Meet the Wealth Break Hosts: Travis Holoway

What makes someone leave a six-figure job to sleep on a friend’s floor and chase a startup idea no one believed in yet? In this unfiltered solo episode, Travis Holoway shares the version of his success story you won’t find on LinkedIn. Raised in Cleveland by two generations of strong Black women, Travis became a financial advisor before realizing the system he was working in wasn’t built for the people he cared about. So he left it—and started building something better.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, I'm Rodney Williams, co founder of The Wealth Break,
and let's get real for a second. Ever felt like
real wealth building strategies are locked behind closed doors, only
reserved for the people with special connections. Trust me, you're
not wrong, but we're changing all of that right now.
The Wealth Break isn't just another podcast. It's your all

(00:22):
access paths, the genuine wealth building knowledge.

Speaker 2 (00:25):
No gatekeeping, no confusion, jarging, just.

Speaker 1 (00:27):
Real talk, powerful strategies, and transparent conversations designed for people
like us.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
Because building wealth shouldn't feel exclusive.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
If you're loving what you're hearing today, just wait until
you check us out at the wealthbreak dot com, where
you'll get bonus content, in depth expert takes in a
community of knowledge committed to leveling up. Ready to break
the cycle, Your path to real wealth starts now. Visit
wealthbreak dot com and let's get it.

Speaker 3 (01:07):
Welcome to a Wealthbreak.

Speaker 4 (01:09):
Real conversations about money, mindset, and growth meant to keep
you informed while you're on the go. It's vacation season,
so I'm here solo today, but we wanted to make
sure that we continue to keep that content coming away.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
So let's get into it.

Speaker 5 (01:28):
So can you paint us a picture of what your
childhood looked.

Speaker 4 (01:33):
And felt like, Yeah, you know, my childhood was fantastic.
I really have no regrets about the way that I
grew up.

Speaker 3 (01:43):
You know. I always like to say I.

Speaker 4 (01:45):
Don't really have any childhood trauma that I feel like
I'm really trying to get over, and I feel really
blessed in that way. But two family household mother and
father met at General Motors on the assembly line.

Speaker 3 (01:58):
Many many moons ago.

Speaker 4 (02:00):
They've been now married, were approaching fifty years for how
long they've been married, which is amazing. And I actually
come from a family where I saw a lot of that,
right My mother and father had been married well over
forty years. My grandparents on both sides were married over
fifty years.

Speaker 3 (02:16):
And I really had a very.

Speaker 4 (02:18):
Very stable family life, spent a lot of time with
family and cousins growing up.

Speaker 3 (02:24):
You know.

Speaker 4 (02:24):
I was talking to my wife the other day and
we were talking about like how we grew up, and
we were talking about vacations, and I was saying that
we didn't really take vacations though, it was more so
we're going to visit family. So because our family was
dispersed all over the country. We had family in Chicago,
we had family in New York, we had family in
the South. A lot of our trips were largely kind

(02:47):
of centered around going to visit family and what I
would call some of the matriarchs of our family. And
that was exciting, right, you know, you couldn't wait till
summer to the family reunion so you could go be
around your cousins and you know, from a stability standpoint, though,
very middle class life. And I was really fortunate in
that way where a lot of the friends that I

(03:10):
had accumulated over my years in school, I realized that
certain things were different about their life. They didn't have
two parents in the home, or their parents weren't married,
or their parents weren't working really stable jobs.

Speaker 3 (03:23):
Right.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
You know, my father worked at General Motors for thirty
seven thirty eight years, right, and that's just a very
very different life than what we see today, where the
average person is at a job for you know, one, two,
three years and then they're moving consistently. And I do
think that part of my upbringing really kind of led

(03:43):
me down this path of can I get a career
and cannot be successful in that career and just work
it for a really long time. And that is something
that I think I had to unlearned because I realized
that we're just different times.

Speaker 5 (03:57):
Right.

Speaker 4 (03:57):
This isn't, you know, the nineteen sixties or seventies where
you're going to have one job for thirty or forty years.
I think in order to really accumulate, you know, wealth
and start to kind of climb professionally, you're going to
have to make some bets in some of those bets
are going to require movement here and there.

Speaker 5 (04:16):
When was the first time that you noticed your friends
not having the same home environment that you did?

Speaker 3 (04:24):
You know?

Speaker 4 (04:25):
I remember vividly being twelve years old and I think
seventh grade, and I was I was very materialistic as
a kid. I don't know that I've completely grown out
of that, so I will give myself some grace and
be honest about it. But I was very materialistic as
a kid. And I remember being in science class and

(04:45):
one of my good friends still to this day, but
was new to me at the time, turned next to
me and said, why is everything that you wear Tommy
Hill figure?

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Like?

Speaker 3 (04:56):
Do you not have anything that's not Tommy Hill figure?
To me? I just thought that that was normal. And
my entire wardrobe was.

Speaker 5 (05:03):
Tommy Oh okay, but why Tommy Hill Figure.

Speaker 4 (05:06):
I mean you got to think this is like early
two thousands, like nineties, going into the early two thousands,
Tommy Hill Figure was like Krim Della Krim.

Speaker 3 (05:15):
Right.

Speaker 4 (05:15):
If you turned on your television and you watch your
favorite you know, rap artist or R and B artists,
they were like.

Speaker 3 (05:22):
Draped and Tommy Hill Figure.

Speaker 5 (05:23):
I didn't know that.

Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, there was a time where Tommy Hill Figure was literally.

Speaker 5 (05:26):
Crazy because right now, like I think of Tommy Hill
Figure as like very much like the guy that like golfs,
you know, very suburban type of energy. That's that's wild.

Speaker 4 (05:39):
So if you if you kind of like track like
streetwear streetwear culture, and you go back to like the
early nineties, you have the rise of Tommy Hill Figure,
and you have the rise of polo. There's an entire
group of people in New York City called the low
Heads that are known for boosting polo Ralph Lauren and
literally they're still active to this day.

Speaker 3 (05:59):
It's not as popular as.

Speaker 4 (06:00):
It once was, but they would literally go from store
to store trying to track down like the best polo outfits.
So if you see like a snow beach polo shirt
or jacket. That was like a really prized possession back then.
So yeah, it was it was Polo and Tommy Hill figure.
Then it became Nautica. You know, I went through a
whole school year where all I were was Nautica, and

(06:21):
then that started to transition in the early two thousands
into a lot of the artists, particularly in like urban music,
starting to have their own labels. So that's where you
see the rise of you know, a Rockawar which was
Jay Z's label, or Fat Farm with Russell Simmons, or Academics,
et cetera, et cetera. So I've always been kind of
into that world in clothes, but that was one of

(06:45):
the first kind of instances where it was like something
about you is different. And I realized that my parents
were actually in a financial position to be able to
do that, because it was significantly more expensive to where
all Tommy Hill figure Natica in those days. Then you know,
it was to where some of the other brands that
were not quote unquote name brand. And then from there

(07:08):
realizing that, you know, people were kind of doing the
shuffle on the weekends. Well, this weekend, I'm going to
my dad's house, or this weekend, I'm going to be
with my mom, or this weekend, I'm gonna be at
my grandma's house, because you know, my mom is traveling
and my dad's not around. And you started to hear
some of these stories that were very very different than
my household. Right you know, there was no such thing
as mom and dad's house, you know, separately. Right home

(07:30):
was home, and mom and Dad were both there all
the time. To be quite frank I don't really remember
more than four or five days in my entire life
that my parents have not slept next to each other.
They're very very much joined at the hip. And that
was a very very different life than I saw elsewhere.

Speaker 5 (07:47):
And so how do you think that made you who
you are today?

Speaker 4 (07:51):
I think that it made me want stability, and to me,
that's what my childhood was. It was stability, and that's
a lot more attractive today than I think I gave
it credit for back then.

Speaker 3 (08:04):
But I think that that's why.

Speaker 4 (08:06):
You know, I was one of the first people in
my friend group to get married, not necessarily because I
was ready to get married or I knew that I
was supposed to be married, but it was more so
like if I think I found this person, then I
think that this is what I'm supposed to do because
this is what I've seen.

Speaker 3 (08:22):
Right.

Speaker 4 (08:22):
I had a lot of examples of that, and I
think hindsight, you know, now, many years later, I realized
that that decision to live a more stable life has
made my life a lot more simple, and it's made
it a lot better, you know. I think my quality
of life is much better having you know, a companion

(08:42):
and also not chasing something that many people are longing for. Companions, Right,
so you're constantly looking forward in all the right or
wrong places depending on who you ask. But it's something
that I don't feel like I still have to go
out and find.

Speaker 5 (08:57):
I have it, okay, But I'm thinking more of the
word stability, and it sounds like that's your thing, Like
you're really on stability. What are the detriments to that
being the goal?

Speaker 3 (09:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (09:10):
I think when you're really focused on being stable, I
think that you take less risk. I think, you know,
Rodney and I talk about this all the time. I
think we're a great team and I think we're great
partners because his risk tolerance is significantly higher than mine
and you need someone who has a lower risk tolerance
because you need to make sure the boxes get checked right.
You know, Rodney's at the box checker. He's the one

(09:32):
who has the ideas and the vision and the plan,
and I'm more like the executor. But I think what
we've been able to do right, and then my risk
tolerance is higher than you know, someone on our legal
or compliance team as an example. Right, So you have
these different types of personality and you have these different responsibilities.
But I think what I've been able to do really
well is kind of land in the middle.

Speaker 3 (09:53):
Right.

Speaker 4 (09:53):
When you can find that middle ground, there's this really
exciting opportunity that gets created where you can be innovative,
but you can do it in a way that you're
not exposing yourself to to unnecessary risk. I think being
more stable and being focused on stability, you will take
less risk. And I think my father and my mother
probably a testament of that. I've surrounded myself with some

(10:15):
people who were risk tiggers, and I think that I've
absorbed some of that.

Speaker 3 (10:19):
Right.

Speaker 4 (10:19):
I'm still not extreme, but I am much more open
to taking risks than I I probably ever thought that
I would be.

Speaker 5 (10:29):
So if there's like any moment where you were like, Okay, whoa,
this is like too much for me.

Speaker 4 (10:33):
I mean when we go back to the start of Solo,
you know, we had this idea in twenty fifteen, and
I didn't go full time until twenty seventeen, right, so
I kind of had this idea, you know, actually had
selected another person to be the CEO of this company
because I didn't want to do it. I didn't want
to be front and center all the time. I realized that,
you know, in order for this to really work, it

(10:56):
was going to have to be me. And that took
two years of me kind of coaching myself and telling me, hey,
you can, you can do this, and you know, kind
of taking away some of the imposter syndrome that I
think that I had, where it was I didn't come
from a tech background and I'm not a technical founder,
and it's like, oh, you're going to start a tech company.

(11:17):
You're just going to be pretending to be someone else
twenty four to seven, and you know, people aren't going
to take you serious, and you don't have the background,
and you don't have the resume, and all of the
reasons like I came up with a bunch of reasons
why I shouldn't do it, And then the more I
started to see that it wasn't going to work if
I didn't do it, that's the moment that I decided

(11:38):
it was worth the risk, because at the end of
the day, and I think my father told me this,
the worst thing that could happen is that you just
have to go back to work and get another job
and your resume that you've built, and the corporate world
is going to allow you to do that.

Speaker 3 (11:52):
So what is really the risk.

Speaker 4 (11:55):
I think the risk is actually not doing it versus
going and trying. And you know, I think that I
have such a fear of failure that, you know, I
would really rather die than lose. Like I'm ultra competitive,
Like I don't work out, but I promise you if
someone says I'll do more push ups than you like,
my arms will fall off before I quit. And I

(12:17):
think that that's been really what's allowed me to be
successful is a very healthy or unhealthy fear of failure,
but also the fact that I'm just ultra competitive.

Speaker 5 (12:27):
Why did it have to be you.

Speaker 4 (12:30):
I think that it had to be me because I
understood the market so well. A lot of particularly with
black and brown communities, there is a cash grab in
our communities, and that cash grab has everything to do
with people know that there's an opportunity there. They know
that people are under resource, they know that people need

(12:50):
access to capital. But because they don't come from the community,
they don't respect the community and the way that I
think that they should, and I think they extract more
than what they actually deposit into these communities. It's not
we went out and you know, we work with this
pr agency, or we went out and we work with
this consulting group to understand how to speak to this community.

Speaker 3 (13:11):
This is something that.

Speaker 4 (13:12):
We uniquely know how to do because we come from it,
and that to me, was very different than what I
had seen anywhere else.

Speaker 5 (13:19):
Does that kind of cash grab make you angry?

Speaker 4 (13:22):
I don't think that it makes me angry, but it
does disappoint me, and it disappoints me for a few
different reasons. It disappoints me because I think that a
lot of individuals who are probably should be situated to
service these communities and participate in the opportunity and create
wealth from these opportunities. Those individuals are never given that opportunity.

(13:46):
And because it really has a lot to do with
your resources, and if you don't have the resources, it's
very difficult for you to have the impact that you
would like to have. I think that I'm not angry
about it, because at the end of the day, you know,
these are opportunities in there to be seized by whoever's
going to seize them. I think sometimes I have some
disappointment with some of the communities who need access to

(14:10):
some of these products that they don't necessarily read through
the line of authenticity and who has their best interests
at heart. They kind of go with who's spending the
most money. But if you don't do your diligence and
you don't see that there's something else better out there,
you know, there's a little bit of disappointment that we
continue to keep going down the same path and expecting

(14:30):
different results. So I would say more disappointment than inger.

Speaker 5 (14:34):
Well, what does make you angry?

Speaker 3 (14:37):
Hmm?

Speaker 4 (14:38):
I think when individuals don't do what they say they're
going to do, that frustrates me and makes me pretty angry.
And that has everything to do with the political landscape.
That has everything to do with the financial landscape. It
has everything to do with. You know, there's so many
people that I encounter on a day to day basis, right,

(14:59):
it could even be an investor who says, hey, I'm
going to do X y z and then they don't do.

Speaker 3 (15:03):
X y Z.

Speaker 5 (15:04):
Well, it also kind of feeds into that cash grap
because these companies are making these promises to brown and
black communities, saying we're going to do this for you,
We're going to help build a better life for you,
and then they don't do it. So does that ever
feel into your sense of competition?

Speaker 4 (15:20):
Yeah, it definitely feels into my sense of competition. I
think that you know, going back to like the George
Floyd days, right, there was a lot of promises of
all the things that people are going to do, and
we're starting to see those things roll back now, whether
it's the rollback of certain DEI initiatives. You know, there
was so much money being committed to these communities. Like
where is it?

Speaker 5 (15:41):
Like?

Speaker 4 (15:41):
Where did it go? Is it still there? Is it
no longer accessible? Did someone else spend it? Because when
I go back to the communities that I've lived in
and that my family's in or my friends may have
grown up in, they really look the same. Right, there's
there's more potholes than there were before. Right, there's more
dilapidated buildings than there was before. Where is this money

(16:03):
and where did it go? And you know, who's saying
things for the press release because they want to get
good favor, and who's actually doing the work. And what
I've come to realize is that usually the most quiet
individuals are the ones who are really doing the work
and don't get any of the credit. And then it's
the ones who are focused on the press releases that
somehow tend to continue to hide the ball. And those

(16:26):
are the things that kind of, you know, make me angry.

Speaker 5 (16:29):
There's so much performativity, and that's something that really gets
to mean for me, almost feels kind of like crippling
at times because I'm just like, I get so sad
about it. It makes me so mad to see people
lose their humanity, you know, And I can imagine that's
something that happens frequently in the business realm.

Speaker 4 (16:49):
Yeah, I mean, I think the only way to really
truly manage it is to try to do something about it, right,
And if you sit back and you just be helpless,
because there's you have every reason to kind of feel
help us, Right, this is a really big world. But
on the flip side of that, if you can have
some type of impact every day that continues to build, right,

(17:13):
and then your personal impact, you know, rows, and if
you can influence others to start to focus on things
that they see that are broken, then we can collectively
have an impact.

Speaker 3 (17:24):
That heads us in the right direction.

Speaker 4 (17:26):
But I think that no one's coming to save us, right,
and in US is America, right, it's not black America,
it's not brown America, it's not white America. It's not rural,
it's not inner city. Like, no one's coming to save us.
And I think we're probably approaching a breaking point where
I think that drastic change is about to happen that

(17:47):
is going to lead to some new kind of evolution
of what this world looks like.

Speaker 3 (17:52):
Very very soon.

Speaker 4 (17:53):
And you know, I think even on a global scale, right,
I think we're seeing so much turmoil all over the
place that are really think that the world is kind
of at a breaking point in some regard. But focusing
more on here where we are, I think that we're
approaching that time and people are going to have to
do something. And you know, I just hope that people

(18:14):
are ready, because it's I think we can feel it coming.

Speaker 5 (18:17):
Are you ready?

Speaker 4 (18:18):
I think I'm ready. I think I'm ready. I think
that I'm trying to ensure that I'm paying close enough
attention to what I'm seeing to be able to have
an opinion and to be able to action off of it.
And that action, for me is first and foremost for
my family. But that action, in this position that we're in,

(18:40):
I think we can have a lot of impact, which
is really really exciting right when I think about all
of the things that are in jeopardy right now, whether
it's medicaid, whether it's snap in food stamps, whether it's
you know, you name it right, there's just so many
things that are in jeopardy. I think that we have
a very unique position with the business that we've built
to be able to be a resource to those.

Speaker 3 (19:01):
Who need it.

Speaker 4 (19:02):
And thinking about that impact that excites me every day, right,
Like that's worth getting out of bed for, Like that's
worth obsessing over. There was a time where I felt like,
you know, I couldn't have an impact. It's like, you know,
the political landscape is what it is, the financial landscape
is what it is. Like, what role can I actually play?
But sitting here now, I realize that I can have

(19:23):
a really significant impact. I can't change the world per se,
but I can change someone's circumstances every day, and we
do that every day.

Speaker 5 (19:33):
So when you feel disappointed, is this what you tell
yourself in the moment? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (19:37):
I mean I think, yes, I think this is what
I tell myself. I think that you know, everyone has
a role to play. Some are bigger than others, some
are more outsized than others, but everyone has a role
to play every day. This is the role that I
chose to play for now. That role may change in
the future, it may look different, but the end goal

(19:58):
of having some outside impact is always something that's going
to be, you know, at the root of my decision
making every day.

Speaker 5 (20:05):
And so for our listeners who don't run solo, what
can they do?

Speaker 4 (20:10):
I mean, Number one, I think vote, particularly like local elections.
I think that we're at a breaking point right now
because there's a lot of people who run campaigns and
say they're going to do something and then they do
the opposite, and I think that that's led to a
lot of anger and frustration. So I think voting is
really important. I think, decide what matters to you, like

(20:31):
what do you care about, like what frustrates you, what
do you see is broken, and then go try to
figure out what part you can play in fixing it right.
And that may start off on a local level, then
that may become a state level, then that may become
a national level, and then who knows, maybe it could
become a global.

Speaker 3 (20:50):
Kind of thought.

Speaker 4 (20:51):
But a lot of you know, these positions that I
think we're hearing different perspectives on are really just thoughts
at the end of the day, and someone came up
with a thought or had had an opinion and they
voiced it, and then they started to get traction and
they started to get support, and that's where movements start
to come from. But I think, figure out what you
care about, and you can't care about everything, And I

(21:12):
think that that's also a problem. I think everyone wants
to have an opinion and they want to act like
they care about everything, But you can't do something about everything.
So figure out what it is that you feel like
you can have an impact on, or what you're overly
passionate about. That'll, you know, keep you up at night
but also roll you out. Of bed in the morning
and then go do that. I think my mother and

(21:33):
father really just tried to instill in meet my brother
and I just like to do the right thing right,
to have a high sense of integrity, and you know,
really kind of like the whole treat others how you
want to be treated, right. And when I think about that,

(21:53):
I think that that has a lot to do with
what I decided to go do with my professional life, right,
So like the years working in finance, you know, as
an advisor, and then you think about the business that
we've built here at Solo. It's like kind of build
a thing that we would want if we were in
the position that of someone who needed what we provide today.

(22:15):
But I mean, I think, you know, my father just
really instilled in me work hard, right, you know when
he was waking up and you know, four in the morning,
five in the morning, and you know, my mother is
working third shift. You know, I'm kind of waking up
and getting myself ready for school in the morning and
going to school. But you know, that taught me that
everyone has a job to do, and they're already off

(22:39):
working their actual jobs, and your job is to get
yourself up and get ready for school and go to
school and you know, do as well as we possibly can.
Because I think that a lot of my parents, what
they tried to instill in me, was that education was
going to kind of be my lane to freedom. And
you know, coming from a family that was more blue

(23:01):
collar in nature, you know, going to college wasn't something
that was you know, normal for my family. It happened,
not necessarily with my parents' generation, but most of the
kids went to college or the military. Right It's kind
of like you had to do one or the other.
And my brother chose a military and I chose college.

(23:23):
And I think that, you know, he's off doing really
really well and it worked out for him, and I
think that was the right move for him. But I
also felt a little bit of a like a burden
of like, well, somebody has to go to college, Like
one of the two of us have to go to college,
So I guess it's going to be me. I never
really talked about it before, but like, I didn't really

(23:44):
like go to college with the intention on graduating. Kind
of went to college with the intent of, well, I
gotta at least be able to say I went to college.
And because I didn't really feel like I was necessarily,
like super well equipped to go be successful in college.

Speaker 3 (23:57):
I knew that I wanted to make money.

Speaker 4 (23:59):
I knew that one I wanted to have some type
of I wanted to be in a position to make money.
My mother sent me a note, I don't know, probably
about a year ago now, of a letter that I wrote,
which was saying that I want to be an entrepreneur
one day, and I want to make a hundred thousand dollars.
You know, I used to think one hundred thousand dollars
was ten million dollars. But I knew somehow I needed

(24:19):
to do something to make money, but I didn't know
exactly what that would be. But when I went to
college and I started to realize that I actually can
do it, I started to build a lot of confidence.
But I didn't necessarily go into college having that. And
you know, thankfully, I surrounded myself with some good peers
who actually went to college feeling like they had no

(24:42):
other option than they were going to be successful no
matter what, and some of that rubbed off on me.
I think that I've done a really really good job
of putting people around me that motivated me and you know,
even Rodney is one of those examples of someone who
thought different than me, someone who dreamed a bit bigger
than me, but also kind of reinforced to me that

(25:03):
you know, there was something special about me and that
we could do some really you know, special and important
things together.

Speaker 5 (25:09):
How does your wife and kids add to that motivation?
How did they make you who you are?

Speaker 3 (25:15):
Yeah, I mean that is the bill that has to
get paid.

Speaker 4 (25:20):
So the reality is is that you know, you got
to figure it out because you not have real responsibilities
and there's someone depending on you right for their well being.
And it's not to say that my wife does not
have her own career, and she does really really well
and she continues to advance herself professionally, which is exciting
to watch. But I think that at the end of

(25:43):
the day, that's a responsibility and a burden that I
willfully take on of making sure that she's good and
that our son is good, because at the end of
the day, I want to do for them what my
parents did for me, which was provide that that level
of stability and then eventually the confidence that you know,

(26:04):
you can be more of a risk taker, like I
want my son to live every day as if he
can take the biggest risk because at the end of
the day, like Dad's got me. And that is that
is a feeling that you know, my parents still tell
me to this day if everything goes goes bad, like
you can always come home. I think that might terrify
me more than anything to make sure that that never

(26:25):
has to happen. But the reality is is I want
my son to feel like he has a safety net,
that he can be more aggressive because he knows he'll
be fine.

Speaker 5 (26:36):
Does this feel like a pressure to you or an honor?

Speaker 4 (26:40):
It's an honor always. I think it's a pressure sometimes, right,
And I think that in business you have these ebbs
and flows, and business is a roller coaster, and there's
times where you know things are going incredibly well and
you don't necessarily feel that it's a pressure because you
know times are good. But when times are bad, it
very much feels like a pressure because again, the responsibilities

(27:02):
and the bills and showing up for those who you
love is a requirement, and it gets harder to be
present when times are not good in business, which I
know a lot of people don't talk about, right. Everyone
wants to talk about like when it's great and you
know everything's firing on all cylinders, but there's times in
business where things are really really, really really bad, and

(27:23):
knowing that once you walk into that door you kind
of have to leave all of that at the door
to go be present for your family, that sometimes does
feel like a pressure. And when payroll gets cut, right,
and who's going to take the biggest cut on payroll?
Of course that's going to be me. Your bills don't
take a pay cut, right, Like, there's no cuts in

(27:43):
what still do, but there's a cut of what's coming in.
And you know, sometimes those things feel like pressure. But
the reality is is that you have to continue to
just push and get through it because at the end
of the day, the circumstances always change. You know, things
have a way of changing, and they change often in
this world.

Speaker 5 (28:01):
Have you become accustomed to leaving out all those stressures,
like just like walking in and being fully present with
your family. Is that something that you do automatically now
or is it something you're still working on.

Speaker 4 (28:12):
I think that I've largely mastered it, but I think
that I can always be better at it, So I
think there's room for growth.

Speaker 3 (28:19):
But I do turn it off.

Speaker 4 (28:23):
You know, I think that that's made for some lonely
times because you really kind of want to just lay
it all out there for both your friends and your
family and my parents. But you know, the more people
you have worrying now, you have to feel the questions.

Speaker 3 (28:35):
Of, well, hey, well, how's everything today? And I would
rather not do that.

Speaker 4 (28:38):
I would rather things just kind of get better and
then for me to be able to kind of bask
and I figured it out again, versus I have to
feel the questions of, well, how are things going, because
that can be daunting as well. Right, you just kind
of don't want to talk about it. So I think
being able to compartmentalize keeps everyone else out of it

(28:59):
and keeps me in it. And again, I tell people
all the time, this is the great reason to have
a co founder, because you know, my business partner is
who is living it alongside me, and we can talk
about all of that and then we can go somewhere
else and then we can turn it off. But if
I were a solo founder, I don't know that I
would be able to do the same thing, because I

(29:20):
would want someone to feel what I'm going through.

Speaker 5 (29:23):
Do you feel like you would have that same type
of closeness with a founder who wasn't your friend, because
you and Rodney are pretty close.

Speaker 3 (29:30):
Right, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (29:31):
I mean we've been best friends for over fifteen years
at this point, so you know, we're kind of like
family more than just business partners. There are other employees
that I feel the same way about, right, like those
who go through the hard times, right, the ones who
had to take the pay cut or the pay reductions,
or the ones who in the early days may have

(29:51):
skipped a pay period so everyone else could get paid.

Speaker 3 (29:54):
Right.

Speaker 4 (29:54):
There's a certain level of esteem and respect and you know,
comfort that you find that person who you know is
really in it, because when times are good, you don't
really know who's really in it with you. But when
times get hard and you start to see the sacrifices
that other people are willing to make in order for
you to like make ends meet and to take care

(30:14):
of the majority, I think that's where you start to
gain that respect and comfortability.

Speaker 5 (30:19):
So is that how you define family as in people
that go through the challenges?

Speaker 4 (30:25):
Yeah, And I think I have a number of friends
who I consider family as well, right, But it's because
you're living through things together, right, It's a collection of
experiences that brings you closer together because at the end
of the day, very very few people can understand what
you're going through or what you've gone through. So yeah,

(30:46):
to me, that that really is kind of the definition
of family. It's you know, my parents would say, like,
you know, what happens in this house stays in this house, right,
And that's very similar to a business world, right, Like
what happens here is supposed to stay here, right, and
it's not supposed to be for the world to know.
And some conversations are supposed to be for even a

(31:07):
smaller segment or group. So yeah, that is as family.
I would like to believe that my wife and my
son keep me grounded and humble. You know, the excitement
that I see in my son, you know, exploring and
experiencing the world and many things for the first time

(31:28):
is like it kind of like speaks to like that
inner child of like, look how big and beautiful the
world is, and things that you take for granted, right,
like things that he's over like to the moon. Excited
about that to me or you or anyone else is
just like, oh, like he's really excited about a balloon, right,
but like he loves that the balloon you know, has
helium and it stays up a little bit longer than

(31:50):
it does if we blew it up with regular air. Like,
you know, there's just so many things that I see
in him that are exciting, and that level of curiosity
that I see him as just being, you know, someone
who wants to absorb as much information as possible kind
of inspires me to continue to be curious. I don't
know that I've necessarily been super curious, like as a child,

(32:14):
Like it was kind of you know, I went at
my clothes, I wanted my sneakers, I liked my music,
I wanted to play basketball. But outside of that, like
I didn't watch a whole lot of Discovery Channel, and
I didn't read a whole bunch of books trying to
learn new industries. You know, learning is something that I
actually had to learn was important and I had to
kind of learn to do because it was important for

(32:38):
me to have as much information to make more informed
decisions as I got older. But I didn't necessarily have
that curiosity as a kid.

Speaker 5 (32:47):
And what about your wife though.

Speaker 4 (32:49):
Yeah, I mean I think my wife, you know, from
a from from the perspective of being present and learning
how to be present. And she's taught me how to
be more present, and I think that that actually has
helped me in business because you need to show up

(33:10):
for someone and because you're a team, right you're both family,
but you're also a team. You have different responsibilities, and
being present is listening when you don't necessarily want to.
You've had a long day, and you walk in the
house and you know she may be ready to unload

(33:30):
on all of the things that occurred in her life today,
and just kind of taking a step back to say,
like this is important to her, Let me put my
phone down, let me turn the TV off, let me
kind of turn off all the things that I'm thinking
about in my brain, to be present for her right now.
Because the more she feels connected to me, the healthier

(33:50):
we're going to be, and the healthier household's going to be,
the healthier parents we're going to be for our son.
That level of presence is really really important. I think
it's helped me in business well, because being present for
your team is incredibly important.

Speaker 5 (34:22):
And so you said, they make you grounded. If you
hadn't met her, if you didn't have a son. Who
do you think.

Speaker 4 (34:29):
You'd be I don't think that I would be lost,
but I do think that I would be distracted. I
think I would be distracted because there's just so many
things that I could be doing.

Speaker 3 (34:39):
Right that.

Speaker 4 (34:41):
You know, you're young, your financial life is pretty well
put together.

Speaker 3 (34:46):
You have access to a lot of things.

Speaker 4 (34:49):
I've seen what that looks like and many others, and
I don't know that I'm so strong that I would
be much different. So whether that is chasing access, whether
that is chasing you know people, I don't know exactly
what that looks like. And I mean chasing people like
chasing you know, potential companions and things like that. I

(35:10):
don't know that I would be much different than that.
I think that my spending habits would look very different. So,
you know, as we sit here and talk about wealth building,
I don't know that I would be very focused on
wealth building. I think I would spend a lot more,
probably a lot more dates, probably a lot more bottle
service at clubs.

Speaker 5 (35:26):
So you're saying that you would be going to the
club and looking for companions.

Speaker 4 (35:31):
Yeah, I don't think that I would be at home
just reading books all day. Now, I don't see that
for myself. I would love to say that that would
be the truth, but I think that I would occupy
my time doing other things. And I'm so thankful that
that's not my life because I see what it looks
like and it doesn't It doesn't look fun, and it

(35:51):
looks very expensive, and I'm happy that I don't have
to do that.

Speaker 3 (35:55):
Now.

Speaker 4 (35:55):
I'm not saying that being married and having a child
is not expensive, because that it is.

Speaker 5 (35:59):
But what you just mentioned going to the club, which
sounds fun, So why doesn't it look fun to you? Like?
What is what are the what are the emotions within
the people that you see who don't have kids, who
don't have a partners.

Speaker 4 (36:12):
Yeah, you know some of my financial you know, we
talk about some of the things that I've done that
are just not smart and not fiscally responsible, right, you know,
bottle service is a complete waste of money. But living
in New York City and living in Los Angeles, right,
like we're spending thousands of dollars on alcohol that some

(36:35):
of your friends are going to throw up. You know,
it's going to come out one way or a thegether,
But it's literally a waste of money, right, it's waste,
but you do it because it feels.

Speaker 3 (36:44):
Good in the moment, and it's funny.

Speaker 4 (36:46):
You're getting a certain level of attention, and you know
everybody's having good time, and that's great, and there's it's
time and a place for everything. But there are individuals
who are kind of addicted to that lifestyle, right, and
you think about the compounding effects of wasting that money
and spending that money, it just doesn't make sense. Now
when someone sees this or reads this and sees me
at a club and I have bottle service, then remember

(37:08):
that I'm still human and sometimes I do things like that.

Speaker 3 (37:10):
But on the flip side of.

Speaker 4 (37:11):
That, you know, I'm glad that I'm not out, you know,
chasing women, and I'm not out just spending money friviously
for the sake of the look.

Speaker 5 (37:20):
So you think that people do that for the look.
You don't think they do that out of loneliness.

Speaker 3 (37:24):
No, you do it for the look. You absolutely do
it for the look.

Speaker 4 (37:27):
There's no reason why you want to go spend a
bunch of money at a club buying bottles and the
sparklers are coming out like, no one's doing that to
not draw attention. To themselves, right, Like, you don't go
get a section at the club just to sit in
it by yourself, Like you tend to do that with
either a small group or you do that to attract
whatever you're trying to attract to you.

Speaker 3 (37:49):
So you know, that's just what it is, right.

Speaker 4 (37:52):
You know, there's also a reason why clubs want you
to do that.

Speaker 2 (37:56):
Right.

Speaker 4 (37:56):
There used to be a time where there used to
be really big dance fors at clubs. Those don't exist anymore.

Speaker 3 (38:02):
Now.

Speaker 4 (38:02):
It's majority bottle service, right, it's majority sections because clubs
have realized that I can buy this bottle of alcohol,
you know, with a volume discount, for twenty dollars or
thirty dollars. But then I can go charge someone five
hundred dollars for it, or I can go charge someone
fifteen hundred dollars for it if you're in New York
or Miami or La or Vegas.

Speaker 5 (38:21):
And so do you think that comes from ego or
does it come from because there is like a certain
perception of people, well that people have of like men
or women who aren't married. So do you think it's
trying to avoid that or do you think it's just
trying to be like, I'm it, I have money, No, And.

Speaker 4 (38:37):
I think that for many people, you're going to figure
out a way to spend your money on something. Right,
some people spend their money a lot more productively than others.
But it's going to get spent on something. You know,
everyone likes to talk about Oh well, you know, like
you know, Steve Jobs were or you know, the same

(38:58):
outfit twenty four to seven, but it wasn't a cheap shirt,
and it wasn't a cheap pair of shoes, and like,
you know, money gets spent. Now, they may put a
lot of money into investments, which is fantastic, Right, your
money's working for you. You're accumulating wealth and you feel
good about it. But everyone has a vice. Now, someone's
vice may be sneakers, you know, my advice at one

(39:21):
time with sneakers in clothes. You know, Now it might
be watches. You know, eventually it might be cars or boats. Like,
everyone's going to have their thing. You know, for some
women it's handbags, for some women, it's makeup. For some
women it's jewelry. Everyone kind of has that thing. So
the money's gonna get spent regardless. But I think that
it's not always about ego. No, I think sometimes it's

(39:44):
about what brings you joy in a moment, and I
think that people should find ways to spend money on
things that bring them joy for much longer than a moment,
and that can help do something or create additional capital
or wealth that will allow them to have joy in
a more sustainable way.

Speaker 5 (40:04):
When you were first getting into solo first, starting with
this idea, were there any doubters? How did you handle that?

Speaker 3 (40:13):
Yeah, daughters were everywhere.

Speaker 4 (40:15):
Doubters were former co workers, doubters were investors.

Speaker 3 (40:20):
You know.

Speaker 4 (40:20):
I talk about my father and his feedback of you know,
what's the worst that could happen? You go get another job. Well,
my mother was like, are you sure you want to
do this? Like why would you want to do this?
It felt too risky to her. But you know, the
doughters in the early days mostly said why would anyone
want to do this? And you know, why would a

(40:41):
stranger want to lend a stranger money? And a lot
of that doubt came from people who had money though,
so they couldn't understand the concept of why would someone
need one hundred dollars right, Like, what is one hundred
dollars going to do and they don't realize that. You
know that one hundred dollars is the difference between lights
being on and lights off, or food on the table
and not being or babies crying because they're hungry.

Speaker 3 (41:03):
Right. So, like.

Speaker 4 (41:06):
Realizing that there's a lot of people who are very
much out of touch with the reality that most Americans
find themselves in was also what made me feel special
because it made me feel like I knew something or
I had like an inkling about something that most people
weren't thinking about. So that's why I felt like I
was the right person to go off and do this

(41:27):
because I saw the world differently. You know investors, you
know who make a lot of money and work on
Santa Hill Road. They too were like I would never
borrow three or four hundred dollars, Like why would I
need to do that? And I probably don't really want
to lend money to a stranger either, right, So, like
they had these ideologies that were very much rooted in

(41:48):
who they were versus like what the world is. And
that's really what we saw as the opportunity, but that
the doubters were everywhere, and our basic thesis was, well,
people are already doing this, like people are already lending
and borrowing amongst each other. You know, even though we
don't consider venmo or cash app alone platform, the majority

(42:09):
of those transactions are actually someone spotting someone, Like they're
lending people money for different things, and the person who's
lending the money is praying that they get it back, right,
but there's no structure around it.

Speaker 3 (42:21):
So that was a concept.

Speaker 4 (42:24):
And then more importantly, people give money away every day
on GoFundMe, right, but they give it away because they
connect to the reason why someone needs it. And that's
another thread that we kind of pulled on for what
we built. But yeah, the doubt was rampant everywhere, and
you know, we still see them and we still hear

(42:44):
some of the doubters, but they're getting a lot quieter
these days.

Speaker 5 (42:49):
Do you feel like you're still becoming the person who
can carry this company long term?

Speaker 3 (42:54):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (42:55):
I think that that just comes with evolution, right, And
I think that you know, I'm evolving, Rodney's evolving, Our
team is evolving, and I think that the more intelligent
people we can put around us, the more well equipped
I think we will continue to be to solve the
needs of the people and you know, for me, that
looks like really smart people around the table. It looks

(43:17):
like really diverse people around the table, because different perspectives
are really important, right You talk about, you know, some
of your upbringing as you know a Latina, you know
other people's upbringing. Maybe they came from Southeast Asia and
they came over as an immigrant for their first time.
They work at Google, and they were shocked at the
fact that they made one hundred and seventy five thousand
dollars but couldn't get a credit card because they don't

(43:39):
have a traditional fico you know score, right, Like, these
are a lot of different realizations that are really important
to put around the table so that you can understand
where opportunities are presenting themselves. So you know, as far
as I'm concerned, I think that I just continue to
learn and listen, and the more that I can absorb
from really intelli legent people around me with different diverse perspectives,

(44:03):
the more well equipped I will continue to be to
meet the need of our members.

Speaker 5 (44:09):
How much of what you learned in school actually prepared
you for this journey and what didn't I.

Speaker 4 (44:14):
Don't think that school does a really good job of
preparing most people how to be an entrepreneur. We're not
getting a lot of money tools and a lot of
information around like managing your finances.

Speaker 3 (44:23):
In school, a lot of what you learn are by.

Speaker 4 (44:27):
Having money and then losing money, making bad decisions with money,
so you know what not to repeat or what not
to do again. Then you have, you know, experiences where
it goes well and you're saying, all right, well, let
me rinse and repeat that because that went the way
that I needed it to or wanted it to. But
I don't think that school really prepares entrepreneurs very very well.

Speaker 3 (44:48):
You know.

Speaker 4 (44:49):
I think one of the things that I really want
to be able to create for our son is is
really the exact opposite kind of feeling that I had,
where it's like I have to go to school because
if he decides that he has if he's creative and
he has a really good idea and he has a
really strong work ethic, if he wanted to start a business,
I would want to support that versus saying, hey, you
have to go to college. I think everyone who does

(45:12):
not know what they want to do with their life
should go to college to go kind of.

Speaker 3 (45:15):
Figure that out.

Speaker 4 (45:16):
But if you have a good idea, or you have
a talent and you're passionate about something, then I want
to be able to provide the latitude and the freedom
to be able to explore that. But college, to me
was where I met some of my best friends that
are now family. It's where I did learn how to
have influence at a bigger scale. So being in college

(45:40):
and throwing parties and hosting events where people would support them,
and I was able to kind of figure out how
do I attract people to whatever.

Speaker 3 (45:50):
It is that I care about in this moment.

Speaker 4 (45:52):
I think that that taught me how to kind of
gather the people right and create movements and things like that.
But as far as running this particular business now, I
think it comes down to personal experience and surrounding myself
with really, really, really smart people who are paying attention
to the market.

Speaker 5 (46:13):
What do you think about everyone calling themselves CEOs on Instagram?
What went through your head when the title became real
for you?

Speaker 4 (46:22):
Yeah, I think that everyone wants to be a CEO
but doesn't really understand what that entails, particularly the Instagram
CEOs who don't have employees and don't have office space
to pay for and don't have like real responsibilities. I
think that most people, like I think people should start
considering themselves employee number one, because that's what you are

(46:45):
until you actually have a team.

Speaker 3 (46:47):
Right.

Speaker 4 (46:47):
You know, there was a time where I was a
quote unquote CEO, but I didn't have a team, right,
I was just employee number one, and all responsibilities are
on you until some later point. But to me, I
still really feel like I'm employee number one. I've been
here the longest, I have the most institutional knowledge. I
took the biggest risk because everyone who came after had

(47:09):
some type of foundation that was set up by those
who came before them to where they could make a
more informed decision of joining this business. But I think
that there is too much of an emphasis on wanting
to be the head in charge of the CEO, And
I think when people start to realize what that seat

(47:30):
actually does entail, I think that they quickly start to
realize that it's either not what they expected, it's not
what they wanted, and it's not what they want to
continue to do.

Speaker 3 (47:40):
Right.

Speaker 4 (47:41):
You know, There's been times where I wish that I
wasn't the CEO of this business because of the burden
that it puts on right. And you know, we talked
about pay cuts, and we talk about salary reductions or
you know, skipping a paycheck or pay period so others
can get paid. You have to sacrifice more in that
seat than everyone else. And at times you're happy to

(48:03):
do it, and at times you're not so happy to
do it. And you know, it's exciting and the reward
if everything works out, is great, but also the disappointment
and the embarrassment of when it doesn't work out is
also on you.

Speaker 3 (48:22):
And I think.

Speaker 4 (48:23):
That that's probably not discussed enough because most businesses do fail, right,
and the CEOs of those companies, yeah, they'll go on
and they'll figure it out, but there is a bit
of a stench that you kind of have as you
walk around when you couldn't figure it out or you
have to get replaced, right, because that happens all the time,

(48:47):
And you know you want to wear that crown just
now that it's very heavy, and that you're renting the space, right,
it's not yours forever. There may be a time that
comes where someone is better suited to do what you're
supposed to be doing.

Speaker 5 (49:02):
How do you know when entrepreneurship isn't the right path.

Speaker 4 (49:06):
I mean, I feel like many people should know that
entrepreneurship is not their path before they start a business.
I think that people who are not they don't follow through, right.
People who tend to today they make music, tomorrow, they

(49:26):
make clothes. Last week they build houses, you know the
week before that, you know they were an accountant, right,
But like they don't tend to actually do the thing.
They're just kind of jumping from thing to thing. I
don't think that that's an entrepreneur. Now, yes, you can
be a serial entrepreneur and start one successful venture and
then go on to do that many times over.

Speaker 3 (49:47):
That's absolutely possible.

Speaker 4 (49:49):
But I don't think that the majority of people are
set up and well equipped to be entrepreneurs. And this
kind of society that we live in where everyone is
chasing I run my own business, I'm the boss, I'm
the CEO, it's just like, well, who's really working right, Like,
because people you need executors to actually get stuff done.

(50:11):
And if everyone's running around saying that they're the CEO,
that they're the boss, right, then, like who's actually gonna
roll up their sleeves and make it happen. So I
think that we've become, you know, pretty and enamored as
like a culture with being at the top of the
food chain, and there's this, for whatever reason, there's this
mentality that you know, if you're not at the top

(50:33):
of the food chain, then you don't really matter because
you know, these corporations don't care about the people, and
they see you as a number and they will replace
you at any time. The moment that you take money
in from someone else, you now have a boss, right,
And I think that we need to start being honest
about that because you know, you start taking money from

(50:53):
other people, you have a job to do and you
should be responsible and you should deliver on that as
best you can. Because money isn't free and you shouldn't
treat it like it is.

Speaker 5 (51:04):
What does protecting your joy look like when the business
starts taking more than it gives.

Speaker 4 (51:10):
I think protecting my joy is really trying to figure
out what are the small things that I can do
today to like keep me sane, keep me grounded, and
keep me happy. Some days that might be taking a
trip to release and kind of reset myself. Some days
that might be a pair of new sneakers, someday that

(51:33):
might be deserted. Right, But like, if I can kind
of figure out what it is that could bring me
some moment or peace of happiness or joy at any
given time, I think that that's important. But I think
that surrounding yourself with people that you know, love and
care about that can.

Speaker 3 (51:49):
Rally around you and give you the laugh that you
might need.

Speaker 4 (51:53):
Right, Like, protecting your joy or finding joy doesn't always
cost money, and many times the purest joy is actually free,
and that comes from you having those experiences with those
that you know you really want to be around. So
you know, for me, it's it's staying really really close
to my peer group. You know, I talked to some
of my best friends multiple times a week. You know,

(52:14):
I talked to my parents still at this point, probably
every other day. And it just gives me a perspective that,
you know, this too shall pass.

Speaker 5 (52:22):
Do you remember your first big check and what you
spent it on.

Speaker 4 (52:26):
I'll go back to my first big check, not actually
being business or work related, but actually in college, and
we still get these like refund checks from loans. And
you know what's crazy is my parents had taken out
loans so that I didn't have to really worry about college.
And I still ended up taking out a loan because

(52:47):
I was seeing my friends get these checks, big checks,
call it one, two, three thousand dollars, and they were
all coming back with all these new clothes, and I
was like, where's ever getting this money from? And they're like, oh,
you didn't get your refund check. I'm like, what refund check?

Speaker 3 (53:05):
What is that?

Speaker 4 (53:07):
And they're like, well, if you have a loan, like
there's a there's a refund check that you'll get like
the beginning of the semester. And while they were probably
supposed to go buy books and dorm supplies and like
things that mattered during that time, or even build a
savings for themselves, people are just blowing the money. And
I wanted some money to blow too, So I went
and I took out a loan, and I got this

(53:29):
refund check, and I went to Sacks Fifth Avenue and Cincinnati, Ohio,
and I started buying every pair of True Religion jeans
I could find.

Speaker 3 (53:39):
In two thousand and six and seven, and.

Speaker 4 (53:41):
At that time, it was like True Religion jeans and
Rock and Republic and Seven Genes and like all all
of these clothes that I did not need, that I
just spent like that. I want to say it was
like a fourteen hundred dollars refund check. I spent every
last dollar and it didn't dawn on me until after
I graduated that like, that wasn't free money, right, That's

(54:04):
all money that has to get paid back. And I
was paying back those true religion genes for a really,
really long time. And I think that that was the
first kind of lesson that I learned that I was
impressionable and I was doing things that other people were doing,
not even realizing that I was in a better situation
where I didn't need.

Speaker 3 (54:22):
I didn't I didn't have to take on the personal loans.

Speaker 4 (54:24):
My parents, you know kind of you know, took on
that burden and bared that cross for me. But I
decided to do it anyway, just because I wanted to
fit in.

Speaker 5 (54:35):
Why does the money feel so big when it hits
in so small a week later.

Speaker 4 (54:41):
Because when you have the money, you can always find
something to spend it on. There's always something that you want.
And you know, my mother used to say as a kid,
like you're just gonna let that money burn a hole
in your pocket. Because it's like you have it and
you're like, I can do something with it, and you
know you're going to find something to do.

Speaker 3 (54:59):
The go goal is to figure out, you.

Speaker 4 (55:01):
Know, how do you preserve that and how do you
grow it versus how do you just be a consumer
you know, forever. And there's a level of discipline that
requires that most people just don't have. And it's really
a muscle, like a financial muscle that I think you
have to like build, right. You know, everyone goes to
the gym and you know, you're learning how to build muscle,

(55:22):
but there's a financial discipline and what I call financial
muscle that must be exercised as well.

Speaker 3 (55:29):
And you know, when when that money is just.

Speaker 4 (55:32):
Sitting there and you can put your hands on it,
it's easy to go touch and go distribute somewhere. But
I think what may be good for a lot of
individuals is to figure out investments that are not super liquid,
right because if it's too liquid and it's too accessible,
you can go do something with it. So lock it up, right,

(55:53):
go put it in you know, some type of treasury
bond or a CD, or you know, some type of
investment vehicle that may have some lock up period, because
once it kind of gets out of sight, it starts
to be out of mind, and then once you feel
like you don't have access to it, then you start
to think about, well, how do I get more money
or how do I make more money that.

Speaker 3 (56:14):
I can use for these liquid things.

Speaker 4 (56:16):
But I do think that it's important for us to
just not always have twenty four to seven access to
all of our cash, because you will find something to
spend it on.

Speaker 5 (56:25):
How have you recovered emotionally and mentally after overspending or
mismanaging money.

Speaker 4 (56:31):
I don't think that I dwell on money lost or
money spent. I think I quickly turn my attention onto
how do I get more? I think I do have
very much an abundant kind of perspective of money comes
and money goes, but there's so much more money out
there to go get, so I don't dwell on it.
I think too many people dwell on their financial circumstances

(56:53):
and decisions that they may have made, But that decision
was already made, the outcomes already here. What are you
going to do about it now? Versus just sulking on
past decisions that were made.

Speaker 5 (57:04):
Where do you draw the line between treating yourself and
doing the most.

Speaker 3 (57:09):
I think I tend to just do the most.

Speaker 4 (57:11):
I think that again, kind of going back to this
abundant mind state or mindset, I feel like better days
are always going to come, and that can be great,
and that could also probably be dangerous. I think for me,
it's tended to work out for me. But I tend
to treat myself, and if I treat myself, I tend

(57:32):
to get most of what I wanted. I think my
parents maybe have spoiled me as a kid where I
got everything for the most part that I wanted.

Speaker 3 (57:41):
I definitely have.

Speaker 4 (57:42):
I had absolutely everything that I needed and most of
what I wanted. It's probably the way that I would
say it, but I continue to kind of walk that
road as an adult.

Speaker 3 (57:51):
For myself.

Speaker 4 (57:52):
There's not many things that I can think of that
I don't have today that I really, really really want,
which excites me because one day, when I have a
lot more money, there's not going to be a whole
lot of time to make up for because I didn't.
I didn't stave off everything that I wanted until I
got this, and then I just go crazy.

Speaker 3 (58:10):
I think that it's more so all right cool.

Speaker 4 (58:12):
I have even more stability now, and I can make
even more investments now, and I can grow this money
even better than I would if I were excited to
come into it. But uh, I think I do the most.
My wife would definitely tell you that I do the most.

Speaker 5 (58:27):
How do we intentionally plan for joy and the same
way we planned to pay bills or stock savings.

Speaker 4 (58:33):
I think that you have to figure out what it
is that brings you joy, because joy means so many
different things to so many different people. But if you
could figure out what it is that makes you happy,
maybe that is working on a remote job where you
feel like you have the freedom to not be on
the rat race or the traffic jam to get to work,

(58:56):
right like, maybe that's joy for someone where they just
feel like they have more time to themselves and more
free time. But you have to first figure out what
that is to you, because what's joy to me is
not what's joy to you. It's not what's joy to
Rodney and so on and so forth. But also, do
realize that bills must be paid and there's no joy

(59:17):
in the world that is going to be significant enough
to keep a roof over your head right or to
make sure that your family is cared for. So there
are trade offs, right, I think the most important thing
I think anyone can do is figure out what they're
passionate about, and what passion they could start to really

(59:38):
focus on that provides them some sense of joy, and
then figure out how to translate that into money. And again,
that doesn't mean that everyone's supposed to go be an entrepreneur.
That means that maybe you should pick an industry that
you're passionate about. You really like music, go work in entertainment.
You really like clothes, go work in fashion. If you
really like you know, find and you want to change

(01:00:01):
the world, go work on Wall Street or go work
in Washington, d C. But like go figure out how
to turn your passion into an income.

Speaker 5 (01:00:08):
Truly, why do we feel guilty spending money even when
it's ours?

Speaker 4 (01:00:12):
I think some cultures don't really mind spending money. I
think this is probably a different conversation for a different day,
and I'm not going to get myself in trouble, but
I think that there is some regret of spending money
more frivolously because everyone can't do it. And if you're
spending money more freely and your best friend can't do it,

(01:00:36):
or your sibling can't do it, or someone in your
family or your peer group can't do it. While you
may have some initial feeling of I'm different and I'm
so lucky and I'm so special that I could spend
this money, eventually, I think what history would tell us,
or at least my history of seeing this happen, is
that it starts to isolate you, and it starts to

(01:00:58):
create resentment from those around you because they can't do
the things that you do. They can't take the trip,
they can't buy that car, they can't wear those clothes.
And if they can't do those things, then you start
to feel isolated, and they will treat you as such,
especially if you kind of rub it in their face,
if you will.

Speaker 3 (01:01:18):
So, I think that that's probably a lot of it.

Speaker 4 (01:01:21):
I think that a lot of people, as they continue
to accrue some level of success, it does get lonely
your quote unquote at the top, because many of the
individuals that you may have kind of come up with,
grown up with, may find themselves in very different circumstances
where your lifestyles are just different. And I think everyone's
afraid of no longer being relatable, and when you're no

(01:01:46):
longer relatable, you feel like you're being ostracized, and that
I think that that's largely true. I think that, you know,
we live in a society now where it's like eat
the rich. You know, many people think that there shouldn't
be billionaires, and for whatever reason, you know, someone who
is a billionaire feels pretty ostracized. Now they're probably pretty

(01:02:08):
happy that they're pretty comfortable, but I can guarantee you
everyone that they grew up with is also not a billionaire.
I think that that's why there's a like a sense
of guilt with overspending.

Speaker 5 (01:02:21):
How do you know when it's time to pause the
grind and actually celebrate yourself.

Speaker 4 (01:02:25):
That's something that I'm still learning, and you know, Rodney
and I have talked about that a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:02:32):
We don't celebrate many of our wins.

Speaker 4 (01:02:34):
We tend to heart more on the losses, or we
tend to heart more on what's not going really well.
And I think we're trying to learn how to turn
off the noise and like celebrate where we are. I
think that we're we work in a world and particularly
once you take in venture capital, that you're now responsible

(01:02:54):
for someone else's money and driving, or you experience the wind,
but you're then immediately thinking.

Speaker 3 (01:02:59):
About, all right, well, what's next? Right?

Speaker 4 (01:03:01):
You know, I got to this revenue milestone, but what's
my next revenue milestone? I got to this you know,
user based number, but what's next? And what's next? Because
that is the treadmill that investors largely put you on, right,
and it doesn't stop adventure. You know, if your company
goes public, right like now you're a public company and

(01:03:21):
you have public stakeholders, and you know, those quarterly earnings
reports come out, and if they don't look the way
that they're supposed to look, you look really bad, right,
You look like a poor leader. It looks like, you know,
there's gonna be a lot of questions around you. So
I think that for many entrepreneurs, especially of like those

(01:03:41):
who are growing, really scaling, large, fast growing businesses, you
can't really stop and smell the coffee that much because
you know that someone tomorrow is coming to eat your lunch.

Speaker 3 (01:03:52):
So you're always on alert.

Speaker 4 (01:03:54):
And I think that yes, in many ways that's unhealthy,
but in many ways it also keeps you hungry and
rather than kind of dwell on the negative aspect of that,
I kind of embrace being a killer.

Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
Thanks for listening everyone. The hosts of The Wealth Break
are Me, Rodney Williams, and Travis Holloway. If you want
to stay connected, follow us at the Wealth Break on
all platforms, and be sure to visit the wealthbreak dot
com for additional resources to help you on.

Speaker 3 (01:04:31):
Your journey to building wealth.

Speaker 1 (01:04:33):
Our executive producers are Ryan Marx and Malik Soka, with
Meredith Barnes as our supervising producer.

Speaker 2 (01:04:40):
Catch you next time on The Wealth Break.