March 19, 2025 • 45 mins
In this episode of TMI, Tamika D. Mallory and Mysonne interview Dr. Benjamin Chavis, a political and civil rights icon. They discuss the importance of understanding history and the struggles that have taken place in Black America. Dr. Chavis shares his personal experiences growing up in a racially segregated America and his involvement in the civil rights movement. He emphasizes the need for education, self-love, and unity within the Black community. The conversation also touches on the significance of the DNC convention, the rise of Black women in leadership, and the challenges faced by Black youth.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm Tamika D.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Mallory and it shit Boy my sona General.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
We are your host of TMI.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Tamika and my Son's Information, Truth, Motivation and.
Speaker 3 (00:09):
Inspiration New Energy. Hello everybody, this is a new episode
of TMI, and it is the summer. It's August, and
so you know, things have been a little bit different
in terms of what we've been doing with the show
during this month. But we will be back to our
(00:30):
regularly scheduled programming come September after our semi vacation, but
it's not really a vacation because we still have been
bringing you all very very important content. Last week, my
son sat down with a group of brothers many that
I respect, all of them that I respect, and had
(00:52):
a really really powerful conversation and I hope that you
all have an opportunity to listen into that.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
We're back to my Son the General. You're back.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
We're here for another week, and today we're jumping straight
into an interview with a very very important political and
civil rights icon.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
We are at the convention.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
We're literally in Chicago at the DNC, and so there's
so much happening.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
If you could see everything.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Going on on the other side, of this device, you
would know how how busy it is. But it was
very important for us to bring context because one of
the things that I think we both know, my son,
is that the Internet is telling us all types of things. Misinformation,
people uninformed, people don't know history, people really don't understand
(01:48):
the road that has been traveled to get not only
to this moment, but the fights that have taken place
and the struggle that has gone on in our world
and certain me in America, in Black America for a
long time. And so we asked this icon to join
us this morning. And if you don't know who he is,
(02:10):
please do your research. We are talking with doctor Benjamin Chaevs,
not just Ben Chavis we so used to calling him.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Ben Chavs. Is doctor Benjamin Chavs, and he his.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Current job is the President and CEO of the National
Newspaper Publishers Association. That's the National Newspaper Publishers Association n NPA.
But he has you have you are here with us
so many other things that make you a legend.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
That's your current.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Work that you are involved in, which is still a
form of activism, telling our stories to us by us
in black newspapers all across the country, and I'm sure
you there. You know it expands beyond that, but you
are truly a legend in the civil rights movement. We
just want to welcome you and thank you so much
for joining us this morning.
Speaker 4 (03:05):
Well, thank you, Tamika, my son. I'm so honored to
be in your presence. You know, Fredick doesn't said it best.
Freedom is a conscious drugg say. Each generation I'm so
proud of has risen to the occasion. And it's not
just a simple matter of passion. At the time, I
wish it was that simple. It was really how to
(03:29):
renew and regenerate our consciousness as a people.
Speaker 5 (03:33):
Who are we in the world, Who are we in America?
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Not only what our past has been, but how does
our pass inform our presence and our future. That's why
I'm so honored to be here with you at the
Democratic National Convention, this pivotal moment in world history.
Speaker 5 (03:51):
You know, you know, soroart the system.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
I want you to know all of my family, my mother,
my sisters, my grandmother, all akas so I got a
lot of pink and green in Oxford, North Carolina.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
Oh so your family, your family picked the right sorority
to be a part of. I just want to make
sure everybody knows very serious matter. And Vice President Harrison
also an AKA, so you know we're on the right track.
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Absolutely absolutely. But I'm a native of Oxford, North Carolina.
I was born in nineteen forty eight, so I grew
up in the nineteen fifties when everything was racially segregated.
But you know, even though things were segregated, I learned
so much about black history, black knowledge, black scholarship, black excellence.
(04:38):
And you know, I didn't know that much about white
people because I was separated from you know, I knew
about your question. I knew about a popeive, but I
never saw a white student to my sophomore year in college.
Speaker 6 (04:50):
Wow, and what college did you go to?
Speaker 1 (04:53):
That?
Speaker 4 (04:53):
To Ben, the first college was Santa Dustin's College at
HBCU and Raleigh, North Carolina and.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Then answer to UNC. I was a chemistry major.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
And when I tried to get into UH in North
Carolina State, which is the white school or UNC the West,
they told me they were not accepting black students unless
I majored in music. That was I said, no, I
want to major in science and young Robert music, but
that wasn't my field, and so I was dissuaded, which
(05:26):
is fine because going to the HBCU the first couple
of years was the best decision of my life. And
uh he gave me a grounded So by the time
I transferred to University of All Carolina to finish my
chemistry degree, I actually was ahead of the white students.
Speaker 5 (05:41):
They used to say, well, where did you come from?
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Who taught you this organic chemistry and physical chemistry?
Speaker 5 (05:47):
And uh, you know nucle can, I said, some black
teachers at a black school. That's what talk.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
Because you know, I think sometimes we underestimate not only
where we get education, but how we get our education.
And so I grew up in the movement. I was
got my NAACP car when I was twelve years old.
I started working for SELC Doctor my little kingdom. When
I was fourteen. Put my age up. We're not supposed
(06:16):
to drive to sixteens. I put my age up. I
had mobility. I was driving. You know, I grew up fast.
James Bonder now became very close friends and he used
to tell me them parting some writing that the pen
is powerful them to saw it. So I started writing
for the Black Press when I'm eleven years old in
the sixth grade, and now, as God would have it,
(06:38):
for the last eleven years, I've been to president of
the CEO of Other Black Press of American National Newspaper
Public and Association. But as to me, could say it
in the intro, what I do now is informed by
many decades of other struggle. To me, when you have challenges,
that's preparation. I once asked Reginald Lewis, who was the
(07:00):
first black beading. I said, Regel, tell me one word
out of the English language that led to your financial success,
and he said, preparation, preparation. We have to prepare ourselves
to deal with the struggles. We prepare ourselves to learn.
And then I started working in the African liberation movements
in Africa.
Speaker 5 (07:20):
I joined the a n C.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
I used to write for the a n C, the
Afghan Acts and youth publication of the SPARE while I
was you know, in college and high school. And then
from nineteen sixty three to nineteen sixty eight I was
the youth coordinator for SELA Christians Leadership Conference until the
day that doctor King was killed in nineteen sixty eighty
(07:44):
and eight. So I've been around the blocks a few times.
But you know what, my Sogning Tamika, most of them
sister in the community that they don't know about the
nap or the mean Man March.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
They know me from the movie Ballet. I was the
minister in Bellet.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
You know, I just told you that I was about
I was about to bring that up.
Speaker 6 (08:03):
Just now.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
I go to anyhood and they said, that's the minister Flue.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
But that shows you the importance though not only our
all tradition, but our our our image, our visual tradition,
particularly now among millennials and generation disease. Not only what
we hear or even what we see a hip hop.
Hip hop is what you feel. It's just not what
(08:28):
you see, but what you hear is what you feel.
And so I think our movement has been successful to
the extent to which we can not only yes, people
can feel our impression oh pressure, but can people feel
our liberation and people feel what we need to do to.
Speaker 5 (08:46):
Change our quality of life.
Speaker 4 (08:47):
And that's why I have so much respect for you
what you're and Tabika do, because you help people feel
the reality of our struggle for freedom, justice and required andy.
Speaker 5 (08:58):
I'm sorry, I'm gonna give you a short answers to no.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I just first of all, it is an honor to
be able to interview you, to be able to know you,
to be in space with you, to get you know,
be able to be tutored by just listening to you,
you know, last night, talking all the times I've been
in your presence, and just hearing the wisdom that you
have and knowing how legendary you are.
Speaker 6 (09:22):
And it's a shame.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
That our youth are not only no belly, right, is
only no belly. But when you listen to the history
you know that you've you've been through. I just want
to know, like, what what were some of the things
that you you picked up working with doctor King?
Speaker 5 (09:42):
Well, I picked up working doctor King.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
Is that.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
You know the eloquence behind the podium, The eloquence on
the stage of life is informed by what happens off
the stage. It's informed by what happens before you get
to the before you get the mic. You know, before
you can drop the mic. You got a hold of money,
you know what I'm saying. So as we pick up
(10:09):
the mic of like I'm talking about, as we broadcast
as like we're doing now as we articulate, as we
disseminate information, you know, we're informed by our lived experience.
And so I've been blessed to me and my sign
to have had lived experiences with doctor King, live experiences
(10:30):
with Malcolm X, lived experiences with Minister farra Con, lived
experiences with doctor Doctor Height, lived experiences with Rose the Pause,
lived experiences, you know, Nelson.
Speaker 5 (10:42):
Mandela, winning Mandela.
Speaker 4 (10:45):
I was with Cuban troops on the ground, and I
was in the fox over to the troops fighting the
South African potactic dream in the mid nineteen eighties. Because
one of the things I found out that you know,
it's one thing to talk liberation, It's one thing uh
engage in armstructure. It's another thing to engage in putting
your life on the front line.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
You know.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Look, I spent most of the nineteen seventies in prison
because I be very honest.
Speaker 5 (11:11):
I was mad.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
I was mad as hell, and they killed Actor King
in nineteen sixty eight. But I learned the channel of
my anger into something a modus operandi that could help
inspire to make sure his dream was not assassinated.
Speaker 6 (11:23):
How long were you incarcerated, Doctor Ben.
Speaker 4 (11:26):
Six and a half years, but I had a thirty
four year sentence. I spent most of the nineteen seventies
in prison. The women to ten case, that's a whole
I could talk to you about the whole program that
they just on the Wilmington tent alone.
Speaker 5 (11:38):
I'm so proud of the young people and women.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
In all Carolina who stood up to racial white supremacy
in the school system.
Speaker 5 (11:47):
And because they stood up.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Eight high school student leaders, sixteen seventeen, eighteen year olds, myself,
I was only twenty three years old and a white
anti poverty work a woman who was also a Hurrunners.
Speaker 5 (12:02):
With ten of us were sent us to two hundred
and eighteen years in prison, and I had to launch
sentence thirty four thirty four years. And so the analogy
is when I heard that Donald Trump had thirty four convictions,
thirty four felons, I said, with damn, I wonder how
much time, how he's gonna get it, you know. And
of course we got that time because we bought white supremacy.
(12:25):
But one of the things I learned from doctor King
that is so big.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
I really don't I don't want you to brush past that,
because that's real.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
That is so so significant.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
Not that you were, which you know, we don't have
any judgment on this show around what people may have
done and how they you know, what road they traveled,
But you weren't scamming and killing or any of that.
Your path to being incarcerated was because of your involvement
(12:59):
in the civil rights movement.
Speaker 5 (13:01):
Yes, absolutely, and I think that to Meka.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
I'm always indebted to my mentors. I had great mentors,
claud Mchison who founded the Conservational Quality you know, Margaine
the Kingdom founded the Silicary's Leadership Conference.
Speaker 5 (13:19):
I used to drive, I told the car.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
Yes, I used to drive his father, Cleave Sellers and
Stoker Cormack around when they were in Snick because back
in the day, you just want any one black odersas
you in every black if it was black, I'm in.
Speaker 5 (13:34):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
That sounds like my parents and my life. How I
grew up in Harlem. We went to the Nation of Islam.
We went to National Action Network, we went to the
Black Church, we went to the street corners, we went
to anything that had to do with black empowerment. At
the slave Theater, my parents were there.
Speaker 4 (13:53):
So it was one thing I guess I should point
out anthropologically and geneologically, I was really blessed to me
and my son to be born in a family. The
land we live on in Oxton, North Carolina has been
in my family for over two hundred years. My great
great great great grandfather was the Reverend John Chambers. He
(14:14):
was the first brother to Bill Dana as a president
in minister. But what significant is he was a freedom fighter.
He was an educator. Now this was before the Nat.
Turner Insurrection. My grandfather was born in seventeen sixty seven,
fought in the Revolutionary War, came an ordained minister, the educated.
But in the early nine eighteen thirty then Turner Insurrection happened.
(14:38):
The State of Virginia, the State of North Carolina, the
State of South Carolina, the State of Georgia, State of Alabama,
and State and Missis passed the law making it a
fella and to teach black side to read and write
a felon. So my great great grandfather was an educator.
So he set up an underground school in Grandma County,
my home county, Native County, his county, and so he
(15:00):
taught white students by day and black students secretly by night,
but they caught up with him. My grandfather was beating
the death. Back in the day there were no cars.
Every head of horse and bugget and they beat him
to death, hid his body, cut the head off of
his horses, and took the head of his horse to
(15:22):
his wife. And we never found his grave. They didn't
want us to honor him in a funeral. So I
grew up with that kind of history in my family.
I come from a generation, yes, of educators menisince I'm
in all they menister myself. But the underlying common donative
common denominated for the males and females in my family
(15:43):
were freedom fighters.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
So I had no choice, man, you know. And I
was in the fourth grade strip uh uh.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
Going back to the first grade, I knew what racism
was and and and I knew that something that we
should not have been tolerated. So I was one of
the impatient. Yeah, I was impatient in my family. And
that's why by the time I was twelve thirteen, fourteen,
I thought I was grown. I'm ready to get it on,
but get it on from the wisdom of the past.
(16:11):
And like I said, I had great mentors. And that's
when I try to be now to our brothers and
sisters today as a mentor, not just as a leader,
but as a mentor, because none of us will be
here forever. But while we are blessed to be here,
let's pass something on. Let's let's pass something wrong, so
(16:32):
the next generation won't have to go through the same
things that we go through.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
You know, well, doctor Ben, before you go, before you
go forward on that because one of the reasons why
we wanted to talk with you today. As we sat
together last night in a very private meeting. You know,
I was thinking a lot about and my son and
I have been talking about the history of this whole
(17:00):
idea of the Convention. Right, we know this is not
the first time in Convention history that there has been
major tension around different social issues. And the meeting that
we were at last night, we were specifically dealing with
the issue of black and Palestinian liberation and how our
(17:23):
struggles are intertwined. And it made me think so much
about nineteen sixty eight and the climate for which that
particular convention took place. And I know you have so
much that you can share with us about that, and
so just you know, want to give you, you know, an
opportunity to talk about nineteen sixty eight, Who were the operators?
Speaker 1 (17:49):
What was give us the tea on what was going down.
Speaker 4 (17:53):
I was a young youth delegate from no Colina, my
home state, nineteen sixty eight. And keep in mind, the
nineteen six convention happened in the wake of doctor King's assassination.
It happened in the wake of Robert Kennedy's assessments. And
then you had Richard Nixon running for president with Spiro Agnue,
(18:16):
the former governor of Maryland, who were running on a
law and order campaign, and so lor and O. It
wasn't just with the Republicans. The Democrats were also Mayor Dale,
who was a Democratic mayor, but he sik the police
on the protest, brutally beating people down as they tried
to exercise their First Amendment right. I was inside the
(18:37):
convention center and I was telling somebody last night to me,
what a change time brings.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
From sixty eight to two thousand.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
And four, we couldn't even we had to fight even
to get be able to sit down in a convention
in nineteen They didn't want black people to be delicates.
They didn't want black people to be pages. They didn't
want black people to have a media station. They don't
want They were trying to exclude black folks in nineteen sixty.
In fact, Julian Bond Fanner Lou Hayman had to go
(19:09):
to court just to.
Speaker 5 (19:10):
Get the right to sit down in the convention. So
now we run in the convention. Black women are running
the convention. You know what I'm saying. And a lot
of times to.
Speaker 4 (19:20):
Me, I'm glad you asked that question because we live
in the present and sometimes the president evil overwhelms us
or underwhelms us. Well, we we think that what's happening
today is suspended in today's reality.
Speaker 5 (19:36):
But this is a long evolutionary struggle, you know, even
in the DNC.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
And let me just point something out, Uh, the Democrats
were the original white supremacists. And my home state of
North Carolina, the Democrats were the original white supremacists who
attacked women.
Speaker 5 (19:54):
To North Carolina.
Speaker 4 (19:55):
Because blacks have formed a fusion with the Republicans, look
out the script this flip. The Republican Party was once
a part of Lincoln. Now it's the part of the
white supremacis. Now it's the party of of of far
white Uh racism and the semitism you just named it.
Speaker 6 (20:15):
When was the switch again, sir? Because there's always.
Speaker 5 (20:18):
Late late eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
Okay, late always this thing that the Republicans is actually
the party for black people, and this and that that
you don't know no history.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
You got to know that history. The script was flip flipped,
you know.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
Uh, Jessin Hams used to be a Democrat.
Speaker 5 (20:36):
He became a Republican with the Destocrats. And UH.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
These are the people who fought when Sturgod Marshingtam got
the Brown decision in nineteen twenty four, uh saying that
uh surrogate schools was unconstitutional. You had all these people
who wanted to assassinate till Good Marshall, you know, because
of that litigation, because they didn't want black and white
(21:00):
kids they ever go to school together. Because we may
find out something, and that is there's no such thing
as white superiority.
Speaker 5 (21:07):
There's no such thing in UH.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
While it lives in ideology of white supremacy, it's a
fake ideology. It has no substance, It has no anser
boula other than the brutal.
Speaker 5 (21:20):
Translantic slavery that they engage us, and.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
I want to plug a book that's coming out in
September to make I gotta get through my son, Uh
Sayty Brown, one of our writers, and the Innate we
just published.
Speaker 5 (21:33):
You know, it's coming out in September.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
And the translanda slave trade because translanda Satarde didn't just
started in sixteen nineteen, It started in fifteen hundreds. The
translation staty was going on a one hundred years before they
brought the first slave to the Virginia shore. And this brutality,
this inhumanity, Uh you know. So to me, going back
(21:57):
to Tamika's question, I'm honored just to witness what's.
Speaker 5 (22:01):
Going on here four.
Speaker 4 (22:03):
But that also means we have the responsibilities that what
are those struggles, what are those alliances we should have? Well,
what can we learn? What do we know about the
Middle East? What do we know about nineteen forty eight?
What do we know about the United Nations? What do
we know about World War two? My father was a
better than World War One? Do we know the sacrifice
(22:24):
that Black troops made going to the front line in
France fighting for democracy and then they get wounded and
they can't even come back home on the ship they
came back home on the ship the German prisons. German
prisons were treated better than black soldiers. Sup fought the Germans.
I mean all this stuff, and so I used to
ask my fastid dad, what's going on? He said, sons,
(22:48):
one day you will understand and appreciate the sacrifices that
we made. We know that racism, but we fought for
America because Spope for the one day America the Chine
And yes, America is changing, but still ain't changing fast enough,
you know.
Speaker 5 (23:02):
And that's our role.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
Each generation has to push that envelope, push those questions,
and push that reality.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
But at the same time, I am concerned about our
state of consciousness as a people.
Speaker 4 (23:15):
You know, I was involved in the Black Power when
Look when I was a kid, if you call somebody
black that was a cuss work, people will cut you out.
They think we were so ashamed of our blackness. Would
sure a claim of our call were so ashamed of
I have we show a shame of our nose, our
lips because let me just cher with you. When I
(23:36):
was in the first grade, even though there was a
black elementary school because of segregation, the white school system
told us what books we had to read. So I
learned how to read out of a book called Sambo.
And Sambo was a of a disfigured little African brother
who only ate pancakes with dripping served you all jip
(24:00):
down for you know. It was like they made him
like somebody, Well, I don't want to be like sample,
but but but but planting it in the seats of
black students in the first space.
Speaker 5 (24:13):
Well, I don't want to be black. I want to
be white.
Speaker 4 (24:17):
That's why when the butther steed with black dogs and
white dogs, a lot of black children true white dogs,
because that's how they've been miseducated.
Speaker 5 (24:26):
You know, college wasn't headed right, the miseducation of the
Negro you know.
Speaker 4 (24:31):
And so one of the fights we have in twenty
twenty four it's about education, it's about uh, it's about curriculum,
it's about consciousness.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
I'm glad you went there.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
I'm glad you a part of Project twenty twenty five,
which is the conservative Republican platform that we know Donald
Trump endorses. While he says he does not, we know
why he's denying it. But Project twenty twenty five we
know has some very very dangerous components. One of the
(25:03):
things in it, however, has attracted a number of people
that I know, doctor Benn, Black folks who have said
closing the Department of Education. They believe that that may
be sensible, right. I don't think that Project twenty twenty
five is doing it for the reasons that Black folks
want something to happen Project twenty twenty five.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
They want to change how.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
Children are educated to ensure that we are less conscious.
As you said, that their own children learn less about
our movements and our struggle, and they would like to deposit.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Into us and our people and.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Our children whatever it is that they want, that serves
only the purpose of white supremacy.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
That's what we know.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
However, there are people who have children right now in
public schools across this country that have and obviously Department
of Education is supposed to be the governing body, and
people do not feel good about how their children are
being educated. They feel their kids are being left behind.
(26:13):
They don't feel that when they approach the Department or
you know, or administration, that there's anything really being done
to deal with the disparities in education for our youth.
And so what would you say to someone who's looking
at that and saying, well, maybe for that particular.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Reason, Project twenty twenty five.
Speaker 5 (26:34):
Is good, well, thank you.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
Project twenty twenty five is the latest rendition from the
Herrigge Foundation of the institutionalized white supremacy institutionalization. And I
think when I listened to you, to me, you know
what came to mind, the Will of Lynch letter. Project
twenty five is an expansion of the Will of Lynch
(27:00):
uh uh letter that told the white supremacists how to
keep black people divided, how to keep us at each
other's strokes.
Speaker 5 (27:09):
How to miseducate us.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
And so I think that keep in mind, education is
really not controlled by the federal Education is controlled by
these local school boards by just let the state. While
the Department Education may pass a policy, but who implements
the policy. You know, a lot of states have gotten funds,
and because you have these reactions and governments, they don't
(27:31):
even distribute the funds.
Speaker 5 (27:33):
And a lot of h spc us should be getting funded.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
And and that's why what Biden herds have done so
significant by putting billions and dollars back into hpcus. But
think about all the years well we didn't get that
front you know and so, and then people try to equate,
you know, Harbored with Howard, though more house with Stamford.
Speaker 5 (27:55):
But the resources were dramatically under under source.
Speaker 4 (28:01):
So I think there's brother and sisters who are concerned
about education. Yeah, that's right, But what is the solution
to the education problem. I think education first, that's is
started in the home. We give our children off to
teachers we don't know. We give our children off to
curriculums we have now investigated.
Speaker 5 (28:19):
We go to PTA meetings. Who shows up at the
PTA meetings? Who shows up at the school board meetings?
Speaker 4 (28:24):
Who shows up at the city council, Who shows up
at the county commission meetings?
Speaker 5 (28:29):
You know? Who just rupts the state legislature. I'm so
glad that one of my.
Speaker 4 (28:34):
Mentors, the name is Golden French City and State Field
Center s LC, we got some.
Speaker 5 (28:38):
Man with the state legislature in North Carolina.
Speaker 4 (28:41):
So while they were in session, we got transferred truck
row of chickens and we backed it up and turned
the chickens to loose in the state legislature as a
protest to what the state legislature has done. So I
learned something about positive action. Around education. The reason why
the Womington tam went to jail cause of education. I'm
(29:01):
so proud of young people will put their lives on
the line to fight for education. Some of you know
here in the here in the city of Chicago, at
the United Centers, there's a statue of the greatest one
of the greatest basketball players, you know. And I think
(29:24):
that we need to realize that what we've been through
in the education process. Yes we have demands, yes we
have grievances, but the solution to our agreements is is
not Qarject twenty twenty five.
Speaker 5 (29:39):
You know, the solution to our agreements is not.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
Accommodating from the Herridge Foundation, which I'm view is it
me and month of million dollar enterprise that puts out
uh fake information and then passes that out uh. You know,
I think that they there's a debate about scholarship. There
is a debate about what truth is. There's a debate
(30:05):
about where you find it, and then once you find
the truth, how you disseminate their truth amidst this atmosphere
of all the misinformation and this information. You know, look
what happened in two twenty sixteen when Trump and press
got elected. He shouldn't have won that election. But there
was so many Russian interference. They leaven today fake accounts.
(30:26):
I get so many that when I go on social media,
I said, this ain't really no black person, you know,
you know, and then I saw it was a sad commentary. Recently,
I saw a brother in Georgia wearing a T shirt
Niggas for Trump, and he was proud of it. He
was proud to call himself a nigga. He wasqulling himself
(30:46):
to call himself Trump. This self destruction. Malcolm talked about, uh,
you know, self hatred. He talked about not loving oneself.
But you get love for oneself person in your heart,
You get love of self in your church, in your community.
Then you take that self love to the schools and
demand that Uh, not only our students learn the truth
(31:10):
about our history, but my students also need to learn
the truth because they've been missed miss educate.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Also, yeah, I wanted to ask you about the gang
conference you did, because I do a lot of work
with with at risk youth in the community, gang members.
So this black Murder campaign that we created, you know,
(31:37):
it's around just trying to gear and just connect our
youth and stop the self hate and stop the violence
in the community.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
Can you give me? Yeah. In nineteen ninety three, I
was so proud.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
I just become the young director of the NWSP and
we held the first Gang Something. Actually, the first Gang
Some was planned before I went to the NAC, planned
by the United to Christ Commisieration, Justice and other grassroots groups.
As you know in early now as there was a
war going on between East and West gangs. You know, uh,
(32:11):
it really has nothing, not so much to do with territory,
asked us much to do with how we defined or
misdefine who the enemy was. And we decided we need
to put a stop to this. So we said, well,
well we're gonna have the first Gang Something. We said
we're gonna do it in the middle of the United States.
So the brothers from the East coast had to go
to the middle of the brothers from the West clubs
comming in. So we chose Kansas City, Kansas City, Missouri,
(32:35):
and hundreds of bloods, crypts gangst the site, all kinds
of brothers and sisters. Uh, well, it was mainly brothers.
There were a few sisters main and brothers. All the
what they call shop, callers in the streets came and uh.
I remember the end was if he asked me, we're
still gonna have this gang something, I said, absolutely, we're
(32:58):
gonna have it, and uh, we're now on it and
estabfish the truth, which was important. But more importantly, we
found out that we don't have to allow.
Speaker 5 (33:08):
Other people to define who we are.
Speaker 4 (33:11):
And we decided to train change the name from games
to street organizations. We decided to change the name. You
can still be the blood and chriss, but whether you're
doing to serve the community, you know, what is our
service to our liberation? What is our service uh to
uh uh to combat and police brutality. You know, it's
(33:32):
one thing for us to get upset when white folks
goruglize us, but we don't get upset when we googlize
each other.
Speaker 5 (33:39):
There's something wrong with that script and we wanted to
change it. And I'm gonna want to give.
Speaker 4 (33:43):
You good news that once we got people around the table,
my son, people found out they had.
Speaker 5 (33:50):
Common interest rather than contrary interests. Rather than contradictory interests,
we have commons.
Speaker 4 (33:59):
You know, when we'll stopped by the police, the police
ain't gonna ask you were your blood or crypto against
the sycle. You know, they don't care what, but it
is your blackness, it is your it is what we've
been through, is the people that determines our faith.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
And so that was very successful.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
And after the Kansas City summer, we had regional summers
around uh the country.
Speaker 5 (34:23):
Uh. And then of course you know when the uh
Rodney King thing, have you know?
Speaker 4 (34:31):
Uh? A year or so later, uh, we went out
to l A. I stayed in Nickoson Gardens, Jordan Downs.
I stayed in the projects and a lot of the
end of us you own doctor staying at the Bannavinc
Hotel downtown. Law that said, no, I'm staying with the struggle.
Is it's something going down in l A. I'm going
(34:51):
down with some rise up. I'm rising up with it.
And I was so proud of the young people in
South Central because we had that truth.
Speaker 5 (35:01):
Look.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
I saw bloods and clips protecting mamas and daughters. I
saw working together. Well, your color was red, Well, your
color was blue. I remember one of the foundings of
the crypts, Who's gonna give me his uh A car?
I said, no, man, I can't drive your car because
people may think that I'm identifying with one group of another.
(35:24):
I said, I'll walk, you know, give me, give me,
give me some bullo to walk through these communities. And
one of the things to me, could you would be
proud today? You know who the shot calls are today
in the community running them projects run in South central
you know. And because a lot of the buller's in
the joint, a lot of in the cemetery. So black
(35:47):
women has risen to the occasion to take over the
quality of life and those what we call projects. Of course,
the Chicago they they they dismantled and destroyed all the projects,
made people flee the city. And that's why the city
always looks at the demographics have changed.
Speaker 5 (36:04):
Same thing in DC.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
Chocolate City used to be a black city is no
longer because you're being pushed out because of gentrification.
Speaker 5 (36:12):
But you know, I just think that I want.
Speaker 4 (36:15):
To make sure that whatever I say today on the program,
that I give some hopes of inspiration.
Speaker 5 (36:22):
I don't want to.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
See this would be your final words, So please give
us some inspiration.
Speaker 4 (36:29):
Well, thank you first of all, looking at you and
my song, I get reinspired because I see the future
in you too.
Speaker 5 (36:38):
I see the future in the colleagues that you organized
and the colleagues that you mobilize.
Speaker 4 (36:43):
And I remember when we start had the anniversaries of
the Man Man March, you start showing up because you're
an organizer, you know, putting stuff together.
Speaker 5 (36:51):
I'm so proud of you.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
And I know a lot of people came down on
you because of your association with UH, that grassroots mobilization.
Speaker 5 (37:00):
But you know what, it made you stronger. And I'm
gonna say this.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
I don't want people to think that I said, go
look for some adversity that make you stronger.
Speaker 5 (37:08):
No, that's not what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (37:10):
I'm saying that the state of affairs of our people,
we have to either let those affairs break us or
make us stronger. You know we yes, we're resilient. Where
resilians come from standing up resisians that I've come from osmosis. Well,
you know we we have we have to lift ourselves up.
Ain't nobody gonna come lift us up. We have to
(37:31):
lift ourselves up. We have to hold our hands up
with dignity, with purpose, with intergity and love. You know,
I want to close on this point. This is the
year of a black woman, Lord have us. I'm so
proud of black women. You know, they not on took
over this DNC convention. Guess whom taking all the grassroots
organizations in our community? Sisters, sister readers, sister me. I mean,
(37:53):
I'm so glad, you know, uh, you know, if we
had to do another Belly movie, it'll be about these
systems soldiers taking over.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
I just want to ask question, and I feel the
same way that you feel about our women taking over.
But what do you say to the brothers who are
feeling threatened by that? Right? Because it's such a pushback,
you know, I celebrate our black women.
Speaker 5 (38:19):
Be a very good and at very good question.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
I'm going to vote for Kamala Harris because it's a
black woman. I want to see her win. And there's
so many black men right now who are threatened by that.
Speaker 5 (38:29):
So what do you say, Well, I'm close out with
his answer.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
As a black man, I should not and cannot be
intimidated by the rise of black women, because then black
women arise.
Speaker 5 (38:43):
Guess who I see riots.
Speaker 4 (38:45):
I see my mama raps, I see my grandmother rise,
and you.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
Know, I see Queen arising. I see the.
Speaker 4 (38:54):
Warriors warriors sisters. See, that's what I'm saying. But it's
so important that we learn our history. All the warriors
were not brothers. Yes, the brothers the warriors, but sisters
the warriors too.
Speaker 5 (39:06):
No.
Speaker 4 (39:06):
Yes, we had kings, but also had queens, you know.
And so I think that this dynamic sarticklarly now by
some well some brothers intimidated by the rise of black women,
and they're.
Speaker 5 (39:20):
Using it as an excuse not to vote for Karma Harris.
Speaker 4 (39:23):
I'm gonna tell brothers, study our history, study of our consciousces.
We should, in fact, we should all be inspired as
black men by the rise of black women. Because when
black women rise, the whole family rights, when black men rise,
the whole family rights. We can't afford this conflict between
black men and black women. What we need to do
(39:46):
is embrace one another, embrace the success of one another.
And if one of us fall, whether they're a sister
or brother, let's pick that brother or that sister up.
Let's march together, let's fight together. And if we march
together and together, my son, we will win together.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
And you said it all, doctor Ben, We appreciaiate you,
we love you, thank you for everything. You're young and
you continue to do and I'm just great gracious to
be able to have you as one of the individuals
that I could reach out to.
Speaker 5 (40:15):
Please, thank you, God bless you. Okay, thank you for this.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
Thank you. I love you so much.
Speaker 2 (40:21):
By shout out to doctor ben Chaves. As you know,
we are in the DNC and Tamika had to go
to a panel, so shout out to her for this
amazing discussion. When you listen to brothers like doctor ben Chaevis,
who has so much deep history, and you listen to
what he's accomplished and the errors he would like, it's
(40:43):
a it's a shame that they want to do away
with history like that. They don't want to notify you
and educate you about brothers like doctor ben Chavers.
Speaker 6 (40:52):
When you when you.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
Listen to this is what this is a person that
they would call a DEI high right, they would talk
about identity policy. But when you listen to this man,
he is probably one of the most intelligent people in
the world. He told you how he went to an
HBCU and then when he transferred to North Carolina.
Speaker 6 (41:11):
He was ahead of the game. Right, So they might
they try to make you.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
Seem like the education in HBCUs isn't equal, equal, or
superior to you know, education in other schools. But that's
obviously not the truth, because when you look at our
brilliant Black people who've.
Speaker 6 (41:29):
Done so much throughout history, who who.
Speaker 2 (41:32):
Have acclimated and ascended in every area of life, you
know a lot of them come from HBCUs. So now
they try to weaponize this DEI tag and this identity politics.
I tell people all the times I have no problem
with identity politics. I'm with everybody black. I want to
(41:54):
see black people get equity, I want to see them
get justice. I want to see us get to the
level that we deserve to be at because we've been
denied those things. So me wanting to see positive things
for my people does not mean that I want to
see negative for anybody else. I just want to see
my people reach the level that everybody else's people. And
there's nothing wrong with that. And people will try to
(42:16):
make you think it's something wrong with that. As I'm
at this DNC convention, surrounded by black excellence, as I
watched the DNC conference last night and seeing black excellence
and seeing leaders that I know came from grassroots organizations,
people that I know is on the ground with me,
be in positions of power to be able to change
and make laws and policy. As I see a black
(42:37):
woman running for president and ahead in the polls, I am,
I am motivated. I am motivated because I feel like
things to happen, and I feel like there's things happening.
Anybody who's not motivated by that as a black person,
I don't know what to tell you. I don't know
what your motivation is, but I know I'm motivated. I
(42:59):
know our kids look into a room like that. They
know what they can be when you hear someone like
doctor Chavis and understand what he the way he paved,
he talked about how his grandfather lost his life. He
lost his life to teach right so that he can
be where he is today right. And every generation is
(43:20):
responsible for his own liberation. So now it's time for
us to be responsible for our liberation. So I'm gonna
do everything I possibly can to contribute to that. I'm
gonna stand ten toes down. I'm not gonna be distracted
by haters, by bots, by whoever you try to send
to determ me. I'm gonna speak truth to power every time,
(43:40):
because when you tell the truth, you don't gotta think
about it. You can sleep good at night every night
when you tell the truth every night. I'm gonna sleep
good at night because I know I tell the truth,
and I stand firm on truth and everything that I say,
I believe in my heart.
Speaker 6 (43:55):
There's nothing that can sway me from.
Speaker 2 (43:56):
My beliefs unless you could tell me something that is
that that conflicts that's right, unless you can tell me
a truth that conflicts my truth, that tells me that
the truth.
Speaker 6 (44:08):
That I have is wrong.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
I'm staying firm and I'm ten toes down on that,
and with that brings me to another end. It brings
me to the end of another episode of TMI. Shout
out to Tamika Hope, she's having a dope panel. Shout
out to doctor ben Chevis. Shout out to all of
the fans. We appreciate y'all. We're gonna try to give
you more content from the DNC. I'm gonna go out
(44:31):
and see who else I can meet, who else I
can interview, so that y'all can get some of this knowledge,
because this black knowledge that they're trying to not put
in these books is out here, and we got historians
like doctor Ben Chavis, and there's so many others out here.
So hopefully I'll run into some and we get some
of these interviews and get you some of this information.
But a twilding, I appreciate you. I'm not gonna always
(44:51):
be right, Tamika D. Mallori is not gonna always be wrong,
but we will both always and I mean always be
authentic until next time.
Speaker 1 (45:00):
That so that, so that, so.
Speaker 6 (45:09):
Check out the video version.
Speaker 3 (45:10):
Of TMO every single Wednesday on Iwoman dot TV.
Speaker 6 (45:15):
That's how we
I'm Tamika D.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Mallory and it shit Boy my sona General.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
We are your host of TMI.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Tamika and my Son's Information, Truth, Motivation and.
Speaker 3 (00:09):
Inspiration New Energy. Hello everybody, this is a new episode
of TMI, and it is the summer. It's August, and
so you know, things have been a little bit different
in terms of what we've been doing with the show
during this month. But we will be back to our
(00:30):
regularly scheduled programming come September after our semi vacation, but
it's not really a vacation because we still have been
bringing you all very very important content. Last week, my
son sat down with a group of brothers many that
I respect, all of them that I respect, and had
(00:52):
a really really powerful conversation and I hope that you
all have an opportunity to listen into that.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
We're back to my Son the General. You're back.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
We're here for another week, and today we're jumping straight
into an interview with a very very important political and
civil rights icon.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
We are at the convention.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
We're literally in Chicago at the DNC, and so there's
so much happening.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
If you could see everything.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Going on on the other side, of this device, you
would know how how busy it is. But it was
very important for us to bring context because one of
the things that I think we both know, my son,
is that the Internet is telling us all types of things. Misinformation,
people uninformed, people don't know history, people really don't understand
(01:48):
the road that has been traveled to get not only
to this moment, but the fights that have taken place
and the struggle that has gone on in our world
and certain me in America, in Black America for a
long time. And so we asked this icon to join
us this morning. And if you don't know who he is,
(02:10):
please do your research. We are talking with doctor Benjamin Chaevs,
not just Ben Chavis we so used to calling him.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Ben Chavs. Is doctor Benjamin Chavs, and he his.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Current job is the President and CEO of the National
Newspaper Publishers Association. That's the National Newspaper Publishers Association n NPA.
But he has you have you are here with us
so many other things that make you a legend.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
That's your current.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Work that you are involved in, which is still a
form of activism, telling our stories to us by us
in black newspapers all across the country, and I'm sure
you there. You know it expands beyond that, but you
are truly a legend in the civil rights movement. We
just want to welcome you and thank you so much
for joining us this morning.
Speaker 4 (03:05):
Well, thank you, Tamika, my son. I'm so honored to
be in your presence. You know, Fredick doesn't said it best.
Freedom is a conscious drugg say. Each generation I'm so
proud of has risen to the occasion. And it's not
just a simple matter of passion. At the time, I
wish it was that simple. It was really how to
(03:29):
renew and regenerate our consciousness as a people.
Speaker 5 (03:33):
Who are we in the world, Who are we in America?
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Not only what our past has been, but how does
our pass inform our presence and our future. That's why
I'm so honored to be here with you at the
Democratic National Convention, this pivotal moment in world history.
Speaker 5 (03:51):
You know, you know, soroart the system.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
I want you to know all of my family, my mother,
my sisters, my grandmother, all akas so I got a
lot of pink and green in Oxford, North Carolina.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
Oh so your family, your family picked the right sorority
to be a part of. I just want to make
sure everybody knows very serious matter. And Vice President Harrison
also an AKA, so you know we're on the right track.
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Absolutely absolutely. But I'm a native of Oxford, North Carolina.
I was born in nineteen forty eight, so I grew
up in the nineteen fifties when everything was racially segregated.
But you know, even though things were segregated, I learned
so much about black history, black knowledge, black scholarship, black excellence.
(04:38):
And you know, I didn't know that much about white
people because I was separated from you know, I knew
about your question. I knew about a popeive, but I
never saw a white student to my sophomore year in college.
Speaker 6 (04:50):
Wow, and what college did you go to?
Speaker 1 (04:53):
That?
Speaker 4 (04:53):
To Ben, the first college was Santa Dustin's College at
HBCU and Raleigh, North Carolina and.
Speaker 5 (04:59):
Then answer to UNC. I was a chemistry major.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
And when I tried to get into UH in North
Carolina State, which is the white school or UNC the West,
they told me they were not accepting black students unless
I majored in music. That was I said, no, I
want to major in science and young Robert music, but
that wasn't my field, and so I was dissuaded, which
(05:26):
is fine because going to the HBCU the first couple
of years was the best decision of my life. And
uh he gave me a grounded So by the time
I transferred to University of All Carolina to finish my
chemistry degree, I actually was ahead of the white students.
Speaker 5 (05:41):
They used to say, well, where did you come from?
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Who taught you this organic chemistry and physical chemistry?
Speaker 5 (05:47):
And uh, you know nucle can, I said, some black
teachers at a black school. That's what talk.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
Because you know, I think sometimes we underestimate not only
where we get education, but how we get our education.
And so I grew up in the movement. I was
got my NAACP car when I was twelve years old.
I started working for SELC Doctor my little kingdom. When
I was fourteen. Put my age up. We're not supposed
(06:16):
to drive to sixteens. I put my age up. I
had mobility. I was driving. You know, I grew up fast.
James Bonder now became very close friends and he used
to tell me them parting some writing that the pen
is powerful them to saw it. So I started writing
for the Black Press when I'm eleven years old in
the sixth grade, and now, as God would have it,
(06:38):
for the last eleven years, I've been to president of
the CEO of Other Black Press of American National Newspaper
Public and Association. But as to me, could say it
in the intro, what I do now is informed by
many decades of other struggle. To me, when you have challenges,
that's preparation. I once asked Reginald Lewis, who was the
(07:00):
first black beading. I said, Regel, tell me one word
out of the English language that led to your financial success,
and he said, preparation, preparation. We have to prepare ourselves
to deal with the struggles. We prepare ourselves to learn.
And then I started working in the African liberation movements
in Africa.
Speaker 5 (07:20):
I joined the a n C.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
I used to write for the a n C, the
Afghan Acts and youth publication of the SPARE while I
was you know, in college and high school. And then
from nineteen sixty three to nineteen sixty eight I was
the youth coordinator for SELA Christians Leadership Conference until the
day that doctor King was killed in nineteen sixty eighty
(07:44):
and eight. So I've been around the blocks a few times.
But you know what, my Sogning Tamika, most of them
sister in the community that they don't know about the
nap or the mean Man March.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
They know me from the movie Ballet. I was the
minister in Bellet.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
You know, I just told you that I was about
I was about to bring that up.
Speaker 6 (08:03):
Just now.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
I go to anyhood and they said, that's the minister Flue.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
But that shows you the importance though not only our
all tradition, but our our our image, our visual tradition,
particularly now among millennials and generation disease. Not only what
we hear or even what we see a hip hop.
Hip hop is what you feel. It's just not what
(08:28):
you see, but what you hear is what you feel.
And so I think our movement has been successful to
the extent to which we can not only yes, people
can feel our impression oh pressure, but can people feel
our liberation and people feel what we need to do to.
Speaker 5 (08:46):
Change our quality of life.
Speaker 4 (08:47):
And that's why I have so much respect for you
what you're and Tabika do, because you help people feel
the reality of our struggle for freedom, justice and required andy.
Speaker 5 (08:58):
I'm sorry, I'm gonna give you a short answers to no.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I just first of all, it is an honor to
be able to interview you, to be able to know you,
to be in space with you, to get you know,
be able to be tutored by just listening to you,
you know, last night, talking all the times I've been
in your presence, and just hearing the wisdom that you
have and knowing how legendary you are.
Speaker 6 (09:22):
And it's a shame.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
That our youth are not only no belly, right, is
only no belly. But when you listen to the history
you know that you've you've been through. I just want
to know, like, what what were some of the things
that you you picked up working with doctor King?
Speaker 5 (09:42):
Well, I picked up working doctor King.
Speaker 1 (09:44):
Is that.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
You know the eloquence behind the podium, The eloquence on
the stage of life is informed by what happens off
the stage. It's informed by what happens before you get
to the before you get the mic. You know, before
you can drop the mic. You got a hold of money,
you know what I'm saying. So as we pick up
(10:09):
the mic of like I'm talking about, as we broadcast
as like we're doing now as we articulate, as we
disseminate information, you know, we're informed by our lived experience.
And so I've been blessed to me and my sign
to have had lived experiences with doctor King, live experiences
(10:30):
with Malcolm X, lived experiences with Minister farra Con, lived
experiences with doctor Doctor Height, lived experiences with Rose the Pause,
lived experiences, you know, Nelson.
Speaker 5 (10:42):
Mandela, winning Mandela.
Speaker 4 (10:45):
I was with Cuban troops on the ground, and I
was in the fox over to the troops fighting the
South African potactic dream in the mid nineteen eighties. Because
one of the things I found out that you know,
it's one thing to talk liberation, It's one thing uh
engage in armstructure. It's another thing to engage in putting
your life on the front line.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
You know.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Look, I spent most of the nineteen seventies in prison
because I be very honest.
Speaker 5 (11:11):
I was mad.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
I was mad as hell, and they killed Actor King
in nineteen sixty eight. But I learned the channel of
my anger into something a modus operandi that could help
inspire to make sure his dream was not assassinated.
Speaker 6 (11:23):
How long were you incarcerated, Doctor Ben.
Speaker 4 (11:26):
Six and a half years, but I had a thirty
four year sentence. I spent most of the nineteen seventies
in prison. The women to ten case, that's a whole
I could talk to you about the whole program that
they just on the Wilmington tent alone.
Speaker 5 (11:38):
I'm so proud of the young people and women.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
In all Carolina who stood up to racial white supremacy
in the school system.
Speaker 5 (11:47):
And because they stood up.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Eight high school student leaders, sixteen seventeen, eighteen year olds, myself,
I was only twenty three years old and a white
anti poverty work a woman who was also a Hurrunners.
Speaker 5 (12:02):
With ten of us were sent us to two hundred
and eighteen years in prison, and I had to launch
sentence thirty four thirty four years. And so the analogy
is when I heard that Donald Trump had thirty four convictions,
thirty four felons, I said, with damn, I wonder how
much time, how he's gonna get it, you know. And
of course we got that time because we bought white supremacy.
(12:25):
But one of the things I learned from doctor King
that is so big.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
I really don't I don't want you to brush past that,
because that's real.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
That is so so significant.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
Not that you were, which you know, we don't have
any judgment on this show around what people may have
done and how they you know, what road they traveled,
But you weren't scamming and killing or any of that.
Your path to being incarcerated was because of your involvement
(12:59):
in the civil rights movement.
Speaker 5 (13:01):
Yes, absolutely, and I think that to Meka.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
I'm always indebted to my mentors. I had great mentors,
claud Mchison who founded the Conservational Quality you know, Margaine
the Kingdom founded the Silicary's Leadership Conference.
Speaker 5 (13:19):
I used to drive, I told the car.
Speaker 4 (13:21):
Yes, I used to drive his father, Cleave Sellers and
Stoker Cormack around when they were in Snick because back
in the day, you just want any one black odersas
you in every black if it was black, I'm in.
Speaker 5 (13:34):
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
That sounds like my parents and my life. How I
grew up in Harlem. We went to the Nation of Islam.
We went to National Action Network, we went to the
Black Church, we went to the street corners, we went
to anything that had to do with black empowerment. At
the slave Theater, my parents were there.
Speaker 4 (13:53):
So it was one thing I guess I should point
out anthropologically and geneologically, I was really blessed to me
and my son to be born in a family. The
land we live on in Oxton, North Carolina has been
in my family for over two hundred years. My great
great great great grandfather was the Reverend John Chambers. He
(14:14):
was the first brother to Bill Dana as a president
in minister. But what significant is he was a freedom fighter.
He was an educator. Now this was before the Nat.
Turner Insurrection. My grandfather was born in seventeen sixty seven,
fought in the Revolutionary War, came an ordained minister, the educated.
But in the early nine eighteen thirty then Turner Insurrection happened.
(14:38):
The State of Virginia, the State of North Carolina, the
State of South Carolina, the State of Georgia, State of Alabama,
and State and Missis passed the law making it a
fella and to teach black side to read and write
a felon. So my great great grandfather was an educator.
So he set up an underground school in Grandma County,
my home county, Native County, his county, and so he
(15:00):
taught white students by day and black students secretly by night,
but they caught up with him. My grandfather was beating
the death. Back in the day there were no cars.
Every head of horse and bugget and they beat him
to death, hid his body, cut the head off of
his horses, and took the head of his horse to
(15:22):
his wife. And we never found his grave. They didn't
want us to honor him in a funeral. So I
grew up with that kind of history in my family.
I come from a generation, yes, of educators menisince I'm
in all they menister myself. But the underlying common donative
common denominated for the males and females in my family
(15:43):
were freedom fighters.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
So I had no choice, man, you know. And I
was in the fourth grade strip uh uh.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
Going back to the first grade, I knew what racism
was and and and I knew that something that we
should not have been tolerated. So I was one of
the impatient. Yeah, I was impatient in my family. And
that's why by the time I was twelve thirteen, fourteen,
I thought I was grown. I'm ready to get it on,
but get it on from the wisdom of the past.
(16:11):
And like I said, I had great mentors. And that's
when I try to be now to our brothers and
sisters today as a mentor, not just as a leader,
but as a mentor, because none of us will be
here forever. But while we are blessed to be here,
let's pass something on. Let's let's pass something wrong, so
(16:32):
the next generation won't have to go through the same
things that we go through.
Speaker 3 (16:40):
You know, well, doctor Ben, before you go, before you
go forward on that because one of the reasons why
we wanted to talk with you today. As we sat
together last night in a very private meeting. You know,
I was thinking a lot about and my son and
I have been talking about the history of this whole
(17:00):
idea of the Convention. Right, we know this is not
the first time in Convention history that there has been
major tension around different social issues. And the meeting that
we were at last night, we were specifically dealing with
the issue of black and Palestinian liberation and how our
(17:23):
struggles are intertwined. And it made me think so much
about nineteen sixty eight and the climate for which that
particular convention took place. And I know you have so
much that you can share with us about that, and
so just you know, want to give you, you know, an
opportunity to talk about nineteen sixty eight, Who were the operators?
Speaker 1 (17:49):
What was give us the tea on what was going down.
Speaker 4 (17:53):
I was a young youth delegate from no Colina, my
home state, nineteen sixty eight. And keep in mind, the
nineteen six convention happened in the wake of doctor King's assassination.
It happened in the wake of Robert Kennedy's assessments. And
then you had Richard Nixon running for president with Spiro Agnue,
(18:16):
the former governor of Maryland, who were running on a
law and order campaign, and so lor and O. It
wasn't just with the Republicans. The Democrats were also Mayor Dale,
who was a Democratic mayor, but he sik the police
on the protest, brutally beating people down as they tried
to exercise their First Amendment right. I was inside the
(18:37):
convention center and I was telling somebody last night to me,
what a change time brings.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
From sixty eight to two thousand.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
And four, we couldn't even we had to fight even
to get be able to sit down in a convention
in nineteen They didn't want black people to be delicates.
They didn't want black people to be pages. They didn't
want black people to have a media station. They don't
want They were trying to exclude black folks in nineteen sixty.
In fact, Julian Bond Fanner Lou Hayman had to go
(19:09):
to court just to.
Speaker 5 (19:10):
Get the right to sit down in the convention. So
now we run in the convention. Black women are running
the convention. You know what I'm saying. And a lot
of times to.
Speaker 4 (19:20):
Me, I'm glad you asked that question because we live
in the present and sometimes the president evil overwhelms us
or underwhelms us. Well, we we think that what's happening
today is suspended in today's reality.
Speaker 5 (19:36):
But this is a long evolutionary struggle, you know, even
in the DNC.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
And let me just point something out, Uh, the Democrats
were the original white supremacists. And my home state of
North Carolina, the Democrats were the original white supremacists who
attacked women.
Speaker 5 (19:54):
To North Carolina.
Speaker 4 (19:55):
Because blacks have formed a fusion with the Republicans, look
out the script this flip. The Republican Party was once
a part of Lincoln. Now it's the part of the
white supremacis. Now it's the party of of of far
white Uh racism and the semitism you just named it.
Speaker 6 (20:15):
When was the switch again, sir? Because there's always.
Speaker 5 (20:18):
Late late eighteen hundreds.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
Okay, late always this thing that the Republicans is actually
the party for black people, and this and that that
you don't know no history.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
You got to know that history. The script was flip flipped,
you know.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
Uh, Jessin Hams used to be a Democrat.
Speaker 5 (20:36):
He became a Republican with the Destocrats. And UH.
Speaker 4 (20:39):
These are the people who fought when Sturgod Marshingtam got
the Brown decision in nineteen twenty four, uh saying that
uh surrogate schools was unconstitutional. You had all these people
who wanted to assassinate till Good Marshall, you know, because
of that litigation, because they didn't want black and white
(21:00):
kids they ever go to school together. Because we may
find out something, and that is there's no such thing
as white superiority.
Speaker 5 (21:07):
There's no such thing in UH.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
While it lives in ideology of white supremacy, it's a
fake ideology. It has no substance, It has no anser
boula other than the brutal.
Speaker 5 (21:20):
Translantic slavery that they engage us, and.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
I want to plug a book that's coming out in
September to make I gotta get through my son, Uh
Sayty Brown, one of our writers, and the Innate we
just published.
Speaker 5 (21:33):
You know, it's coming out in September.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
And the translanda slave trade because translanda Satarde didn't just
started in sixteen nineteen, It started in fifteen hundreds. The
translation staty was going on a one hundred years before they
brought the first slave to the Virginia shore. And this brutality,
this inhumanity, Uh you know. So to me, going back
(21:57):
to Tamika's question, I'm honored just to witness what's.
Speaker 5 (22:01):
Going on here four.
Speaker 4 (22:03):
But that also means we have the responsibilities that what
are those struggles, what are those alliances we should have? Well,
what can we learn? What do we know about the
Middle East? What do we know about nineteen forty eight?
What do we know about the United Nations? What do
we know about World War two? My father was a
better than World War One? Do we know the sacrifice
(22:24):
that Black troops made going to the front line in
France fighting for democracy and then they get wounded and
they can't even come back home on the ship they
came back home on the ship the German prisons. German
prisons were treated better than black soldiers. Sup fought the Germans.
I mean all this stuff, and so I used to
ask my fastid dad, what's going on? He said, sons,
(22:48):
one day you will understand and appreciate the sacrifices that
we made. We know that racism, but we fought for
America because Spope for the one day America the Chine
And yes, America is changing, but still ain't changing fast enough,
you know.
Speaker 5 (23:02):
And that's our role.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
Each generation has to push that envelope, push those questions,
and push that reality.
Speaker 5 (23:10):
But at the same time, I am concerned about our
state of consciousness as a people.
Speaker 4 (23:15):
You know, I was involved in the Black Power when
Look when I was a kid, if you call somebody
black that was a cuss work, people will cut you out.
They think we were so ashamed of our blackness. Would
sure a claim of our call were so ashamed of
I have we show a shame of our nose, our
lips because let me just cher with you. When I
(23:36):
was in the first grade, even though there was a
black elementary school because of segregation, the white school system
told us what books we had to read. So I
learned how to read out of a book called Sambo.
And Sambo was a of a disfigured little African brother
who only ate pancakes with dripping served you all jip
(24:00):
down for you know. It was like they made him
like somebody, Well, I don't want to be like sample,
but but but but planting it in the seats of
black students in the first space.
Speaker 5 (24:13):
Well, I don't want to be black. I want to
be white.
Speaker 4 (24:17):
That's why when the butther steed with black dogs and
white dogs, a lot of black children true white dogs,
because that's how they've been miseducated.
Speaker 5 (24:26):
You know, college wasn't headed right, the miseducation of the
Negro you know.
Speaker 4 (24:31):
And so one of the fights we have in twenty
twenty four it's about education, it's about uh, it's about curriculum,
it's about consciousness.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
I'm glad you went there.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
I'm glad you a part of Project twenty twenty five,
which is the conservative Republican platform that we know Donald
Trump endorses. While he says he does not, we know
why he's denying it. But Project twenty twenty five we
know has some very very dangerous components. One of the
(25:03):
things in it, however, has attracted a number of people
that I know, doctor Benn, Black folks who have said
closing the Department of Education. They believe that that may
be sensible, right. I don't think that Project twenty twenty
five is doing it for the reasons that Black folks
want something to happen Project twenty twenty five.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
They want to change how.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
Children are educated to ensure that we are less conscious.
As you said, that their own children learn less about
our movements and our struggle, and they would like to deposit.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
Into us and our people and.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Our children whatever it is that they want, that serves
only the purpose of white supremacy.
Speaker 1 (25:51):
That's what we know.
Speaker 3 (25:53):
However, there are people who have children right now in
public schools across this country that have and obviously Department
of Education is supposed to be the governing body, and
people do not feel good about how their children are
being educated. They feel their kids are being left behind.
(26:13):
They don't feel that when they approach the Department or
you know, or administration, that there's anything really being done
to deal with the disparities in education for our youth.
And so what would you say to someone who's looking
at that and saying, well, maybe for that particular.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Reason, Project twenty twenty five.
Speaker 5 (26:34):
Is good, well, thank you.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
Project twenty twenty five is the latest rendition from the
Herrigge Foundation of the institutionalized white supremacy institutionalization. And I
think when I listened to you, to me, you know
what came to mind, the Will of Lynch letter. Project
twenty five is an expansion of the Will of Lynch
(27:00):
uh uh letter that told the white supremacists how to
keep black people divided, how to keep us at each
other's strokes.
Speaker 5 (27:09):
How to miseducate us.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
And so I think that keep in mind, education is
really not controlled by the federal Education is controlled by
these local school boards by just let the state. While
the Department Education may pass a policy, but who implements
the policy. You know, a lot of states have gotten funds,
and because you have these reactions and governments, they don't
(27:31):
even distribute the funds.
Speaker 5 (27:33):
And a lot of h spc us should be getting funded.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
And and that's why what Biden herds have done so
significant by putting billions and dollars back into hpcus. But
think about all the years well we didn't get that
front you know and so, and then people try to equate,
you know, Harbored with Howard, though more house with Stamford.
Speaker 5 (27:55):
But the resources were dramatically under under source.
Speaker 4 (28:01):
So I think there's brother and sisters who are concerned
about education. Yeah, that's right, But what is the solution
to the education problem. I think education first, that's is
started in the home. We give our children off to
teachers we don't know. We give our children off to
curriculums we have now investigated.
Speaker 5 (28:19):
We go to PTA meetings. Who shows up at the
PTA meetings? Who shows up at the school board meetings?
Speaker 4 (28:24):
Who shows up at the city council, Who shows up
at the county commission meetings?
Speaker 5 (28:29):
You know? Who just rupts the state legislature. I'm so
glad that one of my.
Speaker 4 (28:34):
Mentors, the name is Golden French City and State Field
Center s LC, we got some.
Speaker 5 (28:38):
Man with the state legislature in North Carolina.
Speaker 4 (28:41):
So while they were in session, we got transferred truck
row of chickens and we backed it up and turned
the chickens to loose in the state legislature as a
protest to what the state legislature has done. So I
learned something about positive action. Around education. The reason why
the Womington tam went to jail cause of education. I'm
(29:01):
so proud of young people will put their lives on
the line to fight for education. Some of you know
here in the here in the city of Chicago, at
the United Centers, there's a statue of the greatest one
of the greatest basketball players, you know. And I think
(29:24):
that we need to realize that what we've been through
in the education process. Yes we have demands, yes we
have grievances, but the solution to our agreements is is
not Qarject twenty twenty five.
Speaker 5 (29:39):
You know, the solution to our agreements is not.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
Accommodating from the Herridge Foundation, which I'm view is it
me and month of million dollar enterprise that puts out
uh fake information and then passes that out uh. You know,
I think that they there's a debate about scholarship. There
is a debate about what truth is. There's a debate
(30:05):
about where you find it, and then once you find
the truth, how you disseminate their truth amidst this atmosphere
of all the misinformation and this information. You know, look
what happened in two twenty sixteen when Trump and press
got elected. He shouldn't have won that election. But there
was so many Russian interference. They leaven today fake accounts.
(30:26):
I get so many that when I go on social media,
I said, this ain't really no black person, you know,
you know, and then I saw it was a sad commentary. Recently,
I saw a brother in Georgia wearing a T shirt
Niggas for Trump, and he was proud of it. He
was proud to call himself a nigga. He wasqulling himself
(30:46):
to call himself Trump. This self destruction. Malcolm talked about, uh,
you know, self hatred. He talked about not loving oneself.
But you get love for oneself person in your heart,
You get love of self in your church, in your community.
Then you take that self love to the schools and
demand that Uh, not only our students learn the truth
(31:10):
about our history, but my students also need to learn
the truth because they've been missed miss educate.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Also, yeah, I wanted to ask you about the gang
conference you did, because I do a lot of work
with with at risk youth in the community, gang members.
So this black Murder campaign that we created, you know,
(31:37):
it's around just trying to gear and just connect our
youth and stop the self hate and stop the violence
in the community.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
Can you give me? Yeah. In nineteen ninety three, I
was so proud.
Speaker 4 (31:49):
I just become the young director of the NWSP and
we held the first Gang Something. Actually, the first Gang
Some was planned before I went to the NAC, planned
by the United to Christ Commisieration, Justice and other grassroots groups.
As you know in early now as there was a
war going on between East and West gangs. You know, uh,
(32:11):
it really has nothing, not so much to do with territory,
asked us much to do with how we defined or
misdefine who the enemy was. And we decided we need
to put a stop to this. So we said, well,
well we're gonna have the first Gang Something. We said
we're gonna do it in the middle of the United States.
So the brothers from the East coast had to go
to the middle of the brothers from the West clubs
comming in. So we chose Kansas City, Kansas City, Missouri,
(32:35):
and hundreds of bloods, crypts gangst the site, all kinds
of brothers and sisters. Uh, well, it was mainly brothers.
There were a few sisters main and brothers. All the
what they call shop, callers in the streets came and uh.
I remember the end was if he asked me, we're
still gonna have this gang something, I said, absolutely, we're
(32:58):
gonna have it, and uh, we're now on it and
estabfish the truth, which was important. But more importantly, we
found out that we don't have to allow.
Speaker 5 (33:08):
Other people to define who we are.
Speaker 4 (33:11):
And we decided to train change the name from games
to street organizations. We decided to change the name. You
can still be the blood and chriss, but whether you're
doing to serve the community, you know, what is our
service to our liberation? What is our service uh to
uh uh to combat and police brutality. You know, it's
(33:32):
one thing for us to get upset when white folks
goruglize us, but we don't get upset when we googlize
each other.
Speaker 5 (33:39):
There's something wrong with that script and we wanted to
change it. And I'm gonna want to give.
Speaker 4 (33:43):
You good news that once we got people around the table,
my son, people found out they had.
Speaker 5 (33:50):
Common interest rather than contrary interests. Rather than contradictory interests,
we have commons.
Speaker 4 (33:59):
You know, when we'll stopped by the police, the police
ain't gonna ask you were your blood or crypto against
the sycle. You know, they don't care what, but it
is your blackness, it is your it is what we've
been through, is the people that determines our faith.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
And so that was very successful.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
And after the Kansas City summer, we had regional summers
around uh the country.
Speaker 5 (34:23):
Uh. And then of course you know when the uh
Rodney King thing, have you know?
Speaker 4 (34:31):
Uh? A year or so later, uh, we went out
to l A. I stayed in Nickoson Gardens, Jordan Downs.
I stayed in the projects and a lot of the
end of us you own doctor staying at the Bannavinc
Hotel downtown. Law that said, no, I'm staying with the struggle.
Is it's something going down in l A. I'm going
(34:51):
down with some rise up. I'm rising up with it.
And I was so proud of the young people in
South Central because we had that truth.
Speaker 5 (35:01):
Look.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
I saw bloods and clips protecting mamas and daughters. I
saw working together. Well, your color was red, Well, your
color was blue. I remember one of the foundings of
the crypts, Who's gonna give me his uh A car?
I said, no, man, I can't drive your car because
people may think that I'm identifying with one group of another.
(35:24):
I said, I'll walk, you know, give me, give me,
give me some bullo to walk through these communities. And
one of the things to me, could you would be
proud today? You know who the shot calls are today
in the community running them projects run in South central
you know. And because a lot of the buller's in
the joint, a lot of in the cemetery. So black
(35:47):
women has risen to the occasion to take over the
quality of life and those what we call projects. Of course,
the Chicago they they they dismantled and destroyed all the projects,
made people flee the city. And that's why the city
always looks at the demographics have changed.
Speaker 5 (36:04):
Same thing in DC.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
Chocolate City used to be a black city is no
longer because you're being pushed out because of gentrification.
Speaker 5 (36:12):
But you know, I just think that I want.
Speaker 4 (36:15):
To make sure that whatever I say today on the program,
that I give some hopes of inspiration.
Speaker 5 (36:22):
I don't want to.
Speaker 3 (36:23):
See this would be your final words, So please give
us some inspiration.
Speaker 4 (36:29):
Well, thank you first of all, looking at you and
my song, I get reinspired because I see the future
in you too.
Speaker 5 (36:38):
I see the future in the colleagues that you organized
and the colleagues that you mobilize.
Speaker 4 (36:43):
And I remember when we start had the anniversaries of
the Man Man March, you start showing up because you're
an organizer, you know, putting stuff together.
Speaker 5 (36:51):
I'm so proud of you.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
And I know a lot of people came down on
you because of your association with UH, that grassroots mobilization.
Speaker 5 (37:00):
But you know what, it made you stronger. And I'm
gonna say this.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
I don't want people to think that I said, go
look for some adversity that make you stronger.
Speaker 5 (37:08):
No, that's not what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (37:10):
I'm saying that the state of affairs of our people,
we have to either let those affairs break us or
make us stronger. You know we yes, we're resilient. Where
resilians come from standing up resisians that I've come from osmosis. Well,
you know we we have we have to lift ourselves up.
Ain't nobody gonna come lift us up. We have to
(37:31):
lift ourselves up. We have to hold our hands up
with dignity, with purpose, with intergity and love. You know,
I want to close on this point. This is the
year of a black woman, Lord have us. I'm so
proud of black women. You know, they not on took
over this DNC convention. Guess whom taking all the grassroots
organizations in our community? Sisters, sister readers, sister me. I mean,
(37:53):
I'm so glad, you know, uh, you know, if we
had to do another Belly movie, it'll be about these
systems soldiers taking over.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
I just want to ask question, and I feel the
same way that you feel about our women taking over.
But what do you say to the brothers who are
feeling threatened by that? Right? Because it's such a pushback,
you know, I celebrate our black women.
Speaker 5 (38:19):
Be a very good and at very good question.
Speaker 2 (38:22):
I'm going to vote for Kamala Harris because it's a
black woman. I want to see her win. And there's
so many black men right now who are threatened by that.
Speaker 5 (38:29):
So what do you say, Well, I'm close out with
his answer.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
As a black man, I should not and cannot be
intimidated by the rise of black women, because then black
women arise.
Speaker 5 (38:43):
Guess who I see riots.
Speaker 4 (38:45):
I see my mama raps, I see my grandmother rise,
and you.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
Know, I see Queen arising. I see the.
Speaker 4 (38:54):
Warriors warriors sisters. See, that's what I'm saying. But it's
so important that we learn our history. All the warriors
were not brothers. Yes, the brothers the warriors, but sisters
the warriors too.
Speaker 5 (39:06):
No.
Speaker 4 (39:06):
Yes, we had kings, but also had queens, you know.
And so I think that this dynamic sarticklarly now by
some well some brothers intimidated by the rise of black women,
and they're.
Speaker 5 (39:20):
Using it as an excuse not to vote for Karma Harris.
Speaker 4 (39:23):
I'm gonna tell brothers, study our history, study of our consciousces.
We should, in fact, we should all be inspired as
black men by the rise of black women. Because when
black women rise, the whole family rights, when black men rise,
the whole family rights. We can't afford this conflict between
black men and black women. What we need to do
(39:46):
is embrace one another, embrace the success of one another.
And if one of us fall, whether they're a sister
or brother, let's pick that brother or that sister up.
Let's march together, let's fight together. And if we march
together and together, my son, we will win together.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
And you said it all, doctor Ben, We appreciaiate you,
we love you, thank you for everything. You're young and
you continue to do and I'm just great gracious to
be able to have you as one of the individuals
that I could reach out to.
Speaker 5 (40:15):
Please, thank you, God bless you. Okay, thank you for this.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
Thank you. I love you so much.
Speaker 2 (40:21):
By shout out to doctor ben Chaves. As you know,
we are in the DNC and Tamika had to go
to a panel, so shout out to her for this
amazing discussion. When you listen to brothers like doctor ben Chaevis,
who has so much deep history, and you listen to
what he's accomplished and the errors he would like, it's
(40:43):
a it's a shame that they want to do away
with history like that. They don't want to notify you
and educate you about brothers like doctor ben Chavers.
Speaker 6 (40:52):
When you when you.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
Listen to this is what this is a person that
they would call a DEI high right, they would talk
about identity policy. But when you listen to this man,
he is probably one of the most intelligent people in
the world. He told you how he went to an
HBCU and then when he transferred to North Carolina.
Speaker 6 (41:11):
He was ahead of the game. Right, So they might
they try to make you.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
Seem like the education in HBCUs isn't equal, equal, or
superior to you know, education in other schools. But that's
obviously not the truth, because when you look at our
brilliant Black people who've.
Speaker 6 (41:29):
Done so much throughout history, who who.
Speaker 2 (41:32):
Have acclimated and ascended in every area of life, you
know a lot of them come from HBCUs. So now
they try to weaponize this DEI tag and this identity politics.
I tell people all the times I have no problem
with identity politics. I'm with everybody black. I want to
(41:54):
see black people get equity, I want to see them
get justice. I want to see us get to the
level that we deserve to be at because we've been
denied those things. So me wanting to see positive things
for my people does not mean that I want to
see negative for anybody else. I just want to see
my people reach the level that everybody else's people. And
there's nothing wrong with that. And people will try to
(42:16):
make you think it's something wrong with that. As I'm
at this DNC convention, surrounded by black excellence, as I
watched the DNC conference last night and seeing black excellence
and seeing leaders that I know came from grassroots organizations,
people that I know is on the ground with me,
be in positions of power to be able to change
and make laws and policy. As I see a black
(42:37):
woman running for president and ahead in the polls, I am,
I am motivated. I am motivated because I feel like
things to happen, and I feel like there's things happening.
Anybody who's not motivated by that as a black person,
I don't know what to tell you. I don't know
what your motivation is, but I know I'm motivated. I
(42:59):
know our kids look into a room like that. They
know what they can be when you hear someone like
doctor Chavis and understand what he the way he paved,
he talked about how his grandfather lost his life. He
lost his life to teach right so that he can
be where he is today right. And every generation is
(43:20):
responsible for his own liberation. So now it's time for
us to be responsible for our liberation. So I'm gonna
do everything I possibly can to contribute to that. I'm
gonna stand ten toes down. I'm not gonna be distracted
by haters, by bots, by whoever you try to send
to determ me. I'm gonna speak truth to power every time,
(43:40):
because when you tell the truth, you don't gotta think
about it. You can sleep good at night every night
when you tell the truth every night. I'm gonna sleep
good at night because I know I tell the truth,
and I stand firm on truth and everything that I say,
I believe in my heart.
Speaker 6 (43:55):
There's nothing that can sway me from.
Speaker 2 (43:56):
My beliefs unless you could tell me something that is
that that conflicts that's right, unless you can tell me
a truth that conflicts my truth, that tells me that
the truth.
Speaker 6 (44:08):
That I have is wrong.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
I'm staying firm and I'm ten toes down on that,
and with that brings me to another end. It brings
me to the end of another episode of TMI. Shout
out to Tamika Hope, she's having a dope panel. Shout
out to doctor ben Chevis. Shout out to all of
the fans. We appreciate y'all. We're gonna try to give
you more content from the DNC. I'm gonna go out
(44:31):
and see who else I can meet, who else I
can interview, so that y'all can get some of this knowledge,
because this black knowledge that they're trying to not put
in these books is out here, and we got historians
like doctor Ben Chavis, and there's so many others out here.
So hopefully I'll run into some and we get some
of these interviews and get you some of this information.
But a twilding, I appreciate you. I'm not gonna always
(44:51):
be right, Tamika D. Mallori is not gonna always be wrong,
but we will both always and I mean always be
authentic until next time.
Speaker 1 (45:00):
That so that, so that, so.
Speaker 6 (45:09):
Check out the video version.
Speaker 3 (45:10):
Of TMO every single Wednesday on Iwoman dot TV.
Speaker 6 (45:15):
That's how we
Hosts And Creators
Mysonne
Tamika Mallory
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