Ash Hamilton: Rock Bottom & Rising

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Fourteen years old.

Speaker 2 (00:00):
I brought a bunch of my friends and we were
just like ripping lines and hookers in the house.

Speaker 1 (00:04):
And this is like, you know, President the fucking Philippines.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
I went from smoking it to that that day, going
home back to my mom's house and shooting up. And
I remember the first place I shut up was in
my vein, in my hand, and I see, you know,
it's the weirdest thing ever.

Speaker 1 (00:19):
I had felt like I had been doing it for
a million years.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
I talk about wanting to kill yourself and you can't,
you know, And they would have to pick me up
to bathe me. And I was so pissed, you know,
there was nothing. I was having seizures because they didn't
they wouldn't get me more med. So I was having
seizures left and right, pissing myself and I was like,
this is just hell. And still I just still can't stop.
And I had the phenomenon cravings. Just how can I

(00:43):
keep going? How can you know all this is happening?
You know, I just couldn't stop me. It was really
emotional because it was my mom had the house for
twenty two years, you know, and this is our last
Thanksgiving and I'm thinking, this is this our last Thanksgiving
because the house is going. It was just my last
Thanksgiving because I might be gone next year.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
All right, welcome back to the Sino Show.

Speaker 3 (01:09):
I don't know how this brother's fucking still alive, but
he's got a fucking brutal addiction. He's battling cancer, but
he's also got a huge heart and extraordinary survival skills.
He comes from Hollywood Royalty. He's a songwriter, singer, producer, actor,
just a fucking talented artist. I got mad love for him,
even when he starts my fucking television and pays allegedly allegedly,

(01:36):
Ash Hamilton, Welcome to the Sino Show.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
Brother, Hey lady, yeah to be here. Yeah, I've been
on this couch. You've been on this country for many times,
just not in this way.

Speaker 3 (01:44):
Yeah, not in this way. Thank you for making time. Yeah,
of course I appreciate you. So I think we just
start from the beginning a little bit growing up. Tell
us about young Ash Hamilton.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
It's funny, you know, because people always ask first question
I always get asked, is uh, what was it like
growing up?

Speaker 1 (02:00):
The way you get?

Speaker 2 (02:01):
You know, And that's because of growing up in a
family that was in the industry, you know, with some
pure we'll get into I'll do it for you. Sure,
our name drop, I'll be the d bagger name drops.
But uh no, I came from you know.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
Uh. My daddy was an actor.

Speaker 2 (02:17):
His name was George Hamilton and uh and then my
stepfather was a singer named Rod Stewart.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
So little singer name rot sing.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
You might have heard of him now exactly. I think
he still might make it one day, you know. Yeah,
it's real close. Yeah, I think he'll break out. It
was funny because that one of the songs I played
you that you loved, that Glasgow Girls one my my
dad lost at the tables, like you you need to
just release it, let it go and yourself. I go,
You can't just I wrote that song with him for

(02:46):
his record. You can't just really see yourself for yourself,
you know. And and I'm out of that at that game.
I really just write for people and step back. But
come back to that story. Yeah, let's go ahead. It's
a great story.

Speaker 1 (02:59):
Disorder. It is real.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
So yeah, so I I parents parents divorced it to
I can't say I remember, you know, my earliest memories
really of where this this guy come in with blonde,
spiky hair and a lot of hair moose, you know,
and uh and some weird spandex on with tiger print
stuff and uh cars I didn't know about, but they

(03:21):
looked like cool cars or talking cool cars or like
they were Lamborghine. So and that was Rod. So I
was kind of my earliest memories, you know. And my
mom and Rod probably got together around the age of five,
I think, you know.

Speaker 1 (03:34):
Yeah, so uh, he.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
Always says, there's a picture of of me just going
like this to them, because like holding hands and like
you know, getting close, and I'm like, you're taking my mom,
you know, even back then exactly. Yeah, So I was.
I was a confused kid because I was like, uh,
you know in this rock and roll house with uh,
you know, spandex and g strings, spand X under you know,

(03:59):
underwear that was the thing back then, and how I
would dress and all the.

Speaker 1 (04:02):
Weight outfits and I go to my dad and other.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
Weird outfits were which was Brooks Brothers and Tan and
you know and Bentley Away. So it was just so
confused on you know, who identity or what was what,
you know, And my dad at that point was really
like he to make a living and a family of support.
So as a kid, you don't understand. I'm sure we'll
get into this too, but as a kid, you don't
understand why you're not seeing.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
Your your main parent.

Speaker 2 (04:26):
You know, you're not you know, you don't understand that
there's these responsibilities and these things that they have to
do to keep everything afloat. You know, young child doesn't
understand that. I think I felt very abandoned by my
my dad at a very young age, especially with what
stuff started happening in my stepfather's house. Sexual abuse, uh

(04:47):
you know, physical, mental, you know, emotional, all that stuff.
So I really started to trust trust less and less
and less, you know, and and and society and people
and you know, and I remember like Rod dropping me
off at school once in a while, you know, and
there was the stories, I'm sure which is near impossible,

(05:10):
but there was these stories that he had to be
rushed into the r because he had like two gallons
of colm pumped up his stomach, which is like, which
is just like ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (05:21):
Half.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
I mean, we've all been there, you know, but not
too our limit, you know, Yeah, there's no way, But.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
How old are you when you go to school in
your here in the stool.

Speaker 2 (05:29):
Like I mean, this was like I guess eight or
nine or something run around then, I mean, you know.
And so every day in the morning they were always playing,
uh this game that used to be like, you know,
smear the queer and I would get out of the car.

Speaker 1 (05:45):
Unbeknownst to me, I was the queer every day.

Speaker 2 (05:47):
So it'd be smear the queer, and I get just
hammered on, you know, because of these stories. And and
so I was like, very like I said, get very
embarrassed from the stuff that you know, your your identity
started being taken over.

Speaker 1 (06:01):
By someone else's identity. At a young age.

Speaker 2 (06:03):
I started realizing that, you know that that you couldn't
you know, it's not poor me, but it's you couldn't
really form your own identity because your parents were bigger
than life and there was a shadow over you, and
whatever they did reflected on to you somehow, you know,
even though you're your own person. That at a young
age I picked up and I really wanted my stepfather's

(06:26):
love and approval, you know. But it's it's a hard thing.
When the seventies, people doing lots of crazy shirt eighties.
You know, he has two other kids with my mom.
I kind of felt like a tourist in my own house,
you know, you know what I mean, like like I
didn't belong there necessarily, and I didn't see my dad much.

Speaker 1 (06:45):
So I learned at a young.

Speaker 2 (06:47):
Age, especially to all the other shit that had happened
in the house, to hire to make myself small, you know.
And and I remember a therapist once saying to me,
he was like, you know, you need it later later
in life, is like you need to take time and space,
you know, walk in the room, because I always just
kind of be trying to you know, just you know,
and you hear that thing uncomfortable our own skin and

(07:09):
the whole thing.

Speaker 1 (07:09):
But I think a lot of it comes from a
certain reason.

Speaker 2 (07:12):
You know, as as the critical parent in our head,
from our main you know, primary caretakers and stuff and
and and you know, they went.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
Around with show.

Speaker 2 (07:21):
I just kind of started like I was kind of
stoked when they went around, which was weird as a
kid too. You know, like a lot of people, I
don't know, a lot of kids maybe even miss their parents.
But I was kind of stokes. And I kind of
live in my own imaginary world and build forts and
you know, do weird things. You know, not much change,
but but you know, like and then I had at

(07:42):
the same time, I had an over over a protective
mom who is you know, she she wasn't around much
either because she was with my stepfather and they were
doing whatever they were doing back then. You know, you
cross sunset, you know, you couldn't cross sunset on your BMX.
You know, you get punished if you did that, you know,
like and so.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
And that's was she aware of the sexual abuse?

Speaker 2 (08:03):
Yeah, they were somewhat somewhat aware of it, you know.
So she didn't protect you, I think to the best
of their ability, you know. Uh, you know, it's just
it's something that I think that parents say they feel
maybe responsible for something or want to shut out or
you know, and and it's that thing lays say shame
What is the thing I say to him?

Speaker 3 (08:24):
Shame on Shame on them for trueing me that way,
Shame on me for staying that way.

Speaker 1 (08:27):
See, I love it, that's it, you know.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
So you know I think we all we all work
through stuff to the best of our ability, you know.
And so the thing, you know, a lot a lot
of stuff turned around and we'll get there. But anyway,
so during all that time, I just you know, I
didn't fit in in school. I became really fat after
being lusted in the household. I became very very fat,

(08:49):
you know. And it was from my nickname was Fatly.
Really so it was you know, smear the queers, it
was fag Ley, then it was fat Ly, you know,
it was fagatle or something fun, you know, so fuck.

Speaker 1 (09:02):
You don't realize how like how brutal kids are on
each other, you know, like.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
Brutal kids have fun eight year old like the little
third gradest that fucking me up more of my life
anybody else, you know.

Speaker 1 (09:14):
So you know that.

Speaker 2 (09:14):
Stuff kind of that you know, goes with you. And
I think that it's the trust is gone. You want
to try to be small. I stuck to myself in school.
I got really into music. The one thing I really
did bond with over Rod was they used to the
band used to you know, rehearse at the house in
the garage, you know, and so I was I was
mesmerized by that. And you know, I would go see

(09:37):
my dad in his film sets and it was you know,
I remember I loved Second Bite and there's these people
and drack you you know, costumes and people around you know,
be cut okay, and you sit around for a few
hours and you'd be like, okay, this is.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
Kind of born. But music caught me.

Speaker 2 (09:51):
It was like love and the thing and yeah, the
whole like you know, just how much fun it was.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
It was just it was just.

Speaker 2 (09:56):
Go, go, go go, And uh, I wasn't go sitting
the trailer for eight hours. Let's wait for the next setup,
you know. And I loved I loved that, and I
loved watching the creative form. And you know, I didn't
I didn't really understand at a young age, you know
what like when you know Ron Wood would be over
there or Mick Jag or whoever. I didn't you know Elton,
you know his pictures of me and Elton John as
like a kid and stuff. I didn't really know, you know.

Speaker 1 (10:17):
They were just your dad's friends. Yeah, my dad's friends,
you know.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
And they taught me some cool fucking how to write,
you to play songs and write songs a little bit.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
You know. That part was really really cool, you know.

Speaker 2 (10:28):
And I also grew up on the road a lot
with my step father, so because my mom and him
and out or out. So I would have a nanny,
you know, nanny, a teacher on the road, you know.
So I grew up just loving that stuff. And then
we would spend half the time of our lives in
the UK. So I spent a lot, went to school
there a little bit, and I really loved the UK.

(10:49):
Uh great, great culture, great stuff.

Speaker 1 (10:51):
But I just got.

Speaker 2 (10:52):
Immersed and music and learned from some of the greatest,
you know, even even rods like you know, bandmates would
just when they were sitting around waiting start showing me.
At fourteen, I started picking up the guitar at fourteen, yeah, fourteen,
And and because I wasn't in the cool cay click
you know, it's still fat and I love playing guitar,
and those guys are teaching me things. And then I
went to a little teacher as well. But there was

(11:13):
nothing better to me at that point, nothing. There was
no better feeling in the world than like learning a song,
you know, starting Friday night, one of the songs you
fucking love, you know, a Dylan song or Hendrix, you know,
watched her whatever it is, and by Sunday morning, you've
learned the whole thing, you know, and like that that's
like that stays with you and you realize like this
is something I can do, and I wake up and
it's you have a great time and it's still with

(11:34):
me the next day and not such a hangover now,
you know, it's just a great night and hangover, but
this thing. And so I really went towards that.

Speaker 1 (11:43):
I love that.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
But my mom and stepfather start to separate, probably around thirteen,
I think twelve thirteen they split. So I was at
military school at that time. At twelve, I wanted to
do geographic, you know. I was like, if I get
away from here, things will be.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
Different, you know.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
And so I went to military school because my friend
was going and I just wanted to try to go
different places, you know, and where you know, saying wherever
we go, there we are. At that young age, I
was already having all that stuff. Finally I went to
OHI Valley School, you know, got kicked out of there.
Then went to Beverlely you got kicked out of there,
went to continuation, which was supposed to be a big

(12:22):
punishment for you to be kicked out and go to
a continuation, and I'm like, wait, wait a second, Like
eight hours a day of school or three hours a
day of school, you know, and you get to pick
your own schedule eight till eleven or nine to twelve.
I'm like, and Angelia and Jolie is my classmate in
this little teen room, I go, this is punishment, this
is heaven.

Speaker 1 (12:40):
You know, you ever figured the game out already? Yeaheah,
you know. So I was like, this is great.

Speaker 2 (12:45):
And so we would just smoke pot back there and
ten it was like a it was just like the
size of this room, you know, and there was a
desk in front with like three teachers, but they would
give you your textbook and your work to go to yourself,
and you go in the back rooms and we'd build
party and doing whatever we were doing that young in age.
And I felt like I first started partying. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
so weird, yeah yeah yeah. I was late to that.

(13:07):
I was late to the game, like seventeen, sixteen, seventeen,
you know, a lot of people started before me.

Speaker 1 (13:13):
I tried everything. We were fourteen.

Speaker 2 (13:15):
I was like, I remember I was at Meldon Marcus's house,
and Marcus she was friends.

Speaker 1 (13:20):
With my dad.

Speaker 2 (13:21):
Then Marcus is with the President of the Philippines and
got thrown out of there because they're highly corrupt. And
I remember like she was like, actually, go ahead, use
my house in New York.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
And I was fourteen years old.

Speaker 2 (13:33):
I bought a bunch of my friends and we were
just like ripping lines and hookers in the house. And
this is like, you know, President the fucking Philippines. Fourteen
years old, I have no idea, you know, like, just
I look back now, I go, that's the craziest shit ever.
You know, there's guys with ak's around us everywhere. You know,
it's it's i'd be old parent, I don't worry. It's diplomatic,
you know, whatever it is. It's safe here. You know,

(13:54):
nobody can touch you.

Speaker 1 (13:55):
But good, you know.

Speaker 2 (13:56):
So it started so young like that. But the thing
with us was there was nothing I really like, really
liked that much. I mean I had lots of coffee.
I liked weed, you know, I like to smoke weed.
Nothing really I tried coke and tried speed. It was
all okay. It just wasn't like really anything was my JamMan.
I read this book. It was this book called Wonderland

(14:17):
Avenue by Danny Sugarmanda. And I remember, if you remember
Danny I think fahe Hall, it's married to him, and
it was about it was about like La and the
sixties and seventies. I was the biggest iggy pop and
doors fan, and you know, he was the manager of
both this era and this thing. And and during during

(14:38):
the you know the book, uh, he starts to describe
the way he felt from this drug called heroin, and Uh,
I was like, man, you know, there's just that That's
what I want, you know, because I knew there was
something better than weed. I was like, we is good,
you know, and it gets me through like not feeling
so awkward and until I get really awkward in my
head and you start getting freaky, you know, the marijuana does.

(15:00):
I had to go search that out. Like I knew
that was my path, which was weird. And I know
when people say you always hear, oh I didn't grow
up and want to be a junkie.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
I knew that I wanted to do that.

Speaker 2 (15:10):
As crazy as that sounds, like, I was like, it
was just but I had that thing of arrogance where
I'm not going to be like them. You know, I'll
be able to handle it and use it when I want.
I read the book and I'm like, how do I
get a heroin I don't I mean, I don't know.
There's no Craigslist back then, and they even cell phones
back then, you know, So I have no idea. And

(15:33):
in the book, the book was written like twenty years prior,
you know, I was I was seventeen at the time,
so I'm fifty one now, so it was written twenty
years prior. And there was this character in the book
at this bar called Coaching Horses, which was on Fairfax
and Sunsets shut down. Now, yeah, old school, like you know,
smokey bar, you know, at the red and juke box

(15:55):
in the corner, and you know, I walk in there
and you know that beer smell whatever, And in there
is the character who is the drug dealer in the book,
and he worked at Coaching Horses, you know, and his
parents owned it, so he worked there as a front
to try to sell it. And I never thought this
guy would be there twenty years later. I mean, who

(16:16):
would ever think that's possible, you know, especially a junkie,
you know, like, you know, the odds are he's something happens,
so for sure, you know, And I just remember sitting
down and I knew that was him, you know, because
he was like this. He looked like long this long,
like greasy hair and a ponytail, and sat Tuesday wear
a biker dude, you know, and a patch over one eye,

(16:36):
and I just knew that was him. And I sat
down at the bar and I was like, can I
have a beer?

Speaker 1 (16:42):
Beer please?

Speaker 2 (16:43):
He goes, you old enough to drink? I go, yeah,
twenty one and I was seventeen. He goes, yeah, sure, punk,
you know. And so he gets a beer, gives me
a beer anyway, and meanwhile I'm looking He's like doing
something nudging with something under underneath the like you know,
bars thing the table, and I'm like, what's what's going on?
I see him pissing in the sink, you know, and
I'm like, this is definitely this is definitely him.

Speaker 1 (17:05):
He's the guy.

Speaker 2 (17:06):
Yeah, the guy I said. I forgure how to segue
into heroin.

Speaker 1 (17:09):
You know.

Speaker 2 (17:10):
It's like, you know, cause I'm a big seventeen year
old too, so I'm not like, you know, it's that
could this guy be an FBI and formant? You know,
like of course he's just a high school fucking drop out.
We are not sure.

Speaker 1 (17:21):
So I.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
Finally start to have the courage to bring it up
and talk. You know, we're smart dopings like us. So
I started talking about la in the sixties. You know,
I'm gonna bring i'mna let him bring it to me,
you know, And I'm gonna let him bring up Oh yeah,
you know this book that he was in called Wonderland Avenue,
because I knew if I asked it was it was over.
And then he brought up that he was his character
in the book. I go, no way, that's my favorite

(17:44):
favorite book ever. Oh my god, I go by the way.
I'm really I'm really sick right now. I'm kicking. I've
never tried heary in my life.

Speaker 1 (17:50):
You know. I'm really dope sick.

Speaker 2 (17:52):
You would you know, anywhere I could get it or anything.
He's like, no, fuck off, you know, and I'm like shit.
So I just sit there a while longer and he
comes back and goes, okay, kid, I know what it's
like to be sick. He gave me some dope, you know,
and he gave me a rig, you know, and he's like,
go ahead here and fix and I'm like, no, it's okay.

Speaker 1 (18:09):
He's like, you want me to do it for you?

Speaker 2 (18:10):
I'm like, no, no, no, I'll just I'll just go home,
but I'll be back right give him.

Speaker 1 (18:14):
A big tip. Whatever it is. Leave the first time
I smoke it, you know, and I excited. I was excited. Man,
this was like this was it, you know.

Speaker 2 (18:24):
And it wasn't uh yeah, it wasn't. It wasn't a
fuck you to society, you know. I wasn't a screw
of you, society, I hate all you. It was I'm
just searching something to be okay and feel okay. And
I remember that first hits that I took, uh and
I literally and kid you not, you know, exhale way

(18:45):
and not feeling that warm feeling started to come over
me where I just felt like, you're back in the
room and everything's okay and you feel good, you know,
and life's okay. And I just dropped on my knees
and thanks God, because at that time I felt like
I was in so much pain that that leaf finally
just leave.

Speaker 1 (19:01):
It felt just normal again, and I was like, this
is it, This is it, you know.

Speaker 2 (19:05):
And so I started going back to that bar every
day and I would watch him shoot up and hadn't
start slamming yet, and I was still living at my
mom's house, you know, still like seventeen years old. I
just finished my first movie, Beethoven second or second, you know,
second week, right, and so I'm living there and this
heroins great and I always felt like, you know, I

(19:26):
love the music, but somehow I got into the acting
thing because of the thing.

Speaker 1 (19:30):
The thing go on this audition.

Speaker 2 (19:31):
You want to try it sure, and you know, it
just kind of had happened, you know. And so coming
from you know, a family, and then these jobs come easy,
you just like, shit, this life's easy, you know, And
now I can feel okay inside. And I remember, like
on Beethibes second, Danny Masterson is now in prison.

Speaker 1 (19:48):
You know.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
He was the other like lead kid, you know, and
he walked in one day and so me doing that,
He's like, what is that. I'm like, it's be twelve.
It's be twelve, you know. But I just needed it
just to uncomfortable. But during the it was a three
month shoot. So during during the three months shoot, the
producers and director and people start coming up to me,
are you okay? They started to notice the difference, you know,

(20:10):
like already you know, because I went from you know,
I went from smoking it to that that day, going
home back to my mom's house and shooting up. And
I remember the first place I shut up was in
my vein, in my hand, and I see, you know,
it's the weirdest thing ever. I felt like I had
been doing it for a million years.

Speaker 1 (20:28):
It was like came right like boom.

Speaker 2 (20:30):
It just was like I knew how to well hold
the whole thing. There was no YouTube videos on how
to shoot dope.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
You know. It was just like I just I don't know.

Speaker 2 (20:40):
It was like boom, I'm in, I'm home, and so
you know, we find the keys to the kingdom. That's
our solution, as we know. And it's one of those
great like uh employees. You know, dope's a great employee,
but when it comes becomes the employer of you, it's
just screwed, you know. And I remember waking up one
day sick and I was just like, oh my god,

(21:01):
what is this what? I don't know what what's going
on with me?

Speaker 1 (21:05):
Uh? And I was getting dope sick. You know.

Speaker 2 (21:07):
I figured that one out fast. And so we finished Beethoven.
Second I come home, I come home from shooting at
great movie, you know, finished it had a fund.

Speaker 1 (21:16):
Of the dog blah blah blah.

Speaker 2 (21:17):
I had a blast on and uh, poor poor Chris
Pan we lost him to you know, from alcoholics.

Speaker 1 (21:22):
And he was staying it with me and.

Speaker 2 (21:23):
And I remember because I was coming back hanging out
with him and Bonnie Hunt were always going in drinking
and you know, it was just it was great. It
was just a great time. But I remember my mom's
friend Steve Bing. I don't remember Steve.

Speaker 1 (21:34):
Yeah, one of us, you know who jumped off a building.

Speaker 2 (21:38):
Because of Central City, the Central City, because of the
pain and you know of fuck.

Speaker 1 (21:42):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (21:43):
My mom asked me to talk to him once when
I was sober, and he was like, man, I'm okay.
I just you know, everybody's still like that. I just
want to have a good time and part of it,
you know. I'm like, well, we're like smoking math and
shooting math at that point. You know, I think we
may have passed the limit. But I'm like, I get it.
You know, you can't tell one of us to stop
until we hit a bottom. And I just wonder, like,
you know, I wonder what that night, because I always wonder.

Speaker 1 (22:05):
I've been one of those.

Speaker 2 (22:06):
People who have had a lot of suicide iliation you know,
and thought about it as a way out. And I
always wonder, what's what's that final thing that makes that
person just do it? You know, when I've been there
with a nine millimeter in my mouth going to pull
the and I want to with all my heart, I'm
like everything, but I can't do it, And what's that thing?
And somebody that's just you know, and I'm sick in

(22:27):
that way. I go, fuck, he had balls, you know,
like when most people a thing yeah, you know, yeah,
I'm like, you know. And then there's this documentary that
comes out about everybody jumps off the Golden Bridge, you know,
and people survive and they're right away as soon as
they jumped there.

Speaker 1 (22:40):
Like I didn't want to do it. I knew it
was the wrong thing to do, you know.

Speaker 2 (22:44):
Like so I'm like, you know, and I don't think
that was my way, you know, it's been my way.
I'm not lucky enough to get out of here. I've
seen guys who who try to kill themselves and you know,
it's recoiled and they're blown half their face off, or
they're in a wheelchair and they're still alive. Y, you know, No,
I want to be like you know, like I just
that that was the that was the Powerlessons part of

(23:05):
No matter how hard I wanted to die, I couldn't,
you know. And that's when we get high. We don't
what we think is gonna happen. Is the Powerlessons part.
We don't know what's gonna happen, you know. But I,
I truly that was My intention wasn't to cry for help.
Back to the party, and I think it's a party.
See bang, I come back to my mom's house, you know,
this big party. I think, oh, this has got the
beer and like he's got the dope. This is great.

Speaker 1 (23:26):
Girls over there and my agents are their managers. You know.
I'm like, this is this is amazing. And uh then
you know it.

Speaker 2 (23:32):
It's a circle and these these pieces of papers come out,
and you know, I'm.

Speaker 1 (23:35):
Like, you know, I knew something was up.

Speaker 2 (23:37):
I didn't think we were doing cold reading, you know.

Speaker 1 (23:41):
The project, I know.

Speaker 2 (23:43):
And uh and I was so mad at Steve being
because I thought he betrayed me, because I thought another
like father, because he's real close to my mom, so
another fatherly figure that was taking me out to dinner,
celebrate and go, oh this is crazy, celebrate because he
cares and then he comes home and he's you know,
it's that a lot and care. But at that age,
I feel betrayed once again, you know, by by like

(24:04):
my male friends and stuff. So they read the letters.
Hey if you don't. And at the time, it was
like I was with Ed Lamaro at the time, who
was like the G.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
It was the G. Yeah, he was the G back
in the day.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
And I loved Ed and Chris Andrews and Tracy Brannan
and uh and you know I had I had been
given like everything every chance that you could have and
and like out of the gate. So whenever I get
in that morbid self reflection, I'm like, there's nobody to
blame but yourself, you know, like like really you know, like.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
As hold one second, I want to ask you this though,
just yeah, how did you lose the weight? Which time? Huh?
Which time? When you when did.

Speaker 4 (24:43):
You become like all of a sudden like oh yeah, okay,
cool col Yeah, So because check this out and the
ninth grade, like around ninth grade, tenth grade, eleventh so
twelfth grade senior year, right, so my my second sexual experience.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
This is how it all ties into there.

Speaker 2 (24:58):
I'm like I'm fourteen fifteen now and I'm starting to
like shoot up until and the slides in front of
my mom's still home, you know, and he's like, hey, kid,
you know, I want to hit the gym a little bit,
you know. Like I was like, oh, this is great,
and there's you know, supplements you can take, you know, supplements,
you know, and it gets your real jacked, you know.
And I did him for Rock You two and three

(25:19):
and uh, and like all of a sudden, I was
hanging out with him as a kid. You know, I'm
going to we'd being like just traveling, what I'm working out,
you know whatever, And so he got me really into
shape and I started to lose the weight and then
I started to seal their attention.

Speaker 1 (25:32):
I started getting Yeah.

Speaker 3 (25:33):
Because now you know the longer fact guy, you're like
a Hollywood fucking league man on every fucking magazine, right.

Speaker 2 (25:38):
Yeah, but you still feel like yeah, yeah, but you
still feel like the fact. Yeah, the part of the
fact came mafia, you know inside, you know, and like
I would, I would I would always keep my shirt
on when I would have sex with women because I
called Donald ducking it, you know, was a top on
because I was so still no matter what, paranoid, you know,
and uh.

Speaker 1 (25:57):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:58):
So they do intervention, do the intervention, to do the intervention,
and uh, you know, either will you do this or
none of us can work with you, and blah blah blah,
you know, and they'll have to cut you off, you know,
from you know, every everything camp in your life. And
you know there's there's a defiant alcoholic in us, and
then there's the hustler, and then there's a little bit

(26:18):
of both in between. Okay, I'll go. You know, so
like I went, and I remember, I'm in there. This
is the Heyday, this is Exodus. You remember, like Exodus went
first to open to Cobain. You know, everybody was there,
Like Cobainia just jumped the wall after I was there,
which he could have just went out the.

Speaker 1 (26:35):
Back door like I did. But yeah, easier, you don't
pull muscles or anything.

Speaker 2 (26:40):
But I remember, like, you know, there's all these characters there,
Mike Starr who passed away from Alice in chains him
and I went off to New York. Started, we did
a record, got signed, a whole nother long story we
don't need to get into. It ended up horrific, you know. Uh,
but but all the stuff started started happening, and so
I I was, I was. That was like seventeen eighteen,

(27:01):
I guess whatever. And after sixteen days, I was just
like I can't, I can't, I can't do this, you know,
I just A'm like, uh and our buddy Solo Scott too,
he was my roommate in Solo, so yeah, uh huh
yeah yeah. And I remember I remember the coolest mofo
I ever seen in my life, who I love dearly
walked in. There was just all these characters back then

(27:21):
in Exodus and he's got this like long blonde, stringy hair,
and he's like black leather pants on and black T
shirt and boots that are kind of messed up with
tape on him and a cane and I'm like that,
dude's so cool.

Speaker 1 (27:31):
I want to be just like him. And it was Norman,
are you just you know, like wow?

Speaker 2 (27:37):
Yeah, you know, And so it was uh you know
aa back then, as you know, it was just it
was popping. It was you know that that that time.
But I just wasn't ready. I didn't, you know, I
didn't I wanted. So it's sixteen sixteen days in, I
called my friend Darius Trugman, who's now one of the
head people over at LAPD. I think he's just retired.
He was working in the chief's office. We were born

(27:58):
two days apart, so we grew up together. But I
had him come and pick me up and take me
raising Waters, you know, on day sixteen treatment center. So
there are some good police out there, and I just
I was just like, this is great.

Speaker 1 (28:12):
And then that night I didn't go back.

Speaker 2 (28:15):
I decided to I decided to go out to a
place called the Whiskey Bar, which was at the Sunset Marquee,
and it was popping and I had met this girl.
I had met this girl there once with this other
friend of mine, Judd Nelson. She was dating Judd for
a second, you know, And and she was there and
I was there, and I guess kind of give me

(28:37):
each other looks, and we started talking and happy to
be Shan Doherty. And two or three nights later, a
month later, I don't remember, we were married, you know,
and divorce that wick. But I started feeling like a
lot of shame over these things because I wanted that,
because I thought that that would bring, you know, some
stability into my life, you know. But when people are

(28:59):
both sick and in their disease and mental health, ship
just kicks off, you know. And I also about to
lie as I am, I'm not good enough, so if
this person likes me, then I'm okay.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
You know.

Speaker 2 (29:13):
Maybe that's where that slow stuff comes in, where I'm like, no,
see now, I don't have an issue with that stuff,
you know, just why you tell the story. And I
just thought, to your voice in my Hand'm like, no, man,
that's not my task. I love the session, love being here.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
This is planned, isn't it? And I started, Yeah, and
I started.

Speaker 2 (29:33):
I started, but I started seeing that with with my
my dad, like the tan and the women and the thing,
and it was just like I said, it made me
feel like I was okay because I didn't feel like
I was okay with who I am. We just start
doing these things, our addiction takes over and then you know,
I remember manager friend of mine going from saying it

(29:53):
was what what movies actually doing?

Speaker 1 (29:56):
To who's he getting married? To?

Speaker 2 (29:58):
To what we have seeing now? Slowy, like you know,
so that's saying all press is good press. It's not true,
you know, And so I got it, heavier into my addiction.
God bless Shane, and we were both kids, you know,
uh you know which is you know, we'll get there.
She died of you know, cancer obviously, which hits home
close to me. But you know, I went from there

(30:21):
on to another, you know, another treatment center to try
to pull it together. And it's so great to get clean.
So we're up and up until it's time to get
clean and sober. You know, it's it's you know, you've
seen it a million times. Our intentions are, but it's
so hard because it's not just the physical detox. It's
these feelings that you've been suppressing for so long that
you don't you know, you don't want them to come up.

(30:43):
And the shame of the divorce and just shame everything,
you know, for I digress because I was when you said,
when I got skinny. You my second my secon My
second sexual relationship was with my father's like girlfriend, and
she was twenty five or twenty six weeks universe whatever,
you know. Some people call it rape at fourteen, and

(31:04):
I call it heaven. You know, I winning the lottery,
you know, but I told my dad years later he laughed,
you know, it was whatever but it was once again
around secrets and lies. You know, when being less is
all around secrets and lies, you know, so and trust.
So like that that was a core thread that I
really realized lately that was starting to come through my

(31:24):
life is that these things I was doing, there were
so many secrets, and I just started losing trust with
so many people.

Speaker 1 (31:30):
And that's what the drugs. Doing with the drugs would
give me.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
Try to trust in the drugs, you know, I trust
that they would make me feel okay, and you know,
and like I said, when they they turn on you,
then that's when stuff gets dark and it's really bad.
And so I was going from treatment center or treatment center,
didn't nothing was working. Danny Sugarman became a friend of mine,
and Danny said, I had this doctor in London and
his name's doctor Pancha, and doctor panche was this.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
Old English like you know, ninety year old, you know,
Harley Street. Doctor carried the look.

Speaker 2 (32:00):
Case around and Danny convinced my family, listen, it's better
he's doing drugs from the doctor than on the streets,
you know, like you know, going scoring on the streets.
And my parents were like, yeah, I was all sounded
it sounded great, and doctor Pancho was also denounced to
my my parents was also taking care of Kurt Cobain
and Courtney, you know, so so he was like that,

(32:20):
but he was in the UK. So I moved over
to the UK. I went to this place called Promises,
that Promises.

Speaker 1 (32:27):
Sorry.

Speaker 2 (32:29):
Uh. It was in Southgate, Priory, sorry Priory, you know,
out there in Southgate. And I remember, I remember I
got Danny Struman drove me to the plane and I
had oldest heroin left on me and I'm like, well,
what do I do, Danny? I can't take you with
me on the plane. I don't want to get sick.
You go swallow it? Like what do you mean swallow goes? Oh,
you get high as fuck, trust me, So I swallow it,
you know. And fourteen hours later I land on the plane.

(32:51):
I land, you know, and doctor Ponche is there with
this guy and he's like, would you like methadone? We
will injected into you? And I was like in jetable methodone.
I was like no, I'm okay. It was still so high.
I was like, you know, still so yeah, I still
I was still so loaded from that, and so you know,
they didn't really, UK was always twenty years behind us

(33:11):
in like as far as you know, the addiction field.
So I was in Southgate Priory. Their whole thing was,
if he wants to shoot up, let's shoot him up
with methadone so he feels like he's getting you know,
I was. I was up to like four hunder and
ninety milligrams of methodone IV IV, a lot of methadone.
Like that's a lot, a lot of methadone. But that
was their thing of the early harm reduction. I guess,

(33:33):
you know, to I guess somewhat. And then I went
from Southgate to Priory to this one bedroom flat on
King King's Road. It was one of those what his
beds called when he pulled the bed down, the Murphy beds.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:47):
So it was just at one run with the Murphy
bed there and the doctor you know, would come every week,
but he would give me something called I think it
was called the PIMS over there, which is like the
the DSM here or Theian's desk reference for PR for
a drug. So he would go, what was you like?
You know, so every week I just picked this, this, this, this,
this this right and uh and I was like you know,

(34:09):
as long as we're not shooting, you know, street drugs
just won't crack.

Speaker 1 (34:12):
You know, we'll give you whatever you want. You know,
you don't buy them.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
So so of course, you know, I'm getting allowance, you know,
a little money every week.

Speaker 1 (34:19):
But I'm just giving your allowance. My dad. Yeah, at
the time, yeah, Roter George, No, George George was making
some coin back there. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:26):
He had a house there, but he wouldn't let me
live in it, you know, you know, And so I
would save up the little allowance to have and then
I would go score, you know, like you know, heroin
and crack. And I remember first time I shot dope.
I was like they ripped me off, and I'm like
these mother, I'm gonna go back. I'm gonna find them.
I run back to go get them, and uh and

(34:48):
I find them and they're like wait, wait wait, oh
oh no, this is good, dope. We'll do it right here.
So you have to you have to scort this limit
here and put or put this viaminent sea powder in
the spoon and like limit environment and see what you
talking about, because it was Afghany, like Persian heroin doesn't
melt down unless you put ascetic thing into it. So
I thought they ripped me off, you know, so they
hadn't you know, and uh, and so I would I

(35:11):
would go to them. And and the first person I
I got off the train because during during treatment, before
I moved into the flat, during treatment, they were there there.
They would let you drink, you know, back then, so
you could leave and say I'm going whatever. And but
I said to the people, listen, I really, I really
want to stay clean. Where where you know I'm gonna.

Speaker 1 (35:28):
Go out for the day.

Speaker 2 (35:29):
Where are the places I actually stay away from? You know,
you know, you guys gonna be so dumb natsy to
me that question. You know, He's like, oh, yeah, you
know Earl's Court.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
You know. I'm like, okay, great, straight to Earl's Court,
jump on the tube. You know. The first person I
asked that they have it? You know, we just we
had that. Yeah, we find them.

Speaker 2 (35:46):
It is crazy, right, like, can you drop us anywhere
in the world within fifteen minutes, we'll find We'll find it.
So I find it. And then smoking crack. Now, this
this guy Kingslee shows me how to smoke cracks. I
hadn't really like smoked crack. Then I was just doing dope,
you know, and uh it started to get worse as
you know that goes.

Speaker 1 (36:03):
And so I'm sitting there in the flat and.

Speaker 2 (36:06):
Uh and I've had enough, man, you know, I've had
enough drug Stop working. I'm getting all the drugs I want,
you know, I mean, you know, when you have to
there's this there's this animalistic, uh primal thing when you're
sick and you have to go out and you have
to go cop dope. You know, there's no like waking
up the morning and I'm depressed. I just don't want
to get to bed and I hate my life, Like

(36:27):
I got to go, I'm going to be sick, you know.
And I there was a part of me that missed
that because it was you didn't have time to get
in your head. You had a right, Yeah, it was
just automatic go. You know all the stuff we try
to teach us in sobriety about smart feet, you know,
you just had that when you had to go out
and get that dope, because you know, the the you know,
the survival part of our brain took over right that
my brain boom, you know, And so when you didn't

(36:49):
have to go anywhere, and you had all the pills
and all the drugs you could possibly want. That's when
it got even darker, you know, because that was gone.
There was no and I was just alone, you know.
And and I was just alone old friends, you know.
I said I I had enough, you know, I was
after we had before all this, I couldn't stop, you know,
I didn't think I was gonna be able to stop.

(37:11):
It wasn't working. And so supposedly I wrote a letter.
I never read it, and my parents kept it. They
told me about it. I took about you know, they
were barbituates, opiates and some benzos, about one hundred and
fifty pills or something. But at the same time, I
shot three grams of cocaine, right, which doesn't make sense
because your heart would blow up on three grams, right,

(37:32):
And I had no I was. I was done done,
it was And I remember that moment. We talked about
that moment earlier. What it makes, that moment where you
just push the edge. Well, if you're intoxicated just the
right amount, you get to a place where you say
buck it, you know, And I was there, and so
I did it, and I just you know, it was
out just five six days past, and I hadn't showed

(37:56):
up at this doctor Pancha's office to get the drugs.
Was always suspicious when a drug addict doesn't show up
for a drugs you know.

Speaker 1 (38:04):
So he actually ended.

Speaker 2 (38:05):
Up saving my life from you know, from it because
he came and you know my building because you know
I lived, and knocked the door and I was already
you know, my fifth or sixth day and in a coma.
And I was on the left side of my body.
So what happens is all the blood stops going to
your your muscles and you know everything. And so when
blood stops, you know, the nerves die, and so the

(38:26):
nerves started dying and everything. So I was completely paralyzed. Uh,
I'm completely paralyzed for three years. I mean, and I
act you feed the old muscles die, you know.

Speaker 1 (38:38):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (38:38):
And it couldn't even move a thumb, nothing, nothing, I mean,
I'm nothing, didn't move, just drop I have having a sling,
otherwise it would just would just dangle on the wing.

Speaker 1 (38:46):
No finger, know, nothing, nothing would move. You know. I
was gone.

Speaker 2 (38:49):
The doctor looked at me and goes, what a waste?
You know, you know, you never going to use your
arm again, Junky. I remember him saying it to me,
and I just it was like ball and crying and
and so I'd have to wear this thing like this,
and and I still couldn't stop, you know. So I
remember I'd be like in the mirror and I have
to I have to put my hand right here and
just place it in between there and there to hold
it because it would just fall down otherwise, because you know,

(39:09):
I couldn't you know, it was dead, you know, and
in the mirror and I have to. Yeah, you like
you're at that point where you just again, you know,
after all this I wanted, I didn't, you know. And
when I woke up in that hospital, I I remember
after od it was it was Chelsea Westminster.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
It was it was like four or five o'clock.

Speaker 2 (39:28):
The sun was coming through. There was no air conditioning.
Son's coming through the door. I was in six people
in the room and I remember this as hell like
and I was sick and I certainly like, you know,
cause it had been six days or whatever from all
the different drugs, the benzos werebituits, the dope, all all
that stuff. And I tried to get out of bed
and there were you know, and I said, fuck it,
let me get out of here. You know, I'm out.

(39:48):
I got to get out of here, you know. And
I remember I couldn't get I couldn't get up, and
I was like, I was my arm. I was like,
is this some kind of joke and my dream? With
what's going on? I was like freaking out, you know.
And I couldn't. I couldn't get out of bed. I
couldn't go cop I could. I was stuck.

Speaker 1 (40:03):
To tell you what I do.

Speaker 2 (40:06):
I talk about wanting to kill yourself and you can't,
you know, And they would have to pick me up
to bathe me. And I was so pissed, you know,
there was nothing. I was having seizures because they didn't
they wouldn't get me more med. So I was having
seizures left and right, pissing myself and uh and I
was like, this is just hell. And I still I
just still can't stop. And I had the phenomenon cravings.

(40:27):
Just how can I keep going? How can I you know,
all this is happening, you know, And uh, I just
I just couldn't stop. And the psychiatrist there, we're trying
to figure it out, and and I didn't. I didn't
I didn't care, you know, And so what happened was
my parents came got me, and uh, what I had
learned shortly was that something was going down in place.

Speaker 1 (40:48):
And I'll tell you man, they bring.

Speaker 2 (40:50):
Me back to the to the US because obviously it
worked out in the K. So I come back here
and my leg is like, my leg is limp as limpable,
you know, it's like if I have a cane on
the side, glump a little bit of the arms.

Speaker 1 (41:03):
Toasts, you know, like toast toast toasts.

Speaker 2 (41:07):
And so to bring me back one more time, I
go to this girl's house I used to shoot dope
with her. Is her name, you know, it was Renee.
I don't think she's with us anymore. God bless her heart,
you know. And I went to her flat, you know,
flat apartment. I get stuck in England. I went to
her apartment and she lived on Detroit and off Sunset,
and she's.

Speaker 1 (41:27):
Like, you know, darling, you've been gone so long.

Speaker 2 (41:29):
It was so good to just be like I'm home,
you know, and get that fix again and just you know,
start getting high and shooting that dope and then you know,
she little coke alsten you're getting that bell ring air
where it's God, I think.

Speaker 1 (41:40):
I did too much. Please please give me out. I
swear to God, I'll never do it again.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
Then you're like, okay, let's do it knowing hey, you know,
then the paranoid kicks and the choppers, you know, it's
like that Ray Ray you know where good Fellaws, good fellas,
you know, And she's she goes, you're doing that thing again,
actually where you just you just you're just tripping out,
you know. And and I'm like, I'm hiding in dumpsters
and I think the SWAT's coming the cops for my
tea little grammar or whatever. I'm like, no, you don't understand.

(42:03):
There's black cards around the bill, andess go, she becaues,
you do this every time.

Speaker 1 (42:06):
Just relax. I go, we're out of here. So we
call a taxi. We jump in a taxi.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
We go to the Hiatt House, you know, the Riot
house whatever. And I'm constantly looking back. I go, can't
you see that because you're tripping? Bro? She's like, you
just tripping, you know, it's stripping she was doing. You're tripping,
you know. So so I go go check in. I'm
gonna I'm gonna run up to the top floor, and
I'm gonna make sure there's no you know, there's no police,
nobody coming.

Speaker 1 (42:30):
You know.

Speaker 2 (42:30):
I'm on the fiftieth floor or whatever it is, the
top floor of the high house. Looking down, I can't
see everybody looks like ants anyway. At that point, you
can't see who's here. So she comes against me and
we go to the room and I'm getting high so fast,
like I'm being high, like that point of where you're
just like, slow down because you're gonna die. But I'm
I'm getting high. I think they're about to come in
any minute. I just want to keep going before they
take all my ship. She's like, slow down, you're gonna die.

(42:52):
You're gonna die. And all of a sudden I hear sheriffs,
and she, all of a sudden does what thesmore adict does,
locks yourself in the bathroom, throws all the all the parapinilia, you,
all the drugs out with me.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
So she's in the bathroom safe. You know.

Speaker 2 (43:05):
I'm the bad one, the villain with all the dope
and the rigs. And I go to the window and
chuck anything out. The windows don't open because people throw
TVs out and uh, and I remember they're like they
come in and they're like, okay, you're gonna have a
you get a choice tonight. You can go to uh
we have where you can go to jail, right, And

(43:27):
I'm like, cops never given me this.

Speaker 1 (43:29):
This is weird. I've never this is something's going on here.

Speaker 2 (43:31):
They've never I've never had this, you know, they've never
given me this ultimating before I said, uh, jail of course,
you know, because I can get high there, you know,
like you know, and they're like, oh, he's he's he's crazy,
let's lock them up. So long story short, my parents
were involved. They found out where we were. I got
fifty two fifty my man conservatorship, you know, right's completely

(43:52):
taken away.

Speaker 1 (43:53):
Now talk about resentment towards your parents.

Speaker 2 (43:56):
You know, Dad, where were you when I was being lested,
eat and all this stuff? You know, And now all
of a sudden, you want to come in and say
the day I had so so much rage, you know,
so much anger in me, and I was so pissed,
and I.

Speaker 1 (44:10):
Remember I was in this this this psych ward.

Speaker 2 (44:13):
And I was just like, I'm gonna I'm gonna's gotta
be a way to get out of here.

Speaker 1 (44:17):
What there isn't you know?

Speaker 2 (44:18):
And I have this very long beard, you know, and
shower long be long hair, the arm that's still in sling,
you know, there's nothing works. And every day I come
out of room, there's like six seven, eight, nine ten,
I'm like twelve people lined out outside my door.

Speaker 1 (44:33):
What's going on here? Psychos?

Speaker 2 (44:35):
You know, And they start following me everywhere I go
and I'm like, what's going what's going on? And they're like,
they're like, Jesus, will you heat the beer there? Think
I'm Jesus. I'm like, I'm like, if I go, if
I'm Jesus Christ, right, first of all, do.

Speaker 1 (44:50):
You think my arm would be like this? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (44:53):
You think i'd be here, you know, like you know,
and then you know, that hustler mentality kicks back in.
I'm like, this gotta be a way to take advantage
of this stuff. So I'm like, okay, let me see
what I'm like. Yes, i am, I'm Jesus. I want
your extra puddings, give me your meds later. I am
the truth, I'm the way, I'm the light. I'm Jesus,
you know. So I started hustling these guys. I want

(45:13):
your smokes, you know, the whole thing. Yeah, you know,
like this is no choke. This is really going on,
you know, like and they're like bow trying to wash
your feet. I'm like, no, no, we're good. I just
want this is cool. The coolest starts to putting more pudding,
you know, sugar and more sugar please, and your smokes
ust to us whatever drugs.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
You're getting, and so it's working. It's cool. I'm like,
this isn't so bad.

Speaker 2 (45:32):
You know, like we human beings are amazing because we
adapt to anything, right, We're just adaptable, so we can
we can lower our standings. However, we're going to be living.
You know, we know how long we're here, blah blah blah.
And so then one day, one day or everything's going
so great and one day we're the loud speaker. I
hear here, uh yeah, we have two more Jesuses coming

(45:53):
in and in Abraham Lincoln.

Speaker 1 (46:00):
The nurse is telling me the zone the loud speaker.

Speaker 2 (46:04):
The hustle was over other fuck Ussele's over and think competition. Yeah,
the guy I was out of there that day because
I think there's gonna be a linstring mob for me
soon and so I remember, because of the disability of
my arm and everything no back then, no sober living,
and wanted to take me because I was too much
of a liability.

Speaker 1 (46:21):
The arm.

Speaker 2 (46:22):
It couldn't work, I mean, clean, you get dressed, nothing,
you can't. You don't think about what you can and
can't do when you don't have an arm that works,
you know. I mean, you can't butt in your pants,
you can't off I mean all that stuff that's impossible
to do. So I ended up going back to my
mom's where that kind of all started. And she because
she what I didn't say is you know, she kicked
me out at seventeen because I was shooting dope, you know,
my brother and sister and I'm back at the house

(46:44):
again because nobody will thank you, nobody.

Speaker 1 (46:47):
To take care of me.

Speaker 2 (46:48):
Yeah, and I'd blown through all my money. I mean,
I remember, like it was crazy. I remember, like I
was doing press for it was based on the second
I was doing press for, and like you have a
shoot at it's with this, uh Bruce Weber. It's for
the cover of Vogue, you know, Men's Vogue for the
you know, publicity for a big toe and second you know,

(47:08):
and I'm like, I'm like cool, and uh, we.

Speaker 1 (47:11):
Go we shoot it. You know, I'm on dope. Whatever,
It's cool. He nails it quick fast. I still have
the picture of it. It's crazy.

Speaker 2 (47:16):
And uh and he's like, listen, how would you like
to come do this, uh, this Pepe Jeans campaign with
us in uh in New York. And I'm like, I go, thanks, Bruce,
But you know what, man, I just I'm not a model,
you know. I don't even really want to act, to
be honest with you, you know.

Speaker 1 (47:31):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (47:31):
He goes, well, it's two hundred and fifty thousand dollars
for the day. This is what nineteeneties whatever. Yeah, he
had me at two hundred and fifty thousand. You know.
I'm like, I'm in you know. And so it's this
campaign with with cos you name. I'll come back to
Bridget Hall, actress, Bridget Hall. I'm not a model, Bridget Hall.
And I remember I went with my assistant time money.

(47:53):
Things are going good, you know. Of course he carries
the dope, you know. And uh, and so we go
over there, we fly in and we you know, go
straight to the shoot and I remember, like I'm sitting
around and I see like Bruce shooting like these model deals.

Speaker 1 (48:06):
I'm like, man, this isn't my thing, you know. And
what was really starting to go on.

Speaker 2 (48:10):
Too, is the fear because of the being blested by
mails on my household and this fear of this stuff
coming in. And I started realizing that was where all
this like things started coming from. I didn't realize it,
but I'm like he was keeping me waiting for like
fifteen twenty minutes.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
So I'm like, I'm out of here, you know, like
let's let's go.

Speaker 2 (48:27):
And I was, you know, I leave, I'm out, and
I remember like Bruce having all this whole crew like
wenning down, like actually, Ashley, please I'll come back, come back.
I'm like, fine, I'll come back, you know. And so,
you know, just being a complete prick, you know, and
same thing with it did with really Scott movie.

Speaker 1 (48:43):
But that was the whole lot of story. So I
walk back in.

Speaker 2 (48:45):
They give me all the clothes, you know, They're like,
can you get dressed, we'll shoot you right now. And
I'm like sure, okay, And I go in there and
I remember like I'm putting all the clothes on and
I'm like, let me get a fixed. Let me just
let me just shoot up a little more, just so
I can be ready and calm down. And so I'm
shoot up, and uh, you know, I get all ready
to come out, and all of a sudden, I see

(49:05):
these these other eyes people like freaking out, like looking
at me like something's wrong.

Speaker 1 (49:09):
I'm like, what's up? You know, do you have a problem?

Speaker 2 (49:12):
And what I realized is I'm in this white fencing
outfit and there's blood all down soaps in my left arm.
And talk about feeling that small, you know, from that
to you know, ego, to the humiliation of that dope fiend,
I've just been you know, caught, and we went on
with the shoot. But from there on out my attitude
to completely change, no problem, whatever you want, you know,

(49:34):
and I just remember.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
Being like just humiliated.

Speaker 2 (49:37):
Years later I made amends to Bruise for that, but
that was, you know, cut to you know, the end
of it. That was before you know, the conservative ship
you know and stuff. So so now now I'm now
my mom's there's this dude sleeping at the botto at
the edge of my bed, and who what the hell's
going on here?

Speaker 1 (49:53):
It's a navy seal. There were like sober companions back then.
You know it's so which is actually pretty freaking smart.

Speaker 2 (50:01):
You know, ship that's really where we should get that
some guy with by sobriety. Yeah, you know, and they're
not complaining that the thread sheet you know, thread County
sheets or this or that or you know, you know
how you know how the business has got today, and
so it's just a navy steal my way or the highway,
you know.

Speaker 1 (50:15):
And so I remember I would just try.

Speaker 2 (50:17):
I would Mike, his name was Mike, and uh, and
I like you have to dress me, undress me and
my brother and sister, you know, would be like, what's up?

Speaker 1 (50:25):
P W?

Speaker 2 (50:25):
I mean it was for a penis washing because I
couldn't wash to say, you know, it was just a
nice guy trying to help me out, but you know
they're just being a little you know wherever they're being.
And uh, I was just so angry. I had this
guy on me, and so I would do everything I
could just piss this dude off, you know, like he'd
get in the car and I'd just crank you know Nirvana.
Back then they're in w A two like one hundred,
you know, just so he couldn't stand anymore. And these

(50:47):
Navy seal dudes are really smart. They're smarter than us
by the ways, you know, you know, we think we're smart.
So the next day, you know, I do that to him.
He shows up with the big cance on so he
could just sit there.

Speaker 1 (50:57):
Yeah, he's like, you know.

Speaker 2 (50:59):
And uh And finally I get enough three months ago,
in ninety days, and every day I want to shoot dope.
And I remember calling this girl, the one were I
was talking about, and I go meet me at the
tie place on Sunset what was that place called toy right,
And I go, I go leave an eagle behind you
like behind there with with some like with some you know,
dope in it, and you know, just and then I'm

(51:20):
gonna go in there and eat and we go there.

Speaker 1 (51:22):
I get so stoked to go behind the toilet. It's
not there.

Speaker 2 (51:24):
I'm like, damn it, you know. And then next time
with friend Marcel. And now my parents had given me
enough leadway to just have Mike follow me in separate
cars so I could have my own car. You can
follow me, you know. And so I remember I was
with my friend Marcel, who had just spoke to the
other day, and uh, I said, let's lose this guy.
Let's go downtown on a cop. He said, all right,
let's go, and so we go. We lose him, right,

(51:45):
you know, we're done and we're bought downtown and we
copped the dope.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
I get the dope.

Speaker 2 (51:49):
He's like, give it to me, A hold on to
it because I was driving. And then I'm like, all right,
let's get high. He goes, well, I can't. I can't.
I can't let you do this.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
I'm like, Dode, you just you.

Speaker 2 (51:59):
Just wand all the fucking dope, bro, you know, you
just want all the dope. We went to high school
a guy and me myself, so we grew up together.
You know, Uh, you just want the dope. And he
I spoke to from the other day, this is so funny,
and uh he's like, no, man, he goes, You're just
too bad of a junkie.

Speaker 1 (52:13):
I can't. I'll throw it all away now.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
So you see that I'm not taking but you're just
you're just too bad of a junkie.

Speaker 1 (52:19):
I can't. I can't see I can't see this. You know,
you go down this way again.

Speaker 2 (52:23):
And I stayed sober from that day for five my
first five years of sobariety, which changed my life entirely
the whole five years from from everything.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
You know, you get clean, I get clean.

Speaker 2 (52:33):
So in that in that five years, everything had changed.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (52:40):
You know, I went from my need to I don't
want to get sober. I'll do it just to keep
everybody off my back till I need to do I
want to. Uh. Then all of a sudden, you know,
things start happening that are phenomenal in as we know gifts.
I met a man named Scott Wiland who was a
singer stone table pilots.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
I looked up to him. He was like a brother.
I loved him. I played him my music. I'm gonna
give you a short version because I.

Speaker 2 (53:02):
Know we're a short time, but he was like, come
come to my studio and I'll listen to it, you know,
And it's just this guy I idolized, looked up to,
and you like.

Speaker 1 (53:10):
People just don't do that usually, you know.

Speaker 2 (53:12):
And then I remember, he's like I go to the
studio and he's like, it just was cassette tape, you know,
and he's you know, he's in a BMW, but he's
in the studio. And then he's like, let's listen to
it into Uh, let's listen to my car and not
the studio.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
I'm like it because he's so embarrassed. You hear about this.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
It's going to be in front of all his bandmates
or is it like see one of those weirdo like
Hollywood guys. He's try to do someone with me in
the car right now.

Speaker 1 (53:33):
You know. I was like, wasn't sure, but I'm like,
let's go. You know.

Speaker 2 (53:36):
So I remember like he's smoking a cigarette, you know,
and it's guy you idolize, right and uh. And I
put the music on and he plays the tape and
I'm just I'm like he stops it like after the
second chorse and goes the next time. Now I'm just cringing.
And then like the third song and I just like,
you know that thing, you're that place like that head
goes off. You're such an media You're just stupid. Why

(53:57):
would you do something like this? And then he'st and
he goes, man, we got to get you off that
terrible show Sunset Beach. He's like, we got to get
you off that show. Come right with me. Long story short,
he goes, I'm gonna get you a deal. I'm like, okay,
I started working with him. I got a one point
six million dollar deal from Imi Marty Banderish and hadn't
even written a hit song yet, you know, and my

(54:19):
life went on from there. So those five years were
just dreams that came true. And started writing for people
and all this stuff success and the music business that
people don't know if you look on Wiki, because I've
never put it on I don't care, but you know
I was. I've written all artists and it was amazing.
And like I said earlier on that's what that's where
I got the juice from, you know, from watching the
band and the rod and the thing, and you know,

(54:40):
acting was just something here and there. But the music
was just this thing that I loved. We're doing a record,
meet Scott. It's called the Wonder Girl's Record, and there's
a bunch of people and you know, Toy from Queens
of the Stone.

Speaker 1 (54:50):
It's a bunch of people.

Speaker 2 (54:51):
I need to get into that. But I'm sober. Five years.
I had just had surgery on my foot. I started
taking those Viking in Man. I feel that feeling again,
you know, And I always say that, you know, the
disease doesn't know the difference if it's justified or not.

Speaker 3 (55:04):
Yeah, straight up, straight up, that's right.

Speaker 2 (55:07):
And I was saying, don't take it. We're not to anybody.
I'm just saying it doesn't know the difference. And I
felt that feeling. I was like, why haven't I been
doing this for so long? You know, like and I
asked Scott, I'm like, do you think I'm like have
I Do you think I'm out? You know? He goes, well, dude,
you've been like taking the way you've been taking this
Viking in I had I abuse. I gave me the

(55:27):
answer I wanted, you know, and uh, you know, and
and I felt like the lame I was from all
these successful people in this band that was in. They
all had huge success at this point, you know, and
I was like, I had to arrived.

Speaker 1 (55:38):
This is amazing.

Speaker 2 (55:38):
But I felt like the sober Here comes the sober police,
you know, and they were all they made it look
good again, you know, because they were successful and people
looked up to and getting high and so you.

Speaker 1 (55:48):
Know, Scott says, yeah, you're out, We're at his place.
I go hit me up, shoot me.

Speaker 2 (55:51):
I didn't want to, like before I changed my mind,
you know, he slammed me the speedball and I almost
like went out. I remember just like starting to seize
and and uh and go out.

Speaker 1 (55:59):
And that was it.

Speaker 2 (56:00):
I was out again. And the next day I was
downtown with Scott. We were we were smoking crack, shooting
up like none. None of those years had happened. All
that magic that had happened, and the old gifts that
got everything was just gone, you know. And I became
and I become I become that same you know, rabbit animal,
that's just this beast again, you know, like like like this,

(56:21):
you know, uh, you seeing it, you know, but even
worse back then, way worse back then rehab after rehab,
you know, thirty two I think I've been to I
don't talk after a rest.

Speaker 1 (56:32):
Oh it was huge, fucking gigs everything.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
I mean, I have a Jimmy I being on the phone,
and I remember this clearly. I was on the I
had just released a solo record in the UK. I
was over there, living over there and all those territories
and getting ready to come here. It was you know,
top seven over there, whatever, lame song whatever, but you know,
I theyre getting ready to release the second single off
my record, and uh, it was gonna be like a

(56:56):
big song. You know, I already had Robbie hits, Hillary
Duff hits. I was a bunch of other you know,
it was like happening. But but I went, I just disappeared,
you know. So Sony couldn't set up the second single,
you know, for it was just gone.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
You know. It's just the kindry.

Speaker 2 (57:08):
There's a certain drug as that can show up, you know,
and it makes sense, and there's ones that can I can't,
you know. And so I remember Jimmy and Ivy, Marty
benderis calling me. They're like, you know, Gwen's been waiting
on the fine He's been waiting to the studio for you
for like two days.

Speaker 1 (57:21):
Now. You know, all you have to do. We don't
care about your shitty solo record. We don't you. But
what you do is good. You know, all you have
to do. You can choose as much joke as you want.

Speaker 2 (57:29):
I'm not gonna I'm not gonna say wish guy on
the phone, because there's multiple people on the phone size
those do. But somebody just said, you can shoot as
much joke as you want. Just show up and be
able to write and do what you do. And I'm like, yeah,
that's that's a great idea. Why did I think of that?
You know, I can do that, you know, and of
course I'll be right there. Yeah, fifty more minutes, you know,
I'm on my way, you know, traf It's bad, it's bad.

Speaker 1 (57:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (57:52):
My grandma just at the Sunset studio, the doctor saying
my lyrics, you know, fuck yeah. And you know, slowly
everybody finds just done with you, you know, and everybody everybody's
everybody's done. There's just nowhere really to go, and it's
you know, sorry, on and off. In twenty eighteen, I

(58:15):
go to a place called Wavelengths and Careers don Tos buddy,
you know, like nothing nothing left, and I'm in there.
I started doing my kd act. I started working as
a you know, drug and alcohol counselor in there, and
I loved it, you know, I was like, this is actually,
this is actually pretty cool, you know, for the first time,
I'm like feeling okay in my own skin. And went

(58:36):
from that to this girl one day saying, hey, do
you mind watching this guy for me? Why I'm doing
you know, blah blah. I didn't know what that was
or sober commanity, which she broke me. Off all this
dough and I was like, well this is cool, you know,
And I just showed up and I finally let go
of of you know, how I thought it should look,
because I was a failure. If it didn't look this way,
if it didn't look like somewhat you know, my stepfather's

(58:59):
way or my dad that success, I was a failure.
But the truth of matters was I was already sent
for failure because nobody it's like five percent that level, right,
So no matter what you do, you're not you're not
you're You're already set up for failure in your on mind.
But when you step back and you look at what
you've done successfully, you know, you go, wow, this is
more than a lot of people have done. But you

(59:20):
always feel less then, you know, always feel less in
the shadow still there.

Speaker 3 (59:24):
But when you're helping people and you're fucking humbliebly good
at it, did you feel less than or you start
to feel like I'm good at something.

Speaker 1 (59:30):
I realized this is where it got really good.

Speaker 2 (59:33):
It went from stopped buying that lie I am not
good enough as I am too. I'm pretty dope, not
an ego way, like, but I don't I'm too, you dope.
I don't need a lot of stuff. Like I'm a
good guy, you know, Like that's what that's what I
was meeting. Like I just getting high of helping people
and doing the right thing. I felt good, you know,
and like not feeling like a pile of shit because
I tell you what, I'll tell you the story really quick.

(59:54):
It's uh, it's I remember all the hits that I had,
you know, I always just more hate Hatrea or more
coke or I feel like a fraud. I faked it
once again. You know, none of that's that it was working
and and uh, and I remember I heard a story.
Remember Falco Ammaidalosammdale's rock Meamadale said worldwide smash. That guy,

(01:00:15):
I mean worldwide number one, you know Bono fight smash
and his manager uh says, you know, it's dinner for
him to to come and you know, have a big
party and you know, celebrate for this this and this smash.
And Falco comes in and he's kind of just kind
of sulking down. The manager goes what's wrong, and Falco
starts crying and he goes, it's over.

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
I'll never be able to do this again. And repeat
this and I, oh god, that's that's my mind.

Speaker 2 (01:00:41):
That's the alcoholic mind, you know, like, now this is amazing,
how grateful for what we had? We did this, you know,
already a failure. I was like I heard that story
and it hit me so hard. I mean, I still
remember it today. It was some I heard it like
on some you know music show and always stuck with
me because I'm like, that's alcoholism. No matter what it is,

(01:01:02):
I'm already a failure and it's done and it's over.
And so, uh, you know, I got into service, got
into helping people, got into the field of you know,
uh sober companioning, started a company, started a company, I mean,
and I loved it, man, Like I really I got
high on like, you know, helping people. And I got like,

(01:01:23):
you know, in a good way, like I just felt
good about myself and I dug it and it was
and I love chaos, so you know, I come from
a house of chaos. So the crazier it is We've
talked about this before. The crazier it is the guy
just trap passes these guys here is let's go, you know,
like I'm in and I and I loved it, and uh,
during this time, I'm dating this woman and you know,

(01:01:45):
you've never been hers before. She she uh, she was
you know, a nice, nice, nice girl. And I was
with it for like six years, you know, but I
remember I was getting sick a lot, and I was London,
traveling for the company, building the company, doing BD all
this stuff, and uh, you know, just so I wrapped
up in this great thing that was going on. And
you know, I also started slowing myself from the herd

(01:02:07):
of AA too, because you know, during COVID a lot
of things happened, people like we moved away, and you know,
I also wasn't in the middle so for what was
about to come, you know, because this was like my
sixth year of sobriety or something at this point, and
I remember it was was farther away from her, but
success working all the time and all that s Everything
was okay. And I had this leaky eye. It's just

(01:02:29):
leaking all the time, you know, and I'm just like, man,
I go to the doctor like, oh, it's just an
obstructed teared duck. You know, we just we just have to,
you know, do surgery. I'm like, okay, and I'm busy
so much that I don't have time to even do that,
you know. And finally, like, I'm getting sick all the time,
science infections, that's happening. So I go to the head

(01:02:49):
and neck doctor and they're gonna put a little stint
there just to fix the dropping, get the you know,
get the stuff out of my nose, fix my nose
so I can like not do sick so much and
get that surgery done. I'm on the tennis court with
my daughter, she's playing tennis and watching her play tennis,
and I get a call and like, Hey, it's doctor
so and so. And I'm like, hey, doctor so and so,
what's going on? Well, the year bops. She came back

(01:03:12):
from pathology. I'm like, what, what, bops are you talking about?
You know, we just did a little stint in my eye,
cleaned out some stuff in my nose.

Speaker 1 (01:03:19):
But he goes, uh, you have cancer. I'm like, well,
what do you mean what you know?

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
Like you sure you're talking the right patient, you know,
and he goes, no, definitely you and uh he just
kind of got off the phone. I didn't even know
what kind really, I didn't know what was going to happen.
I didn't know if I was like this was it,
you know, And so I called the mother and my
child and I was like, I'm I'm about to lose
I'm freaking. I've never experienced anything like this.

Speaker 1 (01:03:41):
I don't. I've seen it in movies. I've heard friends
who have had it, but I haven't. I don't.

Speaker 2 (01:03:45):
I don't know what the hell's going on. I needs
you to pick up well, you know. So she came
to get her.

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
I left. I called the other doctor who was involved.
Doctor I can't say his.

Speaker 2 (01:03:54):
Name, but he was like what he told you, he's
not He wasn't supposed to tell you what pathology hasn't
even signed off on it, that it's one hundred percent
cancer yet, and he.

Speaker 1 (01:04:01):
Wasn't supposed to tell you.

Speaker 2 (01:04:02):
We were supposed to use as a team and come
in here and talk to you in person, you know,
like that just dropped his bomb on you and out
in the wild, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:04:09):
And so, you know, a long story short, I go.

Speaker 2 (01:04:14):
In and I have it, and they say you have
to have surgery, and so like the first person I called,
like cause, like I said, I didn't know anybody. The
first person I called was my friend Josh Amy from
Queens the Stone Age, because Josh had just gone through
colon cancer. He was the only person in my age
I knew, and I saw him go through it, and
he went through it with such like just he walked
through it like such a man. Josh like I just like,

(01:04:35):
I've never seen anything like it. I was like, that's
how I want to try to walk through this, you know.
And so I called Josh and I remember he said
these things right away to me.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
I never forget him.

Speaker 2 (01:04:43):
He goes, see, if there's a few things I can
tell you, listen to me now, and he goes, it's
what I did. You've got to advocate for yourself, buddy.
He goes, nobody's gonna do it for you, you know. He goes,
don't take no for an answer, you know. And number three,
if you have any favors.

Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
Hold on now.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
And so the problem was my cancer had metastasized from
my eye to the bone on my nose, and they
had to have three surgeons for the six to seven
hour surgery, and they couldn't line them up together. So
it was gonna be six seven months down the line,
and six seven months I could have been dead. It
was already in the bone. It happens is you get
bone cancer, you know, And I had a favor, you know.

(01:05:23):
I remember Josh's voice going off in my mind sometimes,
like your voice goes off from my mind. In certain places.
You just hear something and luckily, you know. And that's
how I start the medical system, why people die and
what happens. But I got lucky, and I got it
in to get that surgery. And I remember waking up
from that surgery, and I was so high on whether
they're giving me. But I could show you pictures when

(01:05:44):
I was crazy, eyes all messed up and anyway, I
go to see the same doctor of the surgeon and
he's like, congratulations, your cancer free, the one who called
me on the phone, you know, cancer free. You can
go on with the rest of your life. My girlfriend's
in the room too, by the way. That's amazing. Right,
Let's just I tell everybody I'm stup, one and done,
you know. And a couple of days later, I get

(01:06:05):
a call from the collegists, can you please come back
in the office, not the surgeon, thencologists. I'm like, sure,
I come with my girlfriend. He goes, so we got
to start you on radiation next week.

Speaker 1 (01:06:14):
I go, what are you?

Speaker 2 (01:06:16):
What are you talking about radiation. I was doctor. Someone
still just said she was with me. She heard me.
I just told everybody that any ray. She goes, well,
there must be some misconfusion. Hold on one second, you know,
And the doctor leaves the room. He goes next door,
and he's on the phone with It's like it's like,
you know, Charlie around wah wah wah wah wah wah whah.
But I could hear him, like, you know, it's something
keywords like uh, radiation, no radiation. He comes back and goes, uh,

(01:06:39):
so yeah, it looks like we do have to have radiation.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
Now.

Speaker 2 (01:06:41):
I don't know if they that doctor didn't say sorry
to me because out of you know, liability, you know.
And sure I don't know, you know, but when I
went back in that office to see him, I looked
and bad in the eye, and I was waiting for
an apology, you know, because if it was me, I
always said, brother, I'm sorry. I mean, you know, can
you imagine like you think you're done and it's over

(01:07:01):
and uh and uh And he didn't. And so my
head goes to, you know, we see you know. My
head goes to, I'm gonna teach this dude a lesson.
I'm gonna let him know what it feels like, you know.
So I'm gonna get a gun, get my gun, go
one of them. I'll figure ou which one the head
down there, and I'm gonna go in the room to
see him, you know, just asked to talk to him alone.
And I'm gonna pull my gun on a stick in
his mouth and I'm gonna blow his freaking brains and

(01:07:23):
pretend I'm gonna blow his freaking rains.

Speaker 1 (01:07:25):
I'm not killed the duder.

Speaker 2 (01:07:25):
I'm not going to, you know, I mean, I'm not
dumbing up prison over, but I'm gonna scare im haveing
pissos pants. So what he knows what it feels like
when he's just been told you can go on with
the rest of your life, your cancer free. And then
you're told you had a death sentence again. You know
it's not over.

Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
I was so and then you know, I talked myself down.
You know, I was like I forgot you see all
I had their own police department. You know, I just
went I was a little you know, it's not tis
in my system.

Speaker 1 (01:07:50):
I run a little hot, you know, I'm like not
a good idea.

Speaker 2 (01:07:55):
You know, especially in the middle of all this stuff,
you probably won't get the same treatment in prison, you know.
So I talked it through a thin I'm like, okay
and uh and now, which I didn't want to do
the first place.

Speaker 1 (01:08:06):
I told them. And when you get here and say
take my eye though, I really just take my eye
out now.

Speaker 2 (01:08:10):
Then I have to go through all those radiation crap
because the radiation was worse than the surgery, you know,
six hour surgery and gnarly, my death perception was off,
you know, my I can see and it's all over
the place and headaches, gnarly. But but radiation for two
months at five days a week, you get sicker and
sicker and burning all over your face and you're puking
and you know the other way and you can't.

Speaker 1 (01:08:30):
Get out of bed. It's just your life. It's so small,
so dark. Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:08:34):
My my partner left during like the second radiation treatment.
I had all these painkillers with my drug and choice opiates.

Speaker 1 (01:08:41):
And I was like, why not, it's only in my system,
you know.

Speaker 2 (01:08:44):
It was like, you know, screw it, like it's on,
you know, like I don't want I don't want to
go through this radiation any anyway, you know, I want to,
Like I still a would have a gun in my mouth.
I don't want to, but yeah, going to raiation. I
didn't want to go, but I had these friends from
AA you know that I grew up with my whole life,
would show up every freaking day and go, you're going.
I go, No, I'm not going, but a lot more
way bigger than me. And you know, we know some dudes,

(01:09:07):
you know, they run and I'm like, I couldn't find
my way out of this one.

Speaker 1 (01:09:09):
But I was just done.

Speaker 2 (01:09:10):
Honestly, if it wasn't for them, I would stop radiation
and the redols just like, no, no, you can't stop
because it makes it worse. In the beginning, radiation grows.
At first, it's just crazier, right, Like what is that crazy?

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
It's crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:09:22):
So they're like, you can't stop now because it's going
to be growing bigger. You have to do the whole treatment.
I'm like, this whole medical system crazy and I'm just
I just want my eye out.

Speaker 1 (01:09:29):
So anyway, I do the radiation.

Speaker 2 (01:09:32):
You know, it's a gnarly thing, and uh and you
know I have just you know, I had just at
this point, I had no connection with God anymore, none.

Speaker 1 (01:09:43):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:09:43):
I was like, after everything I've been through everything, you know,
fuck you, you know it is iHeart sorry, beat beep,
screw you. You know.

Speaker 1 (01:09:53):
I was so angry, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:09:55):
And it was that rights at the same through line,
trust once again, trusted this thing that's let me down
again and taking advantage of me, you know, molestation of this.
The trust is so broken, you know. I came here, remember,
I just can't. I can't.

Speaker 1 (01:10:10):
I can't get that connection with God again.

Speaker 2 (01:10:12):
I just can't. I'm too angry, you know, too freaking angry.
And I go to Florida, you know, just to visit.
It wasn't even to me, it was a visit. But
then the geographic, oh i'll get over here, you know,
happens and and I was sick again all the freaking time,
you know. Remember I was even sick here a lot,
you know, and I already knew. I was like, I
already knew it was back, you know, and I'd be like, no, no,

(01:10:35):
you're just in your head. And so long story short,
you know, I come back here and my friend Richard Tate,
you know, he let me into his treatment center.

Speaker 1 (01:10:46):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:10:46):
It took care of me because I'm I'm you know,
got nothing broke. You know, it ruined everything, you know,
you know, everything's everything's been gone. So I go there
and I forgot and appointments at UCLA just happened to
be at the same time that I come to LA
from Florida to go to the treatment center, and uh
and uh. I go to see the doctor and he

(01:11:06):
looks up there and he goes, looks like, you have
these tumor things back. But you know, well we'll biops
you and we'll let you know in a couple of days.
And I already knew, you know, like you know, and
people are like, you're just being negative. It could be
it could be not. I'm like listening, you know, I'm
sick like I was. It's in the same place as
it was last time, all around the same place. I mean, like,

(01:11:27):
it's not let's it's not negative thinking. Let's just be
let's just call it what it is. You know, next
day they got back fast. He goes, yeah, we have
to operate right away. And that was two months ago,
and so uh, there was more tumors different places had
spread and the problem that where I'm at right now
is that. Uh, it's it's mucosal carcinoma lactimal lactimal sack

(01:11:50):
carcinoma hp they highly likely think to HPV. They don't
know for sure because there's only so many strains you
can test for.

Speaker 1 (01:11:58):
But it's HPV.

Speaker 2 (01:12:00):
Squeamiss but people think of squam as is just like
little skin cancer. This is not that type is a
very aggressive type. As the doctors who's told me, he goes,
you have a very aggressive type of cancer, and he goes,
when it's when the first year it comes back like this,
your chance is a success you know, go down and
down and down, you know, be like just success rates
to live, go down and down and down and down.

(01:12:20):
And so you already have it, you know. They said
to me, it's not a matter of if, it's a
matter of when and where. You just keep trying to
treat it the best we can. And I'm like, well,
how many how can you how many times can you do?
How many treatments can you take? You know you can't
and do radiation again, you know, like you like, how
much is enough? Is enough to where you're like, we
can't do it? So I speak to the doctor. He's

(01:12:41):
like you know, uh, because I wanted these, these checkpoint
in hibitors. Checkpoint hibitors are like chemo, but targeted so
it's not as bad, and they target the type of
cancer you have. But he pointed out, because I'm immune compromised,
I have to take these immune globulin every two weeks.

Speaker 1 (01:12:58):
This ib i G.

Speaker 2 (01:12:58):
You have to get this subcontaneous medications so I can
be out in the world because if I'm not, I
can't fight off bacterial infection, viruses or a fun guy anything.

Speaker 1 (01:13:08):
So I have to get this every two weeks just
to just to be.

Speaker 2 (01:13:10):
At baseline feel normal, you know, like, which is great
because I don't take it for advantage day to day
and I feel like okay, you know, because I was
so sick.

Speaker 1 (01:13:18):
So he goes, We've got bad studies.

Speaker 2 (01:13:20):
Checkpoint inhibitors don't work well for people who are immune
compromised like yourself. Chemo won't work, you know, so then
they're like, radiation won't work. Radiation I did, and it
came back in a million other places, you know, all
all up here and with me kolsal, it can spread
right because you think anywhere mucus throat, you know, you know,
colon cancer aius all all that stuff, and he says,

(01:13:43):
I think, you know, you have to lose that eye.
There's some stuff up there. Again, I think you're gonna
have to lose that I one. I mean, he goes,
if you, he goes, your best chance of survival is
if we take your eye. That's what was really said.

Speaker 1 (01:13:51):
You know. Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:13:52):
And then and then he goes, I think it's coming
in through the brain, because the last time I was
in was the school based brain whatever. And he goes,
I think it's coming in from there. And it's not
shown up on the CT scans and all that stuff,
the PET scans because it has to be a billion
cells of cancer for it to show, so if it's
anything less than that, it won't show, which is weird.
Like I started learning all the stuff that I never knew.

(01:14:13):
Because there's these scans where they say, hey, five years,
come get checked up, and you know you're good. It's
not true, you know, because you get five hundred million
cells and you know the next month have a billion.
So they're they're talking about opening up the brain and
having to like cut you know, whatever the day thinks
out there and cut out the eye, you know, And
that's where the last phone call has been left with.

(01:14:34):
There's other doctors who have done some you know, DNA
all the stuff. They're waiting to come back right now
and see what the final verdict is. And I won't
know for like another two weeks what's going to happen,
you know?

Speaker 3 (01:14:45):
Okay, Yeah, you come back from Florida, you get this information.
You and I have a nice healing together, and there's
something very different about you this time though. I don't
see the fight. I don't see the jive. Yeah, see humility.

Speaker 1 (01:15:01):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:15:02):
You come here and speak, and you said two things
that were very profound. I have stage four cancer. I'm
stage four alcoholic.

Speaker 1 (01:15:10):
Yes, And you.

Speaker 3 (01:15:11):
Said I'm not praying for God's will to live. That
might not be God's will for me, And that fucking
cracked me. Yes, and I believe you that we to
talk about that.

Speaker 2 (01:15:18):
Brother, Well, I don't have stage four cancer, said, it's
like stage like.

Speaker 1 (01:15:24):
Stage nine. Thank you. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:15:28):
No, I I just came up with this analogy that
which which which is weird because now I'm dealing with
two diseases right, So now I'm dealing with disease of
alcoholism and the disease of cancer. And if if if
one of them's not checked and check you know, mainly
the mind, you know, the alcoholism, it's all going to

(01:15:49):
go to crap.

Speaker 1 (01:15:49):
I'm not going to show up.

Speaker 2 (01:15:50):
So managing two diseases becomes a whole different ballgame. And
so you know, it's correlated with people who have cancer.
You know, it's the stage stage on right, So it's uh,
it's like you.

Speaker 1 (01:16:03):
Know, you have a mole, you go remove, You're good
to go use some check ups. You know.

Speaker 2 (01:16:07):
It's like that's like maybe you're a problem drinker. You know,
maybe you don't want too many drinks. You check out
a meeting here, you cool, yeah, you know, you just
do whatever you know, and then it's like the two Okay,
now it's a little more, and it's a little more
you do anyway, long story short, it's like stage four, right,
So like stage four alcoholism where we know where it's
just like horrific, you know, to the bottom, like it's

(01:16:30):
it's over, You're gonna die. And I relate to that
cancer like you know, you have to have to do
the radiation, I have to do the immune therapy. I
have to you know, it's it's all the stuff just
to come to baseline, which is the same stuff with
our stage four alcoholism. I gotta I gotta work with
a sponsor, I gotta work with a spon s. I
gotta wake up, I hit my knees and pray. I
gotta do this stuff in the book. I gotta go
be of service. I gotta go speak at meetings just

(01:16:52):
to survive, you know, just to be at the baseline,
you know. And so I believe like those two points
were really like that analogy of stage four cancer and
stage four alcoholism are really you know, for us stage
four alcoholics, we have to do a lot, you know,
because I see people in the who are just they
don't have the they don't have that stage four mind
that we had. That's just a crazy NonStop you know,

(01:17:13):
that just wants to kill us all the time, you know.
And uh, and so I have to do the full
on everything to stay alive in my sobriety and have
to do all the same thing with the cancer stuff,
you know.

Speaker 3 (01:17:25):
So I got a sense from you, buddy, you got
real hit with like you're going through these real treatments.
Still what's really important now in my life?

Speaker 2 (01:17:34):
You know, And in the in the Book of alcoholics anonymous.
It says alcohol the great persuader, and and uh, beaten
into the state of reasonableness. And I also feel like
cancer is a great persuader, you know. And I feel
like I was beaten into a state of reasonablesness. Is
I just I couldn't I couldn't get to this place
until I was beaten into it. And I remember my

(01:17:56):
sponsor in Florida saying to me, he was like, listen,
you know you're you're getting high every like, you know,
a few days and then poem together for a month
and it's like working for you. And he goes, you know,
because I knew what was gonna happen. You know, I'm
not dumb enough to know like what's not gonna happen.
I knew, but I wanted to try to stop it,
you know. And he goes in my in my book,
he goes, you know what I've seen. He goes, it's

(01:18:18):
not until you're desperate in here, rock Boma, you're gonna
really get so bottom line, oh bottom mine, right, you
got to tap out. It's so scary to hear that, though,
you know, and uh, and you know, my problem, my
problem always was with relapsing too was. You know, people
will say that the the you know, the definition of insanities,
you know, doing the same thing over and expecting different results.

(01:18:39):
Well mine's not. I know exactly what I'm going to get. Jails,
institutions are death, but I want relief so much that
I'll be like fuck it, I don't care give it
to me, you know. Even it's that second that's more
insane to me than thinking like knowing what you're gonna get,
rather than thinking it's gonna be different this time.

Speaker 1 (01:18:57):
Like I don't know which one's more insane, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:19:00):
And so that's really a place that I've had to
like look at not to get to that place where
I'm like, screw it.

Speaker 3 (01:19:06):
But we also to buddy, we'll wrap up. Got a
few minutes here, but you really figure out who your
real family is now?

Speaker 2 (01:19:14):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And like I was, like I was saying,
like you, like you said, the different thing about me
is that I got I had to make peace with
God again.

Speaker 1 (01:19:23):
I had to make I had to make not on
my terms, you know, I had to make peace with God.
And I started to realize like.

Speaker 2 (01:19:32):
Things changed, you know, there was no silver lining the
first time, you know, I was just like it was
like everything else in my life, just wipe it off,
move on, you know, but this wasn't going to be
what it's going to be with me, you know, with
the cancer thing. So I've had to make you know,
and then you drop thirty pounds and you know, the girl,
things taken away from you, have money, things taken away
from you, all the all the thing, right, so all

(01:19:54):
the distractions I was trying to you know, I just
I need those distractions. I just couldn't give them up
until I stripped them all for me. And you know,
sometimes I would hear people say that and go, oh,
that's just you feel it well, just because you lost everything,
you'll lose her, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:20:08):
And it's really true though.

Speaker 2 (01:20:09):
It's like I'm so glad that stuff got stripped because
I feel so much better now, uh than just all
the all that, you know. But I don't have to
hide anymore because you know, I'm not a tough guy.

Speaker 1 (01:20:23):
I know tough guys. You know, I'm not one of them,
you know, like uh.

Speaker 2 (01:20:27):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean I'll get down with you, you know,
like but you know, just to say face, but like yeah, but.

Speaker 1 (01:20:34):
I don't you know, I'm more of the you know,
emotional sense.

Speaker 2 (01:20:38):
Yeah, so so I just things have rearranged in my life.
Relationships a has become my family.

Speaker 1 (01:20:45):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:20:45):
It's it's really hard for my dad mom because you know,
they're they're across you know, the pond in Florida, and
they're also an age where you know, there's they can
you know, they can't.

Speaker 1 (01:20:56):
I don't want to tell them everything because what's that
going to do?

Speaker 2 (01:20:59):
There is just going to and more, you know, and
you know, it is scary though when you're like, you know,
we just had our last Thanksgiving at my mom's house
before it's gone, when my dad was in town. It
was really emotional because it was my mom had the
house for twenty two years, you know, and this is
our last Thanksgiving. And I'm thinking this is this our

(01:21:20):
last Thanksgiving because the house is going, or is this
my last Thanksgiving because I might be gone next year?
You know, Like it was it was really like it
was heavy and like a lot of a lot of
you know, a lot of areas and.

Speaker 1 (01:21:33):
Trying to make things right with your daughter.

Speaker 2 (01:21:35):
It's yeah, it's yeah, I am, but there's so many
factors in it.

Speaker 1 (01:21:42):
That's that's tough, you know, and I have.

Speaker 2 (01:21:46):
I have definitely like I would be a liar if
I you know, I can play the part well oh yeah,
blah blah blah, you know, but the truth, the truth
is like I have failed a lot of things in
my life and I want to try to be better
however I can with her, you know. And that's that's
one of the reasons I had to make peace with God,

(01:22:07):
because I was like if I just found some shitty
motel with the nee on my neck because I couldn't
take it anymore, because I had to tap out because
I was in so much pain the cancer and pour
me like, I can't leave that stain on that little
girl for the rest of her life. That's just that's
the most selfish thing that any human being could do,
you know, as painful as it is sometimes, you know, yeah,

(01:22:28):
it's it's it's complicated.

Speaker 1 (01:22:30):
I want to have more of a relationship.

Speaker 2 (01:22:32):
There's other factors that are involved, and I'm but we know.

Speaker 1 (01:22:37):
We do the right thing.

Speaker 3 (01:22:37):
Things work themselves out. You're going to start an AA
meeting for cancer, yes, yes, start that?

Speaker 2 (01:22:43):
Well, yeah, just because and you offered to get lench
your space, which is really nice. Because I've been sharing
about this and me because I go to the cancer group,
and the cancer group I would do is a reoccurring group,
which is fascinating because it's all about people going through
exactly what. It's recurring. But it's going to get you,
you know. But there's many people I've talked about this
when I share now in AA that they come up
to me. You're like, me too, me too, me too.

(01:23:05):
Hour I've had gone, just got diagnosed. I'm like, I
got you dog, like call me. It's the same thing.

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
You know. So you have these two diseases and they're scary. Man.
You get really sick, you know, when you don't have
anybody by your side going through this. It's scary.

Speaker 2 (01:23:15):
I'm blessed because I grew up in alcoholics an ymous
that I forget who wasn't as you or someone said,
this is your karma of how many people you helped,
you know, and uh, and Richard kept saying, because I'm
always like, well, if it's three, how much does it cost?
You know, it's a Colonel Parker, you know. And Richard
and them all over like, dude, we just want you,
we just want to help you. We don't we don't.
You don't got to do anything. You don't got to

(01:23:36):
you don't give us anything. We just want you to
We just want you to get okay, you know. And
and the trust once again, you know, it's always that
that that I just I just keep bringing on that
trusting because I'm sitting here as we're talking, I'm seeing
this linear thing going.

Speaker 1 (01:23:49):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:23:49):
They just they just want to help me, which is
hard to accept in a way too until you just because.

Speaker 1 (01:23:54):
I wouldn't been able to.

Speaker 2 (01:23:55):
I've been so sick, man, I was not unable to
get out of bed, you know, let alone to like
or go anywhere. Before I even started the infusions. That
was so sick, you know, and just had surgery in there.
They took me a surgery every day, you know. Staff,
the people, you know, I mean, they've been so nice
and like, you know, from them at career to let
me be there and just be and help me, you know,

(01:24:17):
because I guess because I've helped other people drawing away,
which is which is what we're supposed to do anyway.
You know, it's alcoholics, you know, But but you get
to see that and you know, I'll wrap up with this,
and I said this to the did the meeting. It
just still hits me so hard because I the stat
of like, you know, for every alcoholic addict, it affects
you know, just seven people directly around them, right, And

(01:24:38):
it's like it's not seven people, it's so much more
than that, because when we're using and we're out there
and we're getting high, you know, our mom goes to
work and she's so upset because you know, her son's
shooting dope and they can't find him, and then has
a bad interaction with her boss, you know, and he's
pissed now, and he goes home with his wife and
has a bat interaction his wife, and then the wife
has a bat interaction with the kid.

Speaker 1 (01:24:59):
This butterfly that carries on. And I'm like, just by us.

Speaker 2 (01:25:02):
Being clean, sober and sitting here and not acting like
an ass and doing the right thing and trying to
help somebody, Like, it's so powerful that we're actually changing
the world like that Gandhi like you know, be stuff actually,
Like it's like, oh blah blah blah.

Speaker 1 (01:25:15):
Now I'm like it's true.

Speaker 2 (01:25:17):
You know, the power of us just being here and
not doing what we were doing changes you know, the
Butterfly Effects Massive.

Speaker 1 (01:25:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:25:25):
Right, we'll close with this from your dad. Here's the album,
Robbie's album, right.

Speaker 2 (01:25:31):
Is that the story? How do you hear oh my stuff?
Yeah yeah, Rob heard the new Robbie Williams stuff he did.

Speaker 3 (01:25:37):
I did, Yeah, that's coming out. Yeah. And he was
like February, it's like who wrote these songs?

Speaker 1 (01:25:41):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's like oh right, yeah
yeah yeah yeah, yeah, no, no, no.

Speaker 2 (01:25:47):
I mean that's the one thing I will give Rod
is he was always very uh you know, it was
always you're a really good songwriter, you know, like the
Scott thing.

Speaker 1 (01:25:57):
You know, he was you are?

Speaker 2 (01:25:59):
You always said you were one the one thing you
know that that are you know I and you wrote
your data song.

Speaker 3 (01:26:06):
I've written the three for his record, yeah and that
and you played me the song.

Speaker 2 (01:26:11):
Yeah it's a fucking I could stop crying. My dad
said the same thing, my real dad, maam my stepdad.

Speaker 1 (01:26:16):
Yeah yeah yeah, yeah, well I could. Why do you
think they were crying?

Speaker 2 (01:26:20):
I think because they they this is what they've said
to me that that, like my real dad goes, I've heard,
you know, all the songs you've written through your whole
life for other urs and people, and he goes, this
feels the most real in touch you're getting with yourself.

Speaker 1 (01:26:36):
You know, they're not trying to be cool anymore. Just
this or that surrender songs.

Speaker 3 (01:26:40):
Yeah, surrender song. Yeah, and Rod still has it. Yeah,
and we're hopefully going to hear that on this new album.

Speaker 1 (01:26:45):
Correct.

Speaker 2 (01:26:45):
No, I know it's yeah, we are no here right,
I know it's it's done.

Speaker 1 (01:26:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:26:52):
Yeah, my dad and my real dad's like a dinner
last night. He goes, Son, I'm telling you you should
keep it for yourself and release my dad's Howard wants
to hear Rod you this.

Speaker 1 (01:27:02):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:27:03):
I was like, please, Dad, I still trying to work
on it still. I know you'll get his I know,
I know, I know.

Speaker 1 (01:27:10):
Hey, thank you for being on the show. Great, Thanks
for everything, man. I love you and and it's been
a good ride with you. And I know you'll be
by my side to twenty four to seven the rest
of the rest of the time. I'm here. Yeah, thank you, brother.

Speaker 3 (01:27:24):
The Sino Show is a production of iHeart Podcasts hosted
by me Cina McFarlane, produced by pod People and twenty
eighth av Our. Lead producer is Keith carlik Our. Executive
prouser is Lindsey Hoffman. Marketing lead is Ashley Weaver. Thank
you so much for listening. We'll see you next week.

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