"Prison Reform" with Wallo and Tony Lewis Jr.

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Yeah, that's what's up, good people. I'm to make a d.
Mallory and it's your boy my son in general, and
we are your host of street politicians, the place where
the streets and politics me. What's up? So you got
your little until Freedom swag because we said, hey, we

(00:24):
wear everybody up. Yeah, and then we got to support
our own. Man. This is our brand, Until Freedom is
our organization is our brand. So you know we're always
supporting everybody else and wearing everybody else's garments. We decided
we're gonna be until Freedom Today. Some of our some
people send us a lot of nice things being gladdened
me and they hook us up every week, but this

(00:44):
time it was you know important. It's the until Freedom
for me. It's the until Freedom for me too. And
it's the last um week of Black History Month, and
so celebrating your own, supporting your own people who are
watching listening. If you want to support our organization Until Freedom,

(01:04):
you can go to until freedom dot com purchase a sweatsuit,
all types of sweat We got what you need. We
definitely do. And this is just two examples of I'm
I'm wearing the deluscious red today and also good quality sweatsuits.
We pride ourselves and making sure that anything that we

(01:27):
sell we would actually wear. Hopefully you guys will support us.
So what's going on. There's a lot happening. I mean,
it's another episode every week. We've been having some incredible
individuals on talking about a lot of great things. You know,
there's been a lot of favorites for me, but I
think Hill Harper was definitely one of the you know,

(01:49):
h Hill was. It was. It was. It was a
cumbination of things. It was, you know, it was. It
was a tear jerker. Then we had a little couple
of moments where we smiled and laughed, you know, especially
since you know I knew him Lord, I knew him
from his first movie before it was even in the bio.
You all confirmed that. I want to be able to

(02:12):
say that you're you know, fibbing, but I can't. It's true.
But he was. He was a good guy and you know,
his personality is one that I would see you connecting with, yeah,
because you know it's authentic, Like that's what it is
for us. It's just like I connect with authentic. It's
so many different people that I have relationships and friendships

(02:32):
with that people don't know. You know, I wouldn't. I
have so many different kind of friends and they the
only common denominating all of them is just that they're
authentic and they comfortable being who they are. So, you know,
Hill is definitely one of those guys. Man so to
him relationships people we have relationships with. You know, one
group of people that I find myself always super duper

(02:55):
engaged with is elderly folks Like I love my elders.
I love the core Master's berries and the Hazel Dukes
and others. Um. I spend a lot of time talking
to them, and you know, I feel like, especially as
we're celebrating back Black history, there is so much, such
a wealth of knowledge out there from our elders that

(03:18):
we can gain from learning about our past so that
we understand one at the moments that what we're experiencing
right now, it's not new. The only thing that's new
is the approach that we will take to address these issues.
And a lot of times that's a remix of things
that happened in the past. Um. But you know, it
also I think informs us when you have strong relationships

(03:40):
with with elders, it informs our path forward, and it
helps you to sort of ground yourself in a foundation
so you're not feeling like you're creating. I hate to
hear people say, oh, this is the first time that
you know, we never now it's not what they say,
nothing new under the sun. And so it's black history.

(04:00):
I would say for this week, as folks, and and
black history is every month. Black History is every day.
But I would say that don't don't just relegate us
to know one month now and not the shortest month
of the year. But I would say to parents, um,
that this is a good time to take your children
around elders, even you learning from people who have been

(04:20):
a part of these struggles and have you know, and
and of course you got your grandparents and your immediate family,
but I'm talking about staples in the community, other people
that you could talk to them, get education. You gotta
have that, Like that's one of our mantras that we
stand on the shoulders of our elders. We say that
all the time, we stand on the shoulders of giants,
and we're just paying our path forward. You know. One

(04:41):
of the things you always say is that it's just
we are responsible for winning our own freedom. Well, Harry,
I mean not Harriet Um corrector Scott King King said that.
So when you say that all the time, I'm like,
that's right, and that's what and that's what we did.
We borrowed from our elders, and we just gotta be
you know, I don't understand a lot of this culture
in this generation. They have a problem with elders, right,

(05:04):
They have a problem with given credit to the elders.
They want to be like, oh, you're too old, and
and it's a privilege to be old, you know what
I'm saying, Like, it's a privilege to actually have accomplished
things and you know, grown and have wisdom, you know.
And I always looked at like you said, I always
have the utmost respect for my elders. I used to
sit at the feet of my elders and just listen,

(05:25):
Like you know, when Bellefonte talks to us, we just
sit there and just taken. When Corus Masses Barry is
talking to us, and we just sit there and listen
to what she says, you know. You know. So speaking
of Harry Belafonte, it's his birthday, birthday and celebration that's
happening shout out Mr Ben years old. I mean, and

(05:47):
it's like, like you said, it's a privilege to get
old because based upon Mr Bee's life and everything that
he has done and how he's been so much so
engaged in the movement, he could have been gone just
like Martin Luther, King, Malcolm X and so many others,
and he, you know, has has lasted and also has

(06:07):
been such an inspiration to so many younger activists who
who have come up sort of behind him. And I
always tell people with money, because you know, we are
always talking the folks who have the resources, but they'll say, well,
you know, I can't necessarily be out there on the
front lines with you, but I'm trying to figure out
what can I do. And I think you know, for one,

(06:28):
Jay Z certainly is one who is trying to follow
in Harry Belafonte's footsteps in terms of funding organizers and
organizations that are doing great work. Um And and you know,
that's the suggestion for us all if we want to
borrow uh some of the wisdom, leadership and some of

(06:49):
the skills of our elders and want to make some
commitments during Black History Months, it's a good time to
say that I am going to begin sending ten fifteen
dollars buying until freedom sweat suit. Uh, send another grassroots
organization some resources to help them to be able to

(07:10):
continue to do their work. And so you know, those
commitments are important. I don't think that Black History months
to just be about us studying things and reading back
over that's that's It's about creating good. But it's yeah,
it's about like, now, what's your commitment. We've learned, we
understand now how you're gonna jump in, Like, you know,
we have black history, we have Black present, and then

(07:34):
we got Black future, and we have if you in
black presents, you supposed to be creating for the future
and creating history. You know, I'm playing it for it
like um. One of the things I want to talk
about is the the originator of We said, you know,
going forward, Someone in your comments was asking about February thirteen,

(07:54):
which is the day before Valentine's Day, and they were
explaining that the thirteen is has been called Black Love
Day and talking about black folks who actually created um
that day and and sort of a holiday of its own.
And we said, going forward, when we talk about holidays,
we want to get text for how these holidays came exactly.

(08:18):
And Krter G Woodson, who created who started with Black
History Week? You know, he decided to create a Blast
History Week in eighteen sixteen, which carried over and eventually
led to you know, the foundation for Black History Months.
So a lot of people because people in my comments,
I don't want to that pagan holiday, there was a
white man, so to know, a white man didn't start.

(08:38):
Carter g Woodson started. But I think you were talking
about I think they were talking about the actual one.
It was actually implement they were talking. They were talking
about you know, I forgot which president was that took
the Black History Week and then extended it into the month.
But if the foundation was set by Carter G. Woodson

(08:59):
who created Black History, right, let's get let's know a
little thing before you start talking about stuff that's really
it's really important to note. I mean, there's been so
many contributions, and you know, as we were talking about
supporting activists and leaders, I was having a conversation um
this week with a loved one who said, after watching

(09:22):
the documentary that was done on My life, which is
currently on Stars, Um, it's not my life it's actually
a part of my life, a time period in my life.
It's on Stars. It's called This is Personal. Uh, folks
can check it out. And as she was watching it, um,
she said, you know, I realized you have a real,
real job, and I see what it is that you do.

(09:45):
And I thought to myself, Wow, there's so many people
who don't really understand what we do. And so it
made me think of my thought of today, because that's
what I do. I think and I come up with
my thought of the day. And that is why don't
people understand that being an activist and an organizer, it

(10:07):
is a full time job. If not like a lifestyle,
it's a real job. People think that it's just like
what you do. I know, I'm an activist literally have
to apply work all day every day, and it's a life.
Like you said, it's a full time, lifetime job. You
don't get to sleep and say, yo, you know I'm
working for nine or five. I ain't doing nothing after

(10:28):
five o'clock. You know, because somebody is killed every minute
of the day, you know, some young black man or
some young poor person from you know, um, Compromised communities
are being abused and the civil rights are being violated
every day, so we have to be on call all
the time. We have to get up and go to
somebody else's city or somebody else's state. We have to

(10:50):
go bring attention to these things at all times, so
our job never stops. And I think people take it
for granted. Even even your own family take sit for granted.
They don't see. They see, they see the moments, right,
they see the news clip, they see the video, they
see the people reposting the thing, and they say, that's
something that happened for thirty seconds one. But they don't

(11:12):
realize the work that's going in to this clip that
you've seen and realized, the planning and organizing and how
you have this and you and put in your life
on the line. A lot of people just don't really
see it that way. You know, Yes they don't, and
you know, and I and I act. She was speaking
to me. I was reflecting on how often I have
heard from people, wow, you know, what you do looks
fun or you know, and we make it fun because

(11:35):
you have to. If you're on the road for six days,
seven days. No one wants to be in a situation
where every moment of it is traumatizing, so you have
to actually build in it's living in your purpose. When
your purpose, you know, you when you live in your purpose,
you never work one day. So I think, because this

(11:55):
is what we ordained to do, this is our purpose,
we make it seem like it's fun. Right. We're able
to smile when we should be crying. You know, we're
able to see the glasses have full and continue to
persevere and move through times. Even after we don't cry
for six hours. The seventh hour, we might say, yo,
let's hug and laugh about something, and onebody, somebody tells

(12:17):
a joke. You know, we're sitting around eating together and
and just live in family and community. So we figure
out a way because it's our purpose. But it's definitely
a job, and it's a lot and and and you know,
building relationships with people who are traumatized as well, that
takes a lot of work. You know, when we are
in places like Louisville, Kentucky, it takes us awhile days

(12:41):
to re kindle and ignite the fire among the groups
that we're working with. Doesn't mean that they're not doing
their own thing all the time, but each time that
we come back, it's kind of like, Okay, where do
we start again? How do we continue to work together?
And we have to actually put time and effort into
building those relationships and making sure that there is trust

(13:04):
and that's it, and that takes work on both sides,
on you know, from from our side and from the
individuals that we're working with. We also support families. I
can't tell you the amount of families that we talked
to all day every day, supporting them financially, supporting their
fundraises and events and other things that they're doing. It
takes a lot of work to accomplish what we do

(13:26):
and knowing and understanding because I guess the next criticism
from people is like, yeah, well, how you know we're
not what are we getting done? And I say all
the time, none of us have actually been able to
get us free, Like not what you're doing, not what
what I'm doing. We're all working towards a goal and
we're fighting and standing alongside one another. And just because

(13:49):
you don't see me in a you know, in scrubs
going into a hospital, doesn't mean that I'm not working
on the sickness that is happening within our communities and
my scrubs may not look like, you know, my sister's
uniform as a nurse, but my scrubs look like and
Until Freedom sweatsuits. So that for me, um is you know,
my thought of the day. As I said, it was

(14:10):
deeply um not so much troubling. But when when she
said it to me, I realized that this is someone
who's known me my whole life, and she's saying, wow,
like you really have a real serious job. So imagine
what other people are thinking that are not really around,
and all they do is listen to people telling us,
or you know, the folks on the in the media.

(14:30):
Let God bless if you watch Fox News where they
tell you that every we're all poverty pampers and oh ye,
Swiss suits. We're not suppo to sell Swiss suits. We're
not supposed to get contributes. We're not supposed to have nothing.
We're supposed to just go outside on the front lines,
risk your life, can't take care of your family, just
be starving and hungry. I was listening to somebody say

(14:53):
last night that um, Martin Luther King died with so
much money and he was taking money from people, and
I'm just watching I've had I've had people tell me,
you know, I worked forever now for a long time,
fourteen years and and and was a part of National
Action Network since before that. And I would hear people say, oh,

(15:14):
you know, he takes money from the families, and he's
you know, and and and and that's how he, you know,
wears his suits or whatever the families and their settlement checks.
I literally was there, right, like, come up with another
criticism about all of us, and you can find one,
but that is a bow faced lie. I was there,
And if anything, he literally worked that nan during the

(15:37):
week and then on the weekends he would go out
and preach so he can make money, so that to
help us make payroll and also to be able to
give families resources because most of the time the families
that we we are dealing with, these are individuals who
are who come from really impoverished circumstances. Right, That's why
it happens to them because they live in certain hoods,

(15:58):
they're dealing with certain things. And these individuals, now that
you're working with them, they might need a suit to
be able to go to court. They may need that.
People people are in regular life, right, So you meet
a family and their loved one was killed Tuesday Saturday,
they still trying to figure out how to get the
rent because the rent was already due. And the rent

(16:20):
man doesn't say, well, now that your loved one has
been killed and you're in the middle of a big
you know, uh situation, They don't say, well, you don't
gotta pay me. You still have to come up with
that money. And sometimes you got to help to do that.
If you claim to be a leader, you're working with people,
you have to be able to find solutions. How many funerals,

(16:41):
How many funerals? How many funerals have we paid for
or help to pay for for individuals, people that folks
don't even know, people it locked up in prisons, who've died,
people children. Absolutely, So anyway, that bottom line is it's
a full time and a lifestyle. And the lifestyle so

(17:05):
the streets is talking. Streets are always talking. The streets
is talking, And what the streets are talking about today
is Russia. Limba, he died. He died, you know, and
people don't a lot of people don't care. No, I'm
just being honest. I think I think you know. There
was a tweet, Yeah, he put out a tweet right

(17:32):
the gist of it was Rus died. So for those
of you who don't know who Russia Limbaugh is, he's
a conservative pundit and you know he's radio host and racist.
Well he's not racist now because he's deceased. But and
a lot of people feel like so yeah, well you

(17:55):
know I think that um Shaun King wrote this tweet,
and this is important, right, he says, Russia Limbaugh attacked
me on air for years, did the same too many
people I care about. We never mentioned his name, but
he was obsessed with us and abused us for profit.
He was a lifelong racist, sexist, bigot. And now he's dead,

(18:18):
that's all right. And you know, when I saw that tweet,
I was really like, Okay, that's everything I want to
say summed up in one I My um experience and
and understanding of Russia Limball extends far right, even beyond
this current movement, this current momentum. I know how much

(18:40):
of his rhetoric and his political stance has been detrimental,
dangerous for communities of color. Um, of course for the
black community, but certainly, like sometimes I think Russia Limbaugh
was was a little bit too racist even for Fox
News and that's hard to That's hard because he you know,

(19:00):
had to go on satellite radio so he could really
kick it. And the previous president, who we shall not name,
I try. I'm working so hard on not saying his name.
Just gave him right before leaving office a medal of honor. Uh.
And this is a man who was divisive, as Sean said,
he attacked leaders, activists, organizes every day. Um, you know,

(19:24):
he just was was not a good person. And I think,
very similar to when John McCain died, that we have
to tell the truth about people when they die. We
can't recreate, like you know, history in order to honor
folks just because they died. And I know that in
birth and death those are two times when we try

(19:46):
to see the positive. But if someone lives their life
raising hell and and and actually causing harm to communities,
we need to tell that truth. And I think that
was the point of what Sean was saying. It's like,
let's not sit here and start talking about Oh, he
was an American radio host and you know he broke
this record and he did. You can talk about those things,

(20:08):
but make sure that it's not an isolation of saying that.
He also was a racist and a bigot, and again
that his rhetoric and his own organizing was harmful to
a lot of people, uh, individually and collectively. I mean
he literally was the sounding board for forty five and
his racism. Yeah, he's somebody that I didn't really pay

(20:31):
a lot of attention to write. But when I did
hear him, it was always something negative. You know, there
was never anything positive that you know, had to do
with us, especially as organizers in communities of color, you know,
in despair. He never said anything that was like okay.
You know, there are some people on Foxes that might
have an opinion that I kind of understand. Sometimes I

(20:53):
don't think Russia Limbo Limbo ever said anything that you know,
that I agree with. So when we look at these tweets,
is it okay? Is it okay that we say, yo,
you're dead and we don't care, you know, Is it okay?
Is that is that crash l I don't think it's
a lack of that. I don't think it's a lack

(21:16):
of class. I think that we as black people are
so loving and caring and that's something that I don't
want us to lose, right, you know, our our Big
Mama's um and Big Papas taught us that we are
always to show grace even when someone has done something harmful,

(21:38):
that it's our job to be the to take the
higher road. And so I guess it's one of those
things where they say, if you're not gonna say anything
positive or if you're not gonna put it in the
proper context, the way I feel, Sean has don't say
anything at all, because sometimes your silence is also uh
it is your silence is deafening, right, people can hear it.

(22:00):
So I think that's that's one part. But as I said,
the same thing happened with John McCain. I mean, this
is an individual who, um, you know, towards the end
of his life he obviously began to understand the importance
of his legacy and started trying to do things to
be more progressive as a Republican UM. But prior to
for many many years, like he didn't support Dr King

(22:22):
having a special holiday, he stood against all the progressive
policies that were that that people were working really hard
to get done during you know, civil rights error. At
least after that once he became a legislator, and you
can't just ignore that. And you can't say that just
because he served the country that now once he passes away,

(22:46):
we're going to glorify and just forget about all the
other things. And by the way, there are people who
are mean, evil, they do a lot of crazy things
and all of that. But there are people who are
in positions of power and have major megaphones at their disposal,
and those individuals you have to tell the truth. So
I think telling the truth and saying I don't care

(23:08):
that a man died are probably two different things. And
Big Mama probably won't like us saying I don't care.
Your emotions and how you express your feelings is none
of someone else's business, right. You don't get to tell
me that I have to wish someone well or I
have to wish someone to rest in peace. You don't
get to tell me to have to be silent about
my pain that you caused harm to me that really

(23:30):
affected me in a way. Because you can listen when
you listen to Sean King, and if you know Shaun
King and you understand the amount of you know, threat
death threats and things that he has received as a
result of the things that rush Limbau has done like
him has done. So when he expresses those sentiments, he
he has every right too because why those people were alive,

(23:53):
they were actually working to take his life from him,
or at least to set him up exactly. They were
putting him in a position to where his life was
uncomfortable or to where he could actually lose his life.
So when you, when you are death, you are a
detriment to my life, in my survival, and then you
lose your life, I'm actually feel okay, I feel like
I have an opportunity to live longer thw because you're

(24:15):
one less threat that I have to deal with. So
people have to you have to acknowledge that everyone is
not gonna be pain. They're not gonna feel sorry, they're
not gonna rest in peace, They're not gonna say that.
Some people are going to be relieved that people who
have harmed them, who have threatened their lives are gone.
Well I guess, I mean, I guess I agree with

(24:36):
you because I feel like, I mean, you know, I
still I'm called to my higher moral conscious, But I
also understand that when the when the slave master died,
the slaves were the reds. They rejoiced because again they
didn't have to take. That's one last one less lashing

(24:59):
that they had to actually deal with. So I guess
it's something that we have to reconcile within ourselves or
maybe not. People just got to do better. We don't
worry about. I don't like there are enough. There are
seventy five or maybe almost eighty million people out here
who they all together, So there's enough folks that will

(25:21):
praise and honor and uplift Rush Limbaugh, but it probably
won't be so this episode today, we're focusing a lot
on mass incarceration. It just happened that the last week
in Black History Month, we're focusing on individuals who have
served their time but are still dealing with the I

(25:44):
don't know, I guess insidual effects, but you know, still
dealing with the grip that the system has on you
if it can catch you right, if it can if
it can suck you in um. And again, these are,
you know, not individuals, And I think what makes these
conversations so real is it's not individuals that didn't commit

(26:06):
their crimes or people who haven't admitted to being a
minister society at some point. Right, But when you start
talking about folks serving thirty forty years or twenty five
years and then still having to deal with long probation
times and you know, parole times. You have to always

(26:26):
educate me probation, parole, get it right to mika Um similar,
very similar, you know, having having still an overseer, right, Um.
You know, those things I think have to be challenged.
And just as we are able to forgive or to
set aside what some of our legislators, leaders and other

(26:49):
individuals that are revered, just like we're able to do that,
I think we also have to live in the spirit
of reconciliation, of rehabilitation with people who are locked up
in prisons across this country. And so um. You know,
today we're focusing on what more can be done to
help free some of these people. And I the two

(27:11):
guests that we have are powerful guests. First, we're gonna
start out our friends, you know what I'm saying, Our friends.
We're gonna start out with you know, a brother who
I've grown to call a brother, you know, and he's
such a powerful, dynamic speaker. He speaks energy into anybody
that he speaks to. He he's overcome so many obstacles,

(27:36):
you know, after serving a twenty years sentence in prisons
and coming home and he's only been home four years,
and he hit the ground running and he came home
and immediately, Oh, he would tell you himself. He had
a cell phone, you know, he was actually got locked
up with herself. But I'll let him explain that to you.
But he came home and utilized that cell phone. He

(27:57):
went to corners and he did motivational speeches. Is he
did push ups, he sold his merchandise, He made everything
go viral. He constantly was speaking into the camera. He
did some of the craziest things and people was like,
what are you doing out here? Well, are you crazy?
But Willow had a plan, you know, and he's it's
such a motivation to see him now with his own

(28:17):
podcast man and being a motivational speaker. He got to
ted talks that he's already done, you know, and just
watching him living his purpose and not killing and his
whole thing is not caring what you think about, you know,
because those were things that led to his incarceration. So
I'm definitely, you know, happy and honored to be interviewing

(28:38):
my brother Willow. So the one thing you didn't say
about Willow is that he's a comedian most definitely, And
that's one of my favorite things about my brother. I mean,
he's obviously doing incredible work, as you said, but them jokes,
wallow them jokes hilarious. This is what it is. Are

(29:00):
should be in my own room, sneaking my own room.
Rest in peace, Muga weeps. He died not too long ago.
And I used to be in his room when I
was a kid, and he used to have the eight
tracks of Red Fox and uh Fire and all that
stuff by Centennial Nigger, all the type of join. So
they say stuff that was funny, but it was funny,
but they was they was telling us some real stuff.

(29:24):
And one thing about us as black people, especially where
we at now, We're only gonna listen to people if
it's funny. Off, it's cool. If you're going social media,
if if you don't have one the Gucci Louis Bliss
got none of that. And the jury and you could
be telling somebody how to do something. You could just

(29:45):
be you're in a regular suit. You're trying to show
somebody how to do real estate or credit. You're done.
Nobody want to hear that. Ship. Oh I realized that
I said, Okay, y'all like to laugh. I'm gonna get
you I'm gonna get you all some information. It's it's
like it's like it's like us sitting in candy, you
know how. You know how when a baby be sitting
there crying, don't we eat? As soon as you do

(30:06):
the airplane with the spoon, you gotta you gotta do
the airplane with the grown ass. In our community, man,
they don't want to hear because nothing is cool but
some ship that got that's outside of yourself. Everything in
the black community, everything that is outside of yourself, that's cool. Ship.
Oh oh you gotta. Oh you got a gun, that's cool?

(30:28):
Are you tough? Oh you got on Louis Vatan. Oh
you cool? You tough? Oh you're driving a billy? Oh
you cool. I can listen to you that we don't
even listen to what we think is uh things. If
you got things, you ain't got no things. They gonna
listen to you unless you make them laugh. And that's
why we appreciate you. Man. I was like, that's what
I said. I was like, yeah, Wilo is so comfortable
being him and that's why the main things that he

(30:51):
talks about. Man, you was telling us you know, are
you well? You was telling me yesterday when we had
spokes that today is your anniversary. You've been home for
four years. Oh yeah, I walked out of prison February
a team two seventeen. I mean years you spent in prison. Years.
Want to talk about that journey? How did you get there?

(31:13):
I got there because when I was young, uh, and
I used to sit on the step. My brother was
already in the street game. My neighbor, my old was
my old head, Jermain Big Main in them. He was
in the street game, and they all my brother homies
was already the street game. But it was times when
I used to sit on the step. I'll be out
playing with my friends and I see the most beautifulest
girl in our neighborhood. Right the most I'm telling about

(31:35):
all the fly girls. They never deal with. The dudes
that was working a day, they never deal with. They
only need the dudes that was coming to pick them up.
Had business and wrope chains on and on. So it
was an education taking place. Then it's like listen, man,
if you don't get that, you're not getting hurt. And
if and if and if you're not cool. You ain't

(31:57):
got shipped coming in the ghetto. The ghetto was based
off for acceptance and the only way you're gonna get accepted.
And if you've got things, if you ain't got things
you've done, you ain't got a chance out here. And
it goes all the way to now we're talking about
we're talking about the eighties for me when I was
a kid, but it's like even up to now, you've
got grown answer delts. Just like they you got people
that's in their thirties and forties chasing acceptings out here

(32:18):
on social media. So it's like that was the education
that was being put down in the streets. And uh,
a woman that was like an eye of myne named Jill.
She was a I'm talking about the prostitute, right, And
we used to always sit there. She used to talk
to me all the time. And the only reasons she
became like my street aunt because I was bad. I
used always throw rocks and cars. I'll be custom, you've

(32:39):
been something, I think all that crazy ship. So she
was I was like nine, so she was like clear
she was and she told me, she was like you're
gonna You're gonna be in trouble and they're gonna tell
on you. I just like why, because she's like, you're
always doing something they're not. They just around, they run
with you, but they don't. You're the one I always
see they throwing rocks and doing dumbs and custom pep uh.

(33:00):
So she used to sit me down. And the way
she got me to really sit down and listen, she
bought me a cheese steak. She's like, you want some meat. Yeah,
she brought me to cheese. So I sit there and
be talking to her, and sometimes she would get to
go away and be and white boy. Somebody pull up
one of doctors from getting the card, come back whatever.
But she told me something. She said, uh, she said,

(33:20):
we could troll this whole thing out here women. I said,
why you said that? She said, everything y'all do is
about us, you mean? And when I grew up there
understand that. And I was talking to so. I was
talking to some sisters in the salon not too long ago,
and he was just talking about some yeah because my son.
I don't want my son to do this. I don't
want this to do this, I said, y'all, I said,
that's up to y'all. When y'all do when y'all have
a meeting, the women have a meeting in the community.

(33:42):
And I'm not putting the sole in y'all, but I'm
gonna tell you, when y'all have a meeting in the
community and y'all really start talking to understand the power
that y'all have, then y'all, then things could change in
the hood. She said, what you mean, She said, you
don't want your son to grow up and be a
street nigga, real nigg or whatever these things. But the
dudes you talk to is getting money niggers. M you
don't want, you don't want your your son is going
to do this to the third but you're not You're

(34:03):
not talking. Dude, you talked to a nigger at work
at the uh Verazing. You don't talk to nobody at
work at the the the water company ever, dude ain't fly.
So it's this thing that's going on, this communication, this
non verbal communication that's going on because in our community,
we first listen with our eyes, then we listen with
our ears. So we're seeing this ship go down. And

(34:25):
even now when you look on Instagram, if you're if
you're a young kid right now, you're going on Instagram
and you see all these women and what's name that
look beautiful. They got the bodies got what's name. They're
not fucking with you don't only see them with balls
as rappers. Are got a bunch of chains on the ship.
So it's an education and that what was going on
back then. And I was like, funk that, I gotta
give me some money. I gotta go ahead, Rob and

(34:47):
still give me some. I gotta put this sogo to
tiny and feel like sweatsuits on the ship. Oh yeah,
I did. Fuck. Listen, let me tell you something I
was so. I was so instant tuitional lies to it
that when I got locked up and I went to
the courts, I immediately told my public defender or quarter

(35:08):
point hold on, we're not I told him before we're gon,
We're not going in there arguing, and none of that
should get me a deal right now on the course,
so I can get the funk back out here, because
I know they got me doing whatever that ship is.
People are gonna come to court on me, whatever it
might be, the police and all that ship. So listen,
that was my whole thing. I was listening. I'm taking
I'm pleading guilty. I'm not even dealing with this ship. Yeah,

(35:31):
I always used to plead guilty. I wasn't going to understand.
I first got of locked up at eleven. I got
locked up June thirty of nineteen ninety. I was eleven,
and I got locked the next Saturday, and and then
by September nineteen night they sent me away for a year.
I did a year in the juven of facility, came
on Coult. Another case went back for another year, came
on Coult, another case went back. I spent five years

(35:52):
and then out the juvenile system. And it was like,
you know, you get to a point where it's like, oh,
I can sit there and do a bit. I'm gonna
go up there and get a home pass. When I
get on the home pass, do what I ever gotta do.
So it was just I normalized that ship because when
I was young, I've seen love what I thought was love.
And the love that I've seen was when I used

(36:14):
to see the old heads from my neighborhood come on
from prison and just like just like paid it for
the movie, remember when paid before, but they come old
he got he right there. Maybe then they got to
change he at the mind I'm like, oh, that's love.
So so Jim, so Jill was just a part of
the part of your story and the journey. That's a
part of being loved. So I became institutionalized the Weirds

(36:37):
though that ship didn't even matter to me. It was like,
all right, fuck it, Oh, I gotta go to a
blue another bit. All right, I know we already know
what type of time they're gonna give me. They I
didn't already went to these four juvene I was at least,
so now they're gonna send me to this one just
then the third and I get in there. Yeah, well,
you know, we think we need to go to get
him to the programs he went to before. He didn't
go to. He need to go to this program. I
used to tell the law's with the second because I

(36:59):
was already in the system so much. You know, I
think that they're getting there. Okay, well we don't even
have to do nothing today. He played guilty, and if
the public defendant didn't do what you need, I'm staying
right up to the court. Yeah, and I'm guilty. I'm
guilty because I was like, it was like, what are
you doing? Man? I know I'm going down because I
already got a jacket. I'm going down. So my whole thing,

(37:21):
like y'all, I don't want to waste the taxpayers money.
You know. I'm just I call it reaction. I got.
I caught a street relapse. Please, So I want to
ask you this. I want to ask you this, Well,
when did your mind state change? Like? What? What? Because
you seem like this was you had accepted it. This
is what I am. I'm locked up and do my time.

(37:42):
What did it take? At what point did your mind
frame change? Listen? When I was in the penitentiary, right,
I woke up one day it was how to ship
like that the new the Waltz was sweating in the
cell and anybody in the yard. I go to the Saint,
splash my face and ship and I connected with the
conscious and I always had I was growing up in
the ghet and I was always doing street ship. But

(38:04):
I always had a consciousness and I would always had
these conversations with self after I did the dumb ship,
like yo, man, we had to pistol whip so and
so we had to do so and so we had
I was always so the conscious. When I was in
the cell, woke up I said, yo, man, I was
living a whole fucking life that that really wasn't me. Man,
I had out of shots. I could have done other ship.
I was smarter than this. So you you you accepted.

(38:26):
I accepted the responsibility like yo, I ain't never my
individualism because I wanted to be a part of the
vibe in the scene out here. So the whole time,
just like you, you know, you ain't no dumb motherfucker.
You were smart. You said to yourself, like certain the
ship that you've done, You're like, damn, that was I
was above that. But it was environmental reaction. And a
lot of times we don't understand that our environment it

(38:49):
dictate the pace of where we're going at man. And
that's how I got into the street game because the
environment told me this was cool, like you gotta do
this in order to be accepted. So but when I
was in that cell and I woke up, I said,
oh man, I'm gonna sell. I'm in fucking jail for
for being somebody that I'm not a hundred percent meaning
I'm in jail. And I got this conscious and I
always had this conscious like I'm doing some ship that

(39:09):
wasn't crazy. We don't have to do that while we
do this this that. So I'm like, yo, man, what
the funk I got? And then I started bracing my
individualism and I said, yo, I gotta tap into who
the funk I am? I got? Because I looked up
and I'm walking to penitentiary. I'm in new Yard. I'm
you know, old hit over here and been here for
thirty years, over head over here, and been here for
twenty years, over height over here and been here for
fifty years. I'm like, oh no, that's just just my route.

(39:32):
If I keep coming back, I'm done. I'm gonna get
career criminal status and I'm finished the funk off. But
I'm like I always was to dude and my crew.
That was funny, that was outgoing, and I always knew
a bunch of people because I was always in juvenificilities
and when I come out, it was people from all
different part of the city. They used to be in
this place for me, and I was a dude that

(39:53):
and we all together. I was a dude that would
talk to other people from other neighborhoods. I always was
an outgoing person with dudes like no while just think,
you know, know funk out of here and I know
dudeys and jail together. I was always that dude. Even
on the street you wanted something, I didn't. I wasn't
no drug that I was. I was a Robbert. So
if you wanted something, it was like, oh yeah, my man,
he got the weed, or you need some weed. I

(40:13):
gotta connect, you need some dope, I gotta connect. I
will always plug people and I will always connect people together.
I was out going first. I never was an angry person.
I wasn't mad at nobody. That wasn't a hater. I
just want to do that. Was young, out here living life,
and I was always funny. I was always talking ship.
I was always a talker. So let me let me
ask you this question. Right listening to what you're saying,

(40:34):
it sounds like there was an accountability mission that you
went on even from the beginning, like you said, very young,
you were like, I committed the crime, let me do
my time. So you were conscious of the fact that
you had to be held accountable for your actions. And
then you had the light switch go on that we're
always talking about. We're always trying to figure out when

(40:55):
does the light switch go off that people are able
to go from being sort of a minister society to
actually doing what's right. Those things happen. Then you came
home and began to help other individuals. And I mean,
I know for sure, I send my son, especially when
I'm having a hard time communicating with him, I send
him your videos. I sent him of course my song's

(41:17):
videos trade the true different ones, so that he could
get some knowledge from from you guys. So you began
to help transform other lives. Now you're in another process
of trying to get off of parole right and and
now I think I'm understanding that they want you to
be on parole to your sixty eight years old. You're
two thousand forty eight, and it's like, uh, without a doubt,

(41:41):
that's gonna happen. I'm in the process of that ship.
Now I've been this year, ready to get going to school.
It's going to happen. It was just that, you know
what I'm saying, This nineteen and a half to two
years together with two different sentences ran together because of Pennsylvania.
I don't know how New York is, but in Pennsylvania,
you got a minimum in a maxim if they give
you a ten of twenty That means you gotta do

(42:02):
tending and tim more out. That's what I'm saying. You
told twenty years, but you gotta do tending and walked off,
you know. I mean. So it was like I just
was sitting back like damn, that'sh it crazy. And it
was like I was just on some real ship a
couple of people that I know, a couple of a
couple of a couple of my elders. I was out
here just living so much. They was like, yoh funk
that we what what? When I told him, they couldn't

(42:24):
believe it. That's like you you're throwing a ready because
some people thought I didn't even think I was on
parad the way I moved. I'm so fluid. I ain't.
I ain't complaining. I'm just out here living my life
because I'm like, man, I gotta live right now. I ain't.
I was in jail all the time because I'm always
living like this. I'm forty one beforety two this year.
I'm like, ship, uh, there's a possibility that fifty years,

(42:46):
that fifty years, there's a fifty of my life is
already going maybe sixty. I don't. I can't. I don't know.
So I gotta max this ship out and I gotta
live a day like it's my last. So I'm just living.
And then I get any conversation with a couple of
guys that's in you know, community, the positions, the political
positions in our sitting there, like what I tell me,
I'm gonna maybe like oh the whole and there was

(43:11):
day was more mad and I was I was like, man,
I'm alway. And then they had to see me that
like no while, because I'm just like it might have
been a part of me from yesterday's that was like,
I'm just I ain't worry about it because I ain't
doing ship. But it's the possibility of it. Ain't gotta
be you wilder. You gotta have a dickcade paroles that
pulled the trigger on you and get you back and
the joint for no reason because they jealous of your success,

(43:32):
damn you right, And then they said, okay, let's and
then the petition went up. You know already it's only
been up probably like not even a week, hundred fifty
thousand signatures. But other people in the other places that's
politicians is on to day. So it's ready to happen.
But it's like you know, um. One thing I was
gonna say was this one of the reasons that I
thought about my when I was young, I had people

(43:55):
that was in my life, Grandmama, different people, owed, some
older guys in the community that was always trying to
give me right. But one thing that that that the
reason they couldn't. They couldn't They couldn't get into me
my mind because they was outnumbered. But there was too
many people in the street. So I said, Okay, I'm

(44:16):
gonna bring I'm gonna grab your attention on social media.
And what I'm gonna do, I'm gonna show you all
some ship that y'all never seen. I'm gonna make it
popular to do right. And you still could be cool,
you still could be thorough. Um, you still could be righteous.
But I'm gonna show you all a different lane of
what right is. And And that was my whole mission
on social was to show these dudes, damn look at
while up all right? Not just as Wildow telling me this,

(44:39):
you know, this cast too much to be a criminal.
He breaking it down, his journey, he telling us the stories,
he shared it with us. He's making his laugh and
he's given it to us. But shit, he's saying, gotta
be right because the dudes that I respect, which is
these big rappers respect wild I see him. I said,
So that's how you break it down to a young cat,
because when when when you're a young dude and you

(45:00):
sitting at your house and your mother or something, they
like this all day only there they're on YouTube all day,
and I know that I got a battle with some
some rap video. They might see what a dude got
a thousand guns in that motherfucker. They got all these
views and people and kids saying he cool. I'm like, man,
I'm cool. I'm gonna sure you what cool is? I'm cool?

(45:20):
Dah mean? And you get in a position where it's
though I hadn't been able to do things since I've
been home to show y'all. Not just being righteous is cool,
Not just doing right is cool. I'm able to. I
made a shipload of money off of being right outside
establishing the infrastructure within the podcast space and advertisement and

(45:42):
speaking engagement and books, and so it's like, bro, like okay,
Like I told my one young boy, yeah, man, but
I'm trying to be you know, I'm a real nick
I said, I said listen, And I didn't want to
do it, but I had to do it to him.
I said, listen, young as I know your father, you
know me. I noticed in the third you know you're
you're real in the street. You're doing your thing. It's
done through, but all your real niggas is broke. You

(46:06):
look homie, I said, you're living with a woman. Dog.
I take care of women and my family. You're living
with a woman. Bro. I I'll take care of ship.
People called, I said, bro, I wear Dada sweatpants all
the time. I said, bro, I'm dying for somebody from
from my family, grandmam and son call me and say
they need something. I'm done saying I may may anybody

(46:27):
what you need? What right here here go. I'll be
begging for them to beg me to say something to me.
I'll be done because I don't do it for me.
I'm not doing it to go and buy by Lamborghinis
and I get all, I said, great credit school money.
It's not I do this for y'all. I'm put my
dad swet who's on my hoodie on anything. I'm gonna mission.
And I want to say that's real because when we
were we ran into Philly, you know, we was in

(46:49):
Philly doing the State of Emergency tour. And while we
was we met him at um Philly Freeway's son's funeral
and he just ran up on us and gave us
a thousand dollars about food. Good. No, you ain't gonna
paid for no food while you're here. You know what
I'm saying. It's just genuine love, just real, you know.

(47:10):
And it was just love, man. So I just want
to say thank you that my thing is like this, Bro,
I can't take this money with me. I may I
put myself in a position to be able to have
to be able to create, like I say, the movies
I make the day, Gonna secure the futures of the
family members I won't be living to meet. That structure
is already put in place, and I continue to add
value to that. So if I expire, they're gonna be.
But it's about like this, And I don't think people

(47:32):
get this. You've got all these people in place that's
making money, have it wherever, Athletes, entertainment don't know nobody,
oh nobody, nothing. But when you got people that's out
here that's fighting for your freedom, that's fighting for the
people that the world forgot about. That's what I'm saying.
Why not try to show them some type of support

(47:53):
in anyway it ain't got and I'll be telling people
it could be a repost, it could be a donation. Bro. Bro,
if you you'll be to share. If you ain't got
that much money to get five hours, don't need something
because you got people that might get cute out here. Motherfucker. Listen.
See this is what people don't understand. And I'm not
saying this in a bad way. It's a it's motherfucker's
out there that will kill y'all because you're pushing and

(48:15):
you're trying to push the agender for us to have
a better life out here. It's my like life fences
they salute, We salute the soldiers when they're going to
fight for American freedom. Are we can't salute black people
that's trying to fight for our freedom and fight for
us like, like, listen, it's two thousand and one, you
mean it's to me, we gotta be out here arguing still, Yeah,

(48:38):
for you treat human beings like human beings, bro, man,
we can sit it all. We need you, We need
you we love you. Follow. I need to know the petition.
How do people go? So I know you said you
got the link. Make my bio go seven follow. We're

(49:05):
going to make sure that folks can watch. Right now,
you gotta go watch him and gillies Man dollars worth
the game. Shout out to my brother. You gotta go
see where's Willow where he interviews all of the artists
like Willow is outside you if you just gotta, you
gotta go watch Willows page. Every day he's gonna push
up to the rain, he and the snow. Today he
had his little his little two step he was doing.

(49:28):
But I want to make sure that we have the
two podcasts come together Street Politicians and your podcasts also,
so I could argue with Gilly because you know me
and Gilly some days. But I love Guilly though, but
I'll be mad. He's still running around trying to tell
people beat me in that battle. So we definitely gotta

(49:49):
we gotta we gotta fix that. We gotta fix that.
We love you so much. You keep doing your work
and stay strong, hit you up, be safe. I can
definitely talk to Willow all day. I do every time
we're on the phone. For an hour or two hours,

(50:09):
you know, because we have so much in common. We
have the same like compass morally, like we want the
same things. And it's hard to find people that's that's driven,
that's find your purpose. Like he's just so comfortable in him.
Authenticity is what it is, man, So shut up to
your authenticity. Man, Now, that's what it is. I don't
need a new word. Somebody else needs a new world.

(50:31):
I got my My word is authentic. I'm not mad
at that. But while he's a good dude, um, And
I think, you know, again black history, like all of
us take different routes to get to our purpose, and
sometimes we have to go through real hard things, like
real hard ship, right, Like you know, he did some
hard time. He went through a lot, and he probably,

(50:52):
as he said, he probably hurt people, hurt his family.
But now he's a man in his family who's able
to take care of folks, and he's changing the lives
of so many others. And I think that's what matters.
And we need to reward those who figure it out
and get it right. They say the struggle has created
more leaders and people of success than privilege has ever

(51:15):
And you know, and that brings us to our change
maker spotlight, my favorite, you know, one of one of
a friend, friend of the family, friend of the rule.
People are gonna start saying that we favor our friends
on this, and we do, we do, we do. You know,
that's why we gotta show. We gotta show so we
can bring our friends like that's what everybody else do.

(51:35):
Black people gotta be attentional about helping their friends and
their families because anybody else is doing that. So I
proudly say that another one of our friends that we
want to bring the change maker spotlight. You know a
brother who I've met in the struggle, you know, on
the grounds grassroots. You know whose father he actually begin
being an advocate and the activists because his father has

(51:59):
been incarcerated for over thirty or two years at this point.
Um he is. He works with them children of incarcerated parents.
He's one of the champions behind that. He's done so
much work in the communities to end mass incarceration. A
brother that I call a friend, you know, he's definitely
a very strong influence in the community. Brother Tony Lewis Jr.

(52:24):
I don't thank thank you so much for joining street politicians,
And you know, I was gonna say, in in light
of the whole conversation around friends, it's that we keep
good company and most of the people that we work
with our folks who are really on the ground. And
if you go to d C and you don't hear
about Tony Lewis, if you say you're going to d

(52:44):
C to do good work, grassroots work, and you don't
hear about Tony Lewis, you haven't heard about anybody, because, um,
you know, everybody is saying your name. People are always
praising your work. And I'm particularly always just so um
when I'm in your presence. The level of humbleness that
you show, um but yet still being a giant is amazing.

(53:08):
And so I'm glad to have you with us today
as our change maker. This is my favorite segment where
we get to highlight people I've worked with for a
long time. But I know that even though we do
have moments that are you know, really good, and we
smile and we laugh and and we have positive moments,
still when your father is incarcerated and I've watched the

(53:28):
journey on your social media where you take pictures with him,
and you know, watch you guys grow up together if
you will, you know, I know that that's still a
burden that's on you. And so please tell us. I mean,
first of all, you don't even have to start there.
You can start wherever you want. Just tell us what's
going on, what's the news, and also what is you know,

(53:48):
how can we help you in your quest to get
your father free as well? First, I thank you for
having me. I really appreciate that my both of you guys.
Salute to all that you do for us, right um
uh and and and I'm very humble by just being
able to be in your friend circle, um and to
you know, collaborate with you guys. In the times that
I've been able to do that, um, you know, I

(54:09):
I've continued to fight, um for economic stability for black
people and in my city, um, you know, violence interruption,
he's of the homicide and DC of black people, of
the people that are incosperated to black people. Uh. So
my fight against master in consperation and for children when
incosperrated parents. It's not just about my personal uh in

(54:30):
action with those topics, but more my my city as
a whole and black people from my city. Uh. And
so as you guys alluded to. You know, I've been
in this fight with my dad for thirty two years.
I was born on nine years old when he went away.
I'll be forty one in May, right, Um. And uh,
you know, particularly with this administration, Uh, the president that
was so heavy handed in the Crime Bill, which you know,

(54:55):
UH did the crack this versus powder cocaine disparity hundred
and one disparity that really ran up massive consperration in
the on the federal side. U States also followed that,
so it had a national impact. And then obviously people
hear more about the ninety four Crime Bill, which we
know was supposed to target violence. Uh, it did things
like put a lot of money and intervention. Uh in prevention. Uh,

(55:17):
it put some bands on the salt weapons, but also
put like nine point seven billion dollars into prisons. Uh.
It also militarized the police departments. So I think President
Body has personal interests in writing wrongs that he played
such a parton during this campaign. He may mention that
they made their wrong decisions right. Uh. And so a
lot of the reforms that we've seen in the last

(55:38):
couple of years under the Obama administration and under the
Trump administration with the First Step ACTUH really stopped at
you know, a point of being able to do what
it really should have done, and even in the good steps,
and then it gave a lot of judicial discrestion. And
so it's a lot of people that um should be
eligible for relief, um, but the judge can still say no.

(56:00):
And we need to rectify that. And so I hope
that this administration in the first hundred days can use
the clinency power that the President has to reunite families
all across the United States, particularly black and brown families
that we know I disproportionately represent in the in the
federal prison. Syst your father has been incarcerated for thirty

(56:20):
two years, Yeah, sir, And what kind of crime does
he have? A violent has a non valient drug offense,
his role as a leader and in a drug conspiracy
here in d c Um that happened he went to
jail April fifteen, nineteen eighty nine. Um. My my position
has never been in my father was innocent, My father
was not in his right, but that those Drake Coney

(56:40):
and since and my father got sentenced today is no
way he gets life without grow So that's his sentence, right,
that's a slow destincy. If nothing changes, he will die
in prison. UM, and and and and sort of the
on top of that, it was like twenty nine people
in their case and everybody's home except for his co defendant,
his partner, UM, who is in with his protection. So

(57:01):
my father has not got any type of relief UM
during his thirty two years. My saw y'all and Tomika
y'all know the work that I do in the city.
My father has, you know, not only advised me throughout
my life becoming the man that I am and steer
me away from the street, but more importantly, we've we've
collaborated to help thousands of you know, young men and
women UM, and then particularly people that are inconsperrated with him.

(57:22):
You know, I helped them when they returned to the
community to stabilize good jobs, etcetera, etcetera, And we're helping
their children. UM. I've actually went to the prison and
filmed a p s A with my father. I don't
think there's anybody there in the country they can say
they went into a federal prison and shout at p
s A to steer young people away from from taking
you know, steps in the path that he took. Um,
he's done a lot of redemptive and restorative acts around

(57:43):
you know g d s and or helping other inmates
with g DS and making positive choices, and the list
just goes on and on. He's had like one shot
since he's been incosperrated. Right, he's been a model prisoner
all the things. He's been a leader, he's been somebody
that the administration leans on to bring peace when and
has issues at the prison. You know. Uh, So there's
been a lot of things that he's done to make

(58:05):
amends for his decision. And my father had never been
the prison prior to. Right he walked into jail at
twenty six years old. Right, he'll be fifty nine in October.
And we've seen a lot of people that's been in
a long time get compassionate release. My father is too
young and too healthy, you know. According right to he's

(58:29):
in f CR Cumberland, which is in Maryland. The first
fourteen years he was in Long Park, California, and uh
for the last nineteen he's been in in in Cumberland,
which is in Maryland, which is a two hour drive
from here, which is UH you know, that's that's a
good thing. But you know, because of coronavirus, we haven't
seen him in like a year, and now he's a

(58:50):
grandfather to not to mention, you know, I think that's girl. Yeah,
thank you. And you know the traumatic part about death
for me is, you know, in order for that relationship,
I gotta take them. That was my biggest fear. I
never wanted to take them inside of prison, but I
had to. And so I'm watching me all over again, right,
I'm having to answer the questions from my babies that

(59:11):
I asked my mother, my grandmother when I was coming up,
you know, when when my father, when Daddy coming home.
And then they're asking me when Pap Pap coming home? Right, um,
and and and so that's something I gotta go through
and deal with. That's a that's just another layer to this, uh,
this gift that keeps giving in the worst way. Yeah. Man,
it's it's it's so you know, it's so contradictory to

(59:34):
what prison is supposed to be. You know, you know,
outside of murder and you know, rape and and those
type of crimes, it's supposed to be about rehabilitation. Even then,
it's supposed to be and then and those and and
then even those people, they have people who commit those
acts that actually come home. Yeah, and I believe in

(59:58):
redemption right in my work, right, but I do more
than any things helped me. And when returning from the conspiration,
I've helped thousands of people over my career, right, twenty
years I've been in this and I've set across from
child molesters, rapist murderers, right, consistently consistent freedom, right. That's
that I'm trying to help, not really offended. I'm trying
to help to stabilize and you know, uh, do the

(01:00:20):
right thing. My father, I'm saying, my father can't get
a chance, you know. So I don't make judgment on
what people they paid their debt. And that's the thing
like when we talk even with this administration that I've
heard a lot of talk about in the death penalty, right,
but how do you what do you do about life
without parole? What can a person selling knock cottage. We're
not taking away from the from the impact that had
in our community, but when you think about that from

(01:00:42):
the lands, if you lose your entire life, you know, uh,
you know, the data has come out even about brain
development that you know, not until twenty five. You know,
my father was jail at twenty six going on twenty seven.
But my point is his career as a drug dealers
started in his youth, right and and and he's paid
his death and and it's not just about him, but
it's many thousands men in the federal prisoning system that

(01:01:05):
fall into that same exact category. They went to prison young,
they've paid their debt, and they should be giving another opportunity. Oh,
I was gonna say, you mentioned um that he's too healthy,
young and healthy and and and I know you smiled
when you said it, but I'm wondering if that really

(01:01:25):
has something to do with him being held. Do you
find that people who are more senior and that are
you don't have different ailments or what have you? That
the system just in this moment, yes, when when I'm
talking about during the pandemic, uh yeah, during COVID, you know,
uh BOP has taken steps to grant compassion released to

(01:01:46):
certain inmates, and that's sort of they wanted to get
the elderly, the people that the most at risk, of
people that have pre existent conditions, and so UM at
least get people on home confinement. Uh. And some people
just got compassionate release, and there's a lot of people
who should have been. Really he's honestly, but this was
an opportunity and I'm I'm and I'm happy to see that, right,
people like guy fishing, people like uh, my sister and

(01:02:07):
me underweel her dad came home and that's a beautiful thing. Um,
they were reunited with their families. And really these are
the type of things. Yeah. Yeah, she's like an activist, right, yeah,
she's we got us now. Yeah, it's amazing, it's amazing. Yeah,

(01:02:29):
so she she her her pops came home, um, and
and there's things like that. But when without compassionate release,
those men had, you know, life without parole. You gotta
really think about that. What is how is that even
a sentence for somebody that did not you know, ain't
convicted of you know, uh, multiple homicide, right like you
know so so and you spoke about that. Uh my son,

(01:02:52):
it's you mentioned too about that. We're talking about rehabilitation
and this country has not. It's become completely pune there
and even I mentioned the First Step Act, one of
the things that was supposed to actually expand vocational educational
development throughout the federal prison system, and that has not happened.
And I hope that this administration can also uh work

(01:03:14):
on that. That's super vital because even when people return
to the community, they're going through doing all this time,
and they're coming out of these prisons with with with
without skill sets that's gonna allow them to be competitive
and and you know, that's that's tragic. You know what
I'm saying, that's that's a travesty. Uh. And so the
collateral damage that the six Bill did, the ninety four

(01:03:34):
bill d mandatory minimum sentence and um, the collateral damage
that it's caused in our communities particularly right is really immeasurable,
and it needs to be real steps towards repair. And uh,
you know, on one end is about releasing people, but
on the other end is about changing the dynamics and
creating uh culture of redemption for many women that have

(01:03:58):
been previously consprated. So you know, for me just hearing
this story, it's I hear these stories. Wait, we hear
these stories way too much. Man. So what what is
it that we can do, you know to try to
um petition to help your father? Like, what is the steps.
How do we follow you? What do you need us
to contribute to, you know, to try to get your
father home and so so first things first, you know,

(01:04:20):
follow me on that on Instagram, Twitter at Mr Tony
Lewis Jr. Mr Tony Lewis Jr. UM. The a c
l U has a petition currently afford to push the
president to use his clinacy powers and honestly not to
wait until he's going out the door four years from now.
We need this now, right, people been waiting too long.

(01:04:41):
But on April ten, I'm doing a free Tony Lewis
rally and the Black Lives Matter Plaza, which is essentially
in front of the White House here in d C. UM.
I want everybody to show up, and we also have
the capacity for people to participate virtually. UM. But this
rally is gonna be pushing this administration to write his wrongs, UM,
to reunite families, and to to to really you know,

(01:05:04):
set an example for also what states should do, because
you know, in d C, you know my my my
father's case and in d C we we we deal
with the federal prison system. But this same type of
action should be taken by governors across this country, right, uh,
in terms of state inconserration. So I really hope this
can morph into, um, a real push nationally, um for

(01:05:27):
people that have been inconcerated, you know, over twenty thirty years,
particularly for drug offenses, to be let out and then
not be no long drawing out process. You have to
go before all these judges like let the people go,
you know what I mean, they paid their debts and
and I think President Obama in his last year of
the eight years, uh second term, he was trying to

(01:05:51):
what is it. What do y'all say, grant clemency, but
it's pardoning? Is that the same? Yeah? Or combia computations
or connusation, That's the word I was looking for. He
was trying to commute the sentences of thousands. He was
trying he actually did, but he was trying to He
was trying to make retroactive law to actually free the
people who were victims I mean, who were incarcerated for

(01:06:13):
non violent and drug abuses. Right. He did, He started
he started doing and he actually, um, he actually commuted
the most sentences in history of any president. But what
he was trying to do specifically was, as you said,
focus on a particular category and then get people free

(01:06:35):
who fit into that category and low level thing. Right,
he was dealing with a Republican. He tried to present
something that the other side of the hour support, right,
and we running We run into that a lot, you know,
And so he set up the clinicy piece. He ran

(01:06:56):
it through the Justice department. You know what was problematic
with that sometimes too, and some of the Justice Department
higher ups they made their bones on cases like myad cases. Yeah,
and they were familiar, so like oh no, you know so,
so so how do you classify who's worthy of redemption?
You know? So so you say, okay, the king pain,
he shouldn't get a break, but the guy who was

(01:07:16):
quote unquote working for him should or the woman who
was quote quote unquote working for him or her should
get a break. And I think that was probably matter.
That's why you left thousands of people who probably would qualify,
who had done more time than the people who got released,
still languaging in prison. And so that was a but
that was a great start, right that Seed was planning.

(01:07:37):
So now that's why it's time for this administration to
come in. You know, look at what went wrong with
that process and and also if if it's anything that
we can pull away from the last administration, and I
think it's important to say, is that how you exude
power right, how you go alone and utilize your power.

(01:07:59):
One of the learned that we learned that from the
forty five and them we have we actually we have
to wrap up. And I think Tony, what you're saying
is a hundred percent true. That you know the way
in which the past administration ran their operation. They knew

(01:08:21):
who their audience was, um, they knew who their people were,
and they were going to, as you said, be intentional
about taking care of their own We're not suggesting that
there be identical behavior, but certainly the courageousness to go
in and say these people have been wrong, we have
to right the wrongs, and there's enough accountability to go around.

(01:08:44):
It's not just Joe Biden, it's also Kamala Harris. It's
also a number of other individuals who are within the
administration at this time. So I certainly a support what
you're saying. And I think that while they're in the process,
while they're feeling executive order is and they're signing everything
up to Wazoo signed something that we're free our brothers

(01:09:06):
and sisters who have been locked up far too long
and have not gotten an opportunity to have a second
chance at life. And certainly I have to say, which
I support your father a hundred percent um, that there
are many women, too, many women who are locked up
because they were in a relationship with someone, uh, they
had proximity to something, and because they weren't willing to

(01:09:27):
either to you know, talk about it, or they just
got caught up in the web and they're doing thirty
forty years and that needs to change as well. Absolutely, absolutely, well,
we appreciate you, brother man. We wish we could talk
to you long, but we definitely need you to go.
Follow Tony Lewis Jr. On Instagram follow sign the petition.
Mr Tony Lewis Junior on Instagram signed a petition support

(01:09:51):
this brother. You know, let's get your father freeman, and
let's start the trend. Let's get your father free, and
then let's start freeing all of those who have been
in jail for the majority of life for non violent
drug offenses. Yeah. Absolutely, I appreciate you both. Thank you,
Thanks Tony. We're gonna have you. Yes, keep doing the work. Baby,
you know what else we gonna do? That's right? Free

(01:10:14):
to guys, Free to guys. Where did free to guys
come from? You gotta tell everyone. I mean, free to
guys is a term that we all used, like when
we want to get guys free. But we we intentionally
used it in Louisville. You know, Louisville eight seven was
the first you know, batch of individuals who they were.

(01:10:35):
It was the first group of people, batch of individuals
called a batch of individuals who participated in civil disobedience
for Brianna Taylor. You know, no, no, they were the
first group. You know, you have to be careful because
Louisville people will watch us to say, other folks have
been arrested, like four people I think. Okay. It was
the first group that until freedom, that until freedom organized

(01:11:00):
to be arrested for Brianna Taylor. And it was about
twenty two males men and that you know, that um
batch of individuals. And we that was we said to
ourselves while we was in the cell. You know, we
kept saying free to gods. So that was our that
was our little slogan, free to guys. But you know,
shout out to Tony Lewis Julian definitely. Man. I met

(01:11:22):
the guy on the ground and like you said, he's
a humble spirit, but he works hard. He's well respected
in his community and UM and he handles businessman And
it's crazy when you do the work he's been doing
for over twenty years and you're able to support everybody
and still sitting in jail for thirty over thirty two
years for a non violent crime. So you know, let's

(01:11:44):
support Tony Lewis Jr. And keep doing the work whether
we see you. You know what, I don't get what
don't you get today, sir? Just talking about inconceerration since
we're focusing on incarceration. I don't get why people are encouraging,
especially these young people to do things that are detrimental

(01:12:06):
to their freedom in their survival. You know, we like
you ever having this conversation. You know, over the last
week there's been a situation with Meek Mills and somebody
that I won't even speak about, you know, and you
know his name, and he had with the guy and
the guy jumps out with his camera, cursing and screaming

(01:12:29):
with his security guards, pulling the stunt we call this
day room. We call it dayroom in the hood. It's
like day room. You know, when you you're pulling the stunt,
you got your security, some of them are police officers
and they're holding you back. But you're the one that
initiating it. But you got your security holding you back
while you screaming curse. And this man is coming out
of club. You know, he's all just just got off

(01:12:52):
of probation, as he's been on probation for eleven plus years,
just was in jail for you know, about eighteen months,
you know, spending doing a sentence. And now he comes
home and you're trying to trick him off the streets,
and people like, yo, you should have did this. You
should have did this. I would have did this. I
would have heard him boom boom. You gotta do this.
And what I'm saying so you you're encouraging a millionaire.

(01:13:15):
He just started own Reform, the organization that's getting people
out of prison. You're encouraging this man to engage with
somebody who's nothing more than a troll, who has already
showed you he has no moral compass, no principle. He
would do anything for a viral moment this is all
he would do. You know, he's already showed you his
willingness to cooperate with the police and put people in prison.

(01:13:36):
You're encouraging this man to actually engage that person and
forfeit his power in his position to somebody like that.
And I don't understand the mind state of some of
the people who would tell you these things. You know,
there are people that you see that supposedly have followings
and have some level of credibility and communities and respect,

(01:13:57):
who are actually saying that this needs to happen or
you need to do that now. I don't care what
you got. You just throw it all away. I don't
care if it's on his own. And I don't understand
the mindster, because what you're doing is you're influencing these babies.
These babies are paying attention to you. You know, these
quote unquote O g s got kids watching them, and
they're saying, yeah, it's I don't kid man, I'm gonna

(01:14:18):
risk everything for that. If he says something to me
he called me a name, you know, he gonna dictate
my whole life. I will to throw it all away
for that. You can't say nothing to me because when
I see you's on site, don't care. The police, they
don't care what's going on. I'm popping off and this
is a mindster and I I've never been stupid, you know,
And I feel like it's a crash Dumby mentality. Right.

(01:14:40):
It's like you're just driving straight into the wall and
you're saying, I don't care, I'm just gonna run into
the wall. And I don't understand. I really just don't
get it. I want somebody to try to make me
understand how you actually contrive that thought. How do you
rationalize that at some level of intelligence or any end
of it, to the level of intelligence that can rationalize that.

(01:15:03):
Please help me? Do you get it? I mean, I
think that the Internet is a very very powerful drug
that everyone is trying to figure out how they can
get their one hit wonder um And you know, I

(01:15:23):
think that's one part of it. When I watched that video,
I was I could see how Meek was not not
that he was like I'm back and down, but he
just was like what is exactly is happening? And like
who's trying to get me? Who's trying to set me up?
Like why is this happening? Right now, like let and

(01:15:44):
you could see him thinking about his move like if
I do this, then this, If I make this move,
then this, These things can happen um and and that's
an unfortunate situation to being in general, but certainly certainly
for anyone to encourage the wrong move. There's definitely people that,

(01:16:06):
you know, our young people don't need to be they
don't know it's dangerous because me, for one, I say
gangs and people, you know, they call it a hypocritical,
hypocritical statement. How you gangster? What you woke? No gangster
means I will whip your ass if you jefferize my life, right,
if you are coming to harm me, I will whip

(01:16:27):
your ass. But in that situation that you know, but
why I mean, I guess that then we have to
start pushing ourselves. And I'm really struggling with the thoughts
around this because I could also see where there are
some folks who will say, well, you know, if if

(01:16:48):
me um is you know, making statements about people, that
you have to be prepared for people to comment and approach.
That's and I think and I think that's true. I
think that's true. But I also know that there was
a time where people would like really be serious about
a fight, like serious about a fight, like you know,

(01:17:08):
we're meeting up, we gotta do what we gotta do,
but not trying to create a stunting or a cloud
chasing monment. And it's just very dangerous in general because
what I saw, I'm be honest, I told you I saw,
you know, I could see Meek's head like turning in
him thinking. But the other thing I saw was a
lot of men whose families would be in jeopardy if

(01:17:32):
they don't make it home because somebody starts shooting, or
you know, they get arrested for abusing another person or whatever.
So it's like responsible, we have the child, and I
think and I think that comes with wisdom. Right. He's
been associated with a couple of things that I didn't
think was smart. You know, the situation with Safari, which
was alleged, you know, the situation that happened with Quentin,

(01:17:54):
which was alleged, you know, and they utilize those things.
When he went to his bastion hearing that, they came
and said, hey, they got video of this and they're
showing this, and those were things that were detrimental to
his freedom. And when you realize that right after you
do what you're young, you're dumb. You have nobody's giving you,
you know, the knowledge when you start. The best teacher

(01:18:16):
is your own experience. So for you to experience that,
understand that, damn, I actually sat in jail for months
behind some ship that really didn't make much sense. Right,
And then you come into that same situation again with
somebody that ain't even a threat at all, right, that
it doesn't even deserve any energy. He's not a threat

(01:18:37):
to you, it's no threat to your person, he ain't
swing a punch. He's actually yelling and screaming behind security guards.
And you say it, said, why do I have to
engage with somebody like this is no threat to me?
And people are are trying to impose some level of
rule that if you say so, and I get it,
if you say something, you should be held account of,

(01:18:57):
you should be willing to deal with the consequences. But
the consequence is if the consequences as you yelling and
screaming at me security what because I'm not I'm not
a threat, You're not threaten in my life, You're not
a threat of my my physical being. There's no physical
harm that can come to me from you yelling with
your camera. The only harm can come to me with

(01:19:18):
your camera is me doing something to you, and that's it.
There's no other harm to me. So you know, that's
just my take on. I mean, there's a lot of uh,
there's a lot of ill will out here. And I
see also again in this situation. I don't know everything,
but I can tell there's a lot of East Coast
West Coast energy people who just don't like me. People

(01:19:40):
who you know, obviously feel um that the other individual
who you say, we can't say his name on the show,
um that you know that people know like what he's done.
And so I think you have a lot of people who,
on both sides of defense, are um just to to
see people commit violent acts. And that's that's something that

(01:20:05):
I believe we've been experienced since since we were kids
and beyond folks who are champing up right, and they
amped it up because they want to see they want
to see a violent situation happen. And you know, so
long as they're not the ones that have to deal
with the consequences, is fine with them. But these are
young kids, um, and you know, hopefully this situation doesn't

(01:20:28):
turn into a thing where it goes on and on,
and you know, and and and then and social media
sort of bullies them into meeting up again or having
another incident take place. I just hope. I just want
to tell my young kingsmen, do not allow anybody to
trick you off of your route, to trick you out
of your greatness, to trick you out of your freedom,

(01:20:49):
to trick you out of your life for stupidity. You
do not have to prove anything to anyone. You do
not owe anything to anybody but yourself and your family.
Protect yourself at all courts. But don't be no damn
crash to me. I hear that, so on that we're

(01:21:12):
on that note and said, you know, we could drop
the mic after that. You know what I'm talking about.
So listen, we appreciate y'all. We want to say thank
you for making us number one. Were number one, Yes,
go look it up with number oneous hilarious. You got
to speak that thing into existence baby making us. Actually

(01:21:33):
we were on the Apple podcast Top one hundred list
people like number eighty seven, and now we just number
We just number one man, not like on the Apple podcast.
But you're saying that's that's where we are. We don't
recognize that. Listen to me, sometimes everybody is slow. People
are usually slow. The Greatness we number one. Man. We

(01:21:54):
just want to say thank you for making us number
one because listen, I'm not gonna always be right man,
Tamika is not gonna always be wrong, but we guarantee
y'all that we will both always be peace. Peace. Thanks
for joining street politicians number one baby, that's how we
own it.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}"Prison Reform" with Wallo and Tony Lewis Jr.