December 12, 2022 • 31 mins
Anicia is an entrepreneur and works as a personal chef and nanny for the ultra-wealthy in New York City. Having met on a photoshoot, Anicia and I bonded over our shared experiences walking into these homes as educated women of color. She’s a first generation Nigerian American and discusses the complexities of power and personhood and some shocking stories from behind the scenes of this industry. In our conversation, the problems surrounding America’s fascination with celebrity and wealth collide with the desire for mobility and representation.
“You go into survival mode and you’re like: ‘Okay, how do I just get through the next hour?’ You start to think about: 'Am I gonna need this money for the next four to six weeks?’ I think the world needs to know that it is far from privilege to be able to work with the privileged.” –Anicia
Check out resources like the Domestic Workers Bill of Rights, NYC’s Statement of Employee Rights for Household Employees, and these support groups for restaurant workers who have experienced abuse.
Creator & Host: Maria Fernanda Diez
Executive Producers: Gisselle Bances, Anna Stumpf, Nikki Ettore
Producer: Pablo Cabrera, Arlene Santana, Dylan Heuer
Associate Producer: Claudia Marticorena
Original Theme Music: Tony Bruno
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
After a difficult yet enchanting four years, I finally got
to graduate from Columbia University. Looking out at that sea
of baby blue Columbia robes, I couldn't help but be
grateful that I've been able to achieve this moment and
have my parents, my brother, my Boila, and the crowd
(00:20):
looking on. And yet I felt this bitter sweetness that
the guys who kept me from dropping out weren't among
those faces. Because of how tightly packed this sea of
people ends up being and the general chaos of the day,
I didn't get to see them. The guys from the
package center were the people I never got to say
(00:41):
goodbye to that day. As I packed up my stuff
into the car and we rolled on down to Lower Manhattan,
I didn't realize what life would become. Well, I knew
I would have to get a day job and grind.
I still, at the time believed in the glamorized version
(01:03):
of the dream that with my theater degree from Columbia
University and my own grit, there's only a matter of
time that I'd get to act with some of my favorites,
whether it be Karenelivo, Chris Jackson, Viola Davis and record
with artists like Jake Cole, the Jasmine Sullivan, the Three Tenors,
and the Likes. What I didn't realize is in this
(01:23):
city of dreams, anything can truly happen. Just as much
as you could dream to the top, there was a
deeper bottom. Ralph was right when he described the city
as concrete, gray, treeless, and everywhere you look there can
(01:44):
be piles of trash and it smells like trash. On
top of that, even your ears are overwhelmed sirens, cars honking,
people yelling, crying, laughing, chatting, phones, lasting music on boom boxes.
(02:07):
People say the most private moment you can cry is
on the subway because everyone will ignore you. While there
are some New York magic moments. When you're in the city,
everything costs a lot. Being someone who didn't come from money,
a job was absolutely necessary and the faster the better.
(02:30):
But I still wanted to and I had the privilege
of pursuing my dream, which was to be an artist,
being an actor, be a creator. And in order to
do that, I went hunting for what we call in
the entertainment industry a day job, and that was so
many things under the sun for me. I at one
(02:53):
point was a reservationist. I was a receptionist. I was
a server, and the reality was in order to make
ends meet in New York, even as a single person
who has no one else to take care of, I
was working crazy hours to not just make a living
and not just pay off my student loan, but also
to pursue my dream. And eventually I fell into the
(03:18):
tutoring and nannying world in New York City. Welcome to
When You're Invisible. My name is Maria Fernando b. S.
But I know not everyone can will there are, so
it's also fine to call me Maria. In today's world,
we love to tell stories about people who have reached
the top, like people who have achieved positions of cloud
(03:39):
wealth power. On this show, I won't be doing that.
When You're Invisible is my love letter to the working
class and others who are seemingly invisible in our society.
Helped to build a community here that will inspire you
to have generous conversations with others that are different from you,
conversations that might help you see life in an entirely
(04:02):
different way. The tutoring in nannying world in New York
City it's actually a decent gig in many ways. You're
paid a decent amount, right because it's New York and
most of the families who are asking for your help
are the upper echelon. One day, at this photo shoot
(04:26):
that I was at, I happen to mention that nanny
and tutor for wealthy families, and this girl turns to
me and she looks at me and she goes, oh
my god, I do too. She's like, girl, I've been
doing this for a long time. Let's chat. That person
was an Asia. It's been a very interesting journey because
(04:47):
I've been in different roles inside of household staffing. And
I started as a nanny and then household management, and
then I went into being a private chef. Anicia did
have a before working as a nanny and personal chef,
but she has health issues which restrict what she's able
to do. She had to change into something somewhat more
(05:09):
flexible to accommodate the doctor appointments and all of these
things that she has to do to maintain her own health.
I do want to point out, though, too, that these
jobs aren't always flexible. In every single arena, people get
their boundaries pushed we expect people to answer emails after hours,
to be available on weekends. You can't take sick days, right,
(05:33):
And that's in the regular workforce, where there's HR departments,
there's legal departments, there's a contract involved. Now imagine walking
into a space where there's no contract, there's no HR.
You don't necessarily clock in, so it's solely based off
of the person who pays you. The more degrees of
(05:53):
separation you have in between you and the family that
you're working for, whether it's like your family friends, or
you overlapping culture or where you grew up, the more
you get separated from that, the more invisible pieces of
you become. Depending on where you sit on that ladder,
the pay can be different and at times you can
(06:13):
then become hate using this term, but like the stereotypical
help where they don't know you as people and you're
seen to be there to just serve. Anisia being a
Nigerian American and me being a Mexican American can mean
different things when we walk in the room. We're both
(06:34):
first gen children of immigrants, but people who have gone
to college, and also an understanding of yes, I need
to work, I can't be without a job. But if
I really needed to, I could leave this particular job. Today,
Anisya and I are going to talk a little bit
more about this complicated dance and different things we've seen
(06:55):
throughout our experiences walking through the room with some privilege
and some invisibility. More when we come back from a
break and we are back to this show doing these jobs,
there's bonds that are awesome that you can form, and
(07:17):
that's so beautiful. I know Nisa has this pair of
kids that she's taken care of for a long time.
She kind of terms them her best friends. May hang
out all the time even when she's not there nanny,
and she's close with their parents. When clients are amazing,
they're amazing. I have a family. They make me dinner
every time I come over. Some families you're not allowed
(07:37):
to touch their food, like at all, can't touch it
even if you're there at dinner time. I can't even
have his neck. And there's families who will be like, yeah,
take whatever you want from the fridge. That's really loving
in a really gentle kind of way. This is why
I'm sharing this range. Is like, sometimes the client can
treat you like a person and be interested in your
(07:59):
day when you have such good people, you can be
shocked when you don't have that, like, wow, we just
went from warmth. Who here's an ice bucket. Sometimes when
you walk into these homes, you become an object. You
eventually find out there's a dehumanization that happens. And it's
in these situations that you realize how unprotected folks who
(08:25):
are part of household staffs are. You don't even signed
an independent contractor contract when you walk into these homes.
There's a lot of verbal agreements, and then there's like
no unions. There's no communication in between nanny's unless you're
like at the playground, And there's so many people who
(08:45):
don't have anything else lined up or this is their
only option. They're stuck in these places because of their
immigration status, because of their financial situation, and don't have
a voice or a platform or a safety net like
I or Anicia do. A lot of what people experience
as part of the household staff is invisible. I was
(09:06):
telling a friend. Most people interact with like executive CEOs
or politicians or celebrities through their work through a TV
screen or like at your office or something like that.
Nanny's insiders interact with these people like on a very
personal level, like with their children. Sometimes when you walk
into a home, you become one dimensional. Your value becomes
(09:31):
these specific things in your identity. So for me, it
was being Columbia educated and bilingual. It can mean that, oh,
that's really cool. Now you have Spanish, so use your
Spanish in this job without it being like an additional
skill we asked for. And then there's people who are like, oh, no,
(09:52):
we are hiring you because we loved this skill of yours,
and therefore we will compensate you accordingly. There's some people
where my Columbia degree doesn't mean anything just because the
nature of the job is simpler. I'm not gonna listen
to you. I'm gonna assume you're dumb, which can happen
as well. And sometimes my Columbia degree gives me more
(10:12):
personhood or only just adds to my perfectly plastic Barbie
toy persona to them where it's not anything other than
an accessory versus like an element of where I come from,
what I know, and who I am. They go to
their friends and they're like, oh my god, I have
this amazing girl. She's from Minnesota and like your kids
(10:32):
would love her. You're like, oh, I just went from
being fully in color to an outline. Having this opportunity
to shed light on some of these behaviors, it's the
opportunity to share stories of many out there as well.
I work in this world, but I live in a
different world. You really see the different realities that people have.
(10:57):
People will leave me with their kids for Like weeks's
asked me like around Christmas time, where are you gonna
go for the holidays? Do you go to Paris or Tokyo?
That's where my mommy and daddy go. And I'm just
like no, like I've never even been. There have been
clients who are like, I want salmon from Alaska, and
I'm like, we're in New York, so what do you
(11:18):
want me to do? And like they will pay for
a private jet to go to Alaska to go to
a fisherman to get the fish and bring it back.
Like I've had clients literally, I've had a supermodel literally
tell me I'm a big name. He should be happy
that you're working here. This past year, I worked with
this person while he was filming in that job. I
think I cried, probably almost every single day for two months.
(11:43):
And it wasn't just me, it was like all the
staff involved. I don't know, I just really feel like
it's an American thing. In America, there are so so
so many opportunities to you know, attain fame and fortune,
and then it is super glamorized. It. It's crazy because
while this wealth gap continues to grow in those wealthy homes,
(12:07):
I'm finding kids are at times growing up with less
empathy or understanding because they lack financially, ethnically and racially
diverse community to help raise them. And I also think
about all the workers who are leaving their family and
(12:27):
their kids that next generation in order to take care
of the ones in the fancy apartments, etcetera. Or those
who are putting off families of their own because they
can't afford it, or they're putting all their energy into
raising other people's kids. That makes me wonder, like, have
you met someone where you feel like they have qualities
(12:48):
that are actually good or qualities. I've had a lot
of clients that are normal people and they just happen
to get rich. Mhm. But yep, I've had a client
you're ago, he said, They didn't want kids, and I
was like, why did you have three of them? He said,
because I didn't want to die and my money would
sit in the bank. It's my money. I worked for it,
(13:10):
and I will have control where it goes. And it's
going to be like someone that has the same genetics
as me. This isn't even the craziest story that Anisia has. Anisia,
can you share? So, like, where do I even start?
So I am booked on this job as a cheft
through like an agency or like a concier service. I
(13:31):
don't know these people. They funded Hillary Clinton's campaign and
things like that, so they're all very new to me.
It's an Upper West Side home. They give me the
address to give me the menu. I show up and
the woman comes down and she's like, are you Anisia?
And I'm like yes, and she's like are you legal
to work in the uns? And I think that was
(13:52):
the moment where I knew that this was going to
be a thing. This was the first question this woman asks,
and mind you Ansia coming from an agency that that's people.
And then I started to kind of go through the house.
I'm talking like statues in the middle of the living
room and door knobs that are like silver shines, and
the spiral staircases that you see in scary movies, and
(14:16):
actual maids throughout the entire home. I totally remember watching
those movies where you see the people in made outfits,
and that's what this place was. These women in black
and white, shining door knobs, glasses, cabinets, and even a
laundry person ironing linens. This woman comes down the stairs
(14:36):
and complains about its smelling like food while Anisia is cooking.
She even complains about Asia's attire. She's like, are you
going to change your outfit? And I'm like, no, this
is what I'm wearing. I have a chef outfit and
Apron like this is it? So women Sin's housekeepers to
find me things to wear. I'm like this is bizarre,
(14:57):
and then they can't find anything, and she's like can
you go home? And I was like, I live in
Brooklyn and she freaks out. Miraculously, someone does find her
an outfit that's up to part for the standard of
this woman, and Anisia goes to change the woman's husband.
He wasn't any better. Her husband comes down and he's like,
I want to block the soda. Okay, it's him in
the afternoon. Sure, he pours a tryan called Pelaca soda
(15:21):
and he drinks it, and then he just starts screaming
at all the different staff for all the different things,
things that are almost out of their control. The killer
part for me was another staff member came up to
me with a page and she's like, you have to
wear this page. And I was like, what is this
like for what? And she's like, this is how they
are able to buzz you. And I was like, buzz
(15:41):
me for what. She's like, we all have to wear them,
and this is how they buzz for service. And so
I found out that under the dinner table were like buttons.
Each seat had a button. You are coming to someone's
home and sitting at their table, and you are allowed
to press a button. Don't have to get up, don't
have to say a word. At some point, this woman
(16:05):
finally apologized, but not to her staff, to her guests.
She's like clinking the glasses and she's like, hello everyone.
I would just like to welcome you to my beautiful home.
Thank you all for coming. It's been a pleasure. I
just want to make an announcement my original chef was
not able to make it, and unfortunately, my concierge sent
(16:26):
the most awful chef that they could find. And I'm
really sorry that the service is just not up to par.
Her outfit is not how we usually present our staff members.
But I can assure you that the dinner will be delicious,
and we've approved the food and we're going to have
a good time. And I'm like, I'm standing right there,
(16:49):
and I'm just like, in what world is that? Okay?
This kind of behavior is absolutely outrageous. And while I've
never experienced it to the degree you that Anicia has,
I have had some level of this interaction. And the
other element to this is not only are you dealing
with this emotionally and mentally, but sometimes there's even a
(17:11):
physical changer, especially when kids try to run away from
you into oncoming traffic or if you have a violent
adult client. And I remember specifically in those moments, I
could feel my body trying to figure out if we
were freezing, fighting, or flying, and the mental gymnastics that
go along in that. Anici and I broke this down
(17:33):
a little bit together. You go into survival mode and
you're like, Okay, how do I just get through the
next hour or the next two hours, or say it
was a contracted job where you were set to work
for or to six weeks. We start to think about,
am I going to need this money for the next
four or six weeks? Am I gonna need this reference
(17:53):
for the job? Am I going to be able to
suck it up and finish the six weeks? I also
know she has very little vacation time and also deals
with several chronic illnesses. Not only is she dealing with
emotional burdens from her clients, but she's also dealing with
her own personal pressures. I also know the pandemic made
(18:16):
them worse. I think the pandemic was very hard for
people who worked in homes because you saw different reality.
You watched the news and you saw people losing their jobs,
people not having housing, people getting evicted. You know, hospitals
over booked, things like that. And you go into these
homes and they have private healthcare. Their businesses are still going,
(18:39):
they're not losing any jobs. In fact, they're making more money.
More from an Asia. When we come back from this
break and we're back while you know, us regular folks
(19:01):
experienced the pandemic. In one way, the wealthy had a
completely different experience. They got to have multiple nanny's, multiple tutors,
personal chefs, and drivers coming in and out of the
city so that they didn't have to deal with the
potential of getting COVID while they were going on a
(19:22):
grocery run or that kind of thing. Overall, it just
reminds me how these people have insane access to things
and don't necessarily have to endure the same way most
of the world has to. It's funny because even with
the ability to have access to so many things, these
(19:43):
people still only want to pay for things based off
of their own particular definition of what that means. I
was actually talking to a nanny friend about this the
other day. The family that she works for their actually
really big restauranteers in New York, and they're just like
not being nice her. In the pandemic, they paid her
to be off, like when we can go anywhere, and
(20:03):
they were like, Okay, we'll still pay you until everything
opens back up. And then when things open back up,
they were like, you always that money back. That threat
of being taken advantage of is always at play. But
the crazy thing is it also shifts depending on if
(20:24):
you're an American born worker or if you're an immigrant
domestic worker. And not only that, but then are you
like of color or are you white? And do you
have an accent or do you not? All of these
factors into how you treated in a household. And when
I've walked into those spaces, and Anisia and I discussed this,
(20:46):
there's a sense of responsibility of being a woman of
color who is the child of immigrants. You want to
take care of the people who may not have a voice.
That's another like part of the job that I just
took on was being almost like a defense attorney for
housekeeper was a woman that barely speak English, and you
(21:07):
know they're getting abused and they're getting underpaid. This's close
to home because I think about my mom, who was
the first personal chef, the first nanny, and the first
personal assistant that I ever knew. I think about the
fact that her immigration status didn't quite let her work
(21:30):
above table to help us through, so there was always
the potential of being underpaid or abused. And I think
we luked out partially when my mom ran a daycare
from our house, which was mostly folks who were from
our same working class or middle class background. But while
(21:53):
that was a beautiful moment, I also know my mom
worked really hard and was overworked and was looking after
ten kids and trying to raise her kids at the
same time. I have memories throughout my entire time growing
up where my mom and sometimes my dad as well
would be treated differently because of their accent. They would
(22:16):
be seen as stupid or slow when they are brilliant
and quick witted and incredibly compassionate. And knowing how people
can get when they hear you or they assume something
because of your position is really difficult to deal with.
(22:37):
And the fact that I can't control how people will
react to either my mom or the other workers, and
I can't save them from that treatment. The only things
I can do is advocate for people in the space,
and I can do what I'm doing here, which is
exposing it, and hopefully we can all pitching to course correct.
(23:02):
So my parents were able to overcome, figure out, work
through their difficulties and the things they endured in order
to achieve the American dream, or their version of it.
What do you want for your life? Where do you
see yourself ten years from now? Do you personally want
(23:26):
to continue in this industry, all right, I don't want
to continue this industry. This is kind of what I've
been thinking about the past couple of years and why
I decided to launch my own startup. I did come
to a breaking point in the pandemic, and I was like,
how do I transition out of this career? Right? Eventually?
I want to have kids and get married and have
a house and things like that. And I thought, could
(23:50):
I actually come home from these jobs, like to my
own children, to my own family, Like absolutely not. And
so that's what really inspired me to create eight Kids Table,
which is like a meal delivery shot up service for
families in New York and eventually will hope to branch
out into other cities. I've experienced, you know, so much
(24:12):
trauma and like mistreatment in this industry. I just feel
like it is my duty to create a business and
a platform that can provide jobs to people and pay
them fairly, treat them well, offer them mental health, and
treat them as equals. A lot of times when I
was nannying, I was always like, I can't wait to
(24:32):
be rich so that I can hire nanny and I
can treat her really nice and pay her really well.
It's interesting that you mentioned like when I'm rich, and
I'm like, oh, so there's the aspiration. It seems like
to become part of this class. In some way, there
is an aspiration to become part of this class, but
to like figure out a way to change it and
figure out a way that there isn't this industry standard
(24:55):
anymore as a minority, to give other minorities opportunity to
know that you don't need to go through these things.
You know, oftentimes you do these jobs and they make
you feel very, very less than almost inadequate. I'm learning
this now because you know, I created this business. It
is a startup, and I have been telling clients about it,
and the feedback is very interesting. Some clients are very
(25:18):
supportive and they're like, oh my god, this is really cool.
But then you have these people who are in shock
because they're like, you created a business, like you were
my help, right, Like yeah, we are of service to me,
Like how how did you even have the resources. It's
those types of stigmas that I just want to completely
definitely want them to be gone. Right. That's definitely interesting
(25:41):
that with this idea of who the help should be right,
we limit their potential even like remembering that everyone can dream,
because I think when we put that label in that stigma,
we limit the potential and possibility of individuals to grow
and change and who gets to succeed. Yes, I think
(26:02):
if people who are from oppressed minority groups are also
sitting at those tables and can also say, you know,
that's not okay. I want to be that person that's like, no,
absolutely not, and I want to have the power to
do so we're equals at this point, right. That's like
the biggest reason why I would want to be rich
is to fully normalize black, brown minority women to be
(26:28):
in the basis. I think that's when things will change.
That's where, like socioeconomic status matters a lot. It's kind
of hard when you've lived in wealth your whole life
to like see the full picture. How do we help
people come up and have a seat at the table
versus have already been born into it. The more people
(26:48):
from all shapes and backgrounds right who can have a
seat at the table, the more we're better off. In general.
It's fun to believe in the potential of robin hood
like persona, but talking to Anisia. I can't help but
think the reality that not everyone has that potential to
(27:09):
dream of reaching that class. I think about how fortunate
Anisia and I are to be able to freely tell
you these crazy stories, and the reality that there are
thousands of more workers who don't get to share these stories,
the people who I asked to join us on this
(27:30):
podcast who were too scared to share it because they
still work for people like this, and they still are
attached to those circles with no other way to create
a source of income beyond these homes. And if you
are going through this, it's actually a lot of an
(27:53):
emotional roller coaster, and I just want to honor the
people who go into those homes every day. I don't
think either of us are saying necessarily that these jobs
shouldn't exist. I value every single person who has ever
(28:16):
helped me, has ever bought in me dinner, who has
ever given me advice, ultimately has helped me succeed. And
I think for me, approaching it as like we are
here because we have people we rely on, Like I
am able to pursue a career because I have a nanny.
It's understanding intricate connectivity that we have no matter what class,
(28:42):
no matter what job, and we are capable of doing
what we want to do because other people are doing
what they want to do and some people who don't
get to do what they want to do, which is
the hard part. So to acknowledge that complexity is why
this episode also exists. Is there anything that you wish
(29:02):
people would know about the industry or you think that, like,
the world would be a better place if fill in
the blank. I think the world would be a much
better place if people did not glamorize these types of
individuals are the status I tell friends about the jobs
that I have. I got to go into this person's
(29:24):
house and that person's house, and they're like, Oh my god,
that's amazing. You're so lucky. They say these things as
if it's a privilege, and I think the world needs
to know that it is far from privilege to be
able to work with the privilege. So we've opened the
(29:49):
door to one world in the New York ecosystem, and
on the next episode of When You're Invisible, we'll be
opening the door to another. This specific group of people
that will be talking about are the crew workers who
cleaned up New York after nine eleven, We're going to
(30:10):
go down town to Wall Street, the site of what
was the Twin Towers, which is now the Freedom Tower
and the nine eleven Memorial. Amongst this gorgeous tribute to
that awful day is the ghosts of those who not
(30:35):
only passed the day of the event, but the people
who passed because of all the illnesses that they got
from working on the site and helping New York return
to its glory. That's on the next episode of When
You're Invisible. Tune in in a week. We'll see you then.
(30:59):
Thank you so much for listening to one ear Invisible
and for joining me on this journey. Don't forget to like, comment,
and subscribe. You can find this episode and future ones
on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you get your podcasts. I'm your host and creator Maria Fern,
with executive producers Anna Stump, Nikki Tour and producers Dylan Hoyer,
(31:26):
Arlene Santana, and Bablo Cabrera, with associate producer Claudia Marfa
Corena and post production producer Daisy James. Original theme music
by Tony Bruno. When You're Invisible is an I Heart
Podcast Network production in partnership with Michael Toura Podcast Network
After a difficult yet enchanting four years, I finally got
to graduate from Columbia University. Looking out at that sea
of baby blue Columbia robes, I couldn't help but be
grateful that I've been able to achieve this moment and
have my parents, my brother, my Boila, and the crowd
(00:20):
looking on. And yet I felt this bitter sweetness that
the guys who kept me from dropping out weren't among
those faces. Because of how tightly packed this sea of
people ends up being and the general chaos of the day,
I didn't get to see them. The guys from the
package center were the people I never got to say
(00:41):
goodbye to that day. As I packed up my stuff
into the car and we rolled on down to Lower Manhattan,
I didn't realize what life would become. Well, I knew
I would have to get a day job and grind.
I still, at the time believed in the glamorized version
(01:03):
of the dream that with my theater degree from Columbia
University and my own grit, there's only a matter of
time that I'd get to act with some of my favorites,
whether it be Karenelivo, Chris Jackson, Viola Davis and record
with artists like Jake Cole, the Jasmine Sullivan, the Three Tenors,
and the Likes. What I didn't realize is in this
(01:23):
city of dreams, anything can truly happen. Just as much
as you could dream to the top, there was a
deeper bottom. Ralph was right when he described the city
as concrete, gray, treeless, and everywhere you look there can
(01:44):
be piles of trash and it smells like trash. On
top of that, even your ears are overwhelmed sirens, cars honking,
people yelling, crying, laughing, chatting, phones, lasting music on boom boxes.
(02:07):
People say the most private moment you can cry is
on the subway because everyone will ignore you. While there
are some New York magic moments. When you're in the city,
everything costs a lot. Being someone who didn't come from money,
a job was absolutely necessary and the faster the better.
(02:30):
But I still wanted to and I had the privilege
of pursuing my dream, which was to be an artist,
being an actor, be a creator. And in order to
do that, I went hunting for what we call in
the entertainment industry a day job, and that was so
many things under the sun for me. I at one
(02:53):
point was a reservationist. I was a receptionist. I was
a server, and the reality was in order to make
ends meet in New York, even as a single person
who has no one else to take care of, I
was working crazy hours to not just make a living
and not just pay off my student loan, but also
to pursue my dream. And eventually I fell into the
(03:18):
tutoring and nannying world in New York City. Welcome to
When You're Invisible. My name is Maria Fernando b. S.
But I know not everyone can will there are, so
it's also fine to call me Maria. In today's world,
we love to tell stories about people who have reached
the top, like people who have achieved positions of cloud
(03:39):
wealth power. On this show, I won't be doing that.
When You're Invisible is my love letter to the working
class and others who are seemingly invisible in our society.
Helped to build a community here that will inspire you
to have generous conversations with others that are different from you,
conversations that might help you see life in an entirely
(04:02):
different way. The tutoring in nannying world in New York
City it's actually a decent gig in many ways. You're
paid a decent amount, right because it's New York and
most of the families who are asking for your help
are the upper echelon. One day, at this photo shoot
(04:26):
that I was at, I happen to mention that nanny
and tutor for wealthy families, and this girl turns to
me and she looks at me and she goes, oh
my god, I do too. She's like, girl, I've been
doing this for a long time. Let's chat. That person
was an Asia. It's been a very interesting journey because
(04:47):
I've been in different roles inside of household staffing. And
I started as a nanny and then household management, and
then I went into being a private chef. Anicia did
have a before working as a nanny and personal chef,
but she has health issues which restrict what she's able
to do. She had to change into something somewhat more
(05:09):
flexible to accommodate the doctor appointments and all of these
things that she has to do to maintain her own health.
I do want to point out, though, too, that these
jobs aren't always flexible. In every single arena, people get
their boundaries pushed we expect people to answer emails after hours,
to be available on weekends. You can't take sick days, right,
(05:33):
And that's in the regular workforce, where there's HR departments,
there's legal departments, there's a contract involved. Now imagine walking
into a space where there's no contract, there's no HR.
You don't necessarily clock in, so it's solely based off
of the person who pays you. The more degrees of
(05:53):
separation you have in between you and the family that
you're working for, whether it's like your family friends, or
you overlapping culture or where you grew up, the more
you get separated from that, the more invisible pieces of
you become. Depending on where you sit on that ladder,
the pay can be different and at times you can
(06:13):
then become hate using this term, but like the stereotypical
help where they don't know you as people and you're
seen to be there to just serve. Anisia being a
Nigerian American and me being a Mexican American can mean
different things when we walk in the room. We're both
(06:34):
first gen children of immigrants, but people who have gone
to college, and also an understanding of yes, I need
to work, I can't be without a job. But if
I really needed to, I could leave this particular job. Today,
Anisya and I are going to talk a little bit
more about this complicated dance and different things we've seen
(06:55):
throughout our experiences walking through the room with some privilege
and some invisibility. More when we come back from a
break and we are back to this show doing these jobs,
there's bonds that are awesome that you can form, and
(07:17):
that's so beautiful. I know Nisa has this pair of
kids that she's taken care of for a long time.
She kind of terms them her best friends. May hang
out all the time even when she's not there nanny,
and she's close with their parents. When clients are amazing,
they're amazing. I have a family. They make me dinner
every time I come over. Some families you're not allowed
(07:37):
to touch their food, like at all, can't touch it
even if you're there at dinner time. I can't even
have his neck. And there's families who will be like, yeah,
take whatever you want from the fridge. That's really loving
in a really gentle kind of way. This is why
I'm sharing this range. Is like, sometimes the client can
treat you like a person and be interested in your
(07:59):
day when you have such good people, you can be
shocked when you don't have that, like, wow, we just
went from warmth. Who here's an ice bucket. Sometimes when
you walk into these homes, you become an object. You
eventually find out there's a dehumanization that happens. And it's
in these situations that you realize how unprotected folks who
(08:25):
are part of household staffs are. You don't even signed
an independent contractor contract when you walk into these homes.
There's a lot of verbal agreements, and then there's like
no unions. There's no communication in between nanny's unless you're
like at the playground, And there's so many people who
(08:45):
don't have anything else lined up or this is their
only option. They're stuck in these places because of their
immigration status, because of their financial situation, and don't have
a voice or a platform or a safety net like
I or Anicia do. A lot of what people experience
as part of the household staff is invisible. I was
(09:06):
telling a friend. Most people interact with like executive CEOs
or politicians or celebrities through their work through a TV
screen or like at your office or something like that.
Nanny's insiders interact with these people like on a very
personal level, like with their children. Sometimes when you walk
into a home, you become one dimensional. Your value becomes
(09:31):
these specific things in your identity. So for me, it
was being Columbia educated and bilingual. It can mean that, oh,
that's really cool. Now you have Spanish, so use your
Spanish in this job without it being like an additional
skill we asked for. And then there's people who are like, oh, no,
(09:52):
we are hiring you because we loved this skill of yours,
and therefore we will compensate you accordingly. There's some people
where my Columbia degree doesn't mean anything just because the
nature of the job is simpler. I'm not gonna listen
to you. I'm gonna assume you're dumb, which can happen
as well. And sometimes my Columbia degree gives me more
(10:12):
personhood or only just adds to my perfectly plastic Barbie
toy persona to them where it's not anything other than
an accessory versus like an element of where I come from,
what I know, and who I am. They go to
their friends and they're like, oh my god, I have
this amazing girl. She's from Minnesota and like your kids
(10:32):
would love her. You're like, oh, I just went from
being fully in color to an outline. Having this opportunity
to shed light on some of these behaviors, it's the
opportunity to share stories of many out there as well.
I work in this world, but I live in a
different world. You really see the different realities that people have.
(10:57):
People will leave me with their kids for Like weeks's
asked me like around Christmas time, where are you gonna
go for the holidays? Do you go to Paris or Tokyo?
That's where my mommy and daddy go. And I'm just
like no, like I've never even been. There have been
clients who are like, I want salmon from Alaska, and
I'm like, we're in New York, so what do you
(11:18):
want me to do? And like they will pay for
a private jet to go to Alaska to go to
a fisherman to get the fish and bring it back.
Like I've had clients literally, I've had a supermodel literally
tell me I'm a big name. He should be happy
that you're working here. This past year, I worked with
this person while he was filming in that job. I
think I cried, probably almost every single day for two months.
(11:43):
And it wasn't just me, it was like all the
staff involved. I don't know, I just really feel like
it's an American thing. In America, there are so so
so many opportunities to you know, attain fame and fortune,
and then it is super glamorized. It. It's crazy because
while this wealth gap continues to grow in those wealthy homes,
(12:07):
I'm finding kids are at times growing up with less
empathy or understanding because they lack financially, ethnically and racially
diverse community to help raise them. And I also think
about all the workers who are leaving their family and
(12:27):
their kids that next generation in order to take care
of the ones in the fancy apartments, etcetera. Or those
who are putting off families of their own because they
can't afford it, or they're putting all their energy into
raising other people's kids. That makes me wonder, like, have
you met someone where you feel like they have qualities
(12:48):
that are actually good or qualities. I've had a lot
of clients that are normal people and they just happen
to get rich. Mhm. But yep, I've had a client
you're ago, he said, They didn't want kids, and I
was like, why did you have three of them? He said,
because I didn't want to die and my money would
sit in the bank. It's my money. I worked for it,
(13:10):
and I will have control where it goes. And it's
going to be like someone that has the same genetics
as me. This isn't even the craziest story that Anisia has. Anisia,
can you share? So, like, where do I even start?
So I am booked on this job as a cheft
through like an agency or like a concier service. I
(13:31):
don't know these people. They funded Hillary Clinton's campaign and
things like that, so they're all very new to me.
It's an Upper West Side home. They give me the
address to give me the menu. I show up and
the woman comes down and she's like, are you Anisia?
And I'm like yes, and she's like are you legal
to work in the uns? And I think that was
(13:52):
the moment where I knew that this was going to
be a thing. This was the first question this woman asks,
and mind you Ansia coming from an agency that that's people.
And then I started to kind of go through the house.
I'm talking like statues in the middle of the living
room and door knobs that are like silver shines, and
the spiral staircases that you see in scary movies, and
(14:16):
actual maids throughout the entire home. I totally remember watching
those movies where you see the people in made outfits,
and that's what this place was. These women in black
and white, shining door knobs, glasses, cabinets, and even a
laundry person ironing linens. This woman comes down the stairs
(14:36):
and complains about its smelling like food while Anisia is cooking.
She even complains about Asia's attire. She's like, are you
going to change your outfit? And I'm like, no, this
is what I'm wearing. I have a chef outfit and
Apron like this is it? So women Sin's housekeepers to
find me things to wear. I'm like this is bizarre,
(14:57):
and then they can't find anything, and she's like can
you go home? And I was like, I live in
Brooklyn and she freaks out. Miraculously, someone does find her
an outfit that's up to part for the standard of
this woman, and Anisia goes to change the woman's husband.
He wasn't any better. Her husband comes down and he's like,
I want to block the soda. Okay, it's him in
the afternoon. Sure, he pours a tryan called Pelaca soda
(15:21):
and he drinks it, and then he just starts screaming
at all the different staff for all the different things,
things that are almost out of their control. The killer
part for me was another staff member came up to
me with a page and she's like, you have to
wear this page. And I was like, what is this
like for what? And she's like, this is how they
are able to buzz you. And I was like, buzz
(15:41):
me for what. She's like, we all have to wear them,
and this is how they buzz for service. And so
I found out that under the dinner table were like buttons.
Each seat had a button. You are coming to someone's
home and sitting at their table, and you are allowed
to press a button. Don't have to get up, don't
have to say a word. At some point, this woman
(16:05):
finally apologized, but not to her staff, to her guests.
She's like clinking the glasses and she's like, hello everyone.
I would just like to welcome you to my beautiful home.
Thank you all for coming. It's been a pleasure. I
just want to make an announcement my original chef was
not able to make it, and unfortunately, my concierge sent
(16:26):
the most awful chef that they could find. And I'm
really sorry that the service is just not up to par.
Her outfit is not how we usually present our staff members.
But I can assure you that the dinner will be delicious,
and we've approved the food and we're going to have
a good time. And I'm like, I'm standing right there,
(16:49):
and I'm just like, in what world is that? Okay?
This kind of behavior is absolutely outrageous. And while I've
never experienced it to the degree you that Anicia has,
I have had some level of this interaction. And the
other element to this is not only are you dealing
with this emotionally and mentally, but sometimes there's even a
(17:11):
physical changer, especially when kids try to run away from
you into oncoming traffic or if you have a violent
adult client. And I remember specifically in those moments, I
could feel my body trying to figure out if we
were freezing, fighting, or flying, and the mental gymnastics that
go along in that. Anici and I broke this down
(17:33):
a little bit together. You go into survival mode and
you're like, Okay, how do I just get through the
next hour or the next two hours, or say it
was a contracted job where you were set to work
for or to six weeks. We start to think about,
am I going to need this money for the next
four or six weeks? Am I gonna need this reference
(17:53):
for the job? Am I going to be able to
suck it up and finish the six weeks? I also
know she has very little vacation time and also deals
with several chronic illnesses. Not only is she dealing with
emotional burdens from her clients, but she's also dealing with
her own personal pressures. I also know the pandemic made
(18:16):
them worse. I think the pandemic was very hard for
people who worked in homes because you saw different reality.
You watched the news and you saw people losing their jobs,
people not having housing, people getting evicted. You know, hospitals
over booked, things like that. And you go into these
homes and they have private healthcare. Their businesses are still going,
(18:39):
they're not losing any jobs. In fact, they're making more money.
More from an Asia. When we come back from this
break and we're back while you know, us regular folks
(19:01):
experienced the pandemic. In one way, the wealthy had a
completely different experience. They got to have multiple nanny's, multiple tutors,
personal chefs, and drivers coming in and out of the
city so that they didn't have to deal with the
potential of getting COVID while they were going on a
(19:22):
grocery run or that kind of thing. Overall, it just
reminds me how these people have insane access to things
and don't necessarily have to endure the same way most
of the world has to. It's funny because even with
the ability to have access to so many things, these
(19:43):
people still only want to pay for things based off
of their own particular definition of what that means. I
was actually talking to a nanny friend about this the
other day. The family that she works for their actually
really big restauranteers in New York, and they're just like
not being nice her. In the pandemic, they paid her
to be off, like when we can go anywhere, and
(20:03):
they were like, Okay, we'll still pay you until everything
opens back up. And then when things open back up,
they were like, you always that money back. That threat
of being taken advantage of is always at play. But
the crazy thing is it also shifts depending on if
(20:24):
you're an American born worker or if you're an immigrant
domestic worker. And not only that, but then are you
like of color or are you white? And do you
have an accent or do you not? All of these
factors into how you treated in a household. And when
I've walked into those spaces, and Anisia and I discussed this,
(20:46):
there's a sense of responsibility of being a woman of
color who is the child of immigrants. You want to
take care of the people who may not have a voice.
That's another like part of the job that I just
took on was being almost like a defense attorney for
housekeeper was a woman that barely speak English, and you
(21:07):
know they're getting abused and they're getting underpaid. This's close
to home because I think about my mom, who was
the first personal chef, the first nanny, and the first
personal assistant that I ever knew. I think about the
fact that her immigration status didn't quite let her work
(21:30):
above table to help us through, so there was always
the potential of being underpaid or abused. And I think
we luked out partially when my mom ran a daycare
from our house, which was mostly folks who were from
our same working class or middle class background. But while
(21:53):
that was a beautiful moment, I also know my mom
worked really hard and was overworked and was looking after
ten kids and trying to raise her kids at the
same time. I have memories throughout my entire time growing
up where my mom and sometimes my dad as well
would be treated differently because of their accent. They would
(22:16):
be seen as stupid or slow when they are brilliant
and quick witted and incredibly compassionate. And knowing how people
can get when they hear you or they assume something
because of your position is really difficult to deal with.
(22:37):
And the fact that I can't control how people will
react to either my mom or the other workers, and
I can't save them from that treatment. The only things
I can do is advocate for people in the space,
and I can do what I'm doing here, which is
exposing it, and hopefully we can all pitching to course correct.
(23:02):
So my parents were able to overcome, figure out, work
through their difficulties and the things they endured in order
to achieve the American dream, or their version of it.
What do you want for your life? Where do you
see yourself ten years from now? Do you personally want
(23:26):
to continue in this industry, all right, I don't want
to continue this industry. This is kind of what I've
been thinking about the past couple of years and why
I decided to launch my own startup. I did come
to a breaking point in the pandemic, and I was like,
how do I transition out of this career? Right? Eventually?
I want to have kids and get married and have
a house and things like that. And I thought, could
(23:50):
I actually come home from these jobs, like to my
own children, to my own family, Like absolutely not. And
so that's what really inspired me to create eight Kids Table,
which is like a meal delivery shot up service for
families in New York and eventually will hope to branch
out into other cities. I've experienced, you know, so much
(24:12):
trauma and like mistreatment in this industry. I just feel
like it is my duty to create a business and
a platform that can provide jobs to people and pay
them fairly, treat them well, offer them mental health, and
treat them as equals. A lot of times when I
was nannying, I was always like, I can't wait to
(24:32):
be rich so that I can hire nanny and I
can treat her really nice and pay her really well.
It's interesting that you mentioned like when I'm rich, and
I'm like, oh, so there's the aspiration. It seems like
to become part of this class. In some way, there
is an aspiration to become part of this class, but
to like figure out a way to change it and
figure out a way that there isn't this industry standard
(24:55):
anymore as a minority, to give other minorities opportunity to
know that you don't need to go through these things.
You know, oftentimes you do these jobs and they make
you feel very, very less than almost inadequate. I'm learning
this now because you know, I created this business. It
is a startup, and I have been telling clients about it,
and the feedback is very interesting. Some clients are very
(25:18):
supportive and they're like, oh my god, this is really cool.
But then you have these people who are in shock
because they're like, you created a business, like you were
my help, right, Like yeah, we are of service to me,
Like how how did you even have the resources. It's
those types of stigmas that I just want to completely
definitely want them to be gone. Right. That's definitely interesting
(25:41):
that with this idea of who the help should be right,
we limit their potential even like remembering that everyone can dream,
because I think when we put that label in that stigma,
we limit the potential and possibility of individuals to grow
and change and who gets to succeed. Yes, I think
(26:02):
if people who are from oppressed minority groups are also
sitting at those tables and can also say, you know,
that's not okay. I want to be that person that's like, no,
absolutely not, and I want to have the power to
do so we're equals at this point, right. That's like
the biggest reason why I would want to be rich
is to fully normalize black, brown minority women to be
(26:28):
in the basis. I think that's when things will change.
That's where, like socioeconomic status matters a lot. It's kind
of hard when you've lived in wealth your whole life
to like see the full picture. How do we help
people come up and have a seat at the table
versus have already been born into it. The more people
(26:48):
from all shapes and backgrounds right who can have a
seat at the table, the more we're better off. In general.
It's fun to believe in the potential of robin hood
like persona, but talking to Anisia. I can't help but
think the reality that not everyone has that potential to
(27:09):
dream of reaching that class. I think about how fortunate
Anisia and I are to be able to freely tell
you these crazy stories, and the reality that there are
thousands of more workers who don't get to share these stories,
the people who I asked to join us on this
(27:30):
podcast who were too scared to share it because they
still work for people like this, and they still are
attached to those circles with no other way to create
a source of income beyond these homes. And if you
are going through this, it's actually a lot of an
(27:53):
emotional roller coaster, and I just want to honor the
people who go into those homes every day. I don't
think either of us are saying necessarily that these jobs
shouldn't exist. I value every single person who has ever
(28:16):
helped me, has ever bought in me dinner, who has
ever given me advice, ultimately has helped me succeed. And
I think for me, approaching it as like we are
here because we have people we rely on, Like I
am able to pursue a career because I have a nanny.
It's understanding intricate connectivity that we have no matter what class,
(28:42):
no matter what job, and we are capable of doing
what we want to do because other people are doing
what they want to do and some people who don't
get to do what they want to do, which is
the hard part. So to acknowledge that complexity is why
this episode also exists. Is there anything that you wish
(29:02):
people would know about the industry or you think that, like,
the world would be a better place if fill in
the blank. I think the world would be a much
better place if people did not glamorize these types of
individuals are the status I tell friends about the jobs
that I have. I got to go into this person's
(29:24):
house and that person's house, and they're like, Oh my god,
that's amazing. You're so lucky. They say these things as
if it's a privilege, and I think the world needs
to know that it is far from privilege to be
able to work with the privilege. So we've opened the
(29:49):
door to one world in the New York ecosystem, and
on the next episode of When You're Invisible, we'll be
opening the door to another. This specific group of people
that will be talking about are the crew workers who
cleaned up New York after nine eleven, We're going to
(30:10):
go down town to Wall Street, the site of what
was the Twin Towers, which is now the Freedom Tower
and the nine eleven Memorial. Amongst this gorgeous tribute to
that awful day is the ghosts of those who not
(30:35):
only passed the day of the event, but the people
who passed because of all the illnesses that they got
from working on the site and helping New York return
to its glory. That's on the next episode of When
You're Invisible. Tune in in a week. We'll see you then.
(30:59):
Thank you so much for listening to one ear Invisible
and for joining me on this journey. Don't forget to like, comment,
and subscribe. You can find this episode and future ones
on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever
you get your podcasts. I'm your host and creator Maria Fern,
with executive producers Anna Stump, Nikki Tour and producers Dylan Hoyer,
(31:26):
Arlene Santana, and Bablo Cabrera, with associate producer Claudia Marfa
Corena and post production producer Daisy James. Original theme music
by Tony Bruno. When You're Invisible is an I Heart
Podcast Network production in partnership with Michael Toura Podcast Network
Host
Maria Fernanda Diez
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.