Beating Breast Cancer at 30 ft. Shayna Angrist

Lisa’s lifelong friend Shayna, an avid TTL listener, shares her story of battling (and beating!) breast cancer after a diagnosis at age 30. 

 

Shayna spills: 

• The importance of advocating for yourself and knowing your body
• The surprising reason why losing her hair was one of the hardest parts 
• Her and her husband’s approach to keeping things “normal”
• How her identity shifted 

• How she handled telling her young children she was sick 
• What to do (and not do) to support a loved one going through cancer 
• and more!

 

Instagram:

The Truthiest Life on Instagram @thetruthiestlife

Host @lisahayim

 

To support TTL, subscribe, follow, or share episodes with family and friends! 

 

If you’re loving TTL, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts!

 

Edited by Houston Tilley

Intro Jingle by Alyssa Chase aka @findyoursails

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
I know Foye. Even when times getheart and you feel
you're in the dime cucy, just so beautiful laugh can
be when you soph in your heart, you can finally

(00:23):
star to your true see it's life. Hello, welcome back.
It's your host, Lisa Hame. And today is a special
episode because it's with one of my lifelong friends, Shana Angriss,
who was diagnosed with breast cancer and kicked its us.
And this episode is actually recorded in person, which is

(00:46):
such a treat because most of my episodes are recorded
over zoom and in person with Shana, given our long
term history, it was really cool to you know, see
her be vulnerable, tune into places where I could see
she was getting emotional, dive a little bit deep, kind
of recognizing that she felt safe enough to do so.
And it just really inspired me, reinspired me as to

(01:06):
why I started this podcast. I know, I get to
talk to awesome people who have been through hard things
and made it out the other side, and bringing these
conversations online to share the wisdom was my goal. And
this was just a reminder of how important it is
to connect with people about the hard things in their
life and learn from them and not be afraid to

(01:28):
shy away from questions because you think that they're necessarily
too personal. Obviously, doing that respectfully is key and a
fine art that I'm always refining. But you know everything
that I asked in this episode because of our unique
relationship and knowing her so well, I feel like I
learned so much how to support somebody going through breast

(01:49):
cancer or any sickness, how to advocate for myself in
health situations. And a few weeks ago you may remember,
we had on Margaret, who is battling breast cancer, and
I think both stories are like beautiful back to back
because it's two women with two completely different approaches that
are taking the empowered choice, even though that empowered choice

(02:10):
looks completely different on them. And I'm so inspired by
the both of them. And this is not an apples
to Apple's conversation. Margaret and Shanna have different types of
breast cancer and different situations, but we are talking about
health and both of them are in control. You'll feel
that from both of them, and nonetheless, the methodologies of

(02:32):
tackling it are so different, and I think that speaks
volumes about our health and the best choices for us
are going to be only known to us in that moment. Lastly,
I just want to share that I was talking to
Shana about how I love doing these podcasts and having
it as a platform to impact people, and I know
that thousands of people listen, but one of the downsides

(02:54):
of it is I record on a random day, it
goes live on a random day, and you listen on
a random day, and it's not like a conversation where
you get that direct feedback and like energy exchange. So
I wanted to let you know, if you're an avid listener,
I would love to hear from you. I'd love to
hear from DMS that you love this episode or what
specifically resonated if you share it with a friend, I'd

(03:15):
love to hear about that too, and really just anything
that's like resonating. I truly would love to hear back
from you and just build more community within this place
that I know exists. So thank you all for listening,
thank you for living your Truthius life, and huge shout
out to Shana for coming on the Truthius life, being
a longtime listener, and impacting people in the way that

(03:38):
you do simply by being you. Let's take a listen welcome, Shana. Hi.
This is crazy. You're like my most loyal fan, one
of my oldest friends from the very beginning of life
or the truthiest life, both true. We go back as
early as sixth grade. And actually, you don't know this,

(03:59):
but I've wanted to have you on here, but I
didn't have the courage to ask you because you're a
private person. You don't show that stuff, and I don't know.
It's like, this is a deeply personal part of your
story and life sort of it is. I think I'm
happy to share what I've been through because I know
that I'm not alone in what I've been through. And

(04:21):
hopefully when I share my story and people hear it,
they either learn from it and can apply it to
their own lives. And everyone knows someone who's been through
what I went through, so I just hope it's helpful. Okay,
So let's just start from how would you describe your
life before your breast cancer diagnosis? It was great, Like
I had a very smooth life. I went to the

(04:43):
college I wanted, I went to the grad school I wanted.
I met my husband at a young age, we got married,
we had kids. Everything sort of went according to plan.
Everything was very smooth. I had no issues with finding
a partner, finding a job, having did find me my partner.
I'll give you credit for that one. But everything was

(05:05):
going according to plan. And I was young. I had
you got married at twenty five. I had my kids
by the time I was twenty nine, and just felt
like I was about to get started on like my
time of life, that I was getting my body back
and my kids were growing and I was about to
just start living my life for me. And then it's

(05:28):
almost exactly four years ago, like almost to the day,
I was like thirty and a half and I went
to my gynecologist's appointment for my regular routine check op
and I had felt a lump in my left breast,
and that was sort of the start of basically like
a big marker of my life of like before and

(05:48):
since right before that, you were a child, but a
grown up child because you did get married early in
terms of like our friend group, right, how old are
you even to get married? So I was nineteen when
I met my husband, and we got engaged at twenty four,
married at twenty five, and I was the first one
definitely in our group of friends to get married and
have kids and have kids. Yeah, by a few years. Right,

(06:11):
so your kids are about how old when you got sick?
When I was diagnosed, they were three and a half
and one and a half, they were babies. When I say, actually,
like when you got sick, is that the correct terminology?
I mean, yeah, it is. Like I used the phrase
like from when I was diagnosed, because that's like the
marker of time. But yeah, I was diagnosed with breast
cancer and from then on, like I was sick. Like

(06:33):
I don't think I ever presented as a sick person,
so it's weird to describe it that way, but that's
the reality. I was sick. I had breast cancer. Yeah. Right,
But then I'm just curious, like when I think of
myself as being sick, I can't get out of bed.
Was there ever a day that you didn't get out
of bed? Or I mean, you had a three and
a half and one and a half year old, Like,
that's not an option. I mean that was sort of

(06:54):
the hardest part was that from the time I was diagnosed,
it was very quick. I went, you know, I had
mammogram ultrasound biopsy, and then from their MRI scheduling surgery,
scheduling chemo is like figuring all of that out, And
the only thing I really cared about was like, am
I going to be okay for my kids? Am I
going to still be the type of mom that I
am to them? I was a very present, hands on mom.

(07:17):
I did everything with them, And would that still be
able to continue? And how is our life really going
to change? And it did? You know? I had chemotherapy
In the beginning, it was treatments every other week, and
then I switched to a different drug and then it
was every week. And thankfully I had a very good
reaction to the chemotherapy, Like I wasn't It wasn't like

(07:40):
what you see in the movies where I was really
really sick and throwing up all the time. Like I
didn't throw up once the entire time. But there were
days that I felt really tired and that sort of
my brain was in a fog, and I would stay
in bed for maybe a day after each treatment and
then try to get right back into it and get
back to my regular mom duties of you know, walking

(08:02):
my kids to school and doing pickup and still being
the present mom that I wanted to still be, so
let's just walk this back a little bit more slowly.
Now we got like the big picture of kind of
and people know that it's been four years. So you're
on the other side, which is beautiful, but walking back
from me too, because obviously I know you, I know

(08:22):
your story, but even as a friend, as like a
loved one of yours, it was very hard to like
grasp everything that was happening. For so I was living
in DC at the time, so I was far away,
and for somebody your age to get one of your
closest friends like to all of a sudden be like
I have blah blah blah, which you'll tell us like
your exact diagnosis, it meant like nothing to me because

(08:44):
I was unfamiliar with this type of breast cancer, unfamiliar
with this stage, unfamiliar with like what the prognosis meant
coming from the doctor and looking at you like through
the steps like you weren't a typical No, I shouldn't
say typical. You were not the person that made the
sick your identity. I feel like you made getting better

(09:04):
your identity and neither a right or wrong, like it
just whatever you are going through. If you are sick
and you're not beating it, that becomes your identity. If
you are crushing it, responding well to treatment, that's your identity.
So for me, I don't know. I kind of feel
like it was like this, Oh my god, and then
like you just kind of like swored up. And I
don't know if that was actually the trajectory, but along
the way I lost touch of like the details. I

(09:26):
kind of love the way you put it that I
didn't put getting sick being sick as my identity. It
was about getting better because from the minute I was diagnosed,
that was the worst news that I heard. You have
stage one triple negative breast cancer. I also found out
at the same time that I was learning all of
this that I also have a genetic mutation I brock

(09:47):
A one positive, which is a genetic mutation that puts
you at a higher risk for breast cancer and other
types of cancers. But it really was that that was
the worst news. It's you at breast cancer, you have
this genetic mutation. And after that, yes, I had to
go through chemotherapy and I was sick and all that,
but it really was an upward journey of this is working,

(10:10):
your tumors are shrinking. Everything is going as it should
and I was responding well to treatments. And I think
my husband is also part of this is he never
treated me like a sick person and he never let
me wallow in sickness. It was always like he would
say to me, whatever you need, we are here. If

(10:31):
you need a day to rest, if you need this,
we're here. But unless you tell me what you need,
we're business as usual. Our life is regular, like we're
going out for dinners, we're going out with friends, we're
doing family things that we have always done. And yes,
this is a huge life changing thing that's happening to us,
but that doesn't mean every aspect of our life has

(10:53):
to change. And it really didn't change. Like, yes, we
had like treatment Tuesdays where our team on Tuesday was different.
Like I would wake up in the morning, my husband
would get my kids ready for school. I would leave
our apartment. I would stop at the bagel store to
get a bagel and coffee, and I would walk up
to NYU for my chemo treatments, and then he would

(11:14):
get the kids to school come meet me at the hospital.
It was almost like we were on a date on Tuesdays.
Like we sat in our little cubicle and he would
work and I would read or watch a show on
my iPad. But it was still like somehow quality time.
Going through cancers really can be so challenging on a
relationship and on family dynamics, but we try to keep

(11:36):
as much else as normal as possible so that it
didn't change everything. I think that's really great advice. And
obviously when you get married and you say through sickness
and health, you don't expect the sickness part to come
five years after marriage in your thirties and really deal
with that. But I think that a lot of relationships
might rise to the occasion initially when somebody is sick,

(11:58):
but it does of wear and tear on a relationship.
You know, like your trajectory was positive, for lack of
a better word, like the treatments were working, but like
can you imagine you know, for people where the treatments
aren't working, the financial burden, the strain of the children,
the dynamic shift. You know, you were also like went
along for his plan of like business as usual, right,

(12:19):
and thankfully, like the modern medicine is like really magical,
Like you go in for treatment and yes, I'm there
to get these chemo drugs, but now there's so many
other medications and other things that you can do to
make sure that you feel okay while you're in treatment.
So that I didn't feel nauseous, I didn't feel all
the side effects that could have come from chemotherapy. To

(12:40):
help me feel as well as I could, like I
also I went to acupuncture, like I don't know, two
to three times a week while I was in treatment,
just to like build my immune system and keep me
feeling good and whatever. That's it for me. But thankfully
everything was on an upper trajectory. It's almost like I
was living my life and then it plummeted with diagnosis,

(13:00):
and then it was upward from there and until you know,
it was six months of chemotherapy. I lost my hair
and then shaved your hair head off before you lost
it though, right, Well, so what they sook my hair
before I got sick was long and lush, and it
was like such a but it was such a big

(13:21):
part of my personality to myself. I don't think anyone
else really cared about my hair, but I loved my hair.
I would it was you know, I got to blow
out twice a week. It was always it was. It
was a shiny, healthy, shiny, lush flowing and that was
to me. Like honestly, when I was meeting with my
breast surgeon and the first thing I said to her was,
am I going to lose my hair? And she was like, yes,

(13:43):
you are. But that's how you know the medicine's working.
You know, chemot therapy targets the most actively growing cells
in your body, which are your hair, your skin, your nails.
So your hair is sort of the first thing to go.
But what they recommended to me is that I cut
it short first, just for my kids to sort of
aid them in the transition that you know, it's not
like mom has hair down to her waist and now

(14:05):
she's bald, but it was I have hair down to
my waist, then it's at my chin, then it's a
little shorter, and then finally one day, I was sitting
on the couch with my husband and my scalp just
started to burn, like it felt like it was burning.
That's the chemo. I lost my hair in between my
first and second chemo treatment, which is what's supposed to happen.
It's so quick, but it was sort of like the

(14:26):
hair follicles releasing but still being attached to my head.
So the next day it was a Sunday. That next morning,
I shaved my head and that was it. Your body
language changes a little bit right now. Is you're like
remembering the Is it the burning that you're remembering or
the emotional I know I'm touching my hair a lot
right now, aren't I Just like your candor around? The

(14:48):
story changes a little bit, because it was was that
like the most palpable thing of like I'm sick? Was
that like the most palpable thing of like I'm sick?
I feel like losing my hair was what made me

(15:10):
look sick. Like there are so many people with so
many illnesses that you can't see from the outside and
they look normal and or normal, they look healthy from
the outside, but what's going on in the inside you
can't tell. And once I lost my hair, it was
almost like my armor was gone. And now I had
a choice. Am I gonna wear a wig and you know,

(15:32):
pretend to still be the same me that I was before?
Am I gonna lean into baldness? Am I gonna how
Am I going to accept this new physical change? And
I really attached a lot to what that physical change meant, Like,
does that now mean that I'm a sick person because
I'm bald, my eyebrows are thinning, my eyelashes are falling off,

(15:55):
like I think I might unravel. I'm just gonna it's okay. No, no,
I mean even just I meant like if I went
through it, you know, I'm somebody that really works on
self acceptance and everything. But at the same time, like
your physical identity outside of like aesthetics or like other people,
it's just like, this is who I am, this is
what I look like, this is my outward connection to

(16:16):
air and people, like I don't know, and then all
of a sudden, you are different, gone, Like you go
completely different, and my face got a little puffy, or
like just all there were all these different physical side
effects that had more of an emotional impact on me.
But I don't know how I had this strength, because
I think looking back on it, I don't I don't

(16:37):
know how I did it. But I kind of just
like kept on going business as usual. But you decided
to cut it off after that, right after the burning
shaved my At the end the next morning, it was gone,
but you had a video. I have a video like
a time lapse, and like, what's crazy is I look
back at that video and I'm smiling the whole video,
like I'm in this little visical. I don't know, Like
my smile looks genuine, like I I'm sitting this guy,

(17:01):
you know. He buzzes it short and then he goes
and I'm looking in the mirror the whole time, and
We're chatting and I'm laughing and I'm smiling. And at
the end he spins me around to look in the
mirror and I smile, Oh, you're not even witnessing it
as it goes like hind up. But then he gives
me like a little twirl and I'm like, uh, you know,
this is what I like. I smile, this is it.

(17:21):
But I did wear my wig for four months, and
then once my hair started growing back just a little stubble,
I was like, I can't do this anymore. And I
was like, so I just was like done with it,
and I really started to thank who am I wearing
this wig? Four? Is it so that other people aren't afraid? Like?
Is it so that I am maintaining this appearance that

(17:43):
I used to be? Like who is it helping? And
it wasn't helping me. So one day I was just
going out for the day and I looked at my
nanny at the time and I was like, I'm not
going to wear my wig anymore. And she looked at
me kind of like I was crazy and was like,
are you sure you want to leave the hose like that?
And I was like, yeah, why, Like I thought I

(18:03):
had a lot of hair, I have a little stubble.
And then from then on I never wore the wig again.
The regrowth confidence, Yeah, you rocked the stubble, the bald,
whatever you want to call it, Like you have no choice.
You know you did have a choice, though, Yes, I
could have kept wearing the wig. I mean at your wedding,
which I don't know if you want to get to it. Yeah,
but I went to your wedding two weeks after my

(18:26):
double miss actomy. We didn't know if you were going
to come right. I didn't think i'd be able to fly.
I didn't think I would feel up to it. Honestly,
I don't know how I did it. I traveled with
a neck pillow and I could barely lift my arms
above my shoulder. And thanks for coming. I was completely flat.
I had no I had very short hair, but I
was like, not going to miss your wedding, like I

(18:47):
had to be there, and I made it and I danced.
They stayed up till I was on the last one standing.
Wait till you had double missectomy. So you got both
out right without and since then you have implants now
I haven't plants. Yeah, okay, So going back again, just
to the beginning, I wouldn't describe myself as a regular
breast lump checker myself, like I know I'm supposed to
do it. I think once I found a lump on myself,

(19:08):
but like almost what happenstance, which ended up being fine,
Were you looking for something like is this something you
regularly do? No? Did the it's not something I So
my lump was on my left breast, like close to
my armpit, and it was kind of this thing where
I had noticed it one day, maybe when I was

(19:29):
like getting dressed or something, and I didn't think anything
of it, like not at all, and then it's like
kind of a blur. Whether it was like my husband
who was like what is that? Or I was like,
can you look at this? And he was like, yeah,
we should probably like get it checked. But it was
really just by chance that I had this appointment with
my gynecologist. Like it wasn't like, oh you didn't make

(19:50):
was not like I feel this lump and I need
to get it checked. It was like, oh, I'm going
to the doctor, like I'll have her check it. You know,
I'm here anyway. But I had no reason to believe
or I had no suspicions that it was anything major
because I was thirty and didn't like think that something
like this could happen to me. And we do hear
about people getting lumps all the time, and you know,

(20:11):
they checked them and they're fine and exactly okay. So
your appointment wasn't for that. So you went in and
you had your regular regular check up. New it was
a new doctor and I had chowed her the lump
and she was like, it's probably nothing, it's probably assist
but I want you to go for imaging just to
be sure. And what I've learned in the last four
years and talking to a lot of people, is that

(20:31):
I'm very lucky that I had a doctor who aired
on that cautious side to say go get it checked,
because so many doctors are sort of dismissive of lumps
in young people because more often than not it's not something,
but like sometimes it is, yea, and she was really
she's one hundred percent saved my life by sending me

(20:53):
to go get imaging because from the time of my
first imaging, which was like a week after that appointment,
until all my final MRI before I started chemo, my
tumor had doubled in size. So this was like a
very fast growing, aggressive cancer that I thankfully caught before
it got to be a bigger situation than what it was.

(21:14):
And unfortunately, from knowing people who have had cancer, now
I'm a little bit more familiar with different phrases, such
as stage one versus stage four. What is stage one means?
So stage the stages have to do with the size
of the tumor and the location of the tumor, if
it's localized just to the breast, or if it goes

(21:35):
into your lymph nodes. My tumor was small and it
was not in my lymph nodes, even doubled in size,
still stage one. Yeah, but I do remember, and you
said it earlier, you know, you said triple negative. What
does that mean, because I think, like hearing anything with numbers,
you're just like, it's really bad. It's triple negative. What
does that mean? So there there's three different types of

(21:55):
hormones that are part of cancer cells. There's estrogen, progesterone,
and this other hormone called her too. And basically the
way my doctor described it to me is like, imagine
your cancer cells are a circle and there's these three
notches and those are the three hormones, and the chemotherapy
is like, are like a key to go into those
three locks. She's like, triple negative means you don't have

(22:17):
any of those hormones in your cancer cells, which she
explained to me. Then I was like, so does that
mean that my cancer cell has no keys? Like there's
no key that can unlock these locks? But then she said, no,
you just need an aggressive form of chemotherapy because it
will target those cells and that's the standard course of
care for your type of cancer. And when they told

(22:39):
you that you had cancer, did they say, like the prognosis?
Is this the prognosis? Like did they give you anything? No.
I remember feeling like it was daunting at first, like
the story that we've described so far, has sounded very
much like you have cancer, Okay, you do treatment, then
you get better. But I remember being like, noid, this
is bad. Yeah. So my doctor told me not to
google my type of cancer, that that I won't like

(23:00):
the numbers that I see if I google. And then
I asked her, you know, like, am I going to
be okay? And she kind of frankly said to me,
She's like, I can't answer that, but we are going
to do everything we can and this is our treatment
and we believe it's going to be effective. And that
was kind of enough for me. I got, you know,
a second opinion from different doctors. I went to a
different hospital. I ended up being treated at NYU, and

(23:24):
all my doctors were at NYU, but I wanted to
get a second opinion somewhere else. And I just really
felt cared for by the doctors at NYU. I really
liked my care team. They worked well together. They were
also all women, which I really thought was important, and
I trusted that they knew what they were talking about
and that they believed that this course of treatment was

(23:45):
going to give me the best chance to beat my
cancer and survived for as long as possible. So they
gave you your action plan and at any point did you,
I know, maybe not looking. Did you look up the
statistics of your type of cancer? By the way, Yeah,
but I really listened to them when they said like,
don't look like, don't attach yourself to these numbers, and
I really didn't. My treatment plan did change from the

(24:08):
first appointment when I met with them. Originally I was
going to have my surgery first and then do chemotherapy after.
But then when I went for that MRI and they
saw that the tumor had doubled, my oncologist basically said
like we wanted This was on a Tuesday, and she
was like, we're changing our minds. We want to do
the chemotherapy first, and we're going to start on Friday,
like in three days. And I was like, oh, you

(24:29):
were expecting months. I was expecting. I was expecting to
have a surgery a few weeks later, have a month
to recovery for cover from surgery, and then start chemo.
And then all of a sudden, it was like, wait,
I'm starting chemo in three days. What does that mean
for my family? How am I going to feel? Like?
It shook things up a little bit, and that first

(24:49):
chemo treatment. Like my entire family came. They wore these hats.
It was like such, it was a circus. It was
so ridiculous. You liked it or didn't like it. I
didn't love it, but I almost felt like they needed that.
I think going through all of it, even though I
was the one going through it, it it was the easiest
for me compared to the rest of my family. Like

(25:11):
I was the one going through it, I had all
the information, I knew what I was feeling. But everyone
around me like wanted to love and support and be
connected to it, but you can't. Like they wanted to
show their support as much as possible, but like I'm
a person who's going through this and I don't love

(25:32):
that sort of attention, So it was harder for them
to get through it, almost, like I can imagine for
my mom, like that was probably the hardest for her
because like I'm her daughter, but I'm going through it
and I need space to go through it. Speaking to
that volumes to anybody being sick with anything and those

(25:54):
around you, like coping and trying to show their support
in one language when it might not be the language
that you need. Not to say that, like obviously doesn't
sound like you're upset with them or anything, but like
it just speaks to everybody goes through the sickness when
somebody is up against something like cancer. Yeah, everybody feels it.
Like I had cancer, but it affected each member of

(26:17):
my family in a very different way. Like I have
a much younger brother, Like how did he feel watching
his older sister who's cared for him go through this?
Like it affects everyone in different ways. And I think
you know, them showing up with their hats on allowed
them to feel like, you know, they're showing their support
and that I feel their love. And you know, that

(26:37):
was the only time that we filled the chemo room
with like twenty people. That was a very pre COVID experience,
knowing you. From what I'm taking from it, like it
wasn't like you wanted to fully be alone. It was
just like this is interesting, right, Like I kind of
let them be there, but like I was still like
doing my own thing, like Okay, everyone's here, Like great.
Do you think there's somebody in your position though, who

(26:58):
maybe would feel overwhelmed by that? How would you recommend
they voice to their loved ones that like the language
of being loved is not working for them, because for
you it was like not not working, but it was
just like, Okay, you're over there, I'm over here. But
for somebody that's like getting anxious about it or it's
making them feel like a sick person, like how can

(27:21):
you use your voice during that time? And it's so hard.
I don't know, because I'm the type of person that
can like roll with it a little bit, and like
I really recognize from the beginning that I was the
sick person, but that it did affect everyone. And I
think that's a really hard realization for I'm sure many
people who are going through something similar that you want

(27:43):
to still be respectful of other people and not ignore
your own needs at the same time. But I always
think like being vocal and being clear is the best advice.
Like you know, we would also like get messages from
friends like we're here for you whatever you need. But sorry,
if that was me, no, I mean, I don't know
if it was you, I don't remember. But you guys

(28:04):
like sent staff, you guys were like you as a friend.
You were all so supportive, and everyone shows their support
in a way that they can remember. I remember what
I did actually because I was in DC, but I
don't know how helpful it was. And I'm curious because
I think when somebody gets sick, we all want to
send them something or show where support in some way
and feel connected to it for whatever reason. When somebody

(28:25):
gets sick, like I think, it's also very sobering for
everyone around you to be like, oh, I'm not invincible.
I mean, no question your own mortality. Mortality right, it
brings up the question that the thought of mortality that
we conveniently brush away, so then you're super connected to it,
you know, just kind of like hyper charges things. But anyway,
I remember I sent you either a gift card to

(28:46):
like seamless or a food delivery or food itself gifts
you could send. I was hoping, so I remember thinking
like what could I do? Okay, which probably doesn't want
to cook or make meals, but I wasn't apparent at
that time, so I wasn't thinking it like what does
she really need? So sending food is a good idea.
Sending food. Honestly, the gift card like DoorDash, Seamless, uber eats,
whatever it is, because then it's I can get whatever

(29:08):
I want at my own time, like we had my
son's school at the time organized like this prepared food
delivery service of kid friendly food, which was amazing because
then I knew my kids were having nutritious foods. Like
not everything sort of fell off the rails because I
wasn't well enough all the time to prepare all the
foods that I wanted. But things like a seamless delivery

(29:29):
card are great. Or even saying like something specific or
like I'm going to bring you a dozen bagels today.
Does that work where it's like so clear of what's
coming instead of just this overarching I'm here for you,
you know, which is also nice, but it doesn't translate
to like a concrete to do list item. No. I
think that it's so important to hear the feedback from

(29:50):
people that have gone through it, because I think we
default back to like I'm here for you, and just
like common phrases that like sounds like that's even like
triggering to a little bit. No, I see, I appreciate
like a thinking of you with a heart, because that's
like it's nice to know that someone is thinking of you.
And also, not everybody could send money, Not everyone can
send money, not everyone has the time to lend. And

(30:13):
I think you have to respect people that they are
where they are too, and you want to hope that
you're surrounded by people that are giving what they can. Okay,
let me ask you this. I think that when people

(30:33):
get sick, it becomes like and this could totally be
the wrong word, and you're a teacher by trades, you
can tell me, but it becomes a little like voyeuristic,
like everybody wants to be part of the story totally.
I don't know if you knew Sam who passed away,
Like who's Jacqueline my best friend's best friend? Right when
Sam got sick and was dying, Like the internet went

(30:55):
crazy with like I was her best friend, I was
her best friend. I was her best friend to the
point we're like I had to take a step back
and be like, I don't even know what the reality
of like our level of friendship was at that point,
because every memory that you have with that person becomes
like higher up in your in your brain of like
you know what I mean, Like everybody wants to be
like I knew her, I knew her, iknew her, I
know her, I know her and post everything that they can.

(31:17):
I don't know what it is, and there's a level
of like something about it that just made me uneasy
and does make me an easy. So my question that
I'm kind of cruising into is like, can you just
tell when somebody's coming from like a genuine place of
like I'm here for you, versus like I'll feel guilty
if I don't text her because she's going through something hard,
or like I'm worried that our friendship will fade away

(31:37):
if I don't text during this hard time. I think
I think there's a little a little of that for sure.
I think I could tell when people were reaching out
either because they thought they would gain something from it,
because I don't know, everyone wants to be friends with
the sick girl, or it became well, I think any
type of not that having cancer is a scandal, but
it's something that like shocks the status quo where everyone

(32:00):
wants to be attached to that, whether it's cancer or
you know, when Sam passed away, it's like there's this
big moment that everyone draws their attention to and people
love to attach themselves to that. Right. So, like when
I posted on Instagram, I was like so hesitant to
do it, and I sat with my husband, I was like,
what am I posting this for? Like is it so

(32:21):
I could get you know, a thousand likes and people
being like thinking of you, thinking of you, like you
got this like you know strong arm emoji, Like what
is it all for? And I like to think that
people want to attach themselves to it for two reasons,
One because they actually want to show their support, and
two because it's so shocking that now it's like taking

(32:43):
up space in their brain, either because they're afraid that
something like this could happen to them, or if it
just plants this in their brain where I need to
be more mindful about things in my own health because
you never know what could happen. I like to think
that most people were reaching out just out of well
wishes and wishing that you know, I was going to
be okay, whether we were close or not, or I

(33:07):
don't know. People totally came out of the woodwork. And now,
especially like being on the other side, if anyone knows
anyone who is like diagnosed with breast cancer, finds a lump,
finds out they have BRACA or any other genetic mutation,
I get a phone call, like I talked to so
many women, mothers of daughters who are going through it,

(33:29):
husbands who are like in shock and don't know what
to do. I talk to people all the time. My
husband talks to people too, to support husbands whose wives
are diagnosed with breast cancer. And I think that is
maybe the reason why I posted in the first place,
that like, I never felt unique and I knew I
wasn't alone, So now I like that I could be

(33:49):
that person to talk people through it. So when you
posted where were you going? So my family goes away
for Passover every year and I was diagnosed like right
around the time of past Over, and I was so
adamant with my oncologists that I wanted to be able
to go on my family's passover trip. And I wanted
to have my hair for that trip, Like we take
family photos every year, and I was like, I don't

(34:11):
care what we do, but I need hair on this
trip to take these photos. So we really worked my
chemo around this trip. Like I had my first chemo
treatment on a Friday, I must have left for Passover
like the next week, because I lost my hair like
two weeks to the day after my first treatment, And
we took these amazing family photos and then like that

(34:33):
was what I posted to say, like I have breast cancer,
and it was like it just felt like I don't know,
I don't know. Yeah, what is that moment like slow
you down so much? Because it was like this moment
where it was like at first it was just like
my family were dealing with this, I'm going through treatment,
and then all of a sudden, I like put it
out into the world and then it made it real.

(34:54):
It wasn't a secret anymore, and I sort of opened
myself up to to everyone knowing about it and absorbing
it however they would, and you know, it just made
it all of a sudden, I was going through it alone,
but now it was like everyone's there too. That was
the moment of like the pre impost, would you say,
or was like the diagnosis That moment the story of

(35:16):
diagnosis is really like the pre impost. My husband was
in London at the time for work, and I feel
like feeling far away when like so good away. It
was a Monday afternoon and at the time I was
working as a private tutor and I picked up my
student from school every Monday, so I was leaving my
apartment going to walk to pick her up, and I
got a phone call while I was waiting for the

(35:37):
elevator and my doctor was like, Hi, like just want
to let you know, like we got your test results back,
you have breast cancer. No, like literally on the phone
and she was like, I just sent you an email
with all the information you need to know, with all
the doctors they're waiting to hear from, you, make those
calls and call me like I'm I'm here for you.
It was. It was a great conversation. It lasted all

(35:59):
of one minute, and then I had to go to work.
So I walked to pick up the student from school
and I called my husband like on my way. I
was like, hey, I know you're in London. This was
a voicemail. I was like, hey, I know you're in London.
I just got the test results back, Like, don't come home.
Call me like it's all going to be fine. Oh
STU didn't tell him on the voicemail. I told him

(36:19):
on the voicemail. I think, all right, so I can't remember, okay.
I told him while he was in London and I said,
don't come home. I'll figure it out. While I was
in between tutoring sessions. That day, I called all the
doctors and made my appointments for the next day, and
like that week, I went to all the appointments by
myself while he was still in London and just like

(36:41):
got the ball rolling of like figuring out what this
all was. So going back to your kids, you had
a three and a half and a one and a
half year old one and a half liked was there explaining, Yeah,
it's exactly silly. So I actually I didn't realize how
young Cooper was at the time. But how did you
explain it to Aiden or Aidan and Cooper? So we
had I didn't explain it to Cooper at all. He

(37:02):
was a year and a half. He doesn't he didn't
have like the comprehension to understand anything. For Aiden, the
biggest thing was was the hair. He also was like
a very bright kid. He's very perceptive, very smart, and
he was very attached to me, also very attached to
my hair. Like when he was upset, he would like

(37:22):
cuddle with me and like hold my hair and like
to fall asleep. He would hold onto like a lock
of my hair. And it was the hardest thing for
me to tell him. But you know, I how do
you frame that to a three and a half year old,
you know, in explaining it to kids, whether they're three
or even a little bit older, just being clear and

(37:42):
concise was the advice that I got. And also that like,
leave it opened for questions after you share with them,
and I'll tell what I shared with Aiden, but that
they are probably not thinking about it as deeply as
I was as a mother, and that he's probably not
going to have questions and kids are super resilient, and
as long as I share with him from the perspective

(38:06):
of like, this is happening and I'm going to be okay,
like I set the tone for how he's going to
receive it. Probably true about anything with kids, it really is,
and this feels a lot more major because it is.
But to a kid, it's like I'm telling him anything else.
Like he doesn't have at three and a half, the
understanding that this is so serious unless I present it
that way. And it doesn't benefit him to have him

(38:28):
feel the weight of it. So all I said to
him was, Mommy sick, I have a boo boo in
my boobies, and I'm going to take really strong medicine.
And the strong medicine is going to make my hair
fall out. But that's how we know the medicine is working.
And that's all I said. Your coach to say that,
it's like I spoke. So I spoke to a social
worker at the hospital. I also I used to work

(38:49):
in a school and I was friends with the school
social worker. I spoke to her about it, and the
advice that I got was just be very clear, simple,
and then say like, do you have any questions about that?
And he didn't. The day that I shaved my head,
I like, you know, I got all these books to
read to him about losing hair, and I started to
read it to him that night, and he could not

(39:10):
have been less interested in this book that I was
reading to him. And I was like trying to have
this moment and he just could not have cared less.
But then you know, I was. I have a video
of it too, which is so triggering to watch, but
you know, I'm sitting on the couch, I was wearing
a beanie. I would wear these like little like cotton
hats in the house and he was sitting next to me,
and all of a sudden, I see him like starting

(39:31):
to touch his own hair, and you know, he was like,
is my hair going to fall out? And I was like, no, Like,
your hair is not going to fall out, just mommy's
hair is going to fall out. But that's okay. Like
that's how we know it's working. And that was enough
for him and he didn't have any questions about it.
What do you mean triggering? Like when I watched the
video and I see just his body language and mine,

(39:52):
just I felt heavy in that moment having to share
it with him, But now I also realized he didn't
feel heavy, Like it was a bigger moment for me
than it was for him in looking at that video.
That's what you take, yeah, Or do you think you
just handled it like really well by taking the heaviness
away from him because you were so instinct rely mother?

(40:13):
But I think like that's the role of a mother
is to try to lessen the load, right, That's that's
what we're here for. Is you can't lessen every load,
but like this was one that he didn't need to feel.
I think you can listen, you could try to lessen
tvery load. You can't get rid of the loads, right,
but like, but that's yeah, that was sort of how

(40:34):
I felt my role through all of it. Like now,
like my Cooper, my little one is now five and
a half. He we look at time hoop like I
love type, I love an archived, I love it. But
like he looks at these pictures of me when I
was bald and he just like brushes over it. He doesn't.
He doesn't know, right because he also like at that age,
they haven't like cognitively associated like no hair with being

(40:58):
sick necessarily or even LA beauty standard or not any
of it. Like I wonder as they get older and
they start to learn more about these types of things
and being sick and losing your hair, if they'll like
look at me and be like that happened to you?
Like but maybe they won't. Maybe they'll just keep living
their lives and it won't be anything that affects them.

(41:29):
So how long did it take for you to get
And I don't know if this is the correct word,
but like remission or no, can't like what's the correct word,
because they did the missectomy towards is that yeah, you
still don't have to go for chemo, so it's not
just like so that always confused me, like if we're
taking it all out, why do we got to do
the chemo? So that was my question too, But like cancer, yes,
it's like localized. My cancer is localized in my breast,

(41:51):
but there could still be cells floating around. So we
did the chemo therapy first, and I could tell physically,
like I could not feel my lump anymore after two treatments,
so I knew that the chemo was doing its job.
And then after my six months of chemo, they do
the surgery and they said from the surgery that I

(42:11):
had clear margins, there was no evidence of cancer outside
of where the tumor was. They took out a few
lymph nodes just to confirm that it didn't actually spread
to my lymph nodes. So from that point on, they
say that I have no evidence of disease, which is
sort of a safe way of saying that you're looking good.
It's not a one hundred percent there is no cancer

(42:33):
because they can't really know that one percent for sure.
It could be too small, it could just be floating
around in there, and who knows for sure. But they
say that I had a complete response to chemo, and
many rounds chemo like sixteen oh wow, yeah, it was
four rounds of these two drugs called adriamycin and cytoxin,

(42:54):
and then twelve rounds of tax all And within those
twelve rounds of taxol, I also had four rounds of
carbo platinum, so it was sixteen sessions. I mean, it's
really incredible that, like you describe not having symptoms the
way we typically think. I think there's a little bit
of like looking back with rose colored glasses. Like with
the first part with the adrianisin and cytoxin, it was

(43:16):
every other week. So for the first week after I
was a little groggier. I definitely experienced sort of like
a brain fog, sort of like you're coming down with
the flu feeling not even body aches, just like a
mental fog. But like I said, I never threw up once.
I never And they give you earlier, they put other

(43:37):
meds and do mean eats strong, so they give you
before you start chemo, they give you steroids and other
anti nauseas, and then in my house, like with me,
I had zofran that I never even had to take.
I had other anti nauseas. Um the night that I
had chemo, I would have to take like a zanix
or something to go to sleep because from the steroid

(43:58):
that day, I am like, you know, like really amped up.
So the first night was not ideal to fall asleep,
but again not major debilitating symptoms. And then when I
switched to the tax all that had more of like
a physical side effect where I would experience like bone pain,
like my lower back would hurt, my hips would hurt.
By the end of it, I started to get like

(44:20):
I would get really itchy feet, which was like a
precursor to neuropathy, which it never developed into neuropathy. So
not to like make light of chemo was a breeze,
like there were still side effects. There were still effects
that it had on my body, but not anything that
was going to stop me from living my life towards

(44:43):
the end. So my birthday was in August, so I
started chemo in like March April, and August I had
chemo and I went with my family for dinner. We
went to Lure Fish Bar and were sitting at the restaurant.
I'm wearing these wedges and all of a sudden, the
bottom of my feet start to itch like so uncontrollable.
I literally had to grab a fork from the table
and like reach under and use the fork to get

(45:05):
into my shoe to scratch my foot. Like that's another
under that you never know what anyone's going through because
if some cell like that girl's disgusting, but right she
grabbed before scratching her foot under the table, so disgusting.
But like I had no choice, Like nothing, nothing could
make it feel better. And what it was that exactly.
It's it has to do with the way that the
tax all affects your nerves. Yeah, yeah, I don't have

(45:26):
it anymore. But and do you have any long term
side effects like body aches or pains or anything that
you know of. I have no, nothing long no long
term anything. I'm not on any medication currently. I guess
for a lot of people with a lot of different
types of breast cancers, there's drugs that you take afterwards
for like five years, ten years that reduce your risks,

(45:47):
reduce your risk over currents. Both the type of breast
cancer I have, there aren't any drugs for that. So
on the one hand, it's like, great, I'm not taking
any medication, But on the other side, it's there's nothing
that I'm currently doing to prevent my cancer from coming back,
you know, like by medically medically. I mean, I'd like
to say I live a healthy lifestyle. I think that
like that's part of it, and mentally, like mentally I'm healthy.

(46:11):
I don't really think often about it coming back. I
wouldn't say I never think about it coming back, but
more often than not, I'm not thinking about it. And
what about that your partner, he's like the strongest rock.
There is rocks of feelings underneath, Like do you guys
discuss fears of it coming back? Or do you both

(46:32):
know you have it and you don't talk about it?
Or is there is there any sort of connection point
on that. We definitely talk about it because it comes
up for me every once in a while, where like
I said, people call me to talk about it. So
I'm constantly being brought back to that time in my
life by sharing my experience with other people. So when
that happens, and you know, I hear about stories where

(46:53):
their case is less severe than mine, and I talk
to women who are have much more severe diagnosis where
I really don't know what the outcome is going to be,
and I still try to support these women as best
I can. But you can't do that without bringing it
back to yourself. Sometimes, like, you know, we talk to
someone who's close to us, who you know, I coached
her through the beginning of her diagnosis, and then she

(47:16):
ended up being diagnosed with stage four breast cancer, which
is a very different thing. So it's hard to support
others when not then thinking well, what if it happened
to me? And then my husband and I communicate about everything,
so of course I'm going to bring that to him,
and he supports that. We talk a lot about it.
But what we both also try to say is, you know,

(47:38):
we'll cross that bridge when we come to it, and
we can handle it when it's in front of us.
But until that, like, there's no use worrying about it.
We can talk about that it's a possibility, but it's
nothing more than a possibility. Is there more maintenance checking
in that you need to do versus like me who
once a year, you know, or whatever it is to

(47:58):
you know, check on women, tell stuff. Yeah, So, because
I'm also Bracca positive, there's other parts of my body
that I need to worry about. Being Bracco positive puts
you at a higher risk for breast cancer and ovarian cancer,
but that's like peppenstance that you are Bracca positive that
had nothing to do with the cancer that you had.
My cancer was likely caused by my genetic mutation. What's

(48:19):
crazy about my situation is that my mom had breast
cancer when she was maybe fifty, So I'm like, I
don't know, ten fifteen years ago. But when she was
when she was diagnosed with breast cancer, she tested for
Brocca and she was negative. So we always were under
the assumption that because she was negative, I'm negative. But

(48:39):
genetics come from two parents and really a wild it's wild,
and so my Bracca status obviously came from my father
and you didn't know it until after you For men,
there are Being Bracco positive as a man does put
you at higher risk for things, but not to the
level that breast of breast cancer. Like if you're a
woman with breast cancer, I think the statistic sticks or

(49:00):
like you have an eighty percent chance of developing breastcancer
in your lifetime, and eighty percent is more of like,
it's not if you get breast cancer, it's when you
get breast cancer, like it will likely happen. So I
think now, like you know, if I had known what,
I've had a risk reducing surgery like having a preventative
mestectomy probably, but that was an action for me maybe

(49:23):
when I was I knew I was done having kids
after I had Cooper, so I maybe would have like
and just having anself to me, reduces your risk by
I don't know the exact numbers, but it drastically reduces
your risk just by getting rid of that tissue or
something like exactly. It takes away the host of like
where it could create. But a lot of people I
know that we know like that are Brocka positive but

(49:43):
never had anything. They just get missectomies, which there's like
a lot of people do. That's a hard one for
me to swallow, like getting a surgery before you know
that there's but it's almost like you're taking your health
into your own hands, where it's like I know this
could happen, and I trust the science behind it that
it is gonna help me to live longer. And so

(50:03):
I was finished with treatment and everything in January of
twenty twenty, and then a year later I had a
surgery to remove my fallopian tubes, which there's evidence that
removing your Philippian tubes reduces your risk of developing ovarian cancer.
So I did that that was also minor surgery, and
happy to do anything that's going to reduce my risk
of developing ovarian cancer, which I don't know how to

(50:27):
say it medically, but basically, ovarian cancer has a lot
of silent symptoms, so you don't know that you have
it until it's much further along, and then it becomes
harder to treat. So now I see a gynecologic oncologist
every I don't know, three times a year maybe to
go for ultrasounds and just make sure that things are
good there. Eventually I'll have those taken out to my ovaries. Okay,

(50:49):
but you had your Philippian tubes out, which means you
can't have children. Correct, I would have to go through IBF.
But I knew when I gave birth to my second
son that we wanted to two children. We had our
two boys, like our family was done growing, which is
honestly a blessing because I know for a lot of people,
when they find out that they have breast cancer when

(51:10):
they're young, their families aren't complete yet and they have
to think of having fertility aspect or started. Yeah, and
they have to go through fertility treatments and you know,
egg retrievals before you start chemo, and then the decision
to grow your family or not using your own body
and the effects hormonally that that could have to reignite
your cancer or I know a lot of people use

(51:30):
surrogates afterwards because they don't want to take that risk.
I remember really sitting with you talking about it, or
I think it was a conversation with you being like,
it's incredible how the not for lack of a better word,
strange timing of your life, like getting married early compared
to like our social norm, like twenty five isn't that
young in the world, but like in our social world,

(51:52):
it was very young having kids at twenty six or
whatever you were twenty seven and twenty nine, twenty nine,
just the twenty seven even just starting is like, you know,
I was just not ready for kids at that age. Like,
it's just amazing how your choices in the moment worked
out so well for you in relationship to the cancer.
Like I can't think of one other friend that would

(52:12):
have been like family complete. I'm good with this many
kids not worrying about that aspect of their life, And
it just felt like you made such good decisions without realizing.
I guess at the time though like there was I
did have this feeling of like I'm rushing, Not that
I'm rushing hastily, but like it did feel like my

(52:33):
life was like moving at a rapid pace, like college,
grad school, meet my husband, and like move in together,
get married. Like it was very It was like a
train that's like chugging along. There were no lulls of
just like life. It was like things were moving and
I don't know if it was like the universe doing
that so that everything would sort of be set before

(52:55):
my diagnosis, like looking back, like it has all worked out.
I couldn't have planned it better, Like you know, maybe
I would have if I wish I would have known
my risk for these things sooner, like because I'm the
type of person that likes to take charge and handle things.
And that was one of the hardest parts, honestly, was
that this was all happening in my body and I

(53:17):
didn't know about it, and that felt like I'm on
top of myself and I take good care of myself,
and how is this happening And I didn't know, but
I didn't know that it was something I should think about.
So then that changed everything, But in general it was
kind of like the timeline was what it was supposed
to be, Like everything has happened as it should. Well,

(53:38):
I mean, your story really is incredible. It's just also
nice to hear like a positive story, and it's cool
to see how you were this like private person and
now you're this person that stands on the stage and
holds fundraisers and speaks your story. And I don't know
if you're not forced to like step out of your shell,

(53:58):
but you are like stepping into your i'll call it
your truest self. Because of this, I think I've been
really lucky that I'm able to share about it. And
breastcancer especially is something that happens mostly to women, and
this has allowed me to support other women, which I
think is really important. And this happened to me, but

(54:21):
I'm not, like I said before, I'm not unique. I'm
not the only person that this happened too. And thankfully
everything went the way that it did that it has
allowed me to come out on the other side with
this message to share that you can get through this
and you need to be aware of your own health
and your own body and know what's happening breastcancer, and

(54:41):
you know, head to tell everything else, Like, no one
is going to know our bodies better than we will facts,
So if we're not paying attention to it, who is.
But I really have liked the opportunity to share my
story and speak to other women, whether it's like you know,
you came to that lunch that I spoke at and
that was a really nice experience. And I think it's

(55:04):
important because like, I'm just like a normal girl and
this happened to me, and it could happen to anyone.
And do you have any like three pieces of advice
for anyone? Not necessarily with breast cancer, but I mean,
just like listening to your story, I've taken away at
least one, which is, if you have a lump, push
for scanning, whether they say that it's probably fine, advocate

(55:25):
for yourself and go for it. Is there any other
like pieces of wisdom like that that you would recommend
to just all women. I think that's the biggest one,
is to advocate for yourself because no one else is
going to do it more than you will, and to
find doctors that listen to you. There's so many stories
I've heard of women who are brushed off by their doctors,
and that has drastic effects like timing. With things like this,

(55:48):
timing is so important and it's up to you to
push things along and don't settle until you feel like
your concerns are being heard. I think, you know, with
my like I said, with my diagnosis, like that was
the worst news I heard, and then we just kept
moving towards getting better. That was the focus. It wasn't
wallowing in what I'm going through. Of course, there were

(56:10):
moments I cried in my shower, like let's you know,
it wasn't all rainbows and butterflies. But to keep trying
to sounds so cheesy, like try to stay positive, but
like find the things that are still positive and and
try to keep things as true to you. Even though
you may have this like monumental diagnosis that changes things,

(56:32):
it doesn't have to change everything that's you think. I
think that's I mean, I haven't been in your shoes,
so I'm not going to give advice on something I
don't know about. But I'm definitely very inspired by the
fact that you and Matt together kept things as normal.
I think whenever I've gotten sick with anything, whether it
be COVID or not like you know, something not you know, chronic,

(56:53):
something very short acute. Just I mentally go down with
the ship really fast, like it feels like it's going
to be forever. It feels like time stops, you know.
And just the fact that Matt was there to keep
things moving normal for the two of you, for you individually,
for the kids is just a reminder that like two
things can kind of be true. You can be sick

(57:14):
and you can do these things, and you know, at
the same time, rest as much as you possibly need
for your individual circumstance. But I think a lot of
the time normal goes out with the second you get
a diagnosis, right, And I think that's the biggest thing
is the two things can be true at the same time.
I can be sick, I can you know, have cancer.

(57:35):
I can be bald, but I can still go on
a date night with my husband. I can still try
to look as good as I can with no hair
on my head or my eyebrows. But like, the two
things can coexist. And just because you have this one thing,
you know, this giant elephant on your shoulder, doesn't mean
that the whole ship has to crumble, like you might

(57:55):
need a lifeboat for a little while, Like it's not
gonna be that way one hundred percent end of the time,
but to try to create that sense of normalcy or
that like we're going to keep on trucking even when
you have something and it's not just breast cancer to anything. Yeah,
I guess my last question is I don't know. I
guess I'm a little bit more. I categorically just think

(58:17):
of myself as more of like a spiritual person than
you are. Not to say that you're not. You're actually
spiritual in other ways than how I categorize myself. But
when solely when she was sick, you know, Evan and
I were, as I put it, like, jolted awake, like
you know it's been by the way, thank you for
supporting me through that and our group of girlfriends. It
was helpful. It was so helpful. You guys said, the

(58:39):
cutest basket you put it together. It was so well done.
It made us feel so loved and you got it right.
But anyway, we were so jolted awake to what matters.
Like Even since then, it's been two months now and
Evan has made a lot of lifestyle shifts to really
live the life that he wants to live with like
family and a little bit more prominence with work life

(59:00):
balance type of a thing. And for myself, I know
that like when we were in the hospital in the
days leading after, I was so grateful and so clear
on what I wanted my life to be. And as
we get more distanced from the event, my biggest worry
is like losing that perspective. Did you have that jolted
awake moment? Yeah, I guess that's the first part. I
didn't have like a moment where I was like, yes,

(59:21):
like now I know what's important in life. But I
think in general, having gone through that experience, I do
have sort of like a shift in my thinking over
a permanent shift from my thinking over how I prioritize
my time, how I prioritize my energy towards things. I
think you know this about me, Like I don't care

(59:42):
about any kind of drama. I will not insert myself
into any kind of unnecessary drama that's so trivial, anything trivial.
I don't know if you did before either, though I
don't think I did before either. But I think now
it's even to a point where, like I don't even
entertain things that will take away from my positive feelings,
Like I won't even go down the road, you know,

(01:00:04):
I don't do things I don't want to do at all.
And I believe so fully that you make time for
what's important to you, no matter how inconvenient it may seem.
And that is something that it's not easy, but that
I really try to live by, that you make time
for what's important for you. And yes, of course, sometimes

(01:00:25):
life gets in the way and sometimes I can't live
that to the extent that I would want to. But like,
nothing is more important to me than my husband and
my kids. I will never put anything in front of them, period,
And I just try to like protect our unit so much.
And I don't know if that's because of cancer or

(01:00:46):
just in general. My family is so important, but that's
something that I think, going through something where I didn't
know one that I was going to be okay, it's
like there's nothing more important to me than them, and
like my close friends feeling like family, like that's the
most important to me. Well, that's definitely true. You are
zeroed in and it gives me great hope that I

(01:01:09):
will continue to be zeroed in. Without having to continuously
live through the trauma, you know, yes, And I think
like the farther you get away from from what happened
with Soli, you'll forget a lot of it. Like this,
it will still sit in your body like it's not
going to go away forever. But that clarity of shift

(01:01:30):
of focus of like okay, this happened, now we're gonna
do this. That becomes lighter, but it doesn't go away
like you experienced this. Your family went through this, like
it was jarring and things like that, not that it's
like nice for them to happen, but like every once
in a while, we all, even now being four years
down the road, I have to stop and be like, okay,

(01:01:51):
this is what's important, right, So we're constantly like a
clarity coming back, clarity, coming back into clarity okay because yeah, yeah,
but having gone through that, that will be like a
focus of like okay, And that's why all these things
are so important, like brings you back of like if
you do lose focus and need to come back, it's
like there was a time where I didn't know that
we were going to all walk out of the hospital together,

(01:02:12):
and it's like Okay, that's why all of this is important,
or like that's why I'm not going to give my
energy to this, Like it's not worth it. I don't
I don't have it in me. I can't do it.
It's like these hard these hard things that happened to
us that we go through, we don't wish for, but
at the same time, they give so much meaning and
purpose back into our lives. And it's like this weird

(01:02:32):
thing if we do not wish it, but like, can
you imagine your life without this and with this instant
honestly instant, Like I wouldn't wish it on anyone, And
I'm not like happy I went through it, but like
it's such a huge part of my life that I
wouldn't I don't know what my life would be without
having gone through that. Like I don't know what I
would be without having gone through that. Yeah, this is

(01:02:55):
your new form, and we like you for it. I'm
happy here, thank you for being a guest and share
your story. I know that it will save lives, change lives,
transform lives, uplift lives. And I know that it's not
like you're natural to speak to the public. So I
really really do appreciate it, and I love you. I
love you. Thanks for having me