Boxing with Chris Mannix - Worth the Weight?

Mannix and Keith Idec discuss Richardson Hitchins disputed decision win over Gustavo Lemos, whether the IBF's 10-pound rehydration is a good thing for boxing, Jared Anderson's turbulent year, a potential showdown between Claressa Shields and Alycia Baumgardner, more; later, Ryan Garcia on his history with Devin Haney, why the animosity between the two has ramped up and why the timing is right for the two longtime rivals to meet. #Volume #Herd

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.

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(01:38):
somebody punch him in the face.

Speaker 2 (01:40):
Empty Joshua is a composed and ferocious finisher. Watch this
Your wed.

Speaker 4 (01:45):
Uses the heavywee posted by Sis Chris Mannix. That was
my moments now with interviews, analysis and everything going on
in the world of boxing.

Speaker 2 (01:55):
When you have talent, you are given another chance.

Speaker 4 (01:58):
Here's Chris Mannix.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
And we are back. Boxing with Chris mannis part of
the Volume Sports podcast Network. Want to welcome in as
always those listening on the podcast Speed. If you are
not a subscriber, get over to the Boxing with Chris
Mannics Speed hit that subscribe button. Make sure you don't
miss a single episode of this show. Every week, we
got a good one for you today. Keith Idek is back,
longtime boxing writer, good friend of the podcast. Keith and

(02:22):
I look back on what was a surprisingly competitive one
hundred and forty pound matchup between Richton Hitchins and Gustavlo Lamos.
We talk about Jared Anderson, the heavyweight contender who is
back in action this weekend. Jared has had a bunch
of stuff going on outside the ring that has overshadowed
what he's been doing inside the ring, and after watching

(02:43):
Claressa Shields and Alicia Bombgardner go nose to nose after
the Zone show last week, we talk about the viability
of a Shields bomb Gardner matchup a little bit later
on this year. Later in the show, Ryan Garcia is back.

Speaker 5 (02:58):
Now.

Speaker 2 (02:58):
This was a sit down Ryan did for his own
this past month. This was during the press tour for
his fight with Devin Haney, which is just like ten
days away. It's crazy. So we didn't get into some
of the stuff that's gone on over the last couple
of weeks. The social media stuff, we didn't get into that,
but we do talk about his history with Devin Haney,

(03:19):
why this fight has become more personal than most expected,
and why he believes, despite what others think, that he
is in a great place headed too that fight. So
stick around great conversation with Ryan Garcia. Before we get
to that, I do want to briefly address something that
happened during the Dezone broadcast this past weekend. During the

(03:41):
fight between Diego Pacheco and Sean mccallman, I approached David
Benavitez about doing an interview. David is a stablemate of
Diego Pacheco. Pacheco is trained by David's father, Jose Benavitez Senior,
so it was natural to want to get his take
on what was going on in the ring. He said yes,

(04:03):
so I sat down next to him for what was
planned to be a quick one on one. I did
not know at the time that David had been drinking,
which became clear as soon as he started answering some
of the questions, and I had to kind of make
a decision in that moment. I didn't want to bail
out after just one question because I thought that might

(04:25):
embarrass him, and I didn't want to do that. Maybe
I should have Hindsight's twenty twenty, but I decided to
ask the three quick ones and then get out. I mean,
the entire interview was less than a minute. The plan
was to go a little bit longer to asking about
Canelo and to get a thought on the future fight
against Pacheco, who is a rising star in his weight class.
The three short questions felt to me like the cleanest

(04:48):
way out. Now. I'm only talking about this because David
went on social media and apologized to his fans, and look, honestly,
he really has nothing to apologize. He's allowed to have
some drinks and have a good time. Most of the
people at the fight we're having some drinks and having

(05:08):
a good time. He doesn't have a fight scheduled yet.
He wasn't behaving in an inappropriate way. The mistake that
was made was putting him in that position, putting him
on air, and I messaged David first thing the next
day to apologize for putting him in that position. He
was great about it. We had to laugh about what
can happen when you mix certain drinks together. And look,

(05:29):
anyone that listens to the show knows I am a
huge fan of David Benavitez, both as a fighter and
of how he conducts himself outside the ring. He is
a professional, as professional as they come, which is why
I hated some of the grief that he caught on
social media on Saturday. It was just a bad moment
that shouldn't have happened, and if there was time to

(05:49):
have had some small talk with him before the interview,
it wouldn't have happened. I would never intentionally put David
in that position. It was just a fast moving live
TEA moment that unfortunately played out the way it did.
So David is going to be just fine. He's probably
gonna fight Alex Navastik. He probably back on the show

(06:10):
before that fight in June. So you know, I think
people that are criticizing David Benavidez need to leave him alone. Basically,
he was having a good time at a social event
and it was just a fast moving live TV moment
that unfortunately played out the way it did. All right,
when we come back my conversation with Keith Ideck. So,

(06:36):
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(07:44):
price guaranteed. You can't beat it all right. Keith Ideck
is here, longtime boxing writer, good friend of the podcast,
or as he texted me last night, BFF of the podcast,
and Keith, I think that is an accurate moniker for you.
You are a BFF of the podcast, We'll be sending

(08:06):
you a T shirt and or a gift certificate with
that notation.

Speaker 6 (08:12):
Fantastic.

Speaker 2 (08:14):
All right, Keith, I want to start with the competitive
fight we saw in Las Vegas last weekend between Richardson
Hitchins and Gustavo Lamos. Hitchins came in with a lot
of momentum, a lot of accolades as being one of
the best pure boxers, at least in that way class,
maybe in all of boxing. He was being lined up

(08:36):
for a world title shot at some point later this year.
Gustavolamos came in relative unknown, had fought exclusively in Argentina.
His most notable win came against Lee Selby, and that
was at the very end of Lee Selby's career, so
we didn't know what we're going to get out of
Gustavo Lamos in this fight. It turned out we got
a lot out of Gustavo Lamos because he came and

(08:58):
took the fight to Hitchins fought extremely well for stretches
during the fight, first couple of rounds, last three or
four winds up on the losing end of a unanimous decision.
We'll get into that in a moment. Well, let's start
with the performance of Hitchens, who came into this fight
saying this was going to be like a robbery, it
was going to be a whitewash, and you know he

(09:20):
struggled in this fight. What did you make of his
performance and the fight in general.

Speaker 6 (09:25):
Look, he over came some adversity in the fight, Chris,
and I know going into the fight, it's something that
you had spoken with Sergio and I think Corey last
week on the podcast about wanting to see how he
would respond to some real adversity in a fight. So
in some ways you saw him go through some things
against a guy who could punch, who was pressuring him,
who's better than people realized. Probably, So in that way,

(09:47):
we did learn something about Richardson Hitchins in a positive way,
but we also might have learned something about him in
a negative way and that maybe he's not nearly as
good as we thought in terms of being an elite
guy in the one hundred and forty pound division, because
you know, by becoming by winning this eliminator and putting
himself in position to fight Surou Mattias, that's not a
fight that I would want if I were him or

(10:08):
his handlers right now because of what happened on Saturday night.
So we did learn some things on the positive and
negative side about Richardson Hitchins. He won the fight. On
the scorecards, you could certainly argue that he lost the fight.
I think you had it scored for Gestavo Lemos, who
fought well and deserves a lot of credit. As we've
learned many many times, Chris just going through the years
with these guys from South America that were not all

(10:30):
less familiar with, some guys even less familiar with than
we were with him, because he had, like you said,
he had fought Lee Selby at least some of these guys.
You know, Ricardo Torres climate came out of Columbia, out
of nowhere and almost knocked out Miguel Coto once upon
a time. You know, of course, the Argentinian fighters have
done it. There's been so many of them, and Marcos
Madono's Madonna and Brian Castago and others from Argentina as well.

(10:52):
So so good for him coming and showing up and
fighting the way that he did. And it's unfortunate when
a guy who's in his position and who could get
a title shot by winning this fight. Loses a fight
that you could certainly argue that he won, because you
have to wonder how it's going to go for him
now that he has to get back in line, and
now people know how dangerous he is, they're not going

(11:13):
to be in a hurry to fight him.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
On Hitchins specifically, I thought we learned that he's still
got a ways to go right, Like I thought, he
boxed brilliantly against josez Apaieda. I did have an issue
with him not going for a finish against a Peda,
but he showed great movement, athleticism and out box the
former world title challenger, shutting him out on the scorecards.

(11:35):
Against a younger and fresher version maybe of Josees Apaida.
He struggled, man, He just struggled, Like you know, Lamos,
there was he was a bull of China shop in there,
and he was just going after Hitchins from the opening
bell and you know Hitchins. Even though I thought he
did a nice job adjusting to that pressure in the
middle rounds got his jab going, was an accurate puncher

(11:57):
throughout the course of the fight. He did a lot
of holding in that fight. He faced adversity multiple times
in that fight. Looked out his feet in the eighth
round of that fight, and that told me that, you know,
if you put in Hitchins right now with a super
heal Matias, who he is now next in line for,
that's probably not gonna go well for Ridge of the

(12:17):
Hitchins because everything that Gustavo Limos can do, that stuff
that super al Matias can do as well. I know
Matias is not invincible. He's got a loss in his
resume as well, but he's a very very dangerous guy.
If you're not gonna be able to stand your ground
and punching, you can't figure out what to do when
he's coming at you in the way that Lemos came

(12:40):
at you. The one aspect of this keip that I
think is worth discussing is the trouble that Hitchins seems
to have with the IBF's ten pound rehydration clause. This
is not new. Hitchins has talked about this in the past,
having difficulty with the IBF clause, which, for people that

(13:00):
don't know, requires fighters that fight for one of their titles,
and this was for a secondary version of the IBF belt.
It requires them to not only weigh in at the
weight on Friday, the day before the fight, but you
have to come in within ten pounds by what is it,
the morning or early afternoon of the fight itself. And

(13:22):
Hitchins has had a problem with that. I mean Hitchins.
You know, people around him after the fight were telling
me like it was difficult for him just to come
within that ten pounds the morning after the weigh in.
And you know, for a fighter, you don't want to
be worried about weight. Once you make the weight, you
want to go about your business, rehydrate as much as
you want. I mean some guys rehydrate to huge numbers.

(13:44):
Devin Haney most recently went up twenty something pounds in
his fight against Regi's program. That's just what happens with
some fighters. I think Hitchens, if left to his own devices,
would probably rehydrate in the same way or similar to
Devin Haney. So if I'm richest in Hitchins and I'm
evaluating my career, yes I would want that world title shot.

(14:06):
I would want to fight Suprialmatias for the IBF belt.
But if I'm not certain that I can make that
second day rehydration limit. I don't know, Maybe I go
a different direction. He's highly ranked in some of the
other sanctioning bodies, not like the IBF, but he's up
there in some other sanctioning bodies. What do you think

(14:27):
his his play is here? Does he does he barrel
forward and take that IBF title fight if offered, or
does he say, you know what, I'm not going to
be able to be one hundred percent if I have
to fight super Healmatias, and if I'm not, that's going
to end very badly for me.

Speaker 5 (14:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (14:42):
I don't know that I would favor him against any
of the one hundred and forty pound champions Chris so
it's a tough position for them to be in. I mean,
I wouldn't think he would beat Isak Cruz. I don't
think he would beat Devin Haney, who I expect to
be Ryan Garcia.

Speaker 2 (14:53):
I don't ta Femo, but is ta Femo the one
like Tamo tends to have trouble with that style, right
Like we've seen him have some trouble with you know,
Sandra Martin. We saw him have some trouble with the
way Jamaine Ortiz fought. I think Taya Fimo might be
the one guy that Hitchins could give trouble to right now.

Speaker 6 (15:10):
He could, but I would certainly favor Tiafimo Lopez in
that fight. And he's not, like you said, he's not
the mandatory for that belt. Look, whatever the rehydration situation is,
I would heavily favor Suprao Matias to win that fight
because he's just a murderous puncher who wears people down
and takes people out. Look what he did to Ergyshev
and his last fight. Ergyshev was a big self. Hadn't

(15:31):
thought someone as good as Matias, of course, but he
started off that fight very strong, and he was hitting
Matias at will. Mattias took everything that he had and
then just laid a beat down on John Ergyshev that
no one really expected. I don't think people are surprised
that Mattias won. I think people were mostly surprised that
he won so quickly and so dominantly.

Speaker 2 (15:54):
That was a No Moss moment.

Speaker 6 (15:55):
Thereshev was just worn out and he just said, man,
this guy just won't stop coming forward. He's so heavy handed,
and I think that that's gonna happen when Matias fights
most guys because he avenged his one loss. You know,
we were all surprised that night when he lost on
the on the Wilder Fury undercard, and then he came
back and the rematch by technical knockout. He was dominant

(16:17):
in that fight for the most part. So so Mattias
is a tough ask for anyone, and then you throw
this rehydration situation into the mix, and it makes it
even more difficult. I would say, though, Chris, I really
wish that the WBA, the WBC, and the WBO would
follow suit because I like this IBAF rule because too
often we have guys that are twenty twenty five pounds

(16:40):
heavier in the ring with the guy that they're fighting.
That just shouldn't be. That's why weight classes exist. I
understand they can't go I don't think it's safe necessarily
to go back to weighing in the morning of the fight,
because enough time to rehydrate. That's not healthy either, probably,
but maybe it's maybe it's healthier than what they're doing.
When you have a twenty five weight twenty five pound

(17:00):
weight advantage for one fighter, that shouldn't exist. So this
at least limits that a little bit. It doesn't eliminate it,
because you still these second day weigh in is typically,
let's just say the fights in Las Vegas, it happens
sometime between nine and eleven am Pacific time, and then
they have somewhere between ten and twelve hours if they're

(17:21):
fighting in the main event to still rehydrate. They can
still rehydrate, it gives them less time to do that,
and I have to show some discipline, of course, in
meeting that ten pound cap the next morning. So it's
a step in the right direction to making it more fair.
But I like it, you know, and if fighters can't

(17:41):
adhere to it, you don't belong fighting in the weight
class anyway. So just move up.

Speaker 2 (17:45):
Yeah, I think that's that's a reasonable position. You know,
it's not healthy to gain twenty some odd pounds in
less than twenty four hours. It's just not I remember
being in California, you know, when Zerda Ramirez fought at
light heavyweight, and when he weighed in the evening of

(18:05):
the fight, he was was it twenty nine pounds above
the light heavyweight limit. That's insane in no world is
that healthy? Now? I understand the thinking that that can
give you an advantage in a fight. If you're effectively
a heavyweight fighting a light heavyweight, then yeah, that is
an advantage that you're going to have. But it shouldn't

(18:28):
be like we build these fights as one hundred and
forty pound title fight one hundred and seventy five pound
title fight, when the reality is they're not. You've got
two guys that are oftentimes in very different weight classes.
That IBF rule, it mitigates that, it makes you make
rehydrate in a healthy way or at your normal weight,

(18:48):
or else you are going to be in the position
that Richard and Hitchins was in this past Saturday night.
And look, I know, you know, guys that win IBF
titles one of their first priorities is not to the title,
but to try to unify. Because if you unify, that's
when the IBF rule goes out the window. They don't,
you know, enforce that policy if two belts or three
belts are on the line, so you don't have to

(19:09):
worry about that in those situations. So yeah, I like
the IBF rule, but it does need to become a
universal rule. It needs to be adopted by the three
other sanctioning bodies to make it effective. So the playing
field is overall level. We have to talk about the
scoring of that fight. As you said, I scored the
fight one fifteen one to thirteen in favor of Gestavo Lamos.

(19:33):
I lean more towards the activity, the power punching. I
thought his body work was a lot better. Could understand
the scoring of the two judges that at one fifteen
one to thirteen for Hitchens because there were so many
razor thin rounds, I mean, Keith, I look at the
last four rounds according to Copybox, beginning with the ninth

(19:56):
ninth round, Lamos outlanded Hitchins thirteen to ten. Tenth round
dead even, twenty one punches land piece, eleventh round dead even,
fifteen punches landed a piece. Twelfth round Lamos eleven punches,
landed Hitchins ten. So that is the very definition of
a close and competitive fight. I did not get the

(20:17):
Tim Cheatham scorecard, which was one seventeen one eleven in
favor of Fritz and hitches That to me, gave Hitchins
every single benefit of the doubt and did not reward
Lamos enough for the work he was doing. Throughout the fight.
What did you think of the scoring of this fight.

Speaker 6 (20:35):
Yeah, I thought one seventeen one eleven was entirely too wide, Chris.
But as you said, you made a really good point.
Some of these extremely slim margins that these guys are
winning these rounds by make those rounds difficult to score.
So I would like to cut Tim Cheathams some slack
in this case because some of those rounds were so close.
But there is a pattern from Tim Cheatham, unfortunately, where

(20:56):
he's always almost always around two different than the other
two judges, and oftentimes he's he gets the highest profile
assignments and fights that are scored in Nevada with Steve Weisfeld,
David Sutherlands, sometimes Max de Luca, previously Dave Muretti before
they kind of stop using Moretti in the highest profile
fights now after what happened last year. But he's always

(21:19):
a round or two off from those guys, and it's
it's happened enough where it's not every single fight, but
it's a pattern of behavior, and I just don't know
why that is. I mean, he's always if someone has
it one fifteen, one thirteen, he inevitably has it at
least one sixteen, one twelve, sometimes one seventeen, one eleven.
In this case, you know that there's two rounds different

(21:41):
from Max DeLuca and Steve Weisfeld.

Speaker 2 (21:43):
So.

Speaker 6 (21:45):
I don't know why that is, But I'd also have
to ask the Nevada State Athletic Commission. I don't have
anything personally against Jim tim Cheatam. I'm sure he's a
nice person and all that, but you're affecting people's careers
here and maybe mix up the judging pool a little bit.

Speaker 1 (21:59):
Now.

Speaker 6 (21:59):
They've done a good job more so in the last
couple of years in Nevada Chris as As opposed to
what they had previously done only using Nevada based judges,
they have gone outside of Nevada. Steve Weisfeld is from
New Jersey, Matte Lucas from California, David Sutherland from Oklahoma.
But let's try to find some younger judges that are
also competent and have proved themselves in championship caliber fights

(22:22):
to maybe mix it up a little bit, because you
can't have the same three or four judges scoring all
of these fights and then have one judge in particular
who always seems no matter who's fighting, no matter which
promoter it is, which network it's on, to favor one
fighter by a round or two more than the other
two judges, it just doesn't add up.

Speaker 2 (22:42):
Yeah, I agree with that, you know, and Weissfeld's scoring,
you know, because I consider Steve to be the best
judge in boxing nationally maybe globally. He scored the first
and the twelfth round for Riches and Hitchins. I scored
the first and twelfth round Augusta Bolamo. So there was
the discreptive see between Steve and I on the scorecards.

(23:02):
But I can understand that because they were really close,
like they were. The first round was separated by I
want to say, four punches in favor of Richard Hitchins.
The power punch is certainly favored Lamos in that round
eight rounds to two in the first. But the fighters
overall were separated by just eleven landed punches throughout the
course of this fight. It was a very close fight.

(23:25):
I just think one seventeen one eleven just doesn't give
enough credit for the work rate that Lamos was putting
out there, the way he was being aggressive and practically
am not a holding that Hitchins was doing. I'm a
big fan of ring generalship during fights, but I didn't
think that was ring generalship. That was just a lot
of holding to try to blunt the momentum of Gustavo

(23:46):
Lamos during this fight. When it comes to Lamos, I
was very happy to hear Eddie Hearn's reaction to the fight,
because Eddie Hearn, one of the first things he said
in the post fight interview was we got to get
Lamos back. We got to give him another opportunity because
even in defeat, however controversial, he proved that he is

(24:07):
a fighter on this level, and maybe even more important,
he proved that he is a television friendly fighter. And
Eddie Hearn has a whole bunch of guys in one
hundred and forty pounds division. He can fight him in
the US against one of his guys here, he can
go over to the UK. Dalton Smith is out there
looking for an opponent presumably you know, for the middle
of the year. That's a terrific fight over in the UK. Again,

(24:28):
I didn't know what to expect from Lamos coming in
because I just didn't know what to make of his resume.
But after watching him for one full fight going twelve
rounds with Richardson Hitchins. That's a guy with potential, Key,
that's a guy that can win I think some big fights.

Speaker 6 (24:44):
Yeah, and he's in the prime of his physical prime
right now. And let's hope that Eddie does follow through
on what he said, because you hate to see guys
come from these extremely impoverished environments. Chris Were, you know,
this is their shot, man, this is it. This is
where they change their life, or hopefully they changed their life,
you know, and then when the decisions don't go their way.

(25:04):
And I'm not saying that, you know, I don't know
if he was robbed necessarily. I mean it was a
close fight, but you could certainly argue that he won
the fight. And when he and when a guy who
comes from where he came from loses a fight, you
just hope somebody does right by him somewhere down the line.
Maxi Hughes didn't come from an impoverished nation. He came
from England. But when Maxi Hughes lost to George Cambosis,

(25:27):
they he got an opportunity. Now was a really tough
fight against Williams of Payda.

Speaker 2 (25:31):
But you wish for I guess, yeah, but at least
he got it back.

Speaker 6 (25:36):
He was overwhelmed by Zepaida, who's very good obviously, but
it was a double eliminator, and you know, it was
a real opportunity for him in his next fight after cambosis.
So you like to see that it wasn't the same promoter. Obviously,
it was a it was a Golden Boy card and
he lost on a top rank card, but you at
least like to see a guy get another opportunity when
you feel that they were wrong. Because I really felt

(25:56):
like Maxi Hughes beat George Campbos. It's again a close fight,
but I thought that he won, so at least he
wasn't put on the shelf. The fight was seven or
eight months later, but it wasn't like he had to
wait three or four years for another opportunity.

Speaker 2 (26:09):
Yeah, and I hope he Gustavo Lamos gets one very quickly.
I think there's enough available fights for him, either in
the US or the UK to give him that opportunity.
If you already heard like that's a guy that makes
good TV. I mean he didn't get a win in
the same way that you know, Mauricio Lara got that

(26:31):
big win against Josh Warrington. But Mauricio Lara was effectively
discovered when he was put in as an opponent for
Josh Warrington and he got a win. But Lamos, that
to me was just as as effective as as a win.
He proved he can fight on this level. He proved
he can be entertaining. He's still young enough to be
considered a kind of a quasi prospect. You can do

(26:52):
something with him if he starts to put some wins together.
So I think it's a good idea to bringing him
back and see what you can make of him moving forward.
All right, Keith, let's talk about Jared Anderson, who will
take on Riad Murray this weekend in Texas. On paper, Keith,
there is a lot to like about Jared Anderson. He's
twenty four, he's undefeated, He's got sixteen wins, fifteen of

(27:14):
them come by knockout. The only guy in the distance
with him was Charles Martin, a former champion himself. He's
gotten the Roy Jones Seal of Approval for whatever that's worth.
But he's been getting in some trouble of late. Two
days after his fight with Murhy, he has a court
date connected to an incident in February where he led
police on a six mile car chase before crashing into

(27:35):
a meeting, and he's also been arrested for improperly handling
a firearm and for driving while intox Kate. On top
of that, he's often made it clear in interviews that
he doesn't really love boxing, that he's in it for
the money, and that he hopes to get out of
the game as early as age twenty seven. Now, Bob
Aarum has come up this week and said, I still believe,
I still think this is the guy that can become

(27:58):
the next great heavyweight. You do you share Bob's opinion
of Jared Anderson or do you have a different one.

Speaker 6 (28:04):
Well, in fairness to Bob, what is he supposed to say? Right?

Speaker 7 (28:08):
I know you're well aware of that too, but I mean,
what is this guy?

Speaker 6 (28:11):
I'm sure that you know in the office internally either
are very concerned about Jared Anderson because this is a
This is not a one instance, Chris, this is a
pattern of behavior. He's been arrested twice in the last
I don't know five months six He was arrested in November,
and he was arrested again last month so it's a problem.
I'm much more concerned about with what's going on with

(28:33):
Jared Anderson outside of the ring than what's happening inside
of the ring. Now, he showed some vulnerability in the
Chris and the Charles Martin fight. You know, he took
that fight willingly on very short notice. I think it
was ten days notice when Martin came in for a
right handed fighter who pulled out of the fight, Kasabutski.
So it was noble of him, I guess, to some

(28:55):
degree to fight a strong southball who had, whatever anyone
thinks of Charles Martin had owned one of the heavyweight
titles and is a big puncher, a big, tall, strong
south Paul who can punch. And Charles Martin exploited some
flaws in Jared Anderson's defense in that fight and buzzed
them twice in the fight, and Jared Anderson withstood that,

(29:15):
fought through it, and came back and won the fight
comfortably on all three scorecards. So I thought we learned
something pretty positive about Jared Anderson that night last July
in that fight. Now, they've been very careful about matching
him since then because of what happened in that fight
of course, right, I had de Andre Ridenko fight with
the guy who's thirty nine to forty years old and
had been knocked out before.

Speaker 4 (29:34):
So and in this fight.

Speaker 6 (29:36):
Okay, well, he beat Tony Yoka in his last fight,
but Tony Yoka had lost his previous two fights, so
I don't know how much of an accomplishment that is
at this point. This is and I don't mean this
in a negative way.

Speaker 4 (29:47):
This is just a fact.

Speaker 6 (29:47):
This is typical matchmaking the way that Top Rank does it,
and they're maybe the most masterful matchmaking company in the
entire sport. They know what they're doing, and they're not
going to unnecessarily put Jared Anderson in the ring with
a risky opponent when it's not necessary. At this point,
we saw what happened. He thought, Charles Martin, there's no
real point to him fighting someone who has the chance
to beat him right now, with the type of persons

(30:08):
that are being made available to him for these ESPN
or ESPN Plus fights right now at the stage of
his career. The question I would have if I'm top
ranked Chris is what's going to happen after this fight?
Presumably he's going to win on Saturday night, right, so
he wins, But then what happens in the months thereafter,
not only with this pending court case, but I don't

(30:31):
know what's going on with Jared Anderson, and I hope
that he's okay, but the way he's behaving would indicate
that he's not.

Speaker 5 (30:37):
I mean, I read, I think it was.

Speaker 6 (30:39):
Mike Toppinger wrote a very detailed story based on the
police report from what happened in Michigan. Some pretty wild
stuff he was doing, I mean, evading the police for seemingly.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
Yea to paraphrase, he was evading the police, and then
when he had evaded the police, he came back. He
turned around and came back and was I forget the
phrasing of it, but he was almost playing a cat
and most game with them. So it was a very
bizarre incident that just kind of screamed, this guy's got

(31:12):
some issues here. This guy's got some issues he's dealing with.

Speaker 6 (31:15):
Yeah, and in the previous incident, he was under some
sort of influence when he was the rest of the
pre which was also a motor vehicle situation, so.

Speaker 2 (31:24):
I don't know was involved too.

Speaker 6 (31:25):
You know, there was a weapon involved in the November incident.
You just hope that the guy's okay. I mean, this
is a very abnormal way to make a living. And
I know, you know, we talk about it and write
about it for a living and everything, but imagine if
you were getting punched in the head.

Speaker 3 (31:41):
For a living.

Speaker 6 (31:41):
You don't know the anyway, we know, the long term
effects of it are are never good. You know, maybe
in the short term it's really affecting him in a
negative way too, because this is really troublesome behavior from
Jared Anderson over these past few months. I've, you know,
in my own deal with him. I don't have anything
personal against him. I sincerely doubt he has anything personal

(32:03):
against me, would never really have. But he's a moody guy.
I mean, that's the way I found him to be.
Now that's fine, I mean whatever, it is what it is.
But this is beyond being moody and a little difficult, Like,
who really care if he's a little difficult for me
to interview or for you to interview. No one cares
about that. It is what it is, part of the job.
We just deal with it and move forward. Not the
end of the world. It is what it is, you know,

(32:24):
he just it's fine, but now his behavior is becoming
much more problematic for everyone that's involved in his career.
Forget you know, reporters who talked to him once every
three or four months. It's sort of irrelevant. But now
that these are real issues, and I just hope whatever
help that Jared Anderson needs, I hope that he's getting it.
And it would seem that he needs some help.

Speaker 2 (32:45):
Is the I don't love boxing stuff a red flag
for you, because when I hear that, where my mind
goes is to wondering what happens when this guy needs
to dig deep, right, Because it's one thing to be
coming up the ranks, knocking guys out that are significantly

(33:08):
inferior to you from a talent perspective, but at some point,
when you get to a championship level, you are going
to face real adversity. You are going to get knocked down,
you are going to be hurt. It's inevitable. It happens
to every fighter. And when I hear a fighter say
that he doesn't really love the game and I want

(33:31):
to be out of the game at age twenty seven,
that makes me wonder how they're going to respond when
that level of adversity hits. Now, It's easy for me
to sit here and say, gotta dig deep, got to
overcome punches. I'm not the one facing Anthony Joshua or
Tyson Fury, or Philip Perkovich or Alexander Usak, whoever he

(33:53):
might be facing at that level at that time. But
that's part of the job, like having to overcome that
type of versity. He says stuff like I don't love
the game. Does that raise any red flags for you?

Speaker 6 (34:07):
It depends on how you look at it, Chris, because
I think we did. He did dig deep against Charles Martin.
I mean, his career could have come apart that night
very easily. If Charles Martin would have been able to
follow up on hurting him and wound up knocking him out.
I mean, his career as ascending heavyweight contender would have
been over in effect. So I thought he showed something
in that fight. You know, you don't love hearing that.
But at the same time, he's being brutally honest. I mean,

(34:29):
the guy does I don't know. You know, there's some
maniacs involved in this sport, obviously, because you gotta you'd
have to have a couple of screws loose to do
this for a living, you know for sure. So in
that respect, I mean, who would love it, you know?
I mean, you're getting punched in that, even if you're
really good at it, you're getting punched in the head,

(34:49):
and you know you're doing some long term damage to yourself.
So in some way I almost appreciate that Jared Anderson's
being honest, you know, he's saying, I don't I'm doing
this because I want to try to make a better
life for my family and get out of this with
my faculties intact and try to make a better life
for them in the short term. Now, this is going
at such a snail's pace for him now because of

(35:11):
what's going on with the heavyweight titles and what's on
the horizon for Tyson Fury and Alexander Usik and Anthony
Joshua and all that. He's not going to get a
title shot anytime soon. So I think we're going to
continue seeing him fight comparable levels of opponents that he's
fighting on Saturday Night and that he fought in his
last fight. I don't know what that's doing for him
necessarily except padding his record and he is being paid

(35:31):
six figure purses. I mean, it's not like he's you know,
it's not like he's struggling financially. But to get to
the types of paydays that he wants, it's going to
take a while. So he's going to have to fight
beyond twenty seven years old, whether he likes it or not.
So that's something that he's going to have to determine himself.
And again, if this pattern of behavior outside of the

(35:53):
ring continues, well, that decision is going to be made
for him, because eventually he's going to do something that's
going to land him in jail or worse.

Speaker 2 (36:00):
Yeah, I'm all for getting out of the game early,
that's for sure, especially if you're a heavyweight, especially if
you wind up taking the kind of punishment heavyweights take
at the highest of levels. But to get to that point,
to your point where you're getting out of the game,
you've got to win these high level fights, and you
have to face adversity in these high letvel fights. I'm
reminded of, you know, the Anthony Joshua Vladimir Klitschko fight
back in what was the twenty seventeen I believe that

(36:23):
was a fight where AJ had to dig deep he
got knocked down by the former heavyweight champion, one of
the best heavyweights of this era. He got up and
he knocked Ladimir klitch Go out. That was and remains
the best win of Anthony Joshua's career. But it was
after that fight where everything kind of changed for AJ.
He was not the same fighter after that. He went
to people on his team and said, I don't want

(36:44):
to be that kind of fighter anymore where I'm in
these kind of knockdown, drag out brawls because I don't
want to be, you know, a messed up fighter or
a messed up X fighter down the line. So and look,
AJ has not had to dig deep like that since
I don't know. A lot of people kind of point
to the Andrew Ruize loss as the fight that changed

(37:05):
Anthony Joshua. It wasn't that. It was the Klitschko fight
that changed Anthony Joshua, and we haven't seen him need
to dig deep to get a win since then. He's
on a four fight winning streak, but he's beaten competition.
He's been comfortable being able to be competition that's not
on that level. I just wonder what happens when Jared

(37:25):
Anderson gets that moment where it's like he's facing an
AJ or, he's facing I don't even know, like a
heard of it, so a young guy that might he
might potentially face in the next couple of years, and
he gets knocked down, he get up and have that
same kind of response to AJ did back in twenty seventeen.
That to me, remains an open question when it comes
to Jared Anderson.

Speaker 6 (37:46):
So, yeah, of Churse, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I
just think it's going to be a while before we
get any answer to that question. I think he's going
to fight again a comparable opponent in his next fight,
assuming everything from a legal perspective him to continue fighting.
Uh So, I don't think we're gonna find out for
quite some time.

Speaker 2 (38:05):
What does the heavyweight scene look like in five years anyway?
Like the who are the prospects that are out there?
I mean, most of these guys are over the age
of thirty at least some of them coming in closer
to forty. I'm just looking at some of the rankings
right now.

Speaker 6 (38:19):
I mean, when they tend to emerge from the Olympics,
there's always somebody.

Speaker 2 (38:24):
I guess, I guess, but who's in that Jared Anderson
kind of class, Like who do you put him in?

Speaker 6 (38:30):
I don't know, Like among young Americans, there's not.

Speaker 2 (38:32):
Really young American and even young European. I mean, I
guess you look at jalal Off as someone down the
line that he could wind up fighting Dubois, still pretty young.
If he can find a way to win a heavyweight title.
That's probably a pretty good fight for Jared Anderson at
some point the next couple of years. But it's, uh,
landscape looks kind of bleak right now, Keith. For the
heavyweights in the next couple of years.

Speaker 6 (38:54):
Yeah, and for Anderson specifically. You know, he's gonna want
a title shot. He's not gonna want to fight someone
in because it could be a dangerous you know. Of
course depends on what happens and Dan duas next fight
and all that, but I understand.

Speaker 2 (39:05):
But you know, David Wall could be tied up too,
Like I mean, one of the scenarios and I'm sure
you've heard it as well, like is Daniel Dubois fighting
Philip Pargovic for a vacant IBF belt, and then if
a Fury Aj fight can't be made, then AJ would
fight the winner of Herkovich dua for the IBF belt,
So Dubois might be tied up for the next eighteen

(39:27):
months or so like, so.

Speaker 6 (39:29):
It eliminates another potential option for that. That's what I mean.
There aren't many guys that will be available to Jared
Anderson because they either hold heavyweight titles or are going
to be fighting for heavyweight titles. So why would they
fight Jared Anderson. He's in a weird position because he's
got a great platform, he's got a great promoter, very
you know, one of the best management teams in the
sport and everything. But losing going to fight anytime soon,

(39:50):
that will really resonate with the public.

Speaker 2 (39:52):
How about Michael Hunter, He's always looking for a fight.
Fight Michael Hunter.

Speaker 6 (39:57):
I think they've tried that, actually I believe so.

Speaker 1 (40:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:01):
I saw Michael Hunter's last fight. He fought some guy
that was huge. This guy was very, very big. Uh,
And Michael's been out there chasing a fight forever. So
I've just thrown his name into the BIX. But there
you go. There's one name, once beaten, Michael Hunter, former
US Olympian, make it in the USA. All right, let's
let's finish your Keith. In the women's division on Saturday,

(40:22):
Clarissa Shields was part of his own broadcast. Also ringside
was Alicia Bombgardner, the undisputed one hundred and thirty pound champion. Now,
these two women have had a bit of a social
media beef going on for the better part of the
last year, where they've been firing shots back and forth
talking about fighting. Well, that spilled over into real life.

(40:43):
Where as soon as the broadcast ended, Clorisa Shields got
up confronted Alicia bombgard it became this big thing ringside.
Colorista Shields is a former champion at one sixty eight,
one sixty and one fifty four. Alicia Bombgardner, I believe
the highest sheest spot is one point thirty's I'm speak
a champion at one hundred and thirty pounds. A lot
to talk about these two fighting each other. There's obviously

(41:05):
bad blood. It's a makeable fight since bomb Gardner's affiliated
with Eddie Hern and his own Gloria Shield's kind of
free agent. Is this a viable fight to you? Like,
there's a pretty big weight difference between these two women.
Is this a realistic fight that we could see at
some point.

Speaker 6 (41:22):
You know, Unfortunately, Chris, I don't think that it is.
The rivalry has been great, and there are a lot
of things in terms of building a promotion that make
perfect sense. They're the same age. I believe they're both
twenty nine years old, they're both from Michigan. There's clearly
just like there. Claressa Shields thinks that Alicia Bomgardner is
a cheater. She has been very vocal about that. She
had her own ped issue with Hannah Gabriel's last year,

(41:44):
and she's been you know, she's been very adamant about
the fact that people need to do comprehensive drug testing
her whole career.

Speaker 2 (41:52):
So Claressa's can I guys point out keep that Like
when Bob Garner first released her statement where she kind
of self vindicated herself, Claressa Shields one of the first
ones to congratulate her on that. So this whole beef
kind of began when bomb Gardner said I want to
fight Claressa. I think I can beat her, and Claressa

(42:15):
kind of takes everything personally. She kind of that kind
of nodded her, and it all of a sudden sort
of snowball from there, but go ahead.

Speaker 6 (42:22):
Sorry, Well she's the quote obviously, and she didn't take
kindly to that. But look, I understand Claressa's perspective. Look,
you're twenty pounds. I think bomb Gardner the high she
has fought at light Technically, she has fought at lightweight
a couple of times. I think she weighed like one
thirty three or one thirty four or so something like
that for a couple of her fights been, but she's

(42:44):
she's really a thirty pounder, right. Claressa has never weighed
in less than one hundred and fifty three and like
three quarters or something like that. For her fight against
of Anna Hobizon, I think it was was the lowest
that she's ever weighed. So that's twenty plus pounds of heart. Basically,
there's no middle ground there that makes any kind of sense,
because as Claressa gets older, it's not going to be

(43:06):
realistic for her to come down any more and weight
than one fifty four. And she's joked around with me
and other people in the past that she would have
to cut off body parts and everything to get any lower.
You know, she really would would have liked to have
fought Katie Taylor because there are two big stars. You know,
Katie's a big star, and you know it would have
been a fight where if they came together on the weight,
although it would have been a big disadvantage. I think

(43:28):
for Katie Taylor to come up multiple D classes and
then Claressa's killing herself to get down to forty sets
or whatever wherever they might have fought. I understand why
Claressa brings up all of these fights because she's already
fought everyone that she can fight for the most part, right,
I mean, she's already beaten Savannah Marshall. There are people
who think on Claressa's team and on Savannah Marshall's team

(43:50):
that they will eventually fight again, and I think there
would be interest in that fight because it was reasonably competitive.
Although I think everyone agrees that Clorssa wanted to fight,
but there is no one really for her to fight.
I mean, she's very good friends with with Cruz Deserned.
You know she's not gonna fight to her again. They
already fought. I mean, she fought in her pro debut,

(44:10):
so she's not gonna They're not going to fight now.
That she's beaten, she's the one hundred and sixty eight
pound champion again, they're not going to fight again, you know,
so or it certainly doesn't seem like they're going to
fight again. So who is Loressa's looking at it like, well,
who am I going to fight?

Speaker 5 (44:25):
There?

Speaker 6 (44:26):
This natural rivalry here, it's been you know, ramped up
on social media and all that kind of stuff. But
I don't think it's a realistic fight that could happen
because they're just too far apart and weight, and it's
not really safe for Caloressa to go in a lower
than one fifty four. I don't think, especially as she's
you know, she's twenty nine now, she's not you know,
twenty three, twenty four trying to do that type of stuff.

Speaker 2 (44:45):
I don't think it's a big deal for Bombgardner to
come up because you know, women do that a lot, right, Like,
look at it that a lot?

Speaker 5 (44:52):
Man?

Speaker 2 (44:52):
Well, I mean, I mean bomb Gardner became a star
knocking out Terry Harper. Two fights after Terry Harper got
knocked up by Bumgardner at one thirty, she moved up
and won a title at one fifty four. So like
it's happened. I mean, Mikhaela Mayer went from one thirty
to one forty seven in a couple of fights, Like
it all depends on the body type, sure, but I
don't think it's that big a deal for Bumgardner to

(45:13):
go up to one forty seven ish, right, And I
say ish because I think there might be a middle
ground there, Like let's I would agree with you. Cloressa
going down to one forty seven probably not a good idea.
Can she make one fifty? He doing a catchweight at
one fifty?

Speaker 4 (45:29):
Maybe?

Speaker 2 (45:30):
You know it's it's such a big fight, there might
be enough money to make it worth it for both
these women, because frankly, I don't know where either one
of them goes right now. I mean at the moment,
Bumgardner is locked into a title defense against Delphine Pursue
and that's a tough fight. Delphine Pursue is a good fighter,
and that'll be Bumgardner's first fight in about a year,

(45:51):
so she's gonna take that fight. Claressa is out there
doing MMA right now, like she doesn't have anyone she
She's as tied to Savannah Marshall as Anna Marshall as
a boxer is tied to her. So Larssa's got to
be looking around at the landscape between one fifty four
and one sixty eight and saying, what am I going
to do? Where's the money? How do I earn at

(46:11):
as a boxer in these weight classes? Bumgardner is the
best chance she can. I mean, you mentioned the geography
both these women from Michigan, like you could probably do
a pretty good crowd at Little Caesar Arena or someplace
along those lines. You could probably do get a good
license fee from his own I agree there are challenges
to a Keith, but I would knock it off the table,
not if they can come to an agreement on a

(46:33):
catchweight that is somewhere in the low one fifties.

Speaker 6 (46:36):
Yeah, and again that might be one of her only options, Chris,
because if Shadejah Green would have beaten Franchise Cruise Design,
that would have been a fight.

Speaker 5 (46:44):
You know.

Speaker 6 (46:44):
I think Laressa would have moved back up to one
sixty eight and taken that fight, and there would have
been a lot of interest in that fight for obvious reasons.
But she lost, so it took another option away from her.
And again she's not going to fight Cruise desern Again,
I don't I certainly don't get that impression. So and
she already beat her.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
Said, they both said, like they'll do it, but they want, like,
you know, back up the Brinks trucks type of type
of stuff, and that's just not gonna happen.

Speaker 6 (47:06):
For where is that truck coming from exactly?

Speaker 1 (47:08):
And I don't know.

Speaker 6 (47:10):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I understand what.

Speaker 5 (47:13):
You know.

Speaker 6 (47:13):
They're friendly and they want to be compensated properly in
their minds to to make the fight happen. But she
already beat her. It's not like there's she was I
was there that night. I believe you were too on
the andre Ward covill At undercard when it was a
long time ago now but seven and a half years
ago or whatever. But she already beat her and it
wasn't controversial. So what there's no real need for them

(47:35):
to fight again, to be honest.

Speaker 2 (47:37):
Now, I'm with you. I just I think her and
Bumgardner is interesting, and for both of them, there really
isn't a lot of interesting action out there, you know.
I know Bumgardner's team will tell you that they believe
they're going to get a shot at Katie Taylor or
Amanda Serrano. I'll believe that when I see it. I

(48:00):
think it's more likely Katie Taylor and Manda Ronano fight
each other at some point this summer. Something Eddie hern
has kind of floated out there. And for Claressa, as
I mentioned, I mean one f one sixty eight is
barren in terms of marketable opponents that can drive a rating,
drive a live gate. It may not be comfortable to

(48:22):
get down a little more in weight that she wants to,
but she if she wants to get paid, she may
have to do it. And bomb Guarter It could mean
the exact same thing. So we'll see. We'll see what
happens later on this year with that fight. Keith, good
stuff man. Always appreciate your time. You are a phenomenal
b FF of the pod. I always appreciate you doing it.

Speaker 6 (48:38):
Yeah, of course, Sun time man.

Speaker 2 (48:41):
Thanks And when we come back, my conversation with Ryan Garcia.

Speaker 7 (48:54):
So, Ryan, this feels like it's been a long time
coming between you and Devin Haney. Does it feel that you?

Speaker 1 (49:01):
Honestly, I mean when you look back at life like
things feel like they come like this. You know, before
you know, I was fighting him at nine years old,
ten years old, and now we're both in our twenties
and we're ready to throw down.

Speaker 5 (49:14):
So to me it feels like this, But obviously it's
been a long time.

Speaker 2 (49:17):
Those first fights when you were nine or ten years old,
what do you remember about them?

Speaker 1 (49:22):
That he was just like a kid trying to, you know,
get into the sport. Like he wasn't known at all.
He just came in out of nowhere and like started
boxing and everybody was beating him. So when I first
fought him, I was like, okay, another kid, like he
sucks by Like I beat him very easy the first time,
but obviously he started evolving, got better, and then all
of a sudden he started beating people.

Speaker 5 (49:42):
And then that's when everybody was on their radar. Okay,
like he stepped it up.

Speaker 7 (49:46):
Did the fights between you and him get more competitive
as they went on.

Speaker 5 (49:50):
Yeah, I would say so when I'm locked in, obviously
I heard him every time.

Speaker 1 (49:55):
You know, there's times where I didn't lock in and
he ended up beating me on points, but it was
very mediocre wins and nothing that stands out. When I
beat him, people were talking about it even after that
I remember specifically.

Speaker 5 (50:09):
In North Carolina. We were at the Junealympic Nationals.

Speaker 1 (50:12):
We were about fifteen fourteen, and I mean I went
at him right away, and I had him, you know, hurt, wobbling,
you know, in the middle of the ring. Everybody's going crazy,
and you know, his own coach or one of his
people in his corner came up to my dad after
the fight and he goes, Devin thinks that he broke
he broke his ear drum, like hed in the corner.
I can't hear at all, like he wanted to stop

(50:34):
the fight. But that was just one example of what
I've done. And he never gave me a count. He
literally cut the video that he was showing like he
actually got a point taking.

Speaker 5 (50:45):
Away that fight for hitting me back of the head.

Speaker 7 (50:47):
This was the last time.

Speaker 1 (50:48):
Yes, he hit me back of the head, got a
point taken away and still won. That means he would
have had to kill me all the round. They probably
robbed me for that fight. But it's all I don't
even care.

Speaker 7 (50:58):
Do you feel like you at your best back then
could have beaten him at his best.

Speaker 1 (51:03):
I was just too much for him, too strong, too explosive,
just you know, there's guys that are like.

Speaker 5 (51:11):
Great, good, and then there's just that guy. I'm that guy.
So you know, when I fight, it's not mid.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
You know, when he fights, it's mid like great Devinitie
Devine is like great, he's boxing like Devin Aiding the boxer.
It's like when I fight, it's like fun. This is
Ryan Garcia fight, like this is a show. There's a
different energy. We're not the same. I'm about to show
you when it comes to fight night.

Speaker 2 (51:32):
You guys bought your last amateur fight towards the end
of your amateur careers. Do you remember thinking at all
back then, like I'm gonna see this guy down the line.
I'm gonna see this guy when we turn pro.

Speaker 1 (51:44):
I mean it always kind of looked like that. Especially
when he first went pro. I was like, oh, what
the heck? He went pro quick? And then this so
worked out for me too. I mean, I made the
USA team. I was gonna chart traveling with the national team,
but something in me he said, nah's let's go that route.
You know, I'll admit he kind of set the trend
on going pro early and fighting in Mexico and doing that.

Speaker 5 (52:07):
I just did it. Ten times better.

Speaker 1 (52:09):
You know, he had his Instagram going and YouTube. I
started doing and I'm just better at it. Everything he does,
I'm just better at So that's kind of how it started.
And then yeah, I went and blew up first in
the pros and I started, you know, making my own way.

Speaker 2 (52:25):
Last December, after Devin beat Regis pro Grade, you pretty
quickly hopped on social media after that and said I'm
ready to fight Devin Handy. Was there something you saw
in that fight or was it a certain level that
Devin got to you that got you as interested in that?

Speaker 1 (52:41):
I think more so instinct. You know, I always let
God lead me and everything, so it felt it felt
like it was time. I'm also in the best place
I've been in for a long time. It carried over
from Dorita and it just got even better. So this
is the time I feel like I'm stepping right into
my prime and I feel like in my heart I'm

(53:02):
the face of boxing. And I say that because of
my upside and how I could, you know, make anything
have a high reach. You know, people don't even just
talk about my boxing, they talk about my life. If
I walk wrong and they record it, I'm gonna go
viral for some reason. So I think I'm just that
guy for everything. You know, I touch places that Canelo

(53:29):
can't touch, and I touch places that no fighter right
now can touch.

Speaker 2 (53:33):
Just me.

Speaker 1 (53:34):
I'm a marketing machine and I have the will to
be the best at everything I do. I don't leave
any stone unturned. So yeah, I feel will this fight
solidify me as a world champion?

Speaker 5 (53:46):
Yes? Do I need that? Yes, I'm gonna do it.

Speaker 1 (53:48):
Yes, that's just a bonus. But also it signifies like
he is the face of boxing. Ryan was always the
one to do it.

Speaker 5 (53:55):
That's great.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
You look back at your fight in December against Oscar
to war table, what letter grade would you give that performance?

Speaker 1 (54:02):
I'll give myself a minus. Only part I messed up
was standing in the pocket maybe a little too long.
But other than that, people like to make front of
the defense. I could show you a million videos of
mayweathery're turning his back.

Speaker 5 (54:13):
I could. I could make a whole real highlight of it.
I don't need to explain myself. I wasn't getting hit.

Speaker 1 (54:19):
I got hit, made one shot in that little thing,
and I made two shots a hook, But most of
the part he was missing and it disrupted his rhythm,
he was coming forward. He was kind of nobody was noticing,
but he was building momentum. By the third fourth round,
I'm like, okay, this dude's like the terminator, Like, let
me just go to this garden, stop and stop the pressure.
Let's stop the bleeding before it gets crazy. So I

(54:41):
did that, and then when I was done deflating the tire,
I started moving again. And then because of all those
punches I hit him with, he started getting delirious.

Speaker 5 (54:49):
And then he threw a punch and got caught with you.
I know what I'm doing. You don't.

Speaker 2 (55:02):
Your first fight with Derek James, how did you feel
that partnership went amazing?

Speaker 5 (55:11):
You know, me and Derek have We just have a
really cool thing going on and we get each other.
I respect him, you know, he's more.

Speaker 1 (55:18):
He's like, he's a coach, he's a philosopher, he's like
a father, he's everything.

Speaker 5 (55:22):
So he's a really really great asset.

Speaker 2 (55:25):
When you're facing someone like Devin Hainey, having watched him
against Lomachenko, watching him against reach pro Gray, how complicated
a fight do you think this is going to be?

Speaker 5 (55:35):
Not at all?

Speaker 1 (55:37):
Not complicated. I've been boxing my whole life. There's nothing
that I'm gonna see that I've not seen before. So
it's not gonna be complicated. It's just I got to execute.
You can't have no mercy on Devin. That's the problem
with Lomachenko had. Regis is just not a good fighter.
You know, he's still an amateur in my opinion. You
know the way he fights. You know he started late.
It's showing that you started late.

Speaker 5 (55:58):
You're not that guy.

Speaker 1 (56:00):
So I would knock him out within three rounds sleep.
It would be very bad for Regis. But let's not
get into that. But I would knock you up. I
would do it for fun, you know, like a little
But Devin is gonna get badly or that's why I like,
that's why there's not gonna be a rematch.

Speaker 5 (56:18):
There's no rematch clause like Rocky bay Boat. There's no rema.
There's not gonna be no rematch.

Speaker 2 (56:23):
And when you when you two guys gotten the ring together,
after you're winning Anaheim four years ago, I mean to
become I'll get to you.

Speaker 4 (56:33):
I'll get to you.

Speaker 5 (56:35):
Let's get that.

Speaker 7 (56:39):
There was some trash talk there, but you seem friendly
in that moment. Has that changed.

Speaker 1 (56:44):
Oh, yeah, there was a big shift. I just started
seeing who they really are, you know, smile on your face,
stabbing in the back. They have different motives. I don't
work that way, but can I sense it when it's
going down?

Speaker 5 (56:56):
Yeah. I was on the phone with him.

Speaker 1 (56:58):
He was explaining what he wanted in this fly and
how could we can make it happen percentage wise. He's
being very nice, calling me bro laughing, and I looked
at my security and uh, I think I put it
on mute or something. I said something you don't feel r.
I don't know what it is, but I don't. I
don't feel at peace. I don't I don't understand this.
And then it hit me, Oh, he's trying to make
me lower my guard. So that's why I send him

(57:19):
that text message basically saying we're not friends. Don't don't
you lose sight of that, Like there's not gonna be mercy.
I don't give a like I'm coming to knock you
out and leave with no crumbs, like you and your daddy.
So I had to let him know, like, you're not
my friends. Don't act like it. Let's not fake it.
You're not my fing friend. You wanna win, and that's it.
Shut the fack up and let's figure.

Speaker 5 (57:40):
It out as men.

Speaker 1 (57:41):
But you're not my friend at all. Don't hit my
phone no more. That's why that was the first thing
I told him when we were were face to face.
Everything I told him on the text, I said, it's
his face. I was like, dude, we're not friends. Stop
playing like, don't try to play me.

Speaker 5 (57:57):
So that's what.

Speaker 2 (57:59):
That was. You faced against each other in Vegas. Did
that get maybe a little more personal then you thought
it was going to get? Did that get more heated
than you thought it was going to get?

Speaker 1 (58:12):
Also, the record straight, all we were gonna do was
face off at a specific spot.

Speaker 5 (58:17):
Nobody paying for what I went and did.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
Because he started talking as I was walking to the spot,
and he was a move and I hit a switch.

Speaker 5 (58:26):
I said, okay, I just went straight to him.

Speaker 1 (58:28):
I was like, we're gonna do it right here, and
then I started going in on him, and obviously I
touched the nerve.

Speaker 5 (58:34):
Bill Hayne even wanted to fight me.

Speaker 1 (58:37):
Those dudes, I they're scared I'm gonna pit so much
fear into Devin that he's gonna be like in the ring,
will be shaky. He's gonna want to pants in the
back room, Like that's how much I'm gonna like. They
think I'm joking, though, I'm gonna make sure he's he
feels like my before we get on there, like your
dad's a pimp and he's pimping you. Yeah, you both,
So I'm gonna pit so much fear in him. He
just starts like the go down his leg.

Speaker 5 (59:01):
Like who's peeing? You know?

Speaker 2 (59:04):
With Devin at this stage, he's probably fighting at his best,
at least the best we've seen him. Whatever you think,
approgram a complete shut out and knock him down good performance.

Speaker 7 (59:14):
Do you feel like you're at your best?

Speaker 2 (59:16):
You're coming off a knockout when you still though working
with a new trainer, there's probably still an adjustment to that.

Speaker 7 (59:23):
Do you feel like you're at your best right now?

Speaker 1 (59:25):
Oh yeah, I mean my absolute best and it's only
getting better. The thing with me, the same time it
would take somebody to get used to a new trainer.
It doesn't work that those rules don't apply to me
because they just don't know. We're perfectly fine. Everything is great.
Like I like I said, he needs the least am
I word if I wasn't scared to fight Tank. Why

(59:46):
would I be worried about a guy that can't crack
an egg. It's not gonna hurt me to be in
the ring with him. The worst thing you could do
to me is jabby Great, What are you gonna do
about me?

Speaker 5 (59:56):
When that really is real?

Speaker 1 (59:58):
Like, it's not like I'm throwing some pebbles, Bro, I'm
hitting you with some like even if it don't hit
you fully, you're gonna be like, oh, I don't want
to do I'm scared, Like he's gonna be worried when
those these are eight ounce gloves. These are not the
pillow ten ounce gloves that we fought in, Like this
is something you thought I hate hard back then, Bro,

(01:00:19):
you have a.

Speaker 5 (01:00:19):
Whole other thing coming for you. And I'm this is
not just a fight for me. This is deeper, This
is spiritual, This is deeper.

Speaker 1 (01:00:27):
I'm coming with a whole type of different energy and
folks Like he's thinking it's a boxing match, I'm thinking
literally life or death. Not for him, of course, I'm
not but like to fight. You know, anything happened, I
don't want that to happen. I want to go that
on record, you know, but I'm coming with that type
of aggression and fury like like I'm coming like that's intentional,

(01:00:50):
like it it's just in me against him.

Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
I know you think and you believe, the perception of
you is different than the reality. You talk about the
keyboard warriors out there that have been critical of you.
Some might have said, maybe he's not as focused as
he should be because you're on social media a lot
and you engage with a lot of fans.

Speaker 7 (01:01:06):
How would you respond to that.

Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
I don't know how long you guys think it takes
to make a post, but in my reality, it takes
ten seconds. So that I mean, if they're that dumb,
like I can't help you. I'm gonna just like leave
it up for your interpretation. As long as I know
and my team knows that we work out every day
hard and we're killing in the gym and we're looking great.

(01:01:28):
I'm not worried about the perception of others because that's
not the reality of it.

Speaker 5 (01:01:32):
So you could call me the most like that was
a stupid quote by Chris.

Speaker 1 (01:01:35):
Aldury, the most disciplined fighter versus the most undisciplined, bro,
You don't get here in this spot being undisciplined.

Speaker 5 (01:01:42):
Think what your brain?

Speaker 1 (01:01:44):
Has anybody ever been successful and came from nothing by
not working hard? You're literally low key dumb. I'd be
probably hikey like that makes no sense. Again, this was
a narrative set by Canilo because I took a mental
health break. This has just been following me my whole life.
It's bull I train hardest.

Speaker 2 (01:02:05):
Does that add even more employees to this, because you would?
You know, Devin does have that perception of strictly focused.
If you win this fight, how gonna be strictly focused?

Speaker 1 (01:02:14):
If he blooms up the most out of all of us,
wouldn't the most disciplined fighter be like Terrence Crawford that's
always in shape. I think you just messed up like
that makes no sense. He gets really big, far past
one eighty in my opinion, when he gets big big.
So look it, it's just a narrative that's gonna, you know,

(01:02:36):
organically change over the over the you know, upcoming months.

Speaker 7 (01:02:40):
How does this end?

Speaker 1 (01:02:41):
I feel honestly that his ribs will be broken, and
I feel like his daddy's gonna need to make the
choice to stop the fight or else gonna get ugly
that or me knocking him out saves him.

Speaker 5 (01:02:53):
It's one of those. But it's gonna be bad.

Speaker 1 (01:02:56):
It's like, I'm not, like honestly, like I don't want
his closest people to be there, but if they want
to be there, so be it.

Speaker 5 (01:03:03):
But it's not gonna I'm not coming to play like.
It's not.

Speaker 1 (01:03:06):
They're smiling another boxing match. I'm telling you, I'm not
coming that way. Like it's a whole different energy.

Speaker 5 (01:03:13):
It's not. It's not the same raneey love.

Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
That's it for this week's episode. My thanks to Keith
Idac and Ryan Garcia who joined the show. As always, subscribe, rate,
review this podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you download podcast,
and I'll see you next week.

Speaker 3 (01:03:33):
Dangers so much I go sleep