April 7, 2021 • 50 mins
Deena Margolin and Kristin Gallant are the moms behind ‘Big Little Feelings’—a research-based, online resource for parents to reign in the chaos and raise happy kids. This week, Deena and Kristin join Heidi and Emma to answer your biggest questions about toddler emotions and behavior. From how to handle tantrums to navigating bath time, screen time, and picky eaters, this honest conversation will empower you to take all of those big little feelings in stride.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Who baby, my baby, I need you, Oh hell, I
need you. What to expect? As a production of I
Heart Radio, I'm your host Heidi Murkop and I'm a
mom on a mission, a mission to help you know
(00:21):
what to expect every step of the way. Remember when
there was no place on the planet your baby would
rather be than snuggled up in your arms, gazing up
at your adoring face, all sweet smiles and breathy coups. Well,
if your baby has taken those first monumental steps into toddlerhood,
(00:42):
you may already belonging for those days when you're little
one's contentment was always just a cuddle and a feet away.
Was so much new territory to conquer, so many new
milestones to check off, and so many miles to cover
on two feet. Your toddler is still very little, but
nobody's baby. In so many ways, toddlers are larger than life,
(01:09):
especially when it comes to their feelings. When they're happy,
you know it. When they're mad, you know it. From
meltdowns on the frozen food aisle to battles over bathtime,
life with a toddler is never boring, and it can
definitely keep you guessing well that's about to change, because
(01:30):
today we're answering your biggest toddler questions, and we brought
in backup. Kristen and Dina are the moms behind big
little feelings, and chances are you are one of the
over million parents who follow them on Instagram for their
practical and actionable advice. They know they're toddlers. Kristen has
(01:52):
two toddlers, so she's in the trenches, and Dina is
a child therapist who happens to have a newborn, so
she'll soon be putting those skills to the test at home. Today,
they're here to talk about communicating with your toddlers, taming tantrums,
and the truth about time out, discipline, and understanding all
those big little feelings. Welcome Kristen, Indiana. We are so
(02:17):
excited to have you here today. And I know someone
who's a little extra excited because your advice could not
come at a better time. For Emma. She has discovered
that the struggle with a two and a half year
old is indeed real. Two story Emma, it's just he's
a lot, you know. He doesn't listen at all. He
doesn't listen to my husband. But I mean he's very headstrong,
(02:40):
and I'm kind of like in that pick your battles
kind of phase and it's kind of taken that to
the next level. Yeah, have you stopped picking any battles
at all? Is what's going on? Yeah, you know what,
I'm so tired. You know, this has been a real
this has been a year, and you know, I've kind
of taking off my parenting hat and I'm at then
(03:00):
this kind of point and I know that's so wrong,
but like, you know what, I think we got to
stop you right there. I think any thank you, I
mean not in fucking mode, right not. I mean I
think you captured that perfectly. Yeah, Nope, You're doing great.
And it's like I want him to like fall direction
(03:22):
because today he started school like for an hour, and
I'm like, I swear to you, I know within a
week he's going to be kicked out for you know,
he is My husband are probably bets on this, Like
We're like, he's he going to punch a kid, He's
gonna throw something. Can we just say that everything you
just mentioned is very normal toddler behavior. Gets kicked out
(03:45):
of school for hitting or knocking over some blocks. Then
we got a bigger problem with that, There'll be no
toddlers in the preschool if we do that. No, yeah, exactly,
Like I think, first of all, you're not saying air,
which is a good thing, um. And and he has
other authority figures. And I think, like Emma, lots of parents,
(04:07):
especially now, just want to get through the day. And
setting short term goals is good because survival, Emma, as
you mentioned, is a good thing. But tellsler's really are
about the here and now, But managing their behavior isn't.
What do you guys think? Yeah, I mean again, we're
in we're in unprecedented times right now. So I think
(04:27):
our answer a year ago would have been very different
than our answer today, And I think that's worth noting that.
I agree with you. Long term is really our goal, um.
And what's kind of cool is when we start to
look at some of the things that that Dina and
I share, some of these strategies that are rooted in
thirty years of research that leads to let's say, long term,
(04:51):
healthy resilient kids. For us as parents, sometimes what we
want is the screaming to stop. Right now, We're really
not so folk guest, I mean, we want that shore
when the kids are in bed and sleeping, we're like, oh, yeah,
how can I make them healthy adults? But in the moment,
right what we want is help right now today. And
what's kind of cool is that when Dina and I
(05:12):
started putting our heads together on all of this research
and long term resilience, there are so many of these
things that actually serve both purposes. Like one thing that
we always talk about that's a great example we like
to use is the you know, just letting toddlers know
that their feelings are okay, okay, let's use that as
a great example. So on one end, that sounds very
fluffy and idealistic and whatever, But when you look at
(05:33):
the research, we're building healthy emotional skills life long. They
won't push their feelings down leads to destructive behavior, YadA, YadA.
At the same time, if you were to say to me, hey, Kristen,
what's the number one thing you should do if you're
toddler is having a tantrum and you do nothing else,
I would say, get down to their level and let
them know, Hey, Bud, you're so upset right now about
(05:56):
the iPad being all done. I get it. It's okay
to be upset because magically, in that moment, oftentimes, just
doing that, their tantrum is going to be shorter and
less intense, rather than you're saying, what's the big deal?
Get over it? I told you a hundred times, the
iPad is all done. And so it's kind of magical
that a lot of these things can can have both. Yeah,
(06:17):
it's important to validate their feelings, as we always talk about,
but also to get on their level and put yourself
in their little shoes and understand why they're feeling the
big feelings that they are and they can't express them
as easily as as we can. And sometimes we have
a hard time expressing our feelings right in a positive way.
(06:39):
It's not like we're running around, you know, being always
calm and collected. I am angry or upset by very
ridiculous things, especially too. I always like to make that
comparison that if you had a really hard day and
you know, there was just traffic and something was just
just grating on you, and you walk in, you tell
your partner about it, and they're like, it's a big deal,
(07:00):
nothing even happened. What are you talking about? Like, get
over it? You would just feel horrible. You'd you would explode.
I mean, it just wouldn't feel good. And all you
needed in that moment with someone to say you're having
a hard time. I get that. It's a game changer.
That's so true. I would fully throw something. Yeah, I
would throw something. Yeah, I would knock go over some blocks. Yeah, exactly.
(07:22):
You know what's interesting what you said though? To me,
it's like during that moment when he's having a tantrum,
like I kind of just I'm in pilot mode and
I like given a lot of times, and then at
night when I'm in bed when he's sleeping, I'm like, wow,
what can I do tomorrow to like help that situation
in a in a more positive way where he's learning,
(07:44):
and also like I'm not losing my mind. But and
then the next day it's again, it's it's a vicious
cycle because I don't want to deal with it. Yeah,
And you know, I feel like it's important, you know,
as much as putting yourself in there their little sneakers
also to understand what toddler is and why they behave
the way that they do, because perspective goes a really
(08:06):
long way. All you see is the screaming and the negativity.
And you know, hoddlerhood is the first adolescence. This is
when a child is for the first time setting out
on two feet, you know, carving their own identity and
declaring their independence. Um, the only way they know how
at this point exactly, I'm so happy you said that.
(08:27):
And has so much to do with their brain development.
At this spep of life, their brains are exploding in
terms of development, it's happening so quickly, and at the
same time, the upper areas of their brain that how
all the networks that help them manage their motions, use
their language to express themselves and ask for things and
(08:49):
control their bodies. That is so under construction still, and
that's why we see them screaming and screeching, flailing around,
you know, like hitting on the ground and your kid
pushing back in the toddler stage is actually an amazing sign.
It's a sign that internally they're starting to become aware
(09:10):
of what they want and what they need and they're
saying no, I have an opinion. You're saying no, and
I say yes, And that's actually kind of amazing, and
they're kind of exploring that that relationship too by the way, right,
everything is new, everything is out there, and they're kind
of I think of it when they're testing boundaries. It's like, yes,
they've reached this milestone. They are healthy development yea. And
(09:32):
then I kind of like to think of it as, hey, mom,
are you in control? Or am I in control? Because
toddler's having control of everything in the whole world, bedtime, iPad,
this keeping them safe, that's actually scary for them. And
even though it seems like they want to have all
the power and all the control, it's actually them kind
(09:54):
of asking us to hey, are you the calm, confident
leader or am I the leader? Should I make these choices?
And when we have those sort of limits that are
loving there, it's not authoritative, it's not threatening, but a
really calm, confident, leading vibe. Our toddler will feel safer
(10:14):
to then be the kid. Right, That's what we want
them to be, is a free kid, and we are
here to keep them safe, to let them know what's
on the menu for lunch. And then, like we talk about,
then you give them toddler type of control and power.
Hey it's time for shoes. Now, we're leaving right now.
That's a mean thing. I'm calm, I'm in control. Do
you want the red shoes or the blue shoes? And
(10:36):
that way they feel like they have age appropriate power.
That's like the wonderful trifecta if you can get there
and avoid the the yes or no answer, because you
will always get no. You're always gonna get no. I
always make this mistake and Melissa, do you want this?
Oh my gosh, if you say do you want to
use the potty? Why are we for? It's like I
say that to you, by the way, but I'm like,
why did I just ask? It's actually unfair because when
(10:58):
they say no, and I'm like, well too, you know
what I mean? All that's terrible. It's not fair. All
I had to say was it's time to use the party? Now?
Would you like to use the big party or the
little potty or something like yeah, but it's just it's
time for bedtime, not are you ready for bed? And
they go no. I mean, why am I? Asking? Is
so important? And I didn't understand that until right now. Actually,
(11:21):
But I think modeling the behavior that you want to
see in your kid it sounds like a great idea,
and it is a great idea. So like you need
to be the common their storm because when you're upset
and they're upset, everybody's upset, and you get nowhere because
that's unsettling. Like you said, Kristen, that's scary when everything's
(11:44):
out of control. Mommy's out of control, even if you're
in control, but you say, you know what, yeah, one
more episode. Even just that can be a little bit
chaotic and confusing, right because with mommy says one more episode,
then okay, just mean one more episode, doesn't mean five
more episode When we're at the park, Oh does this
mean five more minutes or ten more minutes, thirty more
(12:05):
minutes or one more minute? So I know I am
the biggest people pleaser in the world. I hate for
anyone to be upset about anything. But what helps me
in the boundary stage because it's hard for us. People
pleasers are people that really want to make people happy,
especially our kids. I try to think of it as
(12:26):
keeping them safe, the same way I wouldn't let them
run into a road, and I would want to say
I'm here and I'm keeping you safe. I'm here, I'm
keeping you safe. I kind of just like mantra that
over and over when it comes to the iPad, when
it comes to leaving the park, when it comes to
getting out of the bathtub, it's like, this is my role.
It's okay to be upset about this. I'm keeping you safe.
(12:47):
And I feel like if you were a pedestrian on
the street and you didn't know what the traffic rules
were and there were no lights and so you would
just cross, so the cars would just go whenever, and
so you would be confused, you would be unsettled, and
you would probably almost certainly be non complaint because you
would never know what the rules were going to be
(13:08):
on any given day. It's confusing. You know what confusion
leads to, by the way, chaos, it leads to tantrums,
It leads to those big emotions and when they feel safer,
Like you just said, there's one, gosh, the one analogy,
and I can't remember who's first said it, but with
the guardrails, it's a great analogy. It's just like that
street light analogy. If there are no guardrails up, then
(13:30):
we're gonna really tiptoe kind of and then be hesitant
and then go forward and then be wary and then
be scared and then be cautious. And then be this.
And it's our job as parents to provide those guardrails
so that they can really thrive and kind of like
run through life being a kid and know that we're
there to have that structure to keep them safe. And
what we're really all saying too, is that when we
(13:52):
don't feel safe, what ends up happening is that your
brain kicks into survival mode. It kicks into that fight
or fly, freeze or faint. Those are really like the
four survival responses. And so we talk about aggressive kids
that's fight. We talk about you know, like nervous kids
who don't want to take risk, that's also a survival response.
(14:13):
This is all like sort of that high level talk
that I always found really confusing. And so the big
little feelings way is, now, let's talk about that with
that iPad example. What that means is is that when
you say every single time almost almost that iPad is
all done, you mean iPad is all done. What that
means is their little brains feel safer, even though they're upset.
(14:36):
By the second or third time, it's not going to
be a pushback or a struggle because when mom says
what she means, she means what she says, and we're
not going in a flight fight or even like oh
how can I get more? It's just like it's hard
for those initial few times, but then it's not a pushback,
it's not a struggle anymore. We feel okay, this is it.
(14:56):
It's one more episode exactly. And I feel like if
you're gonna old boundaries, which is like we're saying, it's
really hard sometimes because they're screaming, they're crying, it's loud,
we're overwhelmed. I feel like we also have to be
armed too. It's like the tool of okay, the feelings,
you can see them and hear them. Yes, it's so
hard right now, you're really upset, it's okay to cry
(15:18):
and let them express that. As we hold boundaries, and
you know, you talk also about the same things that
I talk about, which consistency and structure and predictability. So
the rules are always the same. The rules are age appropriate, right,
because if you expect too much from a kid, they
can't deliver, they can't live up to those expectations. And
if you expect too little, what's the point? So true,
(15:40):
and of course the unconditional love, So even when I
mean everybody's heard this, but it's so important to remember
that if your child feels loved, it's okay for your
child to know you're not fond of their behavior in
this moment, but that you always love them no matter what,
absolutely and eve even not only unconditional love, which is
(16:03):
so important, but also cementing in the fact that they
are a good kid no matter what. They are a
great kid who made a mistake, and so the mistake
can be something that we will help them by the
way we're going to help them in the future. To Okay,
we were feeling angry, It's okay to feel angry. I'm
(16:24):
here with you. And next time we feel angry, what
are we going to do differently? And we love them
no matter what they do, and they are a good
kid no matter what mistakes they may have made today. Dina,
(16:49):
You're not there quite yet, but christ and I'm sure
there are times when you completely ignore your own best advice.
Oh my god, all the time. Yes. First of all, yes,
human nature, especially under stress under hello a pandemic our
big thing. Anyways, No matter what is the twenty rule,
I am all about the eight twenty rule. And I
(17:11):
feel a lot more empowered when I let myself do that.
So that means eighty percent of the time is what
I'm striving for. Some weeks, it's not gonna be eighty.
Sometimes it's gonna be fifty. But let's celebrate that eighty
or fifty percent of the time where we're like, all right,
I held that boundary. I didn't give in Okay, cool,
I did this or I did that. And then twenty
(17:31):
of the time I now structure those days in because
I'm a little bit of a perfectionist and I just
like to know, like, Okay, today is a day where
I'm gonna try really hard, and then I know that
two days a week almost I'm letting go of everything.
I let screen time, we're having crackers with cheese, We're
having you know, we can let on like holidays. You know,
(17:52):
you're letting the boundaries go, you're having their having sugar,
things like that. It is impossible to be perfect one
hundred percent of the time. And I think that people
when they read about, you know, sort of positive parenting
gent whatever you want to call it, it seems really unrealistic.
And that's because I think it is. And you can't
(18:15):
be at one of the time, and for me, I
know not even to strive for that, so I don't
feel like I failed. And when you feel like you've
failed and you get into that like guilt and the cycle,
you're gonna wake up and not really do it again
and pop up up. And for me, it's like I
did a fifty percent jobs it's great, like I did it,
I tried, I killed it. But it's the same thing
(18:37):
as with kids. You want to set expectations for yourself
that are realistic, because when I see headlines that are
just like, you know, how to be a better parent.
First of all, there's no one right way to do
any of this. You know, you've got to find your
own way. But you can't be so hard on yourself.
Moms especially, I think, are so hard on ourselves on
on others, and I mean Insta ram, social media. All
(19:02):
we see are the toddlers who are wearing matching outfits
with like perfect ice cream cones in their hands that
are not dripping, and then the mom is wearing like
like booty shorts with her abs and like a newborn
baby on her breast, and it's like nobody is showing
the behind the scenes where she was like screaming and
giving them candy to sit down and stay still, and
(19:22):
like threatening to take away the ip and then she
storms off and then this and that, and it's very
difficult space I think to be a mom because it's like, oh,
I need perfect activities, I need a perfect I haven't
done an activity in four years. I did one time
and I was like, this is my nightmare. I don't
have the capacity for this. I don't have the patience
for it. You know what I'm good at, I'm really
good at messy play, Like I'll let them jump in
(19:44):
a puddle, I'll let them go wild. You should celebrate
the ship out of that um and celebrate those things.
It's such a mind shift and we have to be
so so aware of it because otherwise we drive ourselves crazy.
And you know, I'm never going to be the clean
mom and I'm never going to be an activity mom.
And that's okay. I'm a great mom, preach I'm not
(20:06):
a clean mom either. My house is a mess and
you know what, yeah no, so yeah, it's never gonna happen.
It's never gonna happen for me. And on the other side,
there are other moms out there that have they do
show that perfectly clean house on Instagram. You know, I
have a friend who's exactly that way, and she's a
really tidy everything is perfect, and yet her child will
only eat like pouches or waffles. That's her struggle. We
(20:30):
all have our struggle, and we all have our things
that we are good at. I love when mom's on
Instagram really show the reality of it though, like like
they tell their their truth, because the thing is you
are helping other moms with that. When you're painting this
perfect picture, which I used to do on Instagram before
(20:51):
the ship hit the fan of this pandemic, I feel
like I used to have a much more clean Instagram,
but now I feel like my house is messying every
picture share everything's a ship storm like and and that's
real and I think that's relatable absolutely. And Dina and
I when we started, we only started one year ago,
big little feelings, and at that time everyone had the
(21:14):
selfie ring light. They were very buttoned up tutorials. You know,
we are educators quote unquote. There was no swearing. The
backgrounds were perfectly clean, and we were like, listen, we're
gonna be us. We're gonna show mom buns. We're gonna
swear sometimes because Instagram is not for toddler's Instagram is
for moms. And when I had my first baby, I
(21:35):
was scrolling through Instagram. I loved all of the you know,
parent coaching and things like that space, but I had
postpartum anxiety. I didn't know any other moms. I didn't
see a single mom that looked like me. I didn't
see a single mom that sounded like me. I didn't
see a house that looked like mine. And it was devastating.
It was really hard, and we thought, listen, this this
(21:57):
may cause that we don't get any followers. It's just
gonna be our mom's being like girls, you're doing so good. Yeah,
but it was important to us to kind of break
the mold and be different and not show just perfection.
We share good days are bad days are like you know,
joyful days, and the days that were just crying messes,
(22:18):
we're just falling apart. That's so important. So we we
know that we need to set boundaries that guardrail. What
do we do? Clearly, young Toddler's distraction is the best
way in most cases, but if you've started thinking about
the word discipline or punishment. I feel like parents need
(22:42):
some guidance on this because it's it's really easy in
the moment to lose your temper. How would you define
discipline for a toddler, Well, let's break down punishment versus discipline,
because they're actually different, but they sometimes are used the same.
So fishman is when our reaction is designed to make
(23:04):
a kid feel scared or bad about themselves so that
they'll shift the behavior next time. Now, discipline, the real
meaning of it, the Latin route, if you want to
get really nerdy with me, really means to teach. We
are their life teachers. They've never done this before, this
whole life thing. It's new to them. And remember the
(23:24):
way their brains work. They may need like a hundred
reminders to get something that's okay. But discipline is really
we are teaching them how to do things differently. We
are teaching them how to understand their emotions, how to
understand what they want, what they need, and express it
in safe and healthy ways, which, by the way, becomes
(23:45):
lifelong skills for living with resilience completely because you are
going to be living with rules around you your entire life,
and you need to start learning at the beginning, and
you need to know right from wrong. And you are
your child's first and most important teacher, and that's one
of the most important things that you can teach. I
love how you say that. Sometimes some of those quote
(24:06):
unquote pushback I guess if you will, on gentle parenting
or positive parenting or whatever you want to say, And
it's it's just a huge misconception because I think that
what we are doing is actually setting them up to
be able to live in a realistic world with rules,
with expectations with others. When we look at how children
learn in schools, when we learn, how did you learn
(24:28):
when you went to college? How did you learn? Was
it fear based? Did somebody threaten to take away your home?
Did somebody threatened to take away your salary? If you
think about the best coach you've ever had, the best
boss you've ever had, were they incredibly domineering and shaming
or were there to make you feel like you were
valued and seen and they were there to help you
(24:50):
next time you made a mistake. Okay, this was a mistake.
They're very confident and permanent. They're not okay with it,
they don't allow it. But hey, what are we gonna
do next time and give you another shot? What is
your incentive, by the way, it's something positive, it's a bonus,
it's camaraderie, it's teamwork. And so it's so boggles my
mind a little bit that we treat children the opposite
(25:10):
and that we should be leading with punishment and fear.
When fear is a terrible teacher. It's a terrible teacher.
It actually studies show that it impacts long term learning,
and that's why we don't use punishments in schools anymore.
So why are we using them at home? And it
just doesn't teach them anything? How many times we hear
(25:31):
over and over, well I put my kid in the
time out. Well I spanked them for hitting, and it
stopped right that second, right, they you know, look at
you and you say, hey, I'm gonna put you in
a time out right then and there what is happening
is they freeze because of that fear. Right, you're threatening
and they're afraid. We don't need to be super dramatic,
but truly it's a fear. I don't want to go
(25:54):
do this, so no, and you stop and you freeze,
and then they go they go in the time out,
they have their punishment, and they come right back out
and they go over to baby sister and they smack
her right in the face. What just happened, right? And
that's because in that very one small moment, they will freeze.
I think that's why people are confused. It works, look,
(26:16):
it works, but it doesn't work long term. It doesn't
teach them how to not hit baby sister. It taught
them in this moment, don't do this or else. Well,
in terms of time out, it's not like they can
sit there and think about what they've done, because you know,
that's like way above their pay right right. I mean
maybe in a much later date they can go to
(26:37):
the room and think about what they've done. But no,
no two year old can't do that. My dad, by
the way, we we had time outs in our house,
and he was really proud because like he wasn't spanking right.
It was like, we do this really awesome thing called
time out. And I would just go into my room
for however long, and I would be steaming. I'd be
so mad, plotting about how I'm going to get them back.
(26:59):
I'm gonna cold show older than when I come out
of this room. And like do bad things, and I
didn't think about what I did wrong at all. Right,
I didn't really learn anything. But I think that's a
really big point too, is when we're talking about a
parent child relationship and building tools and building trust and
building authenticity. I mean, when we send our kids away
(27:22):
to time out when they've quote unquote done something wrong,
we teach them that big feelings really aren't welcome in
this house, and we miss the opportunity to teach them
how to handle a big feeling next time, which is
that lifelong skill. What is your takeaway when they slug
punch saying for hitting, Yeah, well we'll see them. Well, okay,
(27:47):
the feeling. It's okay to feel mad, bringing a boundary,
it's not okay to hit when we're mad, I'm going
to move baby to keep her safe, or I'm going
to move my body to keep everyone safe. And then
later at a calm time when their brains can actually
take in information, because just like us as adults, when
(28:07):
we are highly emotional, nothing's coming in. It's just how
your brain works. You can't talk, you can't reason, use logic,
think learn. So then when they're calm, we want to
revisit and say, oh, you are so mad when the
baby knocked over your blocks. I get it. That is
so frustrating. What can we do next time instead of
pushing her? And that's where we start to teach and
(28:30):
practice the coping skills. We often see or think that
when a toddler or when a kid does something bad,
that that warrants a bad response, a big punishment, a
big reaction, even if it's not a time out. Perhaps
we want to walk over, grab their arms and look
hum in the eyes and go no, no hitting. And
(28:52):
it's actually the opposite because a what is in post
control layman strums that means hitting. It's like angry, Oh
hit right, that's normal for toddlers. First of all that perspective,
and then knowing that our toddlers especially, but all kids
are desperate and I love our attention. They love it.
(29:13):
Their dream is for us when we're washing the dishes
pop up up and they hit their baby sister. Their
dream scenario is we turn off the water, we walk
over to them, we give them attention and look really like,
look in them in the eyes, and now we're focused
on them, even if it's negative attention. Now they've thought, oh, okay,
(29:35):
I know how to get mommy to come over here
and pay attention to me. And so, like Dina said,
staying incredibly calm and having that perspective, Hey, toddler's hit,
Let's try to teach them to not hit in the future. Right,
this is what we're gonna work on. Calm, cool, It's
okay to feel angry because it is contain them in
(29:56):
that moment. Is the only goal in that moment is
to keep everyone's safe. I'm keeping everyone safe now and
then teaching those coping skills. And so that brings us
to tantrums naturally, because when there are so many triggers
of tantrums that if we start to identify, we can
prevent some of them, not all of them. Some of
them are completely necessary. Part of you know, toddler behavior happens,
(30:20):
and you know, you can't prevent all tantrums, but you
can prevent them. And one of the ways to do that,
I would say, is paying attention before now. You can't
always obviously, parents sometimes don't realize that that negative attention
is better than no attention. As you said, um, and
when you say on your phone, you're not paying attention
(30:42):
in the store. Well, what happens the kid wants some attention,
They're going to scream for it. That's part of it, right,
It's true. Yeah, and you well, what would the other
triggers you would say? I would say one that I
think we lose track of is are we kind of
dictating ish all day long? Are we like no, no, no, no, no,
(31:04):
this way, this way, this way, this way, this way,
this way. A great way to prevent a tantrum is,
like we were saying, to making those big adult decisions, right,
it's time for bedtime, it's time for potty, it's this.
But making your toddler feel involved and in control of
the situation. Giving them they love power age appropriate power, though,
(31:24):
is the key, right. And so I can't tell you
how many times that if that checklist is truly there,
I can't tell you how many tantrums we can avoid
by making our kids feel involved. Right, If you're barking
at them and it's like you're not going fast enough
get your shoes on right now, we're heightened and they're
gonna heighten and we're gonna explode. If we say, hey,
(31:45):
it's time for shoes now, how fast can you go?
Could you get blue shoes or red shoes. You choose,
do you like? Yeah? I like that choice. And giving
them a little bit of age appropriate power is key
before anything, we're to even go south. And a circle
back on what you were saying before too, which is
like any time we see an uptick in unwanted behavior,
(32:07):
we can almost fill up their attention tank proactively in
a positive way. And we call this the ten minute miracle.
So carve out ten minutes a day, every day something
they can count on. Give it a special name. Maybe
you know my baby's hunter. It's mama hunter time, and
he's going to get to pick what activity we do.
I put my phone down, there's no siblings. He gets
(32:29):
my full attention, no teaching, no correcting him, and he
can just soak up my love and attention. And a
lot of times, when we do this consistently, you will
start to see a change in behavior. You'll see the
hitting kind of mellow out, whatever it is. And this
is especially helpful if there have been you know, like
big life changes like new baby in the house or
(32:51):
you know you're moving. You know, even I sometimes will
forget how powerful this really is. And that's because people
are like well, I'm with my kid all day long, Like, no,
absolutely not. This isn't gonna work. It is so different.
And this works for spouses too. By the way, I
always like to use this analogy of I don't know
about you, but after my kids go to bed, we're
(33:12):
on Netflix, we're on our phones, were scrolling, and we
haven't actually like communicated or looked at each other or
felt connected at all. And they keep happening, right, So
that happens at least in my house as as a
prior stay at home mom. And now to we're shuffling,
we're doing dishes, baby needs this, baby does that ten
(33:33):
minutes literally of just there's no siblings, there's no one
else in the world. It is so different. I can't
even tell you how different that special ten minute time is.
And it's kind of cool for us parents too. It's
like we're not fighting. Nobody is like struggling against me.
It's just like you pick what we're doing and let's
have this time. It's it's a game changer, it really is.
(33:55):
Even sometimes a hug, a cuddle, even when a tantrum
starting to happen. And this goes for relationships too. If
you have touched. Then you melt down all of these
angry feelings, not all of them, but you can. It's
a potential to melt away some of those feelings. It
(34:15):
doesn't necessarily work every kid every time, but it can work.
And you know what, we like to even say offering
a hug. Right even the other day, I was really upset.
I was crying a lot, and I typically don't like
to be touched. And that's the same with our kids.
My my youngest does not like touch She's just like me,
and that's okay, but I always offer it and I'm
(34:37):
I'm here if you need me, and it's okay to
be sad. The key Adina and christ and are making
(34:58):
is don't be a cave mom. You don't cave. Instead,
you set these expectations and you follow through as much
as you possibly can. And you know what, I used
to think that that was like for the well being
of long term in thirty years and you know, funk
that I need to have this crying stop now what
I found as now being a mom of two childlers,
(35:20):
I will tell you as hard as it is in
that moment, it is I can speak from experience ten
thousand times harder in your day to day life when
you're just giving in because it is chaos and they
are screaming and they are demanding and you are screaming
and back and forth. And so my main motivation in
(35:41):
these moments is, yes, this moment is hard, but this
moment will last two minutes. Like today, Okay, we're testing
on the car seat battle. If I do this now
and I let her run around the car and go
back and forth and okay, please, okay, this, okay, that, Okay,
the five more minutes. I know that every day and
every time we want to get in a car seat,
(36:01):
until I rein it in and decide to it will
be chaos and a nightmare. And so my main motivation is, yes,
it's hard in these two minutes or three minutes or
four minutes, but overall, your whole life and your whole
day to day life is so much calmer, more manageable.
That's the motivation for me. That's going to be my
(36:22):
motivation to exactly exactly. We're all set and we're going
to check back in with you tomorrow, Emma. So, not surprisingly,
Emma is not alone. There are many menu moms of
toddlers at what to expect, and they brought with them
all of their questions, you know, even beyond the temper
(36:44):
tantums and the biting and the hitting. One of course
that you here every day is about picky eaters. And
these moms are wondering, how do you negotiate a balanced
die with a toddler who doesn't want to eat in anything? Yeah, well,
I love this question because the answer is you don't.
(37:04):
You don't negotiate with a toddler in general, in general, right,
you don't. And and that doesn't mean you don't let
them have feedback, because, like what we've learned is it
goes back to the same things. We are calm, confident leaders.
We decide when we're eating, We decide what is on
the menu, and perhaps we want to give them a
(37:25):
choice like do you want the purple plate or the
pink plate? Do you want this or do you want that?
And what we like to do is always include one
safe food, especially for picky eaters already okay, because if
you put a plate in front of them. And my
kids are great eaters, I mean, but great is a
relative term. My kids like to eat a lot of
stuff because I've done a lot of these strategies. So
(37:46):
they'll eat sushi, they'll eat asparagus, they'll do this. But
if that sushi is different than the sushi that they like,
they're not gonna eat it. They're gonna pitch a fit
if the asparagus is different. So it all is just
a toddler thing of when there is one safe food,
they feel safe to explore those other foods, and you,
as a parent, feel confident, calm, and you're not going
(38:09):
to negotiate because you know there is one food on
their plate that they like. So let's say it's blueberries.
You know they're not going to starve. I see a
lot of parents try to do the negotiating or the pleading,
or the airplane or that this or that, or go
back and forth and oh you don't like the blue
but okay, I'll get you something else. We know they
like blueberries. It's on their plate. They're not going to start.
(38:29):
They can always have the blueberries. And when you put
that plate down and they say, oh yucky, you say
that's okay, you don't have to eat it. There is
no pressure. There are so many studies that Diana and
I just rifle through that are increased pressure leads directly
to picky eating. So parents strategies they think that what
they're doing is helping the begging and the pleading or
(38:53):
following them around or they sort of that, and you're
directly leading to picky eating. And when you do at
no pressure approach, we call it play it cool and
you put it down and that's like, this is your food,
this is what we're having today, this is what's on
the menu. Knowing there's a safe food that is the
best strategy. And then you just back off. You just
(39:13):
relaxed and you tell them listen to your body. That's okay.
That's it. It's that simple. Yeah, it's not like when
you're in a restaurant the waiters like standing over you
saying one more bite, just one more bite. Can you
imagine even when my husband does that, when he's like,
you're gonna love this. I know it. I know you're
like this, and I'm like, I don't feel like eating
this right now. I'm not going to try it, Like
I don't want to. He's like, well, you never know,
(39:35):
because you even tried allives in two years, you should
try all I'm like, I don't want an olive, right
but you know, it literally makes sense that we're staring
somebody in the face and being like one more bite.
Of course it would be like I'm all done, Like
I don't want this anymore. I'm done. I don't want
to eat if you're staring at me exactly. And I
think it's also you said how many times you know
(39:56):
they eat? That's your decision and what they eat, but
also are they eat. They should be eating sitting down
and not like eating on the run, because you know,
meal time is something that takes place in a set
of position. It's much safer, but it's also socially acceptable
place to eat, and it builds the foundation for good,
(40:17):
healthy eating habits. And it's not surprising that toddlers resist
high chairs because they don't like being cooped up, you know,
baby's love. That's like the highlight of their day is
trying new foods. And then they turn toddlers and game changer. Yeah,
and you know it's actually a part of like the
evolutionary process is that if a toddler was in the
(40:38):
wild and they see something new, this is something that's
going to keep them safe because they're like, oh, is
this poisonous? Is this not so coming? At it. This
is literally what they're supposed to do. They're supposed to
question anything new on their plate. Research shows it can
take up to a hundred exposures of something new. So
it takes the pressure of a parent to be like, listen,
(40:59):
put a safe food on a plate. Try giving them
new things. And it is not your job to get
them to eat. It's your job to build the plate,
give a safe food, but it in front of them,
and then you did your job. Then you let go.
There's nothing else for you to do. Exactly. We decide
what's on the menu, and they decide how much goes
in their body. Exactly. Okay, let's say bed time. How
(41:22):
do we make bed time not a nightmare? Yeah? Well,
one thing they can do is create a chart, a
bedtime chart that's a visual aid, something they can see
that lists out the steps that need to happen. So
we're gonna put the words it's you know, brush your
teeth and there's a picture of brushing teeth, put on
your jammy's picture of jammies so that they can fall along.
(41:45):
And then we want to give them age appropriate power
here again so that they feel involved, like it's their choice.
They get to put a check after each step or
put a sticker on that chart after they do each step,
so that we can say, okay, you brush your teeth.
What's next? You tell me, and they run to the
chart say okay, it's time for jammies. Let's do it.
(42:08):
So that's one way to get them involved so that
they're not in pushback mode during collaboration mode. That's awesome, Okay, bathtime.
Some toddlers love bath Some toddlers don't want to get in.
Some tiddlers don't want to get out. What are your thoughts? Yeah,
especially with the getting out. It comes back to being
that calm, confident leader. So it's a little bit trickier
(42:31):
to get them in right, it's like a slippery wet
fish over you know. But getting getting them out is
an easier answer. And that is I hear you're upset,
you want that more bathtime. Bathtime is all done. Now,
we'll do more bathtime tomorrow. And confidently holding that boundary
because now we realize, okay, when mom says bath time
is all done, bath time is all done. That's the
(42:52):
same consistency every night. We're always getting out at the
same time. That's an easier one. The resisting bath time
is pretty tough because it's it's hygiene. You gotta do it.
It's non negotiable. Um, what we don't want to do is, Okay,
find no bath tonight because my main motivation, yes, I
(43:14):
want healthy kids. I want resilient kids in thirty years.
But my main motivation when I'm like, oh, should I
just should I just skip bathtige tonight and I'm like, Nope,
it's gonna be a fresh nightmare for the next thirty
sixty ninety days. I Am not going to do that.
What I'm gonna do is I'm gonna I'm gonna tackle
this today. I mean, I have to do it tonight.
I know, girl, Oh you're gonna need to text me.
(43:35):
I'm like your support, your like your sponsor. I would
get creative. I mean, at first, right, what we're trying
to overcome is this this cycle that now we have
gotten ourselves into. And so my recommendation at first would
be whatever fun thing we need to do at first
to break this cycle. And also then it is non
(43:58):
negotiable too. But if we can make it fun in
that process and it becomes habit every single day, then
you know we don't have to keep upping the antie
of like what comes to my mind is like popsical
batho or like my kids I do like um, it's
really subtle and very weird, but it's not that weird.
But baking soda is actually very helpful for diaper rash,
(44:19):
and so I used to put it in babies bathtime.
Now we call it snow. So sometimes when we have
bathtime struggles, I'll put the snow on the lid of
the bathtub. You could even put like food coloring in it, whatever,
and I would try to keep it fun, like something
novel and fun, just to get over this hump. Now
we don't need to keep upping the antie and have
popsicles forever. But it's getting over this like battle hump
(44:41):
to get there. That okay, And now it's a habit.
We have bathtime every day. We're not getting in like
ever again. Making it if it fun is one thing,
But when you you get into the bribery department exactly,
you start to become on like a rewards treadmill. You
gotta up. It's got to be exciting and fun to
keep them interested. Just my get fun, okay. Separation, anxiety
(45:02):
is real. Um, Emma was human cling wrap. I still
have it. So what would be your best advice for
you know, mom wants to leave the building too. Yeah,
So this is all about prepping them beforehand. We want
them to understand what's going to happen, who's gonna be
there when you're going to return. Because again, our toddlers
(45:24):
will feel safest when they know what to expect. Uncertainty,
terrifying chaos. Knowing what to expect much better, much calmer.
So if we're gonna be going to the grocery store,
whatever it is, we're gonna let them know. Okay, Mommy
is going to go to the grocery store. Grandma is
gonna be here with you. You're going to play with her.
(45:44):
You're gonna have lunch, and when you wake up from
your nap after lunch, mommy is going to be home
to give you hugs and kisses. Okay, go play and
how fun. And one thing that we really want to
emphasize is that when it's time to actually say goodbye,
we don't want to linger, we don't want to hesitate,
we don't want to give you know, like come back, okay,
bye bye. They're upset and we walk away, but then
(46:06):
we come back because they're upset. Now we're giving them
the message that, oh, maybe I'm not safe because mom
keeps leaving but she comes back. Oh is there day here?
There's got to be something to worry about exactly. And
it's not like you don't have to do these long,
dramatic goodbyes. Yeah, we want to keep it quick and
brief and loving, by the way, and then they know
(46:28):
it's it's almost like the test the first time you
do it. Okay, I love you, bye bye, love you
so much. They're they're upset, they're crying, and we still
leave very confidently, and hopefully the caregiver, by the way,
knows to say things like it's okay to be upset.
You're sad that mommy's gone. Mommy will be back after lunchtime.
You know, they're not kind of doing the thing like
oh look at this, Oh bub bla blah blah blah
(46:49):
blah blable. We wanna let them know, I see you're upset,
It's okay to be upset, that kind of a thing,
but yeah, keeping it brief and by the way, I
mean daycare workers, preschool workers. We've talked to so many
of them about this, and we actually have a section
on this in our course because it's so nerve wracking
for parents and you feel horrible guilt, horrible guilt. So
(47:10):
when we were talking with teachers and preschool workers, that
is their go to. Is the longer you're lingering, the
sort of more heart wrenching it is, and the more
it causes that feeling of like, what's wrong. Why isn't
she leaving? I don't understand is something wrong? And they
can't settle in until you leave exactly. They need your permission,
(47:30):
So you need to leave so they can start, you know,
their day, And then to really build that security when
it's all over, when you're back from the market, when
you picked them up from you know, preschool, you're gonna
tell the story of what happened. You were crying, you
were upset, remember, you were so nervous, and you did it.
You were safe, and I came back to get you,
(47:52):
and I will always come back to get you the
next day or like after preschool, whatever it is. So
just telling that story can kind of like build that security.
And a little pro tip if it's something like preschool,
give them something to hold onto, like a little special
thing when they miss you. They can touch it, they
can look at it. Remember we do little hearts on
(48:14):
on hands sometimes if that happened, so drawing a little
heart and you're like a little kiss. So it's like
so like if you miss mommy, you can give a kiss,
and then it seems to really work. They really look
at it and they're like okay, mommy, and then they
can kind of go about their day. Consistency is so
important in having that consistent goodbye, even if it's to
see you later, alligator, whatever it is that you say,
say consistently because that means mommy's leaving, she's coming back.
(48:38):
Have the same thing when you return, so that they
feel safe and secure. Oh my god, we could talk
to you guys all day. So where can Emma and
other desperate parents find you. We are on Instagram, We're
on their every day so at Big Little Feelings. We're
also on Facebook. Um we post every single day and stories,
(49:01):
tutorials and helpful tips, and then we also have our
toddler course. It's called Winning the Toddler Stage. So it
is we really trying to make it everything that I,
even as a mom, have ever personally faced. So eating, bedtime, siblings, tantoms, discipline.
We wanted it all in one place so that you
can find it. Big Little Feelings dot com. That's great
(49:23):
to know. I'll be right there. Thank you so much,
Dean and Kristin. Thank you so much for having us
so fun. Yeah, thank you. And I'm going to text
you tomorrow girl. Okay, baby love, baby love. I need you, Oh, hell,
I need you. Thanks for listening. Remember, I'm always here
(49:49):
for you. What to Expect is always here for you.
We're all in this together. For more on what you
heard on today's episode, visit what to Expect dot com
slash podcast. You can also check out What to Expect
when You're Expecting, What to Expect the First Year, and
the What to Expect app. And we want to hear
from you. Connect with us on our community message board
(50:12):
or on our social media. You can find me at
Heidi Murkoff and Emma at Emma Being w t E
and of course at What to Expect. Baby Love is
performed by Riley Biterer. What to Expect is a production
of I Heart Radio. From more shows from I heart Radio,
check out the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or
(50:35):
wherever you listen to your favorite shows. In my arms?
What on? Just stay Nija nieda baby, baby,
Who baby, my baby, I need you, Oh hell, I
need you. What to expect? As a production of I
Heart Radio, I'm your host Heidi Murkop and I'm a
mom on a mission, a mission to help you know
(00:21):
what to expect every step of the way. Remember when
there was no place on the planet your baby would
rather be than snuggled up in your arms, gazing up
at your adoring face, all sweet smiles and breathy coups. Well,
if your baby has taken those first monumental steps into toddlerhood,
(00:42):
you may already belonging for those days when you're little
one's contentment was always just a cuddle and a feet away.
Was so much new territory to conquer, so many new
milestones to check off, and so many miles to cover
on two feet. Your toddler is still very little, but
nobody's baby. In so many ways, toddlers are larger than life,
(01:09):
especially when it comes to their feelings. When they're happy,
you know it. When they're mad, you know it. From
meltdowns on the frozen food aisle to battles over bathtime,
life with a toddler is never boring, and it can
definitely keep you guessing well that's about to change, because
(01:30):
today we're answering your biggest toddler questions, and we brought
in backup. Kristen and Dina are the moms behind big
little feelings, and chances are you are one of the
over million parents who follow them on Instagram for their
practical and actionable advice. They know they're toddlers. Kristen has
(01:52):
two toddlers, so she's in the trenches, and Dina is
a child therapist who happens to have a newborn, so
she'll soon be putting those skills to the test at home. Today,
they're here to talk about communicating with your toddlers, taming tantrums,
and the truth about time out, discipline, and understanding all
those big little feelings. Welcome Kristen, Indiana. We are so
(02:17):
excited to have you here today. And I know someone
who's a little extra excited because your advice could not
come at a better time. For Emma. She has discovered
that the struggle with a two and a half year
old is indeed real. Two story Emma, it's just he's
a lot, you know. He doesn't listen at all. He
doesn't listen to my husband. But I mean he's very headstrong,
(02:40):
and I'm kind of like in that pick your battles
kind of phase and it's kind of taken that to
the next level. Yeah, have you stopped picking any battles
at all? Is what's going on? Yeah, you know what,
I'm so tired. You know, this has been a real
this has been a year, and you know, I've kind
of taking off my parenting hat and I'm at then
(03:00):
this kind of point and I know that's so wrong,
but like, you know what, I think we got to
stop you right there. I think any thank you, I
mean not in fucking mode, right not. I mean I
think you captured that perfectly. Yeah, Nope, You're doing great.
And it's like I want him to like fall direction
(03:22):
because today he started school like for an hour, and
I'm like, I swear to you, I know within a
week he's going to be kicked out for you know,
he is My husband are probably bets on this, Like
We're like, he's he going to punch a kid, He's
gonna throw something. Can we just say that everything you
just mentioned is very normal toddler behavior. Gets kicked out
(03:45):
of school for hitting or knocking over some blocks. Then
we got a bigger problem with that, There'll be no
toddlers in the preschool if we do that. No, yeah, exactly,
Like I think, first of all, you're not saying air,
which is a good thing, um. And and he has
other authority figures. And I think, like Emma, lots of parents,
(04:07):
especially now, just want to get through the day. And
setting short term goals is good because survival, Emma, as
you mentioned, is a good thing. But tellsler's really are
about the here and now, But managing their behavior isn't.
What do you guys think? Yeah, I mean again, we're
in we're in unprecedented times right now. So I think
(04:27):
our answer a year ago would have been very different
than our answer today, And I think that's worth noting that.
I agree with you. Long term is really our goal, um.
And what's kind of cool is when we start to
look at some of the things that that Dina and
I share, some of these strategies that are rooted in
thirty years of research that leads to let's say, long term,
(04:51):
healthy resilient kids. For us as parents, sometimes what we
want is the screaming to stop. Right now, We're really
not so folk guest, I mean, we want that shore
when the kids are in bed and sleeping, we're like, oh, yeah,
how can I make them healthy adults? But in the moment,
right what we want is help right now today. And
what's kind of cool is that when Dina and I
(05:12):
started putting our heads together on all of this research
and long term resilience, there are so many of these
things that actually serve both purposes. Like one thing that
we always talk about that's a great example we like
to use is the you know, just letting toddlers know
that their feelings are okay, okay, let's use that as
a great example. So on one end, that sounds very
fluffy and idealistic and whatever, But when you look at
(05:33):
the research, we're building healthy emotional skills life long. They
won't push their feelings down leads to destructive behavior, YadA, YadA.
At the same time, if you were to say to me, hey, Kristen,
what's the number one thing you should do if you're
toddler is having a tantrum and you do nothing else,
I would say, get down to their level and let
them know, Hey, Bud, you're so upset right now about
(05:56):
the iPad being all done. I get it. It's okay
to be upset because magically, in that moment, oftentimes, just
doing that, their tantrum is going to be shorter and
less intense, rather than you're saying, what's the big deal?
Get over it? I told you a hundred times, the
iPad is all done. And so it's kind of magical
that a lot of these things can can have both. Yeah,
(06:17):
it's important to validate their feelings, as we always talk about,
but also to get on their level and put yourself
in their little shoes and understand why they're feeling the
big feelings that they are and they can't express them
as easily as as we can. And sometimes we have
a hard time expressing our feelings right in a positive way.
(06:39):
It's not like we're running around, you know, being always
calm and collected. I am angry or upset by very
ridiculous things, especially too. I always like to make that
comparison that if you had a really hard day and
you know, there was just traffic and something was just
just grating on you, and you walk in, you tell
your partner about it, and they're like, it's a big deal,
(07:00):
nothing even happened. What are you talking about? Like, get
over it? You would just feel horrible. You'd you would explode.
I mean, it just wouldn't feel good. And all you
needed in that moment with someone to say you're having
a hard time. I get that. It's a game changer.
That's so true. I would fully throw something. Yeah, I
would throw something. Yeah, I would knock go over some blocks. Yeah, exactly.
(07:22):
You know what's interesting what you said though? To me,
it's like during that moment when he's having a tantrum,
like I kind of just I'm in pilot mode and
I like given a lot of times, and then at
night when I'm in bed when he's sleeping, I'm like, wow,
what can I do tomorrow to like help that situation
in a in a more positive way where he's learning,
(07:44):
and also like I'm not losing my mind. But and
then the next day it's again, it's it's a vicious
cycle because I don't want to deal with it. Yeah,
And you know, I feel like it's important, you know,
as much as putting yourself in there their little sneakers
also to understand what toddler is and why they behave
the way that they do, because perspective goes a really
(08:06):
long way. All you see is the screaming and the negativity.
And you know, hoddlerhood is the first adolescence. This is
when a child is for the first time setting out
on two feet, you know, carving their own identity and
declaring their independence. Um, the only way they know how
at this point exactly, I'm so happy you said that.
(08:27):
And has so much to do with their brain development.
At this spep of life, their brains are exploding in
terms of development, it's happening so quickly, and at the
same time, the upper areas of their brain that how
all the networks that help them manage their motions, use
their language to express themselves and ask for things and
(08:49):
control their bodies. That is so under construction still, and
that's why we see them screaming and screeching, flailing around,
you know, like hitting on the ground and your kid
pushing back in the toddler stage is actually an amazing sign.
It's a sign that internally they're starting to become aware
(09:10):
of what they want and what they need and they're
saying no, I have an opinion. You're saying no, and
I say yes, And that's actually kind of amazing, and
they're kind of exploring that that relationship too by the way, right,
everything is new, everything is out there, and they're kind
of I think of it when they're testing boundaries. It's like, yes,
they've reached this milestone. They are healthy development yea. And
(09:32):
then I kind of like to think of it as, hey, mom,
are you in control? Or am I in control? Because
toddler's having control of everything in the whole world, bedtime, iPad,
this keeping them safe, that's actually scary for them. And
even though it seems like they want to have all
the power and all the control, it's actually them kind
(09:54):
of asking us to hey, are you the calm, confident
leader or am I the leader? Should I make these choices?
And when we have those sort of limits that are
loving there, it's not authoritative, it's not threatening, but a
really calm, confident, leading vibe. Our toddler will feel safer
(10:14):
to then be the kid. Right, That's what we want
them to be, is a free kid, and we are
here to keep them safe, to let them know what's
on the menu for lunch. And then, like we talk about,
then you give them toddler type of control and power.
Hey it's time for shoes. Now, we're leaving right now.
That's a mean thing. I'm calm, I'm in control. Do
you want the red shoes or the blue shoes? And
(10:36):
that way they feel like they have age appropriate power.
That's like the wonderful trifecta if you can get there
and avoid the the yes or no answer, because you
will always get no. You're always gonna get no. I
always make this mistake and Melissa, do you want this?
Oh my gosh, if you say do you want to
use the potty? Why are we for? It's like I
say that to you, by the way, but I'm like,
why did I just ask? It's actually unfair because when
(10:58):
they say no, and I'm like, well too, you know
what I mean? All that's terrible. It's not fair. All
I had to say was it's time to use the party? Now?
Would you like to use the big party or the
little potty or something like yeah, but it's just it's
time for bedtime, not are you ready for bed? And
they go no. I mean, why am I? Asking? Is
so important? And I didn't understand that until right now. Actually,
(11:21):
But I think modeling the behavior that you want to
see in your kid it sounds like a great idea,
and it is a great idea. So like you need
to be the common their storm because when you're upset
and they're upset, everybody's upset, and you get nowhere because
that's unsettling. Like you said, Kristen, that's scary when everything's
(11:44):
out of control. Mommy's out of control, even if you're
in control, but you say, you know what, yeah, one
more episode. Even just that can be a little bit
chaotic and confusing, right because with mommy says one more episode,
then okay, just mean one more episode, doesn't mean five
more episode When we're at the park, Oh does this
mean five more minutes or ten more minutes, thirty more
(12:05):
minutes or one more minute? So I know I am
the biggest people pleaser in the world. I hate for
anyone to be upset about anything. But what helps me
in the boundary stage because it's hard for us. People
pleasers are people that really want to make people happy,
especially our kids. I try to think of it as
(12:26):
keeping them safe, the same way I wouldn't let them
run into a road, and I would want to say
I'm here and I'm keeping you safe. I'm here, I'm
keeping you safe. I kind of just like mantra that
over and over when it comes to the iPad, when
it comes to leaving the park, when it comes to
getting out of the bathtub, it's like, this is my role.
It's okay to be upset about this. I'm keeping you safe.
(12:47):
And I feel like if you were a pedestrian on
the street and you didn't know what the traffic rules
were and there were no lights and so you would
just cross, so the cars would just go whenever, and
so you would be confused, you would be unsettled, and
you would probably almost certainly be non complaint because you
would never know what the rules were going to be
(13:08):
on any given day. It's confusing. You know what confusion
leads to, by the way, chaos, it leads to tantrums,
It leads to those big emotions and when they feel safer,
Like you just said, there's one, gosh, the one analogy,
and I can't remember who's first said it, but with
the guardrails, it's a great analogy. It's just like that
street light analogy. If there are no guardrails up, then
(13:30):
we're gonna really tiptoe kind of and then be hesitant
and then go forward and then be wary and then
be scared and then be cautious. And then be this.
And it's our job as parents to provide those guardrails
so that they can really thrive and kind of like
run through life being a kid and know that we're
there to have that structure to keep them safe. And
what we're really all saying too, is that when we
(13:52):
don't feel safe, what ends up happening is that your
brain kicks into survival mode. It kicks into that fight
or fly, freeze or faint. Those are really like the
four survival responses. And so we talk about aggressive kids
that's fight. We talk about you know, like nervous kids
who don't want to take risk, that's also a survival response.
(14:13):
This is all like sort of that high level talk
that I always found really confusing. And so the big
little feelings way is, now, let's talk about that with
that iPad example. What that means is is that when
you say every single time almost almost that iPad is
all done, you mean iPad is all done. What that
means is their little brains feel safer, even though they're upset.
(14:36):
By the second or third time, it's not going to
be a pushback or a struggle because when mom says
what she means, she means what she says, and we're
not going in a flight fight or even like oh
how can I get more? It's just like it's hard
for those initial few times, but then it's not a pushback,
it's not a struggle anymore. We feel okay, this is it.
(14:56):
It's one more episode exactly. And I feel like if
you're gonna old boundaries, which is like we're saying, it's
really hard sometimes because they're screaming, they're crying, it's loud,
we're overwhelmed. I feel like we also have to be
armed too. It's like the tool of okay, the feelings,
you can see them and hear them. Yes, it's so
hard right now, you're really upset, it's okay to cry
(15:18):
and let them express that. As we hold boundaries, and
you know, you talk also about the same things that
I talk about, which consistency and structure and predictability. So
the rules are always the same. The rules are age appropriate, right,
because if you expect too much from a kid, they
can't deliver, they can't live up to those expectations. And
if you expect too little, what's the point? So true,
(15:40):
and of course the unconditional love, So even when I
mean everybody's heard this, but it's so important to remember
that if your child feels loved, it's okay for your
child to know you're not fond of their behavior in
this moment, but that you always love them no matter what,
absolutely and eve even not only unconditional love, which is
(16:03):
so important, but also cementing in the fact that they
are a good kid no matter what. They are a
great kid who made a mistake, and so the mistake
can be something that we will help them by the
way we're going to help them in the future. To Okay,
we were feeling angry, It's okay to feel angry. I'm
(16:24):
here with you. And next time we feel angry, what
are we going to do differently? And we love them
no matter what they do, and they are a good
kid no matter what mistakes they may have made today. Dina,
(16:49):
You're not there quite yet, but christ and I'm sure
there are times when you completely ignore your own best advice.
Oh my god, all the time. Yes. First of all, yes,
human nature, especially under stress under hello a pandemic our
big thing. Anyways, No matter what is the twenty rule,
I am all about the eight twenty rule. And I
(17:11):
feel a lot more empowered when I let myself do that.
So that means eighty percent of the time is what
I'm striving for. Some weeks, it's not gonna be eighty.
Sometimes it's gonna be fifty. But let's celebrate that eighty
or fifty percent of the time where we're like, all right,
I held that boundary. I didn't give in Okay, cool,
I did this or I did that. And then twenty
(17:31):
of the time I now structure those days in because
I'm a little bit of a perfectionist and I just
like to know, like, Okay, today is a day where
I'm gonna try really hard, and then I know that
two days a week almost I'm letting go of everything.
I let screen time, we're having crackers with cheese, We're
having you know, we can let on like holidays. You know,
(17:52):
you're letting the boundaries go, you're having their having sugar,
things like that. It is impossible to be perfect one
hundred percent of the time. And I think that people
when they read about, you know, sort of positive parenting
gent whatever you want to call it, it seems really unrealistic.
And that's because I think it is. And you can't
(18:15):
be at one of the time, and for me, I
know not even to strive for that, so I don't
feel like I failed. And when you feel like you've
failed and you get into that like guilt and the cycle,
you're gonna wake up and not really do it again
and pop up up. And for me, it's like I
did a fifty percent jobs it's great, like I did it,
I tried, I killed it. But it's the same thing
(18:37):
as with kids. You want to set expectations for yourself
that are realistic, because when I see headlines that are
just like, you know, how to be a better parent.
First of all, there's no one right way to do
any of this. You know, you've got to find your
own way. But you can't be so hard on yourself.
Moms especially, I think, are so hard on ourselves on
on others, and I mean Insta ram, social media. All
(19:02):
we see are the toddlers who are wearing matching outfits
with like perfect ice cream cones in their hands that
are not dripping, and then the mom is wearing like
like booty shorts with her abs and like a newborn
baby on her breast, and it's like nobody is showing
the behind the scenes where she was like screaming and
giving them candy to sit down and stay still, and
(19:22):
like threatening to take away the ip and then she
storms off and then this and that, and it's very
difficult space I think to be a mom because it's like, oh,
I need perfect activities, I need a perfect I haven't
done an activity in four years. I did one time
and I was like, this is my nightmare. I don't
have the capacity for this. I don't have the patience
for it. You know what I'm good at, I'm really
good at messy play, Like I'll let them jump in
(19:44):
a puddle, I'll let them go wild. You should celebrate
the ship out of that um and celebrate those things.
It's such a mind shift and we have to be
so so aware of it because otherwise we drive ourselves crazy.
And you know, I'm never going to be the clean
mom and I'm never going to be an activity mom.
And that's okay. I'm a great mom, preach I'm not
(20:06):
a clean mom either. My house is a mess and
you know what, yeah no, so yeah, it's never gonna happen.
It's never gonna happen for me. And on the other side,
there are other moms out there that have they do
show that perfectly clean house on Instagram. You know, I
have a friend who's exactly that way, and she's a
really tidy everything is perfect, and yet her child will
only eat like pouches or waffles. That's her struggle. We
(20:30):
all have our struggle, and we all have our things
that we are good at. I love when mom's on
Instagram really show the reality of it though, like like
they tell their their truth, because the thing is you
are helping other moms with that. When you're painting this
perfect picture, which I used to do on Instagram before
(20:51):
the ship hit the fan of this pandemic, I feel
like I used to have a much more clean Instagram,
but now I feel like my house is messying every
picture share everything's a ship storm like and and that's
real and I think that's relatable absolutely. And Dina and
I when we started, we only started one year ago,
big little feelings, and at that time everyone had the
(21:14):
selfie ring light. They were very buttoned up tutorials. You know,
we are educators quote unquote. There was no swearing. The
backgrounds were perfectly clean, and we were like, listen, we're
gonna be us. We're gonna show mom buns. We're gonna
swear sometimes because Instagram is not for toddler's Instagram is
for moms. And when I had my first baby, I
(21:35):
was scrolling through Instagram. I loved all of the you know,
parent coaching and things like that space, but I had
postpartum anxiety. I didn't know any other moms. I didn't
see a single mom that looked like me. I didn't
see a single mom that sounded like me. I didn't
see a house that looked like mine. And it was devastating.
It was really hard, and we thought, listen, this this
(21:57):
may cause that we don't get any followers. It's just
gonna be our mom's being like girls, you're doing so good. Yeah,
but it was important to us to kind of break
the mold and be different and not show just perfection.
We share good days are bad days are like you know,
joyful days, and the days that were just crying messes,
(22:18):
we're just falling apart. That's so important. So we we
know that we need to set boundaries that guardrail. What
do we do? Clearly, young Toddler's distraction is the best
way in most cases, but if you've started thinking about
the word discipline or punishment. I feel like parents need
(22:42):
some guidance on this because it's it's really easy in
the moment to lose your temper. How would you define
discipline for a toddler, Well, let's break down punishment versus discipline,
because they're actually different, but they sometimes are used the same.
So fishman is when our reaction is designed to make
(23:04):
a kid feel scared or bad about themselves so that
they'll shift the behavior next time. Now, discipline, the real
meaning of it, the Latin route, if you want to
get really nerdy with me, really means to teach. We
are their life teachers. They've never done this before, this
whole life thing. It's new to them. And remember the
(23:24):
way their brains work. They may need like a hundred
reminders to get something that's okay. But discipline is really
we are teaching them how to do things differently. We
are teaching them how to understand their emotions, how to
understand what they want, what they need, and express it
in safe and healthy ways, which, by the way, becomes
(23:45):
lifelong skills for living with resilience completely because you are
going to be living with rules around you your entire life,
and you need to start learning at the beginning, and
you need to know right from wrong. And you are
your child's first and most important teacher, and that's one
of the most important things that you can teach. I
love how you say that. Sometimes some of those quote
(24:06):
unquote pushback I guess if you will, on gentle parenting
or positive parenting or whatever you want to say, And
it's it's just a huge misconception because I think that
what we are doing is actually setting them up to
be able to live in a realistic world with rules,
with expectations with others. When we look at how children
learn in schools, when we learn, how did you learn
(24:28):
when you went to college? How did you learn? Was
it fear based? Did somebody threaten to take away your home?
Did somebody threatened to take away your salary? If you
think about the best coach you've ever had, the best
boss you've ever had, were they incredibly domineering and shaming
or were there to make you feel like you were
valued and seen and they were there to help you
(24:50):
next time you made a mistake. Okay, this was a mistake.
They're very confident and permanent. They're not okay with it,
they don't allow it. But hey, what are we gonna
do next time and give you another shot? What is
your incentive, by the way, it's something positive, it's a bonus,
it's camaraderie, it's teamwork. And so it's so boggles my
mind a little bit that we treat children the opposite
(25:10):
and that we should be leading with punishment and fear.
When fear is a terrible teacher. It's a terrible teacher.
It actually studies show that it impacts long term learning,
and that's why we don't use punishments in schools anymore.
So why are we using them at home? And it
just doesn't teach them anything? How many times we hear
(25:31):
over and over, well I put my kid in the
time out. Well I spanked them for hitting, and it
stopped right that second, right, they you know, look at
you and you say, hey, I'm gonna put you in
a time out right then and there what is happening
is they freeze because of that fear. Right, you're threatening
and they're afraid. We don't need to be super dramatic,
but truly it's a fear. I don't want to go
(25:54):
do this, so no, and you stop and you freeze,
and then they go they go in the time out,
they have their punishment, and they come right back out
and they go over to baby sister and they smack
her right in the face. What just happened, right? And
that's because in that very one small moment, they will freeze.
I think that's why people are confused. It works, look,
(26:16):
it works, but it doesn't work long term. It doesn't
teach them how to not hit baby sister. It taught
them in this moment, don't do this or else. Well,
in terms of time out, it's not like they can
sit there and think about what they've done, because you know,
that's like way above their pay right right. I mean
maybe in a much later date they can go to
(26:37):
the room and think about what they've done. But no,
no two year old can't do that. My dad, by
the way, we we had time outs in our house,
and he was really proud because like he wasn't spanking right.
It was like, we do this really awesome thing called
time out. And I would just go into my room
for however long, and I would be steaming. I'd be
so mad, plotting about how I'm going to get them back.
(26:59):
I'm gonna cold show older than when I come out
of this room. And like do bad things, and I
didn't think about what I did wrong at all. Right,
I didn't really learn anything. But I think that's a
really big point too, is when we're talking about a
parent child relationship and building tools and building trust and
building authenticity. I mean, when we send our kids away
(27:22):
to time out when they've quote unquote done something wrong,
we teach them that big feelings really aren't welcome in
this house, and we miss the opportunity to teach them
how to handle a big feeling next time, which is
that lifelong skill. What is your takeaway when they slug
punch saying for hitting, Yeah, well we'll see them. Well, okay,
(27:47):
the feeling. It's okay to feel mad, bringing a boundary,
it's not okay to hit when we're mad, I'm going
to move baby to keep her safe, or I'm going
to move my body to keep everyone safe. And then
later at a calm time when their brains can actually
take in information, because just like us as adults, when
(28:07):
we are highly emotional, nothing's coming in. It's just how
your brain works. You can't talk, you can't reason, use logic,
think learn. So then when they're calm, we want to
revisit and say, oh, you are so mad when the
baby knocked over your blocks. I get it. That is
so frustrating. What can we do next time instead of
pushing her? And that's where we start to teach and
(28:30):
practice the coping skills. We often see or think that
when a toddler or when a kid does something bad,
that that warrants a bad response, a big punishment, a
big reaction, even if it's not a time out. Perhaps
we want to walk over, grab their arms and look
hum in the eyes and go no, no hitting. And
(28:52):
it's actually the opposite because a what is in post
control layman strums that means hitting. It's like angry, Oh
hit right, that's normal for toddlers. First of all that perspective,
and then knowing that our toddlers especially, but all kids
are desperate and I love our attention. They love it.
(29:13):
Their dream is for us when we're washing the dishes
pop up up and they hit their baby sister. Their
dream scenario is we turn off the water, we walk
over to them, we give them attention and look really like,
look in them in the eyes, and now we're focused
on them, even if it's negative attention. Now they've thought, oh, okay,
(29:35):
I know how to get mommy to come over here
and pay attention to me. And so, like Dina said,
staying incredibly calm and having that perspective, Hey, toddler's hit,
Let's try to teach them to not hit in the future. Right,
this is what we're gonna work on. Calm, cool, It's
okay to feel angry because it is contain them in
(29:56):
that moment. Is the only goal in that moment is
to keep everyone's safe. I'm keeping everyone safe now and
then teaching those coping skills. And so that brings us
to tantrums naturally, because when there are so many triggers
of tantrums that if we start to identify, we can
prevent some of them, not all of them. Some of
them are completely necessary. Part of you know, toddler behavior happens,
(30:20):
and you know, you can't prevent all tantrums, but you
can prevent them. And one of the ways to do that,
I would say, is paying attention before now. You can't
always obviously, parents sometimes don't realize that that negative attention
is better than no attention. As you said, um, and
when you say on your phone, you're not paying attention
(30:42):
in the store. Well, what happens the kid wants some attention,
They're going to scream for it. That's part of it, right,
It's true. Yeah, and you well, what would the other
triggers you would say? I would say one that I
think we lose track of is are we kind of
dictating ish all day long? Are we like no, no, no, no, no,
(31:04):
this way, this way, this way, this way, this way,
this way. A great way to prevent a tantrum is,
like we were saying, to making those big adult decisions, right,
it's time for bedtime, it's time for potty, it's this.
But making your toddler feel involved and in control of
the situation. Giving them they love power age appropriate power, though,
(31:24):
is the key, right. And so I can't tell you
how many times that if that checklist is truly there,
I can't tell you how many tantrums we can avoid
by making our kids feel involved. Right, If you're barking
at them and it's like you're not going fast enough
get your shoes on right now, we're heightened and they're
gonna heighten and we're gonna explode. If we say, hey,
(31:45):
it's time for shoes now, how fast can you go?
Could you get blue shoes or red shoes. You choose,
do you like? Yeah? I like that choice. And giving
them a little bit of age appropriate power is key
before anything, we're to even go south. And a circle
back on what you were saying before too, which is
like any time we see an uptick in unwanted behavior,
(32:07):
we can almost fill up their attention tank proactively in
a positive way. And we call this the ten minute miracle.
So carve out ten minutes a day, every day something
they can count on. Give it a special name. Maybe
you know my baby's hunter. It's mama hunter time, and
he's going to get to pick what activity we do.
I put my phone down, there's no siblings. He gets
(32:29):
my full attention, no teaching, no correcting him, and he
can just soak up my love and attention. And a
lot of times, when we do this consistently, you will
start to see a change in behavior. You'll see the
hitting kind of mellow out, whatever it is. And this
is especially helpful if there have been you know, like
big life changes like new baby in the house or
(32:51):
you know you're moving. You know, even I sometimes will
forget how powerful this really is. And that's because people
are like well, I'm with my kid all day long, Like, no,
absolutely not. This isn't gonna work. It is so different.
And this works for spouses too. By the way, I
always like to use this analogy of I don't know
about you, but after my kids go to bed, we're
(33:12):
on Netflix, we're on our phones, were scrolling, and we
haven't actually like communicated or looked at each other or
felt connected at all. And they keep happening, right, So
that happens at least in my house as as a
prior stay at home mom. And now to we're shuffling,
we're doing dishes, baby needs this, baby does that ten
(33:33):
minutes literally of just there's no siblings, there's no one
else in the world. It is so different. I can't
even tell you how different that special ten minute time is.
And it's kind of cool for us parents too. It's
like we're not fighting. Nobody is like struggling against me.
It's just like you pick what we're doing and let's
have this time. It's it's a game changer, it really is.
(33:55):
Even sometimes a hug, a cuddle, even when a tantrum
starting to happen. And this goes for relationships too. If
you have touched. Then you melt down all of these
angry feelings, not all of them, but you can. It's
a potential to melt away some of those feelings. It
(34:15):
doesn't necessarily work every kid every time, but it can work.
And you know what, we like to even say offering
a hug. Right even the other day, I was really upset.
I was crying a lot, and I typically don't like
to be touched. And that's the same with our kids.
My my youngest does not like touch She's just like me,
and that's okay, but I always offer it and I'm
(34:37):
I'm here if you need me, and it's okay to
be sad. The key Adina and christ and are making
(34:58):
is don't be a cave mom. You don't cave. Instead,
you set these expectations and you follow through as much
as you possibly can. And you know what, I used
to think that that was like for the well being
of long term in thirty years and you know, funk
that I need to have this crying stop now what
I found as now being a mom of two childlers,
(35:20):
I will tell you as hard as it is in
that moment, it is I can speak from experience ten
thousand times harder in your day to day life when
you're just giving in because it is chaos and they
are screaming and they are demanding and you are screaming
and back and forth. And so my main motivation in
(35:41):
these moments is, yes, this moment is hard, but this
moment will last two minutes. Like today, Okay, we're testing
on the car seat battle. If I do this now
and I let her run around the car and go
back and forth and okay, please, okay, this, okay, that, Okay,
the five more minutes. I know that every day and
every time we want to get in a car seat,
(36:01):
until I rein it in and decide to it will
be chaos and a nightmare. And so my main motivation is, yes,
it's hard in these two minutes or three minutes or
four minutes, but overall, your whole life and your whole
day to day life is so much calmer, more manageable.
That's the motivation for me. That's going to be my
(36:22):
motivation to exactly exactly. We're all set and we're going
to check back in with you tomorrow, Emma. So, not surprisingly,
Emma is not alone. There are many menu moms of
toddlers at what to expect, and they brought with them
all of their questions, you know, even beyond the temper
(36:44):
tantums and the biting and the hitting. One of course
that you here every day is about picky eaters. And
these moms are wondering, how do you negotiate a balanced
die with a toddler who doesn't want to eat in anything? Yeah, well,
I love this question because the answer is you don't.
(37:04):
You don't negotiate with a toddler in general, in general, right,
you don't. And and that doesn't mean you don't let
them have feedback, because, like what we've learned is it
goes back to the same things. We are calm, confident leaders.
We decide when we're eating, We decide what is on
the menu, and perhaps we want to give them a
(37:25):
choice like do you want the purple plate or the
pink plate? Do you want this or do you want that?
And what we like to do is always include one
safe food, especially for picky eaters already okay, because if
you put a plate in front of them. And my
kids are great eaters, I mean, but great is a
relative term. My kids like to eat a lot of
stuff because I've done a lot of these strategies. So
(37:46):
they'll eat sushi, they'll eat asparagus, they'll do this. But
if that sushi is different than the sushi that they like,
they're not gonna eat it. They're gonna pitch a fit
if the asparagus is different. So it all is just
a toddler thing of when there is one safe food,
they feel safe to explore those other foods, and you,
as a parent, feel confident, calm, and you're not going
(38:09):
to negotiate because you know there is one food on
their plate that they like. So let's say it's blueberries.
You know they're not going to starve. I see a
lot of parents try to do the negotiating or the pleading,
or the airplane or that this or that, or go
back and forth and oh you don't like the blue
but okay, I'll get you something else. We know they
like blueberries. It's on their plate. They're not going to start.
(38:29):
They can always have the blueberries. And when you put
that plate down and they say, oh yucky, you say
that's okay, you don't have to eat it. There is
no pressure. There are so many studies that Diana and
I just rifle through that are increased pressure leads directly
to picky eating. So parents strategies they think that what
they're doing is helping the begging and the pleading or
(38:53):
following them around or they sort of that, and you're
directly leading to picky eating. And when you do at
no pressure approach, we call it play it cool and
you put it down and that's like, this is your food,
this is what we're having today, this is what's on
the menu. Knowing there's a safe food that is the
best strategy. And then you just back off. You just
(39:13):
relaxed and you tell them listen to your body. That's okay.
That's it. It's that simple. Yeah, it's not like when
you're in a restaurant the waiters like standing over you
saying one more bite, just one more bite. Can you
imagine even when my husband does that, when he's like,
you're gonna love this. I know it. I know you're
like this, and I'm like, I don't feel like eating
this right now. I'm not going to try it, Like
I don't want to. He's like, well, you never know,
(39:35):
because you even tried allives in two years, you should
try all I'm like, I don't want an olive, right
but you know, it literally makes sense that we're staring
somebody in the face and being like one more bite.
Of course it would be like I'm all done, Like
I don't want this anymore. I'm done. I don't want
to eat if you're staring at me exactly. And I
think it's also you said how many times you know
(39:56):
they eat? That's your decision and what they eat, but
also are they eat. They should be eating sitting down
and not like eating on the run, because you know,
meal time is something that takes place in a set
of position. It's much safer, but it's also socially acceptable
place to eat, and it builds the foundation for good,
(40:17):
healthy eating habits. And it's not surprising that toddlers resist
high chairs because they don't like being cooped up, you know,
baby's love. That's like the highlight of their day is
trying new foods. And then they turn toddlers and game changer. Yeah,
and you know it's actually a part of like the
evolutionary process is that if a toddler was in the
(40:38):
wild and they see something new, this is something that's
going to keep them safe because they're like, oh, is
this poisonous? Is this not so coming? At it. This
is literally what they're supposed to do. They're supposed to
question anything new on their plate. Research shows it can
take up to a hundred exposures of something new. So
it takes the pressure of a parent to be like, listen,
(40:59):
put a safe food on a plate. Try giving them
new things. And it is not your job to get
them to eat. It's your job to build the plate,
give a safe food, but it in front of them,
and then you did your job. Then you let go.
There's nothing else for you to do. Exactly. We decide
what's on the menu, and they decide how much goes
in their body. Exactly. Okay, let's say bed time. How
(41:22):
do we make bed time not a nightmare? Yeah? Well,
one thing they can do is create a chart, a
bedtime chart that's a visual aid, something they can see
that lists out the steps that need to happen. So
we're gonna put the words it's you know, brush your
teeth and there's a picture of brushing teeth, put on
your jammy's picture of jammies so that they can fall along.
(41:45):
And then we want to give them age appropriate power
here again so that they feel involved, like it's their choice.
They get to put a check after each step or
put a sticker on that chart after they do each step,
so that we can say, okay, you brush your teeth.
What's next? You tell me, and they run to the
chart say okay, it's time for jammies. Let's do it.
(42:08):
So that's one way to get them involved so that
they're not in pushback mode during collaboration mode. That's awesome, Okay, bathtime.
Some toddlers love bath Some toddlers don't want to get in.
Some tiddlers don't want to get out. What are your thoughts? Yeah,
especially with the getting out. It comes back to being
that calm, confident leader. So it's a little bit trickier
(42:31):
to get them in right, it's like a slippery wet
fish over you know. But getting getting them out is
an easier answer. And that is I hear you're upset,
you want that more bathtime. Bathtime is all done. Now,
we'll do more bathtime tomorrow. And confidently holding that boundary
because now we realize, okay, when mom says bath time
is all done, bath time is all done. That's the
(42:52):
same consistency every night. We're always getting out at the
same time. That's an easier one. The resisting bath time
is pretty tough because it's it's hygiene. You gotta do it.
It's non negotiable. Um, what we don't want to do is, Okay,
find no bath tonight because my main motivation, yes, I
(43:14):
want healthy kids. I want resilient kids in thirty years.
But my main motivation when I'm like, oh, should I
just should I just skip bathtige tonight and I'm like, Nope,
it's gonna be a fresh nightmare for the next thirty
sixty ninety days. I Am not going to do that.
What I'm gonna do is I'm gonna I'm gonna tackle
this today. I mean, I have to do it tonight.
I know, girl, Oh you're gonna need to text me.
(43:35):
I'm like your support, your like your sponsor. I would
get creative. I mean, at first, right, what we're trying
to overcome is this this cycle that now we have
gotten ourselves into. And so my recommendation at first would
be whatever fun thing we need to do at first
to break this cycle. And also then it is non
(43:58):
negotiable too. But if we can make it fun in
that process and it becomes habit every single day, then
you know we don't have to keep upping the antie
of like what comes to my mind is like popsical
batho or like my kids I do like um, it's
really subtle and very weird, but it's not that weird.
But baking soda is actually very helpful for diaper rash,
(44:19):
and so I used to put it in babies bathtime.
Now we call it snow. So sometimes when we have
bathtime struggles, I'll put the snow on the lid of
the bathtub. You could even put like food coloring in it, whatever,
and I would try to keep it fun, like something
novel and fun, just to get over this hump. Now
we don't need to keep upping the antie and have
popsicles forever. But it's getting over this like battle hump
(44:41):
to get there. That okay, And now it's a habit.
We have bathtime every day. We're not getting in like
ever again. Making it if it fun is one thing,
But when you you get into the bribery department exactly,
you start to become on like a rewards treadmill. You
gotta up. It's got to be exciting and fun to
keep them interested. Just my get fun, okay. Separation, anxiety
(45:02):
is real. Um, Emma was human cling wrap. I still
have it. So what would be your best advice for
you know, mom wants to leave the building too. Yeah,
So this is all about prepping them beforehand. We want
them to understand what's going to happen, who's gonna be
there when you're going to return. Because again, our toddlers
(45:24):
will feel safest when they know what to expect. Uncertainty,
terrifying chaos. Knowing what to expect much better, much calmer.
So if we're gonna be going to the grocery store,
whatever it is, we're gonna let them know. Okay, Mommy
is going to go to the grocery store. Grandma is
gonna be here with you. You're going to play with her.
(45:44):
You're gonna have lunch, and when you wake up from
your nap after lunch, mommy is going to be home
to give you hugs and kisses. Okay, go play and
how fun. And one thing that we really want to
emphasize is that when it's time to actually say goodbye,
we don't want to linger, we don't want to hesitate,
we don't want to give you know, like come back, okay,
bye bye. They're upset and we walk away, but then
(46:06):
we come back because they're upset. Now we're giving them
the message that, oh, maybe I'm not safe because mom
keeps leaving but she comes back. Oh is there day here?
There's got to be something to worry about exactly. And
it's not like you don't have to do these long,
dramatic goodbyes. Yeah, we want to keep it quick and
brief and loving, by the way, and then they know
(46:28):
it's it's almost like the test the first time you
do it. Okay, I love you, bye bye, love you
so much. They're they're upset, they're crying, and we still
leave very confidently, and hopefully the caregiver, by the way,
knows to say things like it's okay to be upset.
You're sad that mommy's gone. Mommy will be back after lunchtime.
You know, they're not kind of doing the thing like
oh look at this, Oh bub bla blah blah blah
(46:49):
blah blable. We wanna let them know, I see you're upset,
It's okay to be upset, that kind of a thing,
but yeah, keeping it brief and by the way, I
mean daycare workers, preschool workers. We've talked to so many
of them about this, and we actually have a section
on this in our course because it's so nerve wracking
for parents and you feel horrible guilt, horrible guilt. So
(47:10):
when we were talking with teachers and preschool workers, that
is their go to. Is the longer you're lingering, the
sort of more heart wrenching it is, and the more
it causes that feeling of like, what's wrong. Why isn't
she leaving? I don't understand is something wrong? And they
can't settle in until you leave exactly. They need your permission,
(47:30):
So you need to leave so they can start, you know,
their day, And then to really build that security when
it's all over, when you're back from the market, when
you picked them up from you know, preschool, you're gonna
tell the story of what happened. You were crying, you
were upset, remember, you were so nervous, and you did it.
You were safe, and I came back to get you,
(47:52):
and I will always come back to get you the
next day or like after preschool, whatever it is. So
just telling that story can kind of like build that security.
And a little pro tip if it's something like preschool,
give them something to hold onto, like a little special
thing when they miss you. They can touch it, they
can look at it. Remember we do little hearts on
(48:14):
on hands sometimes if that happened, so drawing a little
heart and you're like a little kiss. So it's like
so like if you miss mommy, you can give a kiss,
and then it seems to really work. They really look
at it and they're like okay, mommy, and then they
can kind of go about their day. Consistency is so
important in having that consistent goodbye, even if it's to
see you later, alligator, whatever it is that you say,
say consistently because that means mommy's leaving, she's coming back.
(48:38):
Have the same thing when you return, so that they
feel safe and secure. Oh my god, we could talk
to you guys all day. So where can Emma and
other desperate parents find you. We are on Instagram, We're
on their every day so at Big Little Feelings. We're
also on Facebook. Um we post every single day and stories,
(49:01):
tutorials and helpful tips, and then we also have our
toddler course. It's called Winning the Toddler Stage. So it
is we really trying to make it everything that I,
even as a mom, have ever personally faced. So eating, bedtime, siblings, tantoms, discipline.
We wanted it all in one place so that you
can find it. Big Little Feelings dot com. That's great
(49:23):
to know. I'll be right there. Thank you so much,
Dean and Kristin. Thank you so much for having us
so fun. Yeah, thank you. And I'm going to text
you tomorrow girl. Okay, baby love, baby love. I need you, Oh, hell,
I need you. Thanks for listening. Remember, I'm always here
(49:49):
for you. What to Expect is always here for you.
We're all in this together. For more on what you
heard on today's episode, visit what to Expect dot com
slash podcast. You can also check out What to Expect
when You're Expecting, What to Expect the First Year, and
the What to Expect app. And we want to hear
from you. Connect with us on our community message board
(50:12):
or on our social media. You can find me at
Heidi Murkoff and Emma at Emma Being w t E
and of course at What to Expect. Baby Love is
performed by Riley Biterer. What to Expect is a production
of I Heart Radio. From more shows from I heart Radio,
check out the I heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or
(50:35):
wherever you listen to your favorite shows. In my arms?
What on? Just stay Nija nieda baby, baby,
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