June 24, 2021 • 38 mins
This week, we interview Rebecca Minkoff, designer and creator of the eponymous global fashion brand. Rebecca dishes on the t-shirt that launched her career, what it’s like running a business with her brother, how she and her husband divide the parenting and best of all, she candidly shares the challenges she has faced on her entrepreneurial journey.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Sam Edis and I'm Amy Nelson. Welcome to
What's Her Story? With Sam and Amy. This is a
show about the world's most remarkable women, their professional and
personal journeys. Together, we'll hear from gold medalists, best selling authors,
and leaders of the world's most iconic brands. Today, we're
(00:23):
so excited to welcome fashion designer Rebecca Minkoff to the show.
She's also the author of the new book Fearless. So
a T Shirt started at All tell Us about It.
So I was twenty years old. I had gone and
been a guest at this artist convention in the Mohammas.
(00:43):
I actually couldn't afford to even get on the trip,
but I was told, if you get five other people
to get on the boat to UH, you can go
for free. So that's how I've paid my way. And
I loved all the Aruba curassow bonn air sort of
cut up but you know, beaded shirts. But I was like,
I don't want to wear a tourist T shirt. I
want New York. So I came home boughten ilee of
(01:04):
New York shirt, cut it up. D I wid it
that was a thing. Then I'm sure you both can
remember that, and bedazzling jen Y doesn't bring that shipped back.
But I wore it. My sister in law wanted one,
and so she wore it and had dinner with Jenna Elfman,
who was a very well known celebrity at the time,
and I sent it to Jenna on September nine, two
(01:26):
thousand and one. She worked on Jay Leno a couple
of weeks later, and he asked her about it, and
obviously nine eleven had happened, so anything that said New
York on it was far more meaningful. And she said
my name on national television, and back then that actually
did something for a brand. And I got, you know,
inbound emails, however, people could reach humans, you know, when
(01:48):
email was still a thing or not not a thing um,
and was making that shirt. And that's all I did
for nine months. I'd bike two different areas in the city,
negotiate with the with the men who will sold these
I Love New York shirts, and then come home and
cut them up and dazzle them or you name it.
And that was It wasn't an overnight success, but it
allowed me to call stores and say, hey, I have
(02:12):
something else besides this will you let me show you
my my goods? Do you remember the first time you
you had this work ethic? And and when it began,
I do. My mom in the eighties, to make part
of her living, sold what's called cast cover, so eighties
neon nylon sheathing to cover your cast to make you
(02:33):
look cool, and she would sell it at the flea market.
And I just remember going, I want to sell something
at the flea market. This is the coolest thing ever.
And so, you know, she paid for enough materials for
you to make some jewelry and some really terrible puffy
paint sweatshirts and some you know, bad spin art. And
I set up a little card table and I didn't
sell a thing, but that whole week preparing for that
(02:56):
flea market was like such an exciting week that I
got to stuff and I was going to sell it
and people were going to see it. And so I
think it started then, um, and then throughout my life,
the answer was always no, you're gonna have to earn it.
You're you know, you're gonna have to make it and
figure it out. So when I when I finally realized
that that sentiment was not changing, I you know, started
babysitting as early as I could to buy my sewing machine,
(03:18):
and you know, just started figuring out how do I
make money because it's not coming from my parents. So
you get really excited, You prepare all weeks to sell
at this little table, and you don't sell anything. How
did you not feel defeated? I felt totally defeated. I
felt like such a loser. I still I have that
same feeling now if I come out with a really
(03:38):
exciting collection or a piece and it's like no one cared,
Like I just worked so hard for this. So I
think that was the first taste of, oh, not everything
I do is going to be wanted. How do you
overcome that? Like? How do you get past that? Even today?
I think having that happen a lot helps you have
perspective and you sort of know that's part of this.
(04:00):
I think that I'll always set high goals for myself,
but I don't go into a shame whole if I
don't make those goals. So I think it's perspective and
knowing that you're not going to get everything you want,
and then when you do get what you want or
you you achieve something, it feels that much sweeter for it.
(04:22):
Your mom strikes me from reading the book as someone
who was a little bit you know, of tough love
that she instilled in you, which really helped. Does that
reflect how you've been parenting your own kids. So here's
what I'm experiencing with my own kids. I am being
as tough and I'm saying, if you want something, you
have to earn it, and my kids are just like,
(04:44):
never mind, I don't want it that badly. And I'll
watch my daughter and be like, I want, I want,
I want, I want, Like anytime she's a toy, I
can I have that for my birthday? Can I have that?
And I'm like, no, you have to earn it, and
then she's like onto the next. And so I'm at
this weird struggle where trying to replicate what really worked
for me and my kids just don't care. They're like,
(05:06):
who needs it? That's really hard. I think it's a
generational thing as well. It might be. I was trying
to explain to my son the other day. I was like,
so summer camp it cost us this. That means that's
why mommy works, and and he finally started to get it.
I was like, so when I asked you to take
your dishes to the sink. That's helping me. But it
took me like talking to him like he was too
(05:27):
for him, he's nine for him to be like, Okay,
I should help out my parents more. Take us back
to when you were first in New York and you
were struggling, where were you living, What was that like
and what finally made the leap to Rebecca Minkoff the brand.
So when I first moved to New York, I I
think I had I thought that my parents would help
(05:48):
me out with an apartment and I just assumed they
rent me one, and they were like, oh, hell no,
we're not doing that. Um. And so I actually had
a really good friend that was at Fordham University that
he had lived with us off and on in high
school because of his family situation was not he did
not come from a good home, and so he said
come stay with me. So I stayed with him in
(06:08):
his disgusting dorm room like three men, just bad college men.
And that lasted for about three weeks and then my
parents said, Okay, we're gonna come check on you, make
sure you're okay. And we had dinner with my dad's
first cousin, and they made some deal with her. They're like,
all right, if you watch her daughter two nights a week,
she'll let you stay her for free in the playroom,
(06:28):
but you have to clean up every night and that's
your option. And I was like cool. So I did
that for about nine months, and by that time I
had saved up I guess enough money that I met
this old lady through this art center that I was frequenting,
and she said, I have a room you can rent.
My mom sleeps in the living room, I sleep in
the bedroom, and I have one extra room and it's
(06:50):
fifty bucks a night. And that felt like so much money,
not per night, per month, but I was like, I
gotta get out of this playroom. I gotta be able
to unpack my clothing. Little did I know that the lady,
who was like seventy and her mom was ninety two,
she would like check to make sure I made my
bed at night, you know, the next day, and boys
couldn't come over. So it wasn't like I just had
(07:10):
a room. I had like a grandma. So once the
shirt took hold and I had moved to an apartment again,
I rented a small closet from a woman and I
had a mattress on egg crates. That was when the
shirt was at a tay Day and I thought I
had made it. I had a five piece clothing collection
and I sort of did the clothing designer thing for
about four years. Could not make ends meet, was slowly
(07:32):
going into credit card debt. I was not able to
qualify personally for a credit card, but my dad co
signed and he's like, I'm not going to pay for this,
you are, but I'll put my name on it. And
I was hitting close to like sixty dollars in debt
and I was like, how the heck am I going
to do this? And the clothing wasn't it was doing well.
(07:53):
It was a small, you know, business to be proud of,
but I couldn't live on it. I was styling on
the side that's I was paying the bill. And then um, Jenna,
the same woman who wore the shirt, we were having
lunch in l A and she said do you make bags?
And I just lied to her and I said, yeah,
I do. And I had been thinking about bags, but
I hadn't really decided to dive in. And that's when
(08:13):
I rushed back to New York. I had a two
week deadline to make her a bag, and I made
two samples. I overnighted it and FedEx missed delivered it
by about two hours. So her assistant called me. It
was like we started shooting, where the hell is this bag?
And no, it's not going to make the movie. And
I was devastated. Um, that was like my last six bucks.
(08:34):
The over the cash advance from the credit card machine
was no longer working, and my dad was like, how
you paying this back? So I started carrying the sample
around and enough women stopped me on the street that
I was like, maybe there's something here. Maybe I should
try to sell it. And I showed it to a
friend of mine who was a buyer in l A
at the time with his door seteen, and she said,
it's incredible. I want to buy it. I'm gonna buy twelve,
(08:56):
and I'm gonna have my friend at Daily Candy right
about it. And if you're an elder millenna yearal or
a geriatric millennial, you know what Daily Candy is. So
she wrote the article. It was called the Catwalk of
Shame and I called it the Morning After Bag, and
the rest is definitely not history. But that was the
birth of that bag and now the brand as we
know it today. I love that story because you missed
(09:17):
the deadline, but it turned out to still be an
open door. It wasn't the end of the story. It
was the beginning of the story. It was And I
think I felt doubly pressured, not only because I really
didn't have any more money, but also like I gotta
turn this into something. It can't just be that this
is the end. And I'm like, all right, I'll go
home now and now for a quick break, tell us
(09:40):
the story of the three bag order from the department store.
And I don't think most people understand the economics of
department stores and the fashion world. Yes, so, most department stores,
when they buy you in the beginning, is a relationship
of like, we're going to buy you. See how it goes.
Once you're sort of more well established, then you start
(10:04):
helping pay for things. So if you see an ad
in a in a magazine or a catalog that you
get from a department store, the designer actually paid for that.
Or if they don't meet the sales expectation of you
have to sell x amount of week and they put
the bags on sale, the designer pays for that. Um
My showroom had warned me, do not sell to a
department store. You are not ready to sell to a
(10:24):
department store. And I said, I'm going to sell to
a department store. Yes, I'm taking the order. And she
had her reasons. She felt like you needed enough. She said,
you needed five specialty stores to even have a brand
awareness enough that a woman walks into a department store
and it's Gucci product, Tory Birds, Mark Jacobs, whoever, that
she's gonna go over the little stand with like a
(10:46):
placard and be like, oh, this is who I was
looking for. So she felt like you needed more awareness
before a woman would know to look for you. And um,
all those bags. I got a call the buyer said, so,
we haven't sold any we'd like to return them all
and we'll work with you in the future if you
take them back. So that was sort of and it
(11:07):
was three three hundred bags, and it was we'll keep
them and never work with you again, or you take
them back and maybe we'll consider coming back and buying
more from you when your brand is more well known.
So I think, I, you know, I didn't really have
a choice if you wanted to grow then because Director
Consumer wasn't even a blip on anyone's radar. Um So
(11:29):
I took them back and I was like, how the
hell am I going to get rid of these bags?
And then I called my friend at Daily Candy. I
was like, you need to write about my sample sale
because it's going to be in my apartment, So let's
do this. And didn't get rid of all three D
D of all of them except for like ten sad
like destroyed samples, but yes, they were they were gone.
(11:50):
There was I lived on three eighteen Street and I
rented an apartment in the same apartment building, so I
lived in one apart and then downstairs was my office.
But it was an apartment. And so when I when
I woke up that morning to like go open the doors,
there was a line around the block and all these
women like they didn't care that they were going into
(12:12):
some tenement apartment. They were like, let's do this. So
you worked with your brother, I would love to hear
your story of how you and your brother evolved from
him funding part of your business to becoming your full
on partner. Yeah. So I think in the beginning went
once the credit card was cut off and I needed
(12:32):
funds and I actually had legitimate business, you know, with
the satine order, and then they sold out after Daily
Candy ran and so I had called my dad first
and he said, I'm done. I'm scared, you're never going
to pay me back. Call your brother. And so my
brother had a technology company and was doing quite well,
and he started loaning me small sums of money and
I would pay them back every time I got paid.
(12:54):
But he could see, as any businessman I guess does
or businesswoman, this sort of hockey stick like growth, and
at each time I came to him with real orders,
you know, it was doubling and tripling. And so he
decided to get serious and sort of on the funding side,
we couldn't get funding vcs and PE wasn't something that
(13:15):
was done then. It wasn't what it is now. There
was no such thing as crowdfunding. So banks were like, hell, no,
we're not going to loan to you, you twenty five
year old girls sitting in my office. And so he
really stretched. He stretched a credit line he had, he
mortgaged his house, he maxed out his m X to
buy leather um and then you know, he really worked
(13:36):
to turn the business side into a real business, and
so he became CEO and I had to deal with him.
I said, when we hit ten million, you're moving here
because this cannot be a long distance relationship. So he
moved his whole family and and you know, started working
full time back in two thousand and eleven. And how
do you resolve any differences between you when they come up?
(13:59):
So let's all be honest. Any people two or more
that worked together full time, related, married or not, you're
going to encounter tough times, especially as business owners. And
I think a brother or sister or sibling relationship has
the added dynamic of you grown up with each other,
(14:19):
you know how to push each other's buttons. And so
for the first few years it was all smooth, and
then the explosions began and we had reached a point
where we hadn't been speaking and it's really hard to
run a business that way. Like we would speak in
front of others and no one knew that our problems were,
but behind closed doors, we just refused to talk. And
(14:39):
so that's when we called in like a professional couples
counselor slash business mediator to really help us, and so
he helped us not only you know, frame rules around
how we treat each other, but also really get down
to what each other needs and wants um because I
think that's critical to understand what your partner married again
business or not. What do I truly needn't want from you?
(15:01):
And what do you need and want from them? And
can you produce it? And that evolves that changes, right,
So it's that constant sort of check in and making
sure that everyone's still on the same page. So that's
been incredibly helpful in keeping us from World War three.
Do you still see the counselor we do? We just
saw him like two months ago. So when did you
(15:22):
feel like Rebecca Mincuff became a known brand? You know,
it had these like big pops obviously when when Daily
Candy happened, or when we opened our first store, you know,
when we finally did account and we were like, oh
my gosh, we're nine points of sale. But I still
think and I don't know, but like when you're hustling
(15:45):
all the time and investing every dime ind your company, Like,
I still don't feel like we've made it as a brand.
And my brother has to remind me. Sometimes he has
to be like, you can't say that, you can't act
like that. We're a big brand. We're not like, you know,
we're not like the girl in the back yard rubbing
sticks together to like have a little cart and sell
(16:05):
it at the side of the road. And I think
that when you're this close to your business and you've
been invested in it this long, it's hard to like
pull yourself back and be like, oh, we're big. As
an entrepreneur, I think you always have that goal post
that's ahead of you, and I know I feel like
that where, you know, we just finished a raise and
everyone's congratulating me, and all I can think of is
(16:27):
the pressure I feel right now to make it worthwhile
and put it to use and hit our next goal post.
And I think that when you're in it, it's hard
to feel that sense of accomplishment or feel like you've
ever made it. And that's what keeps you going, right,
is that that hustle never ends. The hustle never ends.
And I think I had to come to grips with
like the disappointment that I kept facing of. I thought
(16:49):
I thought I'd feel fine if I just got here.
I thought i'd oh, wait, I got here. Wait. That
still doesn't feel good. And so it's like that disappointment
of like, all I'm doing is setting these goals and
meeting them and the completion of that goal is not
bringing me joy. And so I really have to get
good at really loving the process. Like when I said, Okay,
I have to pre sell ten thousand books, let me
(17:11):
enjoy this process because it's gonna feel great when I
hit that goal and not hitting the goal. Your brand
is you write like you design beautiful products, but it's
your name. What does it like to have the brand
with your name on it? So I think I've gone
through different evolutions with my relationship with the brand. Obviously,
when I started, it was the same age in sex
(17:33):
as my customer, going through lots of different life stages. Um,
we reached a point when I was about thirty one,
when I had my first kid, where some people within
the company were like, you know what, we're going to
freeze our customer and we're just going to talk to her.
And so when you show your kids on Instagram or
(17:54):
that grown up life at thirty one, that doesn't resonate
with her. And I didn't agree, but I was like, well,
these people are trained and they know what they're doing,
and they're they know more about social media and marketing
than me. What do I know? I didn't go to
college and I listened to them. And so for for
a couple of years, it was like this disconnect of
my customer is someone I don't recognize anymore and I'm
(18:16):
not sharing what I'm going through and that didn't feel
good and it actually hurt us as a brand. But
I had to almost disconnect myself from the brand and
from me. And then there was a short period of
time where we had a woman as president who was
going to sell anything to anyone, and so she'd come
to me with this outlandish request like nerd alert on
(18:37):
a computer tote, and I'd be like, that's disgusting, and
she's like, do you want to be the one who
doesn't make the year because we didn't hit our numbers
or not. And I'm like, well, I don't want that
pressure on me. Throw nerd alert on a toe. So
then i'd like see women walking around a cringe to
be like, oh, that's my brands. Oh god. So you know,
I finally I think reached a point of maturity and
(18:58):
strength several years ago, and I was like, that's it.
It's me, It's it's my women. They've grown up with me.
It's my life stages. It can also be young, right,
but it can also go old, and it's going to
be human. And so I think we've done a lot
of work to change it and bring it back to that.
And my customer was like, oh, yeah, I love you.
(19:18):
You left me for a little bit because you were
talking about only going out to clubs and eating chicken
nuggets and champagne in the morning. But you're back and
I'm glad, and so it's been nice that the two
can live closer together again. Do you ever feel pressure,
as Rebecca main coff, that you're also representing this established brand. Yeah,
I think I choose to complain with the right audience.
(19:41):
I don't think it does me any good or my
customer any good to vomit on them about my day. Yes,
I'll appear more real, but does that actually help her?
Does that make her go oh, I want to invest
in this brand, but I'll definitely vomit on Amy, you know,
and share with her my struggles and whatever. If I
get to see her or other other co founders or
(20:03):
our founders, right, So I picked my audience for who
I'm going to like let my hair down with because
they can provide me with a solution and they can
listen with an intelligent response. I think the thing that
I sometimes forget is the messiness of life, you know,
Like I'm at an airport. All three kids are misbehaving.
I might have had a beer that was too too
(20:24):
much too soon, and I'm not doing my best to
be present, and food is spilling everywhere, and then these
girls are like, we're your biggest fans, and I'm like chewing,
and I'm like thank you and sorry, Like my kids
are insane and foods everywhere and I'm slurring, you know,
Like I think that's that's my moments where I'm like, okay,
(20:45):
I don't like that part. Do you ever get sick
about talking about the brand? About talking about your story? Like,
do you ever get tired of it? Here's what I
get tired of. And I've had to for the book specifically,
I knew that there was going to be a lot
to media impressed and I was going to have to
tell the same stories over and over. But it drives
me crazy when I meet someone and they're like, how
(21:07):
did you get started? I'm like google it. It's like
there asked me something else, like the questions you're asking
me today. Um, that's when I get annoyed. It is
like when someone asked a really like a really dumb
question that is has been printed and people know the
answer to. And now for a quick break, tell us
about when you met Gavin. I had a gentleman who
(21:30):
was the love of my life who broke my heart. Um.
I thought we were gonna get married. I thought I
was going to be his kids, step mom, all the things.
He lived in l A and Um. One day he
called me and he was like, yeah, I think I
want to date someone in real estate, so, um, we're
gonna end our relationship. And I was like, I'll get
interested in real estate. All buy a real estate. I
(21:51):
bought real estate for dummies. That's how definitely I was
to hold on to this person. And so every year,
every New Year's Eve, I don't know if he was
drunk or whatever, he would call me like I want
to let you know I love you. And I tried
several times to get back together with him. And it
was New Year's Eve two thousand five, and he called
me and I was like, I'm on the next plane.
I'm out. You told me love me, We're making this happen,
(22:12):
and he didn't say no, and I basically went out there,
and on my way from the airport to his house,
He's like, you can't come over here. I got a
girl here. And I was like, like I should have
known right this this this guy had a habit of
doing that. And so I went home to my parents
house they lived in l A at the time, and
was sulking and a friend of mine was like, you
should come out with me tonight and when I go
(22:34):
to this house party and maybe we'll meet some people.
So she took me there and um introduced me to
a lot of guys and I was like, not in
the head space for that. And then I went outside
with her and I had this list and I was like,
this is what I want in a man, and I
was like very specific, like down to like green eyes
and or funny or all these sort of qualities I wanted.
And I walked back inside and there was Gavin and
(22:57):
I recognized him because stick some months prior, a friend
of ours had tried to set us up and I
went to his MySpace profile just to really date me,
and I saw his profile and I was like, this
guy's immature. He put like a sharpie mustache on his picture,
Like I'm not into that. And then I also had
remembered meeting him very quickly in passing. I was on
(23:18):
the phone with with my then boyfriend at the time,
getting um, not the one I was trying to reunite with,
but a different one, getting screamed at for not calling
him enough, and like I remember like my friend being
like Gavin, that's Gavin, and we both like waived. And
then he was at this party and so I was
like instantly shy. I was instantly like, oh my god,
I can't talk to him. And she literally found an
opportunity and pushed me into him, and all I can
(23:41):
think about was to say. It was like, hey, I'm
helping this charity put together a fundraiser and they need
a band. He was a musician, and he was like yeah,
let me know, and we exchanged I think I gave
him my email and I knew I could find him
on my days. So I went very swiftly to his manager,
who I knew as a friend, and I was like
tell me everything about Gavin, and he's like, oh, you
(24:03):
guys would be perfect together. You need to meet. I'm
going to tell him to have coffee with you. And
Gavin was bulking and I didn't know why, but he
was seeing someone, and so finally he relented and we
had coffee and he's like, I just want to let
you know I'm seeing someone. And by that time, I'd
already saved his number in my phone. I was like,
this is who I'm marrying. He's everything that I wrote
down and I we were smoking at the time, and
(24:27):
I like took a long drag of the cigarette and
I was like, let me know what happens with that,
but inside I was like dying. And we ended the night,
and about ten days later he called me and he's like,
that thing is no longer a thing. Let's start talking,
and then his phone basically broke. This is early cell
phones here, so we could only text. So for like
two weeks we were just texting, and it allowed us
(24:50):
to really ask questions that you might not ask on
the phone, like what do you love to do? And
it was a lot of yes, no questions. And then
I flew out to l A to see if it
was the thing and we've been together ever since. So
how does Gavin not walk around the earth feeling like
Mr Rebecca Minkoff or does he And he doesn't mind.
You know, he is a very special individual and that
(25:14):
his masculinity or his identity isn't hurt or diminished by
my being known. And you know, I wasn't anything when
we met. I literally was me in an intern and
my fifth floor walk up. So it's you know, I
was actually trying to shack up with him, partially because
(25:35):
I was like, this guy is a really successful actor,
Like he could buy me gifts and he could maybe
you know, pay for some dinners like so if anything,
I was like, oh, he's going to be the one
to to cover this little hobby that I have of handbags,
And so I think because he saw it grow organically
and from the beginning, he's really proud and he laughs,
(25:55):
you know when we'll go to a dinner and I'll
say Mr Minkoff and he'll laugh, Um, But he's just
you know, he has his own pursuits and passions and
my success doesn't diminish his. And he's incredibly successful, but
like it's not a competition you know, it's more like, babe,
how can I help you this week? Which I know
is rare, and I feel really happy that I chose
(26:16):
the right person. How do you divide all the parentsing
and all the stuff of life? We are really equal.
We sit down and we're like, what's your day? What's
my day? And we each take a load. Um, I'm
out of town for two days. He's leaving the minute
I come back for two days. And so I think
(26:37):
it's this, We're constantly passing the baton, and you know,
I feel that guilt and maybe that's us as women
way more. And I'm like, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, And
then you know, he's like, stop saying sorry, Please don't
say that anymore. It's okay, and he knows. And I
think we both know there's ebbs and flows when one
(26:58):
is busier than the other, and we just you know,
he calls it dad miles and he's like, just put
those dad miles in my account and he cashes them
in to go do late night poker or whatever, and
I'm just like, or he's going to do a white
water rafting trip with his guy friends, and I'm you know,
and then I and then I'm as giving as possible
when those moments happened for him. Did your relationship change
(27:18):
when he became parents? It? Did? You know? We were
having the conversation the other day because we have a
set of friends and their relationship is the priority, and
their children fall to the back burner and they leave
their childs more or children more than we leave ours,
and they take trips and it is like they are
each other's rocks in a way that I was like
something missing from our relationship because our priorities our kids
(27:42):
and never each other in terms of the date, nights
and the times away and every once every six months
we get to go do that. I was like, should
we be more like them? And he's like, I don't know.
I kind of like that we are putting our children first,
and yes we should get away more than once every
six months. That's sad, but like we don't need to
leave them two or three nights a week. So I
(28:04):
was just honest, like, are we are? We are we
putting our relationship on the back burner and he was like,
you know what, our kids are young. I think our
relationship can be on the back burner and we can
be like roommates for a little bit, and when they
get older, we can do all those things and they
don't want to hang out with us anyways. When they're older,
talk to us about networking and women and how more
women can be better at it. I think that networking
(28:26):
get um sometimes a bad connotation, and then you'll end
up somewhere and because you're afraid to network, you don't
need anyone. I remember early on for me, like I
counted business cards that I got like it was cash
when I would get home, and I like, met this person,
and this person there's an opportunity, and I think it's
how you approach that person. Right, We've all met the
person that stevie and is using you and just want
(28:48):
something from you, and then they use you and move on.
And then there's the people that truly need your help
and ask for a very specific thing and then send
you a thank you note and casually keep in touch
or see if there's anything they can do for you.
And I think that that's the only way we get ahead,
that's the only way we help each other. I mean,
if we just take a look at what both of
you do, I think we've all gone somewhere because someone
(29:11):
woman or man has helped us, and it's because you
met them and you made that outreach. And so now
I don't hesitate when I'm asking for favors, and then
I know that if someone needs a favor from me,
I'm happy to do it if I can. So I
think viewing this as a two way street, you never
you might never be able to repay the person that
helps you or that you network with, but you can
(29:32):
give it to somebody else. I think makes it feel
a lot less like a I used tampon to put
it bluntly. All right, Well, with that, we're going to
go to our speed round where we're gonna ask you
quick questions. You can give us quick answers, and then
Lue Burns Um will come in with a male perspective
and ask the final question, what book are you reading?
(29:54):
Amanda cludes is book is came out on the same day,
and she's a friend of mine, and I'll assue we
are aware of what happened and what she's been through.
So I'm at the tail end of reading her book
because for our Brook launch I had her be interviewed,
and um, I wanted to make sure that I had
finished with that book before the event happened. Who leaves
(30:15):
you starstruck? Oh, Oprah? I would love to be starstruck
by Oprah. I love that woman. What is your nighttime routine? Lately?
I once the kids in the keeping of my husband
and I share duties. I put the younger kids to bed,
which takes about an hour because I guess I'm weak
and I never sleep during them, and he makes lunches
(30:36):
in the morning as like the trade off. So ten
thirty is probably by the time they're actually asleep. I'll
do some Netflix and binge. I did a lot, yes,
so one am is probably when I go to bed
after I've watched a couple of episodes um of whatever
I'm going through. I take a ton of vitamins. It's
(30:57):
definitely a large handful of vitamins. I feel like it
can tributes to my my mental state but also my
helping my body with how fast I'm going. I drink
this drink called Calm. It's like a magnesium drink that's
supposed to be stress you and help you sleep. And
then I go put on like a slathering of face
scream by Joanna Argus or Sunday Riley, and then I
go to bed and pro tip, these babies make me
(31:19):
look more awake, and I glue them on and then
I call it sleeping like Beyonce because apparently she sleeps
sometimes with her own makeup on. So I leave the
lashes on and then the next day it really distracts
from like the swollen eyes that four year olds now get.
How would your friends describe you? So it is my
friend's truest desire and wish to have the world see
(31:41):
unfiltered Becky as they call it. And it's my close
circle where I can just say the things that are
on my mind. There's no there's no filter, and I
can laugh at myself and I and I love. I
love when I'm just reduced to tears by something that
someone notices that's ridiculous about me. What was the last
item that you splurged on? So when I signed my
(32:05):
book deal, I then went to a show room where
they were having like a drinks income see the last line,
it's this l a based jewelry and that was a
lot of money, and I was like, I shouldn't be
doing this right now. And then I had two glasses
of wine and I was like, fuck it. I just
signed the goddamn book deal. I am buying myself this
five thousand dollar bracelet. Okay, that's what I'm gonna do.
(32:28):
And then I bought the bracelet, and then I had
another glass of wine real quick. And then every time
I look at him, like, you're my book deal bracelet,
like yeah. Rebecca who was the designer. Her her name
is Shelly, and the brand is called the Last Line,
and she has incredible fine jewelry that if you're looking
for something that's a little bit different than like your
grandma's jewelry but still classic. Um, she fits that bill,
(32:50):
all right, Lou, I was thinking about when people create
a brand, you also created demographic that you target. And
me be in a black man, but my girlfriend's Korean.
I'm like everybody markets to somebody, you know, So do
you have a I guess, a product designed for black people.
(33:10):
So this is what I'll say. And some of it
is learned learned from hearing women speak, and some of
it has learned from data that we get. You know,
every single person that I've met, and I met a
lot of my customers because I used to go all
across the country to meet them. Starts with a I
got your bag, when I got a raise, got my
(33:31):
first job, quit my job, got a promotion, met a guy,
got a divorce. Like these these milestone moments for women.
I don't know in the man's world, like maybe getting
a watch is sort of the equivalent. But woman, a
woman gets a bag, it has a significance of like, yes,
I've arrived or I achieved something. And that bag usually
(33:52):
lasts longer than a pair of heels or a shirt
that goes out of style, so it's definitely there for
a longer period of time. And then I think we
broke down in our customer from what does she look
for aesthetically from us? What's our brand promise? So we're
a little bit of rock, we're a little bit of bojo,
We're never too much one or the other. And so
she can expect that aesthetic from us. And then her mindset,
(34:14):
her mindset is she wants to be more fearless, she's optimistic,
she wants to feel more powerful. And then something that
it was really important to me is, you know, my
logo has always been very small, very discreet. I never
I hate it when a woman is wearing something because
the plaque is five thousand dollars. I want the woman
(34:34):
to be noticed, and so I like the whole package.
I don't want you to walk into a room, you know,
with the women have a way of going like this
with their bag of like look how much money I
spent today. I want everyone to be like, Wow, that
woman is so stylish. How can I get her look?
So that's my approach with design. And it's not for
a black woman or a Korean woman or a white woman.
(34:55):
It's for every woman. And I'm happy that we have
a diverse customer base. But I think I think when
it comes to a type of person, you know, we're
making sure it's hands free because women are busy, or
it has a lot of pockets because now we need
pockets for everything, and so I think we think of
that type of person more than a color of their
skin or what size they are. That was so much fun.
(35:19):
I mean, I definitely I had read her book cover
to cover, so a lot of those stories in her
book she shared with us. However, there are a lot
of news stories too, and she's definitely super quick and
really fun. Yeah, she's really great. The thing I love
about Rebecca she's just so direct, Like I don't think
that you get that enough in the world. And Rebecca
(35:41):
is like, let's be honest here, let's talk about this right,
like when she's talking about her brother, like, let's be honest,
Like there's conflict. It's really hard, of course it is,
but I feel like a lot of times we always
try to sugarcoat things, but like we should talk about
how hard it is, because this stuff is almost impossibly hard. Yeah. No,
that was my first time meeting her. I know, you
know her fairly well, how do you know her? How
(36:02):
do I know Rebecca? So it's really interesting. We talked
about women supporting women in networking, which we touched on today.
And I was introduced to Rebecca through somebody I met
in Los Angeles, and then through a PR firm I
was working with, and Rebecca and I got to know
each other. And then eventually Rebecca's Female Founder Collective, which
is another group that she she works on, came to
(36:24):
the Riveter to do a big event, and you know what,
like that was really boosting for us because it was
a revenue be publicity and see brought in a ton
of female founders who were the Riveters clients, and so
you know, like those things come full circle and it's amazing.
And then Rebecca got a beautiful space to do the event,
and and she got to support another female founder and
so those things like they really really really do matter,
(36:45):
those little connections. Yeah, I just joined Female Founder Collective,
but I haven't been active with them. Yeah, because I
joined it in the pandemic. We'll see. Yeah, I think
it's I think it's great. Listen, I think you know,
we don't talk about this a lot on the show,
but women only received two percent adventure capital funding, which
Sam in an amazing feat closed a venture capital round
(37:05):
during the pandemic. But and also we have to know
whenever we talk about the two percent of VC funding
that goes to women, that's white women. You know, for example,
black women last year raised like point zero zero zero
one of VC funding, which is zero. But anyway, point
is women don't get funded, so their ideas don't get
to go into the world at the same velocity men's
ideas get to go into the world. And so Rebecca's
(37:26):
Female Founder Collective is one of the many amazing initiatives
out there that works on that. It's a huge problem. Yeah,
we could talk about LAP for days. We should have
another show just about that. Aim. I know we should,
We definitely should, but this was a great conversation. It
was really fun. Thanks for listening to What's Her Story
with Sam and Amy. We would so appreciate if you
(37:47):
would leave a view wherever you get your podcasts, and
of course connect with us on social media at What's
Her Story podcast. What's Her Story with Sam and Amy
is powered by my company, The Riveter at The Riveter
dot c O and Sam's company, park Place Payments at
park place Payments dot com. Thanks to our producer Stacy Para,
our social media manager Phoebe crane Fest, and our male
(38:09):
perspective Blue Burns h
Hi, I'm Sam Edis and I'm Amy Nelson. Welcome to
What's Her Story? With Sam and Amy. This is a
show about the world's most remarkable women, their professional and
personal journeys. Together, we'll hear from gold medalists, best selling authors,
and leaders of the world's most iconic brands. Today, we're
(00:23):
so excited to welcome fashion designer Rebecca Minkoff to the show.
She's also the author of the new book Fearless. So
a T Shirt started at All tell Us about It.
So I was twenty years old. I had gone and
been a guest at this artist convention in the Mohammas.
(00:43):
I actually couldn't afford to even get on the trip,
but I was told, if you get five other people
to get on the boat to UH, you can go
for free. So that's how I've paid my way. And
I loved all the Aruba curassow bonn air sort of
cut up but you know, beaded shirts. But I was like,
I don't want to wear a tourist T shirt. I
want New York. So I came home boughten ilee of
(01:04):
New York shirt, cut it up. D I wid it
that was a thing. Then I'm sure you both can
remember that, and bedazzling jen Y doesn't bring that shipped back.
But I wore it. My sister in law wanted one,
and so she wore it and had dinner with Jenna Elfman,
who was a very well known celebrity at the time,
and I sent it to Jenna on September nine, two
(01:26):
thousand and one. She worked on Jay Leno a couple
of weeks later, and he asked her about it, and
obviously nine eleven had happened, so anything that said New
York on it was far more meaningful. And she said
my name on national television, and back then that actually
did something for a brand. And I got, you know,
inbound emails, however, people could reach humans, you know, when
(01:48):
email was still a thing or not not a thing um,
and was making that shirt. And that's all I did
for nine months. I'd bike two different areas in the city,
negotiate with the with the men who will sold these
I Love New York shirts, and then come home and
cut them up and dazzle them or you name it.
And that was It wasn't an overnight success, but it
allowed me to call stores and say, hey, I have
(02:12):
something else besides this will you let me show you
my my goods? Do you remember the first time you
you had this work ethic? And and when it began,
I do. My mom in the eighties, to make part
of her living, sold what's called cast cover, so eighties
neon nylon sheathing to cover your cast to make you
(02:33):
look cool, and she would sell it at the flea market.
And I just remember going, I want to sell something
at the flea market. This is the coolest thing ever.
And so, you know, she paid for enough materials for
you to make some jewelry and some really terrible puffy
paint sweatshirts and some you know, bad spin art. And
I set up a little card table and I didn't
sell a thing, but that whole week preparing for that
(02:56):
flea market was like such an exciting week that I
got to stuff and I was going to sell it
and people were going to see it. And so I
think it started then, um, and then throughout my life,
the answer was always no, you're gonna have to earn it.
You're you know, you're gonna have to make it and
figure it out. So when I when I finally realized
that that sentiment was not changing, I you know, started
babysitting as early as I could to buy my sewing machine,
(03:18):
and you know, just started figuring out how do I
make money because it's not coming from my parents. So
you get really excited, You prepare all weeks to sell
at this little table, and you don't sell anything. How
did you not feel defeated? I felt totally defeated. I
felt like such a loser. I still I have that
same feeling now if I come out with a really
(03:38):
exciting collection or a piece and it's like no one cared,
Like I just worked so hard for this. So I
think that was the first taste of, oh, not everything
I do is going to be wanted. How do you
overcome that? Like? How do you get past that? Even today?
I think having that happen a lot helps you have
perspective and you sort of know that's part of this.
(04:00):
I think that I'll always set high goals for myself,
but I don't go into a shame whole if I
don't make those goals. So I think it's perspective and
knowing that you're not going to get everything you want,
and then when you do get what you want or
you you achieve something, it feels that much sweeter for it.
(04:22):
Your mom strikes me from reading the book as someone
who was a little bit you know, of tough love
that she instilled in you, which really helped. Does that
reflect how you've been parenting your own kids. So here's
what I'm experiencing with my own kids. I am being
as tough and I'm saying, if you want something, you
have to earn it, and my kids are just like,
(04:44):
never mind, I don't want it that badly. And I'll
watch my daughter and be like, I want, I want,
I want, I want, Like anytime she's a toy, I
can I have that for my birthday? Can I have that?
And I'm like, no, you have to earn it, and
then she's like onto the next. And so I'm at
this weird struggle where trying to replicate what really worked
for me and my kids just don't care. They're like,
(05:06):
who needs it? That's really hard. I think it's a
generational thing as well. It might be. I was trying
to explain to my son the other day. I was like,
so summer camp it cost us this. That means that's
why mommy works, and and he finally started to get it.
I was like, so when I asked you to take
your dishes to the sink. That's helping me. But it
took me like talking to him like he was too
(05:27):
for him, he's nine for him to be like, Okay,
I should help out my parents more. Take us back
to when you were first in New York and you
were struggling, where were you living, What was that like
and what finally made the leap to Rebecca Minkoff the brand.
So when I first moved to New York, I I
think I had I thought that my parents would help
(05:48):
me out with an apartment and I just assumed they
rent me one, and they were like, oh, hell no,
we're not doing that. Um. And so I actually had
a really good friend that was at Fordham University that
he had lived with us off and on in high
school because of his family situation was not he did
not come from a good home, and so he said
come stay with me. So I stayed with him in
(06:08):
his disgusting dorm room like three men, just bad college men.
And that lasted for about three weeks and then my
parents said, Okay, we're gonna come check on you, make
sure you're okay. And we had dinner with my dad's
first cousin, and they made some deal with her. They're like,
all right, if you watch her daughter two nights a week,
she'll let you stay her for free in the playroom,
(06:28):
but you have to clean up every night and that's
your option. And I was like cool. So I did
that for about nine months, and by that time I
had saved up I guess enough money that I met
this old lady through this art center that I was frequenting,
and she said, I have a room you can rent.
My mom sleeps in the living room, I sleep in
the bedroom, and I have one extra room and it's
(06:50):
fifty bucks a night. And that felt like so much money,
not per night, per month, but I was like, I
gotta get out of this playroom. I gotta be able
to unpack my clothing. Little did I know that the lady,
who was like seventy and her mom was ninety two,
she would like check to make sure I made my
bed at night, you know, the next day, and boys
couldn't come over. So it wasn't like I just had
(07:10):
a room. I had like a grandma. So once the
shirt took hold and I had moved to an apartment again,
I rented a small closet from a woman and I
had a mattress on egg crates. That was when the
shirt was at a tay Day and I thought I
had made it. I had a five piece clothing collection
and I sort of did the clothing designer thing for
about four years. Could not make ends meet, was slowly
(07:32):
going into credit card debt. I was not able to
qualify personally for a credit card, but my dad co
signed and he's like, I'm not going to pay for this,
you are, but I'll put my name on it. And
I was hitting close to like sixty dollars in debt
and I was like, how the heck am I going
to do this? And the clothing wasn't it was doing well.
(07:53):
It was a small, you know, business to be proud of,
but I couldn't live on it. I was styling on
the side that's I was paying the bill. And then um, Jenna,
the same woman who wore the shirt, we were having
lunch in l A and she said do you make bags?
And I just lied to her and I said, yeah,
I do. And I had been thinking about bags, but
I hadn't really decided to dive in. And that's when
(08:13):
I rushed back to New York. I had a two
week deadline to make her a bag, and I made
two samples. I overnighted it and FedEx missed delivered it
by about two hours. So her assistant called me. It
was like we started shooting, where the hell is this bag?
And no, it's not going to make the movie. And
I was devastated. Um, that was like my last six bucks.
(08:34):
The over the cash advance from the credit card machine
was no longer working, and my dad was like, how
you paying this back? So I started carrying the sample
around and enough women stopped me on the street that
I was like, maybe there's something here. Maybe I should
try to sell it. And I showed it to a
friend of mine who was a buyer in l A
at the time with his door seteen, and she said,
it's incredible. I want to buy it. I'm gonna buy twelve,
(08:56):
and I'm gonna have my friend at Daily Candy right
about it. And if you're an elder millenna yearal or
a geriatric millennial, you know what Daily Candy is. So
she wrote the article. It was called the Catwalk of
Shame and I called it the Morning After Bag, and
the rest is definitely not history. But that was the
birth of that bag and now the brand as we
know it today. I love that story because you missed
(09:17):
the deadline, but it turned out to still be an
open door. It wasn't the end of the story. It
was the beginning of the story. It was And I
think I felt doubly pressured, not only because I really
didn't have any more money, but also like I gotta
turn this into something. It can't just be that this
is the end. And I'm like, all right, I'll go
home now and now for a quick break, tell us
(09:40):
the story of the three bag order from the department store.
And I don't think most people understand the economics of
department stores and the fashion world. Yes, so, most department stores,
when they buy you in the beginning, is a relationship
of like, we're going to buy you. See how it goes.
Once you're sort of more well established, then you start
(10:04):
helping pay for things. So if you see an ad
in a in a magazine or a catalog that you
get from a department store, the designer actually paid for that.
Or if they don't meet the sales expectation of you
have to sell x amount of week and they put
the bags on sale, the designer pays for that. Um
My showroom had warned me, do not sell to a
department store. You are not ready to sell to a
(10:24):
department store. And I said, I'm going to sell to
a department store. Yes, I'm taking the order. And she
had her reasons. She felt like you needed enough. She said,
you needed five specialty stores to even have a brand
awareness enough that a woman walks into a department store
and it's Gucci product, Tory Birds, Mark Jacobs, whoever, that
she's gonna go over the little stand with like a
(10:46):
placard and be like, oh, this is who I was
looking for. So she felt like you needed more awareness
before a woman would know to look for you. And um,
all those bags. I got a call the buyer said, so,
we haven't sold any we'd like to return them all
and we'll work with you in the future if you
take them back. So that was sort of and it
(11:07):
was three three hundred bags, and it was we'll keep
them and never work with you again, or you take
them back and maybe we'll consider coming back and buying
more from you when your brand is more well known.
So I think, I, you know, I didn't really have
a choice if you wanted to grow then because Director
Consumer wasn't even a blip on anyone's radar. Um So
(11:29):
I took them back and I was like, how the
hell am I going to get rid of these bags?
And then I called my friend at Daily Candy. I
was like, you need to write about my sample sale
because it's going to be in my apartment, So let's
do this. And didn't get rid of all three D
D of all of them except for like ten sad
like destroyed samples, but yes, they were they were gone.
(11:50):
There was I lived on three eighteen Street and I
rented an apartment in the same apartment building, so I
lived in one apart and then downstairs was my office.
But it was an apartment. And so when I when
I woke up that morning to like go open the doors,
there was a line around the block and all these
women like they didn't care that they were going into
(12:12):
some tenement apartment. They were like, let's do this. So
you worked with your brother, I would love to hear
your story of how you and your brother evolved from
him funding part of your business to becoming your full
on partner. Yeah. So I think in the beginning went
once the credit card was cut off and I needed
(12:32):
funds and I actually had legitimate business, you know, with
the satine order, and then they sold out after Daily
Candy ran and so I had called my dad first
and he said, I'm done. I'm scared, you're never going
to pay me back. Call your brother. And so my
brother had a technology company and was doing quite well,
and he started loaning me small sums of money and
I would pay them back every time I got paid.
(12:54):
But he could see, as any businessman I guess does
or businesswoman, this sort of hockey stick like growth, and
at each time I came to him with real orders,
you know, it was doubling and tripling. And so he
decided to get serious and sort of on the funding side,
we couldn't get funding vcs and PE wasn't something that
(13:15):
was done then. It wasn't what it is now. There
was no such thing as crowdfunding. So banks were like, hell, no,
we're not going to loan to you, you twenty five
year old girls sitting in my office. And so he
really stretched. He stretched a credit line he had, he
mortgaged his house, he maxed out his m X to
buy leather um and then you know, he really worked
(13:36):
to turn the business side into a real business, and
so he became CEO and I had to deal with him.
I said, when we hit ten million, you're moving here
because this cannot be a long distance relationship. So he
moved his whole family and and you know, started working
full time back in two thousand and eleven. And how
do you resolve any differences between you when they come up?
(13:59):
So let's all be honest. Any people two or more
that worked together full time, related, married or not, you're
going to encounter tough times, especially as business owners. And
I think a brother or sister or sibling relationship has
the added dynamic of you grown up with each other,
(14:19):
you know how to push each other's buttons. And so
for the first few years it was all smooth, and
then the explosions began and we had reached a point
where we hadn't been speaking and it's really hard to
run a business that way. Like we would speak in
front of others and no one knew that our problems were,
but behind closed doors, we just refused to talk. And
(14:39):
so that's when we called in like a professional couples
counselor slash business mediator to really help us, and so
he helped us not only you know, frame rules around
how we treat each other, but also really get down
to what each other needs and wants um because I
think that's critical to understand what your partner married again
business or not. What do I truly needn't want from you?
(15:01):
And what do you need and want from them? And
can you produce it? And that evolves that changes, right,
So it's that constant sort of check in and making
sure that everyone's still on the same page. So that's
been incredibly helpful in keeping us from World War three.
Do you still see the counselor we do? We just
saw him like two months ago. So when did you
(15:22):
feel like Rebecca Mincuff became a known brand? You know,
it had these like big pops obviously when when Daily
Candy happened, or when we opened our first store, you know,
when we finally did account and we were like, oh
my gosh, we're nine points of sale. But I still
think and I don't know, but like when you're hustling
(15:45):
all the time and investing every dime ind your company, Like,
I still don't feel like we've made it as a brand.
And my brother has to remind me. Sometimes he has
to be like, you can't say that, you can't act
like that. We're a big brand. We're not like, you know,
we're not like the girl in the back yard rubbing
sticks together to like have a little cart and sell
(16:05):
it at the side of the road. And I think
that when you're this close to your business and you've
been invested in it this long, it's hard to like
pull yourself back and be like, oh, we're big. As
an entrepreneur, I think you always have that goal post
that's ahead of you, and I know I feel like
that where, you know, we just finished a raise and
everyone's congratulating me, and all I can think of is
(16:27):
the pressure I feel right now to make it worthwhile
and put it to use and hit our next goal post.
And I think that when you're in it, it's hard
to feel that sense of accomplishment or feel like you've
ever made it. And that's what keeps you going, right,
is that that hustle never ends. The hustle never ends.
And I think I had to come to grips with
like the disappointment that I kept facing of. I thought
(16:49):
I thought I'd feel fine if I just got here.
I thought i'd oh, wait, I got here. Wait. That
still doesn't feel good. And so it's like that disappointment
of like, all I'm doing is setting these goals and
meeting them and the completion of that goal is not
bringing me joy. And so I really have to get
good at really loving the process. Like when I said, Okay,
I have to pre sell ten thousand books, let me
(17:11):
enjoy this process because it's gonna feel great when I
hit that goal and not hitting the goal. Your brand
is you write like you design beautiful products, but it's
your name. What does it like to have the brand
with your name on it? So I think I've gone
through different evolutions with my relationship with the brand. Obviously,
when I started, it was the same age in sex
(17:33):
as my customer, going through lots of different life stages. Um,
we reached a point when I was about thirty one,
when I had my first kid, where some people within
the company were like, you know what, we're going to
freeze our customer and we're just going to talk to her.
And so when you show your kids on Instagram or
(17:54):
that grown up life at thirty one, that doesn't resonate
with her. And I didn't agree, but I was like, well,
these people are trained and they know what they're doing,
and they're they know more about social media and marketing
than me. What do I know? I didn't go to
college and I listened to them. And so for for
a couple of years, it was like this disconnect of
my customer is someone I don't recognize anymore and I'm
(18:16):
not sharing what I'm going through and that didn't feel
good and it actually hurt us as a brand. But
I had to almost disconnect myself from the brand and
from me. And then there was a short period of
time where we had a woman as president who was
going to sell anything to anyone, and so she'd come
to me with this outlandish request like nerd alert on
(18:37):
a computer tote, and I'd be like, that's disgusting, and
she's like, do you want to be the one who
doesn't make the year because we didn't hit our numbers
or not. And I'm like, well, I don't want that
pressure on me. Throw nerd alert on a toe. So
then i'd like see women walking around a cringe to
be like, oh, that's my brands. Oh god. So you know,
I finally I think reached a point of maturity and
(18:58):
strength several years ago, and I was like, that's it.
It's me, It's it's my women. They've grown up with me.
It's my life stages. It can also be young, right,
but it can also go old, and it's going to
be human. And so I think we've done a lot
of work to change it and bring it back to that.
And my customer was like, oh, yeah, I love you.
(19:18):
You left me for a little bit because you were
talking about only going out to clubs and eating chicken
nuggets and champagne in the morning. But you're back and
I'm glad, and so it's been nice that the two
can live closer together again. Do you ever feel pressure,
as Rebecca main coff, that you're also representing this established brand. Yeah,
I think I choose to complain with the right audience.
(19:41):
I don't think it does me any good or my
customer any good to vomit on them about my day. Yes,
I'll appear more real, but does that actually help her?
Does that make her go oh, I want to invest
in this brand, but I'll definitely vomit on Amy, you know,
and share with her my struggles and whatever. If I
get to see her or other other co founders or
(20:03):
our founders, right, So I picked my audience for who
I'm going to like let my hair down with because
they can provide me with a solution and they can
listen with an intelligent response. I think the thing that
I sometimes forget is the messiness of life, you know,
Like I'm at an airport. All three kids are misbehaving.
I might have had a beer that was too too
(20:24):
much too soon, and I'm not doing my best to
be present, and food is spilling everywhere, and then these
girls are like, we're your biggest fans, and I'm like chewing,
and I'm like thank you and sorry, Like my kids
are insane and foods everywhere and I'm slurring, you know,
Like I think that's that's my moments where I'm like, okay,
(20:45):
I don't like that part. Do you ever get sick
about talking about the brand? About talking about your story? Like,
do you ever get tired of it? Here's what I
get tired of. And I've had to for the book specifically,
I knew that there was going to be a lot
to media impressed and I was going to have to
tell the same stories over and over. But it drives
me crazy when I meet someone and they're like, how
(21:07):
did you get started? I'm like google it. It's like
there asked me something else, like the questions you're asking
me today. Um, that's when I get annoyed. It is
like when someone asked a really like a really dumb
question that is has been printed and people know the
answer to. And now for a quick break, tell us
about when you met Gavin. I had a gentleman who
(21:30):
was the love of my life who broke my heart. Um.
I thought we were gonna get married. I thought I
was going to be his kids, step mom, all the things.
He lived in l A and Um. One day he
called me and he was like, yeah, I think I
want to date someone in real estate, so, um, we're
gonna end our relationship. And I was like, I'll get
interested in real estate. All buy a real estate. I
(21:51):
bought real estate for dummies. That's how definitely I was
to hold on to this person. And so every year,
every New Year's Eve, I don't know if he was
drunk or whatever, he would call me like I want
to let you know I love you. And I tried
several times to get back together with him. And it
was New Year's Eve two thousand five, and he called
me and I was like, I'm on the next plane.
I'm out. You told me love me, We're making this happen,
(22:12):
and he didn't say no, and I basically went out there,
and on my way from the airport to his house,
He's like, you can't come over here. I got a
girl here. And I was like, like I should have
known right this this this guy had a habit of
doing that. And so I went home to my parents
house they lived in l A at the time, and
was sulking and a friend of mine was like, you
should come out with me tonight and when I go
(22:34):
to this house party and maybe we'll meet some people.
So she took me there and um introduced me to
a lot of guys and I was like, not in
the head space for that. And then I went outside
with her and I had this list and I was like,
this is what I want in a man, and I
was like very specific, like down to like green eyes
and or funny or all these sort of qualities I wanted.
And I walked back inside and there was Gavin and
(22:57):
I recognized him because stick some months prior, a friend
of ours had tried to set us up and I
went to his MySpace profile just to really date me,
and I saw his profile and I was like, this
guy's immature. He put like a sharpie mustache on his picture,
Like I'm not into that. And then I also had
remembered meeting him very quickly in passing. I was on
(23:18):
the phone with with my then boyfriend at the time,
getting um, not the one I was trying to reunite with,
but a different one, getting screamed at for not calling
him enough, and like I remember like my friend being
like Gavin, that's Gavin, and we both like waived. And
then he was at this party and so I was
like instantly shy. I was instantly like, oh my god,
I can't talk to him. And she literally found an
opportunity and pushed me into him, and all I can
(23:41):
think about was to say. It was like, hey, I'm
helping this charity put together a fundraiser and they need
a band. He was a musician, and he was like yeah,
let me know, and we exchanged I think I gave
him my email and I knew I could find him
on my days. So I went very swiftly to his manager,
who I knew as a friend, and I was like
tell me everything about Gavin, and he's like, oh, you
(24:03):
guys would be perfect together. You need to meet. I'm
going to tell him to have coffee with you. And
Gavin was bulking and I didn't know why, but he
was seeing someone, and so finally he relented and we
had coffee and he's like, I just want to let
you know I'm seeing someone. And by that time, I'd
already saved his number in my phone. I was like,
this is who I'm marrying. He's everything that I wrote
down and I we were smoking at the time, and
(24:27):
I like took a long drag of the cigarette and
I was like, let me know what happens with that,
but inside I was like dying. And we ended the night,
and about ten days later he called me and he's like,
that thing is no longer a thing. Let's start talking,
and then his phone basically broke. This is early cell
phones here, so we could only text. So for like
two weeks we were just texting, and it allowed us
(24:50):
to really ask questions that you might not ask on
the phone, like what do you love to do? And
it was a lot of yes, no questions. And then
I flew out to l A to see if it
was the thing and we've been together ever since. So
how does Gavin not walk around the earth feeling like
Mr Rebecca Minkoff or does he And he doesn't mind.
You know, he is a very special individual and that
(25:14):
his masculinity or his identity isn't hurt or diminished by
my being known. And you know, I wasn't anything when
we met. I literally was me in an intern and
my fifth floor walk up. So it's you know, I
was actually trying to shack up with him, partially because
(25:35):
I was like, this guy is a really successful actor,
Like he could buy me gifts and he could maybe
you know, pay for some dinners like so if anything,
I was like, oh, he's going to be the one
to to cover this little hobby that I have of handbags,
And so I think because he saw it grow organically
and from the beginning, he's really proud and he laughs,
(25:55):
you know when we'll go to a dinner and I'll
say Mr Minkoff and he'll laugh, Um, But he's just
you know, he has his own pursuits and passions and
my success doesn't diminish his. And he's incredibly successful, but
like it's not a competition you know, it's more like, babe,
how can I help you this week? Which I know
is rare, and I feel really happy that I chose
(26:16):
the right person. How do you divide all the parentsing
and all the stuff of life? We are really equal.
We sit down and we're like, what's your day? What's
my day? And we each take a load. Um, I'm
out of town for two days. He's leaving the minute
I come back for two days. And so I think
(26:37):
it's this, We're constantly passing the baton, and you know,
I feel that guilt and maybe that's us as women
way more. And I'm like, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, And
then you know, he's like, stop saying sorry, Please don't
say that anymore. It's okay, and he knows. And I
think we both know there's ebbs and flows when one
(26:58):
is busier than the other, and we just you know,
he calls it dad miles and he's like, just put
those dad miles in my account and he cashes them
in to go do late night poker or whatever, and
I'm just like, or he's going to do a white
water rafting trip with his guy friends, and I'm you know,
and then I and then I'm as giving as possible
when those moments happened for him. Did your relationship change
(27:18):
when he became parents? It? Did? You know? We were
having the conversation the other day because we have a
set of friends and their relationship is the priority, and
their children fall to the back burner and they leave
their childs more or children more than we leave ours,
and they take trips and it is like they are
each other's rocks in a way that I was like
something missing from our relationship because our priorities our kids
(27:42):
and never each other in terms of the date, nights
and the times away and every once every six months
we get to go do that. I was like, should
we be more like them? And he's like, I don't know.
I kind of like that we are putting our children first,
and yes we should get away more than once every
six months. That's sad, but like we don't need to
leave them two or three nights a week. So I
(28:04):
was just honest, like, are we are? We are we
putting our relationship on the back burner and he was like,
you know what, our kids are young. I think our
relationship can be on the back burner and we can
be like roommates for a little bit, and when they
get older, we can do all those things and they
don't want to hang out with us anyways. When they're older,
talk to us about networking and women and how more
women can be better at it. I think that networking
(28:26):
get um sometimes a bad connotation, and then you'll end
up somewhere and because you're afraid to network, you don't
need anyone. I remember early on for me, like I
counted business cards that I got like it was cash
when I would get home, and I like, met this person,
and this person there's an opportunity, and I think it's
how you approach that person. Right, We've all met the
person that stevie and is using you and just want
(28:48):
something from you, and then they use you and move on.
And then there's the people that truly need your help
and ask for a very specific thing and then send
you a thank you note and casually keep in touch
or see if there's anything they can do for you.
And I think that that's the only way we get ahead,
that's the only way we help each other. I mean,
if we just take a look at what both of
you do, I think we've all gone somewhere because someone
(29:11):
woman or man has helped us, and it's because you
met them and you made that outreach. And so now
I don't hesitate when I'm asking for favors, and then
I know that if someone needs a favor from me,
I'm happy to do it if I can. So I
think viewing this as a two way street, you never
you might never be able to repay the person that
helps you or that you network with, but you can
(29:32):
give it to somebody else. I think makes it feel
a lot less like a I used tampon to put
it bluntly. All right, Well, with that, we're going to
go to our speed round where we're gonna ask you
quick questions. You can give us quick answers, and then
Lue Burns Um will come in with a male perspective
and ask the final question, what book are you reading?
(29:54):
Amanda cludes is book is came out on the same day,
and she's a friend of mine, and I'll assue we
are aware of what happened and what she's been through.
So I'm at the tail end of reading her book
because for our Brook launch I had her be interviewed,
and um, I wanted to make sure that I had
finished with that book before the event happened. Who leaves
(30:15):
you starstruck? Oh, Oprah? I would love to be starstruck
by Oprah. I love that woman. What is your nighttime routine? Lately?
I once the kids in the keeping of my husband
and I share duties. I put the younger kids to bed,
which takes about an hour because I guess I'm weak
and I never sleep during them, and he makes lunches
(30:36):
in the morning as like the trade off. So ten
thirty is probably by the time they're actually asleep. I'll
do some Netflix and binge. I did a lot, yes,
so one am is probably when I go to bed
after I've watched a couple of episodes um of whatever
I'm going through. I take a ton of vitamins. It's
(30:57):
definitely a large handful of vitamins. I feel like it
can tributes to my my mental state but also my
helping my body with how fast I'm going. I drink
this drink called Calm. It's like a magnesium drink that's
supposed to be stress you and help you sleep. And
then I go put on like a slathering of face
scream by Joanna Argus or Sunday Riley, and then I
go to bed and pro tip, these babies make me
(31:19):
look more awake, and I glue them on and then
I call it sleeping like Beyonce because apparently she sleeps
sometimes with her own makeup on. So I leave the
lashes on and then the next day it really distracts
from like the swollen eyes that four year olds now get.
How would your friends describe you? So it is my
friend's truest desire and wish to have the world see
(31:41):
unfiltered Becky as they call it. And it's my close
circle where I can just say the things that are
on my mind. There's no there's no filter, and I
can laugh at myself and I and I love. I
love when I'm just reduced to tears by something that
someone notices that's ridiculous about me. What was the last
item that you splurged on? So when I signed my
(32:05):
book deal, I then went to a show room where
they were having like a drinks income see the last line,
it's this l a based jewelry and that was a
lot of money, and I was like, I shouldn't be
doing this right now. And then I had two glasses
of wine and I was like, fuck it. I just
signed the goddamn book deal. I am buying myself this
five thousand dollar bracelet. Okay, that's what I'm gonna do.
(32:28):
And then I bought the bracelet, and then I had
another glass of wine real quick. And then every time
I look at him, like, you're my book deal bracelet,
like yeah. Rebecca who was the designer. Her her name
is Shelly, and the brand is called the Last Line,
and she has incredible fine jewelry that if you're looking
for something that's a little bit different than like your
grandma's jewelry but still classic. Um, she fits that bill,
(32:50):
all right, Lou, I was thinking about when people create
a brand, you also created demographic that you target. And
me be in a black man, but my girlfriend's Korean.
I'm like everybody markets to somebody, you know, So do
you have a I guess, a product designed for black people.
(33:10):
So this is what I'll say. And some of it
is learned learned from hearing women speak, and some of
it has learned from data that we get. You know,
every single person that I've met, and I met a
lot of my customers because I used to go all
across the country to meet them. Starts with a I
got your bag, when I got a raise, got my
(33:31):
first job, quit my job, got a promotion, met a guy,
got a divorce. Like these these milestone moments for women.
I don't know in the man's world, like maybe getting
a watch is sort of the equivalent. But woman, a
woman gets a bag, it has a significance of like, yes,
I've arrived or I achieved something. And that bag usually
(33:52):
lasts longer than a pair of heels or a shirt
that goes out of style, so it's definitely there for
a longer period of time. And then I think we
broke down in our customer from what does she look
for aesthetically from us? What's our brand promise? So we're
a little bit of rock, we're a little bit of bojo,
We're never too much one or the other. And so
she can expect that aesthetic from us. And then her mindset,
(34:14):
her mindset is she wants to be more fearless, she's optimistic,
she wants to feel more powerful. And then something that
it was really important to me is, you know, my
logo has always been very small, very discreet. I never
I hate it when a woman is wearing something because
the plaque is five thousand dollars. I want the woman
(34:34):
to be noticed, and so I like the whole package.
I don't want you to walk into a room, you know,
with the women have a way of going like this
with their bag of like look how much money I
spent today. I want everyone to be like, Wow, that
woman is so stylish. How can I get her look?
So that's my approach with design. And it's not for
a black woman or a Korean woman or a white woman.
(34:55):
It's for every woman. And I'm happy that we have
a diverse customer base. But I think I think when
it comes to a type of person, you know, we're
making sure it's hands free because women are busy, or
it has a lot of pockets because now we need
pockets for everything, and so I think we think of
that type of person more than a color of their
skin or what size they are. That was so much fun.
(35:19):
I mean, I definitely I had read her book cover
to cover, so a lot of those stories in her
book she shared with us. However, there are a lot
of news stories too, and she's definitely super quick and
really fun. Yeah, she's really great. The thing I love
about Rebecca she's just so direct, Like I don't think
that you get that enough in the world. And Rebecca
(35:41):
is like, let's be honest here, let's talk about this right,
like when she's talking about her brother, like, let's be honest,
Like there's conflict. It's really hard, of course it is,
but I feel like a lot of times we always
try to sugarcoat things, but like we should talk about
how hard it is, because this stuff is almost impossibly hard. Yeah. No,
that was my first time meeting her. I know, you
know her fairly well, how do you know her? How
(36:02):
do I know Rebecca? So it's really interesting. We talked
about women supporting women in networking, which we touched on today.
And I was introduced to Rebecca through somebody I met
in Los Angeles, and then through a PR firm I
was working with, and Rebecca and I got to know
each other. And then eventually Rebecca's Female Founder Collective, which
is another group that she she works on, came to
(36:24):
the Riveter to do a big event, and you know what,
like that was really boosting for us because it was
a revenue be publicity and see brought in a ton
of female founders who were the Riveters clients, and so
you know, like those things come full circle and it's amazing.
And then Rebecca got a beautiful space to do the event,
and and she got to support another female founder and
so those things like they really really really do matter,
(36:45):
those little connections. Yeah, I just joined Female Founder Collective,
but I haven't been active with them. Yeah, because I
joined it in the pandemic. We'll see. Yeah, I think
it's I think it's great. Listen, I think you know,
we don't talk about this a lot on the show,
but women only received two percent adventure capital funding, which
Sam in an amazing feat closed a venture capital round
(37:05):
during the pandemic. But and also we have to know
whenever we talk about the two percent of VC funding
that goes to women, that's white women. You know, for example,
black women last year raised like point zero zero zero
one of VC funding, which is zero. But anyway, point
is women don't get funded, so their ideas don't get
to go into the world at the same velocity men's
ideas get to go into the world. And so Rebecca's
(37:26):
Female Founder Collective is one of the many amazing initiatives
out there that works on that. It's a huge problem. Yeah,
we could talk about LAP for days. We should have
another show just about that. Aim. I know we should,
We definitely should, but this was a great conversation. It
was really fun. Thanks for listening to What's Her Story
with Sam and Amy. We would so appreciate if you
(37:47):
would leave a view wherever you get your podcasts, and
of course connect with us on social media at What's
Her Story podcast. What's Her Story with Sam and Amy
is powered by my company, The Riveter at The Riveter
dot c O and Sam's company, park Place Payments at
park place Payments dot com. Thanks to our producer Stacy Para,
our social media manager Phoebe crane Fest, and our male
(38:09):
perspective Blue Burns h
Hosts And Creators
Samantha Ettus
Amy Nelson
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