Nation Seeks Answers In Missing California Baby Case; Plus Who Is The ‘Ketamine Queen?’ And More Pop Culture Meets True Crime

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,
and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,
it's affiliates or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome through True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking true
crime all the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here with Body Movin.
Courtney Armstrong is out for the evening, but we're being
joined by pop culture expert and casting director Dorano Fear,
who is going to be breaking down some of the
major pop culture crime cases of the moment. For example,

(00:41):
Matthew Perry, you know the lethal dose that was apparently
given to him by the ketamine Queen. She is planning
on pleading guilty, So we'll be unpacking that a bit.
And most pressing, Body, You've been covering this awful story
of this missing child, and I know we're following it
very closely. Let's start with that.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
Yeah, this is really sad.

Speaker 4 (01:00):
So warrants have been issued for the cell phones belonging
to Emmanuel Harrow's parents as deputies continue their search for
the missing seven month old in southern California. So authorities
are investigating the suspicious disappearance of seven month old Emmanuel
Horrow in Ukaipa, California, that's just outside of Riverside zam

(01:20):
Or Nadino area. The focus is increasingly on the baby's
parents amid like really really inconsistent accounts, prior abuse convictions,
and a newly reported sighting in Kern County, which is
like up north a little bit. This all happened on
August fourteenth. Rebecca o'harrow, that is Emmanuel's mother, reported that

(01:43):
her son Emmanuel was abducted outside of Big five Sporting
Goods after she was knocked unconscious while changing his diaper.
So she said she was changing his diaper.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
She she is very elaborate too, in a parking lot,
in a parking lot, she said that, but he walked
up to her and said, oh lah, and that was
the last thing she remembers she got She went on conscious, right,
that's what she says, right.

Speaker 3 (02:06):
So that's her, that's what she's saying.

Speaker 4 (02:09):
So this all happened outside again the Big five Sporting
Goods store. You know, there's all these contradictions in her
story that have been emerging, and no abductor or any
credible lead has materialized. The investigation has pivoted towards parents,
as I stated, both who have concerning criminal histories and
whose home has since been searched with cadaver dogs. So

(02:30):
we know, whenever there's cadaver dogs brought in, it's never
Usually it's a good indication of what the investigators are thinking.
You know, you can kind of monitor what is happening
in an investigation. But what kind of dogs are they
using or using tracking dogs? Are they using cadaver dog?
You know, like what kind of dogs? So cadaver dogs

(02:51):
are used, of course to find bodies. So that's another
good thing, terrible and tragic. Hopefully she maybe there's a
bright light in this somewhere.

Speaker 3 (02:59):
Is it suppol she's still out there?

Speaker 4 (03:02):
I don't know, I mean maybe, I hope. So it's
been what today's day six, I don't know. So San
Bernardino and Versus Riverside County Sheriff's departments have launched a
really extensive search for Emmanuel, using helicopters K nine teams.
Do you know, they're going through surveillance footage. And despite
all these efforts, there's been no sign of a manual

(03:24):
and Amber alert has not been issued. Well because for
an amberlert, you need a suspect vehicle.

Speaker 3 (03:32):
Yeah, that is fair.

Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yeah. Oh they're objective though, but you would think they
would have a suspect vehicle potentially if they've honed in
on any suspect. Well, I guess you can't put there.

Speaker 4 (03:42):
We have to address something very quickly. I'm so sorry
you guys. I have to interrupt. I have Yogi with
me and he's sick and so he's making some noises
and I hope it's okay.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
Of course it's okay.

Speaker 3 (03:53):
So bad, I feel bad. I feel bad.

Speaker 4 (03:55):
Yogi's my dog, He's my little Pomeranian and he's not
a little cold and he's okay. But anyway, I just
wanted to I don't want to be talking about this
story and be disrespectful because it deserves a lot of respect.
And my poor dog is behind me, yucking, and I
feel terrible about that. So yeah, so yeah. An Amber
alert typically involves some sort of vehicle.

Speaker 3 (04:18):
You know.

Speaker 4 (04:18):
Usually when you get an Amber alert, it will say
white Bronco license plate from California.

Speaker 3 (04:23):
Xxxxx, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (04:25):
It won't do this kind of thing in extraordinary circumstances,
like if there's like an endangered child, like or weather
is an issue.

Speaker 3 (04:33):
Things like that.

Speaker 4 (04:33):
Don't for medication, Yeah, away from medication, those kinds of things.
They'll also issue an amber alert, but they have not
issued one for a manual. So August eighteenth, a couple
of days ago, the authorities served search warrants at the home.
Cadaver dogs were used in searches around the property. Jake Carrow,

(04:54):
who is the father, his vehicle, computers and cell phones
and other electronic of devices wereceives for evidence processing. So
the couple's two year old child has been removed again.
Emmanuel is seven months old, but he also.

Speaker 2 (05:10):
Has such a list guy at this point, Yeah, such exactly.

Speaker 4 (05:14):
So the couple's two year old child has been removed
from custody as part of this investigation, and police have
confronted the mother, Rebecca, about her inconsistencies in the story,
and she has declined further cooperation. She is not taking
a polygraph again. It's important to note polygraphs are not
admissible on court. It's just an course pool, you know,

(05:35):
it's it doesn't.

Speaker 2 (05:36):
It's strange not to take one if it's you're being
accused of something that is so heinous. The loss of
your child they're missing, you would do anything in your
power to move that investigation along. Of course, she should
take a lie detector test, you know, dad should take
a lie detector test, regardless of their backgrounds, which by

(05:57):
the way, are not great. It's it's not a great look.
Also putting police out, you know, law enforcement has a
lot going on to be running around on a false
alarm if that proves to be the case, and I
pray it's not. You know again, cadavdogs in the home
says something.

Speaker 4 (06:14):
Right, and you know, there's a lot of inconsistencies too
about the pride to be basically where Emmanuel was prior
to the kidnapping.

Speaker 2 (06:24):
There's a lot of social media buzz right now.

Speaker 4 (06:26):
That you know, they run like a kind of like
a flag football game of some kind, some sporting some
children's sporting event, and she needed to go to Big
Five to get you know, something for her other the
team and a lot of theirs speculation online that people
who were at that game are saying they never even

(06:46):
saw a manual there.

Speaker 2 (06:48):
Right like he never even attended. So she was already
building a case if that is true. To think about it,
the wherewithal to be able to pull that off as
a parent. I'm going to go on record as saying
I don't believe it's true. I do not believe in
my heart that a woman couldn't do that to her
own child and then go about and tell her true.

(07:08):
Though we've seen it so many times, but it's rare.
I mean, it takes a royal specific kind of a
woman who can put on a show like that and
use up resources when she knows full well the fate
of her loved one.

Speaker 3 (07:22):
I just can't believe that it would be true.

Speaker 4 (07:24):
I mean, most recently we sawt with Quentin Simon, and
if you don't know Quentin Simon, but his mother put
him in a dumpster and he ended up in a lanth.

Speaker 2 (07:32):
Oh, it's so too much, it is, it's too much,
and she was too much time. She lied the whole time,
he led the whole time.

Speaker 4 (07:39):
So you know, I mean, it's it does happen, you know,
But I'm not saying she's guilty by any stretch of
the imagination. I am the last person that wants to blame. Well,
she was very convincing. Smile by the way, very convincing.
And you know, again, this is why amber alerts have
to have certain criteria. I've actually been to the location
with the amber alert button is used in Sacramento in California,

(08:01):
and it's a really interesting process and it's literally like
there is a actual like yes.

Speaker 2 (08:07):
There's prongs to it. It's a headquarters. It is very
serious and extremely effective, I might add, So you know,
we know this. We've heard the harrowing tales of success
that have been because of an amber alert. So people
like this in the event that this is where this goes.
Anybody who you know, misuses law enforcement in cases like

(08:30):
this kind of diminishes the search for others.

Speaker 5 (08:32):
Right.

Speaker 3 (08:33):
Well, then yesterday we were on the air and remember.

Speaker 4 (08:38):
I made that face and you were like, what is
up during It was during a break and I said,
oh my god, there's a fire at the house next
door to the Horrows, which is you know, where these
people live, and it's like this house is engulfed in flames.
And of course that fueled a lot of speculation like

(08:58):
maybe they set the fire to the house because they
buried you know, in the backyard or something you know,
or you know, something like that. But the San Bernardino
County Sheriff's Department and other law enforcements agencies have stated
that it was the house across the street, and it
does seem like it is not related.

Speaker 2 (09:20):
And I heard that be well.

Speaker 4 (09:21):
I have a an acquaintance of mine who's a private
investigator who's actually on site and he posted drone footage
today of the area and he's really good at what
he does, and he has not detected any kind of
burial site with this drone footage and stuff like that.
So you know it, you know, but it is what

(09:43):
it is, you know. You know what is interesting though,
what these parents have. They don't have the same lawyer.

Speaker 2 (09:50):
No, they lawyered up with separate lawyers, which again says
a lot. It's also extremely expensive and you want to
be fighting to find a child I always want about this.
This is where kind again, we shouldn't be We're not
accusing anybody of anything. I'm just saying and even in broadly,
in other cases, we've seen this where parents you would
think they were help, help, help, but instead they're lawyering up,

(10:13):
making game day decisions about how to handle the investigation,
keeping out of the public. You know, there's just there's
pieces of it that just are you would want to
shout out from the rooftop, I would assume yeah.

Speaker 3 (10:25):
And again I want to say too. I think I
might have skipped over it.

Speaker 4 (10:28):
But there was no CCTV outside of the Big five store,
so that there's no footage of any kind of kidnapping,
which is very interesting to me because most establishments have CCTV.
So I kind of feel like this was almost cased out,
but I don't have any evidence of that. August twentieth,
so this, you know today is August twentieth. The San

(10:50):
Bernardino County Sheriff's Department have confirmed they are aware of
a possible sighting of a manual in current county. However,
they've not given any specific details about location or if
they've checked it out. We don't know anything. They're going
to keep all this under wraps until they know for sure.
But you don't want to put if it is him,
and I hope it is, but if it is him,
you don't want to give any indication that you're onto him,

(11:13):
because then maybe they might hurt the child or.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
Yeah, or change their story or get out of dodge
or yeah, cover their tracks, and that's not what the
investigation needs right now.

Speaker 4 (11:23):
Right So Jake Harrow, who is the father. He has
a really terrible hast and he has pled guilty to
the abuse of his other daughter from another woman.

Speaker 3 (11:34):
And you know this this I don't you know. I
don't want to go into too many graphic details because
this is a child, but she is basically she's going
to need care for the rest of her.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
Life because of the injuries that she sustained from her father,
who is the same father of this poor missing seven
month old. So you know, let's all keep our eyes
out and sends hope and hope I suppose you know
the way for a manual that is so troubling. It
is so his.

Speaker 4 (12:05):
Lawyer, the father, Jake Harrow's lawyer, told Banfield last night
that both parents voluntarily turned over their electronic devices and
their passwords and that Jake the father, is cooperating with
the investigation. He said, and unquoting, I don't know where
that statement that they stopped cooperating came from. I spoke

(12:26):
to the detectives yesterday offered for Jake to continue to
speak with them and have been and have not made
any indications or request to day to speak with Jake.
That meaning that they have not where's.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
The march, where's the candlelight vigil of like you know,
knocking on doors and you know, creating us well and
wanting answers. That's what you would think would be happening
right now, and let's all do that together, and our
hearts go out to the family, right so, and then
on top of that, the mom's brother is in prison
for murder, so they have a kind of shady family tree,

(13:02):
okay a little bit, And so there's just a lot
of speculation, and I hope all the speculation is wrong
and that this beaning is in Kern and that he's
going to be safe. This was Indie story too. Shout
out to Andy and always thank you Indy.

Speaker 3 (13:17):
We're going to continue to follow this.

Speaker 4 (13:18):
When we come back, Doronto Fear will be joining us
to discuss the ketamine queen.

Speaker 2 (13:22):
Keep it right here. True Crime Tonight. Welcome back to
True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking true crime all
the time. I'm Stephanie Leidecker here of course with Crime Analyst.
Body move in now. Tonight, Courtney Armstrong is out and

(13:46):
about gallivanting. And while she's gone, we miss your court.
We have Doronto Fear, our pop culture expert, also a
great casting director giving us some pop culture true crime
cases to unpack, and of course producer Taha always bouncing
in in the background there, So jump in. The biggest
thing is we want to hear from you eight eight

(14:06):
eight to three one crime, So jump in join the
conversation anytime, or you could always leave us a message
on a talkback on the iHeartRadio app. So this Matthew
Perry loss. I was a huge Friends fan. The loss
of Matthew Perry under such silly circumstances if you're not aware,
he was battling addiction and then o deed even at

(14:30):
a time that most thought he was sober, and now
we know it was from a lethal dose of ketamine.
And now the person who illegally got him that illegal
dose of ketamine that ultimately killed him has pled guilty
to all charges or is expected to plead guilty, I
should say, and five others as well in this like

(14:52):
ketamine ring in North Hollywood. They were basically posing in
her case like a like an art kind of a
you're a curator, when in reality she was taking advantage
of very wealthy celebrities and giving them narcotics even knowing
that they were drug addicts, giving them ketamine and you know,

(15:13):
getting paid top dollar for it, which is ultimately what
killed Matthew Perry in his hots up. Now again he
did drown, but the circumstances were he was served.

Speaker 3 (15:23):
A legal dose you have to buy, you have to
do a needle to.

Speaker 2 (15:28):
Do this drug. And his personal assistant, who's one of
the five, is the one who was shooting him up basically.
So you know, listen, this is a pretty big development
a that there is such a big ring. I don't
know why. I'm surprised to know this of you know,
this whole machine behind the scenes, and also that you know,
we're seeing this woman in the center of it and

(15:51):
she's looking at sixty five years Oh my god.

Speaker 5 (15:54):
Really? Oh yeah, you know, this is a fascinating story.
I think that there's some nuance here. You know, the
Russian is is whether Jazzbine Sanga, you know, who is
then dubbed the ketamine Queen, Like is she sort of
the mob boss behind this? Is she the godmother?

Speaker 6 (16:10):
Right?

Speaker 5 (16:11):
I don't know she you know, she was a party promoter,
live event person. You know, she had this this this
North Hollywood event space where they did like pop up
for influencers. So she's a socialite quote unquote I use
that loosely.

Speaker 2 (16:26):
Yeah, loosely and North Hollywood social life.

Speaker 5 (16:28):
You know, it's sort of like, was she the queen?
You know, I don't know about that. We do know
that she's connected and her Instagram and things like that
had shown her, you know, traveling the world and she's
been seen in many different events with people like DJ Khaled,
and she's affiliated to Charlie Sheen, another sort of notorious
figure in you know, Hollywood legend.

Speaker 2 (16:47):
And lobold, well known drug addict. By the way, his
documentary coming out looks so good side and.

Speaker 5 (16:53):
Remember and remember, Charlie Sheen really came his His notoriety
was highlighted by Heidi Flice, who was the Hollywood Madam
and I kind of dubbed the ketamine Queen that like
the drug version of Heidi Flies.

Speaker 2 (17:05):
That's right. However, again, the ketamine thing is a whole
new jam that we're seeing people really being held accountable
for as a whole. It's really that infentanyl, right, We're
seeing these rings that are you know, they are two
different things, how so.

Speaker 5 (17:22):
Well, Okay, first of all, ketamine is an independent drug,
and to have a lethal dose of ketamine, you need
a lot you know, when it comes to the ketamine.
Most ketamine is not done intravenously, and so you have
to be are to be doing ketamine intravenously. And Matthew
Perry had she had sold Eric Fleming, who was the

(17:43):
acquaintance to Perry or his assistant, who then distributed it
to him fifty vials like that is an extraordinary amount
of the drug. And that drug really is something that
is usually done nasally or inhaled. It's not really a
smokable drug, and it's not really you know, so if
someone is intravenously doing that, then this is a whole

(18:04):
other level. And ketamine has gotten a lot of positive press,
strangely because of its therapeutic effects, and there are a
ton of legal ways of doing ketamine as as therapy.

Speaker 2 (18:18):
Right which he was doing I think by all accounts,
Matthew Perry, who was you know, sober and was allegedly
maybe using ketamine as a therapeutic It was maybe, you know,
maybe whatever the doctor or whatever. I don't know the
process yet this person was a workaround. So she was
doing it illegally, paying getting paid top dollar knowing full

(18:40):
well she was administering a drug in major ways to
a person who's in recovery.

Speaker 5 (18:47):
Well, the question is was she administering it? Was she
playing you know, teenage nurse like like.

Speaker 2 (18:52):
Here's no, the assistant was, and that's what I wanted.
The assistant, amongst several others, were all now brought in
and they're they're pleading.

Speaker 5 (19:01):
But they're facing fifteen to twenty five years in federal
in prison. Where she's where she's she's facing fifty to
sixty five. So really, my question about this case is
it is a tragic loss of a beloved Hollywood.

Speaker 2 (19:14):
I love Matthew Perry. It's a Demist's so happy.

Speaker 5 (19:19):
He struggled an entire life of addiction. He was very
open about that addictive thing. And did he then shift
gears into ketamine therapy and then abuse that as well
like any other drug, because you could be addicted to xerix,
you could be addicted to any kind of pharmaceutical. And
this is a long history in Hollywood. And the question
then becomes, who really is being held culpable or is

(19:39):
this now being used to open a Pandora's box, Because look,
when it comes to ketamine, and people don't understand what
ketemine is. It is a disassociative and really what it
is is a narcotic that is used for sedation for
animals in the veterinary world. It's used on cats during
Spain and horses to tranquilize them during various procedures. And

(20:02):
it kind of rose to fame in the nineties during
as to become a notorious party drug. And when ketamine
became a class substance and was made illegal. Because it
was legal, they the American pharmaceutical manufacturers changed the formula
so that it became oil based, so that you couldn't
inject or evaporate or snort, so the only ketamine that

(20:25):
is really in the day.

Speaker 3 (20:25):
They tried to like halt the abuse.

Speaker 2 (20:28):
Basic.

Speaker 5 (20:28):
Yeah, well, the American unagree, correct, the American pharmaceutical companies.
There was also outrage by a lot of veterinary clinics
because they had break ins where people would go in
and steal this drug, right to rob.

Speaker 2 (20:38):
Hold that thought for one second. Hold that thought, because
we just want to make sure anyone who's joining us
real Briefly, you're listening to true crime tonight, We're talking
about the recent development of the ketamine queen who's now
pleading guilty for the final lethal dose of ventanyl that
was distributed to Matthew Perry.

Speaker 7 (20:58):
And that's the conversation. Sorry you afteran no worries. I'm
hoping people are here from them. But if you're just
joining in, welcome and queen. So you know, for me, one,
I don't know how I don't know this woman, But two.

Speaker 4 (21:12):
I don't know how you don't know her either, And
you have your finger on the pulse of Hollywood. You
really do you guys don't know. Doron really is a
pop culture expert, and he comes here once a week,
thank God, to give us all the true crime pop
culture references and discussion points, and we thank you so

(21:33):
much for you.

Speaker 2 (21:34):
I'm really surprised you don't know who she is.

Speaker 5 (21:36):
Well, of course I know she is now and you know,
but again I'm not out and about, you know, wearing
a small little crown on my head like I used
to do in the nightlife world.

Speaker 3 (21:46):
I'll get you a new one.

Speaker 5 (21:51):
Is in terms of the benefits of Kennymine, this is
sort of the next big wave of psychopharmaceuticals. It is
there's extraordinary results for benefits and depression, suicidal ideation, PTSD,
anxiety disorders, chronic pain. I mean, people are really saying
that this microdosed version of this is really something that

(22:11):
is over the next five and ten years, very similar
to the microdosing of mushrooms, the way that they're using
mushrooms to microdose and that whole world and even ayahuasca
to some extent, So this is the next wave of that. However,
where this went awry is the question of how many
hands did the lethal dose go through and who's really

(22:31):
held responsible.

Speaker 2 (22:32):
And I think this is giving fifty vials of an
illegal drug getting top dollar for it. That is illegal,
And that's why we're talking about it because on that level,
it's a crime knowing.

Speaker 5 (22:44):
But is it aco crime. It's a drug, it's a
drug trafficking crime. It's a sales and distribution crime. But
when you when you, I mean, you have to then
question every other celebrity murder. And let's not even take
it out of the celebrity. It's it's the everyday person
on the street that gets it from their doctor, that
gets it from their nurse, that's that that gets it
from that steals it from their mother or their grandmother's

(23:06):
you know, medicine cabinet. At what point does personal responsibility
is lost? And I'm not trying to blame the addict
or the victim, but I am saying that when it
comes to drug addiction and drug abuse and overdose deaths,
we're open, We're going down a very slippery slope. And
if I circle back to the pop culture of it all,

(23:26):
it's sort of like, who's the most famous drug overdose
that you would think of? And what comes into my
mind is immediately Marilyn Monroe, you.

Speaker 2 (23:32):
Know, Michael Jackson, Phoenix.

Speaker 5 (23:35):
Yeah, No, I mean I mean Anna, Nicole Smith, Oh yeah,
you know, Jim Belushi.

Speaker 2 (23:41):
Yeah, they're all tragedies.

Speaker 5 (23:43):
Correct. Sorry, But do we now have to like sort
of go back in time or is this going to
change the pattern? Now from a law and legal perspective, great,
take down the distributors, Yeah, take.

Speaker 2 (23:58):
Down the rings if in fact that's the case. And
we've heard this even from Kelly Osbourne, who's spoken out
pretty actively about you know, rehabilitation centers being real hotbeds
for creeps who are looking to get people addicted to drugs.
They use those centers to pedal drugs to the very
people who a maybe have some money in their pocket

(24:19):
because they're there and some of these places are very
expensive and they're vulnerable. And in this case, was she
involved with.

Speaker 3 (24:27):
Any other kind of drugs or just ketamine?

Speaker 2 (24:29):
Who just ketamine? Know all kinds of drugs. And she
had also in a previous case with a young man
also you know in La he was like an up
and coming want to be like fitness instructor, and he too,
you know, she gave him a doseph ketamine.

Speaker 5 (24:46):
And you know you're talking about you're talking about queen
correct we circle back.

Speaker 2 (24:52):
Yeah, I just was wondering, No, no.

Speaker 5 (24:53):
You're right body to ask that question. But she's affiliated
with every drug, methamphetamine, cocaine. So that's where I to
think of her more as a queen pin right, rather
than you know, and unfortunately, look, you guys are right.
She was affiliated with another death, Cody McLaury in twenty nineteen,
who also died of a ketamine overdose. And he was

(25:15):
somebody that was supposedly a beautiful soul. He was a
fitness trainer. He had just moved to Hollywood with a
Hollywood dream. He was not a celebrity, but he or
an actor, but he was hoping to become one. And
what's nuts about this is that Kimberly his sister. She
had then called and confronted jazz Vine. What and I've
got something about her text messages when we return.

Speaker 3 (25:34):
Oh well that was a good tease.

Speaker 2 (25:36):
You're all right now? Goodness? Look at this? Yeah, take
us to the close, baby, we'll stay with us. Coming
up next, we're going to have what Deron was talking
about and an exclusive look at the Idaho student murder
season three, the Idaho Massacre.

Speaker 3 (25:50):
Keep it right here, True Crime Tonight.

Speaker 2 (26:02):
Welcome back to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking
true crime all the time. I'm Stephanie here with Body
and Courtney's out for the evening. But pop culture expert
Toronto Fear is here discussing this recent development with the
Matthew Perry overdose on ketamine. The air quotes ketamine Queen

(26:22):
has agreed to lead guilty to all charges and really
she fed him the lethal dose of ketamine that allegedly
killed him. So, Doro and I know you were finishing
up your thought, but now that we're back, go ahead.

Speaker 5 (26:35):
I was talking about justice for Cody, who was the
original victim of twenty nineteen. And you know what was
interesting about that was that when his sister, Kimberly, had
obtained his phone, she had turned over these text messages
between her passed away brother and Jasmine and then she
confronted Jazzbine about it. And now in this current case,
those text messages just have come back and she the

(26:59):
investigators just saying that she googled after receiving those text messages,
can ketamine be listed as a cause of death?

Speaker 2 (27:05):
Oh, so she knew.

Speaker 5 (27:08):
And that's where justice for Cody is now. And there
was just recently somebody asked for a vintigation like it's
it's vindication to Kimberly, and she said, it's just regret
and that if they would have listened to them back
then maybe Matthew could have been spared.

Speaker 2 (27:21):
And ultimately tragedy.

Speaker 5 (27:23):
And ultimately Singa has now admitted saying I am guilty
of the charges. So she acknowledges this, Yeah, acknowledges it.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
And if you know, convicted for all counts, she's looking
at maybe up to sixty five years in prison.

Speaker 5 (27:38):
Along with with Kenneth Awamasa and Perry.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yeah, it has a little bit of the Michael Jackson
a little bit all right, the pope offal and a
doctor prescribing something that you know was lethal. Because you know, Baddie,
you were saying this in the break, it's because sometimes
people can't say no, right.

Speaker 5 (28:00):
You know. But doctor dear Boss, Well, but doctor Conrad Murray,
who's the doctor of the Michael Jackson case. You know,
he was convicted, but he was convicted of involuntary manslaughter. Right,
So with this case, she is a supplier, you know,
sort of the godmother of drugs, I guess if you
want to call it. And you know, and she's as
a drug dealer. I mean, you could already see the

(28:21):
miniseries coming, you know, kind of me Queen of Hollywood,
but which I'll watch on you know, Ryan Murphy Special.
But here it comes, and you know these stories even
Prince in twenty sixteen when he dies of his overdose
of ketamine, the question was where did he get it,
who supplied it, and who's culpable And this is a
bigger question we should follow moving forward.

Speaker 2 (28:43):
Yeah, we just are seeing this real time, you know,
during a case we covered you know, we've covered this
a few times with Joseph Scott Morgan, the forensics expert.
You know, he's the one who's kind of trained us
to know in many of these drug panels that are
done on an autopsy, if you're not asking for specific things,
ketamine is just not on the regular panel either. So
something to be aware of. We're seeing this, you know,

(29:04):
toxicology panel be a big deal, even in that mon
talk story that we were talking about the other night.
So it's important stuff, and it's important stuff for us
just to be at least looking at.

Speaker 5 (29:14):
It's time to look at enablers, you know, who were
the enablers that caused these deaths?

Speaker 2 (29:19):
And it also brings factor It also brings me up.

Speaker 5 (29:21):
To Anonicle Smith. That makes me think about that becauselers
they conspired with.

Speaker 2 (29:26):
Howard Stern yep, the lawyer. The lawyer, we should talk
more about that one as well.

Speaker 5 (29:31):
So and the psychiatrist, both of them, that's true.

Speaker 3 (29:34):
The psychiatrist too, right, gave her jugs of it.

Speaker 2 (29:37):
Although a Nicole's daughter turned out so she's so lowly.
Have you seen her in her little interviews and her
dress wearing the dress, Oh, the dress was so beautiful
and the dad is so devoted so sweet. I know,
I know, I really like the image of her little face.

Speaker 8 (29:52):
I know.

Speaker 2 (29:53):
And then yeah, I love happy endings for her tragic loss.

Speaker 3 (29:58):
So sad I was really said when she died?

Speaker 5 (30:00):
I was?

Speaker 9 (30:01):
I was.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
I understand.

Speaker 3 (30:03):
We have a talkback. Can we hear the.

Speaker 10 (30:04):
Talk about Hey, this is Steve from Vegas. I'm wondering
now that the Coburger docs have dropped and there's so
much information about him being a complete whack job, why
he wasn't immediately suspected and also is that why the
cops tailed him and his father? Thanks?

Speaker 3 (30:25):
Good question, such a great question. Thank you for the talkback.

Speaker 2 (30:28):
Steve.

Speaker 3 (30:29):
You know, we don't know, you know, don't We don't
know those things.

Speaker 4 (30:33):
So the only thing that we have right now are
the police reports when so like something happens and they
make a report, right, we don't have any of like
the real investigative documents, like the filings, the findings.

Speaker 3 (30:45):
Right, we don't. We just don't know.

Speaker 11 (30:47):
Now.

Speaker 4 (30:48):
We do know that there were thirteen formal complaints made
by WSU faculty and students, and that he was eventually fired,
but he was fined like after the murders.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
It's all but a lot of the stuff leading up.

Speaker 3 (31:04):
To the murders were what we people were complaining about, right,
because after the murders he seemed like fine, So a
lot of the complaints were pre murder. But he didn't
get fired until after anyway, so we don't know.

Speaker 2 (31:18):
Well that's to tell, right, Like there were rumblings about him,
and I think too, you know, great question, because really
there were a lot of red flags, many many, many
documented red flags along the way. And again some of
this is all in hindsight, right, but it's important stuff.
And yeah, I do think personally this is based on
my personal opinion only that yeah, the cops were tracking him.

(31:42):
This guy was displaying such psychotic behavior, the kind that
you see in movies. Honestly, Yeah, no, for real.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
I mean this is like the stuff of nightmares his behavior, right, but.

Speaker 5 (31:52):
Not only not to think that now we know what
we know and after his admission, right exactly, the fact
that even people questioned it leading up to this is
a real tragedy, exactly.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
And by the way, I was one of those people.
By the way, doron, we haven't spoken about this and
he has you know, we now know on his phone,
meaning the killer Brian Coburger on his cell phone.

Speaker 3 (32:14):
He was on Christmas Day. This guy was obsessed.

Speaker 2 (32:17):
Go ahead, go ahead, take it, boyd it Ron, I
have been dying to tell you this. I'm edge of
your seemed you're gonna die. He seemed pretty obsessed with
Guess who, Guess who who? The Gainesville Ripper? Yeah? No, yes,
he was like really down a rabbit hole on him.
And I know that's the case you presented to you

(32:37):
talking about, Like, how come we don't talk about that
one too much? Well, apparently, Brian Coburger, we now know
amongst the other twenty serial killers that he was researching
on Christmas Day, Dan had a personal, a real, real
extra fascination with.

Speaker 5 (32:55):
Jaws.

Speaker 4 (32:56):
Can you tell people about Danny briefly the people familiar
with that, because it's important.

Speaker 5 (33:02):
Look, it's one of the most tragic cases in serial
killer history. And not only that, it is the one
that to me makes my skin crawl and gives me
chills every day because he did it as performance, and
almost no other serial killers did it like that. Danny
Rollins killed sorority girls in an apartment, set them up
like puppets, strung them in the window, and did it

(33:25):
as a photo shoot, and so that when people walked by.

Speaker 2 (33:29):
By the way, a k bar, Yeah, with a K bar,
which is we now know likely the inspiration. You know, again,
this is a leap, not a fact. But let's just
connect that dot. Why that knife? We could ask that
question so many times, possibly because it was Danny Rollins. Wow.

Speaker 3 (33:48):
I mean, I've been just dying to tell you that I.

Speaker 5 (33:50):
Can't believe it, you know, because I I just thought
that it was. It was eerily similar, you know, especially
the whole Sorority killings, and you know Danny Rollins and
his fascination with horror of the eighties, Light Black Christmas
and you know those kind of movies. It this just
made my skin, my blood go cold.

Speaker 3 (34:08):
I knew it was.

Speaker 4 (34:09):
I was like when I I think I texted Stephanie
and Ellis.

Speaker 2 (34:12):
We were like, oh, oh my goodness. I mean now
I believe it.

Speaker 4 (34:15):
So so we know this now, we know this now,
and it's you know, a red flag. He had downloaded
multiple he clicked on the link multiple times basically on Christmas,
on Christmas and and by the way, prior to the
murders as well.

Speaker 5 (34:32):
I mean, this is really nuts because you know those
crimes happened in August of nineteen ninety, so you're talking,
you know, what is a twenty five years later, and
you know he and by the way, by the way, my.

Speaker 4 (34:43):
Mathe I know, it seems impossible that nineteen ninety was
like thirty five years ago.

Speaker 2 (34:48):
I just graduated high school.

Speaker 3 (34:51):
And what the heck, guys, you quit it, quit it.

Speaker 2 (34:53):
You're perfect and you're so young.

Speaker 5 (34:55):
And think about this for a second. Rawlings murdered five
college students. He murdered four women and one man, which
is eerily similar, early similar, But I guess the difference
is is he didn't just kill them. He mutilated and
post them.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
He did, and that might have been the next step
for this sicko. You know, like Brian Coburger, we now
know is a total, absolute maniac, regardless of how he
was raised, regardless of the opportunities he had. This is
a maniac by his own admission. So yeah, he was
getting little nods from all kinds of places.

Speaker 5 (35:30):
Do we know if it he this is his only killing.

Speaker 2 (35:36):
Well, we know he's got some like spooky, creepy, like
very annoying things. He's been a creep Go ahead, But
I didn't mean to cut you off. But yeah, totally creepy.

Speaker 5 (35:45):
Well because remember that Danny Rollins. Also after he was
arrested and everything else. Later they found out that evidence
tied Danny Rollins to a triple homicide in Shreeve Fort,
Louisiana in nineteen eighty nine. So he had a like
a predilection. So now my worry is that Brian Coburger,
this was his first of what could have been many,
so luckily and the grace of the courts have put

(36:08):
him away at his own self admission, obviously, but I
worry that there might suddenly be something else.

Speaker 4 (36:13):
That might and there might be now he was investigated.
There was a grand jury inquiry into his possible involvement
of a murder or a missing person murder in Pennsylvania,
but he was eventually he was cleared. I'm sure now
that they have his DNA obviously they obviously we have
his DNA's in prison, but I'm sure they're running it.

Speaker 3 (36:35):
I'm sure, I'm sure they have for other states, you know,
like you know, in Jersey.

Speaker 4 (36:40):
Probably New York, probably Ohio, probably Pennsylvania obviously, you know,
the surrounding states.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
It is an escalation, like even when we started, you know,
the Idaho Massacre. Season three drops today on or dropped
earlier on the iHeartRadio.

Speaker 3 (36:57):
App as well the podcast. You'll check it out.

Speaker 2 (37:01):
Yeah, like when we started that at season one, it
seemed impossible to imagine that this guy did it. He
seemed like he was the outcast. And you know, I
thought people were piling on and jumping to conclusions too quickly.
And what a joke.

Speaker 3 (37:16):
Yeah, I mean he is, well, he is a joke.

Speaker 5 (37:18):
By the way, I don't trust anybody with a long
neck and a large atoms apple.

Speaker 2 (37:23):
Really is that something to look out for.

Speaker 5 (37:27):
I think it's I think it's a trade. I'm not
an expert in this, but you know, hey.

Speaker 3 (37:32):
I didn't want to hear it. Yeah, I didn't want
to hear from anybody with large atams.

Speaker 2 (37:36):
And listen, the good news is that Brian Coburger is
having a really hard go of it behind bars. He
surely know minute to minute, it's just getting harder and
harder for this creep to survive all the noise. It's
maddening they're being unkind to him. What do we want
for our Brian Coburger? I mean, what a joke?

Speaker 3 (37:56):
Right, And you know.

Speaker 4 (37:57):
And in the next in the you know coming up,
I'm going to be telling you some of the complaints
he's been making.

Speaker 3 (38:03):
He made formal complaints coming.

Speaker 5 (38:06):
From a narcissist. He thought he was going to go
to prison, and he was going to get love letters
and he was going to you know, get women's like
underwear sent to him. That's what he thought was going
to happen. And I'm glad that he is in a
maximum security prison. I'm glad that he's in a period but.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
Cell with one hour of daylight alone, Mammy too exact
coming in here here coming up, I'm going to be
filling you in on those complaints that he's making in prison.

Speaker 4 (38:32):
And Justin Baldoni just won't quit. His co star is
speaking out about alleged legal harassment.

Speaker 2 (38:39):
We are talking about the Kenemine Queen and her recent
plea for guilt. She's now pled guilty for the lethal
dose that killed Matthew Perry, the friend star, which is
which is so sad first and foremost, and also now
where Idaho, you know, we want to be talking about
that in a lot more depth. We have the Idaho

(39:00):
Massacre podcast also dropping tonight, season three, and yeah, we
have a talkback now.

Speaker 12 (39:08):
Oh, hey, guys, I love the show and I was
actually curious. Have you guys heard about the Department of
Justice worker who got charged for a felony of soul
after he threw a sandwich at an official.

Speaker 2 (39:20):
Yes, I did hear this.

Speaker 5 (39:23):
That's the viral meme that it's the gift that keeps
on giving. It is, he's a pair of He's in
a pair of khaki shorts and yelling at some sort
of an officer and wings the subway sandwich at him
and then books away and his loafers, and they tackled him.
But I only watched it. I only watched the takedown
because I'm on.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
Those like videos.

Speaker 5 (39:43):
So I don't know the backstory. I don't know why
he was doing I do.

Speaker 2 (39:47):
Let's hear it. Let's hear it.

Speaker 4 (39:48):
Well, I don't know the whole backstory, but we knew
that the National Guard has been deployed to Washington, d C.
And that you know, Trump is saying there's a lot
of crime there and they need these National Guard people
there because of all crime. Right, Well, a Department of
Justice employee. I don't know if this guy was getting
harassed because it is being reported that people are being harassed.

Speaker 3 (40:08):
Okay, but I don't know if it's true. Understand, this
Department of Justice employee had a confrontation with one of
the officers, and you know, he literally had a sandwich
in his said, just threw it. After what.

Speaker 2 (40:19):
Now he's getting charged the felony.

Speaker 5 (40:22):
It's all viral.

Speaker 2 (40:23):
You should not throw a subway sandwich at law enforcement.
Is that a felony? Come on?

Speaker 5 (40:30):
Yes? Why because it was soft and smushy? Yes, well
the way siland by the way, I thought he was
yuppified like crazy and whatever that polo shirt whether he
was wearing, and those those khaki shorts and honestly boat shoes,
and so I'm watching this guy like in his face, like, Okay,
here's the deal. Whatever you think about law enforcement, whatever
you think about governmental sort of like law things, it

(40:53):
is a little bit of a yes sir, no, sir,
sorry sir kind of situation. To get yourself out of it.
If you're pulled over regards whether you were doing nothing,
the first thing to do is not to say I
wasn't doing anything, and who were you to pull me over?
You're making me late to work, right, You're just you're
just opening up a box of trouble. So whatever the
reason was, that guy was in his face and he

(41:15):
wong he like, he literally winged that sandwich. And it
was funny because he you you gotta look it up.
It's all over the internet. It has gone crazy by it.
He wings that sandwich, turns around and runs he like books,
and they set the enforcement whatever they were stood there
for a second and then went in a full chase,

(41:36):
and the people filming it, you know, filming it whatever
bystander happened to have seen it, get him, take him down,
and they tackled that boy.

Speaker 3 (41:47):
They did.

Speaker 5 (41:48):
Oh yeah, And then it turns out that he worked
for the Justice Department.

Speaker 2 (41:51):
And now he's wait, the boy, diddy sandwich thrower works
for the government.

Speaker 5 (41:58):
Yeah, for the Department of.

Speaker 2 (42:00):
This he's a Department of Justice employee.

Speaker 5 (42:02):
No, BANDI was like, oh no, you.

Speaker 2 (42:06):
Don't get oh Pan's head enough.

Speaker 3 (42:10):
I think this could be a distraction. Okay, this could be.

Speaker 2 (42:12):
This is a distraction. Don't get me started. This is
a distraction. We all know it. This is topic.

Speaker 3 (42:19):
This is the crime.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
Nation is protecting us from sandwich throwers exactly exactly what
this is. Where we are Americas of America.

Speaker 5 (42:30):
You're trying to do something else and the sandwich storers
are getting in the way.

Speaker 2 (42:34):
We'll listen to Ron. You're gonna stick with us, right so, Doronto,
if you're casting, will be joining us in the next hour. Listen.
If you've missed any of the shows so far, no sweat,
you could always catch it this podcast right back after
and we will be right back stay with us. Hey,

(42:57):
so listen, we have Doronto Fear pop culture expert back
with us. We've been talking about all kinds of true
crime cases in this pop culture world, and we're going
to get back to that. But first, Brian Coburger, we
have a little bit of a talk back about that
right now.

Speaker 9 (43:12):
Hello to everyone in the studio.

Speaker 13 (43:14):
This is Julie.

Speaker 9 (43:15):
I have a comment and a question. You had a
talk back last night with a gentleman asking.

Speaker 2 (43:20):
Why you still talk about BK.

Speaker 9 (43:22):
Well, knowledge is power and the more we know, the
more we can avoid crime. Also, I'm wondering if Brian
Coldberger still gets Vegan Mills. I've not heard that mentioned anywhere.
Thank you and you are my favorite podcast.

Speaker 3 (43:36):
Ah, thank that's so nice. I'm so sweet. Knowledge is
power and you know we you know, we do try
to the goal For me, at least in my personal
you know, journey with this stuff is to learn as
much as I can. You know, I'm a single gale,
I live alone, you know what I'm.

Speaker 2 (43:58):
That is not true everybody with lots of security, with
many people holding guns by the roof. I'm just saying
one hypervigilance.

Speaker 4 (44:12):
So yeah, we do try to learn. And second of all,
the vegan meals. So this there's some news. Okay, I
do believe he's getting vegan mills, by the way, No,
he is getting vegan meals.

Speaker 2 (44:22):
This guy.

Speaker 5 (44:22):
Can you in the irony of him wanting a vegan
meal because he wants to Like, you know, animals have
a soul. I agree they do, but not when you're
murdering other things with souls like I think he would
just be like ripping meat off his chink bone, you
know exactly.

Speaker 4 (44:38):
He's a vegan for health reasons, it's not he's he
doesn't give a crap about right, so he can't.

Speaker 5 (44:44):
We'll hear that, do you hear the high pitch of
my tiny violin?

Speaker 4 (44:48):
No, I know, I'm just saying, I'm just letting people know,
like he he has visual snow, and he posted on
a forum when he was a teenager and one of
the suggestions was to change his diet to help with
this visual snow wh hatchment that he was facing, and
exercise and things like that, and so he did those
things and he posted and he said it is helping.

(45:08):
So he's a vegan, not because he cares about animals
or he cares about anybody but himself.

Speaker 5 (45:13):
He's a vegan, apologized to the truth. Honestly, I like,
because you know, I do, I do honor that that
people I know for moral reasons. I just you know,
he gets so under my skin that every time I
hear anything about him, I'm just like, good, Like I
just want to be with pom poms and that little
puff on my sneaker doing high kicks.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
Mm hm. I agree.

Speaker 3 (45:33):
I totally agree. I totally agree. I mean, it's just
the way it is.

Speaker 5 (45:37):
But Julie the callback, Yes, he's still getting vegan meals.

Speaker 4 (45:40):
He's still get as far as I know, he's getting
vegan meals. But my understanding, my understanding is that we
actually have a live caller. Uh can we get the caller?
Anders Hi, Welcome to the show.

Speaker 11 (45:54):
My Anders.

Speaker 8 (45:56):
Hey, guys, are you good?

Speaker 2 (45:57):
Are you glad you called? What's your question?

Speaker 14 (46:01):
I'm good. I So I live in Rhode Island, and
I was curious if you guys heard about the story
of Kylie Monteriro.

Speaker 2 (46:10):
No, no, tell us this Rhode Island story.

Speaker 14 (46:14):
Sure, so she is actually technically Massachusetts story. But her
remains were just found yesterday in her ex boyfriend's backyard.
She was just a teenager. She was allegedly eleven weeks
pregnant or so, and her her body had been missing
all week and they found it in the her ex's backyard.

(46:38):
And he confessed to the surer today.

Speaker 2 (46:40):
He confessed today. Did he give any reason in this confession?

Speaker 14 (46:47):
As far as I can see, there's not much of
a reason. I was curious if you guys would maybe
learn more about it, and yes, the story over the
most couple of days.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
Yeah, you got it.

Speaker 5 (47:00):
What a horrifying tragedy, what a.

Speaker 2 (47:02):
Horrible tragedy, and what a great, you know, piece of information.
You know we'll dig into that and cover tomorrow for sure. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (47:07):
No, thank you for the you for calling in, and
a shout out to Rhode Island, because you know, I'm
from Apple Valley in pascog So just a little hometown
chair to you.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
I thought you were from Long Island. Such a big
personality from such a little state.

Speaker 5 (47:21):
Well that's where my grandma was.

Speaker 2 (47:23):
Yeah, so Doron also spent a lot of time on
Long Island. Yeah, there you go.

Speaker 4 (47:28):
So in relation to Brian Coberger and the vegan meals,
he's been making some complaints okay in prison. So for
a little back history, backstory, Brian Coberger officially was transferred to.

Speaker 3 (47:41):
Uh, the J Block, right, we know that.

Speaker 4 (47:46):
What's his space is there, Chad day Bell and J
Block is kind of like a mixed pod of people.
There's people on death row in J Block. There's people
that need, you know, like segregation from other inmates.

Speaker 2 (47:59):
It's very kind of the worst of the worst. Yeah,
it doesn't get worse. It's as close to being on
death row as you could get.

Speaker 3 (48:07):
Right.

Speaker 4 (48:07):
So he's on Jay Block, and he was transferred to
J Block after his medical hold placement and all that.
But he was transferred on July twenty ninth. Okay, so
that's when he officially entered J Block. The very next day,
on July thirtieth, he submitted his first handwritten request asking
to be moved out of Jay Block, citing harassment and

(48:29):
difficult living conditions. A few days later, on August fourth,
he filed a formal sexual harassment complaint, describing threats from
other inmates. Okay, so do you guys want to know
what he said?

Speaker 2 (48:43):
Yes, we sure do.

Speaker 4 (48:44):
Okay, As I continue the SPP phase, I wish to
discuss if I may be transferred to another ACEG setting
as I'm not engaging in any of the recent flooding
fighting as well as being subject to my current roommate's
verbal threats. I want to make sure that all other
facets part of B Block is an environment that I

(49:04):
wish to transfer it from. If possible, I request transfer
to B Block immediately.

Speaker 3 (49:09):
I wish to speak with you soon, because can.

Speaker 2 (49:14):
You imagine this guy, the nerve of this guy is
complaining about the living conditions after he's murdered by his
own admissions for incredible humans, This guy and now going
to request a special meal and doesn't want to be
in such an uncomfortable position.

Speaker 5 (49:31):
Right Well, I thought he was in solitary. He has
a roommate.

Speaker 4 (49:34):
Is no, he doesn't have a roommate. He's talking about
his like people around him, and he can hear a.

Speaker 5 (49:41):
Joint the cells adjoining whispering.

Speaker 2 (49:44):
Through the vent Exactly. It's those vents that apparently fellow
inmates are all taking turns sort of torturing him by
keeping him awake and talking through the vents.

Speaker 4 (49:54):
So the officer interviewed him, Okay, and it says in
this report that we have it says Lieutenant Maland Molliant
received the concern and conducted an interview with Coberger in
J Block. Coberger stated that a resident that goes by
the name Crew told him I will.

Speaker 3 (50:14):
But f you.

Speaker 5 (50:17):
Coburger.

Speaker 4 (50:18):
Coburger also stated an unknown resident from Tier one of
J block said the only but we're going to be
eating tonight is Coburger's.

Speaker 2 (50:28):
Yeah, that's what's gonna happen. Have you not seen Shank Redemption?

Speaker 5 (50:33):
Okay, I'm going to exactly where I was going to
go with this. I used to be such a fan
of HBO's Oz Scar. The reason, it's the reason why
I've never broken the law because in a jail like
oz and the fact is is that he's so lucky
that he is not in a cell or in g
Pop gen Pop. Because we know what happens to be right,

(50:57):
pop any note.

Speaker 4 (50:58):
Listen, we have decided as the societ though, and I
know it's so easy to be like, oh go, you know,
like he deserves it in you know whatever, But we
have decided as a society that prison is how we
handle these kinds of people, right, that's what that's the
punishment prison. You know, we have to make sure that
we're feeding them, we have to make sure they're safe.

Speaker 3 (51:18):
We have to do those things.

Speaker 4 (51:19):
And you know, I want to tell everybody too, Brian
Coberger is in no danger.

Speaker 2 (51:23):
He's in a pretty good situation all things considered. He
really is.

Speaker 4 (51:26):
So he's in a cell twenty three hours a day
by himself. He gets one hour he's everybody in that
block is escorted in chains. Okay, they should be never
in a moment. There is never a moment where somebody
is going to be able to shank him or you know,
rape him.

Speaker 5 (51:46):
Historically, child abusers, serial killers, they've all been attacked in prison,
and there is sort of a prison justice thing. And
he doesn't seem to realize again because of his narcissistic disorder,
that he is not God. And then he doesn't get
preferable treatments.

Speaker 3 (52:04):
Right, this is.

Speaker 4 (52:05):
Your Cramptonight and iHeart Radio. We were right in the
middle of talking about Brian Cobricker's complaints in prison.

Speaker 3 (52:10):
What do you have to say about it? How do
you feel about it?

Speaker 4 (52:12):
Give us a call eighty to eight thirty one crime
or hit the talkbacks on the iHeartRadio app. There's a
lot of people who feel like, yeah, you know, he
deserves this, and I get listen, I get it.

Speaker 3 (52:22):
But I just I think that's easy.

Speaker 2 (52:24):
I think that's easy to do.

Speaker 4 (52:26):
I think the harder position to take is we shouldn't
really kind of encourage rape of any kind ever ever,
in my opinion. Ever, Okay, and you know we shouldn't.
This is what we've decided as a society that you know,
we live in a civilized society, and this is what
we decided to do with these people is.

Speaker 3 (52:46):
Put him in prison.

Speaker 4 (52:48):
And so it's our you know, as a society, our
responsibility to make sure that that is functional in.

Speaker 2 (52:55):
He deserves a vegan meal because I don't care about
the American way. No, I don't know. I hear you
point taken though you won't. Yeah, that's what there we're
but into that's just one side of me, Okay.

Speaker 4 (53:07):
The other side of me is like, go Peru, good
for you, And I hope that the families of the
victims are sleeping well tonight, knowing that he is suffering.

Speaker 5 (53:16):
Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (53:16):
Like, there's the other side of me too. I'm just saying, like,
you know, I hate to say it, but I feel
like he deserves it.

Speaker 5 (53:25):
So I'm a hye for an eye kind of a person,
and that's.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
A very rare thing.

Speaker 3 (53:29):
I absolutely respect that.

Speaker 4 (53:30):
I absolutely respect both of your opinions because me too.

Speaker 5 (53:36):
I'd like to clarify that statement, because he's self admitted
there was no question I.

Speaker 2 (53:42):
Was trying to prove a medicine for a long time.

Speaker 5 (53:45):
If there was a question that, could he be innocent,
like my god, he If he was, then he doesn't
deserve that. But that is that that question, that that
moral dilemma does not exist here exactly.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
The gloves are off. Let him be hungry, let him
be uncomfortable. Well, he has done unthinkable things and he
now has to do the crime time the end, and
it's not pretty well. In regards to the food and
the talk back, right.

Speaker 4 (54:15):
He also submitted a complaint about that he's and here's
what he said on the thirty first of July. Okay,
I have on several occasions not received all items of
food on my tray. What now, Listen, his handwriting is atrocious.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
It's it's like a serial killer. It's terrible. Like it's
literally the worst I've ever seen in my life. So
it's really hard to read. Okay, So but I'm doing
my best. Okay, in your life. It is literally it's worse.
It's worse than my niece when she was like in kindergarten.
I'm telling you, it's just the worst. It really.

Speaker 4 (54:50):
But basically it boils down to he's missing food from
his tray. And here's what he said. He said, I
wish to, without exception, receive those replacements. So he keeps
getting told basically that oh well, we'll fix it, but
they never do.

Speaker 3 (55:05):
And he's making a complaint.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
Yeah, making away your complaint to mother father like his
mother father range and entitled. I kind of wonder if
mother or father encouraged him, Oh, son, let them know
you're missing your corn bread, Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 5 (55:19):
Like, I think the takeaway here is that the educational
system has failed us, and we need to bring cursive
back into my.

Speaker 2 (55:26):
God Dolan, I was talking about this today.

Speaker 4 (55:28):
Unrelated. My handwriting has gotten so bad. I don't write
anything anymore.

Speaker 3 (55:32):
I don't teach it.

Speaker 5 (55:34):
They don't each they don't you know, big a little a.

Speaker 2 (55:37):
Shut up script.

Speaker 3 (55:41):
I didn't know that.

Speaker 5 (55:42):
I mean from the curriculum.

Speaker 2 (55:45):
Stop it. Oh are you telling me that my niece's
kids won't be able to read like my cards that
I send them.

Speaker 5 (55:52):
They're not going to get that little.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
Card AI, Stop it.

Speaker 5 (55:55):
They're not going to get that. They're not going to
get that little blue book where you have to write
every single letter and then connect to them and then
you draw that one g as like an umbrella, you know,
like they don't learn that anymore.

Speaker 3 (56:06):
I didn't know that.

Speaker 2 (56:07):
That's all rime.

Speaker 4 (56:09):
Stick around. We have more coming up. We're going to
be talking probably about Brian Coberger a little bit more,
because I have a lot more going on my.

Speaker 3 (56:15):
Plate here with about this.

Speaker 2 (56:16):
Keep it right here at True Crime Tonight. We're talking
true crime all the time.

Speaker 3 (56:20):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (56:26):
We have a caller in the line right now, Christy.
Welcome to the show. What's your question?

Speaker 5 (56:31):
Hi, Hi Christy?

Speaker 8 (56:32):
Hello, Hi Christy, Hi, how are you You're great?

Speaker 2 (56:36):
What's your question?

Speaker 8 (56:38):
Okay, I had a question about Triff Steigns that had
walked into the room and killed Judge Bolan. If y'all
had did a podcast on that, and you're welcome, have
a good day. If y'all had did a podcast on that,
and so when because we haven't heard a lot about it, right,
what's going on with it?

Speaker 4 (56:59):
So did we did a couple We did a couple
episodes on it. Why like a month ago? I think, yeah, exactly,
there's been a later there's been a new development. And
by the way, thank you so much for calling Christine.
We really appreciate it.

Speaker 3 (57:10):
Christine.

Speaker 2 (57:11):
Thank you. Good question.

Speaker 4 (57:12):
So my understanding. Brian Investigates on his podcast interviewed a
woman who said that the judge was running like a
sex operation. Yeah, in wings, like behind the scenes, where
he would women that were basically up for sentencing of
some sort that he that he had ProView over. He

(57:34):
would basically bribe them, you know, like I'll reduce your
sentence those kinds of things, not even like no, yeah, listen,
I'm trying to be respectful of These are women that
were suddenly being dragged into.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
Court, whether they were escorts or whether they were on
drug charges and they couldn't afford to make bail. So
this judge and some you know facocta lawyer involved, they
would basically say, hey, if you want to get this
off your record, you must do X, Y and Z.
And really, at the end of the day, it was
a very high level sex trafficking ring and this is common.

(58:09):
We're hearing this again and again.

Speaker 4 (58:10):
I actually put this in the rundown this morning to
talk about today.

Speaker 2 (58:15):
How crazy is that time?

Speaker 4 (58:16):
So maybe we'll maybe we'll cover that tomorrow. But thank
you for the call so much, Christine that we're definitely
interested in that case. And we have another caller, Heather's
on the line. Hi, other Hid, how's it going.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
Hi? I am good.

Speaker 13 (58:31):
I am just calling back with my report on the
Jeffrey Dahmer tour. I went on, Oh.

Speaker 5 (58:35):
Why a prime travel, dark travel experience.

Speaker 2 (58:43):
I want to hear everything late. So this is the
Jeffrey Dahmer tour that you went on under this.

Speaker 13 (58:50):
Dark tourism, right, It's called the Cream City Cannibal Tour
and it was actually it was a super victim focused yea,
that a huge plas Yeah, you learned all about the absolutely,
So you'd stop that, like you'd go down the blocks

(59:10):
of where he actually picked up like seven of the
seventeen victims, and you'd stopped at the bars and you'd
learn all about You'd see pictures of the victims, learn
all about them, their lives, very brief history in the
beginning on him, you know, his childhood, not great, not horrible,

(59:34):
and then it was it's just it was a really
good history lesson on the area and just the community
at the time the day community was very it was new,
and they've kept a lot of that.

Speaker 2 (59:47):
History in that area. Window.

Speaker 8 (59:49):
They're still blacked out at a lot of the bars.

Speaker 13 (59:51):
Really, which was really cool. Yeah, because they would black
them out because people would come by to see and
people would want to hide.

Speaker 2 (59:59):
Wow, from within the bar.

Speaker 3 (01:00:01):
They wanted to hide I see.

Speaker 13 (01:00:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:00:03):
Again, that's part of the LGBT community because.

Speaker 2 (01:00:06):
We're very right wow, especially that in that time.

Speaker 5 (01:00:10):
It hasn't really changed, to be honest, right well.

Speaker 3 (01:00:13):
Right well to that end though, in the ignorance, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:18):
The straight ignorance and also but being on a tour
like that where you're actually like in the in the
space you're taking the last steps kind of in your
head seeing the placement of sort of how some of
these crimes could have been. That must be pretty haunting
a little bit.

Speaker 13 (01:00:35):
Yeah, and it was a dark it was like a
rainy day too, so you're like, did you enjoy it?

Speaker 2 (01:00:40):
Tho?

Speaker 8 (01:00:41):
So just how people it was.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
It was really in the neighborhood.

Speaker 13 (01:00:46):
It's this Waker's Point neighborhood in downtown Milwaukee. The bar
that's held out of is it was originally owned by.

Speaker 2 (01:00:54):
The Capone brothers.

Speaker 13 (01:00:55):
Oh and it's built on the seventeen hundred cemetery, so
the bar itself is haunted.

Speaker 2 (01:01:02):
Heather, all your choices, this is a crime on a crime.
By the way, Boddy, you just went on vacation and
watched you know, red Brian Colberger documents all weekend.

Speaker 5 (01:01:12):
So you shouldn't have to talk, Heather. Let's talk for us.
Why did you choose to do this.

Speaker 2 (01:01:18):
For to be because it's probably expensive, Heather, it was
fifty dollars. Why.

Speaker 13 (01:01:26):
Okay, so ill a little history. I'm fifty two.

Speaker 14 (01:01:30):
I would see each other crime fanatic.

Speaker 13 (01:01:32):
Before true crime, before it was cool and high school.

Speaker 5 (01:01:38):
And rule books.

Speaker 2 (01:01:39):
Heather, we would be best friendly.

Speaker 5 (01:01:43):
We were feral we were feral children, and we know
how to.

Speaker 2 (01:01:46):
Survive exactly correct.

Speaker 13 (01:01:49):
And so I was nineteen when this started happening, and
we were going and I lived right on the border
of Wisconsin and Chicago, like the Illinois border, so we
would go to Walkee all the time. So this consumed us.
This like you'd be watching The Price is Right, and
all of a sudden it was another brain found.

Speaker 4 (01:02:09):
Like, well, I grew up in north where the talker
was killing people, so I get it. And we're the
same age, so you know, like, yeah, I get it,
I totally And.

Speaker 13 (01:02:17):
We didn't have internet.

Speaker 2 (01:02:19):
Yeah, we had to buy the paper.

Speaker 13 (01:02:23):
I think it always kind of was an inter right,
and you didn't know. You only knew what they wanted
to tell you. No one at that time wanted to
paint the police as terrible as they were. I didn't
actually understand all of that until Ryan Murphy's show came
out how terrible it was handled.

Speaker 14 (01:02:42):
And so on this tour they talked.

Speaker 13 (01:02:44):
A little bit like when these men were going missing people,
he would sit in a telephone booth, and when you'd
walk into telephone booths back then, if they would light up,
he would sit in there for two or three hours
a night hunting these streets, and this woman kept calling saying,
the same man is in this telephone booth night after night.

(01:03:05):
You should check into it, and no one ever did.

Speaker 11 (01:03:07):
Wow.

Speaker 5 (01:03:09):
I have a thought about that, unfortunately, and that is
that LGBT prime is usually on the bottom of the
of the of the must prosecute and must investigate. And
because these gay men were disappearing, they attributed it to
awe poor them, or they ran away, or they disappeared,
or this is common. Just like the one victim that

(01:03:31):
actually escaped Dahmer and ran to the police naked, collapsed
in front of the police officer and then he escorted
him back to Jeffrey and gave him back to him
where eventually he was murdered. That tells you that they
thought it was an ick factor and that this was
some sort of gay king.

Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
And they disregarded human period. And yeah, that was a fact.
And now that tour does that still exist, Heather, or
is this that? Yeah, it's very recent.

Speaker 13 (01:04:02):
Just did it two weeks ago?

Speaker 3 (01:04:04):
I remember she that was the.

Speaker 2 (01:04:06):
Night that I was gone. But I heard about it afterward,
and then I was asked to vote if I would
go on a dark tour, which I have versions of.
So I'm with you, Heather, and I understand it.

Speaker 5 (01:04:18):
Can I ask you, Heather about the others on your tour?
They were they respectful? Like did you eyeball every one
of them? And was like you're a future something.

Speaker 4 (01:04:28):
By the way, is wearing his Jeffrey, I'm sorry, didn't
mean to talk.

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
Oh, no, you're good.

Speaker 13 (01:04:37):
It was it was very like there was only four
of us on the tour, and then our tour guide
it was it's summer, so it's hot and a lot
of people don't want to do a walking tour and
eight degrees in.

Speaker 2 (01:04:49):
The rain no less.

Speaker 5 (01:04:53):
Okay, but was there anybody that was being disrespectful doing
a TikTok as they tried to strangle each other in
front of a bar.

Speaker 13 (01:05:01):
No, but there were bars we could not go right
in front of because they don't want to be associated
with this tour. I wouldn't like we'd have to stand
two doors away. Yeah, and it just and honestly so
Tracy Edwards is who escaped, and honestly, if it had
not been found, he would have worked in those hands

(01:05:26):
that would have ended. Yeah, they would have to go
to get the key for his handcuffs and they found
the pictures.

Speaker 2 (01:05:35):
Your audio is breaking up a little bit, but it's
like so on point if you want to hit us back.
But yeah, thank you for calling Heather. We are that
is a very thin insective. And yes, Deron is wearing
the the you know, the Jeffrey Dahmer wrap by design.
Oh my goodness, all these fans around me.

Speaker 5 (01:05:56):
It's a late seventies classic. It's just aesthetic, you know,
heyas I you know, I'm glad that you explained why
you did it and that you did it because you
experienced it from a personal consstive and that it wasn't
from a place of disrespect. So thank you for sharing
that with us, because you know, we go a little

(01:06:17):
awry over here and make all sorts of judgments and sometimes,
like especially me, that I don't need to do.

Speaker 4 (01:06:22):
So I give you some props, no, and I appreciate
the insight. Like you know, Heather is my new best friend,
and you know we're the same age and we both
experienced I know you in your neighborhoods. You know, Richard Ramirez,
I grew I lived in Mission Viejo and Richard Ramirez
attacked in people in my neighborhood.

Speaker 5 (01:06:42):
And by the way, our generation is traumatized by this.
I remember in the late seventies and when the Son
of Sam thing was happening that my sister, my mother
was so crazy that you know she could be next,
that they dyed her hair blonde because he was going after.

Speaker 2 (01:06:56):
Yes, yes, we've heard mom, I'm strong. Was her mother's
belly Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:07:02):
In Queens during this time, Yes, And she was telling
us about how scary it was for her mom when
the Son of Sam was out hunting in that area
and the power went out and it was hot as hell,
and you know, and everybody was.

Speaker 5 (01:07:14):
Like, my sister's hair bloond. She peroxided.

Speaker 4 (01:07:18):
I believe it, No, I totally believe it. With Richard Mirrors,
it was initially came out that he was only attacking
people in yellow houses and so people were literally painting
their houses in my neighborhood blue.

Speaker 2 (01:07:31):
Wow. That ended up not really being accurate. It did not,
It was not true, but it was.

Speaker 3 (01:07:36):
It was kind of like an o press initially that
he's you know, the the people are that live in
yellow houses are basically at risk.

Speaker 5 (01:07:44):
And body He also stayed at the Cecile Hotel and
down he dead.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
Have you ever stayed there?

Speaker 3 (01:07:49):
I've stayed there, Absolutely not.

Speaker 5 (01:07:52):
I don't want to bring in to stay there.

Speaker 4 (01:07:54):
It wasn't on purpose, but it was for sure haunted.
But I was like twenty, this was ninety years ago.

Speaker 2 (01:08:01):
We were we were partying it right now, like it's
just a thing, like we just ended up there.

Speaker 3 (01:08:06):
It was like, oh my god, the Cecil Hotel.

Speaker 4 (01:08:08):
It was like the cheapest place on the block, you
know what I mean, And that's where we ended up.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
Did you watch that documentary? By the way, guys, I
don't even want to cut anybody off here, but we
have big developments in the dock naming coming up soon.
What are we going to be calling our streaming show,
our little streaming club? I should say this is true
crime tonight. We'll be right back and listen. It is

(01:08:39):
the moment so many of us has been waiting for.
The calls have been wild. We have finally have the
contenders for our streaming club. What documentary are we gonna watch?
We're always talking about decrimentaries. We were just talking about
the Cecil Club. But when that one downtown, this haunted hotel, honestly,

(01:09:00):
this is.

Speaker 5 (01:09:00):
Going to be a big favorite.

Speaker 2 (01:09:01):
It's a big deal. We're divided. I don't know that
we're a united front on this.

Speaker 3 (01:09:05):
I don't think we are.

Speaker 2 (01:09:06):
Are we going to hear it in a bar fight?

Speaker 5 (01:09:08):
I could tell you that we have. We have received
hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of requests based on last
week's poll, the top four. So I'm going to get
right into it. This is my moment of like, wait.

Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
Was doing You're doing it now? Okay, go go, go ahead,
take it away. Yes, wait a minute, you get a
drum roll? Were girls not yet?

Speaker 3 (01:09:29):
Okay?

Speaker 2 (01:09:32):
It's everyone knows.

Speaker 5 (01:09:33):
These are the titles of our documentary clubs.

Speaker 2 (01:09:36):
So these are the four best options that have been
decided upon.

Speaker 5 (01:09:40):
And the final name and what we're calling our new
watch club where we're going to give you, guys the
title of the show we're going to watch and then
weekly we're going to lay the episode out. Then we're
going to talk about it with you. What so full
Interactive book Club in video for I'm.

Speaker 2 (01:09:55):
Excited, Oh my goodness, with that kind of a lead
in edge of our seats.

Speaker 5 (01:10:00):
In fourth place that did not get it, but I
love this one was murder they watched.

Speaker 2 (01:10:06):
Okay, that was a cute one. We were all going
to be on our bicycle solving murders and watching them.

Speaker 5 (01:10:12):
In third place solved Stephanie, I'm sorry to tell you,
but Prime Watchman third Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:10:18):
I knew I saw the writing on the wall on
that one based on your horribly luke warm reactions Live,
so this is not a huge surprise to me. I'm
glad I made it to the top three.

Speaker 5 (01:10:28):
Yep, and in second place. The Killer Watch Party didn't
quite make the cut. What one w P didn't happen,
but I could tell you the new name of the
watch is Crime and Chill.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
True Crime and Chill. Is that Convetti falling from the sky,
I think forever a visa. Yes, this is amazing, open
and chill.

Speaker 5 (01:11:00):
Portion I like it.

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
That's more like on Ice. I'm I'm.

Speaker 5 (01:11:08):
By the way watch.

Speaker 4 (01:11:11):
So for true Criminal Chill, I'm going to recommend that
we watch one of two that I'm going to recommend.
Amy Bradley is missing, obviously, because that's the one I
wanted to watch together to begin with.

Speaker 2 (01:11:23):
Kind of the origin, kind of the origin, and I
still hope I finished it because I've been waiting those
whole time. Okay, And you know, my my inbox is
full of people literally, I'm not even kidding. And my
comment sections are full of people asking me, have you
watched it? If you watch it, if you watch it?

Speaker 3 (01:11:39):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:11:39):
So that's number one and number two is the Son
of Sam Tapes.

Speaker 3 (01:11:42):
Those are my two.

Speaker 15 (01:11:43):
Suggestions, kind of leaning towards one body, I'm with you,
I'm still Amy's missing and more Amy.

Speaker 5 (01:11:51):
Yeah, donnything, I.

Speaker 4 (01:11:53):
Just didn't the only problem with with the Amy Bradley
one is it's time has passed and people are not
really interested in anymore.

Speaker 5 (01:12:00):
But also many people have actually watched it, which is
fine because the whole point of this watch club. I
don't really like this everybody to talk about it. It's
for everyone, it's for us to be excited about the
next episode a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:12:12):
I'm talking about it for weeks, I feel because people
have been gone and we haven't been able to Oh
my goodness, have we still not figured this out?

Speaker 5 (01:12:20):
Well? Remember it was even very mad.

Speaker 2 (01:12:22):
We're fine, Okay, we're fine. What recommendation go ahead to Ron,
you're up next?

Speaker 5 (01:12:28):
Well, for whatever we're going to do. I haven't seen
any of them so I'm excited to like have my homework,
watch my episode, think about all of the questions I've got,
and then either call in on the day that we're
doing it or be here for it.

Speaker 2 (01:12:40):
Are you on Wednesdays?

Speaker 5 (01:12:41):
I'm a fan of Oh, I love that. I'm a
fan of the Son of Sam tapes because it's not
released yet, so we have no spoilers.

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
Right, I'm with that. All right, Well, then I guess
this might be where we are unanimous, because I was
going to say the Son of Sam tapes too, And
the reason being is all the one as you guys
just discussed. It was a New York story kind of
you know, folklore where I was coming up and Courtney
Armstrong's mom was pregnant with her during the summer of

(01:13:10):
Sam in Queens the way in Queens, New York. I
feel like we need to know more and it's not
spoiled yet because I haven't heard any feedback about it.

Speaker 5 (01:13:21):
All right, can I change my opinion?

Speaker 15 (01:13:23):
Then yes, Son of Sam and then body, we're going
to have a private club.

Speaker 2 (01:13:29):
I want to come to you with the anti amy,
but we can have. But that's a grandfathered in also
secondary conversation so we can double up if you've already
watched it. This is a ridiculous conversation. But if you
already watched it, we'll have tuned.

Speaker 5 (01:13:45):
Okay, But I just want to make sure that we're
talking about the same thing. It's conversations with a killer,
the son of sand tapes. Is that what we're watching?

Speaker 3 (01:13:51):
I think.

Speaker 5 (01:13:53):
So for everyone that's curious, it's on Netflix. I see
three episodes. It might be the first three that are available.
The whole thing might just be three. And this is
a trial run to see how you guys, our listeners
want to play along with us and interact with us
and get excited to watch it with us.

Speaker 3 (01:14:07):
That's right.

Speaker 2 (01:14:08):
So then we'll we're here on Wednesdays to discuss it.
So that's right. That was so great. Yeah, well done, everybody,
great participation, everybody, crime clus This.

Speaker 4 (01:14:18):
Was kind of like my little baby. So I really
appreciate everybody, you know, I don't know, just thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:14:26):
Yeah, you're welcome to take about take about and the
curtsy and all. In my mind's eye there's like a
disco strobe light, you know, dancing around right now and
all of the.

Speaker 5 (01:14:36):
I just want to give a warning about this though,
because these are the actual his actual confessions on tape,
so we're going to hear his voice and you know,
let's just gave David Berkowitz. Let's know what this this
first season is going to be like The Confessions, and
it's been a modern day uptake on it. So exciting
and Netflix, you should be sponsoring our show.

Speaker 4 (01:14:57):
Yes, the Netflix. Actually hello, we're frying reach out. But
speaking of releases and whatnot, Idaho Massacre podcast.

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
Yes, dropped today and we're really proud of it. Thank
you for mentioning. I hope you guys will listen Katie Studios.
It is season three. You know, we've all we're all
on it, and you know, such great experts and some
unique access. I mean, listen. The intention initially was to
be alongside the trial, right, and once he confessed it

(01:15:30):
just honestly, the gloves are off, right and it is
really a deep dive into all of this new information
we know, but also revisiting some of the family and
his current prison conditions, all of the things. We had
talked about this briefly last night. I can't get it
out of my head today for some reason. But just
the idea we have we're speaking to this. For example,

(01:15:50):
the Washington State University police chief so interviewed Coburger maybe
about six months prior to the murders, because Coburger wanted
to be in the police force, and he was like, no,
this guy's too weird, creepy, hard, No, would not allow
this PhD student to study under him, even as like

(01:16:11):
an air quotes intern cut. Two months later, he then
becomes the chief of police at the university and knows
the guy that two months later, you know, obviously does
what he does. It's an interesting side of law enforcement
that we're seeing for the first time, goodbad, all of
the above, you know, from all sides, and also the outrage.

(01:16:33):
Now that we're seeing all of these documents, it really
is painting a scarier picture than I think we've even imagined.

Speaker 5 (01:16:41):
When does the third season drop stuff?

Speaker 2 (01:16:43):
Today?

Speaker 3 (01:16:44):
I listened to the episode. I listened to episode one,
and I have to tell you there were some great
guests you had. Me and Jeanette.

Speaker 4 (01:16:52):
She's wonderful, she's such a great, greatest power Blum. Of course,
I heard in Steve.

Speaker 2 (01:16:58):
Yep Gonzioky Gonzalez Ish, I heard him. We love Jerry.

Speaker 4 (01:17:05):
You've thought You've had a lot of really interesting guests,
which is it provides a really well rounded picture of
what's happened so far, right, Like, I mean, that was
my impression just from the first episode that I listened
to today.

Speaker 2 (01:17:17):
Well, it's pretty sacred and it's you know, a similar thing.
It's funny we make the piked In Massacre podcast also
with iHeart and the Idaho Massacre kind of not to
get too in the weeds on podcast talk, but it's.

Speaker 3 (01:17:30):
Also on the same feed and it has the same artwork.

Speaker 2 (01:17:34):
We started wonder that this is just like the Insider,
not so deep. It's kind of thing. It's weird because
the piked In Massacre not to be a spoiler. There
wasn't just one person alone as a killer. It just
goes to show when we started that podcast, we had
nowhere going to go, and we always have thought, Wow,
now that we kind of know the ending in this

(01:17:56):
piked In massacre, you know, we know that it's not
just human. Now the Idaho massacre, we start that again
with the intention of sort of seeing who else could
be out there, you know, let's get some noise out there,
because there's a killer at large potentially or somebody being
maybe wrongfully convicted or targeted. Who knows. Le's unpack it.

Speaker 3 (01:18:15):
And sure enough that picture it really applies for this.

Speaker 2 (01:18:19):
One, right.

Speaker 3 (01:18:20):
Can we can we get like a tease of what
maybe we can hear?

Speaker 5 (01:18:25):
Yes, a trailer, a supertrailer.

Speaker 2 (01:18:28):
We have a little clip here for you guys, if
you want it.

Speaker 3 (01:18:31):
Yeah, Adam, go for it, dude.

Speaker 2 (01:18:32):
Thanks.

Speaker 11 (01:18:33):
He essentially gets to live rent free, no expenses, for
the rest of his life, and we call that justice.
It's insane. They knew we wouldn't agree with it, and
they made it pretty clear they weren't too concerned with
how we felt about the whole situation.

Speaker 2 (01:18:47):
Now that's Kaylee Gonzalveez's brother, Gonzo. He's also in our
documentary on Peacock. Hope you'll watch that as well. The
piped in student murders and streaming. Now, I mean the
Idaho it's to the student murders exactly, but yeah, I
mean it's the family has such differing opinions about how

(01:19:10):
this is being handled, even today. I mean, we were
just discussing this earlier, you know, just how you know,
now Madison Mogan's family is is you know, doing a
lawsuit because they don't want the photoco chaps that are
exactly In fact, we should talk about that a little bit. Yeah,
So anyway, I hope you'll listen. Thanks for thanks for
sharing and being on it. And of course you know

(01:19:33):
it's not a happy ending, but I think it's important
for us to really do a deep dive.

Speaker 5 (01:19:38):
And it's on iHeartRadio as well as Apple podcasts and.

Speaker 2 (01:19:41):
Everywhere wherever you get your podcast. Does one episode come
out every week or is it all at once every week?
And Courtney Armstrong is the voice as away for the
final season, and yeah, we want to hear your opinion,
so please jump in join the combo, whether about that
or any of the podcasts we make. And of course

(01:20:01):
we want to hear about the cases that we're covering
real time.

Speaker 4 (01:20:04):
Wow, how exciting for you though, I mean it's got
to be you. You've had a lot going on lately. Stuff, congrats, stuff,
I mean you really have. You had the documentary release,
you had this show starting, you have the podcast The
Idaho Masacer.

Speaker 2 (01:20:18):
I mean that's you moved in the middle of the
of all this.

Speaker 5 (01:20:24):
Let's not forget Murder one.

Speaker 2 (01:20:25):
Oh, Murder one on one right, Yes, I read that
in the press release today.

Speaker 3 (01:20:29):
Wow, you get that secret.

Speaker 2 (01:20:31):
No, it's just that it's like everything takes a really
long time. There's no secret. It's just that, you know,
things take a really long time. There's twists, and you know,
we follow true crime investigations. It's really hard to do
that on a schedule, it is, and it changes on
a dime. So mostly we just hope the victims' families
and this night went by like a blink. Thank you

(01:20:52):
for bearing with us. There's been some giggles along the way.
I feel like I've been naughty in church a little bit,
and that is I need a good laugh. So I
blame thank you Doran oh Fear, who has been here
at our post.

Speaker 4 (01:21:07):
And it's always a little bit lighter when Doron is here, right,
like Wednesdays are like Wednesdays are our pop culture day.

Speaker 3 (01:21:14):
They're supposed to be light and airy.

Speaker 4 (01:21:16):
I just want everybody to to understand we take this
very seriously, like we're trying to. But this is the
hump that we got to get over every but so
thank you so much for being here ton for real.

Speaker 2 (01:21:26):
Yes, it's so good. Yes, And also we're going to
be back next week Wednesday. We know what our marching
orders are. Just rate the Son of Sam tapes. It's
on Netflix. Well man, we didn't make it. We didn't where,
we don't work for Netflix. But boy watch it and
discuss yes too.

Speaker 5 (01:21:46):
As you watch it, you're going to go and do
a talkback and then we can respond to them. And
if you're going live, make sure to call in.

Speaker 2 (01:21:53):
Yeah, okay, good, good note and let's go to the
talk back right now.

Speaker 6 (01:21:56):
Oh shoot, hi guys, it's Cricket from Connecticut. Cricket Body
and Stephanie. You were just talking about paper routes and
how horrible that job is.

Speaker 16 (01:22:08):
And yes, a horrible job, especially if you have to
ride your bike up. But how about it nothing, I'm
sure for kids. First job top decastling corn?

Speaker 2 (01:22:21):
O that top that requires a drum roll too?

Speaker 3 (01:22:26):
How did we even corn?

Speaker 2 (01:22:29):
Sounds like a lot of work and hands you. I
think you have looked.

Speaker 17 (01:22:36):
Show basically taking those little grain things in the corn.
So you're out in the fields picking apart those little
like like their equivalent of seeds and put off it's
and imagine doing that out in the hot sun.

Speaker 3 (01:22:55):
No, I was not meant to be out in the
hot sun.

Speaker 2 (01:22:58):
I mean that. No, that's a the cake. For sure,
you were going to add to it.

Speaker 15 (01:23:02):
I was going to ask, Now, I'm curious as to
what Doron's first job was.

Speaker 5 (01:23:06):
I failed miserably and I'm going to have to join
this gen X like rite a passage because I used
to have to deliver the penny saves.

Speaker 2 (01:23:13):
Was this like a ring that we were all in?
It's like stranger things? Why did we all have these
weird newspaper situations. I was knocking on people's doors to
say collect listen, and.

Speaker 5 (01:23:24):
I was a frail little boy, and I thought I
was going to make all this money. And they dropped
off huge piles of h and I had to sit
there the night before and ordinate basically take nine piles,
put them into one roll it, put it in a
plastic bag, create two thousand of these. And I didn't
do it on a bicycle. I did it with a
supermarket cart that I had to push up. And it

(01:23:46):
was like a seven mile reading that.

Speaker 2 (01:23:49):
Yeah, the mean streets of man.

Speaker 5 (01:23:52):
My dad did it.

Speaker 2 (01:23:53):
Yeah, I was going to say, that was the whole thing,
getting your dad to do it. You know, I had
older brothers, but boy.

Speaker 4 (01:23:58):
That was My mom was like I'm not helping you.
You decided to take this job. You're putting those papers
together and Sunday with all the coupons and you Literally
my kitchen table was just newspapers, thousands of them, and
my mom.

Speaker 2 (01:24:09):
Is just shaking her head at me, and I'm like,
I'm going to get six dollars on this.

Speaker 5 (01:24:12):
Yeah, we got two cents a paper, like.

Speaker 2 (01:24:15):
Yeah, it was awful.

Speaker 4 (01:24:16):
I'm convinced that they were in like child trafficking at
the child whatever child labor, like it was real.

Speaker 2 (01:24:21):
I was like thirteen, Like what am I doing? I
made seven dollars? Like what of me? You weren't shucking corn?
That is I guess the good news is that we
didn't have to feel the corn, I suppose, but yes,
it does seem even dangerous. By the way, in resturspect dron,
what are you go going on? Tell us about what?

Speaker 11 (01:24:39):
Then?

Speaker 5 (01:24:40):
I was curious about who I am since my favorite
topic is myself. My second episode of Cast to Screen
dropped on Daily Mail Entertainment. It's a YouTube and it
tells you the history of reality television and how casting
was made, and it also talks about some of the
things we talked about a couple of weeks ago for
you know, listeners, and it talks about the club industry.
So check it out, Hope you watch.

Speaker 2 (01:25:01):
Check it out, hope you'll watch. And more on this
to come. We'll be back tomorrow. We have a huge
show tomorrow. We're covering the Menendez brothers new developments. So
make sure we're going to have the guy, the guy,
I mean honestly, he's going to be here, and make
sure you tune in. We'll be back tomorrow night. Stay safe,
good night, everybody, good night

Speaker 7 (01:25:20):
Bye, good night.

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