December 10, 2025 • 38 mins
The legendary Bob Boyett created and produced all of your favorite sitcoms from back in the day like Happy Days, Full House, Laverne and Shirley, Bosom Buddies, Step by Step...and a million more. But his best work (in our humble opinion) was Family Matters!
On this special episode, Bob gives us an insider's look at creating the show and why he wanted to center a Black family, especially Black women, on primetime TV.
Leave us a voicemail at thefamilymatterspod.com! Let us know what you think of the podcast and share your own memories of "Family Matters." And if you have any questions, issues, or "family matters" of your own that you need advice on, Telma and Kellie will do their best to help!
Follow us on Instagram @welcometothefamilypod. And follow Telma @telma_hopkins and Kellie @kellieswilliams.
"Welcome to the Family with Telma and Kellie" is an Audiation and iHeartRadio production.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Really listens a mission this day and age Kelly and
Tilma and return in the page. We're talking family matters
is about those times? Ellen?
Speaker 2 (00:12):
What happened between.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
The line with Kelly and me?
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Welcome to the famlie people.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
We promised you treat on this show, and we have
a real big treat for you today. We are so
excited to welcome a Hollywood legend to the family.
Speaker 4 (00:43):
Oh, we love you, We love you.
Speaker 5 (00:44):
Thank you so much, Bob.
Speaker 4 (00:46):
Well, thank you. We had a great time. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Well, let me just give you some accolades, young man. Now,
this man put the F in family. He knows about
family shows. He has developed, created, or produced shows like
Happy Days, la Verne and Shirley, Bosom, Buddies, Perfect Strangers,
More Mendy, Full House, Step by Step, Somebody bring me
in a halo.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
I'm running up.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
He has also been a VP of Programming at ABC.
Oh and let me mention have over sixteen hundred episodes
of TV to his credit. He is a multiple Tony
Award winner, twelve at last count, I think he has
credits on over one hundred Broadway plays, including Glenn Blarry,
Glenn Ross, spam Alot, Tammy Fay, dear Evan Hanson, Hillary
(01:35):
and Clinton and like one hundred others.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
You know, I just can't do it. Mata Morse.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
He was our executive producer. That's right on family matters.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
And proud to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Please, welcome to this show, our family, our friend, our buddy,
mister bob boy.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Yet bye bye, by, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
What a wonderful day this is.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
I miss you well. I missed you too. You both
look wonderful though you Thank you.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Jesus and see as she was on the show. Yeah,
So there's so much I want to talk to you about,
and I'm sure Kelly as well, because I mean.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Your Bob boy.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Yet this is just amazing. And the fact that we
can pick up a phone and talk to.
Speaker 4 (02:31):
You, of course anytime.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
With all the stuff that you have done, is just amazing.
Now I met you, I think in nineteen seventy nine.
You came to visit a little show called A New
Kind of Family Brennan, Rob Lowe, Jory Kendler and Janet
Jeffson myself. Janet played my daughter, and you came to
see Jane Eisner and aren't you Gordon. Yeah, And that's
(02:57):
the first time I met you. And then I got
an audition forsom Buddies. If it began our relationship.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Absolutely, it's been almost fifty years.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Very quietly, let's not feel too much. I give you
notes about what we can say and not say on
this show because only thirty nine and holdly, that's right.
But that was just such a wonderful time. I want
to talk about some buddies. But you know there's a
little actor on there that you found, Tom Hanks, I believe. Yeah,
that was a wonderful show. How did I get on
(03:32):
the show? I always wonder that I thought I talked
my way into it.
Speaker 4 (03:37):
Oh no, no, you were much sought after and we
were happy that you were willing to come on and
be an important part of this family. That's great.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
Yeah, such a great cast. Such I mean, such a
it was place to start for so many of us.
I mean we were like a bunch of bad kids
with a great show.
Speaker 4 (03:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I thought about when I was reading all the statistics,
how many hectors you have employed over the I mean
it's got to be in the thousands just on TV alone,
and then all the plays and just all your productions.
It's just amazing. I remember Bob Saggat as one of
our warmers.
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Oh yes, right, yes, mister.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Tatahad, if I'm not mistaken. That was his first television credit.
He did an episode of Bus and Buddies. If back
to listen to the show that you featured me on
where I was a singer that couldn't quite get it
together and coming back to the stage. But my son
talks about that all the time, talks about the atmosphere
of the show that you created. Because he was like
(04:42):
nine or ten, he was so welcome there.
Speaker 4 (04:44):
Yeah, and he always remember, well, a little boy sitting
up there. Yeah, it's so great.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
But I just want to interject to it because I
love how excited tell Me is to see you. And
I was thinking about when we were talking about inviting
you on to talk about the Telma so excited. When
I talked to Joe Joe Marie, you know, she wound
up leaving the show and coming back, but she all
always talks about how kind you were. You know, I
come from a very working class family, and my father,
(05:11):
who's not a very emotional guy, when he talks about
you and the way that you welcomed us to the show,
he talks about how kind you were to us. Do
you think that some of your success was partly because
of your approach to leadership?
Speaker 4 (05:28):
Absolutely. I have been very fortunate to work with wonderful
people like the two of you, and I never took
that for granted, and that I cared about the people
that I worked with and I respected the people that
I worked with. That's very very I think important for
us all as a family to produce well, to do
(05:51):
whatever we do, whether we're acting or writing or producing
or whatever. We need to be comfortable in the environment
that we create to work together. Well, that's always been
very important to me.
Speaker 5 (06:06):
A lot of leadership is not taking that approach right now.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
I also think that at a certain point, a lot
of people that own shows, managed shows, directed shows, or
executives somewhere in the process took shortcuts and it was
the bottom line for them, and that's what mattered. Always.
I always got in trouble for spending money on dressing
(06:31):
rooms and forgive for all the creature comforts, but the
creature comforts were important, so important. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
A lot of people don't know this, but I want
to thank you for how you took care of Rosetta
when you.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
Talk about caring about your family.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
When you talk about that, you know Rosetta didn't want
to do the show, Yeah, because she had had bad
experiences before that. Yeah, but she never stopped thinking thanking
me for talking her into it.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
Well, you were responsible for getting her to come with us.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Wanted her to have a Bob experience because she did
have a tough time on the show we were on before.
But from getting her an assistant, you just took such
good care of her and she's so appreciated. I just
want to tell you, I loved you anyway that made
me love you even thank you.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
I loved her, and of course I love you, but
I felt a connection with her right away, and I
cared about her.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
Yeah. She was a wonderful lady, a wonderful way, and
she so loved being on that show. She just had
the time of her life and we got the benefit
of it because she was the perfect mother for Reggie.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
They were that's right together, that's right, that's right.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
We speaking of that. How did you come up with
the concept for family Matters? I know that Joe was
on Perfect Strangers. Yeah, how did you spin our character off?
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Well, actually, we developed the show because we felt there
was a need for a more accessible black family show.
The Cosby Show was out and a great success, and
they deserved it. It was a well written show. He
was a great performer and entertainer. It was a wonderful cast,
(08:24):
that whole cast. Yeah, so I had nothing but admiration
for the show. But the show aimed at a certain
level in society that was sort of high end, and
we thought, wouldn't it be great to do a show
that is sort of middle ground, And that's why we
came up with the idea. We thought, look, no one
(08:46):
wants to do another copy or try to do a
copy of The Cosby Show, but we could cast those
whole different light on this by doing a show that's
slightly different in terms of the approach to life together
as a family. And that's when we came up with idea.
And actually we came up with the idea for the
(09:08):
show and started pitching at Tom Miller and myself and
then we thought, well, we need some kind of launch,
and we thought it would be great to do it
with Joe Marie because she was a very popular character
on her strangers didn't have much to do. She was
playing an elevator operator. So yeah, that's a very small set, right,
(09:33):
but it was great and it was a great way
for us to get it onto the network also because
the network would rather do a spin off than to
do a pilot.
Speaker 5 (09:43):
Do you have a specific approach to deciding what kind
of shows that you guys wanted to produce.
Speaker 4 (09:50):
Well, I don't know that we have a form that
we follow, but we obviously want to produce shows that
appeal to us, and that was always hallmark of our shows.
I didn't want to do a show that I didn't
want to watch, and so it was very important always
to do shows that first and foremost appeal to me
(10:12):
and appeal to Tom. And we also wanted to do
a show with great, strong characters and then hire great
actors to enable those characters.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Kelly, do you remember your process becoming part of the cast?
Speaker 5 (10:30):
Do? And that's what I totally remember. Like I was
doing Joe Turner's Coming Gone to August Wilson play in
DC when I got the call, and I remember coming
out there it was a whole new world. It was
so exciting. Yeah, I mean I approached it the same
way that I approached theater, So it was very similar
because you guys have all been such seasoned actors. The
(10:52):
process was very similar.
Speaker 4 (10:54):
Well, first and foremost, you guys, you two guys were actors.
You were not tellelevision stars. You were real actors from
the real world of acting. And that's what we sought
and thought. Tom and I cast many shows in New York.
We really didn't just sit in a room in Hollywood
at guess shows because we found a lot of seasoned,
(11:18):
stage trained actors.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
That.
Speaker 5 (11:21):
Hey, I love that you said that, because I think
that your approach to the writers. Also because I was surprised.
Did you guys intentionally find such huge characters like, you know,
the Fawns Lennon Squeggy, Julia's character. Did you guys intend
to make these characters the huge TV success?
Speaker 4 (11:41):
No, we really didn't. We never set out to create
a breakout character. We let it happen. If it did happen,
we let it happen. But that was not the goal.
And in almost every show there would be someone who
would either be worky enough or unique enough compared to
(12:03):
the rest of the characters you see on television that
they would break out somehow. Yeah, I see.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
The audience always chooses yeah, you know they know who
they're going to latch onto. That's right, and it's just
amazing to me. I wanted to ask you something this
kind of goes back, but how did you start in
this business? Did you start as a producer? I mean
I'd heard that you started in a mail room. Was
that true or was that just something somebody made up.
Speaker 4 (12:30):
I didn't start in the mailroom, but way I started
When I got out of school. I had gone to
college in New York at Columbia, and I got a job,
my first job working in an advertising agency because that
was the closest I could get to writing things. And
it was a good job because that was the era
(12:50):
of doing comedy commercials for products. I was doing that
job at a that agency when someone came up to
me and said, I've heard you talk about wanting to
do theater, and there's somebody that is developing for theater.
That was really my first love, honestly, But they also
(13:12):
reminded me you have to make a living, and yes,
there's a job in television. It's a good job because
you would be developing programs in New York City where
you would meet a lot of the writers and directors
and whatever that worked throughout the industry, and it happened
to be true, and I did meet a lot of
great people that way, and so I kind of fell
(13:34):
into it, and then I began to love television. I
was a snob at the beginning. I was a snob.
I didn't watch television. I looked on my nose a
little bit. But when I started doing it and started
doing the kind of television that we did, I developed
a great love for it, and I had a wonderful
(13:55):
life doing it, and it enabled me to then transition
and to what I do now, which is Broadway, which
I love, and you are doing it. Wow.
Speaker 5 (14:05):
I saw Steven Spielberg say that if the industry was
similar to how it is now, basically run by attorneys
lawyers that he don't even know if his career would
have been what it was. Do you think that you
would have been as successful as you have become if
the industry had been similar, I mean, because they're not
(14:27):
making those kind of TV shows anymore.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
Yeah, I don't know about that. I do know that
it's much harder today. I mean, it always seemed hard
to break into an industry like this. This aspect of entertainment.
But I think it's much harder today. I often wonder now,
like how because I have young people that come to
me and say, look, how do I get in? And
(14:50):
I always say, take any job you can get in
the door, in the door, get your foot in the door,
and then make friends with every There's nobody that you
want to turn away. Absolutely want to be friendly with everyone,
because you'll meet him on the way up, and you'll
meet him.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
To be pushing and kicking you down or trying to
help you back up.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
You put me on a show getting by with someone
that I loved and admired so much, Sidi Williams. I
want to thank you because that job turned into a
friendship to the end, and I I mean it's very
emotional for me because I miss her so much. Thank you,
Thank you. I know she was great, what a great
(15:42):
I can still her here calling me. Tell me, Luke
and you are our great, great team, which is one
we were.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
We had a lot of fun.
Speaker 5 (15:49):
Yeah, so, Bob, you mentioned how you shifted back to
your first love. What made you leave till Vision to
do theater basically full time?
Speaker 4 (16:03):
Well, I didn't really leave television frankly, a lot of
shows that we had done, thankfully ran for nine years
or eleven years, and it was a wonderful career. But
at some point there was a greater value put on
reality based ships that were cheap, cheaper to produce and
(16:27):
all of that, and I just felt, well, this is
not for me. I don't want to do that form
of television. And I also had always wanted to settle
back on the East Coast. All my family is on
the East Coast. And I also always maintained an apartment
in New York because I love New York. Some of
(16:47):
them were one room, but still, you know, I had
one room in New York and so and I was
grateful for that. So I I did, when things started
changing radically in the industry, to come back where I
wanted to live and where I wanted to work and
(17:09):
where I could try to break into theater because I
didn't have any experience in it. I was so fortunate
that when I came back, the community sort of welcomed
me into it. I thought that would be shut out
because I know the Broadway community is very competitive because
it's not much to go around, you know, and so
(17:32):
people fight like dogs to get their show on, and
they fight like dogs to keep your show off. I
found it to be just the opposite for me. It's
like I met a few wonderful people and they helped me,
showed me the ropes, welcomed me into the whole Broadway scene.
So I was very lucky. It was luck too, you know.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
I think it had a lot to do with how
you are with people though, the things that we've been
talking about, the way you welcome people, and the way
you are with people, how kind you are, and how
it doesn't matter whether it's the janitor or the executive producer,
you treated everybody on the show with love and respect,
and that you deserve everything, all your accolades and everything
(18:15):
that you've gotten. It has so much to do with
your personality.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
I appreciate that, but I don't know any other way
to act. Really. That's good, don't go changing. Yeah no,
that's right.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
Yeah, So, Bob, other than family matters, what was your
favorite show to theater or television, what was your favorite
thing to produce?
Speaker 4 (18:37):
Well, let's the old classic answer.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
You know you you love all your children the same,
that's right.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
My sister's my parents' favorite.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
Yeah, no, not the same. Everybody's not loved the same,
but everybody's loved differently. And there's some shows that I
attached myself to emotionally for one reason, and others maybe not.
But there might be something else about the show that
I love. It might be a fun show to do
(19:09):
and to write and to develop, and that's justifiable enough
for me to work on something that's a lot of
fun to do. But I also like to work on
things that I think have some meaning and some usefulness
to humanity. Yes, I don't do it to make a box.
(19:29):
I've been fortunate and that just doing it make a book.
Speaker 5 (19:38):
The industry is really run by lawyers. So what do
you attribute back to. Like again, you go back to
you make things that you would want to watch, correct.
Speaker 4 (19:47):
Right, well, things that they want to It's yes, the
old issue. Follow the money, and the money comes from
bank First of all, bankers hire the lawyers, and so
you've got a bunch of people that are not in
the business to entertain people, to provoke people, to provide
(20:10):
people with some polemic or whatever. They're just in the
business to make a book. And that's the direction then
that they impart to the people they hire and to
the lawyers. The lawyers are really just following instructions. You
have to remember that people that got into television initially
(20:31):
were not supported or helped by the wider community because
everybody in the motion picture industry and the theatrical they
were afraid of television. They thought, oh, that little box
is going to put us all out of work, and
so they did everything to try to not support rank.
(20:51):
I don't know why the transition took place, but it
transitioned from people that honestly wanted to to do good work,
write good shows, entertain people and have the audience really
enjoy it. It transitions somewhat into people looking only at
the bottom line.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
And I love that you bring that up, because what
do you think about how the industry has turned into
streaming the streaming industry to you, how has it changed
even more?
Speaker 4 (21:22):
Well, the truth is, we all want exposure for our show,
no matter what you are, whether you're an actor or producer, writer,
or whatever, and streaming has provided wider and more exposure.
There are still some problems to work out. I don't
(21:42):
think that people are adequately compensated for streaming yet, and
that's changing, and that people are negotiating at a more
fair level. I think I think it will happen because
it's a big business and they want the product. I mean,
the bottom line is what you do and what I
(22:04):
do we make the product. I mean, all those other
people might make money, but they can't make the product
we need, and we therefore are in control. And the
bottom line.
Speaker 5 (22:16):
Is that's how empowering to creatives because it does feel
so difficult to realize what you have is it's a
valid product and that people still want to have good,
solid storytelling in the way that you obviously approach your productions.
Speaker 4 (22:33):
Absolutely. Yeah, well that's what we believed in. I didn't
ever know another way to do it, and fortunately we
worked at a time where we were not bossed around
by a bank or lawyer.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
Really, I want to Bob Iger give the speech where
he says, Hi, I'm Bob Iger, and I come from
the time of the forty haer so different, right, Yeah,
you don't have to compete with a billion different TV
shows at the same time. Yeah, you don't have to
compete with crappy stuff.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
On every table channel in the world. There's so many.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
Oh, yeah, that's true.
Speaker 5 (23:17):
I don't know if you remember, but initially you guys said,
we wanted to make a strong show about a working
class family that just happened to be black. Right, But
we watched the show, there are a lot of things
that are very specific to black culture and black people.
Did you just trust us to do the blackening part.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
Was to black it up? Well, of course we did
trust you. But the truth is, Look, I was raised
for at least half of my upbringing by two black
women who lived with us, and I grew up in
the South and they lived with us and who raised me,
and I to this day will say the wisest people
(24:01):
I know are black women. Right. Because I was never
told to do something because I told you to. I
was given a reason don't do this because your mother's
going to come home and she's going to get mad
with you and mad with me, and then you're going
(24:22):
to clean all this up right now before she gets here.
And that made sense to me because I thought, yeah,
she will, she'll be mad and all of us here
and I would clean it up. But that's the way
they reasoned with me. I always had a reason for
things that I had to do. That is so interesting.
Speaker 5 (24:41):
Yeah, often do people from your actual life make it
into the shows that you produced a.
Speaker 4 (24:47):
Lot, a lot. In fact, your name in the show
came from well, she was called a nurse because back
in the day, people that worked with young children were
not called nan they would call nurses nurses. And my
nurse was Laura Lee, and so I took that name
for you based on my nurse. But my point is,
(25:14):
I feel that I was very sophisticated about black culture.
I knew black people, and I, as a child, of course,
was nurtured by them. But even later on I had
lots of black friends. I heard a really silly thing
one time from a producer who was doing another black
show that had nothing to do with us whatsoever. And
(25:37):
the producer said, last week, we were doing a show
and a very strong member of the cast said to us, look,
what's wrong with this episode is you have the cast
finishing dinner and serving dessert in a black household. When
they finished dinner, they go and wash all the dishes,
(26:01):
and then they come back to the table and eat dessert.
And you've got to change the show to make it authentic.
And I thought, well, that's kind of ridiculous. First of all,
I'd eaten in a lot of black homes and we
didn't have to go to Washington between dinner and dessert.
I never heard we did. That's true, But I just
(26:23):
thought that was interesting that this cast member had imposed
that on them, and that, you know, just seemed very
unreal to me. But I never felt I had to
strive too hard to understand black culture. I mean I
knew a lot about it, you know.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Yeah, well because that that, like I said, that episode
was so well written and so pay tribute to the
strength and just the superiority sometimes of.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Black Remind me again, because I've forgotten who wrote that episode. Remember,
I don't remember who wrote that. I just wanted anybody
on the team remembers a Bill and Michael or maybe
some of the They're going to look it up for us. Okay,
good Bill and Michael, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
Ellen, Michael, Bill Bigley and Michael Warren wrote.
Speaker 5 (27:09):
What was your relationship with them? How did they wind
up helping with the creation of the show. Did you
know them from Laverna Sharly in those days?
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Yeah, we knew them from all the paramount days. Bill
Bickley came from Texas, and I think his first job
was being an assistant to Tom Miller before he became
a legitimate show writer, and he then wanted to try
to submit a script and he wrote a really good one.
So Tom said, look, next season, we'll put you on
(27:39):
a show as apprentice writer. And that's how he got started.
And then he hooked up with Michael Warren at some
point and they became a team.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
A lot of the same names on a lot of
your shows, that Donadas and Jack Zeapert. Yeah, yeah, and
I love that because I've got four shows with you
that you are right loyal.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
Look, we are, and people have been loyal to us,
So it's a two way street and there's a reason
for it. Well, I hope.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
So nobody can tell me anything about my bye boy
yet I call you my box so much. They thought
your first name was my.
Speaker 4 (28:14):
Well, we've had a wonderful long friendship as we have.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
We have.
Speaker 4 (28:20):
I'm happy about that, and I'm happy about having worked
with the two of you because you were outstanding examples
of talent and the ability to also maintain a great
rapport with all of the people in this cast, and
that has a lot to do with how you come
(28:44):
off on screen. I agree with that.
Speaker 2 (28:46):
I think that's one reason that we were so believable
because we really did love each other. It wasn't it
were a family manufacturer, you know, And so the proof
of it is here. It is what forty years later
and we're still around and still still in touch and
still loving each other.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
People will never understand how much that matters. When I'm saying,
as Laura to Telma, Aunt Rachel, I love you, it's
still Kelly saying to Telma, I love you. And it's
a real something that happens when you can find that
kind of connection as an actres.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
We have to give it all to you because I
think the first time I met everyone was at the
table read but it just felt right. It just read right,
It just seemed right.
Speaker 4 (29:31):
Well, you know, Tom Miller and I did not know
how each of us would perform the leadership role with
a show because when we first met, I was an
executive at ABC and Tom was a producer who was
coming into New York to bring a show called Happy Days,
(29:52):
and Michael Eisner was the president of Paramount and he
called me and said, there's a show coming in that
I'm very high on, and Tom Miller is one of
the producers. He's coming in with the show. I want
you to meet him, I want you to get very
familiar with the show, and I want you to be
prepared in the meetings. We have to really defend that
(30:12):
show and sell the show. So when Tom came in,
I of course introduced myself and we watched the show
together and I immediately loved the show. I loved all
the characters, and I thought, well, this is an easy
job for me to sell the show. Interestingly enough, when
we presented it to the ABC executives, so with a
son who said, oh, well, why are you doing a
(30:34):
period show? I mean, that doesn't work on television. It's
set in the fifties. Well, we had gotten the idea.
Gary Marshall actually got the idea because he was in
Chicago and he saw an early development production of Greece,
and he came back from that trip and he said, look, guys,
(30:56):
let's do that. Let's set the family show. We already
had the characters, but let's set our family show in
the fifties. It'll give it a unique look that's not
on television right now. And that's where the idea came from.
But the man I was pitching to in New York,
of course, they didn't know about Greece, or they didn't
know about fifties or anything like that, except some of
(31:18):
them were probably graduated from school when they were in
the fifties because they were mostly seventy year old men. Anyway,
we were able to sell it, and Tom and I
became good friends, and then Eddie Milchis was the third partner,
and the three of us got along great. They said
to me, why don't you just join us as a producer,
because you're more creative than an executive, So why don't
(31:41):
you come over and make the shows with us? And
I said, I would love to do that. Wow, that
is so interesting.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
And I love that you defended the show and I
wanted to come back to our show because I remember
initially the show didn't do as well before that great
you know, the big Arkle craze. The show wasn't doing
as well. What made you stay with our show because
we didn't have the numbers initially, Well.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
We believe we had a great show. What happened is
they threw a lot of hard competition against us initially
because they knew the same thing at CBS and NBC.
They knew this was a good show. So they put
hard shows against us to try to kill our chances
of becoming successful, and we had to move the show
(32:26):
twice to get into a more favorable time period. But
we had no question about the show. We thought we
have a great show. So that's a fact. That was
our sensibility. What we have to do is fight to
get out of the way of competition until we get
the audience to see the show and appreciate it. And
(32:46):
so that's why we kept fighting to move to another
time period, which we did, and eventually the audience caught on.
Speaker 5 (32:53):
Well, that really speaks to the time because now you
get one episode and if not, you are to here.
So they think that the network must have really believed
in you guys.
Speaker 4 (33:04):
Also right, Oh, in some cases, Kelly, you don't get
one episode, You get a test session, wow, with some
audience that watches your pilot and says yes or no.
You never get on the air to begin with.
Speaker 5 (33:20):
So is the luck of the draw in terms of
like a test.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
It could be yes, yes, it can be now yeah.
And you know, these test audiences are supposed to be
a random selection of a cross cut of the population.
But the truth is between you and me. People who
sign up to drive to a bad neighborhood in New
(33:45):
Jersey and sit in a room with twelve other people
to watch mostly bad television shows are not the kind
of people that should be judging whether something's good or not.
Speaker 5 (33:57):
Well, why is making this sound like jury?
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Dude?
Speaker 4 (34:01):
It is? I think it is. I think it is.
Oh my gosh. You know, I have never been called
to be on the jury, and you don't know. And
I would love that. I would love that, and I
always fancy myself. Oh I would be a great joy.
Speaker 5 (34:19):
You know, since the person who has never been called
I have never gotten a call, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (34:27):
Maybe they know something about me.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
You know.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Well, this has just been been great. It's been a
wonderful bab.
Speaker 4 (34:37):
I love seeing both of you. You both were wonderful
people to work with and good friends, and I'll treasure
that always as well.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
I mean, you have been such a huge part of
my career and I brag about you all the time.
Speaker 5 (34:56):
And yeah, and you don't to note that your influence
on the life of performers, it's like life changing. Like
I came from Maryland, I came from Detroit. Right awesome,
Thank you so much, Bob.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
And by the way, you mentioned your father, who was
such a sweet man. I enjoy knowing him. He was
a great guy. So yeah, thanks Bob, Yeah, yeah, absolutely absolutely.
And Telma had a great son sitting up there in
the bleachers.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
Yeah, he loved that chep.
Speaker 4 (35:30):
What was he eight or nine years old?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Yeah, Tom used to on his days off, he would
call him down to be in the sets to fill
up the room.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
He just had such a great time.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
The big joke Tom would always say on tape night, okay,
everybody get food before Gerald. I mean where they call
him a red then he wasn't caerrold Red and his
little friend get here because you know they got chew
everything down.
Speaker 4 (35:50):
To the tablewall.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
So he would get your food, get your food or
Soun's coming today.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
It's funny.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
I just thank you from the bottom of my heart.
I thank you, grateful to you, so honored to know you,
not just as as the great man that you are
in the business, but as a great friend. He's a
great person. I just admire you. I love you.
Speaker 4 (36:12):
I could go on and on and me too, absolutely,
and that's mutual for both of you. And I thank
you for this invitation and I look forward to your
whole series.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Well, don't be surprised if you get another call, Bob.
It's kind of an interesting guy.
Speaker 5 (36:28):
See how he's laughing, like.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Don't call me. You better hurry up because I'm getting
older every day, Honey, we all are. I feel like
I'm so old, not.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
Got everything written down at this point, even though I'm
only thirty nine. Well, Bob, thank you so much for
the time. Thank you guys just for being a part
of what you created.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
Thank you, Bob, Thank you absolutely. I love you both.
We love you more. Bye bye right bye bye. Stay tuned.
Speaker 5 (36:59):
Yeah, we want to rewatch each episode of Family Matters
week by week, so make sure to rewatch the show
right along with us. You can catch it on Hulu
and TVs and a bunch of other places.
Speaker 2 (37:11):
Welcome to the Family with Telma and Kelly is a
production of iHeart Podcasts and Audiation. It's hosted by me
Tloma Hopkins and me Kelly Williams. Our executive producers are
Sandy Smallings for Audiation, Adam rip JD.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Hopkins, who also happens to be my son.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
And Kelly's pobro, and Jonathan Strickland for iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 5 (37:32):
The show is produced by Telma and I, but our
series producer is Irelen Meechin and our theme songs lyrics
were written by j. D. Hopkins and Adam RiPP. The
theme song was scored and mixed by Matt Noble, who's
also our series mixer.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
And we'd like to thank Nikki E Tour and the
entire iHeart Podcast team.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 5 (37:52):
Follow us on Instagram at Welcome to the Family Pod
for behind the scenes photos and more bonus content.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
And don't forget to leave us a voicemail. Let our website,
Thefamilymatterspod dot com. We want to hear your thoughts and
favorite memories of the show and let us know if
you need advice, because we're good for some bad advice.
We might be able to help you with your own
Family Matters.
Speaker 5 (38:13):
And make sure to rate and review us wherever you're listening.
We are so excited to have you guys along for
the ride.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Yes, Welcome to the family, y'all, and we'll see you
next time.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
Welcome to the Familie
Speaker 1 (38:36):
Audiation
Really listens a mission this day and age Kelly and
Tilma and return in the page. We're talking family matters
is about those times? Ellen?
Speaker 2 (00:12):
What happened between.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
The line with Kelly and me?
Speaker 3 (00:20):
Welcome to the famlie people.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
We promised you treat on this show, and we have
a real big treat for you today. We are so
excited to welcome a Hollywood legend to the family.
Speaker 4 (00:43):
Oh, we love you, We love you.
Speaker 5 (00:44):
Thank you so much, Bob.
Speaker 4 (00:46):
Well, thank you. We had a great time. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Well, let me just give you some accolades, young man. Now,
this man put the F in family. He knows about
family shows. He has developed, created, or produced shows like
Happy Days, la Verne and Shirley, Bosom, Buddies, Perfect Strangers,
More Mendy, Full House, Step by Step, Somebody bring me
in a halo.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
I'm running up.
Speaker 2 (01:11):
He has also been a VP of Programming at ABC.
Oh and let me mention have over sixteen hundred episodes
of TV to his credit. He is a multiple Tony
Award winner, twelve at last count, I think he has
credits on over one hundred Broadway plays, including Glenn Blarry,
Glenn Ross, spam Alot, Tammy Fay, dear Evan Hanson, Hillary
(01:35):
and Clinton and like one hundred others.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
You know, I just can't do it. Mata Morse.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
He was our executive producer. That's right on family matters.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
And proud to do it.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Please, welcome to this show, our family, our friend, our buddy,
mister bob boy.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Yet bye bye, by, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
What a wonderful day this is.
Speaker 4 (02:05):
I miss you well. I missed you too. You both
look wonderful though you Thank you.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Jesus and see as she was on the show. Yeah,
So there's so much I want to talk to you about,
and I'm sure Kelly as well, because I mean.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Your Bob boy.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Yet this is just amazing. And the fact that we
can pick up a phone and talk to.
Speaker 4 (02:31):
You, of course anytime.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
With all the stuff that you have done, is just amazing.
Now I met you, I think in nineteen seventy nine.
You came to visit a little show called A New
Kind of Family Brennan, Rob Lowe, Jory Kendler and Janet
Jeffson myself. Janet played my daughter, and you came to
see Jane Eisner and aren't you Gordon. Yeah, And that's
(02:57):
the first time I met you. And then I got
an audition forsom Buddies. If it began our relationship.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Absolutely, it's been almost fifty years.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Very quietly, let's not feel too much. I give you
notes about what we can say and not say on
this show because only thirty nine and holdly, that's right.
But that was just such a wonderful time. I want
to talk about some buddies. But you know there's a
little actor on there that you found, Tom Hanks, I believe. Yeah,
that was a wonderful show. How did I get on
(03:32):
the show? I always wonder that I thought I talked
my way into it.
Speaker 4 (03:37):
Oh no, no, you were much sought after and we
were happy that you were willing to come on and
be an important part of this family. That's great.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
Yeah, such a great cast. Such I mean, such a
it was place to start for so many of us.
I mean we were like a bunch of bad kids
with a great show.
Speaker 4 (03:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
I thought about when I was reading all the statistics,
how many hectors you have employed over the I mean
it's got to be in the thousands just on TV alone,
and then all the plays and just all your productions.
It's just amazing. I remember Bob Saggat as one of
our warmers.
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Oh yes, right, yes, mister.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Tatahad, if I'm not mistaken. That was his first television credit.
He did an episode of Bus and Buddies. If back
to listen to the show that you featured me on
where I was a singer that couldn't quite get it
together and coming back to the stage. But my son
talks about that all the time, talks about the atmosphere
of the show that you created. Because he was like
(04:42):
nine or ten, he was so welcome there.
Speaker 4 (04:44):
Yeah, and he always remember, well, a little boy sitting
up there. Yeah, it's so great.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
But I just want to interject to it because I
love how excited tell Me is to see you. And
I was thinking about when we were talking about inviting
you on to talk about the Telma so excited. When
I talked to Joe Joe Marie, you know, she wound
up leaving the show and coming back, but she all
always talks about how kind you were. You know, I
come from a very working class family, and my father,
(05:11):
who's not a very emotional guy, when he talks about
you and the way that you welcomed us to the show,
he talks about how kind you were to us. Do
you think that some of your success was partly because
of your approach to leadership?
Speaker 4 (05:28):
Absolutely. I have been very fortunate to work with wonderful
people like the two of you, and I never took
that for granted, and that I cared about the people
that I worked with and I respected the people that
I worked with. That's very very I think important for
us all as a family to produce well, to do
(05:51):
whatever we do, whether we're acting or writing or producing
or whatever. We need to be comfortable in the environment
that we create to work together. Well, that's always been
very important to me.
Speaker 5 (06:06):
A lot of leadership is not taking that approach right now.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
I also think that at a certain point, a lot
of people that own shows, managed shows, directed shows, or
executives somewhere in the process took shortcuts and it was
the bottom line for them, and that's what mattered. Always.
I always got in trouble for spending money on dressing
(06:31):
rooms and forgive for all the creature comforts, but the
creature comforts were important, so important. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
A lot of people don't know this, but I want
to thank you for how you took care of Rosetta
when you.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
Talk about caring about your family.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
When you talk about that, you know Rosetta didn't want
to do the show, Yeah, because she had had bad
experiences before that. Yeah, but she never stopped thinking thanking
me for talking her into it.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
Well, you were responsible for getting her to come with us.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Wanted her to have a Bob experience because she did
have a tough time on the show we were on before.
But from getting her an assistant, you just took such
good care of her and she's so appreciated. I just
want to tell you, I loved you anyway that made
me love you even thank you.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
I loved her, and of course I love you, but
I felt a connection with her right away, and I
cared about her.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
Yeah. She was a wonderful lady, a wonderful way, and
she so loved being on that show. She just had
the time of her life and we got the benefit
of it because she was the perfect mother for Reggie.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
They were that's right together, that's right, that's right.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
We speaking of that. How did you come up with
the concept for family Matters? I know that Joe was
on Perfect Strangers. Yeah, how did you spin our character off?
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Well, actually, we developed the show because we felt there
was a need for a more accessible black family show.
The Cosby Show was out and a great success, and
they deserved it. It was a well written show. He
was a great performer and entertainer. It was a wonderful cast,
(08:24):
that whole cast. Yeah, so I had nothing but admiration
for the show. But the show aimed at a certain
level in society that was sort of high end, and
we thought, wouldn't it be great to do a show
that is sort of middle ground, And that's why we
came up with the idea. We thought, look, no one
(08:46):
wants to do another copy or try to do a
copy of The Cosby Show, but we could cast those
whole different light on this by doing a show that's
slightly different in terms of the approach to life together
as a family. And that's when we came up with idea.
And actually we came up with the idea for the
(09:08):
show and started pitching at Tom Miller and myself and
then we thought, well, we need some kind of launch,
and we thought it would be great to do it
with Joe Marie because she was a very popular character
on her strangers didn't have much to do. She was
playing an elevator operator. So yeah, that's a very small set, right,
(09:33):
but it was great and it was a great way
for us to get it onto the network also because
the network would rather do a spin off than to
do a pilot.
Speaker 5 (09:43):
Do you have a specific approach to deciding what kind
of shows that you guys wanted to produce.
Speaker 4 (09:50):
Well, I don't know that we have a form that
we follow, but we obviously want to produce shows that
appeal to us, and that was always hallmark of our shows.
I didn't want to do a show that I didn't
want to watch, and so it was very important always
to do shows that first and foremost appeal to me
(10:12):
and appeal to Tom. And we also wanted to do
a show with great, strong characters and then hire great
actors to enable those characters.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Kelly, do you remember your process becoming part of the cast?
Speaker 5 (10:30):
Do? And that's what I totally remember. Like I was
doing Joe Turner's Coming Gone to August Wilson play in
DC when I got the call, and I remember coming
out there it was a whole new world. It was
so exciting. Yeah, I mean I approached it the same
way that I approached theater, So it was very similar
because you guys have all been such seasoned actors. The
(10:52):
process was very similar.
Speaker 4 (10:54):
Well, first and foremost, you guys, you two guys were actors.
You were not tellelevision stars. You were real actors from
the real world of acting. And that's what we sought
and thought. Tom and I cast many shows in New York.
We really didn't just sit in a room in Hollywood
at guess shows because we found a lot of seasoned,
(11:18):
stage trained actors.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
That.
Speaker 5 (11:21):
Hey, I love that you said that, because I think
that your approach to the writers. Also because I was surprised.
Did you guys intentionally find such huge characters like, you know,
the Fawns Lennon Squeggy, Julia's character. Did you guys intend
to make these characters the huge TV success?
Speaker 4 (11:41):
No, we really didn't. We never set out to create
a breakout character. We let it happen. If it did happen,
we let it happen. But that was not the goal.
And in almost every show there would be someone who
would either be worky enough or unique enough compared to
(12:03):
the rest of the characters you see on television that
they would break out somehow. Yeah, I see.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
The audience always chooses yeah, you know they know who
they're going to latch onto. That's right, and it's just
amazing to me. I wanted to ask you something this
kind of goes back, but how did you start in
this business? Did you start as a producer? I mean
I'd heard that you started in a mail room. Was
that true or was that just something somebody made up.
Speaker 4 (12:30):
I didn't start in the mailroom, but way I started
When I got out of school. I had gone to
college in New York at Columbia, and I got a job,
my first job working in an advertising agency because that
was the closest I could get to writing things. And
it was a good job because that was the era
(12:50):
of doing comedy commercials for products. I was doing that
job at a that agency when someone came up to
me and said, I've heard you talk about wanting to
do theater, and there's somebody that is developing for theater.
That was really my first love, honestly, But they also
(13:12):
reminded me you have to make a living, and yes,
there's a job in television. It's a good job because
you would be developing programs in New York City where
you would meet a lot of the writers and directors
and whatever that worked throughout the industry, and it happened
to be true, and I did meet a lot of
great people that way, and so I kind of fell
(13:34):
into it, and then I began to love television. I
was a snob at the beginning. I was a snob.
I didn't watch television. I looked on my nose a
little bit. But when I started doing it and started
doing the kind of television that we did, I developed
a great love for it, and I had a wonderful
(13:55):
life doing it, and it enabled me to then transition
and to what I do now, which is Broadway, which
I love, and you are doing it. Wow.
Speaker 5 (14:05):
I saw Steven Spielberg say that if the industry was
similar to how it is now, basically run by attorneys
lawyers that he don't even know if his career would
have been what it was. Do you think that you
would have been as successful as you have become if
the industry had been similar, I mean, because they're not
(14:27):
making those kind of TV shows anymore.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
Yeah, I don't know about that. I do know that
it's much harder today. I mean, it always seemed hard
to break into an industry like this. This aspect of entertainment.
But I think it's much harder today. I often wonder now,
like how because I have young people that come to
me and say, look, how do I get in? And
(14:50):
I always say, take any job you can get in
the door, in the door, get your foot in the door,
and then make friends with every There's nobody that you
want to turn away. Absolutely want to be friendly with everyone,
because you'll meet him on the way up, and you'll
meet him.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
To be pushing and kicking you down or trying to
help you back up.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2 (15:16):
You put me on a show getting by with someone
that I loved and admired so much, Sidi Williams. I
want to thank you because that job turned into a
friendship to the end, and I I mean it's very
emotional for me because I miss her so much. Thank you,
Thank you. I know she was great, what a great
(15:42):
I can still her here calling me. Tell me, Luke
and you are our great, great team, which is one
we were.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
We had a lot of fun.
Speaker 5 (15:49):
Yeah, so, Bob, you mentioned how you shifted back to
your first love. What made you leave till Vision to
do theater basically full time?
Speaker 4 (16:03):
Well, I didn't really leave television frankly, a lot of
shows that we had done, thankfully ran for nine years
or eleven years, and it was a wonderful career. But
at some point there was a greater value put on
reality based ships that were cheap, cheaper to produce and
(16:27):
all of that, and I just felt, well, this is
not for me. I don't want to do that form
of television. And I also had always wanted to settle
back on the East Coast. All my family is on
the East Coast. And I also always maintained an apartment
in New York because I love New York. Some of
(16:47):
them were one room, but still, you know, I had
one room in New York and so and I was
grateful for that. So I I did, when things started
changing radically in the industry, to come back where I
wanted to live and where I wanted to work and
(17:09):
where I could try to break into theater because I
didn't have any experience in it. I was so fortunate
that when I came back, the community sort of welcomed
me into it. I thought that would be shut out
because I know the Broadway community is very competitive because
it's not much to go around, you know, and so
(17:32):
people fight like dogs to get their show on, and
they fight like dogs to keep your show off. I
found it to be just the opposite for me. It's
like I met a few wonderful people and they helped me,
showed me the ropes, welcomed me into the whole Broadway scene.
So I was very lucky. It was luck too, you know.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
I think it had a lot to do with how
you are with people though, the things that we've been
talking about, the way you welcome people, and the way
you are with people, how kind you are, and how
it doesn't matter whether it's the janitor or the executive producer,
you treated everybody on the show with love and respect,
and that you deserve everything, all your accolades and everything
(18:15):
that you've gotten. It has so much to do with
your personality.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
I appreciate that, but I don't know any other way
to act. Really. That's good, don't go changing. Yeah no,
that's right.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
Yeah, So, Bob, other than family matters, what was your
favorite show to theater or television, what was your favorite
thing to produce?
Speaker 4 (18:37):
Well, let's the old classic answer.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
You know you you love all your children the same,
that's right.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
My sister's my parents' favorite.
Speaker 4 (18:47):
Yeah, no, not the same. Everybody's not loved the same,
but everybody's loved differently. And there's some shows that I
attached myself to emotionally for one reason, and others maybe not.
But there might be something else about the show that
I love. It might be a fun show to do
(19:09):
and to write and to develop, and that's justifiable enough
for me to work on something that's a lot of
fun to do. But I also like to work on
things that I think have some meaning and some usefulness
to humanity. Yes, I don't do it to make a box.
(19:29):
I've been fortunate and that just doing it make a book.
Speaker 5 (19:38):
The industry is really run by lawyers. So what do
you attribute back to. Like again, you go back to
you make things that you would want to watch, correct.
Speaker 4 (19:47):
Right, well, things that they want to It's yes, the
old issue. Follow the money, and the money comes from
bank First of all, bankers hire the lawyers, and so
you've got a bunch of people that are not in
the business to entertain people, to provoke people, to provide
(20:10):
people with some polemic or whatever. They're just in the
business to make a book. And that's the direction then
that they impart to the people they hire and to
the lawyers. The lawyers are really just following instructions. You
have to remember that people that got into television initially
(20:31):
were not supported or helped by the wider community because
everybody in the motion picture industry and the theatrical they
were afraid of television. They thought, oh, that little box
is going to put us all out of work, and
so they did everything to try to not support rank.
(20:51):
I don't know why the transition took place, but it
transitioned from people that honestly wanted to to do good work,
write good shows, entertain people and have the audience really
enjoy it. It transitions somewhat into people looking only at
the bottom line.
Speaker 5 (21:12):
And I love that you bring that up, because what
do you think about how the industry has turned into
streaming the streaming industry to you, how has it changed
even more?
Speaker 4 (21:22):
Well, the truth is, we all want exposure for our show,
no matter what you are, whether you're an actor or producer, writer,
or whatever, and streaming has provided wider and more exposure.
There are still some problems to work out. I don't
(21:42):
think that people are adequately compensated for streaming yet, and
that's changing, and that people are negotiating at a more
fair level. I think I think it will happen because
it's a big business and they want the product. I mean,
the bottom line is what you do and what I
(22:04):
do we make the product. I mean, all those other
people might make money, but they can't make the product
we need, and we therefore are in control. And the
bottom line.
Speaker 5 (22:16):
Is that's how empowering to creatives because it does feel
so difficult to realize what you have is it's a
valid product and that people still want to have good,
solid storytelling in the way that you obviously approach your productions.
Speaker 4 (22:33):
Absolutely. Yeah, well that's what we believed in. I didn't
ever know another way to do it, and fortunately we
worked at a time where we were not bossed around
by a bank or lawyer.
Speaker 5 (22:47):
Really, I want to Bob Iger give the speech where
he says, Hi, I'm Bob Iger, and I come from
the time of the forty haer so different, right, Yeah,
you don't have to compete with a billion different TV
shows at the same time. Yeah, you don't have to
compete with crappy stuff.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
On every table channel in the world. There's so many.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
Oh, yeah, that's true.
Speaker 5 (23:17):
I don't know if you remember, but initially you guys said,
we wanted to make a strong show about a working
class family that just happened to be black. Right, But
we watched the show, there are a lot of things
that are very specific to black culture and black people.
Did you just trust us to do the blackening part.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
Was to black it up? Well, of course we did
trust you. But the truth is, Look, I was raised
for at least half of my upbringing by two black
women who lived with us, and I grew up in
the South and they lived with us and who raised me,
and I to this day will say the wisest people
(24:01):
I know are black women. Right. Because I was never
told to do something because I told you to. I
was given a reason don't do this because your mother's
going to come home and she's going to get mad
with you and mad with me, and then you're going
(24:22):
to clean all this up right now before she gets here.
And that made sense to me because I thought, yeah,
she will, she'll be mad and all of us here
and I would clean it up. But that's the way
they reasoned with me. I always had a reason for
things that I had to do. That is so interesting.
Speaker 5 (24:41):
Yeah, often do people from your actual life make it
into the shows that you produced a.
Speaker 4 (24:47):
Lot, a lot. In fact, your name in the show
came from well, she was called a nurse because back
in the day, people that worked with young children were
not called nan they would call nurses nurses. And my
nurse was Laura Lee, and so I took that name
for you based on my nurse. But my point is,
(25:14):
I feel that I was very sophisticated about black culture.
I knew black people, and I, as a child, of course,
was nurtured by them. But even later on I had
lots of black friends. I heard a really silly thing
one time from a producer who was doing another black
show that had nothing to do with us whatsoever. And
(25:37):
the producer said, last week, we were doing a show
and a very strong member of the cast said to us, look,
what's wrong with this episode is you have the cast
finishing dinner and serving dessert in a black household. When
they finished dinner, they go and wash all the dishes,
(26:01):
and then they come back to the table and eat dessert.
And you've got to change the show to make it authentic.
And I thought, well, that's kind of ridiculous. First of all,
I'd eaten in a lot of black homes and we
didn't have to go to Washington between dinner and dessert.
I never heard we did. That's true, But I just
(26:23):
thought that was interesting that this cast member had imposed
that on them, and that, you know, just seemed very
unreal to me. But I never felt I had to
strive too hard to understand black culture. I mean I
knew a lot about it, you know.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Yeah, well because that that, like I said, that episode
was so well written and so pay tribute to the
strength and just the superiority sometimes of.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Black Remind me again, because I've forgotten who wrote that episode. Remember,
I don't remember who wrote that. I just wanted anybody
on the team remembers a Bill and Michael or maybe
some of the They're going to look it up for us. Okay,
good Bill and Michael, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
Ellen, Michael, Bill Bigley and Michael Warren wrote.
Speaker 5 (27:09):
What was your relationship with them? How did they wind
up helping with the creation of the show. Did you
know them from Laverna Sharly in those days?
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Yeah, we knew them from all the paramount days. Bill
Bickley came from Texas, and I think his first job
was being an assistant to Tom Miller before he became
a legitimate show writer, and he then wanted to try
to submit a script and he wrote a really good one.
So Tom said, look, next season, we'll put you on
(27:39):
a show as apprentice writer. And that's how he got started.
And then he hooked up with Michael Warren at some
point and they became a team.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
A lot of the same names on a lot of
your shows, that Donadas and Jack Zeapert. Yeah, yeah, and
I love that because I've got four shows with you
that you are right loyal.
Speaker 4 (28:00):
Look, we are, and people have been loyal to us,
So it's a two way street and there's a reason
for it. Well, I hope.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
So nobody can tell me anything about my bye boy
yet I call you my box so much. They thought
your first name was my.
Speaker 4 (28:14):
Well, we've had a wonderful long friendship as we have.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
We have.
Speaker 4 (28:20):
I'm happy about that, and I'm happy about having worked
with the two of you because you were outstanding examples
of talent and the ability to also maintain a great
rapport with all of the people in this cast, and
that has a lot to do with how you come
(28:44):
off on screen. I agree with that.
Speaker 2 (28:46):
I think that's one reason that we were so believable
because we really did love each other. It wasn't it
were a family manufacturer, you know, And so the proof
of it is here. It is what forty years later
and we're still around and still still in touch and
still loving each other.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
People will never understand how much that matters. When I'm saying,
as Laura to Telma, Aunt Rachel, I love you, it's
still Kelly saying to Telma, I love you. And it's
a real something that happens when you can find that
kind of connection as an actres.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
We have to give it all to you because I
think the first time I met everyone was at the
table read but it just felt right. It just read right,
It just seemed right.
Speaker 4 (29:31):
Well, you know, Tom Miller and I did not know
how each of us would perform the leadership role with
a show because when we first met, I was an
executive at ABC and Tom was a producer who was
coming into New York to bring a show called Happy Days,
(29:52):
and Michael Eisner was the president of Paramount and he
called me and said, there's a show coming in that
I'm very high on, and Tom Miller is one of
the producers. He's coming in with the show. I want
you to meet him, I want you to get very
familiar with the show, and I want you to be
prepared in the meetings. We have to really defend that
(30:12):
show and sell the show. So when Tom came in,
I of course introduced myself and we watched the show
together and I immediately loved the show. I loved all
the characters, and I thought, well, this is an easy
job for me to sell the show. Interestingly enough, when
we presented it to the ABC executives, so with a
son who said, oh, well, why are you doing a
(30:34):
period show? I mean, that doesn't work on television. It's
set in the fifties. Well, we had gotten the idea.
Gary Marshall actually got the idea because he was in
Chicago and he saw an early development production of Greece,
and he came back from that trip and he said, look, guys,
(30:56):
let's do that. Let's set the family show. We already
had the characters, but let's set our family show in
the fifties. It'll give it a unique look that's not
on television right now. And that's where the idea came from.
But the man I was pitching to in New York,
of course, they didn't know about Greece, or they didn't
know about fifties or anything like that, except some of
(31:18):
them were probably graduated from school when they were in
the fifties because they were mostly seventy year old men. Anyway,
we were able to sell it, and Tom and I
became good friends, and then Eddie Milchis was the third partner,
and the three of us got along great. They said
to me, why don't you just join us as a producer,
because you're more creative than an executive, So why don't
(31:41):
you come over and make the shows with us? And
I said, I would love to do that. Wow, that
is so interesting.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
And I love that you defended the show and I
wanted to come back to our show because I remember
initially the show didn't do as well before that great
you know, the big Arkle craze. The show wasn't doing
as well. What made you stay with our show because
we didn't have the numbers initially, Well.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
We believe we had a great show. What happened is
they threw a lot of hard competition against us initially
because they knew the same thing at CBS and NBC.
They knew this was a good show. So they put
hard shows against us to try to kill our chances
of becoming successful, and we had to move the show
(32:26):
twice to get into a more favorable time period. But
we had no question about the show. We thought we
have a great show. So that's a fact. That was
our sensibility. What we have to do is fight to
get out of the way of competition until we get
the audience to see the show and appreciate it. And
(32:46):
so that's why we kept fighting to move to another
time period, which we did, and eventually the audience caught on.
Speaker 5 (32:53):
Well, that really speaks to the time because now you
get one episode and if not, you are to here.
So they think that the network must have really believed
in you guys.
Speaker 4 (33:04):
Also right, Oh, in some cases, Kelly, you don't get
one episode, You get a test session, wow, with some
audience that watches your pilot and says yes or no.
You never get on the air to begin with.
Speaker 5 (33:20):
So is the luck of the draw in terms of
like a test.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
It could be yes, yes, it can be now yeah.
And you know, these test audiences are supposed to be
a random selection of a cross cut of the population.
But the truth is between you and me. People who
sign up to drive to a bad neighborhood in New
(33:45):
Jersey and sit in a room with twelve other people
to watch mostly bad television shows are not the kind
of people that should be judging whether something's good or not.
Speaker 5 (33:57):
Well, why is making this sound like jury?
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Dude?
Speaker 4 (34:01):
It is? I think it is. I think it is.
Oh my gosh. You know, I have never been called
to be on the jury, and you don't know. And
I would love that. I would love that, and I
always fancy myself. Oh I would be a great joy.
Speaker 5 (34:19):
You know, since the person who has never been called
I have never gotten a call, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (34:27):
Maybe they know something about me.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
You know.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Well, this has just been been great. It's been a
wonderful bab.
Speaker 4 (34:37):
I love seeing both of you. You both were wonderful
people to work with and good friends, and I'll treasure
that always as well.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
I mean, you have been such a huge part of
my career and I brag about you all the time.
Speaker 5 (34:56):
And yeah, and you don't to note that your influence
on the life of performers, it's like life changing. Like
I came from Maryland, I came from Detroit. Right awesome,
Thank you so much, Bob.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
And by the way, you mentioned your father, who was
such a sweet man. I enjoy knowing him. He was
a great guy. So yeah, thanks Bob, Yeah, yeah, absolutely absolutely.
And Telma had a great son sitting up there in
the bleachers.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
Yeah, he loved that chep.
Speaker 4 (35:30):
What was he eight or nine years old?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Yeah, Tom used to on his days off, he would
call him down to be in the sets to fill
up the room.
Speaker 4 (35:37):
He just had such a great time.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
The big joke Tom would always say on tape night, okay,
everybody get food before Gerald. I mean where they call
him a red then he wasn't caerrold Red and his
little friend get here because you know they got chew
everything down.
Speaker 4 (35:50):
To the tablewall.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
So he would get your food, get your food or
Soun's coming today.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
It's funny.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
I just thank you from the bottom of my heart.
I thank you, grateful to you, so honored to know you,
not just as as the great man that you are
in the business, but as a great friend. He's a
great person. I just admire you. I love you.
Speaker 4 (36:12):
I could go on and on and me too, absolutely,
and that's mutual for both of you. And I thank
you for this invitation and I look forward to your
whole series.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Well, don't be surprised if you get another call, Bob.
It's kind of an interesting guy.
Speaker 5 (36:28):
See how he's laughing, like.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Don't call me. You better hurry up because I'm getting
older every day, Honey, we all are. I feel like
I'm so old, not.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
Got everything written down at this point, even though I'm
only thirty nine. Well, Bob, thank you so much for
the time. Thank you guys just for being a part
of what you created.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
Thank you, Bob, Thank you absolutely. I love you both.
We love you more. Bye bye right bye bye. Stay tuned.
Speaker 5 (36:59):
Yeah, we want to rewatch each episode of Family Matters
week by week, so make sure to rewatch the show
right along with us. You can catch it on Hulu
and TVs and a bunch of other places.
Speaker 2 (37:11):
Welcome to the Family with Telma and Kelly is a
production of iHeart Podcasts and Audiation. It's hosted by me
Tloma Hopkins and me Kelly Williams. Our executive producers are
Sandy Smallings for Audiation, Adam rip JD.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Hopkins, who also happens to be my son.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
And Kelly's pobro, and Jonathan Strickland for iHeart Podcasts.
Speaker 5 (37:32):
The show is produced by Telma and I, but our
series producer is Irelen Meechin and our theme songs lyrics
were written by j. D. Hopkins and Adam RiPP. The
theme song was scored and mixed by Matt Noble, who's
also our series mixer.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
And we'd like to thank Nikki E Tour and the
entire iHeart Podcast team.
Speaker 4 (37:51):
Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 5 (37:52):
Follow us on Instagram at Welcome to the Family Pod
for behind the scenes photos and more bonus content.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
And don't forget to leave us a voicemail. Let our website,
Thefamilymatterspod dot com. We want to hear your thoughts and
favorite memories of the show and let us know if
you need advice, because we're good for some bad advice.
We might be able to help you with your own
Family Matters.
Speaker 5 (38:13):
And make sure to rate and review us wherever you're listening.
We are so excited to have you guys along for
the ride.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Yes, Welcome to the family, y'all, and we'll see you
next time.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
Welcome to the Familie
Speaker 1 (38:36):
Audiation
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