Portal Talk with ESPN's Max Olson - College Football Podcast for 1/30 - The Solid Verbal College Football

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the solid verbal coll that for me, I'm
a man.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
I'm for I've heard so many players say, well, I
want to be happy. You want to be happy for
Dake Edo Steak.

Speaker 1 (00:13):
Is that woo woom?

Speaker 2 (00:14):
And them and Tie.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
Danner vers see.

Speaker 1 (00:19):
Let's talk transfer portal, shall we?

Speaker 2 (00:21):
Are you replacing me? Um? Is somebody transferring in? I
will neither confirm nor it's not.

Speaker 3 (00:31):
It's okay.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
I will neither confirm nor deny whether there have been
discussions behind the scenes on that front.

Speaker 2 (00:37):
We're having Max Olson on the show. You're a huge
portal guy, not necessarily like if this is the best
possible thing for the sport kind of guy. You are
a portal guy in that you love a little bit
of touch, a splash of chaos in the off season. Yes,
I adore the transfer portal. No, I don't think it's

(01:00):
it's necessarily the best thing for the sport, right. I'm
not saying I'm a cheerleader for it, but yes, given
what we do, given what I'm interested in, I prefer
a little bit intrigue here in the offseason, during the
season in some cases. And yeah, I think it's been
a real shot of life It's given us something else

(01:20):
to pay attention to.

Speaker 1 (01:21):
And sure, I'm a fan. I fall what Max says
Pete nakos oudead on three, like, there are a lot
of really good people that are working this beat and
I am reading everything they have to say with regard
to the portal.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Okay, what is your fate? Do you have a favorite part?
Is it like the major player surprise? Is it a
school all of a sudden finding seventeen and a half
million dollars in the couch cushions. Is it a roster
being decimated because a coach left and you're like, oh
my god, it's like an expansion draft in college football

(01:56):
now that everybody is looking at Alabama players now that
Nick Saban has left. Is it the idea a juicy
tampering story, Yes, what is it? Yes to all of
the above, Yes, all the above. I mean obviously the
surprise player. Yeah, the surprise player goes without saying, we
have those every site. Carson Beck was I think.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
Both times a surprise player, a that he would go
into the draft with the injury that he sustained in
the playoff and then or at the end of the
season excuse me, and then of course, with his decision
to kind of come out, pull his name from the draft,
decide he's going to go to Miami, where he's obviously
got some connections, and get a ton of money. We
don't even know what he's going to look like throwing
the football this year, but the surprise stories for sure

(02:38):
are a big one for me. I am hopeful that
at some point I want to ask Max a couple
questions about this. I'm hopeful that at some point we
will start getting dumb money stories. I love a good
dumb money story with respect to professional sports yea, and
teams just going out and offering crazy contracts for players

(02:58):
that it doesn't seem are worthy of that dollar figure.
We haven't quite gotten there yet because a lot of
this stuff happens behind the scenes. But I eagerly await
the days when we find out, oh, so and so
spent what on that player? Why would they do then?
Where was the return? What was their assumed return on
investment there? I am eagerly awaiting stories like that, which

(03:20):
I think will come to us in relatively short order. Here.

Speaker 2 (03:24):
Well, I mean, you've watched have you watched a Notre
Dame Penn State like roster and said, Okay, this guy
transferred in. I assume he's going to get some snaps at,
you know, right tackle or safety, and then a year
or two later you're like, he just never played.

Speaker 1 (03:39):
Julian Fleming had a couple big catches and mostly was
a blocker here for Penn State, and he was one
of the big gets last portal cycles. So yeah, I'm
I'm looking at this constantly and wondering what is the
hit rate on these guys? How much can we assume
from a production standpoint, how much is safe to assume
based on what we've seen go on l s where

(04:01):
it really is a big shrug. To be honest with you,
it's a big old shrug. And I think that's what
makes it interesting. As I suspect we'll hear from Max.
I want to talk to him about guardrails and structure
and where is this thing going next. I don't know
if anybody knows the answer to any of those questions,
and in the absence of true hard facts, we have

(04:22):
a lot of innuendo and assumption, and that's what makes
it interesting to me. I don't know what was the name.

Speaker 2 (04:27):
I'm going to google this as I'm as I'm talking
to you, Do you remember so there was like Willy
Wonka had like that agent, right, Willy Wonka had the
agent on the streets, right, making sure I'm gonna get
this absolutely.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
Right, like the smut peddlers in Vegas.

Speaker 3 (04:41):
Right.

Speaker 2 (04:41):
Yeah, but I'm saying, but the point of the Willy
Wonka one was to like investigate the people getting the
golden tickets. Sure, I just want to know if any
school has a particularly good secret agent behind the scenes. Oh, like, okay,
I got youa investigating making sure this investment is going

(05:03):
to work for the collective whatever. Like I just want
a really juicy story about like after they retire, Like, oh, yeah,
they had a fixer. Not a fixer, I guess, but
they had a guy who has just had eyes everywhere
and was making sure that you know, their portal decisions
were worthwhile.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
I tell you who'd be up for that, right, who
Connor Stallions with a fake mustache is one thousand for that.

Speaker 2 (05:27):
Role and has vacuums if you're interested, has vacuums lightly
used vacuums? He does, You're interested? Yeah, I'm I'm interested
by all of the mechanics of this shady as they
may be, so yeah, I the portal stuff is kind
of a bummer more than it's not to me, because
I still love the idea, like of some emotional attachment

(05:51):
to players that commit to your school and contribute and
are fun.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
I want to talk to Max a little bit about
because Ma's been covering college football for a long time.
He's one of the finest reporters that are out there
in the public sphere. Go and read everything he has
to say at ESPN. But I do want to talk
to him about has this had a depressing effect on
his fandom or has it made him more skeptical or

(06:18):
cynical with how he covers and just watches the sport.
You know, we've been doing this for a long time,
and I would say, even though we both love it,
there is some element of like the emotional appeal of
college football that over the course of time comes out
in the watch a little bit just from constant exposure
to it. You add something like this in your faith

(06:41):
in retaining players and building a roster from within, and
the old school romanticism I think that we used to
have with the sport. A lot of that's gone away.
I want to know what effect that's had on Max.
I have to imagine it has affected him more than
it's affected almost you know anybody fair enough. We're going
to talk to Max Olsen here in a moment. Yes,

(07:02):
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(07:24):
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Speaker 2 (07:41):
You get access to Ty Hildenbrand up close and personal.

Speaker 1 (07:45):
Help support independent podcasting ventures that apparently are not worthy
enough to go to the national champions apparently per the
College Football Playoff and the suits over there. Thank you
so much for giving us something we can use in
our intro without further ado, shall we get to Max.
Let's do it all right, Dan, We wanted to do

(08:05):
this episode a couple weeks ago. I think we caught
Max right in the middle of the busy season, which
was poor timing on our behalf. Yes, we're making it happen. Now,
let's talk the portal with our good friend from ESPN,
Max Alson. Max. Welcome back.

Speaker 3 (08:20):
Hey guys, thank you for having me back. You caught
me at a good time. Now that portal is finally
settled down and I'm no longer deluged with two thousand
young men trying to pick school.

Speaker 1 (08:32):
Has it settled down? It feels like the portal is
just constantly going, is it? Like? What does your portal
off season, if that's what we're in right now, look
like until we get to the spring window.

Speaker 3 (08:44):
I think we've hit the portal off season when I
don't think I'll have to look at my phone over
the course of this podcast and see breaking news happened
and say, oh shit. So I think nonether, we're past
that phase, hopefully. I mean, grad tr answers can still
go in between now and April, so that could still
pop every now and then but yeah, for the most part,

(09:06):
the top guys are all off the board, they're all
enrolling in school, and now I feel like the dust
has kind of settled, kind of kind of finally talk
competently about the winners and losers and all that.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
When does the busy season pick up for you? Because
like for us, we're covering the games. Obviously, that moment
in December hits a million names go in the portal,
that's when we start talking about it. But you're reporting
on this, So how soon into the season, how late
into the season? What is the timetable for you when
you start picking up these crumbs and piecing together who's

(09:40):
going to go in, who's not going to go in,
who's going to get the big money offers, et cetera,
et cetera.

Speaker 3 (09:46):
It's a good question because I think this stuff is
starting earlier and earlier, and really throughout the month of November,
you're having conversations on a daily basis with people either
who work on the personnel side gms and DPPs, or
this year certainly talking to a lot more agents, and
just their involvement in the cycle certainly stood out. But yeah,

(10:08):
I think a month before the portal opened, I tried
to kind of like do a preview of like, hey,
here's what it's going to look like. And even at
that time, when you talk to personnel people who were
looking for quarterbacks, for example, they were already talking at
the end of October about we want John Mattier, we
want Darien Mensa, we want for naaman Joza. We hope
these guys go in the portal. You know, we're talking

(10:28):
to the representation, We're trying to figure out who's going
to be out there, because I think nowadays, you know,
for these recruiting departments, they spend the whole season doing
advanced scouting of their opponent's rosters and trying to figure out, okay,
we need a tight end next year. Who are all
the tight ends that are going to have eligibility remaining,
and what kind of money should we be throwing at them.
I mean, it's just a daily conversation now for these departments.

(10:52):
It's not just sort of like all right, December nights here,
wait and see, we'll see who pops up, and let's
try and call them as soon as we can. The
fact that you can now I would just talk directly
to agents and the agents are telling these schools like
I'm going to represent these guys. We think they're probably
going in the portal? How much would you pay them?
Like that's what it is now. It's a lot of
conversations well before that name shows up, and then certainly

(11:14):
when it hits that first week in December, you know,
it's like over a thousand names just popping up every minute,
and so it's yeah, pretty relentless.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
Is it now?

Speaker 3 (11:24):
Fair?

Speaker 2 (11:25):
And I don't know when like that moment is where
a guy goes from being a question mark to legitimately good.
If a player is legitimately good at a school that
is not considered to be a power conference power is
the likelihood almost past fifty percent that they're entering when

(11:47):
it's clear whether it's early October, mid October you mentioned
the name John Mattier and Darien Mensa where it's just
like I remember looking at just quarterback stats in the
middle of October, late October, like, oh, these guys are
among like the best dozen quarterbacks in terms of pass
efficiency against you know, different strengths of schedule, but like
it doesn't seem viable for any of those places. And

(12:08):
I say that, and it sounds like I'm being derisive,
but that's not my intention to keep a legit star?

Speaker 3 (12:13):
Is that?

Speaker 2 (12:14):
Is it past fifty percent? Sixty percent?

Speaker 1 (12:16):
What is?

Speaker 2 (12:17):
Where is your like assumption needle when somebody proves to
be like, oh, this guy's legit.

Speaker 3 (12:22):
Yeah, I think that that's that's just how it is now.
I think that these personel departments they're all using PFF
so they all see when guys rise up in terms
of like the national position ratings and stuff like that,
and they are breaking down film as early as possible
in these guys. I've talked to some players that like
left G five schools when in the portal of this

(12:42):
offseason who are like, yeah, coaches started following me on
Twitter during the season. That kind of tells you that
they know who I am and there's some intrigu there,
but they can't reach out directly and say, you know, hey,
come to Oregon. It's it's more of that kind of
that distanced flirting until those guys get agents or you
find out who their agent is. And yeah, I think
that that's just like I think in this cycle, you

(13:04):
kind of can't talk about it without just talking about
the money first, because that's just how this one played out.
And as we transition into rev Share, when you talk
to gms that were sort of planning for this portal cycle,
they'd say, Man, we're you know, we're playing to have
fourteen million or fifteen million bucks for the roster for
next season some school, you know, like if you're like

(13:24):
the Big twelve in the ACC, you're like, man, we're
hoping to get to ten to fourteen, Like we're hoping
to get somewhere in that range. Think for the Big
ten and SEC schools it was kind of automatic. And
when you talk to the gms at you know, G
five schools, they're like, man, I'd love to get a
million that it'd be great. You can put together a
million bucks or two million bucks and hopefully our wide

(13:45):
receiver we can throw fifty thousand dollars at him. If
he goes into portal, he's going to get offered five
hundred thousand dollars. So it's just it just doesn't make
sense for these kids, unfortunately, to kind of stay put.
I mean, and that you can't really fault at this point,
Like it's not about loyalty and stuff like that. It's
like they're just not even close in terms of the
offers they're going to get on the open market. Now,

(14:06):
it doesn't mean that that's always going to be the
best move for them. Sometimes guys should stay put and
keep producing and you're gonna get invited to the Combine
and all that, like, you can stay on that path
to the NFL. But right now, I just think there's
so much pressure on these players at G five or
at kind of lower level P five schools of like, okay,
you did it, you produced, Now you need to go

(14:27):
cash it.

Speaker 2 (14:28):
If a GM, if a coach finds out about a
player entering the portal via either having the open Portal
document or whatever spreadsheet or finding out on social media,
is it already too late?

Speaker 3 (14:43):
Increasingly? Yes, yeah, okay, that's I think that. I mean,
there's there's certainly still an element of let's evaluate who's
out there and you know, kind of try to find
the neil in the haystack. And you know, certainly there
are a ton of FCS players that go in the
portal and end up you know, over one hundred of
them are going to move on to schools this offseason,
So there's still an evaluation piece that has to happen

(15:06):
after the portal entry happens. But yeah, I think a
lot of cases it's we got a deal done to
get him in the portal. And a lot of times too,
it's like, oh, they're gonna go take this official visit
to this school. Okay, Well, they've already discussed the terms
of what the deal is going to be before that
kid showed up on campus, and the visit is just
sort of like, all right, let's confirm I'm happy with

(15:27):
this situation. But a lot of times, you know, you're
not seeing these guys take five visits and hold a
hat ceremony anymore. Right, It's it's pretty quick and easy
for these players. And you know, when Carson Beck go's
in the portal, he knows where he's going, and then
that thing could be done in forty eight hours, Right,
So I think that a lot of cases, Yeah, that
that the conversation, and you know, you could call it tampering,

(15:51):
but they don't really have to tamper anymore because you
can just deal with a third party and say, hey,
we're interested in this guy, we have a spotform, here's
how much we could pay him, and that that information
gets back to the player and certainly influences if they're
going to go in.

Speaker 2 (16:04):
The portal, who are this year's Maybe he will, maybe
he won't. Obviously Carson beck situation was unique because of
his injury, because obviously his draft stocks seem to have
taken a hit this year with some underwhelming performances, or
maybe George's overall offense was underwhelming. Who were the like
fifty to fifty, Like this is a late decision. This

(16:25):
wasn't a like, oh, he was pretty sure he was
going to enter in early November or something like that.
Who were those like, oh, didn't see this coming, But
because of how the last one, two, three, four weeks
ended up, he's in. Who are some of those names?

Speaker 3 (16:40):
I mean, it's hard to think of one that's like
as prominent as Beck. I think. I think for Carson
Beck really just identical to cam Morden went a year
ago in a lot of ways of I mean, you
were hearing rumors before the Pop Tarts Bowl, you were
starting to hear people kind of connect the dots and say, like,
Miami hasn't taken one. He's got the obviously get like

(17:02):
the Cavender connection to Miami, Like girl, we sure with
the elbow injury, like, are we sure he's gonna go pro?
And Carson Beck kind of dispelled that by declaring for
the draft, but I think we know that that's that
you put that out there, but that doesn't fully close
the door anymore. And so you know, I think for
him the move makes a lot of sense. I'm sure

(17:25):
you guys have broken it down already, but like you know,
when you can't like you when you don't know how
much you're gonna be able to go through the draft process,
like how do you guarantee you're gonna be QB three
in this draft? So I think the upside there is
is crazy. I think in like, especially with the quarterback
market in November, you would hear a lot of names
of of you know, players that the schools were interested in.

(17:49):
You know, you you heard some buzz around guys like
Dylan Royola or Avery Johnson, which is a little bit
more of like there's interest in them, are they going
to go in the portal and they weren't, right?

Speaker 2 (17:59):
And how much is that sort of floating for leverage
from like their own camp?

Speaker 1 (18:04):
For sure?

Speaker 3 (18:04):
For sure, I mean that's that's always a possibility between
the agents and reps and families and stuff of like
maybe they want the name out there a little bit
and they kind of want to see what they can make.
I don't think those guys were ever like that close
to going into the portal. You know, Kyra and Drones
of Virginia Tech, they're able to resign him. You kind
of heard sympathized from him to Miami early on that
that was not the move for him. I think in

(18:26):
a lot of cases, especially like like Big twelve is
the league that has a lot of quarterbacks returning this year,
and those schools like they were not gonna let those
guys hit the portal, and so you know, they were
able to lock them up for deals that kind of
range between one million and one point five. I mean,
that's just kind of the price of retaining your starter
and keeping them out of the portal. And I'm not

(18:46):
saying there's like a ton of position players that are
going to kind of touch that money to keep them
out of the portal, but they certainly the retention piece.
And these schools knowing we have more money to deal
with and we could deal directly with the athlete. I
think that definitely influenced let's have these conversations really early
and not just kind of wait and see what happens
on the window opens.

Speaker 1 (19:06):
Max. The big rumor was eight million dollars for quinn
Ewers to stay in school and maybe transfer elsewhere. Is
there any validities Max Olsen money? By the way, Yeah,
that's Max Olsen money. Is there any validity to that?
Can you share the team? What do you know about
that whole circumstance.

Speaker 3 (19:25):
I have I have no doubt that Miami probably investigated
the quinn Ewers situation while they were also investigating the
Carson Back situation and at least trying to find out, Hey,
what would it take. I don't think from Quinn Youwr's side,
there was any flirting, there was any Let me think
about this. I think Quin Yours maybe this is an

(19:45):
underrated thing nowadays because so many guys are extending their eligibility.
Quentin Yours is ready to go pro. I think he
was ready to be done playing college football. He was
ready to be done to Texas, you know, I think he.
I think when they won that game against Arizona State,
you could tell that there was just a sense of
relief for him of like, Okay, I've you know, I've
I've achieved a lot here, Like I'm proud of my
legacy here. You know, I think to to to you know,

(20:08):
win a big tall title to get them to the
SEC championship. Like, I don't think there was a part
of Queen years that was like, let's let's see what
happens here if I throw my name out there. And
then obviously they're in the middle of the playoff roum too.
So I don't think there was ever a time when
it was like leaning towards queenere is going to be
back in college football if he were to come back, Like, yeah,

(20:28):
I probably don't think he'd be at Texas, right, I
mean I think that that that's there was a clear
succession playing there that that everybody has been sort of
working on that you thought was for going to be
for a year and it ended up being for two years.
So Queen Yours could have made a ton of money.
I don't think that he was really looking to uh
to stay in college and I and I imagine with

(20:49):
the way this draft is shaking out, I would imagine
he feels like he does have a chance to be
the third quarterback taken and maybe play his way into
the first round. Obviously, last few years has been a
lot of guys that go into the draft that that
you surprised you in terms of them becoming first rounders.
So I would think he'll be a top fifty pick,
and I imagine that he's pretty content with the way
that all played out.

Speaker 1 (21:09):
Okay, I will accept that answer. I do have another
question kind of along the same lines though. You know,
so much of the reporting with respect to transfer portal
news is about teams going out after other teams players,
but there is now almost a cottage industry related to
recruiting your own players. We've heard numerous coaches talk about

(21:30):
this that is ever important to just keep your roster intact.
To what degree does this aspect of it affect your
love for college football right, because there is I think
a bit of cynicism now that comes with where we're
at in the sport, with this constant push pull of

(21:51):
needing to recruit other guys to come in and make the
roster better at the same time not losing what you have.
What do coaches say to you, what do personnel guys
say to you about that whole process and how it
affects their love for the sport as well.

Speaker 3 (22:08):
You know, I think this is like it's an exciting
beat to cover, and there's when things are going on
in December, it is pretty fast paced and action packed
and all that stuff, and it can seem exciting. Sometimes
you do have to take a step back in my
role and be like, wait, do people like this that
this is going on?

Speaker 2 (22:27):
Who is this for?

Speaker 3 (22:28):
Do people buy jerseys and what do they do with
those jerseys? Now? Like I mean, it's like, I definitely understand,
especially when you've had just like decades of people obsessively
covering and following recruiting and being like, all right, this
guy's gonna be here for four years. I'm like, you know,
when they're junior senior, you're like, we're gonna go with
a nation championship and all that stuff. Like when you

(22:49):
have kind of that that belief that you're going to
have long term investment in a player and then it's
all just year to year now, Like, I definitely understand that.
For Assertion, I've received a bunch of phone calls in
December and January from DPPs and gms who are venting
about things that they are dealing with. And that's not

(23:10):
just I mean they know that that, like everybody else
is dealing with it too.

Speaker 2 (23:15):
What are they dealing with specifically?

Speaker 3 (23:17):
I mean, you've got I think this was an off
season where I don't know that the fans would maybe
necessarily fully understand this yet, but where it is more
pro style in the sense of, like, Okay, we've got
three running backs. I don't know if we can afford
to bring back all three running backs next year. We'd
love to. We like them, but we're going to prioritize

(23:39):
resigning this guy. And then our number two running back
is going to be able to make more money if
he goes somewhere else, So we're not pushing him out,
but we're not going to offer him as much as
he could make on the market. And hopefully he stays,
but he's probably not going to stay. Like I think
there's just more of that, just the kind of cap
management dynamics are way more in play now. It's not

(24:00):
kind of just impulsive spending. I think everybody's trying to
figure out, like how to make this work under a
twenty you know, the fourteen to fifteen million under the
twenty point five, under a deal that hasn't even really
officially been approved yet, So I think there's a lot
of like moving parts to that piece. I think there's
also just on the on the staff side, you know,

(24:20):
you are dealing with even at the contenders, even at
the playoff teams who are like, look, our guys are
going to stay because they want to become starters and
they want to become early draft picks and all that
kind of stuff. I think they kind of feel like
they're experiencing price gouging even just for like for their backups.
And they're young guys of like, Okay, yeah, this guy,

(24:43):
you know, red shirt of this year, he's a retro freshman.
This year, he played a little bit, he's going to
have a good role next year. So why is his
agent calling me and saying we got to get him
to four hundred to six hundred, Like what are we
doing here? I think there's just a lot of like
because there's one hundred and thirty four schools out there there, uh,
and there's sixty other you know, or seven of the
other power for schools that theoretically could offer your guy

(25:06):
more money, they're constantly going to be asked to pay
them more. And so I think back the competitive nature
of that it's, uh, there's there's definitely some some challenges
that come with that. And then, like you know, you
even talk to Lin Kiffin and some of the guys
that are very good at this, I think there's still
a lot of frustration about like why are there two
free agency periods? Why are we doing this again in

(25:28):
the spring. I feel like I'm just getting this guy
for six months and then we're going to go through
this mess all over again in April. And so someday
will there will there be When we say deals will
we mean these are deals that keep them on campus
for multiple years. Like you can put that in writing
now with your your conference deals. You're doing them and stuff.
But I think people still understand we're gonna have more

(25:51):
headaches again in the spring.

Speaker 1 (25:53):
You mentioned the headaches some perfect segue for me because
again from Afar, we're not working the portal. Beat back
from Afar, it feels like there are no guardrails on
this thing whatsoever. You know, as Dan often mansions on
the show, scaffolding on top of scaffolding, not just for
college football, but certainly for the transfer portal. Is that
an accurate depiction of this thing? Have there been guardrails

(26:16):
built over the last couple of years to maybe keep
this thing a little bit more curtailed. Is that not
the case? Like, how would you represent this to people
who aren't as in the weeds as you.

Speaker 3 (26:29):
I think that Like the way that the game is
played now with transfer recruiting is very different than it
was like two or three years ago. And I think
a big piece of that is just there is presently
no fear of enforcement. I mean, the SLA is straight
up they had to pause all of it. They just
they you know, yeah, we would love to look into

(26:51):
third party involvement in transfer recruiting and pay for play recruiting,
and less of they cannot. I mean, they just straight
up cannot. And so in the past, you were you know,
you had to be careful and you had to you know,
have collectives pop up as kind of that intermediary to
have the conversations and work out the financial element of it.

(27:12):
That's not the case now. Right right now it is
We're gonna do whatever we want and we're not going
to really live in fear of get of anybody cracking
down on this. And so when you talk to players
and just like what their portal experience was. It's now like, yeah,
this head coach texted me and said, we will give
you seven hundred thousand dollars, and then this you know,

(27:34):
assistant coach texted me and said we will give you
nine hundred thousand dollars and a Lamborghini and all this sudden.
It's just straight up like like the money comes first
now and then. And I'm not saying that the player
doesn't automatically go to the school that offered the most money.
I mean there's still an element of fit and role

(27:54):
and can I see myself being successful here and all that,
but I mean they're there's no there's no fear of
the police catching you speeding anymore, and so you can
have these dealings directly with the agent and you know
it now. It's just I'm not saying this is the
case for every player, because some players are not worth

(28:16):
this kind of action, but like for the top guys
out there, it's just it's just kind of a straight
up bidding war now. And you talk to some gms
that are doing this now when you know that's the case. Now,
Like if you get the guy on campus for the
official visit, I think you're you're going to approach this
from Look, we're not going to let you go in
to any other official visit. It's like, what is it
going to take to get this done? And we are

(28:37):
going to, you know, make you an offer you can't
refuse to get this thing. Need to get you signed now.
And so I think that's that's kind of the increases
the pressure of like, if you've got a chance to
get somebody, you're going to pay whatever it takes to
get them. And so yeah, it's just it's more competitive
than ever before because there's more money dumped into the
market than ever before, and there's not really any rules

(28:58):
that people are trying to tiptoe around now know about
about this being anything other than you know, just straight
up pay for play.

Speaker 1 (29:05):
By the way, am I the only one of us
three who was still uncomfortable using the term GM as
much as we've been using it for college football, Like,
I'm still getting used to this. It used to be
a pro thiing, now it's now it's here.

Speaker 2 (29:16):
Some schools don't even like USC just hired a GM
just right.

Speaker 1 (29:20):
Yeah, everybody has to get in this game now. I'm
still getting caught.

Speaker 3 (29:22):
Up, It's true, and I think that talking to some
of them. I think part of it is that they
are the person who is directly dealing with the wild,
interesting world of agents. I think that part of it
is just like, hey, let's let's have them be the contact.
We don't want the head coach to be fielding those forward.

Speaker 1 (29:41):
Which sounds like the worst job in the world.

Speaker 3 (29:42):
By the way, well, I mean you could see why
the guys out there who are doing at the highest level,
like Courtney Morgan in Alabama and Brandon Harrison Texas, James
Lashter tex Tech, the salary and the price for those
guys is going up because you know, and you mentioned
Chad going to USC like those guys do a lot,
and and part of that is the classic, you know,

(30:04):
old school direct recruiting. And part of that is is
running an increasingly complicated operation, especially now that you are
shifting some of the collective responsibility in terms of managing
the money over to the personnel department and the head
coach and so. But you can't just do this by
the seat of your pants and just uh, oh, I
want this guy, I don't care, let's pay him, like

(30:25):
you have to have some uh some element of responsibility
to it. And so yeah, I think that the GM role.
You know, this is easy to say as you see
these guys, their their salary go up, like those guys
probably should be making coordinator money and not tight ends
coach money. I mean, it's a it's a it's a
very involved and a complex job.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Nowadays, when you look at the portal team rankings from
whatever site you want to choose, it seems to be
like it's kind of the usual suspects. It's those schools who,
like you mentioned, like they're not going to let a
perspective poor guy get off campus without a deal. It's Miami,
It's Oregon, LSU, Ohio States up there, Alabama. There is

(31:06):
one school I think in whatever top five, top ten
that and this happens every year. There's a school that's like, oh,
let's let's find a bunch of money this year. We
feel good. That school this year is Texas Tech. Texas
Tech coming off of a an okay season, a pretty
good year. They did beat i think both teams that
played in the Big Twelve championship game. So there's that
level of encouragement going into twenty twenty five. But they

(31:30):
haven't recruited like this in the portal before to this degree,
what's behind this the Lubbock surge this season.

Speaker 3 (31:40):
So Texas Tech is trying to do an old miss
but they're trying to do it in the Big twelve
where they think that you have a higher chance of
that paying off because I think if you do the
all in show that Ole missed it a year ago.
Like they built probably one of the best d lines
in the country, right they Serena Jackson dart with playmakers

(32:00):
and a veteran off it's the line and everything the challenges.
You still go line up with LSU, and you go
line up with Georgia and all these schools and you're like, Okay,
now we've like caught up to them, but we're not
like far superior to them when we when we line
up at them. And so Texas Tech is sort of
trying to replicate that, but in a Big twelve where
you feel like if we're the only school that's really
spending a lot of money, we feel like we're going

(32:23):
to be in the Big Tal Championship. And so this
is an all in schep for them. They like what
they have coming back, they like Darren Morton, they want
they won eight games this year and made some good progress.
But you know, I think that there is Texas Tech
has never been to a big tal championship game. They
have they have not won an outright conference championship at
their school since Mateen fifty five. So I mean there

(32:44):
is a lot of hunger for like we got to
put this together. There's a lot of belief in Joey McGuire,
but they it's time to like take that next step.
And so you know, Cody Campbell, they're they're a billionaire
guy that runs their collective. Their big donor looked at
this and that there's an opportunity with the rev share coming,
you know, starting in July, where from July on there's

(33:09):
a cap and there where this is going to be
tracked and there's gonna be you know, more county in
this stuff. Right, So let's go make a big spend
for the spring and do front loaded deals so that
we can kind of outspend our competition and and get
these guys in on on deals that pay you pretty
pretty real money from now through June. And they went

(33:29):
out and they built their border who they wanted, and
they went out and got like the top guy on
their board, like kind of across the board. I mean,
they got Howard Sampson from North Carolina, who people view
as like a potential early round pick at tackle. They
really rebuilt their offensive line. Reggie Virgil from Miami Ohio,
Quentin Joiner the running back from USC one of the

(33:50):
best tight ends in the country, Turns Carter from Louisiana,
Leehunter the defense tackle from UCF. Like, these are not
household names. These are not you know, all Americans, uh,
but these are guys that have real NFL potential and
can be all Big twelve caliber players. And they're able
to go out and get old. And so you know,
they spent more than ten million dollars on their portal

(34:13):
class and I have a story on this cost coming
out on Friday. It's a lot of money. So in
this day and age, that's still a lot of money,
and it's a real all inch of that they believe,
you know, they think they've got the most talented roster
in the Big twelve now and that they should be
in the playoff next year. So you're certainly setting extremely
high expectations in Lubbock that this team's going to be

(34:34):
a real factor.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
There are a few different types of players that enter
the portal that will get fans excited. You've got your
proven guys who have produced and developed and, as you mentioned,
have NFL potential. There are guys who were former blue
chip recruits who for whatever reason didn't mesh with the team.
But you can still right or wrong talk yourself into

(34:56):
the potential because like, hey, they were so highly thought
of coming out of high school and maybe they just
got buried on a depth chart at this big place.
Sometimes there are guys who are just sort of toolsy
and measurables, guys that like, oh, he's huge, he's going
to be an anchor on our defensive line, but like
hasn't done anything, hasn't produced anything, and hasn't been like
a true game changer. And then there's the small school

(35:16):
guys who are like, look at all this production at Youngstown, State,
at Rhode Island or whatever. They you know, caught two
thousand yards worth of passes last year, but it was
against whatever.

Speaker 3 (35:26):
The CIA.

Speaker 2 (35:29):
Who has a class this year that is the most
in terms of rock solid, Like these are dudes who
have proven themselves, have produced, and like this team is
getting like proven quality more so than other classes at
or near the top.

Speaker 3 (35:47):
Yeah, I would say the one that stands out like so,
like we did, we did a ranking of the top
seventy five players in the transportal during the cycle. LSU
has got a lot of guys that are high on
that list. I think LSU did a really impressive job.
And you know, a year ago, you know, they brought
in Austin Thomas and they they kind of rebuilt their

(36:07):
recruiting staff a little bit, but they that that was
they did not in replacing Jane Daniels and Lick Neighbors
and Brent Thomas, all the guys of Oustitay. I thought
they didn't really make a big shove in terms of
of of portal pickups they did this year. I think
that I think that they knew if Derek Nessmuyer coming back,
Harold Perkin's coming back, you know, and and obviously just
a season that was not up to their standards for sure,

(36:28):
and you could see the frustration from Brian Kelly throughout
the year that they they were going to to go
all in with this uh this cycle. So you know,
some really impressive wins. I think Barrion Brown and and
Nick Anderson at wide receiver two of the best out there.
I think obviously Baron Brown, we've seen these one of
the fast receivers in the country and a true all
purpose playmaker. You know, Nick Anderson missed miss time, missed

(36:52):
the season with injury basically, but but as one of
the freakier wide receivers out there. I think they did
a really good job on the offensive line. I think
they did a really good job at dB and they
added a lot to the deal on it too. And
so like it's hard to like Texas Tech did a
really press the job. I think you could definitely still
make a pretty sorry argument els you had the number
one portal class just in terms of like these were

(37:13):
proven players that they were competing with a lot of
other people for and there's there's star players, and there's
also depth to it too. So like I think that's
the one. I'm not saying that automatically, you know, catapults
LSU into their playoff team, but that's certainly their ambition.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
Are there any schools that you take and say, like, Okay,
this is a lesson in how to do the portal
over these last couple of years, and this is a
lesson in how to not do the portal, that team's
built in a way that actually haven't helped that team's roster,
and that team's like the next one two three years
of the program and teams where they're just like, oh,

(37:51):
they figured out where to spend money, they figured out
the types of players they wanted, and the results have
been there. Who are like your your role models and
your cautionary tales in terms of portal activity.

Speaker 3 (38:04):
Well, I mean when everyone's just you know, you talk
to they just point to Florida State is the cautionary
tale now, which is crazy because a year ago you
would say the King. I mean, who's who's done it
better than Mike Norvel in terms of the player, you know,
the Jared Versus of the world that they were able
to go find and develop, and Kean Coleman and just
all the NFL studs that they had. But I think

(38:26):
what what they went through last year. You know, if
you if you if you need all those guys to
hit and they don't, then you're kind of like you're
kind of shot out of luck. I mean, that's just
kind of how it is nowadays because you kind of
if you go heavy on portal every year, your backups
are going to transfer out and then whoever's left is like, Okay,

(38:47):
are they good enough to like maintain us playing at
an ACC contender level? In that case, last year it
wasn't obviously you miss a quarterback and that that that
makes it so much tougher. But I think that that
was kind of a challenge across the board. There weren't
a lot of spots at Forest State where you'd say
they're they're playing at a you know, all ACC level.
So that's the casting of tail. But I think they
did a good job again this year in terms of

(39:09):
who they you know, what they're bringing in and again
we'll see a quarterback if Thomas Castlanas can be everything
they helped. But solid job in terms of you had
to you had to go back to the portal and
replace these guys that you just kind of get on
that that hamster wheel of like we have to do
this again next year. I think in terms of like
the ones that really impress you, Arizona State is one

(39:30):
that just nobody talked about when they were getting the
guys and then two years later you're like, whoa they
the batting average on on whaton what? Kenny Dillingham and
his staff did going into their first year, where like
we talked to Kenny Dillingham about what that was like.
It's like we had to recruit a huge portal class
just to feel the team for twenty twenty three because

(39:52):
they and then as you go through the season and
you get decimated by injuries, like you have no chance
of contending. But certainly nobody was talking about out Cam
Skataboo when he went in the portal coming out of
Sacramento State, and I'm sure there's a ton of teams
that would throw away more money at him now and
knowing what they know now, but they were able to recruit.
You know, you looked at the editor at the time

(40:14):
and say, Okay, they're just taking like a lot of
depth guys and maybe there's not a bunch of star
stars coming in here, but they knew like, we're going
to take guys that have multiple years of eligibility and
we're going to develop them and we're going to set
a culture with them. And just the number of guys
that they brought in via the portal who were starting
for them during that playoff run is crazy. And then
again a year ago, Sam Levitt was not on the

(40:37):
radar of like, here's one of the top twenty quarterbacks
who were in the Portal, right, I mean he didn't
have that much tape coming out of his one year
in Michigan State and being kind of in a three
man situation there, and I didn't know. It's still there's
a huge piece of this that is still relationships and
evaluation and having information that other people don't have. So

(40:59):
I think that that you have to look at Arizona
State and artily Kiddy Gillingham learned a lot from Mike
Thorvel in terms of how to recruit the Portal, but
they certainly, you know, struck gold in terms of the
way they approach it. As a team that did not have,
you know, millions and millions of dollars to invest, they
were able to kind of moneyball it. And you have
to dip your cap on it to that A.

Speaker 2 (41:21):
Position group that doesn't get I think a ton of attention,
and I think it's because you don't see a lot
of star power from this position group enter the Portal
is offensive line that teams, it seems from the outside,
can solidify a position. They can find a left guard
who is competent because there's a glaring hole there or something.

(41:42):
But in terms of star power in the sport, you
don't see huge left tackles, huge centers all that often.
It happens, but not super often. What is behind that?
And is this a position group that is like secretly
demanding more money because of the scarcity of potential star power?
It about the offensive line that it seems that like

(42:03):
you can't drastically improve in the way that you can
at receiver, at defensive line in the secondary, what is
it about the you know, what do we call them
the hog Molly's up front? What is it about that group?

Speaker 3 (42:15):
I think in a lot of cases, when you're recruiting
offensive lineman, you're just looking for solid like that. You know,
let's we want experience. Can we can we get a
guy that started twenty to thirty games whose size is
good enough? Maybe, especially if you're like, you know, trying
to get a guy to go from G five to
P four, like you're just hoping for good enough. I
think that's that's usually the case, and certainly from a

(42:37):
retention standpoint, those guys are worth a lot. When you
do have like a high potential offensive tackle hit the market,
those guys are worth a million dollars in the view
of GMS now. And I'm not saying that there's a
ton offensive linement out there that there me making that
kind of money, but the few that do hit the market,
I mean, the demand is crazy and you've got to
kind of you get your pick of school basically, and

(43:00):
so you know, I think one thing that you also
see now is like, and I think offensive line is
just a tough position to evaluate out of high school
to patiently develop, and I think there's maybe just not
a ton of patients anymore for that. You want to
just go get a guy that you know, hey, we
know he can play. Here's tape of him playing against
college guys. We love what he put on tape against

(43:21):
a good opponent, and so that that, you know, if
you've got size and a pulse and you've got you know,
a bunch of pff tape, then you know, jackpot. But
you know, I think that like it's just kind of
hard to go find a guy that's special. And I
think that where this is really kind of the personnel

(43:42):
departments that like want to compete at the highest level
for portal guys. What they're looking at are Okay, who
are the guys that would be like a sixth or
seventh rounder if they went pro, but they're going to
come back to college for another year. Like those those
guys are like what everybody is looking for. And you
might say, like, well that that didn't sound like very ambitious.
What don't you want like, you know, first round guys,

(44:03):
But like those guys just don't become available, so you're
you were looking for experience and some validation that the NFL,
like would draft this guy if a player kind of
checks those boxes. Yeah, they're worth a ton of money.

Speaker 1 (44:16):
Is anybody talking about return on investment? You know, not
to get all business y with this, but Ohio State
spent twenty million dollars on a portal roster or just
a roster in general. Now it wasn't a portal roster,
it was just in general, right, Yeah, certainly portal included
in that. But want a national championship, right, some would argue,
Some have argued that that's a deal. Some of these

(44:39):
dollar figures that you're throwing around, Max, it's a lot
of money for places that typically we haven't talked about
them spending Texas Tech spending however, much to compile their roster.
What is like the value proposition for some of these places.
Is there a goal of simply reaching the playoff winning
a championship to validate the spend. How do they view

(45:01):
this whole endeavor in terms of yes, it was worth it,
No it wasn't.

Speaker 3 (45:06):
I don't think it's ever crossed their mind. No, it's
a great question. I mean it really is, because, especially
like as you as this just drips further and further
into free agency and the price goes up. At some
point you have to be like, Okay, well we want
a defensive lineman, but here's how much we're willing to pay.
And and some you know, I think you saw, like
last spring there was a run on defensive tackles because

(45:28):
there was just a ton of teams that needed one.
And obviously, like as Dan can test like a Derek
Harmon worth a lot if you can get them. You know,
some of those guys made a massive potentially yeah yeahred percent,
and and those guys are like, you know, worth a lot.
But there's there's also some teams that like, well, yeah,
we need a defensive tackle, but like I'm not trying
to pay that kind of money, Like that's that's crazy

(45:50):
we can get by. I think that there's like, over
over time, like there's there's going to be more and
more people that get burned who just say like, Okay,
well that was regrettable. Maybe we'll maybe we'll rethink that
next time. But I think that once you get into
December and all these guys are out there for the taking,

(46:11):
it kind of just becomes like a competitive thing of
just like, Okay, well I want him, and I don't
want my team that I played in our conference to
have him, So let's get it done. And you know,
hopefully that works out or hopefully the guys behind them
compete with them and get a lot better. Now, there's
there's absolutely going to be cases where, wow, we spent

(46:33):
a ton of money on this guy, but then our.

Speaker 1 (46:36):
Retro freshman tackle was turned out.

Speaker 3 (46:38):
To be really good, and then we didn't really need
this guy, and that was like kind of a huge
waste of money. And you could say from in some
ways you say like, Okay, well that's better depth I
guess that's a good development, but yeah, there's gonna be
a ton of wasted money. And I think now that
we shift from this being on the books of the
collective and of you know, donors, you know, contributing to this.

(46:59):
And I think obviously we reached a point where there
was a lot of strain for them of just like,
this is a lot of money I'm having to spend
in addition to all the other money I'm dealing with
the school when you kind of shift that over to
the school. And if we actually are like getting into
a world where you know, deals over six hundred dollars
have to be reported and there's like potentially more transparency

(47:19):
of this stuff, I think you're going to find there's
a lot of overspending going on on players who you know,
did they actually start twelve games three this year or
did they not you know, not really play at the
level that you thought they would just based off the
tape you watch. I think that's still a guessing game
and a very expensive word from Afar.

Speaker 1 (47:39):
This is screaming for some kind of salary cap or
screaming for some sort of regulation that can keep this
thing in check. You talk to personnel people all the
time acts what what is it that they want this
portal to turn into, to maybe put some additional guardrails
up around it, or do they not want that some

(48:00):
places might not want that at all.

Speaker 3 (48:01):
I think right now everybody is just sort of trying
to keep up day to day with I mean like
in the middle of this portal cycle, all of a sudden,
Diego Pavia gets his injunction and now you just like
drop all these extra Juco players into the market. It's
sort of like everyone's just sort of trying to keep
up with the day to day of like will this
settlement be approved and we'll be we be ready for July.

(48:23):
And it's like there's just so much on these guys
plate that and there's I think there's obviously so much
frustration about you know, in action from the NCBLA or
the slow pace of you know, evolution, that you kind
of don't really spend as much time sitting around concocting
solutions to all this stuff. It's just sort of trying
to trying to survive and thrive. And so yeah, I

(48:44):
think that right now everybody is like just would like
to have more money. It's not that it's like fair,
it's not that we want to we don't really know
how to limit this stuff. And then also like when
you say, you know, the school is going to have
a cap of twenty point five million. I mean, people
look at that stuff and say, Okay, well that'll get
challenged into court and we're gonna probably strike that down

(49:06):
right or raise that or whatever. And so I think
that it's hard to it's hard to say like, Okay,
I definitely know how this is going to go next year,
because it's just it's just constantly changing and the fact
that you know, somebody can follow a lawsuit and then
that undows that rule like that, you know, and then
obviously you know that there's down the road we're gonna
have to have the conversation about collective bargaining and all
those things. Like I think in a lot of ways,

(49:29):
coaches probably would like to live in a world where
it is more like the NFL, where it is structure,
it is contracts for multiple years and players are required
to play that out and stuff like that. But we're
all just sort of living in the interim period of
we don't know how to set that up.

Speaker 2 (49:49):
We're a couple of weeks out from Valentine's Day, and
obviously we know it's not just about finding the best
it's about finding the best match. And so I want,
I'm a romantic tie, what can I say, of course,
I want you to know because we've seen great matches,
like the portal has been great for entertainment in a

(50:09):
number of instances where like, this player fits this kind
of system, ended up at this school. It's Michael Penni's
at Washington, It's Caleb Downs at Ohio State. Right, it's
star power entering the portal finding the place that fits
them really well in this year's class. And it doesn't
have to be like the top guys, but in terms
of guys who have transferred, who stands out as like

(50:29):
this player is this kind of player. He's going to
play for this coordinator or this head coach, And it
just seems so obvious that this is going to work.
On January twenty ninth, as we record this, who are
those matches where you're just like, oh, yeah, that makes sense.

Speaker 3 (50:45):
Well, I can I just guess you up here real quick? Dan? Sure?

Speaker 2 (50:48):
Please?

Speaker 3 (50:49):
I love what Orgon did in the Portal. Oh here
we go.

Speaker 2 (50:52):
Hold on, I'm gonna really so can we stop the recording?
I didn't even ask for team A player, but if
you want to go the whole Orgon class by all.

Speaker 3 (51:00):
Every single player, I'll break out of no, Yeah, I
think that there's still something to be said for quality
over quantity with this stuff because they're just you know,
there's so many teams out there that, man, we got
to take twenty this year, we gotta take twenty five.
We just lost twenty five guys off our to the portal,
so we've got to take a lot. Orgon did not
need to take a lot, but they took McKay Hughes

(51:20):
from Tulane, which is crazy. And I you know, certainly
when you look at the guys that I think he
was ninth or tenth in the in the country and
rushing and all the all the guys ahead of him
are going to the draft, so a real real case
to be made that he's the best returning running back
in the country or one of the best. And and
that just had adding that asset, uh for for Organ's

(51:43):
backfield is a big deal. And I and I love
what they picked up in in Dylan Pieinman too. It's
it's safety from Purdue. And I got some grief from
some personnel people who are like, you got that safety
from Purdue ranked a little bit too high. It's like,
I mean, yeah, but he's extremely productive He's a playmaker.
He he just he you know, was was the best

(52:06):
freshman in the Big Ten last year produe, probably the
best freshman defensive freshman in the country, and just a
really talented player who I think will make them a
lot better in terms of I'm gonna go down the
list here a little bit like plays. I think I'm
excited to see what Zachara Abranch can do a Georgia.
I think that that's a situation where they need the help.

(52:28):
I mean, a wide receiver. Was just a huge glaring
meed for going into this portal cycle, and you knew
they were gonna kind of recruit all these guys. And
I don't know why Zacharai Branch didn't have like a
crazy productive software year at USC, But that's just one
of those guys where it's like, Okay, you're going to
your junior year, they're gonna get you the ball of tons.
I would just just as you saw kind of with
etn and making his movie Georgia, It's like, I think

(52:50):
that's the guy that's like probably gonna be ready to
play his best football and have like a very high
usage role. I think you all again not not a
household name Indiana just continues to to kill it when
it comes to recruiting the portal. And you could say
a year ago, oh, well, they had all those James
Madison guys, so like that's easy and they probably got

(53:13):
those guys for cheap and all that. But like, I
think what Kurtz Signetti his staff did again this year
was really impressive and and to to you know, leverage
the momentum and the playoff appearance and all that. And
I think Forananda Mendoza is going to have a really
big year there. And I know that for those of
us who are like you know that no ball, You've
you've watched Nanda Mendoza cal you know that guy can

(53:34):
do some things. You watch the Miami game or you
watch the Sameford game this year and you saw him
play at a super high level or beat Auburn. But
I'm excited to see him like get a little bit
bigger platform. I think that's a really talented player and
leader who can who can really put it together this year.
Just as you know, again we weren't talking about Curtis
work a year ago, but one of the most impactful
transfers in the country. Let's see there's a lot there

(53:58):
was a lot of wide receiver movement in this cycle,
and I think those guys cashed in. I think that
another one that again not the biggest name. I'm really
interested to see what Eric Singleton does at Auburn. And
obviously you've got Kim Coln coming back, one of the
best young guys in the country, and they they made
their big move to get Jackson Old. This is a

(54:19):
big portal class for Auburn. They they really need to
hit on this group and be a contender in the
SEC this year for ke Freeze. But I think Eric
Simpleton is a guy that I had him riked this
the number one wide receiver because you talk to personnel people,
they've they view him as not the most like well
known name from his time at Georgia Tech, but a
guy that has, you know, one of the fastest players
in the country, a true like true track athlete who's

(54:41):
a chance to be a first round type of player
if he can really put it all together this year.
So excited to see what he can do. Yeah, we could,
we could. I could probably go down on this list
for hours, but well let's go.

Speaker 2 (54:52):
I mean, we can go the other direction. Though with
it not a negative direction, but like, are there players
that and aside from all of them that personnel people
or coaches are like, look, this guy didn't get a
ton of attention. This guy didn't play a ton of snaps.
But from what we saw, we're kind of giddy that
we got him for the price that we did. Like

(55:12):
we can't believe that, we can't believe, but like we
are extraordinarily thankful that we were able to get this
kind of under the radar guy, that they weren't just
feeling a roster hole that like maybe that coach recruited
that player, maybe you know there was some connection, but like,
are there any players where like you've heard specifically, We're
just like he's not a big name at all, but

(55:34):
we can't wait to get him in pads.

Speaker 3 (55:37):
There's a ton of guys making the move. I mean,
there's there wass a. It's a record setting year in
terms of G five players move up to P four.
It's more than three hundred and twenty of those guys
are transferring up and so I'm excited to see like
and then of course when they hit the portal, you know,
everybody acts like you know they're they're the greatest thing
ever because.

Speaker 2 (55:56):
Right, and they're just they're just they're all Khalil Mack. Right,
they're all like the G five star who's just ready
to explode.

Speaker 3 (56:02):
Yeah. Always, But I think there's a lot out there
that that that people are are pretty excited about. I
think a Mott Hardy running back from Louisium mon Roe.
He's going to Missouri. He was a freshman All American
this year. And you know, sometimes you get those guys
and it's just like, Yep, he shouldn't be playing at
this level. The guy's really good and he's moving up.

(56:23):
I think he'll have a chance to be really productive.
Chase so Well, the wide receiver from ECU, He's going
to Iowa State, and obviously they're replacing their top two guys.
I think that's it. Like a pretty sneaky one ethan
one On, Like I should mention Ohio State. Like Ohio State,
while they were busy going out and winning a national championship,
also got some of the best guys out there and

(56:43):
and there you know, there weren't a lot of qush
On Judkins Caleb Downs available in the cycle, but they
went out and got some of the best of their position.
I think Ethan Oneona from from Rice is an offensive
lineman who comes in and fills a big need for
Ohio State. Obviously, they got hit hard by injuries this
year and and and had to move guys around a bunch,
and I think that one is going to work out
for them. Zeck Poyser from Jacksonville State is going to Miami.

(57:06):
I think that's a really good young TB. I think
you saw just a big run on Washington State players
going to the portal, and I think just obviously those
guys aren't really G five players, but but then moving
on and then obviously Jake Dicker moving on to Wake Forest,
Like those guys are kind of spread out all over
the country. It's funny, that's just how it goes. Like
Washington State and Purdue, like all their players become available

(57:28):
and it's like these guys are incredible. It's like, okay, well,
I mean Purdue is pretty bad last year, but some
good pieces, you know, some good pieces that are that
are worth more. I think that's just kind of like
how the market goes. I think we're all excited to
see I'm sure you guys are buzzing about this too.
Mark Gronowski at Iowa. I mean, yeah, come on, South

(57:48):
Dakota State legend making them move up for his final
season of eligibility, has won multiple national championships at the
SCS level. It's it's a it's certainly an exciting time
if you're if you're looking for good quarterback play at Iowa.

Speaker 1 (58:04):
I got two left for you, Max, and then we'll
wrap again. Max Olsen from ESPN, I want to circle
back to something you said earlier. We were talking about
almost this disparity between the power conferences and the money
they're spending versus the G five and those teams and
what they have at their disposal. Is there a G
five team in particular that you think is handling circumstances

(58:27):
better than their peers given that disparity.

Speaker 3 (58:32):
Oh that's a really good question. Yeah, I think so
much of it is, like and you know, they all
they all deal with like Higatrician or the threat of hiattriction, right,
and they all in turn then have to go to
recruit the portal a ton and there's just really a
food chain to it of like all right, well let's
go get some some guys that are bouncing back from

(58:52):
power for schools. Let's go with guys that are that
are moving up from fcs, you know that, let's just
sort of try to string together good evaluations here. And
obviously these guys are coming in cheap. It's not really
about hey, we can give you this much money. I
think that there are there are definitely some AAC schools
that have some money. I think they're certainly you've seen that,

(59:15):
like Memphis is the NBA of a lot of these schools,
and just in terms of their their ability to spend.
You know, one that like is always interesting to watch
every year is North Texas just always loses their guys. Yeah,
and then they just go replace them and then the
next guys are really good too. I think Eric Morris
has done a really good job of that of just
like you know, it's it's tough. Like I talked to

(59:37):
him in the middle of the season about Chandler Morris
and kind of the resurgence that that he was having
after you know, Bumpy run in Oklahoma and TCU and
just kind of finally put it together. And and when
I talked to him, I talked to a GM before
I talked to him, who was like, oh, yeah, I
heard somebody who was already offering Chandler Morris like five
hundred thousand dollars, like, oh man. So just like in October,
it's like already, all right, we did it, see you,

(59:58):
you know, and uh, Chandler Morris did transfer to Virginia.
I'm not saying that Virginia gave him that kind of money,
but as soon as you strike gold there, it's like, okay, well,
we just got to expect this guy's balan. And so
North Texas put a lot of guys at Power four
schools this offseason, and I would trust that once again
he'll go out and replace them and find some guys
that are that can, you know, continue to produce. They

(01:00:20):
were i think one of the top five or ten
scoring offenses in the country this year, and I'm sure
he'll just plug in the next guy and just loaded that.
I think that's just kind of how you have That's
unfortunately how it goes. It's just like, hey, we love
these guys, we can't blame them for taking the money,
and we're just going to trust our evaluation and our
ability to go find the next one.

Speaker 2 (01:00:39):
It's it's almost like the NFL Draft with the huge
teams right, we have this many draft picks. It's G
five school saying we had this many transfers up to
major schools and made this much money. It's weird, but
it's a reality, Neil. Final question from me Max.

Speaker 1 (01:00:55):
On a scale of one to ten, mindful of the
fact that we've got the spring window coming up here,
One being let's say Jayden Rashott is in the portal
again not very surprising. Ten would be arch Manning is transferring. Okay,
this is different. What level of surprise should we expect,
if any, from this upcoming window? Are there any surprises

(01:01:18):
bubbling beneath the surface?

Speaker 3 (01:01:22):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:01:22):
Probably look at deep quarterback rooms. Ty, I think that's
the first place to look.

Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
Yeah, I remember I would go on the lower end there,
And I remember a year ago when you'd kind of
preview it sort of like, okay, we'll we'll Michigan go
out and get a quarterback. You know, they just kind
of move forward with this situation. Is that really the
best there? You know? Same with Auburn. Is Auburn gonna
bet a guy or do they like really believe in
Peyton Thorne that the quarterback market just didn't really materialize?

(01:01:50):
And I don't know if that's because everybody's kind of set,
and then the ones that aren't just sort of are
they kind of stubbornly sticking with what they got or yeah,
like ja were shot of winning the portal, but there weren't,
like there really weren't that many big names. I think,
you know, Dylan Edwards left Colorado of Case State. That
was a good move, Like I said, Derek Harmon and
the defensive tackles that made moves, those were impactful. But

(01:02:13):
you're not gonna see a lot of court me. I mean,
I think people like this time will probably be like, well,
North Carolina go get a quarterback, right, I don't know
who that guy would be. They they seem to have,
you know, especially with with Jacoby Chrismall moving on going
down to the FCS level, Definitely a lot of like
kind of unclear what that what's going on with their

(01:02:33):
quarterback situation. Max Johnson coming back from the lake injury.
Bryce Baker the freshman coming in probably will have a
chance to play right away. So like you'll see some
of those where you're sort of like, are they going
to do something? But other than yeah, maybe just kind
of teams shoring up those last means. I don't think
it's going to be crazy. And you know, when you
talk to some of these gems and we'll see if

(01:02:55):
this is true. I think this wishful take it on
their part a little bit. But I do think that
now that they're setting these deals up and putting this
in writing with these guys, you are trying to structure
it of like, Okay, well after the April portal window closes,
you will get this amount of money, and that's a
really good amount of money, So why would you go
in the portal? You you should stay that and stay

(01:03:16):
with us for the season. And so I think people
are going to be are are going to be a
little bit smarter about trying to structure this stuff to
discourage them we're going to the portal. But obviously last
year you saw Louisville lost several of their guys that
had just showed up back to the portal, including Tyler Barrett,
and so there will probably be you know, can Procter
going back to Alabama that was a big surprise. I

(01:03:36):
think you'll still kind of see some of those little
random stories because anything's possible, and you know, like even
the situation with with Oregon's cornerback going back to cal
after a couple of weeks, like those things can happen.
I mean, it's just it's never really totally over. And
you know, if if you have a need, you're gonna

(01:03:57):
again reach out and find out what it takes you
get the guy that makes you better. So I would
put the number it like more of a three or four,
but you never know.

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
So basically you're saying the spring is the scene in
Dumb and Dumber. So you're saying there's a chance that's
essentially what March seventeenth is in every single.

Speaker 3 (01:04:18):
I don't think Arch Manning and Djay Lenora sellers and
all those guys are trades ro and but yeah, I
you can't know, you can't say with any certainty that
everyone is content where they are. And you know, I
think that's again that's a frustration of these coaches of like, man,
I just I'd love to know who's on our team

(01:04:39):
next year. Can we get to a point where, like,
you know, can we make this easier on Phil Steele
and just kind of walk this in here.

Speaker 2 (01:04:46):
Poor Phil Steel he needs to go digital probably at
this point, because yeah, that is I mean if you're
talking about the big sufferers of the portal. One, it's
people who grow attached to good players on their teams,
especially if they root for G five or lower four teams.
And two it's people in print media producing things just
try and sell all summer in the spring. So good

(01:05:08):
point there, Max Olsen, ESPN. You've got a Texas Tech
feature about their portal activity coming out as we speak
later in the week. Yep, ESPN dot com. Max, thank
you very much for all of your time and hope
to have you back soon.

Speaker 3 (01:05:23):
Thika as always a pleasure.

Speaker 1 (01:05:24):
Appreciate it all right, Dan, That is Max Olsen from ESPN.
Please go and check out Max. Go and read his article.
As he said, dropping later in the week, talking about
all things Texas Tech and how they're building their roster.
As he was talking through all of these machinations of
the portal, I kept hearkening back to my very first

(01:05:46):
fantasy football league. Okay, my very first fantasy football league.
My friend CURTI set it up. We had no idea
what the scoring should be or could be, how we
would track it, and we changed it week to week
to the point where I think we got about five
weeks in and the ultimate players on every roster were kickers.

(01:06:08):
Everybody had like five kickers on their roster. Jason Elam
was on Monster back in the day. Yeah, and I
thought of that because it really does feel like we're
just making this whole thing up as we go along
with this with the transfer port of course, and that
definitely brings an element of intrigue. It's also very unsettling
that this is now kind of the bedrock for the
sport outside of the high school recruiting game, which is

(01:06:32):
probably less meaningful than it used to be. But this
year transfer portal and the ability to spend money and
bring guys in and constantly be recruiting other rosters as
well as your own. This is the game now. And
it's like you could see Max was shrugging with a
lot of the questions we asked him because he doesn't
know either, and he covers this thing every day. It's
incredible to me.

Speaker 2 (01:06:54):
I had the question in there about perfect matches that
were ahead of Valentine's Day, and it's not just about
being the best, it's about being the best match like
that this team runs this system and like, oh, of
course this is a true nose tackle. This is what
they need to run this three four or whatever. You
never dated online, right?

Speaker 3 (01:07:10):
I did?

Speaker 1 (01:07:11):
Not?

Speaker 2 (01:07:11):
I did, And it's quite the experience. And I'm sure
most of the people listening to this show at this point,
if they've been single relatively recently, have done. So there's
a lot of overlap between like Okay, well this person
seems super attractive, but I'm not sure like they're super
into that in their description, like maybe I could get

(01:07:34):
into that, like there is like there is that talking
yourself into like wow, it didn't work out at Eastern Michigan,
but I mean they run a four to three laser,
so I think I could see this working out for
us at Corner. And I just keep thinking about the
like the swipeization of everything, and there is that in

(01:07:54):
the portal a little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:07:55):
Oh, there is there is. It's kind of fascinating, absolutely,
and it does, I think support this conversation today supports
a little bit of what you got into with Bruce
on the last episode, which was the value of information.
Information is everything. Max talked about it with Kenny Dillingham

(01:08:17):
and by Hooker by Crook. They had really good insight
into Camp Scataboo. They had really good insight into sam Levitt.
These are players who clearly had an immediate impact on
that program. Sam Levitt will continue to have an impact
on that pro program moving forward. You hear stories often
about teams overvaluing certain players, maybe not having all the information,

(01:08:39):
maybe only seeing them a bit on tape before committing
to them. And then you hear stories about like the
one we just heard with Kenny Dillingham at Arizona State,
where it's clear they've got a good scouting department, they've
got insider information to some extent to know who to
go after. That is something I suspect we're going to
have to hear more about moving forward. As every Power program,

(01:09:02):
every G five program builds out its front office. This
is where we're at now. You're going to have to
have these guys that are working the streets and you know,
trench coats getting the Manila envelopes in dark corners, deep
aalleys finding out inside information on some of these guys
that they want to go after next. Because I this
is the game now. As I said at the top,

(01:09:22):
this is the game.

Speaker 2 (01:09:24):
Slug Worth is the Charlie and the Chocolate Factor.

Speaker 1 (01:09:26):
Slugworth.

Speaker 2 (01:09:27):
Okay, to make sure that the heir to the Willy
Wonka fortune in factory has a pure heart slug Worth.
Here's something else from the portal that I I've just
noticed and I think is interesting and actually like kind
of admirable as we know. And this is sort of
in light of the Ryan Day stuff with his family
and being harassed and stocked and hiring security and everything

(01:09:49):
that fans, especially on social media, are prone and sit
down for this tie to acting perhaps irrationally and unfortionally
about their sports. What right that?

Speaker 3 (01:09:59):
Like?

Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
How could this guy transfer?

Speaker 3 (01:10:01):
Like?

Speaker 2 (01:10:02):
Is there no loyalty these days?

Speaker 3 (01:10:04):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:10:05):
I one, I get and relate to all of it.
I'm not gonna I'm not putting down that fan at all,
because that's a really unfortunate part of the sport. But
the Portal era and you got to pay attention on
social media. You gotta pay attention if you're on message
boards or wherever people congregate to talk about this sport.
There is a new kind of fan that I've noticed

(01:10:25):
popping up, and it's the most arguably the most admirable
sports fan on Earth. And I'm going to tell you
who that fan is.

Speaker 1 (01:10:34):
Can I guess?

Speaker 3 (01:10:35):
Please?

Speaker 1 (01:10:36):
Is it the fan of a team whose player is leaving,
but they are grateful that the player was on the
team and they just want to tweet them and wish
them well.

Speaker 2 (01:10:45):
Almost, okay, almost, it's the fan. Let's say it's a
Texas fans. It's generally a fan of a team that
recruits really well and is pretty deep. Let's say it's
a Texas fan, a Florida fan who at Clemson fan,
an Alabama fan where a backup corner who couldn't quite

(01:11:05):
see the field after a couple of years, wasn't a
rotation guy. Maybe was a five star but for whatever
reason didn't make his way into the rotation has decided
to enter the portal. And let's say this former five
star Alabama corner ends up at you know, TCU at
Oklahoma State or something like that. And it's the fan
that says, you know what, have heard good things and

(01:11:28):
I think there's a lot there. Probably wasn't going to
see the field all that much here, Hope he thrives
at the new place, like fly high, young condor oh,
spread your wings, like hope it works out. Yeah, that's
sort of the like the like, yeah, this relationship isn't
where if you love something said it free like the
relationships run its course. But I hope she's doing well.

(01:11:50):
I hope she's happy. That's the kind of like the
well adjusted portal fan I think is who we should
all thrive to be. And I've seen that fan, you know,
lurking on the on the on the dark college football web.
But I appreciate that those people are out there.

Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
If we made a well adjusted portal fan T shirt,
would we sell any of them?

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
At least one? And it would be that the order
would be coming from inside the.

Speaker 1 (01:12:16):
House, and we would wear them on a show. We'd
put a patch on a hat. We'd be proud of it.
Nobody would buy.

Speaker 2 (01:12:24):
But I'm telling you, I'm if you look closely enough
at Notre Dame Penn State, who you pay close to
the most, I know exactly who you're talking about.

Speaker 1 (01:12:33):
I've seen that.

Speaker 2 (01:12:33):
You're like this former four star It just for whatever reason,
wasn't happening here. But good size, supposedly a good kid.
Hope he catches on somewhere and you know, with added
playing time, is able to realize his I saw a number.

Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
Of Penn Staters doing that exact thing with Bo Prabula.
Now The complication was the fact that he left during
the playoff and they absolutely could have used him in
spots as a change of pace. I mean, he was
a bigger part of the offense for a backup quarterback, right,
But that aside. Yes, plenty of Penn Staters bo Brabula

(01:13:11):
grew up in Pennsylvania, wanted to go to Penn State,
came to Penn State, had a I mean, it was
a winning quarterback at the high school level. People were
high on bou Pribuela, but it was clear there was
no path to immediate playing time. So people understood it, right,
And I've seen countless accounts out there talking about bo
brabuel wish him well, wasn't wasn't going to work out

(01:13:32):
in the immediate future for him.

Speaker 2 (01:13:33):
Was just a path there.

Speaker 1 (01:13:34):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, So we'll see, I don't know, maybe
come back. You can always come back at some point
if you really wants to do after next season. But
that fan does exist, rare as they may be.

Speaker 2 (01:13:44):
I love that fan. That fan's great as an asset
to our community.

Speaker 1 (01:13:48):
Tie, I love it. Well. Thank you again to Max
Olsen from ESPN for stopping on by imparting some of
his wisdom on us with respect to the transfer portal. Again,
if you made it this far, hit follow, hit subscribe, alright,
listen to us wherever you may be, whatever it is
you're doing. Fit us into your workout or to your
drive to grandmother's house, whatever it is. We'll be with

(01:14:10):
you this offseason.

Speaker 2 (01:14:11):
We'll get your steps in.

Speaker 1 (01:14:14):
Whatever you're into, whatever you're into, it doesn't matter.

Speaker 2 (01:14:17):
Great to listen to while you get your ten K.

Speaker 1 (01:14:19):
Absolutely great to have you with us here in this community.
We will be back next week talking more things college football.
If you do have suggestions for topics that we should
unpack a little bit more, you can always hit us
up Cliverble at gmail dot com, or or you can
go on out to Verballers dot com. We have a
ten dollars tier that we are going to use to

(01:14:41):
help guide us topically speaking this offseason. So we'll put
that like in terms of like creams and skin like
alo stuff, not that topical. No, no, we're not talking
about nothing like that. But we do want to rely
on our verballer hood to help guide our topic in
this offseason. So if you're interested in having a more

(01:15:03):
direct role, you can go out to for bawlers dot
com and check that out.

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
Yes, I think that's all I got. Dan, I gotta
go make some pizza dough.

Speaker 1 (01:15:11):
Yeah, thank you for taking over for me while it
was absent last episode. It was a bummer that I
missed that conversation with Bruce, but I enjoyed listening back
to it as a fan after the fact, I would
encourage everybody to go and do so as well, because
Bruce is super smart. One of our favorite guests that
we have on.

Speaker 2 (01:15:26):
He remembered your mother's maiden name Crazy because it was
on his caller ID when we used to connect via
your illegal phone coupler way back when. I don't know
if the Statute of Limitations is up on that title used.

Speaker 1 (01:15:38):
It's okay.

Speaker 2 (01:15:40):
It was it industrial military technology. It was something that
should not have been available to you.

Speaker 1 (01:15:45):
It was not no the the book on that was
it was. I bought it on eBay for forty five
dollars and it came with a disclaimer saying that if
you buy this, you can't talk about it because it
is not f CC approved, at least not in all states.
And whatever it was, I think it wasn't just the

(01:16:07):
is your state a two party state or not, which
is kind of its own thing. But it was like
the tech being used in this was not street legal,
and so you can buy it and I can sell
it to you, but you can't talk about it. And
now I have, so I've been.

Speaker 2 (01:16:20):
Out yea thi bot illegal Chinese technology. On that note, yeah,
thank you to one and all for downloading, for listening,
for supporting with Dan, and I do big thanks to
Max Olsen for his generous generous donation of an hour
plus talking all things Portal on today's episode.

Speaker 1 (01:16:39):
We will catch you all next week. In the meantime,
you know the drill, Stay solid, Peace,

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Portal Talk with ESPN's Max Olson - College Football Podcast for 1/30

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Portal Talk with ESPN's Max Olson - College Football Podcast for 1/30