July 23, 2024 • 35 mins
"On the ninth of July, with a few shots to the neck and the head, he was shot at about 11p.m. near the preschool."
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
All eight episodes of To Die For are available now
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Speaker 2 (00:18):
Warning, the following episode contains explicit language and sexual themes.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Listener discretion is advised.
Speaker 4 (00:32):
This is a scary case.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Actually tell me what you mean by that.
Speaker 5 (00:39):
This is scary because the implications are pretty profound, I think.
Speaker 4 (00:46):
So let's assume everything.
Speaker 6 (00:49):
This is Robin Drake, who spent twenty two years working
Russian counterintelligence for the FBI. You heard from him in
the first episode of this podcast. I've circled back to
get his thoughts from an intelligence perspective on what he's
heard so far.
Speaker 5 (01:04):
Let's assume everything Aliah has said is true. That would
mean that this country is won by warlords. That each
one of these generals is a fieftom under themselves, and
they're all serving the greater warlord Putin, and they each
have their cadre of enforcers that are in uniform, that
(01:27):
are under state kind of control. I'm only analyzing the
information she provided, but they're not as a nation state
trying to counter drugs. They as warlords are going after
their adversaries, and if it's a general that's at the
top of yours, that means a general on the top
(01:48):
of another. So in other words, this to me looks
like a feudal system of a bunch of fiefdoms trying
to take out each other's supply chain and monetary structure.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
That's kind of scary if you're thinking about it.
Speaker 5 (02:02):
This is actually the truth of how this nation state,
a world power is supposedly being run.
Speaker 4 (02:07):
So it's either one or the other.
Speaker 5 (02:09):
Either she's making all us up, or this country is
a country of warlords.
Speaker 7 (02:16):
To jolly, I'm really sorry.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
How to do jut to? This is.
Speaker 6 (03:07):
Episode sixteen, chapter thirty three, down word spiral.
Speaker 7 (03:22):
He put me into the car. I drove away, and
I felt like something died inside of me. I felt
like I just lost him forever. But I was trying
to tell myself, no, no, no, I will see him again,
But they didn't feel like I will really see him again.
Speaker 6 (03:46):
Aliyah had just left the home of Vladimir, her former
target and now her ally. He was sending her to
Moscow for the time being to hide out until it
was safe. She had no idea how long that would
be and whether or when she'd hear from the general.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
She met with.
Speaker 7 (04:05):
The driver. He drove me to Moscow and he opened
their apartment for me, quite like small but very clean
and nice apartment. The driver brought me some food and
then he left, and I remember, I just I just
(04:27):
wanted to sleep. I think I slept like a few
days straight.
Speaker 5 (04:37):
Up.
Speaker 7 (04:37):
I drank some water and I just went back to bed,
and I was just sleeping, sleeping, sleeping, recovering. You know,
sleep was the best recovering medicine. I just wanted to
forget everything. I was thinking about the bladder or a lot,
(05:00):
about what he's done for me, about Cornell, and about
you know, my former commander. Then I didn't go out
for like a few days. And then at some point
life was starting to come back to me, and I
(05:23):
was wondering what's happening outside, And I decided to go
out just to buy some food, buy some newspapers. It
was a dark time. I knew that I couldn't contact anyone,
but I thought, if I will contact one person, wouldn't
(05:44):
be bad.
Speaker 6 (05:47):
Leah decided to contact an old high school classmate of
hers who had moved to Moscow.
Speaker 7 (05:52):
I was just alone, lonely and board.
Speaker 6 (05:56):
Her friend invited her to a party, and against her
better judgment, A Liah decided to go.
Speaker 7 (06:03):
I knew I couldn't do it, but yet I did it.
And I remember, like first time, for like so long,
I saw so many people in one place and it
was so weird. There were like access to drugs everywhere.
Speaker 6 (06:22):
Despite everything she'd seen, Leah quickly found herself swept into
this culture of drugs. It wasn't because she didn't know
how they ruined lives, it was because she did.
Speaker 7 (06:34):
And then at some point I just couldn't understand why
the vict just was gone in one day. It was
just like only one scene club, dog dancing, drugs, alcohol,
and it just was like NonStop, and then you come
(06:58):
back to the reality and you cannot accept it again
and you just go back. I think that time I
felt so much guilt. I felt guilt for Vladimir, I
felt guilt for Sasha. I felt guilt for my father
(07:22):
that I didn't succeed in my career. I failed. The
feeling of guilt which was so deep inside of me
that I just couldn't handle it. And I just thought
(07:44):
that moment that maybe this will help me to stop
this pain when I try that. I don't understand people
when they become drug added because they have so much
pain inside of them, so much so they just cannot
handle it in a normal life. It's like too much. Everything.
(08:10):
What Vladimir told me about the big life and the
big world, I didn't see it. And I was still
waiting maybe he will come and he will know what
to do, because I was completely lost completely.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Unfortunately, Leah never saw Vladimir again.
Speaker 7 (08:36):
So his driver, his friend, he called me. He said,
do you know what happened? He said, like, no, I
didn't know what was happening. I stopped even reading newspapers
and I was just in another world. And I asked him,
what's happening. Do you know anything about Vladimir? He said, well,
(09:02):
he said he is his dad. And for a quite
a long time, I was silenced. He's like, are you okay?
Are you okay? And I asked what happened how? And
he said, I don't know a lot of details, but
(09:25):
he was murdered and I don't know how and where.
I just wanted to tell you, so you know, And
I said, when it's the funeral and He's like, well
it will be soon, like in a couple of days,
but you can't come here. Don't even think about doing that.
(09:48):
And he switched over the phone. And I couldn't even cry.
Speaker 6 (09:57):
You know.
Speaker 7 (09:57):
It was almost like the last my hope of the future,
the last my connection with the past. It was just
gone with him. I found some newspapers, but they wrote
(10:18):
like in the very like facts kind of thing, so
and so was killed at this place. That's it. And
I just took some drugs just to escape because I
felt even more guilty. I felt like, now it's time
(10:43):
for me to leave the world. I felt so disgusting
that I'm not allowed to leave.
Speaker 6 (10:58):
Leah soon fell sick, a combination of the psychological toll
of Vladimir's murder and the physical toll of her lifestyle.
Speaker 7 (11:08):
I have a very high fever. I couldn't walk. It
was something really bad. I thought like, this is the
time when I may finally die, like I felt, that's
so close to me. And I was thinking about my parents,
(11:31):
and you know what, I decided to call them. My
mom remembers that call still now. She sounded really sad,
and I said, Mom, that's me. I just wanted to
tell you that I really really love you, and I
(11:53):
want to apologize for everything, like everything I've done, and
I'll just try to do my best. And he said,
oh my god, he sounds so sick, like where are
you what's going on? I said, like, tell my dad
(12:14):
that I'm really sorry for everything, and I think this
would be my last call. So I just wanted to
tell you that I love you and thank you for
giving me this life. That's it, and I switched over
(12:35):
the phone. I thought like, oh, this is just absolutely
pointless life. You know, I live a pointless life. So
I took the raise of blade. I didn't even like
(12:56):
write a letter whatever they say lo because sometimes they
write a letter, you know. I didn't do anything like that.
I just took the lizard and just cut my wrist.
I thought, okay, so now I can be free. This
(13:18):
is my freedom. Now, this is the end of my suffer,
of my guild, of my negative experience. And at some
point I just fainted. I woke up. I looked at
(13:42):
my wrist and either I didn't do the deep cut either.
My blood it dried so fast, so it's so blood
on the floor on my hand, but in my hand,
the blood stopped bleeding.
Speaker 6 (14:02):
Somewhere in the state being half awake and half asleep,
half alive and half dead, Elia saw a vision that
to her seemed very real.
Speaker 7 (14:11):
It was Vladimir, and I saw him sitting next to
my bed and he looked at me and he said,
come on, wake up, you have to go. You have
to leave. You have to go and live your life.
(14:35):
And he told me, do you remember I gave you
all these numbers. Call them. They will organize for you everything.
Call them. And he was saying it like, come on,
stand up, you have to go. You have bigger goals,
(14:57):
bigger mission. And he just disappeared. The next morning, when
I woke up, I found a note with all these numbers,
all these addresses, names everything, Switzerland, Italy, Fronts, Turkey, Greece,
(15:24):
his friends people, He relied on them, He trust them.
And I called one number and I said that I'm
from Vladimir, and I asked for the help, and then
they arranged everything. So I fly away. First country was Turkey,
(15:52):
and I had the time. Russian prospered, so it was
very convenient and easier to fly to Turkey. First. I
wanted to find the light in this dark tunnel, and
Vladimir showed me that light and I stopped doing drugs
(16:14):
and alcohol just like that in one day. Where I
am right now, it thanks to him, you know. He
pushed me and he didn't let me die. Seriously, I
feel this way.
Speaker 6 (16:40):
While Leah was in Turkey, she discovered the fate of
her former superiors, the colonel and the commander who assaulted
her and abused her and sent her to die.
Speaker 7 (16:51):
So both of them, the coronel and my previous commander,
they got retired and it was quite quick of the
whole operation was finished. Usually, if you do something bad
while your career, but not too bad, then they just
(17:13):
read of you like okay, so here's your pension, here's
your retirement. Good luck. And it gives me understanding that
they obviously lost the income of the bribery and the
power which they had while they had high rank.
Speaker 6 (17:53):
Chapter thirty four fairy tale endings.
Speaker 7 (18:05):
So ninth of July in two thousand and four, according
to Regno media, with the few shots to the neck
and had the criminal leader, which is in Russian calls
of started forty four years old. Vladimir Costin were shot
(18:28):
about eleven PM near to the preschool.
Speaker 6 (18:34):
Alia Rosa is reading an article on the death of Vladimir.
It's still a mystery what happened, but she believes that
his former partner and friend had something to do with it.
There are a lot of unanswered questions left at the
end of Lea's story, so I asked her about a
few of them. In the last episode, we discussed your
(18:57):
meeting with the general and himself saying take a rest,
I have some other missions and things for you, and
the story got a little squarely there. But now that
we're talking together, I wanted to get your answer to
what happened there.
Speaker 7 (19:16):
I okay, So I still, you know, like it's still scared.
I mean I was scared a lot of times when
I was there, but this was the most scariest meeting
in my life, because you I that time, and even
(19:37):
now I kind of like, you know, like the power
of the person.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Eliah seems to be struggling here.
Speaker 6 (19:44):
I try to ask again what really happened at that
meeting with the general, why she was allowed to leave
the country, whether we had new assignments for her, and
whether she escaped the system and how. For the next
half hour, I struggled to get a clear and direct
answer that makes sense. I'm not sure something is lost
in the translation, or if there's something she's hiding and
(20:08):
it turns out there is.
Speaker 7 (20:12):
Am I free now? Am I free? Now?
Speaker 5 (20:15):
Like?
Speaker 7 (20:15):
I don't know? Where is the guarantee they will not
do anything to me? Oh? My son and I have
this the thought every moment I leave, Is it a freedom? Now?
Speaker 6 (20:30):
I ask Aleiah why she doesn't feel free and if
there's anything she's had to do since.
Speaker 7 (20:36):
My general in my new commander, the unofficial commander, gave
me a new task to become whom I never wanted
to be. And it was low to my pride and
betray to my body and my soul. But I don't
(20:59):
want to end up on this note because it's such
a it's like breaking every hope for every person who
listen to that. The life is not like.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
You know.
Speaker 6 (21:13):
Aliyah trails off here. It's clear that she's conflicted. She
wants to be the hero of her own story and
she is just for starters. She's here and she survived it,
but it's a different kind of hero than perhaps her
father raised her to be. This desire to give her
story a happy ending for the audience helps explain who
(21:35):
she's become today. Throughout this podcast, some listeners have written
in struggling to reconcile the story she's telling with her
social media presence, which portrays a lot of red carpets,
expensive sports cars, paparazzi, fame and glamour. She wants She
likes everybody to see the success, the success.
Speaker 7 (21:58):
The final story. Yeah, retail which I create in my
in my illusory world which actually fucking doesn't exist. I
pretend the Instagram is just all for me. It's like
I look at it and I feel better. I want
(22:18):
to believe that this is the result which I created
for myself.
Speaker 6 (22:25):
Do you think part of that illusion also is not
just for you? But like showing your dad, even though
I didn't choose his path, look at me and look
at my life to.
Speaker 7 (22:33):
My dad, of course, to show him that without military
and without following your order, I still pretend that I'm
successful because I feel I feel like it's my armor,
(22:54):
and I protect myself in certain ways where I cannot.
I don't have power enough to be open and live
in real world because it's it scares me a lot.
Speaker 6 (23:16):
Let me pause, I said, Okay, if I call Emily.
He'd been working with therapeutically. So if I kind of
looper around this discussion, yes, okay, heym Lee you're there.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
Yeah, I am so.
Speaker 6 (23:29):
As I'm sitting here sort of unpacking stuff with Alah,
I just thought i'd sort of bring you in and
getgains some thoughts. Okay, what I'm learning is I talked
to a Liah Moore. Is the happy ending isn't exactly
how would you put Aliyah? The happy ending isn't?
Speaker 7 (23:46):
There is no happy ending?
Speaker 6 (23:48):
To be honest, at this point, I've spent a year
and a half with Aliyah an unpacked her story, not
just with Emily Maccus, the trauma counselor we're speaking with now,
but with Russian intelligence sources and experts. And I could
go over at point by point and share what the
FBI says was believable, with the CIA says was credible,
(24:09):
and so on. But I think we could do that
with any story. Every true crime podcast is a collection
of narratives that we're trying to pick the best path through.
And I think the path that is best to take
with Aleah given everything we've heard, is a trauma informed one.
People see Lea's Instagram, and they think of it from
an influencer point of view, but I'm curious what does
(24:31):
it look like from a trauma point of view.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Part is the association. It's part of her coping mechanism
and what she.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
It was.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
It's involuntary and detachment from reality at times, and it's
a way that she protected herself and most of the
time is unconscious.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
With that dissociation.
Speaker 6 (24:58):
When we experienced trauma, some of us want to feel
like it doesn't define us, that we're not victims, that
we winners, winners.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Trauma does affect the way we perceive ourselves, the way
we act and react, because it affected our brain. It
affected our nervous system. When you look at the association,
it's part of the fight flight response. It's even your
memory that can be affected.
Speaker 6 (25:29):
I start to understand, as Emily speaks, that after surviving
such a disempowering experience, there's a need to find a
way to empower ourselves through our narrative. As the author
Esactinas and once said, all sorrows can be born if
you put them into a story or tell a story
about them.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
And look at even the way Eliir was raised by
her father in the military. She was raised not to feel,
not to be connected, but she was also raised to
be the superhero in the story. I just want to
(26:10):
remind you, Aliyah that you can't change your past. You can,
but you can't change the narrative of the story. But
you are the superhero in your life story.
Speaker 3 (26:24):
What are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 7 (26:26):
I was thinking that I think this podcast actually gave
me freedom because first time in life I started to
feel I felt a strong guilt, I felt anger, I
(26:50):
felt hate, I felt pain, and then I started to
feel love. I started to not to be ashamed of
my vulnerability. And first time in life, I noticed that
(27:12):
I started to be open to people in general and
man especially. And it's very scary, like it's so many
fears that I don't know if I can handle it.
But I take a deep breath and try to move
(27:38):
on and not to close my heart and continue feeling,
which which is so hard.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
Epilogue a Russian story.
Speaker 6 (28:21):
So I just called to ask, what are your thoughts
now that you've heard the rest of e Leia's story.
Speaker 4 (28:27):
It took me on a journey, really, and.
Speaker 5 (28:30):
The journey that it brought me on was such a
conclusion that she is a product of.
Speaker 4 (28:36):
A father who's part of the state.
Speaker 5 (28:38):
She was recruited and or volunteered into the state system.
Her context is then shattered tragically with abuse and rape
and then put into this odd school of sparrow training.
Speaker 4 (28:55):
Because that is just as we've said before.
Speaker 5 (28:58):
Was that a real school, Was it a state spons
to school, or was a bunch of dirty old men
that were justifying their actions on behalf of the state
as an excuse could be all there lies the Russian
state at its bedrock.
Speaker 6 (29:11):
This is Robin Driek again, former chief of the FBI's
Counterintelligence Behavioral Analysis program.
Speaker 5 (29:17):
To keep you in a state of chaos personally, emotionally, psychologically,
and physically. They traumatize you, They trauma bond you to them.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
This is the case where they give you.
Speaker 5 (29:28):
A little bit of love bombing, we love you, you're great,
you're awesome, and then they beat on your, beat on
your beat on your beat on you, and then the
beating has become more and the love becomes less, and
then you get addicted to that. One time out of
a million, you might get a kind word or a
promotion or a good posting from someone, or maybe even
not being traumatized tonight by someone. This is what they do,
(29:51):
and that's what she u is a product of the state.
It is pretty profound that she was able to do
what she did to rescue herself, the amount of bravery
she had to start recognizing. Basically, it's the matrix. You
know that they have to get myself out of this matrix.
And that's where therapy comes in, and that's where rescuing
ourselves from the trauma with the great healthy relationships we
(30:14):
tend forge around us and getting that narrative and that
story out there for people to see.
Speaker 6 (30:25):
What is a hero? Is it Black Widow? Is it
Red Sparrow? Is it James Bond? When I first sat
down with Aliyah, that's the type of story I imagined hearing,
and I think that's the type of story Aliyah imagine telling.
But real life is not so clear cut. And I
learned through this process at least three things I will
(30:47):
never forget. The first is that life in a totalitarian system,
whether it's a country or one's own family, is a
prison with bars made of fear and duty, and even
if we manage to gape physically, it's much harder to
escape psychologically. The second is that sexpionage is anything but sexy.
(31:10):
The third is that most stories of abuse don't have
happy endings. The perpetrators often get away with it, the
victims rarely get justice or resolution, and even if they do,
the healing process is often messy and incomplete.
Speaker 5 (31:26):
All these things in here do happen, and these are
the tragic results of them.
Speaker 6 (31:31):
So what is a hero in this case and so
many others? Does a person who survived to tell their story?
Not necessarily the story, their story? And what is healing?
It's being heard, So thank you for listening. To Die
(32:13):
For is a production of Tenderfoot TV in association with
iHeart Podcasts. The show is hosted and written by me
Neil Strauss, with additional writing assistants by Tristan Bankston. Executive
producers are myself, Donald Albright, and Payne Lindsay. For iHeart Podcasts,
executive producers are Matt Frederick and Alex Williams. Lead producer
(32:33):
and editor is Tristan Bankston. Additional editing by Miles Clark
and Christian Brown. Supervising producer Tracy Kaplan. Consultants include Nushin,
Valiza Day, Chelsea Gooden, and Jamie Albright.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
Artwork by Byron McCoy.
Speaker 6 (32:49):
Original music by Makeup and Vanity Set, mixed and mastered
by Dayton Cole. Our theme song is Killer Shangui Law
by Psychotic Beats featuring Pattiamore. Special thanks to Aorin Rosenbab
and the team at Uta Beck Media and Marketing, Aorn Siegel,
Becky Jensen, the Nord Group, Meredith Stedman, Rose Baruch, and
(33:11):
Alex Vespustad. Thanks also to additional guests. Robin Dreek, author
of the upcoming book and Breakable Alliances, A spy recruiter's
authoritative guide to cultivating powerful and lasting connections. Alex Finley,
author of the Victor Caro series. Doctor David Lewis, author
of Triumph of the Will, How two men hypnotized Hitler
(33:32):
and changed the world. Doctor Joel Dimmesdale, author of Dark Persuasion,
A History of brainwashing from Pavlov to social Media. Professor
Mark Gailliatti, author of Downfall, Precosion, Putin and The New
Fight for the Future of Russia. Mark Hollingsworth, author of
Agents of Influence, How the k g B subverted Western democracies.
(33:53):
Doctor Ian Garner, author of Z Generation into the heart
of Russia's fascist youth.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Robert J.
Speaker 6 (33:59):
Lifton, author of Surviving ar Catastrophes, Resilience and Renewal From
Hiroshima to the COVID nineteen pandemic. Amy Knight, author of
The Kremlin's News, Putin's bitter feud with the oligarch who
made him Ruler of Russia. Yuri Felshtinsky, author of From
Red Terror to Terrorist State, Russia's secret service and its
(34:19):
fight for world domination. Doctor Joe Sirio, author of Being
Resilient Fifty lessons on Leaving chronic Stress behind. Holly McKay,
author of The Dictator's Wife. Emily Machis, author of The
Naked Truth of a Healer, The Path to My Authentic Self.
Luke Harding, author of Invasion, The inside story of Russia's
(34:41):
Bloody War in Ukraine's fight for survival and Setlana Stephenson,
author of Crossing the Line, Vagrancy, homelessness and social displacement
in Russia. Federico Varez, author of Mafia Life, Love, Death,
and the Money at the Heart of Organized Crime. And
Matt Tipton Army r Your veteran and internal medicine doctor
(35:02):
trained in chemical and radiological weapons response.
Speaker 4 (35:07):
Wow, that was a very Russian story.
All eight episodes of To Die For are available now
to bench absolutely free, but for ad free listening and
exclusive bonuses, subscribe to tendorfoot Plus at tenderfootplus dot com
or on Apple Podcasts.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Warning, the following episode contains explicit language and sexual themes.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Listener discretion is advised.
Speaker 4 (00:32):
This is a scary case.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Actually tell me what you mean by that.
Speaker 5 (00:39):
This is scary because the implications are pretty profound, I think.
Speaker 4 (00:46):
So let's assume everything.
Speaker 6 (00:49):
This is Robin Drake, who spent twenty two years working
Russian counterintelligence for the FBI. You heard from him in
the first episode of this podcast. I've circled back to
get his thoughts from an intelligence perspective on what he's
heard so far.
Speaker 5 (01:04):
Let's assume everything Aliah has said is true. That would
mean that this country is won by warlords. That each
one of these generals is a fieftom under themselves, and
they're all serving the greater warlord Putin, and they each
have their cadre of enforcers that are in uniform, that
(01:27):
are under state kind of control. I'm only analyzing the
information she provided, but they're not as a nation state
trying to counter drugs. They as warlords are going after
their adversaries, and if it's a general that's at the
top of yours, that means a general on the top
(01:48):
of another. So in other words, this to me looks
like a feudal system of a bunch of fiefdoms trying
to take out each other's supply chain and monetary structure.
Speaker 4 (02:00):
That's kind of scary if you're thinking about it.
Speaker 5 (02:02):
This is actually the truth of how this nation state,
a world power is supposedly being run.
Speaker 4 (02:07):
So it's either one or the other.
Speaker 5 (02:09):
Either she's making all us up, or this country is
a country of warlords.
Speaker 7 (02:16):
To jolly, I'm really sorry.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
How to do jut to? This is.
Speaker 6 (03:07):
Episode sixteen, chapter thirty three, down word spiral.
Speaker 7 (03:22):
He put me into the car. I drove away, and
I felt like something died inside of me. I felt
like I just lost him forever. But I was trying
to tell myself, no, no, no, I will see him again,
But they didn't feel like I will really see him again.
Speaker 6 (03:46):
Aliyah had just left the home of Vladimir, her former
target and now her ally. He was sending her to
Moscow for the time being to hide out until it
was safe. She had no idea how long that would
be and whether or when she'd hear from the general.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
She met with.
Speaker 7 (04:05):
The driver. He drove me to Moscow and he opened
their apartment for me, quite like small but very clean
and nice apartment. The driver brought me some food and
then he left, and I remember, I just I just
(04:27):
wanted to sleep. I think I slept like a few
days straight.
Speaker 5 (04:37):
Up.
Speaker 7 (04:37):
I drank some water and I just went back to bed,
and I was just sleeping, sleeping, sleeping, recovering. You know,
sleep was the best recovering medicine. I just wanted to
forget everything. I was thinking about the bladder or a lot,
(05:00):
about what he's done for me, about Cornell, and about
you know, my former commander. Then I didn't go out
for like a few days. And then at some point
life was starting to come back to me, and I
(05:23):
was wondering what's happening outside, And I decided to go
out just to buy some food, buy some newspapers. It
was a dark time. I knew that I couldn't contact anyone,
but I thought, if I will contact one person, wouldn't
(05:44):
be bad.
Speaker 6 (05:47):
Leah decided to contact an old high school classmate of
hers who had moved to Moscow.
Speaker 7 (05:52):
I was just alone, lonely and board.
Speaker 6 (05:56):
Her friend invited her to a party, and against her
better judgment, A Liah decided to go.
Speaker 7 (06:03):
I knew I couldn't do it, but yet I did it.
And I remember, like first time, for like so long,
I saw so many people in one place and it
was so weird. There were like access to drugs everywhere.
Speaker 6 (06:22):
Despite everything she'd seen, Leah quickly found herself swept into
this culture of drugs. It wasn't because she didn't know
how they ruined lives, it was because she did.
Speaker 7 (06:34):
And then at some point I just couldn't understand why
the vict just was gone in one day. It was
just like only one scene club, dog dancing, drugs, alcohol,
and it just was like NonStop, and then you come
(06:58):
back to the reality and you cannot accept it again
and you just go back. I think that time I
felt so much guilt. I felt guilt for Vladimir, I
felt guilt for Sasha. I felt guilt for my father
(07:22):
that I didn't succeed in my career. I failed. The
feeling of guilt which was so deep inside of me
that I just couldn't handle it. And I just thought
(07:44):
that moment that maybe this will help me to stop
this pain when I try that. I don't understand people
when they become drug added because they have so much
pain inside of them, so much so they just cannot
handle it in a normal life. It's like too much. Everything.
(08:10):
What Vladimir told me about the big life and the
big world, I didn't see it. And I was still
waiting maybe he will come and he will know what
to do, because I was completely lost completely.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Unfortunately, Leah never saw Vladimir again.
Speaker 7 (08:36):
So his driver, his friend, he called me. He said,
do you know what happened? He said, like, no, I
didn't know what was happening. I stopped even reading newspapers
and I was just in another world. And I asked him,
what's happening. Do you know anything about Vladimir? He said, well,
(09:02):
he said he is his dad. And for a quite
a long time, I was silenced. He's like, are you okay?
Are you okay? And I asked what happened how? And
he said, I don't know a lot of details, but
(09:25):
he was murdered and I don't know how and where.
I just wanted to tell you, so you know, And
I said, when it's the funeral and He's like, well
it will be soon, like in a couple of days,
but you can't come here. Don't even think about doing that.
(09:48):
And he switched over the phone. And I couldn't even cry.
Speaker 6 (09:57):
You know.
Speaker 7 (09:57):
It was almost like the last my hope of the future,
the last my connection with the past. It was just
gone with him. I found some newspapers, but they wrote
(10:18):
like in the very like facts kind of thing, so
and so was killed at this place. That's it. And
I just took some drugs just to escape because I
felt even more guilty. I felt like, now it's time
(10:43):
for me to leave the world. I felt so disgusting
that I'm not allowed to leave.
Speaker 6 (10:58):
Leah soon fell sick, a combination of the psychological toll
of Vladimir's murder and the physical toll of her lifestyle.
Speaker 7 (11:08):
I have a very high fever. I couldn't walk. It
was something really bad. I thought like, this is the
time when I may finally die, like I felt, that's
so close to me. And I was thinking about my parents,
(11:31):
and you know what, I decided to call them. My
mom remembers that call still now. She sounded really sad,
and I said, Mom, that's me. I just wanted to
tell you that I really really love you, and I
(11:53):
want to apologize for everything, like everything I've done, and
I'll just try to do my best. And he said,
oh my god, he sounds so sick, like where are
you what's going on? I said, like, tell my dad
(12:14):
that I'm really sorry for everything, and I think this
would be my last call. So I just wanted to
tell you that I love you and thank you for
giving me this life. That's it, and I switched over
(12:35):
the phone. I thought like, oh, this is just absolutely
pointless life. You know, I live a pointless life. So
I took the raise of blade. I didn't even like
(12:56):
write a letter whatever they say lo because sometimes they
write a letter, you know. I didn't do anything like that.
I just took the lizard and just cut my wrist.
I thought, okay, so now I can be free. This
(13:18):
is my freedom. Now, this is the end of my suffer,
of my guild, of my negative experience. And at some
point I just fainted. I woke up. I looked at
(13:42):
my wrist and either I didn't do the deep cut either.
My blood it dried so fast, so it's so blood
on the floor on my hand, but in my hand,
the blood stopped bleeding.
Speaker 6 (14:02):
Somewhere in the state being half awake and half asleep,
half alive and half dead, Elia saw a vision that
to her seemed very real.
Speaker 7 (14:11):
It was Vladimir, and I saw him sitting next to
my bed and he looked at me and he said,
come on, wake up, you have to go. You have
to leave. You have to go and live your life.
(14:35):
And he told me, do you remember I gave you
all these numbers. Call them. They will organize for you everything.
Call them. And he was saying it like, come on,
stand up, you have to go. You have bigger goals,
(14:57):
bigger mission. And he just disappeared. The next morning, when
I woke up, I found a note with all these numbers,
all these addresses, names everything, Switzerland, Italy, Fronts, Turkey, Greece,
(15:24):
his friends people, He relied on them, He trust them.
And I called one number and I said that I'm
from Vladimir, and I asked for the help, and then
they arranged everything. So I fly away. First country was Turkey,
(15:52):
and I had the time. Russian prospered, so it was
very convenient and easier to fly to Turkey. First. I
wanted to find the light in this dark tunnel, and
Vladimir showed me that light and I stopped doing drugs
(16:14):
and alcohol just like that in one day. Where I
am right now, it thanks to him, you know. He
pushed me and he didn't let me die. Seriously, I
feel this way.
Speaker 6 (16:40):
While Leah was in Turkey, she discovered the fate of
her former superiors, the colonel and the commander who assaulted
her and abused her and sent her to die.
Speaker 7 (16:51):
So both of them, the coronel and my previous commander,
they got retired and it was quite quick of the
whole operation was finished. Usually, if you do something bad
while your career, but not too bad, then they just
(17:13):
read of you like okay, so here's your pension, here's
your retirement. Good luck. And it gives me understanding that
they obviously lost the income of the bribery and the
power which they had while they had high rank.
Speaker 6 (17:53):
Chapter thirty four fairy tale endings.
Speaker 7 (18:05):
So ninth of July in two thousand and four, according
to Regno media, with the few shots to the neck
and had the criminal leader, which is in Russian calls
of started forty four years old. Vladimir Costin were shot
(18:28):
about eleven PM near to the preschool.
Speaker 6 (18:34):
Alia Rosa is reading an article on the death of Vladimir.
It's still a mystery what happened, but she believes that
his former partner and friend had something to do with it.
There are a lot of unanswered questions left at the
end of Lea's story, so I asked her about a
few of them. In the last episode, we discussed your
(18:57):
meeting with the general and himself saying take a rest,
I have some other missions and things for you, and
the story got a little squarely there. But now that
we're talking together, I wanted to get your answer to
what happened there.
Speaker 7 (19:16):
I okay, So I still, you know, like it's still scared.
I mean I was scared a lot of times when
I was there, but this was the most scariest meeting
in my life, because you I that time, and even
(19:37):
now I kind of like, you know, like the power
of the person.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Eliah seems to be struggling here.
Speaker 6 (19:44):
I try to ask again what really happened at that
meeting with the general, why she was allowed to leave
the country, whether we had new assignments for her, and
whether she escaped the system and how. For the next
half hour, I struggled to get a clear and direct
answer that makes sense. I'm not sure something is lost
in the translation, or if there's something she's hiding and
(20:08):
it turns out there is.
Speaker 7 (20:12):
Am I free now? Am I free? Now?
Speaker 5 (20:15):
Like?
Speaker 7 (20:15):
I don't know? Where is the guarantee they will not
do anything to me? Oh? My son and I have
this the thought every moment I leave, Is it a freedom? Now?
Speaker 6 (20:30):
I ask Aleiah why she doesn't feel free and if
there's anything she's had to do since.
Speaker 7 (20:36):
My general in my new commander, the unofficial commander, gave
me a new task to become whom I never wanted
to be. And it was low to my pride and
betray to my body and my soul. But I don't
(20:59):
want to end up on this note because it's such
a it's like breaking every hope for every person who
listen to that. The life is not like.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
You know.
Speaker 6 (21:13):
Aliyah trails off here. It's clear that she's conflicted. She
wants to be the hero of her own story and
she is just for starters. She's here and she survived it,
but it's a different kind of hero than perhaps her
father raised her to be. This desire to give her
story a happy ending for the audience helps explain who
(21:35):
she's become today. Throughout this podcast, some listeners have written
in struggling to reconcile the story she's telling with her
social media presence, which portrays a lot of red carpets,
expensive sports cars, paparazzi, fame and glamour. She wants She
likes everybody to see the success, the success.
Speaker 7 (21:58):
The final story. Yeah, retail which I create in my
in my illusory world which actually fucking doesn't exist. I
pretend the Instagram is just all for me. It's like
I look at it and I feel better. I want
(22:18):
to believe that this is the result which I created
for myself.
Speaker 6 (22:25):
Do you think part of that illusion also is not
just for you? But like showing your dad, even though
I didn't choose his path, look at me and look
at my life to.
Speaker 7 (22:33):
My dad, of course, to show him that without military
and without following your order, I still pretend that I'm
successful because I feel I feel like it's my armor,
(22:54):
and I protect myself in certain ways where I cannot.
I don't have power enough to be open and live
in real world because it's it scares me a lot.
Speaker 6 (23:16):
Let me pause, I said, Okay, if I call Emily.
He'd been working with therapeutically. So if I kind of
looper around this discussion, yes, okay, heym Lee you're there.
Speaker 4 (23:28):
Yeah, I am so.
Speaker 6 (23:29):
As I'm sitting here sort of unpacking stuff with Alah,
I just thought i'd sort of bring you in and
getgains some thoughts. Okay, what I'm learning is I talked
to a Liah Moore. Is the happy ending isn't exactly
how would you put Aliyah? The happy ending isn't?
Speaker 7 (23:46):
There is no happy ending?
Speaker 6 (23:48):
To be honest, at this point, I've spent a year
and a half with Aliyah an unpacked her story, not
just with Emily Maccus, the trauma counselor we're speaking with now,
but with Russian intelligence sources and experts. And I could
go over at point by point and share what the
FBI says was believable, with the CIA says was credible,
(24:09):
and so on. But I think we could do that
with any story. Every true crime podcast is a collection
of narratives that we're trying to pick the best path through.
And I think the path that is best to take
with Aleah given everything we've heard, is a trauma informed one.
People see Lea's Instagram, and they think of it from
an influencer point of view, but I'm curious what does
(24:31):
it look like from a trauma point of view.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Part is the association. It's part of her coping mechanism
and what she.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
It was.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
It's involuntary and detachment from reality at times, and it's
a way that she protected herself and most of the
time is unconscious.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
With that dissociation.
Speaker 6 (24:58):
When we experienced trauma, some of us want to feel
like it doesn't define us, that we're not victims, that
we winners, winners.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Trauma does affect the way we perceive ourselves, the way
we act and react, because it affected our brain. It
affected our nervous system. When you look at the association,
it's part of the fight flight response. It's even your
memory that can be affected.
Speaker 6 (25:29):
I start to understand, as Emily speaks, that after surviving
such a disempowering experience, there's a need to find a
way to empower ourselves through our narrative. As the author
Esactinas and once said, all sorrows can be born if
you put them into a story or tell a story
about them.
Speaker 2 (25:49):
And look at even the way Eliir was raised by
her father in the military. She was raised not to feel,
not to be connected, but she was also raised to
be the superhero in the story. I just want to
(26:10):
remind you, Aliyah that you can't change your past. You can,
but you can't change the narrative of the story. But
you are the superhero in your life story.
Speaker 3 (26:24):
What are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 7 (26:26):
I was thinking that I think this podcast actually gave
me freedom because first time in life I started to
feel I felt a strong guilt, I felt anger, I
(26:50):
felt hate, I felt pain, and then I started to
feel love. I started to not to be ashamed of
my vulnerability. And first time in life, I noticed that
(27:12):
I started to be open to people in general and
man especially. And it's very scary, like it's so many
fears that I don't know if I can handle it.
But I take a deep breath and try to move
(27:38):
on and not to close my heart and continue feeling,
which which is so hard.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
Epilogue a Russian story.
Speaker 6 (28:21):
So I just called to ask, what are your thoughts
now that you've heard the rest of e Leia's story.
Speaker 4 (28:27):
It took me on a journey, really, and.
Speaker 5 (28:30):
The journey that it brought me on was such a
conclusion that she is a product of.
Speaker 4 (28:36):
A father who's part of the state.
Speaker 5 (28:38):
She was recruited and or volunteered into the state system.
Her context is then shattered tragically with abuse and rape
and then put into this odd school of sparrow training.
Speaker 4 (28:55):
Because that is just as we've said before.
Speaker 5 (28:58):
Was that a real school, Was it a state spons
to school, or was a bunch of dirty old men
that were justifying their actions on behalf of the state
as an excuse could be all there lies the Russian
state at its bedrock.
Speaker 6 (29:11):
This is Robin Driek again, former chief of the FBI's
Counterintelligence Behavioral Analysis program.
Speaker 5 (29:17):
To keep you in a state of chaos personally, emotionally, psychologically,
and physically. They traumatize you, They trauma bond you to them.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
This is the case where they give you.
Speaker 5 (29:28):
A little bit of love bombing, we love you, you're great,
you're awesome, and then they beat on your, beat on
your beat on your beat on you, and then the
beating has become more and the love becomes less, and
then you get addicted to that. One time out of
a million, you might get a kind word or a
promotion or a good posting from someone, or maybe even
not being traumatized tonight by someone. This is what they do,
(29:51):
and that's what she u is a product of the state.
It is pretty profound that she was able to do
what she did to rescue herself, the amount of bravery
she had to start recognizing. Basically, it's the matrix. You
know that they have to get myself out of this matrix.
And that's where therapy comes in, and that's where rescuing
ourselves from the trauma with the great healthy relationships we
(30:14):
tend forge around us and getting that narrative and that
story out there for people to see.
Speaker 6 (30:25):
What is a hero? Is it Black Widow? Is it
Red Sparrow? Is it James Bond? When I first sat
down with Aliyah, that's the type of story I imagined hearing,
and I think that's the type of story Aliyah imagine telling.
But real life is not so clear cut. And I
learned through this process at least three things I will
(30:47):
never forget. The first is that life in a totalitarian system,
whether it's a country or one's own family, is a
prison with bars made of fear and duty, and even
if we manage to gape physically, it's much harder to
escape psychologically. The second is that sexpionage is anything but sexy.
(31:10):
The third is that most stories of abuse don't have
happy endings. The perpetrators often get away with it, the
victims rarely get justice or resolution, and even if they do,
the healing process is often messy and incomplete.
Speaker 5 (31:26):
All these things in here do happen, and these are
the tragic results of them.
Speaker 6 (31:31):
So what is a hero in this case and so
many others? Does a person who survived to tell their story?
Not necessarily the story, their story? And what is healing?
It's being heard, So thank you for listening. To Die
(32:13):
For is a production of Tenderfoot TV in association with
iHeart Podcasts. The show is hosted and written by me
Neil Strauss, with additional writing assistants by Tristan Bankston. Executive
producers are myself, Donald Albright, and Payne Lindsay. For iHeart Podcasts,
executive producers are Matt Frederick and Alex Williams. Lead producer
(32:33):
and editor is Tristan Bankston. Additional editing by Miles Clark
and Christian Brown. Supervising producer Tracy Kaplan. Consultants include Nushin,
Valiza Day, Chelsea Gooden, and Jamie Albright.
Speaker 3 (32:47):
Artwork by Byron McCoy.
Speaker 6 (32:49):
Original music by Makeup and Vanity Set, mixed and mastered
by Dayton Cole. Our theme song is Killer Shangui Law
by Psychotic Beats featuring Pattiamore. Special thanks to Aorin Rosenbab
and the team at Uta Beck Media and Marketing, Aorn Siegel,
Becky Jensen, the Nord Group, Meredith Stedman, Rose Baruch, and
(33:11):
Alex Vespustad. Thanks also to additional guests. Robin Dreek, author
of the upcoming book and Breakable Alliances, A spy recruiter's
authoritative guide to cultivating powerful and lasting connections. Alex Finley,
author of the Victor Caro series. Doctor David Lewis, author
of Triumph of the Will, How two men hypnotized Hitler
(33:32):
and changed the world. Doctor Joel Dimmesdale, author of Dark Persuasion,
A History of brainwashing from Pavlov to social Media. Professor
Mark Gailliatti, author of Downfall, Precosion, Putin and The New
Fight for the Future of Russia. Mark Hollingsworth, author of
Agents of Influence, How the k g B subverted Western democracies.
(33:53):
Doctor Ian Garner, author of Z Generation into the heart
of Russia's fascist youth.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
Robert J.
Speaker 6 (33:59):
Lifton, author of Surviving ar Catastrophes, Resilience and Renewal From
Hiroshima to the COVID nineteen pandemic. Amy Knight, author of
The Kremlin's News, Putin's bitter feud with the oligarch who
made him Ruler of Russia. Yuri Felshtinsky, author of From
Red Terror to Terrorist State, Russia's secret service and its
(34:19):
fight for world domination. Doctor Joe Sirio, author of Being
Resilient Fifty lessons on Leaving chronic Stress behind. Holly McKay,
author of The Dictator's Wife. Emily Machis, author of The
Naked Truth of a Healer, The Path to My Authentic Self.
Luke Harding, author of Invasion, The inside story of Russia's
(34:41):
Bloody War in Ukraine's fight for survival and Setlana Stephenson,
author of Crossing the Line, Vagrancy, homelessness and social displacement
in Russia. Federico Varez, author of Mafia Life, Love, Death,
and the Money at the Heart of Organized Crime. And
Matt Tipton Army r Your veteran and internal medicine doctor
(35:02):
trained in chemical and radiological weapons response.
Speaker 4 (35:07):
Wow, that was a very Russian story.
Host
Neil Strauss
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