October 30, 2024 • 64 mins
On this episode we talk to Dirk Eldredge who discusses his addiction to becoming a leader in recovery services. He talks about his 'white flag' moment, intervention by friends, and navigation through rehab to achieve 21 years of sobriety. He highlights the role of mentors, emphasizing the nuances of intervention, family dynamics, and working with athletes at USC and the Seattle Seahawks. The discussion touches on the challenges of relapse, the importance of trust and respect, and Pete Carroll's impactful leadership.
Keep in Touch With:
Instagram: @Seanovenice
Website: https://www.shellvenice.com/
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Everybody talks about having to hit bottom. I'm not a believer.
Coming to somebody without judgment, without condemnation, and lifting them up,
reminding them of their wonder, reminding them of why they're loved,
and then extending a gift and an opportunity to each
person to heal. Taking that action, to me is more
(00:22):
important than whether they say when are we leaving? Or
go to hell? What breaks your heart? What breaks my
heart is what happened yesterday. Family asked me to help them.
I come to in this case, Las Vegas. I've given
the address of Sentinel A hospital to go meet the
(00:43):
identified patient. In all my years, I've never had it
go down like this, But I got there so you know,
and walked into the hospital room with his sister, said hello.
Three minutes later, he flatlined and died.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Welcome back to the SINO Show. I'm your host Cina
McFarland today, who I'm joined by someone who's made it
his mission to help pledge to the journey to recovery.
He's the CEO of Elders Recovery Service, a dedicated advocate
for addiction treatment. As a leader in helping people reclaim
their lives from addiction or his work focused on providing
(01:26):
real solutions and hope to those who need it the most.
It's a privilege to have you on the show.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Welcome, brother, Welcome, welcome, welcome, Thank you, Cina, glad you're here.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Thanks brother. You are such an interesting cat.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
You really are.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Man, You're a special guy. We're gonna let everyone know
how specially you are on the beauty you do and
all the people you've helped, and how humble you are.
But that wasn't who you were all the time. Let's
just talk a little bit about your bottom, just kind
of the white flag moment and what led you into
this business.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The white flag moment would be at forty years of
age to have four of my best friends come basically
sit at the end of my bed and say we're done,
like we're done watching you in your charade.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
And how old were you?
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Well I was about forty.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
So inhuman you're tell everybod what are the alcoholic translation
is that what seventeen to eighteen? Maybe ninety?
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Well, here here's the skinny. This is the rub and
the reason I didn't give you a straight answers because
I went to treatment twice. Yeah, once was my idea like.
I literally called the only guy I knew in recovery
who ran Sampedro Recovery Center back in the day, and
I said, I think I got a problem with drugs
(02:51):
and alcohol, Pierre, can I come talk to you? And
he said sure. So I went down and three hours
later I checked in, called my wife, told her I
was in rehab. She says, like, what You're in rehab?
I said, yeah, I think I got a troubled relationship
with substance and alcohol. Yeah, but I was. You know,
it all looked good on the outside. I had a
(03:12):
white picket fence and all this stuff. So she was
a bit shocked by it. And then I went and
stayed for thirty days, sat in the front row, listened,
did everything they asked me to do, and decided I
was smarter and different than everybody else there, and then
I could manage the issue in a much different way.
And as we say in the rooms, you know, I
(03:35):
did three or four more years of research and then
ended up in the er half a dozen times in
a couple of months. And the last one of those times,
my buddies came and changed my life forever. They just said,
we're done watching your live.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Why did they say something? Was the seriousness of their talkue?
Was it that you knew they were actually done?
Speaker 1 (04:01):
What was it that it was? It was that it
was like iality of it. I've been gifted throughout life
with some like blessed with really good friends, and this
particular group was a group I went through USC with
and then early adult life, you know, after graduation while
(04:21):
we're trying to figure out what we're going to do
the rest of our lives. Just some really good dudes,
and they showed up for me. They didn't know, you know,
they'd been partying with me, but they didn't party when
they rolled out of bed. They waited till Friday night, right,
And I just kept the party going from USC on
for twenty years as a high functioning alcoholic addict that
(04:42):
never missed a day of using wow Like, but I
never missed a day of work either, So you know,
I was very gifted at manipulation and deception and certainly denial.
But just like making everybody think that everything was fine,
and the only person that knew it wasn't was me.
(05:02):
I was depressed and anxious and driven by a hundred
forms of fear and a tremendous amount of low self esteem.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Mm m mmm mmmmm. It's a lot of work being
an active addiction, Isn't.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
It absolutely exhausting?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Eh, so it's not. Yeah, how long ago was that?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Well, two thousand and three, June third is my sober date.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
So you know.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
I went up to Creative Care in Malibu because one
of my buddies that showed up lived next door to
doctor K who owned the place, and asked him if
he had a room for his buddy in the morning,
like getting the paper at the end of the driveway
kind of shit, and doctor K, who's a good man,
said yeah, bring him. So a couple hours later, I
(05:47):
was knocking on the door. It's a beautiful therapist named
Dominique answered the door and she said, who are you?
And it was me with my board, shorts and flip
flops and my towel around me. I still have not
towel blanket. I still have the blanket. But I looked
at Dominique and I said, my name's Dirk, and I
don't know how to do life. Can you teach me
(06:08):
how to do life?
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Was that a pickup line? Did you actually mean that? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I would have run away with her at that moment.
But no, I was totally legit.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
You were serious, you had at that's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
I was just it was exhausted. Like you said, it
was like it was all a ruse and it looked
pretty good on the outside as a high functioning addict,
but I was absolutely miserable.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I think you'll agree, and if you don't, you'll tell me.
Like my phone rings off the hook with people wanting
to help in different things, and I always say the
same thing. It just I think you have to be
sick and tired of being sick. I always come back
to that. Do you know anything else? Is there anything else?
Speaker 1 (06:47):
No? I mean a it's you know. We had so
many sayings and most of them, most of them just
make me want to throw up, honestly. But that one sticks,
It sticks, right, That one works?
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Sure?
Speaker 2 (06:57):
And so you've been sober? How long? Now?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Twenty one years?
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Wow? Right on? Good for you. And let's talk about
how you pivoted in this work and some of the
great places you've worked. And I want to break it
down some of the things you've done in some of
your teachings and about real skill sets to help people.
What made you say I want to do this business.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Well, it's a funny story. Doctor Randy Gunther, who was
my therapist.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Oh my god, I'm remember that name forever.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
And she's an author. She's a badass woman that is
still working hard, just beating cancer. And that's all. We
could talk for hours about Randy Gunter. Look her up.
She's written books about relationships and what have you. But
she was my therapist. And when I left Creative care,
I drove to a printing company that I worked at
(07:51):
and helped run and said, I'm resigning. You'll never see
me again, thank you very much. And then I drove
from there to LMU to study addictionology because I, for
the first time in my life, in that second treatment experience,
recognized the power of recovery, certainly in the opportunity to heal,
(08:12):
which I never really believed I had. But doctor Gunther
kind of pushed me in that direction. And then she
saw something new, she saw something, and I went away
to treatment, came back on that same day and looked
at her and said, I just quit my job, Like,
what am I going to do now? And she looked
(08:34):
at me and said, You're going to be an interventionist
and I'm like, what the fuck is that? Like, I
really I had no idea what it even meant. And
she said, well, the godfather of it, the guy that
wrote the book, Ed Storty, is about five miles from here.
So all you've got to do is convince him to
give you some of his time. And I was like
a dog on a bone. I'm like, I'll get that done.
(08:57):
And I called him and I had to stalk him
from a couple of weeks until he was in sam Pedro. Yeah,
wonderful guy, still a dear friend, but that in that moment,
he was the man. He was the guy I was
going to learn from. And you know, he could have
been anywhere in the country and he was literally five
miles from where I was sitting. So Ed and I
(09:19):
became great friends, and I was gifted with sitting second
chair with him I did, and watching him do his thing.
You know, the dude wears a tie every day. I mean,
he's buttoned up like to the nth degree. He's just
a class act, a man of exceptional character and integrity.
And we became friends, and he gave me what he
(09:41):
had and I ran with it. I was like investing
in him. And another guy named Keith Fearman who was
other side of the country, Alabama guy, great gifted interventionist.
Learned a ton from Keith, and between those two guys,
I knew that that's what I wanted to do. Like
(10:02):
somehow the crazier shit gets the calmer I got. And
you know, like having Thanksgiving dinner can be much more
anxiety provoking than talking to a methadic with an automatic
weapon in his hand. It's just like, I don't know why,
but that's just what happens.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
I know, I can go in the hood and get
you know, mix it up with pimps and everybody, but
packing my luggage it just drives me. Don't think I'm
gonna drink again.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Exactly. So anyhow, that's I mean, that's how it was
born from doctor Gunther and then ed sorty kind of
showed up as this affirming older guy that I kind
of thought and still think, hung the moon. And I
got to learn from the best, and it was like
(10:47):
the more I did them, the more I enjoyed the
process of it. I mean, I think it's gotten hacked
up a lot, a lot, and it's a very intimate
relationship with families that are, you know, rolling the dice
on at the time, a complete stranger basically to come
in their living room and navigate this process. And I
(11:08):
take it very seriously and I absolutely love it. I
mean I've traveled as far away as Bangladesh doing it
and it's like it's a pretty cool thing because I
think they're best described and defined as living eulogies like
we're we're going to die or we're going to live
these really marginalized lives that are nowhere near kind of
(11:30):
showing up as the best version of our most authentic self.
You know, quite the contrary.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Derek, You're the perfect guide answer this question. You know
the listeners. When do we intervene on our son, our daughter,
our father, our uncle? When do we When is the
right time to do that? When you walk us through
that process.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Absolutely, I think action, like taking action and understanding expectations
is the key. Meaning to me, you can like it
falls into the category of you can pretend to care
or care about and love on somebody, but you can't
pretend to show up for them. So to me, working
(12:11):
with families that are curious and they're seeing this thing,
this progressive thing evolve in living color in their lives,
and I think oftentimes we wait too long until things.
You know, everybody talks about having to hit bottom. I'm
not a believer. I think coming to somebody without judgment,
(12:33):
without condemnation, and lifting them up, reminding them of their wonder,
reminding them of why they're loved, and then extending a
gift and an opportunity to each person to heal. Like
taking that action, to me is more important than whether
they say when are we leaving or go to hell?
(12:55):
I'm you know, get out of my get out of
my life. Like showing up and extending that opportunity, whether
it goes down in that moment or six years later,
to me, is a much smarter play than waiting until
you know, the train wreck or a series of train wrecks.
So I'd like to encourage delivering the message because that's
(13:18):
the only thing we can control anyway, Like we can't
throw these people over there our shoulders and drag them
into treatment, like I think sometimes that gets lost, Like
this is a gift. This is a huge gift, and
whether you accept the gift or not is up to you.
But to extend that kind of grace and say, hey,
(13:41):
you know, if you want out of this hamster cage
that you're on, or if you want out of this
dysfunction that you're sitting in, there is in fact a
way out, Like let's surrender right here, right now. Kind
of like me at the front door of Creative Care
was like I literally did not know how to do
(14:02):
life like which, you know, that's the essence of my
whole recovery process over the last couple of decades has
been just that, like trying to figure out how to
love myself and another human being. Like we didn't talk
about that kind of shit in my household, Like we
(14:23):
were mechanical, event driven young people that were trying to
please our parents or my parents, And it's just like
I didn't get to talk about my fear. I didn't
get to talk about what the hell am I supposed
to do with my life? Or I'm scared, you know
I was. It was all kind of a performance based
(14:46):
model that as soon as I did my first bong hit,
I was like, okay, I've been chasing after the wrong thing.
M m mmm, and just put it all down.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
When how did your heart get cracked in sobriety that
way to actually start loving yourself actually start looking at
the trauma, actually start looking at you know, man, there's
a lot I need to learn still about life.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yeah, I think a couple of really gifted therapists, but
the one primaries is doctor Randy. Like, she allowed me
to look inside myself. I thought I thought the answers
were all out here, like what you think of me,
(15:30):
what she thinks of me? Like everything was external. That
was kind of the paradigm in which I grew up,
Like exceeding academic expectation, athletic expectation, all of these things
outside of myself were replaced by my first opportunity at
(15:51):
forty years old to recognize that peace and happiness and
serenity are all inside myself. Like that was totally contradictory
to everything that I believed. Like I thought that I
was in some kind of a play, and it's been.
(16:13):
That's why I think there's so many grateful addicts and
alcoholics that have done a bunch of work and recognize
that nobody can take that away from us except ourselves. Amen.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Right on, Wow, Okay, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. Let's talk
about this then, Jaywalker Ranch Lodge Lodge, when were you.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
There twenty fifteen.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
Through nineteen Right, talk, what's the specialty in the program there?
And I want to break that down a little bit.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
It's a cool program. Right. Bobby Ferguson, the founder, dear friend,
wonderful guy, long term recovery. He had this awareness. He
went through Hazleton for his recovery, learned a lot and
founded Jaywalker Lodge based on his belief that what I
(17:10):
really need is a good friend, and I need healthy
community with that friendship. And Bobby birthed Jaywalker based on
community and Step one. But his belief was thirty days
doesn't work. Ninety days will create better outcomes. And if
(17:32):
we can place this thing in this case Jaywalker Lodge
in a place where community is easy to navigate, meaning
not a lot of cars are needed, you know, because
a lot of us are restricted there. But he picked
this beautiful place in Carbondale, Colorado with all the amenities
you'll ever need in walking distance. Wow, and built a
(17:56):
beautiful place based on his vision. And you know, not
only was he right about the ninety days, you know,
we've since found out that you know, if nineties better
than thirty, then one hundred and twenty or a year
is going to merit even greater outcomes. So the magic
of Jaywalker is really born out of the fact that
(18:16):
if you and I go there from you from New York,
me from LA we just we just might stay, meaning,
you know, trying to figure out how to do this
life sober and recognize what a quality friendship looks like
and have it be so galvanizing that you don't want
to leave.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Interesting. I love that, And then I always thought, as
that place is kind of the last stop for people
at are chronic relapses.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
That's brand recognition. That is that true? Well, yeah, it's
it's true, but like a lot of things, it's it's
a generalization. But most everybody, not everybody, but most everybody
that went through and goes through Jaywalker, which is still
a great place, and on this day is going there
after whatever, two, three, ten other treatment experiences that didn't
(19:09):
work out so well?
Speaker 2 (19:10):
Right, Why do people relapse?
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Why do people relapse?
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Boom, Yeah, you know, I'm gonna come in quick, brother.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
No, it's a great question. I would suggest that that
is done with self will, reigniting over God's will. Like
as soon as I creep back, and I do several
times a day, creep back into Dirk's will versus God's will.
And to me, the more often I'm doing that and
(19:39):
maybe conveniently not recognizing that that's exactly what I'm doing,
I'm getting closer to a relapse. Pat answers would be,
you know, not pat, but common answers would be to
increased isolation, maybe you know, lack of a focus on
(20:00):
service and giving yourself away. It's a it's an insidious foe, right,
we know that, and so it's sneaky and it sits
on our shoulder. And I think as soon as we
are respect for what we're truly dealing with ways, then
we're setting ourselves up for relapse.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Beautiful. Let me add to that. I think it's uh,
I always talk to people. If you've got a secret
and you can't share it in the rooms you're getting ready,
it's possibility relapse if you're keeping secrets.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
And then the other thing is, I don't these guys like,
I don't know. I just was at the bar and
I had a drink and I you know, I was
at mcgilla Cuddies a happy hour. The relapse for me
starts the moment you're thinking about going to mcgilla cuddies.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Yeah, that's the nine one one moment. Yeah, along the
same lines. Relapses are happening long before we're picking up exactly.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Talk about that in your experience with working with so
many people.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
We just see again self will taking charge, exceptions being
made to things that worked. I always come back to respect, Like,
if I don't respect the beast right, it's going to
eat me right. And I don't give a shit if
you got two days or twenty thirty, forty years, it
doesn't matter. Like we the other we were talking about
(21:18):
sayings earlier, but like to me, if we're not sitting
on top of the fact that I can't give away
what I don't have, and if I'm not taking care
of my own program and my own work, then it's
going to slip away. And we're gonna we're going to
begin doing that long before we actually pick up.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
How did Pete Carroll come in your consciousness.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
By the grace of God? Yeah, we Pete and I
share a friend. He wouldn't mind doctor Maser like, he's
a dear friend of Pete's and mine. And when Pete
was coaching at USC, he was talking to doctor Macer
and said you know, talked about some troubled with a
(22:08):
coach and a player, and doctor Maser said, why don't
you call my buddy Dirk. So he ended up calling
me and hiring me to do two different interventions, one
on a player and one on a coach, two completely
separate events. But through those two processes, Pete and I
(22:30):
struck up a friendship and a relationship, and he's one
of the best leaders I've ever had a chance to
be around. And when he asked me a couple of
months into this process if I would be the life
coach for at the time, the USC Trojan guys, it was,
you know, something I'd never imagined doing and was privileged
(22:54):
to have the ask from Pete, and I jumped on it.
And you know, the problem with going back to your
where I graduated, where my disease was born. Basically it
wasn't a problem. But a year into that Pete decided
to go to Seattle.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
You did the job. You did it for one year.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Yeah, here back and it was kind of cool because
I mean, I was a complete moron at USC, Like
I regressed, like I got dumber, not not brighter with
my college. And I'm not proud of that, but that's
the truth of the matter. Like I went backwards, not forwards.
So there was something poetic about going back and helping
(23:37):
kids that are struggling at the same place that I struggled.
And that's how it started, and it was really it
was really kind of good.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Before we go to the Seahawks, talk to me about
what was it like. Walk me through a day at
SC working with the athletes there. What were you doing exactly?
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Lots of different things, making sure certain students got to
the right place at the right time. Some of them
got distracted on their way to class, for example, so
there was a little bit of handholding going on, but
mostly it was good position coaches that knew their guys right.
(24:18):
On a football team, you know, everybody talks about the
head coach, which is hugely important, but each of those
head coaches would tell you the most important thing is
their staff, right. So their staff at SC was very gifted,
obviously and paying attention. So they if they were working
with five or ten guys, they knew who was struggling
and who wasn't. So they would bring me in and
(24:40):
plug me into guys that were struggling with everything from
fear of playing football, or you know, a struggle relationship
wise that wasn't fitting, or class or you know, any
number of obvious challenging areas for student athletes. And they
(25:00):
would plug me in and say, hey, you know so
and so you're going to spend a couple hours a
week with Dirk. He's our guy. He's helping with with
this and that. And I would strike up relationships with
those guys and get to know them on an intimate level.
Sometimes they're families, and basically just help them navigate this,
(25:24):
you know, this life in college, which was, you know,
at USC, larger than life. It's a pretty big stage.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Especially at that time. We were some of the best
college football in America going on down there.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Oh yeah, I mean Reggie Bush was kind of he
still is the best that ever played college. Yeah, so
you know that's how it started, And how did you
get the trust of the players? Trust is earned? You know,
it takes time, as you know better than anybody, and
it takes about a second to lose it. And I
(25:56):
just I mad made the same decision with them that
I do with anybody I interact with, and that is
that I'm going to hold certain things sacred and if
if there's something margin on the margin, I'm going to
ask permission. But I am not going to talk to
your coaches, parents, girlfriends, or anybody else about it unless
you tell me that that's what we're going to do,
(26:18):
and just you know, create a safe container for kids to,
you know, from all kinds of different backgrounds to navigate
some pretty exceptionally dicey landscape. There's a lot of distraction
going on, especially at that time.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Yeah, I always saw Coach Carrol was so ahead of
the curve on it. He just saw something. You obviously
saw something in you, but he knew there was a
need for it.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Absolutely, He's he is outside the box thinker. He's an
organic leader that is authentic. And I think sometimes and
I know for a fact at Seattle, it took, I
would say that first year for that whole organization to
(27:03):
recognize that not only is the authentic, he can sustain it.
He has greater focus, greater energy, greater leadership capabilities than
most anybody you'll ever Yeah, how can a guy this
old move that fast, like not just physically but emotionally
and like he's he's a charismatic leader that is infectious.
(27:29):
I just think like any good leader, if it's if
it's you can you can see what's real and what's not.
And Pete Carroll is legit because it's coming out of
his pores. He competes, for example, at everything you know,
and he makes it fun. But that's one of his
(27:49):
of his foundational pieces, is that we're going to compete
in whatever arena we're in and and that was his
and and that will always be his. But he brings
people along by modeling the kind of behavior that he
expects from others.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
It's those are the best teachers.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
Yeah, I mean, screwood comes out of your mouth? Yeah right?
Speaker 2 (28:09):
How are you living your life?
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (28:11):
What what was it like going from the college level
to the pro level? Did they different? Respect, take it
longer for the buying on you, more attitude, more like
checking you out, more like what the fuck?
Speaker 1 (28:29):
Certainly it was different, and you're hitting on some of
the major pieces as to why. But in college, if
Kenny Norton says, hey, you're gonna go see Dirk two
hours a week for the rest of the year, you
know Sino is going, yes, sir, right, and same Sino
in the locker room up in Seattle, you look at
(28:49):
Kenny and goes say, go fuck yourself right like it's
you don't. You don't have that kind of control. So
it's really a harder, a longer runway to earn trust.
So I would I would again, and this time on
myself in Seattle, I would say I was not wholly
(29:10):
but primarily ineffective for a year wow, because none of
the guys would be quick to trust. I mean, the
rules are different and on every level. So you know,
again it's showing up doing the right thing, staying out
of the results, and making sure that my primary objective
(29:33):
is to hold safe a safe container for people to
do their work. I mean, my best work in Seattle
was done in the sauna.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
Yeah, yeah, talk to people. Why that is? It's right.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
I'm not that bright and I didn't play that movie through.
But the fact of the matter is, you know, for
all the obvious reasons, it's quiet, it's you know, we're
alone most of the time, and I feel safe enough
to talk to this guy at this point because I
you know, we've spent some time maybe at dinner, go
(30:06):
for a walk, whatever. But whenever the guys got in
the sauna, they just started talking and I'm like, son
of a bitch, I'm gonna die in these dast I mean,
I'm it's amazing how many hours in a day that
I would be in the sauna. Once I figured it out,
like this is magic, what's happening in this thing? And
(30:29):
so up in the in Seattle, it took a little
bit longer, but then it took off. And because players
talk to each other obviously, and like if one guy says,
you know, there's a good dude and he's safe, then
another guy is going to try, and then another guy
is going to try. So it took it took a
little longer. And the truth is, numbers wise, I didn't
(30:53):
help as many guys as I did in college because
some guys just weren't able to trust. And that's okay.
But it was like there was plenty of work and
plenty of you know, kind of rich opportunities to show
up for people and kind of have a servant's heart
with no agenda.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
You know what I think is so beautiful about that, Derek,
And I think it's one of the reasons why you're
so good at what you do. It requires a different
level of patience to do that, and you don't attack.
It's like, why don't you guys want to deal with me?
That's never the style. It doesn't work that way. They'll
come when they'll come. Yeah, I'm gonna keep showing it.
I'm going to keep being here for them, right, And
(31:34):
it's that's that's talk about that because a year's a
long time. The art of patients are art of letting
them have their space, the art of just letting modeling
like I'm here, I'm patient, I'm kind whenever you're ready,
you move it, your space, your terms. Can you talk
about that, well.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
It's patience. It's like it's people will come when they
see something that's attractive to them and that they want.
And if I can show up not only in the
locker room at Seattle, but in my family room, in
every room as a safe place, you know, where somebody's
gonna actually listen. It was about showing up and just
(32:15):
exhibiting whatever it is that I was feeling in a
given moment, just like modeling a little bit of this
transparency that I think is so healthy that all of
us are somewhat forgetting along the road. But to you know,
back to the sick as your secrets piece It's like
(32:36):
I don't have any secrets. Like, I'll tell you I'm
scared shitless right now. I love that, right man, And
it's the I don't I'm never gonna deviate from that
for the balance of my days. It's like I am.
I think we all are doing far too much acting
and not enough being amen.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
I always tell people the buy in is I'm scared
and I need help.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
Yeah, you can never go wrong with that.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
Yeah, right, Rick, let me ask you this, okay?
Speaker 1 (33:05):
On that?
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Oh I was gonna say, it also helps. And see
how you started winning a lot?
Speaker 1 (33:10):
Yeah, winning is good.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Manage. You talk to this dirt thing, you know, and
you know you gotta go to a couple of Super Bowls?
Speaker 1 (33:18):
Yeah yeah, super Bowl ring, right, brother? Yeah, I got
about that.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
What was that? Like?
Speaker 1 (33:21):
It was magic?
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Talk about that?
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Jesus Well, I'll just I don't know. John Schnyder, the
GM up there, the whole organization just class acts and
I would argue the best defense ever. I mean, wow, yeah,
Cam Chancellor, Richard Sherman, Earl Thomas, Bobby Wagner all in
the back. I mean it's like, yeah, there were some
serious badasses that were kicking ass and taking names and
(33:47):
having fun. Yeah. Just it was a privilege really just
to be in that space and to ride that wave
and show up and and love on these guys. And
you know, I remember met Life Stadium was the only
uh Winter City super Bowl in history, and they pulled
(34:09):
it off by less than twenty four hours. The next
day was a huge blizzard. Wow. And but they, I mean,
the New York execs. I made this up in my mind.
I don't know what the truth is, but I'll go,
if I'm living and running the NFL out of New
York City, I'm gonna say, fuck it, I'm gonna have
a super Bowl in New York City. Well that was
the one we got to. And you know, at the
(34:30):
end of the game, watching all the guys run around
and the coaches and the families, Confetti falling down.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Denver, right, Peyton Manning?
Speaker 1 (34:38):
Yeah, what was the score?
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Like forty nine?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
We kicked their ass, killed them, right, it was. I
mean the snap of the first snap of the game
went right by his head.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
What was the other one? The lost to New England?
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Yes, and you didn't you didn't need to bring that up?
Speaker 2 (34:52):
Well no, no, but I did. You know what I got
to right up is because like, walk me through talking
to these guys after that game? What was that like
for you?
Speaker 1 (35:01):
There was no talking after that game.
Speaker 2 (35:02):
It was just silence.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
Well yeah, it was actually pretty dark, but it was difficult,
difficult situation for everybody involved. Wow, lots of uh, some
finger pointing, you know, just I think kind of natural
human reactions to something that shocking. Like if you're in
(35:25):
that position one hundred times ninety nine of them, you're
going to score. I mean, you got the best running
back in the NFL sitting there with four downs to
go one yard. But it's easy to second guess, right right,
But when that went down, there was a lot of
second guessing, as any organization would have, but it was different.
(35:48):
It was a little bit scary.
Speaker 2 (35:50):
I bet. I mean, I mean, as you know, the
spiritual leading or spiritual guy there and then you know,
I mean what was that like for you? Just just
holding space for people and just knowing a lot of
a lot of energy was going on a lot of
What was that for you personally? What was your inner
life work like that moment?
Speaker 1 (36:11):
I was sad for the guys, for the organization, was
I was overwhelmed with sadness because I'm just a freakishly
emotional human being.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
I should in your buddy, Pete.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
I mean that must have been Yeah. I mean he
you know, to me, he's always done a great job.
And I go back to Texas and USC.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
Well you bring up my PTSD.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Yeah, but like Pete said it right and it was legit,
and I think it was something along the lines of,
you know, twenty seconds doesn't define you, right, you know,
the body of work, the ground we've covered, so you
can almost always spin that. But with the Super Bowl piece,
(36:55):
it was really ramped up a notch with players feeling
very strongly, coaches feeling, you know, a lot of pressure
forget about me. But like if you're Darryl Bubble, the
OC on that game, there's a lot of heat right
about that call, and Pete, being the leader that he is,
(37:18):
took it like like he made the call, but he didn't.
Daryl Bubble made the call. But that shows you a
little bit about who Pete is and the fact that
he took one hundred percent ownership of that. But yeah,
it was just tough.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
It was a tough day.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Did the players reach out to you weeks afterwards and
want to check in with you did a.
Speaker 1 (37:40):
Lot of them. Yeah, I still keep in touch with
a lot of them. They're really beautiful people. You know,
like any organization, there there's assholes and there's sure people
that you want to grow old with. And that particular
team was primarily a bunch of really.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Good peoples and recovery and what breaks your heart.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
What breaks my heart is what happened yesterday. You know,
a family asked me to help them. I come to
in this case, Las Vegas. I've given the address of
Sentinel a hospital to go meet the identified patient. And
(38:25):
in all my years, I've never had to go down
like this. But I got there so, you know, and
walked into the hospital room with his sister, said hello,
and three minutes later he flatlined.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
And died three minutes later.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
Literally three minutes after I met him. Forty year old,
forty year old with kids and a great family, and
he drugs alcohol, both he it was drugs and alcohol.
But his his latest thing and the thing that took
(39:05):
him ultimately was whippets. Oh why Wow nitrous. His brother
found him in the bathroom. Wow. Nobody expected him to die.
He'd been on a respirator. They pulled it. He was
doing great coming back, you know, our bodies are amazing
that way. But literally three minutes and he was dead.
(39:28):
And I'm like, we waited too long, you know, because
like some of the backstory with this particular family was
like a lot of families they're faced with. And you
asked me a minute ago, you know, when do you
do an intervention? Well, you do it now now, Yeah,
not because you can control the outcome, but because you
(39:49):
can take the action right, And it's like that's always
better than waiting, because you don't nobody knows, right, Like,
why the hell are you? And I said here, you know,
why did we get to live? Because we lose so
many amazing people, And that's why I want to I
(40:12):
want to show up for my inner circle of friends,
my kiddos being the most important, and my bride and
then like we got to we got to do a
better job of getting back to to you know, I'm
gonna sound like an old old school dog, but the
fact of the matter is we suck at listening. And
(40:35):
I see the art of listening as maybe the most
important puzzle piece in human relationships that exists. And again,
I guess I don't give a shit if people think
I'm an old dog, but that you know, the whole
cell phone thing and laptop thing as opposed to doing
what we're doing here sitting down and talking. I think
(40:59):
we're missing the mark and I think it's going to
come at a tremendous cost. But like, my dad was
a big, big guy on the English language as well
as listening, and he gave me that. And you know,
I suppose I wish he would have listened to me
a little bit more, but he didn't. But he taught
(41:23):
me about the importance of listening. And I think much
of my approach in life and certainly in the process
of intervention, is to take my listening game up a notch,
like to hear people, to actually meet them where they are,
as opposed to where we think they ought to be
or where they could be, but to really kind of
(41:45):
get down in the dirt with everybody and hear them, Like,
I don't know that there's a better gift we can
give one another.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
Active listening is the most powerful thing. I'm right there
with you, man, I actually just talked about it with
the show before. It's very powerful. So you saw that
young man forty flatline and it just boomed. It just sobering, right.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
Yeah, And it wasn't anything to do with me. But
I'm in the middle of the room, so I was
trying to figure out where to take myself because family
was rolling in and it was my heart was broken.
But the stream of family and anybody, I mean, most
(42:33):
of us have seen or been around that before, but
this was different for me because I really didn't know
the identified patient particularly well. Knew his sister real well,
but nobody else. And I just found myself in this
moment where like, if somebody wants to cry or pray
or just hold one another, like I'm here, and if not,
(42:59):
you know, I kind of continued to step kind of
back out into the hallway and give the family privacy.
But it's not a situation that I'd been in before,
and I didn't want to I didn't want to overstep
and lean in too much, and I didn't want to
run away.
Speaker 2 (43:16):
I've been in that one. It's a tricky one. I
don't think there's anything sadder than seeing a family that
just lost somebody to addiction. No, it's just so fucking
painful to see that. Yeah, especially some of that age
they're never coming back done and you got you know,
he had a couple of teenage daughters that caught my
(43:38):
eye and like their brokenness was so Angela, it's just right, yeah,
I mean just looking in their eyes just like it
was like, what the fuck do I do?
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Now?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Yeah, let's just stay with that. That's people call you.
Let's just say those teenagers call you. They have already
I don't know, or I'm sure that I know you
have hunters that called like this. What do you say
to them? They just lost their father? What's the path
for them?
Speaker 1 (44:09):
Well, we know about the stages of grief, right tell
our listeners about that. Well, I don't particularly, I can't
recite them other than to know that we're all going
to experience four or five primary emotion that are going
to be fleeting, like going from sorrow to anger and
(44:29):
to denial all in a minute. But to me, it's
about allowing yourself to feel all of those feelings and
to be patient with yourself, you know, working in this space.
I don't need to ask you because I already know
like dozens, if not hundreds over the years that we've lost.
(44:54):
How do we deal with that? I guess No, matter
the relationship. I would think if Sino died today, we
would want to take the things that endeared us to
him and carry them forward, meaning to take his spirit,
to take to take the reasons we loved him, and
(45:18):
honor him moving forward each day by exhibiting those same
characteristics that drew us to you in the first place.
Like to me, that's probably the greatest gift we can
give somebody that's meant a lot to us, that's passed,
and you know, systemic families certainly a better example maybe,
(45:39):
But I think people that touch our hearts in this
life and in this journey, to not forget them is
to honor them by the way we're showing up every
day moving forward.
Speaker 2 (45:52):
The game has changed so much in the last three years,
the mental health, the fetanyl and I've also notice, and
you know, I've professionals people that I've known, or people
have long term sobriety, they're they're besides not even over,
there's checking out. Walk me through what we're up against
right now. Walk me through what you're seeing, what you're
(46:14):
doing to combat it. You're processing with all that your
awareness around that, anything that you comes to mind. That's
a big one is a big one.
Speaker 1 (46:24):
I would start with acuity seems to have ramped up,
meaning people are challenged more with mental health things meaning
depression and anxiety, isolation, all types of personality and mood disorders.
(46:46):
And I would suggest that the acuity of those disorders
is heightened since maybe the pandemic. So I think we're
dealing with a lot more people with mental health. Forget
about our coping mechanism of addiction, but I just think
(47:09):
more there's the isolation index, if I had one, I
would say is through the roof a lot of this
remote working. I don't want to go down that rabbit hole,
but it it tears us apart from communities that I
think help lift us up, maybe even subconsciously. Just being
(47:31):
around other people certainly is one puzzle piece. The flip
side of what you asked around fentanyl is an unequivocal
mathematical formula that would indicate like there's no way of
telling how much is in whatever I'm using, So we're
(47:54):
killing ourselves at unprecedented rates, And it seems impenetrable because
it's in so many places. Mmm, Like it's just there's
so many people that aren't probably even what you and
I would define as addicts. Yeah, that are dying from
(48:15):
fedanhol because they're having a good time at a party
doing Atlantic cocaine.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
It's done.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:20):
We lost five people in the canals a couple of
years ago, just five people, not and I know they
weren't addicts, just all died.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
Yeah, things are out of control. And I would argue
on the mental health side of things, it's we've probably
never been in a trick here place.
Speaker 2 (48:36):
Father Boyle he talks about when he's to give him
mask or going to the youth the detention centers, and
he sees these kids, he said, I can't get through
to them. I can just see they're staring at the
walls that I've not seen this before, right, you know.
But so what you're getting these calls from parents? What
do we fucking do dark my kids strung out? I'm
so worried he's gonna die on fetanyl. I'm so worried.
(48:59):
I don't know how to get to them. And what
do you say to them? What's the answer to that? Oh,
we're not just gonna talk about usc football.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
Brother, Come on, hell no, this is the good stuff
right now.
Speaker 2 (49:11):
You're the best man.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
I just again I'll go back to listening, like I
need to know what that house looks like. I need
to know who the players are, like the I think
backing into this by understanding the systemic family systems before
I even know anything about the identified patient is a
(49:33):
pretty keen approach because all the attention goes to the
the IP or the addict, and to backdoor it by
understanding all the cohorts that you got to have and
that I recognize. You know, any any good addict knows
you got to have the things set up in a
(49:54):
way that's sustainable. So that usually means the piece of
people closest to you are going to get your your
best bullshit, you know, the best muse because I don't
want to.
Speaker 2 (50:05):
Also know it was junkie dive here at Shelle Avenue.
Speaker 1 (50:08):
Yeah, it's like, don't pay attention to me. Everything's cool,
I'm fine, and you know today, I would suggest just
by kind of understanding the environment the identified patient shows
up in every day and understanding that piece is primary
to understanding how to best help the individual. Okay, because
(50:32):
I really think that the focus is usually more well
suited for the family than the IP.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
Right, I agree with that, Right, on Okay, you found
love in Sobriety.
Speaker 1 (50:43):
M though, Yeah, let's talk about that Stacy Lee.
Speaker 2 (50:49):
Talking about Stacey Lee, Well.
Speaker 1 (50:54):
She's magic, you know. We we our first day was
an AA meeting, We went and saw The Aviator of
the movie. Then we stayed up all night. Basically I
mean Ellen Smith, a dear friend of both of ours.
The true story is We're at the MPR watching our
six year old kids, you know, like in some play,
(51:16):
and Ellen throws her elbow into my chest and says, hey, dumbass,
And I said yeah, And she says, why don't you
take Stacy out? And I'm like, that's a pretty good idea.
So I went home because we'd known each other when
we were both married to other people. And then I
(51:37):
went away to rehab for a year and came back
and Stace was newly sober and we had her best friend.
Ellen suggests to me what I had to ask her out?
But yeah, Stacy Lee has taught me a lot, like
more than I could ever even contemplate understanding about love,
like how to love myself, how to love her, to
(52:00):
love others. She's just this super gifted psychotherapist, came from
a normal family, with some really horrific abuse from grandparents
in this case. But Stacy's healing journey took her through
(52:24):
the rooms of AA to us M University of Santa Monica,
like spiritual psychology, Like a lot of people have been
through that, and if you know anything about it, it's
fucking magic. But that's as I saw the transformation of
my bride, Stacy. It was USM and the work she
(52:44):
did there that really ignited this amazing journey that she's
on with healing. She just we're just talking about I'll
say m h our buddy Mike before the show. But
just one example of showing up for people without judgment
and holding space for somebody to go back and do
(53:08):
some work.
Speaker 2 (53:08):
The incredible capacity to love somebody, you'd be there for him.
Our friend probably wouldn't be alive without their wife's loving care.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
Why did she pick you, Ah, Why did she pick me?
Speaker 2 (53:20):
I'm not saying that in a funny, snarky way at all.
I'm just curious.
Speaker 1 (53:24):
I think she probably picked me primarily because I was sober,
Because she was married to a wonderful addict before me,
who we lost to this disease, a wonderful human being
named Steve, but she had already gone through another trauma
(53:46):
with you know, a busted up marriage from this disease.
And probably I had enough street cred from the fluid
where we were at raising our kids in Palace Vertes
in on the bubble. Yeah, and.
Speaker 2 (54:02):
She gave.
Speaker 1 (54:04):
She gave me a shot and we went to eat
it Joe's down there in Rodondo and then we went
to the Hermsta the Beach Holano Club. First date. I mean,
this is big stuff, off to a movie, but you
just welcome to grandchild. Yes, we did last a week ago.
Today we became grandparents for first time. Crew Hansen. Wow,
(54:28):
what's that like?
Speaker 2 (54:29):
Man?
Speaker 1 (54:30):
It's been fun. Man, It's like Missy and Biorn the parents.
It's just it's like takes you back, obviously to when
you were a parent and watching the little ones run around.
It seems like a different lifetime. But it's all now
reignited and we get to show up differently. Like I
visualize spoiling the ship out of the kids and then
(54:52):
jacking them up with sugar, giving them back to their
parents and saying ce ya. But I don't know. I
just want to I want and I definitely want to
show up and be active in that capacity what we can,
because it's.
Speaker 2 (55:06):
Beautiful to be sober. For these we don't miss anything
anymore doing right, We don't miss it now listen. I
don't know what's more impressive the fact that you've been
sober this long or that you met somebody on the
AA campus and you're still together.
Speaker 1 (55:21):
Never a good idea when it wasn't a campus a campus.
Speaker 2 (55:26):
Why don't most people that meet each other in the
program say together?
Speaker 1 (55:29):
You think because they haven't spent enough time getting to
know who the hell they are exactly. Yeah, we took
some time. I mean at least at least a year.
I mean the Big Book tells us that a lot
of people that have been down the road before us say,
stay away for a year, and you know, rules are rules,
But this is magic somehow, this thing.
Speaker 2 (55:48):
Yeah, you love her and it's crazy. It's beautiful, man.
Speaker 1 (55:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (55:51):
How does the person find a higher power surrender? How
does the person surrender?
Speaker 1 (55:56):
I think it? For me, I needed it to be tangible,
like I believe that there's a living, loving God in
the form of a black woman, like I've always visualized.
And I don't know why, but overweight, like very robust
African American woman has like that's who I want to
(56:16):
cuddle with. That's who my that's safe to me.
Speaker 2 (56:19):
Oh wow, and that's your higher power from the gate.
Speaker 1 (56:22):
Yeah. But I mean, like, I don't think anybody really
knows who or you know, what God looks like. So
I figured in my little brain that I need to
make it very clear, like I need to be able
to visualize what my higher power looks like, because if
I'm going to be in a relationship with this power,
(56:43):
I damn well better know what they look like. So again,
just my quirky little brain recognizing with absolute certainty that
God is our creator and that I believe that the
way God manifests and shows up is in the form
(57:05):
of a black woman.
Speaker 2 (57:06):
Right on, man, beautiful.
Speaker 1 (57:08):
But it's it's like it's a very active relationship, like
I am talking to God all day every day. Like
there's a lot of give and take, there's a lot
of dialogue, and I think it needs to be relational,
like you know, nature is another big one. But like
(57:29):
I want to, I want to. I had to drill
it down to a place where I could look you
in the eye and say, you know, this is what
God looks like to me, and this is a little
bit about my relationship with that God.
Speaker 2 (57:41):
That's great. I really believe addictions to spiritual malady. And
I always tell people it's none of my business to
your God or higher powers, but you better fucking find one.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
Yeah that works for you. Yep.
Speaker 2 (57:55):
Why is service so important?
Speaker 1 (57:57):
Gets me out of self? It slowly incrementally, I believe,
makes me feel that Dirk is part of the solution.
Like I just I want to love on people and
not have any expectation Like I don't. I don't want anything,
and but I look for little opportunities, and I think
(58:22):
we all should look for the little windows of opportunity
throughout each day to extend a little bit of grace
and a little bit of love. I mean, we're riffing
a little bit here, but I'll go there. But like,
why is everybody so damn angry? I don't see it.
I mean, I know we have very polarized politics, all
(58:42):
of the difficulties around the globe, But at the end
of the day, I think if we all focused on
truly learning to love one another and accept one another
without judgment, most of the bullshit problems go away. So
my little part in that is to love on the
people that are around me really really well. And I
(59:08):
don't know, I'm kind of a simpleton. And at the
end of the day, like if in my sphere, whether
I'm traveling or sitting here or like wherever I am,
you know, I look down at my feet, which is
a funny one that we've been talking a little bit
about the recovery journey. Jimmy Leisure, my first sponsor up
(59:29):
in Malibud, taught me something that I took all the
way to the Super Bowl and beyond. But he made
sense out of something for me that seems appropriate right now,
and that is being present for our own existence. Like
I was always worried about what the hell happened last night?
Or you know, what the fuck when I'm done talking
(59:51):
to Sino, what am I going to be doing? Like
I was never fully present. And this guy, this mill
plant AA sponsor, which is perfect for me, he kicked
my ass. But he told me one day he said, Dirk,
look down at your feet, And I'm like, what the fuck, Jimmy,
(01:00:11):
what just say? Shut up? Look down at your feet.
So I looked down at my feet and he goes
recognize this right here is where you are. Mmmm, like
show up, m because he saw the distraction. He saw
you know, the hmmm, just your inability to be present.
(01:00:33):
My add on, you know, dyslexic self, just like dancing
around thinking about everything other than the moment that I'm in.
And Jimmy taught me to look down at my feet
when I felt anxious or I felt like things were
spinning out. I still to this day a couple of
times a day, will stop and look down on my
(01:00:54):
feet and ground it grounds me.
Speaker 2 (01:00:58):
And you brought that to the players. Yeah, and what
was the application.
Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
A lot of people anxious, scared, fearful, whatever performance anxiety distraction.
You know, something happened last night with my girl. Any
number of distractors, and one of their favorite things was that,
And a lot of the guys practiced it, like instead
(01:01:22):
of being fearful or distracted, like, look down at my feet,
recognize where we are in this moment, whether you're playing
in football game or you're going to the grocery store
or whatever. It's like, I want desperately to be fully
present in whatever moment I'm in. Like this is a gift.
Speaker 2 (01:01:41):
Yeah, such a gift, man.
Speaker 1 (01:01:42):
And that's part of the magic of this recovery thing
is that I actually get to be here with Cino
like and I don't give a shit about what's happening.
Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
Outside exactly doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
And that's a huge gift. This guy.
Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
Two kinds of head coaches, the one where you fumble
and you yell at the player, and the one you say,
I love you, get back into it. Coach Carroll's approach.
You're talking about football is love you. So no, big,
don't move on from it. It doesn't matter, it doesn't matter,
move on, stay in the network.
Speaker 1 (01:02:15):
We're good. Yeah, there's a real art. Yeah, especially with quarterbacks,
and I you know, Pete's a super gifted coach in
many ways. But every relationship he shared with a quarterback
was with some magic. He was. He was their safe place,
and you know what happened between the two of them
(01:02:36):
never was talked about with anybody. Yeah, it's sacred, sacred,
and it should be sacred. But that was cool to watch.
Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
Yeah, I bet it was. Okay. I always ask people this, dear.
You know, people are struggling right now, People are addicted,
people are jammed up, people are paranoid. What's the parting
words for everybody right now. What do you how do
you want to inspire people? What do you want to
say to everybody that's listening right now all around the world.
Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
Brother, we can pretend to care, but we can't pretend
to show up. And I think if we focus on relationships, family,
inner circle, friends and show up for one another and
have that be good enough, then we're winning.
Speaker 2 (01:03:24):
Amen. I Amen, all right, thank you so much for
being I really appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (01:03:29):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
All right, God speak, brother, all right, love you, I
love you too, man. Thank you.
Speaker 3 (01:03:34):
Hey, folks, Jreck and I got so caught up talking
about waking up, getting sober, living out how that I
forgot to mention the nonprofit he leads. It's called the
Healthy Hive. Now, the Healthy Hive was creative served through
providing scholarships for people to assess health care opportunities such
as private therapy, intervention, care management, impatient residential care, intensive, outpatient,
(01:04:02):
experimental and somaticcare opportunities that otherwise would not be affordable.
The Healthy Hive is looking to give a hand up
to people to possess a high level motivation for change.
Contact Dirk at Dirk g. I r K at Healthy
dash high hiv e dot org. Learn more at www
(01:04:25):
dot healthyhive dot org.
Speaker 2 (01:04:27):
The Sino Show is a production of iHeartPodcasts hosted by
me Cina McFarlane, produced by pod People in twenty eighth
av Our lead producer is Keith carnlik Our executive producer
is Vincy Hoffman. Marketing lead is Ashley Weaver. Thank you
so much for listening. We'll see you next week.
Everybody talks about having to hit bottom. I'm not a believer.
Coming to somebody without judgment, without condemnation, and lifting them up,
reminding them of their wonder, reminding them of why they're loved,
and then extending a gift and an opportunity to each
person to heal. Taking that action, to me is more
(00:22):
important than whether they say when are we leaving? Or
go to hell? What breaks your heart? What breaks my
heart is what happened yesterday. Family asked me to help them.
I come to in this case, Las Vegas. I've given
the address of Sentinel A hospital to go meet the
(00:43):
identified patient. In all my years, I've never had it
go down like this, But I got there so you know,
and walked into the hospital room with his sister, said hello.
Three minutes later, he flatlined and died.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Welcome back to the SINO Show. I'm your host Cina
McFarland today, who I'm joined by someone who's made it
his mission to help pledge to the journey to recovery.
He's the CEO of Elders Recovery Service, a dedicated advocate
for addiction treatment. As a leader in helping people reclaim
their lives from addiction or his work focused on providing
(01:26):
real solutions and hope to those who need it the most.
It's a privilege to have you on the show.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Welcome, brother, Welcome, welcome, welcome, Thank you, Cina, glad you're here.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Thanks brother. You are such an interesting cat.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
You really are.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Man, You're a special guy. We're gonna let everyone know
how specially you are on the beauty you do and
all the people you've helped, and how humble you are.
But that wasn't who you were all the time. Let's
just talk a little bit about your bottom, just kind
of the white flag moment and what led you into
this business.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The white flag moment would be at forty years of
age to have four of my best friends come basically
sit at the end of my bed and say we're done,
like we're done watching you in your charade.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
And how old were you?
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Well I was about forty.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
So inhuman you're tell everybod what are the alcoholic translation
is that what seventeen to eighteen? Maybe ninety?
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Well, here here's the skinny. This is the rub and
the reason I didn't give you a straight answers because
I went to treatment twice. Yeah, once was my idea like.
I literally called the only guy I knew in recovery
who ran Sampedro Recovery Center back in the day, and
I said, I think I got a problem with drugs
(02:51):
and alcohol, Pierre, can I come talk to you? And
he said sure. So I went down and three hours
later I checked in, called my wife, told her I
was in rehab. She says, like, what You're in rehab?
I said, yeah, I think I got a troubled relationship
with substance and alcohol. Yeah, but I was. You know,
it all looked good on the outside. I had a
(03:12):
white picket fence and all this stuff. So she was
a bit shocked by it. And then I went and
stayed for thirty days, sat in the front row, listened,
did everything they asked me to do, and decided I
was smarter and different than everybody else there, and then
I could manage the issue in a much different way.
And as we say in the rooms, you know, I
(03:35):
did three or four more years of research and then
ended up in the er half a dozen times in
a couple of months. And the last one of those times,
my buddies came and changed my life forever. They just said,
we're done watching your live.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Why did they say something? Was the seriousness of their talkue?
Was it that you knew they were actually done?
Speaker 1 (04:01):
What was it that it was? It was that it
was like iality of it. I've been gifted throughout life
with some like blessed with really good friends, and this
particular group was a group I went through USC with
and then early adult life, you know, after graduation while
(04:21):
we're trying to figure out what we're going to do
the rest of our lives. Just some really good dudes,
and they showed up for me. They didn't know, you know,
they'd been partying with me, but they didn't party when
they rolled out of bed. They waited till Friday night, right,
And I just kept the party going from USC on
for twenty years as a high functioning alcoholic addict that
(04:42):
never missed a day of using wow Like, but I
never missed a day of work either, So you know,
I was very gifted at manipulation and deception and certainly denial.
But just like making everybody think that everything was fine,
and the only person that knew it wasn't was me.
(05:02):
I was depressed and anxious and driven by a hundred
forms of fear and a tremendous amount of low self esteem.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
Mm m mmm mmmmm. It's a lot of work being
an active addiction, Isn't.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
It absolutely exhausting?
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Eh, so it's not. Yeah, how long ago was that?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Well, two thousand and three, June third is my sober date.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
So you know.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
I went up to Creative Care in Malibu because one
of my buddies that showed up lived next door to
doctor K who owned the place, and asked him if
he had a room for his buddy in the morning,
like getting the paper at the end of the driveway
kind of shit, and doctor K, who's a good man,
said yeah, bring him. So a couple hours later, I
(05:47):
was knocking on the door. It's a beautiful therapist named
Dominique answered the door and she said, who are you?
And it was me with my board, shorts and flip
flops and my towel around me. I still have not
towel blanket. I still have the blanket. But I looked
at Dominique and I said, my name's Dirk, and I
don't know how to do life. Can you teach me
(06:08):
how to do life?
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Was that a pickup line? Did you actually mean that? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I would have run away with her at that moment.
But no, I was totally legit.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
You were serious, you had at that's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
I was just it was exhausted. Like you said, it
was like it was all a ruse and it looked
pretty good on the outside as a high functioning addict,
but I was absolutely miserable.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I think you'll agree, and if you don't, you'll tell me.
Like my phone rings off the hook with people wanting
to help in different things, and I always say the
same thing. It just I think you have to be
sick and tired of being sick. I always come back
to that. Do you know anything else? Is there anything else?
Speaker 1 (06:47):
No? I mean a it's you know. We had so
many sayings and most of them, most of them just
make me want to throw up, honestly. But that one sticks,
It sticks, right, That one works?
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:57):
Sure?
Speaker 2 (06:57):
And so you've been sober? How long? Now?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Twenty one years?
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Wow? Right on? Good for you. And let's talk about
how you pivoted in this work and some of the
great places you've worked. And I want to break it
down some of the things you've done in some of
your teachings and about real skill sets to help people.
What made you say I want to do this business.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Well, it's a funny story. Doctor Randy Gunther, who was
my therapist.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
Oh my god, I'm remember that name forever.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
And she's an author. She's a badass woman that is
still working hard, just beating cancer. And that's all. We
could talk for hours about Randy Gunter. Look her up.
She's written books about relationships and what have you. But
she was my therapist. And when I left Creative care,
I drove to a printing company that I worked at
(07:51):
and helped run and said, I'm resigning. You'll never see
me again, thank you very much. And then I drove
from there to LMU to study addictionology because I, for
the first time in my life, in that second treatment experience,
recognized the power of recovery, certainly in the opportunity to heal,
(08:12):
which I never really believed I had. But doctor Gunther
kind of pushed me in that direction. And then she
saw something new, she saw something, and I went away
to treatment, came back on that same day and looked
at her and said, I just quit my job, Like,
what am I going to do now? And she looked
(08:34):
at me and said, You're going to be an interventionist
and I'm like, what the fuck is that? Like, I
really I had no idea what it even meant. And
she said, well, the godfather of it, the guy that
wrote the book, Ed Storty, is about five miles from here.
So all you've got to do is convince him to
give you some of his time. And I was like
a dog on a bone. I'm like, I'll get that done.
(08:57):
And I called him and I had to stalk him
from a couple of weeks until he was in sam Pedro. Yeah,
wonderful guy, still a dear friend, but that in that moment,
he was the man. He was the guy I was
going to learn from. And you know, he could have
been anywhere in the country and he was literally five
miles from where I was sitting. So Ed and I
(09:19):
became great friends, and I was gifted with sitting second
chair with him I did, and watching him do his thing.
You know, the dude wears a tie every day. I mean,
he's buttoned up like to the nth degree. He's just
a class act, a man of exceptional character and integrity.
And we became friends, and he gave me what he
(09:41):
had and I ran with it. I was like investing
in him. And another guy named Keith Fearman who was
other side of the country, Alabama guy, great gifted interventionist.
Learned a ton from Keith, and between those two guys,
I knew that that's what I wanted to do. Like
(10:02):
somehow the crazier shit gets the calmer I got. And
you know, like having Thanksgiving dinner can be much more
anxiety provoking than talking to a methadic with an automatic
weapon in his hand. It's just like, I don't know why,
but that's just what happens.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
I know, I can go in the hood and get
you know, mix it up with pimps and everybody, but
packing my luggage it just drives me. Don't think I'm
gonna drink again.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Exactly. So anyhow, that's I mean, that's how it was
born from doctor Gunther and then ed sorty kind of
showed up as this affirming older guy that I kind
of thought and still think, hung the moon. And I
got to learn from the best, and it was like
(10:47):
the more I did them, the more I enjoyed the
process of it. I mean, I think it's gotten hacked
up a lot, a lot, and it's a very intimate
relationship with families that are, you know, rolling the dice
on at the time, a complete stranger basically to come
in their living room and navigate this process. And I
(11:08):
take it very seriously and I absolutely love it. I
mean I've traveled as far away as Bangladesh doing it
and it's like it's a pretty cool thing because I
think they're best described and defined as living eulogies like
we're we're going to die or we're going to live
these really marginalized lives that are nowhere near kind of
(11:30):
showing up as the best version of our most authentic self.
You know, quite the contrary.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Derek, You're the perfect guide answer this question. You know
the listeners. When do we intervene on our son, our daughter,
our father, our uncle? When do we When is the
right time to do that? When you walk us through
that process.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Absolutely, I think action, like taking action and understanding expectations
is the key. Meaning to me, you can like it
falls into the category of you can pretend to care
or care about and love on somebody, but you can't
pretend to show up for them. So to me, working
(12:11):
with families that are curious and they're seeing this thing,
this progressive thing evolve in living color in their lives,
and I think oftentimes we wait too long until things.
You know, everybody talks about having to hit bottom. I'm
not a believer. I think coming to somebody without judgment,
(12:33):
without condemnation, and lifting them up, reminding them of their wonder,
reminding them of why they're loved, and then extending a
gift and an opportunity to each person to heal. Like
taking that action, to me is more important than whether
they say when are we leaving or go to hell?
(12:55):
I'm you know, get out of my get out of
my life. Like showing up and extending that opportunity, whether
it goes down in that moment or six years later,
to me, is a much smarter play than waiting until
you know, the train wreck or a series of train wrecks.
So I'd like to encourage delivering the message because that's
(13:18):
the only thing we can control anyway, Like we can't
throw these people over there our shoulders and drag them
into treatment, like I think sometimes that gets lost, Like
this is a gift. This is a huge gift, and
whether you accept the gift or not is up to you.
But to extend that kind of grace and say, hey,
(13:41):
you know, if you want out of this hamster cage
that you're on, or if you want out of this
dysfunction that you're sitting in, there is in fact a
way out, Like let's surrender right here, right now. Kind
of like me at the front door of Creative Care
was like I literally did not know how to do
(14:02):
life like which, you know, that's the essence of my
whole recovery process over the last couple of decades has
been just that, like trying to figure out how to
love myself and another human being. Like we didn't talk
about that kind of shit in my household, Like we
(14:23):
were mechanical, event driven young people that were trying to
please our parents or my parents, And it's just like
I didn't get to talk about my fear. I didn't
get to talk about what the hell am I supposed
to do with my life? Or I'm scared, you know
I was. It was all kind of a performance based
(14:46):
model that as soon as I did my first bong hit,
I was like, okay, I've been chasing after the wrong thing.
M m mmm, and just put it all down.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
When how did your heart get cracked in sobriety that
way to actually start loving yourself actually start looking at
the trauma, actually start looking at you know, man, there's
a lot I need to learn still about life.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yeah, I think a couple of really gifted therapists, but
the one primaries is doctor Randy. Like, she allowed me
to look inside myself. I thought I thought the answers
were all out here, like what you think of me,
(15:30):
what she thinks of me? Like everything was external. That
was kind of the paradigm in which I grew up,
Like exceeding academic expectation, athletic expectation, all of these things
outside of myself were replaced by my first opportunity at
(15:51):
forty years old to recognize that peace and happiness and
serenity are all inside myself. Like that was totally contradictory
to everything that I believed. Like I thought that I
was in some kind of a play, and it's been.
(16:13):
That's why I think there's so many grateful addicts and
alcoholics that have done a bunch of work and recognize
that nobody can take that away from us except ourselves. Amen.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Right on, Wow, Okay, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. Let's talk
about this then, Jaywalker Ranch Lodge Lodge, when were you.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
There twenty fifteen.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
Through nineteen Right, talk, what's the specialty in the program there?
And I want to break that down a little bit.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
It's a cool program. Right. Bobby Ferguson, the founder, dear friend,
wonderful guy, long term recovery. He had this awareness. He
went through Hazleton for his recovery, learned a lot and
founded Jaywalker Lodge based on his belief that what I
(17:10):
really need is a good friend, and I need healthy
community with that friendship. And Bobby birthed Jaywalker based on
community and Step one. But his belief was thirty days
doesn't work. Ninety days will create better outcomes. And if
(17:32):
we can place this thing in this case Jaywalker Lodge
in a place where community is easy to navigate, meaning
not a lot of cars are needed, you know, because
a lot of us are restricted there. But he picked
this beautiful place in Carbondale, Colorado with all the amenities
you'll ever need in walking distance. Wow, and built a
(17:56):
beautiful place based on his vision. And you know, not
only was he right about the ninety days, you know,
we've since found out that you know, if nineties better
than thirty, then one hundred and twenty or a year
is going to merit even greater outcomes. So the magic
of Jaywalker is really born out of the fact that
(18:16):
if you and I go there from you from New York,
me from LA we just we just might stay, meaning,
you know, trying to figure out how to do this
life sober and recognize what a quality friendship looks like
and have it be so galvanizing that you don't want
to leave.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Interesting. I love that, And then I always thought, as
that place is kind of the last stop for people
at are chronic relapses.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
That's brand recognition. That is that true? Well, yeah, it's
it's true, but like a lot of things, it's it's
a generalization. But most everybody, not everybody, but most everybody
that went through and goes through Jaywalker, which is still
a great place, and on this day is going there
after whatever, two, three, ten other treatment experiences that didn't
(19:09):
work out so well?
Speaker 2 (19:10):
Right, Why do people relapse?
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Why do people relapse?
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Boom, Yeah, you know, I'm gonna come in quick, brother.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
No, it's a great question. I would suggest that that
is done with self will, reigniting over God's will. Like
as soon as I creep back, and I do several
times a day, creep back into Dirk's will versus God's will.
And to me, the more often I'm doing that and
(19:39):
maybe conveniently not recognizing that that's exactly what I'm doing,
I'm getting closer to a relapse. Pat answers would be,
you know, not pat, but common answers would be to
increased isolation, maybe you know, lack of a focus on
(20:00):
service and giving yourself away. It's a it's an insidious foe, right,
we know that, and so it's sneaky and it sits
on our shoulder. And I think as soon as we
are respect for what we're truly dealing with ways, then
we're setting ourselves up for relapse.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Beautiful. Let me add to that. I think it's uh,
I always talk to people. If you've got a secret
and you can't share it in the rooms you're getting ready,
it's possibility relapse if you're keeping secrets.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
And then the other thing is, I don't these guys like,
I don't know. I just was at the bar and
I had a drink and I you know, I was
at mcgilla Cuddies a happy hour. The relapse for me
starts the moment you're thinking about going to mcgilla cuddies.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Yeah, that's the nine one one moment. Yeah, along the
same lines. Relapses are happening long before we're picking up exactly.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Talk about that in your experience with working with so
many people.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
We just see again self will taking charge, exceptions being
made to things that worked. I always come back to respect, Like,
if I don't respect the beast right, it's going to
eat me right. And I don't give a shit if
you got two days or twenty thirty, forty years, it
doesn't matter. Like we the other we were talking about
(21:18):
sayings earlier, but like to me, if we're not sitting
on top of the fact that I can't give away
what I don't have, and if I'm not taking care
of my own program and my own work, then it's
going to slip away. And we're gonna we're going to
begin doing that long before we actually pick up.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
How did Pete Carroll come in your consciousness.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
By the grace of God? Yeah, we Pete and I
share a friend. He wouldn't mind doctor Maser like, he's
a dear friend of Pete's and mine. And when Pete
was coaching at USC, he was talking to doctor Macer
and said you know, talked about some troubled with a
(22:08):
coach and a player, and doctor Maser said, why don't
you call my buddy Dirk. So he ended up calling
me and hiring me to do two different interventions, one
on a player and one on a coach, two completely
separate events. But through those two processes, Pete and I
(22:30):
struck up a friendship and a relationship, and he's one
of the best leaders I've ever had a chance to
be around. And when he asked me a couple of
months into this process if I would be the life
coach for at the time, the USC Trojan guys, it was,
you know, something I'd never imagined doing and was privileged
(22:54):
to have the ask from Pete, and I jumped on it.
And you know, the problem with going back to your
where I graduated, where my disease was born. Basically it
wasn't a problem. But a year into that Pete decided
to go to Seattle.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
You did the job. You did it for one year.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
Yeah, here back and it was kind of cool because
I mean, I was a complete moron at USC, Like
I regressed, like I got dumber, not not brighter with
my college. And I'm not proud of that, but that's
the truth of the matter. Like I went backwards, not forwards.
So there was something poetic about going back and helping
(23:37):
kids that are struggling at the same place that I struggled.
And that's how it started, and it was really it
was really kind of good.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Before we go to the Seahawks, talk to me about
what was it like. Walk me through a day at
SC working with the athletes there. What were you doing exactly?
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Lots of different things, making sure certain students got to
the right place at the right time. Some of them
got distracted on their way to class, for example, so
there was a little bit of handholding going on, but
mostly it was good position coaches that knew their guys right.
(24:18):
On a football team, you know, everybody talks about the
head coach, which is hugely important, but each of those
head coaches would tell you the most important thing is
their staff, right. So their staff at SC was very gifted,
obviously and paying attention. So they if they were working
with five or ten guys, they knew who was struggling
and who wasn't. So they would bring me in and
(24:40):
plug me into guys that were struggling with everything from
fear of playing football, or you know, a struggle relationship
wise that wasn't fitting, or class or you know, any
number of obvious challenging areas for student athletes. And they
(25:00):
would plug me in and say, hey, you know so
and so you're going to spend a couple hours a
week with Dirk. He's our guy. He's helping with with
this and that. And I would strike up relationships with
those guys and get to know them on an intimate level.
Sometimes they're families, and basically just help them navigate this,
(25:24):
you know, this life in college, which was, you know,
at USC, larger than life. It's a pretty big stage.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Especially at that time. We were some of the best
college football in America going on down there.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Oh yeah, I mean Reggie Bush was kind of he
still is the best that ever played college. Yeah, so
you know that's how it started, And how did you
get the trust of the players? Trust is earned? You know,
it takes time, as you know better than anybody, and
it takes about a second to lose it. And I
(25:56):
just I mad made the same decision with them that
I do with anybody I interact with, and that is
that I'm going to hold certain things sacred and if
if there's something margin on the margin, I'm going to
ask permission. But I am not going to talk to
your coaches, parents, girlfriends, or anybody else about it unless
you tell me that that's what we're going to do,
(26:18):
and just you know, create a safe container for kids to,
you know, from all kinds of different backgrounds to navigate
some pretty exceptionally dicey landscape. There's a lot of distraction
going on, especially at that time.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Yeah, I always saw Coach Carrol was so ahead of
the curve on it. He just saw something. You obviously
saw something in you, but he knew there was a
need for it.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Absolutely, He's he is outside the box thinker. He's an
organic leader that is authentic. And I think sometimes and
I know for a fact at Seattle, it took, I
would say that first year for that whole organization to
(27:03):
recognize that not only is the authentic, he can sustain it.
He has greater focus, greater energy, greater leadership capabilities than
most anybody you'll ever Yeah, how can a guy this
old move that fast, like not just physically but emotionally
and like he's he's a charismatic leader that is infectious.
(27:29):
I just think like any good leader, if it's if
it's you can you can see what's real and what's not.
And Pete Carroll is legit because it's coming out of
his pores. He competes, for example, at everything you know,
and he makes it fun. But that's one of his
(27:49):
of his foundational pieces, is that we're going to compete
in whatever arena we're in and and that was his
and and that will always be his. But he brings
people along by modeling the kind of behavior that he
expects from others.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
It's those are the best teachers.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
Yeah, I mean, screwood comes out of your mouth? Yeah right?
Speaker 2 (28:09):
How are you living your life?
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (28:11):
What what was it like going from the college level
to the pro level? Did they different? Respect, take it
longer for the buying on you, more attitude, more like
checking you out, more like what the fuck?
Speaker 1 (28:29):
Certainly it was different, and you're hitting on some of
the major pieces as to why. But in college, if
Kenny Norton says, hey, you're gonna go see Dirk two
hours a week for the rest of the year, you
know Sino is going, yes, sir, right, and same Sino
in the locker room up in Seattle, you look at
(28:49):
Kenny and goes say, go fuck yourself right like it's
you don't. You don't have that kind of control. So
it's really a harder, a longer runway to earn trust.
So I would I would again, and this time on
myself in Seattle, I would say I was not wholly
(29:10):
but primarily ineffective for a year wow, because none of
the guys would be quick to trust. I mean, the
rules are different and on every level. So you know,
again it's showing up doing the right thing, staying out
of the results, and making sure that my primary objective
(29:33):
is to hold safe a safe container for people to
do their work. I mean, my best work in Seattle
was done in the sauna.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
Yeah, yeah, talk to people. Why that is? It's right.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
I'm not that bright and I didn't play that movie through.
But the fact of the matter is, you know, for
all the obvious reasons, it's quiet, it's you know, we're
alone most of the time, and I feel safe enough
to talk to this guy at this point because I
you know, we've spent some time maybe at dinner, go
(30:06):
for a walk, whatever. But whenever the guys got in
the sauna, they just started talking and I'm like, son
of a bitch, I'm gonna die in these dast I mean,
I'm it's amazing how many hours in a day that
I would be in the sauna. Once I figured it out,
like this is magic, what's happening in this thing? And
(30:29):
so up in the in Seattle, it took a little
bit longer, but then it took off. And because players
talk to each other obviously, and like if one guy says,
you know, there's a good dude and he's safe, then
another guy is going to try, and then another guy
is going to try. So it took it took a
little longer. And the truth is, numbers wise, I didn't
(30:53):
help as many guys as I did in college because
some guys just weren't able to trust. And that's okay.
But it was like there was plenty of work and
plenty of you know, kind of rich opportunities to show
up for people and kind of have a servant's heart
with no agenda.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
You know what I think is so beautiful about that, Derek,
And I think it's one of the reasons why you're
so good at what you do. It requires a different
level of patience to do that, and you don't attack.
It's like, why don't you guys want to deal with me?
That's never the style. It doesn't work that way. They'll
come when they'll come. Yeah, I'm gonna keep showing it.
I'm going to keep being here for them, right, And
(31:34):
it's that's that's talk about that because a year's a
long time. The art of patients are art of letting
them have their space, the art of just letting modeling
like I'm here, I'm patient, I'm kind whenever you're ready,
you move it, your space, your terms. Can you talk
about that, well.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
It's patience. It's like it's people will come when they
see something that's attractive to them and that they want.
And if I can show up not only in the
locker room at Seattle, but in my family room, in
every room as a safe place, you know, where somebody's
gonna actually listen. It was about showing up and just
(32:15):
exhibiting whatever it is that I was feeling in a
given moment, just like modeling a little bit of this
transparency that I think is so healthy that all of
us are somewhat forgetting along the road. But to you know,
back to the sick as your secrets piece It's like
(32:36):
I don't have any secrets. Like, I'll tell you I'm
scared shitless right now. I love that, right man, And
it's the I don't I'm never gonna deviate from that
for the balance of my days. It's like I am.
I think we all are doing far too much acting
and not enough being amen.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
I always tell people the buy in is I'm scared
and I need help.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
Yeah, you can never go wrong with that.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
Yeah, right, Rick, let me ask you this, okay?
Speaker 1 (33:05):
On that?
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Oh I was gonna say, it also helps. And see
how you started winning a lot?
Speaker 1 (33:10):
Yeah, winning is good.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Manage. You talk to this dirt thing, you know, and
you know you gotta go to a couple of Super Bowls?
Speaker 1 (33:18):
Yeah yeah, super Bowl ring, right, brother? Yeah, I got
about that.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
What was that? Like?
Speaker 1 (33:21):
It was magic?
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Talk about that?
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Jesus Well, I'll just I don't know. John Schnyder, the
GM up there, the whole organization just class acts and
I would argue the best defense ever. I mean, wow, yeah,
Cam Chancellor, Richard Sherman, Earl Thomas, Bobby Wagner all in
the back. I mean it's like, yeah, there were some
serious badasses that were kicking ass and taking names and
(33:47):
having fun. Yeah. Just it was a privilege really just
to be in that space and to ride that wave
and show up and and love on these guys. And
you know, I remember met Life Stadium was the only
uh Winter City super Bowl in history, and they pulled
(34:09):
it off by less than twenty four hours. The next
day was a huge blizzard. Wow. And but they, I mean,
the New York execs. I made this up in my mind.
I don't know what the truth is, but I'll go,
if I'm living and running the NFL out of New
York City, I'm gonna say, fuck it, I'm gonna have
a super Bowl in New York City. Well that was
the one we got to. And you know, at the
(34:30):
end of the game, watching all the guys run around
and the coaches and the families, Confetti falling down.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Denver, right, Peyton Manning?
Speaker 1 (34:38):
Yeah, what was the score?
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Like forty nine?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
We kicked their ass, killed them, right, it was. I
mean the snap of the first snap of the game
went right by his head.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
What was the other one? The lost to New England?
Speaker 1 (34:50):
Yes, and you didn't you didn't need to bring that up?
Speaker 2 (34:52):
Well no, no, but I did. You know what I got
to right up is because like, walk me through talking
to these guys after that game? What was that like
for you?
Speaker 1 (35:01):
There was no talking after that game.
Speaker 2 (35:02):
It was just silence.
Speaker 1 (35:04):
Well yeah, it was actually pretty dark, but it was difficult,
difficult situation for everybody involved. Wow, lots of uh, some
finger pointing, you know, just I think kind of natural
human reactions to something that shocking. Like if you're in
(35:25):
that position one hundred times ninety nine of them, you're
going to score. I mean, you got the best running
back in the NFL sitting there with four downs to
go one yard. But it's easy to second guess, right right,
But when that went down, there was a lot of
second guessing, as any organization would have, but it was different.
(35:48):
It was a little bit scary.
Speaker 2 (35:50):
I bet. I mean, I mean, as you know, the
spiritual leading or spiritual guy there and then you know,
I mean what was that like for you? Just just
holding space for people and just knowing a lot of
a lot of energy was going on a lot of
What was that for you personally? What was your inner
life work like that moment?
Speaker 1 (36:11):
I was sad for the guys, for the organization, was
I was overwhelmed with sadness because I'm just a freakishly
emotional human being.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
I should in your buddy, Pete.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
I mean that must have been Yeah. I mean he
you know, to me, he's always done a great job.
And I go back to Texas and USC.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
Well you bring up my PTSD.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Yeah, but like Pete said it right and it was legit,
and I think it was something along the lines of,
you know, twenty seconds doesn't define you, right, you know,
the body of work, the ground we've covered, so you
can almost always spin that. But with the Super Bowl piece,
(36:55):
it was really ramped up a notch with players feeling
very strongly, coaches feeling, you know, a lot of pressure
forget about me. But like if you're Darryl Bubble, the
OC on that game, there's a lot of heat right
about that call, and Pete, being the leader that he is,
(37:18):
took it like like he made the call, but he didn't.
Daryl Bubble made the call. But that shows you a
little bit about who Pete is and the fact that
he took one hundred percent ownership of that. But yeah,
it was just tough.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
It was a tough day.
Speaker 1 (37:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Did the players reach out to you weeks afterwards and
want to check in with you did a.
Speaker 1 (37:40):
Lot of them. Yeah, I still keep in touch with
a lot of them. They're really beautiful people. You know,
like any organization, there there's assholes and there's sure people
that you want to grow old with. And that particular
team was primarily a bunch of really.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Good peoples and recovery and what breaks your heart.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
What breaks my heart is what happened yesterday. You know,
a family asked me to help them. I come to
in this case, Las Vegas. I've given the address of
Sentinel a hospital to go meet the identified patient. And
(38:25):
in all my years, I've never had to go down
like this. But I got there so, you know, and
walked into the hospital room with his sister, said hello,
and three minutes later he flatlined.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
And died three minutes later.
Speaker 1 (38:43):
Literally three minutes after I met him. Forty year old,
forty year old with kids and a great family, and
he drugs alcohol, both he it was drugs and alcohol.
But his his latest thing and the thing that took
(39:05):
him ultimately was whippets. Oh why Wow nitrous. His brother
found him in the bathroom. Wow. Nobody expected him to die.
He'd been on a respirator. They pulled it. He was
doing great coming back, you know, our bodies are amazing
that way. But literally three minutes and he was dead.
(39:28):
And I'm like, we waited too long, you know, because
like some of the backstory with this particular family was
like a lot of families they're faced with. And you
asked me a minute ago, you know, when do you
do an intervention? Well, you do it now now, Yeah,
not because you can control the outcome, but because you
(39:49):
can take the action right, And it's like that's always
better than waiting, because you don't nobody knows, right, Like,
why the hell are you? And I said here, you know,
why did we get to live? Because we lose so
many amazing people, And that's why I want to I
(40:12):
want to show up for my inner circle of friends,
my kiddos being the most important, and my bride and
then like we got to we got to do a
better job of getting back to to you know, I'm
gonna sound like an old old school dog, but the
fact of the matter is we suck at listening. And
(40:35):
I see the art of listening as maybe the most
important puzzle piece in human relationships that exists. And again,
I guess I don't give a shit if people think
I'm an old dog, but that you know, the whole
cell phone thing and laptop thing as opposed to doing
what we're doing here sitting down and talking. I think
(40:59):
we're missing the mark and I think it's going to
come at a tremendous cost. But like, my dad was
a big, big guy on the English language as well
as listening, and he gave me that. And you know,
I suppose I wish he would have listened to me
a little bit more, but he didn't. But he taught
(41:23):
me about the importance of listening. And I think much
of my approach in life and certainly in the process
of intervention, is to take my listening game up a notch,
like to hear people, to actually meet them where they are,
as opposed to where we think they ought to be
or where they could be, but to really kind of
(41:45):
get down in the dirt with everybody and hear them, Like,
I don't know that there's a better gift we can
give one another.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
Active listening is the most powerful thing. I'm right there
with you, man, I actually just talked about it with
the show before. It's very powerful. So you saw that
young man forty flatline and it just boomed. It just sobering, right.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
Yeah, And it wasn't anything to do with me. But
I'm in the middle of the room, so I was
trying to figure out where to take myself because family
was rolling in and it was my heart was broken.
But the stream of family and anybody, I mean, most
(42:33):
of us have seen or been around that before, but
this was different for me because I really didn't know
the identified patient particularly well. Knew his sister real well,
but nobody else. And I just found myself in this
moment where like, if somebody wants to cry or pray
or just hold one another, like I'm here, and if not,
(42:59):
you know, I kind of continued to step kind of
back out into the hallway and give the family privacy.
But it's not a situation that I'd been in before,
and I didn't want to I didn't want to overstep
and lean in too much, and I didn't want to
run away.
Speaker 2 (43:16):
I've been in that one. It's a tricky one. I
don't think there's anything sadder than seeing a family that
just lost somebody to addiction. No, it's just so fucking
painful to see that. Yeah, especially some of that age
they're never coming back done and you got you know,
he had a couple of teenage daughters that caught my
(43:38):
eye and like their brokenness was so Angela, it's just right, yeah,
I mean just looking in their eyes just like it
was like, what the fuck do I do?
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Now?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Yeah, let's just stay with that. That's people call you.
Let's just say those teenagers call you. They have already
I don't know, or I'm sure that I know you
have hunters that called like this. What do you say
to them? They just lost their father? What's the path
for them?
Speaker 1 (44:09):
Well, we know about the stages of grief, right tell
our listeners about that. Well, I don't particularly, I can't
recite them other than to know that we're all going
to experience four or five primary emotion that are going
to be fleeting, like going from sorrow to anger and
(44:29):
to denial all in a minute. But to me, it's
about allowing yourself to feel all of those feelings and
to be patient with yourself, you know, working in this space.
I don't need to ask you because I already know
like dozens, if not hundreds over the years that we've lost.
(44:54):
How do we deal with that? I guess No, matter
the relationship. I would think if Sino died today, we
would want to take the things that endeared us to
him and carry them forward, meaning to take his spirit,
to take to take the reasons we loved him, and
(45:18):
honor him moving forward each day by exhibiting those same
characteristics that drew us to you in the first place.
Like to me, that's probably the greatest gift we can
give somebody that's meant a lot to us, that's passed,
and you know, systemic families certainly a better example maybe,
(45:39):
But I think people that touch our hearts in this
life and in this journey, to not forget them is
to honor them by the way we're showing up every
day moving forward.
Speaker 2 (45:52):
The game has changed so much in the last three years,
the mental health, the fetanyl and I've also notice, and
you know, I've professionals people that I've known, or people
have long term sobriety, they're they're besides not even over,
there's checking out. Walk me through what we're up against
right now. Walk me through what you're seeing, what you're
(46:14):
doing to combat it. You're processing with all that your
awareness around that, anything that you comes to mind. That's
a big one is a big one.
Speaker 1 (46:24):
I would start with acuity seems to have ramped up,
meaning people are challenged more with mental health things meaning
depression and anxiety, isolation, all types of personality and mood disorders.
(46:46):
And I would suggest that the acuity of those disorders
is heightened since maybe the pandemic. So I think we're
dealing with a lot more people with mental health. Forget
about our coping mechanism of addiction, but I just think
(47:09):
more there's the isolation index, if I had one, I
would say is through the roof a lot of this
remote working. I don't want to go down that rabbit hole,
but it it tears us apart from communities that I
think help lift us up, maybe even subconsciously. Just being
(47:31):
around other people certainly is one puzzle piece. The flip
side of what you asked around fentanyl is an unequivocal
mathematical formula that would indicate like there's no way of
telling how much is in whatever I'm using, So we're
(47:54):
killing ourselves at unprecedented rates, And it seems impenetrable because
it's in so many places. Mmm, Like it's just there's
so many people that aren't probably even what you and
I would define as addicts. Yeah, that are dying from
(48:15):
fedanhol because they're having a good time at a party
doing Atlantic cocaine.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
It's done.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:20):
We lost five people in the canals a couple of
years ago, just five people, not and I know they
weren't addicts, just all died.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
Yeah, things are out of control. And I would argue
on the mental health side of things, it's we've probably
never been in a trick here place.
Speaker 2 (48:36):
Father Boyle he talks about when he's to give him
mask or going to the youth the detention centers, and
he sees these kids, he said, I can't get through
to them. I can just see they're staring at the
walls that I've not seen this before, right, you know.
But so what you're getting these calls from parents? What
do we fucking do dark my kids strung out? I'm
so worried he's gonna die on fetanyl. I'm so worried.
(48:59):
I don't know how to get to them. And what
do you say to them? What's the answer to that? Oh,
we're not just gonna talk about usc football.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
Brother, Come on, hell no, this is the good stuff
right now.
Speaker 2 (49:11):
You're the best man.
Speaker 1 (49:13):
I just again I'll go back to listening, like I
need to know what that house looks like. I need
to know who the players are, like the I think
backing into this by understanding the systemic family systems before
I even know anything about the identified patient is a
(49:33):
pretty keen approach because all the attention goes to the
the IP or the addict, and to backdoor it by
understanding all the cohorts that you got to have and
that I recognize. You know, any any good addict knows
you got to have the things set up in a
(49:54):
way that's sustainable. So that usually means the piece of
people closest to you are going to get your your
best bullshit, you know, the best muse because I don't
want to.
Speaker 2 (50:05):
Also know it was junkie dive here at Shelle Avenue.
Speaker 1 (50:08):
Yeah, it's like, don't pay attention to me. Everything's cool,
I'm fine, and you know today, I would suggest just
by kind of understanding the environment the identified patient shows
up in every day and understanding that piece is primary
to understanding how to best help the individual. Okay, because
(50:32):
I really think that the focus is usually more well
suited for the family than the IP.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
Right, I agree with that, Right, on Okay, you found
love in Sobriety.
Speaker 1 (50:43):
M though, Yeah, let's talk about that Stacy Lee.
Speaker 2 (50:49):
Talking about Stacey Lee, Well.
Speaker 1 (50:54):
She's magic, you know. We we our first day was
an AA meeting, We went and saw The Aviator of
the movie. Then we stayed up all night. Basically I
mean Ellen Smith, a dear friend of both of ours.
The true story is We're at the MPR watching our
six year old kids, you know, like in some play,
(51:16):
and Ellen throws her elbow into my chest and says, hey, dumbass,
And I said yeah, And she says, why don't you
take Stacy out? And I'm like, that's a pretty good idea.
So I went home because we'd known each other when
we were both married to other people. And then I
(51:37):
went away to rehab for a year and came back
and Stace was newly sober and we had her best friend.
Ellen suggests to me what I had to ask her out?
But yeah, Stacy Lee has taught me a lot, like
more than I could ever even contemplate understanding about love,
like how to love myself, how to love her, to
(52:00):
love others. She's just this super gifted psychotherapist, came from
a normal family, with some really horrific abuse from grandparents
in this case. But Stacy's healing journey took her through
(52:24):
the rooms of AA to us M University of Santa Monica,
like spiritual psychology, Like a lot of people have been
through that, and if you know anything about it, it's
fucking magic. But that's as I saw the transformation of
my bride, Stacy. It was USM and the work she
(52:44):
did there that really ignited this amazing journey that she's
on with healing. She just we're just talking about I'll
say m h our buddy Mike before the show. But
just one example of showing up for people without judgment
and holding space for somebody to go back and do
(53:08):
some work.
Speaker 2 (53:08):
The incredible capacity to love somebody, you'd be there for him.
Our friend probably wouldn't be alive without their wife's loving care.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
Why did she pick you, Ah, Why did she pick me?
Speaker 2 (53:20):
I'm not saying that in a funny, snarky way at all.
I'm just curious.
Speaker 1 (53:24):
I think she probably picked me primarily because I was sober,
Because she was married to a wonderful addict before me,
who we lost to this disease, a wonderful human being
named Steve, but she had already gone through another trauma
(53:46):
with you know, a busted up marriage from this disease.
And probably I had enough street cred from the fluid
where we were at raising our kids in Palace Vertes
in on the bubble. Yeah, and.
Speaker 2 (54:02):
She gave.
Speaker 1 (54:04):
She gave me a shot and we went to eat
it Joe's down there in Rodondo and then we went
to the Hermsta the Beach Holano Club. First date. I mean,
this is big stuff, off to a movie, but you
just welcome to grandchild. Yes, we did last a week ago.
Today we became grandparents for first time. Crew Hansen. Wow,
(54:28):
what's that like?
Speaker 2 (54:29):
Man?
Speaker 1 (54:30):
It's been fun. Man, It's like Missy and Biorn the parents.
It's just it's like takes you back, obviously to when
you were a parent and watching the little ones run around.
It seems like a different lifetime. But it's all now
reignited and we get to show up differently. Like I
visualize spoiling the ship out of the kids and then
(54:52):
jacking them up with sugar, giving them back to their
parents and saying ce ya. But I don't know. I
just want to I want and I definitely want to
show up and be active in that capacity what we can,
because it's.
Speaker 2 (55:06):
Beautiful to be sober. For these we don't miss anything
anymore doing right, We don't miss it now listen. I
don't know what's more impressive the fact that you've been
sober this long or that you met somebody on the
AA campus and you're still together.
Speaker 1 (55:21):
Never a good idea when it wasn't a campus a campus.
Speaker 2 (55:26):
Why don't most people that meet each other in the
program say together?
Speaker 1 (55:29):
You think because they haven't spent enough time getting to
know who the hell they are exactly. Yeah, we took
some time. I mean at least at least a year.
I mean the Big Book tells us that a lot
of people that have been down the road before us say,
stay away for a year, and you know, rules are rules,
But this is magic somehow, this thing.
Speaker 2 (55:48):
Yeah, you love her and it's crazy. It's beautiful, man.
Speaker 1 (55:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (55:51):
How does the person find a higher power surrender? How
does the person surrender?
Speaker 1 (55:56):
I think it? For me, I needed it to be tangible,
like I believe that there's a living, loving God in
the form of a black woman, like I've always visualized.
And I don't know why, but overweight, like very robust
African American woman has like that's who I want to
(56:16):
cuddle with. That's who my that's safe to me.
Speaker 2 (56:19):
Oh wow, and that's your higher power from the gate.
Speaker 1 (56:22):
Yeah. But I mean, like, I don't think anybody really
knows who or you know, what God looks like. So
I figured in my little brain that I need to
make it very clear, like I need to be able
to visualize what my higher power looks like, because if
I'm going to be in a relationship with this power,
(56:43):
I damn well better know what they look like. So again,
just my quirky little brain recognizing with absolute certainty that
God is our creator and that I believe that the
way God manifests and shows up is in the form
(57:05):
of a black woman.
Speaker 2 (57:06):
Right on, man, beautiful.
Speaker 1 (57:08):
But it's it's like it's a very active relationship, like
I am talking to God all day every day. Like
there's a lot of give and take, there's a lot
of dialogue, and I think it needs to be relational,
like you know, nature is another big one. But like
(57:29):
I want to, I want to. I had to drill
it down to a place where I could look you
in the eye and say, you know, this is what
God looks like to me, and this is a little
bit about my relationship with that God.
Speaker 2 (57:41):
That's great. I really believe addictions to spiritual malady. And
I always tell people it's none of my business to
your God or higher powers, but you better fucking find one.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
Yeah that works for you. Yep.
Speaker 2 (57:55):
Why is service so important?
Speaker 1 (57:57):
Gets me out of self? It slowly incrementally, I believe,
makes me feel that Dirk is part of the solution.
Like I just I want to love on people and
not have any expectation Like I don't. I don't want anything,
and but I look for little opportunities, and I think
(58:22):
we all should look for the little windows of opportunity
throughout each day to extend a little bit of grace
and a little bit of love. I mean, we're riffing
a little bit here, but I'll go there. But like,
why is everybody so damn angry? I don't see it.
I mean, I know we have very polarized politics, all
(58:42):
of the difficulties around the globe, But at the end
of the day, I think if we all focused on
truly learning to love one another and accept one another
without judgment, most of the bullshit problems go away. So
my little part in that is to love on the
people that are around me really really well. And I
(59:08):
don't know, I'm kind of a simpleton. And at the
end of the day, like if in my sphere, whether
I'm traveling or sitting here or like wherever I am,
you know, I look down at my feet, which is
a funny one that we've been talking a little bit
about the recovery journey. Jimmy Leisure, my first sponsor up
(59:29):
in Malibud, taught me something that I took all the
way to the Super Bowl and beyond. But he made
sense out of something for me that seems appropriate right now,
and that is being present for our own existence. Like
I was always worried about what the hell happened last night?
Or you know, what the fuck when I'm done talking
(59:51):
to Sino, what am I going to be doing? Like
I was never fully present. And this guy, this mill
plant AA sponsor, which is perfect for me, he kicked
my ass. But he told me one day he said, Dirk,
look down at your feet, And I'm like, what the fuck, Jimmy,
(01:00:11):
what just say? Shut up? Look down at your feet.
So I looked down at my feet and he goes
recognize this right here is where you are. Mmmm, like
show up, m because he saw the distraction. He saw
you know, the hmmm, just your inability to be present.
(01:00:33):
My add on, you know, dyslexic self, just like dancing
around thinking about everything other than the moment that I'm in.
And Jimmy taught me to look down at my feet
when I felt anxious or I felt like things were
spinning out. I still to this day a couple of
times a day, will stop and look down on my
(01:00:54):
feet and ground it grounds me.
Speaker 2 (01:00:58):
And you brought that to the players. Yeah, and what
was the application.
Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
A lot of people anxious, scared, fearful, whatever performance anxiety distraction.
You know, something happened last night with my girl. Any
number of distractors, and one of their favorite things was that,
And a lot of the guys practiced it, like instead
(01:01:22):
of being fearful or distracted, like, look down at my feet,
recognize where we are in this moment, whether you're playing
in football game or you're going to the grocery store
or whatever. It's like, I want desperately to be fully
present in whatever moment I'm in. Like this is a gift.
Speaker 2 (01:01:41):
Yeah, such a gift, man.
Speaker 1 (01:01:42):
And that's part of the magic of this recovery thing
is that I actually get to be here with Cino
like and I don't give a shit about what's happening.
Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
Outside exactly doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
And that's a huge gift. This guy.
Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
Two kinds of head coaches, the one where you fumble
and you yell at the player, and the one you say,
I love you, get back into it. Coach Carroll's approach.
You're talking about football is love you. So no, big,
don't move on from it. It doesn't matter, it doesn't matter,
move on, stay in the network.
Speaker 1 (01:02:15):
We're good. Yeah, there's a real art. Yeah, especially with quarterbacks,
and I you know, Pete's a super gifted coach in
many ways. But every relationship he shared with a quarterback
was with some magic. He was. He was their safe place,
and you know what happened between the two of them
(01:02:36):
never was talked about with anybody. Yeah, it's sacred, sacred,
and it should be sacred. But that was cool to watch.
Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
Yeah, I bet it was. Okay. I always ask people this, dear.
You know, people are struggling right now, People are addicted,
people are jammed up, people are paranoid. What's the parting
words for everybody right now. What do you how do
you want to inspire people? What do you want to
say to everybody that's listening right now all around the world.
Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
Brother, we can pretend to care, but we can't pretend
to show up. And I think if we focus on relationships, family,
inner circle, friends and show up for one another and
have that be good enough, then we're winning.
Speaker 2 (01:03:24):
Amen. I Amen, all right, thank you so much for
being I really appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (01:03:29):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
All right, God speak, brother, all right, love you, I
love you too, man. Thank you.
Speaker 3 (01:03:34):
Hey, folks, Jreck and I got so caught up talking
about waking up, getting sober, living out how that I
forgot to mention the nonprofit he leads. It's called the
Healthy Hive. Now, the Healthy Hive was creative served through
providing scholarships for people to assess health care opportunities such
as private therapy, intervention, care management, impatient residential care, intensive, outpatient,
(01:04:02):
experimental and somaticcare opportunities that otherwise would not be affordable.
The Healthy Hive is looking to give a hand up
to people to possess a high level motivation for change.
Contact Dirk at Dirk g. I r K at Healthy
dash high hiv e dot org. Learn more at www
(01:04:25):
dot healthyhive dot org.
Speaker 2 (01:04:27):
The Sino Show is a production of iHeartPodcasts hosted by
me Cina McFarlane, produced by pod People in twenty eighth
av Our lead producer is Keith carnlik Our executive producer
is Vincy Hoffman. Marketing lead is Ashley Weaver. Thank you
so much for listening. We'll see you next week.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com