Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Oh my gosh, what's up?
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Its way up with Angela Yee and today we are
definitely way up. And I needed this today. Tasha kab
Lenna is here with me. Thank you for coming to
the studio. Hey, hey, thank you for having me man.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
It is an honor.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
And congratulations on the album this And I know you've
been working and doing live albums, but for you to
have put together this studio project. How do you feel
now that it's out?
Speaker 3 (00:24):
I feel great, And you know what, I expected it
to take some time people to sit and listen to
it and then they but people have fallen in love
with these songs. And I was a little nervous, you know,
it's something new, it's something different from me. So I
did it really with my knees shaking, just really nervous.
But everybody's response has been absolutely incredible, So I'm super excited.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
It's nice when you can challenge yourself in those ways too, Yeah,
because sometimes I feel like getting out of the comfort
zone of Okay, this has been working and people know
me for this, and now I got to shift. You know,
there's something different, it's you.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Know, and and I put out.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
A buck also prior to that that was your first book, right,
do it anyway?
Speaker 4 (01:05):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (01:05):
And so I feel like this album it just kind
of builds on the foundation that the that the book created,
Like this this new transparency telling stories about my life,
the ups and downs, the hills, the valleys, and you
can't be that open and then go back to a
place of being closed. It's like, now that I put
it all out there, let's also do that in the music.
(01:28):
And so these songs are very transparent. They're you know,
in your face. It's talking about, you know, some hard
seasons that I've gone through, hard conversations that we have
with God sometimes like like what are you doing?
Speaker 4 (01:39):
You know?
Speaker 3 (01:40):
So some of those songs are very in your face
like that, and I think it really I got comfortable
with it because of the book, Like, Okay, now I'm
putting it all out there. I talked about, you know,
us losing the baby. I talked about going through the
grief with my dad and what that really looks like,
you know. And now with the songs, I can be
honessed that when my faith was shaken, I had questions.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
I feel like things changed so much when your father passed.
That was in twenty fourteen, and you talk about that
whole journey and winning a Grammy a few days later
being in the audience for that, and I wanted to
ask you. You also said in the book that your
family did therapy. Was that the first time you guys
had as a family done therapy together.
Speaker 3 (02:23):
Yes, my mother, though she was grieving. So the story
with my mom and my dad is beautiful. So they
started dating when she was thirteen, she was thirteen, he
was fifteen, I believe, and so they're the only two
people they had ever dated. She had never been with
anyone else, and so they kind of raised each other.
They had been together for a very long time and
for her to be thinking about everyone else during that time,
(02:47):
she called our entire family, so not just immediate family,
but my fathers, sisters and brothers, her sisters and brothers
because they all just kind of grew up together. And
then of course my dad passed her to church, so
she also had the therapist to come into some of
the midweek services to talk through, you know, therapy. And
I really just feel like she was just taking a
faith lead during that time because she was smothering in grief,
(03:10):
but she's still Her love for her family was like
I know that he impacted everybody's lives, and if I'm
going through, I know you're going through. So all of
us agreed that we would do grief counseling together.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
We don't hear a lot of stories like that nowadays, either,
like she was thirteen, he was fifteen. No, that is
you know what before earlier we were discussing this. You know,
Kirk Franklin has his Den of Kings, yes, yeah, and
ty Reese was on the last episode and he was
talking about how many bodies he had, right, and then
we were discussing on the air, how you know the
(03:42):
average number is somewhere like between four and eight, and
anybody who says more than that, it just feels like
a whole lot. But that's because I also feel like
people nowadays it's hard to be like this was the
only person I've been with, because I feel like we
have so many distractions, so many so much access to people, right, Okay, yeah, you.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
It's a little different than because now people you went
to school with could look you up on Facebook, right.
Speaker 4 (04:05):
Yeah, and I did.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
I never thought of it that way. You had access
to the people that you went to school with, went
to church with. But now the world is so open
you you can find people anywhere.
Speaker 4 (04:17):
You know that.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Don't see what my high school boyfriends are.
Speaker 4 (04:21):
I never thought about it that way.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
That's a good way to think about how the numbers
can grow now.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
Yes, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
You also discussed social media and being on TikTok and
you had a moment when you realize like, Okay, I'm
gonna just play a little something up on here. Maybe
a few people will look at it, but like, very
quickly over a million views. When did you realize the
audience that you had and just really that it was like,
this is your true calling.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
That's a loaded question because you know, sometimes you can
be I can be off and on with social media
because they'll clap for you today and crucify you tomorrow,
you know, so you have those ups and downs. I
think one of the one of the moments that I
realized that my platform was very influential was when I
did the first song, when Nicki mina, oh yes, yeah,
(05:13):
you know you you could do it well, and it's like,
you know, so people have their opinions and they're very
verbal about it now online and to be honest, that
was the first controversial moment that I had one line,
and I think it's an awakening that hey, okay, now
you gotta be careful what you say, careful what you do,
(05:34):
because people are watching, you know, every move that you make,
and you influence their.
Speaker 4 (05:39):
Lives as well. And I take that very very seriously.
Speaker 3 (05:41):
You know, sometimes people that come to me and say, well,
what do you think about the girls that are watching you?
And they're exposed to this because you're I feel like
to the Bible talks about training up a child in
the way they should go, and then they want when
they grow old, they won't depart for it from it.
I believe that even with the rise of these new
features and collaborations across genres, I believe that those of
(06:05):
us who are in Christ and those of us who
have raised our kids right, they're covered, you know, and
they see that.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
Influence in the homes.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
Like I think it's the responsibility of parents still to be,
you know, that influence over your children's lives, and you
can't really depend so much on the influencers to be
to raise your kids, you know what I'm saying, Even
though we do take on that responsibility that kids are
watching us so I'm very responsible with you know, what
(06:35):
I do online and what I say online. But for
the most part, I have to be led by what
God tells me to do. And I really believe that
even both of those features with Nikki have been great
just to expose people to you know, to gospel songs,
to ministry who just to be honest, they're not they're
(06:56):
not coming to our churches. You know, they're not gonna
they're not gonna walk in the church, ma they don't
feel welcome, maybe they don't feel worthy, but they'll hear
a song that says, you know, blessings or I'm getting
ready to see.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
Everything that God has for me. You know.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
I feel like that that moment was really really strong
for me. But it also, like you said, it was
eye opening to the influence that I've been entrusted with.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
When you first heard like the first song that you
guys did together, did you just leave it as is
or realize should we changed this around?
Speaker 4 (07:27):
Or oh?
Speaker 3 (07:28):
Man, So the way that that happened, that was a
live record, but I did it live in studio, and
during that time, you know, it was it was cultural
to just kind of hold on to your songs before
you release them, don't don't put out. But I chose
to do something different. So while we were recording throughout
the week, I would put out little snippets of the
songs just to you know.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
Give give you a little little.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
Taste, right, And I did that one song I'm Getting Ready,
and Nikki saw, she saw the clip, and so she
sent me a message on Actually she didn't do a DM.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
She put this in comments like she's met that.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
She was like, when you're done with this song, send
it to me and I'm gonna put sixteen bars on it.
And I was like, well, I you know, it's out
there now. And I literally did that. When we finished
the song, I said Nikki, hey, this is the song
that you liked this car I'm Getting Ready And it
was just live, straight up gospel song and she said,
this is what I want, this is what I need.
And when I tell you, in about a week she
(08:22):
sent that song back. There were no changes, just straight
up heat. It was incredible and so what you hear
is exactly what she did in that moment.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
I think it is great because you know, just like
we've seen and I feel like every artist and with
gospel gets like some backlash whenever they collaborate outside of
the space, But how do you want the space to
grow if you're not collaborating, And how do you invite
more people in?
Speaker 1 (08:47):
And how do you not have judgment?
Speaker 2 (08:48):
And how do you feel like I can say who
can come here and who can you know?
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Yeah, I think that's that's a part of the conversation too,
because a lot of times we can look at it
like the secret Society, like it's me, my church, my
four walls.
Speaker 4 (09:04):
And no more.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
But the truth is we're trying to win people, win
people's souls, win them to Christ. And the only way
you can really do that is by reaching out the Bible, specifically,
go out into the hedges and the highways and compel
people to come. And sometimes that may require us to
collaborate and to do features and to connect with people
(09:26):
that some people might think, oh I don't agree with
what they did, you know what I'm saying, But their
audience is now listening to Atasha right right.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
You know, I also was thinking about there was like
some chatter about Glorilla winning and I'm over city. Yeah, yeah,
And so I saw that conversation. What did you think
about that for Glorilla winning for like I think it
was Best.
Speaker 3 (09:47):
B BT Awards. Yeah, yeah, best Gospel Album. I think
it's a conversation that people are you know, people are
always gonna feel some kind of way, like you said,
with these collaborations. One of the things that I do
want to say is I think we in that conversation
we overlooked talking about the gospel artists who were on
(10:07):
that track. So you had Kirk Franklin, you had Kierra
shear Kelly, you had Chandler more So, it's not void
of gospel artists. And these are major gospel artists who
are doing great things who were also on that song.
It just happened to be a feature with Gorilla, so
they all want to be to you award. The argument
is how can a rap artist win a gospel award?
Speaker 4 (10:30):
But you also had gospel artists on that song as well.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
You know, I want to go back to us talking
about therapy and your family doing that. What were your
thoughts on therapy before you did it? Just because I
know and you know when it comes to church and
when it comes to therapy, I feel like things are
more aligned now. But I think also in our community,
the thought of therapy for a long time has been stigmatized.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
So true, I just.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Want to know, was it something that for you You
had a different view of it until you did it.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
You know what, it was a beyond just church. I
grew up in a very, very small town in Georgia.
So on top of you know, this is God, your
Holy Spirit is gonna take care of you.
Speaker 4 (11:09):
He'll take care of your mind.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
You also got okay, y'all, you're going to lay on
somebody's couch.
Speaker 4 (11:14):
What's wrong with you? You know you have the just the
cultural shunning. They're shunning this.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
So my mother to do that was my first time
going to therapy. However, our family was very open to
it because I had cousins who had moved to Atlanta,
moved to different cities, and they were exposed to different
things that they in turn exposed us to. So we
were very open to it. And I also grew up
in a Pentecostal church, so you know, you got all
of these all of these layers of don't do that.
(11:41):
But for my mother to choose that, I think it
made a huge statement for our family that God uses
people to help us to a place of freedom in
our minds and that I love that she made that statement.
So I believe in therapy. I have a therapist right now. Okay, yes,
so and I. But I also believe that my mother
making that decision gave me the okay that hey, this
(12:04):
is okay for you to do to take care of
yourself and your mental health.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
What would you tell people if, like, say, right now,
I do feel like a lot of the younger generation
is trying to figure out, like what am I doing
with my life?
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Right?
Speaker 2 (12:17):
How do I tap into my gift or my passion?
And sometimes they can look at what other people have.
They can measure success by the amount of followers or
how much money they're making. What advice would you give
for people that need to figure out how do I
tap into my personal gifts and my passion and then
also make this something that I can feel like I'm successful.
Speaker 4 (12:39):
Wow. I think it's it's wow.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
This is loaded because what you're asking requires a lot
of maturity and wisdom. And I think the first thing
that young people should seek after is that like, who
am I outside of what I see every day on
social media? And it's okay to look at someone like
a Tasha or Angela and say, man, I love where
(13:05):
they're going in life. I love the things that they're doing.
How can I glean from some of the things that
they've done but not try to beat them?
Speaker 2 (13:13):
Right?
Speaker 3 (13:13):
That requires wisdom because outside of you being you, you
find yourself with in an identity crisis. Like I'm not
completely Angela, but I think I've been consumed trying to
be everybody that I see online. I think the first
thing we should seek is wisdom, like okay, teaching our
young people that you can look at Atasha but find yourself.
Speaker 4 (13:36):
And that I think about my mentor. So my mentor's
name is his.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
Name is William Murphy, and he has a song called
Praise is what I Do. Back in the day, it
was like a huge gospel song. And I remember when
I moved to Atlanta, I start to travel with him
and just watch watch how he flowed, you know, just
how he would lead worship. And one day he said
to me, all right, Tasha, people started calling and booking
me and he was And I was like, well, what
do I sing when I go? I don't have any songs.
(14:01):
He was like, you sing my songs, and you do
what I've done until you find you this is what
he said to me, So I would. I would mimic
the way that he sang the songs. I would do
his runs and all this kind of stuff. But one
day I realized, Oh, when I did it this way,
it worked even better, because that's Tasha's way, you know.
And I feel like we can get so consumed in
(14:21):
trying to be the big star that we see that
we lose ourselves in it. But I think what you
should seek to do is find yourself in what they've done.
Like you were just talking about this major event that
you did, and you put it on for the city
and you know, blessing so many people. I can find
myself in that, like, Wow, Angela did that, and so
can I.
Speaker 4 (14:40):
But do it my way.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
I like that you said that because sometimes people don't
like when celebrities post like giving back and they'll be like, oh,
when I get back, I want to do it quietly.
I'm cool with that, But I don't think it's bad,
not when people post it either, because maybe somebody would
be like, Oh, I want to do an event where
we're giving away backpacks, free back to school things, haircuts,
hair bring I want to do that too. How can
(15:01):
I learn because I don't think it's so bad. I've
seen people get backlash. Oh, you didn't have to post
that you did X, Y and Z. You should just
do it quietly, and you can choose to do that.
But I also feel like if you do something good,
there's nothing wrong with you advertising and letting people see that,
because that can be a catalyst for other people to say,
you know what, I'm gonna start my own X, Y
(15:21):
and Z too.
Speaker 3 (15:22):
Yeah, And it could be like you were just saying,
a young person that's lost, trying to find their way,
trying to find their purpose, and then they see you do.
Speaker 4 (15:28):
That and it's like, oh, that's who I am.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
That speaks to me. So I'm all for it, you know.
And now you don't post everything that you need, not everything,
but I feel like it is important to also not
just show the glitz and the glam, right, but to
also show the work that you do in the community.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
Yeah, if you're gonna go out and do something like
donate and volunteer, you could post the place so other
people might say, oh my gosh, I'm gonna go and volunteer,
you know as well, and work in the shelter and
give out whatever. Like, I think that's a good thing
to let people know that those services are available.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
I agree.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Now, get in your first record.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
That was not something that was even you trying to
go out and pursue that. That was something that kind
of happened, but it happened on the terms that you wanted.
So I want you to discuss how you even got
signed because you were singing in church.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
You didn't even want to do that, right, not originally?
Speaker 4 (16:20):
Not at first.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
Yeah, that's true because I had family members. So I
grew up in a family of singers. Everybody sings on
my mom's side, so all my aunts, all the cousins,
it's just the thing. And then on my dad's side,
it was full of musicians, so they played keyboards and guitar.
Speaker 4 (16:34):
So I've been.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
Surrounded by music my entire life. But it wasn't something
that I wanted to pursue. I actually wanted to be
a teacher, you know, Yeah, I wanted to be a
math teacher. I enjoyed math teacher. I know, right, just
so far, so far so, but I did. I wanted
to be a teacher. But when I moved to Atlanta
in two thousand and six, I started leading worship at
(16:54):
our church, the Dream Center in Atlanta, and I just
started writing these songs like songs would just come, songs
like Smile and Happy, all the songs that people were
singing back in the day. And I just remember two
of my friends took me out to lunch and they
set me up because I thought, hey, we were just about
to have a girl's day out.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
We're hanging out.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
And as soon as I sat down, the first thing
they said was, so, when you're gonna do this album?
And I was like, what are y'all talking about? What
album are we talking about? And I think it's really
really good to be surrounded by friends. I'm gonna take
a sidebar to people who can see things in you
that you might not even see yet. Like they saw
that this was a huge gift on my life, and
(17:32):
they wanted to pull that out of me. So I'm
so appreciative of that. But it was just something that
I did not lean towards. It was I loved leading
worship at my church during that time. I loved writing
songs that we were just singing our church during that time.
I was not pursuing a record deal whatsoever. And when
they said that I could not shake it. I literally
sat up all night thinking about it, and I got
(17:55):
up and I just started writing out this plan for
a live recording. Literally, and I know this sounds Maraki.
Literally this is how it happened, a budget and everything.
I never done anything like that in my life. And
so the next day I went to William and I
was like, Hey, I'm doing a live recording.
Speaker 4 (18:09):
He was like, what are you just yesterday?
Speaker 3 (18:13):
You were fine leading worship And they really just kind
of pulled something out of me that I didn't know
was there. And a few months later I did my
first independent album that my dad was an executive producer
or he's funded it. He left here went to be
with the Lord saying Baby where Daddy get his money back,
(18:33):
and he funded that from my parents' savings. He cleared
out their savings because he believed in me so much,
and he funded that album.
Speaker 4 (18:42):
And that album we put it on YouTube.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
I personally it was when I say independent, it was
old school independent.
Speaker 4 (18:48):
We had CDs in our trunks.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
I was going here and there and everywhere, just just
selling them and pushing it myself, and people picked up
on and they started singing those songs in their churches.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
I will say that is that is miraculous. I've never
heard of something like that happening.
Speaker 3 (19:03):
People started singing it around the world in their churches.
They would sing these songs. And right after that, I
did a live recording for a gospel artist. His name
is Myron Butler, and he had me do this song
called my Life Is Not My Own. It was a
feature on his record, and I'll never forget. Just like
on Sunday mornings, I got up and I sang that
song and for about fifteen minutes, people were just crying
(19:26):
and worship. He could not move on with the recording,
and E and My Gospel happened to be there that night.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
And two days later that Tuesday.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
They called, and they called me and said, hey, we
want to put you on as many platforms as possible for.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
You to do what we saw you do Saturday. Wow.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
Yeah, And I signed to E and My Gospel as
a gospel worship artist and I've been with them ever since.
Speaker 1 (19:51):
I remember.
Speaker 2 (19:52):
I think in your book you said one woman that
was working with you was like, she's worked with all
kinds of artists and she's never felt like what she
felt when she heard your music.
Speaker 4 (20:00):
Wow, yep. Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
One of the things that I really took to heart,
like coming into the industry is that there were so
many people who are broken, so many people who are
torn about their relationship with God, but they're the ones
distributing the gofbel music. So I felt like before I
can like minister and inspire the masses, I got a
minister to the people who I work with that you
(20:24):
know so and I mean many of them were broken
in a dark place and if I could be just
a light in their life, that was one of my desires.
That was one of my prayers. And many of them
that I've worked with over the years, they had that testimony. Natasha,
you have been one of the one of the best
artists to work with.
Speaker 4 (20:42):
It was just a joy. So I love to hear
that it was life changing for them and for me.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
It's interesting that you've managed to be the light for
so many people but then have been in a dark
place yourself and people would never expect that. Yeah, And
sometimes it can also feel like, well, I should know
how to get myself out of this situation if I
can do it for other people, And even like having
conversations and listening to God speak and tell you what
(21:08):
it is that and just kind of accepting that.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
But sometimes it's not so easy.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
Yeah, yeah, I was.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
I probably between the years of twenty ten to about
twenty twelve, I was in a really really dark place,
just battling depression and fear and anxiety. I remember I
would go to churches and I would just watch people
be set free, you know, hugging babies, kissing babies and you.
Speaker 4 (21:32):
Know, smiling.
Speaker 3 (21:33):
And I would go home for like two or three
days and be under the covers, curtains closed, just really
really plagued by depression. And I remember just one night
I woke up and I just felt like, Hey, I
gotta get free from this, because what God has for
me it is I can't go into it if I'm
not if I don't break this, you know. And so
(21:54):
the song break every Change. People talk about that song,
but I experienced the change breaking off of my life
through that song.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Don't you think to do a song like that that
is like the biggest, you know, smash hit record, but
it came from such a place in your own life.
It's crazy how something like that, your darkness turned into
like a huge light for so many people, including yourself.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
Yeah, Yeah, that song I'll never forget. For two weeks straight,
I would just play it constantly in my house, like
I needed those chains of depression and fear to be
broken off of my life. And for years I had
battled with it and I just could not get it
to break. But I think the intentionality of just reminding
myself that God loves me, that I made in his
(22:40):
image and his likeness because during that time my entire life,
I had struggled with weight. You know, my weight was
up and down. I remember I was three hundred and
fifty pounds right around twenty twelve, and that was the
heaviest I had ever been. It was the darkest place
I had ever been mentally, just really really struggling with
(23:03):
anxiety and depression. And I feel like the weight was
an outward display of what I was dealing.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
The weights.
Speaker 3 (23:13):
Yeah, And so I just made a decision back then
that I am going to drop this weight. I'm going
to break the chain of fear and depression that's all
my life. And I was very very intentional about it.
I changed the way that I spoke because I believe
you live out what you say. Like a lot of
times sometimes we just have to change our language that
you know, I am loved, I am beautiful.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
You know, God cares about me. I made in his image.
You know.
Speaker 3 (23:37):
I was very aware and intentional about what I said
in my language, and it just changed my lifestyle, you know.
And the more that I did it, the more I
could see just like the light coming in, you know,
in that dark place that I was in.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I love that you say that, because sometimes people look
at someone who's overweight and will be like, they just
eat too much, or they're just lazy and they need
to just go to the gym and eat less. And
it's not that easy. If it was that easy, no
one would be able to wait it.
Speaker 3 (24:06):
Yeah, it's a it's a disease, just like you know,
obesity is a disease. And I would love for people
if I could just be an advocate, if people would
see it that way, the way that you deal with
those people that you love who struggle with that disease,
you would you would approach it differently.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
You know.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
I remember when I lost the way my mom came
to me. You know, no, I'm sorry. I went to
my mother because I saw a picture and I was like, Mommy,
I was dying, why didn't you say anything? And you know,
her answer was, we didn't know what to say or
how to say it without it hurting your feelings or
without it breaking you. And so a lot of times
people just don't address it because they don't know what
to say.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
And it's the same thing with grief.
Speaker 3 (24:46):
Sometimes you just don't know what to say when the
truth is people need you to say something.
Speaker 4 (24:51):
You know.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
So I feel like even for those people you have
loved ones who are struggling with the disease of obesity,
kind of be intentional about loving on them, inviting them
to the to the gym with you, inviting them to
go out on a walk with you, you know, living
out a healthy life in front of.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Them, right, you know, because they're not agree with that.
Speaker 4 (25:12):
You know, people who don't deal with obesely. You just live.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
You want to live what you want to.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
Struggling, Yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (25:19):
Your life is influencing their lives as well, So that
that would be some encouragement I would give to people.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Now let's get to this album.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Who Tasha, talk to me about what this process was
like for you, because, like you said, and we started
the conversation with this you've done live albums, but this
is your first studio album. Yeah, so how was that
for you? And is this something you can first see
yourself doing more.
Speaker 3 (25:41):
Yes, first to have a giving a huge kudos to
my husband Kennath Lennard. He produced this record and it
is just absolutely amazing. One of the things that I
love about how he produces, even as a music director,
he makes everybody feel safe and comfortable. So from the
background singers, to every person playing instruments, to every producer
(26:01):
that's that's involved, Kenny absorbs the vision. So for months
I talked to him about what I wanted this to
sound like, what I wanted it to look like, and
and so once he gets that vision, he walks.
Speaker 1 (26:12):
It out, but it just said you wanted it to
sound like you know, so.
Speaker 4 (26:15):
I wanted it to One of the things is so funny.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
So over the past two or three years, I keep
getting these invites to do like ciphers on bet and
I remember going to the Jennifer Hudson Show and they
were like freestyle for us.
Speaker 4 (26:28):
And I'm like, who told you I was a rapper?
Speaker 3 (26:31):
And I realized that I was being introduced to another
creative expression.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
That I did not know existed like that. I didn't
know I had it in me.
Speaker 3 (26:39):
So people kept calling for me to do it, and
so I had to perfect it because it's just me,
like I want to. I'm not gonna do it shabby,
so let me just make sure I do it right.
And I realized, then, hey, this is a new another sound,
not not something new. I'm just building on top of
the sound that I've already created.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Thing. Yes, it's evolving, and so that was one of
the things that I want. I told him.
Speaker 3 (27:00):
I was like, I think there's gonna be some rap
on this out Britney. Yeah, it just like Yes, I
felt that too. I felt like he would have like
a nineties pop field and you've in a nineties gospel
field because some of the songs even has like this
nineties vibe on it. So when I expressed all of
(27:20):
that to him, the way that he developed the tracks,
it was all just perfect. Every time I would hear
that is so, that is so what I heard. So
I love the way that he takes a vision and
he makes it come alive. And so every day when
we were in the writing sessions, because I did a
writing camp leading up to it with some of my
favorite writers. So it's like Naomi Rain, Chandler Moore, Travis Green,
(27:40):
all these incredible gospel artists, Jonas Myron, who.
Speaker 4 (27:43):
Is an amazing pop writer.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Who else was there at Hanks Just all of these songwriters.
And for five days we were at the studio just
doing writing songs, and I would tell them stories about
my life. I would tell them testimonies about my life
and they would take them and create these songs. So
a lot of the songs that you hear on the
record were just made in the moment of sharing my
stories with them. Yeah, it was such a great experience
(28:08):
that that those writing sessions.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Tell me this story behind I still Choose You.
Speaker 3 (28:12):
Oh so me, so I still choose you. I love
that you asked about that song. So I literally during
this process, I would wake up in the middle of
the night sometimes with these sounds and songs in my
head and I felt like I had this Bennie and
the Jets kind of vibe like I can't hear.
Speaker 4 (28:31):
I Still Choose You.
Speaker 3 (28:33):
So we were in one of the writing sessions and
I was like, guys, this could be corny or not,
and I'm not listen.
Speaker 4 (28:38):
I don't live on my shoulder.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Yeah, yeah, come.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
And so we were actually doing lunch and all of
the writers were sitting around and I said, Okay, I
want to sing this this vibe for you.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
And I was like, I still choose you.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
So Vaughn, who was like a brother of mine, he
got on the piano, he started playing and then I said,
I think Kirk needs to be on this song. So
right after that writing session, I said it's the writing
session to Kirk and I was like, Kirk, you gotta
do this song with me. And Kirk and I had
never done like I did a song with him Tamlaman
and it was another singer that was on that song,
(29:09):
but nothing just him and I together and I felt
like this was the perfect moment for that. So when
I sent that song to Kirk, that's how it was developed,
and we sent him just like it was a shell
of a song. But when he got in the studio,
it's nothing like being in the studio with Kirk.
Speaker 4 (29:22):
It is a masterclass.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
I can imagine, oh a magic. Kirk is hilarious. Yeah,
he is definitely a person that has defied like what
the what expectations that people would place him and confine
him to.
Speaker 3 (29:37):
He had them bring out this computer and he was
standing like on a desk just like this, and he
was like, let me just play this like this, and
then he would come up with these lyrics. Just watching
him is like watching a genius at work.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
I wanted him to produce like you leading a Den
of Queen's.
Speaker 3 (29:51):
Ah Kirk, do you hear that?
Speaker 1 (29:54):
I think that could go.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
We do need one episode where we're like, Okay they
Din of Queens, we gotta up.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
I feel like we need you know what I mean?
Speaker 4 (30:03):
Yes, I love that.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
So now that this just seeing like what the response
has been, you feel you should feel amazing.
Speaker 1 (30:11):
Yeah, number one album.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
You also Billboard twenty twenty the Gospel Artists of the Decade.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
I mean that's huge. How did you feel when you
found that out?
Speaker 4 (30:20):
I was like, I am still like what, but you
know what I feel like.
Speaker 3 (30:26):
During that time, it was it's when streams was just growing,
so people were streaming more records. I remember in twenty
seventeen when I released Heart Passion Pursuit, that album just
like made history for streams. People streaming that album during
the time, and it was a lot during that time.
You know, people were like they didn't want to receive it.
(30:47):
They didn't want to do it, especially artists because you know,
you didn't get paid as much from the streams, and
you still don't, you know, you know streams. It's I
don't even know how many you have streams you have
to get in order to take Yeah, it's not yeah,
but I am because I was like, you know, it's like,
you know, some somebody saying, I don't I still want
to listen to a cassette tape and not get a
CD like.
Speaker 4 (31:07):
Life is is always.
Speaker 3 (31:09):
So I just kind of embrace the streaming idea and
people gravitated to it.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
You know, are you gonna embrace AI for anything?
Speaker 3 (31:17):
Oh my goodness, you're talking about you And now I'm
forty four, and I'm like, what do y'all do it?
Speaker 4 (31:22):
Over there? They can literally take your voice and make
a song out of it.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
You know, I don't know, you know, I I am
not the type of person who will I'm not just
gonna deny something. I feel like there's you can find
good and in all things that are created. So I
feel like, hey, in AI the way that I use it,
I can use it for the good. Okay, of course
people are gonna use it, you know, with ill intent.
(31:49):
But for me, the way that we use AI, I
think you can use it for the good. The Bible
actually says that all things He's working all things together
for your good. So it's you know, it's my anything
that is at the tip of our fingers. I believe
that God can use it for his good.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
You know, I want to go back to do it
anyway now, And let's talk about In your book, you
discuss being present and how important that was for you
because look at all the things that you have going on, right,
and there was a period of time when it's like
we're just running on fumes. We're just showing up as
a responsibility to the places that we have to be.
(32:27):
Like you said, you'd be at the Grammys and doing
work on your phone. Sometimes we're at concerts, everybody's holding
up their phone. I was looking at some of my
footage from my Angela Yide and there's one part where
Jypchin gets on the stage and everybody just has their
phone up. I'm like, wow, everybody's just that's like the
thing now instead of my eyes, I got my phone up.
So talk to me about how you've managed to become
(32:47):
more present in some ways that you've seen that benefit
your life.
Speaker 4 (32:51):
I love this.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
I love to talk about this because it goes back
to my therapist. Well, I had a therapist when I
was living in Atlanta, and one of the things that
she challenged me to do is to be present. And
a lot of people don't notice because they think my
sneaker game is what it is just because I.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
Like sneakers is not.
Speaker 3 (33:07):
I actually have bone on bone arthritis in both of
my toes, and I'm going somewhere with this. I played
basketball when I was younger. I broke a toe and
it never heeled properly. So now what position I was
for it? Okay, yeah, power for it. So when I
broke the toe right around thirty years old, I started
having excruciating pain. I realized that I have arthritis in
(33:30):
both of my toes, and so doing shows with heels
on was just the pain was unbearable, and I decided, Hey,
I'm just gonna wear sneakers. So one of the things
that she said to me was make your loved ones
make you be present.
Speaker 4 (33:43):
So have them to ask you, how do you feel
right now? Are your toes hurting? Do you have a headache.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
She was like, just those just those questions will bring
you back to a space.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Of right now, living in the moment.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
And still to this day, my husband sometimes will grab
me by my shoulders and say, do you have a headache?
How are you feeling? Something great just happened in your life.
I want you not to miss it, living in what's next,
And so one of the things I have to give
a kudos to my loved ones like my mom and
my husband and sometimes even my children make me be present,
you know, And I feel like sometimes we have to
(34:18):
entrust the people around us to help us do that
because I don't want to miss Astra's life. I don't
want to miss you know, even like Thursday, my four
year old has a baseball game going up. He's a toddler.
They're all over the place, but I want to be
there for that. I want to I want to experience
the laughs. I want to make the memory to screen.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
Yeah. I want to be that mom, you know, the
soccer mom. I want to have that feel.
Speaker 3 (34:41):
But before, to be honest, I didn't. I wasn't always
that way. I was living in what's next, just always
super super busy, and so I want my life to
encourage people to be present, even those of us who
are busy and who carry a lot of weights and
a lot of responsibilities, there's still a way to be present.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
It's always going to be something that you could be doing,
and so sometimes you have to say notice certain things
even if you're like it could be good for me,
I need to do this, But sometimes it's like, no,
next time, I'll do the thing, but it's just not
working with the other responsibilities or things that I want
to be present for now. Another thing you've been open
about is your journey with family and having children, and
(35:23):
so when did you feel comfortable enough to even be
able to share your story, which I think is the
story of so many women that they could benefit from
hearing what you've been through.
Speaker 3 (35:32):
Yeah, I think with the book Do It Anyway, that
was the first. That was the first time I had
a chance to share it in lots of detail about
us going through the IVF and having endometriosis. So I've
been diagnosed with endometriosis and what it does is it
just kind of prevents you from giving birth. There's a
(35:52):
lot of scar tissuing, a lot of pain that I've
been doing for many many years, and I didn't have
didn't have a lot of information about it until after
we got married. And so that first year I was like,
you know, I think there's something going on that we
need to find out, you know what it is. And
so we went to a specialist and they told me
I had endometriosis. And so for a year we would
(36:14):
travel to Houston, from North Carolina to Houston once a
month to have injections just to clear out the endometriosis
enough so that we could try to have a baby.
And so I did that for nine months I believe.
We went to Houston and they were like, Okay, it's
cleared out enough so that you can try the IVF.
(36:35):
And so my husband's story is a little different, and
actually we can laugh about it now because he's like,
after we had the they did the implant with the embryos,
the doctor says, now it's in God's hands. Kenny was like, what,
we know.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
It's in God, but what about doing your job right?
Speaker 3 (36:53):
He just didn't think for once that it just would
not work. And that was our story. That and going
through the IVF and all of the years of trying
it did not work the natural way for us, but
we chose adoption. Yes, And we have such a beautiful
baby boy, Asher, who is now four years old.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
And I know that baby is so loved.
Speaker 3 (37:18):
Oh, he is the perfect baby for our family. His
siblings spoil him, to everybody spoils him. But Asher, he
looks like us, he acts like us, and he's just
you know, he's God's design for our family. And I
have a friend who says something that I'll never forget.
She said, a lot of times we love to receive
(37:38):
God's will for our lives.
Speaker 4 (37:40):
So God's will was that we have a child.
Speaker 3 (37:42):
But sometimes we don't stick around to hear his way
and to do it his way, you know. We want
to do things our way. And I even I have
a song on the record that talks about the conversation
about the tug of war between God's will and our
will and how we're asking God, why don't you do this?
I've asked for this, I pray for this, and what
are you gonna come through? And just to be honest,
(38:04):
we're human, you know, and so sometimes you have those conversations.
And God is not afraid of those conversations.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
He's God not to just pray when I need something.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
To be thankful, grateful, right, be great for the small things.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
But but sometimes we just wanted our way. But God's
way is always the best way. You know, we couldn't.
I can't imagine life without Asher.
Speaker 4 (38:27):
I can't. I don't even know what life was like
without Asher.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
Yes, and listen, Asher is blessed to Yeah, it's been
a better situation for as.
Speaker 4 (38:37):
That's our baby boy. Yep.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
As a matter of fact, coming here and he thinks
he's supposed to go everywhere with us.
Speaker 4 (38:43):
Yeah, I'm like, you have to go to school. He's
a he's k four now.
Speaker 3 (38:46):
So I read something the other day because Ash is
a pandemic baby, and I didn't even think of it
this way that it said, hey, guys, all the pandemic
kids are going to kindergarten.
Speaker 4 (38:56):
And I'm like, oh my goodness, that is so true. Yep,
so a wild.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Time that way, I know.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
I know, what do you tell yourself about what's happening
in the United States right now? You know, there's a
lot of things being rolled back, and then we have
to be like, why is this happening? And for everybody
else who is wondering what do we do? Like businesses
are suffering. Black women with employment and entrepreneurship are suffering. Education,
(39:24):
the system is suffering. There's just so much going on.
The National Guard is being called.
Speaker 1 (39:28):
In the DC. It just feels like chaos right now.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
So what would you say in a time like this
to somebody who was like, why is this happening?
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Yeah? I have to be true to who I am.
Speaker 3 (39:38):
I think that in this season, we have to run
to God, Like, in all seriousness, you have to run
to God and find out what his plan is for
your life. I was at a conference the other day
and the speaker was up and he said something that
was just so touching to me, like, you know, sometimes
we got to clear out all of the noise, all
of the clutter, and if that means to turn off
the news sometimes, if that means to deactivate your Instagram
(40:00):
and your TikTok for a little while so you can
hear what God desires for you and your family right now?
What are the steps in the moves that I need
to make? And I think we also have to be
a little bit more wise with how we spend what
we're spending on. You know, how we're navigating through life
and you can only get those instructions from God. You know, God,
what do you have for me in this season? I
(40:22):
believe we just you know, we live, those of us
who are children of God, we live different and we
cannot live. And I refuse to live in fear of
what's gonna happen next. You know, what's the doom that's
gonna happen next, because that's not God's will for me.
God's will is that we prosper and be in good health,
even as our souls prosper. And the one place that
(40:42):
you have to run to, even when things are frantic
and there's a lot of anxiety and fear, you have
to run to Jesus.
Speaker 1 (40:48):
I know that's right.
Speaker 4 (40:49):
Yeah, I had to preach a little bit right there.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
I died that and I'm sure everybody listening and needed
that too. But Tasha Cobbs Leonard, thank you so much
for joining us today. This was honestly amazing. It's such
a pleasure to have you. Thank you and just enjoying
your whole story. Your new album, Tasha, that's out right now.
To make sure you check that out and if you
haven't read do it anyway, you know, pick that up.
As you can see, I was all into it, so
(41:13):
sometimes I need to learn, like what prayers I should.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
I think it's very helpful just as a guide.
Speaker 4 (41:18):
Awesome, thank you, thank you, Blas