September 28, 2020 • 16 mins
What happens when the 2003 Masters runner-up shows up at a small Rhode Island country club? No record is safe. On the 18th green, Len Mattiace has a 10-foot putt that would etch his name in the record books. But it never had a chance. Hear the uplifting circumstances that kept his ball from ever going in the hole.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to Trickeration, a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome
back to the Trickeration podcast, your number one spot for
stories about deception in sports. I'm your host, Matt Waxman,
each week bringing you an offbeat sports tale you've hopefully
never heard before. Last week, we went all in on
a story involving Red Sox, third basement, wade bogs, and
(00:25):
a pair of underwear that definitely didn't belong to Christie Alley.
Check that one out if you haven't already. And next
week we'll hear the true story of how a smuggled
potato ended a guy's baseball career. But today, on this
very podcast, I'm speaking with a longtime professional golfer about
the one shot in his life that was unlike any
other good question. Have I ever purposely missed? Uh? Uh No,
(00:55):
I never have. I've never given a shot in any way.
Uh um. Up to that point, yeah, up to that point.
Back in two thousand two, Len Matisse was one of
the best golfers in the world. I was like top
five that year as far as like hottest golfers. Tiger Woods. PHILM.
(01:16):
Michelson I think had won twice in that year as well,
only like three or four golfers had won multiple times,
so I was like, I was one of the guys.
The following year, Matisse would finish runner up at the
two thousand three Masters. But on this day in two
thousand two, he was playing a casual round at Pawtucket
Country Club with his father in law, his neighbor, and
(01:38):
another friend. It was a summer day, the weather was great,
you know, a little bit of breeze, and it was
fun because we were all giving each other needles and uh,
the three people that I was playing with, you know,
(01:58):
they had been a long time friends, so everybody's giving
each other a hard time. So it was a lot
of fun and just some good energy, good mojo going on.
When a pro shows up at a country club, is
that a big exciting thing for them or that happens
all the time? Now? I think it is a big thing.
I think it's an exciting thing. You know, it's not
(02:19):
really the normal thing, especially a touring pro, whether it's
a Champions Tour player or p G a tour player.
So I think it is exciting, especially for the members
who are playing with the pro, you know, because they
get to see shots that they don't normally see they
get to see possibly four or five, six, seven birdies
(02:41):
when nobody usually does that, and then word gets around
maybe ahead of time, so you get other members to
come out and watch or at least say hi, maybe
to meet the pro that they watched on TV, maybe
signed some autographs. That's the unique thing about golf is
that closeness of the same weren't that people play, You
(03:01):
can have that connection, and uh, that's that's a great thing.
As perer golf etiquette, Matisse started his day at Pawtucket
in proper fashion. Before we went out and played the round,
I just went into the golf shop to just say hi,
introduced myself, and I think that's just a nice thing
to do. And when I went into the golf shop
above the door, I had noticed that they had the
(03:25):
course record by the pro that had been there for
a long time, I want to say forty plus years.
Was a guy named of Les Kennedy. And he was
the guy. I mean, he was the player in the Northeast.
He was, you know, obviously the player in Rhode Island,
and he had a lot of tournament wins. He played
in US Open twice and he was not only a
(03:47):
really good player, but he was that head professional Atpatucky
Country Club for at least thirty plus years. In nineteen
forty four, Less Kennedy became the head pro at Pawtucket
Country Club, a position he'd hold until his retirement. In anyway,
(04:09):
the course record that he had was kind of set
right there above the door, and if I remember right,
it was sixty one. And of all things, part on
that course is sixty nine. So that's eight under par.
And you know, like you would think of all the
years right like what, I don't know how when that
(04:31):
course record was set, but maybe forty fifty years worth,
you would think that somebody would shoot lower than eight
under par. But that was it. So I just kind
of looked at it and I was like, yeah, eight
under par sixty one, that's pretty cool. In nineteen seventy
Kennedy shot the low Market his home course. But on
this day, fifty years later, that record would be under attack.
(04:52):
And I always remembered something that Ken vent Urry and
Byron Nelson would always say is when you go play
a golf course, when you're a guest at of course,
when you're traveling on the road, you know you want
to know what the course record is and if the
local pro, like the head pro, you know, made it,
and if it did, you'd never beat it, you know.
(05:13):
And I always thought that was like, wow, that's really
respectful and kind of fun and all that. And when
they said if the head pro has the record, what
would be the reason why you wouldn't beat it? Well,
you know, like you know, here, you come in for
a round of golf and this guy usually you know,
they're there for twenty or thirty or forty years, and
(05:35):
you know they're working, they're playing, they're giving lessons. They
have this relationship with the club and the members. So
you come in for one round, you have to have
a really good round and you beat this thing. Nobody
really knows you, but they have this relationship with the
pro and do pros have a sort of an unwritten
rule like hey, when we go to of course, is
(05:57):
that regular people are playing, let's not try and it's
these things and chatter all the records. I think the
older and I say the older maybe like the guys
who were ages eight, you know, I think that was
more of a thing because in the sixties and seventies
and even eighties, the pros were more at clubs for
(06:17):
longer periods of time, kind of like baseball players, you know,
or football players playing their career with the same team.
So you had that relationship of this really well known
probe that did a lot for the club over thirty
or forty years, and he was a good player and
he had the course record. So I think nowadays it's
(06:40):
more relaxed and uh, you know, less personal and yeah,
and guys, guys are trying to shoot as low as
possible and get that course record and move up. Until
that point, Matisse had only one course record to his name.
That was at the Robert Trent Jones Golf Trail in Alabama.
(07:01):
They have all these state golf courses and my second
stage of Q school one year, I had a sixty
five and at that time that was the new course
record that was down to Mobile, Alabama. So that was
my only course record, So, you know, it wasn't like
how this was happening all the time and stuff. And
when you play a course like Pawtucket Country Club, what
(07:22):
are the main differences between that course and when you're
playing a course on the PGA Tour, Like, what's the
main difference between of course you're playing for millions of
dollars versus of course you're playing with your father in law.
All in all, it's kind of very similar to what
we play. I'd say there's probably fifteen courses on PGA
Tour that are very similar to Pawtucket and what you
(07:43):
would describe Pawtucket as an old style tree lined golf
course very close together. It's easy to walk, uh little
hilly Rowley, and the greens are very hard as far
as tough to put because they're so sloped. The one
thing that jumps out of the Tucket is that it's
(08:03):
a part sixty nine. You know, on PGA Tour courses
it could be a part sevento. And the reason why
it's the sixty nine is it only has one part
five on the whole course. That's the only difference. But
in that sense, the Tucket may play a little harder
because usually the pros kill the par five's because we
(08:25):
hit it longer. We're able to power on, maybe knock
the ball on and two and have an eagle try
or a definite birdie. So when there's only one part five,
it actually can be a little bit harder because usually
pros for Part four is we don't really overpower those
When you play a fun round like this that doesn't
(08:46):
have as steaks as high as when you play on tour,
are you as locked in or are you having a
hot dog drinking a beer? Playing in shure, It's like,
what's the difference for you playing around like that versus
playing a professional round. Well, it is casual in that
sense that you know, it's it's more relaxed. You know,
I'm helping reading the other guys puts, you know, like
(09:08):
we're finding a ball over in the trees. But when
you go play, you want to hit the shots at
you're capable of hitting. And usually for all pros, we
want to make as many birdies as possible in every
round just because it's good training, you know. So then
we go out in the tournament play and it's it's
the same type of stuff. So yeah, I'm out there, Sure,
(09:30):
I'm out there trying to make five to ten birdies
around absolutely all right, time for a quick break. On
the other side, Matisse is forced to make a faithful
decision that could alter the history books. You know, everybody
was kind of getting all jacked up about it, but
they were all rooting for me, like get the sixty,
you know, come on, lens around begins inauspiciously as he
(09:59):
parsed the first hole in bogies number two, so you know,
I was like, oh man, And then I started making
a couple of birdies. He makes the turn at three under,
meaning he would need to shoot five under on the
back nine to tie the record, six under to break it.
And then I got hot on the back and I
started making some birdies on eleven and twelve and fourteen,
(10:23):
fifteen before we get to eighteen, If you could just
tell me, like, how much were you thinking about the
course record as you were playing? Yeah, well, on the
front nine, no, And really I didn't even know what
my score was until like seventeen green and again I
(10:44):
really threw that back nine. I was just trying to
make birdies because that's what we that's what we're programmed
to do. It just never really dawned on me that
that was actually happening to me during the round. And
do the players you're playing with realized that you were
potentially closing on a course record that they were excited.
I could kind of see, you know, like you know,
(11:05):
everybody was kind of getting all jacked up about it,
but they were all rooting for me, like get the sixty,
you know, come on, so take me to the t
shot on the team. Tell me what happens there A
share though, just to you know, be really clear on
what's happening. Part of course record And at that point
(11:28):
I was eight under par, so I was one birdie
away from breaking the course record shooting sixty, which also
would be my lowest score. I had shot sixty three before,
but I've never shot six sixty, so I need bertie
for sixty. I hit the drive just in the right
(11:52):
rough pin was in the front left, and I hit
a sandwedge up. They're like from a hundred yards about
twelve feet from the hold, And when I got up there, uh,
at that point, I knew that this was going to
be a big deal. You know, Rhode Island is a
(12:12):
very small state golf ridge, you know, like there's so
many good golf courses. People are passionate about golf, and
it's a very small state in the sense of you
know that that word gets around, you know, like you
think about Florida, how big the state is. The word
might get around in the town, but you're talking about
a whole work can easily get around the whole state
and the golf circles. So it kind of hit me
(12:34):
on that green that, wow, I make this putt. It's official.
It's a sixty, and that's a that's a big deal.
So it took me about twenty seconds to think is
it worth it? Is it worth it me trying to
make this putt and actually changing what had been for
forty years? So everybody was every like the three eyes
(13:00):
were ready. I mean they were ready, like they were
ready for me to make it, you know, just because
of the momentum and the way it was going and stuff.
And I didn't say, oh, I'm just I'm not gonna
make I didn't, you know, like I didn't let anybody know.
I just I intentionally missed. You know. It's a left
to right break and I aimed to the right and
I just made a normal stroke, So I knew I
(13:21):
was going to miss it for like two or three ft.
Setting a new course record was no longer in play,
but Matisse still had one more decision to make and
and I had like about a three footer and if
I tapped that in for sixty one, Les Kennedy would
not have had the course record. He would have then
(13:42):
shared the course record, and I wasn't even going to
do that at that point. I just picked the ball
up and the guys looked at me like what are
you doing, you know, and I said, I'm good. When
I picked the ball up intentionally, it wasn't then an
official round. It was basically an incomplete round. And what
(14:06):
was your playing partner's reaction when you picked it up?
They were shocked, and then they quickly said that's a
classy move. But then we went upstairs and had a drink.
Do you go back to the clubhouse and and are
people talking about it? They were like, you know, ten
or twenty people around that outside deck area, and I
(14:27):
think we're just kind of got around, you know, We
just we kind of downplayed it, you know, like, yeah,
Lenn had a great round. He made like you know,
eight birdies, nine birdies, whatever, and we just kind of,
you know, what do you shoot? I was like sixties
two or three. Even if Mattis had tried to make
the ten footer for the course record, there was no
guarantee he would have made it. But not all ten
footers are created equal. Just how difficult was this putt.
(14:52):
That putt was probably uh not much break. I mean
one cup. You know, we were talking like three inch break,
a little left to right, and it was probably a
thirty percent chance that I make it, maybe fifty chance.
So even if I tried to make that part what
(15:12):
I've made it, maybe maybe not. But I wasn't going
to give that that that chance. You know, from what
all accounts I was told about Les Kennedy, that guy
deserved it. I mean, there's no way that I was
going to take that, take that away from the pro
that had been there for that long. Just it just
(15:34):
wasn't gonna happen. And that's how that's how I wanted
to go. Earlier this summer, Les Kennedy's sixty one was
tied by a junior at Notre Dame who calls Pawtucket
his home course. Search for lenn Mattiza's name in the
Pawtucket Country Club history books and you'll find no record
of it, which is exactly how he wanted it. All Right,
(15:59):
that is it for this week. Thank you to lend
Matisse for chatting with me about this story that's long
been on my radar. I hope you enjoyed hearing this one,
and I hope it inspires you to go out there
and not break records and whatever sport you play. If
you're liking these kinds of stories and we'd like to
hear more, please take a moment to rate and review
on Apple Podcasts. If you have ideas for future episodes
(16:20):
involving sports deception, please send me an email at the
tip line at Trickeration Nation at gmail dot com. And
as we do every week, we check in with the
legend Chris mad Doug Russo. Chris, how do we do
this week? Maddie, Good job, keep up to good work now,
thanks Chris, all right, see you next week. Triggeration is
a production of my Heart Radio. For more podcasts for
(16:43):
my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Welcome to Trickeration, a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome
back to the Trickeration podcast, your number one spot for
stories about deception in sports. I'm your host, Matt Waxman,
each week bringing you an offbeat sports tale you've hopefully
never heard before. Last week, we went all in on
a story involving Red Sox, third basement, wade bogs, and
(00:25):
a pair of underwear that definitely didn't belong to Christie Alley.
Check that one out if you haven't already. And next
week we'll hear the true story of how a smuggled
potato ended a guy's baseball career. But today, on this
very podcast, I'm speaking with a longtime professional golfer about
the one shot in his life that was unlike any
other good question. Have I ever purposely missed? Uh? Uh No,
(00:55):
I never have. I've never given a shot in any way.
Uh um. Up to that point, yeah, up to that point.
Back in two thousand two, Len Matisse was one of
the best golfers in the world. I was like top
five that year as far as like hottest golfers. Tiger Woods. PHILM.
(01:16):
Michelson I think had won twice in that year as well,
only like three or four golfers had won multiple times,
so I was like, I was one of the guys.
The following year, Matisse would finish runner up at the
two thousand three Masters. But on this day in two
thousand two, he was playing a casual round at Pawtucket
Country Club with his father in law, his neighbor, and
(01:38):
another friend. It was a summer day, the weather was great,
you know, a little bit of breeze, and it was
fun because we were all giving each other needles and uh,
the three people that I was playing with, you know,
(01:58):
they had been a long time friends, so everybody's giving
each other a hard time. So it was a lot
of fun and just some good energy, good mojo going on.
When a pro shows up at a country club, is
that a big exciting thing for them or that happens
all the time? Now? I think it is a big thing.
I think it's an exciting thing. You know, it's not
(02:19):
really the normal thing, especially a touring pro, whether it's
a Champions Tour player or p G a tour player.
So I think it is exciting, especially for the members
who are playing with the pro, you know, because they
get to see shots that they don't normally see they
get to see possibly four or five, six, seven birdies
(02:41):
when nobody usually does that, and then word gets around
maybe ahead of time, so you get other members to
come out and watch or at least say hi, maybe
to meet the pro that they watched on TV, maybe
signed some autographs. That's the unique thing about golf is
that closeness of the same weren't that people play, You
(03:01):
can have that connection, and uh, that's that's a great thing.
As perer golf etiquette, Matisse started his day at Pawtucket
in proper fashion. Before we went out and played the round,
I just went into the golf shop to just say hi,
introduced myself, and I think that's just a nice thing
to do. And when I went into the golf shop
above the door, I had noticed that they had the
(03:25):
course record by the pro that had been there for
a long time, I want to say forty plus years.
Was a guy named of Les Kennedy. And he was
the guy. I mean, he was the player in the Northeast.
He was, you know, obviously the player in Rhode Island,
and he had a lot of tournament wins. He played
in US Open twice and he was not only a
(03:47):
really good player, but he was that head professional Atpatucky
Country Club for at least thirty plus years. In nineteen
forty four, Less Kennedy became the head pro at Pawtucket
Country Club, a position he'd hold until his retirement. In anyway,
(04:09):
the course record that he had was kind of set
right there above the door, and if I remember right,
it was sixty one. And of all things, part on
that course is sixty nine. So that's eight under par.
And you know, like you would think of all the
years right like what, I don't know how when that
(04:31):
course record was set, but maybe forty fifty years worth,
you would think that somebody would shoot lower than eight
under par. But that was it. So I just kind
of looked at it and I was like, yeah, eight
under par sixty one, that's pretty cool. In nineteen seventy
Kennedy shot the low Market his home course. But on
this day, fifty years later, that record would be under attack.
(04:52):
And I always remembered something that Ken vent Urry and
Byron Nelson would always say is when you go play
a golf course, when you're a guest at of course,
when you're traveling on the road, you know you want
to know what the course record is and if the
local pro, like the head pro, you know, made it,
and if it did, you'd never beat it, you know.
(05:13):
And I always thought that was like, wow, that's really
respectful and kind of fun and all that. And when
they said if the head pro has the record, what
would be the reason why you wouldn't beat it? Well,
you know, like you know, here, you come in for
a round of golf and this guy usually you know,
they're there for twenty or thirty or forty years, and
(05:35):
you know they're working, they're playing, they're giving lessons. They
have this relationship with the club and the members. So
you come in for one round, you have to have
a really good round and you beat this thing. Nobody
really knows you, but they have this relationship with the
pro and do pros have a sort of an unwritten
rule like hey, when we go to of course, is
(05:57):
that regular people are playing, let's not try and it's
these things and chatter all the records. I think the
older and I say the older maybe like the guys
who were ages eight, you know, I think that was
more of a thing because in the sixties and seventies
and even eighties, the pros were more at clubs for
(06:17):
longer periods of time, kind of like baseball players, you know,
or football players playing their career with the same team.
So you had that relationship of this really well known
probe that did a lot for the club over thirty
or forty years, and he was a good player and
he had the course record. So I think nowadays it's
(06:40):
more relaxed and uh, you know, less personal and yeah,
and guys, guys are trying to shoot as low as
possible and get that course record and move up. Until
that point, Matisse had only one course record to his name.
That was at the Robert Trent Jones Golf Trail in Alabama.
(07:01):
They have all these state golf courses and my second
stage of Q school one year, I had a sixty
five and at that time that was the new course
record that was down to Mobile, Alabama. So that was
my only course record, So, you know, it wasn't like
how this was happening all the time and stuff. And
when you play a course like Pawtucket Country Club, what
(07:22):
are the main differences between that course and when you're
playing a course on the PGA Tour, Like, what's the
main difference between of course you're playing for millions of
dollars versus of course you're playing with your father in law.
All in all, it's kind of very similar to what
we play. I'd say there's probably fifteen courses on PGA
Tour that are very similar to Pawtucket and what you
(07:43):
would describe Pawtucket as an old style tree lined golf
course very close together. It's easy to walk, uh little
hilly Rowley, and the greens are very hard as far
as tough to put because they're so sloped. The one
thing that jumps out of the Tucket is that it's
(08:03):
a part sixty nine. You know, on PGA Tour courses
it could be a part sevento. And the reason why
it's the sixty nine is it only has one part
five on the whole course. That's the only difference. But
in that sense, the Tucket may play a little harder
because usually the pros kill the par five's because we
(08:25):
hit it longer. We're able to power on, maybe knock
the ball on and two and have an eagle try
or a definite birdie. So when there's only one part five,
it actually can be a little bit harder because usually
pros for Part four is we don't really overpower those
When you play a fun round like this that doesn't
(08:46):
have as steaks as high as when you play on tour,
are you as locked in or are you having a
hot dog drinking a beer? Playing in shure, It's like,
what's the difference for you playing around like that versus
playing a professional round. Well, it is casual in that
sense that you know, it's it's more relaxed. You know,
I'm helping reading the other guys puts, you know, like
(09:08):
we're finding a ball over in the trees. But when
you go play, you want to hit the shots at
you're capable of hitting. And usually for all pros, we
want to make as many birdies as possible in every
round just because it's good training, you know. So then
we go out in the tournament play and it's it's
the same type of stuff. So yeah, I'm out there, Sure,
(09:30):
I'm out there trying to make five to ten birdies
around absolutely all right, time for a quick break. On
the other side, Matisse is forced to make a faithful
decision that could alter the history books. You know, everybody
was kind of getting all jacked up about it, but
they were all rooting for me, like get the sixty,
you know, come on, lens around begins inauspiciously as he
(09:59):
parsed the first hole in bogies number two, so you know,
I was like, oh man, And then I started making
a couple of birdies. He makes the turn at three under,
meaning he would need to shoot five under on the
back nine to tie the record, six under to break it.
And then I got hot on the back and I
started making some birdies on eleven and twelve and fourteen,
(10:23):
fifteen before we get to eighteen, If you could just
tell me, like, how much were you thinking about the
course record as you were playing? Yeah, well, on the
front nine, no, And really I didn't even know what
my score was until like seventeen green and again I
(10:44):
really threw that back nine. I was just trying to
make birdies because that's what we that's what we're programmed
to do. It just never really dawned on me that
that was actually happening to me during the round. And
do the players you're playing with realized that you were
potentially closing on a course record that they were excited.
I could kind of see, you know, like you know,
(11:05):
everybody was kind of getting all jacked up about it,
but they were all rooting for me, like get the sixty,
you know, come on, so take me to the t
shot on the team. Tell me what happens there A
share though, just to you know, be really clear on
what's happening. Part of course record And at that point
(11:28):
I was eight under par, so I was one birdie
away from breaking the course record shooting sixty, which also
would be my lowest score. I had shot sixty three before,
but I've never shot six sixty, so I need bertie
for sixty. I hit the drive just in the right
(11:52):
rough pin was in the front left, and I hit
a sandwedge up. They're like from a hundred yards about
twelve feet from the hold, And when I got up there, uh,
at that point, I knew that this was going to
be a big deal. You know, Rhode Island is a
(12:12):
very small state golf ridge, you know, like there's so
many good golf courses. People are passionate about golf, and
it's a very small state in the sense of you
know that that word gets around, you know, like you
think about Florida, how big the state is. The word
might get around in the town, but you're talking about
a whole work can easily get around the whole state
and the golf circles. So it kind of hit me
(12:34):
on that green that, wow, I make this putt. It's official.
It's a sixty, and that's a that's a big deal.
So it took me about twenty seconds to think is
it worth it? Is it worth it me trying to
make this putt and actually changing what had been for
forty years? So everybody was every like the three eyes
(13:00):
were ready. I mean they were ready, like they were
ready for me to make it, you know, just because
of the momentum and the way it was going and stuff.
And I didn't say, oh, I'm just I'm not gonna
make I didn't, you know, like I didn't let anybody know.
I just I intentionally missed. You know. It's a left
to right break and I aimed to the right and
I just made a normal stroke, So I knew I
(13:21):
was going to miss it for like two or three ft.
Setting a new course record was no longer in play,
but Matisse still had one more decision to make and
and I had like about a three footer and if
I tapped that in for sixty one, Les Kennedy would
not have had the course record. He would have then
(13:42):
shared the course record, and I wasn't even going to
do that at that point. I just picked the ball
up and the guys looked at me like what are
you doing, you know, and I said, I'm good. When
I picked the ball up intentionally, it wasn't then an
official round. It was basically an incomplete round. And what
(14:06):
was your playing partner's reaction when you picked it up?
They were shocked, and then they quickly said that's a
classy move. But then we went upstairs and had a drink.
Do you go back to the clubhouse and and are
people talking about it? They were like, you know, ten
or twenty people around that outside deck area, and I
(14:27):
think we're just kind of got around, you know, We
just we kind of downplayed it, you know, like, yeah,
Lenn had a great round. He made like you know,
eight birdies, nine birdies, whatever, and we just kind of,
you know, what do you shoot? I was like sixties
two or three. Even if Mattis had tried to make
the ten footer for the course record, there was no
guarantee he would have made it. But not all ten
footers are created equal. Just how difficult was this putt.
(14:52):
That putt was probably uh not much break. I mean
one cup. You know, we were talking like three inch break,
a little left to right, and it was probably a
thirty percent chance that I make it, maybe fifty chance.
So even if I tried to make that part what
(15:12):
I've made it, maybe maybe not. But I wasn't going
to give that that that chance. You know, from what
all accounts I was told about Les Kennedy, that guy
deserved it. I mean, there's no way that I was
going to take that, take that away from the pro
that had been there for that long. Just it just
(15:34):
wasn't gonna happen. And that's how that's how I wanted
to go. Earlier this summer, Les Kennedy's sixty one was
tied by a junior at Notre Dame who calls Pawtucket
his home course. Search for lenn Mattiza's name in the
Pawtucket Country Club history books and you'll find no record
of it, which is exactly how he wanted it. All Right,
(15:59):
that is it for this week. Thank you to lend
Matisse for chatting with me about this story that's long
been on my radar. I hope you enjoyed hearing this one,
and I hope it inspires you to go out there
and not break records and whatever sport you play. If
you're liking these kinds of stories and we'd like to
hear more, please take a moment to rate and review
on Apple Podcasts. If you have ideas for future episodes
(16:20):
involving sports deception, please send me an email at the
tip line at Trickeration Nation at gmail dot com. And
as we do every week, we check in with the
legend Chris mad Doug Russo. Chris, how do we do
this week? Maddie, Good job, keep up to good work now,
thanks Chris, all right, see you next week. Triggeration is
a production of my Heart Radio. For more podcasts for
(16:43):
my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
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