Uplifting Athletes’ Potential with Brianna Salvatore Dueck

Women’s sports are gaining momentum—and brands are finally catching up. The Packers dive into Coach’s multi-year WNBA sponsorship and why more brands should invest in rising stars. Then, they talk to Brianna Salvatore Dueck, former pro-basketball player and founder of Uplift Sports and Entertainment. Passionate about the power of sports to drive social change, Brianna shares her journey from playing professionally to working with the UN after retirement, to now helping athletes build platforms that amplify their voices. She offers insights on the growth and challenges of women’s sports, the impact of NIL deals on college athletes, and how losing her mother at a young age led her to find healing and community through sports.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey everyone, I'm Madison Packer. I'm a recently retired pro
hockey VET, a founding member of the National Women's Hockey League,
a pillar in the PHF, and an inaugural member of
the PWHL Sirens.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
And I'm Anypacker, also a former pro hockey player, also
founding member of the National Women's Hockey League. But today
I'm a full Madison Packer. Stand.

Speaker 1 (00:21):
Anya and I met through hockey, then we got married,
and now we're moms to two awesome toddlers, ages two
and four.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
And on our new podcast, These Packs Puck, we're opening
up about the chaos of our daily lives, between the
juggle of being athletes, raising children and all the messiness
in between. Hey Maddie pack Hello, how I you.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
I'm great today?

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Great. One day we'll find a way for you to
say your gr is in a better way.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
Great, great, perfect.

Speaker 2 (00:56):
Well I'm fired up today because we're recording the day
after the WNB Draft, So I want you to know
that my hockey hot take today has nothing to do
with hockey. It actually has everything to do with one
specific brand hockey hot take. I think that coach absolutely

(01:18):
smashed the WNBA draft. So last week, they announced a
multi year partnership with the WNBA, kicking off with the Draft,
where they were the flagship sponsor and dressed a bunch
of athletes. Using the draft as their first launch point
in a multi year partnership is one of the most
iconic things that somebody can do as they re enter

(01:39):
a market, kind of rebranding, becoming cool again, and like
having the moment that Coach has been having.

Speaker 1 (01:44):
I'd agree wholeheartedly. It's a good look for them. It's
a huge moment for them, and it's literally putting your
money where your mouth is and doubling down on it.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
One thousand percent. So I'll give you a little history
lesson with Anya and Coach, because back in the day,
Coach was like the brand in my life. When I
was younger, I was upper middle class, working through you know,
all the things in Massachusetts, which has, you know, forever
been a very expensive state. But that being said, when
I was a kid, a coach purse was like the

(02:13):
thing to have. Everybody had coach purses. I didn't really
know any other designer by name, and I was obsessed
with it. I had this little chocolate brown square tote
that I was truly, I wore it with everything. It
didn't match ninety nine percent of when I worked with.
But then I feel like, you know, I kind of
entered a new cut, Like, yeah, I got used to
different brands. I started like really investing in those pieces,

(02:35):
and Coach kind of fell off the map a little bit.
And they've been back in such a huge way. So
to watch them one come back with the influencer scene,
like rebranding their products, starting to become cool again, right
that like hype cool and leveraging the success of women's
sports in the most influential place, which is the WNBA

(02:55):
and Paige Becker's Haley van Lyth like the athletes way
head to toe. Coach was such a power move in
showing that women's sports, specifically women's basketball, but women's sports
and individual stars can be a difference maker for your
entire brand. As if I didn't go online and buy
Coach person this morning, you're wrong. I did.

Speaker 1 (03:16):
Yeah, But it's like it's it shouldn't be that hard
to conceptually grasp what these brands are doing right and
get more brands on board.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
To do it.

Speaker 1 (03:24):
Because we've talked about this before, Fans of female athletes
and female sports are very specific. They're very very you know,
brand and fan loyal to their teams, to their players,
and so it's genius. Again, we've talked about this before.
You don't want to just be in a magazine on
a front page, you know, like having people scroll through
your Instagram. You want someone to feel like that brand

(03:46):
and that message is sitting in the living room. They're
taking part in it. They're a part of the movement
that the brand is taking part in. And I think
that the more female athletes use their platforms to humanize
themselves right and continue to be stars. But there's a
human aspect and element to these athletes because they're more
willing to be open. They're more willing to be authentic
with their stories and their journeys, and people want that.

(04:08):
People are tired of the same old one word answers,
the same outfits, not expressing yourself, putting yourself in a box.
Like I just think it's incredible to watch. I think
that it's fun for the athletes. They deserve the moments,
and I hope that brands continue to do it because
the WNBA specifically is proving time and time again that
there is no bad investment in women's sport.

Speaker 3 (04:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
I mean Coach's whole like big push right now is
the courage to be Real. That's their like tagline. And
the thing about it is anybody can look and be
anything confidently, kind of like that perspective, like you can
look or dress or or wear whatever person you want
or do right like through through the brand. That's their vision.
They put two maybe three women in these gorgeous tailored suits.

(04:53):
I mean Page Beckers in a custom suit Sparkly. It
was like kind of this like flowy under bendery look.
The hair was like a you know, huge drop of
these gorgeous waves, like and I thought it was a
fun dichotomy like last year Page comes in all white,
I think it was an LV fit, and then this
year she comes in this like dark, kind of like moody,

(05:15):
purply brownish fit, and in my mind, I'm like, ah,
she's gonna have this, you know, devil year where she's
coming out with the wings first round draft pick, absolute beast.
It's a fun application of the concept of just where
whatever makes you feel good. I mean, like everything about
the whole night was iconic, but I felt like the
winner of the night. Well, yes, it's the Dallas Wings.

(05:35):
They have Page Beckers. They're going to be a challenge
to play against. Now has to be coached. You have
to give them all the shining glory.

Speaker 1 (05:42):
Yeah, and I also want to give not that she
needs any more shout outs, but when Page Beckers had
her moment, right, her moment was the first round draft pick.
Then she's got interviews every single time she had a moment.
Last night, she took that moment to thank her teammates,
to uplift her teammates, going as far as saying, hey,
like this is great, this is good, but you should
draft my teammates. And what happens Kitlyn Chen and Aubrey

(06:05):
Griffin get drafted. Did it happen because of her? I
don't know, Like you know, those athletes stand on their own,
but she is a woman at the top who stands
for women. People have said it so many times before.
The people at the top aren't competing, they're collaborating. Like
in that moment, she could have made it all about her.
She could have you know, taken it all in, continued
to ride the high of winning a national championship. Now

(06:25):
going first overall, she's going to go to the WNBA
and kill it, and she didn't do that. She was like, yeah,
this is great, but those are my sisters. They are
why I'm here. They deserve to be here as well.
Very Kate Martin full circle moment. And I just think
that was really cool because I think that that's also
something that's lacking in sport. And I think that the
more times women have a microphone in front of them,

(06:46):
and the more that they use their platform to continue
to amplify and uplift other women, it just becomes a
natural part of the cycle. And then we as women
begin to recognize and realize, yeah, we're paving the way,
but the way is going to continue to be there
because you have strong, positive, powerful leaders at the top
who are continuing to create space for you, not hogging
off the spotlight.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
One million percent, we all rise. I love when you say,
you know, at the top, it's not a challenge, it's
a collaboration. That is such an odd concept in so
many different worlds, right if you think about it, like
in my world of sales, like so many people want
to be like a dog eat dog personification. But if
you just realize that if we all lift each other up, yeah,

(07:28):
maybe I want to hit one hundred and ten percent
of my sales number. I want you to hit one
hundred and nine. I want to win, but I want
us all to be successful. There is no challenge at
the top. But air is good. The money is flowing,
it's going for everyone, and when we can all look
at these situations, I think the draft is a great
way to do it because the WNBA has done an

(07:49):
incredible amount of content where before the draft, they get
all the draftees in, they light the Empire State Building,
they you know, have them do content shoots, They give
them all essentials hoodies with the ESCENTI WNBA collab. They
give these athletes the time to build a storyline, which
they already had an NCAA. But there's a bunch of
athletes that were drafted that are international. I think a

(08:10):
ton of athletes this year. And you might know who
page Backers is, but you don't know Dominique Malonga the
same way that you know Pagebackers. And that is such
an interesting thing, right, these French players are coming into
this league. They're going to be beasts. She's on a
storm now, which is already a pretty good roster like
this is going to be a beast, and the WNBA

(08:31):
giving time to tell that story, to share that name,
to build Build Build is just continuing on the kind
of leverage that the WNBA has specifically with their new athletes,
with the next generation content getting people involved. I can't
make it up. But when you are a woman for women,
like Pages, like any of these other athletes, Hailey van Lift,

(08:53):
like you go through a list of these athletes that
are really good about giving kudos where they're deserved, recognize
it's not really a competition, right, We're all winning. Caitlin
Clark quite amazing at that. When DT retired, she went
on and was like, yeah, she's going to talk smack,
but at the end of the day, she's gonna pat
me on the button say I love you, kid, And
that is like the definition of what we should all

(09:16):
be doing in women's sports.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
Yeah, one hundred percent. Like you said it before, it's
so cliche. Rising tide lifts all ships. We have to
continue to not just say that and be like, oh, yeah,
I'm about that, do it. Try it because we are
seeing it play out live and it works.

Speaker 2 (09:33):
Yeah, It's an insulation effort, right, Like I'm only as
good as the person beside me pushing me to be better. Yeah,
if that person's giving me the free pass. We know
the trickle effect is coming to women's hockey. We see
the rising tide in women's sports. So it is a
great time to be a women's athlete, a women's sports fan,
a brand that's investing in women's sports. Our hockey hot

(09:55):
take is an absolute shine of love and glory on
the brand coach today.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
All right, So since we're talking about all the shine,
where we're at today?

Speaker 2 (10:08):
Ooh, I'm in a good spot now, and I'll tell
you why, and then I'll give you a number. The
kids are at school. In between my meetings, because we
are in Florida, I get in my parents' golf cart,
I drive to the driving range and I hit some
golf balls and then I come back here and I
get another call, and that takes me fifteen twenty thirty

(10:30):
minutes to get like twenty five thirty balls off. And
today I was using my eight iron and I absolutely
smashed and everything was straight down the fairway. And so
I'm gonna give myself a ninety one.

Speaker 1 (10:44):
Ooh, I feel great.

Speaker 2 (10:47):
That's a good score right now, you know, what I
was watching some Nelly Corrida drills. Started working on my
take back so that I'm coming through the ball more straight,
and I'm not My banana slice is gone down, not gone,
It's not gone away. But I'm understanding what's happening now.
So in all things golf things are great, and when
golf is good, everything else is fabulous. And last night

(11:08):
I did the hot tub for like twenty minutes, which
was fabulous. So ninety one for me, Where are you at?

Speaker 1 (11:13):
I'm flying pretty high too. We woke up played pickleball,
which actually, oh yeah. Without the pickleball situation, I think
I'd be at like a ninety eight, but I'm around
eighty seven because down well, it was humbling. It was
quite humbling. We go up there, No one's under sixty five,
No yeah, and we walk up like all athletic, and
the people are like, ooh, you guys playing because there's

(11:35):
there's dropping pickleball every morning in our community down in
Florida that we just learned about. So we played today
for the first time. My first game I lost eleven nothing,
my second game, I lost eleven to eight, and my
third game we lost eleven to one.

Speaker 2 (11:53):
Two eleven to two.

Speaker 1 (11:55):
We had two Oh yeah, I don't know. The second game,
you and I were split up and we played with
other people and you guys you hooked me spanked. Yeah,
it was I was not prepared for that. Like it
was like very intense pickleball.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
Yeah, I'm not gonna lie, like it's not a lot
of like lateral movement with these oldies. But they kick ass.

Speaker 1 (12:15):
Oh they just like rip it at your face. Like honestly,
at one point I was mad. I'm like, where is
the courtesy or like the warning, like, hey, this is
Olympic level pickleball, so buckle up or get off the
court like the one you know what sort I'm talking about.
The lady like beamed it across the net and I
was like yo, she was, oh, sorry, I didn't mean
to do that. I'm like, yeah you did.

Speaker 2 (12:31):
You aimed, smashed it in your face? Oh yeah, no,
hit the knuckle knuckles bleeding.

Speaker 1 (12:37):
There was a guy that showed up late and everyone's
already playing and you put your paddle in, you wait
your tear and whatever. So this guy's like hadn't played yet,
so we get out. There's yah, you mind if I
get a little warm up in so we're like warming up,
like really slowly. He backs up to serve missus. I'm like, complete,
miss you can have a breakfast ball, like they gave
me one in my first game. So he misses reserves,

(12:58):
they get like four points and I'm like, wait a minute.

Speaker 2 (13:00):
What his first serve was a laser by the way,
I was like, he's given this guy an inch.

Speaker 1 (13:06):
And I'm like, okay, so then we it's our turn.
We get the ball. I serve like out of bounds
by a tiny bit, though, like it was close. No mercy,
it doesn't give us a breakfast ball.

Speaker 2 (13:16):
No, no, no, no, Mitch.

Speaker 1 (13:18):
And then proceeded to beat us eleven to two. So
aside from that, then I went to the gym. I
worked out with Rod my Man and another old guy.
I love it down here. I could talk to He's
not old, he's like sixty three, sixty two, basically your
age today. We lifted together like we were spotting each other.

Speaker 2 (13:37):
Madison loves old people, just so everyone knows, Like for context,
if there's an old person even remotely in Madison's vicinity,
her hair sticks straight up and she recognizes it and
she's like a hawk. She's like, Hey, where are you from?
And then they tell her where she's She's like, I'm
from Michigan and they talk for hours. I'm like, I'm leaving.
I don't like old people.

Speaker 1 (13:55):
They're not old people. They're well traveled and more experienced,
and I like having conversation with.

Speaker 2 (14:00):
Them, grizzled veterans. Just that the grizzled bets having a conversation,
not me. All right, enough about old people. I want
to talk about our next guest. Who is one of
my new favorite people.

Speaker 1 (14:15):
I met her at the Outdoor Game in Columbus with
the NHL. She was a panelist at the NHL Women
in Hockey or Women in Sport brunch. Brianna Salvatory Duek
is currently the CEO and founder of Uplift Sport and
Entertainment in La. Like I said, I met her through

(14:37):
a hockey panel connection. She played collegiate basketball at UC Davis.
She played professionally in Switzerland, retired in twenty seventeen, and
then has just gone on to do a ton of
incredible things in sport. I would read her resume, but
she talks a lot about it and I don't want
to spoil the surprise, but she just has had an
incredible journey through sport and now is, like I said,

(14:58):
the CEO of Uplift Sports and Entertainment. And she works
with athletes, she works with creators. But long story short,
she's just an incredible person who's doing a lot of
really cool, innovative things in the world of sport. My
biggest takeaway from the time I've spent with her is
that she's just all about exactly what her company's about,
uplifting athletes, bringing people together, continuing to cultivate a positive
community within women's sport. And so we chat with her next.

(15:22):
I'm really excited.

Speaker 2 (15:23):
Yeah, she cares a lot about the humans. I think
she's a good person. But when you care about the humans,
the right things follow after that. So we'll get to
that conversation next.

Speaker 1 (15:42):
We are super excited today to have a chat with
Brianna Salvatory duek Brie, thanks for joining us.

Speaker 4 (15:49):
So stoked to be here. Mattie and Anya, thank you
for having me. I'm really excited for the conversation.

Speaker 2 (15:54):
Yeah, we are too welcome to these packs Puck.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
These packs Puck. So we're going to get into all
the things. But first I want to let you kind
of introduce yourself a little bit, tell our listeners how
we know each other. We met at the NHL outdoor
game in Columbus. I left my AirPods there. It's been
an ongoing nightmare now, but we kind of met and
just like vibed, and I learned more about you through

(16:19):
the panel, But just yeah, tell people a little bit
more about you, what you're working on, and then we'll
jump into the meat of this.

Speaker 2 (16:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (16:26):
So, I recently just launched my own sports agency and
create agency called Uplift Sports and Entertainment, working with professional
athletes and mega content creators on all things brands, so
kind of the social digital media side of their brand,
securing endorsement deals, the impact side of their brand, and
then business opportunities more largely. And my background is as

(16:49):
a former pro hooper and college hooper. I played basketball
at UC Davis go Ags and then professionally overseas in
Switzerland in the city of Losanne, and I'm there kind
of spent my career between both the impacts out of
sports as well as the business out of sports. Started
my career at the United Nations UNSCO offices doing sports

(17:10):
diplomacy in Paris as well as gender quality and education,
and then pivoted to the business of sports doing consulting
for the last five years before I launched my own agency.

Speaker 2 (17:20):
Not that you haven't done enough. I'm wait, I'm that
is so nice of just fold. We're just gonna fold.
That's like, like I have a thousand questions to ask you,
but I have to tell you. As a five foot
four girly, I was always meant to be a basketball player.
That's all I care about. It's my favorite sport. It's

(17:40):
all I want to watch. It's march Man is just wrapped.
Like the amount of basketball knowledge in this brain far
outweighs the hockey knowledge. So I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed a basketball.
Where do you cross into hockey?

Speaker 4 (17:52):
Why?

Speaker 2 (17:52):
Why hockey? Where do you touch it? Have you ever
seen it or played it? Do you love it? Do
you not know enough about it? Where are you at
with the hockey crossover? I of hockey.

Speaker 4 (18:00):
I think it's such a cool sport. It's new for me. Candidly,
we had season tickets to the Ducks when I was
a kid. I grew up in Anaheim, so it would
go pretty regularly when I was like little little, but
got reconnected with the hockey ecosystem through Rob Woolley, who's
the executive director of the NHL Foundation, and was just
kind of talking to him about some of the amazing

(18:22):
impact initiatives of the NHL, particularly on the women's side
of hockey, and then got connected to be a part
of this amazing panel during the NHL Stadium Series game
at Ohio State University, which is where I mean MADDI
met suffering in the cold at this eight degree outside
weather games crazy, don't worry.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
I got like a thousand texts. She was like, I
can't believe this. I'm freezing.

Speaker 1 (18:44):
I'm coming called.

Speaker 2 (18:45):
Im believing this game. I was like, a really good game,
Actually you should stay. We all left.

Speaker 1 (18:50):
Eventually, we all left.

Speaker 4 (18:51):
I think Maddie left out of the first period, which
was wild because like I feel like, you know, the cold.

Speaker 1 (18:56):
I at least stayed through the second. But still's goodness.

Speaker 2 (19:00):
We all know she's weak. We talk about it all
the time, but we do talk about the NHL, and
we talk about what the NHL does, and we've given
them all the shine and glory because I think that
they just do so much amazing work to reconnect kind
of segmented groups within the hockey community, which leads me
to the work that you did at UNESCO. So how foundational,
especially as an athlete, did you feel like getting into

(19:23):
that kind of work, Like where did that cross over
for you? And where did that kind of scratch that
itch on your passion? You're an athlete and now you're
creating like global change.

Speaker 1 (19:34):
Yeah, totally.

Speaker 4 (19:35):
Well, the reason that I actually ended up deciding to
want to work at UNESCO United Nations and doing this
sports diplomacy thing, a lot of it comes down to
kind of my own journey with sports. I have seen
the power of sports in my own life really kind
of helping me overcome the loss of my mother at
a young age.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
And when I started playing.

Speaker 4 (19:53):
The sport, I automatically felt like I had this kind
of sense of belonging and confidence in myself and.

Speaker 1 (19:59):
Come here unity and friendship.

Speaker 4 (20:01):
And then getting to travel as a professional basketball player,
like all over the world, hoping in China, playing basketball,
you know, in Togo, in Switzerland and seeing just how
like the sport is such a connector has made me
so passionate about the power of sports to drive positive
social change. So my work at UNESCO really was about

(20:22):
kind of the power of sports to break down barriers
to help achieve what we call the sustainable development goals,
things like gender equality, education for all, health and wellness,
like really, it can have an impact on so many
different things.

Speaker 1 (20:36):
So that's kind of.

Speaker 4 (20:36):
Initially how I had gotten into it. I did grad
school out in Paris at SIENCEPO and then shot my
shock sat next to someone who worked at UNESCO at
a conference and just was like, can.

Speaker 1 (20:46):
You give me an internship? Which turned into a job eventually,
never hurts you to ask the question, right, Yeah, totally.
So you just touched on it. You lost your mom
at a young age. It's a big part of your story.
Was the loss of your mind a part of what
inspired you to do that? Was it a coping mechanism?
Like I can't imagine navigating anything in life without my mom,

(21:08):
but because I'd never had two, I guess what was
that like? And how did you kind of springboard yourself forward?
And you created an incredible career for yourself. I think
it's really inspiring and important. Thank you.

Speaker 2 (21:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (21:20):
So my mom passed when I was about two and
a half, so very very young, and for me it
was kind of different because I didn't really know my mom.
I knew, I have a couple memories of her, but
I was so young. And I've been very fortunate to
have Sandy come into my life, who is also a
mom to me, and she's amazing. She's my dad's partner

(21:42):
and my mom. But a lot of my childhood was
like me and my dad. My dad kind of raised me.
And after I had that loss, I went to four
different schools in like four years, so like preschool, kindergarten,
first grade, second grade, third grade, like all different schools.
So in addition to having loss of mom, like, I
had to detach from friends very quickly, and basketball served

(22:05):
as this almost like constant safe place where the friendships
that I made through the sport were consistent throughout those
formative years of my life. I started playing in fifth grade,
and I have the same best friends that I started
playing with in fifth grade that are still my best
friends today literally, Nicole Balsaro, Shamara McCorkle, we went to
high school together, play together.

Speaker 1 (22:25):
So it gave me stability.

Speaker 4 (22:27):
And then I started to have confidence in myself and
I saw my grades got like significantly better in school
because I think I just had that confidence that translates
into a lot of areas of life. So I think
that's kind of why that element of kind of losing
my mom having that sports piece come in and plays
such a big role.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
I think that's how it's connected for me.

Speaker 2 (22:47):
Awesome. Yeah, I mean change is a general rule of
thumb not great for kids, and that's always the thing.
Like Madison and I live a very change filled life,
so we always try to think about it from the
lens of like what creates the most solid foundation for
our kids. But what a way to kind of take
situation that really is so you know, disillusioning it and

(23:10):
kind of find a common light through it. So how
did that common light write these friends, this new culture,
this new confidence, this new swagger, Right, how do you
take that into college? And what's that transition?

Speaker 4 (23:22):
Like I didn't play college basketball with any of my
high school friends. That would have been like so fun.
But I went to UC Davis, which is about seven
hours from Orange County, and I was so fortunate because
this program was the actual best. Like coach Jen Gross
is still there, she's a head coach, Joe Tormoto associate
head coach, her husband and des A Beta was one

(23:44):
of our coaches, Matt Clemmen, and just such an incredible
coaching staff that made it feel like a family. So
me coming into college, like, honestly, it was so nice.

Speaker 1 (23:54):
My high school coach was a little while she would
be like a little bit crazy, and so.

Speaker 4 (23:58):
It's just such a positive and vironment. It almost was like, whoa,
You're not gonna personally attack me, what's happening?

Speaker 2 (24:05):
This feels very rock solid. I don't know if I like.

Speaker 4 (24:07):
It, I know exactly, but it was really it was
pretty seamless, other than the fact of, like, you know,
a freshman coming in you're used to being like the one,
you're the goat in high school, like all county, all state, whatever,
to like, oh wow, everyone on this team is a
freaking stud and I'm a freshman and I'm like, week,
I can't even bench press like forty five the bar.

Speaker 1 (24:27):
You know, let's see how we do.

Speaker 4 (24:30):
But so that took an adjustment, just like on the court,
playing a new role freshman year of like hype girl,
energy girl, like super encourager. But yeah, it was pretty seamless.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
I was really fortunate, I would say, in the interest
of comparing and contrasting our experiences. My experience going from
high school to the college was the exact opposite. Really,
it was miserable, okay, but because I got hurt. Oh no,
I got hurt. I got We gotta make this about
me for a second. So my last game of high
school hockey, we're playing at Nationals in Green Bay, Wisconsin.

(25:03):
I was so pumped. Family was there. I got hit
after the whistle. One person hit me high, one person
hit me low, and I blew my entire knee out.
ACL mclpc lmaniscus gone, that's wild. I'd had like high
ankle sprains and like little ouch ouch by this, but
I'd never been like injured like that before.

Speaker 2 (25:20):
Little ouch ouch by this is the crazy I've ever heard.

Speaker 1 (25:23):
Just decimated my knee so fast forward. I had to
have surgery obviously. Then I had to go to Wisconsin
to rehab. I was living with five sorority girls in
an apartment off campus. I blew up the microwave on
my second day because I'd never I tried to microwave
at Campbell's chicken noodle soup thing like in the you know,
the little to gos, and I didn't take the metal
thing off the top So that was the start of

(25:45):
a very long summer because they hated me and I
had to rehab every day for like six hours. I
didn't know anyone, I didn't have a scooter yet.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
Miserable.

Speaker 1 (25:54):
So all that to say, it got better.

Speaker 2 (25:57):
In the antithesis, Madison went and was online like one
of the top lines, like she went from a big
fish in a small pond to a medium sized fish
in the biggest party. I had a very much more
of a career like you. I was interesting from like
a small hometown, I was the best. Everybody wanted to
like talk to me, like blah blah blah.

Speaker 1 (26:16):
I Walfam, mass is not a small hometown. I got
the call that out. Okay, the women's biggest count town
outside of Boston, Massachusetts.

Speaker 2 (26:23):
Okay, but you're not understanding what I'm saying. Like women's
hockey there. I started playing on the varsity team in
eighth grade because we couldn't feel the team. There was
nobody playing, that's why. So yeah, it was crazy. So
I had to do the hype girl thing. I had
to go on as a recruited walk on and just
be the hype girl. And that's an ego blow I'm
not gonna lie, like, oh, for sure, being a benchwarmer

(26:44):
it as a freshman is an underrated skill.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
Character building truly.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
Yeah, Like you were like, I'm actually good. Does someone
want to watch Meat play for a minute? Like no, okay, fine,
I'll just sit here. But how do you do that?
That's a total mind shift, and like and how do
you do that? And what skills that you learned? Then
do you now take in I'm not going to bury
the lead, but you're the CEO of a company that
literally lifts and uplifts athletes' named Uplift, which great name,

(27:12):
but that's the whole goal of it. So where does
that perseverance come in?

Speaker 1 (27:16):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (27:16):
I mean I feel like we all, like as athletes,
have some similar there's some themes that you get from sports, right,
Like I think in those trial seasons, whether it is
like you're injured, Maddie you have knee surgery, or Anya
you're playing a new role where you're not getting playing
time and you're like, oh this is hard, but there's

(27:36):
something that I think there's a mindset that comes with it.
It's like how can I one be about the team
in this moment? Like it's very humbling, and it teaches
you to not be so selfish, yeah, because you're like
I can sit here and sulk on the bench and
be like a little punk, or I can be championing
my teammates and understanding that I have a role to
play on this team, even if that role is encourager

(27:57):
and getting my teammates amazingly better practice every day and
giving energy minutes when I go in. And I think
that skill set is like hugely important, and I think
that's why athletes work so incredibly well as a part
of a team. For real, Like we see that stat
that like ninety four percent of women that are C
suite executives played sports, And there's a reason you know

(28:19):
how to be in a team and play every single role.
And then I think there's like a grittiness and a
discipline that comes with being an athlete. Like there are
days when you're like I literally don't want to wake
up and go to waits. It's seven am, it's cold,
I don't want to ride my bike. This is miserable,
But you know you have to, Like you can't just
not show up, Like that would be crazy.

Speaker 2 (28:37):
Could you imagine maybe everyone's running lines and you're just like,
I don't feel like it, but in the moment, you
really don't feel like it. You're like, this actually sucks.
I don't know why I'm here, but you're there, which
I think is amazing.

Speaker 1 (28:49):
Yeah, exactly. Well, I love that you mentioned that stat
because there's more of them, right, Like, I don't know,
like off the top of my head, what every stat is,
but like there is data that supports that women are
better sellers than men, Like people are more inclined to
buy from a woman, women have stronger leadership skills, and
like it's we always seem like shocked when we read
these things and see these things, and it's like, well.

Speaker 5 (29:08):
No shit, they've had to work twice as hard as
hard just to be in the room, exactly. Then they
have to constantly level up, right, And it's like so
for me, and I guess this is going to turn
into a question for you. But when we look at
the growth of women's sport as a whole, and I'll
focus specifically on basketball because basketball has definitely been the
biggest do you think that the level of support women

(29:29):
get now as players is much better than it was
in the beginning. And with that, do you think that
the rise in investment and resources and support is equal
to the value that they have proven that they provide,
Like they're so much more profitable, they're all these other things,
they get a little more support. Do you think it's

(29:50):
equal or do you think that there's a there's still
a long way to go, specifically in women's basketball.

Speaker 4 (29:54):
Yeah, totally, Okay, So yes, it's much better than it
was when I was playing. And no, oh, I don't
think that in terms of the value that women's basketball
is driving and the potential as well, I don't think
that the resource investment has yet caught up to that.
So to give a little bit of context, like we

(30:16):
just renegotiated the CBA Collective bark in a agreement for
the WNBA last year, but we're seeing TV ratings increase
year over year, like crazy, WBA viewership is up. You
have these amazing stars like Caitlin Clark, Angel Reese, Nafisa Collier,
Breonna Stewart that are driving significant value for the league,

(30:39):
and their salaries are still very much like undervalued compared
with the value that they're driving.

Speaker 1 (30:44):
And I think a lot of that.

Speaker 4 (30:45):
Also comes down to TV rights packages, Like even if
we think about NCAA women's basketball. We also just negotiated
renegotiated a deal for March Madness, and on the women's side,
it encompassed March Madness for women's basketball, but then also
all of the rights to women's sports, and that package, again,
a lot of the data is showing is undervalued compared

(31:06):
to what the studies had showed before that was negotiated.
And just to continue to see the rise in demand
for the product and viewership of games, and you're only
seeing it increase year over year, I do think there's
still a gap there. And I also think on the
sponsor side, which play a big role in the women's
sports ecosystem, you're starting to see a lot more brands

(31:28):
get on board, they're investing. We know that for brands
that sponsor women's sports, the fans of women's sports are
two times as loyal to those brands. So brands are
recognizing like, Okay, maybe the overall fandom of this sport
is not where it is for the NBA, but this
is actually like a higher engagement per fan. This is

(31:49):
an area we want to invest, We want to put
our money here. But still I don't think it is
where it needs to be and where it should be,
and it's kind of like a circle.

Speaker 1 (31:57):
Right as you.

Speaker 4 (31:59):
Invest, you get higher TV viewership when you built into
that product. So yeah, there's still a long way to go,
but it's also really really cool to see where we've
come from twenty twenty to now, even just in the
last five years, even with the launch of the PWHL
as a continuation in the women's hockey space. But yeah,
it's been great to see and I'm excited for the

(32:21):
future growth as well.

Speaker 1 (32:22):
And I think it's interesting. And Anya used to work
on the PA with the NWHL and the PHF. She
was the executive director of the PA, so I know
she has a lot to say here too, so I'll
let her comment next. But the biggest thing that stands
out to me, and what you just said, we don't
recognize the advantage that men have in raw resources, right,

(32:42):
like the difference between getting off the court, getting on
a plane, and being where you need to be within
ninety minutes of the game ending, versus getting undressed, going
busing somewhere, getting on a commercial plane, traveling through the night.
Like all of the best of the best men are
traveling privately with medical staff with all these resources. I

(33:03):
the WNBA flies privately, now, don't they. They just got
charter flights. Yeah yeah, just this last year. Like no
other women's professional league is doing that. And when you
when you rely on your body for a living like that, that,
to me is the simplest thing, is that we just
need to find a way to have equal resources and
access to resources for recovery and travel. In Aunia's work
with the PH's like it's a constant, constant battle and

(33:25):
a never ending funnel of need.

Speaker 2 (33:27):
I'm obsessed with this topic and I and I go
so deep in certain points, like let's live in the
Unrivaled world for a second. Unrivaled does thirty six athletes.
Unrivaled pays seven million dollars in salary, so let's call
it two hundred k an athlete. They make twenty seven
million dollars in profits. They have an average attendance or
an average viewership excuse me, of like two hundred and
seventy seven thousand people. The NHL has like a three

(33:51):
hundred and seventy thousand average viewership, Like, yeah, that's crazy.
Unrivaled does almost one point five million dollars in merch
sales in like three months, Like they announced their logos
and then played a whole season and then wrapped and
then all of these athletes are putting out all this content.
Their social viewership is massive, their impact is massive. And
it's a three on three league. It's not even like

(34:12):
basketball basketball. It's skill ball. It's one on one tournaments.
It's quick, cash grab tournaments that are really sexy and
fun like.

Speaker 1 (34:20):
And it goes to breeze point about fan loyalty though, right.

Speaker 2 (34:23):
Like, Yeah, that's what I was gonna go to because
the Nielsen data always says you're never going to get
fired for investing in the NFL. Those fans love their team.
If you're the official beer of my Patriots, yeah, I'm
drinking that beer during the right like right like, I'm
buying a lifetime table for my like Bill's Mafia tableslam

(34:43):
Like they get it right, Like the lineup is one
hundred percent clear, Yes, within sports, cross that threshold, Like, yes,
the numbers are smaller, but our propensity to spend money
on people that support our people. Yeah, I bought Madison
like six pairs of Converse shoes when Natasha Cloud signed
our deal. A lot you just do what you You're like,
that's amazing, I'm gonna do that thing. There's a I

(35:06):
watched your socials you posted about women and how much
of their total comp is made up of sponsorship deals. Yeah,
you know, kind of all those things. So talk a
little bit about that data, talk about why it's so important,
because the other thing is like we see the investments go,
but they kind of flow to a few spots in
the river, right, Like it's not always the widest investment.

(35:27):
So totally talk about the stats on that.

Speaker 4 (35:30):
Yes, absolutely, So, first of all, what's crazy is for
women athletes, on average, this is a Wasserman stat, eighty
two percent of our total earnings come from endorsement deals,
which is crazy. For men is thirty nine percent on
average as well, but that's a.

Speaker 1 (35:45):
Huge chunk of the bag.

Speaker 4 (35:47):
And I think, you know, to your point, Anya, like
one of the things that we're seeing is a lot
of the top players are eating, like the Angel Reeses,
the Kaitlin Clarks, they're the ones bringing in these mega megabags.
And I will say I think part of it also
is for women athletes, like there's such an importance on
building your own personal brand, and I think being able

(36:09):
to resource our women athletes both at the league level
PWHL investing and helping support their women athletes on building
their own personal brand, which will rise the entire league up.
If you have stronger individual brands, like you're going to
have more loyal fans that love that one player, especially
when you look at the gen zs and millennials, they're

(36:29):
way more loyal to players than teams. That's where I
want to see more investment for women athletes is how
can we help resource them up on building a social
media presence, on being able to grow their presence in
general bringing in more endorsement deals. And I think also
candidly leagues like the WNBA have leaned into that they

(36:51):
have moments like tunnel fits, which they took a nod
out of the NBA's book, but they allow their athletes
to really like show their stuff. Same with all the
Enribe players have these amazing personal brands, which I think
was the strength of the league on the whole. It's
the brands of the players. But there are moments for
women to kind of show who they are whoever that

(37:11):
is be you, but like be bold about it. And
I do think there are even some cultural things that
kind of sit behind some of these other leagues where
it's like maybe not as encouraged or supported or understood
by people who are leading those marketing departments and kind
of like yeah, just helping to lift that side of
the sport.

Speaker 2 (37:32):
A thousand percent. And I think a lot of it
will always come down to this, like this challenge about
being cool, like the coolness factor. I tell Maddie every day,
if we can figure out court side in women's hockey,
you'll unlock a whole nother coolness factor. Like it isn't
currently Sorry if I'm gonna sound not so nice, but
it's not currently cool to go to a women's hockey game.

(37:56):
Like yeah, maybe you can go post a picture of
the ice, but there's not like the same photographers getting
the court side photos. Like when Maddy and I go
said courtside at a Liberty game, they're taking pictures of us.
We want to dress a certain type of way, we
want to engage with the people beside us. It's a
cool vibe. Yeah, I'm sorry when I'm up in the
nosebleeds at a Peter BHL game, Like I'm not getting

(38:17):
that cool vibe yet. I'm gonna say yet, because there's
a way, Like we've just got to the marketing. Smarter
people than us have to figure it out.

Speaker 1 (38:23):
I'm going to push back because I love women's hockey.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
Yeah, me too, like, and I love men's like, I
like the NHL. I like hockey in general. Like, but
going to Four Nations Cup right, which was a wildly
successful campaign by the NHL. It will hopefully trump the
All Star Game forever. It was so much fun. Yeah,
there's no court side, there's no like throw a good fit,
get a photo, be famous and in the room.

Speaker 1 (38:46):
Like yeah, true, very true.

Speaker 2 (38:48):
We'll talk about it because we're kind of like going
we're going full into our passion project, which I know
is yours as well. Sorry, well, I get so fired up.

(39:10):
You go from playing in college to going playing in
pro and then you start this career, and in this
career you have these stops that are very very very interesting.
So kind of walk us through the transition from pro
athlete to post athletic career, which has been fabulously successful.
But like where, like where are the boulders in that river?

(39:31):
Like where is the water? Like hitting and then taking
a turn, and where do you feel like is the
most formative time in that post athletic career that brought
you to this current role.

Speaker 4 (39:40):
My kind of transition into my next play, A lot
of it was actually thanks to doors open for me
being in Switzerland. So I was fortunate enough to be
in the city of Losanne, which is where the Olympics
and Paralympics headquarters are for the IOC International Olympic Committee.
You also have a ton of European sporting federations in Switzerland, FEBA, FIFA,

(40:01):
everyone's there, and then the United Nations offices are just
like a short train ride away. And for me, I
kept thinking about how can I do something in sports
and impact? What does that intersection look like? So I
just was having these conversations with all these people at
World Health Organization, United Nations, the International Olympic Committee, just
to understand, like what do you do? What is this?

(40:24):
Where do I fit in all of it? And so
when I was officially kind of jumping into what's life
after basketball, I had a little bit of a north
star to say, like, I know it's something in sports
and impact. I want to continue to build some of
these skills, like being bilingual in French and having more

(40:44):
of a global perspective, which is why I chose to
go to grad school in France. And then the jump
to the United Nations was really like It's always been
something that I'm passionate about, and I had an opportunity
to be a part of this mega organization that's like
very flawed but also like has a beautiful mission.

Speaker 3 (41:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (41:01):
So I was like, let me, let me go and
see where I fit into this, and really was such
a cool experience, Like I learned a ton. It was
diplomacy at its core, like the good, the bad, the ugly.
And at the end of the day, I realized, like,
if my passion really is sports and entertainment, I think
the place where I can have the biggest impact is

(41:22):
in the sports and entertainment industry. The United Nations is great,
but their platform in sports is really small compared with
the platform of the NHL, PWHL, the NBA. Yeah, a
lot of these mega players that we look up to.
So and given my like competitiveness and my desire to
like make things happen quickly, I was like, I think

(41:42):
I need the private sector.

Speaker 2 (41:44):
You know, look, I can't rely on viig money. I
need I need money I find exactly Well, again we
said not to bury the lee. But you're now the
CEO and founder of UP of Sports and Entertainment, you
co host your own pod. You kind of like have
this new space where you're advocating, you are representing athletes.
What about the other work brings you to this work

(42:06):
and where do you find that superpower in that?

Speaker 1 (42:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (42:09):
So after I worked at the UN, I spent the
next I would say five years in consulting across the
sports industry. So I worked as the head of the
advisory packs at another sports agency called seventeen Sport, and
then I was at Nielsen Sports before that, and we
worked with teams and leagues like the NFL, International Olympic Committee,
the Raiders, Adidas on their general quality strategy, the Lakers

(42:31):
my favorite team. And so I've been in this space
for a really long time, and I've also worked with
pro athletes, and I had this breath of experience across
the industry and I loved it. And I got to
a place where I was like, you know what, I
have wanted to start my own company for a really
long time.

Speaker 1 (42:49):
And I think there is a fear there.

Speaker 4 (42:51):
That goes with stepping into that next thing because it's
like unknown and you're taking a big risk on yourself.

Speaker 1 (42:58):
But I finally got to a place where I was like,
I can do this.

Speaker 4 (43:00):
I'm freaked out, but I'm confident that I have the
skills to be successful here, and I really want to
work with talent that I want to work with. Like
I love women athletes. I would love to partner with
women athletes. I have men athletes as well, but like,
why not champion these athletes that I care about? And
then the content creator side, I think is a whole
other thing, and there's so many lessons learned with these

(43:23):
content creators, these influencers, some of which have literally sixty
million followers down to like one hundred thousand, and you're like,
they obviously understand how to build a brand, they understand
social media, and I think there's a lot of interesting
crossover between both of them because the influencers low key
like look up to the athletes in a lot of
ways and it's like, dang, how did you get so

(43:44):
amazing at your sport? And then the athletes are inspired
by the creators because it's like, how did you build
a brand? And you're so self sufficient jumping into Flift,
the idea was, I'm going to take my skill sets,
I'm going to partner with talent that I love. I
believe this and on the athlete and the influencer side
can have a huge impact in this world. So the
talent that I work with recognizes that platform as well.

(44:07):
They're not just here to make the bag, but they
also want to make an impact in society as well
as being successful financially and setting it out for success
like off the court as well. So it's really kind
of encomassing all that.

Speaker 1 (44:20):
That's awesome. I'm most mind blown because I'm going through
it right now, Like you have created a great career
for yourself, You've built a brand, you've built a company.
It's just so interesting for me right now. The most
overwhelming part of the transition is I'm so used to
someone telling me what to do right, where to be,
what to eat, how to dress, when to be there,
And now I'm like, I can do anything. I have

(44:40):
all this opportunity. Well, what if I do this, then
I'm not good? What if I do that and I
don't like it? Like it's overwhelming and it's scary. So
I applaud you because It's not an easy thing to do,
for sure, but it's also inspiring and motivating to see
people in the space doing it and doing it well
and successfully because it puts your mind to ease a
little bit in trying to navigate it yourself.

Speaker 4 (45:02):
I think, yeah, totally, thank you. And and Madison, like, you're
such a powerhouse, Like all the ways in which your
personality in your brand is so authentic and it comes
to life like people love that they resonate with that.
And I think too, like the skills that you have
as an athlete, like you could.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
Do whatever you want. Truly, Yeah, I appreciate. I really
do think this guy's the limit for you and do anything.

Speaker 2 (45:27):
Yeah, and the kind of like point that you're making,
And I love it because we actually watch kids, you know,
pre eighteen year old college players at any sport have
to be then tasked with building their brand, knowing what
deals to take, knowing what things align with their moral values.
Like how hard is that part? Because nil adds a
whole layer to these kids who just are going to school,

(45:49):
trying to learn, trying to not fail, and trying to
be the best at their craft.

Speaker 1 (45:52):
Yeah, totally, I know. It's so so crazy.

Speaker 4 (45:56):
Nil is literally the wild West, and for a lot
of these kids, maybe they're not going to play pro
and so these are like important earning years for them.
And you know, if someone offers you forty thousand dollars
like that could be a huge game changer for you
or for some pace foot culture and ile deals are insane,
and so yeah, it is really hard to be able

(46:16):
to navigate that. I think that's why it's important to
have someone in your corner that really understands you and
can say, you know what, we're going to say no
to this, but we're going to find something else, and
to be able to help that talent, that athlete kind
of navigate this space because it does feel it can
feel sharky sometimes and it can just feel like overwhelming

(46:39):
and confusing, and so having someone that really understands who
you are and where you want to go. And the
other thing too is like it's so important who you
partner with because they also rub off on your brand.
Like for example, like I've put together a proposal for
one of my athletes, a huge advocate for like mentorship
giving back to young girls mental health. So as we're

(47:01):
structuring this partnership package, like a lot of it is
to say, hey, partner, what impact can we drive in
the community together? What are some cool content series we
can do together? Like how do we show up in
a meaningful way that really resonates with my athlete and
also resonates with your brand? And so it's being able
to kind of help translate the personality in the brand

(47:24):
of your athlete and what they care about most because
they're also going to invest the most and what they
care about to that brand, and crafting a partnership that
is authentic and will help both people be successful, like truly.
But yeah, that can feel overwhelming when you're like, there's
one hundred thousand dollars in my face. I just need
to take that. And I have no judgment for athletes
in that situation because it's so hard and that could

(47:46):
change your family's life. But I do think that having
someone with you will just allow you to have more
clarity in those decisions.

Speaker 1 (47:54):
But it's changed a lot.

Speaker 4 (47:56):
Like imagine if you two had nil in college, like
no be, it'd be so different.

Speaker 1 (48:01):
I actually think about it all the time because it
like think about you said it just a few seconds ago,
Like so few athletes, even if like it doesn't matter
how good you are. So few athletes go from college
sports to pro Yeah. I think about it mostly with football,
like University of Michigan, Ohio State. Think about these guys
that are getting tons and tons and tons of money

(48:22):
to play football at that school. They're playing in front
of one hundred to one hundred and twenty five thousand
fans every Saturday, and then you graduate and it's just
like you got to go sell insurance for all state
for thirty five thousand dollars starting salary. I think about
it from that lens of like have we prepared these
kids and do they have financial literacy to move to
the next step? Because it's great to like capitalize why

(48:44):
you can, but at some point like that flood stops.

Speaker 2 (48:47):
The answer is we don't, like, right, we don't coach
people up in that way. And I was actually gonna say,
like kind of a little bit on in the side,
but you also find if you find an athlete that
believes in your dream, right, Like we watch this all
lot of times with underprivileged youth. We watch peks who
can do it in Newark, we watch Jalen Brown do
it in Boston, Like, how are these dollars going to

(49:09):
be reinvested in a community that I care about, right, Like,
Jalen Brown is an incredibly intelligent man. He's he's well educated,
he's well spoken, and he's an unreal baller. Like let's
just call it what it is. But what he's doing
to create real generational wealth for communities that need that
level of insulation is humongously important when you're young, when
you're a woman already feeling like you're getting less, just

(49:31):
because like it's hard to say, yeah, match me on
this fund that picks up three of my athletes or
my teammates, right, match me on this fund that invests
in my community, Match me on this fund that goes
to mental health, because you want to capture that whole bag.

Speaker 3 (49:44):
So totally, yeah, it is so hard, true, true, true, true, exactly,
especially when that back is like your livelihood, eighty two
percent of your livelihood is the investment deals.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
But also a really rocky dude, like like I remember
when we were younger, younger being an operative term, but
like people would be like afraid to come out like,
am I gonna lose? Might come out? Am I if
I gain weight? Am I gonna lose? My deals or
taking createen and get bulked like, yeah, I might use
my deals if I want to dress more masculine. I'm
super feminine. I wear heels, Like right, it probably will

(50:17):
because people aren't investing in you for the right reasons yet.
Now we're seeing that tide turn. But like ten years
ago when we started, no you had to look and
act a certain way to get those deals one hundred percent.
Did you all ever watch the thirty for thirty on
like the Dream Team WNBA team in nineteen ninety six,
like gives the backstory of basically the launching of the WNBA,

(50:40):
And they did a segment on a couple of the
WNA players and I think it was like Calvin Klein
did a campaign with them, and they like it was
so interesting because to your point, like a lot of
them felt like they couldn't come out and be their
true self and they had to dress basically super scantily
in order to like market the WNBA, And there was
just a lot of Yeah, it was very, very different

(51:03):
than how things are now, but that does still play
a part in how we market women's sports. And unfortunately,
I think the sexualization of women's sports is still a
really big part of it. And you see a lot
of those athletes that are like kind of sexier and yeah,
to no fault of their own, but like they're perceived
in that way that sometimes can kind of capture more
of that money as well. I'll tell you an ultra

(51:25):
feminine women's talking player that takes off the gear, puts
on a bikini and posts in that bikini is going
to have more followers than somebody who's a mask presenting
similar skill. It's going to happen like we watched that
go on in the w when they did that Sports
Illustrated and they did gating suits. Yeah, and it was
again no shade, go get your bad right right, it

(51:46):
was all the female presenting day are straight. No, I'm
not not saying that that was the determining factor, but
they were presenting right. They were girly girls and they
looked at the makeup was done, the hair was blown out,
like everyone looked ten out of ten chef's kiss right.
None of them were wearing board shorts, none of exactly,
none of them looked a certain Yeah like that. Their

(52:07):
brand is so important, And Mattie, I'll kick it to
you because I think the kind of like last thought
that we want to leave with squarely lives in that
branding world.

Speaker 1 (52:14):
Yeah, so basically we wrap every show asking our guests
to provide a piece of advice, most frequently momming advice.
But this whole conversation I think lends and leads into
this question very well. What advice would you give athletes
starting out now trying to build their brand? What would
you say to athletes who are either trying to break

(52:35):
into the creator space and or just build a brand
for themselves as the landscape of sports continues to evolve, I.

Speaker 4 (52:42):
Would say to continue to keep it in the sports space,
Like think about your game plan as an athlete, Like
we all knew Anya and Madison. In order to play
pro basketball or even college basketball, I needed to get
in the gym every morning. I needed to average over
fifteen points a game with ten rebounds and x amount
of assists. And I had very tangible, practical goals and

(53:04):
a game plan in order to achieve that overarching goal.
And I think the same is true when you think
about your brand off the courts, like Okay, where do
I want to go in five years? Like what's my
global north? And then work backwards from that overarching goal,
and that should include like what you're passionate about outside
of hockey or basketball, what kind of quirky fun things

(53:26):
are unique to you, Like you love fashion, you love music,
you love pottery, whatever, those little things are that kind
of really make you tick as you kind of bring
that to life. One of the big ways is your
social media presence, and it's also just being very disciplined
with that as well. It's like, all right, this is
where I want to go this month. This is my
social media calendar, and every single Tuesday I post about

(53:48):
my little like get Ready.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
With Me series.

Speaker 4 (53:51):
Every Friday is a like kind of cute little hey,
it's game day weekend, Like these are the things that
I'm excited for this weekend. This is my mental preparation
little series or whatever. So kind of really actually tangibly
plot out what those moments are across social media because
it'll just allow you to be disciplined and sustainable.

Speaker 1 (54:12):
And we all love a good plan.

Speaker 4 (54:13):
It's a lot easier to follow a plan than just
feel overwhelmed and.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
Like, Okay, what am I going to do today?

Speaker 4 (54:19):
But I think it's like, yeah, having a plan and
direction and then just executing against that.

Speaker 2 (54:24):
I love it, Maddie. It's not shoot from the hip
like we dooo.

Speaker 1 (54:29):
This fits.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
Yeah, it's not just Oh, I took a cute picture
of myself post for no reason, which.

Speaker 1 (54:35):
Is great too, you know, Sprea glauded and why not?

Speaker 4 (54:37):
Yeah, why not?

Speaker 2 (54:38):
I love the advice and honestly, this has been an
illuminating conversation. Thank you so much for joining us, Thanks
for opening up on some stuff that I know is tough,
and also just talking about all the different ways that
sports has impacted your life in ways that you've then
been able to give back to it. We really appreciate
you and appreciate you being on here. You're now part
of a very small circle of people that we decided
are our new best friends. So welcome to the friends circle.

Speaker 1 (55:01):
Yes, love, this is a great circle.

Speaker 2 (55:03):
We'll have a lot of fun.

Speaker 4 (55:04):
Good.

Speaker 2 (55:05):
Yeah, it's a fun circle. Yes, perfect. Well, thank you
for joining us and we will see you at the
next event.

Speaker 1 (55:10):
Thank you so much for having me. Both are incredible.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
And that's all we have today. Thank you for listening.

Speaker 1 (55:18):
I'm Onya Packer and I'm Madison Packer and this is
these packs, puck, These.

Speaker 2 (55:26):
Packs Puck is a production of Iheartwomen's Sports in Deep
Blue Sports and Entertainment.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
It's hosted by Us Madison and Onya Packer. Emily Meronoff
is our awesome senior producer and story editor. We were
mixed and mastered by Mary do. Our executive producers are
Jennifer Bassett, Jesse Katz, and Ali Perry.