White on White Intervention

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm Tamika d.

Speaker 2 (00:00):
Mallory and the ship Boy my Son in general.

Speaker 1 (00:03):
We are your host of TM I.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Tamika and my Son's Information, Truth, motivation and inspiration.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
Name new Energy. What's going on?

Speaker 2 (00:15):
My son lennon long weekend?

Speaker 1 (00:18):
But I'm here long no long week.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
Well, the weekend seemed like it was the whole week.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
It's been a lot going on.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
But at least spring it's trying to fight. Fighting day
I needed and I you know, I didn't. You know,
I didn't get to go outside that day until the
sun came down. Well because I was dealing with Target
all day, all day long, so I never got a
chance to get up from my computer the whole entire day.

(00:49):
On the eighty degree day, I went out with you know,
She's Canvas but MS Diddy forever to us for us.

Speaker 1 (00:57):
We went out to eat at like eight, That's what.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
It was. It was really beautiful shop.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
It was nice at night time.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
Because I went like Easter shopping for the kids and
brought them some clothes and stuff. Resurrections Resurrection Sunday, you know,
because people so listen, I don't really, I'm not really
for the holidays and all that. You know, I try
to stay away from holidays, but there's a certain feeling
during certain days, whether we call them holidays.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
East outfit, Yeah, but you got to get.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
You an Eastern outfit. Like if you're from the hood,
you know that that Eastern outfit is paramount. You got
to get you a good Eastern outfit, and you've got
to go outside.

Speaker 1 (01:36):
You gotta, like I gotta go somewhere.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
God too, because I remember, I swear to I remember,
like my mother, we didn't have much, but she knew
that we had to have an Eastern outfit.

Speaker 3 (01:45):
No, I'm telling you, that's to give me. She's to
give me one hundred dollars. And now you know I
lived in Manhattanville and Harlem, so she gave me one
hundred dollars. My homegirl, who lived in thirty three thirty three,
which was right behind Manhattanville.

Speaker 1 (02:00):
You know, you see it, You see the area.

Speaker 3 (02:02):
Anybody who lived in these places knows exactly what I'm
talking about. And she and I used to meet on
the corner. We had our hundred dollars in our pockets
and we had to go to one twenty fifth Street
and go up and down until we found a pair
of sneakers, which was usually a new pair of fifty
four elevens, and then you had forty dollars and some
change to get you a pair of jeans, a little

(02:23):
shirt or something.

Speaker 1 (02:24):
But you was getting you an east outh.

Speaker 4 (02:25):
Go.

Speaker 2 (02:25):
I had to get you an east out and.

Speaker 1 (02:27):
You had to sit in the hairstyle in the hair
salon all damn day.

Speaker 3 (02:33):
It was, it was, it was. It was Friday night.
Listen to get the doobie. Friday night when my mother
got off work. Because now my dad, my dad paid
the bills right, and he might I don't know what
did what him and my mama business was, but I
do know that he paid the bills, and my mother's
paycheck was used for hair bowls and going, you know,

(02:55):
out and get your little stuff and your things, stuff
that he don't be knowing about, don't need, didn't know about,
and he ain't involved with. So Friday night she get
her check, she would have me meet her at the
hair salon to get my dubie. It was down on
one twenty fifth Street to a guy named Roy used
to hook me up.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
Roy was a crackhead also so Roy used.

Speaker 2 (03:15):
To Roy crack has been multi purpose.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
He used to do good head, but he was there.

Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yes, they did mechanics. They was, you know, a crackhead.
This one I'm trying to crack fucked us up because
it was so skilled, a real and you just didn't
You would just see them in this crackish mold. But
they were so skilled and it was beyond skilled, you
know what.

Speaker 3 (03:40):
And let me correct myself. I shouldn't call him a crackhead.
He was a drug add he was addicted, but at
the time it was a crackhead because he would like
beat there. He was good and then all of a sudden,
everybody be gonna where is Roy.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
But he knew that. He knew Easter though he.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
Was because he needed to get the money. That's his
money for that's.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
Working for Easter brouh. He did what he had to do.

Speaker 3 (04:07):
So anyway, we go get our outfit and then on
Sunday you got.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
To go somewhere.

Speaker 2 (04:12):
That's usually we did. We did the movie, so we
just will be in Halem just rooming around. But you
had to you had to go and get your outfit.

Speaker 1 (04:19):
But my parents never let us think Easter was an Easter.

Speaker 3 (04:22):
Yeah, they'd be like this ain't this is just a
day for us to do something that we do.

Speaker 2 (04:29):
That's what we did when I shopped and it was
hot in all the stores, and then went to a
baby shower, enjoyed that and the kids enjoy you know,
kids like and then I was exhausted. And then next
day we went to some game room, dope game room,
and the kids enjoyed theirself with that, and then we

(04:51):
had a batch and I was exhausted again.

Speaker 3 (04:54):
The same same I hosted. My my granddaughter was in town.
We went to church with her her cousin and they're
both two and three years old. So I was saying
that I spent a lot of time talking about I mean,
dealing with Target all week. You know a lot of
people saw that last week, you know, things kind of

(05:15):
it just was like all of a sudden, all this
stuff got in the media because it was announced that
Reverend Sharpton was having a meeting with the Target executives
now and then so and there were people who were
upset because they were like, well, where's Jamal Bryant and
you know, and then people were tagging and saying where's
Tamika Mallory And of course Nina Turner, who leads we
are somebody and until freedom was a part of it.

(05:37):
And then you have folks saying, where are the people
from Minneapolis?

Speaker 1 (05:40):
So people were pissed.

Speaker 3 (05:41):
Off because they like, we ain't heard Reverend Sharpton involved
in this target situation, So like, how did he all
of a sudden get centered and why is he the
one having a meeting?

Speaker 1 (05:51):
And so you know, that turned into a whole thing.

Speaker 3 (05:52):
And I think a part of it is that social
media and the Internet does not always give us an
opportunity to fully discuss everything so people will be able
to get a clear picture of what's going on. Just
for quick points of reference, Number one, I worked for
Reverend Sharpton for a very very long time. You know,
fourteen years I did within nan and it was even

(06:15):
before that, but fourteen years I was on the payroll.
And I can tell you that the issues around diversity, equity, inclusion,
holding corporations accountable, all of that he has.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
Been doing for a long long time.

Speaker 3 (06:31):
And there's a history of it that comes from Operation
bread Baskets, which is Reverend Jackson.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
Remember I've given this.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
History before for people who don't know that one of
the reasons why we understand.

Speaker 1 (06:42):
The attacks on DEI is because we know they know
they know.

Speaker 3 (06:46):
The people who want to roll back DEI understand there
is a history of how diversity, equity and inclusion became
a thing that you hold that with the fact that,
of course other groups have benefited from it and it's
been infiltrated by other people.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
We get all of that.

Speaker 3 (07:03):
We're not saying that diversity, equity and inclusion as it
stands is perfect, or that it is you know that
it is a that it is great. Put it that way.
We're not saying that. We're saying we know it's not
we know it's still inequitable. Sure, Nonetheless, we understand that
the reason why it's being attacked is because black people

(07:23):
are under attack and women are under attack. And so
that's that, you know, putting that in in perspective. So
Reverend Sharpton has been doing this work around diversity, equity
and inclusion and holding corporations accountable for a long, long,
long long time, many many many years, more than thirty years.
He's been engaged in that area and has a great

(07:47):
level of expertise in terms of how to get corporations
to have to deal with black folks and our issues
and demands, and so it is not unusual for a
corporation to call.

Speaker 1 (08:01):
Him and want to meet with him. So he got the.

Speaker 3 (08:04):
Call and he called Reverend Bryant, Jamal Bryant, and asked him, hey,
Target wants to meet.

Speaker 1 (08:10):
Now. Another thing.

Speaker 3 (08:12):
For the last I think sixty something weeks, I think
it's been sixty something weeks, there has been a national
action network has been protesting outside of the office of
I forget his first name, but I know his last
name is Acman. And this guy is the one who
pretty much started the fight against the Fearless Fund, which

(08:34):
is where this DEI think sort of first started to come.
It came from that because the women from the Fearless
Fund are funding black women own businesses, and this guy
Ackman started a campaign and actually sued them to say
it was unconstitutional, and you know and all of that.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
And so Sharpton has been.

Speaker 3 (08:53):
In the space of this whole diversity, equity and inclusion
piece since the beginning. So there was a prime but
the details of it was to be discussed, as Jamal
did at church on Sunday, and then there's a town
hall meeting on Tuesday.

Speaker 1 (09:08):
But again social media things move at the speed of lightning.

Speaker 3 (09:12):
So once it's out there that there's a meeting, people's
opinion and feeling and this and that.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
And I'm not saying they shouldn't have that.

Speaker 3 (09:19):
There should be accountability across the board because all of
us are out here managing something that other people, two
hundred thousand people have signed up for.

Speaker 1 (09:28):
But there are people who never signed the petition.

Speaker 3 (09:30):
At all who are boycotting Target, And people want to
know what are y'all meeting about, and what's happening and
who's doing what, and they have the right to know
those things.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
The headlines didget out there, and I think that's precisely
my point. As seasoned leaders, we have to understand that
people are going to sensationalize headlines. So if we understand that,
then we have to be intentional about what gets out
there and how we organize things. So this is what
my main point was, that people have to be very aware,
intentional and strategic, specially when we this season as leaders, all.

Speaker 3 (10:02):
These people who are a part of this effort, that
we understand our power is working because Target is even
calling people for meetings. And another thing that's Reverend Sharpton
is not the only person that Target met with in
the civil rights community. They've been meeting with different groups, right,

(10:22):
and it just so happened that we know about the
meeting with Reverend Sharpton, But there are other people who
had meetings that we don't know anything about having heard
from them on what went on or what took place.
But one thing I can say is that nobody agreed
to end the boycott or to stop it. People have
just been listening and allowing Target to explain to them

(10:45):
where they stand, and also doubling down on the idea
that we don't agree with the decision you all made
on January twenty fourth or twenty fifth to say that
you're rolling back DEI because get us what Costcos didn't
roll theirs back. Delta didn't roll theirs back. So what
is different between you Target and these other companies who

(11:08):
have stood ten toes down and chose not to cower
to Donald Trump and align themselves with bigotry and Nina Turners.

Speaker 1 (11:16):
We now have met with Target.

Speaker 3 (11:17):
We have we've met with an executive from Target, Nina
turn On, myself and Jamal Bryant where we talk to
them about the demands. Ugain reiterated the demands and have
asked them to get back to us with specific details
on the demands, not to just repackage the numbers of

(11:38):
what they've done in the past, to tell us about
their new ways of going about dealing with these issues.
We don't want to be your nighttime lover. We want
to be in broad daylight. What exactly are you intending
to do and why would you make a statement that
you need to roll back the diversity, equity and inclusion
instead of enhancing it. That's what we've They should have

(12:00):
came out and said, to be honest, we need to
do more diversity and equity and inclusion. We need to
make sure that black folks get even more a share
of what we as consumers are putting into Target. That's
actually what they should have come out with, and instead
they went in the opposite direction, which is to align
themselves with Donald Trump and Elon Musk and, in our opinion,

(12:23):
as Nina Turnet has said, to align themselves with bigotry
and that's not okay. So with all of that, the
boycott continues. There's work that's happening behind the scenes. We
will not sell our communities out. We will make sure
that when we come back to report on something, we're
reporting on tangibles, real tangible results, and that takes time.

(12:47):
Let's not forget that the Montgomery bus boycott lasted for
three hundred and eighty one days, and so we are
not even at six months of this yet. We're going
to have to have some discipline. And I guess my
thoat of the day for today is everything that comes
out on social media, we can allow ourselves to just

(13:07):
go run with it because of either our feelings of
about people.

Speaker 1 (13:12):
We've got to ask for more.

Speaker 3 (13:13):
Information because over these next four years, Over these next
four years, there is going to be a lot of
stuff that's thrown at us to get us to everybody
starts fighting and arguing and everybody gets divided and all
of that. We're not trying to be divided. We need
to course correct some things. Sometimes we gotta have conversations,

(13:35):
but we are not going to allow these folks to
divide us.

Speaker 1 (13:38):
Because the enemy is not us.

Speaker 3 (13:42):
It's not organizers, it's not the people online. The enemy
are the people who are attempting to suppress and oppress
our communities. And we cannot allow social media to or
or things that hit the news or social media to
throw us off our we gotta be targeted. We've got

(14:02):
no pun intended or pun intended. We've got to be focused.
We've got to be focused. And our focus at this
point is that we are making sure that corporations understand
there's one point eight trillion dollars that we spend. And
if you want to align yourself with Trump, there's a
lot of us.

Speaker 1 (14:20):
Who don't like Trump. So if you with him, you
not with us. And that's it.

Speaker 2 (14:26):
That's pretty much. I mean, I don't know what else
I can say after that film was broken down. You know,
we just have to be away about the information. Like
you said, Denzel said, you know, if you watch the news,
then you misinformed, and if you don't do you uninformed.
So you have to be very careful about how you
get your information. You got to be make sure that
you're listening to credible sources. You got to do three
or four different checks. You can't just google one page

(14:48):
and you just see some random things pop up, like
you gotta be intentional. You gotta really want this information.
You gotta look, and you gotta also use common sense,
because a lot of people don't even use common sense.
They just hear something say, look, such such jumped off
the roof and he landed on both foot and now
he's Superman. He started flying around. Look it's on the internet.
I've seen it, and I'd be like, does that even fit?

(15:09):
What you know is humanly possible? Like they don't even
think about that no more, you know. So I think
we have to be intentional and we have to make
sure that we follow people who have levels of integrity
right that you that you actually can trust, not just
somebody that just showed up on the internet one day
and they started creating these conspiracy theories that go along

(15:31):
with you know, these crazy things that you have in
your head and you're like, listen, listen, no, make sure
that there's a basis for what somebody says. Make sure
that it goes along with common sense. Make sure that
these people are trusted that you when you look up
the information they say that other people that you trust
that are you know, parenting that information or sharing that
same information. Don't just take information and just run with

(15:53):
it and then come and spread it, because a lot
of travels ten times before the truth pushes.

Speaker 3 (16:00):
So for today's TMI, you know, it just be too much.
Sometimes for me, But I really want to ask people
out in the universe to listen to this story and
decide who they think is doing too much in this situation.
So a few days ago, it was announced that Fanny

(16:25):
Willis the prosecutor in Georgia in DCAV County has is
trying to put young Thug back in prison, which we
know that a part of his sentence was if you
violate the terms of your probation. Probation is not parole,
no probation. The terms of your probation that you can

(16:46):
be committed for a backlog of twenty years. He can
be committed for a backlog of twenty years, so he
would have to serve out twenty years if he does
any of the things that's in the stipulations. So she
wants to have him sent back to prison. And as
soon as I saw it, I'm not gonna lie. I

(17:09):
was one of those people that was like, oh, come on,
Like what did he do go to Metro Atlanta and
ride on the side of the you know street where
you ain't supposed to be on that corner? Like come on,
Like I didn't even hear the story, just a headline.
Headline made me automatically be like, come on, Fanny, let's
not do this, right.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
So then I said, I have to listen to the story.
So I listened to it.

Speaker 3 (17:31):
So they say that allegedly, they say that a blogger
tweeted a witness's name an address. Right, that's what they say.
This is the whole face and the face of the person.
And it had been the judge's ruling that this witness

(17:54):
was not to be exposed anything about it, and they tweeted,
you alleged they tweeted this person's home address and image
and said so and so does not want to be
named or does not want the court, you know, the
people outside of the court to know who they are.

Speaker 1 (18:15):
So this is the person.

Speaker 3 (18:16):
Now, this is what I will say allegedly too, although
the interview or this whole story, they've given you a
chronicle of what took place that got them back in court.

Speaker 1 (18:26):
Right.

Speaker 3 (18:27):
But allegedly, young thug retweeted this post on social media,
and now Fanny Willis wants him to go to prison.
So there are some people that's like, all right, he
tweeted something. I still don't think he needs to do
twenty years in prison for that. Fanny Willis just wants
to send this black man to prison so bad. She's

(18:50):
got a I was gonna say hard on, but that's
probably inappropriate, you know' she's she's what's the word says
thank you with him, and there's no reason for him
to go back to prison for this. And in fact,
which is where like you said, allegedly comes from the

(19:10):
newscaster the reporter, the reporter is saying that when speaking
with Young Thug's attorney, the attorney says it's never okay
to tamper with witnesses, and it or because then they
say that some other they never say it was the
same blog. And they also don't say that Young Thug

(19:30):
retweeted this, but that the next thing was a post
was out there that called for the murder of Fanny
Willis right, and so, but they never said that Young
Thug posted that or retweeted it, or that it came
from the same place, but they just put that in
the universe. And so the lawyer responds to it and

(19:52):
says it's also not okay to threaten law enforcement. But
then he goes on to say that Young Thug did
not do any anything wrong and therefore Fanny Willis presenting
this type of motion to have him sent back to jail.
Is like, not, okay, it's stupid, it's wrong or whatever.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
That's not his words.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
I'm just saying what he's saying is wrong, that he
shouldn't do it. So now, if it is true, right,
and so again that there are people who don't feel
like he should have to go back to jail for that.
If it is true that a blogger posted this thing,
this person, this witness's face, name address, and if it

(20:34):
is true that young thug retweeted it, I think that's stupid.
That's just me, but there might be some other people
as saying not.

Speaker 1 (20:43):
I just think it's stupid.

Speaker 3 (20:45):
First of all, we know all the legal implications and
what if something happens to this person, how do you
You're now a part of it. But also you gotta
stay out of trouble. You gotta stay away from people,
place in spaces that could potentially put you back in

(21:05):
some mess or in a situation.

Speaker 1 (21:08):
And I just feel like even when he first came
out on.

Speaker 3 (21:12):
The social media talking to stuff and doing the thing,
you know, because you home right, and we know that
the come home aspect of anybody who's been locked down,
and people are advocating for you or just even if
you did something wrong. I'm saying in general, when you
come home, as you know most people, but I know
in the black community, that's a time for a celebration

(21:35):
of the person to return.

Speaker 1 (21:37):
And so you now social.

Speaker 3 (21:38):
Media is a part of it, because I remember when
people used to come home before it was a chicken
dinner at the house. Right now it's social media, you
doing whatever. And I remember watching that part the live
or whatever he was doing and saying to myself, Lord,
have mercy, put the get.

Speaker 1 (21:53):
The cell phone.

Speaker 3 (21:54):
Take the cell phone, because you don't need to be
on the social media.

Speaker 1 (22:00):
Now this person tweets.

Speaker 3 (22:02):
Something and allegedly and you believe that they're supporting you
or whatever it is. You have to put this somebody,
anybody that knows young thug in the world.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
I really is rooting for the brother.

Speaker 3 (22:15):
I really was, because after a while the case was like,
all right, either y'all have it the evidence or you don't.

Speaker 1 (22:22):
But this too, however long it is trial going on
and on.

Speaker 3 (22:26):
And on and on, and then finding out this and
that and all this stuff. It's like, come on, you
blew it, You blew your shot to make this clean.
It was a circus. So I'm just saying I don't
know what he may or may not have done because
we never really got to learn the truth to my
in my opinion, right or maybe we did, I don't know,
but we didn't really get clear.

Speaker 1 (22:49):
This Happenedness happened, This happened.

Speaker 3 (22:50):
So at some point I became one of those people
to say, if the brother did do the things that
they accused him of, then I really know that he's
gonna have to pay for that somehow, right Like, but
y'all did not do a good job of proving it,
and it's time to let that man go home. That's
how I felt. Anybody who don't like that, that's on you.

(23:12):
But that's how I felt. But now I want I
just want to say, as a person who did believe
that after a while the trial was not going in
the right direction, I just want the brother to put
down the cell phone.

Speaker 2 (23:27):
Yeah, I think I think we just have to be
honest and as men, we got to hold ourselves accountable.
We got to have strong support systems around us. We
gotta have people to say, yo, stop doing dumb shit.
And I'm not saying he did it, because it's allegedly
and he somebody could have. You know, you're a famous person.
You're a famous person. People get you know, packed all

(23:49):
the time, so that that's a possibility. But I'm just
I'm having a conversation man to man. If you, if
you did do this allegedly, then you gotta check yourself
because your freedom. You you you've seen as if your
freedom was paramount to you, you know so, And if
it's paramount to you, then we can't make decisions that's
gonna jeopardize it, especially stupid decisions like from your page.

(24:12):
So I'm not saying you did. I don't know. I'm
just saying if you are, sometimes you gotta you have to.
You have to suspend your first judgment. You might have
a lot of animosity, you have to feel away against
the system. I get it. You know, it's a lot
of times we hold in you. You said for years,
and you see, you felt like a system had targeted

(24:37):
you and they did you wrong and you but God
gave you opportunity to come back to society. God gave
you opportunity to be free and to make different choices,
to make different decisions. And you said that you said
that you learned from and you and thank you for
playing fair and the people and you said they played
fair with you. So you have to make decisions that
make sure that the choice they made is justified as

(24:58):
a man. And if you didn't do it, then then
get it out, get it out. If somebody had them,
then you know, then that's the reality situation. But if
you are, I just want you just to make better decisions, brother,
because we're room for you. You know, we're fans of
the music, we're fans of just a young black man
being able to get a second because a lot of us,

(25:19):
there's a lot of people that's in jail that have
done that, haven't done anything, that will never come home.
And you wanted the opportunities that people get to see
where there is a silver lining at the end of
the road where you can actually go through a justicism
and somebody can give you opportunity. They can see you
know the word, and they can see that you are
rehabilitating and have an opportunity. So don't fuck it up,

(25:40):
because if you fucked this up, allegedly, if you if
you fucked this up, then you're gonna suck it up
for a thousand other young black men just like yourself.
So that's all I have to say about.

Speaker 3 (25:51):
So I guess the question is, do you think Fanny
Willis is doing too much or all these people on
social media?

Speaker 2 (25:58):
I mean, that's y'all incident. I don't know what it is,
you know, so I didn't see it.

Speaker 1 (26:03):
I didn't see the tweet. I should go look to see.

Speaker 2 (26:06):
But that's what they're allegedly saying is happening. But but
y'all give us, y'all, give us y'all feedback and let
us know what you think.

Speaker 3 (26:13):
So now we are getting ready to go to a
guest that.

Speaker 1 (26:20):
You know they're trying to kill us.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
I'm just saying your tickets on.

Speaker 3 (26:25):
Oh no, no, no, that's not that's the woman. That's
the woman.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
Okay, okay, jolly yeah, So you know that.

Speaker 3 (26:32):
That Now for our guests, you know, we've only had
maybe two white folk on this show after this is
the fifth season. We had Jason Jason Flohm, who is
a big supporter and advocate for our brother justice for

(26:52):
Pierre Russian who is serving time for a crime that
he did not commit. And Jason is one one of
his biggest advocates and so there's that, And that was.

Speaker 1 (27:05):
One white man.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
I actually can't think of another, but you know, I
always leave room by saying too, so maybe there was
one more. There was an Asian man, yeah right, that
was the husband of young couple.

Speaker 1 (27:22):
But that's it. I don't know if any other white
folks has been on our show.

Speaker 3 (27:25):
Just to make sure that you know, we never say
we never did, we never saw, we never went unless
you really know you never went, because if you might
have went and you say you didn't, people won't find
out because that's just the world that we live in.
But this might be the third white person that's been
on our show. But this is this brother. He is
definitely invited to the cookout.

Speaker 1 (27:47):
So that's definitely guess.

Speaker 2 (27:49):
Let's get to it. So today we have a friend
to the room who has been a friend of mine,
but he probably doesn't know it. Just watching her he's
a friend of mine, and just watching his commentary, watching
his unabridged truth, watch him face to face, just dismantle
just system that he's been dismantle in the system of

(28:12):
white supremacy by hisself for a long time now. And
it's in amazement. You know. The other day I was
watching this video where a lady was talking about d
I and this and that, and he walked up and
just grabbed the microphone and just left her speechless and
just walked off. And it was just it was so
beautiful to me. And he does this all the time. Today,

(28:34):
we have the Jolly Ginger aka.

Speaker 3 (28:37):
Jolly Good on Instagram.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
That's why people know him.

Speaker 2 (28:42):
I just say, I don't be saying Jolly Good Ginger,
but today we have Russell Ellis aka Jolly Good Ginger today.
He is a social activist from western North Carolina Foothills
of Appalachia. He was raised racist and bigoted, and begin
deconstructing his own racist him as a teenager. After establishing

(29:02):
a relationship relationship with his mom, he joined the Army
of eighteen. He spent thirteen years in human intelligence Iraq
and Afghanistan. Veteran he now denounces the US occupation of
those countries. First started getting real active in activism in
twenty thirteen. He has social media started in twenty twenty.

(29:23):
He has over six million followers across all these platforms
and he is the guy, the guy. How you doing today? Man?

Speaker 5 (29:33):
I feel like I'm not worthy of that introduction for me,
I really appreciate the kind words and vice versa.

Speaker 6 (29:43):
I've been watching you, know you.

Speaker 5 (29:44):
And to make a in your activism across the years,
and you inspired me, you inspired countless other people, and
so hearing you say these cond words about me truly humbling.

Speaker 2 (29:55):
It's the work that you're doing. Brother. You know a
lot of people, you know, they say, you know, I
injustice and I don't like that, and they quietly whisper.
But the way that you you face it, the way
that you dismantled you know, your videos are they are eloquent,
they are precise, they're educated, any of them with thought,

(30:16):
and you can't really dispute, you know, when you get facts.
You know, I don't care how you feelings. It's facts
are feelings, and you always come with facts. And that's
what I really appreciated about you.

Speaker 6 (30:27):
I appreciate that. And to be honest with you, social media.

Speaker 5 (30:30):
Was an accident, so like now, watching how much of
an influence social media has on the social conversation is
fascinating because I joined social media in twenty twenty, literally
by the accident, and it's not something I ever thought about.

Speaker 6 (30:45):
But now when you think about this social conversation.

Speaker 5 (30:47):
You think about social media, so I'm blessed to have
a platform to.

Speaker 6 (30:50):
Be able to do it.

Speaker 3 (30:51):
So we don't have we ever met Jolly who was
aka Russell Ellis.

Speaker 1 (30:58):
We have, yes, Louisville.

Speaker 5 (31:01):
We met on a few separate occasions. But see, I
knew who you were, you know who I was, and
that's fair. But I'm good friends with Bianca, you.

Speaker 1 (31:11):
Sister.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
Yeah, yes, I.

Speaker 5 (31:13):
Love Bianca her birthdays past her birthday Byonka and uh yeah.

Speaker 6 (31:18):
On several different occasions.

Speaker 5 (31:19):
The first time I think we met was the tenth
anniversary down in Miami Traymon Martin.

Speaker 1 (31:26):
Okay, okay, yeah, so that's great.

Speaker 3 (31:29):
I mean, and I share my sons sentiment about you
being my friend in my head. So you know, whenever
I see you on social media, and you know, I
obviously support you, but I also share your videos in
private on my page. You know, I make sure to

(31:49):
lift your name as being a person who can be trusted,
who has an authentic voice and of course a very
courageous spirit, which is something that we need now more
than ever. And so I also respect you greatly and
I'm actually happy to have you on the show because
you are You're a celebrity. You kind of you popping
out here. So you know, we got the celebs on today.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
You are interviewing the congressman and everything.

Speaker 1 (32:15):
I'm like, this man moving yeah right.

Speaker 3 (32:18):
But you know, as my son has said, you are
truly confronting white folks, which is something that we think
is a specific job.

Speaker 1 (32:29):
I think that in this movement.

Speaker 3 (32:31):
Uh, you know, we get a lot of people who
want to join the march and they want to be
a part of what we're doing as black folks and
brown folks. They want to run to our issues and say,
you know, we're here to support I. You know, I
feel you, I see the harm, I see the wrong.
And then they go back to their racist family members

(32:52):
and friends, and a lot of times they either say
nothing or they certainly are not as assertive as they
are when they're in spaces with us, right, And so
I always redirect especially white women back today mama, back
to their daddy, back to their cousins, their friends, and

(33:13):
to go do some personal and internal work on themselves.

Speaker 1 (33:17):
And you.

Speaker 3 (33:19):
Have done that work, and you also confront people who
look like you. And I love for you to talk
a little bit about what that is for you because
I know that. I mean, I'm sure you're comfortable in
it now, but I don't know if you always have been.

Speaker 5 (33:35):
So I really I love the question and I love
the way you phrased it, because this is a question
I've been asked a.

Speaker 6 (33:41):
Lot, especially, you know, since been on social media.

Speaker 5 (33:45):
To be honest, when I initially started like confronting white people,
it was out of anger and frustration. So I grew
up in I mean, white supremacy. Let's just call it
what it is.

Speaker 6 (33:59):
I grew up in the mountains Clina Foothills of Appalachia.

Speaker 5 (34:02):
And where I was raised, I mean, racism was so casual,
it was culture right.

Speaker 6 (34:07):
I didn't even know it was racism. I didn't know
that not everybody said the N word.

Speaker 5 (34:12):
I thought the N word was just part of daily
vocabulary because where I grew up, that's how everyone acted,
and it was a foregone conclusion of how things work.
So when I figured it out, and there's a long
story about how it all came to be, but when
I figured out, oh shit, I'm a white supremacist, and
I started figuring out there's this whole other world out

(34:33):
there that I didn't really know about I was not.
I want to be very clear when I say this,
I was not saying it or bringing it to the
forefront like it was some light like I was trying to.

Speaker 6 (34:45):
Save the world. It was like this moment of epiphaness
aha moment. But I was saying it.

Speaker 5 (34:52):
To the people I knew, which was the white folks
to my left and right, and I would say to them, hey, man,
you know this ain't right or this and this, and
I would reveal the things I've learned and they would
then deny it to my faith, Oh no, we're not
that way.

Speaker 6 (35:09):
Oh, we don't say that, we don't. And I'm like,
the fuck you mean we don't say that, Yes we do.
I've been here the whole fucking time and we've been
doing that shit.

Speaker 5 (35:21):
Like I was. Really, I felt like I was being
gas lit by my own fucking people.

Speaker 6 (35:26):
And I'm like, I remember I was like.

Speaker 5 (35:30):
Fourteen fifteen years old around that time, and I was
riding down the road my dad's second wife.

Speaker 6 (35:36):
You'll never hear me say, stepmom, my dad's second one.

Speaker 5 (35:39):
We're riding down the road, and she dropped the N
word out there, which was pretty normal, and I don't
know why. I was just fucking fed up. I said, hey,
you know what, don't say that in front of me
no more. And she was like, say what. She didn't
know what the fuck she said. She'd say what said
the N word, don't feed no one. She started laughing,
you don't liking God in my car? I said, pull over,

(36:00):
so she did. She pulled over right. I got the
fuck out the corner. I walked my ass the rest
of him about two miles, which, of course, you know
back in that you know, nineties, wasn't that bad to
walk home a couple three miles.

Speaker 6 (36:09):
But I decided, I'm putting my foot down, like I
don't know why. I don't know what. You know, you
went through.

Speaker 5 (36:14):
Puberty, went to the ship. But I was like, fuck it,
I understand it, and I want to put my foot down.
And then it wasn't even a week later.

Speaker 6 (36:21):
I did the same thing to my dad.

Speaker 5 (36:22):
Were in my house, and my dad said he dropped anywhere,
and I say, man, don't say in front of you
in the morning, said whatever you want, and he got man,
you know, down south where I grew up, you don tell.

Speaker 6 (36:31):
Another man how to live in his own house.

Speaker 5 (36:34):
Kind of like a rule and that's what he told me.
He said, you know, boy, you don't tell me how
to how to act in my own house. I said,
I'm telling you, I don't want to hear that shit and.

Speaker 6 (36:43):
Tree me and you.

Speaker 5 (36:43):
He beat the shutter he did. I was about fifteen,
he was about thirty six. He's grown ass man, but
he eats shutting me. And he told me, if I
want to hear it, I can leave, so I did.
I actually left my house for a little bit there.
But that's what got me started calling out white people
to be honest with you. I think the message gets

(37:05):
lost on social media where people think I'm trying to speak.

Speaker 6 (37:09):
For the black community. The black community does not need
me to speak for them.

Speaker 5 (37:12):
No one has asked me to be speak over for
another community, so I don't do that. What got me
started speaking so harshly to the white community was when
I figured out the white supremacy was a real deal,
and I started speaking out loud the things that I
figured out. And then my community treating me like I'm
just making this shit up, like they wasn't just saying.

Speaker 6 (37:31):
It last week had me so fucking fired up. That's
what got me started.

Speaker 2 (37:37):
But okay, so made.

Speaker 4 (37:38):
But what what was the thing that clicked in you
to say, Yo, this shit is just wrong, Like when
you started to cold because you said you were practicing
like you were you were brought in racism.

Speaker 2 (37:49):
It was regularly thing that you did. But what was it?
Was there a moment? Was it just a culmination of
things that made you start deconstructing within yourself before you
even started to confront them.

Speaker 5 (38:01):
So have a unique situation. My mom and dad divorced
when I was three. Now, I'm gonna be abundantly clear.
When I was born, my mom was sixteen, my dad
was twenty one. It was the eighties, But I don't
think we can go ahead and excuse that. But that
was the situation. And when I was three, my mom

(38:26):
was nineteen.

Speaker 6 (38:26):
My dad was twenty four. But my dad was very
openly white.

Speaker 5 (38:32):
My mom could tell you stories about my dad and
his cousin pulling up to the store after dark in
our little town when we grew up and seeing two
white ladies with two black guys in the car, and
my dad and his cousin got pissed off and told
my mom who was I wasn't born yet, but my
mom and her friend you're going to go and beat

(38:54):
those white girls ass because they shouldn't have those, you know,
in this town. And that's how my dad was so
obviously my mom was that way because she was raised
by But my mom, being so fucking young, started realizing herself,
this shit ain't right, and she ended up separating from
my dad and she ended up dating a black man.

(39:14):
Her second husband was a black man. Well shit, you know,
like this is like my Watergate scandal. Where the fuck
I'm from? And so my dad's older than my mom,
has a career, my mom's really young, doesn't have a career.

Speaker 6 (39:32):
He's got money, she don't.

Speaker 5 (39:35):
And so it goes to court, and my dad got
custody of me, which in the eighties is unheard of.
The mother gets custody, but my mom's with a black man.
That's the deciding factor. Ain't no judge, nor Carolina, I'm
going to give this white kid and this white woman
dating a black man. So my dad got custody on me,
and my dad told me every bad.

Speaker 6 (39:56):
Thing about my mom you can think of under.

Speaker 5 (39:58):
The sun, and I believe it. I'm impressionable, obviously, who isn't.
And he had me convinced that interracial marriage was against
the Bible. He could show me the book and verse
where the Bible says. I said, no, Bell, so I
believe it. You're literally, you're literally in violation of.

Speaker 6 (40:16):
The walls of God by being married this man. When
I was taking its old, my mom took the whole
thing to court and she got visitation rights on me.
I still remember when it happened. It was a very
big moment in my life. I was terrified.

Speaker 5 (40:30):
The only thing I ever know about this woman was
bad things, and now she's got visitation rights on me.

Speaker 6 (40:36):
And I'll make this long story short. The very first
time she picked me up for visitation, it was my
goal in my mind.

Speaker 5 (40:45):
And I told my dad this that after this visitation,
she'll never want to see me again. I want to
hate me so she'll never come back. And I was
incredibly hateful to her. I told her that her marriage
was a sin against God. I told her children were
in words, and I said the word and she told me,
you know, a ten year old shouldn't talk like this,

(41:06):
and I said, you shouldn't be a sinner, you evil be.

Speaker 6 (41:10):
That's how I talked to her, and it was a.

Speaker 5 (41:12):
Very painful two hours three hours that she had me
whatever the vegetation was, and she had visitations every other Saturday.

Speaker 6 (41:19):
So she dropped me off of my dad's house.

Speaker 5 (41:21):
I told my dad, I said, she'll never come get
me again because I told her exactly what I feel
about her dad. And two saturdays went by and it
was time for her to come get me again, and
I was confidence she will be back.

Speaker 6 (41:32):
I'll be damned she ain't pulled up in the driveway.

Speaker 5 (41:36):
And then that particular Saturday, she took me to her
house to meet my siblings, who were all younger than me,
but also.

Speaker 1 (41:43):
You know, right, and it was my.

Speaker 5 (41:47):
First time ever in my entire life being with and
everything there was about black all criminals, it.

Speaker 6 (41:53):
Is all violence, is all drugs. You don't want to
go there. It's the bad part of ten.

Speaker 5 (41:56):
That's what I'm we pulled in this neighborhood, was playing
with my mom's house. You know, it's normal, It's normal
ast neighborhood like I was used to seeing. And then
my siblings came out and they were so happy to
see me, which could not compute in my head, how
the fuck are you happy to see me? I was
so angry at the world that they wasn't and they

(42:17):
were all younger than me, and I could not bring
it to my in my heart to be mean to them.
I don't want them to be Even as a ten
year old, I had to word with all the say
it ain't their fault. And they played and talked to me,
and I kind of didn't didn't really engage.

Speaker 6 (42:35):
Then every other Saturday, I'm back. I started. I love basketball.
I grew up playing.

Speaker 5 (42:38):
Last Well, I'm a tall kid, and so my brother's
next visits.

Speaker 6 (42:44):
You want to go to the basketball.

Speaker 5 (42:45):
Hell, yeah, I'm a good basketball I'm down the neighborhood
playing basketball with the neighbors. And nothing's like what I
was told. It was life, you understand, nothing was what
my dad and so I had reached this moment. My
dadd had told me a but my eyes are witnessing
be of what the fuck conclusion do I come to?

(43:06):
And it was at that age, the early age of
ten years older, I started confronting the realities of what
I was told versus the reality.

Speaker 6 (43:11):
Is what I see. It took me a few years.

Speaker 5 (43:13):
I had nobody to talk to him, not close enough
to my mom to talk to her. He talked to
my dad, I'll be that he'll throw me out the house.
So by the time I was at thirteen fourteen, I
had really put some shit together. And my son you
asked me, what was that moment. I'm gonna be answering you.
There was this one watershed moment. I had begun reading

(43:35):
books in the library because nobody even checked me in
the library at school, and I had to begun watching
vachest tape.

Speaker 6 (43:41):
You're gonna rent VHS tapes.

Speaker 5 (43:43):
In the library where I went to schooling and you
can watch these old talk shows.

Speaker 6 (43:47):
And I watched the talk show where Malcolm X.

Speaker 5 (43:51):
Was giving an interview, and the guy who was doing
the interviews on TV say, hey, what's your last name?

Speaker 6 (43:57):
It's not Ax. We know it's not X.

Speaker 5 (44:00):
What's your last name? Malcolm has told him, you know,
I don't know my last name. You stole, you robbed
me of my last name, and you took my last
name and you assigned to your last name.

Speaker 6 (44:08):
It's not my last name.

Speaker 7 (44:10):
And in my white life, I had never heard something
like that, and my life like that, and where I
grew up.

Speaker 5 (44:20):
Your family names fucking everything. You uphold your family name.
That's a fundamental value. Uphold your family name. It makes
each generation better than the next. You're told the shit
from time to you're fucking mee how to agresship. And
it occurred to me in that moment that taking the
last name, or taking the family name of enslaved people's

(44:43):
was very on purpose by my people, because my people
are taught that your family name is your identity, so
it was intentional to rob them of their identity. And
it was at that moment where I had everything that
I had been learning and thinking of my head.

Speaker 6 (44:58):
Built up and it burst.

Speaker 5 (45:00):
I said, that's fucking rom You don't take people's fucking
family name from them.

Speaker 6 (45:04):
You don't fucking rob them of their identity.

Speaker 5 (45:07):
My fucking people should be fucking He'll respond, and I
just I just had this watershed moment, and that's really
where the fire lit Uneasy.

Speaker 1 (45:18):
This is so much that I'm just like, do I
lay down? Do we get the collection?

Speaker 2 (45:24):
Please? Like?

Speaker 1 (45:25):
What do we do?

Speaker 3 (45:26):
Because but you know what, that's what we wanted to
have you on today to talk about. And of course
we'll get to the danger of the moment. But I
think that my son always says that there's a backstory
to our like human lives. We're not just an Instagram profile.
We're not just you know, a quick SoundBite. We actually

(45:48):
have human experiences, and not enough people know who we are,
where we come from. And that's why there's so many,
so much, which is my next question to you. But
that's why there's so much, so many misconceptions about the
why why do you do this work?

Speaker 1 (46:07):
You know why?

Speaker 3 (46:07):
Oh oh, you just want to make money or you
just want to and people need to know that No,
actually I got here by fire. You know what happened
to me. It hurt a little bit, you know, for
my entry into this work. And so that's what I
wanted to talk to you about. But I want to
get to misinformation because it sounds like it and it

(46:28):
really is kind of like a beautiful song being put
together here because you were given misinformation and for.

Speaker 1 (46:37):
A while, thank god, you learned otherwise. Young.

Speaker 3 (46:41):
But there are some people in which are some of
these folks that I see you talking to in these
videos while you're out confronting people. Their information is a
narrative full of misinformation. So it's you caught it early.
But imagine when you are are a thirty five, forty five,

(47:02):
fifty five year old, big dummy, because you just all
you know is whatever Fox News is telling you. So
do you feel like, yes, there's racism and all that,
but you think misinformation is also a part of why
so many white people, even the ones who are like
good white people, are like, I don't know what you mean, Like,

(47:24):
you know, I thought they were only deporting criminals, you know, Like,
what do you think about the misinformation piece?

Speaker 5 (47:32):
Misinformation is a staple of White America. Misinformation. That's why nuance.
Nuance is is the ship of freedom, you know what
I'm saying. The ability to discuss nu ones is how
all of this falls apart. And so this whole two
dimensional world is what they want with I digress, misinformation

(47:55):
is exactly what white America thrives. The I do the
Ted Talk a few years back, and I kind of
just said it in the Ted Talk. I didn't expound
upon it, but I don't think people really understood how
deeply I meant it. I talked about how Donald Trump
did not usher in white supremacy in America. White supremacy
ushered in Donald Trump. And it's important for people to

(48:18):
understand a few things. Literally, every single talking point of
the make America.

Speaker 6 (48:25):
Grade of the movement is a recycled talking point. I've
heard it when I was ten years old. I've heard
it all. There's nothing you can say.

Speaker 5 (48:33):
The difference between a bigot and a parrot is one
of them has no original thought and just repeats everything
they hear around them because they don't have a brain,
and the other one's a fucking burn fucking There is
no unique ideology in bigatry, there's no unique ideology in
white supremacy.

Speaker 6 (48:51):
So misinformation is how we thrive.

Speaker 5 (48:53):
When I was ten, I was told there's a war
against Christianity, there's a war against straight people, there's a
war against white men. Heard that before, yeah, last week
the fucking news.

Speaker 6 (49:05):
But I heard it when I was fucking ten.

Speaker 5 (49:09):
Because you know, if you trace the white race back,
when did this white race begin begin right here in America?

Speaker 6 (49:16):
After Bacon's Rebellion sixteen seventy six. What happened was rich.

Speaker 5 (49:21):
People were trying to be rich and poor people were
fucking tired of getting shit on. So there was a
whole bunch of rebellions and there was this one really
big relion called Baker's Rebellion, and the fucking rich white
men holding fucking you know, colonizers decided, Hey, we need
to fucking stop this shit. So what we're gonna do
is we're gonna convince the white people, Yeah, you might
be poor, but at least you made black.

Speaker 6 (49:42):
And that's what I did.

Speaker 5 (49:42):
They created this race of white people that didn't exist before,
to create this fake majority, to create this mythology of
white supremacy, so that at least you might be poor, motherfucker,
but you ain't black, you're not enslaved, you're not less
than human.

Speaker 6 (49:57):
And so that was.

Speaker 5 (49:57):
Enough, And that ideology has served I at the test
of time. In twenty twenty five, it's all still the same,
and the entire basis of how we convince white people
to be okay with absolute the most oborigious human rights
violations in human history is through misinformation. If I tell
you that you're the victim, if I tell you the

(50:18):
wars against you, if I tell you that people hate you,
it's a whole lot fucking easier to be hateful. It's
a whole lot fucking easier to dehumanize others.

Speaker 6 (50:27):
We see that happening right now.

Speaker 5 (50:29):
We're watching fathers, we're watching brothers, we're watching human beings
get shipped to a torture prison in Al Salvador, and
then you're watching people justify that bullshit. The only way
that's possible is through misinformation. White supremacy was built on
the foundation of misinformation. White supremacy in it of itself
is misinformation.

Speaker 3 (50:50):
White people worshipree that's right, that's right. It's the white
supremacists want to be. That's what I call it.

Speaker 2 (50:57):
Yes, yes, sir, so well, you said that Trump didn't
usher in white supremacy. White supremacy ushered than Trump. Do
you think that Trump is necessary in order to actually
come to the moment to where we get rid of
this thing? Do you think that what is he's doing
right now we do you? Do you think it's going

(51:17):
to have this effect to where people are gonna look
and say this is over the top or do you
think that people are gonna just continue as business as normal.

Speaker 6 (51:29):
I think both are a very real possibility.

Speaker 5 (51:31):
If you look at after the Civil War, that should
have been America's movement, like we just literally killed each other,
maybe we should get our shit together, but they didn't,
and then what happened was south to the North. Hey, man,
if you take your federal troops out of our out
of our states will be good.

Speaker 6 (51:51):
But they weren't good. Jim pro Laws immediately.

Speaker 5 (51:54):
Followed the exit of federal troops from Southern from the
Southern States of America. And then what followed after that
was the United Daughters of the Confederacy. My dollars, a
profession came in, resurrected the Confederate statues, resurrected the Confederate flag.
The United Daughters of the Confederacy are the ones who
started the ideology of it was states rights and not slavery.

Speaker 6 (52:14):
We never held this is very important. We never held.

Speaker 5 (52:17):
The leaders of the Confederate States of America accountable under
the idea of we should just heal our wounds and
welcome our brothers back into our arms.

Speaker 6 (52:26):
Right, they got a free pass on it.

Speaker 5 (52:29):
Now, I want you to ask yourself, the Confederate States
of America was purely a black movement. What they have
got a free pass? Would we have given them the
fucking same courtesy we gave the CONFEDIANTO we wouldn't we
know the fucking answer. So we never held white America accountable.
Woodrow Wilson, I believe it was the bread no No,
it was Harry Truman. Wasn't Harry Truman was the first
president that allowed a film to be played in the

(52:51):
White House?

Speaker 6 (52:51):
What was that film? The Birth of America? Made by
the kumplux Tian. In this country, we have never, ever, ever, ever,
ever held white supremacy accountable.

Speaker 5 (53:01):
I can draw you a straight line from the Confederate
States of America to make America great again.

Speaker 6 (53:07):
I can draw it. I don't have to make a left,
I don't want to make a right. I gotta make
a you turn. I gotta do no trickery. It's a
straight fucking line. The make America way to good movement
is the Confederate States of America. It's the fucking reintroduction,
reintroduction of the first time. How do we get here?
We didn't hold white America accountable. So if Donald Trump
disappears fucking tomorrow, he's gone. Are supremacists that put him

(53:29):
in the office?

Speaker 2 (53:30):
Goon?

Speaker 5 (53:30):
Are the motherfuckers we gave a free pass to goone?
Is the ideology that they use to fucking vote for him?
Going No, And if we don't hold white supremacy accountable
in this country, then we're just waiting for the fucking
next time it happens. We have to defeat Donald Trump.
We have to defeat fascism, we have to defeat the misinformation.

Speaker 6 (53:50):
We also have to hold white supremacy accountable, and that's
something America is still not ready to do that. I'm afraid.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Do you do you find yourself? Do you feel like
you're a danger sometime? Do you feel like there's some
people that's so racist, white people that are mad at you.
Do you get like death threats or anything.

Speaker 5 (54:07):
I've had death threats, I had a goud pulled up
to my house. I've had people approaching me in crowds. Uh. Yeah,
that's that's an inherent part of being a I am
a race trader. They came, you're a trader to your race,
should be your first fucking billion in the cult.

Speaker 6 (54:24):
But they're not. They're too stupid. And so.

Speaker 5 (54:28):
My thoughts on it are this, First of all, my
children aren't white. And first of all, I want to
be clear, you don't have to have children or family
members are of any race, color, ethnicity, religion, creed to
just fucking have basic human compassion. But I do remind
myself that I just want my fucking children to live

(54:49):
in a better fucking country than when I lived there,
Like goddamn, But I don't think there's a way to
stand up against white supremacy and not be in danger.
So the best you could do is stand up against
white supremacy and fucking keep your head on the slow,
you know what.

Speaker 1 (55:02):
That's it.

Speaker 3 (55:04):
But you were kind of like not the person. Folks
want to roll up on what you said. Thirteen years
and Iraq?

Speaker 1 (55:10):
Did you say, I have been to Iraq.

Speaker 5 (55:13):
I have been to Afghanistan thirteen years in the Army
military intelligence.

Speaker 6 (55:20):
Nine of those thirteen years was overseas. And yeah, I
try to, I try to.

Speaker 5 (55:26):
I try to, you know, take the things I learned
from the military, take the things I learned from the
intelligence community, and apply them to my everyday life. And
the guy who didn't come to my house, you know,
I'm not going to talk about that because he didn't
go to court and the guy was convicted, and you know,
but the fact is, you know, thankfully I was paying

(55:47):
attention and it didn't work out good for him, and
so yeah, you know, that's that's what we have to do.

Speaker 6 (55:52):
I think that if this wasn't such, if this wasn't.

Speaker 5 (55:59):
A thing, built on hate, and speaking against it wouldn't
be so dangerous, if that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (56:03):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (56:03):
Yeah, the thing is dangerous, so in order to confront it,
it is equally, if not more dangerous. I mean, that's
just the reality. We deal with it all the time.
I mean, in my life, I've had some real serious
close calls, like things where you know, people showing up
to my speaking engagements, folks pulling out weapons.

Speaker 1 (56:24):
We've even had black people.

Speaker 3 (56:27):
It was like two years ago, maybe three years ago,
where that black woman showed up in DC at that
march that we went to.

Speaker 1 (56:35):
And I don't even know.

Speaker 3 (56:36):
And this is not even someone who was supposed to
be even though I think she was certainly planted and
paid to do what she did. But nonetheless, if what
she says is true, that she was just mad at
me because I didn't support her thing or whatever, she
was going through some mental health situation and just my

(56:57):
visibility alone put me in the cross here, So you know,
I don't I don't believe her. I think she was
there on purpose, paid to do the thing. But if
that's not the case, and she just got upset because
I didn't help her or whatever it is, and decided
to approach me and it turned into a physical thing
where people had to get involved, like she was enraged.

(57:20):
And that is because I'm in my visibility is there
where she she picked me as the person you know.

Speaker 1 (57:27):
So I'm you know, so I understand every day.

Speaker 3 (57:30):
But the one thing about it is, as was said
to us by one of our dear, dear sisters that
we love so much. And I won't name her so
to protect her. But all you got, all you're gonna
do is kill me. That's it, you know what I'm saying,
Like I you know that that's the worst that can happen,
is that you could kill me. I don't want to
be dead. I don't want to be killed. I don't

(57:53):
want to be harmed. I don't want to be impaired
for the rest of my life from a bullet or
this or that.

Speaker 1 (57:58):
But what I know is that what.

Speaker 3 (58:00):
I definitely don't want to live with for the rest
of my life is that I did nothing.

Speaker 1 (58:05):
That part. I can't. I can't.

Speaker 3 (58:07):
I can't, I can't because that's a mental death to me.
So I'm you know, we out here just we gotta
do what we gotta do and whatever comes with it.

Speaker 1 (58:16):
God knows, God knows, God's got me and you and you.

Speaker 5 (58:22):
My kids see what's going you know, my kids. My
oldest son, when he was in middle school, was the
experience about of racism. And I called her school, you know,
and I say, hey, man, you know, you might want
to talk to this kid who's been a racist.

Speaker 6 (58:36):
I talked to the teacher, first teacher. Teacher didn't stop,
but I talked to the principal. Principal.

Speaker 5 (58:40):
I told the principal, listen, man, come, come time. Number three,
I'm gonna tell my my son take care of it himself.
And that's actually what happened. And my son, you know,
I made this individual aware of the consequence of possessions.

Speaker 6 (58:53):
But then the principal literally fucking told.

Speaker 5 (58:57):
Me to my face, we can't respond to the words
with violence because that principle was too white and too
uneducated to understand the racism is violence and that he
was funny. And that's what motivates me. Like you said,
the worst you can do is kill me. Yeah, if
that's the worst, okay, because the worst you can actually

(59:17):
do to me is arem my children.

Speaker 6 (59:20):
I'll be damned if I let my children grow up in.

Speaker 3 (59:22):
This world that's right, at least putting force some fucking
effort to change that part.

Speaker 1 (59:28):
Trying. I gotta try, try.

Speaker 5 (59:31):
I cannot let my children, who recognize what's happening in
the world when they finally become adults, look at me
and said, Daddy, what you do in twenty sixteen, what
you do in twenty twenty, what'd you do in twenty
twenty four. What'd you do when Donald Trumps ignore the
owners of the Supreme Court? What did you do when
Donald Trump was shipping people off to an outside of

(59:51):
door in prison without due process?

Speaker 2 (59:53):
Daddy?

Speaker 6 (59:54):
What did you do?

Speaker 5 (59:55):
And I'll be damned if I look at my kids
in the eye and say nothing.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
I just want to say, man. We always say that
we don't need allies, we need accomplices, man, And you're
definitely one of those accomplices. Man. And I just appreciate
you every day. Like sometimes, like I tell you, I
don't feel like I'm fighting enough. I'm doing enough because
you've taken on your own fight. And I know, to
confront people, you know, your own family members, people you've

(01:00:22):
grown up with, and confront them about something that they've
normalized so much, you know, and to really address that
and take and be disinvited from the family functions and
be kicked out of the house from your father and
have the shit beat out of you. You know what
I'm saying to really have to go through those things
just to stand on the side of what's right. It's

(01:00:45):
something different, man, And it's not even a fight that
you are plagued by every day, right, because I say
to myself, I'm a black man, I'm plagued by racism, right.
It affects me every day. I gotta go every day
I have to deal with that. I've grown up with.
My third grade teacher used to call me the N word,
and he used to look at me and tell me
I was going to do nothing. I'd be dead by

(01:01:07):
the time I was eighteen, and you know, and he
would just do things to me. And those things I've experienced,
So they pushed me to those things I experienced, being
incarcerated unfairly and sentenced with no crimes, really no crime
at anything, and having to spend seventeen years when I
know that there was a white counterpart that went home

(01:01:28):
with probation, and they said, we don't want to mess
up his college career. He's going to college. He has
no record, and you know, no one was hurt, so
we're just going to give him some I know those
things happened because I seen it happen, So I was
directly impacted by those things. So this fight that I
thought was fighting back, right, you chose to fight just

(01:01:49):
because it was the right thing to do, you know,
and not a lot of people that just fight because
it's the right thing to do and who haven't been impacted.
So I just want to say thank you, and we
truly appreciate you.

Speaker 3 (01:02:00):
Yeah, truly, truly, truly you deserve all the honors. And
you know, like I tell people all the time, none
of this means we're perfect, because we're not perfect.

Speaker 1 (01:02:10):
We mess out Aaron Donald exactly, We're not perfect.

Speaker 2 (01:02:15):
Tim Scott, they could take We give him Byron Donalds,
Kennis Owns and Tim Scott and you can just.

Speaker 1 (01:02:21):
Come on to But yeah, I did.

Speaker 3 (01:02:25):
I do want to underscore that point that for those
who are listening. I know there's ten people and saying no,
but he did this to me and I didn't like
when he said that, and he did this that Yet
all of us, we know whatever he did to you,
he did it you're right, I get it, I understand.
But the overall point is that the work and the

(01:02:46):
mission and the authenticity is what's important. Can we all
improve certainly? Are we working on that?

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (01:02:55):
Should we be called in and have to have conversations, well,
I feel like, you know, you took the credit for
my thing, you stepped on my top.

Speaker 1 (01:03:02):
Whatever that is.

Speaker 3 (01:03:03):
Absolutely, we should definitely reconcile those things. But it is
important to be able to lift your work jolly and
make sure that you feel supported, because not just your children,
but also for you. We all want to die with
a better place, and right now it's going back to

(01:03:24):
worse than it was before we were born. And that's
something that, as you said, I just can't sit by
and watch it happen. So I am very grateful for
you becoming one of the TMI show alumni. Yeah, you're
alumnion and you could come back anytime you want.

Speaker 5 (01:03:44):
I've been on a lot of podcasts and with Tamika
here up last week, Hey on our podcast, Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:03:52):
Reality TV shows. I've been on Discovery.

Speaker 5 (01:03:54):
Channels, and I was really excited to be on your
podcast because to what I do appreciate to.

Speaker 6 (01:04:00):
Work with you, dude, my sign.

Speaker 5 (01:04:02):
I know your story about you know, how you incarcerated,
why you're incarcerated, and that shit means something to me.

Speaker 6 (01:04:07):
And I hate the thank yous, and I hate when
people give me flowers. That's also you know.

Speaker 5 (01:04:13):
That's my therapist, something that's a result of being an
abused child and not taking compliments well, but truth that
I think to myself, like you just said, I could
walk away tomorrow and just you know, assimilate into my
white supremacy and be okay. And so that's like a

(01:04:34):
motivating factor to me that the fact is we talk
about these things, we say.

Speaker 6 (01:04:39):
These things happen, but they're not just fucking words and stories.
They really really happen.

Speaker 5 (01:04:44):
And when we're watching what's happening right now, I think
the most fascinating part for me is we've talked about
this before. I've had these conversations in private. I've had
these conversations in public. If we do X y Z,
then ABC is going to happen.

Speaker 2 (01:04:59):
We did X y Z and.

Speaker 5 (01:05:01):
ABC, sure as fuck's happening right now. And so seeing
it happen, seeing Donald Trump just absolutely dismantled the constitutions,
seeing America become nineteen thirties Germany.

Speaker 2 (01:05:15):
It is.

Speaker 5 (01:05:16):
It is overwhelming to the senses to see it happening,
and I think a lot of people are dealing with
it in different ways. But my message to everybody is
it is happening. This is not just fucking hyperbolieve, this.

Speaker 6 (01:05:30):
Is not just a story.

Speaker 1 (01:05:32):
This is not just political the fear mongering and emotional right,
this is.

Speaker 6 (01:05:39):
Real life happening. And every single moment in American.

Speaker 5 (01:05:44):
History where human rights were literally in the fire, the
defining factor between good and evil was the people. And
so your grandchildren are going to ask you one day,
what did you do right now in this moment? And
my only question to you is what the fuck's gonna
be here?

Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
Answer?

Speaker 3 (01:06:06):
Thank you, jolly, We appreciate you, Russell Ellis. Thank you
for joining the TMI Show today and keep doing your work.

Speaker 5 (01:06:14):
Brother.

Speaker 1 (01:06:14):
We support you.

Speaker 3 (01:06:15):
We are here to be partners and to figure out
ways to fight back. You know, I think what we
need one another right now more than ever, and we
are certainly very appreciative of your work and will continue
to support you as we hope that you do the
same for us.

Speaker 6 (01:06:32):
Everything y'all doing. Thank you so much for having me.
I respect both of you, and I thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
It's the only thing that's necessary for evil to prospers,
for good men to do nothing.

Speaker 6 (01:06:41):
Man, thanks, I stand by. It's so true.

Speaker 1 (01:06:45):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:06:49):
Shout out to our brother Russell Ellis aka Jolly Good.
You know what I'm saying. It's an energy that he has. Man. Look,
he has this, he has this revolutionary Santa Claus. Look
about him, right, he looks like the cool white guy
with the bed, but he has this fire in him

(01:07:09):
and it's about justice. So I love him. I appreciate him.
You know, people like are you racist? Everything is no,
I'm not racist. I'm just anti white supremacy. It ain't
white people, it's white supremacy. And when you when you
on the side of what's right, I'm with you. If
you speaking against negativity, you speaking against fascism, or you
speaking against racism, if you're speaking against all isms and

(01:07:30):
you're speaking on the side of what's right, then I'm
with you. Don't try to put that on me because
you mad that. I'm not gonna let you do racist
shit or say racist shit, or be comfortable in racism.
And we even got our own people that say, oh,
you're racist because you talked, No, I'm not racist. I
am a person of conscious right Eve. When a person

(01:07:51):
of good conscious understands what racism does and he's able
to identify racism and speak against racism all the time, mister,
mister jolly good Ginger is one of our accomplices. As
we like to say, no more allies, man. So I
appreciate him, y'ad.

Speaker 1 (01:08:09):
I love him. He's good people.

Speaker 3 (01:08:11):
He's good people, and I don't I've never heard anybody
say anything bad about him. But I bet you if
I did some research, somebody I can find. I'm not
talking about dumbfolk. The opposition to my eye phone.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
I bet I know that.

Speaker 3 (01:08:26):
When they see him on the thing, I can't believe
you would have him. Don't you know that in nineteen
seventy three he said this? And don't you know that
he did this and he stole my credit and he
was named that the so and so and I was
the one did the thing.

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
Set already know.

Speaker 3 (01:08:49):
But I'm I'm with him because I see, I know
what he's doing is very dangerous, Like seriously, it's very well.

Speaker 2 (01:08:55):
I ask a question, like, I know you do you
get death threats and you fear for your life because
the white people mad at us and we're black, and
they mad at us because we're black and were speaking
against I know, but I'm just trying to say, I
know how mad they ought to see black people speak
against white supremacy. So when they feel like they got

(01:09:17):
a trader and.

Speaker 1 (01:09:19):
They have killed the many, and they have killed the many,
and they have killed.

Speaker 2 (01:09:24):
It's a person that's he's a trader of white supremacy.
He's denounced white supremacy and he's gonna stand on the
good side. And speaking of the good side, that brings
me to my I don't get it for today. So
if you haven't been up to speed, there's a young
man by the name of Carmelo Anthony, a black young man.
I think he's about seventeen years of age. He's been

(01:09:47):
accused of murder of Austin Metcalf. Now, the circumstances surrounding
his death was there was a game of sports game
that they were at. He was sitting in the seat
which was actually his seat, was he Carmelo Carmelo Carmelo
was sitting in the seat who was actually his, which
was actually his seat, and two white guys woke up

(01:10:09):
to him threatening him, and he defended itself. Allegedly, this
is what from witnesses saying that he was sitting there
and he told him don't put their hands on him.

Speaker 1 (01:10:20):
Yeah, I think I saw.

Speaker 3 (01:10:21):
Ben Crump wrote about this too, and and because Ben
was asked to look at it and to make you
give an objective opinion. And you know, Ben, he don't
play if it ain't right.

Speaker 2 (01:10:32):
And there's other video servicing where you've seen another situation
where a white man was doing something to him, being
aggressive to him, or he was just interviewed. It's just
who he was sitting there interviewing a white guy and
somebody was very disrespectful to him and his camera man

(01:10:52):
was he.

Speaker 1 (01:10:55):
Okay? So Carmelo Anthony was interviewing.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
Interviewing a white guy in another scenario and it wasn't
even at the game. He was just on campus interviewing
the white guy and the guy came over with disrespecting
him and his camera man, and you can see he
was polite. He was like, hey, what's going on here?
Like why would he talk to my camera?

Speaker 4 (01:11:12):
You know?

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
And they they left without incident. So then at the school,
so now at this game that they were at you know.
Witnesses say that he was sitting in the seat. They
told him to get up, he said, on this is
my seat. They threatened him, he told him, don't put
your hands on me, and allegedly, based on witnesses testimony,

(01:11:35):
they jumped him.

Speaker 3 (01:11:36):
And they being Austin Metcalf, Metcalf and another guy all
still the same age, right, because that's the game, that's right.
I really am asking these questions because I've seen it everywhere,
and I saw you talking about it, and I read
a statement from Ben that I thought was really powerful,

(01:11:56):
but I really did not know all the details because
of so many other things we've been dealing with.

Speaker 1 (01:12:01):
So I'm really trying to understand.

Speaker 2 (01:12:02):
So this is what happened. And then allegedly he had
a knife over a pocket knife, and in his defense,
you know, he decided he used the knife and Austin
Metcalf was pronounced dead at the scene. So, and there's
been a lot of just different outlooks, you know, I

(01:12:22):
for one, believe that the man deserves his day in court,
you know, and if what they say happened, allegedly that
these people gemmed him and he was defending himself, then
that will come out in court as well, you know,
and a lot of people have raised money against for
him to make sure that he has a legal defense
team that could accurately defense him, like just like you know,

(01:12:46):
we have Kyle Ridhouse Naus or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
Is Kyle Rittenhouse.

Speaker 2 (01:12:50):
I don't even care, and all you know, they they
constantly make sure that the white guys who commit murdered
against black people have the adequate you know, defense teams
and money for it. So people were angry about him
being able to raise money. So you know, I've been
very vocal about that, but I've seen this video today

(01:13:11):
that was quite enlightening. Now there is a group called
Protect White Americans and it's an anti white violence coalition.
And one of the guys who was there, his name
is Jack Lane. He was speaking, he was being interviewed,

(01:13:34):
and the father of Austin Metcalf was on the phone
and Jack was telling him, hey were very strong. If
you came down to sit down here with us as
we advocate for your son, it will be very strong.
And now listen, Austin Metcalf's father wants justice for his son.

(01:13:55):
His name is Jeff Metcalf. He wants justice for his
son his son was killed than as any father would.
He wants to see whoever did it held accountable. That's
that's a real thing. But what he said was so powerful.
He realized that this Jacqueline guy and Protect White Americans
organization Anti White Violence, which okay, organization was trying to

(01:14:20):
use his son's likeness in situation to promote racial division. Right,
because most people are not saying that this situation was
racially motivated. They were saying, it's a self defense situation.

Speaker 3 (01:14:32):
Well, it depends on which way where when the racism began,
because it's possible that those two white guys going to
Carmelo Anthony and telling him to get out of his
seat that may have been racially may have been, but.

Speaker 2 (01:14:46):
That hasn't been the theme of it, Okay. The theme
of this situation was two people approached one person, he
defended itself, and he's happened to be white, I mean,
the person who lost their life having to be white,
and the young man happened to be black, and black
people are saying this man had a right to defend
himself against two people and the man's father and everybody else,

(01:15:10):
and most people are saying that he had the right.

Speaker 1 (01:15:13):
To live so that they gotta go to court.

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
They need to. So what these people are trying to
do now is make it seem like there was violence
against a white person that it was just it was
good because he was because he was white. That's why
he lost his life.

Speaker 3 (01:15:31):
And the fact that the black guy is able to
raise money means they're trying to trying to I saw
something about this. They're trying to pretty much equate it
with Dylan Ruth and Kyle rittenhou Is, like, oh, y'all
was mad about that, So now why you're not mad
at a black boy has raised X amount of dollars

(01:15:56):
in his defense against a white man, a white young
young man. Right. But the thing about it is, and
also it's important to say because this is what I read,
that the money that was raised went through a channel
that stopped it before distributes, because they're now doing legal
stuff to find out how is the money being used.

(01:16:18):
So actually, Carmelo Anthony has not benefited from the money
that was raised. So they just wanted they was out
there the other day like let's just start with the
misinformation and the jumping to conclusions we don't know yet
about that money.

Speaker 2 (01:16:35):
Go ahead, exactly, and this Jacquline guy was actually trying
to utilize Austin Metcalf as a poster boy for this
anti white violence. And the father said, you know, I
don't want my son's face, likeness or anything associated with
you got because what you trying to do is cause

(01:16:57):
racial division and that's not what this is about. I
don't respect what you do, and I don't want anything
to do with you. Take my son, Take my son's
face and everything off. And Jack Lane said, this is weakness, sir,
this is white guilt. You know, you're showing weakness. And
then it was and it happened to be this.

Speaker 1 (01:17:16):
The rack they got, and it happened to be and.

Speaker 2 (01:17:22):
It happened to be a black guy tap dancing in
the back line, black guy speaking, you know it is
we just showing weakness and do you even talking? It
was so like, what what are you even talking about?
Black guy? Sir? What what he said? Because he was
Jack jack Lane told he was on the phone.

Speaker 3 (01:17:42):
With the dad.

Speaker 1 (01:17:43):
Yeah, he told Jack that they were out in public.

Speaker 2 (01:17:47):
Okay, listening, he got the camera, they got the phone.
It's a guy. Let him listen to it. Jeff is
saying and jack Lane looks at him and said, looking
at the phone, and said, sounds like white guilt, sir,
it's white Guilt's showing weakness. You should be standing with us.
And he's like, no, I don't want to stand with
some ship that I know is bigotry. And then you're

(01:18:10):
trying to use my son to promote your racist bullshit,
and we not with that. And then there's a black
guy in the back. He leans over black guy here,
Black guy here. It is showing weakness. And I'm just like, bro,
what you even gonna have to do? Let them people
handle their.

Speaker 1 (01:18:27):
You because I want to put him on.

Speaker 2 (01:18:34):
Somebody get his name, because we need to talk to him.
I need to have a conversation because I need to
understand what is he even talking about. But what I
just don't get is why are people trying to utilize
this situation for racial division? Right? Why are you mad
at a father who doesn't want to his face, his

(01:18:55):
son's face, to be utilized in something that he doesn't
stand for.

Speaker 1 (01:18:59):
Right, You're gonna force the man.

Speaker 2 (01:19:01):
Gon force the man to be with the racism, because
you with the racism. You want him to be with
the anti white violence, which is not really a thing,
because you know, it's not really a thing. It's not
something that's overwhelmingly impacting our communities. So why would you
want to utilize this boy in this situation and be

(01:19:22):
mad at him and call him weak? Like the crazy
shit is that you gonna call that man weak? Well,
that man lost his son. You got the gall You
got the gall to sit there and tell that man
he's weak because he don't want to be involved with
your situation, like somebody, these people need some help. Man,
I don't know. Look, white privilege and white supremacy go

(01:19:44):
hand in hand because black people would never say we
wouldn't give for what was going on. White people Black
purchase saying I don't want my son to do this.

Speaker 3 (01:19:54):
We had situations where we think, family, you think it's
supposed to be a fight, we're getting out there, were
about to show up, and I don't want to be
associated with that. We don't believe in that.

Speaker 1 (01:20:07):
That stuff is.

Speaker 3 (01:20:08):
You know, I could think of a family that was
like that in a major case and the reason and
people will be they'll see me in the street or online,
they'll be like, why didn't.

Speaker 1 (01:20:19):
We do anything about stuff?

Speaker 3 (01:20:20):
What happened with such and such, and of course, well
I don't say that because the integrity of the family
is also important. So you don't want to be like,
well they didn't want to anybody to stand up for that.
You just say, you know what, it just you know,
there are other people that are handling it. I'm not
really involved in that situation anymore, but I certainly pray
for or hope that whatever, and just kind of let

(01:20:42):
it go.

Speaker 1 (01:20:43):
Meanwhile, you got black.

Speaker 3 (01:20:45):
Folks that's in the background, who's supposed to be the
family members of tomorrow. I don't associate with that. I
don't think that all police are bad. I you know,
I stand with the cops and I want peace and
I you know, and it's.

Speaker 1 (01:20:58):
Just like, gotcha, you got it. I never said that
all police was bad. Where you get that from? But
as soon as they say that, as.

Speaker 3 (01:21:06):
Soon as they say that, I don't believe that all
police are bad, and I don't want you know already
the mindset that's coming behind you.

Speaker 2 (01:21:14):
And it's like, once you say that, we can't galvanize
the people to speak against this individual because you've already nullified.

Speaker 1 (01:21:22):
The fight, right, So, and if people like that and
we back up.

Speaker 2 (01:21:26):
And because that's your ideology, that's your theory of your
child and also your child or your family member, whoever
it is. And if you're in charge and you don't
want the fight for your child to happen in that manner,
then people have to respect it. But not this white man.
He called the man weak and dealing with he told me,

(01:21:47):
dealing with white guilt and the black man.

Speaker 3 (01:21:49):
So this week or you're giving in or you're going
to create more awestin people.

Speaker 1 (01:21:54):
Right, Yeah, it's.

Speaker 2 (01:21:56):
Gonna be more medcasts because of you. It's like, come on, man,
it's like, we just gotta do better and white black
people mind their business. Man, where would you come from?
Why did that man say that black person here it
is weakness? And he leaned back up and you just
looked at his face and said, he got his good

(01:22:18):
old tap dancing shoes.

Speaker 1 (01:22:19):
I have to see him.

Speaker 2 (01:22:20):
Oh man, somebody got to give me his name. Please.
If y'all find his name, please put it under there,
because I need to know who he is. We need
to bring him to the round table. Man. There's that
there's that well that brings us to the end of
another episode of t M. I make sure that you
tune in. This is the number one podcast in the world.
We are the best host in the world. You know,

(01:22:41):
it's hard being this great. It is really hard being
this great. I have to shout out to my team
Janie who is doing an amazing job, Amando and Toya Tsha,
everybody who is contributing to this podcast, like it is
entering stages of greatness that I don't think I've ever anticipated.

(01:23:04):
So continue to support us. Send us topics you want
us to talk about. Let us know who you want
us to interview. Tell us you love us, tell us
you hate us, but just tell us something. Make sure
you follow us on YouTube at Tami Show PC and
on Instagram at Tami Underscore Show. We love you. I'm
not gonna always be right, Tamika d. Marri is not
gonna always be wrong, but we will both always and

(01:23:26):
I mean always, be authentic.

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Tamika Mallory

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