Lane Kiffin to LSU, CFP Debates & Teams to Celebrate | College Football - The Solid Verbal College Football

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the solid verbal hull. That for me, I'm
a man, I'm forty.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
I've heard so many players say, well, I want to
be happy.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
You want to be happy for day Edith State?

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Is that whoo whoo? And no Dan and tie Dan Rubinstein,
I have very big news to share with you right now.

Speaker 1 (00:23):
Oh man, are you joining Bob Chesney and Westwood? Is
that happening official?

Speaker 2 (00:27):
Let's make it a December to remember the calendar has turned.
We know a lot more now that it is December.
We will talk through some of that and much much more.
We're going to take a spin on the coaching carousel.
We're going to talk through some of the brewing playoff debates.
We're going to give shout outs to teams that exceeded

(00:49):
expectations that we feel we need to celebrate. And we're
going to take a quick meandering through some of the games,
not all of the games, but some of the games
that Conference Championship Week has in store. Welcome back, My
friend has the voice healed? Have you gotten sleep? How
are you feeling? Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:06):
I feel great? Ty. You know sometimes when we come
around to Monday, I'm like, oh man, we were on
to the next week already. I'm still recovering from the
previous week. But it was a long, cold Thanksgiving extended weekend,
And even though we did a live stream on Friday,
even though we did a live stream on Saturday and
then a live show Saturday night, a couple watch alongs

(01:28):
in the reaction stream, I had nobody to talk to
all the stuff that just completely broke yesterday across this
great land. Like my four year old had very limited
interest in the idea of Pat Fitzgerald coaching Michigan State. Yeah,
so at one point he was like, absolutely, Texas deserves
to be in the playoff and I was like, you
don't know anything. He was like, no, you don't know ball, Dad,

(01:51):
And it just it wasn't the same. It just wasn't
the same. So I'm glad to be here with you
because we got got a lot to pung off of
each other.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
We absolutely do. So for those of you tuning in
at home, whether via YouTube, via the audio experience, whatever
does it for you, please hit follow or subscribe to
help support what Dan and I do. We will be
with you all through the off season. The second season
is officially now underway, and we're going to get to that.

(02:21):
I promise you here momentarily. Of course, if you're going
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(02:42):
in time for Bowl season slash the postseason, Dan Rubinstein.
With all that being said, why don't we take a
spin on the carousel. It's where everybody else is right now,
the coaching, the roar of that imaginary dinosaur or for
whatever reason, I do not know why you put that

(03:03):
in there. That means that we've got coaching news to discuss,
and boy do we ever. So we knew going into
this year. We just knew that it was going to
be a very active coaching cycle. Yes, we saw hirings,
in some cases firings during the season before the season

(03:24):
was fully through. We've got a bunch more now to
report here on today's episode. We kind of played it
cool on Sunday. We didn't break in to do live
streams or anything crazy we wanted to give this cycle
more of a chance to marinate and work itself out.
And of course the biggest domino was Lane Kiffin.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
And by the way, should mention it. This doesn't just
apply to Lane Kiffin, but all of these coaches moving,
not moving, or anything like that. This is a serious
life decision, ty, And there is something you need to
think about before making serious life decisions, is there not?

Speaker 2 (03:59):
There is? Yeah, And that's life.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
If you're gonna do it really well, you better learn
to get uncomfortable and just sitting it. You got it,
instead of running from it. Of course, for a lot
of times in life I ran from things that were uncomfortable.
Now you gotta sit in it.

Speaker 1 (04:18):
It's a good lesson.

Speaker 2 (04:19):
Who was that voice? The voice sounds familiar. Who was that?

Speaker 1 (04:22):
I couldn't place it. If I had to guess, Lane Kiffin.
If I did guess, but I don't know, sit in
the man.

Speaker 2 (04:29):
Gosh, what a circus. So look, Lane Kiffin was everybody's
top target this cycle, right. We have been hearing about
that for weeks, for months on end, that Lane Kiffin,
now formerly of Old miss was going to be the
top target at Florida, at LSU at many other jobs
around college football. The Lane Kiffin saga came to a

(04:51):
conclusion of some sort on Sunday, when it became official
that he is taking the job at LSU. There had
been much debate over whether or not Lane was going
to leave. We reported here not through any insider information,
but just through common sense that if he decided he
wanted to stay at Ole Miss, he would have told

(05:11):
us well before the Egg Bowl. There was no need
to drag this out with all the fanfare and the hullabaloo.
It seemed as though he was gone. The question was
really is he going to stick around long enough? Is
Old Miss going to allow him to stick around long
enough to coach the Rebels through the playoff? He put
out a statement made it fairly well known. I would say,

(05:33):
through that, as well as in the interview he did
with ESPN's Marty Smith Keith Carter's decision at ole Miss
to not let him coach it out and finish what
he started at Ole Miss. We can talk about the
merits of that Dan here in a second, But your
impression of LSU now getting Lane Kiffin from Ole Miss.

Speaker 1 (05:54):
Well, I, first of all, I thought that was a
sweet little hug from Marty Smith to Lane Kiffin at
the end of that interview. I don't know if you noticed.
That's what you see a lot of when reporters are,
you know, on the ground doing that dirty work. Is
just like, hey, you made this decision. Why'd you do that?

Speaker 2 (06:08):
All right? Hey, hey go get him Tiger?

Speaker 1 (06:13):
That was that was unexpected, honest reporting. Yeah, yeah, I'm
on the ground here and in Taipei.

Speaker 2 (06:23):
Good luck.

Speaker 1 (06:27):
So anyway, I what what did I take away from it? Look,
why why does Lane Kiffin leave a playoff team? Because
he wants to write like, why does and I'm not
talking about specifically ahead of this year's playoff, but ole
miss is a playoff program. Why does Lane Kiffin decide
that he does no no longer want to coach a

(06:48):
program that is built to go to the playoff many
years because he wanted to because he either stopped having
fun or stopped enjoying his time in Oxford or some
combination of that, and feeling like LSU is a bigger,
better place for him to soar to new heights. I

(07:09):
don't know. It all strikes me as like nobody forced
you to do this, And despite the set of college
game day having his back. As for his desire to
coach for the LSU coach, to coach all miss and
try to steal players as was reported, his threat and coaches,

(07:30):
it was all very strange to me. Ty. The whole
episode was strange, but at the same time, it's Lane
Kiffin so perfectly normal. So it was just you know,
you guys, you know how this is gonna end at LSU. Right,
It's gonna end worse than this. It's gonna end so
much worse, and we all know it already. We're all
prepared for it, and it's gonna be great.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
Look, he left because he've used it as a more
prestigious job. He left because this has been who Lane
Kiffin has always been. I'm not gonna ben vilifying him
for jumping around. I mean, he's talked about it in
the past. He grew up with the coach as a father.
They moved seventeen times or some crazy number like that.
This has just always been who the guy is. The
other thing that I would add is he's never been

(08:11):
And I'll give credit to Bruce Feldman because I watched
the audible the show that he does with Ralph and
Stu over at the athletic and he said it on
the podcast that they did yesterday morning, and he kind
of like, beat me to the Punchlane Kiffn's a bad
breaker upper. We've seen this everywhere, so this should come
as no great surprise. What I do find funny as
you talk about the LSU coach coaching Ole Miss. I

(08:33):
don't know if he saw some of the details of
Lane's contract that have since surface since he took this
job at LSU, But LSU is paying him to coach
at ole Miss. Right, they are paying him his postseason
bonus even though he is no longer with Old Miss.
So if Old Miss goes on to win a national championship,
whatever escalators were present in that Old Miss contract, pending

(08:57):
how far they go in the postseason, Kiffen will be
rewarded for that, given the fact that he was previously
there even though he is now at LSU. So credit
Jimmy Sexton, the agent forgetting it done, for pulling one
over on another athletic department. They get a good coach,
they get a good coach in Lane Kiffen. They also
get something of a circus, but that's come as no

(09:19):
great surprise to anybody who has signed on with Lane
Kiffin in the past. What I do find interesting now
is this conversation on whether he should have or shouldn't
have coached Ole Miss. I think, if you're all miss,
what you don't want is the optics of the entire
stadium booing your coach as you host a home playoff game. Okay,

(09:41):
cut out all of like the league elees and the
ethical stuff and whether or not you should do this
as a hiring or HR practice. But the optics, the
sheer optics of having a guy on the sidelines that
might be boot out of the stadium seems like it's
a bad thing, and I would not want that if
I were Keith Carter. So I understand that this is prickly.

(10:04):
I understand that this is definitely an unprecedented situation for
God to just straight up and leave before his team
kicks it off in the twelve team field. But I understand, frankly,
where all parties are coming from. And I think I
signed a little bit more with Keith Carter and Ole Miss.

Speaker 1 (10:20):
As do I. And look, we're going to see Eric
Morris at North Texas for the postseason, are we not?
We are? We're going to see John Summral at Tulane.
Are we not?

Speaker 2 (10:30):
We are.

Speaker 1 (10:30):
We've seen coordinator stay Dan Lanning State at Georgia through
their national championship run before taking over Oregon. This is different.
It is different when however you want to, you know,
name Ole Miss and LSU as rivals right there. It's
not on the level of the Iron Bull, it's not
on the level of the biggest rivalries in the sport,
but it is a rivalry. It is a meaningful annual matchup.

(10:53):
And that a coach would leave one school for the other.
We really haven't seen that in a major conference on
this level, like Sark left Washington for USC But that's
not the same. That's it's just not the same. And
so I can understand if you're old miss, right, you
feel sort of jerked around. You know, two months ago

(11:14):
you were doing you were watching your coach as the
subject of an E sixty. I don't need to play
this again. And that's like, but it was all about
how yoga had changed him and centered him. And now
LSU has hired two consecutive troublesome coaches who've been changed
by yoga. The yoga card. They went back to the

(11:34):
well with the yoga card twice incredible. And look, it's
going to end at LSU with a statement or a
quote that is going to go along the lines of
it's going to start with look in retrospect, Like, no,
not in retrospect. Everybody knows how this is going to go.
It's it's a question of like the juice being worth
the squeeze for LSU. Right, if he wins you a
national championship, you deal with whatever the fallout is at

(11:58):
the end.

Speaker 2 (11:58):
You make that trade to make that trade too, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:01):
Right, and so there's no apologizing if he is able
to bring you back to that you know, hallowed ground
that LSU expects from its program. So yeah, it's it's
all just an insane circus. And I get it. The
funny stuff too. Was just like Nick Saban on game
day and Kirk Herb Street on game day. I think
I saw Booger McFarland like ESPN circle the wagons to be.

Speaker 2 (12:23):
Like let a coach come on doing for the kids.

Speaker 1 (12:25):
And then there was a quote it was like the
players full on Hateum. It was just like they are
very happy he's gone after just the way everything has
transpired these past few days.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
I mean, do you blame them, No, not at all.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
I just thought it was funny that they were all
just like think of the kids, you know, let them
play for the coach that brought him here, and then
immediately when everything went down, they were just like f
that guy.

Speaker 2 (12:49):
Yeah, I mean, look, I would I would probably feel
similarly and not to play too much of Devil's advocate here,
but I was thinking about this a lot. What is
lank lank Kiff has been a very successful coach, no
doubt about it, and I understand why he is a
target for many of these openings, or was a target
and will probably continue to be in the future. Yeah,

(13:10):
link Kiffin's won like a bunch of news cycles and
a couple of recruiting cycles. Is he worth all of
this time and energy that people have put in A
good coach, a coati of offensive mind?

Speaker 1 (13:22):
But like, what.

Speaker 2 (13:24):
Are what are we like hanging our hat on here
in terms of like hard accolades that make all of
this trouble worth it?

Speaker 1 (13:32):
You're you're hanging your hat on the fact that he'll
take your money. And the very best coaches in this sport,
whoever you consider them to be, didn't seem as willing
to take your money. And in a market that has
you know, Penn State and Florida and obviously now Ole
miss open and shut pretty quickly, Michigan State opened up,
like there are just a lot of big jobs and
big conferences UCLA out west that opened up, and a

(13:56):
lot of the perceived top candidates across the country either
recently took a new job, like Ryan Day wasn't taking
the LSU job, Dan Lanning wasn't taking the LSU job,
Mike Elcho wasn't taking like all those in demand jobs
or in demand coaches. Kurt Signetty wasn't taking the LSU job.
They weren't common. And you know, Lane Kiffin will there's

(14:17):
like the old I wish I could attribute this to
the correct person, but like the old joke of like
Shackle take ten million dollars from fascism if the check
clears right, they're just like he Lane Kiffn's willing to listen.
He's willing to take your money, and he's willing to
win double digit games at your university or college. And

(14:39):
that's why all of this, you know, it's it's a
leverage play that Lane Kiffin had a Tonnel leverage. Because
of the Florida interest and obviously the ole missinterest, he
was willing to listen. LSU considered LSU to be a
step up, and so you do whatever it takes. Because
LSU didn't want to hire John Summral, LSU didn't want
to hire take your pick of Alex Golash, guys who

(15:03):
are good coaches, legitimately good coaches, but they didn't feel
like they were of the stature of the LSU job.
And so you know, you are what your options are,
and that's you know, that's the position Lane Kiffin, you know,
pretty advantageously found himself in.

Speaker 2 (15:18):
Well, look, this is not me saying it is a
bad hire, but I get what you're saying. Everybody wanted
Lane Kiffin. I completely understand the draw to Lane Kiffin. A.
You know what you're signing up for. B let's see
him do it now, right. If he wants to create
this kind of circus to go to LSU, then you
got to put your money where your mouth is. And
he's got a lot of money. By the way, despite

(15:39):
all of the hollow talk on the ls side about
not wanting to commit to irresponsible contracts and change the
model moving forward. Yeah, the buyout for Lane Kiffin is
more than it was for Brian Kelly, and it is
fully guaranteed. So they also talk out of two sides
of their mouth.

Speaker 1 (15:54):
What's the number.

Speaker 2 (15:54):
I didn't see the official number. I just saw that
it's more than Brian Kelly and it's fully guaranteed.

Speaker 1 (16:00):
And you know what, Ty, that's life and that's life.

Speaker 2 (16:02):
It's life.

Speaker 1 (16:03):
Oki, you get what you can. Yeah, what somebody's wanting
to pay you. By the way, way back.

Speaker 2 (16:09):
When, this is my final point on Kiffin, and then
we got like eighty other coaches to talk to. That's fine,
way back when, in the year of Our Lord two
thousand and ten, when we were younger and more full
of life and had fewer grays. And I don't think
we were married at that We definitely weren't married at that.

Speaker 1 (16:25):
But I maintained three girlfriends at a time. Sure, unbelievable.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
Way back when, right after Kiffin left Tennessee for USC
you and I set an imaginary line over under five
and a half five and a half total head coaching
jobs over the course of Lane Kiffen's career. At the
time that we set it, we thought it was ridiculous.

(16:51):
He just hit it. This is head coaching stop number
six if you account for the brief time that he
was with the Raiders. Course, I had some listeners reach
out to me and remind me of this. I didn't
even recall it as fifteen years ago that we set
this line and it just hit amazing, amazing. So, with
all that being set on the lane kiff in front,
thankfully that is now over, Florida pivoted rather quickly. They

(17:15):
hired John Summral away from Tulane. We started seeing these
come through in rapid fire. On Sunday morning, Auburn snatched
up Alex Golesh from USF. Arkansas made it official with
Ryan Silverfield, who had been reported by some outlets weeks
ago that he was going to accept the position at Arkansas.
That was quickly refuted, but now it turns out indeed, yes,

(17:38):
he is the guy. We saw ole Miss move very
quickly to promote from within Pete Golding, not just to
an interim but to be there full time head coach
moving forward, their permanent guy moving forward. That is in
addition to some others around college football. We also saw
Oklahoma State a little bit earlier on in the site,

(18:00):
I'll go with Eric Morris. Of course, we know about
James Franklin and Tavita Pritchard taking the positions at Virginia
Tech and Stanford respectively. Michigan State moved and fired Jonathan Smith.
This shouldn't come as a great surprise to anybody who
years seemed as if it was trending in that direction,
even though even though it was only two years on

(18:22):
the job. They now are I believe making it official
that it's going to be Pat Fitzgerald coming out of
retirement and taking over the position at Michigan State formerly
the coach at Northwestern. I say retirement in quotes because
we had a bit of a legal dispute there that
ousted him from that position previously. We just got words
shortly before we hit record that Bob Chesney is going

(18:43):
to be leaving James Madison and taking over the job
out at UCLA. It had been rumored for a couple
of weeks that he was a top target out there.
I know he had spoken to Penn State a couple
times over but UCLA it seemed was going to be
the school that landed Bobby Chez, so good for him.
We also found out lately last night that the Kentucky
Wildcats were moving on from Mark Stoops. The two names

(19:06):
that have merged almost immediately in response to this becoming
open or two coordinators Will Stein, who was formerly I believe,
a quarterback at Louisville, as well as Brian Hartline, currently
the offensive coordinator at Ohio State.

Speaker 1 (19:22):
Yes, whose brother was a quarterback at Kentucky brother was
a quarterback line Yeah, acting two thousands. Will Stein, I
think grew up his parents. Maybe. I think I think
I saw both went to Kentucky. I grew up a
season ticket holder. There so all interesting jobs, and I
don't know we can if you want to go through
rapid fire or if you want to sort of sink
our teeth into any of these. The Auburn Hire is fascinating.

(19:45):
I think there's like a personality, intriguing personality fit there
with Alex Golesh.

Speaker 2 (19:50):
I like that hire.

Speaker 1 (19:51):
I do.

Speaker 2 (19:52):
I mean, look, I'm very guilty of doing this thing
when we go then we've done this a million times
over now with the coach and carousel, where I go
through every higre and I sort of talk myself into it.
Of course I come out of this liking every single higher, well.

Speaker 1 (20:08):
Every single official. Hi, are you big on Pat Fitzgerald
at Michigan State.

Speaker 2 (20:13):
I'm not big on Pat Fitzgerald just in general, but
I understand why they would go in that direction. What
I was going to say is I need to be
a little bit more judicious about how I grade these
hires this year and not over commit to a guy
working or not working. I was convinced that Jonathan Smith
was a slam dunk. Oh same, I thought that was
a slam dunk higher at Michigan State, and he just

(20:34):
you never know what is going to work out because
it is dependent on a multitude of variables, Right, Nil.

Speaker 1 (20:41):
I still say love with your entire heart, ty.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
Alignment with the administration, the players, the coaches, on staff.
There are so many things that go into this. Go
through and tell me which of these hires jumps out
to you the most.

Speaker 1 (20:55):
All of them. These are all big places making big moves,
and obviously we have like an opening at USF, now
we have an opening it too, Lane. These are huge
jobs in their own right as well. So okay, all
of these jump out for various reasons. I like the
potential fit of Alex Golish at Auburn, especially once you see,
once we all see what his hires look like on defense,
that's obviously going to be huge, and how well they

(21:16):
can do to maintain the talent and success that Auburn's
had on the defensive side of the ball recently since
Alex Golish, his background has been on offense. The John
Summrall thing is interesting. I know Florida people are sort
of sour on it initially because of a similar background
to Billy Napier, the success in the Sun Belt and
the lack of a huge job, you know, a huge

(21:38):
coordinator job at a major place in the SEC. But
I don't know, his success has been pretty consistent. He's
coached in the SEC right, he played at Kentucky, he
coached at Kentucky, has a background there, and I think
it's unfair to say we should have gone in a
completely different direction in terms of background and experience when

(21:58):
these are two different guys who have two different experiences
and two different visions. But again, if I'm a fan,
I get it.

Speaker 2 (22:06):
I totally get it, and I even said it to
you on the show at some point a couple of
weeks ago. Are they really going to go a G
five coach after what went down with the G five coach.
But that's I know. I said it. It's sort of
a brain dead take, right, These are different guys. Billy
Napier's success or lack of success, in no way has

(22:27):
any bearing on what John Sumral is going to be.
And John Sumrall, much like his predecessor Billy Napier, was
very much in demand this coaching cycle. There were a
bunch of schools that wanted John Somemrall. Auburn thought they
had John Sumrall if not for what went down with
Lane Kiffin taking LSU and the Dominoes sort of leading
some Roll to Florida. So it wasn't just Auburn. It

(22:48):
wasn't just like Arkansas. There were a bunch of schools
that thought they might have a shot at some Rall,
including oh Miss, if Lane Kiffin left with like an
appropriate amount of time to make it happen. Like there
have been conversations all throughout the South about John some Roll.
So it doesn't surprise me that and it shouldn't surprise
Florida people that they would be quick to make him

(23:09):
the guy, even despite the experience they just had with
Billy Napier. These are two different dudes.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
They are, And the question is, you know, does coaching
in the Sun Belt as a head coach adequately prepare
you to take over a major place like Florida.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
I get it. And look, he's he was in the
Sun Belt with Troy, He's been in the American with Tulane,
and it feels to me like this is just a
much different situation. I do not think it is apples
to apples. I think he is better prepared to step
into this role, and even more so, he's going to
have the benefit of what went down with Billy Napier,

(23:44):
knowing what the pitfalls were, hopefully being smart enough to
know what the pitfalls were.

Speaker 1 (23:49):
When he's interviewed and asked, will you hire an offensive Cordner,
He'll say yes, yeah, okay, I.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Can do that for sure, for sure. So look to
the extent that anybody can like these hires. Jen Sumroll
is very much in demand. So I get it. I'm
with you on the Alex Golsh thing. By the way
at Auburn.

Speaker 1 (24:05):
Oh, that makes me think he's an immediate failure.

Speaker 2 (24:07):
I know, I know, I know what I like about
gole Ash He's got a little bit of a screw loose. Yeah,
got a little bit of a screw loose, like all
these guys do to some extent. But Golesh is like
the crazy dude in the fight that you do not
want to be up against. And I think that plays
really well at a place like Auburn.

Speaker 1 (24:26):
I don't see I feel like there their personalities from there,
the personalities from their recent coaches hasn't really been that.
Like Gus Malzan doesn't strike me as that does he No.

Speaker 2 (24:38):
No, no, no no no no no no no. But I'm
like saying, in in this era of SEC football, I
think you need a guy with some was one of
the Auburn players himself has said they need a guy
with some dog in him.

Speaker 1 (24:49):
Okay, this is gole ash man. That is brow skolish
is okay. I that's that's good by me. The Jonathan
Smith thing wasn't surprising just because it did seem that.
I mean, they had a ton of injuries this year
and two years I think traditionally speaking, doesn't feel like
enough time. But obviously in the portal era, when you
can remake your roster and you know if you have

(25:11):
the support you if everybody shares your vision is willing
to execute on your vision. But ultimately, he was the
guy who hired everybody in this program, right, He's the
guy who hired the assistance and you know how to say,
and who was going to be running things behind the scenes,
and it just it didn't work. And so it does
feel like this is more than just football, Like something

(25:33):
behind the scenes said that, like, this is not our guy.
And I'm not sure how you reportedly move on to
Pat Fitzgerald as somebody who is a better fit in
twenty twenty five to say, like, here is somebody who
is going to be aggressive. Here is somebody who is
savvy with regard to you know, building out a roster

(25:55):
through the portal and has connections in a way that
we can build out this roster to compete with you know,
Michigan and Ohio State and whatever whatever Penn State does
when they hire a coach in June and Oregon and Indiana.
I just his name would not be at the top
of my list as like the modern savvy, electric personality

(26:17):
to drag Michigan State kicking and screaming into the modern era.
I just I think he was a product of a
fortuitous divisional situation in the Big Ten and did a
really nice job hiring and keeping Mike Hankwitz calling that
defense and you know, found really good dudes in the

(26:39):
trenches and on defense to help build a defense that
was able to beat Purdue and Illinois and you know,
sometimes Iowa. But I don't know, it just felt like
they cast a net that didn't go beyond Pat Fitzgerald.

Speaker 2 (26:58):
I mean they went spearfishing instead of of Penn State's
been doing, which is, you know, using a deluxe fisherman's
net to try and talk to everybody. Yeah, I mean
at this point, Penn State might hire a coach from Serbia,
like they talk about overseas. I'll talk about that in
the second where I'm leaning on that front. But I'm
not into the Pat Fitzgerald hire either. And I've never

(27:18):
been a Fitzgerald guy. And I understand that there is
an allure given what he did at Northwestern, and that's
viewed as being transformational in some sense. Clearly he was
in good with the big money men at Northwestern and
there was a deep respect for him, you know, separate
from whatever went down on the legal side of things.
I mean, there were a lot of people who were

(27:38):
very high on Pat Fitzgerald, and so when his name
started bubbling up as wanting to get back in the
coaching game, it seems to me like there was a
lot of interest in him. I mean, I think there
were conversations with Penn State. I think he cast a
wide net himself to try and see where he might
fit in. So in terms of the style of football
that I think he likes to play, which is very physical,

(28:00):
sort of aggressive defense first football, I think that can
play well at a place like in Michigan State. My
concern with what it looks like longer term is what
is that offense going to be sure? Who is going
to be his offensive coordinator because it seems like that
side of the ball only worked well at Northwestern when

(28:20):
he had a really good quarterback who can run and
he had a running back who could fill in the gaps.
This is never an electric passing team or anything like
that under Pat Fitzgerald. So if he wants to line
up and play that physical brand of football, I need
to know more about who your quarterback's going to be
and need to know what you're going to do up
front along the line, who your running back is going
to be and who is going to set the identity

(28:41):
for this offense. He went two to fourteen in the
Big Ten his final two seasons. I'm going to reserve
judgment until I find out some of the other pieces
that he is adding. But I understand the allure. I
don't think it's a terrible fit, but I do need
more information before I'm willing to commit.

Speaker 1 (28:57):
Okay, Bob Chesney's as good at UCLA.

Speaker 2 (29:01):
Bob Chasney was very much in demand this cycle, and
I think there's a chance that UCLA got the higher
of the cycle with Bobby Chaz Wow. I really like him.
I really like him. He's young, he's been putting in
hard work. Everywhere he's been. He has done a good job.
I still remember when he took over at James Madison,
which was just two years ago, right that there was

(29:23):
this thought that there might be a bottoming out with
Kurt Signetti leaving taking a bunch of his players. It
was basically going to be a full reboot at James Madison.
James Madison, by the way, he's been very good at
hiring coaches. They've got a track record for being good
at this, and it seems as though they got another
guy in Bob Chesney who may not be Kurt Signetti,
but is like at least twenty five years younger something

(29:44):
like that. Then Kurt Signetti and you know, obviously has
some recent success to pull from. We'll see what happens
with JMU as they play their championship game this weekend.
They're about a three touchdown favorite. He's going to coach
that game from what I understand, But to what extent
he will be involved in the playoffs should they make
the playoffs. I have not seen any official word on that. Again,

(30:06):
this just sort of broke the wire shortly before we
hit record today.

Speaker 1 (30:10):
Ryan Silverfield at Arkansas, I'm.

Speaker 2 (30:15):
Very mixed on this one.

Speaker 1 (30:19):
Okay, why I wonder.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
What he brings to the table that some of the
other candidates I've heard do not. Okay, he has been
very good at building an offense. We have seen that
in his time at Memphis and this year. I think
the defense also took a bit of a step forward,
which is nice.

Speaker 1 (30:41):
But yes, top fifty defense, top twenty offense per points
per drive.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Yeah, I just think it's an uphill battle at a
place like an Arkansas and even more so than Ryan Silverfield.
Much of my understanding of the Arkansas program is that
they are somewhat behind with regard to the other levers
of modern college football. Nil spend things of that.

Speaker 1 (31:08):
Nature, right, which is where Memphis was more advanced than
teams in the America.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
It was because of the FedEx money that came in.
So I'm very mixed on silver Field. I feel like
they wanted Golesh, but Golesh took Auburn. Silver Field was
very much a name out there. Again, he had been
reported to take this job weeks ago. I don't know
if it's more of a silver Field thing for me

(31:37):
and why I'm blase on it, or if it's more
of an Arkansas thing. One or the other is spooking
me out a little bit about this move, and I'm
not fully on board with it.

Speaker 1 (31:48):
Yeah, I guess the only reason to uh to be
blase is at Arkansas you are going to need somebody
creative and energizing, right that like Arkansas can win football,
You're gonna need to, you know, energize the money behind
the scenes in a way that it is in all ways,
which is you know, you should energize the money, right,
You should give reason to people with money to spend money,

(32:11):
and maybe a very specific vision in terms of like
what kind of systems you're going to be running and
not that Ryan Silverfield doesn't have that. It was not
a great ending to the Memphis season this year. I
think they lost their last three or three or five
something like that. Yeah, as the schedule got.

Speaker 2 (32:26):
More, they went out with a whimper. They really did.

Speaker 1 (32:28):
But it's a tough conference, I guess. And he beat Arkansas,
So there's that at Memphis. Yeah, this is this feels
like the most TBD to me. To see what they
look like on the field, what his staff looks like,
what they do in the portal, what he can do
in terms of just a sales job. I think that that,
to me is going to be the intriguing thing here.

(32:50):
And then you mentioned the Kentucky thing, you know, having
will Stein and Brian Hartline both have been quite successful
at huge places, and then the question just remains like
do you take a Kentucky job that has a pretty
clear ceiling like that? Is that seen as a destination
for either of these guys? Maybe for will Stein, you know,

(33:11):
from the area whatever, that can be a destination thing,
But when you look around the SEC and the same
can be said for Arkansas obviously. Is if you have
grand designs of coaching the biggest possible programs, can you
make a leap from Kentucky to that? Or if you
look at it as a destination, then you know, get
as much as you can, grab as many wins as

(33:33):
you can, have fun along the way, retire a legend.
I don't know, but I yeah, I'm curious to see
the direction they go to because it doesn't seem like
a huge ceiling job. But I think they were ready
for something new, for sure.

Speaker 2 (33:47):
I agree with that. So basically where we stand now,
a lot of these jobs filled up very quickly with
the news. Now that Bob Chesney has taken UCLA. There
are three Power four jobs that remain vacant. Cal still open. Yes,
it'll be Tosh Lupoy most likely. It seems Kentucky.

Speaker 1 (34:06):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (34:07):
I've put all my money on will Stein. Okay, but
we'll see. And that leaves Penn State.

Speaker 1 (34:16):
Yeah. Oh, Dan Hawkins, come on down, dirt cutter, come
on down.

Speaker 2 (34:28):
The natives are growing restless for a name here. Bill
Parcells Is Bill Parcells still alive?

Speaker 1 (34:35):
I hope so I believe he is. I'm googling, but
I believe he.

Speaker 2 (34:40):
Is man to be one of the first teams to
jump aboard the carousel still alive and thank you. That's
good to hear.

Speaker 1 (34:49):
Eighty four years old.

Speaker 2 (34:50):
He should coach the Giants. Yea. To be one of
the first teams to throw their hat in the ring
and to now be what feels like left without a
chair when the music stops, that is a bit disheartening.
I know that Penn State met with Bob Chesney and
talked to him a couple of times, and I know
Bob Chesney, from what I have heard, would have walked

(35:12):
over hot coals to get this Penn State job. He's
from central Pennsylvania from about an hour and a half away,
obviously knows the area, has been coaching in this part
of the country for the entire day of his career.
So the fact that they didn't go after Chesney signals
to me that they had somebody a little higher up
on the perceived food chain that they are targeting. The

(35:34):
latest rumors are all surrounding Kalani Sataki at Buyu, which
is a name that started coming out of left field
a few days ago. It definitely caught me by surprise,
and I will admit when I first heard it, I
did not believe it at all. It just felt like
it was too random a name to come out of
nowhere and to be seriously considered for that Penn State job.

(35:58):
I feel like there is reel credibility behind those rumors, now, Okay.
I have been kicking some of my own tires to
try and figure out is there any real validity to
these And I've seen other people talk about I know,
I like Liam Over at Barstool was talking about it,
and Matt Brown, our friend Matt Brown was posting about

(36:18):
it a little bit.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
Does Terry Pagoula pick up your calls? Is that somebody
that you're you're interact with?

Speaker 2 (36:24):
I wish, I wish.

Speaker 1 (36:25):
No, I know Rack Daddy doesn't pick up the tie calls.

Speaker 2 (36:28):
Okay, I know Matt was posting a little bit about
this as well. But Kalani Sataki is a very good
football coach. He is a very good football coach, and
as you said to me earlier today, you don't win
that many games by accident. He is a revered figure
in the BYU community, and so for sure, as some

(36:48):
of these rumors have started to bubble up. Many folks
on the BYU side of things have been in a
full blown panic because they want to keep Kalani Sataki
at all costs. He is viewed as sort of like
this large than life figure. He is a treasure within
the BYU universe, which I mean.

Speaker 1 (37:03):
He's literally larger than life. He's a big dude. He's
a big dude. He's got to start ordering those Paul
Chris pullovers. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (37:09):
So this is not me reporting that Kialani Sataki is
going to be the guy. This is me just saying
that based on a little bit of my own research,
I have plenty of reason to believe that there is
a lot of truth to the rumors that we have seen,
and it isn't just some random stuff that popped up
at two am on a message board. Sure where it
goes from here that remains to be seen. Would it

(37:32):
be a fit in State college. We can have that
discussion if and when he gets to stay college. I
don't want to get too far out over my skis,
but among the names that seem to be connected to
the Penn State job, this is the one right now
that feels to me like it's got the most validity.

Speaker 1 (37:47):
And if it doesn't happen, there's my GUNDI like, there
are guys out there, there are names, there are there
are I would I have warmed to the idea.

Speaker 2 (37:56):
Of Kilani Sataki. I will say that. Okay, he has
always preached the value in staying humble and hungry. I
think it's his mantra. Okay that very much would would
play well, very much would be a fit in state college.
He has constantly been in this position where idiots like

(38:19):
you and I look at the BYU program and we say, wow,
it can't be any better than they were last year.
Look at this roster, especially this year. I mean I
was guilty of it. They lost Jake Retz left like
four days before the season, whatever it was. They've been
starting a true freshman and now they're on the precipice
of winning a conference championship and going to the playoff.
That stuff doesn't just happen by happenstance. He's been doing

(38:41):
it now for a decade at BYU. He's been very
good at getting more with what the rest of us
idiots out here would think is less. And so given
where Penn State has been with James Franklin, which is
not getting more with more. I understand the logic of
going after potentially a guy like a Sati who you
can look at his body of work and say, this

(39:03):
guy has found ways to just make it work. And
so if at the end of the day, Pat Kraft
decides I just want to go with the good football coach,
I understand that logic and I would support that, And
I like Kilani's talk. You have very much warmed to
him over the years as we've covered the sport and
recently now as I think his name has started to
be connected to Penn State.

Speaker 1 (39:23):
But we'll see.

Speaker 2 (39:24):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
I wish I could find out at the end of
this cycle just how many raises Pat Kraft got various
coaches across America, like Sugar Daddy to the Stars Pat Kraft.
When Kalani Sataki signs a new deal in two days
with BYU, that is the concern.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
I mean, there have been so many names that have
been sent to me in connection to this job. I
don't believe that they're going to get Kaylen Deboor. There
might be a conversation, but I don't believe they're going
to get Kaylen Deboor. I believe some of the steam
that Lincoln Riley doesn't like USC and is looking for
ways out or some of his options. But I don't
honestly believe they're gonna end up with Lincoln Rally, and

(40:03):
I don't think Lincoln Riley be a great fit.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
PJ. Fleck will take your money.

Speaker 2 (40:06):
I don't want PJ. Fleck. I really don't want to
deal with that. Okay, right, there are these all these
other names that have popped up. Chip Kelly, I don't
want Chip Kelly.

Speaker 1 (40:16):
Jimbo, No, come on, Dan West, Virginia is not far
from Pennsylvania. That's where's That's where he's from.

Speaker 2 (40:25):
I guess, man, I'm just look I Josh Hipel's another
name that I saw floating around out there. I don't
buy that. I really don't.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
Matt Campbell doesn't seem interested. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (40:37):
I don't know what the deal is with Matt Campbell.
I like Matt Campbell. I actually think that would be
a fine hire. But I think he just likes coaching
and name, and he likes coaching names.

Speaker 1 (40:45):
I think he does.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
Maybe he's not much for promoting himself. I know that's
been a popular theory out there as well. But of
the names of the names that seem like they are
out there now in connection with Penn State, the final
three that I would probably posit if I were putting
money on any of these, And I am not necessarily
privy insider info, right, I think there. I think some

(41:06):
of the smoke around Sataki is real. I put him
in there. I would probably put Brian Dable in there,
and I would probably put Brian Hartline in there as
my final three. I think it'll be end up being
one of those three guys. But when that happens and
who it ends up being, your guests is as good
as mine.

Speaker 1 (41:24):
To Sean Foster.

Speaker 2 (41:27):
Right in solid Verbo at gmail dot com, let us
know what we got right, what we got wrong. We
would love to hear from you. Certainly, as some of
these other jobs are filled, we will do our part
to keep you abreast of the situation. It won't be
long before we start getting names for coordinators for some
of these new places. Sure it did see that. Like
Matt Ruhle, formerly my favorite to take the Penn Stage job,

(41:49):
he made a move at defensive coordinator that got rid
of John Butler, who formerly had some Penn State routes.
There is a whole circle going on here right now.
The carousel continues to spend do our part to try
and stay on top of it.

Speaker 1 (42:01):
Oh Man, the ball knowers in Lincoln, we're lecturing us
pre season about how John Butler was going to be
a big improvement over Tony White.

Speaker 2 (42:08):
I know.

Speaker 1 (42:09):
Well, yeah, so there you have it. I think that's
still gonna spin. Carousel is still spinning. There's fallout from
all of these hires, and Oregon might be out two coordinators.
I don't know. It's all fascinating. And that's ahead of
like it's the final stretch for the playoff. It is
the final stretch of the playoff.

Speaker 2 (42:28):
Dan, Let's talk a little bit, and I do mean
a little bit because we don't have the official playoff
rankings right now, but let's talk a little bit about
where things stand for the college football playoffs. We do
have an Overballer top twelve poll for those who are interested.
It goes Ohio State, Indiana, Georgia, Texas, Tech, Oregon, Texas
A and M down to six, followed by Ole Miss

(42:50):
at seven, Alabama at eight, ahead of Oklahoma at nine. Okay, yeah,
Number ten, Notre Dame number eleven, BYU number twelve of
the Miami Hurricanes. In case you are interested, we've got
Vanderbilt at thirteen. And because I think Arvar bowlers are
very keen on the G five schools, North Texas at fourteen,

(43:11):
JMU at fifteen, and Texas at number sixteen.

Speaker 1 (43:15):
That's I think I would take Texas over James Madison. Well,
you know, you never know. I think I would too,
but I think I would take Utah over North Texas
and James Madison, which you never know.

Speaker 2 (43:25):
With ye, I am with you. Here is my question
to you, by the way, in case you're interested in
how that compares to the AP pole. They have Ohio State, Indiana,
Georgia one two three, Oregon up to four, Texas Tech
at five, Ole Miss at six. They dropped Texas A
and m four spots all the way down to number seven.

(43:46):
They've got Oklahoma, Notre Dame, Alabama BYU remaining unchanged, Miami
jumping up a spot to number twelve in that poll
as well. So yeah, there's a lot to discuss here.
This is all going to come to a head this
week when we have our conference championship games. There is
an outstanding question as to whether or not the committee
could or should punish or take some of the hot

(44:09):
air out of the Old Miss balloon as a result
of the coaching staff turney over, at least on the
offensive side. Right, we've Lane kiff and walking out, Charlie
Junior taking his talents to baton Rouge as well. How
do we feel about where ole Miss is now relative
to their peers given the news of the day.

Speaker 1 (44:29):
I wouldn't punish them. I wouldn't punish them. At the
end of the day, it's players who play, it's players
who win. I understand the brain trust is now gone
and it's going to look different, But I didn't love
punishing Florida Satan. They lost their starting quarterback, and I
still didn't love punishing them there. I just I don't
see how you can There's so many variables in this sport. Obviously,

(44:51):
it's not an ideal position that Ole Miss finds themselves in,
even though their new full time coach is the interim
coach slash just the full time coach now in Pete Golding,
who we didn't really discuss in terms of taking over
that job, but I'm sure we'll have plenty of time
to I'm happy with them there. I'm happy with them seven.
I think no matter what I mean, they're not playing,
they're gonna be an eleven to one SEC team. They're

(45:12):
gonna make the playoff no matter what. I guess your
question is, like, do you dock them? I don't think
you can dock them for something that is not in
the control of like the administration tried to keep him
even Lane Kiffen wanted to stay for the playoff, which
is kind of funny, but like, you can't dock ole Miss.
I don't believe you can dock ole Miss anything, uh,
for things that have happened behind the scenes. When they're

(45:34):
gonna field the same team.

Speaker 2 (45:36):
I think I'm with you. I think I'm with you.
I hate that set up when they punish the players
for the coach leaving. I understand a coach is a
valuable part of the team, but of course the players
are the ones making the plays.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
The Alabama ahead of Oklahoma thing because they did recently
play and as many questions as I have about elements
of Oklahoma on offense, Oklahoma beat them in Tuscal loose.

Speaker 2 (46:02):
I mean, this is a shot across the doubt the
for ballers the APD is I know, I know, but
our arver ballers did. Arver ballers have Oklahoma two spots
ahead of Alabama. I'm getting a little bit nervous on
the Notre Dame front. I'm a little bit nervous that
so much of this public pressure is going to start
to seep in to the playoff committee and they're going

(46:23):
to put Miami ahead of Notre Dame when we get
the latest batch of rankings, and is going to put
Notre Dame very much on the bubble. I think they're
very much on the bubble as it is right now.
Depending on what goes down this weekend, we're in line
for I think at least two outside the top ten
right grabbing playoff spots. If BYU were to pull an

(46:46):
upset and knock off Texas Tech, that would be the
death knell for Notre Dame. By you would steal a bit,
I think.

Speaker 1 (46:53):
You also, I don't know, man, if you're what, are
they going to be eleven in one or they are
eleven and one, potentially twelve and one or eleven in two.
And we haven't seen, you know, a large sample size
of how the Committee's going to react to conference championship games.
But SMU still made it in despite their their close
loss last year to Clemson. It's been an awful long
time of keeping BYU this low. I know that it

(47:13):
does feel like, you know, they haven't had the most
control over teams all of the time. No, they didn't
control the game against Texas Tech at all. I would
also hold their non conference schedule against them. But also
like they went eleven in one of the Big twelve,
like they beat legit teams up right, and I just

(47:37):
they're a pretty complete, really good team, and I just
don't think what they've shown on the field has them,
you know, this, consistently behind teams with two losses in
other major conferences. So I wouldn't hate putting BYU in
the like eight nine you know eight nine region right

(47:58):
and there, because at a certain point they just think
wain a ton of games. The Notre Dame Miami thing
is interesting, But if you're going to keep Notre Dame
above Miami last week and Miami destroys Pitt, a team
that Notre Dame also destroyed, it's not a clear vaulting
data point for Miami necessarily.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
No, and with SMU losing that doesn't help the quality
of the loss, doesn't help the quality of the loss.
I just like part of this is just me being
a nervous fan.

Speaker 1 (48:31):
I are you.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
I think, if you're looking at it logically, the time
to move Notre Dame more on the outside looking in.
I mean, they were always going to be in this
playoff conversation until the very end. But if they wanted
to bump Notre Dame down another rung, the time to
do that would have been last week after Alabama loss. Now,
with Alabama winning over Auburn and the Iron Bowl, maybe

(48:53):
that will give the playoff committee another opportunity to do that.
I'm curious to see what happens if Alabama were to
go and beat Georgia again. What would that mean for
Notre Dame. So I just I think they're in very
uncertain territory. There's a reason as a fan, and I
am saying this only as a fan, not as somebody
who does this show. The reason that I was rooting
against Oklahoma was because Oklahoma losing would have kicked them

(49:16):
out of the way. It would have given Notre Dame
a little bit more breathing room to get them on
I think more stable ground. But as it stands right now,
I'm not fully convinced that Notre Dame is a sure
thing to get in there.

Speaker 1 (49:28):
But on what grounds? At this point? I understand the
grounds if you like Miami over Notre Dame. Like, right,
they played Miami one. The case against Notre Dame, yeah,
I think you make that case two three weeks ago,
but like they both throttled Stanford, right they did. They
both throttled Stanford, so you have even data points there.

(49:50):
I said this to you earlier. The broader case against
Notre Dame is not a crazy one, right that they
played essentially three teams of compar talent and with comparable
goals in USC, Texas A and m and Miami, and
they lost to two of them. And I think we
afford Notre Dame less leeway because they're in more control

(50:11):
of their schedule than others, and so you really have
to lock in on how they do against the best
teams in the most comparable teams, and Notre Dame does
not have a favorable case there. The case against Miami
is they haven't taken care of business against the sort
of upper middle part of their schedule, like Notre Dame
has and so if you talk about control since those

(50:34):
early losses, you should afford everybody an opportunity to improve
over the course of a season and sort of plant
a flag that they're not who they were earlier on
the best of Miami is as good as most teams
in this country, let alone playoff, right that, Like, they're
just better. You know, they're playing like a top eight
or nine team for sure at their best. The problem
therein is just like they had control over those SMU

(51:00):
Louisville games, they quite literally threw those games away. And
those are not excellent teams. Those are not good teams.
And so the case against Miami is a win in
August is not the same as a win in October
and November. So I still think I would have Notre
Dame over Miami because they've shown themselves to be in

(51:21):
more control against their schedule. They've been able to control
what they can control in a way that Miami hasn't
been able to in the last six seven weeks.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
Yeah, and so.

Speaker 1 (51:31):
That's the case. But I don't have a strong argument
against Miami in the playoff because to my eyes, they're
very clearly of playoff caliber.

Speaker 2 (51:39):
Like I would like to see Miami in the playoff.
I wouldn't like to see them in the playoff at
the expense of Notre Dame. But I believe Miami is
one of the twelve best teams in the country, and
I don't think that's that hot of a take, right
I mean, I would take Miami over a bunch of
these teams right now. Yeah, I just don't know if
it's gonna happen for them. We're gonna They're probably gonna
need some help. They certainly need YU to lose. They

(52:01):
probably need a change of heart from the playoff committee.
I think they'd need BYU to lose forty two to seven. Again,
they would need BYU definitely to lose their game. I'm
just not sure how much wiggle room there is in
front of them at this point. Like if Alabama goes
into a game against Georgia and they lose by twenty points,

(52:21):
that could be grounds of kick Alabama out. But I
think that's what they would need. They would need a
loss by BYU. They would probably need a resounding loss
by Alabama to give them some way to go up
the standing. Certainly Ohio State and Indiana are going to
go anywhere, right, you know, Georgia at this point I
think is pretty squarely in this field. There's just not

(52:44):
that much else that could go on that would vault
them into that top ten, which again is where you
need to get at least right now because of two
teams coming from outside with whoever is going to win
the G five rep that spot and whoever's going to
win the ACC. The ACC thing is extremely interesting too,
and we haven't really talked about this, but because of

(53:05):
what went down on Saturday, the game is going to
be Virginia against Duke. Duke right now is seven and five.
They are not ranked, they probably won't be ranked. If
Duke were to pull the upset and knock off Virginia.
There is a very real possibility that there's going to
be no rep from the ACC, that we're going to
have an American winner, and then either James Madison or

(53:28):
UNLV potentially from the Mountain West, worm their way into
this playoff field. That would be something else. I mean,
that would be a conversation probably its own show episode.
But if you are looking at this, I think objectively,
at this point, there is a very real possibility that
the ACC could be left out completely if somehow, you know,

(53:50):
Duke wins and Miami can't find a way to jump up.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
Yeah, and you know what, this is all your fault,
my fault, not your fault. No, this is all your fault.
Like teams who had the ability and have shown the
ability to look like a top twelve team. You know,
it's an acc tiebreaker situation obviously, but it's not like
Miami or whoever else you know is in the top

(54:12):
twenty that feels like they should be jumping higher. I mean,
I think we can both agree that like Texas, no thanks,
I'm just a no thanks on Texas, Like, congratulations on
your win. It's a nice way to finish out the season,
but you had it's it's Texas's own fault. They're not here.
And I might even like, you know, kudos Texas for
you know, booking that Ohio State home and home. Don't

(54:34):
lose to you know, a four and eight Florida team,
like even in their wins, like did you come away
from the Kentucky game, the Mississippi State game, the fourth
quarter of the Vanderbilt win, like did you come away
like be'st a playoff team right there? That's a playoff
team right there? I mean I think did I think
Texas is evolution.

Speaker 2 (54:54):
The second half the season has been a really nice
story and arch Manning has definitely grown. I would not
put them in the playoff. No, I don't think they're
a playoff team. I think there are more deserving teams
in front of them that should go in their place. Now.
If all hell would have broken loose last week and
we had a bunch of teams fall out of contention,
then that's a conversation. That's a separate conversation. Sure, But

(55:16):
as it stands right now, there are far too many
really good, two lost teams that I think should go
before Texas.

Speaker 1 (55:25):
But in two of their last three weeks they got
to play playoff caliber teams. They beat a Texas A
and M team that is legitimately very good, and they
lost by twenty five after a bye week against the
other one. I don't know, man Texas in control to
see how well they can control and compete, and just
thanks for an entertaining season. You're not of this caliber,

(55:45):
is my opinion. And if Duke got in, or if
Duke won the ACC and doesn't get in, like I
don't know, it just kind of funny to me.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
Sorry, is there a case for somebody like a Vandy
to jump up?

Speaker 1 (55:58):
I think he'll see. I think Vandy has a good case. Look,
but Vandy lost the head to head to Texas. I get.
But Texas again has that third loss, and Vandy does
not have a loss like Texas does, and again it's
a great loss. Texas had to Ohio State. Texas has
what a couple top ten wins. Vanderbilt was not in
the is not in the top ten at the moment.

(56:20):
But Vanderbilt, with what they've done against their schedule and
the defenses they faced and how the offense has been
this year, I think they're of top twelve caliber. Now,
you have to look at the teams that are considered
to be ranked on a certain level, like Missoo and
Tennessee haven't beaten a team with a winning record, right, No,
And they're like floating around being ranked or are like
twenty four to twenty five, and so like that's doing
a lot of work for some of these teams. So

(56:42):
I just prefer to look at like how they've performed
against who they've played, And Vanderbilt has been very impressive,
and so i'd hold them in highest team and wish
we could see Diego pave in this playoff, though it
seems like that's kind of a long shot. Dan, Before
we go any further, before we close the book on

(57:03):
this episode, of course, we invite over bowlers to chime
in on this playoff conversation. Celibbgemail dot com, hit us
up on social media. We would love to hear from
me anywhere. You can leave a comment. All that stuff
helps even if you disagree, as they say, don't be
a dick, but you're more than welcome to disagree with
us and offer your thoughts. We do read everything.

Speaker 2 (57:20):
Yes, I did want to do a little bit of celebration.
Uh oh, we don't have the rights, type, we.

Speaker 1 (57:27):
Don't have the rights.

Speaker 2 (57:28):
I cut it off at two seconds. We're good, Okay.
Some teams that had really fun stories this year that
maybe get lost in the shuffle. The fact that we're
talking about coaches coming and going, we're talking about college
football playoffs. There is a whole other universe out there,
one hundred and twenty four other teams that played FBS
college football, and I pulled out a nice little collection

(57:50):
of teams that I think deserve a little bit more conversation,
if only because they took an enormous jump in some way,
shape or form from twenty four to twenty twenty five,
and in pretty much all of these cases, neither you
nor I saw it coming.

Speaker 1 (58:06):
Yeah, are you ready? I'm ready? North Texas unbelievable. North
Texas lost his coach now to Oklahoma State.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
We didn't even mention that. I guess we mentioned that
in passing. There's reporting to suggest that Drew Mestamaker may
follow Eric Morris up to Oklahoma State.

Speaker 1 (58:26):
Maybe Caleb Hawkins.

Speaker 2 (58:27):
Yeah, six and seven. Last year, they improved to the
number one overall S and P plus offense. This season,
you know how to score points drastically, drastically better on defense.
They're going to play for a conference championship this weekend
against Tulane.

Speaker 1 (58:49):
Yep, how about the game?

Speaker 2 (58:51):
How about the Virginia Cavaliers.

Speaker 1 (58:55):
Did the portal right, went heavy on defense, didn't play
a big schedule, took advantage.

Speaker 2 (59:01):
Five and seven last season to ten and two this year,
a five game leap for Tony Elliot. By the way,
this is a very pivotal year for Tony Elliott. Now,
if it didn't work, if it was five and seven. Again,
it is a pretty good chance they're looking for a
coach right now.

Speaker 1 (59:15):
Oh by the way, sidebar, if you're a Virginia administrator,
do not consider any prospective coach if their name is
not Tony. After the success this year of Tony Elliott,
in previous success of Tony Bennett, and that could be
a lady with Tony with an eye or you know,
dude coaching Tony continue.

Speaker 2 (59:35):
Drastic improvements on both sides of the ball. They finished
with the top twenty five defense.

Speaker 1 (59:39):
Yes they did.

Speaker 2 (59:41):
This one is fairly obvious. Texas Tech. Texas Tech was
eight and five a year ago, or a fine team
a year ago. Yep, took a jump this year. Number
three overall in the sp plus, number two on offense,
number four on defense. That is up from number fifty
four overall, with the number twenty six offense and the

(01:00:02):
number ninety five defense. This is per the sp plus.

Speaker 1 (01:00:06):
If you listen recording, If you listen to Texas Tech
fans and you asked them, hey, what changed, they will
say nothing, nothing change.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
We've had some interactions with the text Joey Maguire's culture
finally taken hold. Can I ask a question about that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
It is an unbelievable season. Texas Texas defense, especially upfront,
a joy to watch this.

Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
Let me ask a question about this. I think we've
addressed this that nothing changed at various points throughout the year. Yeah,
Why did Texas Tech fans view it as some sort
of pejorative when we mentioned the fact that they spent
in the portal and they used that infusion of talent
to make the team better. Why do people view that
as some sort of slight I think it makes Yeah,

(01:00:51):
I gotta say every other team in college football is
trying the same thing, and very few of them have
been a successful like. If anything, I think that is
a compliment that you targeted guys that you thought you
could bring in ad depth. Again, none of it was
really that sexy, but they knew they needed help in
their defensive front seven. Just as an example, they went
out they hired shield Wood away from Houston to bring

(01:01:12):
him over on the defense. I mean, they made some
really smart moves with how they attacked the transfer portal
and how they hired you know, in this case, just
one assistant coach. When we say these things, we're not
saying it as if it is like some cover for
a program that is in shambles, and they just got lucky.
This was a very targeted build in the offseason. They

(01:01:35):
used their money wisely. The guys that they brought over
in large part have hit and have been very impactful
as part of this playoff runt. So I don't understand
why the Texas Tech fans have decided to chime in
with some sort of hate as a result of us
saying this. I think it's a great thing, and I
mean it as a compliment. They were good at this

(01:01:57):
when many of their peers simply were not full stop.

Speaker 1 (01:02:01):
I can't speak for Texas Tech fans, but I imagine their
viewpoint is, yes, but there are other things just beyond Sure, there.

Speaker 2 (01:02:10):
Are always other things, Dan well, they're paying always other things.

Speaker 1 (01:02:13):
They're paying shield would with a scholarship and experience, right
job experience, and not paying them with money. Sure, no,
I get it. It makes you feel cheap, right if
somebody is just like you're just buying wins, It does
make you feel cheap.

Speaker 2 (01:02:27):
Cheap. Now, the whole thing is cheap. Everything is cheap.
Get used to it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
I know. I imagine there is sensitivity because it there
is an implication that it devalues what they're able to
accomplish on the field.

Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
I'm not saying get over it, get over it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:45):
I agree, because you know what, the winds taste better
if you go to the final four.

Speaker 2 (01:02:50):
Yeah, after having like the ninety fifth best defense a
year ago, and it took some spend and some money
from Goate Campbell to get you there, who gives a
fly in f.

Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
Yeah, I agree. I happen to agreece again, they haven't
finished ranked. This is the first year they've they're going
to finish ranked in the A people since like two
thousand and nine.

Speaker 2 (01:03:13):
Nice are out of your minds. I take it in
a heartbeat.

Speaker 1 (01:03:17):
Well, I also think it is like just how publicly
it all seemed to go down with go T Campbell,
right that he's in commercials and you know, he's making
a big deal of the whole thing, and he's on
Twitter or x the everything app everything, And I don't know,
you're just going to get more attention from it because

(01:03:37):
of how well it worked, And so I just imagine
Texas tech fans don't want the only spotlight to be
on the portal. But also, you know what they've done
on offense, what Baron Morton has accomplished in his growth
like that, Joey maguire has largely been pretty good and
has won big games before a Texas Tech, and he's
just doing more of it this season. But like it's

(01:03:59):
just it is, you know, a good part of the story.

Speaker 2 (01:04:02):
It's a huge part of the story. They got big.
This was not the only reason they got better. It
wasn't It was not the only reason they got better.
But they were smart with how they attacked the portal.
It made them better very quickly in a way that
in previous years it would have taken years to get
to this point. High school recruiting and pounding the pavement
and you know, you have a pass to cut the

(01:04:25):
line now if you're smart about it. And they were
smart about it and it worked, and good for them.
I'm rooting for them.

Speaker 1 (01:04:30):
Also, the conference got easier. Hey, there's a little bit
Kennesaw State Dan, Yeah, two and ten a.

Speaker 2 (01:04:37):
Year ago they are playing for a conference championship. Yeah,
they d a little bit from two and ten to
nine and three. They got rid of the old coach.
They brought over Jerry Mack, who I seem to remember
saying in the preseason that I liked a lot. They're
over under was three and a half three and a
half going into the year. They eclipsed that total far

(01:05:00):
and away, finishing with nine wins. So whether or not
they win the conferences beside the point. This is a
huge jump in a really good season for Kennesaw and
I believe just their second year at the FBS level.
So kudos to them. Man, what a jump.

Speaker 1 (01:05:14):
Yeah, maybe perhaps the Owl of the year.

Speaker 2 (01:05:16):
It could be the Owl of there. Yeah. Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (01:05:18):
They did just lose to Jacksonville State, who they're playing
once again back on the road, going to Alabama. But yeah,
it should be a good game. It should be a
nice back and forth. These they are not two perfect teams.

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
They are not two perfect teams. Kennesaw is only a
point and a half underdog on the road at Jacksonville State,
so Vegas Jesus is a very close game. Another two
and ten team a year ago was Mississippi State. They
jumped up the five and seven. You can look at five
and seven, you can say, yeh, I'm not going to
bowl whatever. This is a Mississippi State team that was
in a lot of games, not all of their games,

(01:05:49):
but they were feisty. Yep, every game that I watched
in Mississippi State, even if they were losing by twenty,
they were playing whistle to whistle. And they took a
big jump up, especially on offense. We started see a
little bit of that Jeff Levee offense that Jeff Leby
influence working its magic. Saw a big jump up on offense.
It helped that they had blake shape and healthy, obviously,

(01:06:09):
but I was a big fan of what they built
Atssissippi State this year, and I hope it continues. They're
always going to have a bit of an uphill climb
in the SEC that goes for everybody, but I think
there are positive results based on what we saw so
far this year.

Speaker 1 (01:06:23):
Yes, So on offense, Mississippi State jumped up from where
they were last season, which is what you just mentioned.
And on defense they it was a more dramatic leap
up because they were pretty catastrophically bad on defense at
twenty twenty four. They made a really nice move which
is why they were more competitive in those you know,
Tennessee overtime game, Texas overtime game. They beat the Big Twelve,

(01:06:46):
the defending Big Twelve champs, early on in the season. Yeah,
so it wasn't the most competitive egg Bowl, but all
the same, a really nice jump from year one to
year two for Jeff Levy Vanderbilt.

Speaker 2 (01:07:00):
Yeah, Man, Vandy was the story of the year a
year ago twenty twenty four for beating Alabama Daego Pavia
coming over from New Mexico State, Right, I mean that
was that captured the imagination of all the college football
hipsters and then what did they do? The conversation in
the preseason about Vanderbilt was as well, can they get

(01:07:21):
you know, I mean, look at the schedule. Schedules could
be harder, Expectations are going to be a little bit higher.
There's no way they can surpass what they did a
year ago. That might be the high water mark. We
just talked about Vandy about being a fringe playoff team. Man,
they are good. They are a ten and two team. Again,
we saw big jumps on both sides of the ball.
They're over under to the point was just five and

(01:07:41):
a half. So there was a lot of skepticism about
the Vanderbilt commodors this here, but I don't know what
the season is going to bring them. The rest of
the way. I don't know if they're going to find
some way into the playoff. If nothing more, they're going
to be in a nice bowl game, and Diego Pavia
probably goes to New York. But I don't see how
in any universe we can't celebrate what Vandy did this season.

Speaker 1 (01:08:04):
Yeah, oh, just a terrific year for Vanderbilt. We've celebrated
Diego Pavia, We've celebrated this offense and at times, you know,
the defense. There were down moments for the defense, but
certainly one that kept them in enough games to get
them to double digit win. Vanderbilt, let me.

Speaker 2 (01:08:20):
Give you three, please, power four teams, and then I'm
going to give you four group of five teams. Five
group of five teams, and I want you to react
to these and tell me who jumps out to most.

Speaker 1 (01:08:31):
Of you, please.

Speaker 2 (01:08:32):
Arizona went from four and eight to nine and three.
M Houston also went from four and eight to nine
and three, and wake Forest went from four and eight
to eight and four.

Speaker 1 (01:08:44):
Yeah, throw all your money at defensive players in the
portal as many bites out of the defensive apple. If
you're going to look at those improvements specifically, Arizona jumped
up huge and also that was you know the development
of play already there, but they reinforced with depth and
just they added a ton there. They made a big

(01:09:04):
new defensive coordinator higher and Danny Gonzalez wake Forest. Obviously,
Jake Dickart's background is on defense that at times, you know,
maybe not the Florida State game, but at times looked
like a really formidable defense at least for a year one,
given where they were, I think that's the lesson there, man, like,
if you need to get better quickly, even you know,
Mississippi State threw a lot at defense. Yeah they were.

(01:09:25):
I believe Misssippi State ended the season as the SEC's
most improved defense.

Speaker 2 (01:09:29):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:09:31):
So yeah, that's what I think.

Speaker 2 (01:09:33):
Defense wins championships as it goes. Yep, we had Old
Dominion taking a jump from five to seven to nine
and three big jumps on both sides of the ball.
They finished the year or winning five games. New Mexico
You're beautiful, beautiful Lobos they were five and seven, also
took ad jump up to nine and three. They were
involved in that four way tiebreaker in the Mountain West,

(01:09:55):
but Man did not make it in which is a
bummer for you.

Speaker 1 (01:09:59):
Thanks to Bill ko Only's sp plus playing a role
even though they just I think UNLV lost to both
of the teams that they played in this tiebreaker, but
ended up because who was the emperor in a ingladiator
as a commedists commedists, Yeah, doing the thumbs up thumbs
down thing, Bill Connolly thumbs down on the lowbos apparently.

Speaker 2 (01:10:18):
Oh well. San Diego State also took a pretty big
jump three and nine to nine and three. They finished
number one in the country on special teams.

Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
In addition hidden yards they finished number three in the
number three in the country between behind Ohio State and
Texas Tech. I shouldn't they finished going into the final
week of the season. The numbers haven't updated yet, but
they will finish as like a top six or seven
defense nationally. Crazy against FBS team's defensive scoring efficiency.

Speaker 2 (01:10:49):
Yeah, how about Missouri State going seven and five in
their first season of FBS. It's great, really strong and
last but not least we mentioned it earlier James Madison
James made since eight and four years ago. A year ago.
They finished the year regular season anyway at eleven and one.
Of course they did so well, they're going to lose
their coach to UCLA. But they do have a game

(01:11:11):
this week playing for the Sun Belt Championship against Detroy Trojans.
I believe they're about a twenty one point favorite something
in that neighborhood Dan. Should they win, there would be
an opportunity for them to go to the playoff, maybe
depending on how things shake out otherwise, especially in that
acc game with Duke. If Duke were to win, that
I think would open up the floodgates for JMU. Or

(01:11:33):
if the committee when they released their next batch of rankings,
they have seemed to favor the whoever wins out of
the American But if they have a change of heart
they decide that they want to put JMU, give them
a little bit of love. Maybe we could be talking
about something else.

Speaker 1 (01:11:47):
So we're basically saying the Dukes are counting on Duke.
That's right, the Dukes are counting on Duke and JMU.
I assumed they're just going to hire Lee Highst coach
right path Hi with Kevin Cahill, Come down, Come on down.

Speaker 2 (01:12:02):
Those are the teams that impress me very very quickly,
and then we're going to let these people go early
for special Here is what your schedule looks like with
regard to all of the conference championship games this weekend.
We will preview these in a little bit more detail
on our next episode. We've got four games on Friday,

(01:12:23):
We've got five games on Saturday. The games on Friday
are all G five games. We've got the Conference USA
Championship Kennesaw State at Jacksonville State, which we mentioned. We've
got the Sun Belt Championship at seven pm on Friday
night between Troy and JMU. We've got the American Championship
at eight pm on ABC between North Texas and Tulane,

(01:12:44):
a big stage for these teams, both of whom have
lost their coach to bigger schools. Right now, Tulane favored
by about three points. And then to close things out
on Friday night, this is an eight pm or on Fox.
It is UNLV at Boise State. UNLV is currently a
three and a half point underdog Dan Rubinstein.

Speaker 1 (01:13:05):
It's actually going to be a pretty terrific weekend.

Speaker 2 (01:13:08):
And then on Saturday, we've got BYU at Texas Tech.
That one's at noon. We've also got the MAC Championship.
That's the only G five game that's going to be
played on Saturday, also at noon, Miami Ohio at Western
Michigan defensive slugfest, by the way, No, indeed. Then to
round out the weekend, we've got Georgia a point and
a half favorite against Alabama, and the SEC game, we've

(01:13:31):
got Duke about a field goal underdog scoring off against Virginia.
They play that one in Charlotte. And then the Big One,
Number one versus Number two, the only two unbeaten teams
in FBS college football. It's going to be number one
Ohio State about a six point favorite squaring off against
Indiana in Indianapolis. Dan, So maybe a little bit of
a home crowd situation for Indiana.

Speaker 1 (01:13:52):
That's true, I would assume so. But you know Ohio
State travels.

Speaker 2 (01:13:56):
They do travel. I like a lot of scarlet and
gray out there.

Speaker 1 (01:13:59):
Speaking of Bill Connolly, I liked that he called the
Big Ten championship game potentially a practice shot for Indiana.
I don't know if you saw that. Just like, look,
it's gonna be a tough one. It's it's an uphill
battle to take down Ohio State. No matter who you are.
This this year's version of Ohio State, it seems. But

(01:14:21):
you get to see something if you're gonna play him
ahead of time, if you're gonna play him in the
in the weeks to come, that maybe you can adjust
to so tough to beat anybody twice if you're dealing
with two quality teams, and there's at least that.

Speaker 2 (01:14:34):
It's gonna be a very active weekend, to say the least,
we would encourage everybody to make sure that they tune
in at midnight. We will go live after that pairing
of games, after we figure out who wins the seen
the Big Ten, and we will recap everything. We are
still putting together our schedule for Sunday. So in the past,

(01:14:54):
what we have done is we have gone live at
some point after they announced the playoff rankings, and you know,
we've put together a show based on what the field
looks like, what the pathways look like, etc. Etc. But
last year was surely our first bite at that apple
trying to figure out how to dissect all of this.
I think we're a little bit smarter now, so we're
gonna put planes together. We'll announce those on Thursday for

(01:15:15):
what you can expect from us this weekend, But we
want to make sure we stay on top of not
only the Conference championship games. But once we know what
that field of twelve looks like, we'll be here to
make sure that you're up to date.

Speaker 1 (01:15:27):
My only parting message here. If you're listening from either
the Coke Kyomega or I guess Delta Gamma House on
the LSU campus, keep an eye on your dms right
mind the dms you never know.

Speaker 2 (01:15:41):
You never know, You just never never know what it's gonna
pop up in there. Now, for that guy over there,
my good friend Dan Rubinstein, for myself, Tie Hilderbrand, thanks
for downloading, for listening, for sporting what we do. Check
us out at for bowlers dot com. In the meantime,
you know the drill has always stay solid.

Speaker 1 (01:15:56):
Peace,

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