Doomsday Murder Couple Sends Messages from Prison; Alleged Kirk Killer to Face Federal Charges

The latest on the case of Charlie Kirk’s murder; the strange messages from convicted ‘Doomsday parents’ Chad and Lori Daybell; and an unpacking of the Brian Walshe case ahead of his murder trial. Plus, the New Zealand dad who hid his kids from authorities for years, and the woman murdered by her state trooper ex after asking police for help. Also, hear from a hero. Tune in for all the details.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,
and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,
it's affiliates or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking true
crime all the time. It's Monday, September fifteenth, and guess what, guys,
we have a stacked night of headlines.

Speaker 3 (00:29):
I'm Stephanie Leidecker.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
Here of course, with Courtney Armstrong and Body move in.

Speaker 3 (00:34):
The band is back together.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
It is just the three of us, ladies and of
course Taha and the boys and the boys in the back.
So we're excited to be hearing from you. Please join
us in the conversation eight eight eight three one crime
or leave us a talkback, and remember tomorrow is Talkback Tuesday.

Speaker 3 (00:52):
Wounds like there's plenty sound off about, so please share
your thoughts, share your opinions.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
Look, it's a very upside down time. So we want
to give you an update on the new developments in
the killing of Charlie Kirk, the Conservative Advocate. There's been
many new details now that we're seeing in this investigation.

Speaker 3 (01:16):
And then after that we're going to.

Speaker 2 (01:17):
Go someplace that I know maybe might feel us, make
us all feel a little bit better.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
We're going to talk about Chad day Bell.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Chad day Bell, Lori Valo's beloved husbands, murderer of count
three behind bars looking at a death sentence. He's reaching
out and he wants the public to hear his side
of the story and has some letters to share. So
if you have any anxiety, we're going to toss it
all toward Chad day Bell.

Speaker 3 (01:44):
Rest assured, I.

Speaker 4 (01:45):
Would love a full episode just to make us all
kind of feel better where we just make fun of
these killers and just like you know, just make fun
of them, laugh at them, talk about how dumb they are. Like,
I think I would feel better after that episode, especially
the ones that are currently serving life sentences or looking at.

Speaker 3 (02:04):
Death for their horrible of them body.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
You were gone when the Brian Coburger personal photos released.

Speaker 3 (02:11):
I we we're here.

Speaker 2 (02:12):
So yeah, Courtney, we haven't even really gone through those
too much either, so we know there are some Yeah,
Brian Coberger, let's do it.

Speaker 3 (02:21):
Let's do it.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
So if you have any burning questions or thoughts or
cases that you just want to talk about without having
to talk about some of the bigger, bigger, bigger things,
the really heavy stuff. Right, let's bring it here. All
info is welcome, that's right, yeah, Courtney Armstrong. Where should we.

Speaker 3 (02:36):
Begin, Well, we are going to begin with the biggest
news of the day and we're just going to speak
about the facts because so much has been unfolding in
different directions and so many retractions have been happening. So
here's what we know. Twenty two year old Tyler Robinson.
He is the man who's accused of shooting and killing

(02:56):
Charlie Kirk, who Stephanie, as you mentioned, is a political activist.
So Tyler Robinson is expected to be charged tomorrow. And
he was not. By the way, the shooting took place
at Utah Valley University, where Charlie Kirk was involved in
a speaking event, and Charlie Kirk was the co founder
of Turning Point USA. Tyler Robinson was not a student there.

(03:21):
DNA on a towel. We spoke the other day about
how the gun, the weapon, the alleged weapon, was found
wrapped in a towel in a wooded area. DNA on
that towel is it was found near where the assassination happened.
It has matched the suspect. This is according to FBI
Director Cash Bettel, and also DNA on a screwdriver that

(03:44):
was found on the rooftop where the shot very much
appears to have been fired from is linked to Tyler
Robinson as well, but.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
Not sure what the screwdriver was about. Yeah, maybe to
put the gun together, but that would in tract.

Speaker 3 (03:56):
The scope adjusting the scope.

Speaker 4 (03:58):
I'm gonna, literally, I'm guessing I do have weapons, and
I do go shooting. I'm literally just assuming I'm totally
a novice, but I think it's to a justice scolle right.
But there was any DNA on the gun.

Speaker 3 (04:12):
I have not seen any reports of. That doesn't mean he.

Speaker 4 (04:15):
Used a towel to wipe it down and got whatever
skin cells he might have left off or something.

Speaker 3 (04:19):
Right perhaps so so far reports I have seen is
the towel and the screwdriver. Tyler Robinson's family turned him
into law enforcement. He is currently in custody without fail
and he could be facing the death penalty in Utah,
where this assassination occurred. The death penalty is indeed legal, sure.

(04:43):
I read today.

Speaker 4 (04:44):
I read today that before he turned himself in, he
messaged his friends on Discord, did you had.

Speaker 3 (04:50):
Been disputed by Discord itself, right, So they spoke about that.

Speaker 4 (04:56):
Discord disputed the planning of it happening on Discord. They
didn't dispute that Tyler was on Discord at all. They
just disputed that it was planned on their platform. But
apparently right before he turned himself in, he messaged his
buddies and said, yeah, it was me yesterday. I'm sorry,
you guys have been great something I'm paraphrasing, but it's

(05:16):
not the message that's interesting to me. What's interesting to
me is that he messaged them before he turned himself in.
And the reason that's interesting to me is like, literally,
your life is in an upheaval, you're getting ready to
turn yourself in. You just assassinated somebody in public. You're
getting ready to turn yourself in, and what do you do.
You go to Discord to message people online. He must
have been incredibly close with those people in Discord. And

(05:40):
if you guys don't know what Discord is, really quickly,
it's just a messaging app. You can do video calls
on it, you can do text back and forth to
one another, to a group a group of people. I
use it to because I'm a gamer. I play video
games and I used it in the past to play
World of Warcraft, and that's how we would communicate with

(06:01):
one another, like I'm going to shoot my fireball now,
and those kinds of things. Okay, I'm really fireball letting
you guys know what a nerd I am?

Speaker 3 (06:10):
Okay?

Speaker 4 (06:10):
Or I just found gold at this rock, you know,
come and dig it up, that kind of stuff.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
But I use it now.

Speaker 4 (06:17):
I have a true crime discord where people that you know,
I communicate online with and true in the true crime sphere,
we talk about cases. And so I have a discord
and there's I don't know about two hundred people in there.
And if I was getting arrested or turning myself in,
I'll tell you what, I ain't going into my discord
to let them know.

Speaker 3 (06:35):
I'm going to be calling my you know, my.

Speaker 4 (06:37):
Loved ones and my best friends and be like I
you know, the fact that he messages people on discord
is pretty telling to me. Well, it was guy his
question online, you know, so online.

Speaker 2 (06:47):
This is a guy who left a weapon behind, obviously
left a screwdriver behind.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
There was engraving on the casings.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
As we talked about last night, and you know there
wasn't a massive attempt to cover and do a great,
full wipe up job. Then you confess to your parents
or to dad, who ultimately has to make the tough
decision about what to do with that information. And now
you're confessing to your buds on discord. That's a pretty

(07:16):
tough case to get around. So if all these things
are true, allegedly, allegedly allegedly, then it seems as though
he was prepared to be caught.

Speaker 3 (07:26):
It certainly does. And also with the you know, leaving
the messages on the case sayings, you know that all
points to I want to be seen in some capacity.
I want this message to be these messages to be
heard in some capacity, so you know, we'll see again.
This is absolutely evolving, and the Utah County Attorney is

(07:47):
holding a news conference tomorrow and they will announce state
charges against Robinson. So that is the news in the moment.
This is true crime tonight. I'm Courtney Armstrong. I am
here as always with Steph nee Leidecker and Body Movin
and we are going over headlines of the day. We
would love for you to join our conversation, so give

(08:08):
us a call eighty eight to three to one crime,
or you can always give us a talk back. You
go to the iHeartRadio app, which is free. You go
to the top right corner, you click on the little
red microphone to leave a message, and then you are
on the show. So, now body, I want to hear
about nothing more than Chad day Bell.

Speaker 4 (08:31):
Yeah, let's listen to some old fashioned true crime, right
like the heart of it all. So, yeah, did you
guys hear about this website that popped up letters from Chad? Okay,
so I was on X. Well, I was on vacation.
I know I shouldn't be, you know, doing things on vacation,
but I was on X reading the news and there's
a next account Letters from Chad, and I'm like, what

(08:52):
is this. It's literally Chad Davill's daughter created a website
and a Twitter account called Letters of Chad, and Chad
is writing letters for the public to read. So he's
trying to communicate with the public and basically tell his
side of the story. And of course I immediately text
you guys, I'm like, oh my god, I don't talk

(09:13):
about this. So I did some reading and I read
these letters and I wanted.

Speaker 3 (09:17):
To talk to you guys about them, if that's okay.

Speaker 2 (09:20):
Yeah, so wait, these letters are so too much. Honestly,
buckle up, but spuckle up, pull up a chair, join
the convo. If you remember anything about Louri Valo, Luri
Valo married, of course, infamously to Chad day Bell. Louri
Valo had three children of her own. By the way,
Chad her latest husband, who she marries while two of

(09:42):
her kids are missing. You'll remember he ultimately is right
now behind bars looking at his death sentence for murdering
three people, her two children and his ex wife, Tammy
day Bell. That's a very broad stroke summary there. There's
so much more to it into just for the play along.

Speaker 4 (10:02):
Yeah no, I appreciate you doing that, because that's pretty
succinct summary of what happened. So Chad day Bell, who
again is on death row, and by the way, he's
in the same block as Brian Coberger in Idaho.

Speaker 3 (10:13):
Goes to both busy block.

Speaker 4 (10:15):
This is a busy busy block. Okay, maybe he's one
of the ones that's tormenting Brian Colberger. I don't know,
that was my question, do you so, Brian Coberger?

Speaker 2 (10:24):
We all know is complaining because people are talking through
the walls and other inmates are taunting him verbally. Taunting
him is Chad day Bell, who clearly has a lot
of time on his hands. This guy is writing an
open letter to the land to get a few things
off of his killer chest. It's unbelievable. Yeah, maybe he's
also taunting Brian Coberger.

Speaker 3 (10:44):
I don't know, you know, I feel like it would
go one of two ways. It could go the way
you're saying, Stephanie, or could they well I guess, I
mean Coburger is in solitary. I mean, would they want
to be partners in arms of? Like only you could
understand being dragged through the press and not being you know,
being misunderstood because I know part of what Chad day

(11:05):
Bell's you know, motive is in this is.

Speaker 2 (11:07):
To have people really see him and his truth. Well,
he's been through it, you know. Obviously he's innocent according
to his proclamations. In fact, his daughter Emma, who is
the one being tasked with making this website and putting
open letters from kill her dad on the website, Emma's
this guy killed Emma's mom. That's what he's behind bars for.

(11:29):
She died allegedly of natural causes in her sleep. She
was a runner and an athlete, and everybody was like, oh,
we missed Tammy.

Speaker 3 (11:36):
That was a you know, bless her soul.

Speaker 2 (11:38):
Meanwhile, Chad's you know, already hooking up with crazy Laurie
Valos and Tammy day Bell. She was not sick and Emma,
everybody had to testify she was very healthy. They ended
up exhuoming her body and finding out she died of exphyxiation, right,
not just natural causes in her sleep.

Speaker 4 (11:57):
Right, And it's in the letters. He defends innocence, especially
of Tammy, Like he's very adamant about Tammy saying that
she had been ill for months and you know, just
like you said stuff. People testified at trial that that
that was totally not true, that it was completely contradictory
to what she.

Speaker 3 (12:17):
Was training for a marathon. She was a very healthy,
abled woman. By the way, how do you slowly get exphyxiation?
Is that an illness? You never heard of it?

Speaker 2 (12:25):
And that's strength being strangled? Right, Yeah, I've tried the association. Yeah, yeah,
that's that's being strangled. Absolutely, So how do you explain
that that's what they exhumed her body and that was
their findings.

Speaker 3 (12:37):
Right. So yeah, the letters are interesting.

Speaker 4 (12:39):
There's five of them so far, and I think there's
going to be like one every week or every two weeks.
I'm not one hundred percent sure of the timing of
it all yet. I think we're going to learn as
time goes on. But I did a a side comparison.

Speaker 3 (12:52):
Okay, let's do it. Dialags coach dialis in.

Speaker 4 (12:55):
Yeah, okay, so letter one, Okay, this is just like
his intro, like he's launching this letter series. He's countering
the media portrayal of him. He asserts his innocence. The
tone of it is defensive but humble. It's very faith oriented,
like he's, you know, kind of laying the groundwork for

(13:16):
his faith. Okay, he has a direct denial. He's like
framing his innocence. Okay, there's a direct denial of being involved.
He's not in a cult.

Speaker 5 (13:25):
He's not a.

Speaker 4 (13:26):
Cult leader, a conspirator, or a killer. In talking about Tammy,
he's saying he grieves her death and that he misses
and loves her. It's very very weird. He denies any responsibility.
He does express grief, and he frames his self as
a faithful follower of Jesus Christ. He establishes a baseline

(13:47):
for his innocence, and he says, I'm innocent, misrepresented by media.
So he's basically saying fake news.

Speaker 3 (13:55):
Don't even listen to.

Speaker 4 (13:56):
The news, even though the news is reporting on what
happened in court, you know, But he's basically saying this
is fake news.

Speaker 3 (14:02):
So don't even bother this guy.

Speaker 2 (14:04):
By the way, how does he explain the fact that
his beloved wife, Tammy of decades, who he had a
full family with and lots of children with, who loved
him very very much, woke up exphyxiated. And how does
he explain the two lovely young adults Jj and Tylee
who were found in shallow graves in his backyard.

Speaker 4 (14:26):
I know we haven't had that happen. We haven't got
sorry that yet. No, do you have no reason to
be sorry. But the letters only go up for right now,
letters one through five. He starts letter five by saying,
I want to explain the events of twenty nineteen, but
it's important to go into the past. So we haven't
even gotten to this point in time yet. In the
letters where you know he's met Lauri and all these

(14:48):
other things. We haven't even gotten that close yet. These
are just like the foundation.

Speaker 3 (14:52):
It is a saga waiting to be unfolded before our
very eye, and I'll be on it. I kind of
can't wait to see what he has to say. But listen,
stick around. We're going to continue to follow this, get
more into the details of this, and later we are
discussing Brian Walsh and what else has been making headlines

(15:15):
in this day Keep it here true Crime.

Speaker 2 (15:17):
Tonight, we are throwing all of our anxiety, all of
our emotion at good old Chad day Bell. You'll remember him,
Lori Valow's beloved husband if you're not up to date.

(15:40):
The two of them are both behind bars for killing
her children, and he's also been accused of killing his
wife at the time, and Laurie has a few others
to count.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
On also, but we'll get to that as well. So
welcome to it.

Speaker 2 (15:55):
We want to hear from you eight at eight to
three to one Crime. Jump in, join the conversation. And
my mom is here the studio. She's waving bet Yeah,
suddenly a little shy, not willing to get on the
mic just yet, but all in good time.

Speaker 3 (16:09):
So yeah, send vibes, mom sending good vibes.

Speaker 2 (16:15):
Anyway, where were we Let's get back to some Chad
Dave Bell hideous letters.

Speaker 4 (16:19):
So yeah, So in the previous segment, I went over
letter one and it's just as a just as a
rebringing up to speed. It's just kind of framing his innocence.
It's just an introduction to him, and he's kind of
like framing his innocence.

Speaker 3 (16:32):
And these bodies. He had his daughter launched a website
and social media account to share these personal letters that
he is writing from death row, claiming, as you said,
his innocence, offering his version of events surrounding the murders
that you spoke about.

Speaker 6 (16:48):
Right.

Speaker 4 (16:49):
And it's the first time we've heard from him because
he didn't testify at his trial, he never really made
any public statements.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
Right.

Speaker 4 (16:56):
No, this was like the first time we're hearing from
him basically since he was arrested.

Speaker 3 (17:01):
It's like it's coming out.

Speaker 2 (17:04):
Yeah, it's a little coming out New York strong like yay,
Chad Dave Bell.

Speaker 3 (17:08):
Let it rip.

Speaker 4 (17:11):
So letter two there's five total, okay, And Letter two
is about Tammy and their marriage and it's you know,
he romanticizes Tammy and their marriage. He builds himself up
as this great, you know, husband and family man. It's
nostalgic and he's, you know, very idyllic when he's talking

(17:32):
about Tammy, and it's actually, if you didn't know any better,
it's actually very sweet. Okay, if you really didn't know anything,
it's very sweet.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
Which is why it's so important with repacking this because again,
this is a perfect example of how both things can
be true. By the way, Tammy probably thought she was
married to a hell of a man. And Emma we're
seeing right now, sweet Emma, whose mother is dead and
whose father is on death row for her murder, is
still feeling very devoted. So they must have had very

(18:02):
happy times, one would.

Speaker 3 (18:03):
Argue, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (18:05):
He implicitly denies her the involvement in her death. He
says that he was a devoted spouse and there was
no motive, like he's completely glossing over the fact that
he was seeing Lorie Valo on the side.

Speaker 3 (18:18):
Basically right, And am I correct in remembering that when
they met it was when Chad Daybell was giving some
sort of presentation or having a gathering.

Speaker 4 (18:31):
Okay, one of his books, I think yeah, I have
to tell you, and she came on his podcast.

Speaker 3 (18:36):
That's right. She traveled far and wide by the way.

Speaker 2 (18:39):
Laurie had been married a few times, unlucky in love,
married to Charles, also deceased. She has three children, Colby
her oldest from a previous relationship. Now she marries Charles
Charles he has Kylie with They have beautiful Kylie, also
now deceased, and JJ is the third child that was

(19:00):
almost gifted to them. She had to adopt JJ, and
JJ was autistic and was a wonderful little boy. But
because she was such an incredible mother, that's how great
everybody thought Larry was.

Speaker 3 (19:13):
She was a hairdresser.

Speaker 2 (19:14):
We interviewed a fellow hairdresser in the salon that she
worked at prior to meeting Chad and his Banana's Nest,
and she was lovely. Everybody really quite liked her. But
you know, clearly there's a wicked side here. And at
some point she starts getting into these books written by
Chad day Bell.

Speaker 3 (19:35):
She travels across.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
Many states to go, you know, stand in line with
a pen to get his autograph or something, and those
two knuckleheads fall in love.

Speaker 3 (19:44):
Like the perfect storm of terribleness.

Speaker 2 (19:47):
And remember this guy, he had those two life he thinks,
or he has said, who's to say, Chad day Bell
His truth is that he had had two like after
life experience.

Speaker 3 (20:00):
Dance is four letters. He talks about him in these letters.

Speaker 2 (20:05):
I always thought it was too like one he was
jumping and like not his head, and then another one
he was swimming exactly lots of water imagery in his mind.
And therefore he's somehow hyper connected to the afterlife.

Speaker 4 (20:18):
Right because he had these near death experiences. Did you
guys were a c o A on Netflix?

Speaker 5 (20:24):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (20:24):
My god, no, little c o A me bring the
OA on Netflix.

Speaker 3 (20:30):
It's about NDEs. Oh anyway, I'm getting I.

Speaker 7 (20:33):
Don't know what you're talking about.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
We're talking about put it the n D to all
your death experiences, near to NDEs, near death experiences. Oh
I'm sorry. I thought that I would love to hear them.

Speaker 2 (20:44):
If anybody listening has a near death experience that they
would love to share, I wouldn't bring them. Tell him,
tell him, tell him. I've heard so many great ones,
especially emails I Sday. I'm not gonna I believe people
have them, just not.

Speaker 3 (20:57):
Him, but also his I feel like his point, particularly
in talking about it so much, is like you said,
then he almost becomes light age Christ figure.

Speaker 4 (21:08):
Way to you hear what I'm going to go into.
Wait to you hear this? Okay, because what you just
said triggered me a little bit. So I'm still a
letter too.

Speaker 3 (21:17):
Okay.

Speaker 4 (21:17):
He said he had no motive. I think that was
the last thing I went over. He said he was
musical or she was musical. They shared this. They were
both very spiritual. He felt like she was his life partner.
He said that she struggled with health, that there was
hidden health struggles. They had a very religious marriage. It
was very LDS focused. They shared faith, they had they

(21:42):
were confirmed in the in the church. You know, this
was very centered. This centered their life centered around this church. Okay,
and it was the cornerstone of their marriage. It was
very important to them. And so Letter three talks about
her health decline, Tam. This is all about Tammy still

(22:02):
all right, explains Tammy's death as a result of prolonged
health decline, but he doesn't really give any specifics. Okay,
This tone is very somber, you know, because he's talking
about her death and he's still not taking any accountability.
He said that she died of natural causes. She was
resistant to doctors, she wanted natural therapy.

Speaker 3 (22:25):
He's making things up, by the way, under his control.

Speaker 2 (22:30):
Yeah, he had her under He was a control guy period.
He said that she was going through fainting spells.

Speaker 3 (22:40):
What Okay, there's no record of her anywhere. Okay.

Speaker 4 (22:45):
He said that she was going through fainting spells and
then of course she suddenly passed away while they were sleeping.
He said that she was an angel, which I believe.
I believe her to be a doubt she was a
wonderful mother and wife, which I also believe. And you know,
he creates basically this alternative cause for Tommy's death and
that he's being persecuted much like Joseph Smith.

Speaker 3 (23:10):
So when you.

Speaker 4 (23:11):
Said, you know that he has these NDEs and he's
getting closer to Christ, it made me think of what
he said, that he's comparing himself to Joseph Smith. And
if you don't know who Joseph Smith is, he is
the basically the founder of the the LDS Mormon religion.
He uh, you know, found these tablets in Ohio. I think,
and I don't want to be disrespectful. So if I'm wrong,

(23:33):
please let me know, and created or founded I'm sorry,
the Mormon religion. And he was persecuted in Indiana. I
believe AnyWho I'm getting off subject. So letter four is
the persecution. Okay, that that he's talking about. Okay, the

(23:54):
focus shifts from h you know, this faith identity to
this unfair excommunication by the LDS church. He's very bitter
about this, by the way. Okay, he's been excommunicated.

Speaker 3 (24:06):
He's no longer why you wonder why.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
Of course, honest, caring giving people are not down with
Chad day Bell.

Speaker 3 (24:17):
They spotted it probably a mile away. But also if
you're excommunicated, then you know your belief is that the
afterlife is I mean is everything, and then you will
be cut off from it, and it's I would love
to get into the kingdom, which is you know a tenant.

Speaker 4 (24:34):
I would love if there's an LDS member in our
audience to let us know if you are excommunicated from
the church, are you cut off from the afterlife and
in you know, from ascending to you know your belief
I would love to know.

Speaker 2 (24:54):
And I think part of the reason also that he
was cut off is that he had these very extreme thoughts.
He was he had a whole other party going in
his head and there was an apocalypse coming and people
were turning into zombies and what started out as a
creative writing session, and he was an author putting out
these like post apocalyptic you know what's going to happen

(25:16):
in heaven type thoughts because remember he's been touched from
his many many cracks to the head. Suddenly they probably
were having a fork in the road in terms of
their belief system, and he was preaching some pretty extreme stuff, right.

Speaker 3 (25:32):
Oh, undeniably listen if you do want to weigh into this,
because these letters are insane, body, and I'm so glad
that you took the time to lay them out in
one of your famous you know, spreadsheets. They're so organized.
But give us a call. Eighty eight three to one crime.
This is true crime tonight, and we are talking about
Chad day Bell's letters that he's letting us know his

(25:54):
truth about. So yes, go ahead, it's trying to order
one more before we go further.

Speaker 2 (25:59):
Just in case you guys aren't playing along and don't
remember who Lori Valo is. Do you remember when her
beautiful young children were missing in the entire country was
looking for them, and instead of aiding law enforcement to
find them healthy, instead she was gallivanting around Hawaii and

(26:20):
many other fun places, getting her nails done with her fiance,
Chad day Bell. They actually got married in Hawaii. Why
her children were still missing, literally still missing. So, you know,
journalists law enforcement would stop her on the street, and
she was so smug, and her smugness was, Hey, they're

(26:42):
already dead and you guys don't know it, and I'm
just going to run off here in Hawaii. By the way,
she looks so normal, that's what's so scary about it.

Speaker 3 (26:50):
She just looks like she's a bride living her happy,
beautiful life with her you know, beloved Chad day Bell,
whose wife just died in her sleep, even though she
was perfectly healthy by all accounts. And even more demented
is Lorie Valo. Two beautiful children sixteen and what seven

(27:10):
seven turned up in a shallow grave in his backyard.
And this guy is somehow innocent.

Speaker 4 (27:17):
And in the meantime, she gets her brother to murder
her husband.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
Oh, don't even get started on Charles goodness. So then
sat by the way, Charles was a Saint and need listen.
You know Lorie Valo's husband Charles, also the father of
Colby I believe, yeah, which we have to get to
that office. I don't know, maybe that's a marriage prior.
She hadn't been married I think four or five times.

(27:42):
But Charles who was also killed by Lorie Vallo's brother,
who then also died. The kill list on this case
alone is really wild. But remember the two of them,
Lori Valo and Chad dave Bell together had this whole date.
In fact, you and I were working together. We were
doing an episode even with Injustice with Nancy Grace, so

(28:05):
that we were working on at the time, and there
was this doomsday date, which of course I'm forgetting. It
was sometime in the early beginnings of twenty twenty.

Speaker 3 (28:13):
Let me assure you this date was very important to
Stephanie at the time, and that was sort of a
countdown she because in my head when I woke up
that one weird day, I was like, is it possible.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
I know it's not, because I know she's completely off
her rocker and demented, but.

Speaker 3 (28:28):
Is it possible that Lori Vallo and Chad Davell are right?
Because tomorrow's the day, like it's something.

Speaker 4 (28:33):
Got in the end of July of twenty twenty.

Speaker 3 (28:36):
That's right, you know, it was cold, were like apocalyptic times.
Granted I knew she was crazy, but at the time
those two really did believe this.

Speaker 4 (28:46):
And by the way, Stephanie, that's why you're going to
be the first one of us to ENTACLT because you
kind of believed it a little bit.

Speaker 3 (28:51):
We're going to get me out. You'll get me out instantly,
I will say the other directions. I will come to.
Just give me a kit kat? Is that your ry?
I'll come, no problem.

Speaker 4 (29:04):
So Letter four is all about him being persecuted, okay
by the LDS church, and it's very He compares himself again.
He does this like parallel comparison with Joseph Smith. He
paints himself as like a hero. Okay, it's crazy and
he's it.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
It has kind of a bitter tone to it.

Speaker 4 (29:21):
And letter five, which the last one, talks about his NDEs,
his near death experiences, and his his misrepresented beliefs. He
prepares you know, he's he He opens the letter basically saying, like, listen,
I want to tell you what happened in twenty nineteen.
But in order to do that, I have to lay
the foundation of what happened before all this. Okay, so

(29:42):
I'm thinking letter six might start with the meeting of
Lori Valo. We're going to find out so, but we
don't know. I mean, we don't know.

Speaker 3 (29:50):
You know, he.

Speaker 4 (29:50):
Doesn't address any of he doesn't address up anything of
importance in this letter, but he does say, you know,
these NDEs brought him closer to God, and that he
had four of them, and that he survived them for
a reason. And you know, this sort of like hero
complex that he's got. It's very interesting and I'm excited

(30:11):
for Letter six. I'm not gonna lie.

Speaker 3 (30:12):
I mean, this is like being in Charles Dickens' time
when he would do those serialized things in the paper.

Speaker 2 (30:19):
Think he is and listen, we're breaking down some of
these well, I guess these letters that Chad Dave Bell
has been releasing to the masses as if there are
so many people that are you know, clamoring to read
his new.

Speaker 3 (30:33):
Released backstory stories, but rest ashured. He claims he is innocent.

Speaker 2 (30:38):
But then Lori da Bell Valo also serving life behind bars,
not death interestingly, but life multiple life sentence, multiple life sentences.
But you know the circumstances, I mean, I guess the
living conditions are therefore a little bit different. And to me,
she is no walk in the park and nobody se

(31:01):
skin any more than Lurie Valo day Bell. So she
was at it again because she's trying to communicate with
her son, her only surviving child, Colby, from a previous marriage.
A courtney, do you want to fill us in what
happened at crime con?

Speaker 3 (31:18):
At crime Con? So, yeah, give me odds on both
Chad day Bell and Laurie Valo going on a letter spree.
So time, that's what they have a lot of time.
They have a lot of time, that's right. So Laurie
Valoda Bell, she sent a loving message it was from
prison to her surviving son. And she did this through

(31:39):
a reporter at crime Con in Denver where Joseph Scott
Morgan just was. We were speaking to him last night,
and this journalist shared a message from Valo to her son, Colby,
and she is expressing her love to him, and she
is referencing Matthew twenty five, which is a Bible passage
and it speaks about the righteousness and the wicked and

(32:00):
again as a reminder of the small details. Laurie Valla
was convicted just two years ago murdering her two children,
Jj Vallo and Tylie Ryan, and currently serving those multiple
life sentences without the possibility. And then she wait, wasn't
she also on trial for her nephews. Yeah, she has

(32:22):
to be just convicted. Yeah, she has an thoughts. And
then he had a husband who then became the niece's
ex husband. And while Lorie Vallo was still out and
about being insane and killing everybody around her allegedly she
or not even no, she's been convicted of it. It's there,
it is not allegedly. And I would also be he.

Speaker 4 (32:42):
Was there and on the steps of the courthouse giving
a speech against his mother. So the fact that she
reached out to him, and this was like two months ago,
I think, yeah, the fact that she reached.

Speaker 3 (32:53):
Out to him.

Speaker 4 (32:53):
He wants nothing to do with her, you want.

Speaker 2 (32:56):
To imagine, and that way, Colby's like a nice guy,
and he's so long now.

Speaker 4 (33:01):
He was so close to Tylie specifically, you know, both
of them and him had a special connection. I mean, listen,
you love all your brothers and sisters, no question, but
Tileie really looked up to Colby, so there was like
a special connection there. And she was a little bit older, right,
so she was closer in age. And I mean, he's devastated.

(33:23):
He is devastated by what his mother did. She killed
her husband, you know, we know that, and he also
really respected him, So he despises his mother. I'm putting
words in his mouth, but he.

Speaker 2 (33:37):
Doesn't complicated because even you know, we did an interview
with him. Again, this is many years ago when he
wasn't speaking out to the press, and it was a
project that we were working on, and he was a
hard interview to get and he was really conflicted because
even though he knew the facts or what these facts
were shaking out to be. Like for his mother, he

(33:59):
really did love and had fond memories of her from yesteryear.
It was almost as though there were two lives that
he was forced to live, the one when he remembers
her as a loving, giving mother and then this like
insane cult mom version that it's hard to reconcile, Like
he almost couldn't reconcile it even at that time. Now

(34:22):
years later and now they've been convicted, they're behind bars.
You know Chad day Bell is you know, on death
row for these crimes. Bodies do you know were discovered
in shallow graves, unspeakable things done to them.

Speaker 5 (34:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:38):
Like now he's an adult man trying to move on
with his life, trying to make sense of this. Is
at crime con and guess what, Yeah, Laurie's writing him
notes from behind bars.

Speaker 3 (34:49):
That's right. So Laurie had found out that Colby, her son,
was going to be on a panel with journalist Nate Eaton,
and then she then gave the letter to Eton to
share with Colby, and she stated, if you talk to Kolbe,
please tell him I love you very much, no matter what.

(35:09):
And you know, Colby, he's interpreted the message as his
mother still attempting to portray herself as godly and good
despite her crimes, and he maintains he has no desire
to communicate.

Speaker 5 (35:21):
I feel much.

Speaker 4 (35:22):
I feel kind of weird about I kind of feel
that that was maybe inappropriate to do. You know, he
doesn't want any communication with her. Maybe you should, oh,
for for I think it's a boundary crossing. Personally, I
think he crossed a boundary and I don't think he
should have.

Speaker 2 (35:36):
Done it, oh, are correct in that Colby was very
outspoken about really his very hard feelings for his mother
at that recent you know trial where she was brought
up on trial for putting out a hit on her
niece's ex husband, Brandon Bordeaux. And to your point, Colby
did attend. And again, that takes a lot of courage

(35:59):
to do that looking out against your mom, I mean
imagining that your mom is capable of something like this
coming to terms with that.

Speaker 3 (36:06):
So, yeah, I could see what you're saying about it.

Speaker 4 (36:09):
There's a reason that Laurie did not reach out to
Kolbe directly, right, right, I mean listen, I like listen,
I like eton. I think he's a fantastic reporter, Like
I really like him. I just think that this was inappropriate,
like a little performative, not necessarily performative, but a boundary crossing.

Speaker 3 (36:29):
You know.

Speaker 4 (36:30):
Maybe he did it because he wants to stay in
good graces with Laurie to continue to get like the
insights gup like a professional. You know, I totally get it.
It's just I don't know, kind of gross me out
a little bit.

Speaker 3 (36:42):
Well fair perspective. Well, listen, if you went a way
in about any of these letters from Lauri Valo or
Chad Daybell give us a call eighty eight three one crime.
So I don't know, do we have anything else to.

Speaker 2 (36:58):
I just think these two the biggest example of love
gone wrong. You know, I thought about this a lot.
You know, if Lori Valo and Chad Dave Bell had
never met, I just imagine that those two never crosspaths.
Would life have gone on normally?

Speaker 3 (37:17):
You know what?

Speaker 2 (37:17):
Maybe was Lori Valo capable of continuing down a healthy path,
and maybe she would have continued to be the mother
that some said she once was. And would Chad have
remained married to his very devoted, healthy athlete of a wife,
Tammy and their many children Emma included. Or were they

(37:40):
just like the most toxic match possible?

Speaker 3 (37:43):
Because I find it interesting that Chad Dave Bell is
really taking the time to write these dumb letters and
putting them out to the world when he knows full
well that they were gallivanting in Hawaii while she was
being all smug to the cameras.

Speaker 2 (37:58):
When his beloved wife's kids were missing. You know, JJ
berried you weres old, Yeah, and Tylie.

Speaker 3 (38:07):
Was witnessed to so much destruction and despair, and you know,
had such a good life ahead of her.

Speaker 2 (38:14):
I mean it was a little teenager. So for Tyler
and for JJ, I find it unimaginable that this guy
could still say I have no idea what happened. Wait
till you hear my side of things. Why weren't you
telling that to authorities? Then, when when everyone was looking
for those two children, why weren't you making Lori your beloved,

(38:34):
come to the carpet and work with law enforcement. So
we weren't rating resources and energy trying to find JJ
and Tylee. How that say that to the people that
loved them, the grandparents and Anny, the aunt, Annie who
we interviewed Charles Ballow's sister who like continues to live
on missing her, her niece and her nephew, and Colby

(38:55):
stuck in the middle of it, like, I don't know
my mom is a maniac.

Speaker 3 (38:59):
But little did he know. That's like so hard to
cross across that in your head.

Speaker 2 (39:03):
So she left a real wake in her past, in
her and then on top of that, still looking her
worth a crazy red lipstick behind bars. If you've seen
any videos of her, it's like looking at death's door,
you know, because She's an attractive woman, or at least
was back in the day. She was very busy getting
her hair highlighted and her nails done while her kids
were missing, so she could look perfect for her wedding.

(39:26):
You could literally see her giggling. And now behind bars,
you know it's there's not other you can't get those facials,
there's no botox. Behind bars, she's looking a little ratchet
like she was trying to paint on what she used
to look like. She was doing it with markers instead
of a fine line.

Speaker 3 (39:45):
Is what it looked like.

Speaker 2 (39:46):
Never say this about another woman, But you know, red
lips she made out of like you know, she had
to make it out of something out of hand together.

Speaker 4 (39:55):
Like I told you guys, I'm on like prison YouTube
a little bit and social algorithm. No I know why,
but I'm kind of fascinated by it. Some of the women,
I mean, they do such a good job with very
little resources. I mean true, they look I was like,
oh my god, she has not laur Valo though, like

(40:16):
ry Valligans.

Speaker 3 (40:17):
Like she murdered her children and has you know, a
lifetime upon lifetime to pay for it, you know, God willing.
And by the way, you're right. Remember Courtney, we were talking,
there used to be these weddings behind bars, and there
was an actual like caterer who her her business was
like snappy little weddings behind bars, and women would make

(40:38):
bouquets out of tampons. Do I remember? I relished every
Zoom interview that we did. I remember, how do they
do that? Like, oh the cotton you can It's just
about being so resourceful. It really was brilliant and they were, honestly,
they were very touching.

Speaker 4 (40:58):
I guess you add like moisture to it, the kind
of expand and can be formed into the pedals. Yes, yes,
that is correcting.

Speaker 2 (41:05):
And you know to your point, you know, they were
very industrious with how they would make makeup and you
know eyeliners and you know curls and you know, you
know the many many things. Listen, leave it to women.
You know, you watch Oz and all the men are like,
this is just it's like the scariest place on earth.
And then you go with the ladies and you know

(41:26):
they're you know, making makeup and you know.

Speaker 3 (41:29):
Well oranges in it. Okay, since we're I'm gonna take
a tangent. I have never seen one episode of either
OZ or Orange is is really scary? Oh yeah, it's
too scary.

Speaker 4 (41:40):
I don't and I feel have a very similar viewing,
like we both feel like the same stuff.

Speaker 3 (41:45):
Correct, I'm telling you OZ is.

Speaker 4 (41:48):
So it's a little dated now because it was created many, many,
many years ago, but I still feel like if I
watched it today, I would still be fascinated by it.

Speaker 3 (41:57):
It is so interesting. Step disagree.

Speaker 2 (42:01):
Yeah, it's scary. It's just honestly, it is too scary.
I mean, I love but it's too scary to watch
it weekly.

Speaker 7 (42:09):
It is scary, but it is. It was one of
the best things ever on television, and at the time
I was like frightened, like I didn't want to do
anything wrong. I would never cross the street because I'm like,
I don't want to go.

Speaker 3 (42:19):
To do That's why you're such a great little rule
for it.

Speaker 7 (42:23):
We all actually, wait, I know you'd love it.

Speaker 3 (42:26):
I'm sure you're right, and body, you're doubly you have
my number in terms of what I do.

Speaker 4 (42:30):
You a kind of like the same thing. And then
Orange is the New Black Listen, Orange is the new
Black Is. I feel like it's made for men. Okay, Oh,
I really do.

Speaker 3 (42:39):
Yeah, now, Shams, Sam disagree. This is cotentious conversation. Sam,
what's what's doing in there? You do not agree?

Speaker 8 (42:47):
No, I think it's the opposite Orange made for women.
Specific I mean.

Speaker 4 (42:54):
Just the fact that like hyper sexualized. It's I feel
like it's made for men.

Speaker 8 (42:58):
Yeah, but I mean the fact that compared to OZ,
there's no like real trauma until like it's.

Speaker 4 (43:03):
Like a minimum security prison.

Speaker 3 (43:05):
It's like a white collar kind of crime.

Speaker 8 (43:07):
Yeah, to go, and then when they finally are in
a real prison and it's like, well I sort of.

Speaker 3 (43:12):
Had spoiler alert, spoiler alert, Well let's watch OZ. I'll
give it as a sample.

Speaker 7 (43:20):
Yeah, you love it. I think I think you're actually
gonna like it, but.

Speaker 3 (43:26):
Because you have to.

Speaker 4 (43:27):
It's an experimental it's an experimental block in a maximum
security prison. And that's in a while because it's in
the Oswald Correctional Facility and the block that OZ is
it's it's all made up, is called Emerald City and
it's it's all pods.

Speaker 3 (43:44):
It's different, it's different, it's a different kind of person.
And Christopher Maloney's.

Speaker 7 (43:48):
If anything, just watching Maloneys.

Speaker 5 (43:52):
All the time.

Speaker 3 (43:53):
I don't know who it is. Yes, dun't do come
on as yes, I of course yeah, but yeah, yes,
that's right. Of course it's so good. Okay, that must
be ago or something, right, but there's a lot of

(44:13):
like really big stars in ohs. Actually it's very good,
but it was made like fifteen twenty years.

Speaker 7 (44:19):
It's old time flying.

Speaker 3 (44:24):
And perfect perfect.

Speaker 2 (44:28):
But listen, okay, so oz that's our new material. Are
we done with Lori Vaalo and Chad day Bell? Get
them to bed on?

Speaker 4 (44:36):
Can I just say, you know, I came into the
show and I think prior to the show, we had
a little meeting and I was talking to you guys
about how I felt really heavy right like the air
is heavy, you know, life is life is crazy right now,
the world is it? Like I feel like it's exploding.
And I just want to say, being here with you
guys right now and talking making fun of Lori Vallo
and Chad day Bell, I feel so much better. You

(44:57):
guys have made me feel so much better. I'm so
ye yes, my girls and my Taha and my Sam
and my Adam.

Speaker 3 (45:04):
I'm just thank you very much.

Speaker 4 (45:05):
I feel a little bit lighter, and I hope that
everyone else does too.

Speaker 3 (45:11):
We could use it.

Speaker 2 (45:23):
Welcome back to true crime tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking
true crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker and I
head have KT Studios where we make true crime podcasts
and documentaries. I say that because please check out The
Idaho Massacre season three deep dive into all of the
details following Brian Coburger's.

Speaker 3 (45:43):
Conviction and guilty plea.

Speaker 2 (45:45):
You'll recognize Courtney Armstrong's voice, of course as the narrator
on the podcast as well as the Pike did Massacre.
And we get to be here every night together Sunday
through Thursday with Body Move In and who is also
excellent on the podcast, and we have a new one
coming out soon too, so we're excited to share that

(46:05):
as well. But we're super excited about Thursday. I can't
believe I buried the lead on this. This should have
been top of show Amanda Knox with us for an
entire hour this Thursday, The Amanda Knox. So remember Wednesday,
we got to watch everything, so you have a couple
of days catch up.

Speaker 3 (46:26):
You know, the Hulu scripted series is very, very.

Speaker 4 (46:29):
Good, and the original Amanda Knox documentary is really good.

Speaker 2 (46:33):
Too, absolutely absolutely, so we really can talk about the
merits of all of this, but you might have a
question for Amanda. So if you want to have that answered,
obviously start leaving some talkbacks, or you could also join.

Speaker 3 (46:44):
Us that night live. I have a big deal everybody.
So it's a huge, huge, yeah, And I mean the
twisted taiale of Amanda Knox, which she eped, is an
unbelievable watch. And just to just to remember the time,
i'd really, I'll be truthful, I'd forgotten just how pervasive

(47:08):
Amanda Knox was for a really large chunk of time
and just beginning to begin to understand what that would
have been. Like She's a nineteen year old girl, yeah
in Italy, not speaking the let you know, speaking a
bit of the language. And yeah, I'm really I'm excited.

Speaker 2 (47:29):
And yeah, that opening will say, I know we're not
at Wednesday yet, but no, there's no spoiler here. But
when you watch the scripted series, that first few minutes
when Amanda's in the car with mom and dad and
they're driving I won't.

Speaker 3 (47:43):
Say where, but woof's harrowing, it's dizzy ing, it's riveting.
I was so I really was sucked in from those
first few minutes.

Speaker 4 (47:55):
I mnsa start watching it as soon as we're done.

Speaker 3 (47:57):
I haven't started. It's okay, you have time, so we're
talking about it. I'm just kind of settling a great
experience for us to be able to talk to Ama Knox.
I'm excited about her.

Speaker 4 (48:07):
I've been following there after many years, so this is
exciting for me personally.

Speaker 3 (48:11):
So what we eighteen years because it was two thousand
and seven. It's a long time.

Speaker 4 (48:15):
No, yeah, yeah, yeah, wait, I think that's when it happened.
She was released to be wrong, No, I think it
was eighteen years ago.

Speaker 3 (48:25):
I think so forever twenty one. I know, I know
I need to go run out, but I swear ten
years ago.

Speaker 4 (48:34):
So yeah, yeah really, but yeah, I think so I
don't yeah, leave your U leave any I have to
go back right now.

Speaker 3 (48:43):
Wait, that can't be. Amanda Knox was on trial. It
was a two thousand and seven is when the murder happened.
It absolutely mm hmm.

Speaker 4 (48:51):
The documentaries and stuff didn't come out to like twenty
eleven or something like that.

Speaker 3 (48:54):
So maybe that's what you're seven. Wow yeah, h yeah,
I guess that's the time warp.

Speaker 4 (48:59):
We live in my I swear I graduated high school
in nineteen ninety one, and I swear it was ten
years ago.

Speaker 3 (49:05):
I swear it was ten years. Does that ever change?
My mother says that that never goes away. I think
you always think you're thirty one. Yeah, I still think
I'm thirty or what was your ideal age? Thirty?

Speaker 4 (49:20):
Yeah, although I was going to be my best at
forty to be to be fair, but yeah, thirty.

Speaker 3 (49:25):
Yeah, anyway, I have some what was your now? I
want to know, Stephanie, what was your idea? I haven't
gotten there yet. I'm still I'm still I'm still I
love that still.

Speaker 2 (49:33):
Head in that way. I'm still still heading toward my
banner year. I'll let you know, though it could be
maybe it's a year. Maybe it's right now, maybe it's wrong.

Speaker 3 (49:42):
What about you? Court magic?

Speaker 9 (49:43):
Now?

Speaker 3 (49:44):
You know forty was actually good? That was the first.
That was the first year I was scared of my birthday.
I never had been. And I'm I'm lucky the way
my birthday falls that I'm about a year younger than
all of my very good friends. Yeah you know know
what I mean. And so I would see them and
they'd flip out. I'm going to turn twenty five, and
I'm like, they made it. It's fine, I'm going to

(50:05):
turn thirty. And so I'd never had it. And then
I honestly thought on I was going to wake up
on my fortieth birthday needing like a cane and tryf goals.
I did it, but it was so wonderful and that
wasn't the case. And I remember it so clearly. It
was a Saturday and I went and I did it

(50:25):
early yoga and I had it. It was just a really
like healthy, wonderful celebratory and I was like, this, ame,
it's kind of great. That sounds kind of terrible. That's
how you spent your fortieth birthday was working out being
just in the morning. Well, because again i'd had this
weird Courtney Armstork. I know you better than this. I

(50:46):
mean I didn't say what happened that night. You have
a little prosecco to celebrate? Oh yeah, I mean the
bourbon was flowing that evening, but you know, a little
Noma stay to get it going, balance, balance, true, play hard, Yeah, exactly. Well,
I've got some headlines. We should probably get into it.
We should probably get into it.

Speaker 4 (51:07):
So this one is from New Zealand saw all the
kiwis out there. I think I said that right, the
kiwis right, Yeah, and that's not derogatory. That's what they
call themselves. So, after nearly four years on the run,
fugitive New Zealand father Tom Phillips was fatally shot by
police following a burglary, and his three children, which he

(51:29):
snatched missing since twenty twenty one, were found safe. Thank god.

Speaker 2 (51:34):
Okay, unbelievable, So get this story is too much. He
disappeared with his three children in late twenty twenty one
after like an argument, and he like they disappeared off
into the woods and they went into the wilderness. It's
like crazy, he just he's arguing. They get to three
kids who were pretty young at the time, they were twelve,

(51:57):
ten and nine. After with their mom with you know,
he was fighting with their mom. He didn't have any
legal custody. He snatched them up and disappeared into the
wilderness and for nearly four years they lived off grid
in the dense forests of the Wacado region. I hope
I'm saying that right, evading multiple multiple police searches and

(52:19):
public sightings. So they were hiding in the woods, living
off grid, and he's apparently breaking into houses to get
items to live on because they're living like you know,
cavemen for four years.

Speaker 3 (52:33):
Three children. That's really unimaginable.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
And they weren't hiding, No, Dad was holding them captive.

Speaker 3 (52:39):
So yes, you know, of course dad had a.

Speaker 2 (52:42):
Disagreement and his co parenting plan was a little out
of sync.

Speaker 3 (52:46):
Is that accurate?

Speaker 2 (52:47):
Yes, he was fighting with his ex, the mother of
these three beautiful children. This guy loses his mind and
instead of doing the right thing by his three children,
he decides to steal them right and go off into
the night where his kids are forced to live off
the land and the grid in unspeakable ways.

Speaker 3 (53:08):
By the way, this is dangerous stuff. Think about it.

Speaker 2 (53:11):
Four seasons, many many years. These are opportune times for
them to be getting educations, having hobbies, being with friends. Know,
they're just being held captive by crazy dad, right.

Speaker 3 (53:23):
It's crazy.

Speaker 4 (53:24):
So he's breaking into homes and apparently in one of
these break ins just recently this month, that he got
caught and there was a shootout and he was fatally injured.
And thank god the police or the police did find
the children. I'm not sure how they found the children
because they were about two kilometers away, just pretty far so.

(53:46):
But the police found the children and he was breaking
into like a farm, like a grocery store kind of place,
and thank god he found the kids.

Speaker 3 (53:57):
They were found unharmed. Thank goodness. Well, I mean after
four years, that is you know, that's a shining light
on that story.

Speaker 4 (54:05):
Yeah, so some good Well, I mean it's sad that
the man died. I mean, I don't want anybody to
be killed.

Speaker 3 (54:10):
No, no, no, I'm sorry. I was focusing on the children.
My mom is probably so happy to have children and
even though a lot of setbacks they have to get
through and a lot to catch up on.

Speaker 4 (54:22):
You know, well, the youngest was nine. Now he's a teenager.
Four thing, I Ember. The name is Ember, so I'm
not sure it's female or male, but I'm going to
say he he's a teenager.

Speaker 3 (54:34):
Now, Oh, the poor thing. That's crazy time change.

Speaker 2 (54:38):
The kids are so resilient though, you know, they will
catch up and they will learn so quickly and be
back with people that love them and hats off.

Speaker 3 (54:47):
They're going to change the world.

Speaker 4 (54:48):
This is your crime tonight and iHeartRadio Linebody Moving here
with Courtney Armstrong and Stephanie Liducker and we're just going
over some headlines.

Speaker 3 (54:54):
Courtney, what do you got Ah. It's also a little
bit of a bitter sweet. Lyle Menendez sent a really
heartfelt message to the actor who played him in Monsters,
the Lyle and Eric Menendez story. So he sent this
message to Cooper Koch right before the Emmys which were

(55:15):
last night, and in it, he praised his betrayal and
urged him to focus on awareness over awards, and he said,
the goal is not accolades. This is what Lyle Menendez wrote.
The goal is to bring awareness. And the actor said
that excuse me. He felt so fulfilled regardless of the outcome,

(55:35):
and he said, I already feel like I've won a
thousand times over. So it's kind of nice that there's
a little bit of a bond and goodwill. Even though,
as we spoke about several weeks ago, when it happened
both the Menenda's brother their recent bids for parole had
been denied. Oh, we also do know that that's very
common for it not to go your way the first time.

(55:57):
So if you were in support to them getting out,
there is still hope. And if you feel otherwise they
are still behind bars. So that is what is happening
with the Menendez brothers. And he Potch did not win,
and the actor for Adolescence won last night, which was

(56:18):
a really big deal.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
Again we keep talking about this, you know, upcoming podcast
in Deep Dive. But Adolescence was a very dark, very
dark series on Netflix, really beautifully done. It centers around
in cells and these online hate groups and sort of
the dark corners of a web and just how young

(56:42):
young boys are, you know, being radicalized right under our noses.

Speaker 3 (56:47):
So it was wild that that was the big win
last night.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
I think it does show a lot, you know, these
these types of shows are putting a big spotlight onto
some really important issues.

Speaker 4 (57:00):
Well and I think too it's hard to I think
to it makes it more palatable for like the judge
Eric in public to understand right when it's presented as
a form of entertainment, to learn right, because like sitting
here explaining you know, in cells and like chronically online culture,
it's difficult to understand unless you experience it. But if
you're watching a show about it or something, I can see,

(57:21):
I can see why, you know, it's kind of riveting
for people especially with all the headlines lately. You know,
you know, if you've got you know, Nancy Pelosi or
something who doesn't understand anything about anything online, she can
you know, kind of get like a short primer on
these kind of things from like watching these shows.

Speaker 3 (57:40):
And I'm not picking on Nancy Pelosi.

Speaker 4 (57:41):
I'm just saying in general, like the older generation who
doesn't know anything about people who are chronically online. You know, anyway,
I think it's good. I have to have I haven't
seen it myself, but I'm oh, it's really good.

Speaker 2 (57:52):
It's any wrong stuff, it's excellent in fact, and you know,
small team. Interesting the way they shot it, you know, infamous.
I'm not saying anything that you guys don't already know
if you've watched it, but you know, the opening shots,
for example, it's all in one take, or these are
the episode the episodes areselves go you know, pretty much

(58:16):
one time. I mean, it's an astounding masterclass in terms
of acting as well, so you know, very nuanced, important
combo are we Sayscoo and e Bert.

Speaker 3 (58:27):
I feel that or the guys that I don't watch
right now and report right back. We go live to
tah at the VMA is giving us some more music day.

Speaker 4 (58:39):
Listen, don't tease him. He would love that.

Speaker 2 (58:44):
He would be so dapper, so good, sharp, and assume
already don't let him flop that tux is ready to
be worn.

Speaker 4 (58:54):
Maybe he can be like our correspondent at crime con
like going people or something I.

Speaker 7 (59:01):
Want to I want to be a crime con with
the three of you with.

Speaker 3 (59:05):
Recording. Yeah, this is TAHA on the scene.

Speaker 4 (59:09):
I've got some updates from.

Speaker 7 (59:12):
Something with a yellow tape on it, like I just
want to make it a theme.

Speaker 5 (59:16):
Like I'll do the whole thing so.

Speaker 3 (59:17):
Yellow the lapel allegedly, allegedly, allegedly, allegedly, he would be
so good, So really it is a lost calling. Like
you also could have been an e true you know, correspondent,
and I can respond it.

Speaker 7 (59:34):
That would have been there's another call.

Speaker 3 (59:36):
Uning door and doors that are opening.

Speaker 7 (59:40):
Now there you go. I love that, and you know,
I just want to go back real quick. But Lessons
was another one of the best things I've ever seen.
I know I said earlier phenomenal, but you would absolutely
love it. I think it's only four episodes, but it's
correct the way it shot, the storyline, everything about it.

Speaker 5 (59:57):
I highly recommend it.

Speaker 3 (59:58):
So, okay, you do the dad write it. Also the
man who played he conceived it. Yeah, yeah, wrote the
whole thing. I mean this is like talent. I mean
this group masterclass and body made. Even though you haven't
yet seen Adolescents on Netflix. You made a really good
point about making in cell culture really palatable because you

(01:00:21):
are seeing it through these really personal I mean, it
is small, this is small cast, and the boy who
won was unbelievable, and you just see the juxtaposition of
what ultimately happened, and then you see his room with
Peddy Bears in it, and Stephen Graham, the actor, did beautifully.
I'm assuming something bad happens because you said that. He okay,

(01:00:45):
I can.

Speaker 4 (01:00:45):
I can ascertain what happens just from that. I appreciate it.
I'm not going to give you any spoilers coming up,
so I'm just going to stay coming up, stay tuned
True Crime Tonight, No spoilers coming up. We're going to
unpack this week's biggest cases and we're going to be here.
Ask me you keep it right here. True Crime Tonight.
We're talking true crime all the time.

Speaker 2 (01:01:14):
Welcome back to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking
true crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here tonight
of course with Courtney Armstrong and body move in. So
we have yet another story to again maybe channel our
anxiety toward. But before we do that, just a quick
reminder tomorrow Talk Back Tuesday, Talk Back Tuesday, So start

(01:01:36):
leaving them now and Amanda Knox live in the studio
for one full hour on Thursday. So if you have
any questions or you know, hit us up on our
socials at True Crime Tonight's show on Instagram and TikTok,
or at True Crime Tonight on Facebook, or the talkbacks,
or you know listen. There is a million ways to

(01:01:56):
leave us a message at this point, so if you
have one for Amanda will be sure to get to it.

Speaker 3 (01:02:03):
And then this Brian Walsh case, here we are. We're
going back. We're going back to procter Land, Karen Reid,
Proctor Land, We're going back to Boston, and here we are.
This guy is trouble, okay, Brian Walsh. He is awaiting
trial for allegedly murdering and dismembering his wife Anna Walsh.

(01:02:27):
So he is back in the news because he was
stabbed in jail right before his trial is set to begin.
And Walsh is accused of this horrible murder on New
Year's Day twenty twenty three, and he then attempted to
cover it up through all these crazy, disturbing means. He

(01:02:49):
did online searches, he had surveillance purchases, and allegedly disposed
of her body. His trial is scheduled for October, and
the case it's drawn some real national attention because it
is so violent.

Speaker 2 (01:03:05):
Got do you dismember your wife? He didn't just toss
away her body. I just think we have to be
a little bit more clear. Graphic trigger alert. He dismembered
her body.

Speaker 3 (01:03:15):
In fact, he dismembered her body and was doing like
surveillance on one of his kid's iPads, I might add,
And when they found body parts in various locations, one
of them was to buy his own mother's dumpster. So
this guy's a real piece of work.

Speaker 2 (01:03:29):
And if you're looking at photos of them, of which
there are many and happier times, you know, it just
goes to show you social media can be so tricky. Right,
They look so happy, he looks so lovely. There's flowers
in front of him, you know, so she obviously received
flowers from him. There's a cake all the time. They're
celebrating an anniversary, even before her murder.

Speaker 3 (01:03:52):
This just popped up, which is so creepy.

Speaker 2 (01:03:54):
My phone is for sure listening. Wow, twenty twenty two,
What a year. This is what she wrote on New
Year's Eve. By the way, she goes missing hours later.
Oh my god, so just to hear it direct quote.
Wow twenty twenty dot dot dot what a year. Exclamation point.
And yet we are still here together exclamation point. Let's
make twenty twenty three the best one yet. Exclamation point.

(01:04:17):
We are the author of our loves, of our lives courage, love, perseverance,
compassion and joy. Love Anna, and this psychopath allegedly allegedly
allegedly murders her the next day and dismembers her body.

Speaker 3 (01:04:34):
Is they have kids together?

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
Yeah, In fact, he's using one of the kids iPads
left and right, which is why they caught the clown.
And he has the nerve And this is what they
were doing on New Year's Eve.

Speaker 3 (01:04:44):
That is so throw and terrible and sad. That message
that this woman wrote. I mean, she was message on
love right, and she's so beautiful and he's like, they
look like a really lovely, happy couple. And it wasn't
the selling like fake faith war Yeah, he.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
Was a total liar and a crook and a con
and now a killer allegedly.

Speaker 3 (01:05:05):
Right. So, according to the court filings, this happened just
days before her disappearance, Anna had told a friend. She
mentioned it to a friend who was in Washington, d C.
That she worried her husband, Brian would soon be incarcerated
and that was for art fraud. So this guy was
a fraud on many levels allegedly in that he was

(01:05:26):
he was accused of that. I think that actually he
was convicted of he was selling fake. He was legit
selling fake.

Speaker 2 (01:05:33):
By the way, who's fake of all the art to
try to like fake even I know in Andy Warhol,
you know what I mean, Like, there's probably some many
more obsolete artists that you could try to get one
over on. This guy was trying to sell Andy Warhol
photos or.

Speaker 3 (01:05:49):
Right, and he works of art. He was getting ready
to go to jail for that, I think, wasn't he.
I think that that that. I think he was getting
ready to go to jail.

Speaker 4 (01:05:59):
And she her job was split between their home in Massachusetts,
and she had to work in Washington, d C. And
I think she was planning on taking the kids to
d C when he went.

Speaker 3 (01:06:12):
To jail, that's right. And she had told a friend
who said that that Anna was uncharacteristically very emotional and
extremely upset, and that again she was planning to move
with her three children. Trying to get out in the
middle of the night. Is what that sounds like.

Speaker 2 (01:06:28):
Also, just imagine how scary that must be, that you know,
maybe you're maybe you know your husband's a con and
going to prison. But maybe she had a sixth sense.

Speaker 4 (01:06:38):
Maybe she did, but it did so noting that he
bought the tools to dismember her beforehand.

Speaker 3 (01:06:44):
So it was premeditated, that's right. It wasn't like a
spur of the moment thing. Was I lured her into
a great New Year's Eve? I might have write, yeah, right,
I think it was totally planned you and Stephanie. You
had mentioned Brian's mother, So just a very brief timeline.
December twenty sixth, so this is you know, about a
week before Anna's alleged murder, Brian's mother hired a private

(01:07:10):
investigator to surveil Anna and apparently that was at Brian's request,
so his mother's embroiled. And then two days later, on
the twenty eighth, she On that day she tells her
friend that indeed she plans to leave Brian with her kids.
And then when she is last seen on January first,

(01:07:30):
Brian then claims that she left for some imaginary flight
to DC. And then the next couple of days January
the first to the third, Brian's allegedly he's making all
these incriminated Google searches and visiting stores to buy cleaning supplies,
full body suits, buckets, a hatchet clan bought a hatchet

(01:07:52):
for his the mother of his children, that's right. And
then it was in the middle of January Brian was
arrested for misleading police, and later that month, so in
the same month he is charged with murder and improperly
transporting a human body, and indeed, while he was waiting.

(01:08:16):
While he was waiting to come up on charges, he
has also been sentenced to thirty seven months in federal
prison for the art fraud we spoke about. So this
child will be happening. October twentieth is when jury selection
is scheduled to begin and we're going to hear Michael

(01:08:36):
Proctor's name. Really.

Speaker 2 (01:08:39):
Oh yeah, I just to refresh your memory. Karen Reid,
the infamous case where doctor was the lead investigator who
got passed because you know, he was he was sitting
inappropriate texts and you know, all kinds of wacky stuff.
Not to go back too far in time, but yeah,
I guess he was investigating this case too.

Speaker 4 (01:09:00):
He's the lead investigator. Oh my god, this better not backfire.

Speaker 3 (01:09:04):
Oh well, it appears. I mean, listen, you know he
was lead investigator and Karen Reid, and you know obviously
he has been suspended without pay after all the nastinessue
referencing with Karen Reid, Stephanie and indeed Walsh's defense. They're
reviewing thousands of pages of records also images that are

(01:09:25):
tied to Practic's investigation, including handwritten notes, and it seems
like the Norfolk DA might hire an external firm to
evaluate what data on Practor's seized phone is discoverable. It's
always a technicality.

Speaker 2 (01:09:42):
That's why this sloppy carry is the worst, because yeah,
people get off the island.

Speaker 3 (01:09:46):
People get off.

Speaker 2 (01:09:47):
Because of these types of technicalities. But didn't he wasn't
he wearing like a hazmat suit when he was tiaturing her?

Speaker 3 (01:09:53):
And her DNA is on said suit. That's correct, that's
all right. So yeah, that type X suit was found
or said near Brian's mother's house with Annie Dear's mom
on it. And then this is this is kind of curious.
Key evidence hasn't been tested due to disputes over who's
supposed to pay for the private lab processing because apparently

(01:10:18):
once these tests happen, the samples will be destroyed. So
I'm curious to dig into that as we get closer
to see what what exactly the dispute is. I've never
heard something quite like that.

Speaker 2 (01:10:34):
So anyway, that mom like, he tells his mother to
hire a private investigator. Poor Anna, can you imagine you're
trying to hold down two different jobs. You're a full
time mom and wife in one city, and you're going
to your job in DC, trying to hold down all
of these things, and your mother in law has someone

(01:10:57):
trailing you for your psychotic husband who's a thief and
a con who's trying to sell artwork on the black market,
and now butchers you. And now mom is like, well
it wear's mom in the mix.

Speaker 4 (01:11:12):
Right, This is True Crime Tonight at n iHeartRadio, where
we talk true crime all the time. I'm body moving
and I'm here with Stephanie Leidecker and Courtney Armstrong and
we're kind of getting into the weeds here a little
bit about the Brian Walsh case. And one thing I
want to talk about is is google searches. Courtney oh brutal.
So his Google searches. He used his son's iPad. And

(01:11:35):
here's some of the Google searches he did. Hack saw
best tool to dismember? How long before a body starts
to smell? How to dispose of one hundred and fifteen
pound woman's body. Now he's using his little son's iPad, okay,
to do these searches about dismembering his mother's body. The

(01:11:55):
son's mother. You know, it's just a sperable. And remember
she went. She was last scene on January first, right,
And he's starting to make these searches between the first
and the third. So her body is somewhere in the home,
I'm not sure where. And he's like, how long before

(01:12:15):
this starts to smell?

Speaker 3 (01:12:16):
I mean, he's.

Speaker 4 (01:12:17):
Googling this before he dismembers her.

Speaker 3 (01:12:19):
It's hers. Is this guy?

Speaker 2 (01:12:20):
How disgusting and dumb is this man? I feel enraged?

Speaker 3 (01:12:25):
No, well, sure these salient details to this, you know,
alleged crime. We don't know. It hasn't gone to court.
But this information may not see the inside of a
court room because when officials searched the house, it was
done before a search oriente was issued. Yeah, it's when

(01:12:45):
the case was a missing person's case. And so Walsh's
attorneys are fighting saying, you shouldn't be able to present
this data that the trooper has gathered because potentially it
went beyond the scope of what Walsh gave them consent
to search. And again, they didn't have a warrant for it.

Speaker 4 (01:13:06):
So, just so everybody knows, when you when you go
before a judge, when you go before a judge for
a search warrant, you have to be very specific about
what you're looking for, and the search warrant itself will
state that you're not allowed to take things that are
outside of that scope. Correct, And that's their argument is
that there was no search warrant and Brian Walsh gave
consent for them to enter the home and search, and

(01:13:29):
they just took things willing illy is what they're saying.

Speaker 3 (01:13:33):
Well, that's what they're yes, that is what the defense,
that's what it is, a bottom line alleging. But then
the state they've argued that the searches were within the
scope of the law and they said that Walsh freely
voluntarily consented to the searches of these three digital devices.
So it's attle.

Speaker 4 (01:13:50):
Hopefully there's some documentation of that, like sign off.

Speaker 3 (01:13:53):
Like go ahead, or a video of when they came.
I don't know that'd be a good bodycam something like that,
but you know this will be one to watch. The
surveillance footage. You can see Brian and Lowe's he's allegedly
purchasing those cleaning supplies and the plastic suits, and then
you also see him with a heavy looking black trash

(01:14:16):
bag into that dumpster and the items that belong to Anna.
It's boots, a Prota bag, and a vaccine card that
we're all recovered from these crash facilities. So you know,
there's a bunch of physical evidence and the charge is

(01:14:37):
first degree murder.

Speaker 2 (01:14:40):
I throw again death sentence. I don't know what to say.
He should be on death row. I don't even know
how I believe about death. But I think death Row
sounds very bad, and it.

Speaker 4 (01:14:51):
Looks like the defense strategy is going to be centered
kind of around, you know, particularly attacking Trooper Proctor.

Speaker 2 (01:15:02):
Yes, this is super intense. I mean, he is the
world's worst husband, imaginable. I mean, Chad Dave Bell, this
is we should just name this the Night of terrible say.

Speaker 3 (01:15:13):
Nasty husband night or despeakable husband.

Speaker 2 (01:15:15):
There's so many great husbands out there, but these two
are not them.

Speaker 3 (01:15:19):
No, no, they absolutely are not them.

Speaker 4 (01:15:23):
So anyway, so the trial is gonna the trial is
going to be happening in October, right, correct, So we
need to watch this. We need to watch this trial.
We need to of course, is it gonna be televised?

Speaker 3 (01:15:34):
Do we know? I don't know if it's going to
be televised, but I do know that Judge Bev will
not be the judge. She will not give me a
heart attack. No, the judge is going to be Diane
uh Prenier. I'm definitely mispronouncing that name, but it will
not be Judge Bev, who, of course was Karen Reid's judge.

Speaker 2 (01:15:55):
Brian Walsh somehow looks a little familiar to me when
I'm looking at his photographs.

Speaker 3 (01:15:59):
I don't know why. He sort of a little bit
looks like Simon man Jack. Brittany Oh Bears not Britney Spears.

Speaker 2 (01:16:10):
They were married and then they both died of an
unusual death because there was some sort of Brittany she
used to do.

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
We did, yeah, Brittany Murphy, I did ye. Speaking of story,
I did that. Yeah, yeah, he does. He kind of
looks like Simon Manjack. We're gonna have to cover that later.

Speaker 4 (01:16:32):
But coming up, we're going to be getting into some
of the top headlines and we're going to be hearing
from you keep it right here True Crime Tonight, We're talking.

Speaker 3 (01:16:39):
True crime all the time.

Speaker 2 (01:16:51):
Welcome back to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking
true crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here with
Courtney Armstrong, a body move in and listening. You'll remember
last week we were starting to pay it forward for heroes.
So my hero was Whitney Galloway. We spoke to her
last week and then Whitney Galloway gave us her hero

(01:17:15):
and her hero is Kyle, her husband, who's just a
delightful father and husband, being deployed serving our country, working
in law enforcement, I mean, the real deal. So we
have a little message from him, and then Kyle's going
to pick his hero, and you see how this game goes.
Every week we have another segment with the new hero.

Speaker 3 (01:17:37):
I love spreading goodness and hope and joy because man,
we could all use a little bit of it now, please, right,
And really, Kyle couldn't be more deserving. As Stephanie said,
We've had the real pleasure in honor of meeting him
and just what a stand up, solid human being. So

(01:17:57):
I love this.

Speaker 2 (01:17:59):
Yeah, there's many Kyles out there, right, so there are
more heroes than we know. So we're starting this like
six degrees of separation of true crime tonight, or maybe
it's six to six degrees of connection true crime tonight.
I like it nice, So yeah, we play? Can we

(01:18:20):
play Kyle's.

Speaker 7 (01:18:22):
Yeah, I spoke with him earlier today, so let's just
jump in and have everyone listen.

Speaker 5 (01:18:27):
To our conversation.

Speaker 3 (01:18:29):
Love it Kyle.

Speaker 7 (01:18:31):
For listeners who may not know you yet, can you
tell us a little about yourself and the role you've
played in Whitney's journey.

Speaker 9 (01:18:38):
Well, I've been married to Whitney for going on nine years.
We have two children together. Really just been trying to
be there for helping her adjust and whatever she needs.

Speaker 7 (01:18:50):
Really well, clearly you have been doing that because Whitney
spoke very highly about you when she was on our
show not too long ago. She said that you or
her hero. How does it feel to hear that Whitney
described you that way as her hero?

Speaker 9 (01:19:05):
It's definitely it's heartwarming, I guess to know that somebody
thinks of you in that way.

Speaker 7 (01:19:10):
I'm curious do you see yourself as a hero. Is
there another way that you think about the part you've
played in Whitney's story.

Speaker 9 (01:19:16):
I don't see myself as a hero. No, I just
see myself really as just a husband trying to be
there for a spouse or a friend, just trying to
help them through one over difficult times.

Speaker 7 (01:19:29):
In your view, what does it mean to truly show
up for a spouse or someone you love during their
hardest moments and how did you find the strength to
do that for Whitney?

Speaker 9 (01:19:40):
What I think it means to truly show up for
somebody is it doesn't have to be like physically show up.
It just you could be there for any sort of support,
whether it be a text message, or a phone call
for being there.

Speaker 7 (01:19:53):
Clearly you have had a major impact on her. And
as you may have known from what she told you
about the show, we're going to sort of do this
paying it forward kind of momentum. And since this is
talking to someone's hero, we'd love to know who your
hero is and why.

Speaker 9 (01:20:12):
My hero would probably have to be Aaron Garcia. He's
a good friend of mine. We went through basic training
together years ago, and you know, we still talk to
this day. He's living in Kansas and I live in Ohio,
but we still talk to this day. Currently, he's getting
ready to be shipped overseas with the military as well

(01:20:35):
as I am, so he's going through the same things.
And he's just somebody that if I have a difficult time,
or if I just need somebody to talk to, he's
always going to answer the phone. He's always going to
respond back at some point.

Speaker 7 (01:20:47):
Do you know when he's deployed.

Speaker 9 (01:20:49):
He'll be going in December.

Speaker 7 (01:20:51):
In December, okay, so we'll make sure we reach out
to him before that. And I just want to wish
you all the best and we thank you again, all right,
I appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (01:21:04):
I mean, listening on the night of all nights when
we were just talking about these dastardly dads and terrible husbands,
a reminder of how many great ones there are. There's
so many wonderful men serving this country. By the way,
we have to know, we have to interview him next week,
not before December.

Speaker 5 (01:21:24):
Okay, that.

Speaker 7 (01:21:28):
Is every week.

Speaker 3 (01:21:29):
Okay, it's not quarterly like.

Speaker 7 (01:21:33):
We should do so every nice to cover though. I'll
push it out.

Speaker 5 (01:21:37):
We'll push it. There's so many we haven't.

Speaker 7 (01:21:41):
So amazing. Yeah, it was a great conversation with him,
and I love this idea. So just continuing to show
heroes because we talk about a lot of that's dark people,
awful people, so it's nice to hear the polar opposite.

Speaker 5 (01:21:58):
So I keeping that going.

Speaker 4 (01:22:00):
I like how I said he was her friend to
you guys can't see me, but I mean, you guys can,
but the audience can't. I was sitting here like making
like crying face because because I was like, well, this
is a good cry.

Speaker 3 (01:22:12):
We all need a Kyle. Everybody needs a Kyle to
lay on right and to be a good friend and
someone that you can talk honestly to. And yeah, working
in law enforcement and again being deployed. You know, we
just we have to remember you know, it's not you know,
people who are serving us. And then also the families
that have to kind of hold out the fort while

(01:22:34):
they're away. It's it's so intense, so big love to
Kyle in Kansas. Here we come.

Speaker 2 (01:22:40):
So next week I guess we'll do the Kansas edition
and then okay, I'll.

Speaker 3 (01:22:45):
Pay it forward.

Speaker 7 (01:22:46):
Yeah, I'm going to keep it going.

Speaker 4 (01:22:47):
Maybe we'll come full circles beautifully. Maybe maybe Courtney is
somebody hero. You never know, it's more likely to be
a hero.

Speaker 7 (01:22:55):
That's why they stop it. How great is this team?
I love this? Yes, and I'm speaking of great. We've
got some great talkbacks. And there's one I've been dying
to get to Sam and Adam. Can we do this one?

Speaker 6 (01:23:11):
This is a question for Taha and everybody in the
Brown booth. I was curious what the best type of
talkback is to try to make sure that it does
get answered or get on air. I was curious if
something for the moment during the middle of a segment

(01:23:31):
is better, or to do something a little bit more
random that you can bring back on a Tuesday.

Speaker 3 (01:23:37):
What a good question. Yes, let's take back, gentlemen, give
us the scoop.

Speaker 7 (01:23:44):
Yeah, yeah, that is that is a good one. I mean,
I'm going to start off by saying, any talkback is
a good talkback because we love hearing from all of
our listeners and what they think about the stories recovering.
I should say not every talkback, but but you know,
in general, we like get as many as possible, so
we want to hear from you. My favorite are the
ones that I think work the best are sometimes if

(01:24:07):
someone has an opposing view to what we've been covering,
because we tend to all be in sync and we.

Speaker 5 (01:24:12):
Hear a lot of similar views on things.

Speaker 7 (01:24:14):
So if someone has, you know, an opposite side of
what we're talking about, I'm open to it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:20):
Like me too.

Speaker 7 (01:24:20):
You know, lately this has come up a lot with
everything we're seeing in the news, and I'm hearing a
lot of negative things. Sometimes it helps to be a
little open and hear everything. Makes me a better person,
maybe makes.

Speaker 5 (01:24:31):
Me grow a little bit more. So I'm open to those.

Speaker 4 (01:24:34):
I always seem to learn the most when I'm arguing
with somebody about something, or you know what I mean,
like agree in a professional way, not in a mean
spirited way. But like when you're debating somebody, I always
tend to learn the most. So I like those two
ta I think those are great.

Speaker 7 (01:24:47):
Yeah, and I love the ones where they, you know,
praise how good we're doing. But that's that's a whole
another story. It's what about you? What are your favorite?
Which ones do you think work best?

Speaker 5 (01:24:55):
Because we do.

Speaker 4 (01:24:55):
My favorite this is body. My favorite talkbacks are ones
are asking questions about evidence and timelines and you know, things,
things that I really kind of like to dive deep into.

Speaker 3 (01:25:11):
I really like timelines.

Speaker 4 (01:25:12):
I don't know why, but I really do it kind
of like, you know, this is what was going on
when he decided to murder, Like this was what was
happening in his life, those kinds of things. I like
detail oriented talkbacks. That's me though, What about you, Steph.

Speaker 2 (01:25:28):
We have so many smart listeners, which is really exciting
because you know, we get these talkbacks and it does
it shifts your perspective a little bit. And I think
that's why we're all so into these crime conversations again,
just because it's really interesting to look at a case
through different perspectives. You know, we can all agree that
this is bad and this act is horrible, but how

(01:25:49):
did we get here? And seeing it from you know,
different angles, I feel like it's shaped a lot of
the things. A lot of the cases that we follow
full time and long term oftentimes come from listeners.

Speaker 3 (01:26:02):
Yeah that's true. But so I also with TAHA, I mean,
they're all so welcome. Just the engagement is so it's
just so lovely that there's a back and forth instead
of sort of speaking into a void. So that's really affirming.
And I love when we get you know, there's a

(01:26:23):
case someone mentions that we didn't know and that we
then end up doing Stephanie. So I love those. And
also when someone comes in with details of something we were, say,
talking about on a Wednesday and then Thursday there's talkbacks
and there's little pieces to the puzzle exactly. It is

(01:26:43):
so gratifying and eye opening. Uh So yeah, I like
those too.

Speaker 4 (01:26:49):
Now from a technical perspective, let's hear what Sam and
Adam have to say, like, because we don't talk, I know, well,
what are you say the ones that come in before
the show, because that's we can stack it.

Speaker 3 (01:27:07):
Well, they all, well, we'll look through them all.

Speaker 10 (01:27:10):
When the first thing Sam and I do when we
come into the studio is look through all the new
talkbacks and uh and I will say most most every
talkback gets through onto the air. And uh, I don't
want I don't want to dissuade anyone or scare anyone
with technical sounding stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:27:29):
But uh, on the iHeart you can.

Speaker 10 (01:27:31):
You know, you go up to the top right hand corner,
there's the little record button. You can press that and
then you can listen back to your talkbacks. So if
you feel insecure about how you sounded or anything, you
can go back and listen to what you did. But yeah,
it's a cool uh feature. They make it real easy.
But we love all the talkbacks. I mean, they're all
great as long as they're uh they're about true crime

(01:27:53):
and uh you by the way.

Speaker 2 (01:27:56):
They could be a little love stories. Send us some
good messages of nice little events that are happening in
your life. We could widen the net a little bit,
just kind of softened the load.

Speaker 3 (01:28:05):
Is a community right where the doing. You know, a
lot of dark talk. We could hear some happy talk too.
By the way, Sam and Adam.

Speaker 2 (01:28:12):
The only way they don't air is if there's like
a glitch or something from an audio perspective, that kind
of thing.

Speaker 4 (01:28:18):
Do you guys remember when the show first started and
we would come in and the first thing we would
ask how many talkbacks we have? That so excited, Like
one day we had looked three and we were just like.

Speaker 3 (01:28:28):
Oh my god, we have three. We three listeners.

Speaker 4 (01:28:31):
I was like, yeah, I was so like blown out,
I couldn't lend the the next day or whatever, it
was like eleven and I was.

Speaker 3 (01:28:38):
Like, Semini are high fiving in the control room.

Speaker 4 (01:28:44):
Like it's so exciting, and you know, like we really
are trying to build a community, right, so like we
have regulars. I think we have regulars that leave talkbacks, Yes,
and we want you to become a regular. We want
you out there to become a regular. Just one big
coffee clutch. Yeah, and let us know, heye I met
a girl, or I met a guy, or I'm getting engaged,
Oh my god, I'm pregnant, I'm gonna have a baby,

(01:29:05):
Like let us know. We want to know what's going
on in your.

Speaker 3 (01:29:07):
Life, right exactly exactly if we are all around at
dinner table together.

Speaker 4 (01:29:12):
All around the kitchen table, Katie right by the way,
how great, Adam, you did a great explanation on that.

Speaker 3 (01:29:20):
That was the best talkback explanation.

Speaker 5 (01:29:22):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:29:22):
I luckily we're recording it. We should put this also
on the infamous website.

Speaker 10 (01:29:29):
I went to college for this. I went to college
for radio, so I know all about this stuff. Did
you explain it to anybody?

Speaker 4 (01:29:35):
Yeah? Oh wow?

Speaker 3 (01:29:38):
Also big radio broadcasting backgrounds. Okay, that's right.

Speaker 4 (01:29:42):
So you know when I when I was in high school,
I wanted to be a DJ for k ron Oh yeah, really,
I wanted to.

Speaker 7 (01:29:49):
Be a DJ.

Speaker 3 (01:29:51):
You never did college radio or anything? No? I never
did college. No, No, I was a burnout computer science.
I don't even know what you're degree is.

Speaker 4 (01:30:00):
My my my degree is actually not in computer science.
It's information technology. Okay, still inst you know me?

Speaker 3 (01:30:09):
Yeah, that's what about Utaha?

Speaker 7 (01:30:12):
I was communications and my minor in public relations, so totally.

Speaker 3 (01:30:19):
I was going to considering.

Speaker 7 (01:30:22):
Are you considering?

Speaker 3 (01:30:23):
Yeah? I want to get my master's in criminology.

Speaker 7 (01:30:26):
Oh what about you and stephan Court?

Speaker 3 (01:30:29):
What about Stephanie? I know where you went Yukon baby.

Speaker 2 (01:30:34):
I went to the University of Connecticut and I studied
English and psychology.

Speaker 4 (01:30:38):
Psychology, No wonder you're into true crime.

Speaker 3 (01:30:44):
Happens in the background. I did. I did play. I
did a bunch of writing, so it was two majors.
I did not surprising, uh, playwriting, and then film and
theater studies, and then I got my master's in a
thing called professional writing. You went to the USC, I did.

(01:31:04):
Oh my god, I'm impressed. You're very smart. She's a
very impressive woman, doesn't she day very impressive. I don't
think I could have gotten into USC. I gotten UNIV though,
but I don't think I can us well for what
is where there's no universe where I'm doing information technology.
So we all have our different things. I love you

(01:31:24):
can see all the pieces like psychology and how you're
so interested in that, Stephanie, and then top in pr
you're the most diplomatic person I've ever met in my life,
like in the best way.

Speaker 4 (01:31:35):
So you know, I I've been looking at going to
back to school, but you know, I've got two jobs.
I'm not sure where I'm going to fit that in,
but I have been looking at it for a couple
of months now, So we'll see.

Speaker 3 (01:31:47):
We all like live in a dorm at the university.

Speaker 4 (01:31:50):
Back to school I would do on the home on.

Speaker 3 (01:31:54):
I was also I mentioned this tught thinking of linguistics,
so I don't know, we'll have to bear. It's more
of a price thing. But I'm like, maybe we can
be study partners, the study buddies, get a couple of
masters up in here. Yeah. No, seriously, I really have
been concerning it. Well, you guys are very accomplished, and
what an honor to get to be here with you guys,
and listen, anyone listening. We want to again hear from you.

(01:32:17):
Those talkbacks. Great question.

Speaker 2 (01:32:18):
You can leave them all night, Yeah, all night, all day.
There is no wrong answer. Thank you for being with us.
This is true Crime Tonight. We're back tomorrow for talk
back Tuesday, Amanda Knox Thursday.

Speaker 3 (01:32:30):
Stay safe out there. This is true Crime Tonight