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October 8, 2025 53 mins

This week on Rut Fresh, we’re breaking down how to hunt the first major cold front of the October and what it means for deer movement across the country. Jake is joined by Mark Kenyon, Javin Mullet of Whitetail Edge, Zac Keim from Ohio, and Aaron Hepler of the InCamp Podcast in Pennsylvania.

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Seth.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Welcome back to Refresh. This is Jake Hoefer and this
week we are doing this a little bit from a
mobile studio. I'm just wrapping up a new Mexico ELK
trip and we have a great episode with a variety
of guests Ohio, Pennsylvania, Who's going to New Jersey? And
we have Mark Kenyon kicking off the episode. Before we
get into all the guests and all the intel, I

(00:21):
want to say that Refresh is brought to you by
land dot com, the leading online real estate marketplace you
find your perfect rural, recreational, agricultural, or hunting properties. Here
in the US. It's been hot, it's been a little
bit stagnant, but there's still been some big bucks that
have been shot. And we have a little bit of
a front moving throughout the country this week. And so
if you're excited and you want to go out and

(00:42):
make a play, you're going to get some great intel
from folks that either have already shot a buck or
developing a plan to hopefully connect with one. Let's go
ahead and kick things off with Mark Kenyon. Here we go,
all right, First up on the line, we have Mark
Kenyon and I'm still in my mobile recording studio here, Mark,

(01:04):
how's it going.

Speaker 3 (01:05):
It's good, It's really good.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
I guess I'm not as good as you coming off
of an incredible LK hunt, but I felt like I
was flying pretty high. The white tail season is kicked
off here in Michigan. I've had a fun start to it,
so I have no complaints. Well good, well, good. So
what constitutes a fun start? Well, I have been out
three times since the opener. So I went out the

(01:29):
first two nights, and then I took off two days,
and then I hunted again on Sunday. And two of
those hunts are on my own, like you know, really
getting after the buck I'm going after. And those were
good hunts. And then the last hunt was more of
a family hunt. I took my two sons they're five
and seven, out four hunt with me, and that was

(01:50):
an adventure of a different kind, but very fun, fun
to have them out there with me. So so yeah,
the uh, you know, the good times were had with
the kids. And I saw very good activity on the
first couple nights, which I can tell you about if
you want.

Speaker 3 (02:04):
On those early October hunts, what.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
Did you see the deer doing and let's hear a
little bit about your setup, because those are some of
the first swings of the year, so they're usually maybe
the most calculated.

Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yeah, So you know what I did the first couple
nights of the year was hunt a place where I
had pretty darn good chances of seeing the deer I
was after, but it was actually a.

Speaker 3 (02:26):
Low risk place to get into and to get out of.

Speaker 1 (02:29):
And you know, given the fact it was the first
night of the season, if there was reason to be
a little bit.

Speaker 3 (02:35):
More risky, I would have.

Speaker 1 (02:37):
But actually my intel was showing me that the buck
I was after was coming out to this kind of
low risk spot in daylight still, so I thought, Man,
I don't need to do something crazy if he's coming
here already.

Speaker 3 (02:48):
So I decided I'm gonna hunt.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
I had a perfect wind for a rare easterly wind
for this zone. I was hunting a tiny green food
plot right on the edge of a betting area with
oaks dropping as well, so it was kind of like
dual food source that's in cover, surrounded by standing corn
and tall early successional habitat and then tight to his bedroom.

Speaker 3 (03:10):
And that was a setup for those first couple.

Speaker 1 (03:13):
Nights it was, you know, a little bit cooler than
previous for a lot of people.

Speaker 3 (03:17):
He had like mid eighties.

Speaker 1 (03:18):
And then October first and second came and we got
that slight drop in temperature down to.

Speaker 3 (03:22):
Like the seventies. So I saw a decent bit of movement.

Speaker 1 (03:26):
It was still pretty late the first night, but the
second night, so October second, you know, an hour and
a half or so before dark, I really started seeing
a lot of deer movement. And I saw seven different
bucks that night and maybe fifteen to twenty dos. A
couple things stand out to me as far as the
activity I've seen.

Speaker 3 (03:46):
Number One, the bucks are.

Speaker 1 (03:48):
Definitely feeling their oats like they're starting to just like
you know, get after just a tiny bit. And by
that I mean almost every time I saw multiple bucks
together they were there was almost always two of them sparring.
I've seen so much sparring, both in person on these
hunts and then also on my trial cameras. Lots and
lots of bucks just kind of locking up, lightly tickling times,

(04:12):
pushing each other back and forth, you know, nothing aggressive,
but just kind of saying, hey, how strong are you?
Here's how strong I am? You know, just kind of
getting a little bit of that angst out and that
got me thinking that, man, a great reminder that this
time of year, some very light rattling, some very light,
little kind of time tickling can be an effective way

(04:33):
to signal, hey, there's another buck over here.

Speaker 3 (04:36):
You're curious, come on over again.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
Nothing aggressive, but just that very light little tinkle tinkle
tick tick. That's what I was hearing a lot of
this week, and I think that's something that will probably
continue in the future.

Speaker 2 (04:49):
Yeah, so were you able to lay eyes on your
target buck on those hunts where you saw you know,
twenty dos and seven different bucks.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
I did not see my target buck. I did see
mostly year.

Speaker 3 (05:01):
And a half folds.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
I saw several two and a half folds, and I
saw one three and a half. Now I will tell
you that I do have daylight pictures of my target buck.

Speaker 3 (05:13):
He showed up at another food.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
Plot of mine that I was not at on the
first night, like two minutes after dark. So he was,
you know, in daylight opening night, about two hundred yards
away from me.

Speaker 3 (05:25):
And then he has.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
Been moving in the morning in daylight three different times
this week. So the unfortunate issue has been that I
can't get into hunt this zone with the winds we've
had and kind of the food set up, just like
the property layout, to get in there and try to
hunt a morning without blowing things up. So I'm on

(05:46):
the fence about maybe I should try something with this
cold front coming up this next week. Maybe there's a
way with the wind we've got coming in that I
might be able to pull off a morning hunt because
he's definitely he's been moving that last hour of daylight
in the morning, So that's a possile stability, but I'm
sure we'll get to it. But with this weather coming in,
I think there's you know, going to be several different opportunities.

Speaker 2 (06:07):
Yeah, so we can jump right into the weather because
I think that you know, it's been elevated attempts here
above average temperatures. You know, across the board throughout the country.
It looks like there's a weather front rolling in Monday
or Tuesday. So with this list, people are listening to
this on Wednesday, you know, there's a lot of people
that really like hunting. Obviously, a front after a pretty
good rainstorm, like creating a pretty good storm for opportunity.

(06:31):
With all that in mind, are you seeing that weather
in your forecast, and that's what's kind of helping you
shape your plan.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Yeah, and you know, it's gonna be a little bit
different for everyone depending on where they are in the country.
So for me in Michigan, the front is hitting Tuesday,
and then we have that cool weather Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday,
and then it heats back up Friday. You're east of me,
so if you're on the East coast, you might not
be getting that cold front till Wednesday. You might have
a Wednesday, Thursday, Friday front. So you know, if you're

(06:59):
listening right now, I'm sure you're all checking your own weather.
So I don't need to tell you to do this,
but think about what I'm telling you and what the
other people are telling you today in relation to that.
You know, somebody might say, well, Monday is going to
be the best day, but that might be because they
are in Minnesota, but actually their Monday might be what
you will have on your Wednesday or whatever it might be.

(07:20):
So keep that in mind. So we've got this big
front coming through. As you mentioned, rain's going to come
in for me on Tuesday. Temperature is going to drop
about twenty degrees for the highs it'll be like mid
eighties today, it's going to be mid to low sixties.
It's a high tomorrow, and then the low temperatures are
going to drop all the way into the thirties by Thursday,
with like a frost warning on Thursday. So because of that,

(07:43):
and because i also am looking at my extended forecast
and I'm seeing that this is the only three day
window like this, This is the only nice front at
least for my zone. It goes right back up to
kind of warm and stable weather for the next fourteen
days after that. So I'm looking at this as like, hey,
this is like mine, this is my mid October front.
This is gonna be the shot, and then it's probably

(08:04):
gonna be late October until we get the next you know,
change in weather patterns that might trigger a little bit
of extra movement. So I'm I'm gonna be a little
bit more aggressive here and look at this as like
this is one of my big swings, and then it's
gonna be I'm actually taking off next week for a
different trip somewhere, so I'm not gonna hunt my Michigan
spots anyways. So all that said, I am in the
process right now of deciding where the best opportunities would

(08:28):
be to take a serious swing at this buck. So
I'm gonna, you know, maybe get tight tight in the
cover right on some oaks that are adjacent to his bedroom.

Speaker 3 (08:37):
That's one idea I've had.

Speaker 1 (08:39):
I'm debating do I want to do like one more
kind of like pseudo safe but still in the game
hunt and if that doesn't work out, then the second
day do the big swing.

Speaker 3 (08:50):
Those are the things I'm thinking about. But the two
options would be, you.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
Know, either hunting in the oaks right adjacent to his
bedroom or just one layer back from that, closer to
the food sources in between, well the planted food sources,
so I can be in a transition between food and bed,
or I can be tight to the bed. In particular,
there's one spot where this buck is beded a lot. Now,

(09:14):
I these bucks bed in you know, multiple locations, so
you never know exactly where they're gonna be, but I
know that this one, you know, several acres zone is
a spot that he spent a lot of time in
the past. There's a big scrape right on the edge
of it that he's hit a ton over the last
couple of years. That I have a tree prepped pretty
close to it that I can get to. It's just
a tough spot to get into if it's you know,

(09:36):
if it's super dry and still, you're gonna bump deer
getting in there. But if it's wet from rain in
the morning and there's some breeze, I could probably get there.
So that might be what I do for me. Tuesday
could be the wet, windy day. It might be worth
getting in there. So I'm I'm weighing those cost benefits
right now.

Speaker 3 (09:54):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 2 (09:56):
Yeah, that's it's crazy that this might be one of
the better opportunities here in October. Obviously the weather can change.
And the other benefit to this time of year too
that no one's mentioned yet, but we haven't had daylight
savings time. So if you get off work a little
bit early, this is potentially an opportunity to sneak out
the stand after work. Maybe jet out of work a

(10:17):
little bit early. Because it's gonna be super stagnant for
fourteen days. You're probably gonna wish you at least went
out and took a swing.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
Yeah, I mean, that's that's what I'm looking at. I'm
just not seeing a lot of that. You know, those
changes and changes on a dynamic forecast is often going
to lead to dynamic movement stability, you know, like like
a monoculture. This is everything right, Like a monoculture of
habitat usually not great. A monoculture of weather forecast not ideal.

(10:45):
Not that they're not going to move, but you're just
going to have things kind of stagnate a little bit.
So I like the fact that, hey, here's an opportunity
where things are shifting up big time. It's going to
lead to some kind of shift with a deer. Might
as well take a swing of swing for and worst scenario,
it doesn't work out, and then you still have several
weeks until late October when a lot of us are
gonna get really serious anyway. So it's it's kind of

(11:08):
a low risk situation this point as far as I'm concerned.

Speaker 2 (11:12):
Yeah. So, I mean, with all that being said, we
got to put a scale one to ten on it.
Where do you think the next seven a's are going
to fall? And we'll say eight for you, will include Tuesday.
I didn't do that for anyone else, but we'll throw
that in here for you. So two day, the following Wednesday.

Speaker 1 (11:26):
So if you're gonna let me include the day before
people are listening that, I'm gonna give this like a
like a.

Speaker 3 (11:33):
Like a seven.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
Like I think it's pretty good, I mean pretty darn
good for like a mid October ish time period. It's,
like I said, it's worth a swing. I don't think
it's going to be the same that on October twenty seventh,
twenty degree cold front would be, but I think that
there will be deer moving. I think that having a

(11:55):
little bit of rain and wind and switching things up
is going to be really nice, not just forgetting deer moving,
but also allowing us that access. It's been so dry here,
I know that's been the case over so many parts
of the country. Finally getting a little bit of moisture,
some wet leaves, that's going to give you a chance
to do something that maybe you couldn't do over the
last week because it's so still, so loud. This is

(12:17):
a chance to take advantage of those things. So I'm
giving you a solid seven. I'm very excited about these
next three days. I'm I'm planning on hunting Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday,
and then probably pull back a little bit be more conservative,
go out to some safe spots with the kids where
I'm just trying to, you know, show them a good time,
or see some doughs or shoot a dough But I'm
looking forward to Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:37):
One last question for anyone that is not they're looking
at this weather front, they're hearing, man, I should be
pretty excited. I should go take a swing. They're also
the person that says, man, I just haven't had any
deer show up yet, or I'm still waiting on a buck,
or I'm still waiting on one to show up. What
would you be your suggestion or of one piece of
advice for them to take somewhat of advantage of this opportunity,
even though they don't feel like they're ready to make

(12:59):
a calculate choice and they're just kind of going with
the flow at the moment.

Speaker 1 (13:03):
So I think I would say if I did not
have any you know, if I didn't have a deer
I was after, or feel confident that there was some
bucks in the air that I wanted to hunt now
and I kind of hadn't dial to some degree, I
wouldn't take a big swing. I wouldn't be taking like
an early to mid October big swing even with this front,
unless I was doing it in a calculated way. If

(13:24):
I'm in search mode right now, I would still hunt,
of course, but I would probably be hunting somewhere. That's
you know, number one, going to give me opportunities to learn.
That's probably the biggest thing. I would be in search mode,
in observation mode, in scout mode. So hunt observation stands,
hunt places where you can see along ways. If you
have rain or wind, you might want to take advantage
of that to do some scouting actually on the ground

(13:46):
right now. This especially given the fact that we haven't
been able to do that quietly for several weeks because
of how I mean, it's just so crunchy out there
right now. If we finally get rain, what a great
opportunity to go check some stuff out quietly. Of course,
be careful about wind, still be smart about it, but
you can go cover some ground real quick. Take an
afternoon and say, you know what, I'm not gonna hunt tonight.

(14:07):
I'm just gonna scout the heck guy this place. Try
to find a concentration of bucks sign. You know, I
have seen a lot of big rubs already. I've been
seeing bucks really starting to rub in my zone and
some pretty decent sized ones, so that starting scraping is
obviously starting. I'm seeing, you know, the target buck I've
been after has been visiting scrapes relatively frequently. So now

(14:28):
is a great time to get out there. If you
don't already have this intel, take advantage of this moment,
this opportunity to go find that try to find a
buck or several bucks, or concentration of activity that then
you can hunt in a more calculated way next time
you have the day off, or next time the wind
and the weather.

Speaker 3 (14:44):
Looks a little better.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
So I would say there's plenty of things you can
do now even if you don't have something picked out
that's chasing wonderful.

Speaker 2 (14:54):
Well, we have a Jeeven Mullet who shot an awesome
Ohio buck. We have Zach Kaim who shot at to
get a couple of Ohio guys because I know there's
a lot of people that have major heartache there, so
I wanted to bring in a couple of Ohio success stories.
And then we have Aaron Hepler from Pennsylvania who opened
the Hunted That opener in Pennsylvania and is headed to
New Jersey. So we have an exciting episode. I hope

(15:14):
everyone has a great week and good luck to you.
I'm hopeful that this plan comes together for you.

Speaker 3 (15:20):
Thanks buddy, I appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (15:23):
Next step we have Javid Mullett with Whitetail Edge, who
connected on a great Ohio buck with no food plots,
no nothing, just intel and the good game plan. Here
we go. Congratulations, you tagged a big deal to kick
off the season. How's it feel?

Speaker 4 (15:39):
Thank you, man, I really appreciate it. Thanks for the
innight here. I am humbled for the opportunity and just
to keep grinding here, but it feels great. I love
killing early, especially for the situation that I'm in with
filming Ben, for Whitetail Edge and everything else. Like the
sooner I can kill, the more that pressure is off
of me, in a freeze, everything up for me to

(16:01):
be able to really do what I need to do here.

Speaker 2 (16:03):
For White Till Edge, yeah, your your tag is filled,
but your season is just getting started still exactly everyone else.

Speaker 4 (16:11):
Yep, my wife, my wife. Everybody's telling telling my wife, oh, yeah,
you know he killed early and you should be good,
and she's like no, no, yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
No, that that's awesome. So here, let's hear the story
and and kind of how you're able to develop a plan.
Everyone's always waiting, you know, killing a buck early there
is a sense of relief, like, man, it all my plan,
my preparation, my scouting plan A came together. Uh how
did you put together a solid plan that came together
so smoothly? Yeah.

Speaker 4 (16:41):
So basically over the years, I've kind of learned that
I I don't put a lot of pressure on myself,
or I'm pretty relaxed, and and oh I can't find
a dear, I can't do this or I can't do that.
Like I'm just like I do my thing and if
it works great, if not, I'm just out having fun.
And and so I did. I also killed Opening Morning.

(17:03):
Actually I think it was back in twenty two with
the exact same strategy. And basically this this is on
a on a permission property that a couple other guys
can hunt, neighboring neighboring guys hunt, and so I have
to I have to bounce around between you know, their spots,
Like I stay await from spots that I know that

(17:23):
they have stands and stuff. And basically my strategy is
mock scrapes and sell cameras, and I just I get
them in spot and transition zones that I feel like
are close to their bedding, and and then I I
find points where I can put those cameras and make
make scrapes, and and then I just wait it out

(17:44):
and whether the deer is going to move in and
use that or not. It's it's, you know, kind of
just up in the air. But like I said, I
just wait then for my cameras to tell me what
they're doing and if a deer moves in and uses that.

Speaker 2 (17:57):
So talk a little bit more about that set up
with the mock scrapes, intead cameras. Are those in conjunction
with food sources, betting mass crops? What did that setup
look like?

Speaker 4 (18:06):
Yeah, so all that stuff comes into play this particular farm.
Obviously I did not there's no food plots or anything
on that I did on this farm wasn't feeding or anything.
And so it's ag. It's it's a mix of of
of timber and ag. And it's pretty steep rough terrain
as well. So so that stuff comes into play as
far as for movement and travel. But in this particular instance,

(18:30):
usually obviously everybody says food to you know, bed to food,
bed to food, and that it is accurate. But I
think in this instance it was maybe a little bit
opposite from what people typically think, Like like usually a
deer beds in the woods, right, and then it goes
into the agfield to feed. Well, this deer was actually

(18:51):
bedded in extending cornfield and he was going into the
woods into the end of the hardwood timber for feeding
in the oaks. And so I killed him between the
standing corn field and the hardwood timber.

Speaker 2 (19:05):
That's interesting. That's that's the polar opposite of what most
people liked me planned on. And there's there's the debate
if they bed in corn or if they don't bet
in corn, will hear the story for you?

Speaker 4 (19:14):
And I guess I don't know for one hundred percent
certainty that he was. I should actually go out and
walk that field, because I know there are some areas
that are maybe a little bit grassy or the corn
didn't come up as much, and I just I kind
of assumed that he did. I didn't, you know, I
didn't have a drone out look or anything like that,
So I don't know for sure. But that's where he

(19:34):
came from. If he wasn't betted in the corn, he
was betted ride on the edge, you know, across the
corner from me.

Speaker 2 (19:41):
What made you anticipate him betted, you know, in the corner,
on the edge of corn to set up that play.

Speaker 4 (19:47):
So this camera wasn't necessarily I didn't really have it
in mind that, okay, this these deer are going to
bet in the corn. It was just the hillside that
I had to hunt. And again this is my strategy
of just I try to pick the best spots that
I can, and I scatter cameras all throughout the farm
in these spots, and I try to tell people like

(20:07):
if I if I get a twenty five to thirty
percent success rate on these cameras, mockscrapes, setups, I should
have two or three spots that are gonna work for me,
like because I try to usually do my roll of
thumb is about a camera per twenty acres. Is what
I like to is what I like to do, And
then I just try to pick these spots. But this

(20:28):
particular spot was so this permission property was timbered seven
eight years ago and it's really really thick in a
lot of the lot of the wooded areas. And this
spot was a pretty steep hillside, west facing hillside, And
I often like to look for the east facing or

(20:50):
the north facing hillsides and try to monitor those spots
a little bit more for the south or west prevailing
wind a five on. So many deer like to bed
on those on those north and east facing hillsides with
the south through a west wind. They can watch down
the hill and they can smell from anything behind them.

(21:11):
But and this is another another key factor that that
was going on here is this particular spot was on
the west facing hillside, and it was I saw there
was a trail that was kind of coming coming to
the standing to the big oak timber, and and I
was I was fairly close to a property line here.
The neighboring timber is mature. There's there's big oak oak

(21:35):
flats on the neighboring timber, and then my side is
is timbered. There is some oaks throughout, but a lot
of it is just thick shrubby brush stuff. And so
this deer was headed to the neighbor's oak flat, and
so I was a little bit limited with I may
not have put the camera where I did. Obviously, if

(21:56):
I probably would have gone over to the actual oak
flat and made a mock scrape, but I obviously couldn't
do that because that's on the neighbors. So this scenario
was just trying to get that travel because I knew
that's what they would do once those those oaks start dropping,
those acorns start dropping, And that's why I put the
camera where I did. And now it ended up we've

(22:20):
been having quite a few north northeast winds and that's
what happened. He moved into this spot. I feel like
because of that northeast wind was on a west facing hillside,
and that's what I capitalized. Then Monday night, that was
the last predicted northeast wind that we were going to
have for a while, So I knew that if I
wanted to kill him there, I would.

Speaker 2 (22:41):
Have to do it. Yeah, do you think there's strategy
looking out into the calendar for the next seven days
or so? Do you think the same type of strategy
and idea is something that people should have in their mind.

Speaker 4 (22:51):
Absolutely, I mean, obviously I think anymore if I I
try to have these cameras and mock scrapes put out, Uh,
it's I'm still trying to figure that out. Just whenever
you have time. It comes down to whenever you can
get to it, because you can still do it in season.
It's just it's it's a little bit it's harder because obviously,

(23:13):
if you're going into timber in these sensitive spots and
and and you know, essentially scouting your way through and
figuring it out, then you're blowing your deer out like
you're that's just inevitable now if you can. I would
say in season, I'm a little bit more cautious about
that unless you're okay with just blowing your deer out
and then and then probably your cameras be dead for

(23:35):
you know, a few days or a week or whatever
until those deer all move back in or in some
cases the you know, you might blow deer out and
he might be there that night.

Speaker 2 (23:44):
It just depends.

Speaker 4 (23:45):
But uh, in season, I'm usually a little bit more cautious,
and I usually try to just stay on the edges
field edges where you can drive to or run your
e bike or whatever is is often you know, an easy,
easiest way to do it, and then hang your cameras
on actual live scrapes if they're already showing. Unless I

(24:08):
will say, unless you can't shoot to one of those scrapes.
I usually try to make so that I can shoot
to the scrape that my camera's hungover. And then another
big thing that I do is is I try to
point the camera and find the route that a deer
will take, regardless whether there's a scrape there or not.

(24:30):
So the more factors that you can put right and
the more exes I guess you could call it, that
you can put right in front of your camera, the
likelihood of you getting that deer if he comes through
is a lot higher, even if he's not checking the scrape.
So that's something that I always keep in mind. And
then obviously if you do do mock scrapes, then I'm
as I'm scouting, I'm looking for trees for me to

(24:53):
be able to hunt with different winds that I can
kill right if a deer travels that or is hitting
that scrape.

Speaker 2 (25:02):
Man, that's some really good insight because I feel that,
you know, there's been some really good deer get that
have been shot and uh, you know, doing reugh fresh
now it's like you kind of start hearing this commonality
or this theme of scouting and developing you know, a
plan to your point, maybe it works twenty percent of
the time thirty percent of the time, but dang when
it does, oh man, well, And.

Speaker 4 (25:22):
That's the way I look at it, Like, dude, I
have I think I have seven cameras on on this
particular piece over over mock Scrapes, and I, like I
said it in a video that I took, like, if
if twenty percent of these spots work, like I'll still
have some good spots like and that's the way that's
and and and the more the more you do this

(25:44):
and the longer you do it, I'm like, especially mock Scrapes,
the more successful you get. Like it's just it's just experience.
And you can sit here and listen to all the
different types and different ways that that people do it,
and and sure you can learn a lot from that,
but until you actually go put boots on the ground
and just just start figuring it out yourself, like you're

(26:04):
going to fail and you just have to expect that.

Speaker 2 (26:17):
Looking, you know, here in the next seven ish days
for weather, it looks like there might be a front
rolling in for folks that still have a tag in
their pocket. And this front rolls in. I mean, do
you think this is going to be a time that
they should really prioritize to be out there. Yeah?

Speaker 4 (26:32):
Absolutely, I mean I think obviously my favorite times are
are small cold fronts of October, and I just proved
that again. You know, the other night was a little
bit the same. The pressure was rising a little bit.
I have a hard time sitting in because a lot
of my spots are are deep in and their access

(26:52):
is tough. So I have a hard time sitting in
those spots if I don't know that the deer is
around at least, Like I don't just go blindly hunt
these these these scrapes just because the weather's good, like
I would. I would rather, you know, go hunt a
different property, or hunt on the fringe to kill some doze,

(27:13):
or maybe do an observation, sit on a big egg field.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
Or something like that.

Speaker 4 (27:17):
But I'm not diving into any spots until I know
that the deer is in the area at least. And
then then is when if the conditions are right with
a with a cold front moving in, then just go
even go sit Even if maybe he didn't hit your camera,
maybe he hit a different camera. A couple hundred yards away.
You just if you know he's in the area and

(27:38):
you get these cold fronts, absolutely you know it's it's
time to go in.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
I love it all right, Scale one to ten. Where
do you think the next seven days will be? You
know for October? Uh October bear with me here? Uh
sure October, October eighth, October fifteenth, Scale one to ten.
Where do you put it? Oh?

Speaker 4 (28:01):
Probably I would say a five or six.

Speaker 2 (28:05):
Okay, I wouldn't.

Speaker 4 (28:07):
I wouldn't be in a hurry. Don't don't haunt just
to haunt. I mean, if you do haunt just to haunt,
then go sit a spot that that you know, you
don't care if you mess it up. Unless unless again
you get that and get that fake picture you know
that he's there, then then for sure, like go go
go in after him. But I I don't get super

(28:28):
excited early October, especially coming into the wall like this.
It's unless the camera tells you that that you need
to go, then then I would be hesitant.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
I like it.

Speaker 5 (28:39):
Well.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
Congratulations once again. I have a feeling you'll be behind
the camera of some more big bucks dropping this fall,
so really appreciate it. Congratulations once again.

Speaker 4 (28:49):
Thank you, I appreciate for the offer. Thanks Jake.

Speaker 2 (28:52):
All Right, next up on the line, we have Aaron
Heppler from Pennsylvania. How's it going this morning.

Speaker 5 (28:57):
What's up, dude? It's good to be here.

Speaker 2 (29:00):
Yeah, so your guys is state wide PA season opened
very recently and you got the jitters out and a
shot of dough.

Speaker 5 (29:10):
I did, Man, I'm very excited.

Speaker 2 (29:13):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (29:13):
It's always good to like knock the cob webs off
and like, you know, get a shot out of his saddle,
and it was a really good shot at twenty yards,
So that makes you feel it makes you feel good
for the rest of the season, you know.

Speaker 2 (29:25):
Yeah, I think I think there's a lot of wisdom
to that for anyone that's maybe doesn't have like for
a lot of guys, bucks show up later in the year,
and so if you're in that boat, I feel like
that's such a great opportunity to go through your draw cycle,
pick a hair on the deer, squeeze off the shot,
because realistically, we all work really hard for that one

(29:45):
opportunity throughout the whole fall. And it was that kind
of your thought process or were you just out of
Venison You're like, hey, I want to get the free
throw a little bit old for.

Speaker 5 (29:53):
I mean, you know how much I love my venison.

Speaker 6 (29:56):
But that's right, Chef Aaron at the You know, no, man,
you know I always go through this thing where you
get bucks on camera and you want to start out
by immediately hunting that buck because you think it's your
best opportunity, and there is sometimes there's opportunity to shoot
that buck on the opener, but really you're kind of

(30:16):
setting yourself up for failure a lot of times, like
if you're not ready for that. There's been years where
I haven't practiced enough archery out of a saddle or
out of whatever I'm planning on hunting on in and
I spent a lot of time doing that. I spend
a lot of time doing that right before the season,
like get up in the saddle, do some offside shooting.

(30:37):
You know, my wife was helping throw the arrows up
to me in the tree the other day, and that
kind of thing really helps. But actually putting an arrow
through a deer once or twice is to me, is
so key to making a successful shot on a buck
later on, because I get buck fever so bad, man,
And it really really does help make the shot process

(30:59):
when a deer in front of you kind of more
of a second nature if you can make it happen
a few times.

Speaker 2 (31:05):
Yeah, I think that's that's a great piece of advice.
So looking here in the next week, I know you're
you're gonna hunting out of state. What's your game plan
with the weather and you know this current time of year,
I feel like October progresses pretty quickly. Where like the
excitement of opening day and then it's like, man, we're
all the deer, so like, where are you at in
your strategy and expectations and where are you headed?

Speaker 6 (31:29):
Well, the October law is happening early here, man. I
mean there's no acorns anywhere. Everything's been so dry, so
the mountaintops and stuff are are are just there's nothing,
not a lot happening. And that's across the board. Like
anybody who talked to here is like, I'm not my
cameras are dead. I haven't seen any deer in fields.

Speaker 5 (31:48):
Nothing.

Speaker 6 (31:49):
And so I've been wanting to do this little Jersey
bear hunt kind of thing for a while. I'm gonna
be going there with with some friends locally, with Mitt
Shirk and group of guys. But there the Jersey bear
population is pretty big, so we're gonna be bow hunting.
They have a bow hunting season that has a couple
of day overlap with a flintlock, a flintlock muzzloader type thing.

(32:15):
The weather there is it's it's a little on the
warm side and it's a lot of invasive plants there,
so it's really going to be like hunt the edges
of the cover because it's so thick you can't really
get into it. Even if you got into it, it
would be literally sitting under tunnels of brush. But I'm
pretty excited. There's a lot of deer showing up on

(32:35):
camera there. We got some permission on some just knock
on door stuff kind of kind of thing, and there's
a couple pieces of public that we've actually found some
pretty decent bears on. In fact, we were there last
week and bumped into a mom with a sow with cubs.
Now in Jersey you can't shoot a sow that has
cubs with her, but you know, just kind of speaking

(32:58):
of bears in the area, it's kind of kind of
cool but made for a hairy situation.

Speaker 2 (33:04):
Are you gonna buy a Are you gonna buy a
white tail? Tag when you're there too, in case you
run across on.

Speaker 5 (33:08):
Yeah, the cool thing is is.

Speaker 6 (33:11):
When you buy your bowl license for Jersey, you get
a buck and a dough tag right away. It's a
pretty inexpensive tag, and the bear permits are like two
bucks apiece for non residents. They don't they want to
then the bear hurts, So it should be a pretty
fun hunt, you know. And as far as deer goes.

(33:32):
These farmers that we knocked on, we're like, please shoot
dear if you have an opportunity, like we like, have
fun trying to kill a bear. But if you have
the opportunity, like police harvest the deer because it's a
they do some pretty serious damage on these farms.

Speaker 2 (33:46):
So so with that in mind, kind of an opportunistic
hunt where it's like, Okay, if a bear comes through,
I'm gonna be able to shoot a bear. If a
dough or a buck comes by, I'm gonna be ready
to go. Does that change how you're anying on setting
up to some regard, I mean, the edge of habitat
sounds like a great spot for setting up for a
deer too. Is that kind of what's in your mind?

Speaker 6 (34:07):
Yeah, it seems like the bears and the deer are
using kind of the same because everything, like I said,
everything's so tight. The bears are a little bit more
prone to going through that, like the thick stuff, but
a lot of the deer are getting funneled through any
little shoots that come out of the woods there. They're
using old logging roads a lot on these farms. There's

(34:28):
a lot of I've noticed there's a lot of like
those old fence line rock piles that mark the border,
and if there's any low spot, the deer crossing over
that stuff. So that's I'm I'm hoping there's a couple
spots like that that I'm hoping to get to hunt,
you know, just kind of pinch points like that fence lines.
They've been crossing a lot of that kind of stuff.

(34:48):
So looking looking forward to just kind of whatever comes first. Man,
I'm not going to be I'm not going to be picky.

Speaker 2 (34:56):
I love it so looping back to Pennsylvania with the
lack of acorn production on the mountaintops, I mean, I
know you have a lot of experience hunting that type
of terrain. For someone that's struggling right now and looking
into the next week, knowing that if you can find
a tree for you know, dropping some acorns, like what
is what would you tell someone that's like, hey, man,

(35:17):
I have a couple of days off next week and
I know we're quote unquote creeping into the lull and
there hasn't been much activity on my cameras. What would
be your suggestion to that type of person and what's
key in on?

Speaker 6 (35:29):
So there are there are acorns in places, they're just
really not up high and they're very isolated. So if
you can find the acorns or beech nuts or something
like that, I know, very stereotypically it's like hunt the
upper third of the of the hills or whatever. I'm
not really finding that. I'm finding that deer are in

(35:50):
the lower quarter of the hills at the current moment.
So if you can find a thermal that that will
they're really you know, the wind is not happening right now.
Normally you have a lot of wind right now too,
but everything is very thermal based. So if you can
find a creek that you can get a longer stretch
from a downward thermal and make it more predictable for

(36:13):
yourself and find something that's like halfway or lower up
the hill that's producing some kind of nuts, or if
you can find a brows line where they're eating um,
some kind of buck brush, or if there's berries still
around stuff like that light food sources. Or if you
can find an acorn tree down in a bottom like

(36:33):
that and focus on deer that are coming up and
down to feed on that that those acorns that would
be pretty clutch.

Speaker 5 (36:39):
But the water is pretty important.

Speaker 6 (36:42):
I've been seeing a lot of deer in that area,
and I think it's the areas that you know still
have creeks that are spring fed, they have like a
little trickle, and even that is attractive right now.

Speaker 2 (36:54):
So those are some key things. And so basically that
lower quarter is where I assume you're finding most more
signed than what you typically would find up top. So
it seems like it might be a benefit to some
regard from based off what you're saying is like you
can almost rule out some of the tops or upper
thirds where people traditionally have hunted and focus more lower.

Speaker 5 (37:14):
Yeah right now.

Speaker 6 (37:15):
I mean I've even spent some time just kind of
driving around and.

Speaker 5 (37:19):
If there's service roads that are open and stuff.

Speaker 6 (37:21):
PA doesn't the game Commission actually in Pennsylvania puts out
seasonal roads. I think on X has some marked, but
you can actually find them on their like interactive web
page and find where the seasonal roads are. They could
drive on them because it's there are occasionally areas where
they're coming out on tops like that.

Speaker 5 (37:39):
But if you've got something that goes through.

Speaker 6 (37:41):
A bottom that you can drive and kind of just
observe without being too invasive, that's been really helpful. I've
done that a couple times, and it's fun to do
with the family too, like let's count the deer kind
of thing, you know.

Speaker 2 (37:53):
Yeah, well, I think those are some really key pieces there.
And so, you know, looking at all things considered the weather,
the time of year, what do you anticipate the next
seven days to be as far as potential hunting opportunity
On a scale one to ten.

Speaker 6 (38:12):
I would say it's probably about a six right now,
other than we're going to have a first cold snap
on Friday morning. We're supposed to get our first forty
degree morning, which is pretty historically here. That's one of
the times where you'll get bucks and any deer really, like,
if you're looking for any deer, that's one of the

(38:34):
times where you do get some movement up top, even
if it's dry. I've had years where you have, like
I mean, it's going to be eighty five degrees today
and then it's going to be high seventies to mid
eighties until Thursday, and then we start to have a
little bit of a drop. So I've seen that a
couple of times, where that very first cold front you'll

(38:56):
get some stuff moving in to just kind of see
what's going on. As far as as like I said,
as far as tops go, there's really not a lot
of sign happening right now, so you could key on
some of your good spots probably towards the end of
the week here. I think it's kind of pretty trendy
for the whole for these you know, a couple of
states like Jersey, PA, Delaware, kind of the same weather

(39:18):
pattern with a little bit of variance. But I think
that would probably be something you could do. Is kind
of get I wouldn't go to your best spot that day,
but you could get close to the edge of it
and actually maybe catch something or learn something that you'll
you'll want to use later on towards maybe the twentieth
of October.

Speaker 2 (39:39):
I love it. Yeah, that's I appreciate the out East report.
I know you have your ear to the ground, and
I really wish you the best of luck this season,
and I hope the New Jersey Hut is going to
be I mean, you've got three tags in your pocket.
Anything can happen.

Speaker 6 (39:54):
I'm excited, man, I have, like, I have twelve deer
tags this year, so I'm judged seriously. Yeah, a PA
put out quite a few tags this year. We have
a pretty cool program too. In specific units they might
put out like, for example, the Special REGs area they
put out seventy thousand dough tags a year, and then

(40:16):
inside some of those areas that haven't even higher density,
they put out Deer Management Assistance Program tags. And some
of those A lot of those are like state forests
and that kind of thing on areas like that, and
those are above and beyond your tag allotment. They're a
little bit they're like three dollars more or something like that.

(40:38):
Nothing crazy, But I bought a couple of those for
up north because I like to use those when for
the PA rifle season. It's pretty fun to just kind
of walk around and you know, last year we had
snow for that kind of thing. So it's kind of
kind of fun to do that kind of thing.

Speaker 2 (40:53):
Awesome, man, Well, good luck, good luck the rest of season.
Appreciate you ouping on here and give an any time report.

Speaker 5 (40:59):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
We have Zach Kaim who is now part of the
two hundred inch club because you have the shirt to
prove it.

Speaker 3 (41:06):
That's right, it's coming man, good good, how about you.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
It's going great man. I ran across your post here
and you tagged a magnificent white tail and you had
a bunch of history with this deer, and let's just
dive right into it. How kind of like the condensed
version of the multiple years of history and then how
it ultimately came together, you know, really quick here in Ohio.

Speaker 3 (41:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (41:30):
Yeah, So in twenty twenty two, this buck was on
my radar. I knew he wasn't a shooter at this point,
but I actually have a phone video of him walking
underneath my tree stand in November. Fast forward to the
next season. He ballooned into like a mid one sixties

(41:52):
class buck as a four year old, and I ended
up missing him. I misarranged him. He was a little
bit further than I thought he was. I thought I
knew how far he was, and he was just a
little bit further and so so that was pretty brutal,
I thought. But then it got worse because I did
the same thing the next year, which would have been

(42:14):
this past season, when he was a five year old.
He would have been I actually have his match set
from last year. He would have been about a one
hundred and ninety eight inch buck depending on his spread.
So that and I had several other encounters with him
last year too. He caught me drawing back on him
at thirty yards at one point. There was another time

(42:38):
he was like fifty yards over the property line during
gun season.

Speaker 3 (42:44):
Obviously he didn't take.

Speaker 7 (42:45):
That shot, and so he was just Yeah, he was
teasing me the last few years. But then then yeah,
fast forward to this year, it was kind of hard
to tell how big he was. His rack changed slightly,
he lost a decent side drop time, but he did

(43:06):
look like he got he put on some inches. But
I was I was estimating him probably in the one nineties.
But yeah, I tried to trade to tried to stay
out of his core area. He actually didn't really live
on our farm, or he never really bettered on our farm.

Speaker 3 (43:24):
I should say.

Speaker 7 (43:27):
Nine percent of the time, I'd say he bettered on
the one of the neighbors.

Speaker 3 (43:31):
And so.

Speaker 7 (43:33):
Fast forward to opening day this year, we had kind
of tried to stay out of his area with choke
cameras and whatnot, just we have enough history now, we
kind of have an idea of what's going on, and
he would be kind of camera shy if he saw
a camera. And so opening day, he actually did walk

(43:55):
past one of the cameras that we had down there
in his area, and he was actually walking onto our
farm just before daylight, which was highly unusual. I talked
to my dad about it that morning. We're both like
that that actually might be the first time ever that
he was walking onto our farm in the morning that

(44:17):
closed to daylight.

Speaker 3 (44:18):
And so so he.

Speaker 7 (44:20):
Was headed there's a small there's a small creek drainage
that goes up into the interior of a cornfield. It's
like a seventy five yard wide strip of woods. And
so we're talking about it, and it's like, well, if
he is better than hours, like he could have easily
went back over to the neighbors, but if he is
better than hours, that's where he's going to be. Because

(44:42):
we knew, we knew deer beded in there before, h
just never him. But so I actually set up a
tree stand this summer thinking it would be more of
a rut spot, just because it's kind of in a
travel corridor, and wh in there, snuck in there and set up,
and seven o'clock here he comes, and yeah, the rest

(45:07):
is history.

Speaker 2 (45:09):
That's that's amazing. And so how many times do you
think this deer cheated death? Because obviously you cheated death
of you multiple times, and then how many other times
have happened that that you're not well?

Speaker 7 (45:22):
The crazy thing is so like a six year old buck,
a lot of times when you skid him out, you'll
see your old wounds and stuff.

Speaker 3 (45:28):
And we didn't really find anything.

Speaker 7 (45:31):
And I know he was a popular year because even
before this, but I've had six different neighbors contact me
about having pictures of them, and some of them are
like a mile away. So how how he didn't die
ever is amazing.

Speaker 2 (45:49):
But that's crazy, so going, so you just make sure
I understand. So you guys had intell of I'm opening
morning going in and betting on you guys, and then
it was that evening when he went in there and
hunted him to try to go back out where he's
going to feed that evening.

Speaker 3 (46:03):
Is that right?

Speaker 7 (46:04):
Yeah, I don't know that it was necessarily where he
was trying to go to feed. I mean there's right now,
at least where we're a lot of red oaks are dropping,
so there's, you know, plenty of acorns. I kind of
assume he was coming to acorns. I was actually sitting
in a red oak, like that's the tree I was
sitting in. I got pretty tight to where I thought

(46:26):
he was bedded, so I think he literally had just
within a couple hundred yards. I think he had just
gotten out of bed and was making one of his
first scrapes of the evening.

Speaker 2 (46:36):
Probably what was that like seeing him, Like, oh my gosh,
just plants coming together. I've screwed up on this deer
in the past, and he had come man like it's
about to happen.

Speaker 7 (46:50):
Honestly, at that point, like I definitely had buck fever,
but it was more of like a like a dude,
let's just get this over with, Like I don't I
don't have time to like sit here and look at
his antlers, Like let's just lock in here and try
to get this over with, Like, let's not go through
the bs again. I was so tired of that, that

(47:13):
feeling of screwing it up.

Speaker 3 (47:15):
So yeah, when I first.

Speaker 7 (47:17):
Seen him, I knew immediately which bucket was. I seen
that flyer off of his G two and I told myself, Okay,
we're not going to look at the antlers anymore. Try
to limit the buck fever.

Speaker 2 (47:29):
But yeah, so that's and so you said last year
he would have been in the nineties, is you know,
estimating with the spread? What did he what did he
end up taping out to. I know a lot of
people don't care, but I do, so I'm going to
ask you. Yeah, because he's a giant. Yeah, he is
a giant. He taped out to two thirteen and two eighth. Wow,
so pretty darn good jump. Yeah, and yeah, I think

(47:53):
I think the last two seasons he jumped twenty to
twenty five inches both years.

Speaker 3 (47:59):
So yeah, which we had anomaly. We had a really wet.

Speaker 7 (48:03):
Spring this year, which I've heard is good for antler groove.
But whether whether that's the case or not, he grew
a lot. He grew more than I thought I thought
he'd be in the one nineties. This year he blew
that out of the water.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
And what was it like when you put your hands
on him finally, like after all the years of history
and everything else, Like was there a sense of like
the story's over now? Or or was it rejoiced right right.

Speaker 7 (48:29):
When I seeing it, Like right when I walked up
to him, like a sense of relief, very relieved.

Speaker 3 (48:36):
I was by myself.

Speaker 7 (48:37):
I nelt down, said a little prayer, thank God for
letting me finally get him, lay my hands on him.

Speaker 3 (48:46):
And so yeah, I was just very relieved and very grateful.

Speaker 2 (48:50):
I would say, yeah, yeah, that's awesome. Congratulations. So for
let's let's pretend you didn't shoot this buck and it's
October eighth, and you're looking over the next seven days.
What would you what would you tell yourself or what
would you tell someone that that might be struggling a
little bit or trying to get together a game plan.
Maybe they know of something of a buck that's kind
of hanging around the area. And now we're getting into,

(49:11):
you know, the the first quarter of October and you know,
creeping deeper into the month. What what would you tell
them to pay attention to, at least in our area.

Speaker 7 (49:21):
I would say, acorns, acorns and water, probably because it
was it's been really dry here in Ohio where we're at,
Like it's only rained a couple of times in the past,
I don't know, a month and a half or more.
So acorns and water and uh, like you know, seemingly,

(49:44):
you know, the October October lil is kind of like
around that time frame or around this timeframe. So but
I generally try to just look for hot time. Like
there's right now where we're at, there's so many acorns
dropping that it would be hard to like hee in
on a specific tree that you should hunt. But if
you can find a white oak, at least on our farms,

(50:06):
there's not a lot of white oaks, so I would
assume they are preferring the white oaks, But try to
find a white oak. Try to get tight to betting
would be my biggest tip, height to betting.

Speaker 2 (50:22):
Find some white oaks. And when you mentioned hot sign,
you know, I think a lot of people could potentially
confuse that, what do you if you could paint real quickly,
what is hot sign in your mind that gets you
excited versus just some general dear sign.

Speaker 3 (50:37):
Scrapes?

Speaker 7 (50:38):
Actually, when this buck came in, which you know it's
it was opening day, which was September twenty seventh, and
he he came in. The first thing he did was
make a scrape at twenty five yards that he's already
you know, doing buck stuff.

Speaker 3 (50:53):
So if you can find the scrape, and yeah, call
me crazy.

Speaker 7 (50:56):
But the week before season actually I went out and
I made a couple of mock drapes here and there,
just to see if you would potentially hit those early seasons,
because with our history of the deer, we kind of
knew he would be around early season, like early early,
and then he kind of disappeared, like mid October into

(51:19):
the rut, and then it would come back late season.
So I was really hoping I would get him before
he leaves because I was afraid somebody else would shoot him.

Speaker 2 (51:28):
Yeah, yeah, that's it. Look, you made it happen. So
if you had to put a scale one to ten
for the next seven days, what would you put at ten? Bean?
Best week ever? One bean? I think I'm gonna seen
it out.

Speaker 7 (51:42):
I definitely wouldn't sit it out. Like the weather conditions
were not ideal for opening day. I mean it was
eighty degrees, so I don't. Yeah, I mean I think
it just depends on Yeah, it can very soil like
if if you know where a year is betting, Uh,

(52:04):
nothing would keep me from going hunting, no matter the
conditions or time of the year. So I mean, for me,
if I was still hunting this buck and you asked
me that question, I'd give it like a six or seven.

Speaker 3 (52:18):
Probably not.

Speaker 7 (52:20):
It's not like perfect conditions, so it's not a ten,
but it's also not a one, so somewhere in the middle.

Speaker 2 (52:27):
Fair enough, fair enough. Well, yeah, congratulations sac on an
incredible deer and I putting a ribbon on the top
after you know, multiple years of history. That's that's really special.
I hope you have been enjoying the moment and congrats
once again.

Speaker 3 (52:41):
Oh I've been thank you, Thank you very much.

Speaker 2 (52:44):
There you guys have it. Hope you guys have a
great week. We're going to see you next week here
for Reughfresh. And with this front, I have an anticipation
that there's going to be a variety of big bucks
that connect with hunters and their plant come together. So
I hope you guys tune in next week on Reugh Fresh.
We'll see you then.
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Host

Mark Kenyon

Mark Kenyon

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