Attack on the Alphabet Mafia

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:04):
You are listening to Waiting on Reparations, the production of
I Heart Radio. Ay, what is happening? It's Dope Knife
and we are waiting give me My Money money Yes,
also known as also known as Waiting on Reparation of

(00:24):
the show. The name of the game is getting that Bag.
And this week we are very excited to be joined
by our guest Christen K Chris, one half of the
dynamic duo that is Moody Black, who you guys will
be seeing touring the country with Pussyfer so be on

(00:45):
the lookout for that. But K, how are you doing.
I'm all right, yeah, I'm thanks for the intro, so
I'm happy to be here. Got the message a couple
of days ago from you, Dope Knife, and I was like,
all right, I'll do it. I haven't really been feeling
like talking a lot we on podcasts and stuff like that,
but I guess I'll do it for you. Thank you,
thank you, thank you. I feel like the world of

(01:09):
like indie wrap that is good is very small, and
so I've like I been aware of you for a
long time, so it's like very like exciting too. What
do you do? You do? You consider what you do?
To be indie wrap these days. I mean, I guess
the people if people, uh if people think that. Yeah,
but I feel like we were. I was doing indie

(01:31):
wrap a very very long time ago, and I feel
like I'm still part of your standing. No it's not,
It's still it's still relevant because it's you know, we
we built a following, you like in those indie rap circles,
but I think it was only like two percent of
what we do. Uh So it was kind of, you know,
in retrospect, you know, maybe not the greatest audience for

(01:52):
us to just be stuck in for so long, even
though we love I wouldn't be here today without indie rap,
not that I'm anywhere, but so so Okay, So before
we get into a broader conversation, why don't you, you know,
why don't you give a little uh overview to our
listeners just who you are and what you do? Uh Well,
my name again, my name is, It's I have all

(02:13):
sorts of names. It's k Death, Chris Kristen. I'm a.
I'm a I'm a I consider myself first and foremost
a rapper, as weird as that is. I'm a rapper, artist, musician,
and then everything else people can classify me as. I
don't like calling myself an activist, but I get caught up, uh,
you know, being a voice, I guess, or giving my

(02:35):
perspective that tends to be a voice for a lot
of people. Um, according to them. I don't like. I hate.
I hate when people call themselves activists necessarily because I
don't know, it's just a weird thing to say that
about yourself. I feel that, I feel that yeah yeah,
and it's call me all the time. I'm just like,
I'm not gonna argue with you. I don't have time
to like mince words, but like, okay, call you that. Yeah. Well,

(02:58):
I think I think it's well. I think it's one
those things that other people should maybe like, like calling
you if they feel like um. But anyway, I've been
doing that, and I guess I'm also um. This is
an odd left turn. But I'm also a cook. I cook,
and I own a We own a taco shop now,
which is just another thing, another idea that we started

(03:18):
with Moody Black when the pandemic hit and we couldn't
tour anymore, and we decided to make tacos to sustain ourselves.
Man which so I mean, is there like a theme
to the the tacos or it's not like any type
of taco. Well they're all moody, black themed. But no,
the the the basis of the food that we have
is is we call it New Era text mex and

(03:40):
it's just taking all the stuff that I grew up
with in O Passo, a lot of the Southwest flavors,
mixing my Mexican and my black side because I'm Mexican
and black, and we put them together and we we
kind of bridge those gaps in the food world. And
we've been doing oddly enough, really really well. I have
no idea why I'm not. I've never I was a
prep shot for a little bit and we worked on

(04:01):
taco truck in l A for a little bit, and
then I've been cooking at home forever and we opened
a place and it's just been it's uh, it's saved
our our lives in a lot of way. That was.
That was so, I mean, like I heard that you're
you know, and I know there's a hip hop show,
but you are going on tour with Postopher, which is

(04:21):
like kind of a big fucking deal for us in
the indie music scene, you know what I mean, Like
whenever some of something like this comes along. So how
did that come along for you? It had everything to
do really well, had a lot to do with movie Black,
but everything to do with the Tacos as weird as
that is. Um, We've been working for a long time.
I've been doing music for or like actively doing shows

(04:44):
and rapping and doing music for sixteen years. And UM,
we've been Every step of the way has been a
battle because we've done really weird quote unquote what other
people consider to be weird rap music. UM. And it's
never been easy for us. We've never fit in hip hop,
never wanted anything to do with us. UM. Yet we still,
you know, we we still participated in at the best

(05:05):
we could. UM. And so sixteen years later, one of
the biggest opportunities we ever had kind of happened when
I decided to stop caring so much about trying to
make it in music. Uh. That didn't mean that I
really like I gave it up. It just meant that mentally,
as you know, dope Knife, we can get so focused
on what we want in this business, UM that I

(05:26):
think you start pushing it pushing it away. UM. And
when I switched that focus too, I'm gonna work on tacos.
But in the back of my mind, I was like,
this is gonna help Moody Black. It's a weird thought, um,
But as you know, I also do my own podcast,
and for years I was interviewing people and one of
the things I found out was that the people that
were successful in the music industry were like, did it

(05:48):
on accident. They weren't usually people that were like, yeah,
I really want to make it and and grinding and
trying to network and figure out all this stuff. It
was more like, oh, I you know, somebody saw me
and then I got a break, or you know, I
got lucky with the YouTube. It was It's usually like that,
and so I kind of just I thought that putting
my energy somewhere else would attract uh, better opportunities for

(06:10):
Moody Black. And I really didn't think it was gonna happen,
and it really happened. It shocked It shocked me. I
was like blown away because people talk about manifesting and
all that. You know, you Anthony Robbins, I did all
that stuff. I went to see a sports psychologist when
I was in college. I got I knew all about
all that, like positive thinking, and I tried to institute that,
but it's so vague and it's so ridiculous. Um, but

(06:35):
it worked as odd oddly enough. But that was also
because we worked really hard for sixteen years. And so
anyway we was because of the top of the spot
or in part Uh Maynard Keenan from Tool the lead
sing or a Tool Pousifer Perfect Circle. Um. His wife
and him run uh a winery in Jerome, Arizona, in

(06:57):
the middle of the desert. Weird again because tour We're
from a Z A lot of the foundation Moody Black
was about the desert. Um. There's a lot of backstory. Again,
I don't want to go too far away from what
we're talking about, but it all went back to the
desert and his wife was playing our music while they
were making wine. Uh. We're we're part of like a
lot of playlists that Maynard would put together. Yeah, they

(07:19):
make wine and then they play like people's bands and
music that they like to the wine to like help
it mature. Maynards nuts. Yeah they're crazy, um, but it
could makes sense, right, you know, talk to plants and
but they so they that's how his wife was like
a big fan. I didn't know that because she was
on Instagram and I didn't know who she was. I
was like, oh, it's so cool, just another supporter. And

(07:42):
then um, I just I didn't even know about that.
And that's going on, and one day I get a message,
I think she messaged me on Instagram like oh, we
got somebody coming out from our winery to talk to you.
And I was like, yeah, okay, whatever, didn't think about it.
And then we're doing a Saturday morning brunt service at
our at our spot here in Minneapolis, just serving breakfast tacos,

(08:05):
and this agent from the winery slash Maynards team comes
in and he's like, oh yeah, like I'm from like
Pussifer and Tooling all these people, and we just wanted
to come try a spot. They bought like a bunch
of tacos and bought our merch and he was like, yeah,
it was it was so weird. Um, and so yeah,

(08:29):
we just had a good conversation. And then he's like,
if you get an email, it was so weird. It's
like a movie, like it's like stuff that it doesn't happen.
And especially again because dope, you know, like in the
indie world, like it's not you hear stories and you're like, yeah,
that's just so lucky. But like it was happening, and
he was like, if you get an email, like that's
really Maynard, And I was like what And the next thing,

(08:50):
I know, it wasn't even it wasn't an email, but
like then Maynard just started direct messaging me and then
we just started talking and we hit it off because
he loved he likes to talk I don't know how
much he wants to me to tell about he he
obsesses about food and like cooking, and so that's what
we like peeked out on. And then next thing you know,
that management is calling me and then that's who are
set up? That's crazy, man, Well well hold on, do

(09:15):
you have any stories like that. I'm just like random
coincidences that led you into like insane musical adventures nack. Yeah, okay,
so shit. Kind of the way that the podcast came together,
it would probably be one of those stories. True, we
don't even really know each other that well yeah, well
know we we we knew each other, but I just

(09:37):
knee like we it was it was we were doing
like a random show you know what I mean. When
we got approached about doing it, that easily could have
been I can't make it up to Athens this weekend,
you know what I mean. It was one of those
things where it was like the circumstances for you had
to be right for you to even ask me to
be there, and then us doing the show together and

(09:59):
have you know that dying amic and the chemistry and
stuff like that. But I guess for me it would
probably be the whole um Sage Francis thing. St. Francis
is a you know, a I guess for for our St.
Francis is like a big indie rapper, right, definitely might.

(10:21):
But you know I had done that show to open
up for him, and uh, I think I want to say,
you know, I had made an impression. It was good.
That also was the first night that I met Mariah,
and we had talked in the in the crowd that night,
and then I want to say, like, yeah, no, we
didn't know each other that night like at all, Like

(10:41):
it was just it was that was cold. That was
the cold open. But but I mean afterwards, like maybe
three four months later, he hit me up at like
three in the morning and yeah, I just happened to
be up and he was. He hit me up on

(11:02):
like all of my stuff, like Facebook, email, like you
know what I mean, Twitter, like all the ships. So
I was like, oh damn, I guess it's like real
serious and from them is how I ended up getting
down with this label Strange Famous and dropping my record.
Then I was able to you know, I've been sustaining
my little indie rap career since, so you know that.
That's kind of my my one story there is the

(11:24):
time when young Buck from g Unit came to a
show I did in Tennessee and bought everything at the
merge table with like a huge iraq. It was pretty dope.
It was pretty flat. We took pictures and stuff, but um, yeah,
you know what you were talking earlier about how hip
hop never really accepted y'all or accepted you and what

(11:46):
you guys were doing and everything like that, and you
being a trans artist. In the news lately, there have
been a lot a lot of stories where it kind
of seems like a lot of the anti g B
t Q or anti transsentiment that's out there is kind
of it feels like it's culminating to some sort of

(12:08):
peak of some sort that I mean obviously is not good,
but I just we wanted to talk about that and
touch some of these stories and then also get some
of your thoughts on it, and you know, just some
of your general you know, your your origin story in
and how you feel in this climate, living as a
trans woman in this climate. So we will be right

(12:31):
back with all of that after the jump. All right,
and we're back. And I felt like opening with this
Huey Newton quote from nineteen seventy because you know, I'm
all about her sex nality and recognizing the ways our
stuck struggles are similar, also acknowledging our unique struggles and

(12:53):
you know, find us Alida area of people. And it
takes me back to this quote. Um. He says friends
are allowed to make mistakes. The enemy is not allowed
to make mistakes because his whole existence is a mistake
and we suffer from it. But the Women's Liberation Front
and the Gay of Liberation Front are friends. There are
potential allies, and we need as many allies as possible.

(13:13):
And so as we make the segue from Black History
Month and the Women's Month and talking about m issues
that impact all of this, ultimately, UM, though it impact
some folks more than others. Um to start of highlighting
the way that in liberation struggles historically, folks have um
you know, found those found those moments of solidarity like

(13:35):
you know what, I might not be going through this,
but uh, I see you, and I appreciate that as
somebody that you know lives in those intersections as like
weer person, woman, ish, uh, black person, et c. But
uh yeah, so should cry out here. I think that
I need it, damn sure. Is as we like, as

(13:56):
people become more open and out and we are evolving
in terms of our understanding of all the things that
you can be and accepting all the all the things
you can be, it makes sense that like the system
ramps up to like evolve, it's as well into new
forms of like trying to suppress folks because they don't know.

(14:17):
I don't know, they're scared. They're scared. They're like scared,
they might like sucking some dick or something like, I
don't know what I think. I mean, that looks kind
of tasty. I don't know, like I'm scared. I don't
I'm scared scared already know how I feel about that.
I feel like all of all of the conservative ship.
Of that ship is projection. Yo. When they say they

(14:39):
don't like gay people, it's because they want to be
in the bathroom stall anonymously with strangers. When they say
they don't like trans people, because they really think trans
women are attractive and they're scared, you know what I mean,
Like like, I mean, I mean that was no. I
mean people try to leverage that like homophobically when it's
like it's really okay, but like, I mean, so okay.

(15:05):
So let's let's let's recap the situation. I'm sure people
are well aware, but let's just recap. So one, the
year that just passed US was the deadliest year for
transgender and gender non conforming people in the US on record.
At least fifty transgender nonconforming people were killed this year alone,
per report by the lgbt Q advocacy organization, the Human

(15:27):
Rights Campaign. The report also makes it clear that the
full number of fatalities is likely higher still, as deaths
by trans people are usually under reported. Uh The Trevor Project,
which is the world's largest suicide prevention and crisis intervention
organization for young LGBTQ people, has published the results of
their annual survey on Mental Health of lgbt Q youth

(15:51):
in it found that fort had seriously considered attempting suicide
last year. This included more than half the transgender and
on buyer MARY respondents. As many of thirty one percent
Native and Indigenous UH surveyed participants reported having attempted suicide
in the last year. Finally, eight percent of Latin youth

(16:12):
and twenty and twelve percent of Asian and Pacific Islander
youth reported having attempted suicide as well. Um, that's cheerious. Fuck,
thank you, Mac. I want to I app man just
reading the words. Well, I mean, like we have to
really think about these things because like one of the

(16:34):
attacks that folks are in the leverage is that like,
well this is not the QUOTEO, this is not that
many people. But we have to really think in terms
of disproportionality that like, um, first of all, there's probably
a whole whole lot more people than you would realize
because folks, because of the cycle of suppression, et cetera,
at least raconian laws. Of course, people ain't gonna tell you, like,

(16:54):
you know, what they really got going on with them,
what they really are um, and so there's a lot
more people that we think then as well, Like if
you have such high margins of people feeling this way,
experiencing these things in a group, that's not that's it's horrifying.
That's bad, and that's bad. And I think, like, you know,
recognizing intersections of struggles like UM, the ways that other

(17:17):
groups are also like disproportionately impacted by things like police violence,
et cetera. The way that these systems all work together
to hold people down, perhaps in different ways, but like
you know, the I guess I say all this to
say that I find hope when addressing like glaring statistics
like these that when we kind of see what our

(17:38):
commonalities are and like also see perspectives that are different,
but like the ways that kind of cross paths, the
points it's like all right, like I can relate to
like I don't know, I wanted to kill myself or whatever.
I mean, I joke about it, but that's been a
real reality in my history. And so like, all right,
I see y'all, like let's like unite, let's like um

(18:01):
fight together. So I just want to uplift that because
some of this top it's really hard to talk about.
It's as really hard to talk about, but I do
feel very hopeful at this moment as well as like
more light is being shed on these issues that like
we have this, we can fight. I'm ready to fight, Chris, Chris.
Like earlier, we're talking about how things are, you know,
seems like they're on the up for you. But is

(18:22):
this anything that you kind of struggled with in your youth? Uh? Well,
at first, the first thing about that is we are
talking about disproportion or the proportion of those numbers. Is
a large amount of those numbers that you're seeing are
actually mostly largely black trans women. Uh, I mean, and
that that's even more alarming. Um, I mean, it's all alarming,

(18:43):
but that and that's been a trend for a long
long time. And talking about intersectionality even more in depth
you're looking at Uh that's it's it's so hard to
have this conversation because I'm always caught in all these
weird intersection alities Mexican black trand whatever it is. Um,
I'm everywhere, I mean all these things. And so what

(19:06):
I say is the critics what could sound like a criticism, Uh,
if I'm not black enough of a black community could
come across a certain way or so you have to
be a little bit. I don't really care, but like
to be mindful of others because I care, Like I
don't want to be I don't want to come across anyway.
But uh, bringing that tie into hip hop, where hip

(19:27):
hop is a largely black centered culture. I mean it,
it came from black culture, um. And then being a
trans uh woman inside of that that doesn't it's so
weird because this is where I get so caught up
because I can go like a thousand different avenues. Um.
It being uh like being a trans woman's one thing

(19:50):
in hip in hip hop or rap or whatever it
is music industry period um. But when uh, when you
The other problem that I get a lot is like
I don't look black. People don't think I'm black, so
like they treat black people will treat you a certain
different way they realize you're black, and then all of
a sudden it's totally different than it's a different way.

(20:11):
It's all good. Uh, I've had that my whole life. Um,
But now being oh no, yeah no, saying that's like
a light skinned person, They're like, well, which one of
your parents is why I actually neither of them, and
like why the fund are you asking like trying to challenge,
Like your experience is based on how you see em
and now where you've been. So yeah, so it's like
I've got I've gotten that static my whole life whatever. Um,

(20:33):
but nothing is is terrifying or dangerous or whatever. I've
never felt like uncomfortable until I came out as a
trans person and lived out as a trans person. That
was true. That's true, fear um every day of my life.
It doesn't go away because when I go out there,
I don't know. I live in North Minneapolis, which is

(20:53):
uh like a largely black Mexican neighborhood, and in those
neighborhoods on fortunately, I feel the least safe because I
get followed sometimes because people giving you looks. So whatever
it is or you know kind of you you've seen,
I mean, were witness. Yeah, we've yeah, we've when we

(21:15):
we went on tour before it was and like one
of the stops, I'm pretty sure it was like maybe
twelve miles outside of Chicago on like some ship like that,
and straight up like eight Nazis walked into the bar
and it was like a standoff and I mean when
I say eight Nazis, I don't mean like motherfucker's with

(21:37):
like haircuts I didn't like or so like I'm talking
like literal you know what I mean, like insignias and
shipped on their shirt Leo. It was like a real
tense situation and that was probably like my first time
really like you know, personally like being there, like, oh, man,
like I think we're gonna I think there's about to
be some violence going down because Christmas is that you're

(22:02):
a black dude that just said you said black, you're
black came in, but they're coming from me, like the
hierarchy exactly. I meant Christian no, no, no, but no,
neither of us were safe. But and I could totally
have been reading the whole situation wrong, but I really
do feel like if Chris wasn't there, if it was

(22:25):
just like me and Chesky and some of the other
cats who are on tour, that it would have just
been a night of dirty looks. Yeah you get in
that right. Chris being there felt like, oh, like we're
gonna have to you know what I mean, Like we're
gonna have to throw a boat, Like somebody's going to
try to start some ship that's gonna like cause there
to be a physical altercation. And that's an important that's

(22:47):
it's it's great you bring that up, because that's an
important difference that I think people need to hear more
about when we talk about those numbers that don't seem
big when they're like they're fifty, because people are missing
like how visceral the hate and and and biggot tree
is right now with trans people specifically, Like it's different,
it's not. And that's like with the Chappelle stuff, with
the jokes, Um, I get jokes, but right now is

(23:10):
not the time, Like it's not for trans people. This
is a legitimately dangerous situation and which Black culture looks
at Dave Chappelle like he's some sort of prophet um
and they're so influenced by that, and even joking about
trans people's invalidating the experience, and it just helps to
uh like to to fuel them, uh to make it

(23:31):
feel like it's okay to bully, to make it feel
like it's okay to kill, hurt, whatever it is. But
there's also and they're also like a tract if they're
also confused and conflicted because they're attracted and you know,
like a lot of trends women black trans women are
sex workers, which is awesome and I fully support get
your get your make your living. Yeah, like it's and

(23:52):
plus there's an audience for it. And that's what's so
frustrating too, is like you know that I mean a
lot of quote unquotes as people which are people that
are identified as the gender they were at birth and
are usually straight, said, dudes honestly are really into trans women.
Is just a fact. Well let me, um, let me
read some things that have been going on to kind

(24:14):
of relate to what you just said in terms of
how the atmosphere is right now. So, um, Marjorie Taylor Green,
who is the representative of this great state of Georgia.
So she was recently on the Alex Jones show or podcast.
I don't know what that nigga is relegated to right now,
but she was on the Alex Jones Ship and she

(24:37):
was talking about a counselor who identifies as they them
at like summer camp or something, and she was saying, well,
first off, my husband would have beat him into the
ground and then he'd be in jail. But that's exactly
what we need to do to stand up against this stuff.
And then elsewhere in the count we got Shelley Luther,

(25:00):
who is a former school teacher who's celebrated by in
conservative circles because she got arrested challenging like mask mandates
or so. She was on one of those viral videos
going crazy in a Walmart or Chipotle or some ship.
And um, she she was, you know, recently at a
in a debate, a primary debate, and she said, what

(25:23):
we have done is become comfortable pretty much, she's advocating
for kids being able to bully trans kids in schools.
Just she was like, what we have done has become
comfortable with what is okay in our society. I'm not
comfortable with transgenders. Uh, the kids that they brought in
my classroom when they said that this kid's transgender and

(25:46):
into a different sex, that I couldn't have kids laugh
at though. And then she gave a really long pause,
realizing what she had just said, before she continued, Um, elsewhere,
you've got uh, the Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton, who
offered a legal opinion that providing medical care and treatment

(26:09):
to adolescents with genderness for it could be child abuse,
so that caused Governor Abbott to order that it be
immediately investigated as to whether or not kids are getting
sex change procedures. Florida past that Don't Say Gay Bill,
which amongst a bunch of crazy shit at one point

(26:31):
and an incarnation of it, had it that teachers would
be outing kids forcibly like the ship is it's it's
getting nuts out there. So I'm just gonna pause real
quick and do a check in because this is all
super fucking heavy, Like, um, I just want to make
sure this is like okay to be talking about because

(26:52):
like I know, I mean for me personally as well,
Like this can be just like very just fucking like
traumatiz I thing to like read about and hear about
all the time. So I just wanted to make sure
we're like we're good, like it's like everything everybody's like
okay with this, just because like I don't know, I
don't want to yeah, like I don't know you for

(27:12):
as thought of I don't like talking about this kind
of stuff. No, We're totally good with it. I like
to talk about it, uh, and I read about it
every morning the first thing I do in the mornings.
That sounds really messed up. The first things I usually
do in the morning is I just type transgender news
and Google just to see what other rights they you know,
are at risk for me, or if I got to

(27:34):
change my passport real quick before they change it back. Um.
But it's so with with this, with this, with this
out like mask off, open out showing of like transphobian
bigotry by elected officials, even you know, like it being
Republicans in the sort of like low expectations that usually

(27:55):
have for Republicans is one thing, But this seems like
something new, Like this seems like a new flavor to
it or like a more bolder, emboldened sort of expression
of it. Do you sense that too is being somebody
who you said you read the news, you know you
see it. You see it also because all the stuff
that they're saying is untrue, Like it's not it's just
not true. Like there's no kids getting uh, sex change operations.

(28:18):
They don't operate on kids, period, it doesn't happen. When
it does happen, is more like with the CIS, people
that have kids that are intersex or what are blah
blah without the kids consent than they do whatever. Then
the kid comes out later it's like, hey, why did
you cut my ship off? Like I didn't done it. No,
they give like quote unquote cist children, like puberty blockers

(28:39):
that they have like precocious puberty well like which is fine,
which is fine, like more than you more than you
could realize. But because they're like gender normative quote unquote,
that's not a problem. It's not really about like doing
like certain medical procedures on people. Generally, it's only like
certain people that they don't want because they're fucking racist,

(28:59):
asshole like misogynists, like homophobic dickheads. And it's always it's
almost always all of all of it together and it
doesn't make it's just not yeah, and it's and they
twist all the narratives to fit what they're saying. And
because people don't know any better and aren't going to
go look at credible sources to to suss that out, uh,

(29:20):
they just go with it. And then that's compounded by
the jokes and stuff going on in media. That's compounded
by now it's it's multi tiered. So that's just those things.
But now they're attacking, uh, you know, the the athletes um.
So they're taking very small instances like Leiah Thomas from
Pen the swimmer that's been winning, which is an anomaly

(29:44):
because not it's not true that all trans women are
just dominating in sports, and go look at it, go
look at their placement. Even lead had not. I think
I was saying her name right, was not um necessarily
as dominant. Um So it's just like they're taking all
these names of conflating and then making us look really
really bad. It just sucks for me because it's like

(30:04):
when I first came out in two thousand and sixteen,
it was totally different. Um Um. I was like this
my whole I have an interview like it's it's it's
frustrating because I was like this my whole life. I
can't it's hard for me to convince people that that
think that that's not a thing. And so it's frustrating
because I know in my my brain and my heart
that it's like a legitimate thing, and that's something I've

(30:26):
dealt with. So I know this isn't a fad. I
know this isn't uh people just getting into this like
people think or another narrative of like oh they're just
this is just cool to do in school. I don't
know why anybody would want to go through all that
bigger trees. It just again, it doesn't add up when
you start looking at uh all that. But that's what's frustrating,
is it sucks that to be like, like I can't

(30:47):
just go out and do things because like I feel
like I'm a statement when I'm just trying to like
do my thing, and every day I go out there,
I know that people I don't know what they're thinking,
but I know it's out there, so I can feel
like the narrative of the world is projected on me
when I'm out about doing things. It's really that part sucks.
And then being a musician and stuff on top of

(31:07):
that kind of it's good and bad. It's like one
thing to like break barriers and be like, yes, this
is a trans woman, sounds like this looks like this
is gonna be a badass like this and fuck you,
but it's a whole another thing, like when they're hitting
me up on like social media and stuff like this
possifer thing is gonna be funny because it's already a
whole different level of getting weird weird comments and stuff

(31:29):
like that we were was very insulated in the indie
rap world. Oh yeah, I know. It's it's it's definitely
going to be an experience for you. Lets it's not.
It's not again, it's so weird because it's not about me. Like,
and that's the other thing with music right now that
I've been like, I all this cool stuff is happening,
but if you notice, like I'm I'm not, I'm trying

(31:51):
not to put too much out there. I feel weird
like promoting right now because like there's so much horrible
like yeah, these all these horrible things, and I'm like,
what does music have to do with this right now?
Like I'm like sitting here talking about like touring and
like like you know, like there's all this heavy stuff
going on. So it's weird. Like I don't know if
that's just me personally or if other people feel like

(32:12):
that now, or if it's just me getting old and
like feeling that way. I don't know. It happens in
waves for me, Like there's there's certain things that come up,
like certain I don't know whether I want to say stories,
but certain like events like world events that kind of
kill my motivation for things like that. Like music or

(32:33):
talking to people about my music or by album coming
out and stuff like that. For example, the biggest, you know,
elephant in the room was COVID. Like when COVID hit,
it just killed all creative drive I had for like
six months and I didn't do ship. Or when I
was in like high school in nine eleven happened. It
was like, you know, it's like it just just put

(32:56):
you know, like the political implications of it, you know,
you know aside. I wasn't even thinking like that back then.
It just put a damper over me expressing like joy
or happiness and like any other thing. It was like,
oh well, it's it's relatively a small thing compared to
this other ship that's going on, you know, yeah, Like
do you funny you say that? I was sorry, No,

(33:18):
I was just gonna ask if you felt Mariah felt
like that. I felt like particularly were talking about the pandemic,
or even just like the way the marshalization within hip hop,
like being like with everything going on right now, feeling
like you want to you know, promote things that you've
got going on, whatever whatever it may be, Like, do
you feel that way where it's like there's and you're

(33:39):
doing a lot of like important work. It's like it's
you know, I know you've got a lot of stuff
going on to like well, I mean even this podcast
I was able to follow. Um, so I was happy
when you first got it. By the way, I'm just
I never get a chance to talk to you all
too much, but um, I just, I mean even doing
this kind of thing is like to me, i'd be
I could be more invested in that because I like,

(34:00):
at least we're talking about relevant things as opposed to
like music music It's like I think I'm a god
in the songs, Like that's so dumb. Well okay, so
here's how I look at it. So, I mean I
did my my my work is like my music is
becoming increasingly political because of the pandemic. Because I had
the opposite experience of Mac, like sitting alone in my
house like no longer drinking myself to death on the weekends,

(34:23):
like because there's no bars open, I started like writing right,
and then for the show We're right, we are wraps
every you know, um every week. It so like you know,
building that fitness, and so I started writing a lot
more political stuff not and it's been like it's been
like weird to promote like because yeah, we're like oh yeah,
like you know, bumped the single or whatever, but like, um,

(34:44):
like everybody's dying and like, you know, it feels bad.
But in this instance at least, it's like it enables
us to have interesting conversations like with like with this
like new music I've been making, Like you know, I've
been talking to people about labor organized and talking to
people about cycles of tra the drive the fact and
hip hop that folks are like, yeah, I'm smoking blunts
and I'm driving my car down the street with the

(35:05):
ball honey and the hand Like where did that come from?
Like in some of the songs. But even in the
instances of like yo, I'm the ship and you're not,
and like I am drinking Henny and driving around and
like whatever, sort of like torque in celebrations of self
in these various ways, like is an active resistance to
like all of the hitty ship that we are like

(35:25):
living through. It's like you have to find some joy
otherwise how are you going to keep fighting for freedom?
How are you gonna keep just living? Just living? And
it's and not in itself being an active resistance if
you're living on the margin. So like like if you
got to like write, like you know, drop singles every
other week about like how much puss do you get
or whatever? Great that makes you feel better. Great because
everything's everything is kind of bad, so like do what

(35:47):
you gotta do, Like, I won't judge in the in
the least lightness, I agree. Usually that's the sort of
thought process that gets me out of that funk whenever
I'm in it is that I start start thinking about
it that way. I mean, that's what got me out
of the ship during the pandemic. You know, I admit
I definitely, I definitely was thought it was gonna be

(36:09):
worse than than the ended up being. And it was bad,
but I thought, like you know, civilization was about to collapse.
I was like, oh man, yeah, there really is no
point to any of this. But then once I once
I got past that point, I felt by creative drive
start coming back a lot quicker than that. So sorry
to get back to the show. You know what, We're
gonna take a little break for a second, then we're

(36:30):
gonna come back. But when we come back, you know,
I hate to just make it doom and gloom and
talk about what's wrong, what's wrong, what's wrong? What's wrong?
Because everything's wrong, Trust me, everything's wrong. But I'd hate
to just talk about it without at least brainstorming and
throwing out some possible solutions for some of these things

(36:50):
out there. So when we come back, we're gonna we're
gonna talk about what can we do to change this
climate that we're in? Um and we'll be back with
that after the jump. All right, we are back and
we're talking with k Death. So, like I said before
we took the break, what what do you think people

(37:13):
can do on an individual level first, to to make
even an incremental smidgeon of a change in this climate
of like intolerance and hate that we got going on
right now. I guess I mean increased intolerance ahead. It's
it's tough to say because it's like it it's like
it just depends on it. People are going to be
ready to change in that that then that's it's just

(37:34):
hard to change people. It's hard to get people to change. Uh,
I don't know if if individuals, I don't, I can't.
I can't answer the question because it's like I know
what I can do to help like influence people. Uh,
and hopefully we get enough allies to make to make
more visibility, to make it more normalized and to get
through to people. I know I've done that on a

(37:56):
personal level for people that I know and men friends
are I mean sure, I've even done it for maybe
even you don't know if I've done it for for
people that that haven't worked with trans people or trans
women that it's also I'm also a good bridge. I
think we need more people that like I used to
play college basketball with these knuckleheads that were just horrible. Like,

(38:19):
I know these people, I know how they work, I
know they operate. But and so I also know that
if they know me, like, they would be a lot
more willing, and they would a lot of people that
do know me except me. I mean I've lost a
lot of really close friends too. Um. That's what I mean.
There are some people that are just not going to change. Um,
but there's also a lot of people that have changed

(38:40):
just because they know trans people, because they know their
friend is trans, and then you know, they find it
with them themselves to like it's just so ridiculous they
need to do that. Um. Oh, so okay, I have
a question, and this Mariah, this is for you too.
So Okay, do you think do you think that um,
do you think it's more to focus on making the

(39:02):
change at a legislative level, whatever legislation needs to be
changed to sway the public and that, or do you
think that it's more important to focus on making that
change in people from a cultural level music, movies, television,
in the arts, things like that. I think all terrains
of struggle are equally valid and necessary. So like mutual aid.

(39:24):
If you see some somebody who you know, they got
kicked out of their house because their parents found out
they were you know, queer, or if someone got fired,
or just a lot of the ways that materially people
are oppressed, like if you've got if you've got money
to give somebody hub out they're in, or their car payment,
or their gender firm and surgery. That matters because if

(39:46):
people have the basic the people are more likely to
fight for freedom they have their basic needs. That's why
you see UM like more like middle class ass like
white ass since hetero people like or more comfort doable
out there, like you know, like advocating for what they
want because they're comfortable and they're fucking fine and everything's
cheery for them or not. They're you know, sitting home

(40:08):
because they have everything they need. They don't even care.
It's folks at the margins that like struggle to like
make it to city hall to advocate for legislative change
or like whatever, um because of the way its materially
like they like they have this insecurity that holds folks
back from um from engaging and so like, I think
that at all levels that's important because it helps. If

(40:30):
you want legislative change, you need a mass movement of
people that feel empowered enough to fight for it. And
if you aren't, like if you aren't eating, if you
can't get food or whatever, whoever you are, whatever your circumstances,
you know, that's not being unique to our community here,
um like like it's it's gonna be hard for you
if you don't have a physical mailing address to like

(40:51):
get your voter registration car, it's gonna be pretty hard
to make legislative change. And then on the on the
roll of art okay um, on the role of art um,
I mean, I think that's also part of building a
mass movement, right, so, like, you know, you you like
meet you to tour the country and you meet all
kinds of people and talk to them and then inspire

(41:13):
them with your ideas and they inspire you with theirs,
and like you know, that's helping build up a mute movement,
like showing people the different ways to be an artist,
Like yeah, like you can you like you can. You
don't have to be like a straight black male in
wrap um and fucking kill it and just be the
illist with the bars ever um as a way to

(41:34):
like model for folks, like the different kind of world
we can live in. I think like art plays that
role also, and like helping build that mass movement and
change people's minds um so, Like it's like two sides
to it, all of which can lead the legislative change.
But it's not like just go vote, Oh, just go
vote every four years. I'm like vote for about what?
Like what are we trying? Like what are y'all trying

(41:55):
to achieve? Also, I don't have a fucking Maily address
because I got evicted, so like I don't know what
y'all want me to do to an about somewhere. I
don't have a place. All these things work together well,
and there there's been that mass movement, uh, in in
in in art, in music, and in movies and film.
I mean, and you're and you see, we're not talking
about the good. We talked about all the bad stuff.

(42:16):
But there's been a lot of progress for trans people.
I mean I've been able, Yeah, like I've been able
to do a bunch of stuff that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to do a few years ago. Um
and even just yeah from the people that everybody knows,
like your Laverne Cox and all that and all those
awesome people. But like there's also you know, like the
Pose uh TV show that came out, which it's hard

(42:40):
for me to I love that show, but it's so
hard to watch because it's so um visceral. Like I
just relate too much to the situations where it was
like I don't want to be depressed anymore today. But like,
so you see all those movements happening, and you see
it happening with the current The people that are politics
are weird, but the people that are are are in

(43:01):
charge right now have made some changes that uh that
corrected some stuff that was there from the previous administration.
So that's why I was like, I'll take advantage of
this time, be like, you know, take take what I
can from what a little bit we're given. Um, but
that does help a lot. I think ultimately biggots won't
care just the same way that I mean, cops don't
care that. I mean, it's its likeable I would random

(43:23):
citizens care about what they do to people. UM. Right now,
I think we could eventually get there. And I think
what you said is like, yeah, you have to have
a balance of people getting that visibility. And it's cool
that I mean to bring it back like that's what
we're doing. Even with to have a trans like fronted band,
trans women fronted band on a on a posta for
tours is pretty it just doesn't hasn't happened. Maybe you

(43:46):
have this taco shop that we own. I think it's
probably the first trans woman owned taco shop, So I
think I don't in Minneapolis. I don't know any others.
So maybe there is at at least, but I mean
it's rare. But that's the thing because again, like we
were talking about earlier, marginalized people just don't have access
to that. And I had a lot of privilege, um,

(44:09):
based on having a career a little bit of career music,
but also because my parents, like I wasn't rich or anything.
We were like a middle class when my dad had
his green card forever was straight from the Mexican border,
and my mom was from El Paso too, So it
was it was weird because they never taught me. They
never I never felt like all the stuff they're talking

(44:30):
about now about being marginalized, and I never had that language,
and I was never brought up like my parents didn't
talk about that. It was weird. They didn't talk about that.
I wasn't raised necessarily like that, so I didn't think
in terms of like, oh, I'm a marginalized person when
I was younger. Looking back in retrospect, I see all
these instances where those things happened where I wasn't aware

(44:50):
of them. Um, but they insulated me in a way
from a lot of that. And even now they don't
think like it's really weird. I don't know. I don't
know if it's a good thing or a bad thing,
because even now like a generational divide. I think I
think it is a generational divide. And they were lucky
enough to do really well, like my dad just I
it's just amazing what he did coming from from there

(45:11):
and just be able to just chill and Phoenix with
the nice house like it's like it's and again, they
don't have a ton of money, they're still working, they're
about to retire. But that gave me the privilege. Are
a lot of marginalized people that don't have those supports
um and so like that. That's and I'm ignorant and
probably have a lot of stuff to work on too
because of the fact that maybe I'm not as compassionate

(45:32):
maybe to like other trans people or people of colors.
So I think it's important to have that awareness too,
especially if you're gonna be called an activist, Like just
the thing. It's like it's easy to say something when
you have this privilege, even as a marginalized person, but
it's different. I try to hold space for people that
have different cognitive things going on whatever. It is, like

(45:53):
we're not all equal, Like some people can't handle things
and it's not their fault. It's just they've been through trauma,
they got different mental capacities, and I don't think we should.
Like That's why it gets hard for me to talk
about you, because it's like I try to like be
aware of all these things, and it's it's everyone's different.
It's there's no blanket answer for how to fix things

(46:14):
in that way because it's it's all just so complex. Well,
all we can do is our best at the end
of the day. Right to the two more things that
I would say, Um, First of all, what you brought
up about, like you know, being becoming more compassionate, etcetera.
And returning to this idea of UH intersectionality and solidarity. Um,

(46:36):
because like you know, like Mac might understand the experience
of seeing some Nazis in a bar that you know,
even though he may have a very different experience than you, Chris,
in that moment, like yo, like I recko, I recognize
what that fear might feel like for someone who is
different than me. Or like because I've been through X
y Z trauma that is different than someone else's. It's like, well,

(47:00):
I've never like I don't know, like been in a
horrific house fire, but like I have like lost loved
ones and been then other things. So I can see you.
I can see the kind of struggle that you have,
even though the things we've been through are different. So like,
even if I don't know I don't understand a lot
about someone's experience, I can understand the emotions underneath of

(47:20):
like how much it hurts when we when we get
these anti trans bills and like we have all this
crazy stuff happening. Like I'm like man, as someone that
has experienced marginalization of different kinds. I see, I see, y'all.
I know a little bit of how that feels. And
so I feel like that's a powerful root of solidarity,
even if in a way to expand our compassion, even

(47:40):
if we don't all the time understand everything about somebody
else is going through. And then a last word on
like what can we do? Um? I do think that,
you know, folks who are safe or comfortable enough in
their lives where they can do so need to like
this this might sound we have like people everybody needs
to come out like because that is like a powerful

(48:03):
form of resistance of saying like, oh, y'all gonna say
like my identity is like pretty much illegalble fuck you
my pronouncer, they them and suck my dick good night, um,
and like really still like, you know, because this societal
pressure is even for like folks that are otherwise comfortable
to like fit in or that. I was like, No,
now is the time to like really lean into who

(48:24):
you are to like, show folks you're not afraid to
model for younger people who are especially getting marginalized with
these like bills against you know, young folks getting people. Yeah,
targeting like gender firming care for like young folks, Like
I hate that, like oh that whole like oh it
gets better campaign bullshit, But like really like show folks

(48:46):
like yo, you can thrive, like you can throve out here,
like there is hope and there is a future by
like modeling that for people. So I just want to
give props to you, Chris for being out here, being
a fucking role model for the people just living. Just
be in dope as hell. So key to our listeners
where they can find you. Oh, noise wrap dot com

(49:08):
because we own noise wrap dot com. And that's not
the impressive part that God can started. Yeah, see that's
to us another two hours of trying to tell people
I don't know again just to set the record straight. Yeah,
that's this dialect. Of course, I don't know if you
know dialect. Dialect is this hip hop and so they're
what I consider the first real people to put noise

(49:30):
and wrapped together. So that's cool. We already we've we
tour with them. It's cool, um, but uh we we
were the ones doing the new era noise wrap stuff,
which was and it's totally different. Go listen to Dialect
and then go listen to Death Grips and go listen
when you black and then tell me that it's the same.
Please tell me it'sn't the same to my face when
I'm you know. But anyway, Yeah, so they could find

(49:52):
us a noise Wrap dot com. You can find us
m O O D I E. Black. Oh. And speaking
of those pronouns, pronouns are she That's the other reason
why podcast tripped me out dout too, because it's like,
you know, like when I'm wrapping, let's go on with
the let's go on with the rap voice, let's do
this and let's wrap. But after that, it's like, God,
damn it, why is my voice so damn deep? It's

(50:13):
the most conflicting thing in the world. Well, speaking of rap,
we are going to close this show up the way
that we do every week, Mara, are you ready to
spit some bars? Let's go a Joe drop a beat.
I know bigotry, like it's part of my hand. They
wanted you to think trans with the silence and lambs.

(50:35):
My niggas called that a scam. It was part of
their plan. They want to force you out the closet
because they close the clan. Now we call that projection
all that ness. So just to compensate for what they
call that erection, conservative GOP nationalist Nazis say the same ship,
like the pamphlet is copied and blaming the senders, your
fake and pretenders. I'm cool with no one who use
the phrase gay agenda that goes for the hotels. I'm

(50:57):
doping a flow. Best shout out to the Ukraine. Our
open ain't hopeless. I'm sorry and who are you? I
don't know, but we're gone and we're done. We're done.
We'll see you all next week. Listen to Waiting on

(51:21):
Reparations on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you get your podcasts