Graham Bunn: Surviving the Unthinkable

Five years after the Route 91 Harvest Festival shooting, reality star Graham Bunn has not healed. 

For the very first time, he reveals what he witnessed the night shots were fired at the crowd in Las Vegas.

In this tearful session, Graham explores the weight of survivor's guilt and the reality that closure may never come.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Meet Graham Bun, Bachelor Nation alumni, musician, and radio personality.
For the first time ever. Graham opens up about experiencing
the deadliest mass shooting and modern history, a first hand
account of the tragic Root ninety one Harvest Festival, and

(00:20):
the survivor's guilt that has followed him ever since. This
is True Crime Reality with Kaylyn Miller Keys and guest
host Bob Guiney. Hello everyone, and welcome back to another
episode of True Crime Reality. I'm your host, Kaylin Millard Keys,
and today I have a very exciting co host, none

(00:44):
other than Bob Guiney. And if you don't know Bob,
Bob is such a light. He just lights up every room, easing,
he puts a smile on everyone's faces. And today's a
pretty heavy episode, so I feel like you need a
Bob on for today's episode. So welcome. Thank you so much, Klin,
thanks for having me. I'm so excited for your show
and when we talked about it, you know, in concept,
I was so excited to hear about it and and

(01:06):
to be here as a guest host is really exciting
for me and um and I appreciate you know, I
appreciate the opportunity, So thank you, thanks for coming on. Um,
can you tell everyone a little bit about your podcast
before we bring grahmmed? Oh sure, thank you. Yeah. We
host with Trista Sutter and I together host the almost
famous version of O G. S. The original Hall. I

(01:29):
don't think we'd be gangs this. I don't know what
the g would stand for in our actor Jerry octogenarians
or whatever that wordd um, but we are the you know,
the originals, um and um. And it's been a whole
lot of fun. We've actually you know, had the opportunity
to bring back some some great uh throwbacks from you know,
the very early years of The Bachelor, and we've really

(01:50):
kind of focused on that with the Bachelor and the
Bachelrette and um, we've already you know, gone all way
down the ladder with the Bachelor Pad and you know
everything else. So it's been a lot of fun and
and but you know, so you definitely find it on
the almost famous O G S H link and um,
you know as part of what what Benn and Nashley started,

(02:11):
and we've sort of been, um the ones who jump
on the on the on the back with them. So
but it's been a lot of fun and um, you know,
it's kind of an interesting thing. I mean, Caitlin, when
we met, we were in Lake Tahoe for an I
Heeart radio event, and I think it was right before
the launch of your show, right yes, right before I
have filmed my very first episode. When we met, Oh

(02:33):
my gosh, that's awesome. Well yeah, and today obviously we have,
like you said, um in your intro, a little bit
more of a heavy uh topic. Um. And and you know,
I know, I know he's gonna be joined us in
just a moment. But he's he is someone from the
Bachelor family and oddly enough, UM, I have a history
with him. His name is Graham Bun. Graham was originally

(02:56):
featured on Diana Pop Paps this season of The Bachelorette,
then went on to do uh best Friend Pad Best
from Paradise. I mean, he's he's you know, he's been
around a little bit on that one. Graham and I
actually met on a on a cruise when he was
with his X and I was with with who is
now li X, And um, we just really hit it

(03:16):
off and became really good friends and um actually lived
together for for quite a while in Los Angeles and
and he became one of my closest and dearest friends,
one of my best friends. And and so you know,
he's he's here today to talk about his experience, um
that he had and I'll let you speak to a
little bit of that to Kalin. But uh, he became

(03:39):
a radio host, country music host for I Heart Radio
I'm sorry, I'm sorry for for the largest country station
on the West Coast in California, Country one oh five,
and then went on to host another show called Real Country,
which was a great show with Shania Twain. And so,
I mean, he's done a ton in his career and um,

(04:01):
and he was actually at Harvest the Root ninety one
concert event in Las Vegas, which, as you'll recall, had
you know it turned out to be uh just a
catastroph an absolute disaster, one of the largest I believe
mass shootings, uh if not the largest in the United States.

(04:21):
And Graham was there. So um, yeah, so he's here
to join us today and and and I'm very flattered
that he wanted me to be here too. Yeah. Should
we bring him on? Graham? Are you there? I am here,
Can you guys hear me? We can we can hear you, buddy,
how are you. I'm doing well outside of the fact
that Bob is like a brother to me, and and

(04:44):
he didn't undersell it, like we're very close and I
love Bob like family. But I hate that he doesn't
remember when we met, like I met him way before
the cruise. But that's okay, it's all good. It's all good.
But like, okay, okay, we reconnected on the sorry we reconnected.
I was, yeah, I was getting ready. I was at
the tail end of a really tough relationship on the

(05:07):
cruise and Bob and I were already close friends. But
that's that's okay, it's all right. You know, right after,
right after I said that, I'm like, that wasn't when
we met. But you know, I was just trying to paraphrase.
I guess. So the Graham is one of my nearest
and dearest and uh, and I happen to know that
this is not something uh that he he takes lightly
talking about. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, Um, Graham,

(05:29):
you were offering an opportunity right after this happened to
go out Good Morning America to discuss that. As I recall,
you said, no I did, Yeah, yeah, I passed on
that opportunity. UM. Yeah, I mean it's it's really tough
subject matter and and you know, I didn't even sleep
last night because I've never really you know, I've issued

(05:50):
some statements and I answered questions when I'm asked about it, um,
but I've never really shared my side of it, just
because I always want to air on the side of
being respectful to those you know, didn't make it out
in the families and the friends that are are still
to this day and forever will be you know, torn
apart and traumatized, and um, you know, it was not

(06:11):
an easy thing to go through. But it seems a
little selfish of me to complain about anything, knowing what
other people are dealing with and seeing some of the
things that went down that night that you know, it's
like partner process. And I think that you and I
spoke that night or the morning after. I think, Um,

(06:32):
I don't know how trauma works in the human brain.
I think everyone has you know, everyone processes it differently.
There are certain things that I remember vividly from the night,
and then there are certain things that people fill in
the blanks for me where I can't recall. Um, you know,
like it didn't happen like you know. And so I
don't know if that's the body or the mind emotionally

(06:55):
protecting you from trauma. I'm not sure, but I do
believe we you and I spoke or did we speak
that night? Yes, I I uh, I woke up. It
was like two thirty three o'clock in the morning. I
woke up, and she just glanced at my phone as
I so often do, you know, when I wake up
the middle of the night for no reason, and and
it was a news like an alert on there, like

(07:16):
you know, shooting at Route ninety one, you know, the
harvest in Vegas, and I I just thought of you
right away because I knew you were there. And I
don't know if you remember I was hosting it. Well
I'm sure you don't, but I was hosting an event
in l A at the time, and you and I
had talked because I was trying to hook up with you,
and you're like, oh man, I'm in Vegas and you
said you should come, and I was like, oh man,
that'd be amazing. You know, I'm hosting this on that

(07:37):
Friday and Saturday. I wouldn't even you know, if I
made it, and I called my wife, who hadn't seen
me in about a week at that point, and she
was not thrilled with me, you know, shat me off
to another party night, and so I didn't go, but
I I was thinking about you being there, and I
was thinking, you know, knowing your career and where you
were with things, and it was just such a big deal,

(07:57):
you know. And so I wake up and I see
that news alert and right away, I'm like, oh my god,
and I I just got hit with it, you know.
So I was living in Seattle the time, and so
I called you, and I was really thinking. I don't
know what I was thinking, but I was. I was
thinking that I was at least were gonna leave you
a message. So a guy showed up and uh, you

(08:18):
answered the phone, which shocked me. And uh, I'm like, buddy,
oh my god, I just want to make sure you're okay.
And and you were like, I don't know what I
am and your your your voice was kind of shaky,
but you were still you know, you were still you.
I mean it was still you know, you were You're
still you, just like you're like this was I can't
really talk right now, but I'm okay, and you know,
thanks for thinking to me, and I said, you know,

(08:40):
and that was it, and that was all. I mean.
I don't think we even touch base again for several
days after that. But I remember the moment thinking, you know,
oh my god, this guy is going, what the hell
it has just happened? Because you know, at that point,
none of the details didn't come out, so I mean,
it was pretty crazy. And and I was talking to
Kalin about it too, right before we brought you on,
and I remember the moment thinking, how does someone, I mean,

(09:03):
how do you recover from something like this, like you know,
I mean, this is a real life deal, like you said, trauma, PTSD,
all that stuff, right, I'm sure all of it is
real for you. Yeah. Well, first I apologize Kalen. I
don't think you and I have ever met. I'm Graham,
so nice to meet you. Thank you for having me today,
and I've heard wonderful things from mutual friends about you,

(09:23):
so I just wanted to introduce myself and and say hello.
I didn't mean to be rude there, no, no thank
you for coming on. I wanted you and Bob to
kind of leave this. I know this is I've heard
you haven't talked about this and it's uncomfortable. UM, so
you know, whatever you're comfortable sharing. Thank you for coming on. Yeah,
no I haven't. Um. And again you know, not to

(09:47):
beat a dead horse, but but Bob is family to me,
and you know I didn't I didn't talk to many
people after after everything had happened, and I have never
really spoken my side or my experience out of respect
for those that are still dealing with it. And you know,
there was a really hard thing to the process for

(10:07):
me personally after what went down and where I happened
to be standing. I was standing stage right when when
all of that happened, and I have a picture somewhere. Um,
it was like two or three minutes right before the
shooting started, with me and a fan of the radio
station with the Mandalai Bay and the stage in the background,

(10:28):
like two minutes before it all went down. And so
the traumatic thing for me was afterwards, people volunteering that
they were there, like it was like something to be
proud of. And again, everyone processed things differently and all

(10:49):
these stories started coming out, and I happened to unfortunately
be in close proximity was someone that was using other
people's pain and hardship. And you know, this thing be
talked about forever it is to this date, and hopefully
it will always be because I never want anything worse
than this to happen. The most. I think it's the
most uh lethal mass shooting on American soil in US history,

(11:13):
and so hopefully that that never gets beaten. You know,
you never want that to happen. But for me, I
kind of went in it into a shell because I
was so mortified by some of the people coming forward
trying to use the platitude of hey, I was there,
Let me talk about it, Let me bolster my own
personal agenda by sharing something that unfortunately, to this day

(11:37):
probably trigger some and and brings back horrific memories. And
one of the reasons that I agreed to do this was,
you know, there's there's this documentary out there now, um,
and you know, I think enough time has passed where
you know, sharing or answering questions is is okay and

(11:58):
and probably healthy. From me, I've never I've never done
anything like this before. I gave a statement when I
was on the radio when I came back to work,
and then I just never addressed it again, and then
I didn't get asked about it on a podcast that
I hosted for Spotify and gave my my my two cents.
But I've never answered any questions or shared what I remember,

(12:20):
and yesterday for the first time, and one of the
reasons that I asked Bob to be here was because
Bob knows me as a person, and um, I'm mortified
at the thought than anyone would ever think that I
would use this experience too, you know, push forward any
kind of personal agenda. So you know, I'm here to
answer questions and share what I went through. But for

(12:42):
anyone that's listening to this that that is triggered or
lost someone there, I'm thinking about you. I'm praying for you.
I'll never understand what you're what you're processing, and what
you're feeling, but I do want you to know that
I would never make light of it. I think that
definitely comes across. Thank you so much, And I can't

(13:05):
imagine what anyone on that day has gone through. And
to take five years to really like figure out if
you want to talk about this is amazing too, So
thank you so much, and yeah, you're very welcome. I
guess start with um, do you want to just like
take us through the day, like maybe leading up to it. Um. Well,

(13:31):
as you know, thankfully, Bob did it so eloquently as
he always does. Uh. You know, I was. I was
there on work. I was the morning show host for
a country radio station here in Los Angeles, so I
was covering it and I worked most of the weekend,
which which was great. It was a wonderful event to work,

(13:52):
you know, to be able to say that you go
to a country show and you get to speak with
very talented, incredible entertainers that are making people's days, and
you know, the general vibe was kind of you fork,
everyone's just on vacation. You know, they're in Vegas and
they're listening to country music. And if you've ever been
to a country show, the general Bob at ninety ercent

(14:14):
of all country shows and this being unfortunately the the
one point zero zero one percent at the end of
the day, uh is, people are in a good mood.
You know, people are strangers are making friends, and friends
are you know, just enjoying each other's company, and that
the overall energy there is just such a positive like, man,

(14:35):
life is really cool that we get to be in
this moment, in this space, at this at this moment
in time, and be together and listen, you've got people
singing together and sharing and community and just everything that
country really encompasses was very present. And Route ninety one
at the time was a fairly new festival, but it
was really you know, growing fast and booking the biggest

(14:58):
names in country music. And the weekend was, from what
I remember, uh, incredible. And Sunday night, which is when
the shooting went down, was the first time that like
I had had a few drinks and I was off
the clock. I wasn't working. I was actually just relaxing
and enjoying myself and um, you know, meeting people and

(15:21):
shaking hands and you know, one of the reasons that
I do want to I do want to preface my
appearance or coming on here and talking about it. I've
never told anyone that's except for my pastor. Um hm.

(15:42):
Someone reached out to me at the at the festival
and wanted to meet me. Hey, I'm I listened to
the station, um like, hey, I'm I'm saying I'm staying right,
you know, come up say hello, like you know, that
was kind of the thing, like everybody come, come hang out,
and unfortunately, you know, they moved up to stage right

(16:05):
and and that's where a lot of the gunshots originated
over the stage into the pit where I was standing.
And uh, you know, some people unfortunately didn't make it
out of that. And and for a long time I
felt responsible for that, and so it's been hard to revisit.

(16:26):
You know, so I just kind of locked it away.
And you know, I'm not responsible for that man's choices.
I'm not responsible for it was death. But I felt
like I contributed to hardship where families being heard, and um,
you know, so that was that was that was hard
for me too to deal with. Yeah, I remember you

(17:02):
saying that. Actually I was. I was wondering I wasn't
gonna bring it up, and I was wondering if if,
if you were. And I'm I'm thankful that you did
in that I think, Um, I remember you feeling that
responsibility when we talked about you know, you invited them
up to the VIP area and they were there and
and you know, they didn't necessarily make it out, and
I and I, um, you know, I can only imagine.

(17:23):
I mean, your pastor is obviously the best person to
talk to you about about that kind of stuff, and UM,
I remember trying to say to you at that point, like, dude,
this is not it's not your fault. You can't you know,
But I also you know, I also can't. You know,
I can't even begin to think how you feel about
that and hear about it. I mean I remember that

(17:43):
part of the story too, and and I mean I
hope you know. I mean that was there's nothing you
could do about that. You were trying to bring more
people into the happiness of the moment and you were
feeling that vibe and who you know, God, I mean,
no one had a clue what was going to happen next,
you know obviously, Yeah you know, Um, for me, I

(18:05):
don't have the information. Uh you know, the names of
the victims and the families and everyone. Uh, you know,
that's out and that's public. And you know, whoever the
it was, it was a girl that reached out and
said hey, you know, reached out on me on the
on Instagram, I think, and and said hey, you know
we're with a group or you know, I wasn't privy

(18:25):
to who they were. Yeah, yeah, please come, you know,
enjoy like, say, what's up and so that person did
make it out because that person reached out and then
I think they started coming to my church, which was
it was a cool thing. Um. But after everything happened,
you know, I kind of went into a hole for
a little bit and with with everything that had to

(18:47):
do with the festival. I didn't talk about it. I
didn't address it, I didn't think about it. I I
started to live my life as if it did not happen.
And so, um, I'm not or in that group. It
was a group of fifteen, is what I remember. Uh,
And so I'm not sure who passed or who was

(19:08):
a part of that group. I just remember that was
kind of what I struggled with the most of thinking
that I contributed in some way, shape or form too
something so negative and so hard and something that would
change families forever and friendships forever. Um. So that was
my That was my biggest hurdle personally with it, not

(19:29):
even seeing you know, some of the things that that
felt like a movie, but just the responsibility moving forward
of not feeling as if I contributed to carrying apart
someone's family. Yeah, that's a lot to carry, a lot
to deal with. I mean, it's almost like you went through,
you know, a war, like you almost went you know,

(19:49):
it's almost like you came home from a war because
you were dealing with loss of life. You're dealing. I mean,
I can't even imagine hearing gun shots. And I mean,
you know, I've never asked question of you before, but
when when it started happening, I mean, was it one
of those things that you thought was you know, firecrackers
or fireworks or pyrotechnics, Like, yeah, I remember, And again

(20:12):
I was standing. I was standing stage right. For anyone
that's not familiar, that's is if you're on the stage.
And uh, you know, Bob's obviously a very accomplished singer songwriter,
so he understands this terminology. Um, it's it's if you're
looking out to the crowd as to your right. So
the Mandolaid Bay was on the other side of the stage,
looking over the top of it. And so when everything

(20:35):
was happening, the only thing I recollect was it was
a popping sound. It didn't sound like gunfire at all.
It sounded like, uh, when someone is too close to
the microphone and they're pronounced, they're over pronouncing their peace.
It sounded like a popping sound, and I remember asking
someone like, what is that man? The sound guy, like

(20:56):
something something's wrong. They need to fix that. That sounds terrible.
And then vividly, the one thing I do remember is
it was like the music stopped. Everything stopped, and I
heard someone scream they're shooting us, and then it was pandemonium.
Then I you know, then it's kind of like people

(21:17):
are scrambling everywhere. I jumped behind a pizza stand and
like took cover, and then then kind of gets kind
of the timeline gets a little blurry for me. I
don't really know what happened in the next like ten
or fifteen minutes. Yeah, I remember one thing you told
me that night, Graham, or maybe it wasn't a night

(21:39):
or a few days later. I remember you saying something
like you saw the best of people in that moment,
and you saw the worst of some people in that moment.
And I mean, you don't have to get into it
if you don't want to, but I remember you saying
that to me vividly, and I remember thinking, God, you
would hope that you would only see the best of people,
you know, in a moment like that. And I remember
you saying that you kind of saw some stuff and

(22:00):
you know it was just mind blowing to you a
little bit. Yeah, and I'll focus on the good. I mean,
there was while I was still in the venue, because
I was in the venue for several minutes, which which
felt like a very long time and long enough, I

(22:21):
think I spoke to my parents to call them to
say goodbye, um, and they, you know, they don't talk
about it, but I think they have the voicemail. And
then they called me back and I think we spoke
and they could hear everything that was going on. Uh,
because at that moment in time, the gunfire was bouncing
off of all the scaffolding. So if anyone is not

(22:43):
familiar with Rout ninety one, it's it's a festival that
they build on a parking lot. So there was like
a V I P second tier stadium seating type deal
to the left of where I was standing, and then
there was feeding in the back, and so the gunfire

(23:05):
was bouncing off of the ground in the scaffolding, and
it made it sound like there was multiple shooters on
the ground. So nobody knew where to go because the sound,
the gunshot sounds were coming from everywhere, and so you know,
I was I was behind the pizza stand or a
beer stand or whatever. The counter was right to my left.

(23:27):
I jumped over it. Um and then the horrific part
looking back on it now, as you know, everybody dropped
because we thought they were walking around shooting at eye level.
And you know, we find out later that he was
just the gentleman that is accused of and I'm sure
he's he's guilty and some facet you know, who knows

(23:49):
how many people were involved or what what goes into that.
But they're just picking people off that were laying on
the ground, you know, And that's that's tough. That's tough.
But you know, there was there was people dragging people everywhere,
and there was people helping, and there was people you know,
stealing trucks and driving people to the hospital. A couple

(24:12):
of guys and I we ran through the media tent.
There was a chain link fence. We we thought the
shooters were behind us, so we we tore the fence
out of the ground and unfortunately got trampled because you know,
thousands of people were trying to get out. But um, yeah,
there was a lot of people doing a lot of
wonderful things in that moment and in time from what

(24:32):
I remember. Um, and again, you know, my timeline is
really hazy. I went back into the venue at one
point in time for some reason to find a friend. Ah,
and then I got separated, and you know, the swat
ran up on me. I think I was on the
phone with my pastor and put a machine gun to

(24:53):
my head, and it was like I thought I was
the shooter. At one point in time, the helicopter light
was on me and I was on the ground and
and they were talking to my pastor I think on
the phone or something. You know, I can't really remember,
but you know they got in there pretty quick. I
mean all of that went down in like seven minutes.
So um. Yeah. Again, like it's you know, I apologize

(25:14):
if it's sporadic. I just it's hard for me to
piece together. I was in and out of the venue twice,
and I do remember that going back to look for somebody, um,
which you know, that's probably the dumbest thing I could
have done. But you know, it's hard to process what
was going on at that moment in time. How did

(25:35):
you eventually get out the second time? At least I
snug out. Uh. Yeah, the shooting I think was was
at that moment in time, I think it was over,
but no one knew. You know. Um, there were undercovers
in the venue and you know you could hear people

(25:56):
over walkie talkies. Um, it was really eerie in really quiet. Um.
And again like you know, my my my memory is
betraying me. I can't remember if the shooting was actually
over when I got out. But when we tore up
the chain link fence that surrounded the venue on the
back side of the media tent, um, I had blood

(26:21):
all over me. I think it was from my hand.
My hands were cut from we were trying to tear
this fence up. Um, and I was walking down like
an empty back road by myself. And then that's when
the cops came and the helicopter came, and um, you know,
they make you get on your knees and as they should.
You know, they don't know I was on the phone.

(26:43):
They thought maybe I was holding the device. Who you know,
who knows, God knows what they they're they're thinking at
this moment in time. And um, you know, I will
take a moment and to thank any of the responders
there were so many stories that that came out of
this over the years of you know, off duty police

(27:03):
officers being there and doing everything they could to secure
the area, and you know, it was pandemonium. I mean
there was ten thousand people in a very enclosed space
just ripping everything apart, trying to get out of there,
and so, uh, you know when they when they came
up on me, I I understood. I was just scared

(27:24):
to death and they were gonna shoot me out of fear,
and they didn't, you know, which was nice, and um,
they sent me on my way and I kind of
they barricaded the city, so I had to walk about
half a mile over what I think was a bridge
or was like a major intersection. And then actually someone
from my church who lived in Vegas that had affiliation

(27:47):
with the FBI picked me up and took me to
a hotel room and cleaned me up. You know, I
was pretty messy, and my pastor and his wife and
one of my buddies here uh drove through the night
team and pick me up and drove me home that night.
It was a good friends to have at a time

(28:07):
like that. Yeah, yeah, you know, I don't remember much
about it. Um. And over the years certain things have
come up about that ride. But I don't even remember
that ride happening. Um. I don't remember talking to my
family that night. I don't remember talking to Bob. I
looked at my phone a couple of days later, and

(28:30):
I guess I called a few people to say goodbye,
and one of which is the aforementioned X that Bob
had mentioned before. She and I had a fallen out,
and I think I tried to call her to, you know,
try to mend that wall of just saying, hey, I
don't think I'm getting out of here. And we spent
years together, and at one point in time we loved

(28:50):
one another. So I hope, I hope we can just
be cool as this. This is it for me. I mean,
it's a weird thing that describes hard to describe. When
you in your body, your mind, you think you're gonna die,
like you this is it. This is a rap. So
I don't remember, you know, it said. The call was

(29:11):
like ninety seconds, so I don't know if she picked
up or maybe I just left the message. I have
no idea, Um, but you know, that's crazy, that's crazy.
How the body kind of like you said, you know,
you got the trauma and the body just sort of
kicks in and you know, sort of protects you or
or whatever it is. I mean, yeah, yeah, and again,

(29:33):
like you know, I'm very blessed. I'm very lucky. I
don't want anyone to feel sorry for me at all.
Like I I lived my life. I'm able to go
to shows. Um, i didn't lose anyone that I personally knew.
I've got a wonderful family. Like you know, there's so
many people that went through this experience, and um, you know,

(29:55):
it's it's scary to think what they're dealing with still
to this day, and their lives will never be the same.
So I just you know, I don't mind sharing my
story at all. I just want to make sure that
it's kept in the right perspective of you know, I
totally understand that I was the lucky one there. You know,
I was very blessed and very fortunate not to be
dealing with what some of these families are dealing with. Yeah,

(30:18):
I think, like Klin said, it's pretty it's pretty obvious
that this isn't easy for you, and I think it's noble.
I think it really is. I know you don't. You
won't even probably accept that compliment. But I think it's
pretty noble that you didn't come out of that thing
and given a you know, a bunch of interviews and
you know, grandstanding on the moment, you're the opposite of that.
And that's pretty evident, you know, through this conversation right here,

(30:41):
just in the fact that you know, it took you
five years even talked to talk about it. And I
think that, um, you know, that's that's gotta be. It's
gotta be cathartic. I at leasently hope this part of
it will be cathartic for you and and helping you
get through it a little bit. But I think, um,
it's probably one of those things that you know, I
don't think you ever get over it. You'd ever get
through it, right yeah, you know, Um, I don't know

(31:05):
how to process it. And and again, you know, I've
honestly on some level, always wanted to talk about it,
but also been so fearful of the pushback and and
have seen unfortunately people use devastation and hardship to their
advantage and some personal agenda. So I've always been really

(31:28):
terrified of that. And and you know, by no means
do I ever want to come off disrespectful to anyone
that that that was there and and then it is
still working through some very hard times, you know. Yeah,
I think it's pretty evident. Well yeah, thank you. I

(31:51):
appreciate you saying that, because it's, um, you know, that
would be my biggest fear in life, would to be
that small of character, you know, to use that And
and you know, I'm very proud of my family, and
I want my family to be proud of me. So
I don't never want to. I don't want to succeed
in that way, you know, Right, has there ever been

(32:11):
any like h ongoing you know, um feelings and issues
that come from that? I mean obviously you know you
used to I know you you still do a bunch
of like Stagecoach and things like that, and used to
be a regular at all those events. Are you were
you reluctant to go back to that ye type of

(32:31):
type of an event? I mean, I mean at this point,
it's like you know, I mean, I I hate to
say it, but it's almost like you think about it
every time you walk out the door to go to
an event. Right, Yeah, I think for me, I'm a
little bit more privy to exits, you know, even like
if I go to a movie theater. There's been a
time where some things have happened in the movie theater
that that really jarred me a little bit. Someone screaming

(32:54):
or doing something weird and they think it's funny, and
you know, I'm sure they don't mean any harm that
in their mind, they think it's just like a silly prank.
And uh, I forgot which I was watching the new
Batman movie with Robert Pattinson and someone started screaming in
the movie theater and I just left. I just couldn't deal.
You know, it wasn't for me. And so uh with

(33:16):
the gun violence that is going on not only at
shows and concerts and schools, and um, you know it's
it's last. It's left a lasting impression or imprint on me.
What what someone having some mental illness problems. And I'm
not making light of that, but I would I would

(33:37):
hope this gentleman that that that made these choices and
decisions was not of sound mind when doing so, because
that seems just incredibly evil to me. But you never
know what someone is capable of. And and now I
feel like I'm very fully aware of what someone is
capable of. So yeah, I'm sorry to Rebel. I think

(34:02):
for me, the lasting impression is anywhere I go, I'm
just really exit strategies. I'm like, Okay, well, if something
were to happen, this is where I would go, because
in that moment in Vegas, um, you know, like crawling
because I thought the gunfire was leveled, like crawling to
a to a pizza stand or the beer counter whatever

(34:24):
that was to the left of the stage. You know,
I didn't know where to go after that, and I
remember laying there thinking I'm getting ready to die, you know,
and so that that was just like a very weird feeling.
So now, just giving yourself an option of Okay, this
is how I'll handle it if something goes down is

(34:45):
something that I do probably everywhere I go. Mhm. And
you mentioned your pastor earlier and you communicate with him
a lot. Was that kind of your main way of
getting over the trauma? I feel like that it's kind
of the way well I think I was. You know,
if my dad, I'm sure my parents would listen to this,

(35:06):
but if my dad would ever hear this, like and
I think Bob can attest to this. My my dad's
my hero, and so I don't I don't think my
dad's afraid of anything, and I don't think he I mean,
I think he would support this. But I was so
scared in that moment. I I was so fearful of
the concept of death. I had never really thought about

(35:28):
my mortality. But when you're laying there and like you're
hearing the things that you're hearing, and then you're seeing
some of the things that were, you know, people struggling
with um in my entire body, I just knew what
I was going to die. And so I called my pastor,
I think because I was so scared, and and he

(35:50):
divulges a little bit of that combo I can't remember
a word of it, was like, Hey, is this real?
Is the afterlife real? Is God real? I'm I'm getting
ready to meeting if he is, like, am I gonna
be okay? You know, like I just didn't want the
lights to go. I was so scared at that moment
in time, and that that's not an easy thing to admit,
but that's that was my real emotion in that moment

(36:12):
of there's nothing left for me here, Like this is it,
and so that was like a very sobering thought that
you know, I hope. I'm sure some people, you know,
they unfortunately have to face that emotion at times and
then sometimes they make it, sometimes they don't. But a
very honest and real answer was I was so scared

(36:33):
that nothing, that my lights were going out, and that
was it. You know, I was just looking for someone
to comfort me in that moment in time, and he
was the person that I had been listening to tell
me these stories of love and like there's more to this,
and I just needed someone to tell me like it
wasn't gonna be over. But I can't really remember the

(36:56):
convo um, so I think I was just looking for reassurance. Well, yeah,
the right guy in the line, you know, I mean,
I know, yeah, he's a he's a great guy. Man,
he's a great guy. And you guys have a great
relationship and a great friendship. And so you know, your
commitment to your faith and and uh, you know, and

(37:19):
I know, to to your church and it was specifically
to you know, everybody that's as part of your church
with you. I'm sure helped I had to help. I mean, yeah,
it was great, it was great. It was. You know,
that community definitely helped me. I I feel blessed that
I'm not traumatized more than I I mean, this is
this is challenging, you know, but probably probably healthy for

(37:41):
me on a personal level. Ah. I struggled with this
because I felt like by sharing my story was a
little bit self serving. So I apologize that it comes
off self serving of like trying to get my two
cents out. But the community was there for me, and mean,
you know, they drove through the night to pick me

(38:02):
up and drive me back. I mean, you know, my
campus pass a big shout out to to Elijah Waters
and the Waters family and Ryan good Um, you know they.
I think Elijah ended up coming back to the apartment
I was living in at the time, and I think
he slept there for like three days, just didn't want
me to be alone, even when I was like I'm okay, man,

(38:23):
like it's gonna be all right. I think he was
just He's like, all right, well, I'm just gonna be here,
you know, for a couple of days. And so I
was very lucky, and I think that contributed to you know,
I wasn't shock after everything, So I don't think I
could process. But I think them being there and being
so prevalent in my life prevented long term trauma, Like

(38:45):
I was able to get through it and not have
as many issues as some might be struggling with. Yeah,
I was gonna ask if you I mean, I figured
you were probably in shock. I don't know how you
couldn't be. I mean with the stuff you saw and
you know, yeah, you know again, and I can't remember
a lot of things, like it's so patchy what what
I can and cannot remember? And and that's that's an

(39:07):
an odd thing to say, but it's you know, again,
like calling the X or or messaging the X. You know,
it's been what we're going on five years now, and
she and I have never connected about it and talked
about it, and so I, you know, that's something I
can't really remember. I just remember days or weeks later

(39:28):
being like, oh, these are the people that I tried
to say goodbye to and and and her being one
of those people, you know. Yeah, yeah. How about the

(39:50):
country music community, I mean, you know, did you ever
have sort of like a little you know, paw with
anybody from from that group. Yeah, they they do a
great job. I have never taken part in it, and
I have, um, you know, there's been a little bit
of pushback on on me being at one point in time,

(40:11):
you know, a figure of representation of the country music
community here in southern California. They do, Uh, there's an
organization called fifty eight Strong that that honors the families,
and UM, I have not taken part in the gatherings
or I think they reconvened at the site for photos

(40:34):
and and fellowship, and I'll support all of that. I
just for me personally, didn't feel like it was my
my journey or my path. I didn't want to bring
especially like right after it happened. I didn't want to
bring any attention to the shooter or give the story

(40:55):
any life. I wanted it to go away. And that's
I'm not saying that's the wrong. I wanted it to
go away. I wanted that person to be forgotten. Whatever
his goal was by doing and choosing to do the
things that he did, I wanted them to not be achieved.
So my way of processing it was to act like

(41:16):
it never happened. And that's that's probably does a disservice
to the families, But I just never wanted to. Like,
at one point in time, it bothered me that the
Boston bomber was on the cover of Rolling Stone, you know,
like I couldn't stand there, like I've never I just
it made me sit to my core. So any kind

(41:37):
of gathering or any posting or um, you know, with
the embloms and stuff, I I innately I pushed back
a little bit because I didn't want to give the
shooter any kind of notoriety, good or bad. You know,
It's like to me, it was it was giving attention
to something that I felt that person wanted. And I

(42:00):
didn't want to give that person anything they wanted. And
and that's not right or wrong. And and hopefully you know,
there were some people that were upset with me for
not taking part in some of those gatherings and not
doing more h on Instagram or you know, social media.
I just I was so angry about those choices that

(42:21):
I I didn't want that person to receive any any
attention at all. Like I was, I was hoping the
news would just stop covering you know. Heck, yeah, I
get it. How do you get closure on something like this?
I mean, do you ever really get closure? Do you
just I'm time hopefully heals. Yeah, I mean, um, I

(42:43):
personally feel like I have done as good as I'm
able to do as far as closure goes. In that regard,
I do value and appreciate my family and my friends
in a different way. And I'll be the first person
to tell you I love you. And um, I think
just living my life in a way where at one

(43:05):
point in time I didn't think there was any more
life left. Uh. I think it is about as close
to closure as I'm gonna get personally. Um. But I'm
also acutely aware of how blessed I am and how
lucky and fortunate I am because of everything that so
many people leaving that festival will never get, no matter

(43:25):
how hard they tried, no matter how many hours of therapy,
and no matter how many prayers are sent for them,
peace of heart and peace of soul and mind will
never be completely given to them because of you know,
the choices of some maniac that you know. I just

(43:48):
I just feel like I'm about as close to closure
as as I'll ever achieve. You know. I think every
once in a while, I'll have some bad memories or
I'll have a bad dream that it that it ended
that eight and you know, all of this is just
some sort of simulation. But um, yeah, I think I'm
as close as I'm gonna get to being okay. And

(44:09):
I'm I'm honestly, you know, outside of this, just because
I've never done this before, I probably haven't articulated very
well the things that you guys, you know, are curious about.
But for me, um, I just feel an overwhelming amount
of I'm just thankful that I'm here and that my

(44:32):
mom doesn't have to go to bed every night wondering,
you know, I wonder what my son would have done
with his life. Now I get to get up every
day and try to show her what I'm gonna do
with my life. There you go, Yeah, that is that
is a blessing for sure. I mean, you're right, it's
it's tough, I think at moments like these because you
have you know, I mean, you have waited so long

(44:54):
to talk about and and but I think you're doing
a great job articulating it, to be honest. I mean
the stuff that I mean, the details of it. I
think we all know most of those details. You know
that you know that I don't think they ever discovered
why the guy. And it wasn't like he left a
letter and said here's why I'm doing this or anything
like that, which is horrible. I mean, the whole thing
is horrible, but it's like, you know, obviously had mental

(45:17):
health issues, right, And I feel for the families. Like
you said, it's got to be hard for the families.
They have no idea why this gentleman and supposedly I
guess he set up camp at Coachella like a couple
of weeks before in Chicago and then didn't do it.
And um so I you know, if any prayers were
ever given by me when I addressed it, it's just
for the families that they you know, I can't imagine

(45:39):
being able to ever sleep, know when some guy just
woke up and decided, oh, you know, lais a fair
I'm just gonna ruin all these families libs for the
rest of their their time here on earth. You know
that would haunt me, and you know it haunts me
to a certain degree, but not nothing like what these
families are probably dealing with. Yeah. Absolutely, I was thinking.

(46:01):
I mean, while you're speaking, how articulate you are without
something and and I know you said your fears to
be self serving, but you seem like the complete opposite
of that and just so humble and and so you
just care so much for everyone who's been affected. UM,
so different from I mean, what other people could put

(46:21):
out there when they've been in this experience. So I
really frequently coming on here and just being so honest
and open about it at all. Well, thank you so
much for saying that it is relieving. UM. And one
of the reasons, you know, I really wanted Bob to
be here because Bob does know me and knows my
heart and and understands I would never use anyone's you know,

(46:44):
hardship or pain for any kind of personal gain. UM.
I have never really talked about it in depth, and
so I thought, maybe, you know, selfishly, it might be
good for me to to share a little bit and
and it and it is. I just again would be mortified.
And I do want to publicly apologize to anyone that

(47:06):
hears this and it feels triggered in any way or
feels like, uh, their experience has been trivialized by someone
that survived, you know, UM, because there's so many people
that did not M I think I think that's uh.
I think that's referred to a survivor's guilt, and I
think it's pretty evident that you know you probably have
a little bit of that too, which I don't know

(47:29):
how you wouldn't go in through a situation like you did,
you know. But yeah, like Haylyn said, I mean, I
I know you, I know you personally, and I love
you at a doory like a brother, and I can
say that I don't think. I don't think you have
any worry of anyone thinking this interview in any way was,
you know, manipulated for you to feel so, I mean,
you couldn't take a more humble route through this thing

(47:50):
than you have. And and you know, I I don't.
I don't know how to say I'm proud of someone
for you know, the way they've handled something like this.
But if the words existed, and I'm sure they do,
I'm just not smart enough to know him. I would
say those about you. Yeah, I'm not smart enough to
comprehend them, so you're neither. But you know, I would
love to end it smiling, and like, you know, life

(48:11):
is good and it's a blessing that, uh, you know,
we get to to share and you guys, you know
helped me through some things that I've I've never talked about,
and that's good. So I I appreciate you know, I
appreciate the support and just the care to to take
your time and want to hear you know, my story,
just as as the human experience and what Graham went

(48:34):
through and how he's processing. So thank you so much
for your time. Thank you Graham. It was so great
to meet you, so great to hear from you, and
thank you again. Oh you're very welcome, Bob. I don't
know what you mean. She seems super nice. I don't
I'm so confused here, Like I know, I know I
shouldn't have told you all those bad things about whoa man?

(48:55):
All right, Well, well we'll reconvene. You can kind of
you can kind of feel me get on the backstory
with all that story. I got a right. We love you, buddy,
We love you man. Thank you, guys, have a wonderful day.
Thank you for coming up. Thank you so much for listening,
and be sure to follow us on Instagram at True
Crime Reality. Until next time,