November 2, 2023 • 30 mins
ChasingHorse grew up in a matriarchal family in Alaska as a member of the Hän Gwich'in people. Her advocacy, on behalf of her community, has made her an ambassador in the fashion industry for new perspectives and values, which she inherited from her mother and grandmother. For ChasingHorse, integrity and authenticity runs deep—her entire family is rooted in Native advocacy and raised her to have a distinct, fiery voice all her own. In this passionate conversation, ChasingHorse walks us through the culture shock she encountered coming to the continental US for the first time, stewardship of nature, of her people’s story, of the gifts they have to give, and the ways she grounds herself as she takes the fashion world by storm.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to VS Voices. I'm Amanda Decademy. Quana Chasing Horse
is an Indigenous model. She's using her platform to champion
indigenous culture and climate justice. In this interview, we talk
about growing up in a matriarchal family and how her
advocacy led to a career in fashion. Kwanna, I'm so
pleased to meet you. Thank you for taking the time.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
I'm so happy to be here. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
You're so welcome. I wanted to start our interview by
talking about how you grew up because I watched this
incredible documentary on you and I was so riveted. Your
life is so fascinating to me. You're a member of
the han Guachin tribe and you were raised in Fairbanks, Alaska,
(00:49):
which is an area that's often referred to as ground
zero for climate change. In interviews, you talk about growing
up in a family of matriarchs, which was amazing to hear.
Can you tell me exactly what that means for any
listeners who may be aunt Shaw.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, So I come from Alaska, as you just stated,
and my people are the Honokuchen people, and we have,
you know, for millennia, been known to be land protectors
and you know, stewards of the land and where I
come from is very different from what I'm now walking into,
(01:30):
I guess, you know. And my documentary is actually called
Walking two Worlds. But yeah, a lot of my work
before modeling, before I entered the industry, was just advocacy
work and doing a lot of environmental work, doing a
lot of land protection work, and just awareness on different
(01:52):
issues within the native community, native sovereignty and all kinds
of stuff. So I have always had this voice and
this drive inside of me to just show up every
day as a good person, as a better person as
I grow. And I've just been very thankful to, you know,
(02:12):
walk into this industry and have people really wanting to
learn and understand. And I've had many amazing opportunities to
work with brands that are willing to make changes, that
are you know, making changes already and just want to
amplify that by giving my voice and my existent space
(02:36):
to take up that space to show up and do
my part. And so my work has been kind of
all across the board. But who I am is the
foundation of the values and the path that I walk
as an Indigenous person in these spaces. I have to
always show up in a good way because I know
I'm representing not just myself, but I'm representing my community.
(02:59):
And I've had amazing opportunities to do that and to
show our resilience and to show, you know, how we
can take up space and we can show up as
ourselves and be proud of who we are and to
be celebrated in that way and not be changed or
modified in a way that this outside world perceives us
(03:22):
as as you know, the stereotypes and those are things
that we're constantly undoing and you know, trying to teach
people how every tribe, every people's are different and we
all come from you know, different walks of life, but
we do share very similar, if not the same values.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Well that was that was when I was listening to
you speak, I was thinking, these are lessons for everybody, right,
you know exactly.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah, that's and that's the kind of messaging I've been
trying to do through this is just that like it's
not just you know, it doesn't it just apply to
us as native or indigenous people. It applies to everybody,
and it can benefit everybody.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
What do you think are some of the strongest values
that your mother and grandmother instilled in you as a
young girl.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
A lot of things, honestly, but a lot of what
they repeated to me were things that you know, we'd
always be like, yeah, I know, or you know, just
kind of would brush off because you hear them repeat it,
and when you're younger, you don't understand that those words.
They seem so repetitive or you're just like whatever, I know.
But there's so much to learn from them, and they
always hold a lesson or always have some sort of
(04:37):
advice in them. So for me, that was never forget
who you are and where you come from. And my
mom repeated that to me, and it got to a
point where I would always, you know, leave the house
and she'd be like, remember who you are and where
you come from.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
And I love that a lot of moms are like,
don't drink too much, make sure you don't get into trouble,
and your mom is like telling you, don't forget who
you are and where you come from.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Yeah, And I think that's how I stayed out of
trouble actually, because you know, I would show up in
a space and I would think, Okay, how would I
want to honor my people and showing up in this space,
how would I want to be seen? How would I
want to be perceived? And so it's not always about
looking for you know, validation or anything. It's really just
(05:23):
how I feel good in making sure that when I
show up in a space, that I show up in
the right way and I come correct, you know. And
that's the best way I can think about it. But
it's okay to like, you know, have fun and as
long as it's you stays professional and you're able to
show up in a space and do your work in
a good way and represent in a good way, and
(05:46):
you know, make sure that people understand that you're not
the stereotype and that you know, we all have different
I guess, versions and visions for our own people and ourselves.
For me, that's just showing up in a good way.
And even if I do want to have fun, I
also want to make sure that you know, when I'm
(06:07):
having fun, I'm not doing it in a way where
I can jeopardize things for myself. And so I just
want to make sure that I always stay true to
who I am as a person, but also stay true
to who I am as an Indigenous person in terms
of like, you know, I hold myself at a higher
standard where I make sure that I'm showing up and
(06:28):
doing good work.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
Where did you get such a sense of value for yourself,
Because not everybody goes out into the world with such
a strong sense of self. Where do you think that
came from?
Speaker 2 (06:40):
It was really just you know, being taught by my
mom and my grandma and all the women and matriarchs
in my family. I've just had such great examples and
really really strong women to show me that they can
do it all themselves. You know, they don't need anybody,
they don't need anything. They will always make it for themselves.
(07:01):
And you know, I always saw that resilience and strength
and power through them, and I learned everything from them.
I mean, every single one of them plays a really really,
very valid and strong role in all of our communities.
I mean, my mom has played many roles, you know,
in terms of like she was in law enforcement for
(07:22):
our tribes, and she protected our people, and she's an advocate,
you know, and she's been on the front lines for
many different things. She's been constantly serving our people, and
all my aunties as well. I mean, they all you know,
work for Native nonprofits, or their professors at a college
teaching tribal sovereignty, and you know, they're always showing up
(07:43):
and they're always doing such a great job at making
sure that their work and their people, you know, are
not just for nothing, and that they put all of
their heart and passion into it. And with that example,
everything that I've done, you know, is with good intention
and with love and with care. And especially my advocacy work,
(08:06):
you know, I don't just do it just to do it.
I don't just you know, go out there and try
to advocate to make myself look good or I've been
doing it since I was a child. I grew into it,
you know, I grew up in the movement. I was
raised to have a voice. Yes, it's not performative, no, never,
And it's it's a passion of mine. It's a passion
(08:27):
and it's not just something that I choose to do
or want to have fun doing. It's a fire inside
of me and it's been there since I was a child,
and you know, when I first understood and learned who
I am and how the world perceives me and how
I have to face different challenges in my lifetime. So
you know, that's important, you know, it's just having such
(08:50):
strong people around you. And I really do believe in
keeping your circle small in terms of like knowing how
to protect your heart, your spirit, your power, your space.
It's important to protect yourself so you can show up
in a good way.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Yeah, and especially as you moved from Alaska to America,
that must have been a significant culture shock. I would
imagine how was that for you.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
It was definitely a huge culture shock because you know,
I'm still kind of getting used to everything. I grew
up eating very traditional foods. So I grew up hunting
and fishing in the woods. You know, my mom is
a dog musher in the wintertime. That was our transportation.
I grew up a very traditional lifestyle. And you know,
(09:35):
my mom, being a single parent my whole life, she
herself had to really you know, she always went hunting.
She knew how to hunt, she knew how to fish,
all of those things, but she had to really learn
how to do everything herself, and with three kids. And
so I've been hunting since I could walk basically, or
even before that. She would pack me out in her
(09:55):
backpack and go hunting. So she always, always, you know,
was a very traditional person and made sure that we
understood who we are and where we come from. But
she also made sure that we were taught these values
and these cultures and traditions so that we can carry
them on, but also so that we can show the
world that, you know, our culture, our traditions, they're beautiful
(10:18):
and there there's always a lesson to be learned, and
there's always a reason for everything, and everything has such value.
And we never separated ourselves from nature. I think that's
the biggest lesson and when you're learning from indigenous cultures
is that we have never separated ourselves from nature. Because
you know, if you really look at the statistics, eighty
(10:40):
percent of the world's biodiversity is protected by indigenous peoples,
and indigenous people only take up five percent of the
world's population, and so you know, that's a huge statistic
and that's you know, a crazy number if you really
think about it. And it's because we never separated ourselves
from nature. We're always talking about, you know, and it
(11:01):
sounds cheesy, but like being one with nature. But how
I see it is we are nature. We are nature
in itself, and we're a part of this life cycle
and we will always recognize that and see that, you know,
our plants, our animals, the land is our relative and
we got to treat it that way. And so that's
(11:22):
kind of what guides me through my journey and how
my mom raised me.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
I agree with you. I feel like so much of
the issues that people experience are from not only that
separation from self, but separation from nature. So how has
it been for you living in a city. Los Angeles
has more nature than many cities in America, but it
is extremely different how you staying connected to yourself. Since
(11:51):
you're living in an environment that's very different than what
you're used to.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
It can be challenging. You know. I've actually, you know,
in my documentary kind of touched on how I've had
a lot of anxiety and I've always been diagnosed with
severe anxiety and major depressive disorder and you know, all
of the all the fun, non fun mental health things.
But you know, when I moved away from home, it
(12:15):
was a lot harder to face those challenges because they
didn't have the outlets that I normally had, and that
was you know, my family, that was our culture, that
was our songs, our traditional foods, all of those things.
That's medicine for me. The ritual, Yes, that is medicine
for me. And it's good medicine. And you know, and
(12:37):
I was just talking about, you know, living that traditional
life and having traditional foods. I don't always have access
to that, you know, And I don't always have access
to everything that my people have back at home. And
I talked about missing out, and that's one of my fears,
is not being able to go back home and do
these things because in a few years those things could
(12:59):
be gone.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
I noticed that actually, when you were speaking about your
anxiety about missing out you were in your documentary. It
was so beautiful and powerful and made me sad to
see how I don't want to say destroyed, but you
obviously felt very upset about missing your home and your
(13:21):
concerned that those things weren't going to be available to you.
So how do you provide tools for yourself to ground
who you are and to give yourself the nourishment because
it's no, you can't compare. There's such different cultures. So
I'm just curious, like, it must be very difficult, and
(13:42):
how do you support yourself.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I thankfully have a very amazing family that you know,
does do all of those things. But what's amazing is
that they always make sure that they always find a
way to include me, and they always, you know, will
send me packages of goodies from home. So like I
(14:06):
missed berry season and I missed hunting season, I've missed
a lot of things since I moved and since I've
been working. And that's fine, you know, you have to
make sacrifices, but you know, those things, it's what really
keeps me grounded. And so when I do go home,
you know, they always spoil me with moose meat or
(14:27):
caribou meat, or salmon or fish or berries, or sometimes
I'll get packages from my aunties or they'll send jars
of fresh blueberry jam that they picked, and you know,
all of the special things that make home home and
feel like home. They we'll make sure that I get
that here. But I also, I really do love outdoors,
(14:48):
so any chance I get, I try to really go
outside a lot. And I have a dog and we
go on hikes and we play outside, and I try
to stay busy, but I also try to make sure
that I rest because you know, busy life, and you know,
make sure I'm resting, but also prioritizing things that keep
(15:09):
me happy and healthy.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Yeah, I mean you talked about having anxiety and mental
health challenges, and you know, I also understand that very well.
And for me, the things that are self soothing and
are part of my self care routine, when those get disrupted,
it becomes much harder to manage those mental health challenges.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
It really really does. And I've really learned to kind
of just take it day by day and move through
the motions. I mean, you can't take anything too too seriously,
and I've had to learn to not take myself too
seriously because you know, there's so much beauty and joy
(15:56):
and you know, just amazing things in the world world,
and as long as you know, of course, the horrific things.
But we have to find the light in those dark
moments because that's how you survive, you know, that's how
you live on, that's how you grow, that's how you
learn from each other, that's how you turn. You know,
unfortunately sad things to beautiful things is when you can
(16:20):
find the beauty in it and understanding that things happen
for a reason. And I've had to really take the
steps necessary to make sure that I'm taking care of
myself and you know, of course I have my bad days.
Everyone has their bad days. But of course, again I
try not to take it too seriously, and I always
try to find the beauty and the light and the darkness,
(16:43):
and you know, I really just try to surround myself
with good people, and you know, I do have amazing resources,
and I do have an amazing support system and an
amazing community that I know I'm very very well loved.
So that's something that definitely helps, is you know, having
community and having amazing people around you to remind you
(17:04):
that you know that they love you and that you're
worth it, and that everything you know. For me too,
I feel like I'm always having to deal with imposter
syndrome where I'm like I don't do I deserve this,
do I? You know? Or like I'll get invited to
something really cool or you know, I've won a few awards,
and every time I've wanted an award, I've always just
you know, felt like an impostor like I didn't deserve it,
(17:25):
or I'm not doing enough or I need to do more.
And I've had to just really tell myself that, you know,
I'm doing enough, and I'm gonna obviously continue to do more,
but not to be too hot on myself and to
understand that I'm just taking life as it is, and
that's okay.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
I mean that's the only way to take it. Exactly,
I mean exactly. So, how would you say your life
changed when social media allowed people to meet you? Because
prior to that, you were just you were living your
(18:04):
life in Alaska. And then once social media introduced you
to a lodge, your audience of people, how did your
life change at that point?
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Oh? Man, It's really opened up a whole new world
for me. I mean, I've learned so much. I've met
so many different people from different walks of life. And
you know, I've gotten opportunities I've never even dreamed of,
or that I've dreamed of or I never even thought
it would even come close to accomplishing, or you know,
(18:36):
I've just had such amazing opportunities and so many dreams
come true. And this world of social media really is, honestly,
it's a whole other world. Like it's a whole different
thing than what I'm used to. And so when I
started to make a little bit of a following through
my advocacy work, I was very like, Okay, I'm going
(18:57):
to use my platform to continue to do good work.
That was all I was trying to do was just
you know, show up for my people and do good
work and make sure that what I'm doing is in
a good way but right. You know, I need to
make sure that what I'm doing is right and that
I use it as a tool to spread awareness, to
(19:18):
share information, and to also connect with people. And the
more I've been able to connect with people and also
humanize myself because I feel like, you know, models and
different people in the industry, celebrities, people with huge followings,
like they forget that we're people too, And I really
just try to humanize myself so people understand that I'm
(19:41):
just a person taking life day by day and that
I'm not perfect and I'm going to make mistakes. But
I also am a very open minded person. And I
really really do love seeing it also not just be
used as a tool, but also a way to connect
with people and you know, share your life for not
share your life, you know, either way, I've just loved
(20:04):
to use it to you know, do good work but
see the world in a different way.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
I guess I love how you have brought impact into
so many of your fashion opportunities. It seems like that
is a win win for you and for the brand
that you're working with, because there are brands that just
pay lip service to whatever initiative it is, and then
(20:32):
there are brands who really genuinely do care about specific issues.
And from what I can see, it's been lovely to
see how much you have inspired the companies you're working
with to give platform to the issues that are important
to you.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
That's like the biggest thing is that I've been, you know,
just dreaming of an opportunity where I can do both,
you know, where I can show up and do work,
show up for my community, but also do good work
in another whole other industry, you know. And to be
able to do both and to be a model and
(21:13):
to live my dream, but to also continue to spread
that awareness and bring that work into the fashion world,
that's just the best of both worlds, it is, you know,
And I'm so thankful that I've gotten those opportunities, because
it really is amazing to see this industry and these
(21:33):
brands wanting to do better, to change, to really see
that there's always room for improvement, I mean, always room
for improvement. I feel like people get so caught up
on thinking, Oh, these brands think they're doing the right
thing or whatever. Like I feel like everyone knows that
there's always room for improvement, and I think that's been
kind of my thing, is opening up that conversation and
(21:55):
sharing that space and helping encourage or inspire that change,
and maybe even collaborating and working with them on how
to how to create that change, or even you know,
directing them on how to make a shift, or even
if they want to make a donation within their brand
to donate to you know, nonprofit organizations that are on
(22:17):
the frontlines doing good work. And so that's just been
my thing, is opening up those conversations, getting the opportunity
and also hopefully getting other people open to working with
these brands, open to seeing that. You know, a lot
of I see a lot of activists, a lot of
people just thinking, oh, well, they did this one bad thing,
(22:37):
and they like shame you for working with them, even
though maybe they have apologized or they move past it
or they've you know, done the right things since then.
It's like, you know, so much of the past is
always held against you, and so I'm always just trying
to also have that conversation with people that it's possible
to change, that we need to change with it, that
we need to encourage that change, that we need to
(22:59):
accept that change and understand that yes, mistakes are made,
but it's possible to do better.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
And when people genuinely and sincerely from a place of
authenticity want to make positive change, me personally, I want
to support that change. It's one of the main reasons
why I chose to work with Victoria's Secret personally, because
I saw genuine change across the entire company, from the
(23:26):
leadership team across the board, a genuine desire to make significant,
impactful change. And I want to be a part of
an organization and support any company that says we want
to do better and here's how we're going to do it.
That to me is like, if we're holding everybody to
every mistake, then how can we ever move forward?
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Exactly. That's been my thing is like, you know, a
lot of people are always trying to shove a lot
of things in my face of brands in their past,
and I'm like, look, I think it's so important that
we have these conversations and yes that unfortunately these things
did happen and they did affect people, but we can't
just hold on to those things because no one's going
(24:11):
to heal. This is about healing at this point. This
is about doing the right thing and creating that space
for people to heal, to understand that, yes, you know,
some of these things may have harmed people, but it's
our job and our responsibility. You know, if we have
hurt somebody to be a part of that healing process
and you know, doing the right thing, it's right. So
(24:32):
that's just been a big conversation that I've been having.
I mean, I'm not want to go back, you know,
freakin do back and forth with people in comment sections
or I'm not want to really have arguments with people
about stuff like that because it's really just like, man,
if you really want to hold on to those things,
you can, I'm not going to fight you on it
(24:53):
because I feel like there's a lot of people that
aren't ready for that kind of change. You know, they
ask for it and they want but some people are
still so hurt that they're not ready for it to
happen because they still want to, you know, be angry,
which is fine. I've recognized that and it's valid, but
you know, in order for them to really heal and
(25:14):
understand that we can't be so angry forever. That that
was the best way to move forward. I mean, how
else are they going to grow? You know, That's that's
how growth happens.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Well, being angry only hurts us at the end, anyway,
you know. Yeah, yeah, So let's talk about VS. What
did you think when Victoria's Secret first reached out to you?
What went through your mind?
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Oh? Man, I was a little bit nervous because as
we were just talking about you know, of course, there's
a lot of like feelings and opinions surrounding Victoria's Secret
and also some interesting facts. But I think for a
while I was just kind of on pause for it.
But once I really understood the project, once I really
(26:00):
understood the changes that were being made, once I really
understood where the brand was that, you know, I really
wanted to get a feel of what was going on,
or I just wanted to make sure that I was
in alignment. And once I started to have those open conversations,
and you know, once I started to really learn more
about what the show was going to be like, and
(26:22):
what the brand was about and what it was looking
like compared to what it used to look like.
Speaker 1 (26:26):
I was very.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Actually impressed and actually kind of excited seeing that, Like, look,
this is what I'm talking about, Like change is happening,
change is possible, and it can be positive, you know.
And I was really excited because I know that creatively,
there's so much to explore in the world, and you know,
(26:50):
with this kind of opportunity with the show, I was
so excited because I was like, man, I know this
is going to open up opportunity for so much more,
you know, in terms of like what VS used to be.
I know this is going to be amazing, and it is.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
It is, right, Yeah, it's incredible, it really is. What
did you think when you first saw the film, Because
I saw a trailer and I was blown away. I
just was like, man, this is something else. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
I was definitely blown away too.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
I mean I thought it was so cool.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
I thought it was so different, and I love that
they you know, explored that creative realm that I was
just talking about. They really did go in different directions,
and I thought it was so cool because you know,
I feel like a lot of people are kind of
scared to do that or shy away from that, and
they kind of want to stick to, you know, things
that people are used to. But I really loved the
(27:50):
idea of it all, and I loved the different messages
with all of the visuals, and how there was so
much beauty and inclusive and you know, it was so
fun too, Like it was almost like you just couldn't
take your eyes off the screen because not only was
there obviously beautiful women to look at and beautiful people
(28:11):
to look at, but the visuals in the art of
it was also within its own beauty and it was
so cool to see. And I loved being a part
of it. I mean, I was in awe. I had
so much fun. I loved my look and I thought
it was so different and interesting. I mean I remember
being on set and then being like, all right, this
(28:32):
is the vibe, this is the mood, and I was like,
oh okay, like okay, like no like blow kisses or anything.
They're like, no, we're doing this, you know. They they
really went into it, and I was like, oh, this
is gonna be so cool and so different and can't
wait to see it. So I'm very satisfied with how
it all turned out. Yeah, it's incredible. I have one
last question. To ask you, which is what does authenticity
(28:55):
mean to you? I really just mean staying true to
who you are, you know, and that's something that I
have been honored and privileged to do. And my work
is stay authentic to who I am and to my
people and to my culture and my ways of life.
I mean, I don't let this world of fashion and
this industry kind of take away from that part of myself.
(29:19):
If anything adds more to it. You know, it's also
beautiful to see that, you know, Vies really did stay
authentic to different models. I mean, every model stayed true
to who they were, and they felt good. And every
single model that I talked to felt of course sexy
and felt cute and felt amazing. And so that was
the funnest part for me, was me feeling very authentic
(29:41):
and into who I am. But I also felt, you know,
Victoria's secret authentic because I still felt like, in a
way they stayed authentic to who they were, which was
being iconic and still bringing out, you know, some of
the most iconic models and giving us the show and
also giving us this amazing crezyative space to play with.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
Wanta, thank you so much for your time. It's been
so lovely to learn about you and you get to
know you a little bit. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Thank you so much for having me. I had so
much fun and I'm so thankful to be here and
have this conversation.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
So thank you, thank you. You have been listening to
VS Voices, the official companion podcast to the VS World Tour.
My thanks to today's guest, and if you love our show,
please comment, like and follow us wherever you listen to
your favorite podcasts, and as always, you can join me
(30:39):
Amman Decademy on Instagram. VS Voices is part of Victoria's Secrets,
ongoing commitment to creating positive change for women. Together, we
are amplifying the voices and perspectives of women from all backgrounds,
and please remember that sharing stories brings us closer together.
Thank you for listening.
Welcome to VS Voices. I'm Amanda Decademy. Quana Chasing Horse
is an Indigenous model. She's using her platform to champion
indigenous culture and climate justice. In this interview, we talk
about growing up in a matriarchal family and how her
advocacy led to a career in fashion. Kwanna, I'm so
pleased to meet you. Thank you for taking the time.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
I'm so happy to be here. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
You're so welcome. I wanted to start our interview by
talking about how you grew up because I watched this
incredible documentary on you and I was so riveted. Your
life is so fascinating to me. You're a member of
the han Guachin tribe and you were raised in Fairbanks, Alaska,
(00:49):
which is an area that's often referred to as ground
zero for climate change. In interviews, you talk about growing
up in a family of matriarchs, which was amazing to hear.
Can you tell me exactly what that means for any
listeners who may be aunt Shaw.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, So I come from Alaska, as you just stated,
and my people are the Honokuchen people, and we have,
you know, for millennia, been known to be land protectors
and you know, stewards of the land and where I
come from is very different from what I'm now walking into,
(01:30):
I guess, you know. And my documentary is actually called
Walking two Worlds. But yeah, a lot of my work
before modeling, before I entered the industry, was just advocacy
work and doing a lot of environmental work, doing a
lot of land protection work, and just awareness on different
(01:52):
issues within the native community, native sovereignty and all kinds
of stuff. So I have always had this voice and
this drive inside of me to just show up every
day as a good person, as a better person as
I grow. And I've just been very thankful to, you know,
(02:12):
walk into this industry and have people really wanting to
learn and understand. And I've had many amazing opportunities to
work with brands that are willing to make changes, that
are you know, making changes already and just want to
amplify that by giving my voice and my existent space
(02:36):
to take up that space to show up and do
my part. And so my work has been kind of
all across the board. But who I am is the
foundation of the values and the path that I walk
as an Indigenous person in these spaces. I have to
always show up in a good way because I know
I'm representing not just myself, but I'm representing my community.
(02:59):
And I've had amazing opportunities to do that and to
show our resilience and to show, you know, how we
can take up space and we can show up as
ourselves and be proud of who we are and to
be celebrated in that way and not be changed or
modified in a way that this outside world perceives us
(03:22):
as as you know, the stereotypes and those are things
that we're constantly undoing and you know, trying to teach
people how every tribe, every people's are different and we
all come from you know, different walks of life, but
we do share very similar, if not the same values.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Well that was that was when I was listening to
you speak, I was thinking, these are lessons for everybody, right,
you know exactly.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Yeah, that's and that's the kind of messaging I've been
trying to do through this is just that like it's
not just you know, it doesn't it just apply to
us as native or indigenous people. It applies to everybody,
and it can benefit everybody.
Speaker 1 (04:04):
What do you think are some of the strongest values
that your mother and grandmother instilled in you as a
young girl.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
A lot of things, honestly, but a lot of what
they repeated to me were things that you know, we'd
always be like, yeah, I know, or you know, just
kind of would brush off because you hear them repeat it,
and when you're younger, you don't understand that those words.
They seem so repetitive or you're just like whatever, I know.
But there's so much to learn from them, and they
always hold a lesson or always have some sort of
(04:37):
advice in them. So for me, that was never forget
who you are and where you come from. And my
mom repeated that to me, and it got to a
point where I would always, you know, leave the house
and she'd be like, remember who you are and where
you come from.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
And I love that a lot of moms are like,
don't drink too much, make sure you don't get into trouble,
and your mom is like telling you, don't forget who
you are and where you come from.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Yeah, And I think that's how I stayed out of
trouble actually, because you know, I would show up in
a space and I would think, Okay, how would I
want to honor my people and showing up in this space,
how would I want to be seen? How would I
want to be perceived? And so it's not always about
looking for you know, validation or anything. It's really just
(05:23):
how I feel good in making sure that when I
show up in a space, that I show up in
the right way and I come correct, you know. And
that's the best way I can think about it. But
it's okay to like, you know, have fun and as
long as it's you stays professional and you're able to
show up in a space and do your work in
a good way and represent in a good way, and
(05:46):
you know, make sure that people understand that you're not
the stereotype and that you know, we all have different
I guess, versions and visions for our own people and ourselves.
For me, that's just showing up in a good way.
And even if I do want to have fun, I
also want to make sure that you know, when I'm
(06:07):
having fun, I'm not doing it in a way where
I can jeopardize things for myself. And so I just
want to make sure that I always stay true to
who I am as a person, but also stay true
to who I am as an Indigenous person in terms
of like, you know, I hold myself at a higher
standard where I make sure that I'm showing up and
(06:28):
doing good work.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
Where did you get such a sense of value for yourself,
Because not everybody goes out into the world with such
a strong sense of self. Where do you think that
came from?
Speaker 2 (06:40):
It was really just you know, being taught by my
mom and my grandma and all the women and matriarchs
in my family. I've just had such great examples and
really really strong women to show me that they can
do it all themselves. You know, they don't need anybody,
they don't need anything. They will always make it for themselves.
(07:01):
And you know, I always saw that resilience and strength
and power through them, and I learned everything from them.
I mean, every single one of them plays a really really,
very valid and strong role in all of our communities.
I mean, my mom has played many roles, you know,
in terms of like she was in law enforcement for
(07:22):
our tribes, and she protected our people, and she's an advocate,
you know, and she's been on the front lines for
many different things. She's been constantly serving our people, and
all my aunties as well. I mean, they all you know,
work for Native nonprofits, or their professors at a college
teaching tribal sovereignty, and you know, they're always showing up
(07:43):
and they're always doing such a great job at making
sure that their work and their people, you know, are
not just for nothing, and that they put all of
their heart and passion into it. And with that example,
everything that I've done, you know, is with good intention
and with love and with care. And especially my advocacy work,
(08:06):
you know, I don't just do it just to do it.
I don't just you know, go out there and try
to advocate to make myself look good or I've been
doing it since I was a child. I grew into it,
you know, I grew up in the movement. I was
raised to have a voice. Yes, it's not performative, no, never,
And it's it's a passion of mine. It's a passion
(08:27):
and it's not just something that I choose to do
or want to have fun doing. It's a fire inside
of me and it's been there since I was a child,
and you know, when I first understood and learned who
I am and how the world perceives me and how
I have to face different challenges in my lifetime. So
you know, that's important, you know, it's just having such
(08:50):
strong people around you. And I really do believe in
keeping your circle small in terms of like knowing how
to protect your heart, your spirit, your power, your space.
It's important to protect yourself so you can show up
in a good way.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Yeah, and especially as you moved from Alaska to America,
that must have been a significant culture shock. I would
imagine how was that for you.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
It was definitely a huge culture shock because you know,
I'm still kind of getting used to everything. I grew
up eating very traditional foods. So I grew up hunting
and fishing in the woods. You know, my mom is
a dog musher in the wintertime. That was our transportation.
I grew up a very traditional lifestyle. And you know,
(09:35):
my mom, being a single parent my whole life, she
herself had to really you know, she always went hunting.
She knew how to hunt, she knew how to fish,
all of those things, but she had to really learn
how to do everything herself, and with three kids. And
so I've been hunting since I could walk basically, or
even before that. She would pack me out in her
(09:55):
backpack and go hunting. So she always, always, you know,
was a very traditional person and made sure that we
understood who we are and where we come from. But
she also made sure that we were taught these values
and these cultures and traditions so that we can carry
them on, but also so that we can show the
world that, you know, our culture, our traditions, they're beautiful
(10:18):
and there there's always a lesson to be learned, and
there's always a reason for everything, and everything has such value.
And we never separated ourselves from nature. I think that's
the biggest lesson and when you're learning from indigenous cultures
is that we have never separated ourselves from nature. Because
you know, if you really look at the statistics, eighty
(10:40):
percent of the world's biodiversity is protected by indigenous peoples,
and indigenous people only take up five percent of the
world's population, and so you know, that's a huge statistic
and that's you know, a crazy number if you really
think about it. And it's because we never separated ourselves
from nature. We're always talking about, you know, and it
(11:01):
sounds cheesy, but like being one with nature. But how
I see it is we are nature. We are nature
in itself, and we're a part of this life cycle
and we will always recognize that and see that, you know,
our plants, our animals, the land is our relative and
we got to treat it that way. And so that's
(11:22):
kind of what guides me through my journey and how
my mom raised me.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
I agree with you. I feel like so much of
the issues that people experience are from not only that
separation from self, but separation from nature. So how has
it been for you living in a city. Los Angeles
has more nature than many cities in America, but it
is extremely different how you staying connected to yourself. Since
(11:51):
you're living in an environment that's very different than what
you're used to.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
It can be challenging. You know. I've actually, you know,
in my documentary kind of touched on how I've had
a lot of anxiety and I've always been diagnosed with
severe anxiety and major depressive disorder and you know, all
of the all the fun, non fun mental health things.
But you know, when I moved away from home, it
(12:15):
was a lot harder to face those challenges because they
didn't have the outlets that I normally had, and that
was you know, my family, that was our culture, that
was our songs, our traditional foods, all of those things.
That's medicine for me. The ritual, Yes, that is medicine
for me. And it's good medicine. And you know, and
(12:37):
I was just talking about, you know, living that traditional
life and having traditional foods. I don't always have access
to that, you know, And I don't always have access
to everything that my people have back at home. And
I talked about missing out, and that's one of my fears,
is not being able to go back home and do
these things because in a few years those things could
(12:59):
be gone.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
I noticed that actually, when you were speaking about your
anxiety about missing out you were in your documentary. It
was so beautiful and powerful and made me sad to
see how I don't want to say destroyed, but you
obviously felt very upset about missing your home and your
(13:21):
concerned that those things weren't going to be available to you.
So how do you provide tools for yourself to ground
who you are and to give yourself the nourishment because
it's no, you can't compare. There's such different cultures. So
I'm just curious, like, it must be very difficult, and
(13:42):
how do you support yourself.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I thankfully have a very amazing family that you know,
does do all of those things. But what's amazing is
that they always make sure that they always find a
way to include me, and they always, you know, will
send me packages of goodies from home. So like I
(14:06):
missed berry season and I missed hunting season, I've missed
a lot of things since I moved and since I've
been working. And that's fine, you know, you have to
make sacrifices, but you know, those things, it's what really
keeps me grounded. And so when I do go home,
you know, they always spoil me with moose meat or
(14:27):
caribou meat, or salmon or fish or berries, or sometimes
I'll get packages from my aunties or they'll send jars
of fresh blueberry jam that they picked, and you know,
all of the special things that make home home and
feel like home. They we'll make sure that I get
that here. But I also, I really do love outdoors,
(14:48):
so any chance I get, I try to really go
outside a lot. And I have a dog and we
go on hikes and we play outside, and I try
to stay busy, but I also try to make sure
that I rest because you know, busy life, and you know,
make sure I'm resting, but also prioritizing things that keep
(15:09):
me happy and healthy.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
Yeah, I mean you talked about having anxiety and mental
health challenges, and you know, I also understand that very well.
And for me, the things that are self soothing and
are part of my self care routine, when those get disrupted,
it becomes much harder to manage those mental health challenges.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
It really really does. And I've really learned to kind
of just take it day by day and move through
the motions. I mean, you can't take anything too too seriously,
and I've had to learn to not take myself too
seriously because you know, there's so much beauty and joy
(15:56):
and you know, just amazing things in the world world,
and as long as you know, of course, the horrific things.
But we have to find the light in those dark
moments because that's how you survive, you know, that's how
you live on, that's how you grow, that's how you
learn from each other, that's how you turn. You know,
unfortunately sad things to beautiful things is when you can
(16:20):
find the beauty in it and understanding that things happen
for a reason. And I've had to really take the
steps necessary to make sure that I'm taking care of
myself and you know, of course I have my bad days.
Everyone has their bad days. But of course, again I
try not to take it too seriously, and I always
try to find the beauty and the light and the darkness,
(16:43):
and you know, I really just try to surround myself
with good people, and you know, I do have amazing resources,
and I do have an amazing support system and an
amazing community that I know I'm very very well loved.
So that's something that definitely helps, is you know, having
community and having amazing people around you to remind you
(17:04):
that you know that they love you and that you're
worth it, and that everything you know. For me too,
I feel like I'm always having to deal with imposter
syndrome where I'm like I don't do I deserve this,
do I? You know? Or like I'll get invited to
something really cool or you know, I've won a few awards,
and every time I've wanted an award, I've always just
you know, felt like an impostor like I didn't deserve it,
(17:25):
or I'm not doing enough or I need to do more.
And I've had to just really tell myself that, you know,
I'm doing enough, and I'm gonna obviously continue to do more,
but not to be too hot on myself and to
understand that I'm just taking life as it is, and
that's okay.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
I mean that's the only way to take it. Exactly,
I mean exactly. So, how would you say your life
changed when social media allowed people to meet you? Because
prior to that, you were just you were living your
(18:04):
life in Alaska. And then once social media introduced you
to a lodge, your audience of people, how did your
life change at that point?
Speaker 2 (18:13):
Oh? Man, It's really opened up a whole new world
for me. I mean, I've learned so much. I've met
so many different people from different walks of life. And
you know, I've gotten opportunities I've never even dreamed of,
or that I've dreamed of or I never even thought
it would even come close to accomplishing, or you know,
(18:36):
I've just had such amazing opportunities and so many dreams
come true. And this world of social media really is, honestly,
it's a whole other world. Like it's a whole different
thing than what I'm used to. And so when I
started to make a little bit of a following through
my advocacy work, I was very like, Okay, I'm going
(18:57):
to use my platform to continue to do good work.
That was all I was trying to do was just
you know, show up for my people and do good
work and make sure that what I'm doing is in
a good way but right. You know, I need to
make sure that what I'm doing is right and that
I use it as a tool to spread awareness, to
(19:18):
share information, and to also connect with people. And the
more I've been able to connect with people and also
humanize myself because I feel like, you know, models and
different people in the industry, celebrities, people with huge followings,
like they forget that we're people too, And I really
just try to humanize myself so people understand that I'm
(19:41):
just a person taking life day by day and that
I'm not perfect and I'm going to make mistakes. But
I also am a very open minded person. And I
really really do love seeing it also not just be
used as a tool, but also a way to connect
with people and you know, share your life for not
share your life, you know, either way, I've just loved
(20:04):
to use it to you know, do good work but
see the world in a different way.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
I guess I love how you have brought impact into
so many of your fashion opportunities. It seems like that
is a win win for you and for the brand
that you're working with, because there are brands that just
pay lip service to whatever initiative it is, and then
(20:32):
there are brands who really genuinely do care about specific issues.
And from what I can see, it's been lovely to
see how much you have inspired the companies you're working
with to give platform to the issues that are important
to you.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
That's like the biggest thing is that I've been, you know,
just dreaming of an opportunity where I can do both,
you know, where I can show up and do work,
show up for my community, but also do good work
in another whole other industry, you know. And to be
able to do both and to be a model and
(21:13):
to live my dream, but to also continue to spread
that awareness and bring that work into the fashion world,
that's just the best of both worlds, it is, you know,
And I'm so thankful that I've gotten those opportunities, because
it really is amazing to see this industry and these
(21:33):
brands wanting to do better, to change, to really see
that there's always room for improvement, I mean, always room
for improvement. I feel like people get so caught up
on thinking, Oh, these brands think they're doing the right
thing or whatever. Like I feel like everyone knows that
there's always room for improvement, and I think that's been
kind of my thing, is opening up that conversation and
(21:55):
sharing that space and helping encourage or inspire that change,
and maybe even collaborating and working with them on how
to how to create that change, or even you know,
directing them on how to make a shift, or even
if they want to make a donation within their brand
to donate to you know, nonprofit organizations that are on
(22:17):
the frontlines doing good work. And so that's just been
my thing, is opening up those conversations, getting the opportunity
and also hopefully getting other people open to working with
these brands, open to seeing that. You know, a lot
of I see a lot of activists, a lot of
people just thinking, oh, well, they did this one bad thing,
(22:37):
and they like shame you for working with them, even
though maybe they have apologized or they move past it
or they've you know, done the right things since then.
It's like, you know, so much of the past is
always held against you, and so I'm always just trying
to also have that conversation with people that it's possible
to change, that we need to change with it, that
we need to encourage that change, that we need to
(22:59):
accept that change and understand that yes, mistakes are made,
but it's possible to do better.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
And when people genuinely and sincerely from a place of
authenticity want to make positive change, me personally, I want
to support that change. It's one of the main reasons
why I chose to work with Victoria's Secret personally, because
I saw genuine change across the entire company, from the
(23:26):
leadership team across the board, a genuine desire to make significant,
impactful change. And I want to be a part of
an organization and support any company that says we want
to do better and here's how we're going to do it.
That to me is like, if we're holding everybody to
every mistake, then how can we ever move forward?
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Exactly. That's been my thing is like, you know, a
lot of people are always trying to shove a lot
of things in my face of brands in their past,
and I'm like, look, I think it's so important that
we have these conversations and yes that unfortunately these things
did happen and they did affect people, but we can't
just hold on to those things because no one's going
(24:11):
to heal. This is about healing at this point. This
is about doing the right thing and creating that space
for people to heal, to understand that, yes, you know,
some of these things may have harmed people, but it's
our job and our responsibility. You know, if we have
hurt somebody to be a part of that healing process
and you know, doing the right thing, it's right. So
(24:32):
that's just been a big conversation that I've been having.
I mean, I'm not want to go back, you know,
freakin do back and forth with people in comment sections
or I'm not want to really have arguments with people
about stuff like that because it's really just like, man,
if you really want to hold on to those things,
you can, I'm not going to fight you on it
(24:53):
because I feel like there's a lot of people that
aren't ready for that kind of change. You know, they
ask for it and they want but some people are
still so hurt that they're not ready for it to
happen because they still want to, you know, be angry,
which is fine. I've recognized that and it's valid, but
you know, in order for them to really heal and
(25:14):
understand that we can't be so angry forever. That that
was the best way to move forward. I mean, how
else are they going to grow? You know, That's that's
how growth happens.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Well, being angry only hurts us at the end, anyway,
you know. Yeah, yeah, So let's talk about VS. What
did you think when Victoria's Secret first reached out to you?
What went through your mind?
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Oh? Man, I was a little bit nervous because as
we were just talking about you know, of course, there's
a lot of like feelings and opinions surrounding Victoria's Secret
and also some interesting facts. But I think for a
while I was just kind of on pause for it.
But once I really understood the project, once I really
(26:00):
understood the changes that were being made, once I really
understood where the brand was that, you know, I really
wanted to get a feel of what was going on,
or I just wanted to make sure that I was
in alignment. And once I started to have those open conversations,
and you know, once I started to really learn more
about what the show was going to be like, and
(26:22):
what the brand was about and what it was looking
like compared to what it used to look like.
Speaker 1 (26:26):
I was very.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
Actually impressed and actually kind of excited seeing that, Like, look,
this is what I'm talking about, Like change is happening,
change is possible, and it can be positive, you know.
And I was really excited because I know that creatively,
there's so much to explore in the world, and you know,
(26:50):
with this kind of opportunity with the show, I was
so excited because I was like, man, I know this
is going to open up opportunity for so much more,
you know, in terms of like what VS used to be.
I know this is going to be amazing, and it is.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
It is, right, Yeah, it's incredible, it really is. What
did you think when you first saw the film, Because
I saw a trailer and I was blown away. I
just was like, man, this is something else. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
I was definitely blown away too.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
I mean I thought it was so cool.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
I thought it was so different, and I love that
they you know, explored that creative realm that I was
just talking about. They really did go in different directions,
and I thought it was so cool because you know,
I feel like a lot of people are kind of
scared to do that or shy away from that, and
they kind of want to stick to, you know, things
that people are used to. But I really loved the
(27:50):
idea of it all, and I loved the different messages
with all of the visuals, and how there was so
much beauty and inclusive and you know, it was so
fun too, Like it was almost like you just couldn't
take your eyes off the screen because not only was
there obviously beautiful women to look at and beautiful people
(28:11):
to look at, but the visuals in the art of
it was also within its own beauty and it was
so cool to see. And I loved being a part
of it. I mean, I was in awe. I had
so much fun. I loved my look and I thought
it was so different and interesting. I mean I remember
being on set and then being like, all right, this
(28:32):
is the vibe, this is the mood, and I was like,
oh okay, like okay, like no like blow kisses or anything.
They're like, no, we're doing this, you know. They they
really went into it, and I was like, oh, this
is gonna be so cool and so different and can't
wait to see it. So I'm very satisfied with how
it all turned out. Yeah, it's incredible. I have one
last question. To ask you, which is what does authenticity
(28:55):
mean to you? I really just mean staying true to
who you are, you know, and that's something that I
have been honored and privileged to do. And my work
is stay authentic to who I am and to my
people and to my culture and my ways of life.
I mean, I don't let this world of fashion and
this industry kind of take away from that part of myself.
(29:19):
If anything adds more to it. You know, it's also
beautiful to see that, you know, Vies really did stay
authentic to different models. I mean, every model stayed true
to who they were, and they felt good. And every
single model that I talked to felt of course sexy
and felt cute and felt amazing. And so that was
the funnest part for me, was me feeling very authentic
(29:41):
and into who I am. But I also felt, you know,
Victoria's secret authentic because I still felt like, in a
way they stayed authentic to who they were, which was
being iconic and still bringing out, you know, some of
the most iconic models and giving us the show and
also giving us this amazing crezyative space to play with.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
Wanta, thank you so much for your time. It's been
so lovely to learn about you and you get to
know you a little bit. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Thank you so much for having me. I had so
much fun and I'm so thankful to be here and
have this conversation.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
So thank you, thank you. You have been listening to
VS Voices, the official companion podcast to the VS World Tour.
My thanks to today's guest, and if you love our show,
please comment, like and follow us wherever you listen to
your favorite podcasts, and as always, you can join me
(30:39):
Amman Decademy on Instagram. VS Voices is part of Victoria's Secrets,
ongoing commitment to creating positive change for women. Together, we
are amplifying the voices and perspectives of women from all backgrounds,
and please remember that sharing stories brings us closer together.
Thank you for listening.
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