone around her. She's never not smiling, she's
never not pleasant. And so when you see her do
(52:25):
something like that, Anna Blinkova, I loved it. Definitely one
of my favorite people.
Speaker 4 (52:28):
Don't want to teach chenellently, but uh tin Chi Lager,
John Grender Neuron, Wow, Gender.
Speaker 2 (52:35):
Would you like to interpret that for everybody else?
Speaker 3 (52:37):
Understand it and explain anyone else?
Speaker 1 (52:38):
What about our listeners, they'll understand it too, No, they won't.
Speaker 4 (52:42):
Thank you guys so much for listening. For the highs
to lows, the woes. We told you to put on
your helmets. I hope you did.
Speaker 2 (52:47):
We hope you did. We hope you enjoyed it. We've
got a lot of tennis still to cover, obviously, with
the WTO Finals, the ATP Finals coming up and next
starting next week. Oh, we needn't even mention the fact
that Sinner one Paris over faa kay Hill there as
the coach again, keep asking the question, what is Darren
k Hill going to do next year? Is he going
(53:09):
to I.
Speaker 4 (53:10):
Know all the audience is on the edge of their
seats about this, so I'm I'm really glad we're bringing
it up yet.
Speaker 2 (53:15):
All Right, everyone, thanks for joining us this week. We
look forward to hearing and we're hearing from us next week.
I hope you enjoy today and we'll see you next week. Everybody,
Bye bye,
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