Live from Pull up for Peace conference Part 2 Guest: Lakeesha Eure and AT Mitchell-Mann

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm Tamika D. Mallory and it's.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Your boy, my son a general.

Speaker 1 (00:03):
We are your host of t M I.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Tamika and my Son's Information, Truth, Motivation and inspiration, new name.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
New Energy. What's going on? My son, Lennon?

Speaker 2 (00:16):
I am black, Black and Holly favored Tamika. How you
doing today?

Speaker 3 (00:22):
All as well as well just true m plenty is
we need to be like we love just water, so
we should be actually calling.

Speaker 2 (00:31):
We need to ask, hey, Jada, we need a few
bottles of this.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
Jada said that Naha Brand.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
She said, that's Jaden Brand said Jaden, Oh, I thought
you said?

Speaker 2 (00:41):
He said Jaden.

Speaker 3 (00:43):
Mama said, listen, don't call me, call the person director.
You need some walked up texts Jayden to say, just
so you know, we drink and love t M I.

Speaker 2 (00:53):
We love just just what.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
It's really good.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
So if anybody who had Just water when it first started,
because remember when Just Water first came out, I started.
I bought some immediately, and I didn't like the way
it tastes. It tastes like a box. As soon as
I had put a little bit in my mouth, I
was like, oh, this is disgusting, and I, along with
I'm sure other people gave some feedback, and then over

(01:21):
time it changed, so I went back. I always drink
smart water or just water, So I went back on
my smart water until I don't know where I was.
I think it was actually I was in the Bahamas.
I was in the Bahamas and I had some just
water and it was so good that I was like, oh,
that's it. I'm back on just water. And then they

(01:42):
sent us some during while we were in Louisville, Kentucky,
with Breonna Taylor's family in the community there, they sent
us a bunch of just water for our airbnbs, and
so then we started got back into drinking it, and
that box taste was gone. So whatever they put inside
of it, it's like an aluminum seal. It changed the

(02:05):
way that the water tastes.

Speaker 1 (02:06):
This water.

Speaker 3 (02:07):
For anybody who is listening, this just water is bomb water.
Everyone that I know who drinks it regularly, they love it,
love it gets you some just what it tastes so
crisp and clean. I was walking around a festival this
holiday weekend in New York City and it's the Commodore.

(02:28):
I think it's the International African American you know, and
there's a whole bunch of letters.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
I A.

Speaker 3 (02:34):
We have to make sure we put it please on
the screen. It happens annually. And I was walking around
in there, and it was so hot on the fourth
of July in this park, but it was so wonderful,
so many black people, activists, leaders, scholars, vendors, everything you

(02:55):
could think people cooking, of course, you know, big massive
lines for food, kids playing music, everything you could think
of at a festival. And I had a bottle in
my car that was so hot, smoking hot, and so
I got some ice and mixed it with it and
like shook it up and did what I had to do.

(03:18):
When I was drinking that water in the park, I
said to myself, there is no water better than this
in the whole wild world.

Speaker 1 (03:26):
It just it was so good.

Speaker 2 (03:28):
You just maybe it just satisfied the need of the moment.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
No, no, it's not.

Speaker 3 (03:33):
Because I also I had a little bottle of poland
spring like that was all I could get to at
one point, and I was like, so I went back
to the car, I got my water, So dang on good.

Speaker 1 (03:47):
That could have been that dirty ice that I put
in there. But you know that's all different.

Speaker 3 (03:53):
Well, they said that the ice is dirty and swamp
they said ice is disgusting. So, you know, but nah,
a black woman gave it to me, so it was clean.
That's it, period, point and blank. But speaking of festivals,
that brings me to the target Boycott continues.

Speaker 1 (04:10):
You know.

Speaker 3 (04:11):
The interesting thing about so this weekend, the reason why
i was at the festival in Brooklyn, which I've always
attended with my parents whenever I didn't go to Essence,
which was meant, which was not often, but whenever I
didn't go to Essence, my parents have been taken me
to Brooklyn on Memorial weekend and then again fourth July weekend.

(04:31):
There are festivals that happened there in Brooklyn. Shout out
to Brooklyn for always maintaining that cultural expression for black
people too. And so I was, you know, so I
decided let me go with them because I knew they
would be doing something, and so I was still going
to be around our people and be at a festival,

(04:51):
but just not the Essence festival.

Speaker 1 (04:53):
And there are a lot of people who I think
were very confused.

Speaker 3 (04:57):
And in fact, I posted a statement and I kind
of left out a really important thing in the statement,
and so I think it may have caused some folks
to be a little bit confused, but then there are
a bunch of other people who were like, I know
exactly what she's saying. So some folks are confused on purpose,
like they want to be confused. But the bottom line

(05:18):
was that I put out, you know, my own statement. Now,
the week before Essence began the festival began, Jamal, Nina
Turner and Die passed to Jamal Bryant, Nina Turner, Senter,
Anita Turner and myself put out a statement pretty much
saying that we weren't going to Essence and explaining why

(05:38):
and also laying out, you know, the boycott, that it continues,
how it started, just reminding people of all the things again,
and we were really clear, we don't have an issue
with Essence. We know that Essence was in a four
year contract or four year deal sponsorship deal with Target,

(05:59):
and in fact, the things that we called on Target
to do in the demands is to make sure that
they spend every single dime that they said they would
spend with the black community as a part of their
initial commitments to diversity, equity and inclusion. I asked the
Target executive that we were working with or speaking with directly,

(06:21):
to show us how the money was spent, all of it.
If you say you've made your commitment, show it to us,
show us real data and see.

Speaker 1 (06:30):
The thing is, these people are so.

Speaker 3 (06:32):
Used to getting into conversations with folks where they just
tell them whatever and talk real good.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
And I mean they can talk.

Speaker 3 (06:39):
They know how to speak well, and they know how
to get you caught up in the cyclone. So you
when it's over, you're like, well, it sounds good this
and that. And my thing was, I've been in enough
of those conversations. I've been working in this space for
a long time. I've sat at the feet of the
best negotiators and people who were able to work on

(06:59):
d and fight for certain things to happen and access
for black businesses and all that I've done that I
know exactly how it goes.

Speaker 1 (07:07):
So I know what to ask for.

Speaker 3 (07:09):
And what we want is the data to show that
you've spent this billion dollar two billion dollars, how did
you spend it, who did you spend it with? And
if it's not all handled at this point or all distributed,
what is the plan? So we understand that target is
in a four year sponsorship deal with Essence, and nobody

(07:30):
is telling Essence don't take the money or go back. Now,
there's some people who said, well, that's what we would
have done, and that's cool, everybody. I'm not about to
sit here and debate back and forth with people on
how they feel they would have handled a situation. But
I understand realistically, with Essence being a massive brand in

(07:51):
the way in which it is, and in the last
this whole diversity, equity and inclusion rollback, by the way,
is impacting businesses like Essence and others, organizations and people, individuals,
Black people, and not get to that in a second,
it is impacting all of us because we know that

(08:11):
there are several vendors that did not have several major
businesses and sponsors who did not go back to Essence
this year. So when people are like, oh it was different,
it felt like this, that and the third, there are reasons,
multiple layered reasons why.

Speaker 1 (08:26):
That happened, right, and so.

Speaker 3 (08:30):
To tell them to give back money or to not
take the money or breach a contract with Target, it's
a long shot. And it's not even an argument that
we want to get into because guess what, black people
are not our enemy. We're not here to fight a
black business, and that's not what we're trying to do,
at least that it's not what we're trying to do.

(08:51):
And so we just said, in good conscious we could
not be up in essence, smiling and grinning and walking
around having a good time while a big old target
exhibit is in the convention center.

Speaker 1 (09:06):
We just can't do it.

Speaker 3 (09:07):
And so we said the action, the call to action
is for people to walk past the target exhibit, don't
go in there, don't walk around with their bag, don't
take their stuff.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
Now, two things about that.

Speaker 3 (09:19):
First off, if people, if any dumb, ignorant person thinks
that we thought that nobody black was going to go
over to the target booth, you're dumb, right. And I
saw somebody write that, and I kind of really want
to call a person out, but I'm just I just
get tired of fighting everybody all the time. So whatever,
no one thought that people weren't going to go to

(09:40):
the booth. Of course you were still going to have
people to line up, because that's how we do, that's
just how we do. We already know that one of
the reasons why when folks are like, oh, we should
boycott this and do this, and that. The reason why
there is a hesitancy from most people who are leaders
to lean into these conversations about boycotts is because we

(10:03):
already understand that if you cannot demonstrate with numbers a
significant impact, which we have done so with Target, regardless
of what happened at essence, we have done so with Target.
But if you cannot demonstrate that, oftentimes people do not
want to put their credibility and everything else on the
line by calling for something that they know more than

(10:25):
likely people are not going to do. So we already
understand that there were going to be lines of black
folks that don't give two shits about a boycott or
anything else. What they care about is we want the
free stuff, and so they're going on over there. But
the second thing is Target changed the color of its exhibit.
So usually everything is big red with the big, big

(10:49):
red bullseye that's the Target brand. This year their entire
exhibit was pink, and the Target symbol was in just
a few places, but not as bold as it usually is.
So people were saying to us, or we got on
the line and then realized it was targeting it. I
don't know if they got off or not or whatever,

(11:11):
but one thing I do know, there are a number
of people, a significant number of people who wrote messages,
who sent back things saying I walked right slam past
it and I ain't thinking about Target. I'm never going back.
So there's going to be that and we're not walking
around like oh man, people who's out there Target things still?

(11:32):
And I feel so bad. It's so much bigger than
that for us. I feel like we were making sure
that we stand true to what we said. We said
we would not support Target in any way, and therefore
we can't even be at the festival where Target is,
you know, all around Now, then there are people who

(11:52):
will say and the same person in fact anyway was
talking about you know, but why were people up in
arms about the National Baptist Convention taking money from Target?

Speaker 1 (12:07):
And what we have been very clear about is there's
a big.

Speaker 3 (12:10):
Difference between somebody signing a four year deal and this
is the last of four, even if it was the
third of four.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
Right, they're in a contract already and you.

Speaker 3 (12:21):
Having a meeting with Target and taking new money from
them in the middle of a boycott. And I know
everybody understands that. That's why I don't even argue about it,
because the reason why you see them keep writing and
talking and writing and talking is because of the guilt
that they know. And the people in that comment section
is tearing them up. They were writing this person was right, Yeah,

(12:41):
why they ain't saying nothing the essence?

Speaker 1 (12:43):
How come you know they ain't going off on essence?

Speaker 3 (12:45):
And it's like in the person in the comments says,
so you saying both the convention and essence fest are
both wrong. That's what you're saying, because it's not to
say that one. You're not saying that both of them
should be off the hook. You saying and Spats should
have gone through the same thing. So you even in
your way, you're acknowledging.

Speaker 1 (13:07):
The issue here. But that's not the point. It is
not to me.

Speaker 3 (13:10):
Again, I am not going to invest my time and
energy into creating or fighting with more of our people
because I can clearly see who the enemy is and
we know very clearly and understand very much. So what
is happening with companies like Target and Target specifically Donald

(13:33):
Trump says and Elon muss I don't care how much
they having a boy and girl or a girl and
boy or whatever you want to call it. Spat in
this moment, I don't care how much they have in
a little spat, a nasty spat, by the way, but
I don't care about that. They were aligned when they
decided that diversity, equity and inclusion needed to be challenged

(13:55):
and made damn near illegal in companies. Target's physics is, oh, well,
we can't defy an executive order. Well, how come Delta
can defy an executive order? How come Costco can defy
an executive order? You don't get a pass for what
you have done? And so when people why this isn't

(14:16):
it because we because the people said.

Speaker 2 (14:18):
So, Listen, I mean, and that's the reality of the situation.
When we look at this whole boycott situation, it wasn't
called by us. It was called by the people. And
we just happened to be in a position to have
the faces and follow the lead of the people. Like
when you do boycouts and when you when you do
fast or whatever you call them, it's you have you

(14:39):
get it from the energy of the streets, and the
energy of the streets was like Target this some bullshit,
and Target got to pay for it, you know. So
when we look at this situation, like you said, ess as,
we all love to go to this is our favorite
thing to do. But when you can't have boycott right,
you can't say you stand up for something and just
because my friend is doing it, it's okay. No, it's
just it's not okay. Because we said we we weren't

(15:00):
going to stand with anything. We're target was prominent, so
you know, we when we gave the the marchin orders
and for the most part, the people who stood for
what we stood for, Like you said, we can't make
everybody do it. Now, there's no way. Black people are
not a mind lift. They have their own ideas. They
have the things that they stand for, things that they
believe in. And if you don't believe that target should

(15:21):
be boycott, that's on you. But we made the decision
that it should be boycotted for us, and there's a
long list of people who agree. So when we look
at the situation, and then you're gonna get the nay says,
and there's gonna be people, oh, y'all ain't did nothing whatever.
We know what the numbers say, we know the statistics, and.

Speaker 3 (15:38):
And who is now retiring. By the way, it was
announced that the CEO is retiring. And it's sad that
we as a people don't sit and understand that our power.
They of course they're not gonna go right so much
about your our power right like.

Speaker 1 (15:55):
These editors and these newsrooms.

Speaker 3 (15:58):
They're not being ready to go out there and be like, oh,
the black people are taking back their power.

Speaker 1 (16:03):
They're not going to do this. They say a little
bit about it.

Speaker 2 (16:07):
You know, they have to say it because the reality
is is it's hurting enough to where they have to
say something to acknowledge that it's happened. But what they'll
do is they'll continuously try to pick us off piece
by piece. They're gonna send somebody that's black like you
to have a conversation with you and say, yeah, we
want we want to support, Yeah, we understand this, and
he's gonna individually do this. And that's why I hate

(16:29):
what's happening with Consanat because he's a good kid. He
represents the culture. Probably, But when they come to you
and you have a deal and you got something that
you want to come and they say, hey, we'll we'll
make sure that this is the biggest thing in the store, right,
and you're not really that conscious of what's going on,
or maybe you don't care as much, right, So what
happens is they're able to utilize us against each other.

(16:50):
And this is what happens all the time, and it
is a sad thing and I'm not And the thing is,
we have to be smart enough to understand it. That's
what they're doing, right, So we have to be able
to educate our youth. We got to sit there, somebody
gotta have a conversation with con say, look, this is
what's happening. So how do we figure out what we
do next instead of we have it looks like us
against the younger kids and us against other black people. Know,

(17:13):
we have to we but we have to strategically understand
that that's what they're doing. They are utilizing us to
pit us against each other.

Speaker 3 (17:21):
Well, but the thing is with somebody like Kai Sano,
when you say someone needs to have a conversation with him,
more than likely there are people having a conversation and
that conversation is fuck that boycott. That's that's the conversation
that even and maybe he doesn't know anything about it
at all, but if he was informed somehow it's coming

(17:44):
through the lens of that is not important. A boycott
is not important. It's just a little thing anyway, it
doesn't matter. We're gonna we're gonna move forward. You're hot,
you're more important, or whatever. And that's why black people
can't have nice things, because at the end of the day,
we have to be in a place where no even
if we don't all it. I watched I saw my girlfriend,

(18:06):
our girlfriend l Joy Williams, who's the president of the
New York State Conference at NAACP. She said, I have
my questions about Target, but I know I ain't been
in Target since they said there was a boycott, right,
She like, I ain't know if I was all the
way with it, but I know once we said there
was a boycott, you weren't gonna catch me in it.

Speaker 1 (18:26):
Period.

Speaker 3 (18:27):
As long as black people are boycotting, I'm not going
to cross the picket line. And that's really what I
think was the message for the National Baptist Convention.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
I already get it.

Speaker 3 (18:38):
A bunch of men got to going back and forth, honey,
and people put their stuff on the table and said,
mine is bigger than yours, don't I'm not I'm not
me and need to turner. We're not in the we
don't got nothing the size up with y'all. Y'all got that.

Speaker 1 (18:51):
Y'all can argue all day, go back and forth.

Speaker 3 (18:54):
What we are saying is just keeping the conversation straightforward.
Is that to your point, the people in many ways
called this boycott certainly need to turn It was one
of the first people out there organizing who said, you know,
we need to boycott, and we're gonna put some structure
and some data and some information and also build the

(19:16):
list of black businesses who are in Target and beyond
and make sure that gets out there so people can
buy directly. And then of course you had Pastor Bryant
to come right behind that and start some serious initiatives
to help people with awareness and to get their muscles,
you know, straighten out your muscles, get yourself, get yourself
in the mindset that I don't need this brand. I

(19:38):
can actually go anywhere and find other things that I need.
I don't have to shop at Target. And so when
you put all of that together, along with our knowledge
and ability and expertise, you have a good group of
people who are still being led by the people the
people right, and the people are saying they ain't never

(19:58):
going back to Target. They said, y'all can he was
the word boycott. We're telling you it's canceled, it's done,
it's over for us. That's just where we are. I
just think that even it's important to keep saying that, Like,
I don't feel and I did write. I wrote my truth, right,
I just I don't need. What happened was we put
the statement out together, and then I was just in

(20:19):
my bed and thinking to myself, Wow, I'm really gonna
miss my friends. Usually I got on my little outfits,
we go into all the things, and I make money.
At Essence Fest, I get invited to speak here and
do a thing over here. Sometimes I receive awards and
in the middle of a book release. Okay, I just
my book was just released a few months ago. It's

(20:39):
not like we're talking about two years or even a year.
It was just February eleventh that my book was released.
I need every event possible to sell books. And I
know that when I'm at Essence Fest, because there's a
difference between essence and Essence Fest. When I'm at Essence Fest,
I am in contact with and in relationship with and

(21:01):
standing next to people who thousands of people who support me,
support my work, they love me, and I could really
sell hundreds, if not thousands of books if I really
set up and do it properly. And that was already
worked out. Essence had already said I could come there
and you know, have my book there. And I'm told
that my book was displayed in a couple of places

(21:23):
in the convention center regardless of whether I was there
or not. So when I say I'm not going, it's
really a sacrifice, you know, but it's one that's cool.
I'm good, I'm spending time with my mom and my
daddy and my sister and my friends. Was the best
thing that could have happened. I saw a lot of
people who also support me. And the interesting thing about it,

(21:45):
as I didn't plan it this way, I just happened
to put the statement out on Thursday. As I was thinking,
while I'm not traveling there, you know, to New Orleans,
and I ain't gonna get that good food, oh.

Speaker 1 (21:55):
Gosh, but I'll be back.

Speaker 3 (21:58):
And as I was kind of like thinking about it,
I'm like, you know what, I want to say something
to people that is really heartfelt. That's not a statement
with everybody else, but it's something that's really coming from
my heart.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
So I wrote that statement.

Speaker 3 (22:12):
So Friday when I'm at the festival just walking around,
which I didn't even realize I'm going to the festival
because I called my father Friday morning and say, yo,
y'all want to go eat or you want to do
what today? And he said, we're going to the festival.
I said, I'm gonna go out ride out there with y'all.
So that's how I got there. We were walking around
and people are like, you ain't at Essence Fest, but
you were at the festival with us. That happened one

(22:34):
hundred times, so it all worked out. There was a
lot of love. And people didn't say damn that Essence.
They said we understand, we understand your position. So there's
all of that and I just I don't know, I
don't know. There's nothing else to say. We still continue on.

Speaker 1 (22:49):
It doesn't end, you know.

Speaker 2 (22:51):
We just got to understand that our collective power is
so strong, like when we utilize that collective problem when
we staying up for one thing and we watch different cultures,
different ethnicities, different groups of people make the sacrifices, and
it's nothing wrong with making it sad because everybody benefits
from it. And I just wish we understood that when

(23:12):
we all make one sacrifice, it's going to double and quadruple,
it's gonna come back way more. So we just have
to show Look, this is what we stand on and
we're not moving from this. And once we show that,
the only people gonna come back whatever you need, and
that's what we got to understand. So I just hope
that people understand the significance of this boycott and the

(23:33):
historical reference of it, and understanding throughout history it is
one of the biggest tools that we have utilized. We've
never been able to gain anything with violence or negative
but us and our collective power unifying against or for
something has always got us who we want.

Speaker 3 (23:50):
So that brings me to my thought of today, which
the target boycott could have been my thought of the day.
But I have much to say today. The Texas was
this is really really, really, really really tough. Really, I mean,
I don't know if I really slept fully last night
because it's just like it put me back in the

(24:12):
mind of the Sandy Hook shooting when all those kids
were killed, right like it turned my stomach flips over
front and back. I'm just thinking about here, my granddaughter, right,
she's a little girl. She's gonna be three years old
one day. She'll probably go to a camp. I have

(24:32):
so many friends whose kids are away at different camps
across the country right now. To think that you take
your child to a camp one or two or three
or four days before and then four five days later
on however many days because it was this is new.
These kids just got out of school and this camp
and these they just got dropped off in the recent days,

(24:53):
and now a flood comes and takes them out. And
I know that it's different with Sandy Hook, because this
is a human that went in there and shot them.
But I'm just saying, the mass death of young babies
at one time, it is so traumatizing. I cannot imagine.
I mean Sandy Hook and even Uvaldi, like the shooting

(25:15):
that happened there, and then of course in our community,
right like the mass death of people, but particularly young kids, babies,
it's hard, it's hard to sit with. It's just you
don't even know what to say. And when it's a
natural disaster, it's even worse because you don't even know

(25:37):
who to blame, Like, you can't. It's nobody to even
like point at to say you did it, or you
did it, or this one or that one in the third.
It's so hard. And so I've been watching these videos
for the last day or so. Especially it's been a
couple from black women who are saying that it is

(25:58):
bothering them that people are inserting political discourse into this situation.
So they're like, how can you, in a moment when
this horrific situation has happened, can't imagine what these families
are going through. You can't imagine the worst time they
want to die? I'm sure right. Even it's called Camp Mystic,

(26:22):
where the kids were that the flood came through and
took swept these babies.

Speaker 1 (26:27):
The man who started the camp.

Speaker 3 (26:29):
Right he died too, seventy years old, went behind those
kids trying to save them, and he died.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
It is horrific. It is horrific.

Speaker 3 (26:41):
Even the camp two those supervisors that's in the picture,
they're young girls, you know.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
Just it's terrible.

Speaker 3 (26:49):
And so the political discourse, you know, people are like,
keep that out of the conversation for now, and let
us not lose our humanity in this moment. And so
they're like, I can't believe that folks want to talk
about politics. So let me just say this, Okay, for
the record, everything is political. Everything is political. Who you

(27:13):
sleep with, where you sleep, how comfortable you're living or not,
what you can eat, what you can't eat, whether or
not the air is clean, in the environment or not,
whether it's safe or not, all those things.

Speaker 1 (27:29):
Everything, whether or not.

Speaker 3 (27:31):
You are exposed to health issues, and also whether issues right,
whether or not a flood comes through and it's taken
care of properly, whether your communities are ravished or fire,
whether the building codes are being properly checked, whether landlords
are doing the right thing. Every single thing we do

(27:53):
every day is political, period. And so while I understand that,
and that no one should be going to a family
and putting a microphone in their face right now and
asking them about the flood warning system, that Donald Trump
and Doge again, going back to the target conversation that

(28:14):
we just had. Donald Trump. They can have a pissy
fight all they want, a Trump and Elon Musk, but
they were together. They were aligned on cutting programs, cutting divisions,
saying every damn thing was waste, and they got rid
of thousands of workers who were in the national weather

(28:37):
whatever program y'all know the right name for it, right,
They were in that. So they did a buyout for
I think twelve hundred people and they laid off eight hundred.

Speaker 1 (28:50):
And something people.

Speaker 3 (28:51):
So again that's thousands of people who don't work there anymore.
That is going to impact service. If you walk in
a restaurant right now, and it used to be that
there was fifty weight staff waiting on everybody, they're going
to tell you that they get a different level of service.
When you fire thirty of those people and only twenty

(29:12):
people work there, it's a different level of service. So
no matter what you say, there's going to be issues.
And the only thing I want to say to the
black women who've made the videos, I agree with you
and I understand nobody should be questioning families about this,
but we do have to have the conversation because we
have not seen the worst of what is going to happen.
If you think that which we know is terrible, that

(29:36):
there was no sirens and no alerts that this situation
took place. If you think that, imagine what's going to happen,
and there are sirens that tells you that cutting billions
of dollars from health care and food benefits and all
the things that they are doing that they just did
in this big nasty, ass ugly ass billionaire bill reports

(30:00):
only billionaires.

Speaker 1 (30:01):
There's an alarm.

Speaker 3 (30:02):
We've been sounding it right, but still in all, we're
going to see more crazy things happen. When more children
are dying, more families are in jeopardy. You haven't seen
the end of it yet. So yeah, we do have
to insert a political discourse in the moment because it
seems that people only pay attention.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
When shit is real, real, real, real, real, real bad.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
And the fact that of camp and schools and families
didn't know, oh my god, something is happening, that's a problem.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
But guess what. Guess what.

Speaker 3 (30:39):
Did Donald Trump and then blame themselves for this? Because
I saw DL Hughgley talking about it. He said, it
just doesn't seem like they blame in themselves the way
that they did. Gavin Newsom, the governor of California, and
what's it in Karen Bass, mayor Karen Bass. Oh, Trump
showed up there and greasy, So what you're gonna do

(31:02):
about these other folks. I ain't even gonna get into
the voting records because I've already looked it up, and
I can tell you that there's a lot of people
in that area that didn't vote for Kamala Harris. So
you know, there may be some level of love and
allegiance and more support that those people receive. I hope

(31:23):
they get everything that they deserve, but we deserve it too,
no matter who. Once you become in the government, you're
supposed to govern for all people equally. But we'll see
what happened. So I'm just saying the political the personal
is political.

Speaker 2 (31:38):
It's always political. When you look at a government and
you look at people who live and governed by government,
these they're supposed to be protected from these things, right,
That's why you pay taxes. This is why we elect
government officials so that when natural disasters like this happen,
they have weather channel like you exactly, we have all
these things people should be evacuate. You're supposed to be

(31:58):
protected by your government. So when people act like it's
not political, and I understand you don't want to make
it political, but someone has to be held responsible.

Speaker 4 (32:06):
Right.

Speaker 2 (32:07):
We have to have checks and balances, and we live
in cities, and we live in communities. The reason why
we have elected officials and we have people that run
those communities so that there is safety there. So when
you take away that part, somebody has to be responsible
for why our communities aren't safe, why those babies lost
their life. No, the parents and the family members should

(32:27):
not have to deal with the politics, but there are
those of us who have to call out the fact
that somebody failed, the fact that this government erased jobs,
that took away people who could have saved lives. That
has to be something that we talk about because that
means that we're dealing with people who are incompetent. There's
levels of incompetence inside of our government and we have

(32:49):
to acknowledge that. So of course, no family members and
people want to hear that when they just lost their
lives and they but there has to be those of
us with in this community and within this nation who
call out those things to make sure that we don't
have incompetent leaders to make sure people like Trump are
constantly erasing, you know, the safety in our communities while

(33:12):
they're making billionaires richer, and you you focusing on getting
rid of immigrants and all these things, but you making
our communities less safe. It doesn't make sense. You know,
we're talking about government spending and wasting. All these are
the things.

Speaker 3 (33:26):
There's no way, yeah, that's not waste. The weather and
and and anyway, I don't anyway, I don't even know.
Like again, just to simplify, if you had all those people,
that's just you go to a place like I don't know,
Row play Land or let's say Great Adventures.

Speaker 1 (33:48):
Most people know Great Adventures.

Speaker 3 (33:50):
And you have hundreds of employees, right, even an employee
who's work in the bathroom can look up and say,
that person put that bag down right there, and I
don't know what's in it. Let me call somebody over
here to look and see is their bomb, drugs or
something that ain't supposed to be here? Right Because they're

(34:12):
in the staff meetings, they're in the environment. They know
they're being told watch this, watch that, know this or that.
So maybe the person in the weather department whatever their job,
might be something over here. But those are often the
people who are like, hey, have you guys seen that
there's something else bubbling up here? Maybe we should check

(34:34):
into it. Right, and then they check into it, and
like they said, now, I saw that the officials in
this local community, they said that there's no way that
they knew it would be anything of this magnitude, which
I can see that you think it's a small storm
and it turns out to be a real big storm.

(34:55):
And they said, well, and there's no alerts that could
have gone off or alarmed that would.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
Have fixed this.

Speaker 3 (35:01):
But no alarm at all is a problem because an
alarm that goes off me a school or a camp
or something like that. Those kids may have been saved.
So somebody needs to be held accountable. And it's interesting.
We'll see how it all plays out.

Speaker 2 (35:20):
We sure will. So now today I have the pleasure
of bringing up a TMI, you know. And so I
actually talked about this months ago when it was first happening.
Nelly had made some comments about the presidency, about Kamala Harris,
about Trump, and he got a lot of pushback, and
you know, I have my own theories on his comments.

(35:43):
Nellie's you know, he's cool with me. I think he's
a dope artist. You know, we got a good rapport.
But you know, like anybody else, when you are a
public person and you make a public statement, then you
you have public pushback, you know, and we were in
a very important election like this is a very and
we see exactly what's happening so here lately, you know,

(36:05):
A Shanty and Nelly have their own TV show. I
forgot what the name of the TV show is. What
I've seen clips from the TV show and you know,
and I'm watching and then I see this statement that
he puts out about, you know, his pushback, the pushback
that him and Snoop received because they performed at an

(36:25):
event that was during Trump's He was a crypto event,
and you know, him and Snoop have received some pushback,
you know, rightfully. So you know, Snoop has been very
vocal about people that he when they when they were
supporting Trump and he didn't like it. He was very
vocal about it. So you know, I guess he expected

(36:46):
a little pushback, and you know, he said what he said,
and cool, but Nelly deubles down right. First, he made
this statement before after he was getting the pushback, and
he stated, how how you know, he just respects the
office and he would have done this performance if any
president would have asked him to do it. That he

(37:08):
grew up and you know, he was on an army, baby,
and he respects just the government. He respects to all
the office, the office of the Presidency, all these things.
There was nothing against Kamala Harris and this and that. Now,
when he puts out this statement, which I already knew
because I've listened to him, shout out to Willie D.

(37:28):
He had an interview with Willie D. And he made
all of these things. He went with the rhetoric, you know,
with the same Republican talking points. Man, oh, that you
know she locked up all these black people, and that
he you know, she's married to a white man, and
if she's a black woman and he's married to a
black woman, he has a black family, and he's done

(37:49):
way more than she's done for community. All of these
you know, talking points. And for me, I'm saying to myself,
what is it, right? Is it that you disrespect the
office or you have an issue with this woman? Right?
Because I understood when you said you respect the office,
I didn't agree. I didn't think that was what it
was from the beginning because I kept hearing you try

(38:10):
to point out the same little Republican talking points that
they kept.

Speaker 3 (38:13):
On Republicans some black people, well, I mean, but definitely
strategy strategy.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
And for me, it's just like we all have our
own personal views of things, right, I just think, for me,
what what do we get as black people pulling down
another black person so that the white people could continue
to win. The thing that confuses me is that we

(38:44):
hold our people accountable for things that we don't hold
everybody else accountable for. Right. My thing is this, if
a black person is doing anything trying to to elevate
and move forward, I want to see you in right,
I'm not going against you for the white person. Because
the white person ain't going against these people for us.

Speaker 5 (39:06):
We call her out.

Speaker 2 (39:07):
Oh she got a white husband, Well, Trump got a
white wife.

Speaker 5 (39:11):
Right, he got whoever he wanted, like, he married who he.

Speaker 2 (39:14):
Wanted to marry. But that don't take away that this
is a black woman that was trying to elevate, that
was smarter than the person that she was running against,
that was more accomplished than the person she was running against.
And the fact that we use these same tropes and
these same talking points to attack our people every time,
it's just I don't know.

Speaker 1 (39:34):
And it's also not true.

Speaker 3 (39:36):
So that's the other thing is that it is not
true that Kamala Harris, and that has been debunked completely,
that she locked up all of these black men.

Speaker 1 (39:46):
That is not true. It didn't happen.

Speaker 3 (39:48):
But it also is very it's very telling that he
said those things, because sometimes if you just let people talk,
they'll tell, they'll tell on them else. So in listening
to him, at first, he's just officer of the presidency.
I respect officer of the presidency. I respect officer the presidency.
And then all of a sudden he drops in all

(40:10):
of these things again, narratives, the Fox News talking points
that became the even even our own people were using them.
And it's like, okay, so I know, you know, you see,
and I don't care what Nelly says. He could tell
the world that it's the office of the presidency. It
is very clear he aligned himself with a white supremacist,

(40:33):
and that is Donald Trump. That's who he is, white supremacist,
and you aligned yourself with them. And it was not
just him loved Snoop to death, but he also aligned
himself with a white supremacist who literally just signed a
bill that cuts the benefits we can have all the
programs we want. Our organization Until Freedom runs programs every

(40:56):
day here they are in the third place, we work
with young people.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
Snooped that.

Speaker 3 (41:00):
I know Annelly does it because I look to see
they do all of that. You cannot serve billions of
dollars worth of healthcare and food benefits for people who
are vulnerable in our society.

Speaker 1 (41:13):
So no matter what what these folks are trying to do.
And by the way, they already told you that's what
they was gonna do. So I don't say, oh, I
didn't know they was gonna do that.

Speaker 3 (41:20):
That just came up now, No, no, no, They wrote
it in a nine hundred page document called Project twenty
twenty five when they said they were going to make
America great again. They were going to restore this country
to its original founding. Do you understand what that means?
And if your black ass thinks that they mean you

(41:41):
when they're talking about restoring the nation, you are out
of your mind. It tells me that you're not as
intelligent as I may have thought you were.

Speaker 2 (41:50):
It's actually sad. I hate to watch black people go
down this thing. And when we look at where we
are right now, like does it make sense? Are you
able to look at me and say that what Trump
is doing for America is making it great again? Are
you able to look and say aligning with Trump made sense?
Are you able to think say to yourself right now
that what Trump has done since he's been in office,

(42:13):
it's okay with me? And it's no way, it's it's no.
If you can, then I don't even know what to
say to you. I don't even know how to address you.
I don't know anything. Any black person who is looking
at Trump's presidency and saying that this is beneficial to
us is just it's shocking and it's appalling and it's scary,
you know, so hopefully you know, you know, I don't,

(42:34):
like I said, we all have different point of views.
I don't agree with anything that he has to say
when it comes to Trump and Kamala, and he should
just probably stop talking about it because it gets embarrassing
more and more. You know, Like you said, you have
a black wife and you have a black family. Focused
on that black family, bro, because you're in If you
focus on that black family and you focus on a

(42:55):
black wife and you look and you realize that this
is the mother of your children, and your child is
growing up in Trump's America, and you aligning yourself with that,
and you watching what they doing wrong to us, and
you okay with that. I think you got to have
a little different conversation with yourself. Man, So God bless you, man,

(43:16):
So our guest.

Speaker 3 (43:17):
Today, we're doing a flashback to the pull Up for
Peace conference. You all have watched the first episode of
our pull Up for Peace experience. It was a collaboration.
You should have watched and you should be listening to
the full episode. We did a collaboration with I Love
Me More, which is a podcast. The co hosts are

(43:39):
tar Wallace, our dear sister, and also doctor Jamilli T. Davis,
who was one of the incredible and lead organizers of
the Pull Up for Peace conference in Atlantic City, New Jersey.
Just it's been over all week, but it feels like,
I mean, I don't even know the days is just
running down crazy. That was It's just the twenty something

(44:01):
of June and now we're already headed into the middle
of July. But at this conference pull Up for Peace,
there were over six hundred grassroots organizers who do gun
violence prevention work every day. They are looking at gun
violence as a public health crisis, and so different people

(44:23):
do different things.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
Not everyone is out.

Speaker 3 (44:25):
There just you know, trying to find guns or de
escalating conflicts. Some people are doing the mental health services.
Some people have food services. Some people are finding these
young people housing. Some people are elected officials who are
trying to look at different ways to address violence. And
this conference, Pull Up for Peace brought together all of

(44:47):
those entities to work together to meet one another, people
from all over the country. So this whole oh why
don't people work on the violence in the community. There
were over six hundred of those practiceitioners together just a
few weeks ago in Atlantic City. And the network can grow.
But guess what Donald Trump said. He's cutting the violence

(45:10):
prevention moneies that would help to keep people like these
folks paid and have benefits and you know, the support
and resources that they need for their families. And so,
you know, while again going back to what we were
just saying, everybody can say or we do services for youth,
and we do, you are not helping the anti violence

(45:32):
or the violence prevention community to the tune of hundreds
of millions of dollars. That's not a thing, right, This
is our tax dollars are going into a pot. And
we at one point fought and worked shout out to
Erika Ford and Pastor Michael McBride and Amber Goodwin and
a bunch of other folks who really fought and worked

(45:55):
hard to get the federal government under Joe Biden, President
Joe Biden and Vice and Vice President Kamala Harris to
a lot hundreds of millions of dollars to the Violence
for the Safety at Community Safeties at so that there
would be money for grassroots groups. And then Donald Trump
came in and said, we don't it doesn't align. They

(46:17):
didn't even say it was waste. They said it does
not align with the agenda of the Trump administration.

Speaker 1 (46:25):
So there goes that.

Speaker 3 (46:26):
And by the way and everything and by the Office
of Violence Prevention, I'm not sure exactly what it was called.
But not only did they get rid of the Violence
Prevention money, they also got rid of addiction prevention resources
and Criminal Justice Reformed moneies to study and build organizations that.

Speaker 1 (46:47):
Deal with criminal justice reform.

Speaker 3 (46:49):
So they're directly targeting our communities and our people directly, Okay,
And they wrote about it nine hundred page article, but anyway,
let me get back centered. So to Pull Up for
Peace conference, it deals with how do you sustain our
even through these difficult times, Like how do you still

(47:10):
keep the groups that are out there doing the incredible
work that they're doing, because so many of us enjoy
the violence prevention work that goes on in our communities
and we don't even know. We don't even know we're
not ducking from bullets and you know, getting shot accidentally
in a park or walking to the grocery store. We
don't even know that we're being saved from these horrific

(47:32):
and tragic incidents by folks who are working three four
five of them in a little organization that's out there
finding out where the beef is and trying to help
work on the issues between two groups of people or
two people. They don't even know, they have no idea
how it works. And so, you know, Pull Up for
Peace gave us an opportunity to come together with so

(47:54):
many incredible people. So our interview today is of two
of the other organizes. So you had doctor Jimilis Davis
and brother attorney Angelo Pinto, who were two of the
lead organizers, And in addition, it was Lakeisha Yuri who
is the Deputy Mayor, the Deputy Mayor of Violence Prevention

(48:16):
and Intervention the Office of Violence Prevention and Intervention in Newark,
New Jersey, as well as our brother at Mitchell at
Mitchell Man at Mitchell Man, who is the violence Prevention
Czar in New York City working in the Mayor's Office
volunteer position, and he also is the CEO of man Up,

(48:40):
which is an organization that has multiple locations around Brooklyn,
the Borough of Brooklyn addressing you know, violence and really
have we have data to prove that the work that
Man Up and other groups are doing is like really working.
So anyway, these two and Jewels, our brethren and sister

(49:02):
and they're going to be talking with us about their
lives and why they actually do this work.

Speaker 1 (49:06):
It's a really good interview.

Speaker 2 (49:08):
Yeah, really things and you need to tune in right now.

Speaker 3 (49:13):
We are live from the Pull Up for Peace conference.
This has been incredible. For the last three days, organizers
from across the country have converged in Atlantic City, New
Jersey to talk about peace, but to look at the

(49:36):
public health crisis of violence and figure out how we
are interrupters and understanding that we have the solutions that
we need to heal the wounds of our communities. And
two people who have been a part of the day
to day organizing, which has been quite the engagement, if

(49:58):
you will, It has been quite the task. For the
first time, this is the first annual Pull Up for
Peace conference, and so you know, anytime we do something
for the first time, it is particularly interesting. We're gonna
speak positive words. It is particularly interesting, but it's also

(50:21):
a beautiful thing to watch something that was a thought,
it was imagine, dreamed about, doctor Jamilli T. Davis, Angelo Pento,
attorney Angelo Pino, and a group of people coming together
to say we should do this. Oftentimes we say we
should do something, but we don't always get it to fruition.
And to see hundreds of people at this conference is

(50:45):
truly incredible. And two people who are responsible for helping
them make this happen. As my sister, I have to
say with my sister, you know, she's the deputy mayor.
She's much more than my sister, but she's my sister.
Deputy mayor of Newark, New Jersey, z Keisha Uri.

Speaker 4 (51:02):
She is the.

Speaker 3 (51:02):
Deputy mayor of Public Safety, which is an incredibly important department.

Speaker 1 (51:08):
Within the City of Newark's government.

Speaker 3 (51:11):
And at this point I would say that Keisha Yuri
is becoming quickly a national voice for what government should
be doing to protect people in communities, in particularly our youth.

Speaker 1 (51:26):
And so thank you Keisha for being here.

Speaker 3 (51:28):
And then we have our brother, brother At Mitchell Man
ac Andre T. Mitchell Man, who has been our brother
for a long, long, long, long time. I have to
claim you first. You know these people, you know me? Now,
you know all these other people. You know you' all here,
big shot. But anyway, and At has a lot of

(51:50):
positions and organization in Brooklyn.

Speaker 1 (51:53):
Man up now has how many offices?

Speaker 3 (51:57):
We have twelve locations, twell, twelve locations including a community center.
And I remember when AT first started, I don't even
think you had an office space. It was just you
know again, hustling out the car, hustling out the house,
hustling wherever you could. And now you have twelve locations

(52:17):
in the city of Brooklyn, New York that focuses on
violence interruption. Also the Czar, the Anti Violent Czar of
New York, which is a volunteer yet important position in
the City of New York, where he is an advisor
to Mayor Eric Adams on how to deal with violence

(52:39):
interruption in our city. And also, I would say AT
has also become a national voice for training our people
on how to do the practitioner work, because we have
to use that language so people will know that this
is not just some thing. This is actually coordinated, very

(53:03):
strategic and professional operation across the country.

Speaker 1 (53:07):
You can't just go out into the streets.

Speaker 3 (53:09):
You can try, but if you actually want to be effective,
you need to learn how to be a practitioner. And
so we have again Deputy Mayor of which one day
is going to be Mayor Kisha Yuri.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
And also.

Speaker 3 (53:23):
And also our brother at mitche Man. Thank y'all for
joining us on the TMI show. Thank you for having us,
Thank you for having us.

Speaker 6 (53:31):
We are incredibly grateful to co sponsor as well until
Freedom on this pull up Foot Peace conference.

Speaker 1 (53:38):
It has been tremendous. We have, like you said, it
came from a vision and to have.

Speaker 6 (53:44):
It manifest and to have people from everywhere, naturally our
frontline people. All of the feedback has been great. People
are blown away. There was a brother this morning that
gotten in the war at the ball last night and
he was in tears this morning because he said he's
never gotten anything and he's just getting his life together

(54:05):
and to receive an award like he was in tears
this morning, and so that's the reactions that we want,
that's the appreciation.

Speaker 1 (54:11):
How did that make you feel?

Speaker 6 (54:13):
It was humbling because he has taken everything that we've
given him, every instruction, and he's put it into practice
and he's now seeing he started a school for financial
literacy for young people. But it was just his thought
and so we've helped him. He went to the community
practitioner class. He's a part of one hood like all

(54:33):
of those things, formally incarcerated, and so when.

Speaker 1 (54:36):
They called his name last night, he was just so proud.

Speaker 6 (54:39):
But he didn't know he was being honor knowing that
the honor reason knew we didn't tell them.

Speaker 3 (54:44):
People act like awards don't matter. I'm doing this for no.
We should be honored, we should be acknowledged. And I
think that's that's just so dope. Yes, and know that
you all, because though this group of people is the
least ignored.

Speaker 6 (55:00):
Conduits right, Their voices are not heard, their work is underappreciated,
they're underpaid, all of those things and so for them
to be able to see themselves, I think it's more
impactful than we ever going to know. But to see
them tears this morning made everything both worth it. For me,
so everything, I'm sorryry so we hit that, I take

(55:22):
all of the screw.

Speaker 1 (55:23):
We all talk about all of those things, right that
comes with it. That right there, that moment for me
was worth it.

Speaker 5 (55:29):
Yeah, So we were very intentional about this confidence.

Speaker 4 (55:32):
This was a conference for them and it was for
us by us, right because a lot, like we said,
we've been conferencing all over the country, if not around
the world, and I haven't experienced one that was dedicated
for the front line, you know, And this conference, you
can see the men and women.

Speaker 5 (55:52):
Has been set.

Speaker 4 (55:53):
They put their lives on the line to make our
community safe and they are underappreciated, and so we wanted
to recognize them. We wanted them to know that they
are important during Gun Violence Awareness Month, right, which is
the month of June that we have taken over for
now over ten years, because right before the month when

(56:14):
they go back, they're going back into the heat of
the summer in the neighborhoods from which they come from,
and we are deploying them. We're putting them right back
into trauma fires and putting out fires.

Speaker 5 (56:26):
We wanted them this year to go.

Speaker 4 (56:27):
Back, rejoice, refreshed, reenergized, and as you said, you've been
hearing so many sentiments.

Speaker 5 (56:34):
I love watching them enjoy themselves.

Speaker 4 (56:37):
They don't often get a chance to dress up, you know,
and just really unwind, because we're trained to really stay
away from those type of elements which can sometimes lead
to our relapse. But when they was out these last
three days amongst their peers from all over the country,
the boardwalk here and Atlantic City, it will never be

(56:59):
the same.

Speaker 5 (57:00):
They lit up after every night they go out there
on that.

Speaker 4 (57:03):
Boardwalk and it's mad peace, love, and everybody is like camaraderie.

Speaker 5 (57:08):
They everybody's just one.

Speaker 3 (57:10):
They're not fighting, No, they're not fighting because we always fighting.

Speaker 2 (57:16):
And you know what I love about this conference, It
distills certain myths, right somehow dispelled. I'm sorry, sorry. You
know what I love about it is that it dispels
certain myths. Like when we were young, we thought like
peace was like soft it was, you know, but now

(57:36):
it's so lit here, right, this conference is lit is
you can be lit, You can have fun, you can enjoy,
You can have all of those things, and he would
do it in a peaceful manner, and you could do
it for respect. Like we always it's so much things
that we've been taught wrong in our communities, right that
we just thought it was corny, peaceful and all that stuff.
It's corny, but it's not nothing corny about being peaceful

(57:57):
and being enjoyed and doing the right thing. And we
can have the same amount of fun. And that's why
I'm glad these young kids are here to witness this,
right because they've been fled those same myths. Right, if
this coach just celebrates, if it's something negative, if we
down in each other and all of that, that's what
we want to be around. But no, we actually having
the same amount of fun in a peaceful manner for

(58:18):
something that's actually that's beautiful, man.

Speaker 4 (58:21):
And that's not making the mistakes. We're talking about some
heavy hitters from all across the country. These men and
women have the greatest influence in the streets. These men
and women are formally and concerrated possibly leaders of their groups.
And these men and women have the touch point that
other people do not have. So it's They're far from

(58:42):
being soft, right, They're chosen, as we said, to choose.
They choose peace now going forward, because it was a
time I'm hearing that all these last three days that
they were never thinking that they can be in the
same space and room with individuals from a different borough.

Speaker 5 (58:59):
Even you know how it is in New York City.

Speaker 4 (59:00):
It's like sometimes the Bronx don't mix with the Queens
and sometimes Staton Island on Rock with Brooklyn.

Speaker 5 (59:06):
But that wasn't the case.

Speaker 4 (59:08):
You know, from New York to New Jersey, from the
East coast, all the way from the West coast to
the Midwest and the South, people came together and became
one man. And I'm so honored to be amongst the
convening you know, committee and co founders of this of
this conference because you know, we are on to a
big thing. This is bigger than any of us can imagine.

(59:32):
This is actually it's gonna em morth into a movement.

Speaker 2 (59:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (59:39):
You know what I've met since I've been walking around
for I've been here two of the three days, I
can calculate about one hundred and fifty years of incarceration
from people who told me their stories about one hundred
and fifty years of incarceration. I have encountered directly from

(01:00:02):
people at this conference who said, I did fourteen, I
did nineteen, I just came home.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
From eleven years. I was in the fence, I was
in the state.

Speaker 3 (01:00:13):
And I'm saying, if I added all of them up,
that I met people who here at this conference, I've
met people who combine have done about one hundred and
fifty years in prisons. That is significant because again, this
is the group that people would say they are finished,

(01:00:36):
They are cast out of our communities. They are not
viewed as an important that they can play an important
role and be just as influential in a positive way
as someone who has.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
A PhD who's never been in trouble, never.

Speaker 3 (01:00:51):
Been arrested, never been And we're not saying we're celebrating it,
but what we are celebrating is that with all of
that time that is and it is unfortunate time that
has been robbed from our community because if they can
be a positive influence today, they could have been that
if from a young age there was a place like

(01:01:13):
this to.

Speaker 1 (01:01:13):
Invest in them.

Speaker 3 (01:01:14):
Right, So our communities have been robbed, but now they
return choosing peace right, And that's.

Speaker 6 (01:01:20):
Powerful, which is powerful because I heard that message yesterday
on a panel life after Life, And on the panel
we had actharpre who just came home from thirty six
years wow, but he had a double life sentence, and
other people that was on a panel who had life
sentences who were able to you know, get clemencies or
commute their sentences. But they said, if I had a

(01:01:41):
place like this, if I had people, and I was
able to convene and see people like me, then I
wouldn't have had to be who I was.

Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
Then I wouldn't have had to do all of that time.

Speaker 6 (01:01:50):
And so again, like those messages shows us that this
is necessary for the next generation and how we passed
that down.

Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
And I just wanted to ask you y'all a couple
of things because y'all doing such amazing work in your
respective positions. But I know that you guys have a
book that you wrote together and talk about that book.

Speaker 1 (01:02:11):
How did you me?

Speaker 5 (01:02:14):
Oh, me and sister keishould know each other now for
decades like in the streets. You know, in the streets,
you know our background, our backgrounds.

Speaker 4 (01:02:21):
We you know, we come from activism, right, and so
we organize this by trained trade by some of the
greats from our cities and across the nation. So it's
not many of us, you guys know, we are a
small community. So that's how we met. And I always
respected my sister and her fire and and just a
commitment to her city and throughout the country.

Speaker 5 (01:02:44):
And so when we came together, of course through our their.

Speaker 4 (01:02:47):
Sister, doctor Davis, who is like that kind of sister
who always knows how to put the right people in
the same and and you know, all of our careers,
we've been doing the work and we han't yet turn
to do things for self, one of which we never
wrote a book, a piece like this. This is my
first book, and I'm so honored to have the opportunity

(01:03:09):
to have to be co authored by this raised system
next to me. Because we wanted, again, we do this
for our people, and we were intentional. We understood that
we didn't want others to repeat some of the mistakes
that we've made, you.

Speaker 5 (01:03:23):
Know, like self care.

Speaker 4 (01:03:25):
You know, we get so dedicated to the movement that
we don't take time out for ourselves. And so we
decided to us put something together that we can give
the masses of people in our Industry was the name
of the book, but.

Speaker 1 (01:03:38):
It actually happened at a conference.

Speaker 6 (01:03:40):
We was at a conference together and they were talking,
they had panelists and they were talking about people being wounded,
and so he and I had been talking about we
need to do something for people, you know, on the
frontline that's wounded healers. And so I text him, I say, At,
this is the confirmation, like we got to do it, yes,
and so he was like, let's do it. So Jamilla,

(01:04:00):
you know, pull it, pulled it all together. But it's
called Ten Steps to Healing the Wounded Healer. And so
we always talk about self care and burnout, but we
don't know how to do it, and so we wanted
to do a how to book.

Speaker 1 (01:04:12):
How do you do that?

Speaker 6 (01:04:14):
And so what happens is At is talking about his
story for being wrongfully convicted, and so I said, At,
let me use my lcs W as a therapist, right
because I don't get to use it. We just know
frontline work. But I'm a therapist and I have that skill.
And so I begin to talk to him about unpacking
some of his stuff, unpacking some of his wounds, unpacking.

Speaker 3 (01:04:38):
Some of the stuff that so you guys practiced it
together so that you could get the book.

Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
The book. The book is the reading this book. I
don't know why I don't have it. Is the practice.

Speaker 5 (01:04:50):
The book is a work book took.

Speaker 1 (01:04:53):
The book is the practice. Wow, that's powerful. So you're
the subject a big I went there professionally.

Speaker 4 (01:05:01):
I went there and again, for people like us who've
had backgrounds like me, it's difficult to as black men,
for us to feel comfortable, you know, being transparent about
things that we experienced, even that during our youth where
a lot of things are that's what we were exposed to.
And so, like she said, talking with sister Keisha, for

(01:05:23):
me is natural and she's using her skillst on me
without me realizing. So she's a credible clinician, and so
it helped me feel more comfortable. We're unpacking a lot
of this stuff that I still today, you know, still
you know, deal with like PTSD right post street, you know,

(01:05:46):
trauma and all that other stuff as we call it.
But you know, I actually, you know, I was able
to feel most comfortable and she was able to come
behind it and realize that you know what the wrong
that was done to me. It wasn't mind right, and
I needed to stop being like blaming myself for somebody

(01:06:06):
for the systems, you know, failure in my case, of
giving me the justice that I thought that I was
going to receive.

Speaker 1 (01:06:14):
And even telling him and helping him.

Speaker 6 (01:06:16):
He runs a huge organization with man up and you
have one hundred employees easily, but every day you are
showing up with all of this stuff that you're holding
on too, and you're trying to pass the baton and
you're trying to help them, but you haven't done the
work on you. And so some of those days we
talk about bleeding on people that didn't cut you right,
And so we talk about acknowledging the wound and being

(01:06:38):
able to name it and claim it and late.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
And talk about it.

Speaker 6 (01:06:42):
So as we're talking to these young people and we're
trying to help them through, be able to do it
in a free way that we're not still holding onto
our own stuff and so passing the baton without harm
attached to it, that's amazing.

Speaker 1 (01:06:55):
Yeah, I was going to ask or you were going
to ask.

Speaker 2 (01:06:57):
Question I was going to ask at because just talking
about this trauma. You know, I know you've been incarcerated
and I've been incarcerated too, So I understand that trauma.
I just want you to give us a little insight
because Samika has this shirt on. Yes, that's free AT
and this is the new campaign that you started. So
I want you to give us, you know, let us

(01:07:19):
know about this camp.

Speaker 4 (01:07:19):
So this campaign, again, a lot of people over the
many years that I've been doing the work had no
real understanding of who AT was right because I did
not disclose. They say, you know, real bad boys moving silence.
And so I understand the stigma that we all have
once we were released back into society from doing time.

(01:07:43):
And so my fear was and I experienced, you know,
being turned down on jobs and not in housing.

Speaker 5 (01:07:49):
I assumed all of the worst, and so I just
wanted to just do the work.

Speaker 4 (01:07:53):
I wanted to get back to my community, and I
wanted to prove my innocence through my work.

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
And so I just.

Speaker 4 (01:08:00):
Recently, you know, just you know, decided that after all
these years of dedicating myself volunteering all these years, that
I'd like back.

Speaker 5 (01:08:08):
To the book, like I have to turn the needle
on myself now.

Speaker 4 (01:08:12):
And so I had to tell my story about how
I was seventeen years old when I was approached by
homicide you know, detectives, and I was questioned on the
homicide that I had nothing to do with, nor did
I commit, And because I did not, you know, kind
of like they tried to do what they did in
Central Park five. You know, it p hurts me into
admitting to a crime. I chose, you know, I believed

(01:08:34):
in the system that again didn't believe in me. And
I went to jail at eighteen and eventually went to trial,
and I really put my faith in the so called
system and it failed me. I got found guilty of
a homicide of actually a manslaughter.

Speaker 5 (01:08:51):
And sentenced to fifteen years.

Speaker 4 (01:08:53):
And from that day forward, from going from there into
maximum security prison and happened to be fos to all
that trauma. I work my way out of prison from
just realizing that, you know, you got to do time
and don't let the time do you. And I got
active inside and eventually I was released and I just

(01:09:14):
continue to do the work.

Speaker 5 (01:09:15):
Brother.

Speaker 4 (01:09:15):
But now you know, the campaign is for my exoneration.
The campaign is for a full parton I want exoneration.
I am wrong, for I'm actually that the District Attorney
office reopened and investigating my crime, my charge. Excuse me,
and you know, really give me the justice that I
think I deserve AT. And you know, it's not even

(01:09:39):
about just At I find it. You know, I represent
thousands of you know, pens of thousands of others. I'm
sure that's in the same predicative here.

Speaker 3 (01:09:47):
Well exactly because you know, obviously my song was also
wrongfully convicted. And I remember when he was wearing this
T shirt that I didn't have, and so just now
so I don't understand how that happened, but I told
you I knew the first.

Speaker 1 (01:10:06):
Priority. And so my song was wearing a T shirt
and I was like, what is.

Speaker 3 (01:10:11):
That and he said, oh, you know, it's AT's campaign
for exoneration. And he said, and I'm so excited because
wearing this shirt feels like once he gets free, I
will get free. And I think that is a beautiful thing.
To your point, it says free AT, but it means
more than one. It's really for a community of people.

(01:10:32):
And I would venture to say even people who committed
the crime right and have done the time, but are unable.
And you have to give you so much respect to
our brother Jay Jordan, who talks about and he's at
reform now. But Jay Jordan talks about the consequences of incarceration,

(01:10:55):
the collateral consequences of incarceration, which means that even when you.

Speaker 1 (01:11:01):
Did the time for the thing that you did or
didn't do, it's still not free.

Speaker 3 (01:11:05):
You still can't have a barbershop, you still can't be
a dog walker, you still can't be on the pca
F too children's school. You've been released from prison for
twenty years. You could be a city council person at
that point, and you still well, you can run for office,
and you can run for aufice, not run because of
a federal conviction.

Speaker 5 (01:11:24):
No, mine's state. So there are these exceptions that they
have to the rule.

Speaker 4 (01:11:29):
Wow, that is no different than the thirteenth Amendment that
says that all will be free except for those that
are committed a fly. In my case, I was released,
but I cannot. I have all my rights except for
my right to own a possess a weapon, all my
right to run for public office.

Speaker 1 (01:11:48):
Right, Wow? Which is so other people?

Speaker 3 (01:11:51):
Because I know people who have run for office, have
run for office and have convictions.

Speaker 1 (01:11:56):
Huh, he said, who the president exactly?

Speaker 3 (01:12:00):
Back the President of the United States, but you know,
you know, but there are people so anyway, the point
is they still can't do these other things, like they
can't be on their children's PTA committee.

Speaker 1 (01:12:12):
I cannot believe that.

Speaker 3 (01:12:13):
You know, you have so many and he talks about
there being thousands of things that a person who has
a conviction, particularly a federal conviction, cannot do after incarceration.
So for me, free at it encompasses all of that.
You know, and you live your life. At is a
person who is not just about you. That is something

(01:12:36):
that is, you know, a great attribute to who you
are as a person that you are always about everybody else.
And I know when you put this campaign together, you
know that being free is going to clear the way
for others. So I want to wrap this up because
I know Akisha never really wanted to stop and do
anything anyway. She is so busy running around trying to

(01:13:00):
get this conference and keep it going and make sure
it ends as strong as it started. But I want
to talk about you had said every hit we take,
you know, the criticism, the judgment, because we as a
people know how to judge one another more than anybody
else in the world. Pastor Freddie Haynes who's our brother

(01:13:23):
and friend said to me one day and it arrested me.
Choke hold. He said, my worst social justice wounds came
from social justice people. So the big the wounds that
I have that cut the deepest have come from people

(01:13:45):
who I'm working alongside that we're supposed to actually be
helping to heal one another, and yet we cut one
another d And I think about some of what both
of you have been through with. In fact, we've talked
about it here at this conference, like in action literally right,
it's happening in real time that people who are also

(01:14:08):
unhealed want to lash out for various reasons, right, And
I think you guys do a good job of helping
to manage that, because I don't want people to walk
away thinking, oh, this conference it was you know, from
watching this show, they would say, oh, this conference was
just so great and everything was perfect, And no, there're
still challenges, but we don't allow the challenges that we

(01:14:31):
have faced to stop us from pushing forward. And so
I just want to talk about want you guys to
talk about those wounds of being an activist, of being
an organizer, of now being an elected official, which somehow
makes you a sellout, like once you cross over us,
like you know, they say we need people in the

(01:14:52):
system and out the system. But once you go in
the system, then people are like, oh, I can't Keisha,
she don't understand where we come from. She thinks she
better than me now and this and that. How does
that impact you is there? Would you say, oh, no,
it doesn't hurt, or would you be honest like I am,
that it does hurt and it causes pain and trauma.

(01:15:12):
And what do you think we should do? Miss doctor
on your way to be in doctor your clinician?

Speaker 4 (01:15:21):
Uri?

Speaker 2 (01:15:21):
What do we do?

Speaker 1 (01:15:22):
And what is in the book? What is in the
book that teaches how to deal with those womans?

Speaker 6 (01:15:28):
So in the book, one of the things we talk
about setting boundaries right, and that's some of the things
that we don't do right as people on the front
line or people that's the givers, right, we give, give,
give so much that you know, we don't even give,
you know, for ourselves. And so for me being on
the front line, and I talked about it yesterday. We

(01:15:49):
talked about being in the streets for one hundred and
fifty five weeks in a row, rallying and protesting against
violence in the city, right with all of the demands
and no resources, right doing it with no resources, blood, sweat, teas,
the sacrifices that you make. And so as I've been
moving along, coming from the streets and then coming into

(01:16:11):
being in city government, I got in city government because
of Mayor Baraka, and because he came from activism. We
said we're going to He said, when I become mayor,
we become mayor, right, And a lot of us took
that sentiment on and was being the mayors, the little
mayors of our little towns, and we understood.

Speaker 1 (01:16:29):
For me, everything comes from community.

Speaker 6 (01:16:31):
So I understood, but also saw I saw my brother
get shot by the police. I saw my brother get
shot by somebody in the community. I had boyfriends that
was shot and killed family members. And so for me,
the passion that I have comes from that place of
wanting to do something about it. And so the criticism
can't be bigger than the mission, right, All of the

(01:16:51):
scrutiny that we take can't be bigger than the mission.
And so because I know the mission, my passion is deep,
and I say all of us do this work from
a place. I lost my mother and my father eight
months apart when I was eighteen and nineteen, and so
life becomes different when that happens. Your life is a
different place, no security, no safety. You're figuring it out
on your own. So every decision has to be the

(01:17:14):
right decision, because there's no going home wow to mommy
and daddy when you don't make the right decision right,
and so you got to work two and three jobs.

Speaker 1 (01:17:21):
You got to always figure it out.

Speaker 6 (01:17:22):
So my level commitment and dedication comes from because I
want my mother and father to be proud. So all
of the scrutiny can't be bigger than what my mother
and father feel and think in the other side. So
for me, you're not going to outwork me because I
got wings on my back from the ancestors, right, I
got wings, and I got people that showed us that,

(01:17:45):
and I need them to be proud, and so all
of that stuff, then they say, is the jealousy, the hate,
the envy.

Speaker 1 (01:17:51):
I have so many folks that don't.

Speaker 6 (01:17:53):
Believe that I deserve what I got, right, they don't
believe that I should have it. But they don't see
the word. They didn't see the sacrifice. I don't have
a husband because I sacrificed. I don't have any children
because I sacrifice. Come on, right, And so they don't
know the sleepless nights, they don't know the days that
I know how I'm going to wake up and make
it that they don't know. And so because they don't know,

(01:18:16):
I can't care. Yes, and so it's hurtful when you
sacrifice everything. And so it's a movie and it said
I do the impossible for the ungrateful?

Speaker 5 (01:18:27):
Can I just can?

Speaker 2 (01:18:29):
I just can? I just ask you?

Speaker 5 (01:18:31):
She ain't want to come in, but I would just
add to all of what my sister just said. Is
the word yet right? You know, right, I have not
that's right. I haven't been able to marry yet.

Speaker 4 (01:18:45):
Right, These things are still part of your future, right,
these things like with the criticism, to me, it's confirmation
that we're doing the right things.

Speaker 5 (01:18:56):
Think about it, right next to love's hate?

Speaker 4 (01:18:58):
Right, and so how do we know that we are
on the right path if we don't got some hate first?

Speaker 5 (01:19:03):
Right, that's nearby, right, And I'm not.

Speaker 4 (01:19:07):
Welcoming criticism because, like I said, it gives us fuel
because it reminds us that we are doing the right
things and we're rubbing some of them and their spirits.
We're rubbing them in a way where they're uncomfortable because like.

Speaker 5 (01:19:20):
We here, we are on a pull up for peace conference.

Speaker 4 (01:19:22):
You can't come to a pull up for peace conference
with anything in your body or soul unless it's peace.

Speaker 5 (01:19:30):
Because we're the dominant, you know. I mean again, this
is for us.

Speaker 4 (01:19:35):
It's our time, and now it's our time to take
advantage of things. This conference was for us, by us, right,
and we are relaunching this movement throughout the nation with
a lot of our attendees are on board alongside all
of our I have never seen this amount of heavyweights
come together in three days, the way that we have

(01:19:56):
come together.

Speaker 5 (01:19:58):
I've been, like I said, I've been pri to be
in certain rooms.

Speaker 4 (01:20:01):
I've been privileged to go to certain places, but I
haven't lost my mind.

Speaker 5 (01:20:07):
Right, this is unique.

Speaker 3 (01:20:11):
You know.

Speaker 4 (01:20:11):
We just came in from the peace walk that they
celebrate out here in Atlantic City. And we've done walks,
we've done marches together, but this walk, this walk was different.

Speaker 5 (01:20:21):
It was right.

Speaker 4 (01:20:24):
It was so many of us participating in the walk.
It was different, and it was to me, it was confirmation.
So I'm excited to be a part of this movement.
But I'm ready, like you with my wings. I'm looking
forward to the next level.

Speaker 5 (01:20:38):
Though, yes, you deserve deserve.

Speaker 2 (01:20:41):
I just want to think. I want to say that
I appreciate both of you. I love both of you.
Which you represent is strength, resilient to always tell you
you like the big brother. I never had a brother,
and I.

Speaker 5 (01:20:56):
Admire you.

Speaker 2 (01:20:58):
I aspire to be like you. Guys. I watched Keisha
work all the time, regardless of what she's kissing hands,
hugging you. She's whatever job. She's not too big to
do any jobs. And I noted that she's great, but
she doesn't. She just treats you with the level of
humility and humbleness and love that's just phenomenal, you know.

(01:21:19):
And you definitely have been ordained. Both of you have
been ordained by God to continue to do God's work.
So the naysay is, like you said, it's confirmation that
you're doing the right things. Denzel told will Smith, at
your highest point, that's when the devil comes, so you know,
we just got to know that. And then the minister
told us, if you look the devil in his eyes,
he's gonna flee so just keep looking him in his eyes.

Speaker 1 (01:21:40):
Yeah, that's y'll. Thank y'all. I appreciate you saying that.

Speaker 3 (01:21:46):
When we're doing the work and people start, they're a
little uncomfortable and being pulled to their higher selves. And
so that's the way we look at it. That's why
we keep coming back no matter what, because I try
to leave. I'm like it was a transferable I could
go work somewhere else. But the truth is my mouth
that's so big that I really can't go work anywhere
else because now they can google me and say she's

(01:22:08):
too controversial. So I'm back here with y'all. I love
y'all so much. Thank you so very much. TMI Show today, question.

Speaker 5 (01:22:19):
Honor, thank you, don't let go.

Speaker 1 (01:22:23):
You don't go because I got an idea.

Speaker 3 (01:22:25):
Okay, sorry, I think we need to do that again
because we didn't get enough out. So let me say again,
thank y'all so much for joining the tm MY Show today.

Speaker 1 (01:22:34):
Thank you. We love y'all so very much. Thank you
for having us, Thank.

Speaker 5 (01:22:37):
You for having us.

Speaker 2 (01:22:38):
It's been amazing, man, you know.

Speaker 5 (01:22:40):
Shout out to Jamilli T.

Speaker 2 (01:22:42):
David, shout out to Tara Wallace, Shout out to at
Mitchell shout out to Lakeisha Yuri. It's just been an
amazing labor of love here at the Pull Up for
Peace conference, and it's nothing else to say.

Speaker 3 (01:22:55):
I love the fact that it's in Atlantic City too,
because I never ever, ever, ever ever come down this
far in New Jersey. But it's also environment Like, you
can do a conference anywhere. You could do it in Manhattan,
they could have done it in Brooklyn, they could have
done it in a different city, but to take it
to a boardwalk where there's a beach, and it just

(01:23:16):
so happens to be like, what is it the heat
wave the most hottest days and scorching whatever, one hundred
degrees every day. So people at pool parties and they
get to experience the water and the environment. That changes
the way you think, especially if you're a person who
lives in a place like Chicago or you live in again,

(01:23:37):
in Manhattan or Brooklyn. You hardly ever get to the
fringes where the water is. That's not your experience, especially
if you're in this work. You spend so much time
walking the concrete where you don't even get the sunlight
that you deserve, and so that you need to survive
and so I'm really really, really really grateful to our

(01:23:59):
organizers for choosing a place that is a different experience
for our people.

Speaker 1 (01:24:04):
Hopefully they didn't gamble too much, so hopefully not.

Speaker 2 (01:24:07):
And you know, and another thing is, since it was
a big heat wave, right, it was actually cooler here
right because we're right by the ocean.

Speaker 5 (01:24:16):
Like it was way cooler.

Speaker 2 (01:24:17):
Like when I came from New York two days ago,
I was on fire, like there was no level of
when there was no breeze, it was just hot, hot,
And here it's been cool. It's like actually feels like something.
They don't feel like hell, Like the heat is on
hell in New York, but out here it's actually summertime.
So I just enjoyed every minute of it. Man, just

(01:24:38):
watching young people, older people, just everybody just in community,
united and just in love and giving back resources like
dropping game and giving real game and not gatekeeping or
it's no little eyes and big eues. It's just everybody
here is just one community. So I just had a ball.

Speaker 1 (01:24:56):
Amazing pull up for peace. And we thank y'all for
joining the tm MY show.

Speaker 3 (01:25:01):
We are trying to bring you all more live experiences,
you know, as we travel the country, and we are
around so many dope people. What often happens is kind
of like you know, we know it and we feel it,
but it's hard to get this type of information to
the rest of the world, and the tam My podcast

(01:25:23):
on the Black Effect Podcast Network gives us an opportunity
to do that. So hopefully you appreciate the live shows
that we've been bringing you from the State of the
People Power Tour to now Pull Up for Peace and
for the rest of the summer, it is our intention
to do the same to let you experience what we experience.

Speaker 2 (01:25:43):
And with that said, we come to the end of
another episode of TM. We appreciate you, We love to love.
Let us know what you want to hear. Let us
know who you want us to interview. Tell us you
love us, tell us what you don't like. We want
to hear all your feedback. I'm not going to always
be right. To make a dmaid is I could always
be wrong both always and I mean always be authentic

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Mysonne

Tamika Mallory

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Live from Pull up for Peace conference Part 2 Guest: Lakeesha Eure and AT Mitchell-Mann