January 17, 2024 • 35 mins
Filmmaker Adam McKay joins climate scientist Chris Turney to share how—inspired by the urgency of the climate crisis—he used humor in his film, "Don't Look Up" to get people talking about the climate and cut through the misinformation.Show notes from Chris:
- Want to find out more about the early – and accurate – climate science work of fossil fuel companies and how they went on to deny the science and delay action on cutting carbon pollution? Check out this excellent summary about how Exxon disputed climate findings for years.
- To learn more about the “3.5% rule,” here’s an excellent BBC article about how a small minority can change the world!
- In light of the climate emergency, Adam McKay has decided to shelve his film about the serial killer lobbying the government to legalize murder to focus on movies related to the climate crisis.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey, before we start, I wanted to let you know
that this interview was recorded a while ago. Since then,
some of the projects our guess we'll talk about have
evolved a bit. And also, we cut down four billion,
three hundred and eighty seven million trees. Yeah, I know
that's an insane number, but it's true. Also, over one
(00:21):
hundred and fifty people died from wildfires, we hit record
global temperatures, and a fuck ton of other terrible things
have happened. Check the show notes if you want to
see updates on anything we talk about in today's episode.
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
I had the moment where I'm like, holy crap, where
no one's paying attention. We're in real trouble here.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
What do I do? I make movies.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
So I wrote five six different ideas for movies, and
I just kept coming back to the idea that if
a good portion of the movie could be funny, nothing
is better at, you know, bringing people together then laughter.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
It's kind of the ultimate truth detector.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Hi.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
I'm Chris Turney, and this is Unfucking the Future, a
show about the climate crisis and what we can do
about it. It's easy to get depressed about the climate.
According to a host of recent scientific studies, this past
year was the hottest ever recorded in human history. But
(01:31):
now is not the time to despair. It's for time
to get activated. And that's what this show is all about. Together,
we really can on fuck this. Let's dig in.
Speaker 4 (01:43):
We're fucking the future.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Let's play a game, all right. On the counter of three,
name your favorite dinosaur. Don't even think about it, just
name it ready one two three glass.
Speaker 5 (01:57):
Raptor favorite non pornographic magazine to masturbate two Good housekeeping.
If you were a chick, who's the one guy you
would sleep with?
Speaker 1 (02:08):
John Samos? What did we just become best friends?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yep?
Speaker 1 (02:13):
That's a scene from the two thousand and eight film
Step Brothers. It stars John c Riley and Will Farrell
and was directed by our guest today, Adam McKay. He's
since written, directed, or produced projects like Succession, The Big Short,
and Anchorman. The Man is a Hollywood legend, but he's
not just a filmmaker. Adam McKay is also an activist,
(02:37):
and he's tackling the climate crisis in his own particular
way his storytelling. His most recent film, Don't Look On
is an environmental allegory he's used for success of that
film to create Yellow Dot, a production studio that's fighting
back against all that climate disinformation we.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
See every day.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
So how did this comedy genius become a climate activist.
It started back in two thousand and eight when he
was making a film about another global crisis, the mortgage bubble.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
We were making this movie, The Big Short.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And you know, because I have a job where I
write scripts, I direct, it's not a regular nine to
five job. Part of my job is to kind of
just follow whatever interests me or I'm curious about. So
I started reading some stuff that was really alarming, and
(03:36):
I went from concerned giving money to holy crap, we
are in trouble. I thought I have to be wrong,
like it can't be this, you know, dire. And so
I started just talking to scientists and calling them and
(03:58):
I just kept double triple checking the science, and every
answer I got was worse than one.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
But before Adam was digging himself deeper and deeper into
a hole of climate anxiety, and suddenly just giving money
didn't seem like enough. He felt like he had to
do something, and so he started writing.
Speaker 6 (04:25):
I heard there's an asteroid or a comment or something
that you don't like the looks of.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Tell me about it.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Yeah, twenty minutes, twenty minutes go. That's a clip from
Don't Look Up, Adam's record breaking twenty twenty one film.
You can find it on Netflix. The movies about two
scientists who tried to warn the media and mankind. But
there's an approaching comment that's going to destroy our planet.
(04:53):
Now you're never going to believe this, but no one listens.
Speaker 6 (04:57):
And then doctor Mindy and miss Debosky, you'll come on
and talk about that planet you discovered.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
We filmed a comment.
Speaker 7 (05:04):
They know what we're here to talk about.
Speaker 6 (05:06):
Right of course, Jack and Bree love doing science segments.
Just remember, keep it light fine, Jack and Bree love
having a good time.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
That's my Partnessy V is frighteningly close to how the
world has dealt with global heating, or hasn't. Despite the
decades of warnings from the scientific community, the reaction from
world leaders has been more like tumbleweeds. Adam recognized, but
the climate crisis isn't just a scientific problem. It's actually
(05:34):
a hearts and minds problem. It's making people care about
this problem, and how's he doing it through storytelling.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
So the story of that movie is obviously.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
I had the moment where I'm like, holy crap, where
no one's paying attention, We're in real trouble here.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
What do I do?
Speaker 2 (05:55):
I make movies? And I just kept coming back to
the that if a good portion in the movie could
be funny, nothing is better at you know, bringing people
together then laughter. It's kind of the ultimate truth detector.
So I sort of settled on the comedy, and then
obviously we got into making it done.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Look Up was such a big moment for climate scientists.
I think we will owe you a huge fanks from
the scientific community. I went embarrassed myself for you to
ask if you saw my picture before you cast in,
you just told me for a project, why did you
choose a comment?
Speaker 2 (06:33):
My friend David Sirota, who's a journalist, had made an
offhanded comment to me about how it's like a meteorite's
going to hit the planet and no one cares yes,
And I remember saying to him and he was talking
about climate and I said, David, that's the movie and
he's like, what do you mean. I go, that's the
movie and he's like, how is that a movie?
Speaker 3 (06:56):
I go, well, let me figure that out.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
What Adam wanted to get across was the urgency of
a climate crisis. It's something that's happening right now. There's
nothing more urgent than a comet about to blast us
all to oblivion.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
What would really surprise us would be a comet, because
that could come from outside our solar system, and that
would kind of blindside us.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
And what we liked.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
About it was it was a familiar movie trope that
a lot of us know. We've seen versions of disaster movies,
whether it's an earthquake or Godzilla's going to attack a city.
We're very comfortable with that as something that we know
how that story plays out.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Normally in a disaster flick, humanity comes together to save
a day, but of course in Don't Look Up, the
opposite happens.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
So disrupting that story would feel weird to an audience
and hopefully funny and maybe a little uncomfortable, And so
that that was really how I came upon it.
Speaker 8 (08:04):
It's headed directly at Earth and it really likely will hit.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
This sounds very very exciting.
Speaker 6 (08:11):
Exploding stars like stars actually explode, So how big is
this thing going to like destroy someone's house.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
Is that possible?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Well, comment bed asking, which is what it will officially
be named, is somewhere ye right, congratulations, it's somewhere between
six and nine kilometers across.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
So it's bad.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
It would damage the entire planet, not just a house.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
The entire planet.
Speaker 6 (08:34):
Okay, Well, as it's damaging, will it hit this one
house in particular, that's right on the coast of New Jersey.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
It's my ex wife's house.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
I needed to be it. Can we make that happen?
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Once he had figured out his idea for the movie,
Adam says, the script just poured out of him.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
He was so inspired and it was the craziest experience.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
I had an outline, but then I went to this
house we have lake in Ireland, and I wrote the
whole script in like four weeks.
Speaker 3 (09:06):
It was incredible.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Wow, just did he really poured out of me.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
I've had that experience maybe one or two other times,
but never like this. It was like a fever dream.
So it was the fastest thing ever where. We sent
it to Leo. We sent it to Jen Lawrence. I
think Jen Lawrence was first in and then Leo and
Tyler Perry and all these great people and then the
(09:33):
release of it was its own crazy story, like nothing.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Oh my god, it was insane.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
In the movie, the media and the government all turn
a blind eye to this comic that's about to wipe
out a planet, and meanwhile they're frightening the people who
are trying to warn the public about the impending disaster.
It's depressingly similar to what happened when the movie was
actually released.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Oh my god, it was insane.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
When we did the theatrical release, we got it was
like I've gotten bad reviews before, Like I don't care.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
When you do this as a job, you're used to it.
Speaker 9 (10:12):
But these were the nastiest reviews, Like they were so
angry and personal and welcome to my world.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
I remember joking, this must be what it's like.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
This must be what it's like to be a climate
science is for the pat sort of hears.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
Can I share with you, just for a moment, what
bad reviews have looked like for climate scientists, for search
fundings being blocked, individuals have been publicly vilified, and of
course there's some good old gas lighting going on out there.
Speaker 10 (10:47):
President Trump just tweeted about the extreme cold slamming more
than seventeen million Americans tonight. His tweet also mocked the
science of climate change. From President writes in the East,
it could be the coldest New Year's Eve on record.
Perhaps could use a little bit of that good old
global warming that our country, but not other countries, was
going to pay trillions of dollars to protect against. Bundle up.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
There's an insane amount of misinformation out there, and there's
a lot of companies and politicians who are making money
with a status quo we now have. It's created a
pretty toxic environment for those of us talking about climate
and apparently also for those making movies about climate any.
Reviews were quite mixed, with some critics describing it as
(11:34):
too negative and even smug.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Meryl Streep I remember, was like, I don't understand. She's
like she was confused, like I saw the movie. This
is not the movie I saw it. But then a
wonderful thing that happened.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
We're un fucking the future. We're un fucking the future.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
We released it on Netflix worldwide and it was the
most incredible thing I've ever seen. People in dozens of
languages immediately identified with it, and it went on to
become the number one movie in like ninety two countries,
which that doesn't happen with a comedy.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
It's very rare. Comedy is very cultural.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
And then I started hearing stories that there were huge
protests in France.
Speaker 11 (12:31):
The French process is obviously so hyped up. Everyone's frying
banana skins, Mario cart style. There's no police there, and
they started and banas I just got hit in the
head banana skins. How politicians, police and the public around
the world reacts has yet to be seen, but the
past week has shown that climate protest is now made
up of a whole ecosystem of tactics.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
And then climate scientists were like criticizing movie critics, like
there were these fights online, like George Mambiad wrote this
beautiful piece how the movie made him cry because it
had been in his life for the previous twenty years.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
The response amongst my fellow scientists was quite amazing, and
it takes a lot to get them excited. It was
a special moment for many of us. Someone else understood
and showed just how mad the last few decades have been.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
So it ended up being an experience like nothing I
have ever had in making films and TV shows. You know,
we're dealing with just a gargantuan force, you know, changing
the livable climate, and it's amazing how much it just
bats you around emotionally, how it plays with people's perceptions,
(13:47):
how some people you don't want to deny it. So yeah,
it's a wild, wild experience, there's no question. And the
number one thing I've been trying to do through the
whole thing is just keep my sense of humor.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
It's not surprising Adam would prioritize his sense of humor
considering his background, but he's also onto something in regards
to how we humans are wired to communicate. If there's
one failing we scientists have is that we think that
the only way to communicate the urgency of global heating
is via facts and data. But research increasingly shows that
(14:25):
these facts don't often change people's minds. If we really
want people's attention, we need new strategies. We need empathy,
we need common ground, We need to tell them stories.
All this points back to a big lesson Adam learned,
and we can take away too.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
What I learned is there is no one way to
do it. Yes, this is a story that's got to
be told in a thousand and a million different ways,
because you know, seven billion people, the world is vast,
there's so many different emotional experiences.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
So what I learned we don't look.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Up is the way we told the story worked really
well for the people it worked for, and.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
So yeah, the big lesson as well, there are a
lot of different ways to tell this story for a
lot of different people. One example is, you know, we
do this prayer in the end of the movie where
Timothy Chalomay's character says a very sincere prayer to God
in this moment of collapse.
Speaker 12 (15:35):
Dearest Father, an almighty Creator, we ask for your grace tonight,
despite our pride, their forgiveness, despite our.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
Down And there's nothing funny or cynical about it. I mean,
I wrote that as sincere as possible, but it never
occurred to me that they were of course a duh.
There would be tons of people of faith that would
really connect with that moment. So I read some beautiful
(16:10):
pieces in outlets that normally I don't think would even
watch anything I make, like you know, Christian News Monthly
or whatever making that up. And then I saw some
responses to the movie from Believe It or Not, right
wing corners of the World, and I saw like one
(16:31):
guy who I'm sure his boss yelled at him afterwards,
but he wrote this piece that was like the movie
is ultimately calling for true accountability. And I was like, wow,
this guy is writing for a magazine I find reprehensible,
but he really got the movie.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
The end is so moving, Adam, the prayer is beautiful
and Leonardo DiCaprio a wonderful moment at the tay Bluff.
I think it's something like we really did have everything,
didn't we? And oh my god, it was so beautiful.
I actually brought me to tears and it was just
an incredible emotional moment. It was just so real.
Speaker 12 (17:12):
The thing of it is is we really.
Speaker 4 (17:16):
We really did have everything, didn't we?
Speaker 1 (17:20):
I mean, when you think about it.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
So I got to tell you this story of that line.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
So for me, the line in the end when I
wrote it was Jen Lawrence saying, at least we tried,
And that was the line when I was a little
great line, but no, no, no, I totally agree with you.
So I when I wrote that line at this lake
house in Ireland, I had tears in my aunt. So
(17:49):
then we're shooting the scene and DiCaprio comes up to
me and he goes, you know, I love Jen's line,
but is there a line that can really drive the
loss home? And of course I'm the writer of the script.
I'm delighted with the line I've written and it's so.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
I tell him.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
I go like, look, I think it works great, but
if you want to try something, which is the way
I work, I always let actors improvise. I go, if
you've got something, let's film it. So he leaves. Then
he comes back and I'm next to my script supervisor,
Kate Hardman, who's hilarious from Texas and no BS calls
(18:27):
everything like she sees it, and DiCaprio's like, you.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Know, I came up with this line. What do you
think of this?
Speaker 2 (18:33):
And he takes a beat and he says, you know,
right at the very end, I just say, wow, we
really did have it all, didn't we? And he said,
and Kate Hartman and I both of us tears in
our eyes, and I'm like, uh yeah, Leo, let's do that.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
It's all right, It's all right.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Like e what after they saw the movie was like
that was the line? And I go, you know, I
cannot tell a lie. I did not script that. That
was all Leo and I go, well, the.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
Only credit I'll give myself is I filmed it.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
I was smart enough to go you inspired, you inspired,
Thank you. I like the Twister, but but it's so
funny because it might be the single line from anything
I've ever worked on that moves me the most. It
hit me every single time I watched the movie when
(19:33):
we were editing or screening it.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Adam was encouraged by the success he saw We don't
look up, and this inspired him to start another big project.
He founded Yellow Dots Studios. It's a nonprofit production studio
fighting against climate disinformation and inaction.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
One goal is educate on climate. There's still a remarkable
amount of people once again because no functioning news media
on it. They don't under stand the basics on how
the climate is warming.
Speaker 3 (20:04):
So that's a big thing. Communicate the science.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
The other thing is to point to the cause aka
the villains, big oil and the banks that fund them.
They directly did this. They knew back in the seventies
that it was happening. They chose to lie about it
and keep making money.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
Okay, I need to interrupt for a second and underscore
Adam's last point. The big ore companies have known about
global heating for decades, and instead of trying to help,
they covered it up, which brings us to a segment
we call what the fuck are you talking about? What
(20:44):
the fuck are you talking about? You might assume that
we've only known about global heating for a few decades,
but actually as far back as the eighteen eighties, scientists
knew but if we added carbon to the hemosphere it
could change our climate. Now fast forward to the nineteen seventies.
(21:05):
By that time there was some amazing research being done
to figure out what impact burning fossil fuels was having
on the climate. Who was doing at research? X on Mobile, Yes,
that big oil company, and they confirmed by nineteen seventy
seven that global heating was real and was actually happening.
So what did they do with this information? They spent
(21:26):
millions and millions of dollars spreading lies and confusion about
their own excellent research. The public started to hear about
the changing climate in the nineteen eighties. I was a
nerdy teenager growing up in England and I remember Margaret
Thatcher of a British prime minister, giving several famous speeches
about it. She spoke about the responsibility we had to
(21:48):
balance economic growth with protection for the environment. But it
must be gross, but it doesn't plunder the planet today
and leave our children to deal with the consequences tomorrow.
We are not the lords.
Speaker 7 (22:04):
We are the lord's creatures, the trustees.
Speaker 8 (22:07):
Of this planet.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
That clip was from a speech Thatcher gave in nineteen
eighty nine. But here's a crazy thing. Since she gave
that speech, humans have pumped more carbon into the atmosphere
than we did in the entirety of history before nineteen
eighty nine. In other words, most of the damage from
burning fossil fuels has been caused after these big corporations
(22:33):
knew exactly how harmful it was. It's absolutely criminal. And
that's what the fuck we're talking about. What the fuck
a we're talking about? Okay, let us get back to Adam,
who's actually trying to help us unfuck this. He's using
his voice as a storyteller and an activist through his
(22:55):
company Yellow Dots Studios.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
We're working on numerous different climates projects. I wrote a
script called to see that's a specscript.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
To TC is that two degrees anegrad correct.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Correct and it's a big sort of climate epic that's
you know, dramatic, funny, thrilling that spans hundreds of years
of climate change. And then I'm working on another script
about the corruption that has stopped action on climate and
it's a comedy. It's about a serial killer that hires
(23:33):
a lobbyist to make it easier for him to kill.
And we've got Rob Pattinson, Robert Downey, Junior uh for
his twitterker, Amy Adams, Daniel Deadweiler. It's incredible cast has
signed up. It's definitely one of the main thrusts of
(23:55):
every single thing I'm doing, just because it feels ridiculous
to be you're alive at this giant seismic moment and
not to at least somewhat address it with anything we're doing.
It feels like a lot of stuff that doesn't is
going to feel awfully irrelevant in the next couple years.
(24:17):
So we always at least try and have it next
to a project we're doing, if not directly in the
middle of it.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
One thing I really like here is that Adam's infusing
the story of a climate crisis into almost every project
that he's working on. He's also connecting people with resources
for them to make positive changes in their communities. If
you follow yellow dots on social media, you'll find lots
of ways to get connected to activism work. And that's
(24:46):
a lesson for all of us. It's keeping the story
at the top of everyone's mind and doing it in
a way that's useful, helpful, and most important of all, engaging.
We can all do that, even if we aren't a
famous director to hang out with movie stars. We can
communicate the story and then collectively we can turn that
awareness into action. I have good news for you on
(25:11):
that front too, because it turns out and in order
to change things, we don't need to convince everyone that
global heating is a crisis. We might just need three
and a half percent. What I'm talking about is a
three and a half percent rule. It's an idea based
on the search done at Harvard by Erika Chenoweth. She's
looked at nonviolent protests over this last century and found
(25:33):
that they almost always bring about regime change when at
least three and a half percent of a population are
taking part. We just need three and a half percent
of us willing to stand up and tell our governments
that we need action.
Speaker 3 (25:48):
Now.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
So I guess my question is why aren't three and
a half percent of us taking to the streets right
now to fight for climate action In the US that
looks like ten million people, which does feel like a lot.
But if you think about your city, let's take Boston
to get real change, it might only take twenty two
(26:11):
thousand people there to ride up and demand stronger action
on the climate crisis from the government. And honestly, to me,
it really doesn't seem impossible.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
Well, in here's the good news, it's already happening. There
have already been successes. There was an incredible protest of
trying to remember the country was Norway or Sweden that
they did against private planes that garnered worldwide attention, and
afterwards there were laws passed restricting use of private jets.
(26:44):
So I just tell everyone I go, look, just show
up at the march. They're not violent. Doesn't mean that
cops aren't going to show up and get really pissed,
and they do arrest people. But you're going to make friends.
You're going to meet people that feel like a lot
like you. I have made so many incredible friends, taken
(27:04):
so much comfort from it. So people ask what they
can do. Show up for declare emergency, climate defiance, extinction rebellion,
just stop oil all these incredible groups that are out there.
I mean, that's something you can do that we know,
like you said, according to actual studies of the data,
(27:28):
really does work far better than signing an online petition
or you know which not fine, do that too, but
that's like a thousandth of the impact of showing up
for these non violent disruptive marches.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
They're so powerful.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Oh Adam, this is just so inspirational. Just before we
sign off, could I just ask your advice as a
master communicator, how do we reach people in our lives
who don't yet care about the issue.
Speaker 3 (27:59):
So, yeah, yeah, you kind of read it and react.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
I love basketball, and basketball is a read and react game.
When you catch the ball, how close is your defender,
where's the defender behind them? Is anyone open? And so
it's a read and react kind of thing. And yeah,
you don't want to be going around putting people into
tears if they're having a hard time, but always if
(28:22):
you can do it with a little bit of like
laughing at yourself or humor, that's fantastic. And then sometimes
I'll just drop one piece of information on them, Like
if I'm talking to someone who thinks, you know, Joe
Biden's not a Republican so he's fixed everything, I'll say,
you know, actually Joe Biden has approved more oil drilling
(28:45):
leases than trumped it. And they'll go that's not true,
and I'll go, yeah, it, actually he is, and that
will hopefully kind of push them towards like you're not
going to solve this through a one party versus the
other lens. And then there are times I need the
people around me to help me and tell me like, hey, McKay,
calm down, No.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
It's so true. Is we need We do need each
other because it's it's pre it's pre sobering what we're
going for a moment. And I just love that reading
a room, empathy, a little bit of human self irreverence
is always really it helps cut for a lot of conversations.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
I always say, like, the most frustrating thing about all
of this is we have the science. We've had it
the whole time. We could have We could have switched
from fossil vuels and gone to solar panels wind like hydro.
We could have been developing new technologies like, you know,
(29:42):
science is our ex caliber, man, it's our secret weapons.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
It's true, we just didn't use.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
It because those big oil companies pay to everyone off
not to use it. So that both infuriates me and
gives me a lot of hope.
Speaker 4 (30:00):
On fucking the future. We're on fucking the future.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
I have to say I've really enjoyed my conversation with
Adam McKay. He's proving how powerful storytelling can be in
the fight against global heating, and it's a reminder that
our words matter, which brings us to our final segment,
what the fuck can I do?
Speaker 3 (30:26):
What the fuck can I do?
Speaker 1 (30:30):
So this is a part of a show where we
tell you one thing you can do to get involved
and see she was so brilliant last episode. We've asked
Maggie Bear to come back on the show each week
to help us with a segment. Hey, Maggie Cray, how's
it going great? It's great to have you back here, Maggie.
What have you got for us this week?
Speaker 13 (30:48):
Okay, since Adam's interview was all about the power of
words and storytelling, I want to recommend that we all
do something super simple, and that is this, We need
to stop saying climate change. Let's call it what it is,
global heating, or for Fox's sake, a climate crisis.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
And why is that important?
Speaker 7 (31:12):
Well, let me ask you a question.
Speaker 13 (31:13):
Do you know why everybody says climate change? So back
in the day, we used to say global warming or
greenhouse effect. But then a Republican political strategist named Frank
Lutz got involved, and in two thousand and two, Frank
(31:35):
wrote a famous internal memo about how Republican candidates should
speak about the environment. And I'm going to read this
bombshell to you quote. While global warming has catastrophic communications
attached to it, climate change sounds a more controllable and
less emotional challenge end quote. So basically, he recommended that
(32:00):
politicians downplay the climate crisis by changing what we call it.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
Lovely thought on this say wow wow.
Speaker 7 (32:09):
Yeah, So get this. President George W.
Speaker 13 (32:11):
Bush switched from saying global warming to saying climate change, and.
Speaker 7 (32:16):
Now we all say it. Everyone says it. It's crazy.
Speaker 14 (32:20):
The United States has committed to strengthening our energy security
and confronting global climate change, and the best way to
meet these goals is for America to continue leading the
way toward the development of cleaner and more energy efficient technology.
Speaker 13 (32:34):
The term climate change is intentionally misleading. It's part of
the disinformation campaigns that we are all subject to. So
can we please call the problem what it is? It
is a climate crisis caused by global heating. We need
to put a label on the problem that sounds like
the problem that it is the problem we need to
(32:56):
solve urgently.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
Thanks Maggie.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
That is so important and that's such a great idea,
And that's what the fuck you can do?
Speaker 6 (33:06):
What the fuck can I do?
Speaker 4 (33:09):
Oh fuck?
Speaker 1 (33:16):
That's all for this episode. Next time I'm Fucking the Future,
I'll talk with you and Goodwill Ambassador Sabrina Elba about
the impact of a climate crisis on Somalia, where her
family is from, and we'll dig into why women and
girls at the forefront of a fight against global heating.
Speaker 15 (33:34):
I'll never hear this image of this swamp land in
sire Leone that was converted into rice farms and seeing
them before and after, I could not believe that land
that was so degradated and so turned into this massive
community with women farming. And I always thought that was
so amazing.
Speaker 8 (33:52):
And it just goes to show like even things like
land degregation like we need rule people to restore the
world through nature based solutions. Nature release solutions are such
a big part of it, and who else is going
to protect these areas the genuine custodians of our planet
rule people.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Until then? I'm Chris Turney signing off from Sydney, Australia.
Thanks for joining me in I'm Fucking the Future.
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Fucking the Future.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
I'm Fucking the Future is produced by Imagine Audio and
Awfully Nice for iHeart Podcasts and hosted by me Chris Turney.
The show is written by Meredith Bryan. I'm Fucking the
Future is produced by Amber von Shassen and Rene Colvert.
Ron Howard, Brian Grazer, Carl Welker and Nathan Chloke are
the executive producers from Imagine Audio. Jesse Burton and Katie
(34:47):
Hodges are the executive producers from Awfully Nice. Sound design
and mixing by Evan Arnette, Original music by Lillly Hayden
and producing services by Peter McGuigan, Sam Swinnerton to our
theme and all those fun jingles. If you enjoyed this episode,
be sure to rate and review Unfucking the Future on
Apple Podcasts or whether you get your podcasts
Hey, before we start, I wanted to let you know
that this interview was recorded a while ago. Since then,
some of the projects our guess we'll talk about have
evolved a bit. And also, we cut down four billion,
three hundred and eighty seven million trees. Yeah, I know
that's an insane number, but it's true. Also, over one
(00:21):
hundred and fifty people died from wildfires, we hit record
global temperatures, and a fuck ton of other terrible things
have happened. Check the show notes if you want to
see updates on anything we talk about in today's episode.
Thanks for listening.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
I had the moment where I'm like, holy crap, where
no one's paying attention. We're in real trouble here.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
What do I do? I make movies.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
So I wrote five six different ideas for movies, and
I just kept coming back to the idea that if
a good portion of the movie could be funny, nothing
is better at, you know, bringing people together then laughter.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
It's kind of the ultimate truth detector.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Hi.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
I'm Chris Turney, and this is Unfucking the Future, a
show about the climate crisis and what we can do
about it. It's easy to get depressed about the climate.
According to a host of recent scientific studies, this past
year was the hottest ever recorded in human history. But
(01:31):
now is not the time to despair. It's for time
to get activated. And that's what this show is all about. Together,
we really can on fuck this. Let's dig in.
Speaker 4 (01:43):
We're fucking the future.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Let's play a game, all right. On the counter of three,
name your favorite dinosaur. Don't even think about it, just
name it ready one two three glass.
Speaker 5 (01:57):
Raptor favorite non pornographic magazine to masturbate two Good housekeeping.
If you were a chick, who's the one guy you
would sleep with?
Speaker 1 (02:08):
John Samos? What did we just become best friends?
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Yep?
Speaker 1 (02:13):
That's a scene from the two thousand and eight film
Step Brothers. It stars John c Riley and Will Farrell
and was directed by our guest today, Adam McKay. He's
since written, directed, or produced projects like Succession, The Big Short,
and Anchorman. The Man is a Hollywood legend, but he's
not just a filmmaker. Adam McKay is also an activist,
(02:37):
and he's tackling the climate crisis in his own particular
way his storytelling. His most recent film, Don't Look On
is an environmental allegory he's used for success of that
film to create Yellow Dot, a production studio that's fighting
back against all that climate disinformation we.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
See every day.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
So how did this comedy genius become a climate activist.
It started back in two thousand and eight when he
was making a film about another global crisis, the mortgage bubble.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
We were making this movie, The Big Short.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
And you know, because I have a job where I
write scripts, I direct, it's not a regular nine to
five job. Part of my job is to kind of
just follow whatever interests me or I'm curious about. So
I started reading some stuff that was really alarming, and
(03:36):
I went from concerned giving money to holy crap, we
are in trouble. I thought I have to be wrong,
like it can't be this, you know, dire. And so
I started just talking to scientists and calling them and
(03:58):
I just kept double triple checking the science, and every
answer I got was worse than one.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
But before Adam was digging himself deeper and deeper into
a hole of climate anxiety, and suddenly just giving money
didn't seem like enough. He felt like he had to
do something, and so he started writing.
Speaker 6 (04:25):
I heard there's an asteroid or a comment or something
that you don't like the looks of.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Tell me about it.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
Yeah, twenty minutes, twenty minutes go. That's a clip from
Don't Look Up, Adam's record breaking twenty twenty one film.
You can find it on Netflix. The movies about two
scientists who tried to warn the media and mankind. But
there's an approaching comment that's going to destroy our planet.
(04:53):
Now you're never going to believe this, but no one listens.
Speaker 6 (04:57):
And then doctor Mindy and miss Debosky, you'll come on
and talk about that planet you discovered.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
We filmed a comment.
Speaker 7 (05:04):
They know what we're here to talk about.
Speaker 6 (05:06):
Right of course, Jack and Bree love doing science segments.
Just remember, keep it light fine, Jack and Bree love
having a good time.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
That's my Partnessy V is frighteningly close to how the
world has dealt with global heating, or hasn't. Despite the
decades of warnings from the scientific community, the reaction from
world leaders has been more like tumbleweeds. Adam recognized, but
the climate crisis isn't just a scientific problem. It's actually
(05:34):
a hearts and minds problem. It's making people care about
this problem, and how's he doing it through storytelling.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
So the story of that movie is obviously.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
I had the moment where I'm like, holy crap, where
no one's paying attention, We're in real trouble here.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
What do I do?
Speaker 2 (05:55):
I make movies? And I just kept coming back to
the that if a good portion in the movie could
be funny, nothing is better at you know, bringing people
together then laughter. It's kind of the ultimate truth detector.
So I sort of settled on the comedy, and then
obviously we got into making it done.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Look Up was such a big moment for climate scientists.
I think we will owe you a huge fanks from
the scientific community. I went embarrassed myself for you to
ask if you saw my picture before you cast in,
you just told me for a project, why did you
choose a comment?
Speaker 2 (06:33):
My friend David Sirota, who's a journalist, had made an
offhanded comment to me about how it's like a meteorite's
going to hit the planet and no one cares yes,
And I remember saying to him and he was talking
about climate and I said, David, that's the movie and
he's like, what do you mean. I go, that's the
movie and he's like, how is that a movie?
Speaker 3 (06:56):
I go, well, let me figure that out.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
What Adam wanted to get across was the urgency of
a climate crisis. It's something that's happening right now. There's
nothing more urgent than a comet about to blast us
all to oblivion.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
What would really surprise us would be a comet, because
that could come from outside our solar system, and that
would kind of blindside us.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
And what we liked.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
About it was it was a familiar movie trope that
a lot of us know. We've seen versions of disaster movies,
whether it's an earthquake or Godzilla's going to attack a city.
We're very comfortable with that as something that we know
how that story plays out.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Normally in a disaster flick, humanity comes together to save
a day, but of course in Don't Look Up, the
opposite happens.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
So disrupting that story would feel weird to an audience
and hopefully funny and maybe a little uncomfortable, And so
that that was really how I came upon it.
Speaker 8 (08:04):
It's headed directly at Earth and it really likely will hit.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
This sounds very very exciting.
Speaker 6 (08:11):
Exploding stars like stars actually explode, So how big is
this thing going to like destroy someone's house.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
Is that possible?
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Well, comment bed asking, which is what it will officially
be named, is somewhere ye right, congratulations, it's somewhere between
six and nine kilometers across.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
So it's bad.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
It would damage the entire planet, not just a house.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
The entire planet.
Speaker 6 (08:34):
Okay, Well, as it's damaging, will it hit this one
house in particular, that's right on the coast of New Jersey.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
It's my ex wife's house.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
I needed to be it. Can we make that happen?
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Once he had figured out his idea for the movie,
Adam says, the script just poured out of him.
Speaker 3 (08:49):
He was so inspired and it was the craziest experience.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
I had an outline, but then I went to this
house we have lake in Ireland, and I wrote the
whole script in like four weeks.
Speaker 3 (09:06):
It was incredible.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Wow, just did he really poured out of me.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
I've had that experience maybe one or two other times,
but never like this. It was like a fever dream.
So it was the fastest thing ever where. We sent
it to Leo. We sent it to Jen Lawrence. I
think Jen Lawrence was first in and then Leo and
Tyler Perry and all these great people and then the
(09:33):
release of it was its own crazy story, like nothing.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Oh my god, it was insane.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
In the movie, the media and the government all turn
a blind eye to this comic that's about to wipe
out a planet, and meanwhile they're frightening the people who
are trying to warn the public about the impending disaster.
It's depressingly similar to what happened when the movie was
actually released.
Speaker 3 (10:00):
Oh my god, it was insane.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
When we did the theatrical release, we got it was
like I've gotten bad reviews before, Like I don't care.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
When you do this as a job, you're used to it.
Speaker 9 (10:12):
But these were the nastiest reviews, Like they were so
angry and personal and welcome to my world.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
I remember joking, this must be what it's like.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
This must be what it's like to be a climate
science is for the pat sort of hears.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
Can I share with you, just for a moment, what
bad reviews have looked like for climate scientists, for search
fundings being blocked, individuals have been publicly vilified, and of
course there's some good old gas lighting going on out there.
Speaker 10 (10:47):
President Trump just tweeted about the extreme cold slamming more
than seventeen million Americans tonight. His tweet also mocked the
science of climate change. From President writes in the East,
it could be the coldest New Year's Eve on record.
Perhaps could use a little bit of that good old
global warming that our country, but not other countries, was
going to pay trillions of dollars to protect against. Bundle up.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
There's an insane amount of misinformation out there, and there's
a lot of companies and politicians who are making money
with a status quo we now have. It's created a
pretty toxic environment for those of us talking about climate
and apparently also for those making movies about climate any.
Reviews were quite mixed, with some critics describing it as
(11:34):
too negative and even smug.
Speaker 2 (11:36):
Meryl Streep I remember, was like, I don't understand. She's
like she was confused, like I saw the movie. This
is not the movie I saw it. But then a
wonderful thing that happened.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
We're un fucking the future. We're un fucking the future.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
We released it on Netflix worldwide and it was the
most incredible thing I've ever seen. People in dozens of
languages immediately identified with it, and it went on to
become the number one movie in like ninety two countries,
which that doesn't happen with a comedy.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
It's very rare. Comedy is very cultural.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
And then I started hearing stories that there were huge
protests in France.
Speaker 11 (12:31):
The French process is obviously so hyped up. Everyone's frying
banana skins, Mario cart style. There's no police there, and
they started and banas I just got hit in the
head banana skins. How politicians, police and the public around
the world reacts has yet to be seen, but the
past week has shown that climate protest is now made
up of a whole ecosystem of tactics.
Speaker 2 (12:53):
And then climate scientists were like criticizing movie critics, like
there were these fights online, like George Mambiad wrote this
beautiful piece how the movie made him cry because it
had been in his life for the previous twenty years.
Speaker 1 (13:08):
The response amongst my fellow scientists was quite amazing, and
it takes a lot to get them excited. It was
a special moment for many of us. Someone else understood
and showed just how mad the last few decades have been.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
So it ended up being an experience like nothing I
have ever had in making films and TV shows. You know,
we're dealing with just a gargantuan force, you know, changing
the livable climate, and it's amazing how much it just
bats you around emotionally, how it plays with people's perceptions,
(13:47):
how some people you don't want to deny it. So yeah,
it's a wild, wild experience, there's no question. And the
number one thing I've been trying to do through the
whole thing is just keep my sense of humor.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
It's not surprising Adam would prioritize his sense of humor
considering his background, but he's also onto something in regards
to how we humans are wired to communicate. If there's
one failing we scientists have is that we think that
the only way to communicate the urgency of global heating
is via facts and data. But research increasingly shows that
(14:25):
these facts don't often change people's minds. If we really
want people's attention, we need new strategies. We need empathy,
we need common ground, We need to tell them stories.
All this points back to a big lesson Adam learned,
and we can take away too.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
What I learned is there is no one way to
do it. Yes, this is a story that's got to
be told in a thousand and a million different ways,
because you know, seven billion people, the world is vast,
there's so many different emotional experiences.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
So what I learned we don't look.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Up is the way we told the story worked really
well for the people it worked for, and.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
So yeah, the big lesson as well, there are a
lot of different ways to tell this story for a
lot of different people. One example is, you know, we
do this prayer in the end of the movie where
Timothy Chalomay's character says a very sincere prayer to God
in this moment of collapse.
Speaker 12 (15:35):
Dearest Father, an almighty Creator, we ask for your grace tonight,
despite our pride, their forgiveness, despite our.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
Down And there's nothing funny or cynical about it. I mean,
I wrote that as sincere as possible, but it never
occurred to me that they were of course a duh.
There would be tons of people of faith that would
really connect with that moment. So I read some beautiful
(16:10):
pieces in outlets that normally I don't think would even
watch anything I make, like you know, Christian News Monthly
or whatever making that up. And then I saw some
responses to the movie from Believe It or Not, right
wing corners of the World, and I saw like one
(16:31):
guy who I'm sure his boss yelled at him afterwards,
but he wrote this piece that was like the movie
is ultimately calling for true accountability. And I was like, wow,
this guy is writing for a magazine I find reprehensible,
but he really got the movie.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
The end is so moving, Adam, the prayer is beautiful
and Leonardo DiCaprio a wonderful moment at the tay Bluff.
I think it's something like we really did have everything,
didn't we? And oh my god, it was so beautiful.
I actually brought me to tears and it was just
an incredible emotional moment. It was just so real.
Speaker 12 (17:12):
The thing of it is is we really.
Speaker 4 (17:16):
We really did have everything, didn't we?
Speaker 1 (17:20):
I mean, when you think about it.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
So I got to tell you this story of that line.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
So for me, the line in the end when I
wrote it was Jen Lawrence saying, at least we tried,
And that was the line when I was a little
great line, but no, no, no, I totally agree with you.
So I when I wrote that line at this lake
house in Ireland, I had tears in my aunt. So
(17:49):
then we're shooting the scene and DiCaprio comes up to
me and he goes, you know, I love Jen's line,
but is there a line that can really drive the
loss home? And of course I'm the writer of the script.
I'm delighted with the line I've written and it's so.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
I tell him.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
I go like, look, I think it works great, but
if you want to try something, which is the way
I work, I always let actors improvise. I go, if
you've got something, let's film it. So he leaves. Then
he comes back and I'm next to my script supervisor,
Kate Hardman, who's hilarious from Texas and no BS calls
(18:27):
everything like she sees it, and DiCaprio's like, you.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Know, I came up with this line. What do you
think of this?
Speaker 2 (18:33):
And he takes a beat and he says, you know,
right at the very end, I just say, wow, we
really did have it all, didn't we? And he said,
and Kate Hartman and I both of us tears in
our eyes, and I'm like, uh yeah, Leo, let's do that.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
It's all right, It's all right.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
Like e what after they saw the movie was like
that was the line? And I go, you know, I
cannot tell a lie. I did not script that. That
was all Leo and I go, well, the.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
Only credit I'll give myself is I filmed it.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
I was smart enough to go you inspired, you inspired,
Thank you. I like the Twister, but but it's so
funny because it might be the single line from anything
I've ever worked on that moves me the most. It
hit me every single time I watched the movie when
(19:33):
we were editing or screening it.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Adam was encouraged by the success he saw We don't
look up, and this inspired him to start another big project.
He founded Yellow Dots Studios. It's a nonprofit production studio
fighting against climate disinformation and inaction.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
One goal is educate on climate. There's still a remarkable
amount of people once again because no functioning news media
on it. They don't under stand the basics on how
the climate is warming.
Speaker 3 (20:04):
So that's a big thing. Communicate the science.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
The other thing is to point to the cause aka
the villains, big oil and the banks that fund them.
They directly did this. They knew back in the seventies
that it was happening. They chose to lie about it
and keep making money.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
Okay, I need to interrupt for a second and underscore
Adam's last point. The big ore companies have known about
global heating for decades, and instead of trying to help,
they covered it up, which brings us to a segment
we call what the fuck are you talking about? What
(20:44):
the fuck are you talking about? You might assume that
we've only known about global heating for a few decades,
but actually as far back as the eighteen eighties, scientists
knew but if we added carbon to the hemosphere it
could change our climate. Now fast forward to the nineteen seventies.
(21:05):
By that time there was some amazing research being done
to figure out what impact burning fossil fuels was having
on the climate. Who was doing at research? X on Mobile, Yes,
that big oil company, and they confirmed by nineteen seventy
seven that global heating was real and was actually happening.
So what did they do with this information? They spent
(21:26):
millions and millions of dollars spreading lies and confusion about
their own excellent research. The public started to hear about
the changing climate in the nineteen eighties. I was a
nerdy teenager growing up in England and I remember Margaret
Thatcher of a British prime minister, giving several famous speeches
about it. She spoke about the responsibility we had to
(21:48):
balance economic growth with protection for the environment. But it
must be gross, but it doesn't plunder the planet today
and leave our children to deal with the consequences tomorrow.
We are not the lords.
Speaker 7 (22:04):
We are the lord's creatures, the trustees.
Speaker 8 (22:07):
Of this planet.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
That clip was from a speech Thatcher gave in nineteen
eighty nine. But here's a crazy thing. Since she gave
that speech, humans have pumped more carbon into the atmosphere
than we did in the entirety of history before nineteen
eighty nine. In other words, most of the damage from
burning fossil fuels has been caused after these big corporations
(22:33):
knew exactly how harmful it was. It's absolutely criminal. And
that's what the fuck we're talking about. What the fuck
a we're talking about? Okay, let us get back to Adam,
who's actually trying to help us unfuck this. He's using
his voice as a storyteller and an activist through his
(22:55):
company Yellow Dots Studios.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
We're working on numerous different climates projects. I wrote a
script called to see that's a specscript.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
To TC is that two degrees anegrad correct.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Correct and it's a big sort of climate epic that's
you know, dramatic, funny, thrilling that spans hundreds of years
of climate change. And then I'm working on another script
about the corruption that has stopped action on climate and
it's a comedy. It's about a serial killer that hires
(23:33):
a lobbyist to make it easier for him to kill.
And we've got Rob Pattinson, Robert Downey, Junior uh for
his twitterker, Amy Adams, Daniel Deadweiler. It's incredible cast has
signed up. It's definitely one of the main thrusts of
(23:55):
every single thing I'm doing, just because it feels ridiculous
to be you're alive at this giant seismic moment and
not to at least somewhat address it with anything we're doing.
It feels like a lot of stuff that doesn't is
going to feel awfully irrelevant in the next couple years.
(24:17):
So we always at least try and have it next
to a project we're doing, if not directly in the
middle of it.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
One thing I really like here is that Adam's infusing
the story of a climate crisis into almost every project
that he's working on. He's also connecting people with resources
for them to make positive changes in their communities. If
you follow yellow dots on social media, you'll find lots
of ways to get connected to activism work. And that's
(24:46):
a lesson for all of us. It's keeping the story
at the top of everyone's mind and doing it in
a way that's useful, helpful, and most important of all, engaging.
We can all do that, even if we aren't a
famous director to hang out with movie stars. We can
communicate the story and then collectively we can turn that
awareness into action. I have good news for you on
(25:11):
that front too, because it turns out and in order
to change things, we don't need to convince everyone that
global heating is a crisis. We might just need three
and a half percent. What I'm talking about is a
three and a half percent rule. It's an idea based
on the search done at Harvard by Erika Chenoweth. She's
looked at nonviolent protests over this last century and found
(25:33):
that they almost always bring about regime change when at
least three and a half percent of a population are
taking part. We just need three and a half percent
of us willing to stand up and tell our governments
that we need action.
Speaker 3 (25:48):
Now.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
So I guess my question is why aren't three and
a half percent of us taking to the streets right
now to fight for climate action In the US that
looks like ten million people, which does feel like a lot.
But if you think about your city, let's take Boston
to get real change, it might only take twenty two
(26:11):
thousand people there to ride up and demand stronger action
on the climate crisis from the government. And honestly, to me,
it really doesn't seem impossible.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
Well, in here's the good news, it's already happening. There
have already been successes. There was an incredible protest of
trying to remember the country was Norway or Sweden that
they did against private planes that garnered worldwide attention, and
afterwards there were laws passed restricting use of private jets.
(26:44):
So I just tell everyone I go, look, just show
up at the march. They're not violent. Doesn't mean that
cops aren't going to show up and get really pissed,
and they do arrest people. But you're going to make friends.
You're going to meet people that feel like a lot
like you. I have made so many incredible friends, taken
(27:04):
so much comfort from it. So people ask what they
can do. Show up for declare emergency, climate defiance, extinction rebellion,
just stop oil all these incredible groups that are out there.
I mean, that's something you can do that we know,
like you said, according to actual studies of the data,
(27:28):
really does work far better than signing an online petition
or you know which not fine, do that too, but
that's like a thousandth of the impact of showing up
for these non violent disruptive marches.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
They're so powerful.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Oh Adam, this is just so inspirational. Just before we
sign off, could I just ask your advice as a
master communicator, how do we reach people in our lives
who don't yet care about the issue.
Speaker 3 (27:59):
So, yeah, yeah, you kind of read it and react.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
I love basketball, and basketball is a read and react game.
When you catch the ball, how close is your defender,
where's the defender behind them? Is anyone open? And so
it's a read and react kind of thing. And yeah,
you don't want to be going around putting people into
tears if they're having a hard time, but always if
(28:22):
you can do it with a little bit of like
laughing at yourself or humor, that's fantastic. And then sometimes
I'll just drop one piece of information on them, Like
if I'm talking to someone who thinks, you know, Joe
Biden's not a Republican so he's fixed everything, I'll say,
you know, actually Joe Biden has approved more oil drilling
(28:45):
leases than trumped it. And they'll go that's not true,
and I'll go, yeah, it, actually he is, and that
will hopefully kind of push them towards like you're not
going to solve this through a one party versus the
other lens. And then there are times I need the
people around me to help me and tell me like, hey, McKay,
calm down, No.
Speaker 1 (29:06):
It's so true. Is we need We do need each
other because it's it's pre it's pre sobering what we're
going for a moment. And I just love that reading
a room, empathy, a little bit of human self irreverence
is always really it helps cut for a lot of conversations.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
I always say, like, the most frustrating thing about all
of this is we have the science. We've had it
the whole time. We could have We could have switched
from fossil vuels and gone to solar panels wind like hydro.
We could have been developing new technologies like, you know,
(29:42):
science is our ex caliber, man, it's our secret weapons.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
It's true, we just didn't use.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
It because those big oil companies pay to everyone off
not to use it. So that both infuriates me and
gives me a lot of hope.
Speaker 4 (30:00):
On fucking the future. We're on fucking the future.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
I have to say I've really enjoyed my conversation with
Adam McKay. He's proving how powerful storytelling can be in
the fight against global heating, and it's a reminder that
our words matter, which brings us to our final segment,
what the fuck can I do?
Speaker 3 (30:26):
What the fuck can I do?
Speaker 1 (30:30):
So this is a part of a show where we
tell you one thing you can do to get involved
and see she was so brilliant last episode. We've asked
Maggie Bear to come back on the show each week
to help us with a segment. Hey, Maggie Cray, how's
it going great? It's great to have you back here, Maggie.
What have you got for us this week?
Speaker 13 (30:48):
Okay, since Adam's interview was all about the power of
words and storytelling, I want to recommend that we all
do something super simple, and that is this, We need
to stop saying climate change. Let's call it what it is,
global heating, or for Fox's sake, a climate crisis.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
And why is that important?
Speaker 7 (31:12):
Well, let me ask you a question.
Speaker 13 (31:13):
Do you know why everybody says climate change? So back
in the day, we used to say global warming or
greenhouse effect. But then a Republican political strategist named Frank
Lutz got involved, and in two thousand and two, Frank
(31:35):
wrote a famous internal memo about how Republican candidates should
speak about the environment. And I'm going to read this
bombshell to you quote. While global warming has catastrophic communications
attached to it, climate change sounds a more controllable and
less emotional challenge end quote. So basically, he recommended that
(32:00):
politicians downplay the climate crisis by changing what we call it.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
Lovely thought on this say wow wow.
Speaker 7 (32:09):
Yeah, So get this. President George W.
Speaker 13 (32:11):
Bush switched from saying global warming to saying climate change, and.
Speaker 7 (32:16):
Now we all say it. Everyone says it. It's crazy.
Speaker 14 (32:20):
The United States has committed to strengthening our energy security
and confronting global climate change, and the best way to
meet these goals is for America to continue leading the
way toward the development of cleaner and more energy efficient technology.
Speaker 13 (32:34):
The term climate change is intentionally misleading. It's part of
the disinformation campaigns that we are all subject to. So
can we please call the problem what it is? It
is a climate crisis caused by global heating. We need
to put a label on the problem that sounds like
the problem that it is the problem we need to
(32:56):
solve urgently.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
Thanks Maggie.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
That is so important and that's such a great idea,
And that's what the fuck you can do?
Speaker 6 (33:06):
What the fuck can I do?
Speaker 4 (33:09):
Oh fuck?
Speaker 1 (33:16):
That's all for this episode. Next time I'm Fucking the Future,
I'll talk with you and Goodwill Ambassador Sabrina Elba about
the impact of a climate crisis on Somalia, where her
family is from, and we'll dig into why women and
girls at the forefront of a fight against global heating.
Speaker 15 (33:34):
I'll never hear this image of this swamp land in
sire Leone that was converted into rice farms and seeing
them before and after, I could not believe that land
that was so degradated and so turned into this massive
community with women farming. And I always thought that was
so amazing.
Speaker 8 (33:52):
And it just goes to show like even things like
land degregation like we need rule people to restore the
world through nature based solutions. Nature release solutions are such
a big part of it, and who else is going
to protect these areas the genuine custodians of our planet
rule people.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Until then? I'm Chris Turney signing off from Sydney, Australia.
Thanks for joining me in I'm Fucking the Future.
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Fucking the Future.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
I'm Fucking the Future is produced by Imagine Audio and
Awfully Nice for iHeart Podcasts and hosted by me Chris Turney.
The show is written by Meredith Bryan. I'm Fucking the
Future is produced by Amber von Shassen and Rene Colvert.
Ron Howard, Brian Grazer, Carl Welker and Nathan Chloke are
the executive producers from Imagine Audio. Jesse Burton and Katie
(34:47):
Hodges are the executive producers from Awfully Nice. Sound design
and mixing by Evan Arnette, Original music by Lillly Hayden
and producing services by Peter McGuigan, Sam Swinnerton to our
theme and all those fun jingles. If you enjoyed this episode,
be sure to rate and review Unfucking the Future on
Apple Podcasts or whether you get your podcasts
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