June 30, 2023 • 56 mins
For my 35th birthday, I wanted to bring you something different. Share a part of myself you’ve probably never seen before — which is me when I’m with my best friends. Geri has been my best friend for 25 years, and when she met Lulu, her wife, I gained another best friend. I always understand myself better after being with them — this convo will have you laughing, thinking in new ways about all things life, relationships, and social media, and hopefully, adding a new dimension to how you see me.
I sincerely hope you feel like you’re just hanging out with your best friends in your own home while listening to this episode!
<3
In this convo, we spill:
- Social media trends: why they became a creative block to Lisa’s inspiration
- Why Lisa can share without tripping herself up about how it will read in the future
- Cancel Culture: would it be that bad?
- Social Sharing: can we be present if we’re documenting?
- Unpopular opinions the three of us hold: funny, thought-provoking, and hypocritical
- Health technology: is it making us healthy?
- Boundaries: why Lisa lays them on thick AND thinks they don’t need to be verbally explained
- Lisa’s traditional life choices: would she reconsider?
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The Truthiest Life on Instagram @thetruthiestlife
Host @lisahayim
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Edited by Houston Tilley
Intro Jingle by Alyssa Chase aka @findyoursails
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
I know you'll be.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Even when times gethard and you feel you're in the.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
C see just how beautiful life can be.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
When you saften your heart, you can finally start to
live your tu.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
See us life.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Hello everybody, and welcome back. I am here in Miami,
Florida on my birthday trip with my family. I turned
thirty five the day this episode comes out, which is
kind of wild because thirty felt like a minute ago
and here I am five years later, and that terrifies
(00:52):
me how fast it all goes. And all I've been
trying to do with time is learn to relate to
it differently, because I think we all know there are
times in our lives when things like fly by because
we're rushing, and then there are times when things move
slowly and we savor it. And time is always time,
but it is how we bring our nervous system to
(01:14):
the table that really changes how things feel and the
spaciousness that we create. Anyway, this is also our season finale,
and we have a plan to pick back up in
the fall. I had slated this episode out as a
solo to impart some sort of thirty five years of
Wisdom upon You, but as the days have creeped up
(01:36):
closer to it. I have not felt like I have this.
I don't know clear wisdom to share with you, and
anything more profound I feel like would be forced. This
year was an incredibly tough one for me. I went
through a lot of life things, real life things that
have definitely taught me a lot. But in this moment,
(01:59):
I don't feel like I have a perfect bow to
wrap on this past year of my life, no profound
wisdom at the surface of my brain. There has been devastation.
There has been surrendering. There has been a lot of
praying that the worst has been behind me. There has
been depletion and repletion, and I think coolest of all,
(02:23):
there has been gratitude. Without practicing like gratitude with a
gratitude journal. This past year has just opened me up
to feel grateful for the small things in a way
that has me feeling really good inside at a lot
of the times. One of the ways that I nursed
(02:45):
and nourished myself back to self I just wanted to
share in case you're in the hard throes of it
right now, was really taking a big step back from
my to do list healing in all the ways that
felt really right, whether that was just growing up to
yoga or spending more time with my friends, not actually
not time, spending more energy with my friends, spending more
(03:08):
energy doing all of the things. Not the time because
we could give time easily, but to give our energy
and present to people and things in a world that
is always trying to steal our presence is very, very
a different thing. And my female friendships in particular have
been huge for me. And it's not just the serious
(03:30):
conversations that we've had, it's the joy that comes from
being around them, whether it's a playful dance party or
sending each other memes. There's just something about female friendships
that have been incredibly healing for me. So for this
episode coming up, this is nothing like I've ever done before.
From the way that our microphones are hitting and the
(03:54):
way the conversation flows so organically and undescripted, it fully
will provide you with a greater sense of who I am.
So for this episode, I brought on my two best friends,
Jerry and Lulu. Jerry is my best friend since we
were thirteen years old, and my brother married her sister.
(04:15):
So my brother Greg married her sister Lauren. They have
two kids, Hunter and Ryan. Jerry and I are aunts
to the same kid, so my best friend became my family.
And then Jerry met Lulu. They got married, and Lulu
is brilliant and her brain works in such a different way.
And I gained another sister, another best friend. Who are
the two people that always help me see myself so
(04:37):
much more clearly because they ask such good questions, They're
so deeply present when I'm with them, and I inspire
to live like them in so many ways. I'm honestly
so excited for you to meet them because they're hilarious
and beautiful on the inside and out. And our conversation
starts with Lulu, who's lactating, never been pregnant before. But
(04:59):
it's just a very funny, light episode that I had
a lot of fun recording, and I think that you'll
also enjoy listening too. So for this episode, you don't
need like a pen and paper to take notes, but
maybe go for a walk and enjoy a light episode
that will make you probably want to pick up the
phone and call your best friend and have a conversation
(05:20):
with them too. Best friends, female friendships are the best,
and I'm so excited to share this other part of
me that you've probably never seen before. I know a
lot of you do want more of me, and I
hope you get a glimpse into that by adding this
dimension into this mix. I will definitely miss being on
(05:41):
the mic over the summer, but I'm also really looking
forward to the spaciousness that I need to be present,
get clear, resettle back into my body after this year,
and really see what comes from giving myself the space
to just be in my favorite season of the whole year.
(06:02):
Thank you so much for being here. I am so
grateful to do this work. Okay, I hope you all this episode.
Speaker 4 (06:08):
Faye.
Speaker 5 (06:10):
I thought I was like showing my vulnerability. I was like,
I'm lactating here, I'm here.
Speaker 6 (06:14):
For the podcast.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
You can we can keep this.
Speaker 6 (06:16):
I'm here and I'm lactating.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
It's worth sharing, huh with excitement?
Speaker 6 (06:22):
Lactating with excitement? No, that sounds so perverse.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
It's worth sharing because somebody out there might be alone
in this.
Speaker 6 (06:28):
Yeah, it might be something that your listener's really bond with.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
So Lulu has you've never been pregnant.
Speaker 6 (06:34):
I've never been pregnant. I am not pregnant.
Speaker 5 (06:37):
I'm in a gay relationship, and there's no chance of
being pregnant unless somebody cheats on somebody, and so and nevertheless,
I'm lactating. I'm lactating. It started about three weeks ago,
and milk just started pouring forth. In the beginning, I
(06:57):
didn't understand why. I was like occasionally like wet in
the chest. And then and then I looked down and
there were these white, milky droplets coming from my nipples
and I couldn't believe it. And then I started squirting.
Speaker 6 (07:11):
Which was even more what does it mean?
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Squirting?
Speaker 6 (07:13):
Like it's in Like it's like a jet.
Speaker 4 (07:15):
It's like.
Speaker 5 (07:18):
So Jerry actually hasn't seen it because she keeps on
missing it. It's like lightning striking. And I'm like, Jerry,
you just missed it. You missed it again. And so
what we're trying to do is not milk for two
days so that we can get a build up and
then we can.
Speaker 6 (07:33):
Do a test.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
So this is new information to me. I actually just
saw it. Some wetness on your shirt? Is it both boobs?
Speaker 6 (07:42):
Both?
Speaker 5 (07:43):
It was only the left in the beginning, and then
the right joined it.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
I'm not sure if it's biologically worrisome or beautiful.
Speaker 6 (07:53):
I don't know. I don't know. There's nothing on the
internet that makes it seem concerned.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
That thanks dropping. Stop fidgeting. Jerry is so nervous.
Speaker 5 (08:05):
Okay, it's not even you on the line, Jerry, just
sit down.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
You're not even the one LAC dating. We can't keep
Jerry at the Do you want to introduce yourself.
Speaker 6 (08:20):
Coming back?
Speaker 3 (08:21):
I kept saying, this is reminding me of Jerry. At
some point it's about Mitzvah. I think this happened. We
had a shared about Mitzvah, and I think you were
really freaking out, and it's just like very surprising because
you're naturally very chill.
Speaker 6 (08:34):
But stage no.
Speaker 5 (08:36):
Sorry, I saw you for Lisa's wedding on the rehearsal dinner.
Speaker 6 (08:39):
You fucking killed it. You were so easy.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
You were so natural, you was you took You've got
the whole room like tip of your tongue, not what's
it called. You had the whole room at the the
yeah of your.
Speaker 6 (09:04):
Oh you had them eating out of your hands.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 5 (09:07):
Do you have them eating out of your hands? And
you just delivered the best.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
You guys just got punked. I'm really you guys, got punked.
This is your pilot episode of the podcast of Jerry
and Lulu. M.
Speaker 5 (09:25):
Well, it's not gonna you got punked.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
You've been canceled after the pilot.
Speaker 5 (09:34):
I think I think I would. I don't I think
I would be canceled. I think I would be scared
to be canceled if I was to have a podcast,
Like I'm surprised that, like anybody has the goal to
make make commitments, Like, how do you deal with that?
Speaker 6 (09:51):
Like, aren't you scared of being canceled all the time?
Speaker 3 (09:55):
I'm sure there is like a deep rooted fear of
being actually canceled, and like the publicity that I've seen
that comes along with like being truly canceled. But then
I also, like, deep down sometimes want to be canceled.
Ooh no, sorry, the surface levels I want to be canceled.
The deep down is like nobody wants to be canceled
because it's like a sense of social not belonging and rejection,
(10:19):
and that would obviously feel awful and come with like
really strange consequences of not knowing like who still likes you,
who doesn't like you, who's talking about you, who's not.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So what's the desire to be canceled.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Then just like kind of like be done with like
being afraid to fully speak certain opinions that I have,
and then like everybody who like is on the cusp
about me is just kind of gone.
Speaker 5 (10:43):
You know, you would filter out your audience and filter
the people who are remaining of the people who like
you would want to have.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Do with, right, because then you're like free to really
say whatever you want if you got canceled on like
some major thing. Right, So like you just get rid
of everybody who didn't who like can't stand for you
being multi dimensional? Yeah or dynamic? How'd that conversation get there?
Are you guys good interviewers? No, just just wrap up
(11:12):
the lactating thing real quick here, just to bring it
back full circle. This is a phenomenon to me. I
think that's so.
Speaker 6 (11:19):
It is weird.
Speaker 5 (11:19):
It is weird, And actually I can't tell my friend
Lara about it, So I hope she never listened to
this podcast, because when I told my friend Lara about
my friend, she was like, she was like gagging. She
was like it's disgusting. She was like, it's actually revolting.
Do you remember we were telling her about it?
Speaker 6 (11:33):
At dinner. She was like, please don't, I'm eating.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
The worse is now you can't tell your friend that
knows that that person would have thought that it was gross.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
Yeah, well this is made for the US. This is
us only. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
Well, I mean I think it's kind of interesting though
when people, like most people when I was breastfeeding, were
like so into it. And then I have one friend
who was totally like, oh my god, please stop talking
about breastfeeding. And she was a female too, and I
found it just like interesting, like and I just like
respect that, like that's like her reaction to it.
Speaker 5 (12:05):
The only I don't know that I remember about like
breastfeeding is or like what I think about breastfeeding is
I remember my mom when I was younger, was reading
a romance novel and she burst out laughing and I
was like, what's funny, and she was just like, oh,
this man is trying to have sex with this woman
and she just squatted milk into his mouth and I
was so young and I was like what.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
And that's like, see why this is also fascinating is
I never leaked when I was breastfeeding. I have a
friend who's leaking all the time to brestighten it. Oh, yes,
I do not like mine. But again, I just want
to nail him the point that you're not pregnant. I've
never been pregnant. This is just happening.
Speaker 5 (12:44):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't know what's happening, but it
is happening.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
But you said that there could be some real hormonal
fluctuations that could cause it's obviously if you have medical
concerns and are going through this, please see your doctor.
Speaker 6 (12:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (12:58):
Like, I wonder whether it has anything to do with
feeling broody and like wanting kids. But I don't think
the feeling of wanting kids is so strong.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
I mean, it did happen when you saw it solely
my daughter, So I think that's where it's notice.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Yeah, yeah, like tearing up.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
But oh, to be a woman, the many confusing ways
it is to be a woman.
Speaker 6 (13:25):
I thought it was interesting what you were saying about canceling.
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Like one of the reasons why on the surface you
would like it is because then you would like filter
out and you would just be able to be like
who you are or like allow for like the multifacetness
of you to come through. Do you feel like there
are lots of sides of you that you feel like
you have to edit out because it's like not part
(13:48):
of the brand.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
H I wouldn't say that I operate from a like
a place of like brand, and that is like both
great and not great at the same time. It's great
because I don't burn out, but it's not great because
I don't think that i've I have tapped into like
true potential of building a business, like I think when
(14:13):
I change my Instagram from the well Necessities to the
to Lisa Haim, I thought that that was like a
really good thing, and I still do think it was
the right move and I would do it again, but
it actually like it created a more me version of
me versus like a business that I have that I
put out that is this niche you know? Hm. So
I think that I don't ask that question of like
(14:37):
is that on brand or is that not on brand?
And maybe I should Maybe then I would be like
growing more, have more followers or more this and more that.
But I just burn out really fast if it's not
coming from a place of like true authenticity. And not
to say that everybody who has a brand based off
of their person is like inauthentic, but I think that
it's like more challenging to like always stay in that
(14:57):
like narrow lane. But at the same time, then it
becomes more of like a job, right, Like my job
is to serve, and I serve and I give you know,
people recipes, right, So they're always talking about recipes. They're
not going to talk about politics one day, or their
relationship or things like that. And I think that can
be really beautiful because they really preserve like their whole
(15:18):
self for their like real life. Like my friend Olivia
came on my podcast and really talked about like how
she saves her like real self. I don't remember if
that was the words that she used for her you know,
real people. And I think I don't know. Would you
guys agree that, like you get a different version of
me than the internet? Jerry looks like she's got something
to say here.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
I think there's consistency.
Speaker 6 (15:37):
I'm not shocked.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
I don't think that you're in conflict with who you
are online. There's different intimacies, Like I do think that
you have a private life.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Right, yeah, or there's more.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
We just have history that would be probably uninteresting or
too particular to share with people, right, And that's what
a lot of our relationship is.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
I think that I am in more. I'm in relationship
with people a lot more like we are in relationship
to each other. And like on the Internet, I'm talking
to a screen, which obviously people are listening, but it's
it's very it feels very one way, even though it's
like not it's being received, but nobody's talking back to me.
So then like the reason that I like, you know,
(16:17):
like Lulu, you were supposed to come on the retreat
and like why I went on my met treat with
you guys is because I think I'm able to like
penetrate different levels of self by way of having conversations
with people. So I've always struggled with the unique dimensional
version of social media, how it's speaking to your audience.
Even if there's comment sections, it's like not usually a
(16:39):
conversation in the real way that I agreed.
Speaker 4 (16:42):
I don't mean, like when you post, it doesn't resonate
with me in the same way that having a conversation
with you does. Right, we could talk forever and it
would never feel long. But like I can't read, it's
not the format that works for me. So when there's
a ton of text coordinated with a photo, right, it
will never land in the same way way, And that's
probably that would probably be with a lot of people, right,
(17:04):
Like if it was a stranger, I would don't know
that I'd be able to identify with a stranger that
I found online through that format, but definitely not with you.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Like have you ever actually identified with like an Instagram
personality or celebrity or anything.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
Yeah, if I had to think about random people that
I followed, but it would it would probably be like
more spoken word or video content.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
True, so that it Mind'm just curious, Lou, are you
thinking of somebody for her?
Speaker 4 (17:36):
Oh?
Speaker 6 (17:36):
I think like you really like Young Me for example?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Who's that?
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Oh yeah, well that's through humor.
Speaker 4 (17:43):
She's a comedian, right, yeah, she's a comedian and she's
amazing so sharp.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
It's like, what's a joke that she tells?
Speaker 4 (17:50):
It's not like not that I can't really reiterate, but
she does. She just souls amazing memes and just has
like a really good take on a lot.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
Of She's insightful.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
How did Young Me do you find out?
Speaker 5 (18:01):
Like there's so many different personalities online and you also
like talk to so many different people. Do you find
it hard to know how to stay true to like
what you want to talk about and like stay true
to you rather than being like, what's what's the difference
between like being open minded and like hearing about loads
of ideas and like not being carried away and like knowing, okay,
(18:25):
good you want to focus on.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
I've never been influenced by like what people are posting
in terms of like, oh, this is what people are
saying and it performs well, and then you should talk
about that because I can't like write or think from
that place. But I have definitely been not inauthentic, but
like struggled with the format of Instagram as it's changed,
like everybody, When Reels came out, I was so excited
(18:50):
because I actually do like video editing. I like making videos.
I think it's like more fun to deliver information via videos.
But then it was like, wait, physical humor what you
like to move? Yeah? I like to move, like And
I was never good at taking pictures, so I always
like struggled with like posing and or like taking pictures
of my food. Everything always felt so weird and interruptive
(19:11):
to like life, like let me everyone stop eating so
I could get this picture perfect thing that I'm gonna
put on my feet and then do the restaurant, you know.
Is like it was just interruptive or reels was exciting,
but then as reels continued and then TikTok happened, it
was like, no, you don't make reels by just like
creating a video and speaking and talking about I don't know,
we'll talk about nutrition or learning to listen to your
(19:31):
body or yoga or anything. It's like it's in the
systematic format that retains people's attention, whether it's like a
dance to a catchy song or a trend pointing to
different words on the screen. I don't if you remember
when people were doing like the point of a lot,
you know, or like certain songs, like it became such
a way to do reels that I like lost inspiration.
(19:52):
So it's like I have all of these ideas in
my head of topics that I want to talk about,
but figuring out how to execute and like bundle that
into what Instagram wants so that it gets to people
has been a roadblock for me. And it's not to
say when I do like try to do it that
way that things don't go well, but it just feels
like so much more of a task that that feels
(20:14):
inauthentic versus like when Instagram started and I would just
like have a thought and I would just like pair
it with a random photo, it just like flowed through me,
versus like, Okay, here's my content idea. Now I have
to like put this camera here and feel me doing
this and then do a voiceover and then put text.
I don't know, it just became so cumbersome. Ye, the
mix of just I don't know what used to feel
(20:35):
very simple. I still think video is great.
Speaker 5 (20:38):
But what is a trend at the moment that you're
just like cannot. What is a trend at the moment
that you're just like.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Cannot, I honestly don't know. I think I have like
a new, accidental, great new relationship to Instagram where I'm
truly viewing it as an app. Is that how you
guys use it? Like I'm going to open my phone
and open this app? Or is it like reflexive for
you as a user?
Speaker 7 (21:07):
No?
Speaker 5 (21:07):
For me, definitely, it's like it's like an app that
like I occasionally like visit, and I think I have
a pretty healthy relationship with it. Well always I've never
been like that attached to it, to be honest, you're
off it for a while, yeah, Like then I came
off it for like six months, if not a bit longer,
which was nice in the beginning, and then after a
(21:28):
while I just was like, oh, I'm actually missing out
on like a lot of news and just basic keeping
in touch with people, and so it's not like an
all or nothing relationship at all.
Speaker 3 (21:38):
I think we talked about this, but I had and
I said it on another podcast episode that you and
I had a conversation about you going off of Instagram
and you're like, hey, I think I want to come
back because like it's kind of like how far can
the pendulum swing go kind of a thing. And I
was like, wow, you're so right, Like we can't pretend
that it doesn't exist, because it is a source of
news and like what's going on around not that you
(22:01):
can't get that somewhere else. But I thought that was
super interesting.
Speaker 5 (22:06):
Yeah, it's about funding the balance like with it, definitely.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
But that's really hard when it's designed to be addictive, addictive,
Like it's so addictive. Okay, So going back to the question,
I think that I've gotten so good at like not
not treating it like I open my phone and then
I'm on Instagram and then I'm gonna watch stories. I
still do get sucked in occasionally, but I don't know.
I'm like literally not interested in what other people are
doing right now, and not that I ever I'm like
(22:31):
so interested, but I'm able to catch myself a little
more being like waste of time. Want to be with
my daughter, want to be with my husband, or I'm
with my husband and I want to actually be with
my husband because I'm next to him, but like this
is a block to intimacy, like emotional intimacy, me being
on my phone, him being on his phone. So all
to say that I don't even know what the trends
(22:52):
are right now. I do love TikTok. I find it
so much more funny inspirational, like I can like get
ideas of things to do. And I haven't been on
TikTok at all very much lately, so I don't even
know what the trends on there are. Do you guys
know the trends?
Speaker 6 (23:07):
I actually haven't been on them for ages. I haven't
been on TikTok for ages.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
You know what TikTok oh at all, But you have Instagram.
I do would have thought you would have made the
switch to TikTok and abandoned your wires worked.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
To know something. Now you watch my you know what
I mean.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
Remember you're like you got You're like, oh, you get
bed such funny stuff like me.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
Yeah, if you show me something we're watching together and
we're laughing at something together, then that feels like the
right amount.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Yeah, but I don't need something else.
Speaker 6 (23:36):
Yeah, we don't need another.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
I thought I didn't need something else either, And then
it was just like, but.
Speaker 5 (23:41):
It is different from Instagram, Like it is like a
welcome break and it feels like a joyful place like
versus Instagram, which is like, I mean, everybody knows what
Instagram is, but TikTok feels like just like a bit
lighter and more expansive.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
Like you're not getting people that are like pumping out
content every day for the sake of like content, Like
you're getting comedians that like otherwise wouldn't have had a platform,
or singer songwriters that like would have never gotten heard.
But but like, if you have good talent, you're rising
to the top much more fast than you would have been.
Like the industry otherwise mm or if you've got if
(24:18):
you're just like really able to articulate a concept, you know,
it picks up speed fast.
Speaker 6 (24:24):
Like who are you talking about earlier? I like the
kids who did.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
The song, Oh yeah, so the song that Evan loves
Take me to the River. I can stay swim and
I can swim anyway. It's a great song. I don't
know if that came from TikTok or Instagram, to be honest,
but the song went viral from two teenage kids at
Jesus Camp and they were otherwise like they have no
interest in being famous. They still don't want to be famous,
but the song just like blasted them to the top
(24:48):
because the song is so good and they just Jesus
gave them the lyrics and they give it back to
the world and it's so beautiful and they're so cute.
Speaker 5 (24:54):
That would literally read my dream for that to happen
to me, for me to like.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Do nothing, no, to do nothing, and.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
To like get recognized for like one of these like
little songs that I make.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
She wrote the best song.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
So here's a good opportunity. I do you do write
good song? Joy? What's your favorite song that was you
wrote a really good one yesterday. Can you sing it?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
It's pretty morbid?
Speaker 6 (25:17):
No, no, no no, can you.
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Go the less morbid one for just for like just
you know, introducing her people.
Speaker 6 (25:22):
To Maybe there will be one that comes to me.
Speaker 3 (25:25):
But there was one that I really loved that used
to sing, Cale's give me wonder.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
Bagels and bagels.
Speaker 5 (25:30):
They're coming to my house, curry puffs and curry puffs.
Speaker 6 (25:34):
I'll put them in my mouth.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
It is good. So it's a jingle. You're a jingle writer.
Speaker 6 (25:40):
That's a jingle.
Speaker 5 (25:41):
But like there's dirty tacos, dirty tacos, come meat shore,
dirty tacos.
Speaker 6 (25:51):
The Gods sauce, the god.
Speaker 5 (25:53):
Beans, they got everything you need to bring you to
your knees.
Speaker 6 (25:57):
It's dirty tacos.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
You heard that one before.
Speaker 5 (26:00):
It's business business, it's business time.
Speaker 6 (26:05):
It's busy. This is a show to go time.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
It's business as usual.
Speaker 6 (26:14):
It's business as usual.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
That came from that.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Came from the day that we did a two day
taco pop up and when when we were pushing our
cart home with our leftover bits and.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
Pieces video foot this one time which I was like,
oh my god, what's that My favorite song? And I
was like, oh my god, the song that I wrote
about the Postman box or something like that. She was like, no,
the Beyonce song.
Speaker 6 (26:41):
I was like, oh my god, what of mine?
Speaker 3 (26:43):
See if this was a video podcast, which you guys
didn't want video, but if we had video, we'd be
able to take that clip.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
I'll share it with the people.
Speaker 3 (26:49):
Okay, yeah, I think that would be a good maybe
promo for this episode.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
It's very good.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
It's business.
Speaker 6 (26:55):
It's really as usual.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Meanwhile, two day business, so for.
Speaker 5 (27:02):
Lisa's thirty fifth birthday, will lease two business. I feel
like what we would like to do in this interview
is ask you some spicy questions.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Spicy spicy which one you're thinking?
Speaker 5 (27:21):
But then like, when I'm asking you spicy questions, I'm like,
which part of you do you feel like you can't
bring to the table because of your brand? You're like, oh,
I don't really see this brand. I'm like, it's hard
because you're like answering in a very wise way.
Speaker 6 (27:35):
So I'm gonna so just.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
Swing it on the same page.
Speaker 6 (27:38):
Yeah, okay, It's funny.
Speaker 5 (27:41):
A lot of the questions actually that we wanted to
ask you you alluded to earlier in the day anyway, Like, Jerry,
why don't you why don't you go with this one?
Speaker 4 (27:50):
I guess anytime I've looked back at something that I
thought was meaningful in writing, Yeah, like an old journal
entry or something like that, there's some element that's like
a bit embarrassed.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
Cringe.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
Yeah, that feels too extreme and kind of like too
on trend. But it's just like something more to the core.
Wh're like, like, I don't really need to revisit that.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
I know where this is going.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
I don't think you do.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
It's more like do I feel that way you make
a career or you just push past that all the time.
Speaker 3 (28:22):
But that's the thing. I never looked back. I don't
want to look back.
Speaker 1 (28:25):
No, but that's good, right.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
So here I am like I can hardly even take
one step forward because I'm too concerned. I think calling
it like insecurity would be oversimplifying it. But it's like
just too concerned with how things will be.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Leaving an imprint. Yeah, No, I think that's intentional. I
think that could be beautifully intentional. I think we have different
parts of the brain that are activated and like mine
is really good at like just but what is that
survival you guys are both good at that.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
Set it and forget it, just chucking on, Like you
don't mind having a conversation.
Speaker 3 (28:59):
Listen, if I would, I like saw something that I
wrote and I was like, I would probably archive the
post and just like pretend it never happened. Right, But
I don't look back very often, but it exists.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
But there's something about just continuing to put yourself out there.
And that's for anyone. That is a type of vulnerability.
And maybe it's like not that you have so much
so much exposure, not that everyone has so much exposure,
but like, even if it was just for myself, even
in this.
Speaker 3 (29:26):
Part of my brain not firing, that should that should
be like, oh, future, look back.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
But that worked, But I think that stopped. That's what
stops a lot of people.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
Right, but maybe in a good way.
Speaker 4 (29:36):
No, because you're creating so much stuff that's helpful and
impactful for people in a really good way. Yeah, And
it's not like you can't recover if you made a mistake. Yeah,
if you've said something embarrassing or regrettable.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
Or whatever it is.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
Right, So you want to.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
Know, yeah, how do you how do you tick?
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Like, how do you kind of like I said in
the beginning, like it also feels like for me to speak, write, share,
it has to come from this like energetic blaze. And
when you're like in that energetic blaze, you're like not
thinking necessarily so clearly mm So like even for this
podcast episode, right, like I was like, I slay it
(30:13):
out my thirty fifth birthday. I want to end the season,
and I don't know, maybe thirty five lessons, but like
I don't have the thirty five lessons, Like I'm sitting down.
It's like not coming out of me. But like if
I was like trying to fall asleep one night and
then it was like boom boom boom, my brain was
like thinking of all these things. Then it's like, yes,
I want to lead with this. It's like coming from
an awake place versus a cognitive place.
Speaker 5 (30:35):
Yeahah, it sounds like you're it's like lacking of self
awareness in a good way, as in you're just really present. Yeah,
you're just really present. You're just thinking what you're thinking.
You're not thinking about like how you're going to be
perceived or like the way in which you're coming across.
Speaker 3 (30:48):
You're just inflow, inflow, right, But over the years, I've
lost that flow because of many reasons. I think industry changes,
life changes. I used to just be twenty middle like
twenty five, twenty six when I started. I'm thirty five
now just naturally by maturation, mature. What's the word here,
(31:09):
that's sure, naturation. Maturation sounds like such a mature word itself.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
When you turn thirty five, you could use it.
Speaker 6 (31:15):
Yeah, a couple more years, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
Yeah, you've got Oh yeah, I was thinking you're turning
thirty five this year, You're not even I think by
way of maturation and like life changes, like I've taken
on a partner who like has a career, I take
I have a daughter who what's a whole other conversation about,
like social media and her and exploring what feels right
for her and probably changing a lot of things in
(31:39):
the next few years too. So I think that I've
I've lost that flow for some time. I'm really in
it right now, which is interesting, But then I'm also
going to go I think, take a social media break
in July or August or maybe both. I don't know
exactly yet. So it's funny to like be in this
flow or I actually am in that like boom boom
boom groove and then be quiet during that time.
Speaker 4 (31:59):
But social, I mean there's only one outlet, right you
still like you have a newsletter you.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
I want to take a break from everything for like
a month or two, just this beginning of this year
or the whole year. Really this last six months have
just been super confusing, dizzying, traumatic, all the emotions, adrenaline
that I feel like I just haven't fully like dropped
into self and like before I take my next step,
(32:24):
and I want to just like make space. And obviously
it's very privileged to be able to.
Speaker 5 (32:30):
It's really interesting because one of the questions that we
wanted to ask you was like, how does it feel
having grown up or done your adult thing? As if
somebody's basically reading your diary, Like how does that affect you?
Speaker 3 (32:45):
I don't think about the words so much as I
do have like regrets of just like moments that I
wish I was like more deeply present, but I was
like recording for something, you know, we're taking pictures, and
it just felt like that made sense for a lot
of years to like do both like oh, Evan and
I are going to Miami, and I you know, everybody
(33:06):
would love to see like what we're eating, right, so
everyonere eating, but then there's like a moment of that
that's like lost. I mean, Jerry and I went we
went to high school together, and I remember our English teacher,
Edward Belliwiot or teacher. We were in the special program.
It was when like social sharing was just starting to
come out. What did we have those Like we had
like these pages where every weekend we would upload photos.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Just between in just the class. No, I remember that it.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
Was like a social It was before social media. It
wasn't like shut orfly, but it was like it was
like a feed. And at the end of like every
Sunday we'd upload our pictures from like our new digital
cameras and then like you'd see like who was at
the party and who was there.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
Sure, it sounds vaguely familiar, but right.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
I remember it was called but I remember him being like,
but are you actually present? You're taking the picture? And
I'm like, yes, you're actively. He's like, but how can
you be because then you're taking the picture to be
perceived in the picture like you're having fun. And I
was like, I don't get it.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Who was the first to present, real existential dread.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
And dread and yeah, and now I get it. I'm like,
if the phone is there, it's a third party for
its party, six party whatever. That changes, yes, all right,
even this podcast right now, there's a microphone in her hand.
This conversation, as natural as it is, is different if
the microphone isn't.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
Here, definitely, Like, how do you feel like it has
affected your personal relationships? Like obviously having a podcast and
like having your social media presence, you've come into contact
with so many interesting new people and like broadened the
(34:47):
groups of people that you're talking to, But in terms
of your own personal relationships, like, how do you feel
like it's impacted them?
Speaker 3 (34:53):
I feel like, at least in my mind, there's this
really thick line between like personal team mey ish like
even though it's me, and then like the me that
is me and all of my friends who are my
real friends, Like most of them don't listen to my podcast,
most of them don't look at my social media, and
if they do, they see occasional posts like it's not
(35:14):
how we keep in touch. It's gotten blurry with some
friends that like I'm not going to say, like take
it at face value but like see something that I
post and then respond to that post or something, rather than.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Like find out what's really happening.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
Find out what's really happening. I mean that kind of
sounds like I'm like lying about something, which I'm not.
But it's just like there are certain people that have
like kind of gotten confused a little bit, but those
aren't like my real people. I don't know if that
answers the question.
Speaker 4 (35:41):
You've kind of always been at risk for that since
before all this.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
What do you mean?
Speaker 4 (35:46):
Remember we used to say, no joke the joke was,
and you were in on it, what the joke was. Yeah,
we would forget how great you were until we got
with you.
Speaker 3 (35:54):
Yeah, but no, I don't mean that. I know that's
the thing about me. Everybody forgets.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Just to expand on that.
Speaker 4 (36:00):
Our sibling friend group, we would joke that once we
were with you in person again, I would be like, oh, yeah,
Lisa is the best. But as soon as we would
have any distance, it would just for some reason, you
were just prone to being diluted to some shallow, I know, assumptions.
Speaker 3 (36:15):
But now I don't feel that.
Speaker 4 (36:16):
No, it's not exactly, no, it is it is a
funny attachment that I think we all remember, you identify
you were the one that figured that out.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
You were, don't you guys remember?
Speaker 3 (36:25):
But I also feel it. I feel it when people
perceive me as like just being right you said in
the beating, not multi dimensional. At the time, we would
just chalk it up to like, oh, Lisa like shoes,
like whatever.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
You came up with that, and it was just like,
oh yeah, that was kind of on the nose, you're right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
And then when they're with me, they're like, oh yeah,
you've got You've got the layers beneath, and they're kind
of shocked, and it's weirds. I'm not like super pretty,
you know, somebody's like super pretty forget Oh yeah, not
like so pretty.
Speaker 7 (36:50):
You're accessible, approachable, you know, yeah, sometimes attractive to some
people not to others.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
It's not like, you know, no, that's so. I don't
know why I got that vibe, why I give that vibe,
or if I still does it still hold true or
do we talk about But I think maybe.
Speaker 5 (37:07):
That's just like what happens to anybody who's like in
the public eye.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
It was before that she was doomed. It was us
or maybe I'm saying, maybe that's something.
Speaker 6 (37:20):
Hate that sounds like he's gonna hate it. Sounds like jealousy.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
Jealous of me.
Speaker 6 (37:24):
Yeah, jealous.
Speaker 3 (37:26):
My brother's jealous. Everybody's jealous. Jealous.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
Speaking which unpopular opinions? Should we do one.
Speaker 3 (37:37):
For the day, I'm gonna keep on light. But yeah,
has your just because it's super.
Speaker 4 (37:42):
Has your audience been introduced? I mean, not that it's
a new idea an unpopular opinion, but just what you
You kind of played this game with us where it
was just like here's a safe space, now, like offer
up an unpopular opinion, got it, and let's just leave
it on the floor and see if we could all
accept it.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Accept it?
Speaker 3 (37:58):
Okay, fine, you go first.
Speaker 5 (38:01):
Lulu had one, Well mine, I said mine the other
day and I didn't realize it was a popular opinion.
I just said, I wish that I spent more time
on my phone. Like I just when I'm with Jerry,
she's just like on her phone and she's just like
doing shit and like staying connected and is like talking
to people having full blown conversations while I'm there, and
(38:21):
like I'm just like I really respect that she's just
like on her phone. And I'm just there like blah
blah blah blah, like or like you know whatever, I'm
just like looking at you. And then you're just like
on your phone, and I'm just like, what am I
not on my phone? Just like I really wish that
I was spending more serious time connected to all the
(38:44):
different apps on my phone?
Speaker 3 (38:46):
Do you mean like connected to different people.
Speaker 1 (38:48):
In your life? That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (38:50):
I couldn't even understand it was And double you're just
insulting me because it's an unpopular opinion and you're you're
ascribing it to me like I just sound like the.
Speaker 3 (38:59):
World and you're like not even on your phone a lot,
I don't write.
Speaker 4 (39:03):
You're like, like, why are you being so defensive?
Speaker 1 (39:06):
That's admirable. I was like, there's nothing.
Speaker 3 (39:10):
I think you meant something else, No, I don't, really.
Speaker 5 (39:14):
I really mean like it could be a variety of
different things, like yes, maybe it's messaging my friends, but
it's also like being on Instagram, being on TikTok, or
reading the news or like news apps or something like that,
like just the whole gamut, like gamot, is.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
That what you guys say?
Speaker 3 (39:34):
It?
Speaker 6 (39:35):
The whole gamut? Gamut.
Speaker 5 (39:41):
So I just think it seems like an adult way
to live your life. I feel like I'm not adulting.
Speaker 3 (39:54):
That's so I can't accept it.
Speaker 6 (39:57):
By not being on my phone as little as I am.
Speaker 5 (39:59):
Like the the fact that I have messages that are
on read for five hours, I think for most people
is like an unacceptable standard of communication. And I think
that they're right. But for me, I'm just like I
could leave my phone at home. Yeah, and I just like, whoop,
So you don't care where it is.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
I think that that's yeah, I love it.
Speaker 5 (40:21):
I guess that that's a goal, but like it's nonsense. Guys,
I'm telling you from the other side. You don't want
to be here.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
What's happening to you over there? It's just you're more present.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
People will need to hear it from you. Hear from you. Yeah,
we get to Jerry if we need.
Speaker 6 (40:36):
No, I think. But that's the thing.
Speaker 5 (40:37):
I think that the people that the news that really
needs to get to me and the people that I
really need to speak to, I often miss opportunities, Like
our world is faster paced and it would be really
nice to go like, oh, I really want to slow down.
But when you slow down you take yourself away from it.
You just have to accept the reality that the world
(40:57):
is fast and that people are getting instant respond and
the news.
Speaker 6 (41:01):
Is changing over a dime. And I don't but it is.
Speaker 5 (41:05):
I'm telling you, when you're not in the cycle, it
feels irresponsible.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
All right, Someone go surface and the non surface surfaces.
We just went to this gelatteria, no plateria. What do
they call it? Yeah, what's it called. It's like a
popsicle place, but it's like a name for it, clo
popsic paleta bar that's what they call it. Whatever, and
their new flavor. It was like, wow, new flavor. No.
(41:33):
I was so offended by their new flavor of the
ice creab cup goat cheese cheese olive popsicle.
Speaker 6 (41:46):
Oh yeah, awful.
Speaker 3 (41:48):
Oh made me sick. Okay, anyway, that's my surface on
surface is I am perpetuating this? So I am part
of quote unquote problem. But like true wellness is like
hypocritical to technology. Obviously it's not black and white, but
I find it hard to believe that we can truly
like be well and like be on our phones going
(42:10):
back to yours. As much as we are reliant on
Instagram for all of our health information or wellness information,
and going even further, like health tech I think is
like the biggest like ruse, like wearable technology to find
out about your sleep and you're trying and how many
steps you took and all that stuff. It's like it's
so opposite, like wellness to me should be stripped down.
(42:32):
It should be simple, it should be connected to self.
And I know that these industries are booming industries, and
I do again just like not fully black and white,
like there's value in information, but there's like this huge
crux of like how well are we if we're always
on our phones? Very well in my right, right right right, right,
(42:53):
right right, but like I think we also don't know
the true health effects of staring at a screen from
like the curves of our spine changing to our eyesight
from an led background, you know, back to us to
holding the phone in our hand with like decrepit thumbs,
to EMF and bluetooth and all of that, to things
(43:14):
I probably can't even you know, put into words. So
it's like here I am, let me teach you about
health and wellness, but also listen to my podcast, stay
on my page, do this that did it? Like for me,
like that feels participatory at this time. But there's like
an unpopular opinion within me of like this can't be it. Yeah,
(43:35):
So like, first of all, do I choose wellness and
health for myself and go off of the grid, right,
or I don't know how that land for you?
Speaker 1 (43:44):
Yeah? Good?
Speaker 3 (43:45):
I mean I feel my healthiest and most well like
detached from all of it when I keep my cel
phone at home, you know, and obviously, like you said,
there's a level of responsibility to it. Especially I think
that word is good because since having solely I've been
on my phone more than ever multiple reasons. Some were
some because if the phone makes you feel like you're
being responsible, Oh, let me google this rash that she
(44:07):
has let me just but like that could be more harmful,
and then other reasons of just like if I leave
the house right, I want to know whoever's taking care
of hercul get in touch with me. So I think
that these smartphones are not smart at all.
Speaker 4 (44:20):
Oh that that that brings me to mind. Maybe this
isn't an unpopular opinion. But the other day I said
to you, I think maybe it's it's good to present
things as truths even when you haven't fact checked them.
Why because I think we're too dependent on Google and like,
and like, you know, a generation ago, people were just
(44:42):
saying things with the confidence that they had from whatever
experience they had or whoever told them, the trust that
they had and whatever was passed down to them, and
they believed it and like probably believed it through some
sort of experience and that was enough, right, And sure,
like there's maybe potential for some thing's being damaging or
some sort of like knock on effect that isn't positive,
(45:04):
But for the most part, that's a I think that's
a pretty positive thing. It's just like take it for
what it is, incorporate something that you've learned into your
own life, and then you can tell someone that without
saying I haven't looked this up or I'm not sure
if it's true, but I think that you.
Speaker 3 (45:18):
Know, the research have to say on that, like as
if it's not harmful, right, and like, people are gonna
believe that this helps with that it gives them something
to do and put their energy forth.
Speaker 6 (45:30):
And you disagreed, Yeah, I really disagree.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
I think the world needs to be more accepting of
complexity and put that vague, like and how vague things
can be.
Speaker 3 (45:43):
But I don't think the phone or internet provides you
with more vagueness. It says like right and wrong.
Speaker 5 (45:48):
No, But I think what it does is you acknowledge
that people don't always have the right answers. And it's like,
if you go on Google, Google's not going to give
you one answer.
Speaker 6 (45:59):
It's also going to give you three different answers.
Speaker 3 (46:00):
But most people aren't going to get to the third
answer they look for the first.
Speaker 4 (46:03):
Well, it's Google's truth anyway, but it's still like, it
still feels like it's more weighted in, like fact truth
then you just sang it from your on.
Speaker 6 (46:10):
Yeah. I don't know.
Speaker 5 (46:12):
I just don't think there's anything wrong with people being
a little bit more humble about their abilities to like
be truth sayers.
Speaker 6 (46:21):
I think that that's gotten us into like a lot
of trouble in the past.
Speaker 3 (46:26):
I guess it depends on what the type of information
is too.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
Yeah. Yeah, I was telling you how to wash dishes.
Speaker 3 (46:30):
Better based on how your ancestors taught you to wash dishes. Yes, yes,
and Google had a different way.
Speaker 4 (46:36):
I didn't ask Google because I didn't need to know.
I'm not sure if you need to have hot water.
But I'm pretty sure based on my whole life's experience.
Speaker 3 (46:43):
You wash that cold A cold rint it was cold.
Speaker 1 (46:45):
Was happening, and I just was like, hot, it'll.
Speaker 3 (46:48):
Be better, yeah, but will it? You're right, will it?
Speaker 4 (46:51):
But like I know enough because I've done it enough
to know that, like right, I don't need Google.
Speaker 6 (46:57):
I know, but I just don't think it's like a
crying shame that you would like. But I'm not sure about.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
That because I felt like I had to double back
by the way before I go just telling you this
thing that you need the heat to cut the grease.
I'm not one hundred that's not that's not science. But
I just needed to know that. And then I was like,
why did I feel like I have to tell you
that that's not sign.
Speaker 3 (47:20):
The intricacies of relationships?
Speaker 4 (47:22):
And then I wanted to and then I sat down
and then I thought, that's it's an interesting thought now
that I thought that I had to tell you know, Like,
then I worked about backwards and I went back to
up to and I was just like, I've been thinking
about whether or not this is something that you need
to do. And then I presented this whole opinion about yeah,
and then there was like, no, you're wrong.
Speaker 1 (47:39):
We should find out if that's true or not.
Speaker 3 (47:41):
I've seen her get like this with you though too.
You guys are like too smart for each other's good.
Just like, all right, should we wrap up this episode?
Speaker 6 (47:52):
I don't feel like we got to the real Yeah,
we didn't really get to.
Speaker 3 (47:56):
One last one. We got to the crux. We had fun.
All I want to do is out with my best
friends and have fun and give the internet a taste
of how wonderful you both are.
Speaker 1 (48:03):
I'm looking okay, get punked.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
This is your part.
Speaker 5 (48:06):
Okay, Now we always as I don't think we have,
but it's anyway.
Speaker 6 (48:11):
Wait, you can say we were trying the commune.
Speaker 5 (48:15):
Oham, So we've talked about like the idea of like
commune living.
Speaker 1 (48:20):
The mom Mune.
Speaker 3 (48:21):
You guys are moms yet, but yeah, we could help. Yes,
you don't have to be.
Speaker 6 (48:29):
Like that's the thing about the mom Mune. You don't
have to be a mom.
Speaker 3 (48:32):
Yes, to be part of it, I do think you
should be largely female. Oh interesting, Well, like what men
would I need? Go on with the question.
Speaker 1 (48:41):
Yeah, well, anyway, you've chosen a.
Speaker 3 (48:43):
Man, right, to be in my village.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
Well, we're not sure. That's this is the this is
the question. So we love Evan.
Speaker 4 (48:50):
So you you have chosen like a pretty traditional nuclear
family set up, and we're just we were.
Speaker 3 (48:56):
We were basic nuclear equals basic. Yeah, already for boring suburbs.
Speaker 4 (49:01):
I get it reduced to the lowest common Yeah. So
if the commune was a real option, do you think
you're ready or would you take it?
Speaker 6 (49:08):
Okay?
Speaker 3 (49:09):
So the commune being we all live together.
Speaker 5 (49:10):
Yea, and it's like we have like equal responsibility for
the different children. So like Rye Hunters, they all come under.
Speaker 3 (49:19):
So we all share, we share a family jo. The
three of us are aunts to the same hunter Ryan.
Speaker 1 (49:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (49:25):
So whatever, where at state are we going to live in?
Speaker 6 (49:28):
Not?
Speaker 3 (49:30):
Okay? So is the question what I leave Evan behind?
Speaker 5 (49:34):
Because we actually called it a commune, you wanted to
call it a mom mune and said, I think we.
Speaker 3 (49:38):
Need right right right right. I think we do need Evan.
He brings valuable skills.
Speaker 6 (49:44):
So the question skills if you had the.
Speaker 5 (49:47):
Starting fires no, so if you had the option, so
you know, you guys are like thinking about getting a
new place and instead of you guys getting in a
new place. It's like, actually, we're all going to buy
a new place together, so it's going to be ten
of us were.
Speaker 6 (49:58):
Living in an apartment and actually be like, your dad's
going to come.
Speaker 7 (50:01):
To dad, My dad gotta come, my mom coming to
this is this is a traumatic place for me.
Speaker 3 (50:12):
I don't want to be here. No, no, no.
Speaker 1 (50:13):
We can pick and choose.
Speaker 6 (50:14):
Yeah, you can pick and choose.
Speaker 5 (50:15):
But the idea that it's like a commune setting, would
you genuinely.
Speaker 6 (50:21):
Make the case to Evan and be like, maybe we
should uproo our.
Speaker 3 (50:24):
Lives genuinely, yes, I believe that that would be the
best thing for all of us. I think we would
not have cell phones. We would just be so like
sustainable within ourselves.
Speaker 1 (50:38):
Or also hunters and gatherers.
Speaker 3 (50:40):
Were sustainable in the sense that like.
Speaker 1 (50:43):
We have but we're living like in the world as
we know.
Speaker 3 (50:47):
It a lot less. We would be talking to each other. Mostly,
I think that it restores many of the things that
people have in the blue zones, which is where people
live the most, which is lots of socialness. I forget
the other thing zones. The blue zones are the areas
in the world that we've studied where people live the longest,
(51:08):
like long. Yeah, so the things that they do is
like what types of food that they eat. But the
huge thing that stands out is that they spend a
lot of time socializing and how like healthy that is.
And I think I would.
Speaker 6 (51:21):
Love I would love to live in a commune.
Speaker 3 (51:23):
I think the way we're living is just is just
so bad for mental health and we don't even realize it.
Speaker 5 (51:28):
And also like I think when you live in a
nuclear family, you're also like really people are really busy
keeping up pretenses and like keeping up like an image
of like what things are supposed to be. And I
think that like if you were living in a more
open community style setting, I think you would have a
lot more space for like real vulnerability.
Speaker 6 (51:50):
And real honesty.
Speaker 5 (51:51):
Like even with being able to talk a little bit
more about mental health, like in the recent years, it's
still presented.
Speaker 6 (51:59):
To you through social media through like.
Speaker 5 (52:01):
A lens of a filter, Whereas like I think if
you had community living like more people would really experience
what it is. And I don't know, I just think
it would be really healthy. So the final question is
something that is going to start with the statement first,
so we know that boundaries are really important to you,
(52:21):
and you've talked about the importance of boundaries before. So
what communication do you owe to people when you put
up boundaries towards them?
Speaker 6 (52:30):
Like? Do people?
Speaker 5 (52:32):
So yeah, do people deserve to be told? Like not all,
I'm putting up a boundary, So you think, so it's
okay to kind of just go cold turkey on someone.
Speaker 3 (52:42):
I think that you always have to make like a
boundary is meant to protect you. It's less about like
the other person in many of those circumstances. So it's
literally like what do you have the bandwidth for? If
you don't have the bandwidth to explain your boundary to
somebody else, like for whatever reason, whether it's feared, hired, exhaustion,
whatever reason, then you have to just create that boundary
(53:05):
without explanation. And many most of the people that I
have like created real boundaries with over time, have like
circled back and understood that it was a boundary without explaining,
and the relationship has been better for it. But in
that murky period, it's not always like that, and you
kind of have to sit with that. But I don't know,
I don't feel I said before, I've been a little psychopathic,
(53:26):
But no, I think I'm more like just focused on
such self preservation. When a boundary is laid that you
just have to like trust that it's for the better
of the relationship and it does create a new path,
but it's like a new pathway for the relationship too
to exist, and then it helps the other person like
do that for themselves or life.
Speaker 4 (53:45):
But there are a lot of people in your life that, yeah,
speak the same language, not just followers, but like people
in your peer group and work and whatever in whatever
element of work. But not everyone has that same emotional
intelligence or is in the pursuit of doing personal work
or would would have the awareness to see a boundary,
(54:05):
identify it, respect it, and then be able to like
grow through it.
Speaker 3 (54:09):
Also maybe they won't be able to verbalize it or
put into words, but like the eventual eventual eventual has
almost always been net positive for somebody that I've retained
a relationship mmm with. Again, they might not be like, wow,
thank you for putting down that boundary with me. Now
I understand how to better communicate with you and other
people in my life. Like maybe not not so literal, Yeah,
it's not so literal, but I don't know. I think
(54:31):
similar to like posting, right, It's like I'm not like
looking all around me. It's just like if a boundary
needs to be put in place, it's because something in
me is being chipped away, and it's for like restoration.
Speaker 7 (54:43):
M hm.
Speaker 3 (54:44):
So I no, I don't think that in all cases
you have to explain it, and certainly that word is
never well received, like this is a boundary that I'm lying, mmmm, right,
Like people get their back up against that and trying
to delicately put it in another way. If you have
to already lay the boundary, it's just like not always available.
(55:05):
It's true emotionally to put it in a sentence that
would be soft enough that they're not defensive, Like that's
so much emotional work just thinking about it right now,
and I'm not even in it's not and I'm just
thinking like hypothetically, right, I don't know. Maybe that's that's
how I do it, but that's not saying that's the
right way to do it.
Speaker 1 (55:23):
No, it makes sense.
Speaker 5 (55:25):
I think that that like that probably comes from being
able to like your answer comes from the ability to
know like what it is to responsibly set a boundary,
like so many people can't do it because they're like
worried about what other people are thinking or thinking about
the repercussions.
Speaker 6 (55:41):
But I guess, and it's not to.
Speaker 3 (55:43):
Say that I'm so great at it. And other times either,
like especially with family right where most people need boundaries
like I do have the same soft spots and re
enter cycles all the time. So I just don't want
to come off as like I'm an amazing boundary. Put
her down her and you should follow my steps. Just
answering that question. Okay, should we wrap up this episode?
Speaker 1 (56:03):
Guys?
Speaker 4 (56:04):
Yeah, well I see a commune in our future twenty
twenty five.
Speaker 5 (56:09):
That was the most interesting thing that we leaned out
of this interview is that it's a yes, but it's
a year ago.
Speaker 3 (56:15):
That you guys are New Yorkers.
Speaker 1 (56:17):
We are.
Speaker 3 (56:17):
We're gonna have to figure.
Speaker 1 (56:18):
Out that we're not right now.
Speaker 3 (56:22):
Thank you for sitting down talk to me. I love you, guys,
Love you.
I know you'll be.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Even when times gethard and you feel you're in the.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
C see just how beautiful life can be.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
When you saften your heart, you can finally start to
live your tu.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
See us life.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Hello everybody, and welcome back. I am here in Miami,
Florida on my birthday trip with my family. I turned
thirty five the day this episode comes out, which is
kind of wild because thirty felt like a minute ago
and here I am five years later, and that terrifies
(00:52):
me how fast it all goes. And all I've been
trying to do with time is learn to relate to
it differently, because I think we all know there are
times in our lives when things like fly by because
we're rushing, and then there are times when things move
slowly and we savor it. And time is always time,
but it is how we bring our nervous system to
(01:14):
the table that really changes how things feel and the
spaciousness that we create. Anyway, this is also our season finale,
and we have a plan to pick back up in
the fall. I had slated this episode out as a
solo to impart some sort of thirty five years of
Wisdom upon You, but as the days have creeped up
(01:36):
closer to it. I have not felt like I have this.
I don't know clear wisdom to share with you, and
anything more profound I feel like would be forced. This
year was an incredibly tough one for me. I went
through a lot of life things, real life things that
have definitely taught me a lot. But in this moment,
(01:59):
I don't feel like I have a perfect bow to
wrap on this past year of my life, no profound
wisdom at the surface of my brain. There has been devastation.
There has been surrendering. There has been a lot of
praying that the worst has been behind me. There has
been depletion and repletion, and I think coolest of all,
(02:23):
there has been gratitude. Without practicing like gratitude with a
gratitude journal. This past year has just opened me up
to feel grateful for the small things in a way
that has me feeling really good inside at a lot
of the times. One of the ways that I nursed
(02:45):
and nourished myself back to self I just wanted to
share in case you're in the hard throes of it
right now, was really taking a big step back from
my to do list healing in all the ways that
felt really right, whether that was just growing up to
yoga or spending more time with my friends, not actually
not time, spending more energy with my friends, spending more
(03:08):
energy doing all of the things. Not the time because
we could give time easily, but to give our energy
and present to people and things in a world that
is always trying to steal our presence is very, very
a different thing. And my female friendships in particular have
been huge for me. And it's not just the serious
(03:30):
conversations that we've had, it's the joy that comes from
being around them, whether it's a playful dance party or
sending each other memes. There's just something about female friendships
that have been incredibly healing for me. So for this
episode coming up, this is nothing like I've ever done before.
From the way that our microphones are hitting and the
(03:54):
way the conversation flows so organically and undescripted, it fully
will provide you with a greater sense of who I am.
So for this episode, I brought on my two best friends,
Jerry and Lulu. Jerry is my best friend since we
were thirteen years old, and my brother married her sister.
(04:15):
So my brother Greg married her sister Lauren. They have
two kids, Hunter and Ryan. Jerry and I are aunts
to the same kid, so my best friend became my family.
And then Jerry met Lulu. They got married, and Lulu
is brilliant and her brain works in such a different way.
And I gained another sister, another best friend. Who are
the two people that always help me see myself so
(04:37):
much more clearly because they ask such good questions, They're
so deeply present when I'm with them, and I inspire
to live like them in so many ways. I'm honestly
so excited for you to meet them because they're hilarious
and beautiful on the inside and out. And our conversation
starts with Lulu, who's lactating, never been pregnant before. But
(04:59):
it's just a very funny, light episode that I had
a lot of fun recording, and I think that you'll
also enjoy listening too. So for this episode, you don't
need like a pen and paper to take notes, but
maybe go for a walk and enjoy a light episode
that will make you probably want to pick up the
phone and call your best friend and have a conversation
(05:20):
with them too. Best friends, female friendships are the best,
and I'm so excited to share this other part of
me that you've probably never seen before. I know a
lot of you do want more of me, and I
hope you get a glimpse into that by adding this
dimension into this mix. I will definitely miss being on
(05:41):
the mic over the summer, but I'm also really looking
forward to the spaciousness that I need to be present,
get clear, resettle back into my body after this year,
and really see what comes from giving myself the space
to just be in my favorite season of the whole year.
(06:02):
Thank you so much for being here. I am so
grateful to do this work. Okay, I hope you all this episode.
Speaker 4 (06:08):
Faye.
Speaker 5 (06:10):
I thought I was like showing my vulnerability. I was like,
I'm lactating here, I'm here.
Speaker 6 (06:14):
For the podcast.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
You can we can keep this.
Speaker 6 (06:16):
I'm here and I'm lactating.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
It's worth sharing, huh with excitement?
Speaker 6 (06:22):
Lactating with excitement? No, that sounds so perverse.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
It's worth sharing because somebody out there might be alone
in this.
Speaker 6 (06:28):
Yeah, it might be something that your listener's really bond with.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
So Lulu has you've never been pregnant.
Speaker 6 (06:34):
I've never been pregnant. I am not pregnant.
Speaker 5 (06:37):
I'm in a gay relationship, and there's no chance of
being pregnant unless somebody cheats on somebody, and so and nevertheless,
I'm lactating. I'm lactating. It started about three weeks ago,
and milk just started pouring forth. In the beginning, I
(06:57):
didn't understand why. I was like occasionally like wet in
the chest. And then and then I looked down and
there were these white, milky droplets coming from my nipples
and I couldn't believe it. And then I started squirting.
Speaker 6 (07:11):
Which was even more what does it mean?
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Squirting?
Speaker 6 (07:13):
Like it's in Like it's like a jet.
Speaker 4 (07:15):
It's like.
Speaker 5 (07:18):
So Jerry actually hasn't seen it because she keeps on
missing it. It's like lightning striking. And I'm like, Jerry,
you just missed it. You missed it again. And so
what we're trying to do is not milk for two
days so that we can get a build up and
then we can.
Speaker 6 (07:33):
Do a test.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
So this is new information to me. I actually just
saw it. Some wetness on your shirt? Is it both boobs?
Speaker 6 (07:42):
Both?
Speaker 5 (07:43):
It was only the left in the beginning, and then
the right joined it.
Speaker 3 (07:47):
I'm not sure if it's biologically worrisome or beautiful.
Speaker 6 (07:53):
I don't know. I don't know. There's nothing on the
internet that makes it seem concerned.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
That thanks dropping. Stop fidgeting. Jerry is so nervous.
Speaker 5 (08:05):
Okay, it's not even you on the line, Jerry, just
sit down.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
You're not even the one LAC dating. We can't keep
Jerry at the Do you want to introduce yourself.
Speaker 6 (08:20):
Coming back?
Speaker 3 (08:21):
I kept saying, this is reminding me of Jerry. At
some point it's about Mitzvah. I think this happened. We
had a shared about Mitzvah, and I think you were
really freaking out, and it's just like very surprising because
you're naturally very chill.
Speaker 6 (08:34):
But stage no.
Speaker 5 (08:36):
Sorry, I saw you for Lisa's wedding on the rehearsal dinner.
Speaker 6 (08:39):
You fucking killed it. You were so easy.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
You were so natural, you was you took You've got
the whole room like tip of your tongue, not what's
it called. You had the whole room at the the
yeah of your.
Speaker 6 (09:04):
Oh you had them eating out of your hands.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 5 (09:07):
Do you have them eating out of your hands? And
you just delivered the best.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
You guys just got punked. I'm really you guys, got punked.
This is your pilot episode of the podcast of Jerry
and Lulu. M.
Speaker 5 (09:25):
Well, it's not gonna you got punked.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
You've been canceled after the pilot.
Speaker 5 (09:34):
I think I think I would. I don't I think
I would be canceled. I think I would be scared
to be canceled if I was to have a podcast,
Like I'm surprised that, like anybody has the goal to
make make commitments, Like, how do you deal with that?
Speaker 6 (09:51):
Like, aren't you scared of being canceled all the time?
Speaker 3 (09:55):
I'm sure there is like a deep rooted fear of
being actually canceled, and like the publicity that I've seen
that comes along with like being truly canceled. But then
I also, like, deep down sometimes want to be canceled.
Ooh no, sorry, the surface levels I want to be canceled.
The deep down is like nobody wants to be canceled
because it's like a sense of social not belonging and rejection,
(10:19):
and that would obviously feel awful and come with like
really strange consequences of not knowing like who still likes you,
who doesn't like you, who's talking about you, who's not.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
So what's the desire to be canceled.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Then just like kind of like be done with like
being afraid to fully speak certain opinions that I have,
and then like everybody who like is on the cusp
about me is just kind of gone.
Speaker 5 (10:43):
You know, you would filter out your audience and filter
the people who are remaining of the people who like
you would want to have.
Speaker 3 (10:50):
Do with, right, because then you're like free to really
say whatever you want if you got canceled on like
some major thing. Right, So like you just get rid
of everybody who didn't who like can't stand for you
being multi dimensional? Yeah or dynamic? How'd that conversation get there?
Are you guys good interviewers? No, just just wrap up
(11:12):
the lactating thing real quick here, just to bring it
back full circle. This is a phenomenon to me. I
think that's so.
Speaker 6 (11:19):
It is weird.
Speaker 5 (11:19):
It is weird, And actually I can't tell my friend
Lara about it, So I hope she never listened to
this podcast, because when I told my friend Lara about
my friend, she was like, she was like gagging. She
was like it's disgusting. She was like, it's actually revolting.
Do you remember we were telling her about it?
Speaker 6 (11:33):
At dinner. She was like, please don't, I'm eating.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
The worse is now you can't tell your friend that
knows that that person would have thought that it was gross.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
Yeah, well this is made for the US. This is
us only. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
Well, I mean I think it's kind of interesting though
when people, like most people when I was breastfeeding, were
like so into it. And then I have one friend
who was totally like, oh my god, please stop talking
about breastfeeding. And she was a female too, and I
found it just like interesting, like and I just like
respect that, like that's like her reaction to it.
Speaker 5 (12:05):
The only I don't know that I remember about like
breastfeeding is or like what I think about breastfeeding is
I remember my mom when I was younger, was reading
a romance novel and she burst out laughing and I
was like, what's funny, and she was just like, oh,
this man is trying to have sex with this woman
and she just squatted milk into his mouth and I
was so young and I was like what.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
And that's like, see why this is also fascinating is
I never leaked when I was breastfeeding. I have a
friend who's leaking all the time to brestighten it. Oh, yes,
I do not like mine. But again, I just want
to nail him the point that you're not pregnant. I've
never been pregnant. This is just happening.
Speaker 5 (12:44):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't know what's happening, but it
is happening.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
But you said that there could be some real hormonal
fluctuations that could cause it's obviously if you have medical
concerns and are going through this, please see your doctor.
Speaker 6 (12:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (12:58):
Like, I wonder whether it has anything to do with
feeling broody and like wanting kids. But I don't think
the feeling of wanting kids is so strong.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
I mean, it did happen when you saw it solely
my daughter, So I think that's where it's notice.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Yeah, yeah, like tearing up.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
But oh, to be a woman, the many confusing ways
it is to be a woman.
Speaker 6 (13:25):
I thought it was interesting what you were saying about canceling.
Speaker 5 (13:27):
Like one of the reasons why on the surface you
would like it is because then you would like filter
out and you would just be able to be like
who you are or like allow for like the multifacetness
of you to come through. Do you feel like there
are lots of sides of you that you feel like
you have to edit out because it's like not part
(13:48):
of the brand.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
H I wouldn't say that I operate from a like
a place of like brand, and that is like both
great and not great at the same time. It's great
because I don't burn out, but it's not great because
I don't think that i've I have tapped into like
true potential of building a business, like I think when
(14:13):
I change my Instagram from the well Necessities to the
to Lisa Haim, I thought that that was like a
really good thing, and I still do think it was
the right move and I would do it again, but
it actually like it created a more me version of
me versus like a business that I have that I
put out that is this niche you know? Hm. So
I think that I don't ask that question of like
(14:37):
is that on brand or is that not on brand?
And maybe I should Maybe then I would be like
growing more, have more followers or more this and more that.
But I just burn out really fast if it's not
coming from a place of like true authenticity. And not
to say that everybody who has a brand based off
of their person is like inauthentic, but I think that
it's like more challenging to like always stay in that
(14:57):
like narrow lane. But at the same time, then it
becomes more of like a job, right, Like my job
is to serve, and I serve and I give you know,
people recipes, right, So they're always talking about recipes. They're
not going to talk about politics one day, or their
relationship or things like that. And I think that can
be really beautiful because they really preserve like their whole
(15:18):
self for their like real life. Like my friend Olivia
came on my podcast and really talked about like how
she saves her like real self. I don't remember if
that was the words that she used for her you know,
real people. And I think I don't know. Would you
guys agree that, like you get a different version of
me than the internet? Jerry looks like she's got something
to say here.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
I think there's consistency.
Speaker 6 (15:37):
I'm not shocked.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
I don't think that you're in conflict with who you
are online. There's different intimacies, Like I do think that
you have a private life.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Right, yeah, or there's more.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
We just have history that would be probably uninteresting or
too particular to share with people, right, And that's what
a lot of our relationship is.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
I think that I am in more. I'm in relationship
with people a lot more like we are in relationship
to each other. And like on the Internet, I'm talking
to a screen, which obviously people are listening, but it's
it's very it feels very one way, even though it's
like not it's being received, but nobody's talking back to me.
So then like the reason that I like, you know,
(16:17):
like Lulu, you were supposed to come on the retreat
and like why I went on my met treat with
you guys is because I think I'm able to like
penetrate different levels of self by way of having conversations
with people. So I've always struggled with the unique dimensional
version of social media, how it's speaking to your audience.
Even if there's comment sections, it's like not usually a
(16:39):
conversation in the real way that I agreed.
Speaker 4 (16:42):
I don't mean, like when you post, it doesn't resonate
with me in the same way that having a conversation
with you does. Right, we could talk forever and it
would never feel long. But like I can't read, it's
not the format that works for me. So when there's
a ton of text coordinated with a photo, right, it
will never land in the same way way, And that's
probably that would probably be with a lot of people, right,
(17:04):
Like if it was a stranger, I would don't know
that I'd be able to identify with a stranger that
I found online through that format, but definitely not with you.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Like have you ever actually identified with like an Instagram
personality or celebrity or anything.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
Yeah, if I had to think about random people that
I followed, but it would it would probably be like
more spoken word or video content.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
True, so that it Mind'm just curious, Lou, are you
thinking of somebody for her?
Speaker 4 (17:36):
Oh?
Speaker 6 (17:36):
I think like you really like Young Me for example?
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Who's that?
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Oh yeah, well that's through humor.
Speaker 4 (17:43):
She's a comedian, right, yeah, she's a comedian and she's
amazing so sharp.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
It's like, what's a joke that she tells?
Speaker 4 (17:50):
It's not like not that I can't really reiterate, but
she does. She just souls amazing memes and just has
like a really good take on a lot.
Speaker 6 (17:57):
Of She's insightful.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
How did Young Me do you find out?
Speaker 5 (18:01):
Like there's so many different personalities online and you also
like talk to so many different people. Do you find
it hard to know how to stay true to like
what you want to talk about and like stay true
to you rather than being like, what's what's the difference
between like being open minded and like hearing about loads
of ideas and like not being carried away and like knowing, okay,
(18:25):
good you want to focus on.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
I've never been influenced by like what people are posting
in terms of like, oh, this is what people are
saying and it performs well, and then you should talk
about that because I can't like write or think from
that place. But I have definitely been not inauthentic, but
like struggled with the format of Instagram as it's changed,
like everybody, When Reels came out, I was so excited
(18:50):
because I actually do like video editing. I like making videos.
I think it's like more fun to deliver information via videos.
But then it was like, wait, physical humor what you
like to move? Yeah? I like to move, like And
I was never good at taking pictures, so I always
like struggled with like posing and or like taking pictures
of my food. Everything always felt so weird and interruptive
(19:11):
to like life, like let me everyone stop eating so
I could get this picture perfect thing that I'm gonna
put on my feet and then do the restaurant, you know.
Is like it was just interruptive or reels was exciting,
but then as reels continued and then TikTok happened, it
was like, no, you don't make reels by just like
creating a video and speaking and talking about I don't know,
we'll talk about nutrition or learning to listen to your
(19:31):
body or yoga or anything. It's like it's in the
systematic format that retains people's attention, whether it's like a
dance to a catchy song or a trend pointing to
different words on the screen. I don't if you remember
when people were doing like the point of a lot,
you know, or like certain songs, like it became such
a way to do reels that I like lost inspiration.
(19:52):
So it's like I have all of these ideas in
my head of topics that I want to talk about,
but figuring out how to execute and like bundle that
into what Instagram wants so that it gets to people
has been a roadblock for me. And it's not to
say when I do like try to do it that
way that things don't go well, but it just feels
like so much more of a task that that feels
(20:14):
inauthentic versus like when Instagram started and I would just
like have a thought and I would just like pair
it with a random photo, it just like flowed through me,
versus like, Okay, here's my content idea. Now I have
to like put this camera here and feel me doing
this and then do a voiceover and then put text.
I don't know, it just became so cumbersome. Ye, the
mix of just I don't know what used to feel
(20:35):
very simple. I still think video is great.
Speaker 5 (20:38):
But what is a trend at the moment that you're
just like cannot. What is a trend at the moment
that you're just like.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Cannot, I honestly don't know. I think I have like
a new, accidental, great new relationship to Instagram where I'm
truly viewing it as an app. Is that how you
guys use it? Like I'm going to open my phone
and open this app? Or is it like reflexive for
you as a user?
Speaker 7 (21:07):
No?
Speaker 5 (21:07):
For me, definitely, it's like it's like an app that
like I occasionally like visit, and I think I have
a pretty healthy relationship with it. Well always I've never
been like that attached to it, to be honest, you're
off it for a while, yeah, Like then I came
off it for like six months, if not a bit longer,
which was nice in the beginning, and then after a
(21:28):
while I just was like, oh, I'm actually missing out
on like a lot of news and just basic keeping
in touch with people, and so it's not like an
all or nothing relationship at all.
Speaker 3 (21:38):
I think we talked about this, but I had and
I said it on another podcast episode that you and
I had a conversation about you going off of Instagram
and you're like, hey, I think I want to come
back because like it's kind of like how far can
the pendulum swing go kind of a thing. And I
was like, wow, you're so right, Like we can't pretend
that it doesn't exist, because it is a source of
news and like what's going on around not that you
(22:01):
can't get that somewhere else. But I thought that was
super interesting.
Speaker 5 (22:06):
Yeah, it's about funding the balance like with it, definitely.
Speaker 3 (22:09):
But that's really hard when it's designed to be addictive, addictive,
Like it's so addictive. Okay, So going back to the question,
I think that I've gotten so good at like not
not treating it like I open my phone and then
I'm on Instagram and then I'm gonna watch stories. I
still do get sucked in occasionally, but I don't know.
I'm like literally not interested in what other people are
doing right now, and not that I ever I'm like
(22:31):
so interested, but I'm able to catch myself a little
more being like waste of time. Want to be with
my daughter, want to be with my husband, or I'm
with my husband and I want to actually be with
my husband because I'm next to him, but like this
is a block to intimacy, like emotional intimacy, me being
on my phone, him being on his phone. So all
to say that I don't even know what the trends
(22:52):
are right now. I do love TikTok. I find it
so much more funny inspirational, like I can like get
ideas of things to do. And I haven't been on
TikTok at all very much lately, so I don't even
know what the trends on there are. Do you guys
know the trends?
Speaker 6 (23:07):
I actually haven't been on them for ages. I haven't
been on TikTok for ages.
Speaker 3 (23:11):
You know what TikTok oh at all, But you have Instagram.
I do would have thought you would have made the
switch to TikTok and abandoned your wires worked.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
To know something. Now you watch my you know what
I mean.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
Remember you're like you got You're like, oh, you get
bed such funny stuff like me.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
Yeah, if you show me something we're watching together and
we're laughing at something together, then that feels like the
right amount.
Speaker 1 (23:34):
Yeah, but I don't need something else.
Speaker 6 (23:36):
Yeah, we don't need another.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
I thought I didn't need something else either, And then
it was just like, but.
Speaker 5 (23:41):
It is different from Instagram, Like it is like a
welcome break and it feels like a joyful place like
versus Instagram, which is like, I mean, everybody knows what
Instagram is, but TikTok feels like just like a bit
lighter and more expansive.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
Like you're not getting people that are like pumping out
content every day for the sake of like content, Like
you're getting comedians that like otherwise wouldn't have had a platform,
or singer songwriters that like would have never gotten heard.
But but like, if you have good talent, you're rising
to the top much more fast than you would have been.
Like the industry otherwise mm or if you've got if
(24:18):
you're just like really able to articulate a concept, you know,
it picks up speed fast.
Speaker 6 (24:24):
Like who are you talking about earlier? I like the
kids who did.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
The song, Oh yeah, so the song that Evan loves
Take me to the River. I can stay swim and
I can swim anyway. It's a great song. I don't
know if that came from TikTok or Instagram, to be honest,
but the song went viral from two teenage kids at
Jesus Camp and they were otherwise like they have no
interest in being famous. They still don't want to be famous,
but the song just like blasted them to the top
(24:48):
because the song is so good and they just Jesus
gave them the lyrics and they give it back to
the world and it's so beautiful and they're so cute.
Speaker 5 (24:54):
That would literally read my dream for that to happen
to me, for me to like.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Do nothing, no, to do nothing, and.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
To like get recognized for like one of these like
little songs that I make.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
She wrote the best song.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
So here's a good opportunity. I do you do write
good song? Joy? What's your favorite song that was you
wrote a really good one yesterday. Can you sing it?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
It's pretty morbid?
Speaker 6 (25:17):
No, no, no no, can you.
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Go the less morbid one for just for like just
you know, introducing her people.
Speaker 6 (25:22):
To Maybe there will be one that comes to me.
Speaker 3 (25:25):
But there was one that I really loved that used
to sing, Cale's give me wonder.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
Bagels and bagels.
Speaker 5 (25:30):
They're coming to my house, curry puffs and curry puffs.
Speaker 6 (25:34):
I'll put them in my mouth.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
It is good. So it's a jingle. You're a jingle writer.
Speaker 6 (25:40):
That's a jingle.
Speaker 5 (25:41):
But like there's dirty tacos, dirty tacos, come meat shore,
dirty tacos.
Speaker 6 (25:51):
The Gods sauce, the god.
Speaker 5 (25:53):
Beans, they got everything you need to bring you to
your knees.
Speaker 6 (25:57):
It's dirty tacos.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
You heard that one before.
Speaker 5 (26:00):
It's business business, it's business time.
Speaker 6 (26:05):
It's busy. This is a show to go time.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
It's business as usual.
Speaker 6 (26:14):
It's business as usual.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
That came from that.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Came from the day that we did a two day
taco pop up and when when we were pushing our
cart home with our leftover bits and.
Speaker 2 (26:25):
Pieces video foot this one time which I was like,
oh my god, what's that My favorite song? And I
was like, oh my god, the song that I wrote
about the Postman box or something like that. She was like, no,
the Beyonce song.
Speaker 6 (26:41):
I was like, oh my god, what of mine?
Speaker 3 (26:43):
See if this was a video podcast, which you guys
didn't want video, but if we had video, we'd be
able to take that clip.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
I'll share it with the people.
Speaker 3 (26:49):
Okay, yeah, I think that would be a good maybe
promo for this episode.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
It's very good.
Speaker 3 (26:54):
It's business.
Speaker 6 (26:55):
It's really as usual.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Meanwhile, two day business, so for.
Speaker 5 (27:02):
Lisa's thirty fifth birthday, will lease two business. I feel
like what we would like to do in this interview
is ask you some spicy questions.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Spicy spicy which one you're thinking?
Speaker 5 (27:21):
But then like, when I'm asking you spicy questions, I'm like,
which part of you do you feel like you can't
bring to the table because of your brand? You're like, oh,
I don't really see this brand. I'm like, it's hard
because you're like answering in a very wise way.
Speaker 6 (27:35):
So I'm gonna so just.
Speaker 1 (27:37):
Swing it on the same page.
Speaker 6 (27:38):
Yeah, okay, It's funny.
Speaker 5 (27:41):
A lot of the questions actually that we wanted to
ask you you alluded to earlier in the day anyway, Like, Jerry,
why don't you why don't you go with this one?
Speaker 4 (27:50):
I guess anytime I've looked back at something that I
thought was meaningful in writing, Yeah, like an old journal
entry or something like that, there's some element that's like
a bit embarrassed.
Speaker 3 (28:05):
Cringe.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
Yeah, that feels too extreme and kind of like too
on trend. But it's just like something more to the core.
Wh're like, like, I don't really need to revisit that.
Speaker 3 (28:14):
I know where this is going.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
I don't think you do.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
It's more like do I feel that way you make
a career or you just push past that all the time.
Speaker 3 (28:22):
But that's the thing. I never looked back. I don't
want to look back.
Speaker 1 (28:25):
No, but that's good, right.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
So here I am like I can hardly even take
one step forward because I'm too concerned. I think calling
it like insecurity would be oversimplifying it. But it's like
just too concerned with how things will be.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
Leaving an imprint. Yeah, No, I think that's intentional. I
think that could be beautifully intentional. I think we have different
parts of the brain that are activated and like mine
is really good at like just but what is that
survival you guys are both good at that.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
Set it and forget it, just chucking on, Like you
don't mind having a conversation.
Speaker 3 (28:59):
Listen, if I would, I like saw something that I
wrote and I was like, I would probably archive the
post and just like pretend it never happened. Right, But
I don't look back very often, but it exists.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
But there's something about just continuing to put yourself out there.
And that's for anyone. That is a type of vulnerability.
And maybe it's like not that you have so much
so much exposure, not that everyone has so much exposure,
but like, even if it was just for myself, even
in this.
Speaker 3 (29:26):
Part of my brain not firing, that should that should
be like, oh, future, look back.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
But that worked, But I think that stopped. That's what
stops a lot of people.
Speaker 3 (29:34):
Right, but maybe in a good way.
Speaker 4 (29:36):
No, because you're creating so much stuff that's helpful and
impactful for people in a really good way. Yeah, And
it's not like you can't recover if you made a mistake. Yeah,
if you've said something embarrassing or regrettable.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
Or whatever it is.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
Right, So you want to.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
Know, yeah, how do you how do you tick?
Speaker 3 (29:52):
Like, how do you kind of like I said in
the beginning, like it also feels like for me to speak, write, share,
it has to come from this like energetic blaze. And
when you're like in that energetic blaze, you're like not
thinking necessarily so clearly mm So like even for this
podcast episode, right, like I was like, I slay it
(30:13):
out my thirty fifth birthday. I want to end the season,
and I don't know, maybe thirty five lessons, but like
I don't have the thirty five lessons, Like I'm sitting down.
It's like not coming out of me. But like if
I was like trying to fall asleep one night and
then it was like boom boom boom, my brain was
like thinking of all these things. Then it's like, yes,
I want to lead with this. It's like coming from
an awake place versus a cognitive place.
Speaker 5 (30:35):
Yeahah, it sounds like you're it's like lacking of self
awareness in a good way, as in you're just really present. Yeah,
you're just really present. You're just thinking what you're thinking.
You're not thinking about like how you're going to be
perceived or like the way in which you're coming across.
Speaker 3 (30:48):
You're just inflow, inflow, right, But over the years, I've
lost that flow because of many reasons. I think industry changes,
life changes. I used to just be twenty middle like
twenty five, twenty six when I started. I'm thirty five
now just naturally by maturation, mature. What's the word here,
(31:09):
that's sure, naturation. Maturation sounds like such a mature word itself.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
When you turn thirty five, you could use it.
Speaker 6 (31:15):
Yeah, a couple more years, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
Yeah, you've got Oh yeah, I was thinking you're turning
thirty five this year, You're not even I think by
way of maturation and like life changes, like I've taken
on a partner who like has a career, I take
I have a daughter who what's a whole other conversation about,
like social media and her and exploring what feels right
for her and probably changing a lot of things in
(31:39):
the next few years too. So I think that I've
I've lost that flow for some time. I'm really in
it right now, which is interesting, But then I'm also
going to go I think, take a social media break
in July or August or maybe both. I don't know
exactly yet. So it's funny to like be in this
flow or I actually am in that like boom boom
boom groove and then be quiet during that time.
Speaker 4 (31:59):
But social, I mean there's only one outlet, right you
still like you have a newsletter you.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
I want to take a break from everything for like
a month or two, just this beginning of this year
or the whole year. Really this last six months have
just been super confusing, dizzying, traumatic, all the emotions, adrenaline
that I feel like I just haven't fully like dropped
into self and like before I take my next step,
(32:24):
and I want to just like make space. And obviously
it's very privileged to be able to.
Speaker 5 (32:30):
It's really interesting because one of the questions that we
wanted to ask you was like, how does it feel
having grown up or done your adult thing? As if
somebody's basically reading your diary, Like how does that affect you?
Speaker 3 (32:45):
I don't think about the words so much as I
do have like regrets of just like moments that I
wish I was like more deeply present, but I was
like recording for something, you know, we're taking pictures, and
it just felt like that made sense for a lot
of years to like do both like oh, Evan and
I are going to Miami, and I you know, everybody
(33:06):
would love to see like what we're eating, right, so
everyonere eating, but then there's like a moment of that
that's like lost. I mean, Jerry and I went we
went to high school together, and I remember our English teacher,
Edward Belliwiot or teacher. We were in the special program.
It was when like social sharing was just starting to
come out. What did we have those Like we had
like these pages where every weekend we would upload photos.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Just between in just the class. No, I remember that it.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
Was like a social It was before social media. It
wasn't like shut orfly, but it was like it was
like a feed. And at the end of like every
Sunday we'd upload our pictures from like our new digital
cameras and then like you'd see like who was at
the party and who was there.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
Sure, it sounds vaguely familiar, but right.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
I remember it was called but I remember him being like,
but are you actually present? You're taking the picture? And
I'm like, yes, you're actively. He's like, but how can
you be because then you're taking the picture to be
perceived in the picture like you're having fun. And I
was like, I don't get it.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
Who was the first to present, real existential dread.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
And dread and yeah, and now I get it. I'm like,
if the phone is there, it's a third party for
its party, six party whatever. That changes, yes, all right,
even this podcast right now, there's a microphone in her hand.
This conversation, as natural as it is, is different if
the microphone isn't.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
Here, definitely, Like, how do you feel like it has
affected your personal relationships? Like obviously having a podcast and
like having your social media presence, you've come into contact
with so many interesting new people and like broadened the
(34:47):
groups of people that you're talking to, But in terms
of your own personal relationships, like, how do you feel
like it's impacted them?
Speaker 3 (34:53):
I feel like, at least in my mind, there's this
really thick line between like personal team mey ish like
even though it's me, and then like the me that
is me and all of my friends who are my
real friends, Like most of them don't listen to my podcast,
most of them don't look at my social media, and
if they do, they see occasional posts like it's not
(35:14):
how we keep in touch. It's gotten blurry with some
friends that like I'm not going to say, like take
it at face value but like see something that I
post and then respond to that post or something, rather than.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Like find out what's really happening.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
Find out what's really happening. I mean that kind of
sounds like I'm like lying about something, which I'm not.
But it's just like there are certain people that have
like kind of gotten confused a little bit, but those
aren't like my real people. I don't know if that
answers the question.
Speaker 4 (35:41):
You've kind of always been at risk for that since
before all this.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
What do you mean?
Speaker 4 (35:46):
Remember we used to say, no joke the joke was,
and you were in on it, what the joke was. Yeah,
we would forget how great you were until we got
with you.
Speaker 3 (35:54):
Yeah, but no, I don't mean that. I know that's
the thing about me. Everybody forgets.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Just to expand on that.
Speaker 4 (36:00):
Our sibling friend group, we would joke that once we
were with you in person again, I would be like, oh, yeah,
Lisa is the best. But as soon as we would
have any distance, it would just for some reason, you
were just prone to being diluted to some shallow, I know, assumptions.
Speaker 3 (36:15):
But now I don't feel that.
Speaker 4 (36:16):
No, it's not exactly, no, it is it is a
funny attachment that I think we all remember, you identify
you were the one that figured that out.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
You were, don't you guys remember?
Speaker 3 (36:25):
But I also feel it. I feel it when people
perceive me as like just being right you said in
the beating, not multi dimensional. At the time, we would
just chalk it up to like, oh, Lisa like shoes,
like whatever.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
You came up with that, and it was just like,
oh yeah, that was kind of on the nose, you're right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
And then when they're with me, they're like, oh yeah,
you've got You've got the layers beneath, and they're kind
of shocked, and it's weirds. I'm not like super pretty,
you know, somebody's like super pretty forget Oh yeah, not
like so pretty.
Speaker 7 (36:50):
You're accessible, approachable, you know, yeah, sometimes attractive to some
people not to others.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
It's not like, you know, no, that's so. I don't
know why I got that vibe, why I give that vibe,
or if I still does it still hold true or
do we talk about But I think maybe.
Speaker 5 (37:07):
That's just like what happens to anybody who's like in
the public eye.
Speaker 4 (37:13):
It was before that she was doomed. It was us
or maybe I'm saying, maybe that's something.
Speaker 6 (37:20):
Hate that sounds like he's gonna hate it. Sounds like jealousy.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
Jealous of me.
Speaker 6 (37:24):
Yeah, jealous.
Speaker 3 (37:26):
My brother's jealous. Everybody's jealous. Jealous.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
Speaking which unpopular opinions? Should we do one.
Speaker 3 (37:37):
For the day, I'm gonna keep on light. But yeah,
has your just because it's super.
Speaker 4 (37:42):
Has your audience been introduced? I mean, not that it's
a new idea an unpopular opinion, but just what you
You kind of played this game with us where it
was just like here's a safe space, now, like offer
up an unpopular opinion, got it, and let's just leave
it on the floor and see if we could all
accept it.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Accept it?
Speaker 3 (37:58):
Okay, fine, you go first.
Speaker 5 (38:01):
Lulu had one, Well mine, I said mine the other
day and I didn't realize it was a popular opinion.
I just said, I wish that I spent more time
on my phone. Like I just when I'm with Jerry,
she's just like on her phone and she's just like
doing shit and like staying connected and is like talking
to people having full blown conversations while I'm there, and
(38:21):
like I'm just like I really respect that she's just
like on her phone. And I'm just there like blah
blah blah blah, like or like you know whatever, I'm
just like looking at you. And then you're just like
on your phone, and I'm just like, what am I
not on my phone? Just like I really wish that
I was spending more serious time connected to all the
(38:44):
different apps on my phone?
Speaker 3 (38:46):
Do you mean like connected to different people.
Speaker 1 (38:48):
In your life? That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (38:50):
I couldn't even understand it was And double you're just
insulting me because it's an unpopular opinion and you're you're
ascribing it to me like I just sound like the.
Speaker 3 (38:59):
World and you're like not even on your phone a lot,
I don't write.
Speaker 4 (39:03):
You're like, like, why are you being so defensive?
Speaker 1 (39:06):
That's admirable. I was like, there's nothing.
Speaker 3 (39:10):
I think you meant something else, No, I don't, really.
Speaker 5 (39:14):
I really mean like it could be a variety of
different things, like yes, maybe it's messaging my friends, but
it's also like being on Instagram, being on TikTok, or
reading the news or like news apps or something like that,
like just the whole gamut, like gamot, is.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
That what you guys say?
Speaker 3 (39:34):
It?
Speaker 6 (39:35):
The whole gamut? Gamut.
Speaker 5 (39:41):
So I just think it seems like an adult way
to live your life. I feel like I'm not adulting.
Speaker 3 (39:54):
That's so I can't accept it.
Speaker 6 (39:57):
By not being on my phone as little as I am.
Speaker 5 (39:59):
Like the the fact that I have messages that are
on read for five hours, I think for most people
is like an unacceptable standard of communication. And I think
that they're right. But for me, I'm just like I
could leave my phone at home. Yeah, and I just like, whoop,
So you don't care where it is.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
I think that that's yeah, I love it.
Speaker 5 (40:21):
I guess that that's a goal, but like it's nonsense. Guys,
I'm telling you from the other side. You don't want
to be here.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
What's happening to you over there? It's just you're more present.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
People will need to hear it from you. Hear from you. Yeah,
we get to Jerry if we need.
Speaker 6 (40:36):
No, I think. But that's the thing.
Speaker 5 (40:37):
I think that the people that the news that really
needs to get to me and the people that I
really need to speak to, I often miss opportunities, Like
our world is faster paced and it would be really
nice to go like, oh, I really want to slow down.
But when you slow down you take yourself away from it.
You just have to accept the reality that the world
(40:57):
is fast and that people are getting instant respond and
the news.
Speaker 6 (41:01):
Is changing over a dime. And I don't but it is.
Speaker 5 (41:05):
I'm telling you, when you're not in the cycle, it
feels irresponsible.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
All right, Someone go surface and the non surface surfaces.
We just went to this gelatteria, no plateria. What do
they call it? Yeah, what's it called. It's like a
popsicle place, but it's like a name for it, clo
popsic paleta bar that's what they call it. Whatever, and
their new flavor. It was like, wow, new flavor. No.
(41:33):
I was so offended by their new flavor of the
ice creab cup goat cheese cheese olive popsicle.
Speaker 6 (41:46):
Oh yeah, awful.
Speaker 3 (41:48):
Oh made me sick. Okay, anyway, that's my surface on
surface is I am perpetuating this? So I am part
of quote unquote problem. But like true wellness is like
hypocritical to technology. Obviously it's not black and white, but
I find it hard to believe that we can truly
like be well and like be on our phones going
(42:10):
back to yours. As much as we are reliant on
Instagram for all of our health information or wellness information,
and going even further, like health tech I think is
like the biggest like ruse, like wearable technology to find
out about your sleep and you're trying and how many
steps you took and all that stuff. It's like it's
so opposite, like wellness to me should be stripped down.
(42:32):
It should be simple, it should be connected to self.
And I know that these industries are booming industries, and
I do again just like not fully black and white,
like there's value in information, but there's like this huge
crux of like how well are we if we're always
on our phones? Very well in my right, right right right, right,
(42:53):
right right, but like I think we also don't know
the true health effects of staring at a screen from
like the curves of our spine changing to our eyesight
from an led background, you know, back to us to
holding the phone in our hand with like decrepit thumbs,
to EMF and bluetooth and all of that, to things
(43:14):
I probably can't even you know, put into words. So
it's like here I am, let me teach you about
health and wellness, but also listen to my podcast, stay
on my page, do this that did it? Like for me,
like that feels participatory at this time. But there's like
an unpopular opinion within me of like this can't be it. Yeah,
(43:35):
So like, first of all, do I choose wellness and
health for myself and go off of the grid, right,
or I don't know how that land for you?
Speaker 1 (43:44):
Yeah? Good?
Speaker 3 (43:45):
I mean I feel my healthiest and most well like
detached from all of it when I keep my cel
phone at home, you know, and obviously, like you said,
there's a level of responsibility to it. Especially I think
that word is good because since having solely I've been
on my phone more than ever multiple reasons. Some were
some because if the phone makes you feel like you're
being responsible, Oh, let me google this rash that she
(44:07):
has let me just but like that could be more harmful,
and then other reasons of just like if I leave
the house right, I want to know whoever's taking care
of hercul get in touch with me. So I think
that these smartphones are not smart at all.
Speaker 4 (44:20):
Oh that that that brings me to mind. Maybe this
isn't an unpopular opinion. But the other day I said
to you, I think maybe it's it's good to present
things as truths even when you haven't fact checked them.
Why because I think we're too dependent on Google and like,
and like, you know, a generation ago, people were just
(44:42):
saying things with the confidence that they had from whatever
experience they had or whoever told them, the trust that
they had and whatever was passed down to them, and
they believed it and like probably believed it through some
sort of experience and that was enough, right, And sure,
like there's maybe potential for some thing's being damaging or
some sort of like knock on effect that isn't positive,
(45:04):
But for the most part, that's a I think that's
a pretty positive thing. It's just like take it for
what it is, incorporate something that you've learned into your
own life, and then you can tell someone that without
saying I haven't looked this up or I'm not sure
if it's true, but I think that you.
Speaker 3 (45:18):
Know, the research have to say on that, like as
if it's not harmful, right, and like, people are gonna
believe that this helps with that it gives them something
to do and put their energy forth.
Speaker 6 (45:30):
And you disagreed, Yeah, I really disagree.
Speaker 5 (45:32):
I think the world needs to be more accepting of
complexity and put that vague, like and how vague things
can be.
Speaker 3 (45:43):
But I don't think the phone or internet provides you
with more vagueness. It says like right and wrong.
Speaker 5 (45:48):
No, But I think what it does is you acknowledge
that people don't always have the right answers. And it's like,
if you go on Google, Google's not going to give
you one answer.
Speaker 6 (45:59):
It's also going to give you three different answers.
Speaker 3 (46:00):
But most people aren't going to get to the third
answer they look for the first.
Speaker 4 (46:03):
Well, it's Google's truth anyway, but it's still like, it
still feels like it's more weighted in, like fact truth
then you just sang it from your on.
Speaker 6 (46:10):
Yeah. I don't know.
Speaker 5 (46:12):
I just don't think there's anything wrong with people being
a little bit more humble about their abilities to like
be truth sayers.
Speaker 6 (46:21):
I think that that's gotten us into like a lot
of trouble in the past.
Speaker 3 (46:26):
I guess it depends on what the type of information
is too.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
Yeah. Yeah, I was telling you how to wash dishes.
Speaker 3 (46:30):
Better based on how your ancestors taught you to wash dishes. Yes, yes,
and Google had a different way.
Speaker 4 (46:36):
I didn't ask Google because I didn't need to know.
I'm not sure if you need to have hot water.
But I'm pretty sure based on my whole life's experience.
Speaker 3 (46:43):
You wash that cold A cold rint it was cold.
Speaker 1 (46:45):
Was happening, and I just was like, hot, it'll.
Speaker 3 (46:48):
Be better, yeah, but will it? You're right, will it?
Speaker 4 (46:51):
But like I know enough because I've done it enough
to know that, like right, I don't need Google.
Speaker 6 (46:57):
I know, but I just don't think it's like a
crying shame that you would like. But I'm not sure about.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
That because I felt like I had to double back
by the way before I go just telling you this
thing that you need the heat to cut the grease.
I'm not one hundred that's not that's not science. But
I just needed to know that. And then I was like,
why did I feel like I have to tell you
that that's not sign.
Speaker 3 (47:20):
The intricacies of relationships?
Speaker 4 (47:22):
And then I wanted to and then I sat down
and then I thought, that's it's an interesting thought now
that I thought that I had to tell you know, Like,
then I worked about backwards and I went back to
up to and I was just like, I've been thinking
about whether or not this is something that you need
to do. And then I presented this whole opinion about yeah,
and then there was like, no, you're wrong.
Speaker 1 (47:39):
We should find out if that's true or not.
Speaker 3 (47:41):
I've seen her get like this with you though too.
You guys are like too smart for each other's good.
Just like, all right, should we wrap up this episode?
Speaker 6 (47:52):
I don't feel like we got to the real Yeah,
we didn't really get to.
Speaker 3 (47:56):
One last one. We got to the crux. We had fun.
All I want to do is out with my best
friends and have fun and give the internet a taste
of how wonderful you both are.
Speaker 1 (48:03):
I'm looking okay, get punked.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
This is your part.
Speaker 5 (48:06):
Okay, Now we always as I don't think we have,
but it's anyway.
Speaker 6 (48:11):
Wait, you can say we were trying the commune.
Speaker 5 (48:15):
Oham, So we've talked about like the idea of like
commune living.
Speaker 1 (48:20):
The mom Mune.
Speaker 3 (48:21):
You guys are moms yet, but yeah, we could help. Yes,
you don't have to be.
Speaker 6 (48:29):
Like that's the thing about the mom Mune. You don't
have to be a mom.
Speaker 3 (48:32):
Yes, to be part of it, I do think you
should be largely female. Oh interesting, Well, like what men
would I need? Go on with the question.
Speaker 1 (48:41):
Yeah, well, anyway, you've chosen a.
Speaker 3 (48:43):
Man, right, to be in my village.
Speaker 1 (48:45):
Well, we're not sure. That's this is the this is
the question. So we love Evan.
Speaker 4 (48:50):
So you you have chosen like a pretty traditional nuclear
family set up, and we're just we were.
Speaker 3 (48:56):
We were basic nuclear equals basic. Yeah, already for boring suburbs.
Speaker 4 (49:01):
I get it reduced to the lowest common Yeah. So
if the commune was a real option, do you think
you're ready or would you take it?
Speaker 6 (49:08):
Okay?
Speaker 3 (49:09):
So the commune being we all live together.
Speaker 5 (49:10):
Yea, and it's like we have like equal responsibility for
the different children. So like Rye Hunters, they all come under.
Speaker 3 (49:19):
So we all share, we share a family jo. The
three of us are aunts to the same hunter Ryan.
Speaker 1 (49:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (49:25):
So whatever, where at state are we going to live in?
Speaker 6 (49:28):
Not?
Speaker 3 (49:30):
Okay? So is the question what I leave Evan behind?
Speaker 5 (49:34):
Because we actually called it a commune, you wanted to
call it a mom mune and said, I think we.
Speaker 3 (49:38):
Need right right right right. I think we do need Evan.
He brings valuable skills.
Speaker 6 (49:44):
So the question skills if you had the.
Speaker 5 (49:47):
Starting fires no, so if you had the option, so
you know, you guys are like thinking about getting a
new place and instead of you guys getting in a
new place. It's like, actually, we're all going to buy
a new place together, so it's going to be ten
of us were.
Speaker 6 (49:58):
Living in an apartment and actually be like, your dad's
going to come.
Speaker 7 (50:01):
To dad, My dad gotta come, my mom coming to
this is this is a traumatic place for me.
Speaker 3 (50:12):
I don't want to be here. No, no, no.
Speaker 1 (50:13):
We can pick and choose.
Speaker 6 (50:14):
Yeah, you can pick and choose.
Speaker 5 (50:15):
But the idea that it's like a commune setting, would
you genuinely.
Speaker 6 (50:21):
Make the case to Evan and be like, maybe we
should uproo our.
Speaker 3 (50:24):
Lives genuinely, yes, I believe that that would be the
best thing for all of us. I think we would
not have cell phones. We would just be so like
sustainable within ourselves.
Speaker 1 (50:38):
Or also hunters and gatherers.
Speaker 3 (50:40):
Were sustainable in the sense that like.
Speaker 1 (50:43):
We have but we're living like in the world as
we know.
Speaker 3 (50:47):
It a lot less. We would be talking to each other. Mostly,
I think that it restores many of the things that
people have in the blue zones, which is where people
live the most, which is lots of socialness. I forget
the other thing zones. The blue zones are the areas
in the world that we've studied where people live the longest,
(51:08):
like long. Yeah, so the things that they do is
like what types of food that they eat. But the
huge thing that stands out is that they spend a
lot of time socializing and how like healthy that is.
And I think I would.
Speaker 6 (51:21):
Love I would love to live in a commune.
Speaker 3 (51:23):
I think the way we're living is just is just
so bad for mental health and we don't even realize it.
Speaker 5 (51:28):
And also like I think when you live in a
nuclear family, you're also like really people are really busy
keeping up pretenses and like keeping up like an image
of like what things are supposed to be. And I
think that like if you were living in a more
open community style setting, I think you would have a
lot more space for like real vulnerability.
Speaker 6 (51:50):
And real honesty.
Speaker 5 (51:51):
Like even with being able to talk a little bit
more about mental health, like in the recent years, it's
still presented.
Speaker 6 (51:59):
To you through social media through like.
Speaker 5 (52:01):
A lens of a filter, Whereas like I think if
you had community living like more people would really experience
what it is. And I don't know, I just think
it would be really healthy. So the final question is
something that is going to start with the statement first,
so we know that boundaries are really important to you,
(52:21):
and you've talked about the importance of boundaries before. So
what communication do you owe to people when you put
up boundaries towards them?
Speaker 6 (52:30):
Like? Do people?
Speaker 5 (52:32):
So yeah, do people deserve to be told? Like not all,
I'm putting up a boundary, So you think, so it's
okay to kind of just go cold turkey on someone.
Speaker 3 (52:42):
I think that you always have to make like a
boundary is meant to protect you. It's less about like
the other person in many of those circumstances. So it's
literally like what do you have the bandwidth for? If
you don't have the bandwidth to explain your boundary to
somebody else, like for whatever reason, whether it's feared, hired, exhaustion,
whatever reason, then you have to just create that boundary
(53:05):
without explanation. And many most of the people that I
have like created real boundaries with over time, have like
circled back and understood that it was a boundary without explaining,
and the relationship has been better for it. But in
that murky period, it's not always like that, and you
kind of have to sit with that. But I don't know,
I don't feel I said before, I've been a little psychopathic,
(53:26):
But no, I think I'm more like just focused on
such self preservation. When a boundary is laid that you
just have to like trust that it's for the better
of the relationship and it does create a new path,
but it's like a new pathway for the relationship too
to exist, and then it helps the other person like
do that for themselves or life.
Speaker 4 (53:45):
But there are a lot of people in your life that, yeah,
speak the same language, not just followers, but like people
in your peer group and work and whatever in whatever
element of work. But not everyone has that same emotional
intelligence or is in the pursuit of doing personal work
or would would have the awareness to see a boundary,
(54:05):
identify it, respect it, and then be able to like
grow through it.
Speaker 3 (54:09):
Also maybe they won't be able to verbalize it or
put into words, but like the eventual eventual eventual has
almost always been net positive for somebody that I've retained
a relationship mmm with. Again, they might not be like, wow,
thank you for putting down that boundary with me. Now
I understand how to better communicate with you and other
people in my life. Like maybe not not so literal, Yeah,
it's not so literal, but I don't know. I think
(54:31):
similar to like posting, right, It's like I'm not like
looking all around me. It's just like if a boundary
needs to be put in place, it's because something in
me is being chipped away, and it's for like restoration.
Speaker 7 (54:43):
M hm.
Speaker 3 (54:44):
So I no, I don't think that in all cases
you have to explain it, and certainly that word is
never well received, like this is a boundary that I'm lying, mmmm, right,
Like people get their back up against that and trying
to delicately put it in another way. If you have
to already lay the boundary, it's just like not always available.
(55:05):
It's true emotionally to put it in a sentence that
would be soft enough that they're not defensive, Like that's
so much emotional work just thinking about it right now,
and I'm not even in it's not and I'm just
thinking like hypothetically, right, I don't know. Maybe that's that's
how I do it, but that's not saying that's the
right way to do it.
Speaker 1 (55:23):
No, it makes sense.
Speaker 5 (55:25):
I think that that like that probably comes from being
able to like your answer comes from the ability to
know like what it is to responsibly set a boundary,
like so many people can't do it because they're like
worried about what other people are thinking or thinking about
the repercussions.
Speaker 6 (55:41):
But I guess, and it's not to.
Speaker 3 (55:43):
Say that I'm so great at it. And other times either,
like especially with family right where most people need boundaries
like I do have the same soft spots and re
enter cycles all the time. So I just don't want
to come off as like I'm an amazing boundary. Put
her down her and you should follow my steps. Just
answering that question. Okay, should we wrap up this episode?
Speaker 1 (56:03):
Guys?
Speaker 4 (56:04):
Yeah, well I see a commune in our future twenty
twenty five.
Speaker 5 (56:09):
That was the most interesting thing that we leaned out
of this interview is that it's a yes, but it's
a year ago.
Speaker 3 (56:15):
That you guys are New Yorkers.
Speaker 1 (56:17):
We are.
Speaker 3 (56:17):
We're gonna have to figure.
Speaker 1 (56:18):
Out that we're not right now.
Speaker 3 (56:22):
Thank you for sitting down talk to me. I love you, guys,
Love you.
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