The TOP 15 Prospects from Day 2 of the Senior Bowl | Ticket to the Draft Podcast | Washington Commanders | NFL

Logan Paulsen picks his Top 15 standout prospects from Day 2 of the Senior Bowl. Plus, he and JAG Jason discuss how to accurately evaluate 1-on-1 drills. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On today's episode of the Ticket to the Draft podcast,
we got Paulson's top fifteen. There are some guys in
this group that got the juice. And when we're talking
edge rushers, why is it so important that college production
matches what we see here at the Senior Bowl. And
then the other thing we talk about, which is maybe
one of the most important things we're talking about the
Senior Bowl, is how to watch effective one on ones

(00:21):
who's actually winning the rep We give you all that information.
It all starts right now. Welcome into the Ticket to
the Draft Podcast. I'm Logan Paulson here with Jessic guy Jason.
We have day two of the Senior Bowl in the books,
and today was a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
Man. Every day that we're out here, I feel like
I get a.

Speaker 1 (00:43):
Little bit more familiar with the guys, a little bit
familiar familiar with the USA dan Quinn saying how they
get down And I think we're really starting to get
a feel for the personalities, especially in that second group,
the American group, but in the for the national group.
Today was the first day we got to watch them,
watch them. Obviously, we read reports and we talked people
about them yesterday, but I'm really excited to kind of

(01:03):
talk about what we saw with that national team in
the first practice today.

Speaker 3 (01:07):
Yeah, what a day today. It was a little warm,
little warm, little warm today. Good thing I learned my
lesson from the last few years. Brought some sunscreen, was big.

Speaker 2 (01:16):
It was big time by you.

Speaker 3 (01:17):
Yeah, well it's a veteran move, right, I'm in that
third year. I'm now a veteran, But yeah, I was.
I was pretty impressed today. It just felt like today
that the guys down on the field, they got their
feet under them right the first day from what we
watched in practice, just getting their feet wet. And some
of the guys that didn't perform as well yesterday performed

(01:38):
a little better today. And it just looked like overall
everything kind of ramped up. And I would say like
including the competition, guys were juiced today.

Speaker 1 (01:45):
And we're not going to talk too much about the
second practice today, but watching the Nash watching the American team,
excuse me, in the second practice today with Shamar Stewart
and Ivy and some of these guys that are like
these big tweeer just the physicality of that group, it
was really impressive today and you really felt like again,
like guys are getting confident. There was a little bit
of chippiness. Guys are talking, kind of talking some smack

(02:07):
to each other. You can hear them way up in
the stands. You know, there's a big hit today in
the second practice. But yeah, it was. It was a
lot of fun. Did you you know we don't we're
not going to talk about quarterbacks, stam, but did you
feel like the quarterbacks settled in it all today?

Speaker 2 (02:20):
I felt like, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:22):
A little better. There weren't as many just errant throws
and I think there was maybe one or two dropped snaps.

Speaker 2 (02:31):
Much better today, but much better today.

Speaker 3 (02:33):
And again some of that goes to like some of
these guys just don't take snaps under center in college.
Is their first time doing it with somebody that they
don't know, Yeah, and it's someone takes it just takes time.
So there was a lot less It was just getting
cleaned up. Right. It's just like when you the first
time you go out to practice, it's a little messy,
a little dirty. Today it was a little more clean up.

(02:53):
I expected to be even more clean tomorrow. And I
think the guys started to play a little freer and
the competition, I think ramped up because of that, right,
like it.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
You definitely felt that way.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
Yeah, so now that they're like there, they feel like that, Okay,
we know what this is, we know how this is
going to go. We feel more comfortable. Now we can
start to really just really let it go, right, And
it seems like that's what happened today for sure.

Speaker 1 (03:16):
Yeah, No, I think that's that's one hundred percent right.
And again, like there was one drop snap today and
it was in the walk through period that they have
at the start of practice. So it was great to
see those guys kind of settle in. But now I
think we can just kind of hone in on some
guys specifically from that national team practice today because again,
like I think that we didn't get talk about it
that much.

Speaker 2 (03:34):
I should it.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
Yeah, So what we're going to do. You came up
with this idea is let's talk about fifteen guys from
the first half of practice. So because we didn't, we
just didn't talk about them as much in our first episode.
So we'll talk about at the very end about some
of the guys in the uh really in the second
group that just stand out. We need to throw their
names out there, but mostly it's going to be about
the first half of practice today, and we're going to

(03:57):
give you fifteen names. So get your pens out, get
your nope out, and then open up your computer, because
go watch the film on these guys because they stood
out that So this is Pawson's fifty from the first
half of practice.

Speaker 1 (04:10):
Yeah, So for me, I'm gonna start it off with
the guy because we didn't do it. I do a
lot of offensive line, a lot of big skill defensive
line kind of focus. The first guy I want to
talk about was wide receiver Ted Johnson from Morgan. He's
five to nine and a quarter so not very big,
one hundred and fifty six pounds and he's got an
eight and a half inch hand, so just like a
very small, kind of petite person.

Speaker 3 (04:31):
Everyone what's gonna compare him to Tank Dell. Everyone's immediately
what they're gonna do.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
And so I will say he does have elements of
that to his game, like he's hyper quick in the
short area. No dB seemingly has been able to cover him,
and he is. He's very quick, he's got great ball skals,
he's got great craft. He's not Tank Dell. He's not
that kind of player in terms of movement skill. But
they're like, if you were to be like, definitely, if
you squinch your eyes, you'd be like, that's Tank Dell's

(04:57):
little brother for sure, in terms of how he wins
and how he creates sate and so like during practice,
you know, like there's seven on seven and the one
on ones are going on at the same time, so
you're kind of bouncing your eyes back and forth between
each part of practice. And I will say that every
time I looked up Ted Johnson was either catching a
ball or wide open in the middle of the field
and the quarterback missed the throw to him. He just

(05:17):
had a really good feel for creating separation even in
the rep at the end of practice today it was
him versus a guy we're going to talk about a
little bit later, but who I think has been the
best corner at the at practice today or you know,
throughout the senior ball so far.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
And it was a press situation. This is a press corner.

Speaker 1 (05:34):
And he literally just dropped a smoke bomb and the
guy went to jam him and didn't touch anything but air,
and he was wide open by ten yards in the
middle of field.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
In this one on one section.

Speaker 1 (05:42):
So he's been a guy that is so interesting to
talk about because his college film is just okay, like
it's good. But again, in Oregon, they're running these like
deep crossers, deep posts, that short area stuff doesn't show
up quite as much for me. But I will say
it's been really impressive to watch him, and so he
does definitely deserve to shout out kind of in terms

(06:05):
of his production and effectiveness over the first two days.

Speaker 3 (06:08):
Yeah, and the thing about him, as you said, like
it's kind of odd what his production is is in
college is because he'll just straight disappear in a game
like this year against Michigan. One reception for eleven yards.
That's it, right.

Speaker 2 (06:22):
And doesn't really block very well. He's an interesting watch
for sure.

Speaker 3 (06:26):
But then he'll go against Penn State in the in
you know, I'm a big Penn State fan, and he
just lit us up eleven receptions for one eighty one
and a touchdown. So he's kind of all over the place.
I'm not sure why that is. Maybe it's like you said,
it's just the blocking. Maybe like maybe it's scheme dependent
the type of team you're playing. But yeah, he's definitely

(06:47):
always going to be compared to Tank Deal because of
his build, but he might be dare I say a
little twitch here?

Speaker 2 (06:53):
Maybe?

Speaker 3 (06:54):
Right.

Speaker 1 (06:54):
It's interesting because Tank Dell is crazy. He's crazy in
terms of I think he's a little bit slower than
in Tank Dell. I'm I'm pulling, you know, from a
slow person. I'm definitely like pulling, like nitpicking this for sure,
but he is He's very quick. I don't think he
is the top end gear that Tank Dell has, but man,
his ability to create separation and create space off that

(07:15):
short air movement skill is just incredible.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (07:19):
Absolutely, And I'm not saying he's better than Tank Dell.
I'm just saying that, like when those comparisons come up,
this is this is kind of like the separator that
might be there. All right, who's your next guy? Moving
on from ride receiver? Oh by the way, sorry, this
is a commander's pod. Do you think that tes Johnson
could fall to a later first round or his second round?
Like where do you think your draft vout would be

(07:41):
for him?

Speaker 1 (07:41):
That's a great question, and that's where the senior ball
becomes like so interesting to talk about because he's definitely
not a first round player. But is he a bottom
of the second half player?

Speaker 2 (07:48):
Probably?

Speaker 1 (07:49):
You know, And when you've got the ability to separate
in that Cliff Kingsbury offense, you say to yourself, Man,
a guy with that skill set that can win one
on one versus a nickel win on one.

Speaker 2 (07:58):
Versus the safety as your third receiver, that's.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
Going to be dangerous because basically it's like an ATM,
like you're always open, you know, I can always withdraw
cash when I need to. And in an offense where
it's like we need to be a fishent on third down,
we need to be a fishing in the red zone,
having a guy you know that that gets how to
create space underneath is extremely valuable. So I'm not saying
they're going to draft this guy, but I think if
you're looking at playmakers and weapons, now, is he does

(08:24):
he get down the way the commanders get down. There's
other guys we're going to talk about later that I
think embody that a little bit more, but I think
that could be definitely a very valuable piece to this offense.

Speaker 3 (08:34):
All Right, who's the next guy you want to touch on?

Speaker 1 (08:36):
Okay, I'm gonna try and say his name, and I
feel bad because he's from my school, but Olufimi Ohlufimi
oh Dajo and so he's from UCLA.

Speaker 3 (08:46):
Sounded great to me, Thank you.

Speaker 2 (08:47):
I appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (08:48):
Hopefully it sounds good to Oladajo. So he's six six,
two and three eights, two hundred and sixty one pounds,
thirty three and a half inch arms, and.

Speaker 2 (08:57):
He just popped today with a physical violence in one
on ones that I was not.

Speaker 1 (09:04):
Expecting ability to pop, get to extension, violently, pull the
pads through, dip your shoulder through, a little bit of
stiff in the upper body because he's so like muscle bound.

Speaker 2 (09:14):
But the violence, the snap.

Speaker 1 (09:16):
The pop, the physicality and think and I do think
that this defensive line group is not as good as
the afternoon group, but this offensive line group is better.
And I thought he was more productive today. And so
to see him jump out from a physicality standpoint in
the one on ones consistently getting wins against guys that
I think are going to be very good players in
the NFL, or at least rotational players in the NFL.

(09:36):
And then on top of that, he played a little
off ball linebacker, went and covered a running back today.
So just a guy that to me, like, to me,
the senior Bowl of seeing guys in person are the
NFL players and watching this dude, the snap, the violence,
the physicality, I was like, this guy feels like a
commander to me, like a violent, aggressive pass rusher that

(09:58):
can play the run, not the biggest guy in the
whole world, but gives you some coverage, flexibility and that
odd spacing and he was just incredibly impressive. And so
I had to give him a shout out because again, Jason,
like I literally multiple times when I was like who
is that? And it was probably three consecutive times, and
I was like, Oh, it's the same guy every single time.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
It's this kid from.

Speaker 1 (10:20):
UCLA who's just absolutely was just like wrecking people today.

Speaker 3 (10:24):
And no hometown bias for that.

Speaker 2 (10:27):
I didn't even know that. I didn't even know that
he was out here.

Speaker 1 (10:30):
So that's the thing that was so surprising is it
wasn't like, oh, he's ucl I'm going to give him
a good look. It was like, sometimes you're actually watching guys,
Like there's guys that I'm watching, like a couple of
guys that I'm wanna talk about later. I'm actually actively
making sure I catch all the reps. This guy just
happened to be up and just killing people, and I
was like, who is that? And again, really, to me,
that's the best kind of day because you are physically

(10:50):
dominant to the point where you have to take notice
of me.

Speaker 3 (10:53):
Yeah. He was an inside linebacker for most of his
college career, moved to the edge during the end of
this season in twenty twenty four and finished off that
season then with career highs for him in tackles were
loss at thirteen point five and sacks at four points.
So as soon if they moved them from inside linebacker

(11:14):
to that edge this season, he became productive, no kidding. Yeah,
So it seems like that was the home that he
probably should have been for a little bit and maybe
his numbers would be a little bit higher and a
lot was some of the bigger guys. So they found
credit to the coaching staff at UCLA for figuring out
how to use them. But they once they got him there,

(11:36):
he became very productive.

Speaker 1 (11:37):
Yeah, so that's a guy again, Like I loved why Saturday,
and I'm really now excited to go back and watch
him more so in keeping with the edge Rrescher of
the next guy on my list is Donovan Azeraku six '
to two in a quarter so a little bit shorter,
two hundred and forty eight pounds, a little bit shorter,
but thirty four and a half inch arms with that
small frame, and he doesn't have the size or the

(11:58):
physicality of Olodij Djo. Excuse me because O the Djo's
two hundred and sixty one pounds. But the length shows
up and they play very similar. They're not the tallest
guys in the world. They have this natural built in leverage,
the snap, the ability to use that extra length. Like
they both they almost look the same as in terms
of how they play. But the snap, the violence, the quickness,

(12:18):
the burst, the pursuit to the football was all there
for both of those guys today. And again maybe two
names that you're not super familiar with. And again donovanez Rok,
who's from Boston College, you know, to me, probably one
of the more impressive edge rushers today. Again, the size
thing gets me a little bit concerned, but very productive today,

(12:38):
very effective in the past rous situation, specifically one of ones.

Speaker 3 (12:41):
Is there a single play that stands out to you
from him today? And that kind of encapsulates what you
were talking about what you saw today or or was
for him? Was it just a bunch of them, It's
just like it's consistency.

Speaker 1 (12:54):
So Ola Djo was the consistency of the day, right
everyone it was like, oh my gosh, he just smoked
the kid from the tackle from Boston College and he
just oh he beat this guy with oh, I think
is really good football player. And with Mezaraku it was
I remember there was this one rep in particular and
he was going up against somebody I forget who it was,
but somebody that I really like, I don't remember who

(13:16):
exactly what it was, and you saw him kind of
get his hands on the inside breastplate, get to extension,
get this huge man back on his heels, and he
know he's only two hundred and forty eight pounds, kind
of pushed him back into the quarterback and then was
able to rip off and get a sack. And that's
where I was like, oh, there's like, I don't know
what he is at the next level. Is he just
a pure time pass rusher pass rush specialist as he

(13:38):
stand up through for outside linebacker. But when you see
that kind of play strength and that kind of snap
and that kind of violence and a guy who understands
how he uses length and uses leverage like that was
something that really jumped out to me and was very,
very exciting. So both those guys really felt you felt
them in practice today in a way, and it felt
him to a point where you said, I'll have to
take notice.

Speaker 2 (13:56):
I got to go watch these guys now.

Speaker 3 (13:58):
Yeah, he finished his career at Boston College. Is one
of the top pass rushers and defensive players in Boston
College history. That's what Boston College likes to say about him.
A lot of tackles for a loss, a lot of sacks,
so the production was there.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
Yeah, I think he's second all time in Boston College
tackles for loss behind like some guys that I played with,
and the end, you know what I mean, Like he's.

Speaker 3 (14:17):
He tied the program as a record of sacks at
sixteen point five. Yeah, so he was in the backfield
a lot. So it's funny when you like are bringing
up these guys and it's like, oh, they shined it
against you know, out here at the Senior Bowl, just
in these drills and these one on ones, and then
I go and I pull up their stats and it's
like there you go, right, that makes sense. And we

(14:38):
talked about in our very first episode of Ticket to
the Draft this year that one of the things you
want to look for with pass rushers especially is not
just their physical ability, but does it dine up with production. Right,
So these guys are standing out to us at the
Senior Bowl and they have the college production that tends
to be a good sign for moving up people's draft boards.

Speaker 1 (14:59):
And both these guys are interesting too because as a
Rocko I kind of knew about tangentially, so I kind
of when you see him like, oh, that makes sense,
but oh, Diijo was nowhere on my radar. I didn't
know anything about him. And this is the this is
the reason the Senior Bowl is so fun, is because
you get to see a guy just being an absolute maniac,
which is which is really exciting.

Speaker 3 (15:16):
Well, let's move on the one more defensive end. He's
probably I would say, getting a lot of buzz yes, right.
I hear his name come up all the time, and
he's a little bit of a conundrum for me. And
I'm talking about Mike Green, the defensive end from Marshall.

Speaker 1 (15:30):
Yeah, And so he's an interesting guy because to me,
I came in maybe with people were kind of saying
he's the next von Miller, and then when you watch
him on tape again, you see tremendous ability. But he's
at Marshall, so he's playing some smaller schools.

Speaker 2 (15:45):
Right.

Speaker 1 (15:45):
The level of competition's not there, and that's why the
Senior Bowl is so important for him. But he's six
two and a quarter two hundred and forty eight pounds
and he's got short arms. His arms are thirty two inches.
So we just talked about those other two guys thirty
three and a half thirty four and a half in charms, bigger,
longer kind of players, And today I just felt like
he had a really excellent rep, like a fantastic rep

(16:08):
versus Josh Connery where he blew him up, Connolly tried
to jump set him, didn't have his feet under him,
and Connor Lely's probably going to be, depending on the
order of the guys, like the fourth or fifth tackle
off the board, maybe a bottom of the first round player.
I could definitely see him kind of in that range
where the Washington commanders are picking in terms of you know,
what is that twenty nine, twenty eight and like maybe

(16:30):
like that kind of range of picks, so definitely a
player to keep an eye on. And he kind of
bulldozed him over, fell down the whole thing. But they
did the rep again and Connorley just stayed in front
of him, mirrored him and did a great job. He
had a rep against Anthony Benton later, and Anthony Benton's huge,
so you expect him to kind of use his quickness
and movement skills to get around him, and Benton kind
of locked him up, and so you're kind of like

(16:51):
where you know, Jalen Travis had a good rep against
him today too, the tackle for MIOS State. So guys,
we're gonna talk about those guys later. But it just
I was expecting when lot Too Loto was here last year,
it just felt like there was a shark on the
field that was eating every offensive tackle. And there was
a couple reps that he lost, but most of them

(17:12):
are so clean. You saw that burst, you saw the quickness,
you saw the hand usage, and here I was expecting
him just to kind of be something different and a
different tier of pass rushers. But today, for example, I
thought the two guys I just mentioned, Ozoriki Ozariku excuse
me and Oladijo had better days than him. And again,
this dude's extremely productive. Mic Green is extremely productive. I

(17:34):
think he led the FBS and sacks last year, the
whole thing. But it just it left something to be
desired in a way that I was not expecting. And
that's the second day in a row where the first day,
you know, we talked to some people and they were like, oh,
not that impressive. Today I kind of felt the same thing.
He flashes, he's got juice, everything you want to see,
but it just wasn't the finisher's mentality that I was

(17:56):
hoping for.

Speaker 3 (17:57):
Yeah, he had seventeen sacks this year, which is a lot,
and but that's at Marshall, and that's nothing against Marshall,
but maybe it's the competition that you're against. And like
how we were saying earlier, you want to see the
physical traits match up with the production. Okay, he's got
the production, but out here it looks like the physical
traits may not be completely there.

Speaker 1 (18:19):
It's interesting because he does have juice, he's got bursts, like, he's.

Speaker 3 (18:22):
Got all those things. He looks a little.

Speaker 2 (18:24):
Small to me, Yes, yeah, I think that's a fair
just a small community.

Speaker 3 (18:27):
To these guys, and there are times where he's going
to win because you don't get seventeen sacks no matter
what college you play for, if you don't have something special,
and he's got that. And I mentioned a couple of
times to you that today, it just it seems like
he's just trying to dip into his bag. He's trying
every move possible that he has to see if he
can win against these guys. And a part of me

(18:49):
is like, yeah, show off everything you got.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
The other part of me.

Speaker 3 (18:52):
Is, well, that's not working. Yeah, that didn't work. That
didn't work. That didn't work. So maybe he just like
focus on one or two things that win you consistently
then try and showing off all these flashy things that
don't always land.

Speaker 1 (19:05):
And it's kind of funny because Shamar Stewart, the defensive
end from Texas A and M in the second practice, uh,
really doesn't do any moves. It's like, I'm just a
power rusher and he'll throw in some different stuff. But
in terms of guys that have flashed more consistently in
those passworising situations, like I think we'd both say Samar
Stewart at this point.

Speaker 3 (19:23):
Right, yeah, absolutely, yeah, absolutely, yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
So that so that was a guy kind of interesting.
Not not a bad day necessarily, but definitely I think
I've been a little underwhelmed with him. And again, there's
one more day he might come out. And it's interesting
listening to other shows where they say, oh, I think
he could take tomorrow off. I think he's shown enough.
I think he's done it, and I'm like, has.

Speaker 3 (19:42):
He though, like he had one? Well, I don't think so.
I want to see him. I want to see him
when consistent. That's still win, especially coming from a school
like a school that didn't have the competition that he's
facing right now. So he has one. That's not to
say that he has one today. He has, yes, but
let's just a couple more times.

Speaker 1 (20:01):
And it's the same thing with you know, like receivers,
like you know TEDS Johnson. The receiver is supposed to
win this drill. The defensive line is supposed to win
the pass rush drill. So you should be if you're
a dominant pass rusher, you should look dominant. And I
just felt like he had. He's looked good, but not dominant.
Maybe let's take a.

Speaker 3 (20:22):
Mini detour with what you just said there, I want
to double click on it because we're just like anybody else.
We're on Instagram reels, we're on Twitter, we're looking at
the highlights. Step you're taking photos of and seeing what
gets around. As far as like going viral with a
play and a lot of it is like the one
on ones with a receiver and a dB and you said,

(20:42):
the receivers like meant to win this route? Yes, what
do you mean by that?

Speaker 1 (20:46):
So, like, for example, like when you're playing if you're
a linebacker playing coverage on a running back, if you're
a safety playing coverage on a tight end, your dB
playing coverage on a receiver, depending on the split, is
going to affect your leverage.

Speaker 2 (20:58):
And what I mean by that is like, let's.

Speaker 1 (20:59):
Say I am like you're on the offensive left side,
I'm a defensive back and I'm standing outside of you.
I'm not standing outside of the outside of you for
my health. I'm standing outside of you because there's a
defender in the middle of the.

Speaker 2 (21:12):
Field that is ready to help you, ready to help
me out.

Speaker 1 (21:14):
So sometimes, for example, like I see a slot receiver
versus outside leverage run like a post or like a
deep cross, and everyone's like, Wow, he's cooked them. He
beat him. But I'm also like, there is going to
be a player there. Yeah, there's probably a safety, a
post safety will standing right there that's going to break
that ball up. Like so today, for example, they were
doing ruts with the backs and routs at the backs.
Is just the Wild West, right, they just do whatever

(21:36):
they want. Like the backs are running all over the place,
and one of the backs ran to go today up
the seam and the linebacker coach is like, don't worry
about it. The safety is right there, and that's that's
a perfect point, Like you have to when you win.
I think in one on ones account for some of
that stuff in terms of defensive structure. So that to
me is like when I see guys and when you

(21:56):
see on Instagram, Oh, this dude got cooked.

Speaker 2 (21:58):
Is he running an in.

Speaker 1 (21:59):
Breaker versus outside leverage? Because if he is, he should
win that one hundred out of one hundred times. And
there was a guy today that I thought did a
great job and to give him a shout out.

Speaker 2 (22:07):
Now, Elijah Royo.

Speaker 1 (22:08):
He's the tight end from Miami. He's six ' four,
he's two hundred fifty pounds, really twitchy. He had an
outbreaking route versus outside leverage.

Speaker 2 (22:16):
Right, So he.

Speaker 1 (22:17):
Shouldn't win that route and was able to with his
stem and with his his indicator at the top, the
double stick at the top, break leverage, get outside, this guy,
draw up PI and catch the football. So to me,
when I see that, I'm like, that, to me, is
an excellent rep in one on one.

Speaker 3 (22:31):
Right, it's understanding the nuances of what you're watching. It's
not just two guys out on the in the backyard
lining up against each other, right, it's the defensive player
is going to play based on the coverage that he
has in his head to an extent. So there are
times where like a dB is out there in one
on ones and the wide receiver catches the ball. But

(22:54):
I'm like, great coverage, Yeah, right, that's not a loss
for the dB because he was he was sticky and
he was pushing them towards where the leverage is. It's like,
that's exactly what you want.

Speaker 1 (23:03):
And it's the same thing with the offensive line, right,
It's like that those are the people that are disadvantaged
in this right because if you're an offensive lineman, right,
there is going to be contained. There's a contained element
to your rush, you have to be in the right
gap to keep the quarterback in the pocket. And in
one on ones the guy can just go ever he
once right, and so you have to defend more elements.
And in some ways it's good to watch DB's and

(23:23):
offensive lineman be stressed to this really high level because
you get to see how they are athletically, and like
you said, a win in one on ones for a
dB is different than it is for a receiver or
for a defensive lineman for example.

Speaker 3 (23:36):
Yeah, and the defensive line. Almost every single defensive lineman
gets to the quarterback quote unquote yeah in the right
because the offensive lineman has to hold them for four
or five seconds. That's never true. And well, I mean
maybe it's true once or twice in the NFL, but
mostly you just have to hold it until the quarterback

(23:57):
gets the ball out quickly right or it makes the
read tropefully doesn't take four seconds for him to go
through his progression. So there were a couple of times
I think we actually had I don't want to see
a debate, but a mini conversation about something where like
a defender made a spin move and turned around and
then the offensive lineman this was in the second practice,
had a nice recovery, came out and got him and

(24:19):
it was like, oh, what a win by the defensive lineman.
It's like, was it because the offensive tackle made a
really nice recovery and that spin move took that edge
rusher out of where the pocket pocket contained was. A
quarterback would have easily have stepped up to avoid that,
and the offensive tackle came back to stop it. And
I think the people down on the field knew that

(24:40):
because they immediately ran another rep.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
It was Baron Currell, the defensive end from Texas. He's
been great, he's been great. And then Emery Jones, the
right tackle for LSU, who also has played some guard.
First day struggled a little bit, but I love this
rep because in one on ones in the practice played
much better. And then at the end he gets the
car out versus versus Sorel, who's had a great couple

(25:03):
of weeks. Yeah, you're saying he beats him to the
edge and you're like, oh my gosh, what a clean
win by Sorel. And then I don't know how Mary
Johns does it because he's not like the quickest footed guy,
but kicks again, gets himself refit and blocks them up,
and it kind of caught everybody by surprise.

Speaker 3 (25:17):
Yeah, they were excited by then. So all the defensive
players obviously they're defensive reading for defense, offense reading for offense.
All the defensive players immediately yeah right right, But the
recovery was so fast and quick and surprising. Like you said,
the offense was like, oh they both thought they won
the rep. Now most people I think in the stands

(25:37):
and to me, at first, I immediately went, oh, that's
a defensive win. But then I took a second, like,
why is the offense cheering? That went oh, well, if
I'm a quarterback, I'm just stepping.

Speaker 1 (25:47):
Up right, good save, right, and in a one on
one situation. To me, that's a win for the offensive
lineman and for the defensive lineman. It needs to be
clean and it was almost clean. And maybe you didn't
finish it correctly, maybe you pulled up too early, but
Emery Jones did a great job getting back in there
and cover right.

Speaker 3 (26:03):
But we digress. My point is is that when you
watch these uh these clips on uh social media, I
mean maybe they're great plays. I'm not saying all these
are not great plays, and like, watch more film, bro,
I'm not doing that.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
Made me think of way today too, Sorry, because we're talking.

Speaker 1 (26:17):
Samar Stewart, for example, has a great bull rush and
kind of forces the offensive tackle. I forget who it
is back into where the quarterback would be the guy
standing there with the ball, And is it a sack no?
Is it a pressure yes? So is it a good
job by the tackle sitting a bull yes. Is it
a great job by Samir Stewart pushing him into the
quarterback yes? So like to me, that's a double check
to it, Like I got to see what I wanted

(26:39):
to see from the tackle. I got to see what
I want to see from him. And could it be better?
Could he quick win? Yeah for sure? But it's just
a good, solid competitive rep. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (26:47):
It's it's hard to judge these one on ones. You
have to you have to put context into it, right,
And it's not about like there's always a winner and
a loser out of everyone. You just want to see
what the guy has, what he doesn't have. You want
to see how competitive they are and if they're smart. Right,
if they're smart in the sense of like a cornerback
using his leverage a wide receiver using different techniques out

(27:11):
of the break right, Like is he telegraphing his route
or is he making it creating a nice route tree
that makes the cornerback not know which way it's going,
Like it's nuances like that, not whether they caught the
ball or not, not whether they quote unquote sacked a
quarterback or not. Yeah, that's not what you're looking for.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
No one ready to get back to the fifteen. Yeah, sorry, no, no, no,
that was so that was good though. I think that
was an important thing to talk about. So I'm going
to hit a couple offensive linemen here just because you know,
I do think that I think the offensive line for
the Commander's played great. But I'm always a big believer
just looking at teams and how they build rosters like Detroit,
San Francisco, Philly is a great example. They're always kind

(27:49):
of stockpiling talented young players and kind of saying we
can we're ready for when this player moves on to
a free agency or this player gets hurt. We've just
got a nice stable of guys that are going to
be good professional football players. And so when I look
it off every time I come to the Senior Bowl,
that's something I really look at because I'm like, if
you're talented, if you're athletic, if you're long and big,

(28:12):
and you take coaching, well, this could be a really
a valuable thing. So the first guy on that of
this kind of offensive line discussion is Marcus Imbo from Perdue.
He's sixty four and a quarter. He's three and nine pounds,
so not the biggest guy in the world, thirty three
in charms, and when I watched this film a Perdue,
he is hyper athletic, like hyper great mover, and you're

(28:32):
when I was watching him, like how strong are you?
Like are you strong enough to sit a bull? How's
your anchor? Can you get your hands fit? He doesn't
look like you have long arms. And I actually expect
him to come here and play some guard and center
with his tremendous kind of quickness and stuff. But he's
been playing tackle and he's looked really good, and I
think he's a guy that strikes me. He had a
day to get a rep today against Mike Green and

(28:53):
sat a really aggressive bowl by Mike Green. Really anchored
down in there, locked him up, worklifted under there, and
that's something he didn't show up produce. So just to
see that level of strength, that level of technique from him,
I thought was really quite fantastic. And so again a
guy that has some flexibility along all five spots. But

(29:13):
it's nice to see him playing tackle because he played
right tackle at Purdue, played left tackle today.

Speaker 2 (29:18):
And had a great rep.

Speaker 1 (29:18):
The next guy is Jonah Manheim, and this guy was weird.
So when I looked at his measurables, we talked about,
you know, the Paulson what is it, puls and paranormals. Yeah,
and this guy was the opposite of that. So he's
six ' four and a quarter, he's three oh seven,
he's got thirty and five eighths inch arms and he
plays tackle at USC and so thirty inch arms is

(29:40):
like a true just straight fail. Like I would, you know,
like can you play football in the NFL because the
length of these guys is so crazy. So the senior
world did a great job. They said, you're not playing
attacking to play guard, and I wasn't sure about. It's
always interesting watching tackles move from tackle to guard because
you're dealing with a bigger guy, more kind of power

(30:01):
on the interior. And like so a guy that struggled
with that is whyatt Tillim Why at Tilam is that
his name from West Virginia. Yeah, he's had a really
hard time on the interior, but Mannheim is not. And
I've been really impressed with his trunk strength, Like he's
just the power through the middle of his body, ability
to deal with these heavier rushers, settle his feet. He's

(30:22):
got a nice quick burst And I don't know if
he's ever going to be a starting guard in the NFL,
but definitely strikes me as a guy who would be
a really effective swing player, like a Nick Gates plus
in terms of athleticism that kind of mentality. But the quickness,
the power, the ability to anchor even when you're not
fit with your hands is extremely impressive to me.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
And I just had to give a shout.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
Out, what do you mean by the trunk? Like I
understand you mean like the core and all that, But
when you say like a trunk, you're using that word specifically.
What are you trying to communicate?

Speaker 1 (30:52):
So basically, like when you're sitting a bull or a
power rush, there's I want to see how basically your
like your adductors, like the inside of your legs connect
to your pelvis and how you're reckt as abdominant or
your abs keep your rib cage and your pelvis connected, right,
so it should look like one piece basically.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
Right.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
When you see someone with a bad trunk, you see
like I'm going to call it like a looseness, right.
You see their torso kind of open up, they kind
of shift back. They can't anchor in their hips and
they just get pushed back or they lean forward. Then
they're susceptible to the push. Poll Monheim was kind of
like the opposite. Right, you push on him, he sinks
perfectly down. You try to pull him. He's strong enough

(31:34):
in that again, that kind of mid section trunk area
of his body to fight the poll, stay fit, keep
his keep his balance, and that was just extremely impressive.
And there's a couple other guys. The guard from Sacramento
Sacramento State Slater, very similar to the guard from NDSU,
also did that, you know.

Speaker 2 (31:53):
And so when you see.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
Three guys that kind of have that strength and that
foot speed to go with it, you're like, man, these
guys that to me for guard is like minimum threshold.

Speaker 2 (32:04):
Right. If you see those things, you can play some
football at the next level.

Speaker 3 (32:08):
Speaking of the Sacramento State guy, he's on our list,
so jack said Slater, go ahead.

Speaker 1 (32:13):
Yeah, Jackson Slatter, he's a second practice guy and him
and so I'm gonna put him and the guard from
NDSU North Dakota State in there as well. But small
school guys, both of them incredibly physical, incredible, incredibly snappy,
and incredibly tough. And then the things we just talked
about with Mannheim, they bring that same thing, but they

(32:35):
have the length, they have the weight, they have these
other elements that come to their game. And I just
for two small school guys coming to this event and
kind of stamping it and saying, hey, I deserve to
be here, I deserve to be drafted. And again they
might be fourth round draft picks. I don't think so.
I think the NDSU guys specifically is going to be
a third round pick, just with how well he's played

(32:55):
in these couple of weeks or these two days. Excuse me,
but both those guys, the mid section, strength, the foot speed,
the hand dexterity, all those things seemed to be there.
And so it's also when a small school guy.

Speaker 2 (33:07):
Both of them.

Speaker 1 (33:08):
Played tackle, played left tackle for their small school Sacramento
State and North Dakota State. For them to be here
and playing so well in the interior, along with Monheim,
they can all kind of go in that same bucket
of player.

Speaker 3 (33:21):
Yeah, and for just Jackson Slater being at Sacramento State,
much like much like Mike Green right, you want to
see the stats line up or the production in college
lineup with what you're seeing here.

Speaker 2 (33:35):
You see the guy that didn't give up a sack.

Speaker 3 (33:37):
He didn't give up a sack or a QB hit this,
which is wild. His first team All American. He wasn't
actually originally invited to play at the Shrine Shrine Bowl,
but then Scoon it over here. I guess the Senior
Bowl was like, hey, come on over and maybe a
little higher caliber talent, let's see what you can do.
And he was like, bet I'm there. And he showed up.

Speaker 1 (33:59):
He did and he's done a job, and he was
I think he weighed like three hundred pounds in college.
He came in at three twenty. It looks like it's
good weight. He looks strong, looks powerful. So I'm really
glad that he came here instead of his Senior Bowl
because I think it's going to be a great opportunity
for him to show up.

Speaker 3 (34:12):
All right, how many do we have left now? One
or two? I think we have two more left here.

Speaker 2 (34:16):
With the offensive lineman.

Speaker 3 (34:17):
Yeah yeah, all right, let's knock it out.

Speaker 1 (34:19):
So then those are guards and interior players that I
think just just deserve to shout out. You know, Marcus Imbo,
I think he is going to play guard probably at
the next level, but did great job in terms of tackle.
These next two guys I think are in the first
practice specifically have done the best job at tackle. Obviously
Josh Connory's done a great job, but I think there's

(34:40):
been a little bit inconsistency to his play strength. So
the guy that jumps out to me is Jalen Travis.
We talked about him yesterday in like the Paulson's Paranormals
or whatever.

Speaker 2 (34:50):
He's six seven and five eighths, so bad.

Speaker 3 (34:52):
Whatever, I was very happy with coming on.

Speaker 2 (34:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (34:55):
So, but he's six ' eight, he's three forty one,
he's got thirty four and a half inch arms, and
he moves significantly better than he did on tape at
Iowa State, and so his ability to get in front
of those really talented edg rushers. Just we just talked
about Mike Green, Ola dj as Araku, right and really

(35:15):
just kind of negate their effectiveness. That got me juiced
up because everybody looks a little bit stressed out by
those guys, and he, for whatever reason, I don't. I
think it's probably due because he's so huge and he's
got good feet, was just able to kind of stay
in front and make it happen. So I really really
liked what I saw from him. I liked his ability
to change direction. Again, there's tomorrow's a new day. But

(35:36):
he's a guy that no one's really talking about nationally,
but I think they probably should be talking about because
of his ability to move and use his length and
use his size to negate these hyper athletic pass rushers
that he's seen.

Speaker 3 (35:51):
All right, And the last offensive tackle before we.

Speaker 1 (35:53):
Move on, yeah, Anthony Belton. And this is where it's like,
it's it's fun to do like the projection game.

Speaker 2 (35:59):
Right.

Speaker 1 (35:59):
So he's from NC State, six ' five and three
eighths three forty five is the heaviest offensive lineman here.
He's he's got thirty four and five inchins arms, so
basically thirty five inch arms and on film is extremely
sloppy with his technique, kind of all over the place,
kind of wonder about his top end athleticism. But today,
for example, Mike Green hit a spin move on him

(36:21):
and I thought, oh, he's dust because he's not gonna
be able to adjust and his you know, dancing bare
body just slid right in front and washed it flat.
And I thought, that is what it's when you're watching
one on one pass pro with a tackle. Anybody can
vertical set like like that's like day one install stuff, right,
But when you can redirect on an inside move on

(36:43):
a spin move, and it's never going to be pretty,
you're never going to shut it down completely. But when
you can wash it flat, that's a great job. So
for a guy that big, and then you when you
watch him in team period, he again is like a
little bit all over the place in terms of his technique.
But we're we're we sit Jay, so we sit probably
fifteen twenty rows up. We sit in the kind of
upper bowl so we can see both things happening at

(37:05):
the same time, both one on ones. Yeah, in team period,
he had a down block, I got a power pushed
the three technique or the four eye all the way
down inside and then just with like a forearm shiver,
like almost decapitated the linebacker. He wasn't low, he wasn't
He just was explosive and violent. And when you see
a guy of that kind of size, you say, if

(37:27):
you're looking for a tackle, if you get him with
the right coach, can this guy be the guy? And
I feel like with both those guys, I would say,
and Josh connerly obviously, but Josh Connelly's going to be
first round pick. Privately, those guys I just think deserve
a shout out based on today's performance.

Speaker 3 (37:41):
Yeah, And I just pulled up his PFF real quick
to see if any of this backs up what you're saying,
And of course it does because you're so good at this.
But his true pass set so true passeet for those
that don't know what that means, that means this is
clearly a pass It's it's not an RPO, it's not
play action, no, not play The quarterback is throwing this ball.

(38:02):
So his true pass set class pass block. Great man,
that's a mouse is grade here in these true pass sets?
Was it eighty two point three this year? That is
ninety eight percent time?

Speaker 2 (38:15):
Is it really? Yes? So wow?

Speaker 3 (38:18):
And when they're throwing the ball, you couldn't get by him.

Speaker 1 (38:21):
That gets me juiced up, man, because again he's all
over the place, his hands aren't great, and you're but
he just is a big athletic dude. And so when
I see big athletic dudes planet theory.

Speaker 2 (38:30):
He bides by it.

Speaker 1 (38:31):
Both those guys circle him maybe you know, late second,
early third round kind of picks.

Speaker 2 (38:36):
So keep those guys get me really juiced up.

Speaker 3 (38:39):
All right, let's move on. We're going back to the
skill positions. Let's do a DBI and a wide receiver
again here for you.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
Yeah, so aziy and is that going to say that.

Speaker 3 (38:49):
Yeah, we're going to figure these out by the com.

Speaker 1 (38:51):
Yeah, and that that's close. So I've heard of the
osra Hey Thomas from Florida State. He is six to
one and a half, he's hundred ninety one pounds, he's
got thirty two and a half inch arms. So for
a corner, that's huge. And so you expect a huge
corner to look a certain way and move a certain way.
And with corners that size and really any corner, you're

(39:13):
looking for a guy that can just effortlessly attached to
the receiver. I'm not going to freak out. I'm not
gonna grab. I'm gonna get nice and sticky. I can
when it's time to open and turn, I open and
turn without losing any speed. It's something we talked about
at the Combine last year a little bit. When they
do that backpedal to transition drill, how stiff are you?
And someone highlighted him yesterday and I was like, I'm

(39:34):
just going to watch a couple of his reps and
I'll be darned if the first rest I watched, I
wasn't like, I didn't even know it was him.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
That's the other thing. He was like, who the heck
is that guy?

Speaker 1 (39:43):
And I opened my book found the number, and I
was like, oh my gosh, that was the best man
coverage rep I've seen here at the Senior Bowl. And
you get to watch him. He does a great job
down and down out. He's hyper competitive, he's long. I
will say he was the call out for tes John
and he absolutely lost Johnsin absolutely lost him. But that's

(40:04):
one rep. But I think on the whole, when you
look at his movement skills, how he tracks the football,
how competitive is a catch point. You're like, if there's
a dude here that could go in the first round,
it feels like that guy. There's another guy in the
second group. We'll talk about him probably tomorrow, but that
guy feels special based on movement. And when you see corners, right,

(40:26):
you want to see tackles block in one on one situation.
You want to see guards do the same thing corners.
You want to see them a manta man. And I
feel like this guy has answered that ringing bell multiple
times with really high quality reps.

Speaker 2 (40:37):
And is the ball getting completed? Sure?

Speaker 1 (40:39):
Sometimes, but that's part of life playing defensive back.

Speaker 3 (40:43):
Yeah, And it's tough to figure out defensive backs with stats,
like just looking at stats, because I'll give you an
example for him. He has only one interception this year, right, Well,
maybe they don't throw the ball his way because the
year before he had ten pass breaking right like he
was so he was all over. So it's like, all right,

(41:03):
we're not going to throw your way. And then the
thing that I like just looking up his stats that
I like about him those he was second on his
team attacking and tackles quarterback, right, So this guy will
go he's he's he's aggressive, he's a gamer, right, So yeah,
he may give up, he may give up a catch
here or there. He's not going to be a ballhawk

(41:23):
like we've seen other corners come into the league. That's
one of maybe one of the main reasons they move
up the boards because they're ballhawks. This guy shuts it
looks like shuts people down to the point they don't
throw the ball his way. And he's going to get
involved and probably the run game. That's what the tackle say.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
And so when I figure guys that fit the Commander's mold,
and I think he fits a lot of molds for
the NFL. But like having a guy that's willing to
tackle like that with his body type and he's kind
of put together. Well again, I haven't watched a ton
of dbs, but he's a guy that I am incredibly
excited to watch after watching him today at the Senior
ball All right.

Speaker 3 (41:56):
Let's talk about a wide receiver. This is one that
I'm actually pretty hyped about.

Speaker 1 (42:00):
Yeah, Jalen Noel nine, three hundred and four nine and
three quarters one hundred and ninety six pounds. Interesting dude,
because I thought at iowas eight he'd be a slot receiver.
He's hyper quick, he runs a lot of choices, runs
a lot of angles, and it's kind of like when
he's here at the Senior Bowl, he was like, no,
I'm gonna play outside receiver and show you that I

(42:21):
can be a true zero X. And so he has
some really excellent outside reps outside today where he's kind
of running by people, the balls overthrown, he runs a
great comeback with a nice little indicator at the beginning
of the route and a great stem, and I was
just like, in terms of impressive, right, he's just been
a guy that stood out for his running ability, his

(42:42):
ability to consistently create separation. Not to the same level
as Tees Johnson, but in some ways it's been more
impressive because he's done it outside kind of where the
big boys like to play, where I thought he would
kind of live as an inside slot player. More so
watching him has been really cool. And again to see
his physicality and kind of his build, and he's he's

(43:04):
not a big guy, but he kind of reminds you
a little bit of like Santana Moss. You know, that shorter,
muscular kind of guy that can really roll and is
really fast. I don't know what he's gonna run, but
he looks like a fourth high fourth three low four
four type guy to me on film. So he's a
guy that I was really impressed with, that competitive dog
to kind of say, hey, you think I'm just a
slot guy at the NFL level, No, I can do more.

(43:26):
And when you look at value for receivers, and this
is where Ted Johnson's value gets a little bit weird.
You say how high would you take a pure slot player,
And most of the time people say I wouldn't take
it before the fifth the fourth round because they're not
on the field enough. Here is a guy who's saying, oh, yeah,
well look at me. I can do whatever you need
me to do and be very successful at it as

(43:47):
a receiving As a receiver.

Speaker 3 (43:49):
Yeah, and super productive at Iowa State. He is second
all time at Iowa State and receptions he has two
hundred and forty five of those, fourth in school history.
With two thousand and andrew and fifty five receiving yards and
eighteen touchdowns.

Speaker 2 (44:03):
In his career though, oh dang.

Speaker 3 (44:05):
And then he racks up the all purpose yards, which
is I think where also the Santana Moss cop comes in.
He was great on punt returns, Like, so he's a
dynamic player that they try and get the ball in
his hands.

Speaker 1 (44:18):
And there's very few receivers here that feel like NFL receivers,
if you know what I mean. Like, there are guys
that will play in the NFL that will be good
NFL players, but in terms of a guy that you
could kind of build an offense around, he feels like
he's got an elements of that. I still think he's
got a little bit of ways to go, but he
does feel like he could do some stuff where you're like, Okay,

(44:40):
your special you run well, you can make the contested catch,
you can win on the perimeter, which again is a
huge credit to him and the other guy from the
same school, Jalen Higgins, is also from Iowa State, a
little bigger at a really nice day to day, but
both those guys feel like, along with Xavier stro that
they're the best receivers here. Yeah, and all those dudes

(45:03):
are in the first group. So when you look at
the skill position players for the afternoon, you're kind of like,
these guys are fine, but there's nobody that kind of
catches your eye the way those three players.

Speaker 3 (45:12):
Yeah, and with an average catch of fourteen point nine yards,
that's basically fifteen yards this season, and that's when eighty receptions.
Big play threat, no doubt, Logan, this is your favorite position.
I can't imagine why, but it's the tight end. And
we got three tight ends we want to talk about
around this conversation.

Speaker 1 (45:32):
Yes, and then we're going to talk about them all
kind of together on one lump. But I just wanted
to bring these three guys up because we've been coming
to this.

Speaker 2 (45:38):
This is our third year at the Senior Bowl, right,
this is the best group.

Speaker 1 (45:43):
And when you're talking about playmakers, you just talked about
three receivers that are playmakers, but when you look at
the tight ends, you're like, there are playmakers in this group.

Speaker 2 (45:51):
And it speaks to I think.

Speaker 1 (45:53):
The composition of this year's draft class and saying that
the tight end position is special. This year, you're probably
gonna have two in the first round a third Mike
creep in there, depending on how you view Elijah Arroyo
from Miami what his role is in your offense. But
but yeah, so let's just talk about those guys. Let's
start with a Royo. He's from Miami. He's six ' four,

(46:14):
he's two fifty.

Speaker 2 (46:16):
He played.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
He competes in line. He's not great in line, but
he competes in line. But he's really special in my
opinion as a route runner. And I think we're going
to talk about three guys here that are all a
little bit different as route runners, but they all find
ways to win. He's very sudden. He's like a big
white out, you know, he's like a big white out.
He's violent at the top of his routes. He can
really sink his hips. He's got a nice suddenness to him,

(46:36):
and he catches the ball.

Speaker 2 (46:38):
Like a receiver. So he can win vertically.

Speaker 1 (46:39):
He can win in the intermediate And think about guys
that can do that at the NFL level, like they're
extremely valuable, Like they just have a playmaking ability. They
can attack the seam. Think about what zach Ertz did
for the Commanders this year. I don't want to say
he's a replacement for zach Ertz, but that's kind of
what he feels like in terms of a guy with
that skill set.

Speaker 3 (46:57):
How would you feel if like we were, well, where
would you have to draft them? Because tight ends are
starting to move up up draft boards these days, especially
with what we saw from guys like Sam Laporta and
last year definitely with Brock Bowers like the importance of
a good tight end starting to move up draft boards.
Do you think that he's second round, third round?

Speaker 1 (47:17):
Is? I think he feels like a second round player
To me, he feels like, if you're desperate, maybe bottom
of the first Like, Okay, that's the kind of athlete
you're dealing with. Him and the next guy we're going
to talk about. I think are both in the same
category after watching them today, Okay, And so I do
think because they're not. Don't think of him as a
tight end, think of them as an offensive weapon. Think

(47:37):
of them about their ability to create matchups. Think about
Zach in the Philadelphia game. You have a matchup, he
can win that matchup consistently for you. And I'm not
saying this guy can do this today in the NFL,
but he's got a skill set that gets you there.
You know that you kind of say, oh, okay, in
a man and man situation on third and five, Arroyo.
If he develops as the athletic tools to do that,

(48:01):
So I think there is more value there and especially
in a week wide receiver class.

Speaker 2 (48:04):
We just talked about those.

Speaker 1 (48:06):
There's only three guys here that are kind of like
they've got some juice to him, kind of exciting players.
That's I think we're very reflective of the entire receiver
class this year, right.

Speaker 3 (48:16):
And what better place to develop than behind Zacher.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
Oh my gosh, that'd be great.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
I mean it would be so cool for him, and
I kind of see these guys in a very similar way.
The other guy is Terrence Ferguson from Oregon. He's six
four and five eight, so basically six five, he's like
two hundred and forty five pounds, got this kind of lanky.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
Basketball player build.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
And so Arroyo wins like, you know, very deliberate sharp cuts,
and Terrence Ferguson wins in kind of this think of
Travis Kelcey. Kind of I understand space, I understand how
to work a speed cut really well. I understand kind
of gradual stems at the beginning of my route less
sudden to kind of help me break leverage. And he
catches the football so incredibly naturally, like it's just easy

(49:00):
for him. He's tall, he moves like he kind of
snakes through the defense, and both of them are okay
in line. I think Terrence has more upside because the
physical frame, right, he's a bigger guy. We could develop
more in that area. But when you say these guys
have that kind of factor to say they can be
weapons in an offense, and talk about both of them

(49:21):
learning under a guy like zach Ertz, that would be
really incredible. So just I got to give him a
shout out. You know, Terrence won. Terrence Ferguson won the
call out today between you know, at the end of
the first national practice today, one in a man and
man situation, caught the ball, got up points big first down,
you know, like you can see the juice, you can
see the excitement. Arroyo had a great catch today too,

(49:42):
ran one of the best out routes you'll see ever.
And so both those guys deserve a shout out, no, no.

Speaker 3 (49:47):
Doubt, Yeah, absolutely, it's I think that we need to
stop looking at tight ends as anything but offensive weapons.
Now that's just the way the league's been going.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
Not everybody's like that, right, And there was a guy.

Speaker 3 (49:59):
There was a guy here today that was not like that.
He was very logan Paulson.

Speaker 2 (50:05):
Asked in the mirror.

Speaker 3 (50:07):
But just but you know what, there's gonna be a
place for him, Someone's going to see him here and
to go, okay, you are just you want to get nasty.
In fact, they did the one on ones at the
end and he was up and they were like, oh,
tight end's coming up.

Speaker 2 (50:23):
And then he said set because he did a blocking.

Speaker 3 (50:27):
Rep instead of instead of a route the other tight
end standard Jackson Hawes. What a Logan Paulson move.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
And I remember I was watching this film and I
was like, you know the Spider Man meme where you're
pointing and he's pointing, and you're like, we are the
same thing because he's physical, he finishes like he think
like you're John Bates type guy. And again not maybe
the same draft value as those other guys we just
talked about, but.

Speaker 2 (50:50):
A guy who's really good.

Speaker 1 (50:52):
And then I got to talk about Harrold fannin Junior,
the guy from Bowling Green. He moves in such an
odd way, he's like so tight in his he's got
this long back and I was like, there's no way
this plays, Like, there's no possible way that this plays.
At the Senior Bowl, guys are just going to be
too good. But you see his craftiness, you see his
ability to restem, you see his ability to accelerate away

(51:15):
from defenders. I still don't think he's like a second
round guy, but I after watching him today run a
couple corners, really just dice people up with his kind
of vertical horsepower and speed. I thought there might be
somebody out there feels away. And again, this is the
guy that broke the all time I think it was
the all time NCAA record for receptions or something like that, one.

Speaker 3 (51:36):
Hundred and seventeen receptions this year for one five and
fifty five yards and ten touchdowns. That dude was balling.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
Dude was balling.

Speaker 1 (51:46):
And again he moves in this he's like kind of
duck footed. His hips are crazy tight, his ankles are
crazy tight, and you're like, what can you do at
the next level? But seeing him beat some you know,
and these guys are maybe not going to be starting
NFL caliber dbs, but beating NFL dbs in a demonstrative way.
I just thought those three dudes from the first group

(52:07):
deserved a big shout out because it's like, damn, we
have We've been coming for a long time. And we
haven't seen tight ends win that consistently, and so in
a draft, it makes sense. The strengths of the draft
are defensive line, tight end, running back. It definitely is
reflected down here at the Senior Bowl.

Speaker 3 (52:25):
Yeah, and they're in they're in his bowling green. Excuse me,
in their bowling green versus it was Arkansas State. It
was their bowl game this year. I mean the offense
was him. He had seventeen receptions for two y thirteen yards.
That's crazy, I mean that's it was him.

Speaker 2 (52:40):
Yeah, and they.

Speaker 3 (52:41):
Couldn't stop them. And again, small school, like we mentioned before,
Bowling Green. The stats are there, the productions here, can
you do it here? Looks like you can. Yeah, so,
which is exciting.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
So yeah, if you look, if you're looking for a
tight end this year that as a playmaker like I
would almost put him in that bucket. Now, I think
I need to see one more day because I was
so after watching film.

Speaker 2 (53:01):
And I'm not saying he wasn't a productive, great college
football player, but just does it.

Speaker 1 (53:05):
Remember with the combine and the draft and the tape watching,
it's all about projection. So when you watch Arroyo, you
see it's easy it's like, oh, yeah, this is his role.
Terrence Ferguson. You see the role with Harreld Finag and
you're like, what is your actual role? But if you
can win that way consistently, then you're like, all right,
I don't care how it looks. You're doing it consistently.

(53:25):
Let's reward that with some value.

Speaker 3 (53:27):
So if you were keeping count, that's your top fifteen.

Speaker 2 (53:31):
Ish. We did a little little little detour.

Speaker 3 (53:34):
Yeah, yeah, that's your top fifteen from the first half
of practice today. So real quickly before we go, and
I mean real quickly, just a couple of names from
the second half of practice that's worth throwing out. They
had good days. They deserve shout outs.

Speaker 1 (53:45):
Yeah, so I'm going to give you six names real quick.
So Walter Nolan, he's been an absolute monster playing three
technique from Old Miss. I mean looks like that kind
of pass rushing three technique interior player. Baron Sorell, the
ed rusher from Texas. I mean, he's not maybe this
high end ceiling of some of these other guys, but
has just shown up every day, been incredibly consistent, wins, reps,
tough in the run game. Jackson Slater, we talked about

(54:08):
him with the offensive line. He's in the second group.
IVY from Old Miss. He reminds me so much of Sherman.
Like he's tall, he's six ' five, he's two eighty.
He plays inside outside, and they move similar they kind
of play with similar power. I think Sherman has a
little bit more up, a little bit more horsepower. But

(54:30):
when I say, man, if this guy's in the second
round and you're picking at what are they picking, you know,
thirty or whatever like that seems like tremendous value there.

Speaker 2 (54:38):
So really really been impressed with him.

Speaker 1 (54:41):
And again, like people aren't talking about him, but he's
really jumped out to me in terms of his consistency
playing the run, rushing the passer, doing all those things.
Eugenis Sante, linebacker from Auburn. A little bit undersize, but
can rip to the football. Man does great in the
one on once from a coverage standpoint, and when I'm
evaluating linebackers, that's like my number one thing great. And
then Jalen Royals from Utah State. I think he won

(55:04):
every single one on one today after struggling big time yesterday.
Had to give him a shout out. Had a great
job that's awesome. Logan, dude, that's a lot of names.

Speaker 3 (55:14):
That's a lot of names, but that's all. That's why,
that's why you're the what did the what did Fred
call you today? Or the No, Fred wouldn't give you an.

Speaker 2 (55:23):
Alleyte It wasn't him. Who was It was Brian?

Speaker 3 (55:25):
Oh, Brian Colbert. You called you the prospect professor. Yeah, yeah,
Paulson the prospect professor.

Speaker 2 (55:32):
There we go.

Speaker 3 (55:33):
Yeah. No, I like draft Google because you are. You're
excellent at this former tight end ten years in the league.
You know what you're talking about. You know what you're
looking for. I learned so much from you. This is
so much fun. The Senior Bowl is so much fun.
And tomorrow will be our last one, last practice. We'll
have one more podcast. Then we'll do a podcast potentially

(55:53):
weekly up until the Combine. Then we'll do the same
thing we did at the Combine, one every day and
then weekly until the draft, and then we'll do the draft.
So don't go anywhere, listeners, like more of this will
be coming this entire process. We love it. We're gonna
have special guests. I got one booked for it tomorrow,
So tune in tomorrow to figure out who that's gonna be.
You're gonna love him. He's great. He's been on several times.

(56:15):
He's really good. So yeah, let's sign off here from
this mobile Alabama, the Senior Bold Daytue Brett.

Speaker 2 (56:21):
That's it.